:00:00. > :00:10.Now on BBC News, it's HARDtalk's review of the year.
:00:11. > :00:21.Welcome to my review of heart talk to thousand 16. This was the year of
:00:22. > :00:26.a certain Donald J Trump. Hundreds of thousands of loggerheads in this
:00:27. > :00:33.country who will follow anyone and vote or a reality TV star. If the
:00:34. > :00:39.choice is between Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton, I vote for Donald
:00:40. > :00:44.Trump. The statement of banning all Muslims is very much contrary to
:00:45. > :00:50.American values. There is one certainty from the Mac, we have
:00:51. > :00:55.voted to take back control of our country. There is my personal
:00:56. > :01:01.feeling that comes into play because I love the UK so much I want them to
:01:02. > :01:10.be with the Europeans. This could be the beginning of the unravelling of
:01:11. > :01:18.the European Union, i.e. Agree. We are in need try new ideas. The only
:01:19. > :01:22.thing which will move is war. Ifill want to make the world a better
:01:23. > :01:26.place and I leave it a better place and that I am honest while I hear
:01:27. > :01:34.which is why I want to do your show because I want to to be asked hard
:01:35. > :01:40.questions. Hard questions is what we do and in 2016, our focus was on the
:01:41. > :01:44.global political phenomena and, a wave of popular anger and disgust
:01:45. > :01:49.with the status quo, sweeping through the democracies of the
:01:50. > :01:55.Western world. People left out and left behind. Look for politicians
:01:56. > :01:59.who seemed to speak to them. In the US, there are likely champion was a
:02:00. > :02:05.billionaire property tycoon with an outsized ego. There are elements,
:02:06. > :02:11.sub elements, fringe element in every country. Did I already know
:02:12. > :02:17.that there are hundreds of thousands of blockheads in this country, who
:02:18. > :02:22.are idiots and will vote for a TV reality star? Lets breed a little
:02:23. > :02:27.bit before we give it too much credit of representing a real thing.
:02:28. > :02:31.I will say this, there is a phoniness about this, consternation
:02:32. > :02:40.at what it means is guys like you love it. You dine out on it. You
:02:41. > :02:44.like a chance to look down upon, to go to the mystery of the Donald
:02:45. > :02:50.Trump phenomena. Any one of our candidates will be better than an
:02:51. > :02:58.Obama third term under the auspices of Hillary Clinton. Even if a colic
:02:59. > :03:02.says he is a race baiting xenophobe missed bigot and would be an
:03:03. > :03:08.absolute disaster to our party and destroy conservatism as we know it
:03:09. > :03:15.and we will get wiped out. I do not agree on all of that. He is a
:03:16. > :03:21.leading to the policies which include building a world with
:03:22. > :03:27.Mexico. I for immigration reform but because we need to get back to legal
:03:28. > :03:30.immigration and put a stop to illegal immigration and most
:03:31. > :03:39.Republicans agree with me on that. They are not allowed Holler about
:03:40. > :03:44.building a wall. I have lived my whole life on the US Mexico border
:03:45. > :03:51.and I have flown it, driven it and read it on horseback and know it
:03:52. > :03:58.very well and my view is... You show me a ten foot well and I will show
:03:59. > :04:04.you a 12 foot ladder. Of all is not adequate. Once he decided to come on
:04:05. > :04:08.board with the Donald Trump, is what you think is so important for people
:04:09. > :04:15.to understand and you claim the media failed to understand, is that
:04:16. > :04:20.this guy is not ideological? He is common sense, problem-solving in his
:04:21. > :04:28.orientation so some of the staff will be surprisingly less than write
:04:29. > :04:32.lenient. This guy, far from being a danger to the world is going to be
:04:33. > :04:38.somebody that governments around the world can work with and put trust in
:04:39. > :04:42.- that is not going to be easy. What I see happening is what happens in
:04:43. > :04:49.life, a convergence between how the media presents somebody, how the
:04:50. > :04:55.soundbites happen on a campaign on how when you are interacting with a
:04:56. > :05:00.person face to face, that might be a difference between your perception
:05:01. > :05:04.and what the person is like and as the gap closes, the world community
:05:05. > :05:10.will be happy to have him as president. Donald Trump's Drive much
:05:11. > :05:16.of the world by surprise. It had the shock value of a political
:05:17. > :05:20.earthquake. Much more political was the other storyline, the
:05:21. > :05:28.continuation of Syria's hellish war. The slow death of a nation under the
:05:29. > :05:34.worlds gaze. We are in a horrible war. Frankly, on behalf of every
:05:35. > :05:40.one, we need to throw new ideas about why things are not moving. The
:05:41. > :05:45.only thing that will move is war and victory but the reason no victory.
:05:46. > :05:48.That is the essence of this crisis. Some players believe victory is
:05:49. > :05:56.still possible and people who believe that our sad and his
:05:57. > :06:04.supporters in Moscow and Tehran. You are totally right. At this very
:06:05. > :06:07.moment, and Assad and his team are feeling comfortable but what they
:06:08. > :06:13.should not be feeling comfortable about is that Russia has no interest
:06:14. > :06:22.in inheriting a broken, destroyed, non- reconstruct a ball Syria and
:06:23. > :06:29.with constant warfare. Russian military forces, airstrike forces
:06:30. > :06:35.being involved in offensives against civilians is out of possibility.
:06:36. > :06:40.They are still performing their task in terms of fighting terrorist
:06:41. > :06:46.organisation. Your air forces been involved with the Syrians in the
:06:47. > :06:51.most ferocious on bad men of Aleppo that we have seen in more than five
:06:52. > :06:55.years of the Syrian conflict. Why are you the point, for example,
:06:56. > :07:00.these are uncovered a sting bombs which reach down into basements,
:07:01. > :07:05.kill civilians where they are sheltering, and also, we know this
:07:06. > :07:12.ROM multiple sources, hitting hospitals. This is false
:07:13. > :07:18.information. There is no possibility that Russian air force can be
:07:19. > :07:26.involved in this kind of activities. Understandably, the war is going on
:07:27. > :07:33.and understandably the cessation of hostile activity is not active right
:07:34. > :07:36.now and we are too far away from a situational ceasefire in Aleppo. We
:07:37. > :07:43.tried to give voice to the survivors of conflict, particularly and
:07:44. > :07:46.predictably, women. For those oppressed by so-called Islamic State
:07:47. > :07:53.to those victimised by one of Africa's most violent militant
:07:54. > :08:01.gangs. You were held for three months, in that time did you have
:08:02. > :08:03.conversations all make any normal conversations with any of these men
:08:04. > :09:38.that were holding you? You have come through the most
:09:39. > :09:45.terrible dramatic experience - eight years you were held captive by the
:09:46. > :09:51.Lord's resistance Army. Do you still find it easy to recall just how
:09:52. > :09:57.awful those moments were? First of all, I was so scared. They are
:09:58. > :10:04.telling you, get up. Get up. I did not know where we were going and
:10:05. > :10:10.that was the day and I only realised in the night, when I been told,
:10:11. > :10:17.come. A lady told me to go to the other tent. Two gentlemen alone? I
:10:18. > :10:25.asked what is this? He said if I do not accept, I have the power to kill
:10:26. > :10:31.you. I accepted it. That is how this man raped me. You board this man to
:10:32. > :10:35.children, a son and a daughter. I cannot even begin to imagine how
:10:36. > :10:38.mixed your feelings were in having those children in these
:10:39. > :10:48.circumstances you were forced to have them? In real life, when you
:10:49. > :10:56.start interpreting, Vijaya will never know this circumstance in
:10:57. > :11:02.which anything happen. -- the child. You never know where their children
:11:03. > :11:15.will lead me to. Europe will remember the thousand 16 as their
:11:16. > :11:20.year of Brexit, coined to reflect Britain leaving the EU. It reflected
:11:21. > :11:25.deep unhappiness with business as usual. A poke in the eye for the
:11:26. > :11:30.political and business elite. Brexit, the idea of leaving the EU,
:11:31. > :11:36.your team said that would cause severe national, regional and global
:11:37. > :11:43.damage? That is partly a preliminarily analysis. Guesswork?
:11:44. > :11:48.Partly intuition and a teeny tiny bit of my personal feeling that
:11:49. > :11:53.comes into play because I love so much of the UK I want them to be
:11:54. > :11:58.with the Europeans of which I consider myself. You comfortable
:11:59. > :12:04.with the idea that the IMF is making statements which are making a huge
:12:05. > :12:10.vertical role and in internal British debate? What right does the
:12:11. > :12:19.IMF to play that role? Clearly embedded in the articles of the IMF
:12:20. > :12:22.is our duty of analysing and maintaining as much as we can
:12:23. > :12:28.stability in the global economy. Ultimately, there is one certainty
:12:29. > :12:32.from Brexit, that we have voted to take back control of our country.
:12:33. > :12:38.Are you ready now to express some regret for some of the things,
:12:39. > :12:42.including false would pedal by the Leave campaign... As far as the
:12:43. > :12:52.Leave campaign there was one mistake, what factual mistake. The
:12:53. > :12:59.350 million. It was on the poster. A very small factual mistake. ?350
:13:00. > :13:08.million a week will go to the NHS is a complete falsehood. Why redirect
:13:09. > :13:13.my question? Why not now that it is over, acknowledge that some things
:13:14. > :13:19.were said that were false and you regret it. I think that was the only
:13:20. > :13:23.fundamental mistake that was made in terms of fact... A fundamental
:13:24. > :13:29.mistake! The course you are cynical and would say almost anything to
:13:30. > :13:33.win. It was not my figure and argue very strongly against it. It was one
:13:34. > :13:37.of the most that regular acts of litter called dishonest on the part
:13:38. > :13:44.of a number of opportunists and populists. I bought interested in
:13:45. > :13:51.the intellectual bases EU approach of this. All those of reasonable and
:13:52. > :13:58.rational mind must be pro- remaining in the EU- you seem to assume that
:13:59. > :14:05.those who won the argument are nothing but opportunists and liars?
:14:06. > :14:13.Am not going to back pedal about my dismay at the intellectual
:14:14. > :14:19.dishonesty of otherwise intelligent people who sought to persuade people
:14:20. > :14:23.about this sort of Utopia beckoning. I want your opinion on what you are
:14:24. > :14:30.seeing from the British government? About what kind of Brexit Theresa
:14:31. > :14:32.May wants. Are you worried about the sense of confusion and K is the EC
:14:33. > :15:25.in London? In your opinion, does it have to be
:15:26. > :15:29.the so-called hard Brexit? President Hollande has said that Britain will
:15:30. > :15:31.have to pay a heavy price for leaving the European Union, and
:15:32. > :15:36.therefore, he seems to be suggesting that the idea that we stay in the
:15:37. > :15:40.single market or have preferential access to the single market, it is
:15:41. > :16:02.not going to be possible. What is your view?
:16:03. > :16:08.This could be the beginning of the unravelling of the European Union. I
:16:09. > :16:14.agree, it cannot be excluded. That could be terrible for Britain. Also,
:16:15. > :16:17.I think it would be terrible to have a united Europe to Britain's
:16:18. > :16:22.exclusion, which is something that Britain tried to prevent 500 years.
:16:23. > :16:26.We will miss you. The European Union with Britain in it was better than
:16:27. > :16:31.what we are going to get now, but you have made your decision. We have
:16:32. > :16:36.to take care of our union, do have to take care of your union. We are
:16:37. > :16:41.facing an existential crisis as never before. It is a crisis of
:16:42. > :16:48.solidarity. Everybody is talking the national talk, and pass imperilling
:16:49. > :16:55.the European Union and its ability to commonly act. This could be the
:16:56. > :16:59.new experience, the new situation, that failure of Europe is possible,
:17:00. > :17:02.and I think we have even more awareness of this new possibility
:17:03. > :17:08.which has not been there since World War Two. Do you see yourself and
:17:09. > :17:12.your political movement as part of a worldwide phenomenon? I am thinking
:17:13. > :17:16.of Donald Trump in the United States, I am thinking of the vote
:17:17. > :17:20.for Brexit in the United Kingdom. Do you think something is happening
:17:21. > :18:29.which the Front National, your party, is a part of?
:18:30. > :18:37.Every year, HARDtalk throws up moments of tension, drama and deep
:18:38. > :18:41.emotion. It can be political, like my encounter with a member of South
:18:42. > :18:48.Africa's troubled government, or it can be personal. Either way, it is
:18:49. > :18:50.compelling. There is no legal or constitutional reason for the
:18:51. > :18:56.President to leave office. It becomes a political question. One of
:18:57. > :19:00.the most important ministers in your government, the government which you
:19:01. > :19:05.loyally serve, has basically declared that in his view, given
:19:06. > :19:08.what the Constitutional Court has said, the President has roped in his
:19:09. > :19:17.contract with the people. I am asking you. Do you agree with that,
:19:18. > :19:22.or disagree? I... I think the minister was actually saying, he was
:19:23. > :19:25.warning us, that we cannot operate beyond the bounds of the
:19:26. > :19:29.constitution. We have to operate within the framework of the
:19:30. > :19:34.constitution. The President is way beyond the bounds of the
:19:35. > :19:38.constitution. Well, I think that is a matter of debate and discussion,
:19:39. > :19:42.so what I am saying is that I inked that from a legal and constitutional
:19:43. > :19:46.point of view, there is no reason for the President to leave office.
:19:47. > :19:50.Minister, are you in any way embarrassed by the answer is that
:19:51. > :19:53.you feel you have had to give to me today, presumably for political
:19:54. > :19:58.reasons? I haven't any reason to be embarrassed. I am just telling you
:19:59. > :20:01.the way I look at the situation in South Africa, that we have got a
:20:02. > :20:05.functioning government in place, we have got a president in place, which
:20:06. > :20:09.there have been some unfortunate incidents around. This wonderful
:20:10. > :20:13.creation of yours, which has in essence to find your career, and
:20:14. > :20:25.that if this marvellous lady, the veto. -- Evita. She is this sort of
:20:26. > :20:29.wonderful Afrikaans woman, obviously a creation, you are in drag. Let's
:20:30. > :20:33.get our first look at Evita herself, in the most iconic circumstances,
:20:34. > :20:36.perhaps one of the most memorable times of your life, actually
:20:37. > :20:41.interviewing Nelson Mandela just months after he was released in
:20:42. > :20:46.1994. Let's play this video clip and give everybody an idea. In the old
:20:47. > :20:49.days, as you probably remember, Afrikaners like me were frightened
:20:50. > :20:54.that when black South Africans would take control of South Africa, all
:20:55. > :20:58.the old symbols, the old paintings, the old furniture would be removed,
:20:59. > :21:04.and we are so happy to see that everything is still here. Minorities
:21:05. > :21:09.are entitled to be concerned about the type of changes that have taken
:21:10. > :21:16.place in our country. The task of the government and the ANC
:21:17. > :21:21.leadership will be to ensure the white South Africans that change
:21:22. > :21:27.will not mean a reversal of the position where blacks were oppressed
:21:28. > :21:31.by the white minority and the other minorities. And I think that we have
:21:32. > :21:37.succeeded, we are succeeding in addressing their fears. I mean, what
:21:38. > :21:40.is beautiful about that is that Mandela appears to be taking it very
:21:41. > :21:45.seriously. Very seriously. And we sat down I was ready with
:21:46. > :21:49.everything, which is frightening when a film crew weights, you know,
:21:50. > :21:52.it is like waiting for the death warrant, the death sentence. And we
:21:53. > :21:58.could hear his voice down the passage. He walked in, he came
:21:59. > :22:03.round, he saw Evita and he said, Evita, you look so beautiful. He sat
:22:04. > :22:07.down and I said, President Mandela, thank you so much for allowing us
:22:08. > :22:12.this 30 minutes. It was a 30 minute interview. He said, no, I want to be
:22:13. > :22:15.at Evita's show because I have important things to say at nobody
:22:16. > :22:21.watches the news. I like this phrase that one of your critics came up
:22:22. > :22:30.with. Every online pronouncements from planet well. You being the
:22:31. > :22:36.ruler of Planet Wealth. Is there a spaceship bike and take there, too
:22:37. > :22:40.Planet Wealth? You know, the truth of the matter is, we have a complete
:22:41. > :22:46.range of price points on the site. You know, we have $8 lip balm, we
:22:47. > :22:53.have $12 non-toxic deodorant, and also, to be honest, we have a bit of
:22:54. > :22:57.fun and we will affiliate link to a $15,000 gold dildo just to trawl
:22:58. > :23:01.people back. The two things that I remember most that I will not get
:23:02. > :23:05.over, and that I probably worry about all the time, the feeling of
:23:06. > :23:08.being existential, of having no power, that nobody cares, you are
:23:09. > :23:13.invisible, you are nothing, you are not going to amount to anything, and
:23:14. > :23:17.there is a part of me that I will always feel like somehow it is going
:23:18. > :23:23.to turn out that way again. I will live running with that chasing me,
:23:24. > :23:28.that I will be that helpless child, once again. And that is what keeps
:23:29. > :23:31.me going, and you do not get over these things. And I think that
:23:32. > :23:34.sometimes when I immerse myself in the traumas and the tragedies of
:23:35. > :23:39.other people, because I desperately need to try to heal other people,
:23:40. > :23:43.because I know what it feels like to have nobody come and do that for
:23:44. > :23:47.you. So, you know, life is a struggle and it is what we make of
:23:48. > :23:52.it, and I am so grateful to have the success that I have, but I also want
:23:53. > :23:56.to feel that I make the world a better place and that I leave it a
:23:57. > :24:00.better place and that I am honest while I am here, even if it is hard,
:24:01. > :24:04.which is one of the reasons I want to do your show, because I want some
:24:05. > :24:08.big asks me the hard questions that we should all be giving hard answers
:24:09. > :24:12.to. I get to produce something beautiful out of it. The art is fun.
:24:13. > :24:15.If I entertain people, then I have taken something and actually created
:24:16. > :24:19.something good about something that maybe didn't start out so hot. 2016
:24:20. > :24:22.was a year that stirred deep emotion and turned conventional wisdom on
:24:23. > :24:28.its head. My only prediction for 2017, HARDtalk will still be roving
:24:29. > :24:30.the world with the questions that matter. Until then, have a very
:24:31. > :24:33.happy New Year.