0:00:01 > 0:00:07Hello and welcome to Inside Out of North West. Tonight, we are live
0:00:07 > 0:00:12from Anfield as Parliament finally debates the Hillsborough disaster.
0:00:12 > 0:00:18I believe it was a cover up of Hillsborough, a blanket was put
0:00:18 > 0:00:21over Hillsborough, there is no doubt about that. I want the whole
0:00:21 > 0:00:31nation and the whole world to realise what we have been saying
0:00:31 > 0:00:36
0:00:36 > 0:00:42for 22 years. Hello and welcome to Anfield, the
0:00:42 > 0:00:44home of Liverpool Football Club. Right now Parliament is debating
0:00:44 > 0:00:52whether or not Government files relating to the Hillsborough
0:00:52 > 0:00:57Disaster can finally be released. 96 Liverpool fans died at the FA
0:00:57 > 0:00:59Cup semi final in Sheffield 22 years ago. Since then their
0:00:59 > 0:01:05families and friends have campaigned long and hard for the
0:01:05 > 0:01:08full facts surrounding the disaster to be made public. Tonight's debate
0:01:08 > 0:01:12offers fresh hope that at long last, they may finally get what they've
0:01:12 > 0:01:16been trying to achieve for over two decades. We've got a special report
0:01:16 > 0:01:23on that fight and with me are three guests who'll help us understand
0:01:23 > 0:01:33why it's taken so long to reach this point.
0:01:33 > 0:01:34
0:01:34 > 0:01:38First of all, let's get the latest from Westminster.
0:01:38 > 0:01:43This has been a powerful to be at this evening and more significant
0:01:43 > 0:01:47than many were expecting. I am here in Parliament, the Commons chamber
0:01:47 > 0:01:52just a few metres away where MPs are at this very moment debating
0:01:52 > 0:01:57the subject which is a subject remember that is being debated
0:01:57 > 0:02:01because so many people signed the petition and demanded that MPs come
0:02:01 > 0:02:07to the chamber and talk about it. The most significant development so
0:02:07 > 0:02:12far is that the Home Secretary, Theresa May, has promised that the
0:02:12 > 0:02:16families will see every single document, known pieces are blanked
0:02:16 > 0:02:25out, so they can see the truth for themselves when the documents are
0:02:25 > 0:02:30finally published. This was a debate opened by the MP who began
0:02:30 > 0:02:35asking for the government to apologise.
0:02:35 > 0:02:40A farcical review of evidence and a system that worked against instead
0:02:40 > 0:02:44of for the families has left a bitter taste. An unsympathetic
0:02:44 > 0:02:48government, and unsatisfactory judicial process and an unforgiving
0:02:48 > 0:02:54press has led observers to believe that an organised conspiracy was
0:02:54 > 0:02:58acting against the best interests of natural justice. Some
0:02:58 > 0:03:01parliamentary observers have said that it was one of the most moving
0:03:01 > 0:03:09moments in the House of Commons a little earlier this evening when
0:03:09 > 0:03:15Steve Rotherham read out the list of those who had died. Parliament
0:03:15 > 0:03:25has never recorded their names for prosperity. Tonight I can at least
0:03:25 > 0:03:39
0:03:40 > 0:03:43put one wrong right. John Anderson, S62.: Ashcroft, 19. Roger Ball, 16.
0:03:43 > 0:03:46That was a very moving moment in the House of Commons, the
0:03:46 > 0:03:49government listening and most importantly, the families
0:03:49 > 0:03:57themselves in the public gallery listening to this debate which they
0:03:57 > 0:04:02have waited so many years for. We'll be back later on in the
0:04:02 > 0:04:08programme. To talk to me about the implications of the debate we have
0:04:08 > 0:04:14a former Walton MP Peter Kilfoyle and also to survivors of the
0:04:14 > 0:04:19disaster, Peter Corry and Damien Cavanagh. Peter Kilfoyle, why has
0:04:19 > 0:04:24it taken so long? The rules of Parliament had changed so the way
0:04:24 > 0:04:29in which petitions are handled - it used to be the case that people
0:04:29 > 0:04:34would take a petition to Parliament, say a few words and that was the
0:04:34 > 0:04:42end of it. Now of course, because of changes in procedure, the
0:04:42 > 0:04:46government have to take notice of a petition. There are those who would
0:04:46 > 0:04:53say that your government failed to act on this, why was it not held so
0:04:53 > 0:04:58many years ago? That demand which is made now, was unanswered off.
0:04:58 > 0:05:01You mean the means of getting it into Parliament? Yes but I am
0:05:01 > 0:05:05saying there were debates. I had wanted a night of course but the
0:05:05 > 0:05:09way in which the system worked at that time, you could only speak for
0:05:09 > 0:05:1415 minutes and indeed the families came down for that debate and the
0:05:14 > 0:05:20then home secretary Michael Howard address the families. There was no
0:05:20 > 0:05:24way in which the wider public could press its case. The debate is still
0:05:24 > 0:05:27ongoing. You two were there that day and is survived, what do you
0:05:27 > 0:05:33make of the news that the Home Secretary Theresa May has stood up
0:05:33 > 0:05:36and said that Cabinet papers will be made available? I think it is
0:05:37 > 0:05:41fantastic, is about time that it did happen and every single paper
0:05:41 > 0:05:44should be released without any censorship. What are people
0:05:44 > 0:05:49expecting to see in these papers because much has been made of Mrs
0:05:49 > 0:05:56Thatcher organising a meeting 24 hours after the disaster where on
0:05:56 > 0:06:01Merseyside certainly, there is a theory of conspiracy, to blame the
0:06:01 > 0:06:05fans so what are you expecting to see? It is clear to us that there
0:06:05 > 0:06:10was a conspiracy because we were there and we are the experts. The
0:06:10 > 0:06:14inquiry reinforced what we thought and our experiences of but with
0:06:14 > 0:06:22regard to what we can expect to see, we expect to see as much publicity
0:06:22 > 0:06:28for the truth has we know and we hope then that it would give the
0:06:28 > 0:06:31arts community to the wider public. This is a step to exposing the
0:06:31 > 0:06:35wider truth but are you actively saying that you expect to see
0:06:35 > 0:06:39evidence of collusion when these papers are released? No, for
0:06:39 > 0:06:44example, there is a video missing from Leppings Lane. If that went
0:06:44 > 0:06:49missing, they could be other things that were not disclosed or whatever.
0:06:50 > 0:06:53What we want is as much disclosure as possible and everyone to see.
0:06:53 > 0:06:58Kids are learning about this at school now, it is as important as
0:06:58 > 0:07:02it was then. Theresa May stood up and said that those notes will come
0:07:02 > 0:07:06out but you have just heard than Damien there that there may still
0:07:07 > 0:07:10be suspicion. It is perfectly understandable that people will be
0:07:10 > 0:07:14cynical about commitments made by government ministers. We only have
0:07:14 > 0:07:17to look at what happened with the Iraqi war inquiries were all sorts
0:07:17 > 0:07:22of papers went missing. More importantly very often it is the
0:07:22 > 0:07:29nature of the record that is kept, it is so ambiguous that it is less
0:07:29 > 0:07:32than helpful. I understand perfectly those who have followed
0:07:32 > 0:07:38this journey over the last 22 years and I have watched the families
0:07:38 > 0:07:43being disappointed time after time. The two words on Merseyside are
0:07:43 > 0:07:47that resonate our truth and justice. Talk to me about justice, what do
0:07:48 > 0:07:52people want? Do they want to see police men prosecuted for
0:07:52 > 0:07:55negligence? I am sure there are plenty of people who want the
0:07:55 > 0:08:00police officers prosecuted for some kind of charge relating to the
0:08:00 > 0:08:04killing of those on Leppings Lane. On the other end of the spectrum,
0:08:04 > 0:08:08we have the inquest verdict that recorded accidental as the cause of
0:08:08 > 0:08:13death and that is absolute nonsense. These issues are going to have to
0:08:13 > 0:08:16be looked at when we see what is in the papers. Just for now, our fans
0:08:16 > 0:08:23going to be happy and satisfied with what they are seeing tonight
0:08:23 > 0:08:26as far as Theresa May standing up and say you'll get these papers?
0:08:26 > 0:08:31Habibie had got this far, public acknowledgement that this will
0:08:31 > 0:08:36happen but there is a long way to go. We went to see the full
0:08:36 > 0:08:41findings and a proper inquiry to go over everything. Have picked up to
0:08:42 > 0:08:46a point but still some way to go. More to come later from these three
0:08:46 > 0:08:49but as we have already said, it has taken 22 years to get this far.
0:08:49 > 0:08:53Families and friends have campaigned for so long and so hard
0:08:53 > 0:08:58for this moment and along the way, they have confronted many hurdles
0:08:58 > 0:09:02and obstacles and got over most of them. We look back now on this
0:09:02 > 0:09:12latest fight in a long flight of fights they have had for truth and
0:09:12 > 0:09:12
0:09:12 > 0:09:21justice on Merseyside. The clock was locked, the sun shone
0:09:21 > 0:09:29down on the pitch lighting up faces as death descended on Leppings Lane.
0:09:29 > 0:09:37Between the bars, an arm was raised amidst a human tidal wave. Her body
0:09:37 > 0:09:41too young to fight For breads is drowned in a sea of debt.
0:09:41 > 0:09:46April 15th, 1989, the FA semi Cup final between in Liverpool and
0:09:46 > 0:09:50Nottingham Forest becomes a human catastrophe. 96 fans are crushed to
0:09:50 > 0:09:54death but instead of sympathy and support, Liverpool supporters faced
0:09:54 > 0:09:57recriminations and are accused of causing their own a tragedy. The
0:09:57 > 0:10:03accusations were quickly proved to be groundless but for those who
0:10:03 > 0:10:07lost loved ones, the pain was just beginning. For 22 years, the
0:10:07 > 0:10:11families of these 96 victims have been in limbo, searching for
0:10:11 > 0:10:14answers, searching for closure but most of all, they have been
0:10:14 > 0:10:19searching for justice. It is a long road that could finally be coming
0:10:19 > 0:10:25to an end but it has been an emotional struggle to get to where
0:10:25 > 0:10:32they are today. It is so frustrating, over 22 years, 22
0:10:32 > 0:10:38years of hurt. I believe it was a cover up at Hillsborough. A blanket
0:10:38 > 0:10:42was put over Hillsborough, there's no doubt about that. Dave is a
0:10:42 > 0:10:45writer and a fanatical Liverpool supporter, he knew from experience
0:10:45 > 0:10:50that the Leppings Lane end at Hillsborough was a dangerous place
0:10:50 > 0:10:55when there was a full house. There was no control really of the
0:10:55 > 0:10:59central pens that were just cages. If they had been outlets to
0:10:59 > 0:11:03disperse the fans from inside the cage, but there wasn't, it was a
0:11:03 > 0:11:08trap. I remember Peter Beardsley hit the cross their at it was just
0:11:08 > 0:11:13shortly after that, things started to go bizarre. I heard screaming
0:11:13 > 0:11:17and it was people getting excited at first. Then I could see people
0:11:17 > 0:11:23screaming at the police, just faces pressed up against the bars and
0:11:23 > 0:11:31people begging you to try and help them and you on the other side of
0:11:31 > 0:11:37the cage and can do anything. It was horrendous, it really was. The
0:11:37 > 0:11:41fans at the back for pulling people up so the fans acted before the a
0:11:41 > 0:11:45authorities. By the time the police did react, it was far too late.
0:11:45 > 0:11:50Your instinct as a human being tells you when someone is in
0:11:50 > 0:11:56trouble and in serious injury but they just did not react. To the
0:11:56 > 0:12:02Prime Minister arrived accompanied by the home secretary. Mrs Thatcher
0:12:02 > 0:12:06said she watched in disbelief following that visit, the Lord
0:12:06 > 0:12:10Justice was appointed to conduct an inquiry into the relief of
0:12:10 > 0:12:15Liverpool fans his interim report concluded that failure of police
0:12:15 > 0:12:21control was the main cause of the tragedy. It was like the fans had
0:12:21 > 0:12:27cost it and the Smiths were being spread. It was so hurtful. When the
0:12:27 > 0:12:32report came out, the initial reaction was one of relief. He more
0:12:32 > 0:12:39less exonerated and blew away those stories. We thought, at last,
0:12:39 > 0:12:44somebody is going to tell the truth. The report was a false dawn. In
0:12:44 > 0:12:481991, the coroner stunned families by returning inquest verdicts of
0:12:48 > 0:12:56accidental death on all the victims. He ruled they must have received
0:12:56 > 0:13:03their injuries by 3:15pm which meant that any new evidence that
0:13:03 > 0:13:11said victims were alive at 4pm was inadmissible. When you leave --
0:13:11 > 0:13:20need the things, it is horrendous. That was probably the most hurtful
0:13:20 > 0:13:24and the families were broken, it really programme at that time.
0:13:24 > 0:13:27Margaret Gloucester 18 year-old son James in the disaster. It was his
0:13:27 > 0:13:32first away match. As chair of the Hillsborough Family Support Group,
0:13:32 > 0:13:38she has thrown her energy into the fight to uncover the truth. It has
0:13:38 > 0:13:41been very difficult over 22 years. If you start from the very
0:13:41 > 0:13:47beginning of the inquest and then the generic inquest then at the
0:13:47 > 0:13:50Taylor Report and of this to the scrutiny we have had and the trauma
0:13:50 > 0:13:55cases, private prosecutions, everything we have gone for it has
0:13:55 > 0:13:58always been doors closed in our faces. Campaigners felt the
0:13:58 > 0:14:08election of a Labour government in 1997 would finally bring a change
0:14:08 > 0:14:13
0:14:13 > 0:14:16in their fortune. Review the following year found nothing new.
0:14:16 > 0:14:21The two chief Superintendents on duty that day were cleared without
0:14:21 > 0:14:26charge. The it was game, set and match against that and that is the
0:14:26 > 0:14:31words I would use. Because we could not bring any of the Taylor report
0:14:31 > 0:14:36in when they went for the private prosecution. We couldn't bring it
0:14:36 > 0:14:39in at the generic inquest. Why when we need the whole trip at
0:14:39 > 0:14:45Hillsborough and yet we couldn't bring the Taylor report into any of
0:14:45 > 0:14:50it? Two years ago on the 20th anniversary of the disaster, the
0:14:50 > 0:14:57Culture Minister felt the anger of Liverpool at a special memorial
0:14:57 > 0:15:06service. He had to stand and listen while fans chanted justice for the
0:15:06 > 0:15:1096. This proved to be a turning point. A panel was set up to review
0:15:10 > 0:15:14the case once more. A BBC freedom of information request called for
0:15:14 > 0:15:19the release of government documents relating to the tragedy. Then this
0:15:19 > 0:15:24summer, 140,000 people signed a petition calling for the release of
0:15:24 > 0:15:28all paperwork prompting tonight's debate. It is historical what is
0:15:28 > 0:15:31happening here today. Really historical and I think everyone who
0:15:31 > 0:15:35signed the petition should be proud of themselves because I think they
0:15:35 > 0:15:41have set a precedent now and I think that is a wonderful thing but
0:15:41 > 0:15:47most importantly, to the 96 he died, who cannot speak for themselves, we
0:15:47 > 0:15:52have got to do it for them. when the whole world to realise
0:15:52 > 0:15:57what we have been saying for 22 years, which is that what happened
0:15:57 > 0:16:01on the day was down to the people in command of Hillsborough and
0:16:01 > 0:16:11nothing to do with the fans. The one that trip to come out, we all
0:16:11 > 0:16:35
0:16:35 > 0:16:4022 years ago, almost 10,000 people came here to remember the lives of
0:16:40 > 0:16:44the 96 people that died. 2,000 people stood inside and 8,000
0:16:44 > 0:16:47gathered outside. As they paid their respects, few of them could
0:16:47 > 0:16:56have imagine that more than two decades later, they would still be
0:16:56 > 0:17:04waiting to find out what really happened at Hillsborough. Mother
0:17:04 > 0:17:11Nature comforts the soul. It takes me to the field of gold. A
0:17:11 > 0:17:15beautiful vision. From 89. As time rolls on each passing year, I feel
0:17:15 > 0:17:25more close to those who fell. I live in hope that soon, we will
0:17:25 > 0:17:36
0:17:36 > 0:17:41hear, the deafening tone of the This is a live edition of the
0:17:41 > 0:17:46programme. We are focusing on the parliamentary debate, the
0:17:46 > 0:17:51historical parliamentary debate on the Hillsborough disaster. We have
0:17:51 > 0:17:55seen the MP for Walton putting through the motion, reading out the
0:17:55 > 0:18:00names of the 96 dead and speaking about a conspiracy that he hopes
0:18:00 > 0:18:03will be exposed. We heard the Home Secretary say that members, the
0:18:03 > 0:18:07families of the Hillsborough dead will receive the Cabinet papers,
0:18:07 > 0:18:12all of them, unredacted and uncensored, in other words, they
0:18:12 > 0:18:22will see everything. With me tonight, p to kill file, Peter
0:18:22 > 0:18:23
0:18:23 > 0:18:26Carney and Damien caveat. -- Peter Guilfoyle. We heard on the film
0:18:26 > 0:18:34about the 22 years of hurt, Peter, tell me what happened to you on
0:18:34 > 0:18:41that day? I was carried into the ground by the momentum from this
0:18:41 > 0:18:48slope that was in the tunnel. Abyss facing the back the way that I ate
0:18:48 > 0:18:54came in. -- I was facing. I eventually was knocked unconscious.
0:18:54 > 0:19:01I was carried out of the ground and I was lying out the back of the
0:19:01 > 0:19:05stand. The lads that had gone into the ground came in and that they
0:19:05 > 0:19:10realised that I was alive and well and they moved me to the recovery
0:19:10 > 0:19:18area and I was taken to hospital. Damian, you were on the pitch
0:19:18 > 0:19:27helping out, what role did you play? I was caught in the crush. I
0:19:27 > 0:19:31was towards the front of the terrace. My hands were up so I was
0:19:32 > 0:19:39able to edge myself up and I crawled over people's heads and I
0:19:39 > 0:19:44got through a gate and on to the pitch. There was no help from the
0:19:44 > 0:19:48police so why had to help myself, and that is the way I got out. I
0:19:48 > 0:19:54got on to the lads that re-using advertising boards as structures.
0:19:54 > 0:19:57People that work distressed and unconscious, I took part in helping
0:19:57 > 0:20:03her that and moving the fans up to the end of the pitch for medical
0:20:03 > 0:20:07treatment. There are many stories like this on Merseyside and they
0:20:07 > 0:20:13are always horrific when you hear them, you met all of the families
0:20:13 > 0:20:18involved, the families of the dead, how we anywhere nearer to
0:20:18 > 0:20:22Merseyside being able to move on? would sincerely hope so, but there
0:20:22 > 0:20:26is always a danger that you expect things, you were looking for things
0:20:26 > 0:20:32that may not be there. You do not know what is there, but what has
0:20:32 > 0:20:35been created over the 22 years with this sense of mistrust about
0:20:35 > 0:20:40anything that comes out from government. The full truth was
0:20:40 > 0:20:44never made available to the families. I do not know how it will
0:20:44 > 0:20:50end, some people will never get closer. We heard from Damian that
0:20:50 > 0:20:53he does not expect the full truth still, but let's focus on the 24
0:20:53 > 0:20:58hours after the disaster, Mrs Thatcher called a meeting of the
0:20:58 > 0:21:02Cabinet, these are the minutes we're going to get. What happens,
0:21:02 > 0:21:11Peter and Damian, I will start with you Peter, if there is no evidence
0:21:11 > 0:21:15of a conspiracy Auric collusion? will have to take note of the
0:21:15 > 0:21:17nature of the notes that are taken at these meetings, they will be
0:21:17 > 0:21:21paid them they will not be very clear. He will not find minutes
0:21:21 > 0:21:26saying that Margaret Thatcher told Bernard Ingram to tell people in
0:21:26 > 0:21:31the papers to write a pack of lies. We will be able to read him to them,
0:21:31 > 0:21:35the kind of direction that Margaret Thatcher was expecting the
0:21:35 > 0:21:39investigations to going. Does that put a false line through this
0:21:39 > 0:21:43procedure, if, for example, these papers are released and to do not
0:21:43 > 0:21:48take them at face value, the politicians will say, what else can
0:21:48 > 0:21:53they do? We are taking them for a face value, it is the meaning
0:21:53 > 0:21:57behind them, you cannot take them as being black and white paper, you
0:21:57 > 0:22:01have to understand what the words mean and what the intention is
0:22:01 > 0:22:04behind what is being said. There is no greater fault line than the
0:22:04 > 0:22:09false line created by Kelvin MacKenzie in the paper on the
0:22:09 > 0:22:14Tuesday. That was the Sun newspaper that said the truth. And it was the
0:22:14 > 0:22:19exact opposite, it was bare-faced liars and it is known to the fact
0:22:19 > 0:22:25on Merseyside. For those that do not know, the son accused fans are
0:22:25 > 0:22:30picking the pockets of other fans and much more work at things. --
0:22:30 > 0:22:34the Sun newspaper accused fans. They apologised, but it did not do
0:22:34 > 0:22:39them any good. Issues like that there will never go away.
0:22:39 > 0:22:45cannot easily forget the fact that Kelvin MacKenzie went to a meeting
0:22:45 > 0:22:51in Newcastle, and he withdrew his previous apology, he said he did it
0:22:51 > 0:22:55at the behest of Rupert Murdoch. The cartel but empathise with the
0:22:55 > 0:22:58families that feel as though they are being lied to repeatedly by
0:22:58 > 0:23:02people that were high up in the establishment in this country and
0:23:02 > 0:23:07should know better. It is a Conservative government releasing
0:23:07 > 0:23:10these papers, are you embarrassed Labour did not manage to do that?
0:23:10 > 0:23:15No, I am just embarrassed by the fact it was a Conservative
0:23:15 > 0:23:19government when the tragedy occurred and it went on until 1997,
0:23:19 > 0:23:25then there were a Labour government and Conservative governments, and
0:23:25 > 0:23:29they have all failed. They have all failed to make sure that the
0:23:29 > 0:23:34families had the truth and the just as they fought for her in those 22
0:23:34 > 0:23:38years. In Parliament, they are debating these issues, they hoped
0:23:38 > 0:23:48to redress that failure, let's go back to war political correspondent
0:23:48 > 0:23:48
0:23:48 > 0:23:51in Westminster with the latest. debate goes on. So far, we have
0:23:51 > 0:23:57heard from MPs from all of the parties in the region pressing very
0:23:57 > 0:24:04much for the same thing which is full disclosure of documents. The
0:24:04 > 0:24:09Prime Minister has walk past earlier today. -- walked past. He
0:24:09 > 0:24:13said that he was committed to the release of the documents. The
0:24:13 > 0:24:19question is, how many of these will the panel published? Theresa May
0:24:19 > 0:24:22went further than many people were expecting. We want to see full
0:24:22 > 0:24:27disclosure to the panel of all of the documents relating to
0:24:27 > 0:24:31Hillsborough, including Cabinet minutes. Those documents should be
0:24:32 > 0:24:37uncensored and unredacted. The fall unredacted Cabinet Office papers on
0:24:37 > 0:24:45Ellesborough have already been made available to the panel. -- the fall
0:24:45 > 0:24:50unredacted Cabinet Office papers. What about Andy Burnham? There is a
0:24:50 > 0:24:55belief of a cover-up and a conspiracy by police at the time.
0:24:55 > 0:24:58That is something that MPs have spoken about, and Andy Burnham was
0:24:58 > 0:25:02the Culture Secretary that led to the creation of the panel and has
0:25:02 > 0:25:06been at the forefront of this campaign, he spoke up in the
0:25:06 > 0:25:11Commons earlier and quoted from a document currently lodged in the
0:25:11 > 0:25:21House of Lords written by a police officer known simply as PCT to
0:25:21 > 0:25:22
0:25:22 > 0:25:27seven. -- PCTs 227. I was over, the motion but I soon realised that I
0:25:27 > 0:25:31would be no use to anyone if I felt sorry for myself. I was assisted
0:25:31 > 0:25:34onto the pitch and I saw several officers wandering around in a
0:25:34 > 0:25:37dazed and confused state, some people crying and some people
0:25:37 > 0:25:44sitting on the grass. Members of the public were running around
0:25:44 > 0:25:48ferrying people from the pitch to the far end of the ground. It is a
0:25:48 > 0:25:52long time since 1989 for the families and campaigners that once
0:25:52 > 0:25:59just as over Hillsborough. A long time they have had to go ahead with
0:25:59 > 0:26:02this campaign and with so many towns, they have been knocked back,
0:26:02 > 0:26:06they face secrecy, they had to fight hard for this debate. -- so
0:26:06 > 0:26:10many turns. They were helped by this public petition and that
0:26:10 > 0:26:14pushed for this debate this evening. They have heard from the Government,
0:26:14 > 0:26:22moving further their money be Boba had expected, and this will leave
0:26:22 > 0:26:26them with some hope this evening. - - than many people had expected.
0:26:26 > 0:26:33Hopefully they will finally get to the truth.
0:26:33 > 0:26:40Thank you. We are here live in Anfield with Peter Gill for while,
0:26:40 > 0:26:43Peter Carney and David caveat. We were hearing from Andy Burnham
0:26:43 > 0:26:49standing in Parliament, he felt that the police reaction was
0:26:49 > 0:26:55inadequate, he said officers were crying, unable to cope on the day,
0:26:55 > 0:27:01does that tied in with what you saw on the day? Damian you were on the
0:27:01 > 0:27:06pitch, does that tied him? Yes. The police response was too little too
0:27:06 > 0:27:10late. It was quite obvious there was a lot of suffering and there
0:27:10 > 0:27:14was death. If you look back at the date, you will see a lot of people
0:27:14 > 0:27:21in dark uniforms standing around and you see the people that escaped
0:27:21 > 0:27:26death getting stuck in. They were hoping on their own. Peter, from
0:27:26 > 0:27:30that small piece of news from Andy Burnham, many, many people on
0:27:30 > 0:27:34Merseyside will feel vindicated because they have said for years
0:27:34 > 0:27:38that the police did not react professionally enough. It has been
0:27:38 > 0:27:43a commonly held belief and it has been vindicated prior to tonight
0:27:43 > 0:27:47that in fact, the emergency services failed on the day. You
0:27:47 > 0:27:53only have to think about the ambulance that was not allowed into
0:27:53 > 0:27:57the stadium. There were police walking around and they did not
0:27:57 > 0:28:03know what to do. Poorly trained. are one step closer to the truth,
0:28:03 > 0:28:08Damian, the last word to you, what we mean just as to you? Just as
0:28:08 > 0:28:13well be, for a start, the world knowing the true story. -- just as
0:28:13 > 0:28:17well be. We want to know everything that happened, we want the facts. I
0:28:17 > 0:28:23never thought ever be standing here two years later, at the time what
0:28:23 > 0:28:29was seen on the TV was obvious to everybody. Thank you. That there
0:28:29 > 0:28:33would be more from us at 10:30pm in the late bulletin. From every when