:00:10. > :00:17.Welcome to the programme. In the next half hour, the former
:00:18. > :00:23.gang member convicted of murder who is trying to clear his name. I
:00:24. > :00:29.partly feel responsible because it was my group of friends that was
:00:30. > :00:32.responsible. How families of fans killed in the Hillsborough disaster
:00:33. > :00:37.are racing against time to find witnesses for the new inquests that
:00:38. > :00:41.start this month. They were with my dad in his last minutes. They try to
:00:42. > :00:49.save his life. My dad responded and opened his eyes while he was behind
:00:50. > :00:56.the goal. PSN trick and troubled company in -- the eccentric artist
:00:57. > :01:15.being compared to LS Lowry. One was sold for ?4000.
:01:16. > :01:23.The Court of Appeal is set to hear the case of a former Manchester gang
:01:24. > :01:26.member and convicted murderer. Dwaine George was jailed for 12
:01:27. > :01:31.years when a teenager was shot dead. He denied the murder, but was
:01:32. > :01:37.found guilty when the jury heard detailed forensic evidence about the
:01:38. > :01:43.gun. We asked Michael Gladwell, one of the most the back country's most
:01:44. > :01:50.experienced detectives to investigate.
:01:51. > :01:52.He will be sadly missed. The murder in 2001 of 18-year-old Daniel Dale
:01:53. > :01:59.shocked Manchester, a city already dubbed Gunchester as gang warfare
:02:00. > :02:01.claimed 30 lives in just five years. Disputes over drugs, money,
:02:02. > :02:07.territory and reputations spiralled into killings.
:02:08. > :02:15.Bullets took criminals and innocents alike.
:02:16. > :02:20.This is the man convicted by a jury of Daniel Dale's murder. Dwaine
:02:21. > :02:23.George served 12 years in prison and was released late last year. He's
:02:24. > :02:28.always denied involvement in the killing, and now hopes to clear his
:02:29. > :02:33.name. He was a teenager when he joined the notorious Cheetham Hill
:02:34. > :02:39.gang. People feared it. You went places, people respect you because
:02:40. > :02:43.they feared it. As a gang, we was known for robberies, drugs,
:02:44. > :02:49.partying. We'd get in fights from time to time. And that was the life
:02:50. > :02:55.really. Were people scared of you? Some people were, yeah. Incidents
:02:56. > :03:00.would happen spur of the moment. In town, in different areas. You could
:03:01. > :03:03.just meet a group of guys, and something could happen, a
:03:04. > :03:12.confrontation and we could end up fighting.
:03:13. > :03:16.The events that led to Dwaine's imprisonment began here on the steps
:03:17. > :03:22.of Manchester Crown Court on the afternoon of Tuesday July the 24th,
:03:23. > :03:27.2001. Another murder, but a different case.
:03:28. > :03:29.The white boys are supporting the victim's family. It includes
:03:30. > :03:34.18-year-old Daniel Dale who is due to give evidence. Dwaine George is
:03:35. > :03:38.part of the Cheetham Hill gang who are friends of the alleged killers.
:03:39. > :03:41.A noisy scuffle breaks out. One witness alleges Dwaine George made a
:03:42. > :03:48.death threat, but no-one else corroborates him. George denies it.
:03:49. > :03:51.The confrontation is the start of a chain reaction that will lead,
:03:52. > :03:52.within 24 hours, to Daniel Dale's murder and the start of another
:03:53. > :04:05.trial. One day later, and there's been
:04:06. > :04:08.another incident. Cheetham Hill has backed down in a street encounter
:04:09. > :04:11.with the white boys who outnumbered them. Now, they feel they've been
:04:12. > :04:18.disrespected, and some are seeking retaliation. Dwaine George admits he
:04:19. > :04:25.was there, but says he argued against revenge. So why didn't you
:04:26. > :04:31.retaliate on this occasion? I said leave it till another time. And what
:04:32. > :04:34.would that have been? It could have been anything. It could have just
:04:35. > :04:38.been bats, it could have been sticks, it could have been if people
:04:39. > :04:42.wanted guns, but for me at my particular moment that time for me
:04:43. > :04:45.was not the time. At his home, Aaron Cunningham stores a gun for Cheetham
:04:46. > :04:51.Hill in return for regular supplies of cannabis. Nathan Loftus, an old
:04:52. > :05:00.school friend of Dwaine George, makes a call. I'm coming to get that
:05:01. > :05:03.thing. Right. A minute later, Nathan calls back. The arrangement's
:05:04. > :05:14.changed, I'm not coming, it'll be Dwaine George. Now, Aaron Cunningham
:05:15. > :05:16.is expecting to see Dwaine George. In Miles Platting, the white youths,
:05:17. > :05:22.including some from yesterday's fracas at court, are on edge.
:05:23. > :05:27.They're expecting retaliation. Aaron Cunningham waits in his house, ready
:05:28. > :05:30.to deliver the weapon. Later he tells police, I saw the car drive
:05:31. > :05:37.off through the kitchen window, Dwaine was driving and Ryan was in
:05:38. > :05:40.the front passenger seat. Later, when this case came to court,
:05:41. > :05:45.Aaron Cunningham, who was under police protection, appeared as a
:05:46. > :05:51.Crown witness. He changed his story. He said, I didn't see him properly.
:05:52. > :06:00.I didn't really have a proper look and that. I just presumed it was
:06:01. > :06:03.Dwaine. The Red Honda has already been seen
:06:04. > :06:11.once. Suddenly it re-appears further down the road. I immediately knew it
:06:12. > :06:17.was the Cheetham Hill lads, and I just knew they would have guns.
:06:18. > :06:25.When you start to analyse what each of the witnesses saw in this murder,
:06:26. > :06:29.you end up with a confusing picture. Two men got out from the front near
:06:30. > :06:32.side and rear near side doors of the red car and both had a gun. They
:06:33. > :06:36.were about 5'10" and both wore masks. Both rear doors opened and
:06:37. > :06:40.two black males got out. The guy behind the driver's seat was small
:06:41. > :06:42.in height. The second guy was much bigger, about six" to 6'3". Both
:06:43. > :06:52.didn't have anything covering their faces. I'm trying to find out why
:06:53. > :06:54.witnesses to the same event can often see things completely
:06:55. > :06:58.differently. So I've come here today to the Royal Holloway University
:06:59. > :07:00.near Windsor to speak to one of the world's leading forensic
:07:01. > :07:03.psychologists and hope that they can shed some light on exactly why that
:07:04. > :07:05.is. Why does it happen that there are so many different accounts by
:07:06. > :07:08.these witnesses? This is not too surprising because
:07:09. > :07:11.the witnesses are not expecting to have their memories tested so
:07:12. > :07:13.they'll be attending to different things, they'll be experiencing
:07:14. > :07:20.different levels of emotion, they'll have different priorities as to what
:07:21. > :07:25.they all notice. Witnesses find it very difficult to make judgements of
:07:26. > :07:30.say height. For example, I'm quite short so I'm likely to describe you
:07:31. > :07:36.as very tall. The last two decades of research show that eyewitnesses
:07:37. > :07:39.can be unreliable. When detectives investigate a shooting they look for
:07:40. > :07:46.gunshot residue - the microscopic particles ejected during firing.
:07:47. > :07:51.These particles can land on the shooter and their clothing. The more
:07:52. > :07:56.particles, the stronger the link between weapon and suspect. In a
:07:57. > :08:05.coat at Dwaine George's house, forensic teams find gunshot residue,
:08:06. > :08:07.but only two minute particles. And, in a car belonging to Dwaine's
:08:08. > :08:14.mother, they discover a spent cartridge case which he admitted was
:08:15. > :08:28.his. I was in a house with my friend, he had a gun.
:08:29. > :08:35.He was messing around with the gun. The gun accidentally went off and he
:08:36. > :08:38.shot me in the foot. The shell case wasn't connected to the murder, but
:08:39. > :08:41.could it have contaminated the coat? A spent cartridge was found in a car
:08:42. > :08:45.that is associated with Dwaine George, could that have a bearing on
:08:46. > :08:48.anything? Very much so. One spent cartridge case will contain tens if
:08:49. > :08:52.not hundreds of thousands of gunshot residue particles. It'll be a
:08:53. > :08:55.repository of gunshot residue. And because these particles are so
:08:56. > :08:58.small, normally one, two, three microns, that even from a spent
:08:59. > :09:05.cartridge they can become easily airborne and contaminate everything
:09:06. > :09:09.round them. In the years since the murder, courts have become cautious
:09:10. > :09:12.about the value of gunshot residue. So with just two particles of the
:09:13. > :09:19.dust-like material, was it reliable evidence? Today, if an investigation
:09:20. > :09:25.found this sort of gunshot residue evidence, as an expert witness, what
:09:26. > :09:29.would you be advising the police? I would be advising the police that
:09:30. > :09:36.those levels are so low that you really can't come to any conclusion.
:09:37. > :09:42.In effect, they are insignificant. Did you murder Daniel Dale? No. Do
:09:43. > :09:56.you feel any responsibility for his do you ever think about the family?
:09:57. > :10:00.Yes. Do you feel any responsibility for his death? I partly feel
:10:01. > :10:02.responsible because it was my group of friends that was actually
:10:03. > :10:05.responsible for this murder. Dwaine George's case was prepared by law
:10:06. > :10:10.students in Cardiff working for the Innocence Project, set up to free
:10:11. > :10:12.people wrongly imprisoned. He converted to Islam in jail, and
:10:13. > :10:17.achieved a first class honours degree in social sciences.
:10:18. > :10:21.He's out of prison, but he can't escape his past.
:10:22. > :10:26.What do you feel about the friends who, you say, have let you rot in
:10:27. > :10:29.jail? There's definitely a sense of
:10:30. > :10:36.resentment, but at the same time there was a code that we had amongst
:10:37. > :10:41.ourselves that was a norm to honour. You know, you don't grass. It was
:10:42. > :10:44.just the expected thing, it was the norm. That's why if you did grass
:10:45. > :10:51.there'd be such bad repercussions against your family, your loved ones
:10:52. > :10:55.because it was a golden rule. And as much as now as a mature adult
:10:56. > :10:57.I see the fallacy of them values, they were the values that we lived
:10:58. > :11:16.by at the time. Coming up, why Cumbrian artist Percy
:11:17. > :11:19.Kelly died penniless? He wrote a nice letter with an illustration and
:11:20. > :11:20.would say, I am missing that painting, do you think I could have
:11:21. > :11:33.it back? There are just four weeks to go
:11:34. > :11:38.before the new inquests into a of the 96 Liverpool fans who died in
:11:39. > :11:43.the Hillsborough disaster. Their families want a different result
:11:44. > :11:47.from the original accidental death verdicts. After campaigning for 25
:11:48. > :11:49.years, they have spent the last few months in a desperate search for new
:11:50. > :12:03.witnesses and evidence. I didn't understand that my dad has
:12:04. > :12:08.gone to a football match and died, because he always went to the
:12:09. > :12:14.football. What I can change is hopefully that my brother didn't die
:12:15. > :12:24.a life. After more than 20 years of
:12:25. > :12:28.campaigning, the original accidental death verdict on the 96 people who
:12:29. > :12:34.died at Hillsborough were overturned. The court sought new
:12:35. > :12:40.inquest after an independent panel revealed alleged failings in the way
:12:41. > :12:44.that emergency services responded to the crash. Tonight, with a new
:12:45. > :12:48.inquest less than a month away, we report on the family's at all to
:12:49. > :12:58.find vital witnesses ahead of the new inquests. We went to games home
:12:59. > :13:03.and abroad, away, everywhere. Charlotte Hennessy is one of those
:13:04. > :13:11.searching for witnesses. She was six when her dad went to watch Liverpool
:13:12. > :13:17.play Nottingham Forest. He was 29 when he died. I don't render his
:13:18. > :13:22.voice. I don't remember his life, but I do remember him being there, I
:13:23. > :13:28.do remember loving him so much and being such a daddy's girl and
:13:29. > :13:35.feeling that love back. I think if I was ever hurt or injured, it will be
:13:36. > :13:41.my dad that I would want. The idea that their relatives'
:13:42. > :13:45.deaths were accidental has always infuriated the Hillsborough
:13:46. > :13:50.families. The judge who investigated the disaster said it was mainly
:13:51. > :13:56.caused by the police losing control of the crowd. Yet an inquest jury in
:13:57. > :14:06.Sheffield decided that all 96 deaths were accidental.
:14:07. > :14:12.It took 20 years of campaigning to set the Hillsborough panel. They
:14:13. > :14:16.said many had the potential to survive if the emergency response
:14:17. > :14:22.had been different. One of the 41 was Jimmy Hennessy. Now his daughter
:14:23. > :14:26.is searching for a St John's ambulance man who tried to revive
:14:27. > :14:29.his father behind the goal. She hopes to find the ambulance men in
:14:30. > :14:35.time for the new inquests. Della mac they withdrew my dad in the last
:14:36. > :14:39.minutes. They tried to save his life. My dad responded and opened
:14:40. > :14:47.his eyes while he was behind the goal, so of course he needs to give
:14:48. > :14:51.evidence. Charlotte and the other families have already travelled to
:14:52. > :14:56.London five times for hearings to sort out legal and practical issues
:14:57. > :15:02.before the new inquests. She is hoping there may also be news of her
:15:03. > :15:06.search in the latest hearing. Growing up, one thing that used to
:15:07. > :15:14.bother me was whether or not my dad was frightened. That used to really
:15:15. > :15:22.upset me. We will never know if he was still alive, if he was found, if
:15:23. > :15:24.he died later. Shallot joins other Hillsborough Family Support Group
:15:25. > :15:29.reign quest hearing, but there is no news today of the man she believes
:15:30. > :15:34.helped her family. There was still no mention of St John ambulance
:15:35. > :15:41.people who have come forward, so I think it is just waiting for another
:15:42. > :15:44.update. Shallot's surge is important, because these new
:15:45. > :15:49.inquests will have a wider scope than the original ones. One of the
:15:50. > :15:53.most controversial aspects of the original inquests was the coroner's
:15:54. > :15:58.decision not to hear evidence about what happened after 3:15pm on the
:15:59. > :16:02.day of the disaster. He ruled that while 96 would have suffered their
:16:03. > :16:08.fatal injuries by then. But that meant that the response of the
:16:09. > :16:11.police, the ambulance people, and others, was never examined at the
:16:12. > :16:16.inquest. That response will be examined at the new hearings, and
:16:17. > :16:25.that is why it is so important for the families to find as many
:16:26. > :16:28.witnesses as they can. I'm sure he was a Scouse in a previous life,
:16:29. > :16:35.because anything to do with Liverpool, his favourite
:16:36. > :16:43.programmes, he even used to talk Scouse. Louise Brooks's brother died
:16:44. > :16:48.at Hillsborough. He was 26. Louise is still searching for a man she
:16:49. > :16:52.thinks may have been a doctor, who apparently helped Andrew on the
:16:53. > :16:58.peerage after 3:15pm. Entry is still searching for another man, marked
:16:59. > :17:07.with a red arrow, pictured near Andrew in the crowd. I feel I am
:17:08. > :17:14.against the clock. I just want my brother to... I want all of the
:17:15. > :17:20.information possible about this at my brother's inquest. So everybody
:17:21. > :17:24.has the full facts. I can't come back in ten years' time and say,
:17:25. > :17:35.excuse me, I found something else, because that will never happen. What
:17:36. > :17:46.I can change is, hopefully, change that my brother didn't die a lie.
:17:47. > :17:54.That's what hopefully I can participate in changing. The
:17:55. > :17:57.inquests are part of three enquiries into Hillsborough. The Independent
:17:58. > :18:01.Police Complaints Commission is looking at the ledge of the least
:18:02. > :18:06.misconduct after the disaster. At offices in Warrington, Operation
:18:07. > :18:12.Resolve is examining whether any crimes were committed before it. But
:18:13. > :18:22.both Operation Resolve and the IPCC are also gathering evidence for the
:18:23. > :18:25.new inquests. One of the areas being investigated are safety,
:18:26. > :18:31.preparations for the match, and crowd management, as well as the
:18:32. > :18:36.cause of death for all 96. They have already interviewed more than 1000
:18:37. > :18:40.people. One new feature the resulting will provide for the
:18:41. > :18:45.inquests are individual diaries of the movements of each of the
:18:46. > :18:48.victims. They have made compilations of CCTV, police, and TV images,
:18:49. > :18:53.showing the victims arriving at the grounds, in the ground, and in some
:18:54. > :19:03.cases, on the pitch after the crutch. -- crash. This woman lost
:19:04. > :19:09.her stepson. She has already seen his video. When I saw was horrific.
:19:10. > :19:13.It was not because the police were being brutal, but because they had
:19:14. > :19:22.to get people out so quickly, and they were tangled, and it was like
:19:23. > :19:34.they were being batted out of a small hole of a doorway. The new
:19:35. > :19:40.inquest starts in Warrington on March 31. It could last until
:19:41. > :19:44.Christmas or beyond. I never went to my brother's original inquest. If I
:19:45. > :19:51.look back now, I feel I should have been there. I understand why my
:19:52. > :19:56.parents tried to protect me, so I feel I have aged second chants now
:19:57. > :20:01.to do right by my brother. -- a second chance. Is about doing the
:20:02. > :20:08.best I could to find out what happened to my dad. I want to be his
:20:09. > :20:16.voice, because he went to a football match and didn't come home.
:20:17. > :20:24.Wordsworth, Ruskin, Wainwright - all famous names who've been inspired by
:20:25. > :20:33.Cumbria's landscape. What about the name Percy Kelly? If not, you still
:20:34. > :20:36.will -- you still will Jacey Normand has been on the trail of Percy, a
:20:37. > :20:37.troubled and eccentric artist, who only after his death is getting
:20:38. > :20:49.wider recognition for his work. He drew everything in sight all his
:20:50. > :20:58.life. It was compulsive. He couldn't not paint or draw. He was amazing. A
:20:59. > :21:01.one-off. I don't know what it is, but it is something that makes
:21:02. > :21:09.people think, I want that, and I like it. This is the landscape that
:21:10. > :21:12.Percy Kelly loved, so I've come to find out more about a prolific
:21:13. > :21:17.artist with an equally incredible life story. He wasn't interested in
:21:18. > :21:21.the chocolate box district, but of the down to earth beauty of West
:21:22. > :21:24.Cumbria. So that is where I'm headed. I'm meeting up with Chris, a
:21:25. > :21:35.former art gallery owner. She's researched and written about Percy's
:21:36. > :21:40.life and work. When did Percy says come to hear? His first wife moved
:21:41. > :21:48.here with him in 1958. They gave up the post office and bought Glen
:21:49. > :21:57.cottage around the corner. What was his early life like? The family were
:21:58. > :22:04.porn. The family were poor. They were a religious family, and he was
:22:05. > :22:08.a twin. Really? Yes. Use the back room as his studio, which was a tiny
:22:09. > :22:14.room. He had a huge printing press in there. And Percy, who was always
:22:15. > :22:21.short of cash is still remembered in the village shop today. He used to
:22:22. > :22:27.want to exchange his paintings for groceries. Did you take any? ? mac
:22:28. > :22:31.know, but I wish we did now. But his time in Allonby came to a swift end
:22:32. > :22:40.one night when he revealed a secret to his wife. She could see a fire
:22:41. > :22:43.flickering, and thought a good, Percy is home. There was a strange
:22:44. > :22:47.man sitting with his back to her. The woman turned around, and it was
:22:48. > :22:52.Percy in her dress. He was asking for help with his make up. She threw
:22:53. > :22:54.him out and locked him out and changed the locks. He never lived
:22:55. > :22:56.here again. Throughout the rest of his life, he'd alternate between
:22:57. > :23:04.being Percy and Roberta. My next stop is a short drive cross
:23:05. > :23:07.country to Isel, near Cockermouth. I've come to visit an old friend of
:23:08. > :23:18.Percy's, who spotted the potential of his work. I thought it was very
:23:19. > :23:22.good. So original. The chief thing about it was it belonged to Cumbria,
:23:23. > :23:25.and he adored Cumbria. Mary was the director of the Abbot Hall Art
:23:26. > :23:37.Gallery in Kendal, and exhibited his work in the 1960s. He was fixed on
:23:38. > :23:41.artistry. I think that was why he was successful. After the break-up
:23:42. > :23:44.of his marriage, he came to Mendel 's Hall with his new partner
:23:45. > :23:47.Christine. He lived in one of these cottages a few miles from the famous
:23:48. > :23:51.topiary. Mavis Aitchison remembers visiting Percy. Mavis remembers a
:23:52. > :23:59.prolific artist, who refused to cash in on his work. When it we came to
:24:00. > :24:04.visit him, we went into the hall, and there was a stack of paintings
:24:05. > :24:10.along the hall. I think they were some of the ones he painted when we
:24:11. > :24:15.in Brittany. They were highly coloured and floral. They were very
:24:16. > :24:25.attractive. I said, are you going to sell any of these? No, no. One
:24:26. > :24:28.critic said he was one of those artists who believed in his own
:24:29. > :24:33.value, and he wanted others to share that high opinion. But it is coming
:24:34. > :24:37.come around to selling his artwork in order to achieve it. In other
:24:38. > :24:42.words, he craved recognition, but couldn't part with his paintings. He
:24:43. > :24:47.was always sorry when a painting went, and sometimes he asked for
:24:48. > :24:50.them back. He would like to somebody a nice letter with an illustration
:24:51. > :24:57.and say, I really miss that painting. Do you think I could have
:24:58. > :25:01.it back? He changed his mind. Yes. In 1973, Percy and Christine moved
:25:02. > :25:06.to St David's, in Wales, and then on to Norfolk.
:25:07. > :25:11.And after years of hardship, and Percy refusing to sell his work,
:25:12. > :25:19.Christine could take no more - she left him.
:25:20. > :25:29.I think she couldn't stand being so poor, and the frustration of knowing
:25:30. > :25:32.there was this wealth of dutiful art, really interesting paintings,
:25:33. > :25:40.just sitting there not doing anything. -- beautiful art. So with
:25:41. > :25:43.Percy alone and in exile in Norfolk, how did his work find its way back
:25:44. > :25:48.to his home county? I'm heading to Kendal in search of answers. "Dear
:25:49. > :25:51.Miss David. Thank you so much for your letter, which arrived today.
:25:52. > :25:54.Your very kind and appreciative words about my work really touched
:25:55. > :25:57.me. It is so rare to hear such compliments, and since I am
:25:58. > :26:07.experiencing the darkest period of my life, I got quite a lift. He was
:26:08. > :26:10.replying to join David, an art lover from Kendal. She'd been captivated
:26:11. > :26:17.by one of Percy's pictures, and wrote to him asking to buy some of
:26:18. > :26:22.his work. Was the tentative beginnings of a feud letters going
:26:23. > :26:28.back and forwards rapidly developed into something on an ongoing basis.
:26:29. > :26:33.Did he have any idea how many letters they were? No, not until we
:26:34. > :26:38.opened the trunk after my mother's death, and it turns out they're
:26:39. > :26:44.worth around 1500 letters in the trunk. It is amazing, because mother
:26:45. > :26:50.and Percy only met for a five times in their lives. "Dear Mr Kelly.
:26:51. > :26:53."What an amazingly generous person you are. I have been living on air
:26:54. > :27:01.since your most beautiful painted letter arrived." She sent him the
:27:02. > :27:04.stamps, so he didn't even have to pay for the stamps to keep the
:27:05. > :27:07.correspondence going. And it was his good friend Joan, and Chris, who
:27:08. > :27:12.rescued the artwork crammed into Percy's tiny Norfolk cottage after
:27:13. > :27:22.his death in 1993. Finally his work would get a wider audience. In 1994,
:27:23. > :27:27.no one really knew about him, and yet when the catalogue went out, I
:27:28. > :27:31.had a queue down the hill for those paintings. Every exhibition since
:27:32. > :27:39.then, there has been a queue outside the door. Now he has hit London. He
:27:40. > :27:45.hit London about three or four years ago, and last December, one of his
:27:46. > :27:49.paintings sold for ?4000. I think he would be very startled at that now.
:27:50. > :27:57.It's now highly prized - he's even been compared to LS Lowry. So Percy
:27:58. > :28:00.Kelly - "talented", "troubled", "a genius", "warm" - all descriptions
:28:01. > :28:02.made about him. He's certainly not been forgotten in his beloved
:28:03. > :28:05.Cumbria. Sadly, long after his death, interest continues to grow in
:28:06. > :28:14.his work- but then he always knew that would be the case. I cannot
:28:15. > :28:18.paint for monetary gain. I would rather starve than sell one piece of
:28:19. > :28:21.my work. But I know when I depart this world, people. And wonder at
:28:22. > :28:29.the beauty and truth that I have portrayed.
:28:30. > :28:35.What a fascinating life story. That is it from us for this week, and for
:28:36. > :28:38.the series. Don't forget you can catch is again on I player, but we
:28:39. > :28:44.will be back in the autumn. Until, goodbye.