30/10/2017

0:00:00 > 0:00:01already just heard in this House the failure of the mayor of London to

0:00:01 > 0:00:03provide a single property for social rent in the last year, so my

0:00:03 > 0:00:06honourable friend is right to raise this and we will certainly be taking

0:00:06 > 0:00:16a much closer look.We must now move on to the next business. Colleagues,

0:00:16 > 0:00:24I wish to make a statement about recent disturbing allegations, about

0:00:24 > 0:00:29a culture of sexual harassment at Westminster. Between members and

0:00:29 > 0:00:34those who work for members. Let me make it clear.

0:00:34 > 0:00:41There must be zero tolerance of sexual harassment or bullying here

0:00:41 > 0:00:50at Westminster or elsewhere. Whether that involves members or their

0:00:50 > 0:00:53staff, or parliamentary staff, or those working on are visiting the

0:00:53 > 0:01:00estate. If there have been assaults, they should be reported to the

0:01:00 > 0:01:09police here as anywhere else. The House of Commons commission, which I

0:01:09 > 0:01:15chair, has a duty to provide a safe place to work.

0:01:15 > 0:01:22In 2014, in addition to introducing the respect policy, providing a

0:01:22 > 0:01:28proper regime for complaints by parliamentary staff, of bullying or

0:01:28 > 0:01:33harassment, the commission provided a helpline for members' staff to

0:01:33 > 0:01:39raise personal and work-related concerns. And I have consistently

0:01:39 > 0:01:46supported the workplace equality networks as peer group support for

0:01:46 > 0:01:51staff. These have all been established since 2010, and are

0:01:51 > 0:02:00doing important work, which I know to be valued by staff. At its

0:02:00 > 0:02:03monthly meeting this evening, I will be inviting the commission to

0:02:03 > 0:02:10consider any further action. I also propose to refer the whole issue of

0:02:10 > 0:02:16sexual harassment to The Commons reference group on representation

0:02:16 > 0:02:25and inclusion, which I established last year. Members' staff are of

0:02:25 > 0:02:29course employed by individual members. That means that they cannot

0:02:29 > 0:02:35simply be treated as if they were parliamentary employees. Nor of

0:02:35 > 0:02:43course can members. I am therefore glad that the party leaders have, in

0:02:43 > 0:02:46statements made over the weekend, acknowledged their responsibilities

0:02:46 > 0:02:53to deal with such behaviour within their respective parties. The Prime

0:02:53 > 0:02:59Minister's letter to me, written as leader of the Conservative Party,

0:02:59 > 0:03:02very candidly admits the difficulties the Conservative Party

0:03:02 > 0:03:08has had in introducing the sort of mandatory grievance scheme which

0:03:08 > 0:03:13some other parties have introduced in recent years. It does not require

0:03:13 > 0:03:18my intervention for the party to adopt an effective grievance scheme.

0:03:18 > 0:03:25I hope that all parties will rapidly and thoroughly reviewed the

0:03:25 > 0:03:31arrangements which they have in place to ensure that those

0:03:31 > 0:03:41arrangements are credible, enforceable, accessible, transparent

0:03:41 > 0:03:49and comprise an independent element. That latter notion that any

0:03:49 > 0:03:54complaint system and grievance procedure must satisfy constituents

0:03:54 > 0:04:03as well as colleagues strikes me as important. The Prime Minister refers

0:04:03 > 0:04:11in her letter to the prospects for a House wide scheme. I would be happy

0:04:11 > 0:04:15to have the idea considered. In the first instance, I hope that parties

0:04:15 > 0:04:20will live up to their responsibilities, demonstrating both

0:04:20 > 0:04:25an appetite for change, and a practical means of delivering that

0:04:25 > 0:04:37change without delay. Make no mistake. There is a need for change.

0:04:37 > 0:04:41The House will also know that members must abide by a code of

0:04:41 > 0:04:47conduct which means that alleged breaches can be investigated by the

0:04:47 > 0:04:52parliamentary commission for Standards. The Commissioner

0:04:52 > 0:04:59suggested, in her September 2016 consultation on the code, a new rule

0:04:59 > 0:05:06that, "A member must treat all those who work in Parliament with dignity,

0:05:06 > 0:05:12courtesy and respect." I hope that the Standards Committee, comprising

0:05:12 > 0:05:19equal numbers of members and lay members, will take forward suggested

0:05:19 > 0:05:25revisions to the cold with appropriate urgency and come to the

0:05:25 > 0:05:32House for its decision. -- revisions to the code. I hope I have the

0:05:32 > 0:05:36support of the House in calling for these issues to be resolved swiftly

0:05:36 > 0:05:39and decisively. It should not require endless debate and

0:05:39 > 0:05:48discussion. For my part as Speaker, I am happy to do whatever I can.

0:05:48 > 0:05:58Others must do likewise. Order. Urgent question, Harriet Harman.Of

0:05:58 > 0:06:04the house will make a statement about her plan -- of the house make

0:06:04 > 0:06:12a plan to tackle this issue?As you know, Mrs B, I was very keen to come

0:06:12 > 0:06:16to the chamber and make a statement today but I am delighted instead to

0:06:16 > 0:06:19respond to the right honourable lady and grateful to you for inviting me

0:06:19 > 0:06:24to provide a full response -- as you know, Mr Speaker. It is absolutely

0:06:24 > 0:06:28right that the House must address the urgent issue of alleged

0:06:28 > 0:06:32mistreatment of staff by members of Parliament. These allegations make

0:06:32 > 0:06:36clear there is a vital need to provide better support and

0:06:36 > 0:06:41protection for the thousands of staff members working in Westminster

0:06:41 > 0:06:45and in constituency offices across the country. And in tackling this

0:06:45 > 0:06:50problem, we also need to recognise that we have interns, work

0:06:50 > 0:06:55experience placements, House staff, clerks and civil servants, all of

0:06:55 > 0:07:01them deserve to be afforded our care and respect. Mr Speaker, I can

0:07:01 > 0:07:06confirm that the Cabinet Office is urgently investigating reports of

0:07:06 > 0:07:09specific allegations of misconduct, in relation to the ministerial code.

0:07:09 > 0:07:15I am well aware that the public rightly expect MPs to display the

0:07:15 > 0:07:20highest standards. As the Prime Minister outlined in her letter

0:07:20 > 0:07:25yesterday, there can be no place for harassment, abuse or misconduct in

0:07:25 > 0:07:33politics. Your age, gender or job title should have no bearing on the

0:07:33 > 0:07:37way you are treated in a modern workplace, and nobody is an

0:07:37 > 0:07:44exception to that. As the Nolan principle has outlined, as public

0:07:44 > 0:07:47servants we must demonstrate accountability, openness and honesty

0:07:47 > 0:07:53in our behaviour. Regardless of role or position, a new approach will

0:07:53 > 0:07:59need to cover everyone working for Parliament. If someone is made to

0:07:59 > 0:08:01feel uncomfortable or believes that others have acted inappropriately

0:08:01 > 0:08:08towards them, they should be able to contact an external independent,

0:08:08 > 0:08:13specially trained support team, via phone, the intranet or face-to-face,

0:08:13 > 0:08:17so that any issue can be raised in confidentiality and appropriate

0:08:17 > 0:08:22advice and support can be given. Everyone in this House must be clear

0:08:22 > 0:08:26that whenever a serious allegation is made the individual should go to

0:08:26 > 0:08:31the police and be supported in doing so. However, it is clear that the

0:08:31 > 0:08:36current system is inadequate. It is for Parliament to come together to

0:08:36 > 0:08:39resolve this, but the Government believes there should be some

0:08:39 > 0:08:43guiding principles. First, as in any other workplace, everyone in

0:08:43 > 0:08:48Parliament should have the right to feel at ease as they go about their

0:08:48 > 0:08:55work, irrespective of position, age or seniority. Second, whilst we have

0:08:55 > 0:09:00had a confidential helpline in place for several years, it must now be

0:09:00 > 0:09:04strengthened, as a dedicated support team, made more accessible and given

0:09:04 > 0:09:07more resources, and its role and responsibilities highlighted to all

0:09:07 > 0:09:13who work there. Third, the support team should have the ability to

0:09:13 > 0:09:17recommend onward referral of a case, to ensure appropriate investigation

0:09:17 > 0:09:23and action takes place. Fourth, the support team should recommend

0:09:23 > 0:09:27specialised pastoral support for anyone experiencing distress as a

0:09:27 > 0:09:32consequence of their treatment in the workplace. Fifth, the support

0:09:32 > 0:09:35team should strongly recommend reporting any allegations which may

0:09:35 > 0:09:41be criminal directly to the police. Sixth, and in addition, there may be

0:09:41 > 0:09:44further action which Government and political parties themselves can

0:09:44 > 0:09:49take to ensure high standards of conduct, and that inappropriate

0:09:49 > 0:09:56behaviour is properly dealt with. This is the very least we can do.

0:09:56 > 0:10:00As the Prime Minister outlined yesterday in her letter to party

0:10:00 > 0:10:04leaders, we must establish a House wide mediation service, with a code

0:10:04 > 0:10:08of conduct but and contractually binding grievance procedure

0:10:08 > 0:10:13available for all MPs and their staff irrespective of their party

0:10:13 > 0:10:18banner. This will reinforce to those who work here and to the public that

0:10:18 > 0:10:21we are serious in our treatment of wrongdoing and in our support for

0:10:21 > 0:10:26those who suffer it. I know all party leaders will work together

0:10:26 > 0:10:29with the House to reach an agreement and get these changes in place as

0:10:29 > 0:10:36soon as possible. As members of Parliament, our constituents will be

0:10:36 > 0:10:39rightly appalled at the thought that some representatives in Parliament

0:10:39 > 0:10:44may have acted in an entirely inappropriate way towards others.

0:10:44 > 0:10:50These reports risk bringing all of our offices into disrepute. I know

0:10:50 > 0:10:54this is an issue of great concern to you, Mr Speaker, and I know you will

0:10:54 > 0:10:58do everything you can to tackle this issue. And I know that members from

0:10:58 > 0:11:02all parties will want to work alongside you to investigate every

0:11:02 > 0:11:05claim, provide the right support in the future, and make sure this never

0:11:05 > 0:11:11happens again. Mr Speaker, it is right, not a privilege, to work in a

0:11:11 > 0:11:18and respect the environment. These steps will ensure Parliament takes a

0:11:18 > 0:11:21zero tolerance approach. Parliament must take action in days, not weeks.

0:11:21 > 0:11:27Thank you.

0:11:27 > 0:11:30Can I fully endorse the words that you said and thank you for the

0:11:30 > 0:11:33commitment that you have always shown on these issues and I thank

0:11:33 > 0:11:37the leader of the House for her answer. She's right. There is

0:11:37 > 0:11:40obviously a problem. It's a good thing actually that it's being

0:11:40 > 0:11:45exposed and it has to be dealt with. No woman or man for that matter

0:11:45 > 0:11:49coming to work in this House should be subjected to unwanted sexual

0:11:49 > 0:11:54advances from those who are in a position of power over them. No one

0:11:54 > 0:12:00should have to work in the toxic atmosphere of sleazy sexist or

0:12:00 > 0:12:04homophobic banter. No MP, let alone a Minister, should think it's

0:12:04 > 0:12:08something to make jokes about. This is not hysteria, this is something

0:12:08 > 0:12:14which is long overdue for all the parties in this House to deal with.

0:12:14 > 0:12:18Shuz she agree that all parties should agree on clear strict rules

0:12:18 > 0:12:23about what is not acceptable, make sure everyone knows about it and

0:12:23 > 0:12:28that there has to be independence in adjudicating complaints? Does she

0:12:28 > 0:12:31recognise that it's almost impossible for someone at the bottom

0:12:31 > 0:12:35of the system to complain and make allegations about someone at the

0:12:35 > 0:12:42top? And that gives those at the top impunity which some, few, but some

0:12:42 > 0:12:46will take advantage of. A young researcher would fear that if she

0:12:46 > 0:12:51made an allegation about an MP she would be plastered all over the

0:12:51 > 0:12:54newspapers and never get another job. A young journalist would know

0:12:54 > 0:12:59that if she made an allegation about a Cabinet Minister she would be

0:12:59 > 0:13:04subjected to an immediate assault on her integrity and that would be the

0:13:04 > 0:13:11only thing that anyone ever remembered her for thereafter. So we

0:13:11 > 0:13:14must have complainant anonymity at the heart of this. Above all, does

0:13:14 > 0:13:21she recognise as we all must that members of this House have an

0:13:21 > 0:13:25immensely important job and great responsibility to speak up for our

0:13:25 > 0:13:28constituents, to hold the Government to account, that is what we are here

0:13:28 > 0:13:34for. No one voted for me to come to this House to engage in high jinxs.

0:13:34 > 0:13:39No one elected any of us to engage in sleazy oppressive behaviour so it

0:13:39 > 0:13:50has to be stopped and now is the time to do it.Thank you, and I

0:13:50 > 0:13:53absolutely share the right honourable lady's concerns about

0:13:53 > 0:13:58allegations and I also share her determination to stamp this out. We

0:13:58 > 0:14:02absolutely are determined to get a grip on this. She is right that all

0:14:02 > 0:14:06parties must agree on the rules and that there must be an independent

0:14:06 > 0:14:09grievance procedure. I absolutely share the concern that particularly

0:14:09 > 0:14:14for young people coming to work or to have work experience in this

0:14:14 > 0:14:17place it is very difficult for them to put themselves forward with

0:14:17 > 0:14:22allegations for fear of what might happen to them and that has been the

0:14:22 > 0:14:26case throughout all areas of life where those in power seek to abuse

0:14:26 > 0:14:30those who are younger and less powerful than they are and it is

0:14:30 > 0:14:34absolutely appalling and unforgiveable. I also share her view

0:14:34 > 0:14:40that complainants should be given anonymity and there should be proper

0:14:40 > 0:14:43and thorough investigations of all complaints.

0:14:44 > 0:14:50Thank you very much. Can I also congratulate you on your comments

0:14:50 > 0:14:53and endorsement, Mr Speaker, endorse the comments of the right honourable

0:14:53 > 0:14:57lady opposite and the leader of the House for all she has said. We do

0:14:57 > 0:15:01indeed need change. Things can't go on as they are. I welcome very much

0:15:01 > 0:15:09the notion that we are going to set up an independent grievous procedure

0:15:09 > 0:15:13to provide protection to everybody who works in this place in the same

0:15:13 > 0:15:17way any other worker would have. Would she look at extending consider

0:15:17 > 0:15:22- consider extending it to every parliamentary pass holder or

0:15:22 > 0:15:27parliamentary e-mail account holder? Would she also set down a timetable

0:15:27 > 0:15:32and would she also agree with me that this is not just about sexual

0:15:32 > 0:15:37harassment. It extends to other forms of abuse and it's important

0:15:37 > 0:15:42that we recognise that.My honourable friend is exactly right,

0:15:42 > 0:15:47this must include all pass holders, in fact, those who come to this

0:15:47 > 0:15:51House for work experience also and indeed those members of the media

0:15:51 > 0:15:55and so on who come to the House is absolutely clear that there needs to

0:15:55 > 0:16:00be a proper means of coming forward with grievances. I think she's also

0:16:00 > 0:16:05right that it's not just a matter of sexually inappropriate behaviour but

0:16:05 > 0:16:10also bullying accusations and all manner of inappropriate behaviour,

0:16:10 > 0:16:15it should be all encompassing and that's what we intend to achieve.

0:16:15 > 0:16:20Thank you. Can I start by thanking the honourable member for Camberwell

0:16:20 > 0:16:25and Peckham for raising this very important issue. 35 years in this

0:16:25 > 0:16:29place and she's trying to take society forward in a leap. Can I

0:16:29 > 0:16:34also thank you, Mr Speaker, for your statement and welcome the leader of

0:16:34 > 0:16:37the House's statement and to thank her for sight of her statement

0:16:37 > 0:16:42before. We on the opposition Labour Party are ready to work with the

0:16:42 > 0:16:46Government and all parties. The leader of the opposition made a

0:16:46 > 0:16:49statement at the weekend saying that committing the Labour Party to do

0:16:49 > 0:16:55such a thing. We all need to come up with an appropriate safeguarding

0:16:55 > 0:16:58policy for everyone who works in this place. The Prime Minister

0:16:58 > 0:17:03mentioned in her letter to you, Mr Speaker, that there may have to be a

0:17:03 > 0:17:07new body, any new body has to encompass everyone who works in the

0:17:07 > 0:17:11House. A body that can look at complaints about members, the staff

0:17:11 > 0:17:15of the House, including contractors on the estate, and with members of

0:17:15 > 0:17:20the other place. And work with trade unions who certainly helped the

0:17:20 > 0:17:25Labour Party to draw up our code of conduct. There must be due process,

0:17:25 > 0:17:28any allegations must be made and there is a proper process of

0:17:28 > 0:17:32investigation. Some may be referred to the police, if they are serious

0:17:32 > 0:17:35allegations. If there is a streamlined process, then

0:17:35 > 0:17:40everybody's aware of it. I know the House currently has the employee

0:17:40 > 0:17:44assistant programme which was set up by you in 2014, Mr Speaker, for

0:17:44 > 0:17:46members' staff, who have a free confidential phone line but it needs

0:17:46 > 0:17:51to go further. The newed abouty needs to build on that and I know

0:17:51 > 0:17:53the leader of the House made a number of recommendations, I would

0:17:53 > 0:17:58say that needs to be looked at by a working party or another body to

0:17:58 > 0:18:03that we ensure we don't react but deal with it appropriately. Could I

0:18:03 > 0:18:07ask the leader if she can make sure that the House looks at widening the

0:18:07 > 0:18:11scope of this helpline to include independent advice, including legal

0:18:11 > 0:18:14advice on the next steps for the complainant? Because all that

0:18:14 > 0:18:19helpline can currently do now is to give counselling for the claimants.

0:18:19 > 0:18:24And then refer the matter to parties. I am not clear what other

0:18:24 > 0:18:27parties do, but the position with the opposition Labour Party is that

0:18:27 > 0:18:31we have a code of conduct that is signed up by every single member of

0:18:31 > 0:18:34the party, that's MPs, and members of the party. This has been sent

0:18:34 > 0:18:39around a number of times since I was first elected in 2010 and I know

0:18:39 > 0:18:44it's been sent around again today. So that if anyone wants to raise

0:18:44 > 0:18:46anything under the code of conduct it says that the matter is referred

0:18:46 > 0:18:50to the head of complaints of the Labour Party who will look at the

0:18:50 > 0:18:54nature of the complaint. Could I also turn to and ask the leader of

0:18:54 > 0:18:58the House as the Prime Minister is here, to the letter that was sent to

0:18:58 > 0:19:05the Prime Minister, if she has seen the letter from my honourable friend

0:19:05 > 0:19:10the Shadow member for women and equalities, those issues where a

0:19:10 > 0:19:14Minister has broken the Ministerial Code, that the person was actually a

0:19:14 > 0:19:19Minister at the time? And could the Prime Minister's response be placed

0:19:19 > 0:19:25in the library? It is not acceptable now in society where women are not

0:19:25 > 0:19:31treated equally, even when we do the same work. It is not acceptable that

0:19:31 > 0:19:36names for women's anatomy are used as swear words and it is not

0:19:36 > 0:19:39acceptable that every time unacceptable behaviour is

0:19:39 > 0:19:43challenged, it is closed down as political correctness. I know all of

0:19:43 > 0:19:49us, every single one of us, on all sides of the House, will use our

0:19:49 > 0:19:58strength and our experience to protect the vulnerable.Thank you

0:19:58 > 0:20:02and I absolutely share the honourable lady's concerns and I was

0:20:02 > 0:20:07very pleased when we met earlier today that we are absolutely in the

0:20:07 > 0:20:14same place in terms of a determination to tackle this issue

0:20:14 > 0:20:18very quickly. In specific response to her particular issues, yes, I

0:20:18 > 0:20:24think she's right that the House does need to look at broadening the

0:20:24 > 0:20:30resources available to the helpline so that staff in this place can get

0:20:30 > 0:20:34better support and more advice. I can tell the honourable lady that

0:20:34 > 0:20:39the Prime Minister hasn't yet seen the letter from the opposition women

0:20:39 > 0:20:42and equalities spokeswoman but will look at that carefully of course, I

0:20:42 > 0:20:48do share the concern about the way in which women's anatomy is referred

0:20:48 > 0:20:51to see a swear word, it's frustrating ap irritating for women

0:20:51 > 0:20:56and men, but I also think we must recognise that this issue doesn't

0:20:56 > 0:21:02just affect women t also affects men, in dealing with the problems

0:21:02 > 0:21:07across both Houses we need to have respect for all people, women and

0:21:07 > 0:21:11men. Thank you.I should congratulate the right honourable

0:21:11 > 0:21:17and learned member, the member for Camberwell and Peckham, I think she

0:21:17 > 0:21:22marked and I think celebrated the anniversary of her election to the

0:21:22 > 0:21:29House. October 28th? It's a very remarkable achievement.Can I

0:21:29 > 0:21:32welcome the statement that my right honourable friend the leader of the

0:21:32 > 0:21:35House has made today and particularly the leadership shown

0:21:35 > 0:21:43shown by the Prime Minister on this issue. Can I welcome the idea of an

0:21:43 > 0:21:46independent grievance procedure for everybody who works in this place

0:21:46 > 0:21:51but can I also gently remind members here today that two-thirds of girls

0:21:51 > 0:21:56in our schools experience sexual harassment on a regular basis, that

0:21:56 > 0:21:58half of university students experience sexual harassment, that

0:21:58 > 0:22:03half of women in work experience sexual harassment, so could I ask

0:22:03 > 0:22:07the leader of the House what more support she might be able to give to

0:22:07 > 0:22:11debates on those issues in this place and encouraging the Government

0:22:11 > 0:22:18to take action and you will be aware of the fact, Mr Speaker, that the

0:22:18 > 0:22:21member for Yardley - Birmingham Yardley and I are holding a debate

0:22:21 > 0:22:27in the chamber on Thursday on the issue of sexual harassment in

0:22:27 > 0:22:33schools.My right honourable friend raises an incredibly important point

0:22:33 > 0:22:40which is really just highlighting that what we do in this House sets a

0:22:40 > 0:22:44role model and an example to those out in the rest of the country and

0:22:44 > 0:22:50in particular at a time when we are so concerned about sexual harassment

0:22:50 > 0:22:54in schools, it is pretty poor show if we can't sort out our own House.

0:22:54 > 0:22:58I think my right honourable friend raises an incredibly important

0:22:58 > 0:23:01point. Can I very much welcome the

0:23:01 > 0:23:06statement from the leader of the house and indeed your statement, Mr

0:23:06 > 0:23:11Speaker, which helpfully makes a positive way forward and can we say

0:23:11 > 0:23:14we support a whole House response to this in establishment of a grievance

0:23:14 > 0:23:19procedure. Abuse or sexual harassment in any form must be

0:23:19 > 0:23:22condemned in the strongest possible terms and this House is no exception

0:23:22 > 0:23:26to that. The Scottish National Party gress that we must adopt a zero

0:23:26 > 0:23:31tolerance approach and we will be ensuring in the Scottish parliament

0:23:31 > 0:23:33any issue will be robustly investigated and the First Minister

0:23:33 > 0:23:37today has written to the presiding officer of the Scottish parliament

0:23:37 > 0:23:41in regard to this. Could I ask the leader of the House to confirm and

0:23:41 > 0:23:45perhaps tell us more about plans to involve all the parties in this

0:23:45 > 0:23:50House. And perhaps tell us how these talks could be progressed and does

0:23:50 > 0:23:55she agree that all staff working on the estate must have access to

0:23:55 > 0:24:00information, impartial advice and a means of raising these concerns in a

0:24:00 > 0:24:05safe space is created so that any concerns can be raised

0:24:05 > 0:24:08confidentially right now immediately after the statement. Finally, does

0:24:08 > 0:24:13she agree this is a watershed moment for this House, this is an

0:24:13 > 0:24:17opportunity for an institutional shift where the historic culture of

0:24:17 > 0:24:22this House can positively be tackled and that there must be no suggestion

0:24:22 > 0:24:29that this House considers itself above any investigation.I am

0:24:29 > 0:24:34grateful to the honourable gentleman for his contribution. He asked what

0:24:34 > 0:24:40plans there are to involve all parties. Obviously, this is all very

0:24:40 > 0:24:46recent news and it's vital that we tackle it very urgently and so there

0:24:46 > 0:24:50will be meetings arced between all parties in the very near future, I

0:24:50 > 0:24:53mean within days to make sure that we are all agreed on a common

0:24:53 > 0:24:58approach. He is absolutely right that all staff must have suitable

0:24:58 > 0:25:02information and a safe space. I do urge people if they have allegations

0:25:02 > 0:25:07or if they feel that they have been made to feel uncomfortable that they

0:25:07 > 0:25:11do come forward and speak to either my office or perhaps to their whip

0:25:11 > 0:25:16or to your office, Mr Speaker, and it is absolutely essential that

0:25:16 > 0:25:22people feel they have somewhere to go and he is right to point out that

0:25:22 > 0:25:26again that the employee helpline must be more widely communicated to

0:25:26 > 0:25:29staff and we will see that that is the case. He finally makes the point

0:25:29 > 0:25:34that this is an opportunity for parliament to show that we can react

0:25:34 > 0:25:38quickly to problems and take a quantum leap forward in our approach

0:25:38 > 0:25:41to dealing with this terrible issue and I would like to think that we

0:25:41 > 0:25:49can and will do just that. Can I pay tribute to the leader of

0:25:49 > 0:25:52the House and the Prime Minister for grappling with this issue so very

0:25:52 > 0:25:56swift slip. The leader of the House talked about this being a modern

0:25:56 > 0:26:00workplace. Isn't that the rub, because this isn't a modern

0:26:00 > 0:26:03workplace, it's a very strange workplace. It's strange for members,

0:26:03 > 0:26:07it's strange for our families, but most of all it's very strange for

0:26:07 > 0:26:11those members of staff and you hinted at that when you tacked about

0:26:11 > 0:26:16Members of Parliament being individual employers. There are 650

0:26:16 > 0:26:20different employment relationships. Can I urge the leader of the House

0:26:20 > 0:26:23to reflect on the fact any new organisation which must be

0:26:23 > 0:26:30independent needs to be nimble enough to reflect on how this place

0:26:30 > 0:26:33actually works, to deliver the institutional shift that the

0:26:33 > 0:26:37honourable gentleman has talked about and must not be like a costing

0:26:37 > 0:26:49of £6 million a year on the taxpayer £6 million a year.

0:26:49 > 0:26:53My right honourable friend is absolutely right. Any new Crosshouse

0:26:53 > 0:26:57body will need to be nimble, will need to have the understanding of

0:26:57 > 0:27:00parliamentary procedures, and will also need to offer good value for

0:27:00 > 0:27:06taxpayers' money.With the leader of the House except that in any debate

0:27:06 > 0:27:10on sexual harassment there is too much victim blaming that happens?

0:27:10 > 0:27:14Women who are blamed for not speaking out about harassment,

0:27:14 > 0:27:17rather than asking why they didn't. Young women we have seen who did

0:27:17 > 0:27:21speak out being targeted with ideas on social media, and if we are going

0:27:21 > 0:27:25to get the right kind of reforms, independent reforms, the processes,

0:27:25 > 0:27:30or the right kind of culture change, not just in this place but in

0:27:30 > 0:27:34institutions right across the country, there has to be a much

0:27:34 > 0:27:39stronger voice in those reform debates for the young women and men

0:27:39 > 0:27:43and the junior staff who too often end up being the victims of

0:27:43 > 0:27:51unacceptable abuses of power? Their voices must be heard.Yes, the right

0:27:51 > 0:27:54honourable lady makes a very good point, that it is vital that victims

0:27:54 > 0:27:59feel they have a safe place to bring forward allegations, and that they

0:27:59 > 0:28:05are not the ones who end up being blamed, either for failing to come

0:28:05 > 0:28:09forward, or for presumably making false allegations, which too often

0:28:09 > 0:28:14seems to be the case. And I would actually highlight the situation for

0:28:14 > 0:28:18my honourable friend who tried to raise some issues of allegation and

0:28:18 > 0:28:22herself suffered unbelievable abuse for it. It is an appalling cultural

0:28:22 > 0:28:32trend in this country, and it really has to stop.Sadly, for those of us

0:28:32 > 0:28:36that have been in the House for some time, we know there is nothing new

0:28:36 > 0:28:42about the exchanges today. I therefore welcome the statement, and

0:28:42 > 0:28:47that of the leader of the House, and the Prime Minister's intervention,

0:28:47 > 0:28:50and indeed I have agreed with all the exchanges across the House

0:28:50 > 0:28:55today. Can we not forget that it applies to both Houses? Can we not

0:28:55 > 0:29:00forget it applies to a constituency staff and people beyond your? And

0:29:00 > 0:29:03can I urge, as my honourable friend the member for blocks studied

0:29:03 > 0:29:09earlier on, can I urge the Leader of the Houster, with the timescale,

0:29:09 > 0:29:14because I think the matter is pressing? -- the member for blocks

0:29:14 > 0:29:20all. But for everyone who works in this estate are connected to it,

0:29:20 > 0:29:25what the interim procedures are for those individuals who may be at the

0:29:25 > 0:29:27receiving end of the appalling treatment we have been reading about

0:29:27 > 0:29:35in the papers.My right honourable friend mentions the fact that any

0:29:35 > 0:29:39new procedure needs to cover both Houses, and she is right. It needs

0:29:39 > 0:29:44to cover all staff working here and in our constituencies, and she is

0:29:44 > 0:29:48absolutely right. She also seeks interim procedures to be clarified,

0:29:48 > 0:29:51which we will absolutely do, but I would just like to point out to her

0:29:51 > 0:29:55that my right honourable friend the Prime Minister has absolutely

0:29:55 > 0:29:59gripped this issue, and whilst it may have been rumbling on for many

0:29:59 > 0:30:03years, I think we should all be pleased that we will be addressing

0:30:03 > 0:30:15it in the very near future.I welcome these steps to eradicate

0:30:15 > 0:30:19harassment from this place, but when I complained recently to an officer

0:30:19 > 0:30:22of Parliament, who had some responsibility in this area, that I

0:30:22 > 0:30:26knew a number of researchers, male and female, who had been made to

0:30:26 > 0:30:30feel deeply uncomfortable in the sports and social club here by

0:30:30 > 0:30:33members of parliament, I was told that that happens in pubs all over

0:30:33 > 0:30:40the country. With the leader of the House confirmed that the duty of

0:30:40 > 0:30:49care that we owe extends 24/7 to every restaurant and bar in this

0:30:49 > 0:30:56place.Well, I'm very happy to give that absolute assurance. They should

0:30:56 > 0:31:00be no place here on the estate or in our constituency offices where

0:31:00 > 0:31:04people can be abused or where their allegations are not taken seriously,

0:31:04 > 0:31:08and I can ensure the honourable lady that I will be meeting with the Lord

0:31:08 > 0:31:11to discuss the specific issues around the sports and social bar

0:31:11 > 0:31:18tomorrow.Can I thank you for your statement, Mr Speaker, and indeed

0:31:18 > 0:31:22for the consensus in all the statements that have so far been

0:31:22 > 0:31:25made and questions raised in these exchanges? But can I just point out,

0:31:25 > 0:31:31we wouldn't be having these exchanges if this code, the code of

0:31:31 > 0:31:35conduct of the House of Commons, was actually working, and if the

0:31:35 > 0:31:39machinery around this code was effective? Can I draw my right

0:31:39 > 0:31:41honourable friend's attention to the fact that the Parliamentary

0:31:41 > 0:31:45Commissioner for Standards is conducting a review of the code of

0:31:45 > 0:31:49conduct? And that the public administration and public affairs

0:31:49 > 0:31:52committee has submitted quite radical suggestions about how the

0:31:52 > 0:31:54code and the machinery around it should be reformed, so that we spend

0:31:54 > 0:31:59far more time in this House as MPs experiencing proper professional

0:31:59 > 0:32:05development and understanding the code of values at the front of this

0:32:05 > 0:32:08document, and what they actually mean and how we should live those

0:32:08 > 0:32:11values as members of Parliament, rather than just concentrating on

0:32:11 > 0:32:15all the other pages which are about declarations of outside earnings,

0:32:15 > 0:32:20members' interests and all the rest, which seems to preoccupy the

0:32:20 > 0:32:25regulatory authorities of this House?Yes, my honourable friend is

0:32:25 > 0:32:28absolutely right to raise the fact that there is already a code of

0:32:28 > 0:32:32conduct, and I'm grateful to him for sending me his committee's report on

0:32:32 > 0:32:35that matter over the weekend. It is certainly something I will be

0:32:35 > 0:32:40looking at Caerphilly over the next couple of days.-- looking at

0:32:40 > 0:32:45Caerphilly over the next couple of days. Much has been made this

0:32:45 > 0:32:48weekend over the standards commission and the committee looking

0:32:48 > 0:32:52into many of the issues raised over the last week. However, in a report

0:32:52 > 0:32:57debated in March 2012 the committee tried to give the commission a wider

0:32:57 > 0:33:01scope over these issues and an amendment was tabled by the three

0:33:01 > 0:33:06major parties parliamentary shop stewards and supported by the front

0:33:06 > 0:33:09benches and was introduced to block this, and therefore the commission

0:33:09 > 0:33:16was left unable to look into these very important issues. When the

0:33:16 > 0:33:19Standards Committee reform shortly we will again be looking at the code

0:33:19 > 0:33:23of conduct, and I hope that all parties in here will be a lot more

0:33:23 > 0:33:31receptive to necessary changes.The honourable gentleman raises a really

0:33:31 > 0:33:35important point and I can assure him that the commission will meet under

0:33:35 > 0:33:38the chairmanship of Mr Speaker this afternoon and will be these matters

0:33:38 > 0:33:47there.I'm delighted to hear the Leader of the House will extend

0:33:47 > 0:33:52these to other forms of abuse. Will that include those MPs who go on

0:33:52 > 0:33:59rallies endorsing the lynching of other MPs? It is an absolute

0:33:59 > 0:34:07disgrace that senior MPs go about their business getting violence

0:34:07 > 0:34:10against female MPs?My right honourable friend raises an

0:34:10 > 0:34:16incredibly important point again about the vital significance about

0:34:16 > 0:34:22what we do as MPs, and certainly slogans about lynching other MPs is

0:34:22 > 0:34:28incredibly despicable behaviour that is occasionally encouraged, and I

0:34:28 > 0:34:32think it is deeply regrettable and we all need to look very carefully

0:34:32 > 0:34:40at what sort of behaviour we endorse in this House.Sexual harassment is

0:34:40 > 0:34:43a problem in Parliament, as it is indeed in workplaces and schools

0:34:43 > 0:34:47right across the country, and it is often worst where there are big

0:34:47 > 0:34:52discrepancies of power. I really hope that the news reports of the

0:34:52 > 0:34:56last few days act as a watershed moment and help to capitalise the

0:34:56 > 0:35:00change that we so clearly need, not least in the outdated attitudes that

0:35:00 > 0:35:05exist still in some quarters. I welcome the cross-party agreement

0:35:05 > 0:35:08that we need an independent reporting mechanism for

0:35:08 > 0:35:11investigating complaints, but will the leader of the House agree that

0:35:11 > 0:35:15if people are to have confidence in using it, the process needs to be

0:35:15 > 0:35:20very clearly set out, as indeed do the outcomes need to be, because

0:35:20 > 0:35:25repercussions in secret via the usual channels will not cut it in

0:35:25 > 0:35:302017?The honourable lady has been a big champion for women over several

0:35:30 > 0:35:35years and I applaud her for that. She is absolutely right. What the

0:35:35 > 0:35:40grievance procedure will need to do is to be very clear, very well

0:35:40 > 0:35:42communicated, and with very clearly established and set out principles

0:35:42 > 0:35:49about how the grievance procedure escalates, with very clear so that

0:35:49 > 0:35:53what results from the end of it, so everybody who participate in it can

0:35:53 > 0:35:59see for themselves.Urgency of course is very important in how we

0:35:59 > 0:36:03deal with this issue, but nevertheless will the Leader of the

0:36:03 > 0:36:05House confirmed that this is not going to be something that will be

0:36:05 > 0:36:11dealt with simply by Has officials and those working at the Palace of

0:36:11 > 0:36:15Westminster? But the best practice would be utilised, and that advice

0:36:15 > 0:36:18will be sought from external organisations as to how they deal

0:36:18 > 0:36:25with this, because we need to get this right first time round.Well, I

0:36:25 > 0:36:29think vital will be cross-party agreement. I'm working closely with

0:36:29 > 0:36:33your office, Mr Speaker, and of course the House officials

0:36:33 > 0:36:36themselves do have some expertise in this area, but all ideas will be

0:36:36 > 0:36:41welcomed, but bearing in mind as the numbers of members have said this is

0:36:41 > 0:36:50a very unusual workplace.I would obviously welcome what has been said

0:36:50 > 0:36:54here today, and look forward to working with you on the reference

0:36:54 > 0:36:58group on this issue going forward. As I walked in here, as I rushed

0:36:58 > 0:37:02into data come to this statement, I overheard two male colleagues

0:37:02 > 0:37:05walking through the halls wittering about a witch hunt that was going on

0:37:05 > 0:37:09in Parliament, so I think that what we need to do in this building is

0:37:09 > 0:37:14not think of this as being a party political thing but something that

0:37:14 > 0:37:18has to absolutely happen, and we don't just cheer when our own side

0:37:18 > 0:37:24is the person getting attacked. We cheer when everyone is bound to

0:37:24 > 0:37:30write. I want to ask the Leader of the House is you touch on a little

0:37:30 > 0:37:32bit, and she didn't when she outlined what she and the Government

0:37:32 > 0:37:35felt needed to be done, what she felt needed to happen the

0:37:35 > 0:37:39perpetrators of this crime, because the fact of the matter is good

0:37:39 > 0:37:43referral lines, support for victims, it is obviously something I support,

0:37:43 > 0:37:47but nothing hurts a victim more than watching a perpetrator getting away

0:37:47 > 0:37:58with it.Well, she is exactly right, and I certainly welcome her desire

0:37:58 > 0:38:00for a nonpartisan approach to resolution of this. It affects all

0:38:00 > 0:38:03sides of the House and we do need to work together on it. In terms of

0:38:03 > 0:38:07what happens to the perpetrators, that is of course a matter for the

0:38:07 > 0:38:12House the debate, but it will include, you know, where they are

0:38:12 > 0:38:17staff who are perpetrating, then the normal contractual potential for

0:38:17 > 0:38:22losing your job, will it as an MP, then the possible withdrawal of the

0:38:22 > 0:38:29whip, or sacking of ministers and so on, all of these well-known events

0:38:29 > 0:38:32that can happen from time to time must be in scope and will be in

0:38:32 > 0:38:40scope.I very much welcomed your inclusion in your about bullying and

0:38:40 > 0:38:45other forms of harassment. Can I say that also sometimes victims are not

0:38:45 > 0:38:49empowered to speak up and make a complaint? Can we also make sure

0:38:49 > 0:38:53there can be potentially a form of a reporting, because other people can

0:38:53 > 0:38:56observe harassment and bullying within an office place and feel that

0:38:56 > 0:39:03they could alert someone's attention to it?Yes, I think if we can

0:39:03 > 0:39:06establish a proper grievance procedure then it should be

0:39:06 > 0:39:09perfectly possible to report observed behaviour and not just

0:39:09 > 0:39:16personal experience.Can I welcome your statement, Mr Speaker, and the

0:39:16 > 0:39:20statements made today? As others have said this is nothing new. This

0:39:20 > 0:39:25comes about because of a political culture of preferment, where people

0:39:25 > 0:39:29can't speak about what has happened to them for fear of their career

0:39:29 > 0:39:32being stifled. In order to change that political culture, it requires

0:39:32 > 0:39:39all of us to take very strong political leadership, and I say this

0:39:39 > 0:39:43to the political leaders on both sides, and all sides of the House.

0:39:43 > 0:39:48This means taking decisions against colleagues and others, even when

0:39:48 > 0:39:51that is inconvenient, even when that is against their own allies or are

0:39:51 > 0:39:55own supporters are their own side, and that requires strong leadership.

0:39:55 > 0:40:05Does she agree with me?I absolutely agree with the honourable lady.I

0:40:05 > 0:40:12also welcome the statements and comments made today. I was speaking

0:40:12 > 0:40:15to my own research or just earlier this week and she herself

0:40:15 > 0:40:18highlighted some of the experiences that she has had in this place, and

0:40:18 > 0:40:25as a new MPI definitely find that shocking and unacceptable -- as a

0:40:25 > 0:40:29new MP I get to define that. Can I had the code of education, both for

0:40:29 > 0:40:33staff themselves and also for us as members? Many members are coming

0:40:33 > 0:40:37here have not had the experience of employing people before. We need to

0:40:37 > 0:40:41be kept up-to-date with what is happening in society, what does

0:40:41 > 0:40:44constitute harassment? We may think those are innocent phrases but they

0:40:44 > 0:40:49are not perceived as such and our staff also need to be empowered

0:40:49 > 0:40:54completely to bring forward complaints. Does she agree with me?

0:40:54 > 0:40:58I think my honourable friend raises a really important and thoughtful

0:40:58 > 0:41:02point, which is that very often members don't... Have not had it

0:41:02 > 0:41:04speeds of employing staff before coming to this place, they do

0:41:04 > 0:41:08themselves need some guidance, and I think that can be a useful

0:41:08 > 0:41:14contribution as a result of this experience. -- they have not had the

0:41:14 > 0:41:18experience of employing staff before.A member of staff in this

0:41:18 > 0:41:22House called me today she reported being sexually assaulted to the

0:41:22 > 0:41:26proper authorities earlier this year, and they did nothing. She is

0:41:26 > 0:41:31deeply disappointed and distrustful and she tells me that mistrust is

0:41:31 > 0:41:40endemic. How can I assure will now be treated differently?

0:41:40 > 0:41:47If her staff would like to talk to me about it I will certainly take it

0:41:47 > 0:41:52up personally.I welcome my right honourable friend's statement

0:41:52 > 0:41:55sending a clear message that sexual harassment is never acceptable. Who

0:41:55 > 0:41:59would have thought as we celebrate the centenary of women getting the

0:41:59 > 0:42:05vote that we have to address in this chamber the conduct and language

0:42:05 > 0:42:09that intimidates and controls women in particular. This is about the

0:42:09 > 0:42:12abuse of power and the status of women. I welcome the cross-party

0:42:12 > 0:42:16agreement to stamp this out, especially as we are all working in

0:42:16 > 0:42:20a climate where women across the House are being abused just for

0:42:20 > 0:42:23being in public office. Perhaps we can start by referring to the code

0:42:23 > 0:42:27of conduct. I raised this with the Minister last week in business

0:42:27 > 0:42:34questions. With the privilege of being elected comes a duty and that

0:42:34 > 0:42:39doesn't involve sexist language and behaviour because all of us elected

0:42:39 > 0:42:43know the power that we hold.My honourable friend is absolutely

0:42:43 > 0:42:49right. I deeply regret the horrible experience she has had in recent

0:42:49 > 0:42:53weeks for merely trying to raise her own digust at sexual harassment that

0:42:53 > 0:43:02was going on. -- disgust.Parliament must act but all political parties

0:43:02 > 0:43:10must act too. Does the leader of the House agree that every party should

0:43:10 > 0:43:14introduce independent reporting so that women have the confidence to

0:43:14 > 0:43:21come forward, not just in parliament, but in local councils

0:43:21 > 0:43:26and our party activists base too?I think the honourable lady raises a

0:43:26 > 0:43:30really interesting point which I will certainly take away and think

0:43:30 > 0:43:34about, but my perspective on this is that we need independent review

0:43:34 > 0:43:38because the problem with parties marking their own homework is always

0:43:38 > 0:43:44that in itself creates an underlying lack of confidence on the part of

0:43:44 > 0:43:48victims. So I think that independent review, that third party

0:43:48 > 0:43:55professional view is going to be very important in resolving this.

0:43:55 > 0:43:59The honourable lady the member for east Dumbarton shire was right to

0:43:59 > 0:44:03talk about confidence because there needs to be confidence in the system

0:44:03 > 0:44:07and that's why it needs to be an independent body because justice

0:44:07 > 0:44:13must not only be done, it must be seen to be done. But may I also say

0:44:13 > 0:44:16that although the honourable lady talked about witch-hunts, we have to

0:44:16 > 0:44:21be very careful to avoid them and one of the advantages of there being

0:44:21 > 0:44:29an independent body was that it will avoid just that. There will have to

0:44:29 > 0:44:32be proper substantiated allegations to be made.Yes, my honourable

0:44:32 > 0:44:39friend is right. What we don't want to see is false allegations made and

0:44:39 > 0:44:43then becoming a fact just is made, so the absolutely proper

0:44:43 > 0:44:48investigation is essential to get to the bottom of the allegations and

0:44:48 > 0:44:54find out whether they're true or not.Thank you for your leadership,

0:44:54 > 0:44:57Mr Speaker, on this issue. We need to be clear that we are not just

0:44:57 > 0:45:01talking about issues that are criminal, we are also talking about

0:45:01 > 0:45:08making sure a culture of sexual violence, harassment and misogny and

0:45:08 > 0:45:11not believing those who come forward is not considered the norm. And to

0:45:11 > 0:45:15do that means being clear about what happens, not just to those who come

0:45:15 > 0:45:18forward, but those who participate. So I would like to hear from the

0:45:18 > 0:45:24leader of the House a bit more clarity, and following my

0:45:24 > 0:45:27colleagues, about what measures she's expecting political parties to

0:45:27 > 0:45:33take to make sure that we don't just keep employees and volunteers safe

0:45:33 > 0:45:36from illegal activities, but we also protect them from a constructive

0:45:36 > 0:45:41dismissal case or is it simply that we are going to expect the

0:45:41 > 0:45:45electorate to pick up the slack?I think I have been perfectly clear.

0:45:45 > 0:45:49Firstly, that the issue is around those who are made to feel

0:45:49 > 0:45:53uncomfortable. I am absolutely setting the bar significantly below

0:45:53 > 0:45:58criminal activity, if people are made to feel uncomfortable, then

0:45:58 > 0:46:02that is not correct. In terms of the consequences for the perpetrators, I

0:46:02 > 0:46:06think I have also been perfectly clear in the case of staff they can

0:46:06 > 0:46:09for fit their jobs, in the case of Members of Parliament they could

0:46:09 > 0:46:14have the whip withdrawn and they could be fired from Ministerial

0:46:14 > 0:46:22office.If we don't call out bad behaviour, irresponsible or criminal

0:46:22 > 0:46:26behaviour, which we do weekly in our constituency surgeries, then we are

0:46:26 > 0:46:32all part of the problem. The right honourable lady opposite raised this

0:46:32 > 0:46:37question rightly, and uses her gravitas to highlight the issue and

0:46:37 > 0:46:41I had the pleasure of serving on your diversity committee to look at

0:46:41 > 0:46:43these issues and we have been making great strides forward on making this

0:46:43 > 0:46:47a positive workplace for all. Can I ask the leader and the Prime

0:46:47 > 0:46:50Minister to work with me and all members from all parties to make

0:46:50 > 0:46:57sure that we have a strong voice in all the separate issues, whether it

0:46:57 > 0:47:00is misogny, poor language or criminal behaviour that we do

0:47:00 > 0:47:07everything to give public confidence in every single party.My honourable

0:47:07 > 0:47:11friend has been a great champion of treating others with respect and I

0:47:11 > 0:47:18would be personally delighted to work with her on this.When all

0:47:18 > 0:47:23cases have been reported and not actioned, which is not just in North

0:47:23 > 0:47:29Wales, but others, will they be reopened? Will there be the right of

0:47:29 > 0:47:33anybody who's been sexually assaulted to say no, I don't want

0:47:33 > 0:47:38the issue to go to the police, I want it treated in other ways, in

0:47:38 > 0:47:44other words, will the victim control what the action is? Will there be

0:47:44 > 0:47:50compulsory training on implications of the duty of care under the

0:47:50 > 0:47:55equality act immediately brought in for all MPs and where someone wishes

0:47:55 > 0:48:02to have trade union representation to assist them will that be allowed?

0:48:02 > 0:48:05The honourable gentleman raises some really important and very sensible

0:48:05 > 0:48:09ideas and I will look very carefully at all of those. I do again urge

0:48:09 > 0:48:14anybody who's been made to feel uncomfortable or who feels they've

0:48:14 > 0:48:19been improperly treated to come forward and those issues will be

0:48:19 > 0:48:25taken up through the right channels which until we have a proper

0:48:25 > 0:48:29independent grievance policy and a group of people able to take that

0:48:29 > 0:48:34up, then the existing policies of the employee helpline which can be

0:48:34 > 0:48:38expanded and my offer that people can come to me personally, will

0:48:38 > 0:48:43absolutely be appropriate ways to take things forward.Can I gently

0:48:43 > 0:48:48remind the House this issue isn't just about sexual harassment and it

0:48:48 > 0:48:53isn't just about women. The issue of bullying in this House is systemic.

0:48:53 > 0:48:56Earlier today I received a text from someone when he described a problem

0:48:56 > 0:49:01that he saw in this place and he spoke of them as a current member.

0:49:01 > 0:49:05He is utterly foul and I am sure it's a pattern of behaviour on his

0:49:05 > 0:49:08part but in this instance I don't think it will be fair on the woman

0:49:08 > 0:49:13in question to name him. Still, he says, do the best you can to widen

0:49:13 > 0:49:18this to bullying and treating your staff like, I think he has put dirt,

0:49:18 > 0:49:24but can I say - can I ask the leader of the House to widen this to not

0:49:24 > 0:49:32only include issues of bullying but also historical allegations?Well,

0:49:32 > 0:49:39it is absolutely the intention that this review looks at all issues of

0:49:39 > 0:49:43misdemeanour and misconduct including sexual harassment and

0:49:43 > 0:49:48bullying and other forms of uncomfortable behaviour that is

0:49:48 > 0:49:56perpetrated on members of staff in this place.When I was a curate in

0:49:56 > 0:49:59the Church of England 30 years ago one of my close colleagues confided

0:49:59 > 0:50:04in me he had been raped by a senior member of the Church of England

0:50:04 > 0:50:09clergy. My friend was understandably terrified about telling anybody,

0:50:09 > 0:50:14telling the police or anybody else that this was the truth. In the end,

0:50:14 > 0:50:17he felt suicidal, he didn't want others to know what had happened to

0:50:17 > 0:50:21him, understandably he was the victim, not the perpetrator. Now I

0:50:21 > 0:50:25make no criticism of my friend and the senior cleric concerned had a

0:50:25 > 0:50:31great deal of protection from the establishment, including from

0:50:31 > 0:50:37certain members in the Royal Family. And he subsequently, thank God, went

0:50:37 > 0:50:41to prison. The Church's instinct was to protect itself as the

0:50:41 > 0:50:46institution. Isn't that always the danger? Isn't the one thing that we

0:50:46 > 0:50:50must learn from all of this, that the best way to protect the

0:50:50 > 0:50:54institution is actually to protect the victims? Put our own house in

0:50:54 > 0:50:58order. Can I make one tiny suggestion, which is that any time

0:50:58 > 0:51:04an MP interviews somebody for a new job, they have somebody from HR, an

0:51:04 > 0:51:11HR professional sitting alongside them in the interview?Well, I think

0:51:11 > 0:51:16the honourable gentleman raises a really terrible case and absolutely

0:51:16 > 0:51:19horrifying and he is right to point out that the victim should not be

0:51:19 > 0:51:24the one to suffer in the way that his friend obviously did. I think

0:51:24 > 0:51:28the point he raises is a very important one, that we do need to

0:51:28 > 0:51:32ensure that this is not the House protecting it self, but that it is

0:51:32 > 0:51:37parliament protecting all of those who come here to work and try to

0:51:37 > 0:51:43make their country a better place. Can I congratulate the right

0:51:43 > 0:51:47honourable lady, the member for Camberwell and Peckham for asking

0:51:47 > 0:51:50this and the leader of the House for her response. Can I ask how many

0:51:50 > 0:51:53calls have been made to the confidential helpline up until now

0:51:53 > 0:51:58and if we are to really get rid of this unacceptable behaviour wouldn't

0:51:58 > 0:52:04it a good place to start be to contact those who have contacted the

0:52:04 > 0:52:09confidential helpline to see how their cases might be taken forward

0:52:09 > 0:52:16now?Well, I say to my honourable friend that on the employee

0:52:16 > 0:52:20assistance programme it is intended as a safety net to complement the

0:52:20 > 0:52:24existing pastoral care and internal processes put in place by MPs

0:52:24 > 0:52:27themselves and the main political parties. In response to his specific

0:52:27 > 0:52:30question about how many calls have been made, I don't know but I can

0:52:30 > 0:52:36find out and put that in the library.When I visit one of the

0:52:36 > 0:52:40schools in my constituency as we often do as MPs, I am required to

0:52:40 > 0:52:44sign in, I am made away of the safeguarding policies every time.

0:52:44 > 0:52:47While I recognise that parliament isn't exactly the same as a school,

0:52:47 > 0:52:51I am concerned there are often visitors brought on to the estate

0:52:51 > 0:52:54often are here socialising late at night who must also be held

0:52:54 > 0:52:57responsible it too. Can I ask the leader of the House how she will

0:52:57 > 0:53:05ensure this is a safe place for all, by all, all of the time?The

0:53:05 > 0:53:08honourable lady raises another different but equally very important

0:53:08 > 0:53:11point which is the safety and protection of those who come on to

0:53:11 > 0:53:16the estate. It's something that I am actually looking at carefully and as

0:53:16 > 0:53:20I mentioned earlier, I will be meeting with Lord McFall tomorrow to

0:53:20 > 0:53:26discuss exactly how we protect those who come on to the estate in order

0:53:26 > 0:53:32to socialise, often quite late at night.I came to this place after

0:53:32 > 0:53:37some years working for the BBC, an institution which in itself has had

0:53:37 > 0:53:41its challenges in this area. With that experience I want to endorse

0:53:41 > 0:53:45what the leader of the House and you yourself Mr Speaker have said about

0:53:45 > 0:53:50the importance of this institution having a robust procedure. It must

0:53:50 > 0:53:55not be left to individual components thereof, be that individual

0:53:55 > 0:53:58employers or political parties. It is this institution, parliament,

0:53:58 > 0:54:03that has to have this robust governance procedure. Can I say that

0:54:03 > 0:54:07there are a few categories of people that I think specifically this

0:54:07 > 0:54:11process must be sufficiently fleet of foot to be able to help. The

0:54:11 > 0:54:17first is those members of staff who work in our constituency offices who

0:54:17 > 0:54:20do often feel isolated and vulnerable. The second is students

0:54:20 > 0:54:24and they are often students who come here on work experience or to do

0:54:24 > 0:54:30internships. I would like to suggest that whenever a student, an intern,

0:54:30 > 0:54:36someone on a workplacement begins, there should be as part of a basic

0:54:36 > 0:54:40induction process, a very simple instruction as to this is where you

0:54:40 > 0:54:45go, if at any time you feel vulnerable. I think that's lacking

0:54:45 > 0:54:51at the moment.Yes, my honourable friend is right. Some of us do have

0:54:51 > 0:54:56clear guidelines for very often quite young people coming to this

0:54:56 > 0:54:59place for work experience and something that we can all give to

0:54:59 > 0:55:05those young people to give them reassurance is an extremely good

0:55:05 > 0:55:14idea.I think across the House what we recognise is that this is a fault

0:55:14 > 0:55:18of undiluted power, when someone holds your entire future in their

0:55:18 > 0:55:23hands, it is very difficult to refuse or to speak out. While it's

0:55:23 > 0:55:28sexual abuse and sexual harassment that has brought this to the

0:55:28 > 0:55:33attention today, it is also misgny dismissal and gender discrimination

0:55:33 > 0:55:39and it isn't just here. Here needs to start the change, but in the law,

0:55:39 > 0:55:44in the NHS, in any hierarchical system we need to see change.

0:55:44 > 0:55:47Victoria

0:55:54 > 0:55:58I think the honourable lady is right and it can create a culture where

0:55:58 > 0:56:02abuse is endemic throughout the systems, so I would not say it is

0:56:02 > 0:56:04only from the top but certainly that is where it starts in real

0:56:04 > 0:56:09leadership needs to be taken.Those of us who have been in this place

0:56:09 > 0:56:13long enough to have seen the expenses scandal will have seen how

0:56:13 > 0:56:19that long drawn-out process, often subject to apparent obfuscation by

0:56:19 > 0:56:22this place, was deeply damaging not only to the integrity of this

0:56:22 > 0:56:25institution but every member of it by implication despite how

0:56:25 > 0:56:29innocently might have been, so does the leader of the Has agree with me

0:56:29 > 0:56:32that it is absolutely essential that the tackle this problem it needs to

0:56:32 > 0:56:37be swift, robust and totally transparent? Because we send out a

0:56:37 > 0:56:44message to the way the rest of society happens and all of us,

0:56:44 > 0:56:48however innocent, have a duty to play in that.My honourable friend

0:56:48 > 0:56:52is exactly right, and it is absolutely our intention that we

0:56:52 > 0:56:54will make very swift progress on this within days. He is right to

0:56:54 > 0:57:00point out that cross-party there is agreement that this needs to be

0:57:00 > 0:57:06resolved, and I think if we all work together we will be able to do that.

0:57:06 > 0:57:13Thank you for your statement, Mr Speaker, and the Leader of the House

0:57:13 > 0:57:16for her very forthright statement. The leader of the house said earlier

0:57:16 > 0:57:20this was an issue that did not just focus on Westminster but applied to

0:57:20 > 0:57:27politics throughout the country. In my own local authority very

0:57:27 > 0:57:29recently, two female councillors have been abused in a most sexually

0:57:29 > 0:57:38derogatory manner online, initiated by a fellow councillor. Could I ask

0:57:38 > 0:57:43the Leader of the House to have conversation with those communities

0:57:43 > 0:57:47to ensure those robust policies and procedures she is outlining for this

0:57:47 > 0:57:55House apply equally to local Government councillors and staff?

0:57:55 > 0:57:59The honourable gentleman raises are very important point and my

0:57:59 > 0:58:03honourable friend would be happy to meet with them and discuss this

0:58:03 > 0:58:09specifically.Many thanks, Mr Speaker. I welcome the cross-party

0:58:09 > 0:58:13approach that has been discussed. As a doctor coming into the house, I

0:58:13 > 0:58:20was quite concerned from the constituency is to find that no

0:58:20 > 0:58:23disclosure checks are mandatory for staff in the constituency office,

0:58:23 > 0:58:26although these checks are quite rigorous in terms of those working

0:58:26 > 0:58:31in Parliament. With the Leader of the House agree it is important that

0:58:31 > 0:58:35staff are kept safe right across the board and also we have a duty to

0:58:35 > 0:58:39protect constituents? -- would then Leader of the House agree?That is a

0:58:39 > 0:58:43very interesting point the honourable lady raises, and I will

0:58:43 > 0:58:54certainly look into it.I referred to the House and my record at the

0:58:54 > 0:58:57register of interests. Your preferred to the fundamental

0:58:57 > 0:59:00imbalance between the parliamentary staff and our staff as members.

0:59:00 > 0:59:02Parliamentary staff have one employer, they are members of a

0:59:02 > 0:59:06recognised trade union if they wish to be, but there is a very active

0:59:06 > 0:59:09and well organised trade union representing member staff. I know

0:59:09 > 0:59:13because it used to be branch secretary of it, so could I ask you,

0:59:13 > 0:59:16Mr Speaker, and the Leader of the House, if you would be willing to

0:59:16 > 0:59:19meet with that union in order to discuss recognition, which is not

0:59:19 > 0:59:27without precedent is?Well, I can't speak for you, Mr Speaker, but I

0:59:27 > 0:59:30would certainly be very happy to meet with them.Similarly, I am very

0:59:30 > 0:59:33happy to meet and I look forward to hearing from the honourable lady.

0:59:33 > 0:59:37This should be an opportunity for a troika, a quartet or perhaps

0:59:37 > 0:59:39something larger, I don't know, but it is important and should happen

0:59:39 > 0:59:52sooner rather than later.Many employers as well as having a

0:59:52 > 0:59:54standard independent procedure, they have a bullying and harassment

0:59:54 > 0:59:58policy separately under a different procedure, so can I ask the Leader

0:59:58 > 1:00:02of the House if that has been explored, a separate bullying and

1:00:02 > 1:00:05harassment policy? And does she agree with me that trade unions now,

1:00:05 > 1:00:08if they have any members of staff coming to them with complaints, that

1:00:08 > 1:00:14they should be invited to make those complaints to the Speaker and the

1:00:14 > 1:00:17Leader of the House?I am certainly aware as a constituency MP myself

1:00:17 > 1:00:23that some trade unions have done excellent work in protecting their

1:00:23 > 1:00:28members from bullying at work, and that is vital role that they fulfil.

1:00:28 > 1:00:33My inclination in terms of how we go about resolving our own House issues

1:00:33 > 1:00:37is that we should have two House solution and it should be an

1:00:37 > 1:00:42independent grievance procedure for anybody can bring any allegations,

1:00:42 > 1:00:43whether of bullying, intimidation, sexually inappropriate behaviour and

1:00:43 > 1:00:53so on, than having separate streams of activity.Can I ask the Leader of

1:00:53 > 1:00:57the House if she will give some consideration to providing a set of

1:00:57 > 1:01:00this training for staff so they might be better equipped to decide

1:01:00 > 1:01:05for themselves what constitutes good humoured hijinks and what

1:01:05 > 1:01:10constitutes sexual harassment?Yes, the honourable lady raises are very

1:01:10 > 1:01:15good point and I certainly would be very supportive of that. They're

1:01:15 > 1:01:18often our courses that are made available, and individual members

1:01:18 > 1:01:24can choose to send staff -- often our courses. I myself have sent

1:01:24 > 1:01:27staff on assertiveness training. Equally, and other members with

1:01:27 > 1:01:30this, the issue of training members of Parliament on how to treat their

1:01:30 > 1:01:33staff, and I think that equally has merit and all of these things should

1:01:33 > 1:01:40be up for discussion.In adding the support of members of this bench to

1:01:40 > 1:01:47the cross-party focus there has been this afternoon, could I urge caution

1:01:47 > 1:01:51to the leader and perhaps ask for a bit of clarity? There was a promise

1:01:51 > 1:01:54earlier for a completely confidential reporting mechanism and

1:01:54 > 1:01:57can I assure that is solely focused on a lack of reporting on

1:01:57 > 1:02:01publication of the name of a victim, bigger can't see how you could

1:02:01 > 1:02:06proceed the full allegation through to the accused without revealing the

1:02:06 > 1:02:12identity of the victim?Yes, I understand the point of the

1:02:12 > 1:02:16honourable gentleman is making and what I was suggesting was that it

1:02:16 > 1:02:21should be possible for the accuser to remain anonymous at least in the

1:02:21 > 1:02:25early stages, because all too often people have been afraid of coming

1:02:25 > 1:02:28forward for fear of their name being all over the front pages of the

1:02:28 > 1:02:36newspapers.Reflecting on the comments of my honourable friend

1:02:36 > 1:02:41from Leicester West, which she also take into account that if we make a

1:02:41 > 1:02:45step forward here in Westminster, it actually further perpetuates the gap

1:02:45 > 1:02:50in terms of protection between people who work in this place and

1:02:50 > 1:02:54our wider political constituencies? In other words the culture of our

1:02:54 > 1:02:56political parties. While we have a real duty of care to those

1:02:56 > 1:03:00activists, and were actually bullying and intimidation and other

1:03:00 > 1:03:05forms of bad behaviour can often spread very easily against a culture

1:03:05 > 1:03:08where political parties seek to shut down allegations rather than

1:03:08 > 1:03:14bringing them into the light?Yes, the honourable gentleman is right to

1:03:14 > 1:03:18raise this point, and it is certainly something I would hope, if

1:03:18 > 1:03:22we can show leadership in this place we would then be able to tackle the

1:03:22 > 1:03:29wider ramifications throughout the country.I, too, agree with much of

1:03:29 > 1:03:32what has been said today, but however I find it hard to believe

1:03:32 > 1:03:37that other members were not aware of allegations of the kind made in

1:03:37 > 1:03:41recent days. The fact that things like this have not been reported up

1:03:41 > 1:03:45until now speaks to the Matt Chilton image of this place but also of the

1:03:45 > 1:03:48unwillingness of far too many men to report such behaviour. Does the

1:03:48 > 1:03:53leader agree with me that those men who remain silent in some cases are

1:03:53 > 1:03:55just as copper bowl of the perpetrators in this place and

1:03:55 > 1:04:02elsewhere and the need to come forward to -- that they are just as

1:04:02 > 1:04:06culpable as the perpetrators.I do off those who feel uncomfortable,

1:04:06 > 1:04:11that they have been abused, bullied, intimidated or harassed to come

1:04:11 > 1:04:13forward, but what I don't think the honourable gentleman is right to

1:04:13 > 1:04:18suggest is that those victims are somehow themselves guilty of

1:04:18 > 1:04:27anything by failing to come forward. Could the Leader of the House ensure

1:04:27 > 1:04:31that the promised new procedures take action on the behaviours of

1:04:31 > 1:04:34racism, misogyny, homophobia and bullying as well as sexual

1:04:34 > 1:04:38harassment, as none of these have any place in our democracy? My

1:04:38 > 1:04:41honourable friend referred to local government. Could we have items

1:04:41 > 1:04:45issued so that other levels of government also adopt similar

1:04:45 > 1:04:51procedure is? We also still have MEPs in the European Parliament,

1:04:51 > 1:04:54because otherwise unless this action is taken it will be politics as a

1:04:54 > 1:04:58whole which comes into disrepute. Yes, I can absolutely confirm that

1:04:58 > 1:05:02all issues around homophobia, racism, bullying, sexual harassment

1:05:02 > 1:05:08and so on will be absolutely part of the scope of the work to look at

1:05:08 > 1:05:11creating an independent grievance procedure, and she is exactly right,

1:05:11 > 1:05:16that treating one another with respect throughout our politics is

1:05:16 > 1:05:19absolutely essential, and we will see what more can be done to ensure

1:05:19 > 1:05:26that is the case.I very much welcome your leadership on this very

1:05:26 > 1:05:29important issue and indeed the statements from honourable friend

1:05:29 > 1:05:35from both sides of the house. Is there Leader of the House away, to

1:05:35 > 1:05:39the best of her knowledge, of any allegations that would warrant

1:05:39 > 1:05:48police investigation?I'm not aware of any specific allegations that

1:05:48 > 1:05:57would warrant criminal investigation, no.With my teacher

1:05:57 > 1:06:02hat on, I'd like to endorse what has already been said about how young

1:06:02 > 1:06:05inexperienced staffers can often not know their rights, and to also

1:06:05 > 1:06:09endorsed the idea of some kind of induction, but this House should be

1:06:09 > 1:06:13reading from the front. There is something else we can also do, which

1:06:13 > 1:06:17is to ensure that sex and relationship education in schools is

1:06:17 > 1:06:23finally enacted so that we can't start to tackle this from the bottom

1:06:23 > 1:06:26up as well. Go absolutely sure the honourable lady's concern that we

1:06:26 > 1:06:31need to set a good example --I absolutely share the honourable

1:06:31 > 1:06:34lady's concern. That we need to set a good example and do more to

1:06:34 > 1:06:38protect children and young people. On the specific subject of sex and

1:06:38 > 1:06:42education, I agree with her up to a point. I think it is absolutely

1:06:42 > 1:06:45vital that the relationship education is put up their own

1:06:45 > 1:06:53alongside sex education and that the two are taught hand-in-hand.I'm

1:06:53 > 1:06:56beginning to realise your attempts to modernise this place, just how

1:06:56 > 1:07:03great they are, the scale of the challenge your face. Can I urge the

1:07:03 > 1:07:08Leader of the House to work with the Institute of personal development by

1:07:08 > 1:07:11way of personal example to Philly audit what procedures are in place

1:07:11 > 1:07:15and to ensure that best practice is introduced to help modernise and

1:07:15 > 1:07:22professionalise this place?I think the honourable gentleman's queue is

1:07:22 > 1:07:25probably shared by many across this House in that it is quite difficult

1:07:25 > 1:07:29to pin down exactly who is response of what -- honourable gentleman's

1:07:29 > 1:07:33view. That is why this very urgent review is absolutely necessary and

1:07:33 > 1:07:36we are determined to come out with a coherent grievance procedure that

1:07:36 > 1:07:50all members and staff, right across both houses, can actually refer to.

1:07:50 > 1:07:53The proposal is a positive step but we also need to consider what

1:07:53 > 1:07:59happens after that procedure has been completed. Quite possibly the

1:07:59 > 1:08:02complainant will still be employed by the person they have made the

1:08:02 > 1:08:04complaint against which could make relationships very difficult at best

1:08:04 > 1:08:07and at worst they will have completely broken down. I know that

1:08:07 > 1:08:10Leader of the House has said that in certain circumstances the whip may

1:08:10 > 1:08:14be removed, but actually that person who made the complaint may still be

1:08:14 > 1:08:17employed by that member. That put someone in an impossible situation

1:08:17 > 1:08:23and surely that cannot be right? Well, I certainly share the

1:08:23 > 1:08:26honourable gentleman's concern and he will be aware that very often

1:08:26 > 1:08:30members of staff to move around and go and work for another Member of

1:08:30 > 1:08:36Parliament, and clearly different outcomes for different situations,

1:08:36 > 1:08:39but what is very important is that victims feel that they are heard,

1:08:39 > 1:08:45understood, listened to, supported, and then that their concerns are

1:08:45 > 1:08:54acted upon.Thank you, Mr Speaker, for your statement today. Could I

1:08:54 > 1:08:58just cautioned the Leader of the House for focus on mediation?

1:08:58 > 1:09:04Mediation as she is there is an equality of power. Where there is a

1:09:04 > 1:09:07perpetrator and survivor of sexual abuse there is a clear inequality of

1:09:07 > 1:09:14power. Did she look at this again? Well, just to be clear, I'm not

1:09:14 > 1:09:17talking about mediation, I'm talking about an independent grievance

1:09:17 > 1:09:22procedure were independent people would be able to investigate a

1:09:22 > 1:09:25particular situation, quite apart from the members in this House. It

1:09:25 > 1:09:28would absolutely not be the case that you would find the victim

1:09:28 > 1:09:32having to be mediated with the person that they alleged perpetrator

1:09:32 > 1:09:40the crime against them.-- committed the crime against them. I welcome

1:09:40 > 1:09:42the Leader of the House's constructive proposals to tackle

1:09:42 > 1:09:48this very serious issue, but over the weekend I read some very

1:09:48 > 1:09:54worrying articles speaking about issues in political parties, saying

1:09:54 > 1:09:58that they held information about sexual misconduct by their own MPs

1:09:58 > 1:10:01but stayed quiet because of fear of sabotaging their own career and

1:10:01 > 1:10:05bringing the Government into disrepute. Is the Leader of the

1:10:05 > 1:10:07House aware of these reports, does she believe them to be true, and if

1:10:07 > 1:10:15so what is she going to do about it? I am absolutely not aware of any

1:10:15 > 1:10:21such wrongdoing as she suggests, and I am absolutely confident that

1:10:21 > 1:10:27anybody who had serious allegations would be directed by the whip's

1:10:27 > 1:10:31offers or by members of Parliament to go directly to the police. -- the

1:10:31 > 1:10:39whips office.In further to my honourable friend's question, can I

1:10:39 > 1:10:42a little further? Just yesterday a current Government minister appeared

1:10:42 > 1:10:46in the media and said he was clear that what went on in the whip's

1:10:46 > 1:10:50offers stayed in the whip's offers. Can she advise that House whether

1:10:50 > 1:10:58she still considers this approach is appropriate in light of these

1:10:58 > 1:11:03allegations -- whip's office. Can she also respond to the question of

1:11:03 > 1:11:08whether the Prime Minister receives our briefing every week from the

1:11:08 > 1:11:11Chief Whip regarding spurious behaviour in the House?I think the

1:11:11 > 1:11:13honourable lady should really consider the logic of what she is

1:11:13 > 1:11:16saying, if she really thinks the Prime Minister would be sitting

1:11:16 > 1:11:20there chatting with the Chief Whip in the way she suggests. That is

1:11:20 > 1:11:27quite clearly not true. I think it is absolutely vital that we all take

1:11:27 > 1:11:32this seriously, and with the proper consideration of the matter, which

1:11:32 > 1:11:38is the allegations against members of Parliament by their staff.

1:11:38 > 1:11:41Anybody who had prior knowledge of those things would encourage those

1:11:41 > 1:11:44individuals to go to the police, or would provide them with the support

1:11:44 > 1:11:51that they need. There is absolutely no covering up going on.

1:11:51 > 1:11:55The leader of the House has rightly recognised that these situations

1:11:55 > 1:12:02arise out of an imbalance of and abuse of power. May I endorse the

1:12:02 > 1:12:05question from my honourable friend the member for York about completely

1:12:05 > 1:12:10outlawing the use of mediation in such circumstances, it would be

1:12:10 > 1:12:14wholly inappropriate. Does she not recognise that this goes to the

1:12:14 > 1:12:18heart of the victims being believed in making their allegation and that

1:12:18 > 1:12:22it is absolutely important that message is sent out loud and clear

1:12:22 > 1:12:29as part of this exercise she's now undertaking?Well, I say again it's

1:12:29 > 1:12:34important that there are independent investigations of allegations, not

1:12:34 > 1:12:39mediation and that we use every effort to ensure that those who have

1:12:39 > 1:12:42allegations against another individual are properly listened to

1:12:42 > 1:12:47and supported and that those allegations are properly

1:12:47 > 1:12:53investigated.On the way to this debate I overheard two members

1:12:53 > 1:12:57joking about this issue asking in humour whether they had fessed up to

1:12:57 > 1:13:02their sexual harassment. As a man I stand up to call that out, it is not

1:13:02 > 1:13:06bants, it is unacceptable. I understand that in response to some

1:13:06 > 1:13:10journalist by members of this House presenting testimony from victims

1:13:10 > 1:13:13with evidence of sexual harassment those members have responded by

1:13:13 > 1:13:16instructing lawyers to gag the stories those journalists are

1:13:16 > 1:13:19pursuing. Can the leader of the House ensure that members that use

1:13:19 > 1:13:23this service, members of staff that use this service will get access to

1:13:23 > 1:13:29legal advice and what will she do to ensure victims' voices aren't

1:13:29 > 1:13:35silenced due to legal process?Well, I say again it's vital that we take

1:13:35 > 1:13:39a grip of this issue, that we look very quickly and I mean in a matter

1:13:39 > 1:13:44of days, cross-party at what can be done to establish a proper

1:13:44 > 1:13:47independent grievance procedure that all staff across both Houses have

1:13:47 > 1:13:53access to so that their concerns can be heard, properly investigated and

1:13:53 > 1:14:01properly acted upon.Thank you. I am grateful to all colleagues who

1:14:01 > 1:14:06participated in this important exchange. Order. Statement, the

1:14:06 > 1:14:19Minister of State for policing and the fire service. Minister of State.

1:14:23 > 1:14:28With your permission, Mr spook -- Speaker I would like to make a

1:14:28 > 1:14:33statement to the House on the publication of an independent review

1:14:33 > 1:14:39of deaths and serious incidents in police custody and this Government's

1:14:39 > 1:14:47substantive response to the report and its recommendations. In 2015 the

1:14:47 > 1:14:53right honourable Theresa May met with the relatives of those who had

1:14:53 > 1:14:58died trajly in police custody. The families' experience left her in no

1:14:58 > 1:15:03doubt that there was significant work to do. Not only to prevent

1:15:03 > 1:15:08deaths in police custody, but also where they do occur, to ensure that

1:15:08 > 1:15:13the families are treated with dignity and compassion. And have

1:15:13 > 1:15:17meaningful involvement and support in their very difficult journey to

1:15:17 > 1:15:21find answers about what happened to their loved ones. I know everyone in

1:15:21 > 1:15:26this House will want to join me in expressing our sympathy and sorrow

1:15:26 > 1:15:31for all those families who have lost loved ones who have died in police

1:15:31 > 1:15:38custody. It is essential that deaths and serious incidents in police

1:15:38 > 1:15:41custody are reduced as far as possible and when they do occur that

1:15:41 > 1:15:45they are investigated thoroughly, that agencies are held to account,

1:15:45 > 1:15:48that lessons are learned, and bereaved families are provided with

1:15:48 > 1:15:53the support that they need. I know that the House will want to join me

1:15:53 > 1:15:56in acknowledging the incredible efforts of our country's police

1:15:56 > 1:16:02officers and forces, the vast majority of which do their jobs

1:16:02 > 1:16:05well, to give substance to the principle of policing by consent.

1:16:05 > 1:16:09However, when things do go wrong policing by consent can only have

1:16:09 > 1:16:14meaning where swift action is taken to find the truth, to expose

1:16:14 > 1:16:18institutional failings and tackle any conduct issues where these are

1:16:18 > 1:16:23found. It is for these reasons that in 2015 the Government commissioned

1:16:23 > 1:16:29the independent review of deaths and serious incidents in police custody

1:16:29 > 1:16:33and appointed an independent chair. Earlier this year the review was

1:16:33 > 1:16:36concluded and today having carefully considered the review and the

1:16:36 > 1:16:40recommendations Government is publishing both her report and the

1:16:40 > 1:16:46Government's response. The report is considerable in scope and makes 110

1:16:46 > 1:16:51recommendations for improvement covering every aspect of the

1:16:51 > 1:16:54procedures and processes surrounding deaths and serious incidents in

1:16:54 > 1:16:59police custody. It is, I think, particularly valuable in affording a

1:16:59 > 1:17:05central role to the perspective of bereaved families. And demonstrating

1:17:05 > 1:17:11beyond doubt that their experiences offer a rich source of learning for

1:17:11 > 1:17:13the police, investigateory bodies, coroners and many others with a role

1:17:13 > 1:17:16to play when these tragic incidents occur. In terms of the Government

1:17:16 > 1:17:20response, I want to stress to the House that the issues identified in

1:17:20 > 1:17:25the report point to the need for reform in a number of areas where we

1:17:25 > 1:17:29have begun or set in motion work today. But the report also

1:17:29 > 1:17:32highlights complex issues for which there are no easy answers at this

1:17:32 > 1:17:38time. The Government response which I outline today is to be seen as the

1:17:38 > 1:17:42start of a journey, a journey which will see a focus programme of work

1:17:42 > 1:17:46to address the problems identified. As the House will understand, I do

1:17:46 > 1:17:51not intend to go into the detail of the Government's response in respect

1:17:51 > 1:17:55of all the report's 100-plus recommendations, instead I will

1:17:55 > 1:17:59highlight the key areas of concern in our approach. The first is in

1:17:59 > 1:18:07relation to inquests. These are intended to be inquistorial. To find

1:18:07 > 1:18:15out the facts of a death and should not be adverserial. Despite this the

1:18:15 > 1:18:17inquests involve legal representation for interested

1:18:17 > 1:18:19persons, particularly those collected to the police force and

1:18:19 > 1:18:24little or no help for bereaved families. The Government recognises

1:18:24 > 1:18:27in some circumstances legal advice representation may be necessary in

1:18:27 > 1:18:31the inquest process, that's why we have protected legal aid for advice

1:18:31 > 1:18:35in the lead up and during inquest hearings. However, it is also clear

1:18:35 > 1:18:39that the system needs simplifying so that legal representation is not

1:18:39 > 1:18:42necessary in all cases and the Government will investigate how we

1:18:42 > 1:18:47can meet this ambition and take this forward over the coming months. As

1:18:47 > 1:18:50an initial step towards addressing these concerns, and ensuring the

1:18:50 > 1:18:55bereaved can have confidence in the arrangements, the Lord Chancellor

1:18:55 > 1:19:00will review the existing guidance so that it is clear that the starting

1:19:00 > 1:19:04presumption is that legal aid should be awarded for representation of the

1:19:04 > 1:19:08bereaved at an inquest following the non-natural death or suicide of a

1:19:08 > 1:19:11person detained by police or in prison, subject to the overarching

1:19:11 > 1:19:16discretion of the dreg are to of legal aid case work. It will also be

1:19:16 > 1:19:20made clear in exercising the discretion to disregard the means

1:19:20 > 1:19:24test, consideration should be given to the distress and anxiety caused

1:19:24 > 1:19:29to families of the bereaved in having to fill out complex forms to

1:19:29 > 1:19:32establish financial means following the death of a loved one. This work

1:19:32 > 1:19:37will be completed by the end of the year. As a next step, the Lord

1:19:37 > 1:19:42Chancellor will also consider the issue of publicly funded legal

1:19:42 > 1:19:44advice and representation at inquests, particularly the

1:19:44 > 1:19:51application of the means test in these cases. This will form part of

1:19:51 > 1:19:55the upcoming post implementation review of the legal aid sentencing

1:19:55 > 1:20:01and punishment of offenders act 2012 due to be published next year. While

1:20:01 > 1:20:05there are cases where legal support is required, we believe that we can

1:20:05 > 1:20:09go further towards building a non-adverserial inquest system which

1:20:09 > 1:20:15is, I hope the House will agree, better for all involved. The Lord

1:20:15 > 1:20:21Chancellor will also consider to the same time-scale reducing the number

1:20:21 > 1:20:24of lawyers who attend inquests without compromising fairness and

1:20:24 > 1:20:28making inquests more sympathetic to the needs of the bereaved. This

1:20:28 > 1:20:31country's proud to have world leading police forces. The police

1:20:31 > 1:20:35put themselves in harm's way to protect the public with honesty and

1:20:35 > 1:20:41integrity, upholding the values set out in the policing code of ethics.

1:20:41 > 1:20:44Police integrity and accountability is central to public confidence in

1:20:44 > 1:20:49policing and a system which holds police officers to account helps to

1:20:49 > 1:20:53guarantee this. The Government must ensure the public have confidence in

1:20:53 > 1:20:57the police to serve our communities and keep us safe. When things go

1:20:57 > 1:21:01wrong, swift action is needed to expose and tackle any misconduct,

1:21:01 > 1:21:06action must be open, fair and robust. The Government will

1:21:06 > 1:21:10therefore implement legislation later this year to extend the

1:21:10 > 1:21:14disciplinary system to former officers so that where serious

1:21:14 > 1:21:17wrongdoing is alleged an investigation and subsequent

1:21:17 > 1:21:20disciplinary proceedings can continue until their conclusion,

1:21:20 > 1:21:24even where an officer has left the force. We will also make publicly

1:21:24 > 1:21:27available a statutory police barred list of officers, special constables

1:21:27 > 1:21:33and staff who have been dismissed from the force and are barred from

1:21:33 > 1:21:37policing. The independent police complaints commission has an

1:21:37 > 1:21:42important role to play in all of this, it has undergone a multi-year

1:21:42 > 1:21:46major change programme which has seen a five-fold increase in the

1:21:46 > 1:21:51number of independent investigations it opens each year, compared to

1:21:51 > 1:21:552013-14. On Friday 20th October we reached another major milestone in

1:21:55 > 1:21:58reform in the organisation with the announcement of the first director

1:21:58 > 1:22:02general of the new independent of police conduct. The new director

1:22:02 > 1:22:06general will start in January 2018 when the reforms to the IPCC's

1:22:06 > 1:22:13governance are implemented and it is officially renamed the IOPC. The

1:22:13 > 1:22:15Government is strengthening safeguards in the custody

1:22:15 > 1:22:20environment. It has been clear that police custody is no place for

1:22:20 > 1:22:25children. Provisions in the policing and crime act 2017 shortly to be

1:22:25 > 1:22:30brought into force will make it unlawful to use a police station as

1:22:30 > 1:22:37a place of safety for anyone under 18 years of age in any circumstance.

1:22:37 > 1:22:41And further restrict the use of police stations for a place of

1:22:41 > 1:22:45safety of people 18 and over. The work of the college of policing, the

1:22:45 > 1:22:47council to improve training and guidance for police officers and

1:22:47 > 1:22:52staff in this area is to be commended. Drawing also and learning

1:22:52 > 1:22:55from the IPC's independent investigations this has contributed

1:22:55 > 1:22:59to a significant reduction in the number of deaths in custody in

1:22:59 > 1:23:05recent years. In other areas however improvements require us to tackle

1:23:05 > 1:23:09entrenched and long-standing problems that cut across multiple

1:23:09 > 1:23:12agencies' responsibilities. The Government will not shy away from

1:23:12 > 1:23:16the long-term collaborative work that this requires. That is why we

1:23:16 > 1:23:19have commissioned the Minister of council on deaths in custody to play

1:23:19 > 1:23:25a leading role in considering the most complex of the recommendations,

1:23:25 > 1:23:29those relating to healthcare in police custody, inquests and support

1:23:29 > 1:23:35for families. The Ministerial Council is uniquely placed and has

1:23:35 > 1:23:38been reformed to ensure an increased focus on effectively tackling the

1:23:38 > 1:23:41issues that matter most. It brings together not only ministers from the

1:23:41 > 1:23:44Home Office, the department for health and the Ministry of Justice,

1:23:44 > 1:23:49but also leading practitioners from the fields of policing, health,

1:23:49 > 1:23:53justice and the third sector. In addition, the work is informed by

1:23:53 > 1:23:56the independent advisory panel which brings together eminent experts in

1:23:56 > 1:24:00the fields of law, human rights, medicine and mental health. This

1:24:00 > 1:24:04will introduce necessary oversight and external challenge to ensure

1:24:04 > 1:24:09that lessons are learned. In my role as co-chair of the board I am

1:24:09 > 1:24:11personally committed to help drive through the new work programme for

1:24:11 > 1:24:16the council and I will do so in a way that is transparent to the

1:24:16 > 1:24:19families. Every death in police custody is a tragedy and we must do

1:24:19 > 1:24:23all we can to prevent them. The independent review of deaths and

1:24:23 > 1:24:27serious incidents in police custody is a major step forward in our

1:24:27 > 1:24:31efforts to better understand this issue and to bring about meaningful

1:24:31 > 1:24:37and lasting change. I would like to thank Dame Eilis for her remarkable

1:24:37 > 1:24:43contribution to this as well as Deborah Camilla Parker Bowles

1:24:46 > 1:24:50To Deborah Coles for their County Councils. They have laid their

1:24:50 > 1:24:54experiences bear in order for us to learn from them and to spare other

1:24:54 > 1:24:57families the suffering they have endured and I can not commend them

1:24:57 > 1:25:00highly enough. In addition to publication I will

1:25:00 > 1:25:05place in the House library copies of the report of the independent review

1:25:05 > 1:25:09of deaths and serious incidents in public custody. The accompanying

1:25:09 > 1:25:19research document, the Government's response to to the report. I commend

1:25:19 > 1:25:25this statement to the House.There are many aspects of the Government

1:25:25 > 1:25:34statement to welcome. Does the Minister agree with me that this

1:25:34 > 1:25:38long-standing issue of deaths in police custody is of particular

1:25:38 > 1:25:45concern to our urban communities and has been for decades.

1:25:45 > 1:25:46It goes has been for decades.

1:25:46 > 1:25:46It goes back has been for decades.

1:25:46 > 1:25:46It goes back as has been for decades.

1:25:46 > 1:25:46It goes back as far has been for decades.

1:25:46 > 1:25:48It goes back as far as has been for decades.

1:25:48 > 1:25:48It goes back as far as the has been for decades.

1:25:48 > 1:25:48It goes back as far as the death has been for decades.

1:25:48 > 1:25:49It goes back as far as the death of has been for decades.

1:25:49 > 1:25:51It goes back as far as the death of Colin Roache in 1983 and this year,

1:25:51 > 1:25:57the very sad death of Rashan Charles who died after contact with the

1:25:57 > 1:26:02Metropolitan Police. I personally have had to comfort to many families

1:26:02 > 1:26:07who said goodbye to their son in the morning and he never came back. Can

1:26:07 > 1:26:13the Minister explain why we have had to wait two and half years for the

1:26:13 > 1:26:17publication of this report, which I understand was completed 15 months

1:26:17 > 1:26:23ago? Does the Minister agree with United friends and families that

1:26:23 > 1:26:27officers must be held to account, although in this context, I welcome

1:26:27 > 1:26:34what he said about dealing with former officers. That will give some

1:26:34 > 1:26:40comfort the families. Is the Minister able to explain why a

1:26:40 > 1:26:44disproportionate number of these deaths in custody happen to black

1:26:44 > 1:26:50men? The Minister has said that this is the start of a journey, but does

1:26:50 > 1:26:56he appreciate that this must be a journey with an end. Families want

1:26:56 > 1:27:04to see some prospect of the recommendations being implemented,

1:27:04 > 1:27:10or at least an explanation of why the recommendations are being

1:27:10 > 1:27:13implemented and an end point to this journey. Does the Minister agree

1:27:13 > 1:27:19with me that we pride ourselves in this country in policing by consent?

1:27:19 > 1:27:27But if policing by consent is to be real for every community, we must

1:27:27 > 1:27:35deal with this long running issue of deaths in custody. And can I assure

1:27:35 > 1:27:40the Minister that this is an issue I campaigned on long before I was a

1:27:40 > 1:27:44Member of Parliament and in my current role as Shadow Home

1:27:44 > 1:27:49Secretary, I will be pursuing him both on the overall burden of his

1:27:49 > 1:27:53statement, but also on all the detail.

1:27:53 > 1:27:59Can I thank the Shadow Home Secretary for her putting me on

1:27:59 > 1:28:03notice that she will hold my feet to the fire? I welcome that because she

1:28:03 > 1:28:07has worked with victims of these tragedies. I have met with the Home

1:28:07 > 1:28:11Secretary and the families and their account is overwhelming.

1:28:11 > 1:28:15Overwhelming in terms of what they have had to endure. Not just with

1:28:15 > 1:28:19the original loss, but the journey from that point, absolutely

1:28:19 > 1:28:24unacceptable. And the report is devastating because it is a story of

1:28:24 > 1:28:28system failure and human failure going back over many, many years.

1:28:28 > 1:28:33And this I think was recognised by the Prime Minister and she was raped

1:28:33 > 1:28:38the Commission this report. And it is our responsibility now after all

1:28:38 > 1:28:43these years of failure to tackle this -- and she was correct to

1:28:43 > 1:28:46Commission this report. And to do something great for families in the

1:28:46 > 1:28:51future. I am absolutely committed to that. We did take some time about

1:28:51 > 1:28:56publishing this because it is a comprehensive review, over 100

1:28:56 > 1:28:59recommendations that needed to be looked at seriously and worked

1:28:59 > 1:29:03through, it is a cross government response. I hope she will see it as

1:29:03 > 1:29:09substantive. In terms of accountability of police, yes, the

1:29:09 > 1:29:12families are very clear on this. The families have worked in that they

1:29:12 > 1:29:19have in Jordan nine years to get to know where in terms of a conclusion

1:29:19 > 1:29:23-- they have enjoyed. This is unacceptable. I beg to differ a

1:29:23 > 1:29:29little in terms of the point she made about whether black or BMA

1:29:29 > 1:29:35people are likely to die in custody, that is not the data I see which is

1:29:35 > 1:29:38the proportion of black people who die in police custody is lower than

1:29:38 > 1:29:44the proportion arrested and the IPCC have published results of a 10-year

1:29:44 > 1:29:48study, but I am more than happy to discuss that personally. The most

1:29:48 > 1:29:53important point is this report has got to be a catalyst for change and

1:29:53 > 1:30:00both sides of the House and we have to make sure we do that.May I

1:30:00 > 1:30:04applaud my honourable friend for his statement? Is clearly a man on top

1:30:04 > 1:30:08of his brief. As somebody who has had the privilege to serve in the

1:30:08 > 1:30:12past as a special constable and who has spent 25 days with the

1:30:12 > 1:30:16Northamptonshire police under the police Parliamentary scheme, can I

1:30:16 > 1:30:20say that we should applaud the work of the vast majority of custody

1:30:20 > 1:30:25sergeants up and down our land who take their work incredibly seriously

1:30:25 > 1:30:31and serve thousands of prisoners well each and every year.

1:30:31 > 1:30:34My honourable friend makes an extremely important point, drawing

1:30:34 > 1:30:40from his own experience.I said in my statement, obviously, in everyday

1:30:40 > 1:30:47and in every force, the majority of the work the police do is absolutely

1:30:47 > 1:30:51fantastic and conducted at the highest levels of integrity. But

1:30:51 > 1:30:57when things go wrong, and they do go wrong, we have got to get to the

1:30:57 > 1:31:01truth, there has to be accountability. What this report

1:31:01 > 1:31:07demonstrates is that in the past, that journey has been too difficult.

1:31:07 > 1:31:10There has been too much defensiveness, not strong enough

1:31:10 > 1:31:13feeling that the system is on the side of the families, that is what

1:31:13 > 1:31:22we have to change. Can I thank the Minister and him

1:31:22 > 1:31:27also bank Dame Elish and her colleagues for them valuable work?

1:31:27 > 1:31:30She speaks of the dignity and tenacity of the families of those

1:31:30 > 1:31:34who have died in police custody and I pay tribute to them and those who

1:31:34 > 1:31:37have supported them. Can I ask initial questions of the Minister?

1:31:37 > 1:31:45The report suggests we are required to overcome inconsistencies with

1:31:45 > 1:31:47funding in different local authorities and it will be useful to

1:31:47 > 1:31:51know what the's thinking gives? The vital importance of what happens in

1:31:51 > 1:31:55the immediate aftermath of a death in custody is emphasised in the

1:31:55 > 1:32:01report, will the IPCC be funded to ensure an officer can attend quickly

1:32:01 > 1:32:07and coordinated response? And the report remains as we must also

1:32:07 > 1:32:11remember that in 2015, there were 60 deaths of individuals in two days

1:32:11 > 1:32:15before leaving police custody -- 16 deaths. What steps have we taken to

1:32:15 > 1:32:23ensure those risks are assessed and reduced?He makes three important

1:32:23 > 1:32:30points. The Government is least persuaded at this moment in time of

1:32:30 > 1:32:35that recommendation. We will explore this, but the first instinct is to

1:32:35 > 1:32:40explore the role of the chief coroner in meeting some of the

1:32:40 > 1:32:45recommendations and the requests from the report. He talks about what

1:32:45 > 1:32:53happens after an incident and the role of the IPCC and is clearly

1:32:53 > 1:32:58critical of that and if he read the report from the families that came

1:32:58 > 1:33:02with the review, he will see some really quite shocking stories of the

1:33:02 > 1:33:09way in which brief families are treated at that deeply traumatic

1:33:09 > 1:33:13moment -- bereaved families. That has to change and I will discuss

1:33:13 > 1:33:20that with the new director-general of the IPCC.

1:33:20 > 1:33:23Can I welcome this report? And the Government's response. In West

1:33:23 > 1:33:28Yorkshire, we had a tragic case of a man who died as a result of being

1:33:28 > 1:33:34held in police custody when he should in fact have been sent to

1:33:34 > 1:33:41hospital.And his family campaigned for many years to have the truth

1:33:41 > 1:33:45uncovered about the lack of monitoring of him in a police cell,

1:33:45 > 1:33:50but also who ensured real difficulties with the failure of the

1:33:50 > 1:33:53IPCC to investigate in a timely way and ensure that lessons were learned

1:33:53 > 1:34:00as a result of that case. I welcome his response, however, one of the

1:34:00 > 1:34:03recommendations is that the NHS commissioning of health care in

1:34:03 > 1:34:08police custody which they say should have commenced in April 20 16th but

1:34:08 > 1:34:13was halted by the Government earlier in the year, and this report

1:34:13 > 1:34:16recommends this policy is reinstated and implemented. Could he set out

1:34:16 > 1:34:23what the government is doing in response to that recommendation as

1:34:23 > 1:34:25clearly appropriate health care on an emergency basis is immensely

1:34:25 > 1:34:29important in these cases? I could not agree with the

1:34:29 > 1:34:35honourable lady more. Underlying a number of tragedies is that the

1:34:35 > 1:34:38victim is of these incidents were in the wrong place. They should not

1:34:38 > 1:34:44have been there. They should not have been in police custody, we are

1:34:44 > 1:34:47trying to change that through the law of regulation to make it clear

1:34:47 > 1:34:50that police cells can only be considered a safe place in the most

1:34:50 > 1:34:56exceptional circumstances and never for children. In relation to health

1:34:56 > 1:35:00care in custody, there is different practice across the country and the

1:35:00 > 1:35:04short answer, this is one of the areas of complexity that we are

1:35:04 > 1:35:08taking to the ministerial Council, which I co-chair the first meeting

1:35:08 > 1:35:15of on Wednesday. The Minister is absolutely right

1:35:15 > 1:35:18that the provision of adequate health care is fundamental, but that

1:35:18 > 1:35:22must include mental health care. We know far too many people end up in

1:35:22 > 1:35:26police cells and they ought to be in the mental health care somewhere

1:35:26 > 1:35:32else. What practically can be done about this? This has got to go

1:35:32 > 1:35:40beyond the police. The second issue is that the delays in the IPCC and

1:35:40 > 1:35:44their system are an acceptable both to the family and police officers,

1:35:44 > 1:35:47we have got to show up on time, resources going to be made available

1:35:47 > 1:35:53to make sure that does happen? Again, the honourable gentleman uses

1:35:53 > 1:35:56his experience to make a very important point and I am sure he is

1:35:56 > 1:36:02where additional funding has been made, £30 million, to secure

1:36:02 > 1:36:08alternative places of safety. And I welcome that. His broader point of

1:36:08 > 1:36:12mental health he knows that at long last, as a result of campaigning

1:36:12 > 1:36:16across all sides of the House, there is more investment going into mental

1:36:16 > 1:36:20health. What he would also know from talking to his local police force,

1:36:20 > 1:36:23more and more time of the local police force is being spent

1:36:23 > 1:36:28safeguarding looking after people with various mental health issues

1:36:28 > 1:36:33and that should not be their job. And so the discussion for us at a

1:36:33 > 1:36:37local and national level is about responsibility, investment and

1:36:37 > 1:36:41resources to make sure that those who are suffering on the spectrum of

1:36:41 > 1:36:46mental health and anxieties and disorders are being treated in the

1:36:46 > 1:36:53right way, in the right place. Can I thank the Minister for his

1:36:53 > 1:36:56statement? In particular, his personal commitment to following

1:36:56 > 1:37:01this through the support for bereaved families. Can I take up the

1:37:01 > 1:37:04point about finding the right places to detain people. We have heard

1:37:04 > 1:37:08about it with respect to people with mental health problems, I want to

1:37:08 > 1:37:12press him on the point of those who are intoxicated. Dame Elish makes a

1:37:12 > 1:37:18very strong recommendation, the gunmen should consider drying out

1:37:18 > 1:37:21centres which international evidence suggests could be safer and cheaper

1:37:21 > 1:37:24than police custody. What is the Government's response to this

1:37:24 > 1:37:28specific recommendation and could this idea reduce pressure on the

1:37:28 > 1:37:31police and Accident and Emergency and provide a much safer environment

1:37:31 > 1:37:38for these people?I thank the honourable gentleman. I am

1:37:38 > 1:37:41personally very committed to this, it is impossible having sat and

1:37:41 > 1:37:46listened to the families talking about their ordeal to leave that

1:37:46 > 1:37:52room with any sense of neutrality or indifference. This is a moment where

1:37:52 > 1:37:57we have to drive change. His point about drying out centres and

1:37:57 > 1:38:03alternative places of safety and support, the government has to be

1:38:03 > 1:38:07open-minded. If there are good examples from elsewhere where that

1:38:07 > 1:38:11works and the evidence supports it, we have to consider it and not will

1:38:11 > 1:38:14be something we take to the ministerial Council which has been

1:38:14 > 1:38:16charged with the follow-up to this review.

1:38:20 > 1:38:27Could I associate myself with the positive remarks about my

1:38:27 > 1:38:30constituent, Debra? Could I asked the Minister at what his expectation

1:38:30 > 1:38:35is around bringing the perpetrators of islands in police custody to

1:38:35 > 1:38:41genuine justice, not just retirement, and what appears to be

1:38:41 > 1:38:48average person who sees it as a nod and a wink.Can I add my

1:38:48 > 1:38:54congratulations to her constituent, meeting again later this week, a

1:38:54 > 1:38:57great job over many years. She raises an important point. The

1:38:57 > 1:39:04critical thing is that the investigations are and seem to be

1:39:04 > 1:39:09genuinely independent of the police and she will know from the counts

1:39:09 > 1:39:13and the listening families. That is not the perception. It is changing

1:39:13 > 1:39:19and moving in the right direction. The new director-general of the IPCC

1:39:19 > 1:39:23has the powers and the freedom to move this on further. But this is

1:39:23 > 1:39:28critical to building trust in the system, which for reasons I

1:39:28 > 1:39:33completely understand is lacking at the moment.

1:39:33 > 1:39:38I note about what she says about Debra Cole being her constituent,

1:39:38 > 1:39:42clearly, she can only be a constituent of one member, but I

1:39:42 > 1:39:46didn't know her at university that years ago, as the honourable

1:39:46 > 1:39:51gentleman for Dudley North did. She was a formidable campaigner. Justice

1:39:51 > 1:39:57then and is clearly a formidable campaigner for social justice now.

1:39:57 > 1:40:00Can I thank the Minister for the statement he has made this

1:40:00 > 1:40:04afternoon. The Police Service of Northern Ireland have an average of

1:40:04 > 1:40:09one death in custody every two years and I have no doubt they will learn

1:40:09 > 1:40:11lessons from the Association of Chief Police Officers. Even we have

1:40:11 > 1:40:15is three separate legal jurisdictions within this kingdom,

1:40:15 > 1:40:19what thought has he given to the devolution issues and particularly

1:40:19 > 1:40:23when we are looking to give assistance through legal aid for

1:40:23 > 1:40:27inquests and families who need our assistance most?

1:40:27 > 1:40:30He raises an important point and that is something that I will be

1:40:30 > 1:40:36taking through the ministerial Council.I note the statistics of

1:40:36 > 1:40:39Northern Ireland, the figures for the UK and Wales are significantly

1:40:39 > 1:40:46worse than that, so it is an example of good practice we can learn from,

1:40:46 > 1:40:50and I am open to that. But the issue of devolution is one we will take

1:40:50 > 1:40:54through the ministerial Council.

1:40:55 > 1:40:58One of the points about supporting bereaved families was the starting

1:40:58 > 1:41:01presumption that legal aid should be awarded for representation at

1:41:01 > 1:41:05inquest. I just wondered if the Minister might be able to give an

1:41:05 > 1:41:11indication of what facts would actually rebut that presumption that

1:41:11 > 1:41:19legal aid would be granted?Well, as I said, the director will have some

1:41:19 > 1:41:24discretion in this but the key thing is to shift the default setting so

1:41:24 > 1:41:26at the moment legal aid is available only under exceptional

1:41:26 > 1:41:34circumstances. This is a shift of presumption that bereaved families

1:41:34 > 1:41:38in these situations going in will have access to legal aid. That is a

1:41:38 > 1:41:42shift in the assumption and in terms of the details of how it will work

1:41:42 > 1:41:45and guidance that underpins that, my colleague the Secretary of State for

1:41:45 > 1:41:49Justice is working that through now and guidance will be personed before

1:41:49 > 1:41:54the end of the year. -- published. Every death in custody is a tragedy

1:41:54 > 1:41:57and I hope that the journey that the Minister refers to is a quick one.

1:41:57 > 1:42:01Can I ask him, he hasn't been specific in this regard, there are

1:42:01 > 1:42:04110 recommendations in the report, can he confirm that the Government

1:42:04 > 1:42:07will be responding to each and every one of those recommendations and

1:42:07 > 1:42:13when will the response to them be forthcoming?I am sorry, I did make

1:42:13 > 1:42:18this clear in my statement, we published our response today which I

1:42:18 > 1:42:26am placing in the library and she will see from that that it is a

1:42:26 > 1:42:31substantial response to all of the sort of themmatic considerations

1:42:31 > 1:42:37brought forward. I hope when she reads it she will see it is a

1:42:37 > 1:42:41substantive response.In Croydon we had the tragic death of Shani Lewis

1:42:41 > 1:42:46in a mental health hospital which is one of the cases that led to this

1:42:46 > 1:42:51very important review being set up. Following the lessons from that

1:42:51 > 1:42:57case, does the Minister agree that non-natural deaths in a mental

1:42:57 > 1:43:00health setting should also trigger an independent investigation with

1:43:00 > 1:43:03the emphasis on independent, as already happens in police custody

1:43:03 > 1:43:07and in prisons when a death occurs? Will the Lord chance already's

1:43:07 > 1:43:13review into legal aid for bereaved families to which he has referred

1:43:13 > 1:43:22also cover deaths of people in mental health custody?I have met

1:43:22 > 1:43:28the Lewis family, it's impossible not to be very moved by what they've

1:43:28 > 1:43:34had to endure. The announcement today about a change in assumption

1:43:34 > 1:43:41on access to legal aid refers to deaths in custody police and prison,

1:43:41 > 1:43:46there is also a wider review being coppeded by the Secretary of State

1:43:46 > 1:43:50for Justice to access to legal aid in other situations. -- being

1:43:50 > 1:43:55conducted.Order. The statement the Secretary of State for Foreign and

1:43:55 > 1:44:00Commonwealth affairs. Secretary Boris Johnson.Thank you

1:44:00 > 1:44:08very much. With your permission, I propose to make a statement on the

1:44:08 > 1:44:14Balfour declaration issued by my predecessor as Foreign Secretary on

1:44:14 > 1:44:182nd November 190 and its legacy today. -- 1970. As the British Army

1:44:18 > 1:44:24advanced towards Jerusalem in the last 12 months of the First World

1:44:24 > 1:44:32War, with the aim of breaking the ottaAnne empire's grip on the Middle

1:44:32 > 1:44:40East. The House will recall the material sentence of the Balfour

1:44:40 > 1:44:44declaration. The Government view with favour the establishment in

1:44:44 > 1:44:49Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people and will use their

1:44:49 > 1:44:54best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object. It being

1:44:54 > 1:44:58clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice

1:44:58 > 1:45:03the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in

1:45:03 > 1:45:08Palestine or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in

1:45:08 > 1:45:13any other country. A century after those words were written, I believe

1:45:13 > 1:45:17that the Balfour declaration paved the way for the birth of a great

1:45:17 > 1:45:24nation. The state of Israel has prevailed overer obstacle from the

1:45:24 > 1:45:28harshness of nature to the hostility of its enemies to become a free

1:45:28 > 1:45:34society with a thriving and innovative economy and the same

1:45:34 > 1:45:40essential values that we in Britain hold dear. Liberty, democracy, and

1:45:40 > 1:45:45the rule of law have found a home in Israel, more so than anywhere else

1:45:45 > 1:45:51in the Middle East. Most of all, there is the incontestable moral

1:45:51 > 1:45:57purpose of Israel, to provide a persecuted people with a safe and

1:45:57 > 1:46:07secure homeland. And we should not brush aside how the extent of

1:46:07 > 1:46:13anti-Semitism, decades before the Holocaust, created the necessity for

1:46:13 > 1:46:20the Balfour declaration. 1881, the most powerful advisor of the court

1:46:20 > 1:46:26of the Tsar Alexander II voted that - sorry vowed, that one third of

1:46:26 > 1:46:30Russian Jews will be forced to convert, one third to emigrate and

1:46:30 > 1:46:35the remaineder left to starve. The moral case for establishing a

1:46:35 > 1:46:40national home for the Jewish people was to provide a haven from such

1:46:40 > 1:46:46horrors. So Her Majesty's Government is proud of Britain's part in

1:46:46 > 1:46:51creating Israel and we shall mark the centenary of the Balfour

1:46:51 > 1:46:55declaration on Thursday in that spirit. And I see no contradiction

1:46:55 > 1:47:02in being a friend of Israel and a believer in that country's destiny,

1:47:02 > 1:47:09while also being profoundly moved by the suffering of those who are

1:47:09 > 1:47:15affected and dislodged by its birth. That vital caveat in the Balfour

1:47:15 > 1:47:18declaration intended to safeguard the rights of other communities by

1:47:18 > 1:47:23which of course we mean the Palestinians, has not been fully

1:47:23 > 1:47:29realised. In the words of Amoz Oz, the Israeli novelist, the tragedy of

1:47:29 > 1:47:34this conflict is not that it is a clash between right and wrong, but

1:47:34 > 1:47:37rather a clash between right and right.

1:47:37 > 1:47:43The Government believes that the only way of bringing peace is

1:47:43 > 1:47:46through a two-state solution. Defined as a secure Israel, the

1:47:46 > 1:47:52homeland of the Jewish people, standing alongside a viable of so

1:47:52 > 1:47:58Palestinian state. The homeland for the Palestinian people as envisaged

1:47:58 > 1:48:06by the UN resolution 181. For Israel, the birth of a Palestinian

1:48:06 > 1:48:11state would safeguard its future as a Jewish democracy. And for

1:48:11 > 1:48:18Palestinians, a state of their own would allow them to realise their

1:48:18 > 1:48:22aspirations for self-determination and self-Government. When the

1:48:22 > 1:48:28parties held their first peace conference in Madrid in 1991 the

1:48:28 > 1:48:33leader of the Palestinian delegation described those aspirations as

1:48:33 > 1:48:42follows. We seek neither an admission of guilt after the fact,

1:48:42 > 1:48:46nor vengeance for past inI canities, but rather an act of will that would

1:48:46 > 1:48:55make a just peace a reality. I believe that a just peace will be a

1:48:55 > 1:48:59reality when two states for two peoples co-exist in the Holy Land

1:48:59 > 1:49:05and that is the goal we must strive to bring about. The House knows the

1:49:05 > 1:49:11troubled history of the peace process so far. The truth is that no

1:49:11 > 1:49:16direct talks have taken place between the parties since 2014. But

1:49:16 > 1:49:21the US administration has shown its commitment to breaking the deadlock

1:49:21 > 1:49:26and a new American envoy has made repeated visits to the region. The

1:49:26 > 1:49:31Government will, of course, support these efforts in whatever way we

1:49:31 > 1:49:36can. And we urge the parties to refrain from acting in ways that

1:49:36 > 1:49:43make the goal of two states ever harder to achieve. For Israelis,

1:49:43 > 1:49:46that means halting settlement activity in the occupied

1:49:46 > 1:49:49territories, and the pace of construction has regrettably

1:49:49 > 1:49:53accelerated, notably with the approval of the first housing units

1:49:53 > 1:50:00in Hebron for 15 years and the first completely new settlement in the

1:50:00 > 1:50:06West Bank since 1999. For Palestinians, it means restoring

1:50:06 > 1:50:12full counterterrorism co-operation with Israel. In line with resolution

1:50:12 > 1:50:172334 and implementing the recommendations of the report on

1:50:17 > 1:50:22curbing incitement. Britain is one of the largest donors to the

1:50:22 > 1:50:25Palestinian Authority with the primary aim of strengthening the

1:50:25 > 1:50:29institutions that would form the basis of any future Palestinian

1:50:29 > 1:50:35state. And it may be helpful for the House if I set out the Government's

1:50:35 > 1:50:38view of a fair compromise between the parties. The borders between the

1:50:38 > 1:50:43two states should be based on the lines as they stood on June 4th

1:50:43 > 1:50:491967. The Eve of the six-day war, with equal land swaps to reflect

1:50:49 > 1:50:53national security and religious interests of the Jewish and

1:50:53 > 1:51:00Palestinian people. There must be security arrangements that for

1:51:00 > 1:51:06Israelis prevent the resurgence of terrorism and for Palestinians, that

1:51:06 > 1:51:11respect their sovereignty, ensure freedom of movement and demonstrate

1:51:11 > 1:51:20that occupation is over. There needs to be a just, fair, agreed and

1:51:20 > 1:51:24realistic solution to the Palestinian refugee question in line

1:51:24 > 1:51:31with UN resolution 15-15. In practice, this means that any such

1:51:31 > 1:51:36agreement must be demographically compatible with two states for two

1:51:36 > 1:51:38peoples, and a generous package of international compensation should be

1:51:38 > 1:51:46made available. The final determination of Jerusalem

1:51:46 > 1:51:51must be agreed by the parties, ensuring that the Holy city is a

1:51:51 > 1:51:55shared capital of Israel and a Palestinian state, granting access

1:51:55 > 1:52:02and religious rights for all who hold it dear. This vision of a just

1:52:02 > 1:52:10settlement finds its roots in another British drafted document. UN

1:52:10 > 1:52:14resolution 242, adopted 50 years ago this November, which enshrines the

1:52:14 > 1:52:21principle of land for peace based on the 1967 lines. It is that essential

1:52:21 > 1:52:25principle which has inspired every serious effort to resolve this

1:52:25 > 1:52:31conflict from the Camp David peace treaty signed by Israel and Egypt

1:52:31 > 1:52:36almost 40 years ago. To the Arab peace initiative first placed on the

1:52:36 > 1:52:40table in 2002 which offers normal relations with Israel in return for

1:52:40 > 1:52:51an end to occupation. I believe that the goal of two

1:52:51 > 1:52:58states is still achievable and with ingenuity and goodwill the pap can

1:52:58 > 1:53:03be configured in way that is meets the aspirations of both parties. A

1:53:03 > 1:53:07century after the Balfour declaration helped to create the

1:53:07 > 1:53:15state of Israel, an achievement that no one in this House would wish to

1:53:15 > 1:53:20undo, there is unfinished business and work to be done.

1:53:20 > 1:53:27And we in this country, mindful of our historic role, and co-operating

1:53:27 > 1:53:32closely with our allies, will not shirk from that challenge. I commend

1:53:32 > 1:53:38this statement to the House.Thank you.I thank the Foreign Secretary

1:53:38 > 1:53:43for advance sight of his statement. As we approach the centenary of the

1:53:43 > 1:53:48Balfour declaration, we on this side of the House are glad to join him in

1:53:48 > 1:53:50commemorating the historic anniversary and expressing once

1:53:50 > 1:53:57again our continued support for the state of Israel. In 1918, Labour's

1:53:57 > 1:54:00first Cabinet Minister Arthur Henderson said, the British Labour

1:54:00 > 1:54:05Party believes that the responsibility of the British people

1:54:05 > 1:54:14in Palestine should be fulfilled to - to the utmost of their power. Not

1:54:14 > 1:54:19least in - the Labour Party has adopted that position, not least in

1:54:19 > 1:54:24recognisation of the egalitarian goals that inspired the early

1:54:24 > 1:54:28pioneers of the Israeli state, we think of the group of people

1:54:28 > 1:54:32dedicated to establishing a more egalitarian society free from

1:54:32 > 1:54:35prejudice and persecution they've experienced in their home countries.

1:54:35 > 1:54:39Even today despite the challenges that I will address in respect to

1:54:39 > 1:54:41its relationship with the Palestinian people, modern Israel

1:54:41 > 1:54:46still stands out for its commitment to egalitarianism, in particular to

1:54:46 > 1:54:50its commitment to equal rights for women and LGBT communities, in a

1:54:50 > 1:54:54region where these groups are far too often subject to fierce

1:54:54 > 1:54:58discrimination. Today, it is right to think about the successes of

1:54:58 > 1:55:05Israel, but we must also be aware that the promise in the Balfour

1:55:05 > 1:55:07declaration cited by the Foreign Secretary today that nothing shall

1:55:07 > 1:55:11be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of

1:55:11 > 1:55:14existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, 100 years on, that

1:55:14 > 1:55:19promise remains unfulfilled and we have more to do. So I would urge the

1:55:19 > 1:55:22Foreign Secretary today to take the opportunity of this centenary to

1:55:22 > 1:55:27reflect once again on Britain's role in the region as his predecessor did

1:55:27 > 1:55:31100 years ago and ask, whether there is more that we could be doing to

1:55:31 > 1:55:34bring about lasting peace and stability in the Middle East? Can we

1:55:34 > 1:55:38do more to ensure that the political rights as well as civil and

1:55:38 > 1:55:43religious rights of Palestinian people are protected? Just as Lord

1:55:43 > 1:55:50Balfour intended?

1:55:50 > 1:55:55There is no better way of marking the centenary them for the UK to

1:55:55 > 1:55:59officially recognise the state of Palestine. The Foreign Secretary

1:55:59 > 1:56:02talked in explicit terms of the benefits of Israel and Palestine

1:56:02 > 1:56:07that the birth of the Palestinian statehood would bring, but surely we

1:56:07 > 1:56:13can play more of a part in doing that by formally recognising the

1:56:13 > 1:56:15Palestinian state. The right honourable gentleman I am sure knows

1:56:15 > 1:56:20that in 2011, one of his other good assessors, William Hague said that

1:56:20 > 1:56:24we reserve the right to recognise Palin instilling in state at England

1:56:24 > 1:56:29of our choosing and when it can best help to bring about peace -- the

1:56:29 > 1:56:33Palestinian state. Six years has passed in which the humanitarian

1:56:33 > 1:56:36situation in the occupied territories has become ever more

1:56:36 > 1:56:40desperate and the cycle of violence has continued unabated and the

1:56:40 > 1:56:44people of Israel remain at daily risk of random acts of terrorism,

1:56:44 > 1:56:48and the pace of settlement building and displacement of Palestinian

1:56:48 > 1:56:52people has increased, six years in which moves towards a lasting peace

1:56:52 > 1:56:56have frankly grown to a halt. Will the Foreign Secretary tell the House

1:56:56 > 1:57:00today if the Government still plans to recognise state of Palestine and

1:57:00 > 1:57:07if not now, when? And conversely, if they have no longer such plans, can

1:57:07 > 1:57:12they, can the Foreign Secretary tell us why it is that the plans have

1:57:12 > 1:57:18changed? You will remember that on October 13, 2014, this has stated

1:57:18 > 1:57:27that the Palestinian state should be recognised. The Balfour anniversary

1:57:27 > 1:57:32reminds us that those words matter and they can make a difference. And

1:57:32 > 1:57:35with this empty vassal which is the American President making a lot of

1:57:35 > 1:57:40noise, but being utterly directionless, the need for Britain

1:57:40 > 1:57:44to show leadership on this issue is ever more pressing, so will the

1:57:44 > 1:57:48Foreign Secretary make a start today on the issue of Palestinian

1:57:48 > 1:57:52statehood? As we write to reflect on the last 100 years, we have a

1:57:52 > 1:57:58schedule look towards the future and to the next generation of people

1:57:58 > 1:58:02growing up in Israel and Palestine, a generation that knows nothing but

1:58:02 > 1:58:06division and violence and has been badly let down by actions of their

1:58:06 > 1:58:09own leaders. Will Young Israelis grow up in a world where are its

1:58:09 > 1:58:16macabre runnings and random stabbings become commonplace? And

1:58:16 > 1:58:19where military service remains not just a compulsion but a necessity.

1:58:19 > 1:58:22Because they live in a country surrounded by hostile neighbours who

1:58:22 > 1:58:26deny their very right to exist. And Will Young Palestinians grow up in a

1:58:26 > 1:58:31world where youth unemployment remains at 58%, reliant on

1:58:31 > 1:58:35humanitarian aid and unable to shake their own futures, will they inherit

1:58:35 > 1:58:38a map where the expanding settlements and the destruction of

1:58:38 > 1:58:41the houses makes it harder and harder to get harder to envisage

1:58:41 > 1:58:46what an independent Palestine could look like? I don't know whether the

1:58:46 > 1:58:49Foreign Secretary agree is with the Prime Minister on whether it is

1:58:49 > 1:58:54worth considering hypothetical questions, but as we mark the

1:58:54 > 1:58:59centenary of that vital step by a former British brand Secretary in

1:58:59 > 1:59:02recognition of Israeli statehood, I would ask this Foreign Secretary,

1:59:02 > 1:59:06how does he believe he will be remembered in 100 years? Will his

1:59:06 > 1:59:09government be remembered for recognising the statehood of the

1:59:09 > 1:59:13Palestinian people and taking a vital step towards correcting

1:59:13 > 1:59:17historic wrongs because I can assure him, that if they are not prepared

1:59:17 > 1:59:22to take that step, the next Labour government will do.

1:59:22 > 1:59:29I am grateful to the honourable lady for the spirit in which she has

1:59:29 > 1:59:34addressed the questions. I think that she asks if I may say so, the

1:59:34 > 1:59:38right questions about the way ahead. The UK is obviously committed

1:59:38 > 1:59:44substantially to the support of the Palestinian Authority and the

1:59:44 > 1:59:49building at institutions and Palestine. British taxpayers paid

1:59:49 > 1:59:58for about 25,000 kids and our money helps them to go to school. We help

1:59:58 > 2:00:06with about 185,000 medical cases every year. A substantial amount is

2:00:06 > 2:00:13given to the support of the Palestine authority. With a view to

2:00:13 > 2:00:18strengthening those institutions. When it comes to recognising that

2:00:18 > 2:00:23state, we judge, in common with our French friends and the majority of

2:00:23 > 2:00:26our European friends and partners, we judge the moment is not yet tried

2:00:26 > 2:00:33to play that card. Because it will not on its own end the occupation.

2:00:33 > 2:00:38It will not on its own bring peace. It is not after all something you

2:00:38 > 2:00:44can do more than once. That card having been played, that will be at.

2:00:44 > 2:00:49That will be at. We judge that it is better to give every possible

2:00:49 > 2:00:54encouragement to both sides, to seize the moment and if I'm may say

2:00:54 > 2:01:03so, I think she is quite hard on the current Administration in Washington

2:01:03 > 2:01:10which is perhaps her job, but I do think... I am hard where it is

2:01:10 > 2:01:20necessary. There is a job to be done. At the moment, I think she

2:01:20 > 2:01:28would accept that there is a conjuncture in the stars that is

2:01:28 > 2:01:30uncommonly propitious. I will not put it higher than that. There is a

2:01:30 > 2:01:36chance that we could make progress on this very vexed dossier, we need

2:01:36 > 2:01:44the Americans to work with us to do that. We need them to be in the lead

2:01:44 > 2:01:48because they understand the facts as they are in the Middle East. And we

2:01:48 > 2:01:54need the Palestinian Authority, with a clear mandate, to sit down and

2:01:54 > 2:02:02negotiate with the Israelis and do that deal that is there to be done,

2:02:02 > 2:02:06that everybody understands. We all know the shape of the future map. We

2:02:06 > 2:02:10all know how it could be done. What is needed now is political will and

2:02:10 > 2:02:17I can assure honourable lady and the House that the UK will be absolutely

2:02:17 > 2:02:24determined to encourage both sides to do that deal.It is right to mark

2:02:24 > 2:02:28the centenary of the Balfour Declaration but we often concentrate

2:02:28 > 2:02:31too much on the first part of the declaration at the expense of the

2:02:31 > 2:02:35second. Does anyone really believe the statement, the very clear

2:02:35 > 2:02:38statement, that nothing should be done which may prejudice the civil

2:02:38 > 2:02:43and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine

2:02:43 > 2:02:48has been at he did to you? Does he not agree that a positive way to

2:02:48 > 2:02:53mark the centenary, this important centenary, would be for the UK to

2:02:53 > 2:02:59finally recognise a Palestinian state, something many of us in this

2:02:59 > 2:03:01House believes would honour the division of those who helped bring

2:03:01 > 2:03:08about the state of Israel in the first place.I agree very much with

2:03:08 > 2:03:15my right honourable friend that, as it were, the Balfour Declaration has

2:03:15 > 2:03:21been fulfilled but the publicist has not been fulfilled. It should have

2:03:21 > 2:03:24spoken of the political rights of those people and it should by the

2:03:24 > 2:03:30way have identified specifically the Palestinian people. That has not yet

2:03:30 > 2:03:37happened. And it is certainly our intention to make sure that Balfour

2:03:37 > 2:03:41does not remain unfinished business. As I have said, we want to recognise

2:03:41 > 2:03:48a Palestinian state as part of a two-state solution, but we judge at

2:03:48 > 2:03:53the moment to do that is not yet right.

2:03:53 > 2:04:01Thank you. Well the historical context is complex, we have the need

2:04:01 > 2:04:04-- we have to learn important lessons from the Balfour

2:04:04 > 2:04:07Declaration, there is plenty of room for lessons to be learnt and

2:04:07 > 2:04:11historic and moral responsibilities to be seen for the betterment of the

2:04:11 > 2:04:15people in the Middle East today. This must start the recognition of

2:04:15 > 2:04:18the state of Palestine is a fundamental stepping stone towards a

2:04:18 > 2:04:23lasting two-state solution and I welcome the Foreign Secretary and

2:04:23 > 2:04:27his words on that solution. We deeply regret the UK Government has

2:04:27 > 2:04:30not fulfilled its Commission in the declaration and we have heard it

2:04:30 > 2:04:34already today, nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and

2:04:34 > 2:04:38religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine.

2:04:38 > 2:04:42The consequence remains clear. We hope the centenary of the Balfour

2:04:42 > 2:04:47Declaration will be an opportunity for reflection and the reinvigorated

2:04:47 > 2:04:51peace process across the Middle East. The SNP support the European

2:04:51 > 2:04:55Union position of a two-state solution based on the 1967 borders

2:04:55 > 2:04:58and we encourage Palestine and Israel to reach a sustainable and

2:04:58 > 2:05:01negotiated settlement and international law based on mutual

2:05:01 > 2:05:05recognition and determination to coexist peacefully. The SNP have

2:05:05 > 2:05:13condemned obstacles in progress -- obstacles to progress in the peace

2:05:13 > 2:05:15process such as indiscriminate rocket attacks on Israel or

2:05:15 > 2:05:21continued expansion of illegal settlements in occupied territories.

2:05:21 > 2:05:25Members have called on the UK Government to use its influence to