0:00:00 > 0:00:05Hello. I am in Cambridge and this week's programme is all about
0:00:05 > 0:00:10saving money to. This man says he can help you avoid paying for care
0:00:10 > 0:00:15in your old age. I am here to show you how you can avoid care fees.
0:00:15 > 0:00:19Toogood To Be True? Is a degree worth the money? We ask why over
0:00:19 > 0:00:25half the graduates from universities across the east end up
0:00:25 > 0:00:29out of work. And money-saving guru Alvin has
0:00:29 > 0:00:39produced a special guide to help you avoid paying student fees.
0:00:39 > 0:00:49
0:00:49 > 0:00:52�75,000. Right now, money is on everybody's
0:00:52 > 0:00:56mind and that is what we are talking about on tonight's
0:00:56 > 0:01:00programme. Needing care when you are all there could cost around
0:01:00 > 0:01:04�50,000 a year, so when someone tells you he has a way of getting
0:01:04 > 0:01:08someone else to fit the bill, that sounds tempting. That is what some
0:01:08 > 0:01:13of you thought when you got in touch to tell me about a Norfolk
0:01:13 > 0:01:16company promising just that. One in four of us will need long-
0:01:16 > 0:01:21term care, and if you have more than �23,000 in savings and
0:01:21 > 0:01:27property, you will be expected to pay for your care. That is a worry
0:01:27 > 0:01:32for some people who would rather keep their assets in the family.
0:01:32 > 0:01:36am Steve Long, founder of the Universal Group. I am here to tell
0:01:36 > 0:01:41you how you can avoid care fees. This man claims he knows how you
0:01:41 > 0:01:44can avoid care fees. He says he is better than a solicitor. Your local
0:01:44 > 0:01:54solicitor will not be able to do this. Solicitors come to us to do
0:01:54 > 0:01:55
0:01:55 > 0:02:01it. Lovely, thank you, darling. Five years ago, the Dillons wanted
0:02:01 > 0:02:08to change their wills. They found Steve Long, whose business had a
0:02:08 > 0:02:14new product to avoid care fees. said you could get out of paying
0:02:14 > 0:02:22fees by setting up a trust that would stop the council from getting
0:02:22 > 0:02:30their hands on your money. He said it would be �3,000. That is a lot
0:02:30 > 0:02:35of money, so my first reaction was, we would have to think about that.
0:02:35 > 0:02:42In the end, he managed to talk us into agreeing with him, but I have
0:02:42 > 0:02:47since found that, if a trust was set up for that sole purpose, that
0:02:47 > 0:02:55would disqualified itself. Beryl O'Shea from Cromer also had a
0:02:55 > 0:03:05visit from speed long. He said the money would all be ring-fenced and
0:03:05 > 0:03:08
0:03:08 > 0:03:18the Government could not get hold of it for fees. He said, there is a
0:03:18 > 0:03:20
0:03:20 > 0:03:25possible, we would like to have it tonight. It was �3,500. We have
0:03:25 > 0:03:33asked several solicitors and they told us similar trusts would cost
0:03:33 > 0:03:38from �700 to 1,200 pounds. Care home fees can run into thousands of
0:03:38 > 0:03:45pounds, so it is only natural to worry about these costs as we
0:03:45 > 0:03:49approach old age. Steve Long holds seminars on the subject. We went to
0:03:49 > 0:03:54some of the seminars and listened to his claims about himself and his
0:03:54 > 0:04:04products. This one was in Bristol. We do seminars like this for
0:04:04 > 0:04:06
0:04:06 > 0:04:10solicitors. A top barrister walks along with us. Not one solicitor
0:04:10 > 0:04:13who deals with elderly clients knows how to do it. It is a
0:04:13 > 0:04:18specialist niche and only five of us in the country deal with it.
0:04:18 > 0:04:22That is not true. At Caroline Bielanska is a solicitor
0:04:22 > 0:04:32specialising in Wales and administration of estates.
0:04:32 > 0:04:40
0:04:40 > 0:04:43-- in wills. Membership of solicitors for the elderly and
0:04:43 > 0:04:47other organisations have thousands of members who would be able to set
0:04:47 > 0:04:51up such a trust. Also, they have to have a very good working
0:04:51 > 0:04:58understanding of social care assessments and funding.
0:04:58 > 0:05:02She wants to make sure that Peter's inheritance...
0:05:02 > 0:05:08In Steve Long's seminars he makes many claims that make him and his
0:05:08 > 0:05:11company sound very well-connected and important. I work with the top
0:05:11 > 0:05:15barrister in the country. We do these seminars for solicitors.
0:05:15 > 0:05:19We spoke to the Bar Council and they told us that no-one would
0:05:20 > 0:05:23claim to be the country's top barrister. He does not seem to be
0:05:23 > 0:05:29quite as well connected as he claims. But he does sound well
0:05:29 > 0:05:37qualified. I am a qualified accountant and a lawyer. He is not.
0:05:37 > 0:05:44We have checked with the UK accountancy organisations and the
0:05:44 > 0:05:50solicitors'' regulatory authority. He is a member of STEP. How
0:05:50 > 0:05:54accurate are his claims? Are under cover producer as given and -- an
0:05:54 > 0:05:58elderly person who is unwell could use a trust to avoid fees. Provided
0:05:58 > 0:06:02he has not already been assessed and is not receiving care, it would
0:06:02 > 0:06:07be straightforward. The local authority will look at the reasons
0:06:07 > 0:06:13why the trust was created and, if they feel it was done for the
0:06:13 > 0:06:16purpose of putting the asset beyond their reach, they could, of course,
0:06:16 > 0:06:21take it into account in an assessment and treat the person as
0:06:21 > 0:06:25if they still owned the asset. irony is that if the motive is to
0:06:25 > 0:06:32avoid paying care home fees the trust may end up doing precisely
0:06:32 > 0:06:35the opposite. That is exactly how Steve Long markets is product.
0:06:35 > 0:06:40here to show you how you can avoid fees.
0:06:40 > 0:06:44In the end, it is the local authority to decide. We ask that
0:06:44 > 0:06:48the Local Government Association just what the rules are. They told
0:06:48 > 0:06:53us that, if you put your assets into a trust deliberately designed
0:06:53 > 0:06:57to avoid care fees, the local authority can treat you as if you
0:06:57 > 0:07:01still on the assets. That seems clear, so we wrote to Mr Long to
0:07:01 > 0:07:05ask why he gives misleading statements in his seminars. His
0:07:05 > 0:07:08office told us he was out of the country until the end of this week.
0:07:08 > 0:07:13Then his office claimed that some of his mistakes up words --
0:07:13 > 0:07:16mistakes were due to any infection. I hope his seeding is better
0:07:16 > 0:07:20because he is still in the country and he is giving a seminar at this
0:07:20 > 0:07:25hotel in Gloucester. I hope his hearing is better because I have a
0:07:25 > 0:07:27few questions. His office said that Universal
0:07:27 > 0:07:34Asset Protection is totally committed to excellent customer
0:07:34 > 0:07:39care and that their fees are not excessive. But Mr Long has not
0:07:39 > 0:07:43given specific answers to most of our questions. I have to ask your
0:07:43 > 0:07:48question, Mr Long. Why is it you are selling a product called How to
0:07:48 > 0:07:52avoid care fees when, by marketing it as that, you are, in fact,
0:07:52 > 0:07:56possibly rendering it useless? is not the advice we have received.
0:07:56 > 0:08:00It is nice of you to come unannounced into a seminar here.
0:08:00 > 0:08:06have been in touch with you, Mr Long. We have asked quite a few
0:08:06 > 0:08:10questions about the validity of these trusts. By advertising
0:08:10 > 0:08:15yourself us how to avoid care fees you are shooting yourself in the
0:08:15 > 0:08:19foot, aren't you? It is not the advice we have received. Who have
0:08:19 > 0:08:24you received advice from? This is from the government. Who is wrong -
0:08:24 > 0:08:27you or the government? You have put me on the spot. Yes, because you
0:08:28 > 0:08:31Office told us you were out of the country and you are here giving a
0:08:31 > 0:08:35seminar today. I am not prepared to discuss on television the
0:08:35 > 0:08:40intellectual property we have. All I can say is that the trust that
0:08:40 > 0:08:44the use as a 100% track record, we have documentary evidence of local
0:08:44 > 0:08:50authorities accepting the trust. You market yourself as one of only
0:08:50 > 0:08:56five companies that specialises in this type of elderly care trust and
0:08:56 > 0:08:59that is not true either, is it? say that we are one of five
0:08:59 > 0:09:04specialist providers but provides this type of thing for people. Many
0:09:04 > 0:09:08specialist firm of solicitors would be able to do this. Strange that he
0:09:08 > 0:09:11said the opposite when he did not know he was being recorded. Your
0:09:11 > 0:09:15local solicitor will not be able to do this. It is a specialist niche.
0:09:15 > 0:09:18There are probably five of us in the country to deal with that.
0:09:18 > 0:09:22Which Mr Long should we believe and what can we learned? If you are
0:09:22 > 0:09:25thinking of putting your property into a trust deliberately to avoid
0:09:25 > 0:09:35care fees, remember they are not suitable for everyone and they may
0:09:35 > 0:09:36
0:09:36 > 0:09:40not work. Mired first reaction was to say no -- my first reaction. He
0:09:40 > 0:09:49eventually wore us down. If you have met in you will know that he
0:09:49 > 0:09:59is a very pleasant man and If there is something you think we
0:09:59 > 0:10:04should investigate on Inside Out, sent me an e-mail.
0:10:04 > 0:10:09Coming up: Money-saving expert Alvin gives us an exclusive guide
0:10:09 > 0:10:19to paying less for your education. The amount you have to pay back
0:10:19 > 0:10:19
0:10:19 > 0:10:22Getting a job at the moment is not easy so giving yourself the edge is
0:10:22 > 0:10:26vital. More people than ever are going for degrees to give
0:10:26 > 0:10:30themselves that edge. Inside Out has commissioned a survey that
0:10:30 > 0:10:34suggests that almost three-quarters of 16th 18-year-olds think their
0:10:34 > 0:10:38job prospects would be better if they got a university degree. But
0:10:38 > 0:10:48they are not cheap. We have been finding out if they really are
0:10:48 > 0:10:50
0:10:50 > 0:10:53worth the money. It is graduation day in Cambridge.
0:10:53 > 0:10:58Students have passed through this city for more than 800 years, all
0:10:58 > 0:11:03hoping to go on to great things. But in the current economic climate
0:11:03 > 0:11:11what really lies ahead for these students and for those at are seven
0:11:11 > 0:11:15other universities? Tonight, we find out how it more than half of
0:11:15 > 0:11:21students in the east are struggling to find a decent job. How many jobs
0:11:22 > 0:11:27did you apply for? Around 150. as the price of a degree rises to
0:11:27 > 0:11:30almost �30,000 we ask if it is worth going to university at all.
0:11:30 > 0:11:36Employers are waking up to the fact that there are still people who
0:11:36 > 0:11:40have not gone to university. -- skilled people.
0:11:40 > 0:11:44I want to find out what the jobs market is like for graduates so I
0:11:44 > 0:11:54have come to St Thomas More High School in Westcliff-on-Sea in Essex
0:11:54 > 0:11:58
0:11:58 > 0:12:04Three years ago Edward graduated hoping for a career in scientific
0:12:04 > 0:12:09research. This laboratory at his old school is the closest he got.
0:12:09 > 0:12:17He is a classroom assistant, and relatively low paid role for which
0:12:17 > 0:12:25a degree is not required. I applied for lots of jobs in that area of
0:12:25 > 0:12:33when I left university. I was not successful. I looked at the
0:12:33 > 0:12:38graduate schemes at various companies. They were competitive.
0:12:38 > 0:12:43he ended up spending two years working at a supermarket while he
0:12:43 > 0:12:51looked for a graduate level job. Most employers said he lacked
0:12:51 > 0:12:59experience. How many jobs did you go for? Proper be 150. It is
0:12:59 > 0:13:04frustrating. -- probably. It can be demoralising when you have applied
0:13:04 > 0:13:10for a lot of jobs and not heard back from any. You think, was it
0:13:10 > 0:13:20worth it? I could have left school and gone into an apprenticeship.
0:13:20 > 0:13:22
0:13:22 > 0:13:27I'm thinking, should I have done that? We got hold of surveys that
0:13:27 > 0:13:37show what graduates do six months after leaving. Some of the results
0:13:37 > 0:13:40
0:13:40 > 0:13:46are alarming. Last year, more than 6000 graduates in the East failed
0:13:46 > 0:13:53to get a graduate level job, more than half. Many decided to continue
0:13:53 > 0:14:02studying. One in three ended up unemployed or under employed, in a
0:14:02 > 0:14:08job for which they do not need a degree. Some do better than others.
0:14:08 > 0:14:17When it comes to the University of Hertfordshire, 46% ended up in
0:14:17 > 0:14:22graduate level jobs. The University of Bedfordshire had 44%. Cambridge
0:14:22 > 0:14:29was third with 43%. That is largely because graduates here are by far
0:14:29 > 0:14:33the most likely to stay in education, with more than one-third
0:14:33 > 0:14:39continuing studying. At the bottom of the table was the University of
0:14:39 > 0:14:44Essex where 30% end up in graduate level jobs. Some Essex students
0:14:44 > 0:14:50stay in education, but there is still a big difference. Why do
0:14:50 > 0:14:56universities like bed that should do better than you?
0:14:56 > 0:15:03universities need to do more. It is also true some universities have
0:15:03 > 0:15:07higher numbers because they have a high set of vocational training. In
0:15:07 > 0:15:15a medical school, all these students are guaranteed employment.
0:15:15 > 0:15:21To be fair, you have to look at the University mixes. Essex does offer
0:15:21 > 0:15:27a number of work-related degrees such as electrical engineering. You
0:15:27 > 0:15:33charge students �9,000 a year. Surely they expect a good job when
0:15:33 > 0:15:40they graduate. They can expect an excellent experience when they are
0:15:40 > 0:15:42here and there will be many things our university will do to connect
0:15:42 > 0:15:46students with employment opportunities and training during
0:15:46 > 0:15:51their time and support afterwards, so they can go into careers of
0:15:51 > 0:15:59their choice. That emphasis on helping students get jobs is
0:15:59 > 0:16:04evident. Essex University offers hundreds of students work
0:16:05 > 0:16:09experience in its offices during their studies. It also pays them.
0:16:09 > 0:16:17This student got a place in marketing. It's gave me a good
0:16:17 > 0:16:21insight into the professional world. It has moulded what I want to do.
0:16:21 > 0:16:27It changed my ideas about what I want to do. It has played a bigger
0:16:27 > 0:16:31role in what I would like to be. His university the best way to get
0:16:31 > 0:16:36a job? I have heard that some graduates in Cambridge are losing
0:16:36 > 0:16:41out to young people who did not go to university. Jamie is one of
0:16:41 > 0:16:49those. With a national diploma, he beat several graduates to his job
0:16:49 > 0:16:54at a computer networks company. His course cost 1500 pounds, one sixth
0:16:54 > 0:16:59of the cost of a degree. Why do you think you beat the graduates?
0:17:00 > 0:17:07Become so I have good qualifications through college. --
0:17:07 > 0:17:14because. And also work experience. Work experience counted. I aimed to
0:17:14 > 0:17:19go to university. But the cost is going up. It is not worth it any
0:17:19 > 0:17:25more. You can get good jobs with a levels. You can get more
0:17:25 > 0:17:33qualifications while working. principle of his college says the
0:17:33 > 0:17:39university degree is no longer a golden ticket. It has become in the
0:17:39 > 0:17:44last decade, bet you have to go to university in order to get into the
0:17:44 > 0:17:51job market. That is not the case. Employers have woken up to the fact
0:17:51 > 0:17:57that there are skilled people who have not gone to university. They
0:17:57 > 0:18:01will not go to university because they are scared of the debt.
0:18:01 > 0:18:10Surveys from some universities show the numbers of unemployed graduates
0:18:10 > 0:18:16have doubled since the recession. Is it worth getting a degree? These
0:18:16 > 0:18:25companies believe it is. At a jobs fair like this one, they still try
0:18:25 > 0:18:31to recruit new graduates. training and a green gives you is
0:18:31 > 0:18:41something where you can express yourselves. To get through the
0:18:41 > 0:18:42
0:18:42 > 0:18:51challenges degrees offer is what we are after. Over the past decade,
0:18:51 > 0:18:56people with degrees earned �12,000 more than non-graduates. Back in
0:18:56 > 0:19:03Essex, Edward is making the best of it. He is not the scientist he
0:19:03 > 0:19:10wanted to be, but he is happy and might switch to teaching. Even
0:19:10 > 0:19:16though I struggled finding a job I envisaged, the life skills you
0:19:16 > 0:19:26learn are rewarding. Even though the fees are going up, I think it
0:19:26 > 0:19:29
0:19:29 > 0:19:35is a good thing to do. Our survey suggests almost half of
0:19:35 > 0:19:4016 to 18 year olds are looking at cheaper ways of getting a degree.
0:19:40 > 0:19:48We asked money-saving expert Alvin Hall for advice.
0:19:48 > 0:19:56Young, confused and afraid. This is what thousands of teenagers fear, a
0:19:56 > 0:20:02lifetime on the run. What is chasing them? It is student debt.
0:20:02 > 0:20:08Is it really going to be the horror movie we have been led to believe?
0:20:08 > 0:20:14Whether you think next year's increase is fair, it is happening.
0:20:14 > 0:20:20Young people need to know the facts. I will show what a degree can cost
0:20:20 > 0:20:26and how you can avoid the fees altogether. Next year, in England,
0:20:26 > 0:20:32universities will charge up to �9,000 per year. Graduates can
0:20:32 > 0:20:39faced debts of around �50,000. How much will they pay back? I have
0:20:39 > 0:20:44come to meet youngsters in Birmingham. I think it is going to
0:20:44 > 0:20:51shock them. Earning interest over such a long time as you pay back
0:20:51 > 0:21:00the loan is a number people do not think about. Imagine you graduate
0:21:00 > 0:21:09with �50,000 of debt. You get a high-paying job. How much of that
0:21:09 > 0:21:19money do you have to pay back? it all of it? All of it and more.
0:21:19 > 0:21:24
0:21:24 > 0:21:31In dressed. Interest. -- interest. �75,000. Is that just for one
0:21:31 > 0:21:40person? That is just for one person. The is that for the average degree?
0:21:40 > 0:21:44If you take out the maximum loan. What if their careers do not go as
0:21:44 > 0:21:54planned and they do not earn more than �21,000 per year. The amount
0:21:54 > 0:21:55
0:21:55 > 0:22:00you have to pay back is zero. What is going on? Basically, the
0:22:00 > 0:22:05repayment of the loan works like a tax. The more you earn, the more
0:22:05 > 0:22:12you pay back. If you never earned above a certain amount, you do not
0:22:12 > 0:22:22pay back a penny. A new task force on student finance is led by Martyn
0:22:22 > 0:22:22
0:22:22 > 0:22:28Lewis. The biggest confusion is the price tag. �9,000 fees, �50,000
0:22:28 > 0:22:33debt, with the actual cost. Many people will not come close to
0:22:34 > 0:22:37repaying what they borrowed. Some will not pay anything. The fact we
0:22:37 > 0:22:44are putting people off going because they are looking at the
0:22:44 > 0:22:52price tag is the biggest problem. Most graduates will face large debt.
0:22:52 > 0:22:57Is there any way to avoid the fees? Yes. You can study abroad. At a
0:22:57 > 0:23:06recent student fare, teenagers discovered how much they could save.
0:23:06 > 0:23:12Everybody would rather pay �8,000 less, rather than the UK. The fees
0:23:12 > 0:23:18are cheaper. In fact, dozens of universities in Europe offer
0:23:18 > 0:23:25courses taught in English. The fees differ in each country. In
0:23:25 > 0:23:30Scandinavia, tuition is free. have no fees because the Danish
0:23:30 > 0:23:36government pays for the Danish students and according to European
0:23:36 > 0:23:45Union rules, we have to treat other citizens alike. The student has
0:23:45 > 0:23:51taken the plunge and is off to university in Slovakia. Over there,
0:23:51 > 0:23:56she saves a fortune on living costs, spending just �100 per month. I
0:23:56 > 0:24:04spoke to her on the internet. What advice would you give to anyone
0:24:04 > 0:24:10considering doing what you have done? You should go for it. It is
0:24:10 > 0:24:20worth doing. You just get on the aeroplane. You have to be a bit
0:24:20 > 0:24:26
0:24:26 > 0:24:34brave! But I have never looked back. Time is up. I want my money.
0:24:34 > 0:24:39Studying overseas may be a way of avoiding debt. But there are down
0:24:39 > 0:24:44sides. If you study abroad, the government here will not give you a
0:24:44 > 0:24:51loan. Only some courses are taught in English and some employers might
0:24:51 > 0:24:57not recognise foreign degrees. You need to do your homework. Another
0:24:57 > 0:25:05way is to get somebody else to pay. London's financial heart and is a
0:25:05 > 0:25:10good place to look. Believe it or not, these youngsters are students
0:25:11 > 0:25:18being sponsored by an accountancy giant. The entire package was a
0:25:18 > 0:25:24degree, a salary, the tuition fees were paid and there is a job at the
0:25:24 > 0:25:32end and you were helped to become a chartered accountant. Did it sound
0:25:32 > 0:25:39too good to be true? There is no catch. You have to work hard. That
0:25:39 > 0:25:45is the only catch. The man who runs the programme tells me that the
0:25:45 > 0:25:49firm does not offer the stereotypical student experience.
0:25:49 > 0:25:53This is an intensive programme. They have to work for us and study
0:25:53 > 0:26:00for their degree and obtain their chartered accountancy
0:26:00 > 0:26:05qualifications. It requires hard work. That's all we ask of them.
0:26:05 > 0:26:11There are bursaries. Students from low-income families can get money
0:26:11 > 0:26:21from various sources. It is worth looking on the internet. Is there
0:26:21 > 0:26:22
0:26:22 > 0:26:29another way of avoiding debt? You can pay up front. This 16-year-old
0:26:29 > 0:26:39is trying to do that. As well as studying for her A-levels, she
0:26:39 > 0:26:44sells beauty products. I started my business to save up for university.
0:26:44 > 0:26:51My parents said it would be too much for them to pay. I hope to not
0:26:51 > 0:26:56get into debt because it takes a long while to get out of debt.
0:26:56 > 0:27:01government allows students to pay up front. Most will have to take
0:27:01 > 0:27:10out a loan. One financial expert believes graduates could pay back
0:27:10 > 0:27:17far more than anybody has predicted. This financial journalist warned
0:27:17 > 0:27:21students to be aware. The problem is that the deal is not a deal.
0:27:21 > 0:27:27There are numbers flying about saying you will be charged a
0:27:27 > 0:27:33certain rate of interest and payments will start at �21,000.
0:27:33 > 0:27:38None of those things are in the contract. In fact, the government
0:27:38 > 0:27:46can change the numbers if it wants to in five years' time, ten years'
0:27:46 > 0:27:51time. Students could end up paying more. Any big changes would have to
0:27:51 > 0:27:58be approved by Parliament. Like many Americans, I graduated with
0:27:58 > 0:28:03the equivalent of tens of thousands of pounds of debt. It was daunting.
0:28:03 > 0:28:13But if you know the facts, student debt does not have to be scary. I
0:28:13 > 0:28:14
0:28:14 > 0:28:19confronted it. So can you. That is it for this week. You can
0:28:19 > 0:28:25catch up on third BBC website if you missed any part of the
0:28:25 > 0:28:31programme. And you can find information on the website. I will
0:28:31 > 0:28:38see you next week. Next week, they say they are strapped for cash, but
0:28:38 > 0:28:46we reveal that our councils are sitting on millions of funding that