:00:07. > :00:16.A living nightmare, the reality for women who have a stalker. I looked
:00:16. > :00:19.at him and his face was... I knew he was going to kill me. How the
:00:19. > :00:26.Kents wine-growers at marriage the wettest drought we've ever known.
:00:26. > :00:33.It is the first time I have known it be this late and we will be
:00:33. > :00:38.picking the crop late. And a Brighton campaign to stop reptiles
:00:38. > :00:42.being kept as pets. We have huge public and political support to
:00:42. > :00:49.achieve our aims and I am confident we will get there. It will never
:00:49. > :00:54.happen. We will continue the struggle. We will not be beaten.
:00:54. > :01:04.am Natalie Graham with untold stories closer to home from all
:01:04. > :01:15.
:01:15. > :01:19.around the south-east, this is Hello, I'm in Biddenden in Kent. We
:01:19. > :01:22.are back later but first, Imagine what it's like having a stalker.
:01:22. > :01:25.Someone following you around - threatening and intimidating you.
:01:25. > :01:30.Now a new law is about to come into force that specifically
:01:30. > :01:39.concentrates on making stalking a crime. But will it make women any
:01:39. > :01:41.safer? We all get a certain pleasure from
:01:41. > :01:45.watching a horror film when your heart starts beating faster the
:01:45. > :01:48.adrenalin starts pumping. But what's it like when you can't turn
:01:48. > :01:51.the television off, when you've lost all control, all your security
:01:51. > :02:01.has gone all the normality in your life, that's what it's like when
:02:01. > :02:03.
:02:03. > :02:12.It's a hidden crime that's often misunderstood, it's a crime that's
:02:12. > :02:15.very hard to prove and a crime that can lead to murder. I will always
:02:15. > :02:19.know when my stalker is out and about and following me because I
:02:19. > :02:22.can feel it. I don't necessarily see him some of the time but I can
:02:22. > :02:26.sense it instinctively know that he is around and it makes me feel very
:02:26. > :02:29.scared and very frightened. find yourself in a period where,
:02:29. > :02:32.you know, lying down because you can't physically get up then it all
:02:32. > :02:42.starts again, you know you'll get that phone call or you'll there is
:02:42. > :02:46.
:02:46. > :02:49.It may seem like a letter here, the odd text there, someone walking
:02:49. > :02:55.past you in the street, but for victims it means living your life
:02:55. > :02:58.in constant fear. The vast majority of stalking is vicious unpleasant,
:02:58. > :03:00.intimidating behaviour by obsessive fixated men who want to hurt and
:03:00. > :03:10.damage their victims and tragically every year dozens of women are
:03:10. > :03:18.
:03:18. > :03:21.seriously hurt and many of them are It's estimated that there are
:03:21. > :03:27.120,000 cases of stalking in the UK every year, and it's mainly men
:03:27. > :03:34.threatening women. Women are often stalked hundreds of times before
:03:34. > :03:38.having the courage to report it. But those who do report it often
:03:38. > :03:41.feel they're not taken seriously by the police, or by prosecutors. And
:03:41. > :03:47.even if they are taken seriously, they feel that the current law is
:03:47. > :03:51.inadequate. Until now there has been no specific law that defines
:03:51. > :03:57.stalking as a criminal offence. Cases were prosecuted under the
:03:57. > :04:00.Protection Against Harassment Act. But now things are about to change.
:04:00. > :04:03.After a group of victims came to Parliament and told their personal
:04:03. > :04:13.stories, a new law has been introduced which makes stalking a
:04:13. > :04:14.
:04:14. > :04:20.And in a few weeks' time the new law comes into force but how
:04:20. > :04:23.exactly will it help victims? Stalkers are rarely strangers, Sam
:04:23. > :04:29.Taylor from Brighton has been stalked by her ex-partner for the
:04:29. > :04:33.past four years. Because we'd all known him, because obviously people
:04:33. > :04:43.like this who behave in this way they don't look like Darth Vader or
:04:43. > :04:47.
:04:47. > :04:51.Voldemort, they just look like Her ordeal started when she found
:04:51. > :04:59.out her partner was on the sex offenders' register for raping a
:04:59. > :05:02.child eight years before he met her. She asked him to leave the family
:05:02. > :05:06.home and that's when things took a sinister turn for the worse.
:05:06. > :05:09.night after I put the children to bed, I came into the living room
:05:09. > :05:13.and I was picking up toys that the children had been playing with and
:05:13. > :05:17.I stood up to find a massive knife, unfolded on the shelf next to me,
:05:17. > :05:27.and and then I looked at him and his face was, I knew he was going
:05:27. > :05:31.
:05:31. > :05:36.It's indescribable, really it's like an animal instinct. His face
:05:36. > :05:40.had completely changed. Sam and her children moved in with
:05:40. > :05:46.her parents. He was arrested and released on bail then the stalking
:05:46. > :05:50.began. He seemed to know where I was the
:05:50. > :05:53.whole time, so if I parked in a car park in the town centre he would
:05:53. > :05:59.know where my car was. He would leave toys, letters, money, on the
:05:59. > :06:03.windscreen of my car. When I was driving around when I pulled out of
:06:03. > :06:07.a road he'd suddenly drive past, he just knew everywhere I was. I went
:06:07. > :06:11.back to my home with my father and as soon as I went into the front
:06:11. > :06:19.garden he was there calling out my name so I raced back into the house,
:06:19. > :06:22.phoned the police. While the police were on their way to my house my
:06:22. > :06:31.mum phoned me screaming down the phone because he was now trying to
:06:31. > :06:35.The campaign of stalking, and intimidation continued. He was
:06:35. > :06:39.constantly arrested and yet he still managed to harass her. Even
:06:39. > :06:42.from prison. He sent hundreds of letters from
:06:42. > :06:45.prison, sometimes he would just send letters calling me a different
:06:45. > :06:49.name to get around the restraining order, he sent me this letter here
:06:49. > :06:59.which is a suicide letter, just to give you a quick example of the
:06:59. > :07:03.kind of things that he would say: 'I'm so sorry, but I'm off to a
:07:03. > :07:13.better place which is pain-free. I'll always be by your side trying
:07:13. > :07:17.
:07:17. > :07:22.to look after you. Your very own She and her children were assessed
:07:22. > :07:26.by police as being at high risk of homicide. And yet he was allowed to
:07:26. > :07:31.live just five minutes from her house. Despite all of his previous
:07:31. > :07:36.convictions he was able to apply from prison to see his children.
:07:36. > :07:39.And she had to face him in court. What was really horrifying, I think,
:07:39. > :07:42.initially was the fact that he was permitted to break his restraining
:07:42. > :07:51.order, to enter the area of Brighton and Hove, in order to
:07:51. > :07:55.attend the family court. I'd also requested screens in court and it
:07:55. > :08:01.was stated that that would be up to the judge on the day. And every
:08:01. > :08:03.single time I attended the family court I was refused screens.
:08:03. > :08:09.Eventually social services assessed the situation and decided Sam's
:08:09. > :08:14.partner was dangerous. He then withdrew his application to see the
:08:14. > :08:17.children, but is able to apply to see them again. Sam feels that
:08:17. > :08:23.because of his previous convictions her ex-partner should not have been
:08:23. > :08:26.able to apply to see them in the first place. She feels she was let
:08:26. > :08:32.down by a system that was supposed to protect her and her children and
:08:32. > :08:35.she's not the only one. 125,000 victims a year, only half report it
:08:35. > :08:39.to the police, and of that half, 50,000, just 2% of perpetrators
:08:39. > :08:41.went to jail, 10% were fined or given a community sentence, and the
:08:41. > :08:50.rest of the cases just disappeared into the ether, they were
:08:50. > :08:53.discontinued. So proof that the victims are not taken seriously by
:08:53. > :09:00.the police, by prosecutors and even by the probation service that I
:09:00. > :09:03.work with. Claire Waxman from London has been stalked by an
:09:04. > :09:09.obsessive man for nearly a decade. She also feels that she was not
:09:09. > :09:13.taken seriously. When I first went to the police, there wasn't much
:09:13. > :09:16.understanding of what was going on for me. A few of them made jokes at
:09:16. > :09:24.the very start, that it was very flattering what I was experiencing
:09:24. > :09:28.and they didn't understand why I was feeling fearful. You don't
:09:28. > :09:31.choose to be a victim, a victim of a crime. I naively thought you go
:09:31. > :09:34.to the police, and then it goes to court, and then it all gets sorted.
:09:34. > :09:37.I remember the first court case being really hopeful that this
:09:37. > :09:40.would be the only court case I would ever have to attend, and
:09:40. > :09:43.naively thought 'wonderful, it'll all be sorted'. And now nine years
:09:43. > :09:46.later, of so many court cases and hearings and appeals and sentences
:09:46. > :09:56.that it's shown me that there is so little understanding within the
:09:56. > :09:57.
:09:57. > :10:00.system of stalking, and of what victims go through.
:10:00. > :10:02.Sam and Claire were two of six victims that spoke to MPs about
:10:03. > :10:06.their terrifying experiences, reducing many of them to tears, and
:10:06. > :10:12.bringing about the change in the law. So just how will it help
:10:12. > :10:16.victims? What we now have is stalking defined in law, as either
:10:16. > :10:18.creating a fear of violence to the woman, or in some cases the man, or
:10:18. > :10:26.psychological damage such that the individual changes their normal
:10:26. > :10:29.daily behaviour to avoid contact with the stalker. We already have a
:10:29. > :10:35.law in Scotland, a stalking law, that came in in December 10, and
:10:35. > :10:40.already there have been close on 500 prosecutions. In the previous
:10:40. > :10:44.ten years there were 7 a year. many victims, and campaigners
:10:44. > :10:47.believe that the law change alone won't be enough. They want police
:10:47. > :10:57.and prosecutors better trained to deal with stalking and for
:10:57. > :10:57.
:10:57. > :11:01.attitudes to change. Why is it officers have not always taken this
:11:01. > :11:04.crime as seriously as they might? think the police service has
:11:04. > :11:07.changed quite a lot. We're much better at learning from mistakes
:11:07. > :11:10.now, there've been a number of high profile incidents that have served
:11:10. > :11:13.as really good examples of how we could have done things better.
:11:13. > :11:19.is part of the problem that an officer will listen to one offence
:11:19. > :11:22.that's been committed but not link it up to all the others. Yes,
:11:22. > :11:24.absolutely, I think that has happened, I think this law will
:11:24. > :11:27.help, because it frames a course of action around stalking, either
:11:27. > :11:30.violent or non-violent, but certainly I think there has, there
:11:30. > :11:33.are examples and Sam's is a good example of where we've looked at a
:11:33. > :11:36.number of different crimes in isolation rather than a pattern of
:11:36. > :11:46.behavior and I think this will help in changing that and painting a
:11:46. > :11:53.
:11:53. > :11:56.holistic picture when we take the So both Claire's and Sam's story
:11:56. > :12:00.have helped to change the law and they are hopeful that this will
:12:01. > :12:04.start to make a difference. And Sam feels that the change in the law is
:12:04. > :12:07.a step in the right direction but for her like many victims of
:12:07. > :12:10.stalking, the fear and anxiety will always be there. Will it ever be
:12:10. > :12:14.over for you? No, I don't, because when you're assessed as high risk
:12:14. > :12:17.the risk never goes away. So I can just carry on as I am, raising
:12:17. > :12:22.awareness of the situation and trying to make it better for myself
:12:22. > :12:32.and for other people. In a way your voice is your power. Yes,
:12:32. > :12:36.
:12:36. > :12:45.Coming up on Inside Out: Keeping reptiles as pets, is it
:12:45. > :12:50.cruel or are campaigners over- reacting? There are such a range of
:12:50. > :12:54.factors that can describe why an animal behaves in a certain way, it
:12:54. > :12:58.is wrong to say that it is doing it because it is stressed. We need to
:12:58. > :13:01.get cleverer Fermat. Now, if you are watching Inside Out,
:13:01. > :13:03.sipping a well-earned glass of Chardonnay and looking forward to
:13:03. > :13:13.this year's Beaujolais Nouveau, spare a thought for Kent's
:13:13. > :13:15.
:13:15. > :13:19.vineyards with wine expert Tim Atkin. There are some grapes at the
:13:19. > :13:23.bottom that are not so good near the road. We will be ruthless about
:13:23. > :13:31.what we pick to start with. Welcome to Biddenden, the oldest
:13:31. > :13:34.commercial vineyard in Kent. Grapes were first cultivated on these
:13:34. > :13:37.gentle south-facing slopes near Ashford way back in 1969.$$NEWLINE
:13:37. > :13:47.It's the busiest time of the season for owner Julian Barnes with the
:13:47. > :13:52.grape harvest finally underway. It's the busiest time of year for
:13:52. > :13:55.the owner with the grape harvest under way but this year it is
:13:55. > :13:59.better late than never. Julian, what has it been like
:13:59. > :14:01.growing grapes in a year like this? I think it has been a really
:14:01. > :14:05.wearing time. Torrential downpour after torrential downpour. When you
:14:05. > :14:09.are sitting there with a crop like this, you don't sleep and then when
:14:09. > :14:12.you get up it has been grey all day and of course the other side of
:14:12. > :14:14.that if obviously the amount that people have been able to enjoy
:14:14. > :14:18.themselves and the feel good factor is obviously relevant to sales.
:14:18. > :14:21.Because tourism is a big bit of what you do here isn't it? We have
:14:21. > :14:25.had 33,000 visitors this year to the vineyard, and I can't say that
:14:25. > :14:28.we've ever had a weekend when we've had people sitting around the yard
:14:28. > :14:31.drinking bottles of wine. And some of his grapes may not make it into
:14:31. > :14:34.a bottle at all. There will be varieties, I think, probably like
:14:34. > :14:37.Gamay, that we don't normally pick until the end of October beginning
:14:37. > :14:41.of November, when the leaves are starting to fall. If we pick those
:14:41. > :14:44.I would be very surprised. What grapes need over the summer is
:14:44. > :14:50.some nice sunbathing weather, and we all know there has been precious
:14:50. > :14:53.little of that this summer. In fact this has been the second dullest
:14:53. > :15:00.and wettest summer since records began, and to add insult to injury,
:15:00. > :15:03.temperatures have been half a degree below average too.
:15:03. > :15:06.And a poor harvest is the last thing our vignerons need right now,
:15:06. > :15:15.just as English wines are beginning to make their mark at home and
:15:15. > :15:19.abroad. It has that aromatic quality as well. If you don't get
:15:19. > :15:23.that in English wine, there is something wrong with it. It is
:15:23. > :15:27.classic English. Julia Trustram Eve speaks for the
:15:27. > :15:30.English Wine Producers. What we have seen is a real growth in the
:15:30. > :15:33.industry over the past few years. Over the last seven years for
:15:33. > :15:36.example our acreage has almost doubled. And what does this
:15:36. > :15:38.terrible summer mean for English wine? It has certainly been a very
:15:38. > :15:41.challenging year, we can't deny that fact. We've all lived through
:15:41. > :15:45.the summer of 2012, haven't we? But it's interesting, it has been
:15:45. > :15:48.patchy in the sense that you've got some parts of the country where
:15:48. > :15:50.really the grapes, the quality of the grapes is looking good and
:15:50. > :16:00.we've got others that obviously have been challenged because it has
:16:00. > :16:19.
:16:19. > :16:22.been a difficult year for them. Worrying signs that this year's
:16:22. > :16:25.harvest could prove troublesome were plain to see when we visited
:16:25. > :16:28.Biddenden back in the summer. Here you can see the problem we
:16:28. > :16:31.have had with the wet weather this year. The small grapes that you can
:16:31. > :16:34.see within the bunch are where the grape hasn't set properly at
:16:34. > :16:38.flowering time because it is so wet. Each individual grape has like a
:16:38. > :16:41.cap and it produces a little flower, and if that cap doesn't come off
:16:41. > :16:45.and it sticks on there, then you get these tiny little grapes that
:16:45. > :16:47.are going to be very sweet, but there are not enough of the bigger
:16:47. > :16:51.berries on the outside of it to give you any quantity.
:16:51. > :16:55.I think this is the first time for a long time that I've known it
:16:55. > :16:59.being this late and it is going to leave it very close to the mark in
:16:59. > :17:01.terms of being able to produce the quality, it will be a brave man who
:17:01. > :17:04.wins, I think. But if you think the signs have
:17:04. > :17:07.been looking ominous at Biddenden, spare a thought for the owner of
:17:07. > :17:10.this vineyard a little further north in Suffolk. Neil Gillis sells
:17:10. > :17:13.his wine to local shops, pubs and restaurants, as well as sharing
:17:13. > :17:15.with friends. Can I try the Thelnetham fizz? Certainly, let us
:17:15. > :17:19.have a go at opening match. Output is small, just 3,000 bottles
:17:19. > :17:23.a year, so it is more of a hobby than a business. Which is probably
:17:23. > :17:27.just as well in a year like this! Show me a bunch of grapes if you
:17:27. > :17:30.can call it a bunch of grapes. is really sad actually cos this
:17:30. > :17:33.time of year they would be really plumped up and juicy, but if you
:17:33. > :17:39.look at that they are shriveled, dry, there is virtually no juice in
:17:39. > :17:43.there whatsoever. So what is going to happen to this year's crop?
:17:43. > :17:46.just going to leave it on there. It is not worth the effort of
:17:46. > :17:53.harvesting it to be honest. I am not going to pick a single grape,
:17:53. > :17:57.unfortunately not, no. But Neil is not alone. Much bigger players than
:17:57. > :18:00.him are in trouble too. Nyetimber, who are one of the biggest and most
:18:00. > :18:03.famous producers in the country just announced last week that they
:18:03. > :18:05.are not going to be producing any wine this year. What is your
:18:05. > :18:09.reaction to that. The decision that Nyetimber took
:18:09. > :18:12.this year not to pick in 2012 was theirs alone, and they are one of
:18:12. > :18:15.England's largest producers. But we do have a number of other very
:18:15. > :18:18.large producers as well who are going ahead and they are picking
:18:18. > :18:20.and they are producing some really very good grapes. Here are the
:18:20. > :18:30.great that we have picked today. They are being pressed and that
:18:30. > :18:31.
:18:31. > :18:33.Jews will be settled in a tank overnight. So what is the verdict
:18:33. > :18:36.on this year's harvest at Biddenden? Julian will certainly be
:18:36. > :18:40.making less wine than usual but he's pleased that unlike some he's
:18:40. > :18:43.at least got a crop worth pressing. The harvest is nearly over, how are
:18:43. > :18:46.your nerves? I am ready for some time out, it's been sleepless
:18:46. > :18:50.nights of listening to rain pouring down on a crop, but it's what it's
:18:50. > :18:53.been like all year. But you got through it. We got through it and
:18:53. > :18:57.next year it will be better, won't it? Let's hope so.
:18:57. > :19:00.It would be unfair to write off English wine on the basis of one
:19:00. > :19:10.bad vintage, but one thing is for certain, English wine growers won't
:19:10. > :19:10.
:19:10. > :19:15.want to have to go through another year like this one.
:19:15. > :19:19.Tim Atkin reporting. Now, we are a nation of pet lovers.
:19:19. > :19:25.Almost half of us own an animal of some sort, but increasingly we're
:19:25. > :19:29.looking for something more exotic like snakes and geckos. But
:19:29. > :19:33.campaigners here in the South East want that stopped. They want to end
:19:33. > :19:43.reptiles being kept as pets altogether. Richard Daniel
:19:43. > :19:43.
:19:43. > :19:48.investigates. This is a reptile show where
:19:48. > :19:55.enthusiasts get together, show off and buy and sell animals. All part
:19:55. > :20:02.of a harmless hobby. Or is it? Campaigners say these shows are
:20:02. > :20:06.cruel and even illegal and should be stopped. I've come to see for
:20:06. > :20:11.myself. The first thing I find out is that
:20:11. > :20:20.this can become an all consuming hobby. This isn't about reptiles
:20:20. > :20:25.caught in the wild. Many of the exhibitors breed them themselves.
:20:25. > :20:30.They come to sell their spare animals. Just to get rid of some
:20:31. > :20:35.surplus stock, it really. I cannot physically house much more. They're
:20:36. > :20:45.all bred in my bedroom. A wind- chill is turned into an incubator.
:20:46. > :20:49.I cut my bed in half to fit some more snakes in. It is down to 30
:20:49. > :20:52.inches. There are about 10 shows like this a year. This is the
:20:52. > :20:56.biggest. Dean has come to find something to add to his collection
:20:56. > :21:00.of 30 snakes which he breeds at home in Essex. These are young
:21:00. > :21:04.gargoyle geckos. They are bred by her friend and died. They are all
:21:04. > :21:09.captive-bred animals. They only youngsters are making grow quite a
:21:09. > :21:15.bit from that. This species I have always been interested in. I mainly
:21:15. > :21:19.keeps snakes like boas and pythons so this is different from me.
:21:19. > :21:24.Obviously the care is very similar. You will take them home tonight in
:21:24. > :21:28.this box? How do you get them back? They will be in this box and I have
:21:28. > :21:31.these heat packs which I snap and poppet in there and they will have
:21:31. > :21:34.a warm temperature for the journey home.
:21:35. > :21:38.So is all this harming the animals? Clifford Warwick was once a reptile
:21:38. > :21:46.breeder himself. He then began studying them and says their
:21:46. > :21:51.behaviour shows they suffer. What concerns me is their welfare is at
:21:51. > :21:56.risk that these events. What sort of behaviour? The most common
:21:56. > :22:03.things you hear his -- seat is interaction with transparent
:22:03. > :22:07.boundaries, and animal cloy at the glass. If an animal has a warm
:22:07. > :22:12.environment with everything it needs to survive, it is very driven
:22:12. > :22:17.by his genetics. When it is confined to a transparent boundary,
:22:17. > :22:22.its mind cannot get round it and it is a confusion and distress of.
:22:23. > :22:26.That is common. We see a great deal of hyperactivity which seems to be
:22:26. > :22:31.related to wishes to escape the environment? Where is the
:22:31. > :22:35.scientific proof behind that? are about 20 papers that have
:22:35. > :22:40.looked into this and the papers show that the behaviour is stress-
:22:40. > :22:44.related. It is not unlike having an animal like a dog and you put that
:22:44. > :22:49.in a vivarium and look at it Barking and screaming all day and
:22:49. > :22:54.think it is normal. You would probably not do it. For some reason
:22:54. > :22:57.because a reptile does not bar can scream people think it is all right.
:22:57. > :23:02.Show organisers have drafted in ex RSPCA officer Tim Wass, now an
:23:03. > :23:07.independent welfare consultant, to carry out inspections. What are you
:23:07. > :23:10.on the lookout for? Anything and everything to do with animal
:23:10. > :23:16.welfare, any breaches, Animal Health and to make sure everything
:23:16. > :23:22.is legal. You talk about welfare, I look at these tiny boxes and think
:23:22. > :23:27.it is cruel. Not at all, these are micro-climate. It is counter-
:23:27. > :23:32.intuitive, I know. The climate they are in, I would not want the
:23:32. > :23:37.animals in bigger accommodation than this for there purposes of
:23:37. > :23:40.Transport and show. Are there signs of stress? Not necessarily. It
:23:40. > :23:45.depends on the environment and the temperature at how long, there are
:23:45. > :23:50.so many factors which can describe why an animal behaves in a certain
:23:50. > :23:54.way. It is so simple and wrong to say that it is doing it because it
:23:54. > :24:00.is stressed, we need to get cleverer than that. Animal welfare
:24:00. > :24:05.is not the only of rejection. You claimed affairs spread disease.
:24:05. > :24:09.Where is the evidence? We have done biological analysis and taken swabs
:24:09. > :24:14.that showed there are a number of salmonella related bacteria on door
:24:14. > :24:24.handles and elsewhere. It is an infection or and the infection hubs
:24:24. > :24:30.
:24:30. > :24:34.are widely known to have negative impact on local and national health.
:24:34. > :24:37.These events get many people through the door, they could be
:24:37. > :24:45.50,000 people are coming to an event in England. Where is the
:24:45. > :24:49.evidence there is a disease issue? Some people are offering a free
:24:49. > :24:52.service that if they have a legal claim get salmonella they will help
:24:52. > :24:55.but it has never happened. Enthusiasts are desperate to keep
:24:55. > :24:58.the shows going. They can swop information and learn from each
:24:58. > :25:02.other. They also come to buy and sell. Prices start at just a few
:25:02. > :25:07.pounds, but I was amazed how much these creatures can be worth.
:25:07. > :25:15.is a reticulated python which is a super time gap anthrax. This is one
:25:15. > :25:21.of two in Europe at the moment. They're worth about �18,000. They
:25:21. > :25:25.are so unique. They have only been in existence for less than a year.
:25:25. > :25:28.But as things stand I couldn't buy this snake today. That's because
:25:28. > :25:31.its owner is a commercial dealer with a shop. Under Animal Welfare
:25:31. > :25:39.law commercial dealers can't trade at shows, but hobbyists can sell
:25:39. > :25:47.their surplus animals. Campaigners say that's not what the law
:25:47. > :25:52.intended and they're challenging that. In the eyes of the law these
:25:52. > :25:59.fares are legal. These events were outlawed in 1993 but at the time
:25:59. > :26:06.the legislation was changed. We saw animals sold in streets markets,
:26:06. > :26:10.not just these but a whole range of Peps, so that the spirit of the law
:26:10. > :26:14.was to stop the trading of environments in environments such
:26:14. > :26:18.as these. We have been investigating for a number of years
:26:18. > :26:24.and we find that the sheer scale and volume of animals is enough to
:26:24. > :26:27.demonstrate that these are commercially driven events.
:26:27. > :26:30.The law may be open to interpretation but so far there's
:26:30. > :26:36.never been a prosecution. However the campaign to stop them has had
:26:36. > :26:39.some success. Some councils now won't allow shows on their property.
:26:39. > :26:44.Reptile owners are worried. They want the government to clarify the
:26:44. > :26:49.law and introduce licensing. If we can get the licensing in place, it
:26:49. > :26:54.deals with any argument. What we are dealing about -- arguing about
:26:54. > :26:58.is money. We seem to be more interested in today it is whether
:26:58. > :27:04.someone is making a bit of money about it. Maybe some are, but the
:27:04. > :27:08.majority will not because these are expensive animals to look after.
:27:08. > :27:12.What would licensing mean it to the fair? It would allow us to bring in
:27:12. > :27:15.more regulation. We have done all the regulation that we can for
:27:15. > :27:19.ourselves and we need the government to step in and license
:27:19. > :27:22.it just in the same way as they would a pet shop but it would give
:27:22. > :27:25.local authorities control. Campaigners don't want licenses.
:27:25. > :27:30.Ending the shows is part of a wider campaign which they've taken to the
:27:30. > :27:36.European Parliament. To be clear, what you want to do is see people
:27:36. > :27:40.banned from keeping these creatures as pets? We want to see a ban on
:27:40. > :27:45.trade and keeping of reptiles as pets. We have huge public and
:27:45. > :27:49.political support to actually achieve our aims and I am confident
:27:49. > :27:55.we will get there. It will never happen. We will continue the
:27:55. > :27:58.struggle. We have got to where we are today and we will not be beaten.
:27:58. > :28:01.Now, if you want any more information on tonight's show, you
:28:01. > :28:08.can visit our local Kent or Sussex websites, and even watch the whole
:28:08. > :28:10.show again by clicking on our iPlayer at bbc.co.uk/insideout.
:28:10. > :28:13.iPlayer at bbc.co.uk/insideout. Coming up next week:
:28:13. > :28:16.Should our seaside towns be looking after London's children in care?
:28:16. > :28:25.The new idea that could create the ideal environment for wildlife in
:28:25. > :28:30.the South East. It is too easy for the London boroughs to dump their
:28:31. > :28:34.children and it is the only word I can use for it, in Thanet.
:28:34. > :28:39.The new idea that could create the ideal environment for wildlife in
:28:39. > :28:43.the South East. We have a few wildlife preserves but we need her
:28:43. > :28:50.bigger picture, a bigger living landscape. And how a Gillingham
:28:50. > :28:55.sailor became Japan's only English Samurai. This is William Adams, an