:00:15. > :00:21.I've been sat on a beach. Sttton Park. I've been sat in a
:00:22. > :00:27.We can go to a number of different places.
:00:28. > :00:30.We can even use, erm, museuls, anything that will help and have an
:00:31. > :00:34.Forget what you've heard about Britain's fight against extremism.
:00:35. > :00:35.This is the frontline, a cafe near you.
:00:36. > :00:39.These people are often ordinary people,
:00:40. > :00:42.just like me or you who acttally are more concerned with what was the
:00:43. > :00:45.score with Chelsea and Man Tnited last night than foreign polhcy.
:00:46. > :00:47.In public places across the land, Government`approved mentors are
:00:48. > :00:49.talking to extremists, trying to prevent them
:00:50. > :00:57.Three Birmingham men have gone on trial accused of plotting
:00:58. > :01:03.a series of suicide bomb attacks on multiple targets in Brit`in.
:01:04. > :01:06.I grew up in Birmingham and the stuff I hear about the city
:01:07. > :01:17.A Ukrainian student has admhtted murdering an 82`year`old
:01:18. > :01:20.He told police he targeted the grandfather just
:01:21. > :01:24.So I've come back to the city to find out what's going on.
:01:25. > :01:28.I'll ask if Birmingham is now the terror capital of Britahn.
:01:29. > :01:30.There's a pretty serious cltster here, disproportionate to
:01:31. > :01:39.And I'll get rare access to the men and women whose job it hs to
:01:40. > :01:43.Can we stop someone putting on an explosive vest simply
:01:44. > :02:04.Of course, conflict in Birmingham is nothing new.
:02:05. > :02:05.There were the Handsworth rhots in the 80s.
:02:06. > :02:08.And I remember the rise of the National Front.
:02:09. > :02:13.This was the last house my family lived in
:02:14. > :02:20.I spent a lot of my later tdenage life here and you know what?
:02:21. > :02:24.So much is whizzing through my head right now.
:02:25. > :02:28.But what I do remember actu`lly was that there was a big brown fence
:02:29. > :02:32.here that went from the end here all the way around and I remembdr waking
:02:33. > :02:38.up one morning and there was a massive NF sign sprayed hdre in
:02:39. > :02:41.white for the National Front and I never even thought this are` was
:02:42. > :02:46.Saying that, the one thing H can say about Birmingham and the ond thing
:02:47. > :02:50.I'm most proud of about this city is that it is so multicultural.
:02:51. > :02:53.You know, I had mates from `ll across the board and all different
:02:54. > :03:00.And this is one of the things that this city has to be most proud of.
:03:01. > :03:04.But I suspect that something has changed, not just because
:03:05. > :03:07.of all the recent headlines about Britons travelling to Syria to
:03:08. > :03:13.fight for the IS, the Islamhc State, but a something before that.
:03:14. > :03:15.And here's why, 90 days of terror that spre`d fear
:03:16. > :03:25.On April 25th last year, a group of Islamist extremists from
:03:26. > :03:28.Birmingham were jailed for planning what would have been the worst ever
:03:29. > :03:36.The judge said Naseer wanted to turn part of Birmingham
:03:37. > :03:45.Just four days later, 82`ye`r`old Mohammed Saleem was murdered in
:03:46. > :03:54.Ukrainian Pavlo Lapshyn had only been in the country for fivd days.
:03:55. > :03:57.Three weeks later in London, soldier Lee Rigby was murdered
:03:58. > :04:03.In response, two men firebolbed a mosque in Gloucester.
:04:04. > :04:07.And throughout June and Julx, Pavlo Lapshyn continued to target
:04:08. > :04:09.Muslims across the West Midlands, planting bombs at mosques in
:04:10. > :04:17.Two days after his arrest, 2000 English Defence League supporters
:04:18. > :04:24.marched through Birmingham, before the protest descended into violence.
:04:25. > :04:25.For ordinary people across the West Midlands,
:04:26. > :04:29.it was a worrying time, with Islamist and far`right extrdmists
:04:30. > :04:42.But one family more than anx other was caught in the crossfire.
:04:43. > :04:46.Yeah, very happy, he was very good with his grandchildren.
:04:47. > :04:51.Shazia Khan's father was Mohammed Saleem, the grandfather killed by
:04:52. > :04:57.He was stabbed in the back `s he walked home from prayers, mtrdered
:04:58. > :05:05.We had an idea it was a racist attack when my father was
:05:06. > :05:09.killed because things like that just don't happen in our community.
:05:10. > :05:12.It is a multicultural community my dad was very well liked by,
:05:13. > :05:17.But when it transpired that it was a far`right extremist attack, yes,
:05:18. > :05:20.we were stunned, because th`t's not something that you expect to happen
:05:21. > :05:25.My dad was sadistically murdered, you know,
:05:26. > :05:33.The police believe Ukrainian Pavlo Lapshyn acted alone.
:05:34. > :05:37.But his campaign of terror was supported by far`right extrdmists
:05:38. > :05:40.here in Britain, with many of them leaving messages on a website set
:05:41. > :05:52.should have chopped off his beard, should have also beheaded hhm.
:05:53. > :05:55.Oh, it was a good thing, I'm the one that should get the
:05:56. > :05:59.And Shazia believes it's tile the Government took far`right
:06:00. > :06:01.extremism as seriously as the threat from Islamists.
:06:02. > :06:04.It's not about just preventhng and protecting the UK
:06:05. > :06:08.and the non`Muslim communithes, what about the Muslim communities?
:06:09. > :06:11.We also get terrorised, we `lso get threatened, we also get abused.
:06:12. > :06:21.I want to find out just how many extremists in Britain,
:06:22. > :06:29.both Islamist and far`right, have engaged in violence.
:06:30. > :06:31.The Government wouldn't give us a list of names.
:06:32. > :06:39.In the last ten years, 282 people have been convicted
:06:40. > :06:45.of what the Government describes as a "terrorism`related offdnce "
:06:46. > :06:48.And, by using a variety of sources, we've been able to find out where
:06:49. > :06:51.more than 200 of them were living when they were arrested.
:06:52. > :06:53.And here they are, on a terror map of Britain.
:06:54. > :06:56.Every dot represents a convicted terrorist.
:06:57. > :07:00.The blue dots are Islamist extremists, the red dots ard far
:07:01. > :07:03.right extremists and the grden dots represent a mixture of others,
:07:04. > :07:15.These convictions were for a whole variety of terrorism
:07:16. > :07:20.offences, from murder to donating money to radical organisations.
:07:21. > :07:26.And the prison sentences vary hugely, from 12 months to lhfe.
:07:27. > :07:29.Nonetheless, it's clear there are far more blue dots than red ones.
:07:30. > :07:32.To find out why, I've invitdd along academic Dr Mark Littler, who's
:07:33. > :07:34.analysed data collected by the organisation Faith Matters on the
:07:35. > :07:41.I do think that there are a huge number of right`wing
:07:42. > :07:44.The data that Faith Matters have collected indicates th`t
:07:45. > :07:48.there's significantly more than these maps would suggest.
:07:49. > :07:52.In fact, last year they identified that there were 734 of them.
:07:53. > :07:55.Now the issue I think is perhaps that a lot of that happens online,
:07:56. > :07:58.almost 600, I think 599 of the attacks were online.
:07:59. > :08:00.And there's a question mark about how you categorise online
:08:01. > :08:07.Is it merely just unpleasant online extremism?
:08:08. > :08:13.But, overall, how does Birmhngham compare to other cities?
:08:14. > :08:17.London may have the most dots, but they're relatively spre`d out.
:08:18. > :08:22.Whereas parts of Birmingham have a greater concentration,
:08:23. > :08:25.with 26 Islamist extremists coming from the East of the city, clustered
:08:26. > :08:44.The comparison with Manchester is stark.
:08:45. > :08:46.So why has Birmingham got such a high concentration
:08:47. > :08:50.Take this part of Sparkhill, within one mile of where I'm standhng have
:08:51. > :08:54.In terms of convictions, this is the epicentre
:08:55. > :09:00.of the greatest concentration of terrorists in Britain.
:09:01. > :09:03.But it certainly doesn't fedl dangerous walking around here.
:09:04. > :09:05.And that's no surprise, because we're talking about
:09:06. > :09:11.a tiny minority in a city that's home to more than 200,000 Mtslims.
:09:12. > :09:14.We live as a good community and I think there's good people hdre.
:09:15. > :09:18.So we shouldn't be judged bdcause one person's done an act, and we all
:09:19. > :09:27.I request to everybody, comd down, have a look for yourself.
:09:28. > :09:29.Pop into the restaurants, shops or have a little chat
:09:30. > :09:36.Everybody is friendly, we're all family mans.
:09:37. > :09:39.But there's no getting away from the fact that too many people from
:09:40. > :09:45.Hannah Stuart is from the think`tank the Henry Jackson Society.
:09:46. > :09:51.She's researched the backgrounds of hundreds of Islamist terrorists.
:09:52. > :09:53.This particular part of Birlingham is one of a number
:09:54. > :09:56.of areas where the Muslim population is particularly high.
:09:57. > :09:58.It's over three times the city average, 70% of
:09:59. > :10:01.the population here are Muslim and these are the areas that extremists
:10:02. > :10:07.And they're the areas that individuals will
:10:08. > :10:11.start to group together and form networks and that's why you
:10:12. > :10:14.see when you see large cells from Birmingham, all clustered
:10:15. > :10:20.And it historically had grotps like Hizb ut`Tahrir that were
:10:21. > :10:21.targeting it, its Mosques, its Community Centres,
:10:22. > :10:30.And Hannah believes that in most cases the individuals involved
:10:31. > :10:35.have identified more with Mtslims abroad than Britons next door.
:10:36. > :10:40.Some of the early Birminghal cases we see individuals shipping
:10:41. > :10:43.materials and supplies to Al`Qaeda via Pakistan and this is whdn the
:10:44. > :10:46.Government, the British State is at war with Al`Qaeda in Afghanhstan and
:10:47. > :10:50.these individuals are chooshng to side with Britain's enemies over,
:10:51. > :10:57.over the country that is thdir home and that many of them were born in.
:10:58. > :11:05.Is that really what's happening on the streets of Birminghal?
:11:06. > :11:08.To find out, I've come to somewhere that sees its fair share
:11:09. > :11:16.Eastside Boxing Club is just a couple of miles from Sparkhill.
:11:17. > :11:20.Out of curiosity, how many of you guys are Muslims?
:11:21. > :11:22.When you see that stuff on extremism and terrorism,
:11:23. > :11:28.Cos you guys seem like peaceful guys to me.
:11:29. > :11:30.Anger, it actually makes me angry when I see...
:11:31. > :11:33.When I see these guys and they're creating a bad name for us.
:11:34. > :11:37.I actually look at the TV screen and I think, you know what,
:11:38. > :11:41.But these guys use our religion Islam, to erm...
:11:42. > :11:43.convey their stupid message, whatever they've got.
:11:44. > :11:53.But the guys tell me they know people who have been radicalised.
:11:54. > :11:57.If I was to just grab you off the street, and you've got no
:11:58. > :12:00.direction in your life, you haven't got a job, you're at home, living at
:12:01. > :12:03.home with your family, and H come and say to you, here, come, come
:12:04. > :12:06.with me, come with me, let me show you this video.
:12:07. > :12:09.Look at this, man, this is happening to these people,
:12:10. > :12:13.These are your people, they are and I'll fill this,
:12:14. > :12:17.I'll call you every day, I'll come pick you up from your house,
:12:18. > :12:21.Sooner or later, you're making plans to do whatever.
:12:22. > :12:22.From this guy who's brainwashed you,
:12:23. > :12:26.It's happened in Birmingham, it has happened in Birmingh`m to
:12:27. > :12:29.people that some of us know personally and they're bangdd away
:12:30. > :12:38.The guys tell me that many of them have been victimised
:12:39. > :12:41.by the National Front and the EDL, but are not tempted to fight back.
:12:42. > :12:43.Being level`headed and whatever you've got to look at,
:12:44. > :12:46.this person did this to me but that's not that person.
:12:47. > :12:50.Although it's very easy to go into that way of thinking
:12:51. > :12:53.but you don't really get nowhere with that, and I think that's what
:12:54. > :12:59.Basically, this gym and like the boxing has saved md.
:13:00. > :13:03.One or two of us might have been locked up if it wasn't for boxing.
:13:04. > :13:06.Hundreds of Britons travelldd to Syria and that group could hnclude
:13:07. > :13:09.the killer of American journalists James Foley and Steven Sotloff.
:13:10. > :13:13.They want Syria Iraq governed under Islamic law,
:13:14. > :13:26.But why leave Britain to fight for that?
:13:27. > :13:29.I've heard about an organis`tion in London which campaigns
:13:30. > :13:32.for the rights of people catght up in the War on Terror.
:13:33. > :13:35.One of its directors, Moazzam Begg, is facing tri`l,
:13:36. > :13:36.accused of terrorism offencds relating to Syria.
:13:37. > :13:39.And his colleague Asim Qureshi doesn't see anything wrong with
:13:40. > :13:42.Britons going to fight in Sxria something currently against the law.
:13:43. > :13:45.What I've always said is th`t if somebody has committed war crimes
:13:46. > :13:48.then they should be held responsible for those, whether it's unddr
:13:49. > :13:51.Islamic law or international law, there should be people being held
:13:52. > :13:54.responsible where those criles are taking place. But the concept that
:13:55. > :13:58.somehow somebody should be criminalised simply because they're
:13:59. > :14:01.willing to put their life on the line in order to do the right
:14:02. > :14:14.When you see people being htrt or are being abused that you h`ve
:14:15. > :14:17.an obligation to do what yot can in that situation and so
:14:18. > :14:22.for a lot of young people throughout that 1400 years of Muslim hhstory.
:14:23. > :14:28.You know, going to fight has been a very, very natural thing to do.
:14:29. > :14:31.And Asim Qureshi tells me that it's the same concern for the plhght
:14:32. > :14:34.of Muslims abroad that's bedn the motivating factor behind most
:14:35. > :14:43.If we look at every single dxample of terrorism that's happened here
:14:44. > :14:46.in the UK, OK, it's been purely based on, from their own words,
:14:47. > :14:54.But these are innocent lives just gone, mate.
:14:55. > :15:01.And it's not a way of justifying any of that.
:15:02. > :15:04.But what I'm saying is that you have to get to the root cause.
:15:05. > :15:08.And the root cause is foreign intervention.
:15:09. > :15:11.And it was foreign intervention in Iraq and Afghanistan that
:15:12. > :15:15.motivated four British Islalists to blow themselves up.
:15:16. > :15:20.In the July 7th bombings in London, 52 innocent people were killed.
:15:21. > :15:22.The pressure on the authorities then, as it is
:15:23. > :15:29.So the Labour Government cale up with a new strategy to try to
:15:30. > :15:34.Its focus was almost entirely on extremism associated with Al`Qaeda.
:15:35. > :15:41.And it was given a simple n`me ` Prevent.
:15:42. > :15:47.By 2008, Prevent had an annual budget of ?86 million
:15:48. > :15:49.The Home Office and the police got half, whhlst a
:15:50. > :15:53.quarter went to the Foreign Office and the rest, almost ?20 million,
:15:54. > :16:01.Well, it's not as easy to find out as you'd think.
:16:02. > :16:09.We submitted Freedom of Information requests to councils across the
:16:10. > :16:15.West Midlands, asking for ddtails of how much was spent and on what.
:16:16. > :16:19.In the three years between 2008 and 2011, a third of councils in the
:16:20. > :16:26.West Midlands were given Prdvent money ` over ?6 million in `ll.
:16:27. > :16:32.Birmingham got by far the most ` more than ?2.5 mhllion.
:16:33. > :16:35.Whilst Coventry, Dudley, East Staffordshire, Sandwell,
:16:36. > :16:42.Stoke, Walsall and Wolverhalpton all got more than ?350,000 dach
:16:43. > :16:45.There were the obvious things ` like training public sector workers
:16:46. > :16:49.to spot signs of extremism `nd teaching Imams to speak English
:16:50. > :16:53.But then there were the less obvious things.
:16:54. > :16:55.This is, um, the niqab where we invited people to
:16:56. > :16:59.stand in and see what it felt like to be fully, fully dressed
:17:00. > :17:03.Friction Arts were given ?14,00 of Prevent money by Birmingham City
:17:04. > :17:05.Council to deliver an inter`ctive art exhibition designed to challenge
:17:06. > :17:18.Now, that pot of money was about preventing violent extremism.
:17:19. > :17:23.I think the Prevent programle, when you read it, it was about
:17:24. > :17:27.enabling people, preventing violent extremism, communicating from
:17:28. > :17:32.the police, creating a, cre`ting a dialogue with communities and I
:17:33. > :17:38.So there are no stats to sax that our project stopped somebodx,
:17:39. > :17:41.but we already know that falilies in Birmingham have absolutely,
:17:42. > :17:46.the minute they found out their son allegedly in Turkey, wasn't,
:17:47. > :17:51.So somewhere, something has worked, the fact that it's not meastrable in
:17:52. > :17:54.the way that this, everybodx wants things to be measurable, dodsn't
:17:55. > :18:01.And community projects right across the country got Prevent mondy.
:18:02. > :18:07.In Walsall, a "Creative Art consultation" got ?7,750.
:18:08. > :18:10.In Wolverhampton, ?3,524 was given to a
:18:11. > :18:20.And in Sandwell, ?3,300 went on "women empowerment workshops .
:18:21. > :18:22.But spending counter`terrorhsm money on social cohesion
:18:23. > :18:29.The thing to remember with the early stages of Prevent was that this was
:18:30. > :18:34.a Government that knew after 7/ that this was a serious problem but
:18:35. > :18:41.And I think the early Prevent was an attempt to try everything,
:18:42. > :18:48.throw money at everything, `ll at the same time and see what stuck.
:18:49. > :18:51.Alan Rudge was the man at Birmingham City Council who had to
:18:52. > :18:57.And he admits some projects were more effective than others.
:18:58. > :19:00.The ones which weren't succdssful, weren't as sufficiently productive,
:19:01. > :19:05.we dropped and we pursued the ones that we thought were most effective.
:19:06. > :19:10.How do you know individuallx that, you know, this year we've t`ken
:19:11. > :19:13.five or six men or women who could be possible terrorists
:19:14. > :19:24.But what we do know is that if you strengthen the community
:19:25. > :19:26.and get a resilience between all the communities to oppose
:19:27. > :19:30.and resist entrapment into that way of life, you know you're saving
:19:31. > :19:36.possible potentially thousands of people being disaffected.
:19:37. > :19:38.But three years ago, the Home Secretary claimed
:19:39. > :19:42.the original Prevent strategy had been deeply flawed.
:19:43. > :19:45.It failed to tackle the extremist ideology that not only undermines
:19:46. > :19:49.the cohesion of our society, but inspires would`be terrorists to
:19:50. > :19:55.seek to bring death and destruction to our towns and cities.
:19:56. > :19:57.So the Government decided to dramatically reduce
:19:58. > :20:00.the role played by local cotncils in preventing extremism.
:20:01. > :20:02.Instead of spending money on whole communities, the focus
:20:03. > :20:07.The priority was to identifx people with extreme views
:20:08. > :20:13.Much of that work is done bx mentors in a programme called Channdl.
:20:14. > :20:17.And for the first time, two of those mentors have been granted pdrmission
:20:18. > :20:22.One of them, who we're callhng John, works with people who've shown
:20:23. > :20:27.He's asked us not to identify him because of sensitivities
:20:28. > :20:33.How serious are the people you deal with?
:20:34. > :20:36.I'll give you one example, this is an extremity, obviotsly
:20:37. > :20:39.And this was a guy who said that he would like to
:20:40. > :20:47.When I asked him who he would put in the camps,
:20:48. > :20:50.he just listed literally evdryone that he didn't see as white,
:20:51. > :20:55.English or British, um, you know, and he really meant it, you know.
:20:56. > :20:57.You know, he idolised Hitler and the Nazis and
:20:58. > :21:02.So that's an extreme though, I mean, I wouldn't want it put across that,
:21:03. > :21:08.Nationally, one in ten referrals to Channel now concern the far right.
:21:09. > :21:10.But the majority of cases involve people at risk
:21:11. > :21:16.Many are referred to mentor Sulaimaan Samuel,
:21:17. > :21:21.who's given a series of one or two hour sessions with the individuals.
:21:22. > :21:23.Can we stop someone putting an explosive vest
:21:24. > :21:29.That type of mentality of wanting to literally destroy
:21:30. > :21:35.that would probably be a person who might not pass through Channel.
:21:36. > :21:39.That person may not get to le because of the type of support and
:21:40. > :21:43.help they need, er, would bd very, very different than the mentoring
:21:44. > :21:47.and the support that I can offer to those vulnerable young people.
:21:48. > :21:50.Um, the people I'm working with are open, they're willing,
:21:51. > :21:57.they want to engage and havd their issues addressed, um, so. .
:21:58. > :22:04.In fact, Channel is a voluntary procdss.
:22:05. > :22:06.It's a kind of "last`chance saloon" offering
:22:07. > :22:12.individuals help, before thdy become of interest to the police.
:22:13. > :22:14.The main tactic the mentors use is to simply challenge the belhefs
:22:15. > :22:19.of the individuals that thex meet, and offer them alternatives.
:22:20. > :22:21.John tells me about a conversation with one young man
:22:22. > :22:27.who claimed he hated all Muslims, following an attack on his family.
:22:28. > :22:29.I got him to count it out on his hand.
:22:30. > :22:32.So I said, right, how many people, how many Muslims attacked
:22:33. > :22:37.And then I said, how many attacked your mum?
:22:38. > :22:39.And I said, OK, that's four, keep going.
:22:40. > :22:41.And he said, what do you me`n, keep going?
:22:42. > :22:44.I said, keep going, you told me you hate all Muslims,
:22:45. > :22:48.you've just given me a decent reason why you would dislike four of them.
:22:49. > :22:52.There's millions of Muslims in the world.
:22:53. > :22:55.And he just hesitated and s`id, well, well, I've never really
:22:56. > :23:00.And Sulaimaan tells me about a young man from Birmhngham
:23:01. > :23:03.who was determined to give loney to Islamist fighters in Syria
:23:04. > :23:09.after viewing images on the internet of fellow Muslims suffering there.
:23:10. > :23:12.Rather than arguing and telling him no don't do that, that's wrong and,
:23:13. > :23:17.What I did was, I explained to him that actually the reason whx you
:23:18. > :23:21.were so passionate about gohng out there to help and sending this money
:23:22. > :23:23.is because you saw all thosd women and children suffering.
:23:24. > :23:26.So actually if you send this money to the people
:23:27. > :23:30.who are out there fighting, is that actually going to fded those
:23:31. > :23:37.Is it going to make their situation better?
:23:38. > :23:39.And he realised no, so I was then able to direct him
:23:40. > :23:43.and say, well look, keep th`t passion, but we're going to try and
:23:44. > :23:46.And you could donate that money to Islamic Relief,
:23:47. > :23:50.to the Red Cross who are dohng work in those countries to help
:23:51. > :23:53.the people who are really stffering who need that money the most.
:23:54. > :23:56.And actually I saw the smild come to his face and that realisation that,
:23:57. > :23:59.Also under the Channel programme ` local authorities and health
:24:00. > :24:02.services get together to trx and help the individuals find housing,
:24:03. > :24:09.So how are people identified as being at risk to radicalhsation?
:24:10. > :24:12.Well, if they're not spotted and referred by the police,
:24:13. > :24:14.it's usually another public sector worker ` like a teacher,
:24:15. > :24:19.That's why many public sector workers are given special training
:24:20. > :24:27.The training is in the form of a workshop and takes
:24:28. > :24:31.But the organisation Cage bdlieves the process forces ordinary people
:24:32. > :24:38.The message that is being sdnt to them is that we're going to treat
:24:39. > :24:43.you like extremists unless xou can prove to us that you're not
:24:44. > :24:47.So we're going to get your doctors and your school teachers and your
:24:48. > :24:50.nursery teachers and your university lecturers and your opticians
:24:51. > :24:54.and everyone to basically tdll us whether or not they think, they
:24:55. > :24:56.believe ` because there's no actual qualitative way
:24:57. > :25:01.of them doing an assessment ` if they believe that you ard some
:25:02. > :25:11.But the head of the West Midlands' Counter Terrorism
:25:12. > :25:14.Unit tells me individuals are only referred to Channel
:25:15. > :25:21.It's not just as simple as ly, you know, there's a boy
:25:22. > :25:23.in a school who's writing something in his school book.
:25:24. > :25:26.Or he's said something in class or my neighbour's growing a be`rd.
:25:27. > :25:28.These, you know, we are talking about a number of significant
:25:29. > :25:31.factors that are present in the behaviour of that individual, um,
:25:32. > :25:39.Last year 93 people in the West Midlands were referred to
:25:40. > :25:43.the authorities as being potentially at risk of violent extremisl,
:25:44. > :25:49.but only 24 actually entered the Channel scheme.
:25:50. > :25:51.I think the reality is the numbers across a multittde
:25:52. > :25:57.So the idea that we are raising awareness amongst a group
:25:58. > :26:00.of professionals who are thdn spying on their patients or childrdn
:26:01. > :26:05.in their school, I don't sed that borne out in the figures.
:26:06. > :26:07.What we're trying to do, just like child safeguarding,
:26:08. > :26:13.is say, um, this agenda, preventing violent extremisl, is
:26:14. > :26:18.as important as preventing ` child from being sexually exploitdd.
:26:19. > :26:20.Um, these are the, some of the signs,
:26:21. > :26:26.Um, if you have a concern, raise that with us.
:26:27. > :26:31.Those on the frontline believe it is.
:26:32. > :26:33.I've never left a session where I think actually, you know,
:26:34. > :26:37.I can't stop here, you know, this guy could still go out and `ttack
:26:38. > :26:40.someone or do something even more serious like a bomb or whatdver
:26:41. > :26:47.So, you know, I do get to the point where I think OK, you might
:26:48. > :26:51.And after all, I'm not therd to necessarily change all their views,
:26:52. > :26:54.it's more about what they'rd going to do with those views.
:26:55. > :26:57.So when I get to that point, I think, yeah, that's OK.
:26:58. > :27:00.But as long as men and women from the Midlands continue to tr`vel to
:27:01. > :27:06.Syria or engage in violent dxtremism here, there will be question marks.
:27:07. > :27:10.The last thing I want to sed is another attack of any kind here
:27:11. > :27:16.But to say that it's never going to happen when you've still got such a
:27:17. > :27:21.hawkish foreign policy and ` quite frankly disgraceful domestic one `
:27:22. > :27:26.you know, unfortunately, we always have to be prepared for that fact.
:27:27. > :27:29.And just try our best to kedp on working to make sure it doesn't
:27:30. > :27:33.The Channel programme is a model that most people tend to
:27:34. > :27:36.But that doesn't mean that we are, we're preventing everybody.
:27:37. > :27:47.There's a long way, there's a long way to go.
:27:48. > :27:54.But if one family can end the cycle of hatred ` maybe we all can.
:27:55. > :27:59.It's a hard one to deal with and it doesn't help, it doesn't help
:28:00. > :28:03.It's something you go through but you have to come out of it,
:28:04. > :28:15.because if you stop at that stage, you'll never heal.
:28:16. > :28:18.Are the authorities getting it right?
:28:19. > :28:44.After all, so much of what we care about depends on it.
:28:45. > :28:47.Next week, the team go undercover to a scam in the pensions industry