0:00:13 > 0:00:22Order, order. Point of order, Lynne Brown.May I first of all wish you a
0:00:22 > 0:00:28very happy birthday, and may I also beg to move that the House to sit in
0:00:28 > 0:00:37private.The question is that the House sit in private. As many as are
0:00:37 > 0:00:40of the opinion, say, "aye". To the contrary, "no". I think the noes
0:00:40 > 0:00:49habit. Order. The clerk will proceed to read the orders of the day.
0:00:49 > 0:00:51Holmes Fitness for Human Habitation and Liability for Housing Standards
0:00:51 > 0:01:01Bill, second reading.Ms Karen Buck. Thank you Mr Speaker, and may I to
0:01:01 > 0:01:04extend my congratulations for your birthday today, it is a pleasure to
0:01:04 > 0:01:10see you in the chat. I beg to move that the Holmes Fitness for Human
0:01:10 > 0:01:12Habitation and Liability for Housing Standards Bill be read a second
0:01:12 > 0:01:17time. Everyone deserves to live in a safe, warm and comfortable home, get
0:01:17 > 0:01:22despite the undeniable progress over many decades, many still don't and
0:01:22 > 0:01:25often the most vulnerable. Currently and extraordinarily, landlords have
0:01:25 > 0:01:30no obligation to their tenants to put or keep the property in a
0:01:30 > 0:01:41condition fit for habitation. There
0:01:46 > 0:01:48is an obligation on the landlord to repair the structure of the property
0:01:48 > 0:01:51and keep in repair features such as heating, gas, water and electricity
0:01:51 > 0:01:53but that only applies when something is broken or damaged. It does not
0:01:53 > 0:01:55cover issues like fire safety, inadequate heating or poor
0:01:55 > 0:01:57ventilation causing condensation and mould growth. There are a range of
0:01:57 > 0:01:59fitness issues which affect the safety and well-being of tenants and
0:01:59 > 0:02:02about which tenants can do nothing. We must await the result of the
0:02:02 > 0:02:04inquiry into the horror of Grenfell Tower before reaching any
0:02:04 > 0:02:07conclusions but what we do know is residents were raising fire safety
0:02:07 > 0:02:11concerns in respect of the cladding long before the fire. This cladding
0:02:11 > 0:02:16was, as far as we know, in good repair but may have been unfit and
0:02:16 > 0:02:29hazardous, something certainly was, yet the residents
0:02:37 > 0:02:39have no legal wood available to pursue their concerns. This bill
0:02:39 > 0:02:41will modernise the housing fitness standard and extended to cover
0:02:41 > 0:02:43almost all tenancies, private housing association and counsel. It
0:02:43 > 0:02:46will allow tenants to take action on their own behalf in the same way and
0:02:46 > 0:02:48on the basis of the same standard as local authorities can currently and
0:02:48 > 0:02:51give a remedy that so many lack. Members of Parliament are all too
0:02:51 > 0:02:54familiar with bad housing. Most of us at one time or another find
0:02:54 > 0:02:55ourselves responding to constituents living in the most appalling
0:02:55 > 0:02:57conditions that their landlord, public or private, cannot or will
0:02:57 > 0:03:00not Act to resolve. As an inner London MPs whose constituency
0:03:00 > 0:03:03includes areas notorious for poor housing dating back to the year of
0:03:03 > 0:03:11slum landlords this issue has always been very dear to my heart. When the
0:03:11 > 0:03:16cases are referred to first come to me, my first port of call is often
0:03:16 > 0:03:21the environmental health department and while my council is of a
0:03:21 > 0:03:24different political persuasion to me and we fight on most issues, I can
0:03:24 > 0:03:27say the environmental health rise to the occasion again and again and I
0:03:27 > 0:03:31must have referred thousands of cases to them and they Act with
0:03:31 > 0:03:35rigour and professionalism yet we know that action is not sufficient.
0:03:35 > 0:03:39I have seen a couple with small children living in two rooms in what
0:03:39 > 0:03:42was effectively the attic of a property in North Paddington. They
0:03:42 > 0:03:48lived and slept in one room. In the other, the tiny kitchen, toilet and
0:03:48 > 0:03:52shower were were just cubicles built into the same space. I have seen a
0:03:52 > 0:03:56family who had to close two bedrooms, the only bedrooms, because
0:03:56 > 0:04:00of the cold and damp and who all sat in the living room because they were
0:04:00 > 0:04:11unable to use the entire property. I met a flat so damp that when I
0:04:11 > 0:04:14visited her even I was struggling to breathe. I met a pensioner only two
0:04:14 > 0:04:18weeks ago who was taken into hospital with hypothermia twice
0:04:18 > 0:04:21because of the cold in a flat where the heat leaks through badly
0:04:21 > 0:04:25designed windows and who also incidentally fell and hurt her hip
0:04:25 > 0:04:29on steps that had turned into a virtual river as water poured
0:04:29 > 0:04:34through a hole in the roof. A good example of how fitness and disrepair
0:04:34 > 0:04:40are distinct and different elements of unfitness comes on an estate in
0:04:40 > 0:04:45my constituency, a lovely and popular S8 in Bayswater. Residents
0:04:45 > 0:04:48had long-standing complaints about extreme cold, damp and condensation
0:04:48 > 0:04:52to the point of environmental health set up a dedicated project with the
0:04:52 > 0:04:56goal of protecting the health of residents. In 2011 their report
0:04:56 > 0:05:00found a range of deficiencies in the flats contributing to the help as
0:05:00 > 0:05:04that of excess cold. Frequently associated with cold conditions
0:05:04 > 0:05:08within the flat, the report says, was another hazard, that of damp and
0:05:08 > 0:05:20mould growth caused by condensation
0:05:22 > 0:05:24moisture forming on cold internal surfaces within the flats including
0:05:24 > 0:05:26the window frames and glazing. In some cases this growth was chronic
0:05:26 > 0:05:28and severe. And despite the environmental health surveys of
0:05:28 > 0:05:30flats, the residents impeded the requested something to be done,
0:05:30 > 0:05:33asking for the windows to be replaced as long ago as 2006. So why
0:05:33 > 0:05:35were these flats are unfit and how does it distinguish itself from
0:05:35 > 0:05:40disrepair? Built in the 1950s when building construction standards were
0:05:40 > 0:05:44poorer than today, the insulation standards on the flats were and
0:05:44 > 0:05:49remain very poor. The end walls of the flats were solid reinforced
0:05:49 > 0:05:53concrete as would-be floors, groups, external stairways, lift shaft,
0:05:53 > 0:06:06walkways and balconies and possibly some internal walls the cavity
0:06:06 > 0:06:07walling was unfilled and uninsulated. Consequently there was
0:06:07 > 0:06:09constant heat loss throughout the building, instances of cold bridging
0:06:09 > 0:06:11within the flats on the estate caused by cold elements transforming
0:06:11 > 0:06:13heat energy and losing it externally, a particular cause of
0:06:13 > 0:06:18condensation, dampness and mould growth in those flats. Those
0:06:18 > 0:06:23residents have been waiting for 12 years and a major state programme
0:06:23 > 0:06:27that has been under way for some years still has to run until 2020 do
0:06:27 > 0:06:33and those residents have no legal redress to deal with their concerns.
0:06:33 > 0:06:38-- run until 2022. In case the references to heat loss and cold
0:06:38 > 0:06:41bridging are a little technical, here is one example of a resident
0:06:41 > 0:06:45who wrote to me on that estate to say, I have been suffering from the
0:06:45 > 0:06:50cold, we are always sick with the flu and colds, I have my heating on
0:06:50 > 0:06:5424 hours a day with another electric heater and I am always ill, so is my
0:06:54 > 0:07:01son. My heating bill for this month alone was £400. My son and I have
0:07:01 > 0:07:06asthma, arthritis, fibromyalgia, diabetes, a disease in my hand, I
0:07:06 > 0:07:11suffer panic attacks and anxiety, I am suicidal and have to go to Saint
0:07:11 > 0:07:15Mary 's Hospital and see a psychiatrist who says I must move to
0:07:15 > 0:07:19improve my health conditions. Please, please help me. I thank my
0:07:19 > 0:07:21honourable friend for giving way and for bringing this Private Members
0:07:21 > 0:07:28Bell. We all know that morally this is an issue we need to take up but
0:07:28 > 0:07:32would she be surprised to know that financially it is an issue we need
0:07:32 > 0:07:36to take up?I received a letter this month from the Department of Health
0:07:36 > 0:07:42that says that the conditions of poor quality housing costs the NHS,
0:07:42 > 0:07:47as a conservative estimate, an estimated £1.4 billion a year.She
0:07:47 > 0:07:53is a mind reader, I was coming on to that very point! Just absolutely
0:07:53 > 0:07:56reinforcing that there is plentiful evidence to confirm that bad housing
0:07:56 > 0:08:00is a drain on the National Health Service and if we were able to Act
0:08:00 > 0:08:04more effectively to tackle the causes as in so many other areas it
0:08:04 > 0:08:10would be beneficial to the NHS as well as to housing.May I
0:08:10 > 0:08:12congratulate the honourable lady on bringing forward this bill and
0:08:12 > 0:08:17assure her of our support. She has given some very disturbing cases,
0:08:17 > 0:08:21many of which we will have heard through our own constituency
0:08:21 > 0:08:25casework, but does she accept in the private sector landlords play a
0:08:25 > 0:08:29valuable role within the housing market and the vast majority of them
0:08:29 > 0:08:33do understand that in addition to the right to receive the rent, they
0:08:33 > 0:08:39do have obligations towards the tenants?I absolutely do, I thank
0:08:39 > 0:08:42the honourable gentleman for his intervention and I will make that
0:08:42 > 0:08:44point, but the vast majority of landlords Act responsibly in respect
0:08:44 > 0:08:50of their tenants and have an interest in making sure the rogue
0:08:50 > 0:08:56minority do not get away with irresponsible behaviour. I was also
0:08:56 > 0:09:04pleased to take part in the engagement process this week and on
0:09:04 > 0:09:12the one hand I was pleased to hear the response to our little project
0:09:12 > 0:09:17on housing standards had the best response that has been had so far in
0:09:17 > 0:09:22this important experiment, and that is obviously pleasing in one way,
0:09:22 > 0:09:29but further serves to confirm the extent of the problem. We were told
0:09:29 > 0:09:34that 57,000 people viewed the Facebook page on which we were
0:09:34 > 0:09:37presenting our questions about attitudes to housing fitness and
0:09:37 > 0:09:42some of the case studies that came on as a response to that were truly,
0:09:42 > 0:09:46truly horrifying, and came from all over the country and reflected the
0:09:46 > 0:09:51scale of the problem. Now, we know anecdotally and from members of
0:09:51 > 0:09:55Parliament, councillors and many others in casework, just how serious
0:09:55 > 0:10:00is the problem of substandard and unfit housing, and we know of course
0:10:00 > 0:10:02statistically from the English Housing Survey that there are three
0:10:02 > 0:10:06quarters of a million private rented properties, equivalent to around one
0:10:06 > 0:10:10in six of the sector, that are unfit, and around a quarter of a
0:10:10 > 0:10:14million social rented homes that have a category one hazard under the
0:10:14 > 0:10:18Housing health and safety rating system whether it be damp,
0:10:18 > 0:10:22infestation, excess cold or a number of other risks. This means that some
0:10:22 > 0:10:253 million people including many children have their health and
0:10:25 > 0:10:29safety compromised every day by substandard housing. And we also
0:10:29 > 0:10:32know that local council led endorsement is simply insufficient
0:10:32 > 0:10:38to the task. I have already mentioned the very positive
0:10:38 > 0:10:41relationship I have with my own local authority although they still
0:10:41 > 0:10:44have constraints particularly in respect of their own housing stock,
0:10:44 > 0:10:47but taken across the board we know that local authorities are not
0:10:47 > 0:10:53enforcing more than a tiny proportion of the substandard
0:10:53 > 0:10:58properties. My own most recent Freedom of Information research
0:10:58 > 0:11:01prepared into a report by Stephen Battersby indicates that enforcement
0:11:01 > 0:11:06action is only taken at a level equivalent to 1% of all those
0:11:06 > 0:11:09properties, we understand from the English Housing Survey, to be unfit.
0:11:09 > 0:11:14And research carried out by Shelter a year or so ago found enforcement
0:11:14 > 0:11:20action had fallen by 40% in recent years. This is importantly not to
0:11:20 > 0:11:24criticise local authorities, but the fact is that the capacity is simply
0:11:24 > 0:11:29not there, and it is also true that performance varies hugely between
0:11:29 > 0:11:40councils and there is a reliance in some areas on informal action which,
0:11:40 > 0:11:43whilst it has its place and can help to resolve some problems, makes it
0:11:43 > 0:11:45very, very hard to assess the overall effectiveness of local
0:11:45 > 0:11:50authorities.
0:11:50 > 0:11:54Tenants need the ability to challenge landlords in court. Will
0:11:54 > 0:12:01she agree we also need to look at reintroducing early legal advice so
0:12:01 > 0:12:09problems can be resolved quicker? As the chair of the all-party group
0:12:09 > 0:12:15on legal aid, she will not be surprised to hear I agree and there
0:12:15 > 0:12:20are many issues relating to advice and other aspects of housing need
0:12:20 > 0:12:30that still need to be resolved. All of us owe our gratitude to our
0:12:30 > 0:12:34honourable friend and for her perseverance.
0:12:34 > 0:12:42Legal aid is already severely restricted for disrepair. Do they
0:12:42 > 0:12:51not need to find the funds to allow tenants to enforce this?
0:12:51 > 0:12:58We would expect tenants whose conditions meet the fitness issue
0:12:58 > 0:13:06will be able to seek legal aid. I will make separate representations
0:13:06 > 0:13:15about legal aid, it is an issue many feel strongly about.
0:13:15 > 0:13:24I am grateful. Will she pay tribute to the Citizens' Advice Bureau who
0:13:24 > 0:13:29in my constituency have assisted 144 families in relation to housing
0:13:29 > 0:13:36repairs, and Doshi agreed many tenants can get legal expenses
0:13:36 > 0:13:42through household insurance -- Does she agree.
0:13:42 > 0:13:47I joined her in paying tribute to Citizens' Advice Bureau is who have
0:13:47 > 0:13:55supported this Bill and have written a briefing about that. There is a
0:13:55 > 0:14:04real concern about advice services that we have to discuss and make
0:14:04 > 0:14:12representations on. On insurance, one concern which underpins my
0:14:12 > 0:14:17motivation is it is often the poorest and most vulnerable, with
0:14:17 > 0:14:21the highest likelihood to have disabilities and sickness, trapped
0:14:21 > 0:14:27in the worst housing, and very few have adequate insurance. Again a
0:14:27 > 0:14:33much larger problem we have to resolve. There may be different
0:14:33 > 0:14:39remedies available to some people. In truth, the minority concentrated
0:14:39 > 0:14:43in bad housing often don't have those remedies.
0:14:43 > 0:14:50I am grateful. I strongly support this Bill.
0:14:50 > 0:14:55The important point about enforcement, this House is good at
0:14:55 > 0:14:58passing revelations but often they are not enforced properly for the
0:14:58 > 0:15:06vulnerable. I believe enforcement agencies need support.
0:15:06 > 0:15:09On the point of retaliatory evictions when local authorities
0:15:09 > 0:15:15take action. In my expense, when taking action, they don't then help
0:15:15 > 0:15:20the tenant to make sure the landlord hasn't behaved badly -- Experience.
0:15:20 > 0:15:29I am clear here are a number of issues supporting tenants that are
0:15:29 > 0:15:33out the scope of this Bill. I will continue to make representations.
0:15:33 > 0:15:40That issue very much one of those. Local authorities are increasingly
0:15:40 > 0:15:47cash strapped which is why the departments aren't able to enforce.
0:15:47 > 0:15:55Ideally, the authorities could find liaison and advice offices. I have
0:15:55 > 0:16:01seen some good examples including in Westminster. I am happy to
0:16:01 > 0:16:10acknowledge when the work is good. I am in agreement it is inadequate,
0:16:10 > 0:16:14patchy, and that is why we need to make sure individual tenants are
0:16:14 > 0:16:21able to exercise a direct remedy in law when the other services are not
0:16:21 > 0:16:29up to the job. I congratulate her on the Bill. On
0:16:29 > 0:16:34the role of local authorities, does she welcomed the recent decision to
0:16:34 > 0:16:41reauthorise new council selective licence scheme. A small minority of
0:16:41 > 0:16:47vandals are a problem, does she believe authorities should have
0:16:47 > 0:16:50those powers? I do. This is out of the scope of
0:16:50 > 0:16:56this particular bill macro. This Bill promotes one tall, an important
0:16:56 > 0:17:00one, but there are many, some of which are coming in and being
0:17:00 > 0:17:21introduce. I congratulate you on the active work from the council.
0:17:22 > 0:17:31Is it a key of this Bill, the social tenants have no effective means of
0:17:31 > 0:17:36redress over poor conditions as local authorities can't enforce the
0:17:36 > 0:17:38rating system against themselves. This would give them a tool to
0:17:38 > 0:17:46provide them, compel the authorities to carry out repairs?
0:17:46 > 0:17:52That is one of the purposes of the Bill, social tenants do not have
0:17:52 > 0:17:56that same right that a private tenant or housing association tenant
0:17:56 > 0:18:04can, to go to the authority. This Bill will extend the right to seek
0:18:04 > 0:18:10remedy to them. As we know, the law is generally
0:18:10 > 0:18:14outdated and restricted in this area. There is currently no
0:18:14 > 0:18:19obligation to ensure the property is fit as opposed to the obligation
0:18:19 > 0:18:27over disrepair. This did not used to be the case. This was set in law
0:18:27 > 0:18:30that has ceased to have effect as the law has developed. The concept
0:18:30 > 0:18:41of housing fitness stems back to Victorian era, and the 1885 act.
0:18:41 > 0:18:46Lord Salisbury made the case the shocking condition of housing was
0:18:46 > 0:18:51injurious to health and morals, and was attacked for propagating state
0:18:51 > 0:18:58socialism. The royal commission established and proposed a simple
0:18:58 > 0:19:01power for the recovery of damages against owners or holders of
0:19:01 > 0:19:06property by those who have suffered injury or loss by clear neglect or
0:19:06 > 0:19:14default insanitary matters. Remedy was granted to tenants subject to a
0:19:14 > 0:19:19relatively generous rent limit. As laws changed, the rent limit ceased
0:19:19 > 0:19:25to be updated and the ability for tenants to find remedy lapsed. The
0:19:25 > 0:19:32impact led to a 1996 report by the Law Commission. It criticised the
0:19:32 > 0:19:36fact the right of the civil remedy for tenants in cases of unfitness
0:19:36 > 0:19:42had withered as the rent limits had remained unchanged. It concluded
0:19:42 > 0:19:47removing the rent limit would be the preferred way. Court of Appeal
0:19:47 > 0:19:57judgments supported this. Closing the gap, a joint report last year,
0:19:57 > 0:20:01concluded the law relating to health and safety in homes is piecemeal,
0:20:01 > 0:20:05outdated, complex, and patchily enforced, making obscure
0:20:05 > 0:20:17distinctions. On that point, the many tenants in
0:20:17 > 0:20:21temporary accommodation with private landlords placed there by local
0:20:21 > 0:20:27authorities, does she see this as a dilemma with the difficulty in
0:20:27 > 0:20:34remedy? My experience is temporary condition
0:20:34 > 0:20:39can have the worst conditions. And for those tenants placed away from
0:20:39 > 0:20:47their local authority, tenants can have problems seeking remedy. What
0:20:47 > 0:20:51does the Bill do? The old obligations on the nose to ensure a
0:20:51 > 0:20:55property is fit and not just in the pair become obsolete. The Bill
0:20:55 > 0:21:00revise the fitness requirements and updating them by definition to
0:21:00 > 0:21:12hazards. A list of 29 categories is set out in the rating system. It
0:21:12 > 0:21:16ensures unfitness is covered as well as disrepair, structural and design
0:21:16 > 0:21:28faults where they include risk to serious harm. This means the tenant
0:21:28 > 0:21:32can take action against the landlord to make them put right these
0:21:32 > 0:21:36problems that make the property and fit and can seek compensation. The
0:21:36 > 0:21:40Bill makes clear the landlord would not be liable for issues arising
0:21:40 > 0:21:50from the behaviour of the tenant. Can I welcome this important
0:21:50 > 0:21:53legislation and her tenacious work. When I was a private renter I was
0:21:53 > 0:22:00offered houses with electric cookers hanging off the walls, dog mess on
0:22:00 > 0:22:05the carpet. Can I welcome what she is saying, the excellent balance
0:22:05 > 0:22:09within the new rights of the tenants and the sensible safeguards for
0:22:09 > 0:22:22landlords. Thank you.
0:22:23 > 0:22:30Finally, can I acknowledge those people who have got us to where we
0:22:30 > 0:22:35are. There has been a breadth of support for which I am grateful.
0:22:35 > 0:22:42Shelter has campaigned strongly. The chartered Institute of environmental
0:22:42 > 0:22:45health has lent expertise, the National Housing Federation has
0:22:45 > 0:22:51given excellent briefings. And the Law Society and House Of Commons
0:22:51 > 0:22:57amongst others. The Bill is backed by the residential landlords
0:22:57 > 0:22:59Association, the National landlords Association and Association of
0:22:59 > 0:23:05residential lettings agents. The chairman summed up for all three
0:23:05 > 0:23:10when he wrote this, the Bill seeks to achieve what all good landlords
0:23:10 > 0:23:27want, better enforcement against the crooks. In -- Stephen Battersby has
0:23:27 > 0:23:33diligently prepared reports into enforcement and fitness. Thanks to
0:23:33 > 0:23:38colleagues who have given up precious time to be here. I am
0:23:38 > 0:23:43thrilled to have Government support and hope we can continue in this
0:23:43 > 0:23:47positive spirit to make good progress. I give thanks to the
0:23:47 > 0:23:51officials who have been exceptionally helpful. I want to
0:23:51 > 0:23:57place on record my appreciation for Justin Bates and the housing boys
0:23:57 > 0:24:00who took the recommendations and drafted this Bill and supported me
0:24:00 > 0:24:11over the past Nama -- Years. I owe them a debt of gratitude. There is a
0:24:11 > 0:24:16great deal more to be done to turn the tide on in security,
0:24:16 > 0:24:20affordability, homelessness and housing needs and none of us.
0:24:20 > 0:24:23Pressing on other fronts. Today we have a chance to progress this
0:24:23 > 0:24:29vegetation to give tenants more powers to hold landlords to account.
0:24:29 > 0:24:35I commend this Bill to the House. The question is the Bill now be read
0:24:35 > 0:24:44a second time. I would like to congratulate the
0:24:44 > 0:24:48honourable lady for bringing forward this important bill and securing
0:24:48 > 0:24:53Government support. It is an excellent example of cross-party
0:24:53 > 0:24:57working. I want to see this Bill deliver on its object is to ensure
0:24:57 > 0:25:05everyone can live in a decent home. I am the chair of the committee for
0:25:05 > 0:25:12new towns and we have a private rental sector where homes have long
0:25:12 > 0:25:19been neglected. We see decay in states built in a hurry where both
0:25:19 > 0:25:24design and materials were not able to stand the test of time. They are
0:25:24 > 0:25:30now passed their useful life. Renewal and renovation is
0:25:30 > 0:25:35challenging. Housing estates in many new towns are often constructed to
0:25:35 > 0:25:41the viburnum design, innovative and experimental, where cars were
0:25:41 > 0:25:45separated from housing, the fund was accessible only by a footpath which
0:25:45 > 0:25:51meant that yard facing each other on to vehicle access alleyways. This
0:25:51 > 0:25:58layout has designed in crime and anti-social behaviour, with
0:25:58 > 0:26:04confusing layouts. We have wooden construction materials Botting, flat
0:26:04 > 0:26:09rues prone to begin, empty properties and the worst of rogue
0:26:09 > 0:26:16landlords -- Rotting. This has become a nightmare the sun. These
0:26:16 > 0:26:25ex-local authority homes are private rental owned by landlords hard to
0:26:25 > 0:26:29trace. There are many good landlords could take good care of their
0:26:29 > 0:26:35property and long-term owner occupied as who take pride. The
0:26:35 > 0:26:39simple fact remains some tenants living in conditions totally
0:26:39 > 0:26:40unacceptable.
0:26:45 > 0:26:49These properties are a catalyst for a spiral of decline on these estate
0:26:49 > 0:26:53and cause untold misery not just to the tenants but the owner occupiers
0:26:53 > 0:26:56living alongside them. Tenants are in the substandard properties
0:26:56 > 0:27:00because they have been unable to secure housing association
0:27:00 > 0:27:05properties. Our housing association properties in Telford are very well
0:27:05 > 0:27:08maintained by our innovative and aspiration of housing Association,
0:27:08 > 0:27:12the Wrekin Housing trust, but these properties are hard to come by, nor
0:27:12 > 0:27:16are the tenants able to secure and other rental property of an adequate
0:27:16 > 0:27:26standard and the
0:27:28 > 0:27:30reason have complex vulnerabilities. They may have a history of
0:27:30 > 0:27:32addictions, debt, addiction or mental health problems. They are at
0:27:32 > 0:27:34the mercy of rogue landlords because of the landlords are not willing to
0:27:34 > 0:27:37give them a tenancy. Rogue landlords charge the full amount of housing
0:27:37 > 0:27:39benefit and charged nothing but a rundown, neglected property in the
0:27:39 > 0:27:42town, just because they can. As much as I welcome the bill, I sound a
0:27:42 > 0:27:45note of caution that tenants are affected by the worst conditions in
0:27:45 > 0:27:50the private rental sector will not be tenants likely to be able to
0:27:50 > 0:27:53complain effectively, never mind take enforcement action against
0:27:53 > 0:27:57their landlord. We need to recognise that there is an important role to
0:27:57 > 0:28:00play here for local authorities and it is not good enough for local
0:28:00 > 0:28:04authorities to say, this is a commercial relationship between
0:28:04 > 0:28:09tenant and landlord, nothing to do with us. These tenants are our most
0:28:09 > 0:28:13vulnerable residents, they are being exploited and we have obligations to
0:28:13 > 0:28:17them to help enforce the powders that this new bill will give them
0:28:17 > 0:28:21and to use the existing powers that local authorities already have. I
0:28:21 > 0:28:28will give way.My honourable friend is making a proper point, does she
0:28:28 > 0:28:31agree with me echoing the points made already, that if these
0:28:31 > 0:28:36excellent new measures are not to be a dead letter, we have to ensure
0:28:36 > 0:28:39some of our most vulnerable constituents have the tools they
0:28:39 > 0:28:41need through the legal process through early advice and assistance
0:28:41 > 0:28:47to prosecute the rights they would be given under the legislation?He
0:28:47 > 0:28:51is absolutely right in making that point, and we must help these most
0:28:51 > 0:28:55vulnerable tenants to be empowered because legislation without
0:28:55 > 0:29:04assistance to exercise it is not going to remedy the situation.Just
0:29:04 > 0:29:07as I intervened on the honourable lady for Westminster North, can I
0:29:07 > 0:29:10ask her whether she agrees that we need to ensure local authorities are
0:29:10 > 0:29:15enforcing these rules and others to protect our most vulnerable
0:29:15 > 0:29:18citizens, and would she agree with me that the Government needs to
0:29:18 > 0:29:22monitor local authorities and actually compared them to see which
0:29:22 > 0:29:25local authorities are going after rogue landlords and name and shame
0:29:25 > 0:29:30those that are not?The honourable gentleman is right and there is much
0:29:30 > 0:29:34more that can be done to persuade, enforce, encourage local authorities
0:29:34 > 0:29:39to play their part, and they have a really important part to play and do
0:29:39 > 0:29:44already have existing powers to bring about a remedy.Would she
0:29:44 > 0:29:49agree with me then, it is really important that the department and
0:29:49 > 0:29:53the Secretary of State approves in a timely manner compulsory licensing
0:29:53 > 0:29:58schemes that a number of Labour councils in London and my council in
0:29:58 > 0:30:01Brighton and Hove have put request in for the Secretary of State to
0:30:01 > 0:30:06approve that will give them those enforcement powers?I thank him for
0:30:06 > 0:30:10his intervention, I'm fact I do not agree on that point and I will come
0:30:10 > 0:30:15it shortly to explain why I do not. The existing powers local
0:30:15 > 0:30:18authorities already have include funding to identify and prosecute
0:30:18 > 0:30:21rogue landlords, and they need to step up to the mark to use those
0:30:21 > 0:30:32powers and prosecute where a
0:30:47 > 0:30:50property is unsafe or substandard. The evidence is that they do not
0:30:50 > 0:30:52make enough use of the powers that they have. To come onto the
0:30:52 > 0:30:54honourable gentleman's point, in my area selective licensing has been
0:30:54 > 0:30:57proposed as a solution to the problems but penalises all landlord
0:30:57 > 0:30:59on an estate, including good, responsible landlords, and hit them
0:30:59 > 0:31:02with an extra levy to prove they are fit and proper people and fails to
0:31:02 > 0:31:04distinguish between those that make their money letting substandard
0:31:04 > 0:31:06properties to the most vulnerable to whom no one else will let. I am
0:31:06 > 0:31:08pleased by this Government's strong record of action on improving the
0:31:08 > 0:31:11experience of tenants and the action already taken on substandard private
0:31:11 > 0:31:13rentals. With local authorities having the powers to impose civil
0:31:13 > 0:31:15penalties up to £30,000 and the introduction of red repayment
0:31:15 > 0:31:18orders, and there are more powers to come into effect...Yes, I should
0:31:18 > 0:31:22like to give way. I and those that make their money letting substandard
0:31:22 > 0:31:24properties to the most vulnerable to whom no one else will let. I am
0:31:24 > 0:31:27pleased by this Government's strong record of action on improving the
0:31:27 > 0:31:29experience of tenants and the action already taken on substandard private
0:31:29 > 0:31:31rentals. With local authorities having the powers to impose civil
0:31:31 > 0:31:33penalties up to £30,000 and the introduction of red repayment
0:31:33 > 0:31:35orders, and there are more powers to come into effect... Yes, I should
0:31:35 > 0:31:38like to give way. The right honourable lady giving I understand
0:31:38 > 0:31:41the point you as is so often case, the powders may exist but the first
0:31:41 > 0:31:43things cut from local authority budgets are those that actually
0:31:43 > 0:31:45enforce the powers that they have and this is a very good example.I
0:31:45 > 0:31:48thank the honourable gentleman for his remarks, he is right that powers
0:31:48 > 0:31:51are not being enforced and there is a reason why and we need to do more
0:31:51 > 0:31:55to make sure local authorities do enforce...I thank the honourable
0:31:55 > 0:31:59lady for giving way. In terms of more resources to enforce
0:31:59 > 0:32:02legislation, would she welcomed the fact that Torbay Council has used
0:32:02 > 0:32:08the powers the Government has given to levy fines of up to £30,000 to
0:32:08 > 0:32:11increase its housing enforcement team using literary money from those
0:32:11 > 0:32:15who abuse their tenants?I am delighted to here poor Bay is using
0:32:15 > 0:32:20these powers and I would encourage Telford and Wrekin, Mike local
0:32:20 > 0:32:24authority, to follow their example. The honourable lady is being very
0:32:24 > 0:32:28generous, thank you. Can I gently said the reason that the council has
0:32:28 > 0:32:32a licensing scheme is because then it can bring in the money through
0:32:32 > 0:32:37that scheme to enable it to do the enforcement it needs to do. I think
0:32:37 > 0:32:43all tenants, as we have heard, all landlords, as we have heard in this
0:32:43 > 0:32:46chamber today, would benefit from such a scheme because it would mean
0:32:46 > 0:32:49there are proper standards they all adhere to which is only good for the
0:32:49 > 0:32:56whole sector.The honourable lady is right that the objective of
0:32:56 > 0:33:00selective licensing is to bring in more funding but there is a raft of
0:33:00 > 0:33:03bureaucracy surrounding it and also some landlords will pass it on to
0:33:03 > 0:33:07tenants. But I want to move on with the bill that is in front of us
0:33:07 > 0:33:12today. I just want to make one more point and perhaps the honourable
0:33:12 > 0:33:16gentleman will come back... The honourable lady has had her
0:33:16 > 0:33:22intervention. More powers are to come into effect in April 2018
0:33:22 > 0:33:25introducing banning orders and a database of rogue landlords to
0:33:25 > 0:33:28support local authorities in tackling the problem. There are
0:33:28 > 0:33:32powers to remove the worst offenders and I urge all local authorities to
0:33:32 > 0:33:37do so because as much as I work on this bill empowering tenants, I am
0:33:37 > 0:33:39concerned tenants in the most substandard properties who do not
0:33:39 > 0:33:51complain currently the many
0:34:02 > 0:34:05different reasons will not be able to take legal action. The needs and
0:34:05 > 0:34:06concerns of tenants are the responsibility of local authorities,
0:34:06 > 0:34:09they are their residence and they must not wash their hands of tenants
0:34:09 > 0:34:11living in these conditions in these properties. I congratulate the
0:34:11 > 0:34:13honourable lady the Member for Westminster North by highlighting
0:34:13 > 0:34:15this very important problem and thank her for drawing t he attention
0:34:15 > 0:34:18of the conditions many people are living get in my constituency, in
0:34:18 > 0:34:20other towns and across the country today. She has spoken up for people
0:34:20 > 0:34:23who cannot speak for themselves and for that she is to be congratulated.
0:34:23 > 0:34:25Order, has the honourable lady completed her speech? We are
0:34:25 > 0:34:27immensely grateful to the honourable lady, I thank her very much for
0:34:27 > 0:34:32that. If the honourable gentleman is ready, let's hear from the fella,
0:34:32 > 0:34:39Clive Betts.I rise to support this bill and many congratulations to my
0:34:39 > 0:34:45honourable friend who has moved the bill this morning, I know she has a
0:34:45 > 0:34:49long-term interest in housing and housing policy and legislation. What
0:34:49 > 0:34:53also came out this morning and almost certainly has been true of
0:34:53 > 0:34:59many years for those who have known her is her passionate commitment to
0:34:59 > 0:35:03housing as it relates to individual tenants and their struggle to get
0:35:03 > 0:35:06decent housing conditions and that is really what has driven her this
0:35:06 > 0:35:10morning to bring this legislation forward, her experience in her own
0:35:10 > 0:35:13constituency which she has spelt out of hours this morning and those
0:35:13 > 0:35:16awful circumstances in which people have to live, and trying to help
0:35:16 > 0:35:21them through this legislation. There are three reasons why I have a
0:35:21 > 0:35:25particular interest in this this morning and want to see this
0:35:25 > 0:35:28legislation pass. The first is if you go to most members of the public
0:35:28 > 0:35:32and say, should a landlord be able to let a property to a tenant which
0:35:32 > 0:35:36is unfit for them to live in? They say, of course they shouldn't! The
0:35:36 > 0:35:41law prevents it, doesn't it? Most people would assume the law already
0:35:41 > 0:35:46does what this bill this morning is attempting to do! They would assume
0:35:46 > 0:35:52Parliament has already taken steps to ensure that any house that is
0:35:52 > 0:35:56left is fit for the person who has it to live in. The fact that it
0:35:56 > 0:35:58isn't is really a condemnation of all of us that we have allowed this
0:35:58 > 0:36:02situation to exist for far too long. So to put that basic problem right,
0:36:02 > 0:36:06I think, is something most of the public would say, of course you
0:36:06 > 0:36:08should do that, of course everyone in the House this morning should be
0:36:08 > 0:36:13here to support this basic measure. I think it is important that the
0:36:13 > 0:36:17House today understands that our predecessors have tried to act on
0:36:17 > 0:36:22this, this bill, very rightly, links back to the 1985 Housing act, and I
0:36:22 > 0:36:29served on the housing bill committee in 2003-4 with the honourable lady
0:36:29 > 0:36:33the Member for Westminster North when we reformed some of the laws
0:36:33 > 0:36:37and brought in the Housing health and safety rating system which has
0:36:37 > 0:36:41proved rather complicated, and the experience of that attempt to
0:36:41 > 0:36:44regulate rogue landlords, going back through the laws of the past, which
0:36:44 > 0:36:47the honourable lady is quite rightly bring it forward to the House, so
0:36:47 > 0:36:51there is a history here and we need to understand that.There is a
0:36:51 > 0:36:55history, but the history is we have not got it right, that is what we
0:36:55 > 0:37:00have tried to do this morning and I take your point about the housing
0:37:00 > 0:37:04health and safety rating system, I will say a few words on that before
0:37:04 > 0:37:06I conclude, so there have been various efforts but in the end we
0:37:06 > 0:37:11are still in a position where houses can be let to tenants which are not
0:37:11 > 0:37:15fit for them to live in and that is what this, fundamentally, is putting
0:37:15 > 0:37:18right, in some ways going back to the 1985 legislation which
0:37:18 > 0:37:23unfortunately has been overtaken by information where the rental figures
0:37:23 > 0:37:27in there are now so far out of date that effectively legislation cannot
0:37:27 > 0:37:32be used at all so it is turning the clock back to a previous situation
0:37:32 > 0:37:38and doing so in a very appropriate way. Secondly, it is nevertheless,
0:37:38 > 0:37:42in terms of the 1985 legislation, updating the fitness standards
0:37:42 > 0:37:45because it is taking the standards from that legislation but then
0:37:45 > 0:37:50adding to them, as I understand it, the fitness standards from the 2004
0:37:50 > 0:37:53legislation and making a more comprehensive definition of what
0:37:53 > 0:37:57fitness should be, bringing the two together in a more comprehensive
0:37:57 > 0:38:01way. So it is turning the clock back to 1985 but then modernising and
0:38:01 > 0:38:08updating it, incorporating the 2004 standard as well, making a more
0:38:08 > 0:38:11comprehensive definition of fitness to make sure homes are truly fit for
0:38:11 > 0:38:16people to live in. The third point is that of course then by giving the
0:38:16 > 0:38:21powers to the tenant as part of their contract with the landlord, it
0:38:21 > 0:38:24means that tenants in local authority housing have the same
0:38:24 > 0:38:27rights of power as those in the private sector or with a housing
0:38:27 > 0:38:31association. It means any tenant in any rental property have these
0:38:31 > 0:38:35rights to enforce against their landlord to ensure that home is
0:38:35 > 0:38:42brought up to a fitness level. It does the three things, brings the
0:38:42 > 0:38:45fitness, any home should be fit for the tenant living, updates the
0:38:45 > 0:38:48fitness standards, then applies the legislation to local authority
0:38:48 > 0:38:53housing as well as other forms of rented housing. For those three
0:38:53 > 0:38:59reasons I think the bill should be supported. Two other things, the
0:38:59 > 0:39:05honourable member made reference to the housing health and safety rating
0:39:05 > 0:39:08system. When the select committee looked at issues in the private
0:39:08 > 0:39:14rental sector in 2013, we called for a review and update, the guidance on
0:39:14 > 0:39:19that system has not been changed I think since 2006 and is now rather
0:39:19 > 0:39:24out of date. There are questions whether the system is understood by
0:39:24 > 0:39:29many people. It is complicated, it is difficult to understand, most
0:39:29 > 0:39:34professionals may understand it but I think the fact there is not an
0:39:34 > 0:39:40absolute definition in there of what is fit and what isn't is a problem.
0:39:40 > 0:39:43Many landlords don't understand it and if landlords don't understand
0:39:43 > 0:39:46it, the chances of tenants understanding it are very small
0:39:46 > 0:39:49indeed so another look at that about whether you should have some basic
0:39:49 > 0:39:52standards as opposed to simply a risk-based system is something we
0:39:52 > 0:39:56ought to come back to in due course. There is something strange with a
0:39:56 > 0:40:01system where you can have a house which is let to one tenant which is
0:40:01 > 0:40:06deemed to be unfit with that tenant in but if the tenant changes and a
0:40:06 > 0:40:17new tenant moved in, the
0:40:26 > 0:40:29House can become fit without having worked on to it whatsoever because
0:40:29 > 0:40:32the second tenant may be deemed to be less of a risk than the first
0:40:32 > 0:40:34tenant and being a risk-based system means the level of fitness is
0:40:34 > 0:40:37changed with the change of tenant, and I think that is something that
0:40:37 > 0:40:39is very difficult for most people to understand and I think at some point
0:40:39 > 0:40:42we have to revisit it. Finally, local authorities and their ability
0:40:42 > 0:40:44to take enforcement action in a range of areas, the select committee
0:40:44 > 0:40:46is currently looking at an inquiry about both the powers and resources
0:40:46 > 0:40:49that local authorities have to carry out enforcement in the private
0:40:49 > 0:40:56sector...I recently undertook a Freedom of Information with local
0:40:56 > 0:40:58authorities in London to see how many people had capital pots of
0:40:58 > 0:41:05money to do works and the answer was just two so our laws cannot be
0:41:05 > 0:41:11enforced at the moment.I think this is a problem and we are getting
0:41:11 > 0:41:14evidence to that effect and having our second session next Monday on
0:41:14 > 0:41:18this. The Government are bringing in more powers for local authorities to
0:41:18 > 0:41:21act, and they are welcome. The banning orders which come into
0:41:21 > 0:41:25effect in April are welcome, and these are the worst landlords who
0:41:25 > 0:41:29will have these banning orders and their names ought to be up there in
0:41:29 > 0:41:32lights for everyone to see what they are up to, and they are good and
0:41:32 > 0:41:40that is supported. The Government's decision to extend the HMO
0:41:40 > 0:41:45definition of properties that need licenses to properties with two
0:41:45 > 0:41:51stories is absolutely right as well, I argued under the Labour Government
0:41:51 > 0:41:54for that definition, unfortunately at the time we could not persuade
0:41:54 > 0:41:58ministers to include properties of two stories, I'm pleased the
0:41:58 > 0:42:01Government is doing it, that is absolutely right as well, more work
0:42:01 > 0:42:05for local authorities as well as more powers. I hope the Government
0:42:05 > 0:42:09brings in the requirement that all private rented homes should have
0:42:09 > 0:42:13their electrical systems checked every five years. This consultation
0:42:13 > 0:42:17has been a long time coming but I hope that comes in as well, but a
0:42:17 > 0:42:23game more work for local authorities. I know my honourable
0:42:23 > 0:42:27friend's bill is essentially giving powers to tenants to act in this
0:42:27 > 0:42:31case but in reality tenants are going to need support and
0:42:31 > 0:42:38assistance, they may well go to the Shelter helpline which is based in
0:42:38 > 0:42:41Sheffield and get the telephone service there which is excellent,
0:42:41 > 0:42:45they may go to their citizens advice service, they may go to other advice
0:42:45 > 0:42:49bureaus and get help, they may go to their members of Parliament or the
0:42:49 > 0:42:53local councillors, but very often they will go to their councils and
0:42:53 > 0:42:58seek help and assistance. What I will say is that although the
0:42:58 > 0:43:02primary requirement of the legislation is to give powers to
0:43:02 > 0:43:05tenants, in the end those tenants may well go to the local authority
0:43:05 > 0:43:17to get help and assistance with all the
0:43:18 > 0:43:20other measures coming in, very good measures which the Government are
0:43:20 > 0:43:22introducing, the extra power was for local authorities to take
0:43:22 > 0:43:24enforcement action, this legislation may put extra demands on local
0:43:24 > 0:43:27authority officers and the issue of resources is still fundamental to
0:43:27 > 0:43:29sorting out the problem and will be raised as part of the select
0:43:29 > 0:43:31committee inquiries and ministers should be listening that without
0:43:31 > 0:43:33resources local authorities will not be able to offer the tenants the
0:43:33 > 0:43:40assistance to make the legislation affected.
0:43:40 > 0:43:46Can I join in wishing you a happy birthday and thank you when you
0:43:46 > 0:43:56could be enjoying yourself in another way.
0:43:56 > 0:44:01I am sure you are going to enjoy our debate.
0:44:01 > 0:44:10Can I draw attention to my entry in the interests that I am part of the
0:44:10 > 0:44:15local Government Association and have a small property portfolio.
0:44:15 > 0:44:19I want to congratulate you on bringing this much-needed bill to
0:44:19 > 0:44:24this House, and to ensure that what she has done is to make sure all
0:44:24 > 0:44:28tenants whether they are in social housing or private rented housing
0:44:28 > 0:44:33will have the right to make sure they are living in a decent home. It
0:44:33 > 0:44:39is a fundamental right of everyone to be able to live in a decent home.
0:44:39 > 0:44:45This measure has been needed for a long time.
0:44:45 > 0:44:50It is a pleasure to follow the honourable member for Sheffield
0:44:50 > 0:45:01South East, the distinguished chair of the Select Committee. He has a
0:45:01 > 0:45:07long history of service in local Government and serving this House in
0:45:07 > 0:45:11holding the Government to account through our work on the Select
0:45:11 > 0:45:16Committee. I have had the pleasure of serving for the last seven years
0:45:16 > 0:45:21on that committee and in that time we have looked at all aspects of the
0:45:21 > 0:45:27private rented sector and socially rented sector. This measure is
0:45:27 > 0:45:34welcome and needed. Can I pay tribute to the honourable member for
0:45:34 > 0:45:36spreading west, the minister responsible for negotiating with the
0:45:36 > 0:45:43honourable lady to get this Bill into such a form the Government can
0:45:43 > 0:45:48now support, and I am pleased we will be passing this unanimously a
0:45:48 > 0:45:54bit later on today. I also welcome the honourable member for South
0:45:54 > 0:46:00Derbyshire and I will have questions I will hope she will answer when she
0:46:00 > 0:46:08rises to speak a bit later. I would also like to thank all the
0:46:08 > 0:46:13myriad of organisations that have sent briefing notes to us, to look
0:46:13 > 0:46:19at. All of whom praise and support the Bill, I am delighted to say, and
0:46:19 > 0:46:28that does mean it is likely to receive a good passage right the way
0:46:28 > 0:46:31through the House. The reality is there are many
0:46:31 > 0:46:37different types of landlords in the private sector and associated rented
0:46:37 > 0:46:41sector, accidental landlords who inherit a property and rent it. Most
0:46:41 > 0:46:47want to do the right thing. Often they are ignorant of their
0:46:47 > 0:46:51requirements and responsibilities under the law. There is a duty on
0:46:51 > 0:46:55Government to ensure those landlords are educated in their
0:46:55 > 0:46:58responsibilities to their tenants. There are those who are small
0:46:58 > 0:47:02investors who have chosen to use this as a means of encouraging a pot
0:47:02 > 0:47:10of money for their retirement or other purposes, and then commercial
0:47:10 > 0:47:14landlords in the private sector who, in many ways, are really good
0:47:14 > 0:47:24landlords, but there are some who are rogues. This legislation does
0:47:24 > 0:47:28indeed aim at spotting them and putting them out of business and it
0:47:28 > 0:47:32is right we should ramp up activities to make sure those
0:47:32 > 0:47:34individuals do not exploit vulnerable people and vulnerable
0:47:34 > 0:47:43tenants. I thank him forgiving way. There is
0:47:43 > 0:47:48evidence we as a co-member of the Select Committee as we heard from
0:47:48 > 0:47:52Shelton saying while the focus on rogue vandals is important, that
0:47:52 > 0:47:57alone can give a misleading impression the experience of tenants
0:47:57 > 0:48:04of poor quality rented housing is limited to a small number and that
0:48:04 > 0:48:10is not the case, there are landlords who are inexperienced, lazy,
0:48:10 > 0:48:13negligent in their response abilities who fall short of rogue
0:48:13 > 0:48:17but whose practice is nonetheless not acceptable.
0:48:17 > 0:48:22Quite clearly, when we look at the percentages of properties that are
0:48:22 > 0:48:27not decent, it is clear it is not limited to a small number of rogue
0:48:27 > 0:48:34landlords, I will come onto that later.
0:48:34 > 0:48:39Clearly, we have a position locally, and I note the right honourable
0:48:39 > 0:48:44Bamber for Brent North is in his place, he and I share the challenge
0:48:44 > 0:48:49of many individuals who may have bought properties many years ago,
0:48:49 > 0:48:52their lifestyles have changed, they have moved out and chosen not to
0:48:52 > 0:48:59sell, but to rent them, and unfortunately in some cases to
0:48:59 > 0:49:04literally exploit many vulnerable people. The reality is those
0:49:04 > 0:49:08individuals need to be called to account. We have had in north-west
0:49:08 > 0:49:16London a huge number of what are now turned beds in sheds, small
0:49:16 > 0:49:22developments, alongside properties were unscrupulous landlords
0:49:22 > 0:49:26literally force individuals to sleep in absolutely unacceptable
0:49:26 > 0:49:32conditions. The local authorities concerned attempt to enforce the
0:49:32 > 0:49:36rules. However, their resources are limited and often it is a
0:49:36 > 0:49:42requirement for people, I routinely draw my local authorities's
0:49:42 > 0:49:50attention to this landlords. However, resources are limited. One
0:49:50 > 0:49:56is the honourable member for Sheffield South East has made is
0:49:56 > 0:50:01local authorities need the resources to enforce the law that exists right
0:50:01 > 0:50:07now. Without that, I am concerned that the good meaning behind the
0:50:07 > 0:50:13Bill which is to give tenants rights may not actually bring to fruition
0:50:13 > 0:50:21what we all want to see which is the creation of a properly decent home.
0:50:21 > 0:50:27I thank my honourable friend forgiving way. This is an important
0:50:27 > 0:50:30point on the onus of responsibility. One of the attractive features of
0:50:30 > 0:50:37the Bill is it puts the part of responsibility on the landlord as
0:50:37 > 0:50:40opposed to them reacting with varying degrees of enthusiasm --
0:50:40 > 0:50:49Enthusiasm. One of the concerns as to be when we
0:50:49 > 0:50:53empower tenants that we have to ensure they have got the
0:50:53 > 0:50:57opportunities and understanding of what their rights are, but also to
0:50:57 > 0:51:01draw to the attention of landlords what their duties are, to make sure
0:51:01 > 0:51:06their homes are safe. One of the issues we discovered when we did in
0:51:06 > 0:51:12quarries through the Select Committee worth the duties on
0:51:12 > 0:51:20electrical safety. You will remember some of the reviews that took place,
0:51:20 > 0:51:27and are collection cup our attachment on -- at the duties of
0:51:27 > 0:51:35home owners, let alone landlords, and often that is invisible to
0:51:35 > 0:51:41tenants and to landlords. But it is a hazard and it would be
0:51:41 > 0:51:50risky for many tenants. Can I say, in my constituency, in
0:51:50 > 0:51:56one ward, more than 20% of properties are rented out in the
0:51:56 > 0:52:03private sector, most are now rented out to people from the EU, mainly
0:52:03 > 0:52:11Romania and Poland, who are being exploited. Herded into cramped
0:52:11 > 0:52:15accommodation in houses in multiple occupation which are not licensed.
0:52:15 > 0:52:21Although the local authority takes action to combat that, it is a real
0:52:21 > 0:52:25problem that individuals who have come into this country to work hard
0:52:25 > 0:52:30and earn a living and contribute to this country, are being ruthlessly
0:52:30 > 0:52:40exploited by a small number of landlords and I condemn them.
0:52:40 > 0:52:45Would he also accept it is not just with migrant Labour where there is
0:52:45 > 0:52:53this exploitation as he rightly describes, but with the student
0:52:53 > 0:52:58accommodation, there is a high churn in the community of one year or less
0:52:58 > 0:53:04that they are so exploited, and it is the same as he is describing of
0:53:04 > 0:53:10the migrant Labour sector. It reminds me of the time when I was
0:53:10 > 0:53:15at university in Liverpool and we all suffered quite frankly appalling
0:53:15 > 0:53:18conditions at that time in the private rented sector. I don't
0:53:18 > 0:53:25believe students, many more now who will need private rented
0:53:25 > 0:53:31accommodation for a period, many of whom as he says are being exploited
0:53:31 > 0:53:36as well and will put up with conditions that others would
0:53:36 > 0:53:43otherwise not, in order to get a lower rent and not draw attention to
0:53:43 > 0:53:49the problems. That is a problem. It is not just a
0:53:49 > 0:53:54problem. We need to be clear. Not just a problem in the private
0:53:54 > 0:53:59sector. There are local authorities who don't maintain properties to a
0:53:59 > 0:54:04decent standard, pockets of them, and I remember as a local authority
0:54:04 > 0:54:09leader applauding the then Labour Government on providing funds to
0:54:09 > 0:54:14bring local authority stock up to a decent homes standard, a great thing
0:54:14 > 0:54:19that meant local authorities could do that. We still have large numbers
0:54:19 > 0:54:24of properties that are owned by councils that are not brought up to
0:54:24 > 0:54:30a decent standard. Can I just do one other point then I will gladly give
0:54:30 > 0:54:33way. We also have housing associations,
0:54:33 > 0:54:42and the reality is, as I mentioned, although 28% of the private rented
0:54:42 > 0:54:49sector is non-decent, 14.8% of local authority housing is still
0:54:49 > 0:54:52non-decent, and 11.8% of housing association properties are not
0:54:52 > 0:54:58decent. This problem is not limited to the private rental sector but
0:54:58 > 0:55:02extended to the socially rented sector which is why I strongly
0:55:02 > 0:55:08support the draft Bill presented by the Honourable lady because we are
0:55:08 > 0:55:10looking at this in a competitive manner.
0:55:10 > 0:55:21I give way.Would he agree there is a problem in many local authority
0:55:21 > 0:55:27housing stock where the local authority has subcontracted out the
0:55:27 > 0:55:34maintenance of their stock, often for very long terms, with not enough
0:55:34 > 0:55:37scrutiny, and it means tenants who are responsible to the local
0:55:37 > 0:55:40authority, are not able to do anything, and the local authority
0:55:40 > 0:55:46offered is not able to reel the contract in. This might help provide
0:55:46 > 0:55:50more leverage for the local authority to step in.
0:55:50 > 0:55:57One of the problems with local authorities who choose to outsource
0:55:57 > 0:56:01their responsibilities is they should not be abdicating
0:56:01 > 0:56:06responsibility they have two their tenants. One problem there has been
0:56:06 > 0:56:10is when tenants complain about that, often, local authorities wash their
0:56:10 > 0:56:16hands and say it has nothing to do with us, go to the service company
0:56:16 > 0:56:20responsible. Tenants find it difficult to identify who is
0:56:20 > 0:56:26actually responsible for these aspects. I have many examples in my
0:56:26 > 0:56:31constituency where individual tenants have complained and not
0:56:31 > 0:56:38being able to get the service they should get from their landlord, be
0:56:38 > 0:56:40it housing association or local authority.
0:56:45 > 0:56:50I thank the honourable gentleman for being so generous in giving way. My
0:56:50 > 0:56:53understanding in my own local authority is the budgets of such
0:56:53 > 0:56:56maintenance and repairs to local authority owned properties has
0:56:56 > 0:57:00already run out before Christmas for this current financial year so they
0:57:00 > 0:57:06are unable to do those repairs to the properties.I thank the
0:57:06 > 0:57:09honourable member for the intervention. Clearly there are
0:57:09 > 0:57:13pressures on local authority budgets, we recognise that
0:57:13 > 0:57:17particular issue. But the key is you is it is the responsibility of the
0:57:17 > 0:57:24local authority to find the money to honour their obligations. I can't
0:57:24 > 0:57:28from this position talk about an individual council's budget but the
0:57:28 > 0:57:33reality is they have obligations and they should not be, therefore,
0:57:33 > 0:57:37rationing the service they provide when they have legal obligations to
0:57:37 > 0:57:44provide tenants with decent quality homes. Could I move on? Deputy
0:57:44 > 0:57:51Speaker, can I say that it is almost a year ago today that I was standing
0:57:51 > 0:57:55up on the report stage of my Homelessness Reduction Bill, now the
0:57:55 > 0:58:04Homelessness Reduction Act... And remind the honourable lady for
0:58:04 > 0:58:08Westminster North that during the committee stage of the bill the only
0:58:08 > 0:58:12amendment that we accepted and the Government would accept through the
0:58:12 > 0:58:16passage of that bill was her amendment which meant that local
0:58:16 > 0:58:21authorities, when they place of vulnerable people in accommodation,
0:58:21 > 0:58:27should have do inspect the premises and make sure they are fit for human
0:58:27 > 0:58:31habitation and are safe, which is a dramatic change to the law. However,
0:58:31 > 0:58:37that only is a narrow requirement on those that are placed there who are
0:58:37 > 0:58:42vulnerable by the local authorities so I'm delighted that this piece of
0:58:42 > 0:58:46legislation will now force all landlords to bring their homes up to
0:58:46 > 0:58:55a decent standard and an acceptable fashion. But I do think there is one
0:58:55 > 0:59:00or two concerns that I just want to raise because I think this bill can
0:59:00 > 0:59:07be improved still further. The first is the need to tenants to understand
0:59:07 > 0:59:13what their rights are and for the enforcement of them. I also want to
0:59:13 > 0:59:16see some protection for those people that complain about their landlords
0:59:16 > 0:59:24that we don't see that the honourable gentleman raised on
0:59:24 > 0:59:28retaliatory evictions taking place, we do not want a position whereby
0:59:28 > 0:59:32someone who takes action under this bill suddenly find themselves
0:59:32 > 0:59:36homeless because the landlord has said, you can take me to court if
0:59:36 > 0:59:40you want but if you do then I'm going to evict you as a result. That
0:59:40 > 0:59:46would be reprehensible and we have to combat that in a way. I also have
0:59:46 > 0:59:53a concern that whilst this gives rights to tenants to challenge bad
0:59:53 > 0:59:55landlords, the primary responsibility for inspecting and
0:59:55 > 1:00:00making sure that properties are safe should reside with local
1:00:00 > 1:00:04authorities. I have a real concern that local authorities are now not
1:00:04 > 1:00:07able to carry out those functions because of a lack of funding and the
1:00:07 > 1:00:11one concern I have in the explanatory notes to the bill is the
1:00:11 > 1:00:17lack of the need for a resolution to provide more funds to local
1:00:17 > 1:00:22authorities to enable them to enforce the rules that should apply
1:00:22 > 1:00:25and I would ask my honourable friend the Minister to have a look at this
1:00:25 > 1:00:28because I do think this is something the department needs to look at in
1:00:28 > 1:00:32the round to make sure that local authorities are given the resources
1:00:32 > 1:00:37that they need to actually ensure that people can live in decent
1:00:37 > 1:00:44accommodation.I commend him for that bill, the Homelessness
1:00:44 > 1:00:47Reduction Bill, and on that note money has been made available for
1:00:47 > 1:00:51local authorities to carry out some of their new duties which I think
1:00:51 > 1:00:54indicates that make that bill work there does need to be some support
1:00:54 > 1:01:00for the local authorities, would he agree with me?I the honourable
1:01:00 > 1:01:04lady, and clearly under the act that I was able to get through the
1:01:04 > 1:01:09Government were very generous and produced some £83 million, I think
1:01:09 > 1:01:14it was, in the end, to support the first two years and £70 million of
1:01:14 > 1:01:20that was as a result of the honourable lady's amendment to
1:01:20 > 1:01:25ensure premises or homes were inspected, made fit for habitation,
1:01:25 > 1:01:31before someone was moved in. So that demonstrates the extent of a rather
1:01:31 > 1:01:35narrow requirement, we are talking a much broader requirement here, and
1:01:35 > 1:01:39that is why I think there is a need for a substantial injection of cash
1:01:39 > 1:01:45for local authorities as a result. I will give way again.Thank you very
1:01:45 > 1:01:53much, you are incredibly kind. Would he agree with me that in many cases
1:01:53 > 1:02:01the bill that he put forward still is not being enforced and in many
1:02:01 > 1:02:05cases, a case for example at Christmas that I had of a mother
1:02:05 > 1:02:09being moved into temporary accommodation with the toilet
1:02:09 > 1:02:12overflowing that lasted until we intervened and the local authority
1:02:12 > 1:02:16only take action when we intervened, means that that bill was too weak
1:02:16 > 1:02:20and there is a danger that without resourcing for local authorities,
1:02:20 > 1:02:27without increasing the cap on house investment and without proper
1:02:27 > 1:02:33enforcement all of these are nice words but they are unenforceable.I
1:02:33 > 1:02:36thank the honourable gentleman, clearly I would agree that what we
1:02:36 > 1:02:42do need to do is ramp up funding and responsibility and give local
1:02:42 > 1:02:46authorities the powers that they need and resources that they need to
1:02:46 > 1:02:49carry out duties under this legislation and other pieces of
1:02:49 > 1:02:54legislation that have been put through. Can I also ask the Minister
1:02:54 > 1:02:58from the Government's side but we also need to look at is the
1:02:58 > 1:03:02sentencing guidelines that are given out against rogue landlords. The
1:03:02 > 1:03:08reality is that there may be a maximum fine permissible of up to
1:03:08 > 1:03:12£30,000 but it is very rare for the courts to issue fines have that type
1:03:12 > 1:03:18and the reality is that we need to have a position whereby not only
1:03:18 > 1:03:22should the fines be reinvested in the service so that any money that
1:03:22 > 1:03:26comes in can be reinvested in the inspection and enforcement process,
1:03:26 > 1:03:29but clear sentencing guidelines need to be issued so that magistrates
1:03:29 > 1:03:34courts will have a position whereby they can maximise the fines,
1:03:34 > 1:03:42particularly on the worst-case scenarios.Can I just confirm that
1:03:42 > 1:03:48we only have 23 minutes until the Government's statements for this
1:03:48 > 1:03:53very important debate to conclude? Is that correct?It will not
1:03:53 > 1:03:57conclude the debate but there will be a statement at 11am. Bob
1:03:57 > 1:04:04Blackman.From the honourable member's perspective, I am coming to
1:04:04 > 1:04:07the end of my speech, I am very supportive of the bill and cognisant
1:04:07 > 1:04:11of the fact that the debate could be adjourned whilst we have the
1:04:11 > 1:04:15statements but will continue thereafter to a conclusion, so he
1:04:15 > 1:04:22should not worry too much about that. One of the concern that I
1:04:22 > 1:04:26have, Madam Deputy Speaker, is the implementation period of this
1:04:26 > 1:04:31legislation, I think in the guidelines it suggested this will be
1:04:31 > 1:04:34introduced three months after the bill becomes an act of Parliament,
1:04:34 > 1:04:39and I would ask the Minister, in her speech, if she could look at whether
1:04:39 > 1:04:43there is a need for secondary legislation, regulation, as a result
1:04:43 > 1:04:49of the bill being made into law because I know from my own
1:04:49 > 1:04:53experience that there is a myriad of secondary legislation that I think
1:04:53 > 1:04:59the Government is introducing next month for my Act and I'm concerned
1:04:59 > 1:05:04that we don't want to get to a position whereby much-needed
1:05:04 > 1:05:07secondary legislation is not ready in time for the commencement of the
1:05:07 > 1:05:14act and therefore we could have potential problems later on. So, in
1:05:14 > 1:05:17summary, Madam Deputy Speaker, I strongly support the honourable
1:05:17 > 1:05:21member for Westminster North's proposed bill, I trust it will
1:05:21 > 1:05:26receive a unanimous support across the house, and I make the offer to
1:05:26 > 1:05:31her that if she wishes me to serve on the bill committee, I would be
1:05:31 > 1:05:38delighted to do so to help her get the bill through parliament.Rupert
1:05:38 > 1:05:47Hook.It is a pleasure to follow my dear neighbour in one direction and
1:05:47 > 1:05:51also supporting the bill brought before us from another west London
1:05:51 > 1:05:56neighbour in another direction. My friend for Westminster North.
1:05:56 > 1:05:59Usually when legislation comes before us as MPs, we have a
1:05:59 > 1:06:05sophisticated lobbying operation from people like change. Old and 38
1:06:05 > 1:06:08degrees that spam us with lots of e-mails but for this bill the number
1:06:08 > 1:06:14of people that have contacted me has been far wider than that. Every
1:06:14 > 1:06:16Friday at my surgery, which I will do after I finish here today, cases
1:06:16 > 1:06:22that come before me knowingly or unknowingly are asking for this
1:06:22 > 1:06:27legislation and we went past the 20,000 mark for individual cases
1:06:27 > 1:06:31processed since 2015 in my office and a large number of those are
1:06:31 > 1:06:36housing issues, people come and show you pictures of damp which is just
1:06:36 > 1:06:41too big to be a case of by a spray and, bang, the dirt is gone, it is a
1:06:41 > 1:06:46bigger problem than that, sealing scathing did or whatever, people
1:06:46 > 1:06:52with rodent infestations where their children cannot sleep because of the
1:06:52 > 1:06:56gnawing that keeps them up, the cases are a multitude, but I'm
1:06:56 > 1:07:00getting a strange sense of deja vu because in 2015I remember one of the
1:07:00 > 1:07:05first things I spoke in was my honourable friend's built with
1:07:05 > 1:07:08precisely the same title and on that occasion it was told that by the
1:07:08 > 1:07:11other side which is why some of us on this side were getting a bit
1:07:11 > 1:07:15jittery when the honourable member for Harrow was being a bit
1:07:15 > 1:07:18loquacious just then, we are relieved to hear that was not the
1:07:18 > 1:07:23case, anyway. It is look for a modern Conservative party that
1:07:23 > 1:07:26opposed homes fit for human habitation and I'm glad they have
1:07:26 > 1:07:30seen the error of their ways and will be supporting this legislation
1:07:30 > 1:07:35today. I only want to be brief because I don't want to do the same
1:07:35 > 1:07:38again and talk ourselves out with this bill today so I will be very
1:07:38 > 1:07:41brief. The gaps behind it have already been dealt with, the
1:07:41 > 1:07:48difficulties of enforcement... What with the other things? Everyone has
1:07:48 > 1:07:51dealt with this. I wanted to draw attention to fire safety, which is
1:07:51 > 1:07:56not dealt with in the existing legislation, and my honourable
1:07:56 > 1:08:00friend and I have the a 40 between us and other side of the a 40 is the
1:08:00 > 1:08:04Grenfell Tower. I went past it yesterday, anyone who lives in
1:08:04 > 1:08:10Ealing and goes to central London by road would, and the bird carcass in
1:08:10 > 1:08:14the sky and one of the richest boroughs in our nation, that used to
1:08:14 > 1:08:18be the world's this largest economy, I think now the sixth post Brexit
1:08:18 > 1:08:22but that is a story we will not get into now, but the fact that there
1:08:22 > 1:08:26were people burned alive in their homes because people pooh-poohed the
1:08:26 > 1:08:31idea of legislation, people that await the idea of health and safety
1:08:31 > 1:08:34as meddlesome and troubling, and when you don't take these concerns
1:08:34 > 1:08:38seriously that is the logical extension of what happens, and it is
1:08:38 > 1:08:42something that shamed our nation. My honourable friend mentioned at the
1:08:42 > 1:08:47very start the powerful groups who are backing her bill, the Law
1:08:47 > 1:08:50Society, the National Housing Federation, the chartered Institute
1:08:50 > 1:08:57for environmental health, Shelter, 51 years ago their film Cathy Come
1:08:57 > 1:09:02Home shocked the nation and Grenfell I feel has shocked the nation a
1:09:02 > 1:09:06second time. As I said, I will not be long. What else was I going to
1:09:06 > 1:09:12say? As an opposition MP, I'm into holding the Government to account.
1:09:12 > 1:09:15This legislation holds landlords to recount where standards are not met
1:09:15 > 1:09:23and I have to say last time this came before... Well, no, actually, I
1:09:23 > 1:09:29will just get this while I am here, as a chair of an all-party part to
1:09:29 > 1:09:32group on single-parent families, you don't have Doobie want to be in our
1:09:32 > 1:09:38group, by the way, quick plug there -- you don't have to do B1, I am
1:09:38 > 1:09:42quick to point out that the Joseph Rowntree Foundation's figures show
1:09:42 > 1:09:46single parents are more likely to live in a substandard property than
1:09:46 > 1:09:53any other family, 20% compared to a national average of 7%, and the
1:09:53 > 1:09:56English Housing Survey shows people in poverty are more likely to live
1:09:56 > 1:10:00in hazardous homes than those who are not, so that is why this
1:10:00 > 1:10:05legislation is needed. As I say, I am pleased to see the Government's
1:10:05 > 1:10:09change of heart. The last and this came before the house, the Member
1:10:09 > 1:10:13for Nuneaton scandalously said that my honourable friend's proposals and
1:10:13 > 1:10:18Labour Party proposals for things like landlord licensing, I'm pleased
1:10:18 > 1:10:21my borough of Ealing does have a register of landlords, but the
1:10:21 > 1:10:28honourable member for Nuneaton, said this would result in an unnecessary
1:10:28 > 1:10:32regulation and cost to landlords, deter further investment and push up
1:10:32 > 1:10:37rents for tenants. I think that is scandalous, and I'm glad that this
1:10:37 > 1:10:40Government, we have a new Government, don't become a Prime
1:10:40 > 1:10:43Minister who talked on the steps of Downing Street about burning
1:10:43 > 1:10:47injustice, so I'm glad they will put their money where their mouth is and
1:10:47 > 1:10:52back this legislation which I hope will be a staging post after the
1:10:52 > 1:10:54next general election for a Government that is for the many, not
1:10:54 > 1:11:04the few.
1:11:04 > 1:11:09I will be brief, there are members who wish to contribute. Can I
1:11:09 > 1:11:14welcome the Minister to her place, and congratulate my honourable
1:11:14 > 1:11:22friend for all the work he did on homelessness production. And the
1:11:22 > 1:11:27lady for Westminster North for the work over a number of years on this
1:11:27 > 1:11:33issue, to make sure this can be supported.
1:11:33 > 1:11:38I note this Bill will grant tenants the right to take action in courts
1:11:38 > 1:11:42against landlords who failed to ensure their property is fit for
1:11:42 > 1:11:48human habitation and I know colleagues today will identify and
1:11:48 > 1:11:54recognise the stories that have been pointed out about issues we have all
1:11:54 > 1:12:00seen about damp, the lack of proper drainage in some properties. I thank
1:12:00 > 1:12:07her other half of constituents for bringing this matter forward. And
1:12:07 > 1:12:11picture beauty to the Citizens' Advice Bureau in South
1:12:11 > 1:12:14Gloucestershire and South Scottish Council for all the work they have
1:12:14 > 1:12:19done ahead of this debate. It is clear the current system needs
1:12:19 > 1:12:24updating, if a tenant is in unfit property, the system allows local
1:12:24 > 1:12:31authorities to assess whether it contains serious risk and where it
1:12:31 > 1:12:36does require the landlord to reduce the risk or remove it completely.
1:12:36 > 1:12:41The upshot being an offence is committed only when a landlord fails
1:12:41 > 1:12:50to comply with an enforcement notice. This Bill is writing that
1:12:50 > 1:12:58wrong. By putting the obligation on land laws to keep their property in
1:12:58 > 1:13:02good condition. There are already statutory obligations to keep in
1:13:02 > 1:13:10repair the structure and exterior of properties. And ensure their
1:13:10 > 1:13:24properties to be fit for habitation, this has had to be addressed. When a
1:13:24 > 1:13:30map -- when a landlord fails to ensure a property is fit for
1:13:30 > 1:13:34habitation, damp, ventilation, water supply, we would take for granted in
1:13:34 > 1:13:42our own lives all of this, this Bill empowers tenants to take action in
1:13:42 > 1:13:46court to hold their landlord to account where there has been a
1:13:46 > 1:13:55failing, to apply for an injunction. Does he agree the fact a tenant can
1:13:55 > 1:14:00get damages is a huge improvement in this Bill, particularly because
1:14:00 > 1:14:08living in substandard accommodation, for example, with mould or damp, can
1:14:08 > 1:14:13be depressing, have an effect on your mental health, and that
1:14:13 > 1:14:17punitive element of damages will make a real difference in terms of
1:14:17 > 1:14:22enforcement and hopefully in terms of lawyers taking forward and
1:14:22 > 1:14:30enforcing rights? She is right, this Bill doesn't just
1:14:30 > 1:14:37give the power to hold landlords to account by making them carry out
1:14:37 > 1:14:48works but gives the power to instruct compensation as well. This
1:14:48 > 1:14:55Bill manages to achieve that while still being proportionate, it is not
1:14:55 > 1:14:58overly burdensome on landlords because of the simple principle it
1:14:58 > 1:15:02should not increase costs or create compass and work because landlords
1:15:02 > 1:15:09are already providing good service to tenants and good quality
1:15:09 > 1:15:15accommodation, the vast majority are. It will push landlords to act
1:15:15 > 1:15:19proactively, creating a ripple effect in the industry to create a
1:15:19 > 1:15:27culture where the industry is more a safety and people first culture. It
1:15:27 > 1:15:34protects to Koech -- landlords from spurious claims where the property
1:15:34 > 1:15:38isn't being used for the purpose it is being let or pushing landlords to
1:15:38 > 1:15:46be responsible for repair for items where the tenant can remove it from
1:15:46 > 1:15:52the property. One landlord contacted me this morning welcome the Bill
1:15:52 > 1:15:57because it is not seen as a threat but supporting the industry by
1:15:57 > 1:16:04enhancing the reputation of the vast majority of landlords. I will
1:16:04 > 1:16:09conclude and say this Bill empowers tenants, the text landlords, dries
1:16:09 > 1:16:17up standard across both sectors, I look forward to supporting it today.
1:16:17 > 1:16:25Thank you. I wish to pay tribute to my honourable friend for Westminster
1:16:25 > 1:16:31North for bringing this Bill and would like to pay tribute to the
1:16:31 > 1:16:34honourable member for Sheffield South East for the debate in
1:16:34 > 1:16:38Westminster Hall yesterday on supported housing. While this was
1:16:38 > 1:16:44not exactly the same issue, there is the issue that many tenants we are
1:16:44 > 1:16:49talking about here are very vulnerable and clearly there is a
1:16:49 > 1:16:53benefit to society for enabling the maximum number to lead independent
1:16:53 > 1:16:58lives and some other people who are not currently able to gain redress
1:16:58 > 1:17:04for inadequate housing run the risk of ending up in supported housing or
1:17:04 > 1:17:09hospital. Last weekend, I called on a couple
1:17:09 > 1:17:14who invited me to that act to show me the mould that had grown around
1:17:14 > 1:17:20the bathroom, in their sitting room and the bedroom. They live in a
1:17:20 > 1:17:25council flat in Ipswich. I was able to pass on their details to the
1:17:25 > 1:17:29local councillors in the expectation that something will be done to
1:17:29 > 1:17:34rectify the situation. The council doesn't always get things right. I
1:17:34 > 1:17:39believe Ipswich Borough housing is an exemplar of good practice but
1:17:39 > 1:17:44even good landlords get things wrong sometimes. That is why it is
1:17:44 > 1:17:48important this Bill will apply to local authority housing properties
1:17:48 > 1:17:54in the same way as private rented accommodation. It impacts more on
1:17:54 > 1:17:59those public sector tenants who need help because whereas a private
1:17:59 > 1:18:03sector tenants might hold up some hope they could persuade the local
1:18:03 > 1:18:07council to act legally on their behalf, a council is not going to
1:18:07 > 1:18:13take out a legal case against itself. One would hope accountable
1:18:13 > 1:18:16local authorities would take their responsibilities to tenants
1:18:16 > 1:18:22seriously to rectify unfitness without the need for legal recourse.
1:18:22 > 1:18:28Unfortunately, that is not the case. In those cases, council tenants have
1:18:28 > 1:18:33no recourse to the law at all. This Bill will enable council tenants to
1:18:33 > 1:18:40take legal action if no action were taken to put right any unfitness
1:18:40 > 1:18:44just as it will to private sector tenants. I know members opposite
1:18:44 > 1:18:49would not be willing to accept a bill that unfairly favoured public
1:18:49 > 1:18:56sector housing over private sector housing. This Bill does not do so. I
1:18:56 > 1:19:00could wish that in the interests of fairness and a level playing field
1:19:00 > 1:19:05the members opposite might consider other measures for the private
1:19:05 > 1:19:09sector and changes to the law and regulations for the local authority
1:19:09 > 1:19:14sector but I think that is for another day.
1:19:14 > 1:19:18While this Bill does afford an important and necessary protection
1:19:18 > 1:19:22to council and housing association tenants, the problem also exists in
1:19:22 > 1:19:27private sector. In the East of England, 20% of private sector
1:19:27 > 1:19:31rental stock is a mistake that pose a serious risk to health, as
1:19:31 > 1:19:37compared with 8% of the Council and housing association stock. In my 20
1:19:37 > 1:19:42years as a local councillor I was constantly being contacted by
1:19:42 > 1:19:48residents who showed me mouldy walls, dodgy doors, awkward entrance
1:19:48 > 1:20:01halls, rickety windows. I would raise these issues
1:20:04 > 1:20:07with council officers but in almost every case was told there was no
1:20:07 > 1:20:10action, the council could take with the private sector landlord on these
1:20:10 > 1:20:12matters. This Bill will empower the tenants to demand safe and healthy
1:20:12 > 1:20:15homes from their landlords. I do not believe there will be any rash of
1:20:15 > 1:20:17prosecutions as a result. I believe it will focus the minds of those
1:20:17 > 1:20:20landlords private and public who do not currently pay enough attention
1:20:20 > 1:20:25to the welfare of their tenants, and encourage them to provide the level
1:20:25 > 1:20:31of service which 75% of landlords are already providing. All good
1:20:31 > 1:20:35landlord should welcome this Bill. Why should the scent of a percent
1:20:35 > 1:20:39who provide fit and proper housing be undercut by rogue operators who
1:20:39 > 1:20:46see their sector tarred with the brush of shoddy flat convergence? I
1:20:46 > 1:20:56look forward to this Bill becoming law.
1:20:56 > 1:20:59Could I join colleagues in congratulating the honourable lady
1:20:59 > 1:21:04for Westminster North in bringing forward this Bill and her opening
1:21:04 > 1:21:09speech today which I thought set out very well why this Bill is so
1:21:09 > 1:21:15important. It is addressing a very important issue not just the sum of
1:21:15 > 1:21:22my own constituents but across the country. Whilst I join colleagues on
1:21:22 > 1:21:26both sides of the House in recognising the vast majority of
1:21:26 > 1:21:32private landlords are not rogue landlords, they act very responsibly
1:21:32 > 1:21:38and provide their tenants with excellent accommodation and service,
1:21:38 > 1:21:43the reality is there are a small minority who exploit some of the
1:21:43 > 1:21:47most vulnerable in society, and this Bill is important in addressing
1:21:47 > 1:21:51that. I am very pleased the Government has decided to support
1:21:51 > 1:21:59the Bill today and I add my support to that. The garment has already
1:21:59 > 1:22:04made good progress, since 2010, introducing powers for local
1:22:04 > 1:22:08authorities and with that £12 million to help them identify and
1:22:08 > 1:22:13prosecute some of the worst offenders. 70,000 properties have
1:22:13 > 1:22:20been inspected and 5000 landlords have had further action taken or
1:22:20 > 1:22:24even had prosecution brought thereafter. So too has the
1:22:24 > 1:22:30Government brought in measures to protect tenants against retaliatory
1:22:30 > 1:22:34evictions and last year further measures were brought in on rogue
1:22:34 > 1:22:38landlords leading to penalties of up to £30,000. That is very welcome
1:22:38 > 1:22:46indeed. But those measures alone as the Government recognises are not
1:22:46 > 1:22:49enough and there is more... I give way. He missed out on
1:22:49 > 1:22:55regulation, on the minimum energy efficiency standards I brought to
1:22:55 > 1:23:02this House on the private rental sector which could be a huge attack
1:23:02 > 1:23:06on fuel poverty. Will he ensure the Government implements it from April
1:23:06 > 1:23:12this year so we can tackle fuel poverty and the worst examples of
1:23:12 > 1:23:16uninsulated homes in the private rental sector?
1:23:16 > 1:23:21He and I are fellow travellers in our enthusiasm for home energy
1:23:21 > 1:23:26efficiency and that is where I was to move on. I fear he may need to
1:23:26 > 1:23:31stay for a while during the statement to hear both parts of my
1:23:31 > 1:23:39thoughts on home energy efficiency. The Government has brought in
1:23:39 > 1:23:45excellent legislation, there is more to do which the Government has
1:23:45 > 1:23:48recognised and this Bill is hugely important addressing what remains to
1:23:48 > 1:23:55be done. As he said, one of the key parts in
1:23:55 > 1:24:00ensuring homes are fit for habitation is in how well insulated
1:24:00 > 1:24:05they are and how efficient they are with their energy. Too many people
1:24:05 > 1:24:11live in fuel poverty, not necessarily because they haven't the
1:24:11 > 1:24:15money to heat their property, but because their property is so poorly
1:24:15 > 1:24:21insulated and the appliance so inefficient that the costs of
1:24:21 > 1:24:24heating are actually disproportionate to what they should
1:24:24 > 1:24:28be if all those measures were adequately in place. We have to
1:24:28 > 1:24:34start to move on from an argument that says all that matters in
1:24:34 > 1:24:39housing is providing it at the most affordable cost to rent or buy.
1:24:39 > 1:24:45Equally important surely is what it costs to live in that property each
1:24:45 > 1:24:52month thereafter. I would argue very much in talking today about homes
1:24:52 > 1:24:56that are fit for human habitation, we should be focused very much on
1:24:56 > 1:25:03making sure the houses people are living in not only affordable to
1:25:03 > 1:25:09rent but affordable to live in each month and that requires much higher
1:25:09 > 1:25:15expectations of landlords when it comes to the home energy efficiency
1:25:15 > 1:25:19measures and installation within their properties. One member of the
1:25:19 > 1:25:27set in the second speech, in an intervention, had a startling
1:25:27 > 1:25:32statistic about the cost each year to the NHS of people living in the
1:25:32 > 1:25:40poorly insulated homes. That figure was 1.4 billion, which seems to me a
1:25:40 > 1:25:46good reason for why we should make it more a priority to have better
1:25:46 > 1:25:49insulated homes so people can live in comfort but be able to afford to
1:25:49 > 1:25:54live in their home.