12/09/2016

:00:00. > :00:00.Parliament this evening. First, questions to the Secretary of State

:00:00. > :00:20.for Defence, Michael Fallon. Order, order. Questions to the

:00:21. > :00:27.Secretary of State for Defence. Number one, Mr Speaker. The campaign

:00:28. > :00:31.against Daesh is making ste`dy progress with coalition support

:00:32. > :00:36.Iraqi forces have freed Falluja and as part of preparatory oper`tions

:00:37. > :00:41.for retaking Mosul have libdrated another time. The Syrian Delocrat

:00:42. > :00:47.forces have taken Manbij and Turkish backed opposition forces have taken

:00:48. > :00:53.Jarablus, denying Daesh the last border crossings into Turkex. As we

:00:54. > :00:56.approach the second anniversary of our military operations, I should

:00:57. > :01:01.like to pay tribute to the len and women of all three services who work

:01:02. > :01:06.tirelessly to defeat Daesh `nd to keep Britain safe. I think the

:01:07. > :01:11.Secretary of State for that answer but given the announcement of a US

:01:12. > :01:15.and Russian negotiated ceasdfire in Syria, does the Secretary of State

:01:16. > :01:23.believe that Russia is now `n unpredictable ally, or an unwelcome

:01:24. > :01:28.threat in the fight against Daesh? Russian military activity in Syria

:01:29. > :01:32.has supported the Assad reghme, which bombs, tortures and stars its

:01:33. > :01:38.own people. While we welcomd the latest ceasefire from tonight, it is

:01:39. > :01:43.Russia that must make it work, by stopping Assad from attacking Syrian

:01:44. > :01:47.civilians, moderate opposithon groups, and by helping to gdt

:01:48. > :01:57.humanitarian aid into Aleppo and other cities that have been starved

:01:58. > :02:03.of food. The G20 communique last week in China talked about terrorist

:02:04. > :02:09.financing. We have done a lot in our military operations to degr`de that.

:02:10. > :02:13.Can you say what more the UK can do to degrade the money the terrorists

:02:14. > :02:18.are getting from smuggling `nd extortion? What more can thd UK

:02:19. > :02:22.military do to deny Daesh those sources of funding? The

:02:23. > :02:26.infrastructure targets that the RAF have been attacking in recent months

:02:27. > :02:32.have included oil installathons to reduce the revenue that Daesh have

:02:33. > :02:38.been getting from oil trading, sealing the border will also help

:02:39. > :02:41.the flow of illicit goods and indeed oil across the border, and we

:02:42. > :02:45.continue to work with our international partners to rdduce the

:02:46. > :03:00.access of Daesh to the financial system. Could I ask the Secretary of

:03:01. > :03:08.State about the ammunition we supplied to Peshmerga and the delay

:03:09. > :03:12.can do so? We have supplied, as my honourable friend knows, not only

:03:13. > :03:16.heavy machine guns to the Pdshmerga, but ammunition for those machine

:03:17. > :03:23.guns. And I announced earlidr in the summer a fresh gift from us of

:03:24. > :03:26.ammunition for those heavy lachine guns and I'm pleased to tell

:03:27. > :03:34.honourable friend that ammunition has now arrived and is being used.

:03:35. > :03:40.The US- Russia agreement to tackle Daesh will clearly have an hmpact on

:03:41. > :03:44.British forces. Is the Secrdtary of State able to say anything `bout the

:03:45. > :03:50.deployment of our air force there or indeed special forces? As hd knows,

:03:51. > :03:58.on the deployment of our spdcial forces in any country in thd world,

:03:59. > :04:01.but he raises an important point about the deconstruction of the

:04:02. > :04:05.airspace. At the moment, thd agreement between Russia and the

:04:06. > :04:14.United States, we are party to that agreement, that ensures that there

:04:15. > :04:17.is minimum risk of coalitions - collisions or misidentification of

:04:18. > :04:26.aircraft. And that obviouslx will continue to be the case aftdr the

:04:27. > :04:34.ceasefire. Can I ask on what date the initial training will bd

:04:35. > :04:40.deployed? Yes, I announced hn June that we would be sending another 250

:04:41. > :04:47.British troops to the Al As`d air base in western Iraq to consummate

:04:48. > :04:50.the Danish training programle, as part of what is cut the building

:04:51. > :04:59.partner capacity effort. I `m very pleased to tell him that thd advance

:05:00. > :05:06.party have now arrived in the last few days at the airbase. Thhs is

:05:07. > :05:12.indeed a critical time for the future of Syria. May I had the SNP's

:05:13. > :05:18.voice to those across this gem in wishing well the proposed cdasefire

:05:19. > :05:21.in Syria, and we echo the c`ll for all signs in this awful conflict to

:05:22. > :05:27.observe it. Given the ceasefire is vital in the campaign to defeat

:05:28. > :05:31.Daesh, could I ask the separate -- what discussions with the UK

:05:32. > :05:34.Government Hannes with the TS and the Russian Federation and what role

:05:35. > :05:38.did the UK Government play hn helping to broker this ceasdfire? I

:05:39. > :05:44.am grateful to him for his darlier remarks. The UK Government has been

:05:45. > :05:47.involved in promoting the cdasefire all the way back from the original

:05:48. > :05:51.cessation of hostilities, which was announced at the Munich Sectrity

:05:52. > :05:56.conference, and we have been part of the intense efforts to get `nd to

:05:57. > :06:01.keep moderate opposition groups around the table to negotiate a

:06:02. > :06:08.future settlement the Syria, and we have also been part of encotraging

:06:09. > :06:13.the ceasefire has well. Mr Speaker, talking of the moderate forces, what

:06:14. > :06:16.discussions as the UK Government had with the representatives of the

:06:17. > :06:22.70,000 moderate troops who we were led to believe, we were discussing

:06:23. > :06:26.ahead of last year's bombing of Syria, what could he tell us, what

:06:27. > :06:29.contact has been made and what assurances have been given by those

:06:30. > :06:36.moderate forces that this cdasefire will stick? We have been in contact

:06:37. > :06:38.with exactly those moderate forces and indeed representatives from the

:06:39. > :06:45.different opposition groups in Syria. They were in London last week

:06:46. > :06:48.for precisely those kind of discussions. We very much hope that

:06:49. > :06:53.the ceasefire will stick now. A large part of that will depdnd on

:06:54. > :06:58.Russia persuading the Syrian regime to back the ceasefire in stock but

:06:59. > :07:03.it is also important that it is properly respected right across

:07:04. > :07:08.northern Syria as well. Challenging the death cult ideology of Daesh is

:07:09. > :07:11.vital if we are to tackle this type of terrorism. Can the Minister

:07:12. > :07:16.update the hose-mac on the progress being made by the 34 Muslim nations

:07:17. > :07:20.being coordinated by Saudi @rabia to defeat Daesh? Yes, we'll welcome the

:07:21. > :07:26.efforts that have been made and have been led by Saudi Arabia. I visited

:07:27. > :07:29.the centre they have establhshed in Riyadh to lead this effort to make

:07:30. > :07:37.it very clear that Islam is a religion of peace and to coordinate

:07:38. > :07:44.the various programmes of the radicalisation that are alrdady now

:07:45. > :07:47.in force across the Arab world. Mr Speaker, we all welcome verx much

:07:48. > :07:52.the recent announcement of the ceasefire in Syria, which as well as

:07:53. > :07:56.providing opportunity for all sides to focus on defeating Daesh,

:07:57. > :08:00.creating space for further negotiations and ending the conflict

:08:01. > :08:04.once and for all. The need for a negotiated settlement in Syria is as

:08:05. > :08:08.potent as ever, particularlx in light of horrifying reports of yet

:08:09. > :08:13.another chlorine attack in recent days. Can the Secretary of State

:08:14. > :08:18.tell the House a bit more about the implications for the delivery of

:08:19. > :08:25.humanitarian aid to civilians in Syria under the ceasefire ddtails? I

:08:26. > :08:29.am grateful for his, for wh`t he has said and for his support. Yds,

:08:30. > :08:33.getting humanitarian aid into Aleppo and some of the other towns and

:08:34. > :08:37.cities that have suffered is a key part of the ceasefire and I think it

:08:38. > :08:41.will be one of the tests of the ceasefire as to whether the regime

:08:42. > :08:57.is really prepared to allow these much-needed convoys in. Sorry, Mr

:08:58. > :09:03.Speaker. Question number three. Since the extremely generous offer

:09:04. > :09:09.by President Hollande to confer the Legion D'Honneur on the surviving

:09:10. > :09:11.veterans, we have had a number of discussions with representatives of

:09:12. > :09:16.the fans Government about the process for making the award. As a

:09:17. > :09:22.result the French Government has presented over 3500 medals to

:09:23. > :09:27.British veterans. The process is being made as smooth as possible. No

:09:28. > :09:36.problems this time, Mr Speaker! I thank the Minister for his `nswer.

:09:37. > :09:40.Several veterans are still waiting for the award of their Legion

:09:41. > :09:44.D'Honneur, and others have passed away over the last year without

:09:45. > :09:47.receiving it. Would the Minhster join me in calling on the French

:09:48. > :09:51.authorities to resolve this issue as a matter of urgency and also to look

:09:52. > :09:56.at whether the honour can still be conferred on those who have passed

:09:57. > :09:59.away since? It is establishdd by law in France through set requirements

:10:00. > :10:03.for scrutiny and approval. French authorities have done the most to

:10:04. > :10:10.expedite the issue of the awards. As with the UK, honours and aw`rds are

:10:11. > :10:13.generally not made posthumotsly I confirm a couple of the casds have

:10:14. > :10:23.been submitted to French authorities but there is no record of 14 the

:10:24. > :10:27.third veteran. I do appreci`te the efforts the Minister and thd

:10:28. > :10:32.Department have taken in trxing to ensure that individuals get their

:10:33. > :10:37.Legion D'Honneur medals but we still have, a large number of people who

:10:38. > :10:42.qualified and have applied but not received it. Is it possible to do an

:10:43. > :10:48.audit in the UK of how many applications are outstanding so he

:10:49. > :10:55.can chase those up? The French have awarded approximately 3500. We have

:10:56. > :11:00.sent the French about 4300. At the moment, the process is taking

:11:01. > :11:03.between six and eight weeks. I appreciate that are still a

:11:04. > :11:07.significant period of time, given the age of this court, but H can

:11:08. > :11:10.assure the honourable gentldman who has pursued this persistently, we

:11:11. > :11:14.have done everything we can to try and make this process as quhck as

:11:15. > :11:23.possible, given the circumstances and the age of those veterans.

:11:24. > :11:31.The French embassy are trying to do their best. If everybody has a

:11:32. > :11:36.problem with their constitudnt, write to me because these pdople

:11:37. > :11:39.deserve better than this. The honourable gentleman is too modest

:11:40. > :11:48.to reveal that although he hs himself not a Normandy veteran he

:11:49. > :11:51.does hold the honour. I am grateful to my honourable friend for the

:11:52. > :11:57.support he offers and I can only repeat we are keen to get these

:11:58. > :12:01.expedited as quickly as possible and whilst all of the cold heart is a

:12:02. > :12:06.rather certain age of any mdmber has a constituent they are parthcularly

:12:07. > :12:11.concerned about please cont`ct us and we will endeavour to get it to

:12:12. > :12:20.them as quickly as possible. Number four. With your permission H should

:12:21. > :12:23.like to answer question for and questioned ten together. Sm`ll

:12:24. > :12:27.businesses are crucial for growth and innovation in this country and

:12:28. > :12:34.we want them to take an increasing share of our growing defencd budget.

:12:35. > :12:38.We are committed to achieving 2 % of our procurement spend with small and

:12:39. > :12:43.medium-sized businesses by 2020 and that target is 10% higher than the

:12:44. > :12:50.one set during the last Parliament. May I say how nice it is to see my

:12:51. > :12:55.noble friend in the place and also to ask what steps she can t`ke to

:12:56. > :13:05.ensure the MOD's largest customers use small firms to deliver their

:13:06. > :13:11.contracts. She is absolutelx right. It is essential that we work not

:13:12. > :13:13.only directly in our defencd procurement process but also with

:13:14. > :13:18.our supply chains and I'm ddlighted to let the House no that thd supply

:13:19. > :13:24.chain advocate network and the supply chain champions are well

:13:25. > :13:28.under way and that last year the Ministry of Defence was abld to make

:13:29. > :13:35.direct spend with almost 5000 different companies. In addhtion to

:13:36. > :13:42.that country ask the Ministdr to confirm what measures the MOD can

:13:43. > :13:48.take to reduce the revelatory burden that small firms have such `s those

:13:49. > :13:53.in my own constituency in m`king applications when it comes to

:13:54. > :13:58.procurement of defence equipment. The honourable gentleman is right to

:13:59. > :14:03.highlight ways in which we can make this easier for small and

:14:04. > :14:07.medium-sized businesses. Thhs year we removed the turnover reqtirement

:14:08. > :14:11.in the prequalification process and we're working towards simplhfying

:14:12. > :14:19.contract terms so that we c`n reduce it to three pages. Can I welcome the

:14:20. > :14:26.Minister to her position but can I ask her to take notice of what

:14:27. > :14:30.happens in Huddersfield. We have many fine people making things that

:14:31. > :14:35.people want in our defence forces but would she disassociate htself

:14:36. > :14:40.from the fat and lazy term tsed by British businessmen. We havd no fat

:14:41. > :14:49.and lazy businessman in Huddersfield. Those are not my words

:14:50. > :14:52.and I would like to pay tribute to the many businesses in Hudddrsfield

:14:53. > :14:58.and around South Yorkshire which to such wonderful work in terms of

:14:59. > :15:03.supplying our Ministry of Ddfence. On Wednesday I raised the issue of

:15:04. > :15:07.an engineering company that went into ministration. I would like to

:15:08. > :15:10.place on record my appreciation to the procurement Minister who are

:15:11. > :15:19.taught noticed scrambled around and rearranged her diary to meet

:15:20. > :15:22.Administration is. Will the procurement Minister work whth me

:15:23. > :15:31.and the administrators to ldarn no stone unturned until we can see if

:15:32. > :15:40.we can save these valuable jobs Yes, we are working hard to

:15:41. > :15:45.represent the interests. We will be able to meet with him and the

:15:46. > :15:50.administrators later today. In rugby we are proud of the contribttion

:15:51. > :15:56.that GE Power conversion ard making to the global combat ship problem

:15:57. > :16:05.they also contribute to the local economy. My honourable friend is

:16:06. > :16:08.right to highlight the fact that earlier this year we were unable to

:16:09. > :16:14.announce contracts for some of the long leave items as part of this

:16:15. > :16:18.programme and to highlight the way in which small and medium-shzed

:16:19. > :16:25.businesses play such an important role in that supply chain. Ht is

:16:26. > :16:35.interesting listening to thd Minister's words and I greatly

:16:36. > :16:40.support 25% of expenditure by 2 20. However, figures published last

:16:41. > :16:48.month were quite clear that over 2% went to companies assessed `s small

:16:49. > :16:53.and medium-sized businesses. It is determined by independent vdrifiers

:16:54. > :16:59.so why has there not been an assessment of new suppliers carried

:17:00. > :17:05.out since 2014 or is the Department resorting to accountancy? I don t

:17:06. > :17:12.recognise the figures she h`s cited but I can confirm that in 2014 we

:17:13. > :17:19.spent 19% with small and medium-sized businesses and she

:17:20. > :17:23.highlight the fact the contract in terms of evaluating the

:17:24. > :17:27.characteristics of different firms which is a Cabinet Office contract

:17:28. > :17:31.ended in 2014 and we are in the process of discussing with our

:17:32. > :17:41.colleagues what the successful framework would be like. Nulber

:17:42. > :17:46.five. I will answer questions five and six together. We are determined

:17:47. > :17:53.to meet the commitment to ensure Armed Forces overseas are not

:17:54. > :17:58.subject to persistent legal claims. I explore the work my predecessor

:17:59. > :18:06.did working across government to bring proposals in the very near

:18:07. > :18:09.future. I welcomed the statdment and urge the government to press ahead

:18:10. > :18:15.with reforms in this area particularly to the extra Torino

:18:16. > :18:19.jurisdiction of human rights laws so that we do have accountabilhty for

:18:20. > :18:24.Ray acts of wrongdoing but we don't subject those risking life `nd limb

:18:25. > :18:36.to litigation by Amblin 's chasing lawyers. It is very important that

:18:37. > :18:41.those who have done wrong adult with Experian wrong that tax paid lawyers

:18:42. > :18:48.are chasing around the country trying to prosecute other pdople.

:18:49. > :18:50.Our Armed Forces are the best in the world and we must do everything to

:18:51. > :18:56.protect them both on and off the battlefield. To that end with many

:18:57. > :19:03.soldiers based in Sennybridge in Brecon can my honourable frhend

:19:04. > :19:07.assure them that the Iraq hhstoric allegations trailer Bale will look

:19:08. > :19:16.carefully at the claims madd against British forces personnel. I think we

:19:17. > :19:19.can all welcome the demise of lawyers and it is for the

:19:20. > :19:25.authorities that look closely at what they did and then incole.

:19:26. > :19:37.Having trained at Sennybridge many years ago I can assure everxbody

:19:38. > :19:41.that this government is behhnd them. Could I welcome my honourable friend

:19:42. > :19:50.to this place. They especially welcome his stance on this latter.

:19:51. > :19:53.Is he aware of the fact that Phil Shiner who has made so much money

:19:54. > :19:58.out of this is trying to conceal his ill gotten gains by threatening

:19:59. > :20:06.editors threatening to expose him with it so on the basis of so-called

:20:07. > :20:20.mental health problems. Can I pay tribute for -- to my right

:20:21. > :20:25.honourable friend. Let's let the bodies do their workforce and see

:20:26. > :20:38.what comes out on the other side of that. Number seven. We positively

:20:39. > :20:41.encourage bids from British companies to ensure they ard in the

:20:42. > :20:45.best position to win future steel contracts. We have issued ndw policy

:20:46. > :20:49.guidance to address the barriers that might prevent UK steel

:20:50. > :20:56.producers from competing effectively on the open market. Now that

:20:57. > :21:00.government departments are landated to provide information about the

:21:01. > :21:03.proportion of UK steel used in crime commercial service would thd

:21:04. > :21:08.Minister please tell the Hotse what percentage of UK steel has been used

:21:09. > :21:14.in current and will be using future defence projects? She rightly speaks

:21:15. > :21:19.up for the steel production in her constituency and she will bd very

:21:20. > :21:23.pleased to know that of the largest project the UK Government h`s ever

:21:24. > :21:28.procured that uses steel shd will be aware that that is the carrher

:21:29. > :21:32.programme which is currentlx under construction and that the v`st

:21:33. > :21:42.majority of that comes from Tata steel. I support the increasing use

:21:43. > :21:45.of small firms but will the Minister and take to encourage those small

:21:46. > :21:52.firms to use British Steel wherever possible? He's right that it's a

:21:53. > :21:58.process not only of encouraging competition within the proctrement

:21:59. > :22:03.process but also where therd are long lead type items and in our

:22:04. > :22:08.security review we have set out the largest programme of investhng in

:22:09. > :22:15.ships for some time. There will be a lot of long lead time items were

:22:16. > :22:20.small businesses will be able to work with those who are procuring

:22:21. > :22:29.the contract in order to find a place in that supply chain. Recent

:22:30. > :22:35.defence procurement decisions have failed to take into account the

:22:36. > :22:41.benefits to the UK economy gained by manufacturer -- manufacturing

:22:42. > :22:48.domestic day. Will the minister commit to assess the wider dconomic

:22:49. > :22:54.and social benefits derived from building the three new solid support

:22:55. > :22:59.vessels in the UK with Brithsh Steel and share information with this

:23:00. > :23:06.House? She's right to highlhght that in our strategic review we have set

:23:07. > :23:12.out a programme. We are invdsting in more ships, aeroplanes and lore

:23:13. > :23:16.cyber investment. She mentioned the solid support ships and those will

:23:17. > :23:21.not be procured until later in this Parliament but I can assure her that

:23:22. > :23:23.we will do everything we can with those items and programmes that have

:23:24. > :23:28.been set out in advance to dnsure that British company and Brhtish

:23:29. > :23:37.Steel companies have all thd information they need to be

:23:38. > :23:41.successful. Number eight. Competition remains the best way of

:23:42. > :23:43.securing value for money but sometimes we need to place single

:23:44. > :23:49.source contracts. We therefore establish a new regime with an

:23:50. > :23:55.independent regulator to ensure contract costs and profit r`tes are

:23:56. > :24:08.both reasonable and transparent Can I thank her for that answer.

:24:09. > :24:16.Will those changes have govdrnment support? Yes, in March this year we

:24:17. > :24:22.reduced the profit rate on single source contracts from 10.6% to .95%

:24:23. > :24:27.and the regulator will then recommend a rate for 2017 which we

:24:28. > :24:34.will consider carefully as well as their recommendation in terls of

:24:35. > :24:39.multiple profit rates. What steps is the minister taking to ensure that

:24:40. > :24:48.were single source contracthng is placed abroad that there is

:24:49. > :24:52.appropriate levels set asidd so that apprenticeships in British defence

:24:53. > :24:59.companies are protected and facilitated? She will be aw`re that

:25:00. > :25:05.this is an ongoing subject of discussion. She will be aware of the

:25:06. > :25:18.commitment that General dyn`mics has made in Wales to create 250 jobs in

:25:19. > :25:24.the supply chain. When the contracts are derived unnecessary costs can be

:25:25. > :25:30.occurred when the design specifications are changed. What

:25:31. > :25:34.steps is the Minister taking to ensure these latest changes after

:25:35. > :25:42.contracts have started no longer occur? This was one of the lajor

:25:43. > :25:47.themes that came out in terls of the review of how we could improve

:25:48. > :25:51.defence procurement. They wdre problems with the design of the type

:25:52. > :25:58.45 which was ordered at the beginning of the last decadd which

:25:59. > :26:03.has been costly to rectify `nd therefore that is why we take such

:26:04. > :26:04.care now in terms of the design to prevent such things happening in the

:26:05. > :26:12.future. I welcome what the Minister has said

:26:13. > :26:15.in answer to another question in terms of the targets that are in

:26:16. > :26:20.place to ensure small and medium-sized enterprises in the UK

:26:21. > :26:25.benefit from defence procurdment. But when she is looking at the issue

:26:26. > :26:32.of value for money and single source contracts, can she assure the House

:26:33. > :26:37.that value for money includds looking at British jobs, Brhtish

:26:38. > :26:43.skills and, as my honourabld friend said, investment in apprenthceships?

:26:44. > :26:46.Can I thank the honourable lember again for mentioning

:26:47. > :26:48.apprenticeships, and I will -- our commitment to continue to work with

:26:49. > :26:54.our single source suppliers to ensure they remain, in fact we can

:26:55. > :26:58.clearly see they are some of the lead providers of apprenticdships

:26:59. > :27:07.across the defence procuremdnt area. Number nine, served. We aim to

:27:08. > :27:14.maximise the benefit of the UK for UK technologies and know-how. These

:27:15. > :27:20.results can be exported through a technology transfer company, which

:27:21. > :27:25.we estimate will have contrhbuted over ?200 million to export value by

:27:26. > :27:29.2018 and to have generated over 500 jobs. On Friday I will launch our

:27:30. > :27:37.plans for a new approach to further exploit innovation in defence.

:27:38. > :27:42.During recess, I spent some special time with the Government Chhef Whip

:27:43. > :27:47.and the member for Stafford visiting Stafford barracks. As we continue to

:27:48. > :27:49.draw down from Germany, Stoke-on-Trent and stature `nd enjoy

:27:50. > :27:54.an influx of highly trained personnel and with it the growth of

:27:55. > :27:58.potential telecoms business, could I urge the Minister to hold a meeting

:27:59. > :28:01.with the Stoke and Staffordshire Local Enterprise Partnership to see

:28:02. > :28:06.how the MoD can help ensure that local businesses enjoy some input to

:28:07. > :28:12.their growth from this arrival of highly trained personnel from

:28:13. > :28:19.Stafford barracks? I'm happx to help facilitate that meeting. I `m aware

:28:20. > :28:24.that are a number of companhes in his constituency that have submitted

:28:25. > :28:27.proposals to the Centre for defence enterprise, I think they have had

:28:28. > :28:35.some feedback and we are as anxious as he is that we capture anx of that

:28:36. > :28:40.know-how for the future. Can I welcome the Government's recent

:28:41. > :28:43.partnership agreement with Leonardo helicopters on research into

:28:44. > :28:47.unmanned aerial vehicles, and asked that ministers work with me to help

:28:48. > :28:53.maximise the effect this has in support of design and engindering

:28:54. > :29:00.jobs? We are very helpful to do that. He will recall we announced at

:29:01. > :29:03.Farnborough the signing of ` ten year strategic partnering

:29:04. > :29:07.arrangement with Leonardo one one of the most important defence companies

:29:08. > :29:13.based here in Britain and I hope that will help enhance jobs in his

:29:14. > :29:20.constituency to further export success, and through the right

:29:21. > :29:26.technology and innovation, but also meet our own defence requirdments.

:29:27. > :29:30.Question number 11. Mr Speaker, we continually invest in recruhtment to

:29:31. > :29:36.attract a diverse and talented workforce that we need now `nd in

:29:37. > :29:38.future for our Armed Forces. Over 8100 new recruits joined thd Army

:29:39. > :29:44.last year, an increase on the previous year, and in July, the

:29:45. > :29:49.strength of the reserve was 23, 00, closely matching the 33,000 we need.

:29:50. > :29:53.We will continue to work closely with all parts of the country, in

:29:54. > :29:59.particular Northern Ireland. I thank him for that response. I understand

:30:00. > :30:02.this is the first time a box soldier or someone from the ranks h`s risen

:30:03. > :30:10.to the position of Minister of State. With help to recruit for the

:30:11. > :30:14.Army, reserves in Northern Hreland have met their targets. Could I ask,

:30:15. > :30:17.can the reserves in Northern Ireland numbers be expanded or incrdase to

:30:18. > :30:24.take account of that positive recruiting environment? Can I say

:30:25. > :30:30.thank you to the kind comments he makes. We were very close p`ls in

:30:31. > :30:34.Northern Ireland and visited on occasion will be visiting vhsiting

:30:35. > :30:41.the problems in the near future -- the province. The ceiling is not one

:30:42. > :30:43.in that we do not want more people from Northern Ireland, it is whether

:30:44. > :30:48.the operational units could take them. I will look closely into

:30:49. > :30:50.looking at whether we can t`ke more from Northern Ireland. Can

:30:51. > :30:56.congratulate Northern Ireland for serving the crown so well for many

:30:57. > :31:04.years. Can I ask what steps he is taking to address the shortfall in

:31:05. > :31:09.engineers and have -- as he had any ideas about giving short on

:31:10. > :31:15.secondment? That is exactly what we tried to do, be as flexible as

:31:16. > :31:19.possible the contracts, not only was short-term and long-term secondment

:31:20. > :31:24.from industry but from other navies as well. There is a shortfall in

:31:25. > :31:30.specific areas but what we need to do is make sure the offer wd make,

:31:31. > :31:34.whether it be in marine enghneers or any other part of the Armed Forces,

:31:35. > :31:40.is suitable for the 21st century. Thank you, Mr Speaker. I want to

:31:41. > :31:45.welcome the Minister to his post. He is one of the -- is aware of the big

:31:46. > :31:50.issue here is taking on, how he will assist the Government Dicko -- to

:31:51. > :31:55.achieve the manifesto pledgd of the army not falling. He also rdcognised

:31:56. > :31:59.a huge issue in the British Army in terms of retention. Does he think

:32:00. > :32:03.what he is saying actually recognises the scale of the

:32:04. > :32:10.challenge that faces us, for the Government to achieve that lanifesto

:32:11. > :32:12.pledge? We are determined to fulfil the pledge, not only becausd it is a

:32:13. > :32:16.manifesto pledge, but it is right manifesto pledge, but it is right

:32:17. > :32:20.for the Army in particular. I know how difficult it is with retention.

:32:21. > :32:27.I purchased my discharge from the army myself. But what is making

:32:28. > :32:32.people leave? Are we being `s flexible as we can? When I left I

:32:33. > :32:40.had a letter a couple of months later asking me whether I w`nted to

:32:41. > :32:47.re-enlist. If we have got them in uniform, let's keep them in uniform.

:32:48. > :32:51.commitment to and inequalithes commitment to and inequalithes

:32:52. > :32:54.ordered across the public sdctor. As the younger demographic frol which

:32:55. > :32:57.the army recruits is increasingly ethnically diverse, will my

:32:58. > :33:00.honourable friend commit to pay honourable friend commit to pay

:33:01. > :33:09.special attention to the recruitment retention and promotion figtres of

:33:10. > :33:14.BME service personnel? And H also pay tribute to my honourabld and

:33:15. > :33:19.gallant colleague for his sdrvice to her Majesty when he was in tniform.

:33:20. > :33:23.For the Armed Forces to work on the 21st century, it has to represent

:33:24. > :33:30.the community where they cole from. Whether it be from DME or more women

:33:31. > :33:34.in the Armed Forces, -- BME, I think we need to be careful to make sure

:33:35. > :33:39.that we promote the Armed Forces to those sorts of people so th`t they

:33:40. > :33:46.feel comfortable in the Armdd Forces. Can I add my voice to those

:33:47. > :33:52.who are welcome you to your place today in the hot seat on thhs issue.

:33:53. > :33:56.This Government may not be very good at meeting its own targets,

:33:57. > :33:59.particularly on Army recruitment. But ministers at least deserved

:34:00. > :34:04.point for creativity. Their plan to grow the trained strength of the

:34:05. > :34:08.Army by changing the definition of training may help with cookhng the

:34:09. > :34:12.books but it will not address the problem. Can the Secretary, the

:34:13. > :34:17.Minister tell us whether he believes it is appropriate for personnel to

:34:18. > :34:20.be deployed on operations bdfore completing their full trainhng, and

:34:21. > :34:28.if so, how he can be confiddnt they will be adequately prepared? Can I

:34:29. > :34:31.say from experience, some dtties once you have passed phase one

:34:32. > :34:35.training can be done and it will certainly done in my time in 19 4

:34:36. > :34:42.when there was a Labour Govdrnment. If we are trying to recruit people,

:34:43. > :34:52.we need money, we need to bd part of Nato that something -- liver-mac

:34:53. > :34:57.want us out. Can I welcome him to his post. Can I just touch on Navy

:34:58. > :35:00.recruitment? Can he quash these rumours that we will not have enough

:35:01. > :35:06.trained sailors demand both our aircraft carriers when they are

:35:07. > :35:10.launched? We have not hidden the fact that it is very diffictlt to

:35:11. > :35:16.make sure we are doing everxthing we can, but we will have, and H was on

:35:17. > :35:22.one of the aircraft carriers recently and I was watching the

:35:23. > :35:27.other craft being built, and we will have the crews and they will be the

:35:28. > :35:33.pride of the Navy. Number 12, please. Mr Speaker, while

:35:34. > :35:37.maintaining the freedom of `ction to operate independently,

:35:38. > :35:42.interoperability with our N`to allies is fundamental to virtually

:35:43. > :35:45.all UK defence capabilities. For the general-purpose frigate, thd Royal

:35:46. > :35:50.Navy is already exploring how this can be delivered and considdring how

:35:51. > :35:53.it will operate within Nato. Does the Minister agree that by opening

:35:54. > :35:57.up more of the procurement process to a broad range of suppliers and

:35:58. > :36:02.avoiding any hint of protectionism, it may be possible to keep the costs

:36:03. > :36:06.of replacing the frigates low? I know that the honourable melber for

:36:07. > :36:12.Clacton pays close interest to defence procurement issues, and he

:36:13. > :36:17.will also be eagerly anticipating Sir John Parker's National

:36:18. > :36:21.shipbuilding strategy, which he has committed to publish for before the

:36:22. > :36:26.Autumn Statement. In that context, he would be aware that complex

:36:27. > :36:33.warships can only be built hn the UK. Specifically on the typd 30 one.

:36:34. > :36:37.When can we expect an announcement on building these ships? We have the

:36:38. > :36:44.capability and the skills, presumably we have a budget.

:36:45. > :36:47.Scotland expects. Can I gently reminded the honourable gentleman

:36:48. > :36:55.that we are building these ships because we all decided to rdmain

:36:56. > :36:59.part of the UK, and indeed, we are in the process of providing more

:37:00. > :37:06.ships, more aircraft, more dquipment to our Armed Forces than evdr

:37:07. > :37:15.before. As soon as we have concrete timetables to announce to the House,

:37:16. > :37:19.we will do so. Question 13. The cost of production scheduled for the Type

:37:20. > :37:22.26 global combat ship will be decided at the main investmdnt

:37:23. > :37:27.decision point of the progr`mme Negotiations are ongoing to

:37:28. > :37:30.delivering contracts that are value for money for the Navy and for the

:37:31. > :37:37.taxpayer. The general-purpose frigate programme is at its very

:37:38. > :37:41.early stages. Decisions on build location and timetable will take

:37:42. > :37:48.advantage of the recommendations of the national ship building strategy.

:37:49. > :37:53.I thank him for his answer. He is well aware that his departmdnt

:37:54. > :37:57.promised 13 frigates on the Clyde in 2014, a huge part of the Scottish

:37:58. > :38:02.independence referendum casd for the union play on this promise. With the

:38:03. > :38:07.number already dropped to ehghth, why can he not answer a civhl

:38:08. > :38:13.question, when will the Typd 26 design be approved? -- simple

:38:14. > :38:15.question. There will be a l`rge number of new frigates, but

:38:16. > :38:21.specifically eight new anti-submarine warfare ships

:38:22. > :38:28.designed to protect the detdrrent that the Scottish National party

:38:29. > :38:34.voted against. The me be cldar, the timetable, I hope, will be set out

:38:35. > :38:42.shortly, when the design continues to mature and many negotiathons with

:38:43. > :38:47.BEA Systems are completed. Hsn't it a fact that BAE Systems are ready to

:38:48. > :38:52.start cutting steel right now, and the only thing that is holdhng

:38:53. > :38:56.things up is a lack of funds in the MoD's budget? The reality is that if

:38:57. > :39:01.we don't start building these ships on time, surely we will end up with

:39:02. > :39:06.the same old story that we will drop below the already inadequatd total

:39:07. > :39:11.of 19 frigates and destroyers, or if we do not, we will have to pay a lot

:39:12. > :39:15.more money to keep old ships in service longer than they should be

:39:16. > :39:19.kept in service? Wick-mac c`n I just reassure my honourable friend we

:39:20. > :39:26.have invested over 1.8 billhon pounds in the Type 26 ship `lready.

:39:27. > :39:30.I announced a further 183 mhllion in July for the guns to go on the ship.

:39:31. > :39:36.A lot of the design work has been completed. But I am not prepared to

:39:37. > :39:40.sign a contract with BAE Systems until I am absolutely persu`ded that

:39:41. > :39:46.it is in the best interests of value for money for the taxpayer `nd

:39:47. > :39:50.indeed for the Navy. Thank xou, Mr Speaker. The Secretary of State will

:39:51. > :39:55.be aware that the shipyards are in my constituency. Can I say to him,

:39:56. > :40:01.the clear message from the workforce can perhaps be best paraphr`sed by

:40:02. > :40:06.Darth Vader, we want these ships, not excuses. Can he explain why the

:40:07. > :40:10.original timetable to cut steel was made this year, but has not been

:40:11. > :40:15.done, and can I ask him to speed up the process so that ships c`n be

:40:16. > :40:23.built on the Clyde? We will not be ordering anything from the Clyde if

:40:24. > :40:27.Scotland had become independent because convex warships are only

:40:28. > :40:31.built in the United Kingdom. -- conflicts. But this contract is to

:40:32. > :40:36.be in the best interests of the taxpayer. I am aware of the need to

:40:37. > :40:41.sustain a boy Matt on the Clyde That is why the Strategic Ddfence

:40:42. > :40:47.Review last December also announced the construction of two further

:40:48. > :40:53.offshore patrol vessels, in addition to the free that are currently being

:40:54. > :41:00.built on the Clyde. Thank you, Mr Speaker. Could my -- would ht be

:41:01. > :41:06.possible for the Ministry of Defence to consider positioning as ` home

:41:07. > :41:09.port some of the Type 26 offshore patrol vessels in Gibraltar, where

:41:10. > :41:11.the facilities are superb for them, and they are in a very good position

:41:12. > :41:22.to operate? Gibraltar is a key base for the

:41:23. > :41:30.Royal Navy. We had to three ships from their only the calling in

:41:31. > :41:39.Gibraltar and Gibraltar ret`ins its affiliation to the Crown despite the

:41:40. > :41:42.recent referendum. Number 14. The MoD is proud to be one of the

:41:43. > :41:46.largest providers of qualitx apprenticeships in the UK and the

:41:47. > :41:50.largest in government having delivered over 150,000

:41:51. > :41:55.apprenticeships. We work closely across both government and hndustry

:41:56. > :42:03.to develop apprenticeship standards to maintain key defence skills

:42:04. > :42:06.across the country. With major defence and infrastructure projects

:42:07. > :42:10.on the horizon now is the wrong time for the government to be cutting

:42:11. > :42:16.funding. What guarantees can the Minister give that quality

:42:17. > :42:22.apprenticeships will be protected? I think we stand by our record. We

:42:23. > :42:27.have delivered over 150,000. Any new recruits joining the Armed Forces is

:42:28. > :42:34.on an apprentice scheme and will continue. The Minister knows that

:42:35. > :42:40.logistics is an incredibly hmportant area for the military and it's also

:42:41. > :42:44.vital for other parts of thd economy. It's essential in refugee

:42:45. > :42:50.work. Can the Minister tell me if he will increase apprenticeships on

:42:51. > :42:56.logistics and if he can enstre the quality of those logistics

:42:57. > :42:59.apprenticeships? The MOD offers a number of apprenticeships in the

:43:00. > :43:05.logistics field including driving goods vehicles, an internathonal

:43:06. > :43:11.trade and logistics. I recognise the portents of logistics and efforts to

:43:12. > :43:21.address skills shortages nedds to be balanced with other areas btt I will

:43:22. > :43:24.look at it. Participation in one of our cadet forces to lure of our best

:43:25. > :43:31.apprenticeships. We have wonderful sea cadet group in the Rhondda. Why

:43:32. > :43:34.on earth now that the MOD is the catering pensioner barracks in the

:43:35. > :43:45.Rhondda are they putting it up for auction on the open market rather

:43:46. > :43:53.than giving it to the Sea C`dets? We will extend cadet forces by 500 by

:43:54. > :43:58.20 20. We have very strict rules and it comes to the disposal of defence

:43:59. > :44:06.property but I am happy to look into what he says. Topical questhons

:44:07. > :44:13.Topical question number one. My immediate priorities remain

:44:14. > :44:21.implementing our security rdview. Last week I hosted the first-ever

:44:22. > :44:26.United Nations peacekeeping ministerial where I underlined the

:44:27. > :44:29.UK is stepping up its global commit and is backed by a rising ddfence

:44:30. > :44:40.budget and including additional troops to peace keep -- peacekeeping

:44:41. > :44:45.in South Sudan. Can he confhrm that contrary to what he told thd today

:44:46. > :44:49.programme last week it does matter which budget conflict and sdcurity

:44:50. > :45:01.spending comes from and if he is so strapped for cash maybe he should be

:45:02. > :45:05.scrapping Trident. I met thd French defence minister last Thursday and

:45:06. > :45:12.the president of South Kore` is Madame part who I met during our

:45:13. > :45:16.most recent visit. The diffhculty of the Shadow Defence Secretarx has now

:45:17. > :45:25.got is that all my defence linisters don't actually know who he hs! So

:45:26. > :45:30.far as the budget is concerned this is an increasing defence budget and

:45:31. > :45:33.we are committed to meeting the 2% target and the defence budgdt will

:45:34. > :45:42.also rise in real terms for every year of this Parliament. Wh`t steps

:45:43. > :45:51.is my friend taking to addrdss the concerns about the antimalarial

:45:52. > :45:55.tablets deployed overseas? The MoD takes the health and well-bding of

:45:56. > :45:57.its personnel seriously and acknowledges its duty of care to

:45:58. > :46:02.provide the best possible stpport to them. As part of this kid I am

:46:03. > :46:09.delighted to confirm today that we have introduced a single pohnt of

:46:10. > :46:14.contact providing information to a range of services to help those with

:46:15. > :46:25.concerns. Further details are available on the website.

:46:26. > :46:31.Last week the MoD was accusdd of a terrifying error after accidentally

:46:32. > :46:40.publishing the details of 20,00 people online. Following a number of

:46:41. > :46:43.recent high-profile securitx breaches many servicemembers will

:46:44. > :46:47.understandably be concerned about their personal safety. What

:46:48. > :46:53.reassurances can the Secret`ry of State provide to these men `nd women

:46:54. > :46:57.with regards to the securitx of any personal information about them

:46:58. > :47:03.We're doing everything we c`n to protect people's personal ddtails

:47:04. > :47:10.online. I went to Marham myself to days after the incident to give the

:47:11. > :47:13.ashore and says to the servhng personnel and their families that we

:47:14. > :47:20.were doing everything we cotld to protect them. British milit`ry

:47:21. > :47:26.personnel in Saudi Arabia include a number of liaison officers stationed

:47:27. > :47:31.in military headquarters in Yemen. These officers are deployed to gain

:47:32. > :47:36.insight into these operations and advise people how to comply with

:47:37. > :47:38.international humanitarian law. Will the Secretary of State tell the

:47:39. > :47:46.House whether any comedic n`tion from these British officers have

:47:47. > :47:50.indicated any concerns about the conduct of operations in Yelen

:47:51. > :47:57.including the possibility that humanitarian law has been vholated.

:47:58. > :48:02.Let me make it there that the UK is not a member of the Saudi ldd

:48:03. > :48:07.commission and UK personnel are not involved in directing or conducting

:48:08. > :48:12.operations in Yemen or in the target selection process. We have not

:48:13. > :48:15.assessed that the Saudi led coalition is targeting civilians

:48:16. > :48:23.what is in breach of humanitarian law. During the EU referendtm of the

:48:24. > :48:30.government said if we voted to leave it would put the security of the UK

:48:31. > :48:33.and Western Europe at risk so can I ask by how much are they increasing

:48:34. > :48:38.the defence budget as a restlt of this outcome all was that p`rticular

:48:39. > :48:49.scaremongering something we can add to the ever-growing file? Mx

:48:50. > :48:53.honourable friend will know that the defence budget is increasing and

:48:54. > :48:59.will go on increasing each xear of this Parliament because of our

:49:00. > :49:04.commit to meet the 2% target. I know he will join with me in remhnding

:49:05. > :49:09.our allies that although we are Exeter in the European Union we are

:49:10. > :49:13.not abandoning our commitment to European security which is why we

:49:14. > :49:19.are leading a battalion in Dstonia next year, we have committed extra

:49:20. > :49:32.troops to Poland, we have txphoons policing the Baltic airspacd. Radar

:49:33. > :49:36.systems installed is a cutthng-edge business and exporting around the

:49:37. > :49:43.world as Russia continues to test our defences and security concerns

:49:44. > :49:47.about breaches grow. This is the kind of manufacturing weenids. The

:49:48. > :49:57.Minister is already coming to Stafford but after that can invite

:49:58. > :50:01.him to Stoke-on-Trent? The honourable gentleman is a champion

:50:02. > :50:04.of the businesses in Stoke-on-Trent and I know the Secretary of State

:50:05. > :50:09.has already offered a meeting with businesses from his constittency and

:50:10. > :50:14.I will look forward to hearhng more about the he mentioned in hhs

:50:15. > :50:17.question. Would the Minister support the recent application by the Magna

:50:18. > :50:22.School in Newark for a new cadet force and agreed that it is the site

:50:23. > :50:28.kind of school in a deprived area with a real problem of whitd working

:50:29. > :50:34.class boys with his new caddt units will make a difference. The

:50:35. > :50:37.government has committed ?50 million in funding to increase the number of

:50:38. > :50:44.cadet units and schools to 400 by 20 20. This manifesto commitment will

:50:45. > :50:47.establish around 100 new unhts across the UK. It is a priority to

:50:48. > :51:04.focus in areas of high deprhvation. People in my constituency are very

:51:05. > :51:08.worried about the UK Governlent s plans for the Army base at historic

:51:09. > :51:13.Fort George which supports `round 750 jobs. Speculation not hdlped by

:51:14. > :51:17.unhelpful comments made by the Secretary of State in Scotl`nd this

:51:18. > :51:22.weekend about the condition of the base. Will the Minister to the right

:51:23. > :51:30.thing and back Fort George `nd end this unhelpful speculation? The MoD

:51:31. > :51:38.is continuing to view our estate to ensure it is smaller and more

:51:39. > :51:46.sustainable. It has enabled the investment insights. No dechsion has

:51:47. > :51:50.been made on the future of Fort George but Scotland will continue to

:51:51. > :52:03.be a vital home to our Armed Forces. But Scotland must expect sole sites

:52:04. > :52:06.to close. Research from the phrase Alen Institute found that ddspite

:52:07. > :52:07.promises to the contrary in 201 defence jobs in Scotland ard

:52:08. > :52:24.plummeting. Can the Secretary of State tell us

:52:25. > :52:31.how Scotland is better off hn the union given this reality? Scotland

:52:32. > :52:45.is getting additional investment in Faslane.

:52:46. > :52:56.It is playing a key part in the construction of our new Navx. All of

:52:57. > :53:05.these contribute to more jobs in Scotland. Kurdish fighters hn parts

:53:06. > :53:08.supplied by this country have been the most effective ground forces

:53:09. > :53:13.against Irish yet they find themselves under attack frol our

:53:14. > :53:19.Nato ally Turkey. How can this circle be squared? My honourable

:53:20. > :53:27.friend is right that the situation in North Syria is compensatdd and we

:53:28. > :53:35.urge the opposition groups hn Syria to combat -- although they `re under

:53:36. > :53:39.pressure also from the regile. I hope as a result of the ceasefire

:53:40. > :53:46.tonight that all those armed groups in Syria can now concentratd their

:53:47. > :53:52.fire against the murderous hdeology that is -- and allow humanitarian

:53:53. > :53:59.aid into those towns and cities that have been so long denied it. Our

:54:00. > :54:06.military charities do phenolenal good but one of them combats stress

:54:07. > :54:12.has just received 400,000 to help carry out its vital work. However

:54:13. > :54:18.its plan to move to using triage nurses to handle calls rathdr than

:54:19. > :54:23.using the admin staff experhenced in handling such mental health cases is

:54:24. > :54:26.what really concerns me. Thdse callers need sensitive hands. Will

:54:27. > :54:33.the Minister meet with representatives to discuss how we

:54:34. > :54:39.can do this better in the ftture? I am grateful to the honourable

:54:40. > :54:44.gentleman for highlighting this Of course he raises a very important

:54:45. > :54:49.issue and I would be delighted to meet him to discuss it. The royal

:54:50. > :55:01.air force has a long historx in Wales and the connection has been

:55:02. > :55:09.maintained by schools. What steps are being taken to return skills to

:55:10. > :55:14.Wales? I commend my honourable friend on his tenacity in ptrsuing

:55:15. > :55:19.this issue. He knows there `re significant challenges surrounding

:55:20. > :55:27.the viability of aerodromes in South Wales. But following his persistence

:55:28. > :55:37.I am looking to see whether other sites are financially viabld. I

:55:38. > :55:44.welcome the establishment of veterans breakfast clubs as a way of

:55:45. > :55:54.supporting veterans. Why ard they being denied the right to use

:55:55. > :56:00.official veterans logos on their clubs? I visited several veterans

:56:01. > :56:09.clubs. They had a fantastic thing which I am keen to encouragd.

:56:10. > :56:17.Last week, it was announced the MoD was going to be disposing of a

:56:18. > :56:26.barracks in my constituency. Can he clarified the criteria to kdep three

:56:27. > :56:31.commando Brigade within my .Mac the decision to close up to 30% of the

:56:32. > :56:35.estate is based on military capability. It is a militarx

:56:36. > :56:40.decision but I'm happy to mdet my honourable friend to discuss it with

:56:41. > :56:46.him. Can I thank the veterans Minister for meeting with Eric

:56:47. > :56:49.Cartman, who set up the vetdrans breakfast club and asking what

:56:50. > :56:53.progress has been made in rolling out the breakfast clubs across the

:56:54. > :56:57.country, because they meet such a real need in the community. I

:56:58. > :57:01.thoroughly enjoyed meeting with her constituent, I thought it w`s an

:57:02. > :57:04.excellent breakfast club. I also met with the national Chairman `nd we

:57:05. > :57:14.are in discussion about how the department can support this

:57:15. > :57:23.excellent initiative. Well the Secretary of State confirm that the

:57:24. > :57:27.service provided by BBC monhtoring to open source intelligence is of

:57:28. > :57:31.vital interest to the Ministry of Defence, and does he agree with me

:57:32. > :57:38.that it would be totally unacceptable if the BBC inflicted

:57:39. > :57:44.swingeing cuts in the monitoring service, as is proposed, including

:57:45. > :57:48.the closure of Caversham Park? It is always good to be able to fhnd

:57:49. > :57:53.common ground with my honourable friend on a defence matter `nd I

:57:54. > :57:57.certainly confirm the first part of his question, and I will do what I

:57:58. > :58:02.can to convey the gist of the second part to the BBC. Very prudent and

:58:03. > :58:08.whys of the Secretary of St`te, I'm sure. An article in the Timds

:58:09. > :58:13.newspaper on the ceasefire hn Syria mentions the fact that the TSA in --

:58:14. > :58:17.and Russia have been working together. Could the Secretary of

:58:18. > :58:21.State provide more details on how this would work in practice, how the

:58:22. > :58:27.UK will be involved and how we can ensure that such coordination

:58:28. > :58:36.ensures no civilian death -, casualties. It is a very colplex

:58:37. > :58:42.situation, and we have conthnued to urge Russia to use all its hnfluence

:58:43. > :58:46.on the Syrian regime to get humanitarian aid in and stop the

:58:47. > :58:53.regime targeting particular opposition groups. We do not have

:58:54. > :58:58.combat troops deployed in Sxria as he knows, but obviously, thd strikes

:58:59. > :59:02.we carry out on behalf of the coalition will also now havd to

:59:03. > :59:09.reflect the new reality on the ground. The British Royal N`vy is

:59:10. > :59:16.now smaller than the flotilla that we tend to take back the Falklands.

:59:17. > :59:22.When will we have a date for the type 45 destroyer replacement that

:59:23. > :59:31.is desperately needed, so that we can at least maintain the 18 ships

:59:32. > :59:37.we currently have? I hope she is not confusing number with quality or

:59:38. > :59:41.power. The ships that we ard now deploying, the aircraft carriers,

:59:42. > :59:44.the type 45 destroyers, the forthcoming Type 26 frigates, of

:59:45. > :59:49.course much more powerful than the ships that sailed to liberate the

:59:50. > :59:58.Falkland Islands. I know shd will join with me in welcoming the new

:59:59. > :00:03.missions of the two type 25s, HMS Diamond and HMS Daring, who sailed

:00:04. > :00:08.in the last few weeks. A serious issue for recruitment policx for

:00:09. > :00:14.service family accommodation, I m sure the Secretary of State agrees

:00:15. > :00:17.with the recommendation for the committee for public audit service

:00:18. > :00:25.family accommodation. The Sdcretary of State update the hose-mac are

:00:26. > :00:30.dealing -- the hose-mac with this and how we will make it does not

:00:31. > :00:36.happen again? As a result of the recent get well-planned, thdre are

:00:37. > :00:40.no meeting all but two of the key performance indicators. But let me

:00:41. > :00:44.reassure the House that I for one do not take this recent improvdment for

:00:45. > :00:47.granted. I am utterly deterlined that the poor standard of sdrvice

:00:48. > :00:52.personnel received in recent years will not be repeated. I do not want

:00:53. > :00:58.the honourable gentleman to be sad or to be isolated, let him have a

:00:59. > :01:03.go. Mr Perkins. A few moments ago, the honourable lady from West

:01:04. > :01:06.Worcestershire said that we were procuring more warships and aircraft

:01:07. > :01:11.than ever before. This is so far removed from reality. In setting the

:01:12. > :01:15.record straight, and she confirm if this sort of information is part of

:01:16. > :01:19.the induction in them Ministry of Defence team or did she do ht by

:01:20. > :01:24.herself? Can I recommend to him that he reads the SDSR and you c`n see

:01:25. > :01:28.that we are increasing defence spending every year, investhng in

:01:29. > :01:33.more ships and planes, more troops that are ready to act, bettdr

:01:34. > :01:38.equipment and more for cyber. In contrast to the Labour Partx, which

:01:39. > :01:42.wants to scrap our nuclear deterrent, withdraw from Nato and

:01:43. > :01:50.abolish our army. They cannot be trusted with our security. Order!

:01:51. > :02:05.Statement, the Secretary of State for Education. Secretary Justine

:02:06. > :02:08.Greening. With permission, Lr Speaker, I would like to make a

:02:09. > :02:14.statement on the Government's consultation published todax,

:02:15. > :02:18.Schools That Work For Everyone, copies of which I have placdd in the

:02:19. > :02:21.libraries of both houses. As the Prime Minister has said, thhs

:02:22. > :02:28.Government is putting the interests of ordinary working class pdople

:02:29. > :02:32.first. We want this country to be a truly meritocratic country, where

:02:33. > :02:36.what matters most is a person's individual talent and their capacity

:02:37. > :02:40.for hard work. So we need to build a school system that works for

:02:41. > :02:43.everyone, not just for the privileged few. The various

:02:44. > :02:47.proposals set out today in this consultation document all drive

:02:48. > :02:53.towards one very simple goal, increasing the number of good school

:02:54. > :02:59.places for all children. Ovdr the last six years, we have madd great

:03:00. > :03:04.strides forward with over 1.4 million more children in good or

:03:05. > :03:08.outstanding skills than in 2010 The flagship academies programmd has

:03:09. > :03:12.unlocked the potential in otr schools. This Government is

:03:13. > :03:16.committed to helping all schools enjoy academy status freedol and

:03:17. > :03:19.school led system improvement throughout multi-academy trtsts The

:03:20. > :03:26.reforms carried out by my rhght honourable friend is the melber for

:03:27. > :03:30.Surrey Heath and Loughborough have had a transformational effect on

:03:31. > :03:35.education in our country. Now we need to build on the educathon

:03:36. > :03:38.excellence everywhere White Paper. Our dedication to having good

:03:39. > :03:45.teachers in every school, world-class qualifications `nd

:03:46. > :03:49.reforming school funding have put an end to the underperformance that has

:03:50. > :03:54.blighted too many children's education, and that still exists in

:03:55. > :03:57.pockets throughout our country. We need to radically expand thd number

:03:58. > :04:02.of good school places avail`ble to all families, not just thosd who can

:04:03. > :04:06.afford to move into the catchment areas of the best state schools or

:04:07. > :04:11.those who can afford to pay for private education. Or those

:04:12. > :04:17.belonging to certain faiths. We need to give all schools with a strong

:04:18. > :04:20.track record, with the experience and the valuable expertise, the

:04:21. > :04:26.incentives to expand their offer to enable even more pupils to go there,

:04:27. > :04:31.driving up standards, giving parents greater choice and control. We have

:04:32. > :04:35.sorted already do this throtgh university technical collegds with

:04:36. > :04:40.specialist subject schools. The reality is that demand for school

:04:41. > :04:44.places only continues to grow. But too many children still do not have

:04:45. > :04:49.access to a good or outstanding school and in some areas, as many as

:04:50. > :04:55.50% of children do not have one locally. In fact, 1.25 millhon

:04:56. > :05:00.children attend schools which are not good or outstanding, in spite of

:05:01. > :05:05.all the progress that has bden made, and that, Mr Speaker, is

:05:06. > :05:12.unacceptable. The Government makes sure that schools have the resources

:05:13. > :05:16.to helps -- help children most in need and that will continue but the

:05:17. > :05:19.Prime Minister is right when she says that disadvantage can be often

:05:20. > :05:23.hidden in this country. Bec`use it is not just about those children who

:05:24. > :05:28.receive free school meals, we want to come up with a broader ddfinition

:05:29. > :05:32.and to look at ordinary working-class families just managing

:05:33. > :05:39.to get by, who are too often forgotten about. This consultation

:05:40. > :05:43.deliberately asks big, open questions about the future of

:05:44. > :05:46.education in this country. The plans are set out in schools that were per

:05:47. > :05:51.everyone focus on how we can unlock four existing parts of the

:05:52. > :05:56.educational community so th`t they can have a bigger impact for all

:05:57. > :05:58.children. Firstly, the independent schools that give wealthier parents

:05:59. > :06:05.the option of an outstanding education for their children often

:06:06. > :06:09.sending a high proportion to the best universities and guaranteeing

:06:10. > :06:14.access to the best career ottcomes. Many of these schools already make a

:06:15. > :06:19.contribution to the state sdctor. Some even sponsor or run st`te

:06:20. > :06:25.schools. While we recognise that work, we want independent schools to

:06:26. > :06:29.do more. So we want stronger, more demanding public benefit tests for

:06:30. > :06:34.independent schools to retahn the benefits associated with ch`ritable

:06:35. > :06:40.status. We want independent schools to offer more places to those less

:06:41. > :06:46.able to afford them, and to sponsor or set up schools in the st`te

:06:47. > :06:50.sector. The smaller schools, we will look at the proportionate approach

:06:51. > :06:53.and we are seeking views on how they can make their facilities available

:06:54. > :06:59.to state schools and share their teaching expertise. Secondlx, our

:07:00. > :07:04.world-class universities. They need funding, of course, in order to

:07:05. > :07:07.maintain that status and under this Government, we have made sure that

:07:08. > :07:14.we have seen steady investmdnt whilst at the same time also making

:07:15. > :07:18.sure that university is not out of reach for disadvantaged people. We

:07:19. > :07:23.want the huge talent base in how universities to do more, to widen

:07:24. > :07:28.participation and to help more children to reach their full

:07:29. > :07:31.potential. We therefore won't universities to open or sponsor

:07:32. > :07:36.schools in exchange for the right to raise their fees. This will ensure

:07:37. > :07:41.that they are not just pullhng in the most qualified applicathons

:07:42. > :07:46.applicants, some of whom might have had an educational head start, Mr

:07:47. > :07:51.Speaker, but they are also playing a bigger role in increasing the

:07:52. > :07:56.numbers of students with a GCSE -- the GCSE and A-level grades that

:07:57. > :08:00.opened the doors to degree courses in the first place. Thirdly, when we

:08:01. > :08:03.talk about selection in this country, we have to acknowlddge that

:08:04. > :08:09.we now have selection by hotse price already. For those who are `ble to

:08:10. > :08:16.buy a house in the catchment area of the best schools. But we know that

:08:17. > :08:23.selective schools are in high demand. As our specialist art, music

:08:24. > :08:27.and sports schools. Selective schools are good for pupils,

:08:28. > :08:32.particularly the most disadvantaged ones who attend them. Yet for most

:08:33. > :08:37.children, the chance to attdnd a selective schools and play does not

:08:38. > :08:41.exist. So we want to look again at selective schools and how they can

:08:42. > :08:44.open up excellent places to more children, particularly the lost

:08:45. > :08:48.disadvantaged. We will therdfore a look at how we can relax thd rules

:08:49. > :08:52.on expanding selective schools, allow new ones to open hand

:08:53. > :08:57.nonselective schools to become selective where there is deland At

:08:58. > :09:00.the same time we have to ch`llenge ourselves and selective schools to

:09:01. > :09:05.raise attainment much more broadly. Mr Speaker, I think it is rdally

:09:06. > :09:09.important that I'm clear about how we ensure that all schools hmprove.

:09:10. > :09:14.We do not want to see a rettrn to the old binary system of good

:09:15. > :09:20.schools and bad schools. Evdry child deserves a place in a great...

:09:21. > :09:25.Order, order. The Secretary of State must be heard, when Ms Ellwood

:09:26. > :09:29.ministerial statements are delivered, I almost without

:09:30. > :09:33.exception hello everyone who wants to contribute a chance to do so and

:09:34. > :09:38.today will be no exception. I am very sensitive to the differences of

:09:39. > :09:41.the opinion in this House. Dveryone will have a chance to questhon the

:09:42. > :09:46.Secretary of State, but meanwhile she should and must be heard with

:09:47. > :09:51.courtesy. Every child deserves a place in a great school. It is not

:09:52. > :09:55.just what they deserve, it hs what our country deserves. What hs clear

:09:56. > :10:02.is that selection should be part of the debate on how we make stre the

:10:03. > :10:05.right number of good places exist. Selective schools will be expected

:10:06. > :10:11.to guarantee places for children from disadvantaged backgrounds, and

:10:12. > :10:15.far from tainting the stand`rds of education in schools around them, we

:10:16. > :10:19.will explore ways for selective schools to share their expertise. We

:10:20. > :10:24.want them to raise standards in every part of the schools sxstem.

:10:25. > :10:26.For example, by opening excdllent feeder primary schools or bx

:10:27. > :10:35.sponsoring local nonselective schools.

:10:36. > :10:42.The current rules means that when new faith free schools are

:10:43. > :10:47.oversubscribed they have to limit the numbers of pupils they `dmit on

:10:48. > :10:52.the basis of faith to 50%. The reality is that this has not worked

:10:53. > :10:57.to combat segregation and also acts as a barrier to bring new schools.

:10:58. > :11:02.We want to remove that barrher so that you places can be created but

:11:03. > :11:06.at the same time consult on more effective ways to ensure th`t all

:11:07. > :11:11.new faith free schools are truly inclusive. We will accept the new

:11:12. > :11:17.requirements on proposers of the free schools demonstrate thdy are

:11:18. > :11:22.attracting applications frol other faiths to establish twinning

:11:23. > :11:31.arrangements with schools not of their faith, to consider sponsoring

:11:32. > :11:34.underperforming non-faith schools. The government wants to build on the

:11:35. > :11:40.progress made over the last six years and make the school sxstem fit

:11:41. > :11:42.for purpose in the 21st-century The schools that were forever and

:11:43. > :11:48.consultation as a budding c`ging with as many people as posshble so

:11:49. > :11:54.we can design policies to m`ke use of the expertise we already have. We

:11:55. > :11:59.on this side of the House bdlieve in building a true meritocracy. We

:12:00. > :12:03.think that every child servds a school place that will best serve

:12:04. > :12:10.their individual talents. Not limited by where they live or by

:12:11. > :12:15.what -- how much the appear`nce in. There is so much potential hn our

:12:16. > :12:19.country and that talent basd needs us to ask the big questions so that

:12:20. > :12:32.we can build a school systel that works for everyone. I commend this

:12:33. > :12:37.statement to the House. I would like to start by offering some advice to

:12:38. > :12:57.the government. Stop your shlly class war.

:12:58. > :13:04.That reaction is very interdsting because that wasn't my advice. It

:13:05. > :13:14.was the advice of the last Prime Minister. When you was asked about

:13:15. > :13:21.Tory MPs wanting to return to grammar schools he went on to say,

:13:22. > :13:25."It is delusional to think that a policy of expanding the number of

:13:26. > :13:33.grammar schools is either a good idea, a sellable idea or evdn the

:13:34. > :13:41.right idea." This Prime Minhster wants to hark back to the p`st.

:13:42. > :13:48.Under Labour were in educathon, education but this government it is

:13:49. > :13:55.about segregation, segregathon, segregation. Perhaps the Secretary

:13:56. > :14:00.of State can tell us when the Prime Minister told her what her dducation

:14:01. > :14:04.policy was going to be becatse when she came to this House last Thursday

:14:05. > :14:12.she told us there was nothing to announce. She said that we have not

:14:13. > :14:15.yet made any policy announcdments, that they will be made in dte

:14:16. > :14:24.course. She assured us she was looking into a range of opthons Yet

:14:25. > :14:29.low and behold 24 hours latdr the Prime Minister unveiled thehr policy

:14:30. > :14:34.in full. Apparently did not take that long look at these opthons

:14:35. > :14:38.This is not a surprise. The Prime Minister's plan seems to be that we

:14:39. > :14:49.need grammar schools, secondary moderns and technical schools. This

:14:50. > :14:55.was a line taken directly from the Conservatives' 1950s manifesto. Did

:14:56. > :15:03.she forget to tell the Housd about the pro Minister's speech? Today's

:15:04. > :15:08.statement is another sorry dxcuse so I have some serious questions that

:15:09. > :15:15.she is yet to answer. Will she confirmed that the new Primd

:15:16. > :15:21.Minister has no mandate for this policy, not only was no such pledge

:15:22. > :15:25.their manifesto but the forler Prime Minister promised precisely not to

:15:26. > :15:32.bring in a new grammar schools. He said it's not something we would do

:15:33. > :15:34.if elected. So we in this House will hold them to that account and the

:15:35. > :15:40.country will hold them to that promise. When the Prime Minhster's

:15:41. > :15:45.predecessor was asked whethdr he would cave in to his backbenchers

:15:46. > :15:50.over grammar schools he said, I lead, I do not follow my party. I

:15:51. > :15:58.leave them. He was able to do this for over six years. His successor is

:15:59. > :16:03.hardly managed six weeks. It is not adjust the former prime minhsters

:16:04. > :16:08.who opposes these plans. Thd right Honourable member for Loughborough

:16:09. > :16:11.said the creation of grammar schools, an increasing pupil

:16:12. > :16:18.segregation on the basis of academic selection is a distraction to

:16:19. > :16:21.narrowing the attainment gap. The Conservative chair of the sdlective

:16:22. > :16:24.committee said last night wd have serious issues about social mobility

:16:25. > :16:31.and I don't think that having more grammar schools is going to help

:16:32. > :16:34.them. He went on to say I think the creaming off of the best is actually

:16:35. > :16:42.detrimental to the interests of the most. So will the Secretary of State

:16:43. > :16:49.now apologise for dismissing all opponents of the plans by placing

:16:50. > :16:51.dogma over pupils and opportunity because all the major research shows

:16:52. > :16:59.that where there are grammar schools today access to them are lilited to

:17:00. > :17:01.the most well off. It also shows education attainment in gralmar

:17:02. > :17:05.areas for those who fail to get into grammar schools is below thd

:17:06. > :17:10.national average. Given the overwhelming academic evidence that

:17:11. > :17:13.grammar has failed to improve the standards of the majority of

:17:14. > :17:19.children what research is she basing her decision on and will shd lay at

:17:20. > :17:23.the hook for this House? Can she explain how this policy is going to

:17:24. > :17:27.work? She seems to be saying not only can every new school bd a

:17:28. > :17:32.grammar but every existing school can convert to a grammar as well. I

:17:33. > :17:35.may be a comprehensive bill but even I can see the flaw in the thinking

:17:36. > :17:40.you can let every school in the country select through an exam. Can

:17:41. > :17:46.she tell us how she will decide which schools will be allowdd to say

:17:47. > :17:49.that the pupils and which whll? We are told the new grammars m`y be

:17:50. > :17:55.free schools but free schools are not free to the taxpayer. How much

:17:56. > :17:58.of the schools budget will be put aside for these new grammar schools

:17:59. > :18:01.and has she received any extra funding from the Treasury or will

:18:02. > :18:06.this have to be taken away from the existing schools who are already

:18:07. > :18:14.facing the first real term cuts in decades. For schools to become

:18:15. > :18:19.grammars on requirement thex might have to meet is the establish meant

:18:20. > :18:24.of a new secondary school whth capital costs paid by the

:18:25. > :18:27.government. Perhaps the Secretary of State can reassure the Housd this

:18:28. > :18:31.will be paid for by new funding arrangements that she has rdached

:18:32. > :18:40.with the Treasury rather th`n being squeezed out of school budgdts. I

:18:41. > :18:52.think the shadow Secretary of State is bringing her remarks to ` close.

:18:53. > :18:59.The Prime Minister promised on the steps of number ten to govern for

:19:00. > :19:04.the many and not the privildged few. Yet now we have a policy ailed not

:19:05. > :19:11.just at serving the privileged few but entrenching that advant`ge over

:19:12. > :19:14.the rest of society. We will oppose this and I applaud every single

:19:15. > :19:27.member of this House to oppose it also. I would like to reiterate this

:19:28. > :19:32.is the beginning of a consultation that sets out a debate that we need

:19:33. > :19:43.to have in our education system if we are going to make sure wd deliver

:19:44. > :19:48.on our manifesto. We set out very clearly that would include lore

:19:49. > :19:53.places at grammar schools. The Honourable lady had nothing to say

:19:54. > :19:58.about how we can make indepdndent schools play a stronger rold in

:19:59. > :20:02.raising standards. She had nothing to say about how universitids can

:20:03. > :20:07.play a stronger role. And she had nothing to say about the fact that

:20:08. > :20:11.in spite of all the challenges and issues that she raises from a Labour

:20:12. > :20:16.perspective on grammar and ht's worth pointing out that the league

:20:17. > :20:27.-- the leader of the Labour Party wants to scrap existing gralmars, is

:20:28. > :20:31.that correct? Maybe he has had his own distraction over recent weeks.

:20:32. > :20:37.In spite of all the issues the Labour Party raises and in spite of

:20:38. > :20:42.being in power for 15 years the party made no steps in government to

:20:43. > :20:50.try to ensure that grammar played a stronger role in raising attainment

:20:51. > :20:54.in their broader communities and what did we actually see under

:20:55. > :21:00.Labour in government? It wasn't education. It was grade inflation,

:21:01. > :21:06.children leaving school without even the most basic skills of knowing how

:21:07. > :21:12.to read and write. We had a university system that had ` cap on

:21:13. > :21:16.student numbers. We had youth unemployment up either best part of

:21:17. > :21:23.50%. We need no lectures from the party opposite on how to deliver

:21:24. > :21:28.opportunity for our young pdople. If we are going to ensure that ours is

:21:29. > :21:32.a country where everybody c`n do their best wherever they st`rt we

:21:33. > :21:37.have to be prepared to have a debate about how we are going to m`ke that

:21:38. > :21:42.happen. It seems to me that the only distraction in this chamber for the

:21:43. > :21:47.Labour Party is its own leadership contest and in the meantime the

:21:48. > :21:52.ideas and initiatives to make sure we drive opportunity and prosperity

:21:53. > :22:05.for the will come from this side of the House.

:22:06. > :22:13.I warmly welcome the motives behind my right honourable friend's state

:22:14. > :22:19.in which appear to be to trx to restore some of the best of the 1944

:22:20. > :22:22.Butler wrapped with its amazing opportunities for bright

:22:23. > :22:29.working-class children whilst avoiding the serious downside which

:22:30. > :22:32.it had which was the very great damage or the poor alternathves it

:22:33. > :22:38.offered to the majority of pupils who did not pass the exam. Does she

:22:39. > :22:45.accept that the devil lies hn the detail and as she develops the

:22:46. > :22:50.policy will she accept it whll be tested by how far she can in

:22:51. > :22:58.specific ways ensure that it's does not damage the opportunities for any

:22:59. > :23:01.pupil in other schools and that it doesn't distract priority from

:23:02. > :23:07.raising the standards of all schools fall pupils which has been the

:23:08. > :23:12.objective is this government? Also can I ask you to reconsider bridging

:23:13. > :23:18.the announcement she has made about faith schools because we nedd to

:23:19. > :23:23.live in a society where we `ctually reduce barriers and improve contact

:23:24. > :23:32.and integration between people of all faiths. We have to know why it

:23:33. > :23:39.has not worked and it might be right to modify it but removing this cap

:23:40. > :23:48.altogether might move us into considerable dangers. I don't

:23:49. > :23:54.personally recall the Butler act having not been born then btt the

:23:55. > :24:04.point is the education systdm in our country is in a radically dhfferent

:24:05. > :24:07.position than it was when there was effectively a binary system between

:24:08. > :24:14.secondary moderns and gramm`rs. Our education system has transformed.

:24:15. > :24:19.This is about improving chohce for parents and it's also about building

:24:20. > :24:24.capacity in our school systdm and it's about continuing with the

:24:25. > :24:28.reforms that have already sden .4 million children get into

:24:29. > :24:37.outstanding schools. They are critical alongside this work to make

:24:38. > :24:41.sure. The. On faith schools, the existing 50% rule was put in place

:24:42. > :24:46.with the best of intention. It kicks in when new faith schools are

:24:47. > :24:52.oversubscribed. The issue is that that very rarely happens so in spite

:24:53. > :24:56.of the best motives to rule doesn't operate effectively. Some ndw faith

:24:57. > :25:01.schools are comprised of chhldren with one faith because the school

:25:02. > :25:05.did not have to go and seek more children of other faiths or no

:25:06. > :25:11.faiths sold a consultation document sets out a number of differdnt

:25:12. > :25:14.proposals that start with ndw faith schools that are proposing to set up

:25:15. > :25:20.more clearly demonstrate th`t is a more broad desire for places at that

:25:21. > :25:31.new school not just from parents of that faith but also from parents of

:25:32. > :25:36.no faith. The Secretary of State has expressed concerns that the

:25:37. > :25:40.opponents of this policy have nothing to say. I have plenty to say

:25:41. > :25:45.but unfortunately I only have two minutes in which to save. In order

:25:46. > :25:49.for any government to be trtly progressive its educational system

:25:50. > :25:54.must do all it can to tackld inequality. Only in this wax can

:25:55. > :26:02.young people reach their two -- true potential. Only in this way can we

:26:03. > :26:09.close the attainment gap. There can be no doubt that grammar schools

:26:10. > :26:15.encourage educational inequ`lity. That is why there will be no grammar

:26:16. > :26:18.schools in Scotland. The SNP government instead is doing

:26:19. > :26:22.everything possible to ensure all children have access to the same

:26:23. > :26:26.opportunities no matter thehr background.

:26:27. > :26:33.If we make the mistake of reintroducing grammar schools in

:26:34. > :26:37.England, if there is any impact any financial impact in Scotland, we in

:26:38. > :26:44.the SNP will fight tooth and nail in our opposition to this policy.

:26:45. > :26:52.Instead of this accursed stdp, this Government should be working to

:26:53. > :26:57.close the attainment gap. The SNP Government has an additional

:26:58. > :27:01.targeted ?750 million to close this gap with a fair and transparent

:27:02. > :27:05.funding formula for schools ensuring additional resources Gold wdre

:27:06. > :27:10.needed. The Secretary of St`te should learn something from this

:27:11. > :27:14.strategy. Can she explain how this Government can trumpet its

:27:15. > :27:19.credentials of so-called social mobility when there is clear

:27:20. > :27:23.evidence that charge admisshons policies in schools are not to the

:27:24. > :27:28.benefit of all children? Thhs Government says it believes in a

:27:29. > :27:36.meritocratic society, so can the Secretary of State explain how

:27:37. > :27:39.grammar schools promote this when it is flying in the face of such an

:27:40. > :27:48.ideal, creating social divisions between Joan at a very young age? --

:27:49. > :27:51.between children. It does not bear comparison to the dramatic

:27:52. > :27:59.improvement that we have sedn here in our English education system in

:28:00. > :28:04.the past six years that we `im to continue to drive forward. Ht has

:28:05. > :28:07.seen stronger focus on school leadership and teaching standards, a

:28:08. > :28:11.more rigorous and balanced curriculum that is truly en`bles our

:28:12. > :28:16.children to have the knowledge and skills they need to be succdssful.

:28:17. > :28:21.It is also critically seeing schools working more closely togethdr in

:28:22. > :28:23.order to collectively raise attainment standards across the

:28:24. > :28:27.board. What I am saying is that I want to see some of those p`rts of

:28:28. > :28:31.our education system that are paid less of a role in doing that that I

:28:32. > :28:37.think they can step up to the plate and did much more. She asked about

:28:38. > :28:40.the attainment. The reality is that disadvantaged children who get into

:28:41. > :28:43.grammar school come on in ldaps and bounds and in fact, the att`inment

:28:44. > :28:48.gap is dramatically closed by the time they leave between thelselves

:28:49. > :28:54.and their better advantaged fellow pupils. The fundamental difference

:28:55. > :28:58.between us is that we believe that is a good thing, therefore we should

:28:59. > :29:02.look at how to make that opportunity available to more children. The 40s

:29:03. > :29:07.opposite believe we should have a levelling down. -- the parthes. That

:29:08. > :29:17.is the difference and that hs why we do not accept their approach. Thank

:29:18. > :29:20.you, Mr Speaker. Can I congratulate the Secretary of State for the clear

:29:21. > :29:24.moral purpose that runs through every word of her statement. Our

:29:25. > :29:28.commitment to ensuring that every child in this country receives a

:29:29. > :29:32.high-quality education and that we narrow the attainment gap bdtween

:29:33. > :29:36.rich and poor as being the driving mission she has taken to thd role of

:29:37. > :29:40.Education Secretary, and I `m delighted to see her at the dispatch

:29:41. > :29:46.box. She is absolutely right in particular to save that two of the

:29:47. > :29:51.highest performance -- performing education sectors in this country

:29:52. > :29:54.still have not done enough to help disadvantaged children to do more.

:29:55. > :30:02.Is it not the case that the example of the Harris Westminster free

:30:03. > :30:08.school and kings mass school shows that you can have institutions that

:30:09. > :30:10.select at the age of 16, th`t can ensure that children from

:30:11. > :30:14.disadvantaged backgrounds do more, and will she reassure this House

:30:15. > :30:19.that in the face of the opposition to all form and debate from that

:30:20. > :30:23.side of the House, she will be driven entirely by data and what

:30:24. > :30:30.works and that she will press ahead with the cause of reform? I can

:30:31. > :30:34.assure him of that, I would like to thank him for his comments `nd

:30:35. > :30:37.intervention. He was Secret`ry of State, someone who was willhng to

:30:38. > :30:40.press on with difficult dechsions in order to get the best outcole for

:30:41. > :30:45.Britain's children and he w`s right to do that. Failure comes from

:30:46. > :30:50.failing to address the diffhcult questions that we need to ask

:30:51. > :30:53.ourselves in order to improve England's education system. We are

:30:54. > :30:57.prepared to do that. We are putting those proposals out in a

:30:58. > :31:02.consultation document, which is effectively a Green paper today but

:31:03. > :31:06.as he says, there is innovation happening across the system. If you

:31:07. > :31:12.look at Kings College London, you look at Harris Westminster `nd that

:31:13. > :31:15.college, further afield at the University of Brighton and what the

:31:16. > :31:19.University of Exeter is doing, these universities are truly showhng how

:31:20. > :31:22.they can work with the local school system more broadly to raisd

:31:23. > :31:26.attainment. We should learn from them and expand the impact of

:31:27. > :31:35.universities could not, not contract it. Let us have the debate, Mr

:31:36. > :31:39.Speaker, but let us have thd debate based on evidence. Kamina Sdcretary

:31:40. > :31:43.of State tell us what evidence she does have that the reintrodtction of

:31:44. > :31:48.selection would work? All the evidence I can find shows that it

:31:49. > :31:54.does not. Areas that have sdlection have a wider attainment gap than

:31:55. > :31:57.those dudes do not. Disadvantaged children do not get into gr`mmar

:31:58. > :32:01.schools and poorer kids do worse in those areas with selection. The

:32:02. > :32:05.highest performing with the gap has been closing dramatically,

:32:06. > :32:08.particularly under the weather Government or comprehensibility

:32:09. > :32:11.Perhaps the Secretary of St`te would be better focusing on how wd can

:32:12. > :32:15.spread the good practice of somewhere like London compared to

:32:16. > :32:24.importing the poorer practice of summer like Kent? -- somewhdre. It

:32:25. > :32:29.is not clear to me, and I think it would be helpful for the Labour

:32:30. > :32:37.front bench to set out exactly where they stand on the issue of removing

:32:38. > :32:40.any existing grammars, which as I understand it, is the Liber`l Party

:32:41. > :32:46.proposal, and perhaps from our comments, we can assume she wasn't

:32:47. > :32:50.all existing selection as wdll. -- Labour Party. If she is not prepared

:32:51. > :32:54.to make the argument, I think it is hard to argue against the status

:32:55. > :32:59.quo, whilst then also arguing that we are wrong to look at reforming

:33:00. > :33:03.it. Which think is the position that she is taking. The reality hs that

:33:04. > :33:11.there are many grammar schools that are doing important work, for

:33:12. > :33:13.example Bournemouth Grammar prioritising children on pupil

:33:14. > :33:17.premium getting into grammar schools. We know that when children

:33:18. > :33:22.on free school meals get into grammar is, they disproporthonately

:33:23. > :33:25.do well. There is evidence from the Sutton trust that shows that

:33:26. > :33:28.children outside of the gralmar system, there was no discernible

:33:29. > :33:34.lessening of their attainment more easily. And we're not in a binary

:33:35. > :33:39.system now, we are in a system were overwhelmingly our schools have

:33:40. > :33:42.improved over the last six xears. There are no many more all kinds

:33:43. > :33:45.that are good or outstanding. So this sense that somehow if children

:33:46. > :33:49.are not in a grammar that they are consigned to an education sxstem

:33:50. > :33:54.that is failing them is simply wrong. But we do have to accept that

:33:55. > :34:00.there are still some schools where children do not have access to a

:34:01. > :34:04.good school place. The proposals and the debate we are starting today is

:34:05. > :34:09.one aimed at looking how we can tackle it. It sits alongsidd a much

:34:10. > :34:13.broader series of policy reforms, but we are going to make sure that

:34:14. > :34:17.we push on and change in circumstance, unlike the party

:34:18. > :34:25.opposite, which seems to not even want to have a debate on thd first

:34:26. > :34:29.place. Thank you, Mr Speaker. Can I welcome what my right honourable

:34:30. > :34:31.friend has said today about greater collaboration between universities

:34:32. > :34:36.and independent schools and those in the state system. I also agree with

:34:37. > :34:41.what she said about faith schools, this does need to be looked at. Over

:34:42. > :34:48.the past six years on the shde, we have consistently challenged the

:34:49. > :34:54.soft bigotry of low expectations. It says that academic education is not

:34:55. > :34:57.available to all. She is right to save that we have great schools and

:34:58. > :35:06.great teachers, but we do not have them everywhere. Good she explain

:35:07. > :35:09.how the Green paper proposals on selective education will benefit

:35:10. > :35:15.those pupils in areas where expectations are still too low,

:35:16. > :35:18.where results are too poor, can t you tell us when she is going to

:35:19. > :35:26.announce the first of the achieving excellence in areas? Cheers right to

:35:27. > :35:29.point out that too often, the past, I don't think governments h`ve had

:35:30. > :35:32.high enough expectations were children growing up in my

:35:33. > :35:36.disadvantaged parts of our country. I think that is totally

:35:37. > :35:40.unacceptable. There are taldnted children growing up all over our

:35:41. > :35:42.country and we must make sure we have an education system th`t can

:35:43. > :35:46.enable them to make the most of their talents. Also right to point

:35:47. > :35:50.out that if we want to see new grammars open, we have to w`lk to

:35:51. > :35:54.work with local communities but I would like to see more of those

:35:55. > :35:58.disadvantaged communities gdt the chance to have a grammar. At the

:35:59. > :36:03.moment that is not an opportunity for them, even if local pardnts want

:36:04. > :36:07.it. We know that 20% of children who are at grammar schools come from

:36:08. > :36:11.outside the immediate catchlent area. That clearly suggests that

:36:12. > :36:18.parents in those broader ardas also want the choice of a grammar for

:36:19. > :36:23.their children. Finally, on the points she stepped out in the White

:36:24. > :36:25.Paper, which I thought was puite right, the achieving excelldnce

:36:26. > :36:30.areas were about saying, actually, we need to look systematically at

:36:31. > :36:33.places where there is systelatic letting down of children, where they

:36:34. > :36:38.do not have access to good school places, and look what it -- look at

:36:39. > :36:43.what it will take inside and outside schools to make sure we change that

:36:44. > :36:46.overtime. So I can assure hdr that all that work will continue and I

:36:47. > :36:50.would like to pay tribute to her for the White Paper that she set out

:36:51. > :36:55.that put in place the buildhng bricks of what I hope will be a

:36:56. > :36:58.successful approach. It is something not true to save that on thd side of

:36:59. > :37:03.the House we are in favour of levelling down. Schools that work

:37:04. > :37:08.for everyone and all familids is exactly what members on this side

:37:09. > :37:11.are in favour of. I want to press the Secretary of State on this

:37:12. > :37:16.question of evidence. Where is the evidence that any of the improvement

:37:17. > :37:22.we have seen in the last 15 to 0 years has come as a result of

:37:23. > :37:25.selection? In particular, c`n she name he schools as elsewherd in the

:37:26. > :37:32.world that succeeds on the basis of selection at 11? Our propos`ls are

:37:33. > :37:37.clear, we do not want to sed a test did -- test court 11 be the main way

:37:38. > :37:42.that children get into gramlar schools, we want more flexibility in

:37:43. > :37:47.the system. This is about h`ving a 20% of education system but also a

:37:48. > :37:50.21st century approach to gr`mmars. I think it is wrong to say we should

:37:51. > :37:54.freeze grammars in time and never come back and look at how they could

:37:55. > :37:57.work more effectively. The test is surely the fact that 99% of grammar

:37:58. > :38:02.schools are judged to be good or outstanding by Ofsted. Thesd are

:38:03. > :38:08.schools that have outstanding leadership, outstanding teachers, a

:38:09. > :38:14.strong and rigorous curriculum, they deliver the children who ard of

:38:15. > :38:17.lower attainment and disadv`ntage but also stretched those who are

:38:18. > :38:21.better attainment and that hs why they are rated as good or

:38:22. > :38:24.outstanding. It would be wrong not to look at how we can all those

:38:25. > :38:29.features into the broader school system. But we should be en`bling

:38:30. > :38:36.where there is choice and wdar there is demand for more grammar schools

:38:37. > :38:40.to open up. Back in 1944, of course, there were three types of school

:38:41. > :38:47.proposed, grammar, secondarx modern and technical. By 1959, onlx 2% of

:38:48. > :38:50.any Eurogroup could expect to get a technical school. The probldm is

:38:51. > :38:56.sometimes in delivery and the mechanism for the fermentathon. My

:38:57. > :39:01.question is, what plans has she got to make sure that the changds she's

:39:02. > :39:06.talking about in the green paper will actually be implemented in such

:39:07. > :39:10.a way that we do reach everx community, that we do reach every

:39:11. > :39:15.and that we can be sure that we are giving every child the best possible

:39:16. > :39:18.opportunity in a grammar school or another school of some diffdrent

:39:19. > :39:23.type? Because it is the mechanism and it is the brokering of that

:39:24. > :39:26.mechanism and the checking that the mechanism is working that whll

:39:27. > :39:33.actually count for a lot in this whole policy. I pay tribute to all

:39:34. > :39:38.of his work as chair of the education Select Committee, this is

:39:39. > :39:41.about loading capacity fund`mentally about having more good school places

:39:42. > :39:46.the children around Britain, and I think what you will see is ` test of

:39:47. > :39:49.its success is the continued improvement in attainment, very much

:39:50. > :39:54.following on from what my rhght honourable friend the member for

:39:55. > :39:56.Surrey Heath has said, but particularly focusing on those

:39:57. > :40:00.children who do not get as far as they should and have not bedn able

:40:01. > :40:07.to enjoy and benefit from the broader reforms that so manx more

:40:08. > :40:12.children now are. Can I tell the Secretary of State that this country

:40:13. > :40:16.has made steady progress in education over the years, under all

:40:17. > :40:20.parties. There has been real improvement in our education system.

:40:21. > :40:23.Is she aware that sending a message that it has been a history of

:40:24. > :40:29.failure is not very encouraging that teachers and people who deliver

:40:30. > :40:36.education? But can I please begged her not to start what we have seen

:40:37. > :40:40.in the chamber already, even bitter -- a bitter war about comp offensive

:40:41. > :40:43.against grammar? Grammar schools, if you like them, provide the dvidence,

:40:44. > :40:48.provide what is best for our students and kids in this country,

:40:49. > :40:49.do not start this ideologic`l turf war that is going to be verx

:40:50. > :41:00.damaging to our country. Well, I agree with him. I think we

:41:01. > :41:04.need to open up a measured debate that is based on evidence about what

:41:05. > :41:08.it is going to take it to ilprove our school system and particular for

:41:09. > :41:12.those children don't have access to a good school plays, what it will

:41:13. > :41:17.take to enable them to have one We believe selection can play ` role in

:41:18. > :41:22.that and we should look at how that should be done more effectively and

:41:23. > :41:26.he was at the urgent question we had on Thursday. I recognise how emotive

:41:27. > :41:31.this issue is across the Hotse. That is because it matters. It m`tters

:41:32. > :41:35.for all of our children. But I think the wrong thing to do would be to

:41:36. > :41:39.simply to see the kind of concerns that the members opposite express,

:41:40. > :41:45.and simply put them in a box over here and not be prepared to look at

:41:46. > :41:48.how we can make grammars work more effectively for disadvantagdd

:41:49. > :41:52.children. In doing so, we should also recognise that every child is

:41:53. > :41:59.different. For those who ac`demic, they need schools which can help

:42:00. > :42:04.them stretch themselves. Thdresa Villiers. My anxiety with some of

:42:05. > :42:09.these pose oils is the Secrdtary of State rightly focuses on ardas of

:42:10. > :42:12.economic disadvantage but whthout any kind of local catchment area,

:42:13. > :42:17.how can we guarantee that ndw selections schools will bendfit the

:42:18. > :42:21.communities in which they are situated? Well, we are setthng out a

:42:22. > :42:26.number of conditions that ndw grammars would have to meet,

:42:27. > :42:30.frankly, for them to be abld to open in the first place. Part of that

:42:31. > :42:35.would be working with local communities and demonstrating local

:42:36. > :42:39.demand. It could also involve setting up a nonselective school or

:42:40. > :42:42.sponsoring one that is therd. It could also involve sponsoring a

:42:43. > :42:47.primary school that feeds the grammar school that is in a more low

:42:48. > :42:53.income area, so that it absolutely reaches into some of those

:42:54. > :42:55.communities that we want to see benefit most from good or

:42:56. > :42:58.outstanding grammars that are being established. I would encour`ge her

:42:59. > :43:02.to look at the consultation document. It opens a lot of

:43:03. > :43:05.questions about how we can do this effectively and then I have no doubt

:43:06. > :43:12.I would be interested in her response. I listened to the

:43:13. > :43:17.Secretary of State carefullx. I m quite sorry for her in a wax because

:43:18. > :43:22.I am sure this is not directly her policy. Could she tell us

:43:23. > :43:29.confidentially whether she was as surprised as we were when informed

:43:30. > :43:35.of this policy and to do with government spats in Downing Street?

:43:36. > :43:38.I think a half of the children of Britain I think that was a totally

:43:39. > :43:43.pointless question and I will not bother answering it. Look,

:43:44. > :43:47.identified any child to go to the sort of school I went to in the last

:43:48. > :43:52.five years of my secondary education. The Hartland

:43:53. > :43:56.comprehensive was more like a Borstal than a school, and

:43:57. > :44:02.unfortunately, there are sthll too many comprehensives like th`t in our

:44:03. > :44:08.country. But, and it is a bhg but, the schools in my constituency have

:44:09. > :44:14.done so well, notably Georgd Spencer becoming an outstanding academy

:44:15. > :44:19.because of the Academy programme. I think in my constituency, there is

:44:20. > :44:24.no desire for us to have selection. So can the Secretary of State assure

:44:25. > :44:27.me and my constituents, that the Academy programme which is

:44:28. > :44:36.delivering, will still be stpported by this government? Guess, of

:44:37. > :44:42.course, and indeed this is `bout providing... In many parts of the

:44:43. > :44:46.country we have seen academhes transform prospects already. It may

:44:47. > :44:52.be that local communities are happy with the existing schools and they

:44:53. > :44:55.want to see them get better. Discussing education with p`rents

:44:56. > :45:00.and teachers, dishes which come up time and time again is the need for

:45:01. > :45:06.more primary places, teacher recruitment and the North-South

:45:07. > :45:12.funding gap. Not one person has ever raised new grammars with me. Where

:45:13. > :45:16.is the evidence that this continuing obsession with structures whll

:45:17. > :45:20.resolve the real issues fachng education? She is right to highlight

:45:21. > :45:24.the need for more primary places and indeed, we have put billions into

:45:25. > :45:31.ensuring those places other. Part of the challenge is insuring that

:45:32. > :45:35.democratic board is passing into secondary schools. We have to ensure

:45:36. > :45:38.the secondary system has a number of places our children need, btt we

:45:39. > :45:42.have to ensure they are good places which is why we want to open up this

:45:43. > :45:46.debate on selection, open up the debate on ending the ban on

:45:47. > :45:50.grammars. This is not to sax there is not the rest of the agenda in

:45:51. > :45:55.education that we need to c`refully push on with. She talks abott

:45:56. > :45:58.teacher recruitment, she talks about making sure education funding is

:45:59. > :46:05.fair around the country and absolutely, all of those thhngs will

:46:06. > :46:10.be once I continue to focus on. May I welcome my right honotrable

:46:11. > :46:18.friend's commitment to greater freedom for faith schools. Hn my

:46:19. > :46:24.constituency we have the best performing competences in the entire

:46:25. > :46:27.country and it forms part of a diverse mix which includes part

:46:28. > :46:31.selective schools. The she `gree with me that it is that divdrsity

:46:32. > :46:37.which is driving up standards and issue committed to maintainhng that

:46:38. > :46:42.diversity? He sets out the case very well in terms of how parents have

:46:43. > :46:46.got more and better choice hn his own local community. It is hmportant

:46:47. > :46:51.and it is how we seek stand`rds rising and we are committed to that

:46:52. > :46:54.continuing. Isle so listened very careftlly to

:46:55. > :47:00.the words of the Secretary of State and she did say we don't want to see

:47:01. > :47:04.a test at 11 for access to grammars. So is it her intention to abolish

:47:05. > :47:10.the 11 plus for existing gr`mmar schools, and if not, why not? The

:47:11. > :47:14.point I was making to him w`s that many people feel there is a cliff

:47:15. > :47:19.edge in terms of the entry hnto grammar schools as it stands in

:47:20. > :47:24.terms of age 11. We are consulting on having the chance for chhldren to

:47:25. > :47:28.go into a local grammar, perhaps at an older age, or indeed if they are

:47:29. > :47:32.particularly capable at one or two subjects that they could perhaps go

:47:33. > :47:41.to a grammar to study those. I'm sure he will read the consultation

:47:42. > :47:43.document with interest. Does the Secretary of State agree

:47:44. > :47:47.with me that when lifting the statutory bar, we are not rdturning

:47:48. > :47:51.to a two tier system of the 195 s, in circumstances where our dducation

:47:52. > :47:56.system has moved on, where we have choice of UTC, free schools,

:47:57. > :47:59.academies as well as apprenticeships, and when striving

:48:00. > :48:06.for educational excellence, we should continue to look at `ll forms

:48:07. > :48:10.of education for our childrdn? She is quite right. We have movdd from a

:48:11. > :48:14.system where there was a ond size fits all approach on schools for

:48:15. > :48:17.children and we now have a system where there is so much diversity and

:48:18. > :48:22.choice, but we do think it hs wrong to have one kind of school hn that

:48:23. > :48:25.system, unable to respond to parent demand, and that is the need for

:48:26. > :48:34.more grammars. We need to open up that debate and look at what we can

:48:35. > :48:38.do to enable parents to havd more of a choice around the country.

:48:39. > :48:41.The minister says she wants to get views from everywhere. The Dducation

:48:42. > :48:47.Minister will be aware that exam results schools in Northern Ireland

:48:48. > :48:51.were some of the best in Brhtain and Northern Ireland. Has the Education

:48:52. > :48:55.Minister had the opportunitx to strategise these results for the

:48:56. > :48:59.benefit of the UK mainland? I know the system of grammars in Northern

:49:00. > :49:03.Ireland is one that people would point to to say an average

:49:04. > :49:06.attainment has increased. I was invited to Northern Ireland in the

:49:07. > :49:09.urgent question last week to look for myself and I am sure th`t I will

:49:10. > :49:16.be able to visit Northern Ireland shortly.

:49:17. > :49:20.I welcome the Secretary of State's Green paper on the wider aspects of

:49:21. > :49:26.education, I have to say th`t I have severe reservations about

:49:27. > :49:30.introducing more grammar schools. I was at a grammar school 50 xears

:49:31. > :49:35.ago, and I have often wondered, if I had failed the 11 plus, where I

:49:36. > :49:39.would be. I wouldn't be herd today. I know the educational systdm has

:49:40. > :49:44.moved on, but I have to say I think it is not a question of introducing

:49:45. > :49:49.more grammar schools, if people want grammar schools, that is fine. It is

:49:50. > :49:52.what is happening in the mahn part of the system. The main question we

:49:53. > :49:57.have to deal with this not just about access to schools, it is about

:49:58. > :50:00.the poverty of many of the parents, the dysfunctional families, and I'm

:50:01. > :50:04.sure that my right honourable friend will be looking at this and if she

:50:05. > :50:12.could perhaps give me some reassurance that this is gohng to be

:50:13. > :50:14.done. Very much so. As I just replied to my right honourable

:50:15. > :50:19.friend for Loughborough, thhs issue of looking at specific areas where

:50:20. > :50:25.there is a persistent and long-term lack of educational attainmdnt and a

:50:26. > :50:29.gap in good school places, absolutely has to sit alongside this

:50:30. > :50:32.consultation document, and the rest of the Government reforms that we

:50:33. > :50:38.now have under way, that have delivered so much for the children

:50:39. > :50:41.of Britain have to continue. The Secretary of State's st`tement

:50:42. > :50:45.is deeply divisive. Will shd say to the House what the differences

:50:46. > :50:49.between the selection criteria for a grammar school and the selection

:50:50. > :50:53.criteria for a free school, and will she say to the House what the

:50:54. > :50:57.evidence base is available to her for not prioritising the nedds of

:50:58. > :51:03.the young people who are not going to be selected? I would encourage

:51:04. > :51:07.him to look at the Green paper consultation document that we have

:51:08. > :51:13.published today. It much not only talks about how we think gr`mmars

:51:14. > :51:17.can play a strong role and selection play a strong role particul`rly

:51:18. > :51:20.improving the specs for disadvantaged children who `re

:51:21. > :51:24.academically able, but it also sets out our expectation that gr`mmars

:51:25. > :51:28.can do a lot more in their local communities to raise attainlent more

:51:29. > :51:33.broadly, and as I said to the honourable lady opposite, the

:51:34. > :51:37.challenge is that this is not a reform that has been engaged with

:51:38. > :51:41.grammars before, and it is time that we asked them to do more, btt in

:51:42. > :51:48.return we should also be prdpared to enable them to open up in other

:51:49. > :51:53.parts of the country. Mr Speaker, I have no ideological

:51:54. > :51:57.hang-ups in letting the brightest children do well, I think it is

:51:58. > :52:00.crucial that we allow the poorest to come through to do so. I welcome

:52:01. > :52:05.this as the beginning of a debate and as one method whereby wd can

:52:06. > :52:11.increase the diversity of the school system. Can I discuss the role that

:52:12. > :52:25.universities play. We see the results that Norwich players and

:52:26. > :52:30.teachers are dressing issues hard. Norwich is an area where we can see

:52:31. > :52:38.attainment is raised partictlarly with the work of the University of

:52:39. > :52:43.East Anglia is doing in the local community. I think we are at the

:52:44. > :52:47.beginning of the understandhng of how universities can work

:52:48. > :52:50.effectively further back in the education system. We see it can

:52:51. > :52:55.dramatically improve the prospects for children so that they gdt the

:52:56. > :52:58.levels of education and att`inment say that going to universitx becomes

:52:59. > :53:02.an option. The Government was serious `bout

:53:03. > :53:05.social mobility, it would bd focusing on the early years and

:53:06. > :53:10.technical and vocational provision. One thing I do welcome as the

:53:11. > :53:14.Secretary of State's accept`nce of the Labour Party's 2015 manhfesto

:53:15. > :53:19.commitment to independent schools and they should be doing more to

:53:20. > :53:23.earn a charitable status. Btt rather than going down the blind alley of

:53:24. > :53:27.the charitable commission, can I urge the Secretary of State to amend

:53:28. > :53:33.the 1988 local government act so that private schools business rate

:53:34. > :53:36.relief is dependent on a hard partnership as determined bx the

:53:37. > :53:41.independent schools Inspectorate. It remains a scandal that our sixth

:53:42. > :53:49.form colleges are paying VAT and private schools have business rate

:53:50. > :53:53.relief. This has two end. As I understood his policy was to simply

:53:54. > :53:57.scrap charitable status. Wh`t we have to do is make sure our

:53:58. > :54:00.independent schools earn th`t charitable status and truly deliver

:54:01. > :54:07.more public benefit perhaps than some are doing at the moment.

:54:08. > :54:09.Although it is fair to say that overwhelmingly many independent

:54:10. > :54:15.schools already do much in their local community. As the competence

:54:16. > :54:20.of schoolboy, can I commend my right honourable friend for this bold new

:54:21. > :54:25.departure. Will she, however, at all times are sure that the language

:54:26. > :54:29.used by the Government focuses on pupils' aptitudes rather th`n solely

:54:30. > :54:34.on their academic ability. H believe that way there are no losers instead

:54:35. > :54:38.all talents are champions and all roles fulfilled. As a competence of

:54:39. > :54:41.schoolgirl I think that is `n excellent point and I can assure him

:54:42. > :54:44.that this is about making stre we have the diversity and choice in our

:54:45. > :54:50.school system so that whatever kind of talents you have as a chhld, you

:54:51. > :54:57.can find a school that will truly enable you to develop them `nd to be

:54:58. > :55:03.successful. The attainment gap between poor and rich children is

:55:04. > :55:06.unacceptable. It holds them and our country back. But the Secretary of

:55:07. > :55:10.State is simply wrong to sax expanding grammar schools whll help

:55:11. > :55:14.the most disadvantaged children who are less likely to get into grammar

:55:15. > :55:19.schools and fall further behind better off children than those in

:55:20. > :55:22.areas without selective schools Can I ask the Minister to inste`d focus

:55:23. > :55:29.on what we know from the evhdence makes the biggest differencd to

:55:30. > :55:33.disadvantaged children, high-quality early years services, getting the

:55:34. > :55:37.best heads and teachers in the school 's and relentlessly driving

:55:38. > :55:43.up standards in academic and vocational qualifications. Two

:55:44. > :55:49.points. We are doing all of those things and the reality is that our

:55:50. > :55:52.proposals are aimed at ensuring the grammar schools do take mord

:55:53. > :56:00.disadvantaged children, and all I would say is Labour had 13 xears to

:56:01. > :56:04.look at this and failed to do so. The Secretary of State will be aware

:56:05. > :56:08.that the community I represdnt in Bournemouth and Poole already has

:56:09. > :56:12.access to high-quality local grammar schools. But can I make her aware of

:56:13. > :56:20.the change in the admission policy from 2018 for a Bournemouth School

:56:21. > :56:24.headed by Doctor Dorian Lewhs that we are going to put a geogr`phical

:56:25. > :56:28.limit prioritising Bournemotth pupils, we're going to prioritise

:56:29. > :56:32.looked after and formerly looked after children, prioritise those on

:56:33. > :56:37.free school meals and combine this, and this is critical, with `n

:56:38. > :56:41.ambitious programme of outrdach to the primary schools to raisd the

:56:42. > :56:44.aspiration of both primary school pupils and their parents about

:56:45. > :56:49.sending their children to these schools. Would she agree with me

:56:50. > :56:53.that this is an ambitious thing that is totally in line with the prime

:56:54. > :56:56.minister's excellent new policy and would she agree to either come to

:56:57. > :57:00.Bournemouth School to see at first hand what they are doing, or to meet

:57:01. > :57:05.Doctor Dorian Lewis the headteacher, we bring him here to London?

:57:06. > :57:11.I'm very happy to meet his local head teacher. What he sets out in

:57:12. > :57:16.terms of what that head teacher is doing, is exactly what we w`nt to

:57:17. > :57:21.see replicated across schools in the country, and also in terms of

:57:22. > :57:27.conditions we'll set for exhsting grammars to extend and to open up

:57:28. > :57:31.new grammars. We want them to be engines for social mobility. I hope

:57:32. > :57:35.we do have a debate because it's important because none of us should

:57:36. > :57:41.be satisfied that our children aren't getting the best out of, what

:57:42. > :57:46.is it these days, 18 years before too long of compulsory educ`tion.

:57:47. > :57:51.When I spoke in a debate led by my former colleague Joe Cox, wd spoke

:57:52. > :57:53.about the lack of education`l attainment in Yorkshire and

:57:54. > :58:00.Humberside. Three things cale out of that. So many are behind thdir peers

:58:01. > :58:05.by the age of three, Doncaster and other places, we can't attr`ct the

:58:06. > :58:09.best teachers for love nor loney. And, the choice at 14 isn't good

:58:10. > :58:12.enough for those who want to follow a vocational route. Can I ask the

:58:13. > :58:17.Secretary of State please do not abandon those areas that I feel are

:58:18. > :58:20.the greater importance to achieving the outcome she wants than the

:58:21. > :58:24.debate that could be divisive on grammar schools? I can absolutely

:58:25. > :58:29.assure her that I won't ever abandon that agenda of looking at some of

:58:30. > :58:32.our more struggling areas in terms of educational attainment and seeing

:58:33. > :58:36.what we can do to lift them. I grew up in Rotherham, went through the

:58:37. > :58:40.state school system there. H'm personally committed to makhng sure

:58:41. > :58:44.that that area does better hn the future than it's done in thd past

:58:45. > :58:49.and for me, to be able to h`ve a role now where I can actually help

:58:50. > :58:53.build the education system that enabled me to be successful, I think

:58:54. > :58:57.that's a chance and opportunity that I'll make the most of.

:58:58. > :59:01.Thank you, Mr Speaker. If the minister is indeed going to search

:59:02. > :59:05.for evidence. Will she try `nd find out why the OECD have said

:59:06. > :59:11.educational outcomes in England are far higher than in Wales whdre we

:59:12. > :59:15.had 17 years of Labour Government? I think it's almost certainly

:59:16. > :59:18.because the Labour Government in Wales has failed to learn from the

:59:19. > :59:21.reforms that we've made herd in the United Kingdom and it's intdresting,

:59:22. > :59:26.we are having a debate about grammar schools. The reality is that many

:59:27. > :59:30.parents want the features of grammar schools that often make thel

:59:31. > :59:38.successful, which is excelldnt teachers and outstanding le`dership,

:59:39. > :59:40.a stretching, rigorous acaddmic curriculum and excellent

:59:41. > :59:43.extracurricular activities `s well. Those are the things that p`rents

:59:44. > :59:47.want across the school systdm. Discipline too. Our reforms have

:59:48. > :59:51.largely embedded them across the school system. That's why wd are

:59:52. > :59:56.seeing standards going up. Thank you very much, Mr Spe`ker I

:59:57. > :00:02.am proud to represent a town which is ram packed with what she calls

:00:03. > :00:06.ordinary working class people. We are also a town - I'm using the

:00:07. > :00:11.Secretary of State's words , it s also a town which has gramm`r

:00:12. > :00:16.schools. I just called them people. Those people are very frustrated

:00:17. > :00:20.that their kids can't get into local grammar schools because people with

:00:21. > :00:25.much more resources are abld to drive miles from West London and get

:00:26. > :00:29.into grammar schools on the basis of the 11-plus. Now, I'm beginning to

:00:30. > :00:34.not be sure what she means by a grammar school because when I talk

:00:35. > :00:42.to the heads in the grammar schools, they say they cannot make a test for

:00:43. > :00:48.admission which is a tutor proof. The point is, my constituents, those

:00:49. > :00:52.who can't afford tutors, ard not getting places in the gramm`r

:00:53. > :00:57.schools. Therefore, grammar schools do not serve, as her statemdnt

:00:58. > :01:00.implies, those ordinary, in her words "ordinary" working cl`ss

:01:01. > :01:05.people. Unfortunately it serves those people who can afford to tutor

:01:06. > :01:08.their kids. I think in that case it's all the

:01:09. > :01:14.more reason for us to be brhnging forward the reforms that we are

:01:15. > :01:18.doing today. I find it nonsdnsical to make an argument in the way she's

:01:19. > :01:23.just done then say we should do nothing about it.

:01:24. > :01:26.Mr Speaker, the whole focus of the debate so far has been on the

:01:27. > :01:32.question of admissions. But what makes for a good school is not how

:01:33. > :01:37.the pupils have been admittdd, but on the quality of the leadership. So

:01:38. > :01:43.how will the Secretary of State focus the debate and her proposals

:01:44. > :01:48.on how we secure more outst`nding head teachers?

:01:49. > :01:52.As we have seen in many parts of the country, including London, what

:01:53. > :01:58.actually made the differencd was schools working together, h`ving

:01:59. > :02:01.outstanding head teachers going into what were under-performing schools,

:02:02. > :02:05.turning them around and working with other schools in neighbouring areas

:02:06. > :02:09.to ensure that those learning about best practice was disseminated. So

:02:10. > :02:16.grammars need to play their role in doing that and these are thd

:02:17. > :02:21.proposals. The Sutton Trust she mentioned points out 18% of pupils

:02:22. > :02:25.are on free school meals but only 3% of gram mar school pupils. The fact

:02:26. > :02:29.that tiny group does well doesn t support her policy, as clailed.

:02:30. > :02:32.Opening new grammar schools inevitably means creating ndw

:02:33. > :02:37.secondary modern schools, however it's dressed up. How can th`t

:02:38. > :02:41.possibly be a food idea -- good idea? Again, he was part of the

:02:42. > :02:45.Government that had 13 years to tackle the issue he's set ott and

:02:46. > :02:49.did nothing. The reality is, we should be enabling parents to have

:02:50. > :02:53.more choice, including secthon in grammars if they want. We should do

:02:54. > :02:57.more to help grammars reach out to disadvantaged children. As we heard,

:02:58. > :02:59.in parts of the country likd Bournemouth, that's already

:03:00. > :03:03.happening. We should be seehng more of that, not simply trying to avoid

:03:04. > :03:09.the debate all together. Thank you, Sir. I'm very gr`teful

:03:10. > :03:12.for the Secretary of State, my right honourable friend's statement and I

:03:13. > :03:16.think it's a very encouraging step in the right direction. Does she

:03:17. > :03:21.share my anxiety and frustr`tion at the fact that so many of thd

:03:22. > :03:30.objectors to this scheme ard themselves the products of selective

:03:31. > :03:35.education? The French have ` saying, the Patron of the establishlent eats

:03:36. > :03:39.here, and isn't it disappointing to see so many people, the products of

:03:40. > :03:43.education, say it's all right for us but it's not all right for them --

:03:44. > :03:47.the product of good education. I tend to agree with him and H would

:03:48. > :03:51.add that on the one hand thdre's a vehement dislike of the status quo

:03:52. > :03:56.whilst on the other hand, apparently an objection to bringing forward any

:03:57. > :04:01.reforms to change it. Mr Speaker, let us deal with this

:04:02. > :04:05.nonsense that, if you are not in favour of her reform, you are not in

:04:06. > :04:08.favour of any change. Where there is failure or under-achievement or lack

:04:09. > :04:13.of ambition in the system, there should be change. The systel should

:04:14. > :04:17.not be a reform free zone. But if the Prime Minister believes that the

:04:18. > :04:23.expansion of grammar schools is better for social mobility, how does

:04:24. > :04:29.she explain that in grammar school Kent, just 27% of kids on free

:04:30. > :04:34.school meals get five good GCSEs, whereas the national averagd is 33%,

:04:35. > :04:41.and in London, where there's been substantial turn around basdd on all

:04:42. > :04:47.ability schools, that figurd is 45%. As he is setting out, the sdnse that

:04:48. > :04:50.grammar schools are the onlx schools delivering good and outstanding

:04:51. > :04:54.education for our children hs wrong, and that's why we shouldn't be shy

:04:55. > :04:58.of the fact that we ought to open up the system to allow grammars to play

:04:59. > :05:02.a stronger role. We can do that precisely because it's not ` bindery

:05:03. > :05:08.system any more with all thd other schools in that system performing

:05:09. > :05:11.weekly. As he says, we need to recognise it's not just opening up

:05:12. > :05:15.new grammars that's going to enable more children to get more good

:05:16. > :05:19.school places, that's part of the answer, the other part is to enable

:05:20. > :05:25.schools to learn from one another to collaborate more and of course, as

:05:26. > :05:27.I've set out, to see other `ctors in the educational establishment like

:05:28. > :05:36.universities, independent schools, playing a bigger role in thd future

:05:37. > :05:38.than they have in the past. Is not the key choice and diversitx, we

:05:39. > :05:43.have been sitting here over an hour now and nobody from either side of

:05:44. > :05:48.the House has suggested a shngle grammar school should be abolished.

:05:49. > :05:52.Is it not therefore perversd that if you have two successful gralmar

:05:53. > :05:56.schools, it's perverse to prevent them expanding and taking more

:05:57. > :06:00.disadvantaged kids if we can try and achieve that, from disadvantaged

:06:01. > :06:07.areas in Lincoln or Grimsby or Scunthorpe. Then the cap on faith

:06:08. > :06:11.schools, why do we have it? It was perverse, bizarre, subjective. Why

:06:12. > :06:15.should Catholic parents be prevented from sending their children to their

:06:16. > :06:22.faith School of Their own choice? This is about opening up choice for

:06:23. > :06:25.parents in terms of those who want grammar schools places and haven't

:06:26. > :06:30.got them at the moment and to enable more faith schools to enup ` third

:06:31. > :06:33.of the school system has fahth schools, they played a long,standing

:06:34. > :06:39.outstanding role in many cases in educating children and we should

:06:40. > :06:44.enable them to do more. Thank you, Mr Speaker. I was the

:06:45. > :06:47.council Cabinet member for dducation and children's services in Trafford

:06:48. > :06:51.which retains selection at 01. As much as we tried to level up and

:06:52. > :06:57.improve all our schools, I can say that the selective system there was

:06:58. > :06:59.expensive in budget terms, ht could be divisive and caused

:07:00. > :07:03.under-performance in a numbdr of schools. Selection at 11 did not aid

:07:04. > :07:11.social mobility in my experhence. Where is the evidence that ht does?

:07:12. > :07:16.The evidence is in the fact that 99% of those schools are good or

:07:17. > :07:20.outstanding, so they are a lodel that delivers great education. The

:07:21. > :07:25.evidence is from areas like the Sutton Trust that track how free

:07:26. > :07:28.school meal children disproportionately do well when they

:07:29. > :07:31.get into grammars. And as for her challenge on the broader system I

:07:32. > :07:36.think it's one that grammars should rise to in terms of raising

:07:37. > :07:40.attainment. As I pointed out to the House earlier, Sutton Trust research

:07:41. > :07:43.shows that actually there w`s no discernible reduction in attainment

:07:44. > :07:46.from children who were outshde the grammar school system either.

:07:47. > :07:49.Thank you, Mr Speaker. Can H first of all say to my right honotrable

:07:50. > :07:55.friend that I really welcomd the fact that we are opening up a debate

:07:56. > :07:58.and a consultation for a Grden Party on this subject. That's verx

:07:59. > :08:00.important. I would say to mx right honourable friend, I'm quitd worried

:08:01. > :08:04.about what I've heard so far because I've not had the answers I've been

:08:05. > :08:08.looking for. A big answer I've looked for is, how do you m`intain

:08:09. > :08:11.and not create a stigma to those who don't go to the selective entry

:08:12. > :08:15.schools and those who stay hn the comprehensive system? Unless you

:08:16. > :08:19.have enough stations to do ht, people of equality ability `ren t

:08:20. > :08:22.going to be able to get in. I welcome comments my right honourable

:08:23. > :08:27.friend made about having ac`demy Trusts which have several schools,

:08:28. > :08:32.but my view is that streamlhning within existing comprehensives and

:08:33. > :08:34.the investment needed to make that better is a good way forward because

:08:35. > :08:38.whatever the intentions are, if there are schools known on `cademic

:08:39. > :08:43.ability and those which aren't, a stigma will be created. What I

:08:44. > :08:47.really want to see is an excellent education system so people from any

:08:48. > :08:51.background can achieve them. I went to a comprehensive, my sistdr also

:08:52. > :08:55.went, she's fellow of the Royal College of Surgeons. It can be done

:08:56. > :08:59.within the comprehensive system but we must not create stigma. That s

:09:00. > :09:03.what I'm really, really worried about but I welcome the fact this is

:09:04. > :09:07.a consultation. THE SPEAKER: The view should be

:09:08. > :09:12.deposited in the library of the House. Preferably by the end of the

:09:13. > :09:16.week! Secretary of State? I'm very grateful for that. As he

:09:17. > :09:20.sets out, there are good or outstanding schools all over our

:09:21. > :09:23.country. This is not a binddry choice between getting into a

:09:24. > :09:28.grammar or not having access to a good school. What we are silply

:09:29. > :09:31.saying is that actually academic children also should have the

:09:32. > :09:35.ability to go to a school that particularly stretches them if

:09:36. > :09:38.that's what they want to do. Mr Speaker, I think what thd

:09:39. > :09:43.Secretary of State just said gets the nub of the problem here. An

:09:44. > :09:47.11-year-old source close to me started comprehensive school last

:09:48. > :09:50.week. He doesn't know if he wants to be a chef, astronaut, plastdrer

:09:51. > :09:54.lawyer, he just doesn't know what he wants to do. So why should closing

:09:55. > :10:01.off opportunities to young people at such a young age?

:10:02. > :10:07.Well, doing precisely the opposite is what we are doing. Much of the

:10:08. > :10:10.reform to GCSEs for example and the introduction of the E-bacc hs about

:10:11. > :10:15.making sure children come ott of the school system, whatever school

:10:16. > :10:19.they've gone into, having a rigorous balanced set of GCSE results that

:10:20. > :10:24.are academic in nature and lakes sure that the future options remain

:10:25. > :10:26.open to them. Thank you, Mr Speaker. I applaud the

:10:27. > :10:30.Secretary of State and the Government's dorm nation to drive up

:10:31. > :10:35.standards for all, but will the Secretary of State confirm dxactly

:10:36. > :10:40.how this proposal will prevdnt those that don't make the grade from being

:10:41. > :10:47.stigmatised and incent that vied. All the evidence suggests age 1 is

:10:48. > :10:52.too early to test aptitude `nd intellect, especially amongst boys?

:10:53. > :10:55.I would urge her to look at the consultation document coming out

:10:56. > :10:58.today, which clearly sets ott how we want more flexibility for children

:10:59. > :11:01.in being able to access gralmars whilst then having in addithon

:11:02. > :11:07.conditions to new grammars setting up in terms of their need to work

:11:08. > :11:11.across the whole school system to raise attainment, more broadly. I

:11:12. > :11:18.would simply say to her that, we do already have selection by House

:11:19. > :11:22.price and we have a variety of school that themselves spechalise,

:11:23. > :11:26.whether in music, art or sport. There'll be children who don't get

:11:27. > :11:30.into those schools. This is a question about having choicd and

:11:31. > :11:34.diversity to enable there to be a school near to each child that can

:11:35. > :11:41.particularly be tailored to their needs and a school that's good.

:11:42. > :11:49.Could the Secretary of Statd explain why she wishes to link univdrsities

:11:50. > :11:55.sponsoring schools to higher tuition fees? Students in this country are

:11:56. > :11:59.already highly indebted, paxing for their own education, without being

:12:00. > :12:02.required to pay for secondary education as well. Universities

:12:03. > :12:08.sponsor a schools might be ` good thing that asking students to pay

:12:09. > :12:14.for it is a mistake. I think she may have misunderstood the proposals. If

:12:15. > :12:18.universities wish to charge higher fees they will have to play a

:12:19. > :12:21.stronger role in raising attainment more broadly alongside the work they

:12:22. > :12:25.do on bursaries. We have sedn that work effectively in some cases and

:12:26. > :12:32.we want to roll that out more broadly.

:12:33. > :12:37.Does my right honourable frhend agree with me that academic

:12:38. > :12:40.excellence is good in and of itself, and therefore something that is

:12:41. > :12:44.academically the best is worth having, and everything else around

:12:45. > :12:49.it is fundamentally secondary. And may I also congratulate her on

:12:50. > :12:52.opening up the faith schools which will be particularly welcomd in the

:12:53. > :12:57.Catholic Church which has a fantastic record in faith schools

:12:58. > :13:02.for some of the most disadv`ntaged and diverse communities? He's

:13:03. > :13:06.absolutely right and this is a rule which Catholic faith schools from

:13:07. > :13:11.feeling they could open unddr the free school system but at the same

:13:12. > :13:14.time is ineffective so it is completely sensible to look at how

:13:15. > :13:18.we replace it with a set of rules that will work more effectively And

:13:19. > :13:22.the reaction that he got from the other side of the House frol his

:13:23. > :13:26.points on academic rigour and academic ability, it is cle`r there

:13:27. > :13:34.is still a class war under way and it is raging in the Labour Party.

:13:35. > :13:40.Can we make do with this nonsense that supporters of grammar schools

:13:41. > :13:51.are being hypocritical. I w`s brought up on a council est`te and

:13:52. > :13:54.went to a secondary modern. It is immoral to select young people based

:13:55. > :13:59.on their academic ability and that is what we should be opposing, can I

:14:00. > :14:08.ask a clear question? Samantha Wilshire has come out clearly

:14:09. > :14:12.against extended -- Sir Michael Wilshaw has come out against

:14:13. > :14:16.extended selection. Is he rhght or wrong? I have a lot of respdct for

:14:17. > :14:21.Sir Michael Wilshaw and on this he is wrong.

:14:22. > :14:26.As a product of and with three children at state faith schools can

:14:27. > :14:30.I recognise the huge importdrs that faith schools play and welcome the

:14:31. > :14:35.proposals put before the Hotse? But can I raise two areas of qudstion

:14:36. > :14:40.which I have. Deprivation, poverty and lack of aspiration are not

:14:41. > :14:43.restricted to our urban are`s. They are across our rural areas `s well.

:14:44. > :14:50.Will my honourable friend undertake to make sure all proposals forward

:14:51. > :14:54.our rural proofed, particul`rly in large rural areas where there is

:14:55. > :14:57.only one competence of secondary school serving a very large

:14:58. > :15:01.catchment? And will she also underscored the Government's

:15:02. > :15:05.commitment to fairer funding for the benefit of our rural schools is in

:15:06. > :15:10.no way hindered by the proposal she has announced today? On the latter

:15:11. > :15:13.point he will be aware that the Government will be responding to the

:15:14. > :15:16.first phase causal treasure shortly and also setting out the second

:15:17. > :15:23.phase on how we can make sure the National funding formula is fair and

:15:24. > :15:27.secondly, he is right to highlight the issue of rural schools being in

:15:28. > :15:32.a position to improve more strongly. I think one of the lessons from

:15:33. > :15:37.London is that schools are very close together. It is a lot easier

:15:38. > :15:41.for teachers to be able to spend the time together working through how to

:15:42. > :15:44.raise standards and I think we need to ensure that we can take that

:15:45. > :15:50.approach but make sure it still works in that area where schools are

:15:51. > :15:54.more dispersed. The Secretary of State will know that in Birlingham,

:15:55. > :15:58.grammar schools have existed alongside competence of schools for

:15:59. > :16:02.decades, and know the argues that the King Edward School is rtnning

:16:03. > :16:07.anything other than a good school and they do collaborate with other

:16:08. > :16:11.schools. The point is, their existence has not changed and cannot

:16:12. > :16:17.changed the life chances of the majority of children in Birlingham.

:16:18. > :16:20.Including tackling the issud of underachievement in white working

:16:21. > :16:25.class areas like the one I represent. She suggests that she

:16:26. > :16:31.doesn't want to have structtres the way raising standards. I put it to

:16:32. > :16:35.her that by making the expansion of segregation and selection the the

:16:36. > :16:38.centrepiece of her ambition, her boss the Prime Minister is `ctually

:16:39. > :16:41.going on the opposite direction and whatever else this is about it is

:16:42. > :16:48.not about schools which work for everybody. I totally disagrde with

:16:49. > :16:52.him. As he will be aware, though schools in Birmingham that he talked

:16:53. > :16:58.about are in fact prioritisd in children to be able to get hn who

:16:59. > :17:01.are eligible for pupil premhum, and I would simply say to him that it is

:17:02. > :17:06.wrong to simply turn around to parents who want more choicd and say

:17:07. > :17:10.they cannot have it and somdhow they are wrong. We should be looking at

:17:11. > :17:16.how parents can get more choice and we should not be ignoring it as his

:17:17. > :17:20.party is. Mr Speaker, there is much to welcome

:17:21. > :17:25.in this paper and statement, the focus on choice, the lack of

:17:26. > :17:28.ideology, the commitment demonstrated by the Secretary of

:17:29. > :17:32.State to meet the demands of the 21st century. But there are some

:17:33. > :17:37.things which concern me. Thd reason why my school has improved so much

:17:38. > :17:42.and the schools in my consthtuency have improved so much, is bdcause of

:17:43. > :17:48.the impact of the Academy programme, particularly the multi-Acaddmy trust

:17:49. > :17:54.which has embraced lower performing schools. Can she say little more

:17:55. > :17:58.with how her proposals would fit with the multi-Academy trust model

:17:59. > :18:01.which is so welcome, and cotld she indicate who will be the decision

:18:02. > :18:07.makers if these choices are to be decided upon? As she will know, this

:18:08. > :18:11.consultation is the beginning of a discussion and debate about how we

:18:12. > :18:16.can make sure these policy proposals work in practice. We are absolutely

:18:17. > :18:19.committed to continuing the process of working with more schools to

:18:20. > :18:24.become academies. We know how much that has delivered in terms of

:18:25. > :18:28.results for our young peopld, the way that multi-Academy trusts are

:18:29. > :18:34.able to work together to rahse school attainment and be thdmselves

:18:35. > :18:37.away for school improvement to take place, is absolutely at the heart of

:18:38. > :18:41.our government education reforms. What we are saying with this Green

:18:42. > :18:44.paper as we think grammar schools should play a stronger role in this

:18:45. > :18:52.existing system in the future than they have done in the past.

:18:53. > :18:55.I was in one of the many high performing competences in mx

:18:56. > :18:59.constituency on Friday, and I asked the head teacher what is thd real

:19:00. > :19:02.issue of challenge at the moment, and she said it is those yotng

:19:03. > :19:07.people who are struggling academically but from familhes with

:19:08. > :19:11.low aspirations. The Secret`ry of State's proposals does nothhng to

:19:12. > :19:14.address this issue. Why doesn't she experiment with those areas of the

:19:15. > :19:19.country which do have gramm`r schools at the moment, and lake them

:19:20. > :19:22.take 25% free school meal students as a pilot and see what happens

:19:23. > :19:28.there before she medals abott with everybody else's education? I would

:19:29. > :19:33.encourage him to look at thd consultation document proposals I

:19:34. > :19:38.think there will be some eldment ofs and that he will clearly welcome. We

:19:39. > :19:42.have to remember there is wd are coming from a position wherd there

:19:43. > :19:46.is no condition on grammars whatsoever, far less push on them to

:19:47. > :19:50.reach out to more disadvant`ged communities. That is what wd are

:19:51. > :19:53.setting out in this consult`tion document, whilst also setting out

:19:54. > :19:58.our intention to give parents more choice. I welcome the Secretary of

:19:59. > :20:03.State and the prime minister's commitment to opening education for

:20:04. > :20:07.everyone and leaving nobody behind. However, conducting research on this

:20:08. > :20:11.issue and asking the Parlialentary library, there is no evidence to

:20:12. > :20:15.suggest us far that social lobility is improved as a result of opening

:20:16. > :20:17.up new grammar schools. What evidence has the Secretary of State

:20:18. > :20:22.got that she will present bdfore this House, to prove that opening

:20:23. > :20:28.new grammar schools will improve social mobility, something this

:20:29. > :20:31.party has worked hard for for a very long time? I set out how research by

:20:32. > :20:34.the Sutton trust has demonstrated the impact of grammars on free

:20:35. > :20:38.school milk children, but also on the broader school communithes that

:20:39. > :20:43.grammars are part of it. I would also say to him that is a c`se for

:20:44. > :20:47.change, not a case for the status quo. I would encourage them to look

:20:48. > :20:52.at our proposals to see how they can do exactly the same and I think he

:20:53. > :20:56.will welcome them. Camera Secretary of State please

:20:57. > :21:01.explain to children and pardnts are my constituency why there are no

:21:02. > :21:04.outstanding schools after shx years of the Tories' accelerated `cademies

:21:05. > :21:10.scheme, and rather investing in those schemes, and insuring that

:21:11. > :21:14.teacher shortages addressed, but that money instead is going to be

:21:15. > :21:19.diverted into a scheme for ` selected few and is cheap proud she

:21:20. > :21:23.is opposing bringing back a two tier education system and yet more up

:21:24. > :21:29.evil in our already exhaustdd schools? Hers is an area whhch

:21:30. > :21:31.demonstrates why we need to concentrate to make sure th`t not

:21:32. > :21:36.only the reforms we have brought forward can start to have an impact

:21:37. > :21:42.on children but it is also right why we are to leave note stone tnturned

:21:43. > :21:46.to make sure there are good schools and good school places in all parts

:21:47. > :21:51.of our country. In my mind that demands us to look at all options,

:21:52. > :21:56.not to close them off. Having represented parents for 16 xears,

:21:57. > :22:03.nothing angers them more th`n their children not being able to `ccess a

:22:04. > :22:07.good local school. With the Secretary of State consider changing

:22:08. > :22:14.axis to UTCs from 14 to 19 to 1 to 19? I think we are right to look at

:22:15. > :22:18.how they can evolve over tile and there are some indications that

:22:19. > :22:22.actually for them, working with children at a younger age, ht may be

:22:23. > :22:29.one of the eight ways they can have a UTC which is successful.

:22:30. > :22:33.I very proudly for the last five years have been chairman of the

:22:34. > :22:39.governors of an academy. It is a school which has 60% of its students

:22:40. > :22:44.on pupil premium. This year it increased its GCSE results by 2 %.

:22:45. > :22:48.It is truly a school to everyone. Can the Secretary of State lain

:22:49. > :22:52.single grammar school which has more than half of its students from areas

:22:53. > :22:57.of deprivation and this year increased its GCSE results by more

:22:58. > :23:02.than 20%? If not, will she just remove this ridiculous proposal

:23:03. > :23:08.before it goes too far? He `rgues about the status quo whilst then

:23:09. > :23:11.resolutely standing in the face of any proposals to change. As he will

:23:12. > :23:16.know, the challenge we have at the moment is there is selection by

:23:17. > :23:20.house price, and therefore, the fact is that parents simply don't have

:23:21. > :23:24.the choice, if they are not able to buy a house in the catchment area.

:23:25. > :23:29.We think that is totally unacceptable. We think gramlars

:23:30. > :23:31.should do more to reach into disadvantaged communities btt we

:23:32. > :23:35.also think parents should h`ve the choice of a grammar if that is what

:23:36. > :23:38.they want. The cold valley is unique in the

:23:39. > :23:42.North of England as we are still served by three state gramm`r

:23:43. > :23:48.schools, all of which are htgely popular with parents and pupils

:23:49. > :23:54.alike -- the colder valley. Will my right honourable friend look at how

:23:55. > :24:01.we look at state primary schools to see how we can help pupils,

:24:02. > :24:08.particular from -- those from deprived backgrounds can sit the

:24:09. > :24:15.entrance exam? That is a serious issue he sets out which is one

:24:16. > :24:22.reason why some of the proposals for grammar schools work more closely

:24:23. > :24:28.with feeder schools with pupils from lower income families. Therd was

:24:29. > :24:31.also an important piece of work done by Kent County Council which looked

:24:32. > :24:34.at some reasons why parents from lower income families were less

:24:35. > :24:40.inclined to send their Georgian to grammar schools. It was not just

:24:41. > :24:48.about the test, it was about school uniforms and transport costs. These

:24:49. > :24:55.are practical steps we can take to remove barriers.

:24:56. > :24:58.As the Secretary of State whll know from her previous job, faith -based

:24:59. > :25:07.institutions are the biggest provider of schools on the planet. I

:25:08. > :25:11.think the grammar is a smokd screen around the issue which has led to

:25:12. > :25:14.few schools being built in `reas of demand and therefore thousands of

:25:15. > :25:19.parents being denied their choice, and that is The Record this

:25:20. > :25:25.government has. I don't think that is correct at all. The realhty is

:25:26. > :25:30.1.4 million more children are now in good or outstanding schools. We have

:25:31. > :25:33.improving standards, a tougher but appropriately stretching curriculum.

:25:34. > :25:40.That is progress and a lot lore progress than Labour made.

:25:41. > :25:42.I was very interested in thd comments from my right honotrable

:25:43. > :25:51.friend about the independent sector. Independent schools truly h`ve much

:25:52. > :25:56.to offer the public sector. But if an independent school does not make

:25:57. > :25:59.adequate contribution or is not willing to, will the Secret`ry of

:26:00. > :26:05.State consider putting VAT on their fees?

:26:06. > :26:10.We'll ask schools to demonstrate that they are eligible for

:26:11. > :26:13.charitable status. If they `re unable or unwilling to meet the

:26:14. > :26:19.tougher standards, they simply won't be able to get the charitable status

:26:20. > :26:22.and that will force the imp`ct on their state.

:26:23. > :26:27.Thank you, Mr Speaker. What does it say when the new Prime Minister s

:26:28. > :26:33.first major initiative is so aggressive that the former Tory

:26:34. > :26:35.Prime Minister would rather resign from Parliament rather than vote for

:26:36. > :26:40.it. The Secretary of State lust know what the real problems are `lready,

:26:41. > :26:47.they are most of all a short annal of teachers, the workload that we

:26:48. > :26:51.then put on the teachers -- shortage of teachers. Please, Secret`ry of

:26:52. > :26:56.State, take this away and come back with something serious about

:26:57. > :27:00.standards. We are working on all of those things but that doesn't mean

:27:01. > :27:04.we shouldn't ask ourselves additionally how welcome make sure

:27:05. > :27:08.there are good school places for more children, especially in parts

:27:09. > :27:11.of the country where there `re currently insufficient good school

:27:12. > :27:14.places. It's not an either or question. These proposals today

:27:15. > :27:18.this Green Party that we ard opening up is about how we ensure that the

:27:19. > :27:26.overall reforms we are bringing forward are going to be successful.

:27:27. > :27:29.Mr Speaker, could I congrattlate my right honourable friend on her

:27:30. > :27:37.vision on both religious and selective schools. Could I shift the

:27:38. > :27:41.Spotlight to subjects. A school in my constituency has produced more

:27:42. > :27:46.than 1% of all this country's physics graduates. Particul`rly

:27:47. > :27:51.there's an even greater isste around maths. The blunt proof is that a

:27:52. > :27:56.child with mathematical abilities in a poor area is very unlikelx to find

:27:57. > :28:00.a critical mass of children sufficient in the top streal of

:28:01. > :28:04.their comprehensive to provhde the critical math for further m`ths

:28:05. > :28:11.A-level or indeed the more demanding teaching needed further down. One

:28:12. > :28:15.thing this Government's foctssed on has been increasing the number of

:28:16. > :28:19.children and entries for stdm subjects. We are seeing maths

:28:20. > :28:23.A-level for example, the most popular A-level there is. There a

:28:24. > :28:26.lot further to go, not least to ensure children are taking the

:28:27. > :28:39.academic exams that will opdn up, but also because it's what our

:28:40. > :28:46.economy needs too. In Northdrn Ireland, 67 of our grammar schools

:28:47. > :28:52.are grammars. I welcome you to Northern Ireland and would xou talk

:28:53. > :28:55.to all parties and look at the three side effects of having a gr`mmar

:28:56. > :28:58.schools which is to make sure vocations are still looked `t, that

:28:59. > :29:02.we have standardised tests that everyone can get at, and thd third

:29:03. > :29:17.is the shares of resources with the other schools so they are not left

:29:18. > :29:20.behind. He sets it out very well, it's about all aspects.

:29:21. > :29:25.I welcome my right honourable friend's commitment to sharhng the

:29:26. > :29:30.success of grammar schools with neighbouring non-selective schools

:29:31. > :29:34.and I welcome it because it's already happening in my constituency

:29:35. > :29:40.with the Horncastle Umbrell` Trust, thought to be the first partnership

:29:41. > :29:45.in the country between a gr`mmar school, Queen Elizabeth's and its

:29:46. > :29:52.neighbouring non-selective `cademy there. The Trust works for the good

:29:53. > :29:57.of all children in Horncastle, sharing teaching practises, sharing

:29:58. > :30:02.facilities and bringing the students together to learn together with

:30:03. > :30:07.pleasing GCSE results this summer. Will my right honourable frhend

:30:08. > :30:09.please look at these schools and the other excellent selective and

:30:10. > :30:14.non-selective schools in my constituency to see if their example

:30:15. > :30:17.can work elsewhere in the country? I think my right honourable friend

:30:18. > :30:22.will welcome the proposals that we are setting out in the constltation

:30:23. > :30:26.document which aim to look `t how we can see stronger more connected

:30:27. > :30:31.relationships between gramm`r schools and other schools ndarby and

:30:32. > :30:37.how working together they c`n lift overall attainment.

:30:38. > :30:42.Mr Speaker, as a product of Luton's comprehensive system, I know first

:30:43. > :30:47.hand the benefits that come from good leadership and good te`ching

:30:48. > :30:52.has never held back capable students from social mobility and I'll do

:30:53. > :30:56.everything I can, as the town's MP, to oppose segregation. Why does the

:30:57. > :31:03.Secretary of State believe that a system in which the pupil is chosen

:31:04. > :31:07.by the school at 11 is bettdr than the shift that's happened in the

:31:08. > :31:11.last 15-20 years whereby pupil and parent together decide on a pathway

:31:12. > :31:14.at 14? Again, I don't accept this hs

:31:15. > :31:18.somehow an either or approach on education. It's about driving more

:31:19. > :31:21.choice for parents, it's about having more schools that can be

:31:22. > :31:27.tailored to particular children s needs and it's about in the end

:31:28. > :31:31.raising educational standards. Thank you, Mr Speaker. I welcome my

:31:32. > :31:37.right honourable friend's statement and I can tell her that in the week

:31:38. > :31:41.or so since this debate beg`n, it's received a very favourable response

:31:42. > :31:47.from my constituents. If we are to maximise the opportunities for our

:31:48. > :31:51.young people, we need not jtst more grammar schools, but more young

:31:52. > :31:56.people reaching the standard at the age of 11 to qualify for thdm, so

:31:57. > :32:01.can she give an absolute assurance that adequate resources will be

:32:02. > :32:06.provided to all schools? Shd spoke of opening excellent feeder schools

:32:07. > :32:10.but we want to make the existing schools excellent feeder schools? Of

:32:11. > :32:13.course one of the suggestions is that grammars expanding could

:32:14. > :32:18.sponsor a primary feeder, particularly in an area of lower

:32:19. > :32:22.income families if that was a possibility. But as he says, you

:32:23. > :32:27.have to look at all of the work that we've done in primary schools in

:32:28. > :32:30.terms of phonics, improving maths, driving up attainment to make sure

:32:31. > :32:35.that children are not only ready but at the right level able to love into

:32:36. > :32:39.a secondary system then finhsh their education from there.

:32:40. > :32:44.Thank you Mr Speaker. I would like to congratulate the young pdople in

:32:45. > :32:48.my constituency who've been successful in their GCSEs and

:32:49. > :32:52.A-level results this year and I make the point that there is no shortage

:32:53. > :32:57.nationwide in access to excdllent academic education. Our world

:32:58. > :33:03.leading universities welcomd in more students from this country than ever

:33:04. > :33:07.before but where we are not so good is providing access to technical and

:33:08. > :33:11.vocational qualifications and employers across the length and

:33:12. > :33:15.breadth of the country are crying out for those skills. Can the

:33:16. > :33:18.Secretary of State tell me dxactly what introducing more gram lar

:33:19. > :33:25.schools, how that is going to improve this situation?

:33:26. > :33:29.She needs to sit alongside the Government's push, improving young

:33:30. > :33:32.people's chances to get work experience, bringing forward three

:33:33. > :33:36.million apprenticeships. Shd's absolutely right to reflect the fact

:33:37. > :33:40.that, although there'll be lany children who now go on to do

:33:41. > :33:46.A-levels and go into our unhversity system I should say, a highdr

:33:47. > :33:49.proportion than ever of thel before now from disadvantaged families

:33:50. > :33:52.many, many young people will not follow that route and we have to

:33:53. > :33:55.make sure the vocational rotte is one that can be delivered from them

:33:56. > :33:59.too. In Lincolnshire, we already have

:34:00. > :34:03.grammar schools and with a third of pupils going to them, many of them

:34:04. > :34:07.from deprived backgrounds, ht's very clear that in the right ecosystem,

:34:08. > :34:11.grammar schools can be a re`l engine for social mobility. Can I `sk the

:34:12. > :34:16.Secretary of State to also bear in mind the contribution that `re made

:34:17. > :34:21.by secondary modern schools in the 21st century, schools like the Gyles

:34:22. > :34:25.Academy which have evolved to make sure the right education is provided

:34:26. > :34:30.for the right pupils in a gdnuinely diverse ecosystem. If we get this

:34:31. > :34:33.right, we can produce schools that make sure ofry pupil gets the

:34:34. > :34:38.education they deserve. Can I invite her to come to the National

:34:39. > :34:42.Association of Secondary moderns reception in the House of Commons as

:34:43. > :34:46.her predecessor the toyed p`y tribute to the excellent work that

:34:47. > :34:53.goes on in these schools? I look forward to getting a chance

:34:54. > :34:56.to meet the organisation. I would reiterate his point which is that we

:34:57. > :35:00.can see grammars operating hn parts of the country, not at the detriment

:35:01. > :35:04.of the broader school community and in fact this is not a questhon, as

:35:05. > :35:08.we saw in the past, of a bindery system where you had outstanding

:35:09. > :35:12.grammars and by contrast other schools in the 1950s and 60s

:35:13. > :35:16.secondary moderns that were simply not even testing the childrdn that

:35:17. > :35:20.came to their doors, let alone driving attainment. We are hn a very

:35:21. > :35:24.different place now, much more diverse system, which is whx it s

:35:25. > :35:28.right to also start opening it up. Thank you Mr Speaker. I would like

:35:29. > :35:32.to echo the words of my right honourable friend, the membdr from

:35:33. > :35:37.Slough, that far from opening up opportunities to all childrdn, all

:35:38. > :35:40.this proposal does is open tp opportunities for those children

:35:41. > :35:44.whose parents can afford prhvate tutors for them to train and coach

:35:45. > :35:49.them for the grammar school exam. I would like to also pay tribtte to my

:35:50. > :35:53.right honourable friend, thd member from Scunthorpe on his excellent

:35:54. > :35:57.suggestion that we should use our current grammar schools as pilots to

:35:58. > :36:01.actually try out some of thd ideas. The Secretary of State's talked

:36:02. > :36:06.about reforming the 11-plus exam. Why doesn't the Secretary of State

:36:07. > :36:09.start with our existing gralmars, on reforming the exams, making them

:36:10. > :36:15.tutor proof and act which whlly doing what she says is going to

:36:16. > :36:18.happen, that young people whll be given an opportunity -- acttally

:36:19. > :36:21.doing what she says is going to happen, that young people whll be

:36:22. > :36:26.given an opportunity. She'll welcome the fact that a number of grammar

:36:27. > :36:30.schools are already looking at how their test is one that focuses more

:36:31. > :36:34.on the underlying abilities of the child rather than the ability of

:36:35. > :36:38.their parents to pay for a tutor. We should also look at other w`ys that

:36:39. > :36:40.we can overcome the barriers. I don't think the answer to that is

:36:41. > :36:45.simply THE SPEAKER: We can't have ` series

:36:46. > :36:47.of side conversations in evhdent disapproval of what people `re

:36:48. > :36:51.saying, while the honourabld lady the Secretary of State is trying to

:36:52. > :36:59.respond to questions. I was speaking to a very large group of school

:37:00. > :37:05.students in south Perthshird on Friday andbit chill refrain "order"

:37:06. > :37:09.- I'm sure the honourable gdntleman is interested in this! It w`s asked,

:37:10. > :37:12.why is it sometimes in Parlhament that members are discourteots to

:37:13. > :37:17.each other and we should trx to set a good example. What is reqtired is

:37:18. > :37:20.the Statesmanlike demeanour personified by the honourable

:37:21. > :37:24.gentleman, the member for Bognor Regis and Littlehampton, thd

:37:25. > :37:27.Minister of State, who is shtting in a solemn and reflective manner.

:37:28. > :37:30.There are many examples of Labour members who're sitting in a similar

:37:31. > :37:35.way. We should learn from them. Secretary of State?

:37:36. > :37:43.And indeed my right honourable friend has been one of the principal

:37:44. > :37:46.reasons we have seen a school reform go through our education system has

:37:47. > :37:51.delivered better outcomes for many children. I would say to thd

:37:52. > :37:54.honourable lady she sets out some of the changes, many grammar schools

:37:55. > :37:57.are already looking at ways to ensure they are open to mord

:37:58. > :38:00.children from disadvantaged backgrounds and I'm sure shd'll

:38:01. > :38:05.welcome some of the conditions we are going to set on grammars and

:38:06. > :38:10.some of the Channings we ard going to put on existing grammars to do

:38:11. > :38:12.more -- some of the grammars. On selective schools, does the

:38:13. > :38:15.Secretary of State agree th`t we must take account of local

:38:16. > :38:19.circumstances because in Chdltenham we have some of the strongest

:38:20. > :38:24.comprehensives anywhere in the country and they sit alongshde an

:38:25. > :38:29.excellent grammar school. They offer exemplary rigour. Does she `gree

:38:30. > :38:32.with me that where this exists thanks to the Government policies

:38:33. > :38:36.and local parents are happy with that provision, nothing shotld be

:38:37. > :38:41.done to disturb that delicate local balance?

:38:42. > :38:44.I do. I've been very clear today, Mr Speaker, that as part of thhs

:38:45. > :38:49.consultation, we understand that we need to work with local comlunities.

:38:50. > :38:51.This is about more choice. Ht's not about dictating what schools people

:38:52. > :39:04.should have locally. Thank you, Mr Speaker. Can H press

:39:05. > :39:08.the Secretary of State on stem subjects with the Humber becoming

:39:09. > :39:13.the UK's energy estuary, thdre are thousands of new jobs that will

:39:14. > :39:16.depend on people having qualifications, vocational `nd

:39:17. > :39:21.scientific and good apprenthceships. I want to know that if we are really

:39:22. > :39:25.serious about schools that work for everyone, we already have academies,

:39:26. > :39:29.we are getting a UTC, we have free schools, wouldn't we be much better

:39:30. > :39:34.concentrating on making thel work best for our children rather than

:39:35. > :39:38.introducing the grammar schools which really are of a by gone age,

:39:39. > :39:42.not for this century? I say two things to that. Fhrst of

:39:43. > :39:45.all s we have seen signific`nt improvements in the attainmdnt to

:39:46. > :39:51.children in maths and English over recent years and we are introducing

:39:52. > :39:55.a more stretching curriculul still for GCSEs, but as set against that,

:39:56. > :40:00.some of the schools that ard delivering best for children in

:40:01. > :40:04.achieving their attainment hn stem subjects are grammars so it makes

:40:05. > :40:07.sense to look at how we can give parents more choice in other parts

:40:08. > :40:11.of the country to be able to send their child to a local gramlar. I

:40:12. > :40:14.welcome both the process and the breadth of the debate launched by

:40:15. > :40:18.the Prime Minister and the Secretary of State. We have four historical

:40:19. > :40:22.grammar schools in Gloucestdr and for some time I have very mtch

:40:23. > :40:27.wanted to increase signific`ntly both the numbers of those free

:40:28. > :40:32.school meal pupils and pupils who live closest to these schools. Would

:40:33. > :40:36.manufacture therefore confirm that these issues and indeed opthons on

:40:37. > :40:42.how best to achieve them, whll form part of her department's subsequent

:40:43. > :40:47.White Paper? I'll be obviously keen to see his response to the Green

:40:48. > :40:50.Party and the consultation document that document that very much sets

:40:51. > :40:54.out the issues and we'll take account of the responses we get as

:40:55. > :40:58.he will know in his particular areas, it's one of those ardas where

:40:59. > :41:02.many of the children from hhs local grammars are actually from outside

:41:03. > :41:10.his local area. It suggests there is broader demand there for parents and

:41:11. > :41:18.that we should respond to that. Accept

:41:19. > :41:24.Can I remind the Secretary of State that educational standards hmproved

:41:25. > :41:29.in London as a result of thd educational challenge. That's

:41:30. > :41:33.focused on standards in the classroom, it focused on qu`lity

:41:34. > :41:38.teaching and excellent leaddrship. It also involved the collaboration

:41:39. > :41:42.of schools across the capit`l. We had a similar scheme in Gre`ter

:41:43. > :41:46.Manchester, the Greater Manchester challenge, which sadly was scrapped

:41:47. > :41:51.in the early days of the last coalition government. Can I urge the

:41:52. > :41:57.Secretary of State, as part of this process, not to focus solelx on

:41:58. > :42:02.structures, but to focus on that collaboration, that drive for better

:42:03. > :42:05.standards and making sure wd best use teaching and leadership to drive

:42:06. > :42:13.up educational standards in places like Greater Manchester? I `gree

:42:14. > :42:18.with him. We are setting out some proposals today about how wd can get

:42:19. > :42:22.some more good places for good children but that sits alongside the

:42:23. > :42:25.other things he has talked `bout in terms of standards and qualhty

:42:26. > :42:29.leadership. I believe gramm`rs have those features but there ard many

:42:30. > :42:34.other schools that have thel too, that is why we have done so much

:42:35. > :42:37.work to raise overall school standards over the last six years.

:42:38. > :42:44.There are now more schools than ever before that are good or outstanding

:42:45. > :42:48.in our country. I was surprhsed not to hear him mention the Manchester

:42:49. > :42:54.Expo proposal which I know his local area is developing so I thotght I

:42:55. > :43:00.would do that on his behalf Can I welcome the Secretary of

:43:01. > :43:05.State's willingness to challenge the status quo and the one sisal

:43:06. > :43:11.approach to education, but can I seek her assurance that she will not

:43:12. > :43:14.neglect the rural areas where you can have communities with only one

:43:15. > :43:20.secondary school in easy tr`velling distance and how we can increased

:43:21. > :43:23.diversity and choice in those areas and also address the shortf`ll in

:43:24. > :43:30.funding which many areas receive in education? His previous points have

:43:31. > :43:34.been made and sets out the particular challenges that rural

:43:35. > :43:37.communities face in terms of having a strong choice and strong school

:43:38. > :43:42.places locally and I can assure him that I am very well aware of the

:43:43. > :43:46.concerns of rural members to see us get on with the national funding

:43:47. > :43:52.formula next steps and we whll be announcing our next steps on what we

:43:53. > :43:55.will do shortly. Can I give the Secretary of State

:43:56. > :43:59.the opportunity to answer the question which I tried to gdt her to

:44:00. > :44:02.answer last week which she said he failed to address such as this, you

:44:03. > :44:06.can either school selection or you could have parental choice. On one

:44:07. > :44:15.hand the school selects and on other hand the parent chooses. Whhch is

:44:16. > :44:19.it? In the end, it is both, but at the moment married parents do not

:44:20. > :44:22.have the choice of a grammar school -- at the moment many parents do not

:44:23. > :44:27.have the choice of a grammar school so we have to see what we c`n do to

:44:28. > :44:31.rectify that. I also disagrde with him that the underlying presence of

:44:32. > :44:35.his question is if a child cannot get into a grammar there ard not

:44:36. > :44:40.other schools around for thdm. We have to make sure there are. In many

:44:41. > :44:44.parts of the country, gramm`r schools and non-grammar schools

:44:45. > :44:49.coexist very well together. We would be wrong to respond to parents who

:44:50. > :44:55.want more school places which are good and the option of a gr`mmar

:44:56. > :45:02.school for their child. Can I take the opportunity to ask my

:45:03. > :45:04.right honourable friend to congratulate Portsmouth schools for

:45:05. > :45:09.another improvement in their results this year. Can my right honourable

:45:10. > :45:14.friend assure me that whatever structures we have, be it academies,

:45:15. > :45:18.grammar or comprehensives, that the Government will be concentr`ting on

:45:19. > :45:25.the quality of teaching, as that is the most crucial impact on raising

:45:26. > :45:27.standards? I would like to congratulate the schools shd

:45:28. > :45:32.mentioned in her local areas for the results they recently got. That is

:45:33. > :45:36.down to not only the hard work of the children, but the dedic`tion of

:45:37. > :45:40.the teachers in those schools, to enable the children to do so well.

:45:41. > :45:44.As she points out, in the end, this comes down to improving the quality

:45:45. > :45:50.of teaching, that is how we get good schools. We believe grammars can

:45:51. > :45:53.play a role in that. The former prime minister h`s been

:45:54. > :45:58.mentioned in the Chamber and we will miss him around the Commons. He

:45:59. > :46:01.didn't go to a grammar school but his parents managed to get him into

:46:02. > :46:06.reducing school, and is that the point? I went to a grammar school

:46:07. > :46:09.and I would not wish to denx that to youngsters growing up in

:46:10. > :46:13.working-class states like the one I grew up in. But could the Sdcretary

:46:14. > :46:19.of State take on one thing which means increasingly people whll not

:46:20. > :46:23.be going to their nearest school, and in the Ribble Valley, wd have a

:46:24. > :46:26.grammar school and a number of other good schools, yet the countx council

:46:27. > :46:31.refuses to give assistance to children not going to their local

:46:32. > :46:36.school. Parents are being clobbered by ?600 or over ?1000 if thdy have

:46:37. > :46:42.two youngsters not going to their local school. Will she make sure

:46:43. > :46:46.parents will not be financi`lly advantaged? He raises an important

:46:47. > :46:51.point and this underlines why we are right to give more places close to

:46:52. > :46:55.where their children are living already. He raises the issud about

:46:56. > :47:09.transport costs. It is one H am aware of and I will look at what we

:47:10. > :47:17.can do. We are very lucky in my constituency

:47:18. > :47:25.because the brightest peopld in my area are doing very well in the

:47:26. > :47:28.local sixth form trust. Will the Secretary of State assure md and

:47:29. > :47:33.local parents that this is ` general consultation and will she focus on

:47:34. > :47:37.social mobility and funding for smaller schools, rather than

:47:38. > :47:42.selection and segregation? H can assure him that this is a vdry open

:47:43. > :47:46.green paper style genuine consultation. I would be interested

:47:47. > :47:50.to see the submission he makes to it. As I have said too many

:47:51. > :47:54.honourable members, this is not about forcing local communities to

:47:55. > :47:57.have schools they don't want, it is about working with local colmunities

:47:58. > :48:01.and simply giving parents more choice, if that is what thex want at

:48:02. > :48:04.the moment, in too many parts of the country where people want it, they

:48:05. > :48:12.don't have it and we should be doing something about that. I welcome my

:48:13. > :48:16.right from macro to her place and also welcome her suggestions for

:48:17. > :48:20.educational reforms. May I suggest this is not about segregation as has

:48:21. > :48:26.been suggested by some, it hs about aspiration. You have only got to see

:48:27. > :48:31.our Olympic gold-medal lists and other medallists who are streamed to

:48:32. > :48:36.perfection. Not everyone can attain that and the inspiration whhch has

:48:37. > :48:40.drive from their success, which ripples down to people like myself

:48:41. > :48:47.who are not the best at the 100 metres. As he points out, r`ising

:48:48. > :48:52.children's expectations and also their parents's is absolutely

:48:53. > :48:55.critical. We believe we can open up our school system to allow selection

:48:56. > :49:00.in playing a role to allow that to take place, but I am also sdtting

:49:01. > :49:04.out how I want independent schools to play a strong role, how H want

:49:05. > :49:08.universities to play a stronger role and I think that will fundalentally

:49:09. > :49:18.help to set goals - our children, and I think if they offset higher

:49:19. > :49:21.they have a chance of reachhng them. Rugby has three outstanding grammar

:49:22. > :49:25.schools and parents will be delighted that they are abld to

:49:26. > :49:37.expand, but the very fact of their excellence means bright youngsters

:49:38. > :49:44.in towns and cities apply for and go to schools which might otherwise be

:49:45. > :49:47.given to rugby children. Thhs means that a greater proportion of the

:49:48. > :49:54.selective places we have in rugby would be able to be taken up by

:49:55. > :49:57.rugby pupils? Although it w`s depressing to hear the Labotr Party

:49:58. > :50:02.not even willing to engage with these sorts of issues that `re

:50:03. > :50:05.actually faced by local comlunities, we are right to open up this debate

:50:06. > :50:11.so we can take a measured approach into understanding what the 21st

:50:12. > :50:23.century approach and policy on grammar schools should be.

:50:24. > :50:26.I wonder if the fact that I welcome the Secretary of State's colments on

:50:27. > :50:32.the fact that schools have `lready started to change their admhssions

:50:33. > :50:35.exam to recognise that over tutoring of children to squeeze into grammar

:50:36. > :50:39.schools can have a negative effect because they may struggle for the

:50:40. > :50:43.next seven years. We were asked for a London example and I wonddr if the

:50:44. > :50:48.Secretary of State will agrde with me that Sutton's example, where you

:50:49. > :50:51.have six selective schools, either fully or partially selectivd,

:50:52. > :50:56.working really closely with two Catholic schools, with two schools

:50:57. > :50:59.which give assistance to schools which are gifted sporting whse as

:51:00. > :51:04.well, and for other schools would give a far more wider range of

:51:05. > :51:07.vocational training as well, including Stanley Park high school

:51:08. > :51:14.in my neighbouring area which has gone from being an average state

:51:15. > :51:19.school to the Times educational supplement secondary School of the

:51:20. > :51:21.year this year. All of that being underpinned by inspirational

:51:22. > :51:28.leadership and great teaching. That is what is going to make schools

:51:29. > :51:34.work for everyone. He used the long wait to allow his thoughts to defy

:51:35. > :51:44.in his mind. We are deeply obliged -- Fruchter... You have a ntmber of

:51:45. > :51:47.schools working effectively together and collectively raising st`ndards

:51:48. > :51:50.and attainment and at the s`me time giving parents choice is well

:51:51. > :51:58.defined the school nearby which will really be one that will help their

:51:59. > :52:01.child will stop that is what we are doing in opening up this debate

:52:02. > :52:04.today and I'm looking forward to continuing it over the coming

:52:05. > :52:09.months. I thank the Secretary of St`te and

:52:10. > :52:13.all colleagues who took part in this important series of exchangds.

:52:14. > :52:23.Order. Presentation of Bill. Tom Brake. Arms export controls

:52:24. > :52:29.countries of concern bill. Second reading what day? The 21st of

:52:30. > :52:38.October. Order. Thank you. The minister to move. Indeed, the

:52:39. > :52:43.question is the Wales Bill programme number two motion, as on thd order

:52:44. > :52:50.paper. As many as are of thd opinion, say "aye". To the contrary,

:52:51. > :52:52."no". I think the Ayes have it. The clerk will now read the orddr of the

:52:53. > :53:02.day. Wales Bill to be amended and

:53:03. > :53:12.considered. Now. Two of thel said it for safety's sake! Order. Wd begin

:53:13. > :53:19.with new clause four. To move government new clause four, I call

:53:20. > :53:25.the Secretary of State for Wales, secretary Alun Cairns. Thank you, Mr

:53:26. > :53:29.Speaker. There are three main categories

:53:30. > :53:33.Firstly, a number of amendmdnts deal with technical drafting changes to

:53:34. > :53:37.ensure that the new devoluthon settlement functions as it should.

:53:38. > :53:40.Secondly, I'm bringing forw`rd amendments that address sevdral

:53:41. > :53:44.issues that have arisen durhng the ongoing discussion of the bhll with

:53:45. > :53:48.the Welsh Government and thd Presiding Officer and the assembly

:53:49. > :53:52.commission. And thirdly, Madam Deputy Speaker, I'm pleased to table

:53:53. > :53:57.a number of amendments that I dress that I am committed to return to

:53:58. > :54:02.that were raised at committde consideration of the bill bdfore the

:54:03. > :54:05.summer recess. So, turning to new clause four, it is the first

:54:06. > :54:11.Amendment to deal with the drafting issue in relation to the bill, in

:54:12. > :54:14.this case, a consequence of devolving local government

:54:15. > :54:18.elections. The clause makes changes to the police reform and social

:54:19. > :54:23.responsibility act 2011, relating to the timing and franchise of

:54:24. > :54:27.elections to the Police and Crime Commissioners, which are reserved

:54:28. > :54:31.under the bill. The timing of an franchise for their elections are

:54:32. > :54:34.currently linked in law to the timing and franchise for local

:54:35. > :54:39.government elections, which this bill devolves to the assembly. It is

:54:40. > :54:44.therefore necessary to bring forward this new clause in order to avoid

:54:45. > :54:48.certain aspects of PCC elections in Wales, being subject to any future

:54:49. > :54:52.changes to local government elections in Wales, made by the

:54:53. > :54:56.assembly. Honourable members will be aware that the Saint Davids Day

:54:57. > :55:01.agreement provides that all aspects of the election of Police and Crime

:55:02. > :55:05.Commissioners in Wales would remain the responsibility of the UK

:55:06. > :55:14.government and parliament. The bill provides that PCCs and reserves

:55:15. > :55:17.matters that amendments madd by this new clause are appropriate. The new

:55:18. > :55:24.clause means that the timing of ordinary elections for PCCs Wales

:55:25. > :55:29.can assist to follow the tilings of ordinary elections in Wales.

:55:30. > :55:32.Instead, the amendments reqtire that elections be held on the first

:55:33. > :55:41.Thursday in May on the year of an election. The news team at new

:55:42. > :55:45.clause also provides that the franchise for PCC elections in Wales

:55:46. > :55:49.will cease to correspond directly to the franchise for local elections in

:55:50. > :55:53.Wales. The new clause requires that the PCC franchise in Wales will

:55:54. > :55:56.instead correspond to the parliamentary franchise with the

:55:57. > :56:00.exclusion of overseas electhons and the exclusion of peers and DU

:56:01. > :56:02.citizens who are entitled to vote in the local government elections in

:56:03. > :56:13.Wales. I will give way. The my understanding is the

:56:14. > :56:18.government is considering whth the Law Society to simplify electoral

:56:19. > :56:22.law. Given that Police and Crime Commissioners are not devolved, we

:56:23. > :56:25.do not be sensible for the government to hold its fire rather

:56:26. > :56:31.than introduce an amendment at this point? Clearly, I think the

:56:32. > :56:37.honourable member is missing the purpose of what we're trying to do.

:56:38. > :56:42.We are seeking to devolve responsibility of local elections to

:56:43. > :56:45.Wales. Because this is linkdd to Police and Crime Commissiondrs

:56:46. > :56:52.elections, any changes to the franchise of local government

:56:53. > :56:54.elections will have a effect to Police and Crime Commissiondrs

:56:55. > :56:58.elections. We are seeking to separate the franchise to m`ke sure

:56:59. > :57:01.the same people have the sale right to vote as currently which leaves

:57:02. > :57:05.the freedom to the Welsh Government to change the franchise as the

:57:06. > :57:12.Seifert should be wished to change the age that example but it would

:57:13. > :57:15.not be appropriate for that to be expense that Mike extended to Police

:57:16. > :57:22.and Crime Commissioners. Th`t is the purpose of this. He will relember

:57:23. > :57:26.that when Police and Crime Commissioners first elections took

:57:27. > :57:33.place, only 14% of the election voted. In my constituency, one

:57:34. > :57:40.polling station achieved a world record because nobody voted. When

:57:41. > :57:44.the elections were held on ` day which coincided with another

:57:45. > :57:50.election, 45% of the electorate voted. Is it not based that we and

:57:51. > :57:52.the assembly ensure that Police and Crime Commissioners elections are

:57:53. > :58:00.held on the same day as othdr elections? I am grateful to the

:58:01. > :58:03.Shadow Secretary of State for his comments. That would be the

:58:04. > :58:08.preferred option. It is onlx appropriate that Police and Crime

:58:09. > :58:15.Commissioners elections rem`in a reserved body and local govdrnment

:58:16. > :58:20.elections remain devolved. That is not a requirement which rem`ins for

:58:21. > :58:25.both administrations to coordinate, nor do we wish to tie the h`nds of

:58:26. > :58:29.the assembly should it Seifdrt to change the franchise and tilings of

:58:30. > :58:37.the elections. But I absolutely concur with the honourable lember's

:58:38. > :58:41.intentions. I will give way. I am great. He is making it clear that

:58:42. > :58:44.the reason for separating the franchises is because of thd concern

:58:45. > :58:52.of the government that the `ssembly could reduce the voting age from 18

:58:53. > :58:55.to 16. Are there any other concerns he has about the franchise that make

:58:56. > :59:02.him want to bring forward this amendment? This would be a latter

:59:03. > :59:07.for the Welsh Government. I am seeking to give the Welsh Government

:59:08. > :59:10.the absolute freedom over the local elections within the limitations

:59:11. > :59:16.that are considered within the bell. It is not tried any changes the bill

:59:17. > :59:22.-- thing about, and that max well be a change the franchise, that should

:59:23. > :59:25.not happen as a natural consequence of their Police and Crime

:59:26. > :59:28.Commissioners elections which they do not have responsibility for

:59:29. > :59:34.because they are reserved under the bell. The new clause makes changes

:59:35. > :59:42.in their 2011 acts for giving notice in the vacancy of the officd of

:59:43. > :59:47.Police and Crime Commissiondrs. And that of candidates. This is the

:59:48. > :59:53.second technical amendments. It removes a reference to the planning

:59:54. > :59:56.act from the definition of relevant, nationally significant

:59:57. > :00:02.infrastructure project in the planning recommendation. Thhs

:00:03. > :00:11.applies only in England so the reference is superfluous. Alendments

:00:12. > :00:18.33, 49 and 57 address an issue with the numerous references to the

:00:19. > :00:24.legislative responsibility of the assembly. Since devolution `cts of

:00:25. > :00:28.parliament often referred to the devolution boundary using

:00:29. > :00:32.expressions like the legisl`tive competence of the assembly. For

:00:33. > :00:37.example the power to make subordinate legislation could be

:00:38. > :00:43.conferred on the Secretary of State where provisions are within such

:00:44. > :00:49.competence. In determining, what is and what is not within the

:00:50. > :00:52.competence of the assembly, new section 100 and 8p and schedule

:00:53. > :01:00.seven A and seven be set out the relevant tests. Provisions such as

:01:01. > :01:04.paragraphs eight at 211 schddule B, whereby a provision will only be

:01:05. > :01:09.within the competence if thd consent of a UK minister has been ghven

:01:10. > :01:15.These consents mechanisms exist so that is an appropriate role for UK

:01:16. > :01:21.ministers in relation to assembly legislation which affects rdserved

:01:22. > :01:24.authorities only. However this requirement for consent is not

:01:25. > :01:30.appropriate when considering UK legislation. For that reason,

:01:31. > :01:35.amendment 33 death applies `ny requirement for the UK minister is

:01:36. > :01:39.sent when the confidence of the assembly is being interpretdd in the

:01:40. > :01:46.confidence of UK Parliament legislation. The next amendlents

:01:47. > :01:50.ensure that we're acts of the UK Parliament referred to the Welsh

:01:51. > :01:53.devolution boundary, they do so in accordance with the new resdrved

:01:54. > :02:00.powers model as inserted by the bell. These are sensible and

:02:01. > :02:05.practical changes to ensure the new reserved powers model devolttion is

:02:06. > :02:12.interpreted and applied consistently for all UK legislation. Turning now

:02:13. > :02:17.to amendments which resulted from ongoing discussions with thd Welsh

:02:18. > :02:26.Government, the assembly prdsiding government and they commisshon. I

:02:27. > :02:29.will give way. I want to reserve to the reserve powers model. Hd has

:02:30. > :02:33.talked about consistency of interpretation which is to be

:02:34. > :02:38.welcomed but it would also be useful if you could say that it will be the

:02:39. > :02:43.desire of the UK government not to be going to the Supreme Court so

:02:44. > :02:52.much to argue about supreme -- to argue about these powers. One of the

:02:53. > :02:56.key purposes of the bill is to provide clarity of powers and

:02:57. > :03:03.responsibilities. Anyone who works or lives in Wales, we want them to

:03:04. > :03:07.understand who is responsible for which rather than going to the

:03:08. > :03:12.Supreme Court which will be needless because of the clarity provhded by

:03:13. > :03:21.the bill. I am grateful to him for his intervention. I will give way. I

:03:22. > :03:26.thank him for giving way. I want to go back to the earlier point about

:03:27. > :03:33.Police and Crime Commissiondrs elections and whether they will be

:03:34. > :03:40.in conjunction with other elections. He makes an important point. There

:03:41. > :03:45.was significant progress in terms of turnout of these elections when they

:03:46. > :03:51.are held on the same day as local elections. That will continte to be

:03:52. > :03:55.the purpose of the desired timing of Police and Crime Commissiondrs

:03:56. > :04:00.elections. The purpose of the amendments I'm talking about are

:04:01. > :04:04.referring to the franchise. The Welsh Government may want to make

:04:05. > :04:10.changes to the franchise or consider the timing of the franchise, on

:04:11. > :04:15.timing of the election we would like them to continue on the samd day as

:04:16. > :04:21.last Police and Crime Commissioners elections, on the same day `s local

:04:22. > :04:25.elections. I will give way. I would like to be clear on the isste of

:04:26. > :04:27.Police and Crime Commissiondrs elections being quite separ`te from

:04:28. > :04:37.the franchise in relation to local government. Does he have concerns

:04:38. > :04:42.that 16 or 17-year-olds are seen as fit and evil citizens to vote in

:04:43. > :04:48.elections that deal with social services, planning and educ`tion but

:04:49. > :04:53.not capable to deal with eldctions of Police and Crime Commisshoners.

:04:54. > :04:58.Is that an issue here is trxing to suggest here because I find that

:04:59. > :05:03.worrying is that is right? H am grateful to her for her

:05:04. > :05:09.intervention. I suspect she has misunderstood the point I'm making.

:05:10. > :05:13.I seek to give the Welsh Government freedom in its franchise eldctions

:05:14. > :05:18.but because the current elections ties the Police and Crime

:05:19. > :05:26.Commissioners elections and local elections. Should the assembly wish

:05:27. > :05:29.to make a change in extending or changing the franchise withhn the

:05:30. > :05:34.powers of the bill, that should not be consequential on the UK

:05:35. > :05:38.government because Police and Crime Commissioners elections shall be

:05:39. > :05:42.reserved. It is up to the Wdlsh Government to decide who is

:05:43. > :05:47.responsible to vote, the agd question she raised is not tied or

:05:48. > :05:52.linked to the policies by the UK government, whatever they m`y be.

:05:53. > :05:57.This legislation I hope will be settled for many years ahead of us

:05:58. > :06:01.and whatever government seeks to extend the franchise or curtail the

:06:02. > :06:06.franchise, especially regarding local elections in Wales is a matter

:06:07. > :06:11.for the Welsh Government rather than UK Government. Likewise any

:06:12. > :06:14.consideration of the franchhse for Police and Crime Commissiondrs

:06:15. > :06:18.elections is a matter for the UK government. Those amendments seek to

:06:19. > :06:25.separate that link so the responsibility lies with thd

:06:26. > :06:30.respectable -- the respective legislator. I hope that clarifies.

:06:31. > :06:34.It is simply to give greater freedom to the Welsh Government so they are

:06:35. > :06:38.not restricted by the franchise which already exists for Police and

:06:39. > :06:48.Crime Commissioners elections from this place. Can I move to alendments

:06:49. > :06:54.14 to 18, 29 to 31, and othdrs which make technical changes relating to

:06:55. > :06:58.financial control and relatdd schedules. Since introducing the

:06:59. > :07:01.bill, the government has continued to discuss the financial control

:07:02. > :07:05.provisions of the bill with the Welsh Government and the assembly.

:07:06. > :07:14.These amendment arise from these discussions. Amendments 16 hnserts a

:07:15. > :07:23.provision in the government of Wales act 2006, the equivalent of the

:07:24. > :07:26.Scotland act provisions of 0998 The funds from the Welsh Consolhdated

:07:27. > :07:31.fund may not be applied for any purpose other than that for which

:07:32. > :07:39.was charged or paid out. Amdndment 29 removes the of assembly `ct.

:07:40. > :07:44.Which makes provision for examinations and studies by the

:07:45. > :07:49.auditor general for Wales. @mendment 18 removes from the controller

:07:50. > :07:54.reserve powers to carry out examinations regarding paymdnts into

:07:55. > :07:58.and out of the Welsh Consolhdated fund and the power to carry out

:07:59. > :08:06.money for value studies in relation to Welsh public authorities. All

:08:07. > :08:12.amendments are consequential on amendment 18, over specific Welsh

:08:13. > :08:17.authorities. The auditor general for Wales will be the sole auditor for

:08:18. > :08:22.Welsh public bodies. The government has confirmed that he is content

:08:23. > :08:28.with the removal of these powers which have never been exerchsed

:08:29. > :08:36.Cynthia Beamond place. Government amendment 28, similar results from

:08:37. > :08:43.the same discussions. -- exdrcises they have been in place. Thd UK

:08:44. > :08:49.Children's Commissioner will be reserved authorities subject to the

:08:50. > :08:56.restrictions in the new schddule 7p. The effect of paragraphs eight and

:08:57. > :09:00.ten is that the UK Children's Commissioner is function cannot be

:09:01. > :09:03.changed unless the Secretarx of State has consented. This whll

:09:04. > :09:08.ensure that are no barriers to the assembly and mending the functions

:09:09. > :09:14.of the children's concert -, Commissioner provided the consent of

:09:15. > :09:21.the UK government has been obtained. Amendment 52 removes and neddless

:09:22. > :09:26.provision. The amendment is being made in the interests of brdvity and

:09:27. > :09:29.to avoid confusion. It is m`de at the suggestion of the Welsh

:09:30. > :09:39.Government and I am grateful to them for reading this point. Amendment 34

:09:40. > :09:45.to 37 removes from new schedule the three Es several functions which are

:09:46. > :09:50.currently listed as concurrdnt but have been repealed or transferred

:09:51. > :09:54.entirely to Welsh ministers. Amendment 38 inserts into a new

:09:55. > :10:01.schedule concurrent functions for several parts of the bill on the UK

:10:02. > :10:05.digital service in relation to local government elections in Walds. The

:10:06. > :10:13.need for these changes has been agreed as part of constructhve

:10:14. > :10:19.discussions on the bill we `re having. These amendments ard minor

:10:20. > :10:24.and technical but are necessary to provide a clear devolution

:10:25. > :10:28.settlement for Wales. Amendlent 39 to 40 to add several further bodies

:10:29. > :10:37.to the list of Welsh public bodies which is provided for in schedule

:10:38. > :10:39.four. This will confirm the devolved nature of these bodies. I t`bled

:10:40. > :10:42.these amendments in responsd to representations made by the assembly

:10:43. > :10:46.Presiding Officer and the Wdlsh Government. These bodies have

:10:47. > :10:52.functions which are exercisd and will only in relation to Wales and

:10:53. > :10:58.are mainly functions which relate to not reserved matters. These are

:10:59. > :11:03.already laid down in clause four of the bill and we are happy to respond

:11:04. > :11:07.to calls of the Welsh Government and the Presiding Officer. Finally, a

:11:08. > :11:10.number of government amendmdnts have been brought forward in response to

:11:11. > :11:23.issues raised during committee Who sought to insert the Government

:11:24. > :11:25.of Wales act 2006, separate statements on the permanencd of the

:11:26. > :11:31.assembly and of the Welsh Government. I committed to consider

:11:32. > :11:35.this matter further and I'm pleased to be able to bring forward to

:11:36. > :11:39.members today to address thhs issue by ensuring that statement hn clause

:11:40. > :11:43.one of the bill relating to the permanence of devolved insthtution

:11:44. > :11:48.in Wales and the recognition of a body of Welsh law and inserted the

:11:49. > :11:55.start of the 2006 Government of Wales act. And then it's nine to 12

:11:56. > :11:57.and 43 make changes to clause 6 give the Presiding Officer, rather

:11:58. > :12:04.than Welsh ministers, the existing power to proposed the date of the

:12:05. > :12:09.election by up to one month as well as one powered to an assembly

:12:10. > :12:13.general action. These powers would bring the position in Wales to line

:12:14. > :12:17.with the provisions in Scotland where the equivalent powers to

:12:18. > :12:24.proposed election dates havd always been exercised by the Presiding

:12:25. > :12:26.Officer and the Scottish Parliament. Amendment 13, simile addresses an

:12:27. > :12:36.issue raised by the honourable member, in the amendment thdy tabled

:12:37. > :12:38.at the committee stage of the bill. They sought to remove the

:12:39. > :12:45.requirement for statements lade under the new section 111 A of the

:12:46. > :12:49.Government of Wales act 2006, inserted by clause eight to be made

:12:50. > :12:52.bilingually. I committed to reflect on this matter further with a view

:12:53. > :12:58.to bring forward and amendmdnt and report. As they rightly highlighted,

:12:59. > :13:01.English and Welsh are both official languages of the assembly. @ny

:13:02. > :13:06.statement made in the assembly must be reported violently as a latter of

:13:07. > :13:10.course and I am content that this does not mean to be provided for

:13:11. > :13:19.specifically in this bill. H thank them for raising it. Amendmdnts 19

:13:20. > :13:24.to 22, and men clause 15 so that if the assembly changes its nale, any

:13:25. > :13:30.Welsh language to the National Assembly of Wales, is commission its

:13:31. > :13:35.acts or acts of the assemblx are changed to reflect the new name I'm

:13:36. > :13:38.grateful to the honourable lember for tabling simile amendments must

:13:39. > :13:43.commit me, I said then I wotld consider these issues and the issues

:13:44. > :13:47.raised and I am pleased to `ddress them now with these amendments, 19

:13:48. > :13:51.to 22. The final issue raisdd that committee, I committed to consider a

:13:52. > :13:54.broom means to be skippered the reservation which deals with civil

:13:55. > :14:05.and criminal receding. The Honourable members tabled an

:14:06. > :14:09.amendment to narrow the scope of reservation, 61 C so that if the

:14:10. > :14:12.current reference to prosecttors would be changed to the Crown

:14:13. > :14:17.Prosecution Service. The intention of this with to make it cle`r that

:14:18. > :14:22.the assembly would be able to specify devolved authorities such as

:14:23. > :14:26.local authorities as prosecttors but the fold defences. In response, I

:14:27. > :14:30.said it was not the intention to prevent the assembly from

:14:31. > :14:34.legislating to make devolved bodies the prosecution authorities to

:14:35. > :14:38.double defences and at the current reservation achieve this. Ndver the

:14:39. > :14:42.less, I understood the honotrable member concerns and agreed to

:14:43. > :14:45.consider the reservation further. Having done so, I have a nulber of

:14:46. > :14:50.concerns about narrowing or broadening the existing resdrvation.

:14:51. > :14:54.First, replacing the current reference to prosecutors within

:14:55. > :14:59.narrow reference to only thd Crown Prosecution Service would not cover

:15:00. > :15:04.other reserve prosecuting authorities such as the Serhous

:15:05. > :15:07.Fraud Office. Second, expanding the list in include a wider range of

:15:08. > :15:11.prosecuting authorities would likely go further than we believe hs

:15:12. > :15:14.necessary. Many of these authorities are functions beyond prosecttion

:15:15. > :15:18.that would make preserving them potentially more complicated. For

:15:19. > :15:22.example, the Serious Fraud Office they've investigate and prosecute

:15:23. > :15:26.cases what other authorities including the Environment Agency,

:15:27. > :15:30.Health and Safety Executive and the Maritime and coastguard agency

:15:31. > :15:36.prosecution is but one of a much wider range of their functions.

:15:37. > :15:41.Third, and non-exhaustive lhst would be likely to preclude the Wdlsh

:15:42. > :15:45.assembly from specifying appropriate authorities as well as making the

:15:46. > :15:49.reservation is longer and more on weekly. However, I understand the

:15:50. > :15:53.need for clarification and reassurance on this issue and

:15:54. > :15:57.officials are that will work closely with key stakeholders, incltding the

:15:58. > :15:59.eternal general's office and the Whitehall prosecutors group to

:16:00. > :16:03.develop an amendment that clarifies the assembly's powers whilst

:16:04. > :16:09.ensuring the prosecution fr`mework remains a reserved matter. @mendment

:16:10. > :16:13.26 retains the existing resdrvations reference to prosecutors th`t makes

:16:14. > :16:18.clear that this does not prdsent the assembly from making provishon about

:16:19. > :16:21.responsibility for the prosdcution of the devolved offence. Thhs could

:16:22. > :16:27.include specifying who would have prosecuting authority, the devolved

:16:28. > :16:33.offence or making provisions for prosecutions of the offences to be

:16:34. > :16:36.subject to consent. However, if the assembly wish to confer functions on

:16:37. > :16:40.a result of authority in thhs regard, this would engage the

:16:41. > :16:44.consent mechanism in paragr`ph eight and all ten of schedule sevdn be. I

:16:45. > :16:52.believe that there moment achieves what the Honourable members are

:16:53. > :17:00.seeking, where seeking to achieve in the most efficient way posshble

:17:01. > :17:03.without impacting negativelx on the intention. I trust I have pdrsuaded

:17:04. > :17:06.members on both side of the House of the need of the Government

:17:07. > :17:15.amendments in this group and I beg to move those amendments. Ttrning to

:17:16. > :17:19.the amendments from the parties opposite, the first set of new

:17:20. > :17:26.courses and Mendez, that is new clause two, new clues to a `nd to

:17:27. > :17:30.be, clause one and 63 to 65. Table in the name of the honourable member

:17:31. > :17:36.Newport West and the honour`ble member for Highlands, would devolve

:17:37. > :17:39.accompanist to the assembly to regulate the number of high sticking

:17:40. > :17:47.gaming machines authorised by new betting premise in Wales. They were

:17:48. > :17:51.also devolve lettuces complhments for vetting, gaming and lotteries in

:17:52. > :17:55.Wales to the assembly. Betthng gaming and lotteries are not

:17:56. > :18:00.dissolved to the assembly whll be reserved subjects under the bill.

:18:01. > :18:03.The commission made no recommendations on the devolution of

:18:04. > :18:07.these and so the subject was not considered by the Saint Davhds Day

:18:08. > :18:12.process, the third of thinkhng that came from the commission. That the

:18:13. > :18:17.Government does not believe that devolving the wider confidence, I

:18:18. > :18:21.will give way. He mentions the amendments table in my name, I am

:18:22. > :18:25.just asking that has the added representation from the Welsh

:18:26. > :18:29.assembly and the Welsh Government, has he followed the debating in the

:18:30. > :18:33.Welsh assembly about this m`tter and listen to the comments from Welsh

:18:34. > :18:39.ministers, has the factor that in because it is losing to be some sort

:18:40. > :18:46.of interesting wealth of devolution? The honourable member is all right.

:18:47. > :18:51.We are happy to continue a dialogue in order to find the reserv`tions

:18:52. > :18:56.but clearly the reservation or the abandoned as tabled extremely broad

:18:57. > :19:03.powers in this regard. It is not our intention to devolved or to accept

:19:04. > :19:08.the MMA, we are happy to continue with a dialogue but I do not believe

:19:09. > :19:12.that devolving the wider confidence that amended 63 to 65 proposed would

:19:13. > :19:16.be the right course of action. They were not raised by the commhssion,

:19:17. > :19:21.nor were they raised by the St David's Day agreement but in our

:19:22. > :19:25.pragmatic style, we are nattrally happy to continue to discuss a whole

:19:26. > :19:32.range of issues. As this bill has continually find itself throughout

:19:33. > :19:37.the process from the draft, from the commission, Saint Davids Dax

:19:38. > :19:43.agreement to the draft Bill to the stage that we are today. New clause

:19:44. > :19:50.three, tabled by the rogue lember for Newport West -- honourable

:19:51. > :19:59.member. New course turn, amdndments 67. Seek to probe the progrdss the

:20:00. > :20:03.Government has made in impldmenting our commitment to devolved dxecutive

:20:04. > :20:09.rail franchising functions. New clause three also seeks to press, I

:20:10. > :20:12.will give way in a moment. New clause three also seeks to press the

:20:13. > :20:17.Government to a decision on whether to enable Welsh ministers to invite

:20:18. > :20:20.public sector operators to bid for rail franchises for which they are

:20:21. > :20:29.responsible and housing authority. I will give way. Does the Secretary of

:20:30. > :20:32.State agree with me that ch`nges to railway powers are needed to put

:20:33. > :20:42.Wales where it should be on parity with Scotland? I'm grateful for the

:20:43. > :20:47.intervention. And her questhon. Yes, there are no Dacians ongoing in

:20:48. > :20:51.terms of the devolution of the franchise and how we achievd them.

:20:52. > :20:55.If we were to accept the amdndments in relation to this, then that would

:20:56. > :21:00.set the whole franchise process back considerably because that h`s

:21:01. > :21:04.already been advertised and we are anxious to press ahead as qtickly as

:21:05. > :21:08.possible in relation to comhng to an agreement between the UK Government

:21:09. > :21:13.and the Welsh Government and the selling the franchise oblig`tions. I

:21:14. > :21:17.will give way. The franchisd of course would not change the

:21:18. > :21:24.boundaries of the Wales boundaries if we would have a different model.

:21:25. > :21:28.We have in Wales and medal, which he is the Lisa Potts, what's the

:21:29. > :21:33.difference between having w`ter run by not for profit organisathon and

:21:34. > :21:37.having our Railways? There `re whole host of considerations and debates

:21:38. > :21:42.and discussions going on between the office, the Welsh Government and the

:21:43. > :21:45.Department for Transport. Wd are in detailed negotiations over the

:21:46. > :21:49.franchise arrangements. We need to find suitable arrangements that will

:21:50. > :21:52.protect wealth passengers and the accountability and responsibly of

:21:53. > :21:59.the Welsh Government but let's not forget the border and that the

:22:00. > :22:02.Manchester to Cardiff line, for example, edges significant dlements

:22:03. > :22:07.of England which a signific`nt number of passengers will bd

:22:08. > :22:15.domiciled or residing in English constituencies and thereford their

:22:16. > :22:19.right to seek redress through the parliamentary regress details that

:22:20. > :22:25.we need to continue to disctss. I'm anxious to continue on that basis

:22:26. > :22:28.and accepting this amendment could certainly undermine the franchising

:22:29. > :22:34.process and the positive bases in which this amendment would force. It

:22:35. > :22:38.is our intention to use othdr powers under the Government of Walds act to

:22:39. > :22:41.devolved franchising functions and agreement with the Welsh Government

:22:42. > :22:46.and the UK Government that `chieves the same objective or many of the

:22:47. > :22:50.same objective is that thesd amendments wish to achieve. I will

:22:51. > :22:53.give way. Could the Secretary of State explain clearly to us what the

:22:54. > :22:59.differences between a German state-owned railway running a

:23:00. > :23:04.railway in Wales and a publhc body here or Welsh Government supported

:23:05. > :23:12.public body doing so over the border in England? The honourable lady will

:23:13. > :23:15.be fully aware that the rail franchise is Wales and Borddrs

:23:16. > :23:18.franchise where significant members of passengers crossed the border,

:23:19. > :23:24.the line itself crosses the border and therefore it may well bd the

:23:25. > :23:30.will of the Welsh Government to set up a state run rail operation but

:23:31. > :23:36.clearly that has implications on reserve areas or an English areas,

:23:37. > :23:43.of course that the UK Government will want to seek to protect, Wales

:23:44. > :23:45.and both England, in the process. There are positive discussions

:23:46. > :23:51.taking place in terms of how we best get to the position we want to get

:23:52. > :23:58.to, where there is an effichent effective operating railway in

:23:59. > :24:01.Wales, you will see that thd report, adverts have already been ptt out in

:24:02. > :24:05.order to move forward with the franchise and with all being well,

:24:06. > :24:13.will take effect from April 201 . I will give way. I using it is OK for

:24:14. > :24:19.a German state run organisation to run the railways in Wales btt not a

:24:20. > :24:23.UK state run organisation? H think the honourable member is missing the

:24:24. > :24:28.point. I'm seeking to identhfy that that are... It gives read the

:24:29. > :24:32.report, he will recognise the complexity is that even thex have

:24:33. > :24:36.highlighted. In relation to those complexities, we are negating in a

:24:37. > :24:39.positive, constructive environment with the Welsh Government. Therefore

:24:40. > :24:45.accepting those amendments hs not the way forward because these

:24:46. > :24:49.amendments don't clearly medt the technical requirements becatse these

:24:50. > :24:52.amendments can affect the stop at the issue border where the

:24:53. > :24:57.honourable member knows that the trains running in and out of his

:24:58. > :25:00.constituency come to from England in many cases and therefore on that

:25:01. > :25:04.basis, excepting this amendlent and that is tabled will not meet the

:25:05. > :25:09.criteria baddies seeking to beat. I will give way. Then I want to make

:25:10. > :25:13.some progress. He still has not answered the question. Does he not

:25:14. > :25:19.believe that at the very le`st it should be a level playing fheld when

:25:20. > :25:23.we have got a German companx running but is somehow a UK company would be

:25:24. > :25:28.prohibited from doing so, ldt alone a partnership model for running the

:25:29. > :25:31.Wales franchise. The advert has been made for the franchise, good

:25:32. > :25:35.progress is being made and we wish to continue in the spirit that the

:25:36. > :25:40.Welsh Government has taken `nd has made that advert and we wish to

:25:41. > :25:43.continue in the delicate sensitive negotiations that have taken place,

:25:44. > :25:54.in a positive, constructive environment that already exhsts We

:25:55. > :25:59.don't agree... I will give way. Can I thank the Secretary of St`te for

:26:00. > :26:03.giving way? Going back to the issue of financial controls and atdits,

:26:04. > :26:07.can I welcome the examinations in Wales into a economy, effichency and

:26:08. > :26:11.effectiveness by the Welsh Consolidated fund in Wales? I think

:26:12. > :26:16.that is a good thing. Howevdr, could the minister confirm who will be

:26:17. > :26:19.responsible for audit studids and scrutiny into large-scale projects

:26:20. > :26:23.where funds have been sourcdd by both Cardiff and white hole in the

:26:24. > :26:26.future? I'm thinking in particular of large scale in production

:26:27. > :26:33.projects, both Cardiff and Whitehall money.

:26:34. > :26:40.The honourable member raises an important point. The adjustlents

:26:41. > :26:44.that have been made to the `uditing arrangements demonstrates the

:26:45. > :26:49.immaturity of the organisathon. Where the money from the Welsh

:26:50. > :26:53.Consolidated fund is being tsed and spent, it is absolutely right that

:26:54. > :26:59.the Auditor General for Walds scrutinises those. Where money is

:27:00. > :27:05.being used from the UK department funds and from the Treasury, it is

:27:06. > :27:10.right for the controller and Auditor General to scrutinise those. I will

:27:11. > :27:16.have to look at further det`il of the issues he raises. I will come

:27:17. > :27:19.back to him in due course. These adjustments have been made `t the

:27:20. > :27:24.request of the Welsh Governlent is supported by the Auditor General for

:27:25. > :27:30.Wales and accepted by the controller and Auditor General. I hope the

:27:31. > :27:33.satisfaction of those bodies will satisfy the concerns of thehr

:27:34. > :27:43.relevant questions that havd been raised. New clause three, wd do not

:27:44. > :27:48.agree with the proposal but positive progress has been made by both

:27:49. > :27:55.governments on the franchishng arrangements. Issues remain

:27:56. > :27:58.outstanding as I have mentioned The Welsh Government and the UK

:27:59. > :28:02.government have been working over recent months to get to a position

:28:03. > :28:09.which works for all passengdrs and both governments. Turning to

:28:10. > :28:13.amendment two, in which the honourable member proposes devolving

:28:14. > :28:20.powers over the community infrastructure Levy. I am pleased to

:28:21. > :28:25.say that uptake for the levx in Wales has made some progress with

:28:26. > :28:29.three authorities currently correct -- collecting the levy. It hs a key

:28:30. > :28:34.objective of national plannhng policy in both England and Wales

:28:35. > :28:40.that local planning authorities plan positively. This levy is an

:28:41. > :28:43.important mechanism for sectring funding for infrastructure. The levy

:28:44. > :28:49.ties with the calls for the Welsh Government. I can also say that in

:28:50. > :28:54.many ways it makes sense for a unified develop levy system across

:28:55. > :28:59.England and Wales. Complexities can hinder investment. I am not

:29:00. > :29:04.therefore minded to agree to the amendment. Much of the argulent

:29:05. > :29:07.behind this amendment has bden that policy does not work for sm`ller

:29:08. > :29:12.authorities of which there `re many in Wales but I would point out that

:29:13. > :29:18.Caerphilly and Merthyr Tydfhl are amongst the two of the smallest

:29:19. > :29:25.authorities in Wales and have made effective use of the communhty

:29:26. > :29:31.infrastructure Levy. Mr Deptty Speaker, amendment 66 to establish

:29:32. > :29:35.Wales as a separate legal jurisdiction, and issue deb`ted

:29:36. > :29:42.extensively as part of a pre-legislative scrutiny of this

:29:43. > :29:45.bill. In its second report published on March 2014, the Silk Comlission

:29:46. > :29:53.recommended further administrative devolution. I will give way. I thank

:29:54. > :30:00.him for giving way. Whilst ht's obviously sensible that an hmmoral

:30:01. > :30:07.-- emerging body of Welsh l`w should monitor things going forward, we

:30:08. > :30:12.have to be careful of a sep`rate jurisdiction body now is not

:30:13. > :30:17.imposing separate legal jurhsdiction requirements which would le`d to

:30:18. > :30:21.barriers of justice. I think the honourable member has made `n

:30:22. > :30:31.important point. He contribtted during committee stage of the report

:30:32. > :30:35.to that effect. I think that the honourable member's expertise in

:30:36. > :30:41.this area should be well he did by those who want to see Wales flourish

:30:42. > :30:43.with a distinctive body of Welsh law but also recognise that joint

:30:44. > :30:50.jurisdiction has worked effdctively as well. It sends a clear mdssage to

:30:51. > :30:55.potential investors in Wales of the clarity and simplicity that is

:30:56. > :31:00.provided. Many of them -- recommendations reflect the current

:31:01. > :31:03.position in Wales. The senior court already sets in Wales, the

:31:04. > :31:13.administration of Welsh quartz is overseen. Quartz fittings are

:31:14. > :31:19.coordinated locally. -- Welsh quartz. This was one of the key

:31:20. > :31:22.issues examined in cross-party discussions on the St David's Day

:31:23. > :31:32.process. Honourable members will be away there is no political

:31:33. > :31:38.consensus, my party's manifdsto made it clear we would continue to

:31:39. > :31:45.reserve justice and policing. If I can make progress, I will ghve way.

:31:46. > :31:48.The government is fully comlitted to maintaining a single legal

:31:49. > :31:55.jurisdiction of England and Wales. Served wheels well. It is also our

:31:56. > :32:02.film view that the most effdctive and consistent way to delivdr

:32:03. > :32:06.justice. I will give way. -, it has said -- served wheels well. He

:32:07. > :32:12.referred to the Silk Report but it talks about the need to revhew the

:32:13. > :32:16.system. I appreciate his st`ndpoint but it is an evolving picture does

:32:17. > :32:22.that not necessitate the recommendation of the Wales

:32:23. > :32:26.government recent report th`t we should have a commission to look at

:32:27. > :32:35.these matters over the period of time? I'm grateful to him for the

:32:36. > :32:38.way he has made his intervention. I would still underline the stability

:32:39. > :32:44.of the existing system and the certainty it provides. The title of

:32:45. > :32:51.the Saint Davids the agreemdnt was powers for purpose. In seekhng to

:32:52. > :32:55.understand what additional purpose would be provided to anyone living

:32:56. > :33:01.in Wales should there be a separate jurisdiction. The amendment

:33:02. > :33:08.envisages -- envisages a separate... I will give way. I thank hil. He was

:33:09. > :33:19.pointing to the administrathon of the courts in Wales and HNC TS,

:33:20. > :33:26.there was recently a destin`tion of court provision across Carm`rthen.

:33:27. > :33:31.When he talks about the bendfits of single jurisdiction, is that what he

:33:32. > :33:36.has in mind? The consequencd of course would be to spend more money

:33:37. > :33:42.on public sector administration such as that which would precludd the new

:33:43. > :33:46.innovations the Department of Justice are seeking to introduce. It

:33:47. > :33:52.is the opportunity for new services to be brought closer to comlunities

:33:53. > :33:58.should we look at how we can enhance the system and make it more

:33:59. > :34:07.efficient. I would say, if H can finish the point, I would rdmit --

:34:08. > :34:12.remind honourable members that the whole debate around a separ`te legal

:34:13. > :34:17.jurisdiction focused on and came as a consequence of their necessity

:34:18. > :34:24.test which existed in the draft bill. This test has been reloved and

:34:25. > :34:29.therefore a call for separate jurisdiction could thereford fall.

:34:30. > :34:34.It seems to have taken on a life of its own. I still question for what

:34:35. > :34:38.purpose? I am still trying to find out for anyone living and working in

:34:39. > :34:44.Wales what difference a sep`rate legal jurisdiction would me`n other

:34:45. > :34:47.than uncertainty foreign investors when the reputation of the legal

:34:48. > :34:55.system is reputable -- recognised around the world. Surely thd purpose

:34:56. > :34:59.of a separate legal system would be the quality of Justice provhded in

:35:00. > :35:03.Wales? This is the only leghslature which does not have jurisdiction in

:35:04. > :35:10.the world and the situation is crying out to be resolved, hf not

:35:11. > :35:14.now when? I know he has a lot to tell us but he must be award that

:35:15. > :35:25.lots of other members would like to speak to day. Can you bear that in

:35:26. > :35:31.mind? Secretary of State. Could you tell us how long we have got for the

:35:32. > :35:37.debate this evening? We havd to finish by 7:57pm. Secretary of

:35:38. > :35:42.State. Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker and of course I will make swift

:35:43. > :35:53.progress in the spirit of which you gave me an indication. Moving on, Mr

:35:54. > :35:58.Deputy Speaker, amendment 60 16 devolved confidence over a Welsh

:35:59. > :36:03.language broadcasting and Wdlsh language media. It is a critical

:36:04. > :36:08.part of our culture and a kdy element of preserving the l`nguage

:36:09. > :36:13.is the government's commitmdnt to Welsh broadcasting. It is a source

:36:14. > :36:22.of great pride for me that ht was established by a Conservative

:36:23. > :36:24.government over 30 years ago and I notice the welcome that was made to

:36:25. > :36:26.buy a number of stakeholders over statements by the BBC and

:36:27. > :36:38.demonstrates our commitment to future funding of the channdl.

:36:39. > :36:42.Amendment 66 would removed requirement of the assembly to seek

:36:43. > :36:47.the consent of UK government ministers are an act of the assembly

:36:48. > :36:52.which would modify the functions of a reserved authority is such an act

:36:53. > :36:55.related to Welsh language ftnction. It is right that the Welsh

:36:56. > :37:01.Government has the freedom to act in the interest of the Welsh l`nguage

:37:02. > :37:04.and when those policies are extended to reserved matters, the UK

:37:05. > :37:10.government minister should `lso approve them. This minister has

:37:11. > :37:17.responsibility to seek the Welsh language protected in reserved

:37:18. > :37:23.matters as well. We all havd responsibility towards the Welsh

:37:24. > :37:28.language. Amendment 68 and 69 seek to provide the future assembly

:37:29. > :37:32.legislation altering the specification or numbers of

:37:33. > :37:35.constituencies or regions or the number of members the return would

:37:36. > :37:41.be subject to agreement by the majority of assembly members. I

:37:42. > :37:45.think the honourable member for Newport West has been mischhevous in

:37:46. > :37:52.tabling such an amendment, especially in light of the news

:37:53. > :37:57.today that will be made public tomorrow about potential ch`nges

:37:58. > :38:05.that are facing the constittencies which may well ending up melbers to

:38:06. > :38:08.this place. The Silk Commission recommended a two thirds majority

:38:09. > :38:18.for the Scottish parliament seeking to change the electoral franchise or

:38:19. > :38:21.regional members. The UK government committed in the St Davids state

:38:22. > :38:27.agreement to implement the same agreement in relation to Wales. I

:38:28. > :38:30.believe I've think really why I cannot support the opposition

:38:31. > :38:34.amendments put forward todax on this basis and I urge honourable members

:38:35. > :38:42.and right honourable members to withdraw their amendments in due

:38:43. > :38:48.course. Thank you. New clause 24-mac, elections of Police and

:38:49. > :38:55.Crime Commissioners. The qudstion is it be read a second time. Thank you,

:38:56. > :39:00.Mr Deputy Speaker. This is one of these occasions returned to every

:39:01. > :39:04.five years in this House and we are doomed to do it for the fordseeable

:39:05. > :39:12.future because this is not the final word. I am grateful, we all are to

:39:13. > :39:16.the amount of consensus that is on the bill. The main features of this

:39:17. > :39:22.bill are progressive and will introduce as stability and new

:39:23. > :39:30.dignity to the assembly which will bring more respect for its position

:39:31. > :39:34.every time we had these bills here. That is in general agreement and

:39:35. > :39:38.thank you to the government for being pragmatic and generous enough

:39:39. > :39:48.to accept reasonably many of the amendments put down. I would like to

:39:49. > :39:52.welcome to the decision to `ppoint, as the new PPS, I young thrtsting NP

:39:53. > :39:56.and it is nice to know the spirit of giving you the chance has bden

:39:57. > :40:08.extended to the honourable gentleman as well. In the response thd

:40:09. > :40:16.Secretary of State need to ly friends about the success of Plaid

:40:17. > :40:21.Cymru. There is a failure to recognise the brilliant, unhque

:40:22. > :40:28.initiative that was taken in this building, after meeting herd, it

:40:29. > :40:33.sounded too good to be true at the time but that it recently cdlebrated

:40:34. > :40:40.its 15th anniversary. It's been going since 2001. It has delivered

:40:41. > :40:45.all it promised as a not-for-profit company, a company which was paying

:40:46. > :40:51.dividends. It has delivered ?1 billion every single year to the

:40:52. > :40:56.Welsh economy. It also delivered increases in the prices that were

:40:57. > :41:00.below inflation and by 2020, they will have done that for ten

:41:01. > :41:05.successive years. It was he`led at the time by an international

:41:06. > :41:11.financial review newspaper `s the best deal in the world in 2001. It

:41:12. > :41:17.continues to be that and we should celebrate this and it is sthll the

:41:18. > :41:21.only one. There is nothing dlse like it in the rest of the United

:41:22. > :41:28.Kingdom. On that basis we should also approach the amendments we have

:41:29. > :41:35.put down on new clause thred because we should be doing... Of cotrse

:41:36. > :41:41.Before he leaves that point, isn't it the case where you have ` natural

:41:42. > :41:47.monopoly like water or light rail that having a system wherebx you

:41:48. > :41:52.ring it into beneficial collective ownership and you can borrow very

:41:53. > :41:57.cheaply against a guarantee future stream of income from a public

:41:58. > :42:00.sector back on, is the ideal way to bring an big servers and th`t

:42:01. > :42:06.private antigen in comparison is inefficient? I agree entirely with

:42:07. > :42:11.my honourable friend. We ard hoping that we can convince the Government

:42:12. > :42:19.to see the great value and to repeat that success with the railw`ys.

:42:20. > :42:26.Another significant aspect hs that they have been able to reduce their

:42:27. > :42:30.gearing, they're paying off when a lot of companies elsewhere, 95% even

:42:31. > :42:34.as the value, I think they `re down to about 65 and they are paxing it

:42:35. > :42:40.off as the dividend for the Welsh people. He makes a very valtable

:42:41. > :42:45.point. This is a huge success story. Why are we not citing this from the

:42:46. > :42:49.rooftops and tried to emulate it, try to repeat it? And we can do it

:42:50. > :42:53.in a very similar situation with the rail franchise. I can recall in this

:42:54. > :42:57.House, I think you will be very disappeared member of this House,

:42:58. > :43:04.Robert Adley, he published ` report one of my best reports in mx time,

:43:05. > :43:08.an rail by the quotation and sadly, he died on the Sunday beford the

:43:09. > :43:14.Wednesday it was published hn 1 93. He forecast all the weaknesses that

:43:15. > :43:20.of turnout in the privatisation system. And that report frol a

:43:21. > :43:27.conservative on the native committee has proved enormously by thd

:43:28. > :43:34.committee and not by Governlent Can I also point out to him the superb

:43:35. > :43:43.job that glass company has done an renewable energy which has ` great

:43:44. > :43:48.interest in Wrexham where it is developing renewable energy, being

:43:49. > :43:54.able to proceed with the positive role for energy in communitx as well

:43:55. > :43:59.as do Valeri get a not-for-profit company? I warmly welcome that point

:44:00. > :44:03.and again the Government is blind to the prospects for Wales in these

:44:04. > :44:07.areas of renewable energy, particularly when it relies on Hydro

:44:08. > :44:13.because we can rely on some things, we can rely on the tide, we can rely

:44:14. > :44:19.on the brain. Perhaps it coles to a surprise, 2200, mega vaults of

:44:20. > :44:24.electricity produced in Walds by Hydro. I would agree with the points

:44:25. > :44:28.we have made and the case ptt forward. I have spent this weekend

:44:29. > :44:32.at the corporative party confident in Cardiff where we discusshng the

:44:33. > :44:35.very many benefits of cooperative mutual nonprofits solutions for

:44:36. > :44:39.running services like this. It is not just the cost benefits but there

:44:40. > :44:42.are also the benefits, would you agree, of involvement in employees

:44:43. > :44:50.and the users in the design and the future of the services? Part of the

:44:51. > :44:56.movement that my party has built on over the years is the cooperative