0:00:04 > 0:00:07Now on BBC News, it's time for HARDtalk.
0:00:11 > 0:00:12Welcome to HARDtalk.
0:00:12 > 0:00:16I'm Stephen Sackur.
0:00:16 > 0:00:21To make it to the top in the world of ballet requires not just
0:00:21 > 0:00:23extraordinary talent, but immense reserves of physical
0:00:23 > 0:00:27and mental determination.
0:00:27 > 0:00:30So imagine how much more it takes if your childhood
0:00:30 > 0:00:33is torn apart by civil war, hunger and homelessness.
0:00:33 > 0:00:37Today's guest, Michaela DePrince, has made a remarkable journey
0:00:37 > 0:00:39from horrific suffering in Sierra Leone to accolades
0:00:39 > 0:00:43in the world of international dance.
0:00:43 > 0:00:46How on Earth did she make it happen?
0:01:12 > 0:01:14Michaela DePrince, welcome to HARDtalk.
0:01:14 > 0:01:17Thank you, thank you.
0:01:17 > 0:01:20It's almost a cliche to talk about people who have made
0:01:20 > 0:01:22remarkable journeys, but you really have.
0:01:22 > 0:01:25And I want to know today, as you sit here with me
0:01:25 > 0:01:32as an internationally acclaimed ballerina, how connected do you feel
0:01:32 > 0:01:36to that little girl who was born and brought up in the first few
0:01:36 > 0:01:38years of her life in Sierra Leone?
0:01:38 > 0:01:42I don't feel as connected as I used to be to her.
0:01:42 > 0:01:46I do have those days where I still have those horrible
0:01:46 > 0:01:48nightmares about my past in Sierra Leone, but, really,
0:01:48 > 0:01:50I'm just Michaela DePrince now.
0:01:50 > 0:01:52I'm not Mabinty Bangura any more.
0:01:52 > 0:02:01What about your memories of Mabinty?
0:02:01 > 0:02:04I mean of the girl you were born as, and raised by a family
0:02:04 > 0:02:07who were caught up in the most terrible way in Sierra
0:02:07 > 0:02:08Leone's civil war.
0:02:08 > 0:02:11For me, it's just - it's mostly just little tiny images
0:02:11 > 0:02:12and the only parts
0:02:12 > 0:02:13I really remember now...
0:02:13 > 0:02:16I don't remember the faces of my biological mom and father.
0:02:16 > 0:02:20I can see their figures but I don't even remember what they looked like.
0:02:20 > 0:02:23And if I'm thinking or dreaming or having a nightmare,
0:02:23 > 0:02:26it's mostly about running from the rebels, all the things that
0:02:26 > 0:02:30people were yelling at me about, or it's mostly those things and just
0:02:30 > 0:02:33the emotions I was feeling, and that's what I wake up yelling
0:02:33 > 0:02:38and screaming about and having to recover from.
0:02:38 > 0:02:41And going to be able to recover from that and still being able
0:02:41 > 0:02:43to go to work that day.
0:02:43 > 0:02:45It's interesting you say you feel less connected
0:02:45 > 0:02:48than you used to and, of course, as you grow up,
0:02:48 > 0:02:52the memories become more distant, but it is interesting to me that
0:02:52 > 0:02:54you've chosen to write about it for a young
0:02:54 > 0:02:55audience around the world.
0:02:55 > 0:02:58This book, Ballerina Dreams, has recently come out in Europe.
0:02:58 > 0:03:02And it's billed as a true story, and you do go
0:03:02 > 0:03:05into some detail of what it was like to be
0:03:05 > 0:03:07a girl at a time of war.
0:03:07 > 0:03:09So you don't want to completely forget about it.
0:03:09 > 0:03:12No, I don't want to completely forget about it.
0:03:12 > 0:03:18It's made me who I am today.
0:03:18 > 0:03:21It doesn't have as many details as it could,
0:03:21 > 0:03:24but I think it is very important for people not to forget
0:03:24 > 0:03:26about the struggles they have been through because it
0:03:26 > 0:03:27creates who you are.
0:03:27 > 0:03:30And if I didn't go through those things, I wouldn't be
0:03:30 > 0:03:34as strong as I am today, because I go through horrible things
0:03:34 > 0:03:37every single day in my dance career and people say things to me that
0:03:37 > 0:03:41maybe I would cry about, but I don't - it doesn't necessarily
0:03:41 > 0:03:43faze me any more, because of the things I've
0:03:43 > 0:03:44been said to before.
0:03:44 > 0:03:46You talk about how strong you are today.
0:03:46 > 0:03:47Let's give people,
0:03:47 > 0:03:50at an early point in this conversation, a real sense
0:03:50 > 0:03:52of what you do, and how you dance.
0:03:52 > 0:03:55Let's look, I think, at a performance from last year,
0:03:55 > 0:03:57of you in the Nutcracker in the Dutch National Ballet.
0:03:58 > 0:03:58Yes.
0:03:58 > 0:04:00MUSIC: Dance of the Sugar Plum Fairy.
0:04:21 > 0:04:24It's gorgeous to look at and, of course, so many people
0:04:24 > 0:04:27know the Nutcracker, but, then, to think back to some
0:04:27 > 0:04:34of the very specific experiences that you went through as a young
0:04:34 > 0:04:41girl, it is almost unbelievable that you've come from there to here.
0:04:41 > 0:04:44So I do want you to just go into a little bit
0:04:44 > 0:04:47of detail about the degree to which Sierra Leone's
0:04:47 > 0:04:49war had a very direct and personal impact upon you.
0:04:49 > 0:04:52I mean just catalogue a few of the terrible things.
0:04:52 > 0:04:55Well, because of the war, my father was shot by the rebels.
0:04:56 > 0:04:58And my biological parents were the only people who believed
0:04:58 > 0:05:00in me, because of my vitiligo.
0:05:00 > 0:05:02In Sierra Leone, they did not understand that vitiligo
0:05:02 > 0:05:04was just a skin condition.
0:05:04 > 0:05:05And let me just stop you there,
0:05:05 > 0:05:08because there will be people around the world
0:05:08 > 0:05:10who do not know who vitiligo.
0:05:10 > 0:05:12It's a pigmentation issue in your skin.
0:05:12 > 0:05:12Yes.
0:05:12 > 0:05:14A loss of pigment in your skin.
0:05:14 > 0:05:16But, unfortunately, in Sierra Leone at the time,
0:05:16 > 0:05:19they just didn't have books or equipment to look up what this
0:05:19 > 0:05:24was, and so they discriminated me, they ridiculed me, they harassed me.
0:05:24 > 0:05:27I mean, to look at you, you look absolutely fine.
0:05:27 > 0:05:27Thanks.
0:05:27 > 0:05:32But you do have this pigmentation issue.
0:05:32 > 0:05:36Yet, from all the way from here and all the way along, my torso.
0:05:36 > 0:05:39On my hands and my arms and my back.
0:05:39 > 0:05:42It gets more and more also when I'm older and also
0:05:42 > 0:05:45some of them fade away, but it was a lot brighter also,
0:05:45 > 0:05:46when I was younger.
0:05:46 > 0:05:51But they didn't understand it, so they called me the devil's child.
0:05:51 > 0:05:54And when my father was shot by the rebels, that meant
0:05:54 > 0:06:01that we didn't really have any source of income for food.
0:06:01 > 0:06:04So then my mum and I - my biological mum and I -
0:06:04 > 0:06:06had to move in with my uncle.
0:06:06 > 0:06:09But my uncle wanted nothing to do with me,
0:06:09 > 0:06:12and so when she passed away, because she ended up starving
0:06:12 > 0:06:15to death, or had a disease, he didn't see any point
0:06:15 > 0:06:17in wasting his money or his food on a child
0:06:17 > 0:06:20who doesn't deserve it, in his mind, so he sent me
0:06:21 > 0:06:24to the orphanage and never came to see if I was OK, or anything.
0:06:24 > 0:06:27And then also, in the orphanage, thinking, OK, I'm surrounded
0:06:27 > 0:06:30by people who might care about me, they ranked us by favourites.
0:06:30 > 0:06:33Number one was the favourite child, number 27 was
0:06:33 > 0:06:34the least-favourite child.
0:06:34 > 0:06:36And because of my vitiligo, I was number 27, the
0:06:36 > 0:06:37least-favourite child.
0:06:37 > 0:06:40And so that meant I got the smallest portion of food
0:06:40 > 0:06:41and the last choice of clothes.
0:06:41 > 0:06:43And you would have thought,
0:06:43 > 0:06:45you know, these kids have been through so much -
0:06:45 > 0:06:48they've lost their parents or their parents weren't able
0:06:48 > 0:06:51to take care of them - that maybe we will show them
0:06:51 > 0:06:54that they are loved and that people care about them.
0:06:54 > 0:06:57And unfortunately, that wasn't the case for me at all.
0:06:57 > 0:07:00But I did have somebody in the orphanage who did care about me.
0:07:00 > 0:07:01Actually, two people.
0:07:01 > 0:07:03Number 26, my best friend, and my sister.
0:07:03 > 0:07:08She was number 26 because she was left-handed,
0:07:08 > 0:07:11and she used to wet the bed, and they didn't understand
0:07:12 > 0:07:12that, you know.
0:07:12 > 0:07:18Well, they didn't understand a lot of things.
0:07:18 > 0:07:22And it's not their fault that they didn't understand that,
0:07:22 > 0:07:26I understand as an older person now, but, before, I just made it seem
0:07:26 > 0:07:30like it didn't faze me, I didn't care if they didn't like me.
0:07:30 > 0:07:33Were you, in this orphanage, at least detected from the really
0:07:33 > 0:07:34brutal violence of the civil war?
0:07:34 > 0:07:36Well, you'll see in a few minutes.
0:07:36 > 0:07:39So we had a teacher who came to the orphanage
0:07:39 > 0:07:41and she was pregnant at the time.
0:07:41 > 0:07:43And this story is in the children's book.
0:07:43 > 0:07:44She cared about me.
0:07:44 > 0:07:45She taught us English.
0:07:45 > 0:07:49I used to always walk her to the gate and she was the one
0:07:49 > 0:07:52who told me about the Ballerina that I found, like, the magazine.
0:07:52 > 0:07:53That she was a ballerina.
0:07:57 > 0:08:00And she was also telling me, maybe you'll become this
0:08:00 > 0:08:00ballerina one day.
0:08:00 > 0:08:03She was, it away, the one who planted the vision
0:08:03 > 0:08:06in your mind off this beautiful, beautiful sort of mythical figure
0:08:06 > 0:08:09of the ballerina who could be happy and who could dance.
0:08:09 > 0:08:09Yes.
0:08:09 > 0:08:13And so I walked her to the orphanage gate and these two rebels come,
0:08:13 > 0:08:16intoxicated with either drugs or alcohol in their system,
0:08:16 > 0:08:18with this little rebel, and they pull out their machete.
0:08:18 > 0:08:23And they cut her open to see if there was a baby girl or baby boy.
0:08:23 > 0:08:24And they were betting.
0:08:24 > 0:08:27So one of them was like, "No, it's going to be a boy,
0:08:27 > 0:08:29it's going to be a girl."
0:08:29 > 0:08:31And it ended up being a girl.
0:08:31 > 0:08:33And they didn't like that, because usually they turned
0:08:33 > 0:08:36the little baby boys into young soldier rebels.
0:08:36 > 0:08:39And so they are upset and so they end up cutting her arms
0:08:39 > 0:08:41and legs off in front of me.
0:08:41 > 0:08:44I tried to go save her and they did the same to me
0:08:45 > 0:08:46and cut my stomach open.
0:08:46 > 0:08:47And so, because of that...
0:08:47 > 0:08:49I'm sorry, how old are you?
0:08:49 > 0:08:49I was about three years old.
0:08:50 > 0:08:51And because of that...
0:08:51 > 0:08:52I am sorry to interrupt.
0:08:52 > 0:08:55You said to be earlier that you try to distance yourself.
0:08:55 > 0:08:57Do you actually remember this?
0:08:57 > 0:08:57Yes.
0:08:57 > 0:09:01But it easier for me to tell it so I don't did emotional, faster,
0:09:01 > 0:09:02than to be able to...
0:09:02 > 0:09:05It is easier for me now to say it with a wall,
0:09:06 > 0:09:09instead of thinking about it, because it's too painful to think
0:09:09 > 0:09:10about and to feel those emotions.
0:09:10 > 0:09:13It's hard for me to be able to continue my day,
0:09:13 > 0:09:17or to continue what I want to do in my life, because then it's just
0:09:17 > 0:09:19going to hold me back.
0:09:19 > 0:09:21It's just...
0:09:21 > 0:09:25Even as we talk about it, it is so shocking to hear it,
0:09:25 > 0:09:27I'm wondering whether, as an artist, and you are,
0:09:27 > 0:09:30an extraordinarily expressive artist, using your body to speak
0:09:30 > 0:09:32to audiences around the world.
0:09:32 > 0:09:36How you can find the way to be so expressive when there's so much
0:09:36 > 0:09:39that's locked up inside you.
0:09:39 > 0:09:42That's what has made my career a bit more difficult.
0:09:42 > 0:09:45I think I could have been more artistic sooner if I wasn't having
0:09:45 > 0:09:50to have that wall of emotions locked up for such a long time.
0:09:50 > 0:09:53And that's why I'm incredibly lucky to have the director I have now,
0:09:53 > 0:09:59because he understands that.
0:09:59 > 0:10:03But now, I've - I had to do this performance once and I lost
0:10:03 > 0:10:03a brother,
0:10:03 > 0:10:05when I got adopted.
0:10:05 > 0:10:08Because I always assumed I am going to lose people I love,
0:10:08 > 0:10:12so I ended up having to also having to tell myself not to love people,
0:10:12 > 0:10:18for quite a long time.
0:10:18 > 0:10:20And then I finally let somebody in again, to -
0:10:20 > 0:10:23you know, that I cared about, and he ended up passing away.
0:10:24 > 0:10:27I had to do a piece about death and I ended up crying on stage,
0:10:28 > 0:10:30because I have to think about the fact...
0:10:30 > 0:10:32I have to think about my brother, Teddy.
0:10:32 > 0:10:34But you know, that's what makes us so beautiful,
0:10:34 > 0:10:37though, that you can use the things that
0:10:37 > 0:10:38you've been through to
0:10:38 > 0:10:41connect with the audience, and that is what art is and that's
0:10:41 > 0:10:42what makes us so passionate.
0:10:42 > 0:10:45And it means sometimes it's hard, but, at the same time,
0:10:45 > 0:10:48you have to have the right support system, the right people
0:10:48 > 0:10:52who can help you, bring you back into reality.
0:10:52 > 0:10:55Do you think, in a sense, finding your path, through dance,
0:10:55 > 0:10:56sort of saved you?
0:10:56 > 0:10:57Oh, it definitely saved me.
0:10:57 > 0:10:57Definitely.
0:10:58 > 0:11:01I don't think I would be the person I am today.
0:11:01 > 0:11:02I don't think I would be...
0:11:02 > 0:11:06I don't think I would be happy at all, if I hadn't danced.
0:11:06 > 0:11:09I would be still that angry little girl that I was.
0:11:09 > 0:11:12And yet, if we fast forward, you were adopted, in the end,
0:11:12 > 0:11:15by an American family, and you were taken to the
0:11:15 > 0:11:17United States into a comfortable, relatively prosperous home.
0:11:17 > 0:11:18Wonderful home, yeah.
0:11:18 > 0:11:21And that's when you got the opportunity to go to ballet
0:11:21 > 0:11:22school, to learn how to dance.
0:11:22 > 0:11:23Yeah.
0:11:23 > 0:11:25But - and here's what's interesting to me -
0:11:25 > 0:11:29even then, in that new, comfortable environment,
0:11:29 > 0:11:32you still had an enormous struggle, because, let's face it,
0:11:32 > 0:11:36you were trying to make it in a world which is extraordinarily
0:11:36 > 0:11:42white and where black dancers have an awful lot of, sort of,
0:11:42 > 0:11:45conventional wisdom which says black dancers simply can't do ballet.
0:11:45 > 0:11:45Yeah.
0:11:46 > 0:11:48I thought it was going to be completely easy,
0:11:48 > 0:11:53but then the older I got, the more I noticed there aren't any
0:11:53 > 0:11:54dancers who look like me.
0:11:54 > 0:11:57Why is that?
0:11:57 > 0:12:00But I had the opportunity...
0:12:00 > 0:12:02There was a dancer from the Pennsylvania Ballet,
0:12:02 > 0:12:03Heidi Cruz.
0:12:03 > 0:12:05She was the only one who looked like me.
0:12:05 > 0:12:09And she was also one of the people who was one of my role models,
0:12:09 > 0:12:12who told me to never give up on my dream.
0:12:12 > 0:12:15There is another beautiful dancer, Lauren Anderson, who was also
0:12:15 > 0:12:16a role model for me.
0:12:16 > 0:12:19But, out of how many dancers, how many black dancers,
0:12:19 > 0:12:21I'm sure there have been, why were there only two?
0:12:22 > 0:12:24Here's a quote from something you said a while ago:
0:12:24 > 0:12:28"When I was young, as a dancer," you said, "I overheard one
0:12:28 > 0:12:32of the directors working with us saying, 'We don't put a lot
0:12:32 > 0:12:35of effort into the black girls, because they end up getting fat.'"
0:12:35 > 0:12:37Yeah. That's a pretty horrible...
0:12:37 > 0:12:40And yet, you said to yourself, "Never mind all this,
0:12:40 > 0:12:43this is still the world I want to be in."
0:12:43 > 0:12:43Yeah.
0:12:43 > 0:12:46And maybe I'm a bit crazy, but, the thing is, for me,
0:12:46 > 0:12:50I love proving people wrong.
0:12:50 > 0:12:54It's my thing that I love to do, and that's what got me
0:12:54 > 0:12:56through the whole thing in Sierra Leone, and that's
0:12:56 > 0:13:02what is going to continue to get me through life.
0:13:02 > 0:13:06You can't just think that somebody's going to be a certain way,
0:13:06 > 0:13:07just because somebody else was like that.
0:13:07 > 0:13:11It's not fair that you are going to give up on somebody just
0:13:11 > 0:13:15because you want to see them in a certain light.
0:13:15 > 0:13:17When you were 17, and we should remind people,
0:13:17 > 0:13:19you are only 22 now.
0:13:19 > 0:13:22But when you were 17, and wanted to join a professional
0:13:22 > 0:13:24company, you looked to Europe and you found,
0:13:24 > 0:13:29or the Dutch National Ballet found you, and they offered you this
0:13:29 > 0:13:33position and you said it felt like your Rosa Parks moment.
0:13:33 > 0:13:33Yes.
0:13:33 > 0:13:34And every single time this company
0:13:34 > 0:13:36continues to surprise me
0:13:36 > 0:13:39by promoting me and believing in me and I'm just incredibly grateful
0:13:39 > 0:13:42for this opportunity.
0:13:42 > 0:13:45And I'm incredibly grateful by the fact that in Europe
0:13:45 > 0:13:48in general, what I've experienced, also in London, when I danced
0:13:48 > 0:13:51with English National Ballet, is the fact that they're not looking
0:13:51 > 0:13:52at my skin colour.
0:13:52 > 0:13:56They're looking at the fact that I'm just an artist who wants to move
0:13:56 > 0:13:59people and he wants to change people's lives by having them
0:13:59 > 0:14:00come see me perform.
0:14:00 > 0:14:07In that spirit, let's look at our second clip of you recently
0:14:07 > 0:14:10in a performance of Swan Lake with the Dutch National Ballet.
0:14:33 > 0:14:37Now, Michaela, you say, you know, your ambition is to be an artist
0:14:37 > 0:14:40who is never judged on the colour of her skin, but one cannot help
0:14:41 > 0:14:43noticing, as we look at you moving so beautifully there,
0:14:43 > 0:14:47that pretty much everybody else in the ensemble is white.
0:14:47 > 0:14:50I just wonder whether even today you feel there is an extra scrutiny
0:14:50 > 0:14:53on you because you still, it has to be said, unusual
0:14:53 > 0:15:00in the world you've chosen to live in.
0:15:00 > 0:15:04Yeah.
0:15:04 > 0:15:07I think it's time for that not to be a discussion any more.
0:15:07 > 0:15:15That there is only one black arena at the Dutch National Ballet.
0:15:15 > 0:15:21I even thought, in the Nutcracker, in the beginning there is a small
0:15:21 > 0:15:24Marie, a small Clara, and it was an Asian girl.
0:15:24 > 0:15:26And all of a sudden she turns black.
0:15:26 > 0:15:27For me, I think that's...
0:15:27 > 0:15:27Why?
0:15:27 > 0:15:30Why couldn't we have a little black Clara or Marie?
0:15:30 > 0:15:33So I think it's time for a change and I'm hoping it's happening.
0:15:34 > 0:15:36It's a slow process but it needs to happen faster,
0:15:36 > 0:15:38it really does.
0:15:38 > 0:15:45I suppose, in a way, ballet is one of those artforms
0:15:45 > 0:15:48that is so steeped in tradition, born out of performances that began
0:15:48 > 0:15:52in Europe's while houses and among the elites of Europe.
0:15:52 > 0:15:58There is perhaps a snobbishness in ballet that isn't
0:15:58 > 0:15:59there in some other artforms.
0:15:59 > 0:16:02Yeah, I think some people are scared of change,
0:16:02 > 0:16:04or the fact how people will respond to change.
0:16:04 > 0:16:07Now, you just saw in the video, I am wearing pink tights,
0:16:08 > 0:16:10and that was, I think, that most of the people,
0:16:10 > 0:16:13most dancers wore white and they wore pink tights
0:16:13 > 0:16:14to complete the line.
0:16:14 > 0:16:17But I'm brown, so, for me to wear pink tights,
0:16:17 > 0:16:18it destroys my line completely.
0:16:18 > 0:16:21So now, in all my performances, I'm going to wear brown tights.
0:16:21 > 0:16:25But you never think to yourself, you know what, this world is just
0:16:25 > 0:16:26beyond the pale for me?
0:16:26 > 0:16:28There are so many other creative forms of dance,
0:16:28 > 0:16:30all sorts of wonderful contemporary dance.
0:16:30 > 0:16:33And I know you do some of that, too.
0:16:33 > 0:16:34I love it, yeah, it's fun.
0:16:34 > 0:16:36You won't give up on the ballet?
0:16:36 > 0:16:37No, no.
0:16:37 > 0:16:39I love wearing tutus and I love the romantic stories.
0:16:39 > 0:16:47It's like as if I'm a little girl playing dress-up.
0:16:47 > 0:16:49I love the way it makes me feel.
0:16:49 > 0:16:52But I also love doing contemporary stuff, which is being myself
0:16:52 > 0:16:56and being feisty, but being romantic at the same time.
0:16:56 > 0:16:57It's an amazing opportunity.
0:16:57 > 0:17:01Let me now bring you back to personal stuff and in particular
0:17:01 > 0:17:03your take on going back to Sierra Leone.
0:17:03 > 0:17:05Because you've become an ambassador for War Child,
0:17:05 > 0:17:08an organisation which is devoted to helping children caught up
0:17:08 > 0:17:11in wars around the world.
0:17:11 > 0:17:14Yet it strikes me that you've never been back to what is your native
0:17:15 > 0:17:19land, your home.
0:17:19 > 0:17:20I would love to go back.
0:17:20 > 0:17:23I became the ambassador with War Child Holland just last
0:17:23 > 0:17:26year and I would love to go back to Sierra Leone,
0:17:26 > 0:17:30but it has to do with the fact that if I'm ready mentally.
0:17:30 > 0:17:33I went to South Africa four years ago, for the first time,
0:17:33 > 0:17:34and I was terrified.
0:17:34 > 0:17:44Because I was so scared that I would get the memories,
0:17:44 > 0:17:47or exactly the full memories of people'sfaces, the emotions
0:17:47 > 0:17:49rushing back, and what happens if I would freeze completely?
0:17:50 > 0:17:52I didn't have any family member with me.
0:17:52 > 0:17:56How would I be able to function and perform and do what I came to do
0:17:56 > 0:17:57in South Africa?
0:17:57 > 0:18:00It suggests to me there is still an awful lot of trauma
0:18:00 > 0:18:01in your mind.
0:18:01 > 0:18:01Exactly.
0:18:01 > 0:18:03And it's not like I was just...
0:18:03 > 0:18:07A lot of the kids in the orphanage did not go through the amount
0:18:07 > 0:18:09of things that I went through.
0:18:09 > 0:18:11My sister went through a lot, also.
0:18:11 > 0:18:11My other sister.
0:18:11 > 0:18:16It's just the thing is I need to be able to have the amount of support
0:18:16 > 0:18:17when I go there.
0:18:17 > 0:18:18I'm going to go back.
0:18:18 > 0:18:20I want to start a school there.
0:18:20 > 0:18:22I want to start an art school there.
0:18:22 > 0:18:23It's going to happen.
0:18:23 > 0:18:26It strikes me, we talk about inspirational figures,
0:18:26 > 0:18:29but what you could offer the kids, the young people of Sierra Leone,
0:18:29 > 0:18:30is something extraordinary.
0:18:30 > 0:18:32A story like no other.
0:18:32 > 0:18:35No, I would definitely love to go back, but I don't know
0:18:35 > 0:18:37if you know my schedule.
0:18:37 > 0:18:39I work from ten to six every day.
0:18:39 > 0:18:42I barely even get a week off during the summer.
0:18:42 > 0:18:43But it's going to happen.
0:18:43 > 0:18:46I'm actually hoping maybe I can go this summer with another ambassador,
0:18:46 > 0:18:50an ambassador here, actually, in War Child UK.
0:18:50 > 0:18:53I know this is a very intrusive question and maybe raises
0:18:53 > 0:18:56lots of painful issues, but do you know, for example,
0:18:56 > 0:18:58what has happened to your uncle?
0:18:58 > 0:19:01The man who, in many ways, gave your way to the orphanage,
0:19:01 > 0:19:09who refused to acknowledge or as part of his family.
0:19:09 > 0:19:13Well, I've gotten a Facebook message from him asking for money.
0:19:13 > 0:19:15Also from the person who ran the orphanage,
0:19:15 > 0:19:17because of my story and stuff.
0:19:17 > 0:19:20You know, the thing is, first I was really angry,
0:19:20 > 0:19:30but I forgiven him and I forgiven the person who ran the orphanage.
0:19:30 > 0:19:32Thing is, they don't deserve high forgiveness,
0:19:32 > 0:19:36but I'm a bigger person and I think there is no reason for me to hold
0:19:36 > 0:19:39a grudge any more because it's not going to help me move
0:19:39 > 0:19:44on with my life and I deserve a lot more than to focus on what they did
0:19:44 > 0:19:45to me before.
0:19:45 > 0:19:47And they don't deserve me even to talk about them.
0:19:47 > 0:19:50There's another aspect of this that raises important moral and ethical
0:19:50 > 0:19:56issues and batteries you are by no means the only child who was plucked
0:19:56 > 0:19:59out of difficult, sometimes awful circumstances in Africa,
0:19:59 > 0:20:05and adopted by families desperate to get a child for their family
0:20:05 > 0:20:09in the rich west - in the United States,
0:20:09 > 0:20:13but it happens in other western countries, too.
0:20:13 > 0:20:17Are you a great believer in the idea that that is the right and proper
0:20:17 > 0:20:18thing to do?
0:20:18 > 0:20:19To adopt?
0:20:19 > 0:20:22To adopt, to allow international adoption so the kids are plucked far
0:20:22 > 0:20:24away from their home countries and cultures.
0:20:24 > 0:20:25I think it's...
0:20:25 > 0:20:34For me, I believe it was the best thing.
0:20:34 > 0:20:36One, it saved my life.
0:20:36 > 0:20:37I would not be alive today.
0:20:37 > 0:20:38You really believe that?
0:20:38 > 0:20:40No, I was very sick.
0:20:40 > 0:20:41I had 106 fever Fahrenheit.
0:20:41 > 0:20:53I don't know what it is in Celsius.
0:20:53 > 0:20:54Yeah, well that's dangerous, yeah.
0:20:54 > 0:20:54Yet.
0:20:55 > 0:20:58And I would not be alive today.
0:20:58 > 0:21:01I also had a hernia, where my organs were coming
0:21:01 > 0:21:02out, so no.
0:21:02 > 0:21:05But I also think the thing is it's very important to also
0:21:05 > 0:21:07educate your children about the culture they came from,
0:21:07 > 0:21:10so they understand what they've been through so they don't forget.
0:21:10 > 0:21:14Because some kids, they do forget where they've come from and then
0:21:14 > 0:21:15they feel like they're missing something.
0:21:15 > 0:21:19I think adoption is an amazing thing and I am just so grateful.
0:21:19 > 0:21:19My other...
0:21:19 > 0:21:23Well, 11 kids in my family, but the other nine who are adopted
0:21:23 > 0:21:24are so grateful for their life.
0:21:24 > 0:21:27The flip side of it, and I know this doesn't apply
0:21:27 > 0:21:32to you, but the flip side of it - and it came out in a major report
0:21:32 > 0:21:36in 2012 from the African Child Policy Forum, and I'm just quoting
0:21:36 > 0:21:39a tiny bit of it, aying "the majority of so-called orphans
0:21:39 > 0:21:41adopted from Africa have, actually, at least one living parent
0:21:41 > 0:21:45and many of these children have been trafficked or sold by their parents.
0:21:45 > 0:21:45Yeah.
0:21:45 > 0:21:47And if you allow international adoption, then the message
0:21:47 > 0:21:50from a variety of different sources, including that major report,
0:21:50 > 0:21:53is that it leads to these terrible situation is,
0:21:53 > 0:21:54abuse of the system.
0:21:54 > 0:21:55That's the thing.
0:21:55 > 0:21:58I saw this documentary a few years ago about that and that's
0:21:58 > 0:22:00what really upsets me, because people believe and then
0:22:00 > 0:22:03they see these negative things about adoption and they don't see
0:22:03 > 0:22:06how many positive outcomes can actually happen through adoption,
0:22:06 > 0:22:09and that makes me really, really sad, because these children
0:22:09 > 0:22:17deserve an amazing life.
0:22:17 > 0:22:19Let's end by talking about identity.
0:22:19 > 0:22:19OK.
0:22:19 > 0:22:22You've gone into a world which is, in some ways, so alien
0:22:22 > 0:22:25to you and your background, and yet you are determined to thrive
0:22:25 > 0:22:30in it and become a major star in it and it seems to be working.
0:22:30 > 0:22:32Also, you switched Countries from Sierra Leone and now
0:22:32 > 0:22:35you are fully American in the way you've been brought up.
0:22:35 > 0:22:38Characterise your identity for me as you see it today.
0:22:38 > 0:22:41I think my identity is very European, not very American.
0:22:41 > 0:22:42Really?
0:22:42 > 0:22:49Yeah, very.
0:22:49 > 0:22:50I think...
0:22:50 > 0:22:50Yes, very.
0:22:50 > 0:22:51Very, especially with...
0:22:51 > 0:22:54Yeah.
0:22:54 > 0:22:57I think you're saying especially with the way America is today.
0:22:57 > 0:23:01I think it is just the way things are going and I'm just a bit sad
0:23:01 > 0:23:03with how things are going in America right now.
0:23:04 > 0:23:07But, at the same time, I am looking forward to going back
0:23:07 > 0:23:10to Africa one day and starting up my school and learning more
0:23:10 > 0:23:13about my culture and bringing all so people I've worked
0:23:13 > 0:23:16with to help me start this school up and having them learn
0:23:16 > 0:23:17about my culture.
0:23:17 > 0:23:19Giving kids an opportunity to just have the chance,
0:23:19 > 0:23:23to have that taste of opportunity that I have been growing up with.
0:23:23 > 0:23:26I think everybody deserves a chance - "maybe I don't like to dance,
0:23:26 > 0:23:30maybe I do like dancing, maybe I love to move this way."
0:23:30 > 0:23:33Just to express themselves in a way where they don't have to talk.
0:23:33 > 0:23:36And when you go back, because you say you will,
0:23:36 > 0:23:43will you go back as an African?
0:23:43 > 0:23:44Um, in what way?
0:23:44 > 0:23:46Just in the way that you present yourself.
0:23:46 > 0:23:49For example, the kids that you will talk about this amazing
0:23:49 > 0:23:51story of yours to in Sierra Leone.
0:23:51 > 0:23:53Will it be an African story?
0:23:53 > 0:23:56I'm not quite sure, I haven't thought about it.
0:23:57 > 0:23:59I'm going to pretty much explains to them how I got...
0:23:59 > 0:24:03Where I came from, how I got to where I am today and see
0:24:03 > 0:24:06if they accepted for what it is I guess that's it.
0:24:06 > 0:24:08Well, it is an amazing, extraordinary story.
0:24:08 > 0:24:09Thank you.
0:24:09 > 0:24:12Michaela DePrince, thank you for being on HARDtalk.
0:24:12 > 0:24:14Thank you so much.
0:24:14 > 0:24:14Thank you.
0:24:14 > 0:24:17Thank you very much indeed.
0:24:43 > 0:24:44Hello there, good morning.