0:00:00 > 0:00:01Now on BBC One, Inside Out with Paul Hudson.
0:00:02 > 0:00:03Good evening.
0:00:03 > 0:00:05Tonight: It's one of the most troubled police
0:00:05 > 0:00:07forces in the country, and we talk to another
0:00:07 > 0:00:11family who want answers from South Yorkshire Police.
0:00:22 > 0:00:24Welcome to Inside Out, I'm Paul Hudson.
0:00:24 > 0:00:27This week, we hear from a family who are
0:00:27 > 0:00:29still looking for answers and crucial evidence about the death of
0:00:29 > 0:00:32their father and husband who more than 16 years ago
0:00:32 > 0:00:37was trampled to death by a police horse.
0:00:37 > 0:00:40And we hear from a witness who saw what happendd.
0:00:40 > 0:00:42He went backwards, flat on the ground, and then the horse
0:00:42 > 0:00:47put his left front foot right onto his stomach.
0:00:47 > 0:00:49Also tonight: Warnings that billions could be lost from the
0:00:50 > 0:00:53Northern economy after Brexht.
0:00:53 > 0:00:56So what now for the so-calldd Northern powerhouse?
0:00:56 > 0:01:02Any investment decisions yot might want to make here will be on ice.
0:01:02 > 0:01:05We ask George Osbourne whether his project is now doomed.
0:01:05 > 0:01:07In a Brexit world, it is even more important
0:01:07 > 0:01:12that the North sells itself around the world.
0:01:16 > 0:01:17South Yorkshire Police have been involved
0:01:17 > 0:01:20in some of the most notoriots incidents in British policing.
0:01:20 > 0:01:22The worst being the cover-up following
0:01:22 > 0:01:24the Hillsborough disaster.
0:01:24 > 0:01:26Tonight, Dan Johnson re-examines the death of
0:01:26 > 0:01:30a football fan at a match hdre in Rotherham 16 years ago,
0:01:30 > 0:01:35and his family's long search for justice.
0:01:36 > 0:01:38We just feel like he deserves justice
0:01:38 > 0:01:40as well, he didn't deserve to go to that match
0:01:40 > 0:01:42and he didn't deserve to die
0:01:42 > 0:01:44and we didn't deserve to grow up without a father.
0:01:44 > 0:01:47Is she also aware of the tr`gic case of Terry Coles,
0:01:47 > 0:01:50a Swansea City supporter who was trampled to death by a police horse
0:01:50 > 0:01:53at a football match in 2000?
0:01:53 > 0:01:54He kicked the horse on.
0:01:54 > 0:01:57You know, the horse geed up, the horse went
0:01:57 > 0:01:59faster.
0:01:59 > 0:02:01You know, it only took a couple of strides and...
0:02:01 > 0:02:03And he hit Terry.
0:02:03 > 0:02:08I think the real truth needs to be examined.
0:02:08 > 0:02:10Terry Coles, a father and a football fan who lost
0:02:10 > 0:02:14his life following his team.
0:02:14 > 0:02:16Terry died after being knocked down by a
0:02:16 > 0:02:18police horse, here in South Yorkshire, just minutds before
0:02:18 > 0:02:21kick-off.
0:02:21 > 0:02:24Swansea City were playing Rotherham United in the last game of
0:02:24 > 0:02:26the season.
0:02:26 > 0:02:28At Terry's funeral, his wifd Christine and his two young
0:02:28 > 0:02:33children were joined by hundreds of football fans.
0:02:33 > 0:02:36Tell me a little bit about Terry for the people that don't
0:02:36 > 0:02:38know much about him - what was he like?
0:02:38 > 0:02:41Very sociable man who enjoydd a game of football, and he had two
0:02:41 > 0:02:44lovely children, Natalie and Matthew.
0:02:44 > 0:02:48That was his main, sort of, pleasure -
0:02:48 > 0:02:50supporting his team.
0:02:50 > 0:02:53And unfortunately that was the end as well.
0:02:53 > 0:02:57How importantly did he take football?
0:02:57 > 0:02:59He went to most home games and when he could go away,
0:02:59 > 0:03:03he would go away.
0:03:03 > 0:03:05And that's what Terry did on the 6th of May
0:03:05 > 0:03:07in the year 2000.
0:03:07 > 0:03:10It was a trip of more than 200 miles to Rotherham
0:03:10 > 0:03:12to cheer on Swansea City.
0:03:12 > 0:03:15The two clubs were fighting for the league title
0:03:15 > 0:03:17in what was then division three
0:03:17 > 0:03:19There could have been, should have been, a carnival atmosphere
0:03:19 > 0:03:22but it suddenly turned nastx.
0:03:22 > 0:03:23I went up with nine other friends.
0:03:23 > 0:03:25We went in a stretch limo.
0:03:25 > 0:03:29It was just another away dax for us, really, but with that
0:03:29 > 0:03:34heightened expectation of winning the league.
0:03:34 > 0:03:36And separately Terry travelled to Yorkshire with a group
0:03:36 > 0:03:38of his friends.
0:03:38 > 0:03:41We got to Rotherham about one o'clock,
0:03:42 > 0:03:43parked the minibus up.
0:03:43 > 0:03:45We...
0:03:45 > 0:03:48We all got together and we went to Yates' bar,
0:03:48 > 0:03:50which is a little bit outside..
0:03:50 > 0:03:54Just up from the stadium.
0:03:54 > 0:03:57We went there, we had a couple of drinks, there was police
0:03:57 > 0:03:59there and police horses.
0:03:59 > 0:04:02This is the shiny modern New York stadium, where
0:04:02 > 0:04:06Rotherham now play their gales, but they have only been herd for the
0:04:06 > 0:04:09last four years.
0:04:09 > 0:04:11This is Millmoor, Rotherham's former ground.
0:04:11 > 0:04:13Even though they haven't pl`yed here for eight years,
0:04:13 > 0:04:15it is still standing.
0:04:15 > 0:04:20But in the year 2000, when Terry Coles came here,
0:04:20 > 0:04:22it was already starting to show its age.
0:04:22 > 0:04:24This is the narrow lane that away supporters
0:04:24 > 0:04:25used to be funnelled down.
0:04:25 > 0:04:27They walked us down the high street towards
0:04:27 > 0:04:29the stadium.
0:04:29 > 0:04:34Very hostile reception, all the way, you know?
0:04:34 > 0:04:36Unfortunately...
0:04:36 > 0:04:40It ended in a great tragedy.
0:04:40 > 0:04:41Alan Roberts was a Swansea regular.
0:04:41 > 0:04:44As a young man, he had been involved in hooliganism,
0:04:44 > 0:04:48but his life changed on the day of Terry's death.
0:04:48 > 0:04:51Alan recognised Terry from previous games.
0:04:51 > 0:04:54He found himself next to Terry in the congested alley.
0:04:54 > 0:04:5716 years on, this is the first time he has been back
0:04:57 > 0:04:59to Rotherham.
0:04:59 > 0:05:02It is the first time he has spoken about what happened.
0:05:02 > 0:05:04When I arrived in this area, there were people throwing
0:05:05 > 0:05:08stones at each other.
0:05:08 > 0:05:11As you can see, just around here, it is quite easy to dig a
0:05:11 > 0:05:13little stone out of ground.
0:05:13 > 0:05:15And that is what the Swansea fans were doing,
0:05:15 > 0:05:16retaliating to the Rotherhal fans,
0:05:16 > 0:05:20who were throwing stones from there and there.
0:05:20 > 0:05:25So we got to the lane, that's where the problems occurred.
0:05:25 > 0:05:32I think there was a pub and people were throwing glasses from there.
0:05:32 > 0:05:36Just give me a sense of what it was like when you moved down here.
0:05:36 > 0:05:38Yeah, well, I ran down here to get away
0:05:38 > 0:05:42from the trouble, because I didn't want to get arrested.
0:05:42 > 0:05:44I had been arrested previously at football
0:05:44 > 0:05:47and I didn't want to get arrested any more.
0:05:47 > 0:05:48What I do recall, though, is
0:05:48 > 0:05:50that when all this started happening
0:05:50 > 0:05:55the police brought two police horses into that lane.
0:05:55 > 0:05:57It's easy with the benefit of hindsight to think about
0:05:57 > 0:06:00this, but I remember saying to my son, "What the hell are they
0:06:00 > 0:06:07bringing these into a lane with a lot of people in?"
0:06:07 > 0:06:10He came on the top of the l`ne there and they were
0:06:10 > 0:06:12walking, the police horses, just normal walking.
0:06:12 > 0:06:14And then you could tell by the police officer's bodx
0:06:14 > 0:06:17language he spotted something, he saw something,
0:06:17 > 0:06:19and he kicked the horse on.
0:06:19 > 0:06:21You know, the horse geed up.
0:06:21 > 0:06:24I don't know what the term hs, you know, the horse term,
0:06:24 > 0:06:27but the horse went faster.
0:06:27 > 0:06:30He only took a couple of strides and as I was
0:06:30 > 0:06:33turning back to see where the police officer was, it was impact.
0:06:33 > 0:06:36I was told to stop at the top of the lane.
0:06:36 > 0:06:38At that point, I saw the horse,
0:06:38 > 0:06:41if I can recall maybe two horses,
0:06:41 > 0:06:42going down.
0:06:42 > 0:06:45At the end, the police said, "Right, carry on."
0:06:45 > 0:06:46So we walked down.
0:06:46 > 0:06:51I got to the point there and Mr Coles was lying on the floor.
0:06:51 > 0:06:54At that particular time,
0:06:54 > 0:06:57I was unaware what had happdned
0:06:57 > 0:07:02But obviously, word got arotnd then from friends on the bus
0:07:02 > 0:07:05that said he had been hit by a horse.
0:07:05 > 0:07:07He headed backwards, he fell backwards
0:07:07 > 0:07:11flat on the ground, sort of like that.
0:07:11 > 0:07:13And then the horse put its left front foot
0:07:13 > 0:07:15right onto his stomach.
0:07:15 > 0:07:18In the ambulance, he was under a lot of pain.
0:07:18 > 0:07:22The actual injury to his stomach was quite prominent,
0:07:22 > 0:07:25because he kept pulling his T-shirt up and...
0:07:25 > 0:07:29It was obvious from then that he was
0:07:29 > 0:07:32in a bad way, you know?
0:07:32 > 0:07:34He was in and out of consciousness
0:07:34 > 0:07:37and screaming with pain when he came round.
0:07:37 > 0:07:39So we went to hospital
0:07:39 > 0:07:43and the rest is history, to be honest.
0:07:43 > 0:07:45After impact, the policeman tried to turn him,
0:07:45 > 0:07:49he turned him to the left, and it was difficult,
0:07:49 > 0:07:50because there was people evdrywhere.
0:07:50 > 0:07:53You know, people are shouting at the police officer,
0:07:53 > 0:07:55people were trying to grab the police officer, people were
0:07:55 > 0:07:57screaming, "Get his number."
0:07:57 > 0:07:59The horse's back legs slipphng on this and you could hear
0:07:59 > 0:08:01the hooves really loudly slhpping, trying to gain traction.
0:08:01 > 0:08:10So I definitely think the horse was spooked,
0:08:10 > 0:08:11but after the event.
0:08:11 > 0:08:13Before the event, no, the horse was just acting normal.
0:08:13 > 0:08:15I think as the phone calls progressed,
0:08:15 > 0:08:18you just felt it was getting more and more serious and he died of
0:08:18 > 0:08:21you know, bleeding, external bleeding and
0:08:21 > 0:08:23there was just nothing they could do.
0:08:23 > 0:08:26They tried their best to save his life
0:08:26 > 0:08:29but unfortunately he died on the table.
0:08:29 > 0:08:31It is possible he just wantdd to break up the crowd,
0:08:31 > 0:08:33to try to stop the trouble.
0:08:33 > 0:08:35He didn't mean to hit anyond, especially somebody
0:08:35 > 0:08:38crouched down, maybe he didn't see from up on a horse?
0:08:38 > 0:08:40I don't believe that.
0:08:40 > 0:08:43It is such a small space, why would you bring a horse
0:08:43 > 0:08:44into such a confined space?
0:08:44 > 0:08:46Yes, there was trouble, there was people throwing
0:08:46 > 0:08:49stones back and forward at dach other,
0:08:49 > 0:08:51but would you charge a horsd into people?
0:08:51 > 0:08:53Why would you do that?
0:08:53 > 0:08:56Shouldn't the fans who were here fighting that day
0:08:56 > 0:08:58take some responsibility as well for creating that situation?
0:08:58 > 0:09:01Yes, absolutely.
0:09:01 > 0:09:04Terry's family was asking questions of the force.
0:09:04 > 0:09:06The police complaints authority asked another police force
0:09:06 > 0:09:09to investigate.
0:09:09 > 0:09:11Because Alan Roberts had thrown something at the polhce,
0:09:11 > 0:09:14and because he had a historx of football violence, he was
0:09:14 > 0:09:15afraid to come forward.
0:09:15 > 0:09:16But a few days later,
0:09:16 > 0:09:19he spoke to West Yorkshire Police detectives.
0:09:19 > 0:09:22Obviously I made my statement originally 16 years ago.
0:09:22 > 0:09:25I will be honest, because I threw the slate
0:09:25 > 0:09:27at the police officer, it was going through my
0:09:27 > 0:09:29mind of going back to jail
0:09:29 > 0:09:32and whether I was going to incriminate myself so I had a lot of
0:09:32 > 0:09:34thinking to do, but eventually my conscience overcame.
0:09:34 > 0:09:36I think it was used at the inquest,
0:09:36 > 0:09:39but it was read out by someone else.
0:09:39 > 0:09:42I mean, I wasn't invited to the inquest, which did surprise me.
0:09:42 > 0:09:45You know, because I gave such an accurate account,
0:09:45 > 0:09:48I believe, of events.
0:09:48 > 0:09:51Alan Roberts was never called to explain what he s`w,
0:09:51 > 0:09:53and perhaps even more surprisingly there was a CCTV
0:09:53 > 0:09:59footage of the whole incident that was never shown to the jury.
0:09:59 > 0:10:02The family solicitor never even got to see it.
0:10:02 > 0:10:05It is something that has always disturbed Christine Coles.
0:10:05 > 0:10:08I think the jury should havd had the opportunity to actually see
0:10:08 > 0:10:11for themselves what happened.
0:10:11 > 0:10:15I actually viewed the tape and until this day
0:10:15 > 0:10:19I definitely say the horse went directly into his path.
0:10:19 > 0:10:21Do you think it was a deliberate act?
0:10:21 > 0:10:23I am not saying deliberate but it was
0:10:23 > 0:10:27obviously loss of control during the policing of the latch.
0:10:27 > 0:10:29A lot of witness statements backed that up,
0:10:29 > 0:10:33to say that, you know, it w`s out of control
0:10:33 > 0:10:36and the horses were travellhng at a greater speed...
0:10:36 > 0:10:43And you know the outcome.
0:10:43 > 0:10:44After a nine-day hearing here at Doncaster
0:10:44 > 0:10:47Magistrates' Court, the inqtest jury
0:10:47 > 0:10:51returned a verdict of accidental death.
0:10:51 > 0:10:53I think that they did focus a lot
0:10:53 > 0:10:55on the consumption of alcohol on the day.
0:10:55 > 0:10:57And bad behaviour of the fans.
0:10:57 > 0:11:03But I think it was the actu`l policing of the crowds.
0:11:03 > 0:11:05And did you get the sense afterwards that they
0:11:05 > 0:11:07were trying to blane Terry, or at least...?
0:11:07 > 0:11:09I think so, because of the focus on the alcohol.
0:11:09 > 0:11:12You know, they kept saying that he was four times
0:11:12 > 0:11:13over the drink-drive limit.
0:11:13 > 0:11:16But of course he was going to a football match,
0:11:16 > 0:11:19he wasn't driving, he wasn't causing any trouble.
0:11:19 > 0:11:23And it did seem to be focusdd mainly on the alcohol.
0:11:23 > 0:11:26The police officer riding the horse that hit Terry wasn't in cotrt
0:11:26 > 0:11:28when the inquest jury delivered its verdict.
0:11:28 > 0:11:30PC Dave Lindsay released a statement
0:11:30 > 0:11:33offering his condolences to the family.
0:11:45 > 0:11:47The jury's accidental death verdict reflects the evidence given
0:11:47 > 0:11:50and the circumstances of the incident.
0:11:50 > 0:11:53Do you support what happened on that day?
0:11:53 > 0:11:55I regret the death of Mr Coles.
0:11:55 > 0:11:59I support the policing oper`tion.
0:12:05 > 0:12:07They may well be.
0:12:07 > 0:12:16We may never be in an exactly similar situation.
0:12:16 > 0:12:19Christine Coles sued South Xorkshire Police but lost a claim
0:12:19 > 0:12:20for compensation.
0:12:20 > 0:12:21A review by the Independent Police Complaints
0:12:21 > 0:12:24Commission heavily criticisdd the horse rider, PC Lindsay, and two
0:12:24 > 0:12:25other officers.
0:12:25 > 0:12:27One of the match commanders, superintendent Dave
0:12:27 > 0:12:30Turner, was given a written warning, but his colleague, Chief Inspector
0:12:30 > 0:12:33Paul Cropley, and PC Dave Lhndsay, had both retired by then so there
0:12:33 > 0:12:36was no punishment.
0:12:36 > 0:12:39That could have been where it ended, but earlier
0:12:39 > 0:12:48this year the BBC showed a documentary about the Hillsborough
0:12:48 > 0:12:50families' fight for justice, and that got the Coles family thinking
0:12:50 > 0:12:52again about what happened to Terry.
0:12:52 > 0:12:55They recently discovered two of the officers
0:12:55 > 0:12:59found to have failed in their
0:12:59 > 0:13:02duty over Terry's death had also been involved in the Hillsborough
0:13:02 > 0:13:03disaster of 1989.
0:13:03 > 0:13:09Both of those officers, Dave Lindsay and Paul
0:13:09 > 0:13:11Cropley, gave statements after the Hillsborough disaster
0:13:11 > 0:13:13talking about fans who were drunk and you didn't
0:13:13 > 0:13:15have tickets.
0:13:15 > 0:13:17Now, that's the narrative that's been rejected
0:13:17 > 0:13:18twice.
0:13:18 > 0:13:21First by Lord Justice Taylor's inquiry in 1989, and again
0:13:21 > 0:13:24by the fresh Hillsborough inquests that finished earlier this xear
0:13:24 > 0:13:26I watched the documentary and I founnd that really totching.
0:13:26 > 0:13:29You know, it was so close to home that...
0:13:29 > 0:13:31And real people affected, isn't it?
0:13:31 > 0:13:35The way those families felt is exactly how we feel.
0:13:35 > 0:13:37How do you feel South Yorkshire Police has treated
0:13:37 > 0:13:38you and your family?
0:13:38 > 0:13:41We never really had an apology.
0:13:41 > 0:13:44And that would mean a lot.
0:13:44 > 0:13:47And then perhaps this would never ever happen agahn.
0:13:47 > 0:13:50I remember going out of the court that day and
0:13:50 > 0:13:56the chief officer shook my hand offered his condolences and stated
0:13:56 > 0:13:59"We shan't be gloating over this," which was sort of a funny statement
0:13:59 > 0:14:01to make.
0:14:01 > 0:14:04And those words will always stick with me for the rest of my
0:14:04 > 0:14:09life because...
0:14:09 > 0:14:10How did that leave you feelhng?
0:14:10 > 0:14:14I think they were relieved, to be honest, that they had won the
0:14:14 > 0:14:17case and we had the opportunity to take it to an Appeal Court, but
0:14:17 > 0:14:22financially we weren't able to do so.
0:14:22 > 0:14:25The family's lawyer believes that because of the links to
0:14:25 > 0:14:28Hillsborough, they should now have the chance to look at `ll the
0:14:28 > 0:14:32documents and the CCTV evidence from the time.
0:14:32 > 0:14:34The findings at Hillsborough were so damning about
0:14:34 > 0:14:37some of the police officers involved in both cases, I think it is
0:14:37 > 0:14:40sensible for the family to look at those problems that have been
0:14:40 > 0:14:43highlighted and see if they can get the answers that they want.
0:14:43 > 0:14:46Christine told us that she had seen CCTV of the incident, but that
0:14:46 > 0:14:51wasn't presented at the inqtest
0:14:51 > 0:14:53Does that trouble you?
0:14:53 > 0:14:55I can't understand why it wasn't presented
0:14:55 > 0:14:57at the inquest.
0:14:57 > 0:14:59It's such a key piece of evhdence.
0:14:59 > 0:15:01It was available.
0:15:01 > 0:15:04And I think that is something that the coroner will have to look at,
0:15:04 > 0:15:11and maybe look retrospectivdly, that may adjust their decision.
0:15:11 > 0:15:14And last month, Terry Coles' case was raised
0:15:14 > 0:15:16in Parliament by the Shadow Home Office Minister and MP
0:15:16 > 0:15:17for Swansea East.
0:15:17 > 0:15:19The Home Secretary will be `ware of continuing concerns about
0:15:19 > 0:15:22the historical conduct of South Yorkshire Police.
0:15:22 > 0:15:25Is she also aware of the tr`gic case of Terry Coles?
0:15:25 > 0:15:29Would she agree to look at the evidence and accept that unless
0:15:29 > 0:15:32we have the truth about all these past injustices,
0:15:32 > 0:15:34we will not be able to
0:15:34 > 0:15:36restore trust in South Yorkshire Police?
0:15:37 > 0:15:39Somebody has to take responsibility for what happened
0:15:39 > 0:15:40that day.
0:15:40 > 0:15:44Whether it is an organisation in terms of South
0:15:44 > 0:15:46Yorkshire Police, for the w`y that they organised
0:15:46 > 0:15:51the planning of that match, whether it is an individual,
0:15:51 > 0:15:55somebody made the decision that it would be policed in such a way and
0:15:55 > 0:15:58decisions were made on that day the consequence of that was Terry
0:15:58 > 0:15:59Coles lost his life.
0:15:59 > 0:16:03We need to find out what went wrong.
0:16:03 > 0:16:06It was an accident waiting to happen.
0:16:06 > 0:16:09There was women and children in that lane as well.
0:16:09 > 0:16:18And unfortunately it was Mr Coles that paid the price.
0:16:22 > 0:16:24What sort of a lasting impact has it had?
0:16:24 > 0:16:28It goes through my head at least three or four times a week.
0:16:28 > 0:16:30You know, I see it over and over and over and over,
0:16:30 > 0:16:32to be honest with you.
0:16:32 > 0:16:33It has never gone away.
0:16:33 > 0:16:35I see it like it happened yesterday, and
0:16:35 > 0:16:38just coming here today now, it has had a profound effect because..
0:16:38 > 0:16:39Just being back here is...
0:16:39 > 0:16:41It's weird, you know.
0:16:41 > 0:16:44My heart is going now, just thinking about Terry.
0:16:44 > 0:16:53We won't be able to move forward until
0:16:53 > 0:16:55we have the full truth about Orgreave, Hillsborough, abott what
0:16:55 > 0:16:57happened in Rotherham, also in terms of the
0:16:57 > 0:16:58case of Terry Coles,
0:16:58 > 0:17:02you know, people need to know what happened
0:17:02 > 0:17:04so that we can learn from the past
0:17:04 > 0:17:05and bring people back together.
0:17:05 > 0:17:10And how do you feel South Yorkshire Police responded?
0:17:10 > 0:17:13Not as responsive as I hoped, because we
0:17:13 > 0:17:14did approach them back in May
0:17:14 > 0:17:16and we're still really waithng for an
0:17:16 > 0:17:19outcome from it.
0:17:19 > 0:17:21You know, they have said they are considering the evhdence
0:17:21 > 0:17:24but we just haven't had any sort of concrete response from them,
0:17:24 > 0:17:27as yet.
0:17:27 > 0:17:31We asked South Yorkshire Police for an interview,
0:17:31 > 0:17:33they declined, but gave us a statement saying
0:17:33 > 0:17:35they are now working with the
0:17:35 > 0:17:38family's legal team to gain a better understanding of their concdrns
0:17:38 > 0:17:41The Independent Police Complaints Commission told us it has considered
0:17:41 > 0:17:47the case but there are no plans to review the original inquhry.
0:17:47 > 0:17:51We just feel like he deservds justice is well.
0:17:51 > 0:17:58He didn't deserve to go to that match and he didn't deserve to
0:17:58 > 0:18:00die and we didn't deserve grow up without a father.
0:18:00 > 0:18:02Just as Orgreave is different to Hillsborough, nobody is
0:18:02 > 0:18:05making a direct parallel with what happened here.
0:18:05 > 0:18:07But you have got a match,
0:18:07 > 0:18:09you've got South Yorkshire Police and you've got
0:18:09 > 0:18:12officers' accounts of what happened at Hillsborough that are already
0:18:12 > 0:18:12being re-examined.
0:18:12 > 0:18:14So, perhaps, it was inevitable that fresh questions
0:18:14 > 0:18:17would be raised about what happened to Terry Coles.
0:18:21 > 0:18:27And if you have got any comlents about tonight's programme,
0:18:27 > 0:18:31or you have got a story you think we might like to cover,
0:18:31 > 0:18:33you can get in touch on Facebook or on Twitter.
0:18:38 > 0:18:40Well, it was George Osbournd's big idea to help the North
0:18:40 > 0:18:43catch up with London, but with the former Chancellor now
0:18:43 > 0:18:45consigned to the backbenches, what remains of
0:18:45 > 0:18:47his vision of a Northern powerhouse?
0:18:47 > 0:18:49We examine claims that the uncertainty
0:18:49 > 0:18:50surrounding Brexit could
0:18:50 > 0:18:52cost billions of pounds of investments in the north.
0:18:52 > 0:19:02Toby Foster reports.
0:19:10 > 0:19:12The nation's wealth was built on the draft of
0:19:12 > 0:19:13the industrial north.
0:19:13 > 0:19:14It was a powerhouse of factories.
0:19:14 > 0:19:16This slick promotional video is how the government
0:19:16 > 0:19:19is selling the North today, as a place for foreign investment.
0:19:19 > 0:19:21But just what is the Northern powerhouse?
0:19:21 > 0:19:22Does it even exist?
0:19:22 > 0:19:23Or is it just a catchphrase?
0:19:23 > 0:19:26We cannot live in a country where we have only got
0:19:26 > 0:19:27one successful city.
0:19:27 > 0:19:29We need to make sure we have got lots.
0:19:29 > 0:19:32There is not really anything in London to draw me away
0:19:32 > 0:19:33from such a beautiful place as this.
0:19:33 > 0:19:36The big goal here is to try to turn around something that has
0:19:36 > 0:19:39blighted our country for 100 years, which is the North, South dhvide.
0:19:39 > 0:19:43Since the vote to leave the EU, many aspects of life in the UK have
0:19:43 > 0:19:44been overshadowed by post Brexit uncertainty.
0:19:44 > 0:19:49I have come to York, home of the Europhile.
0:19:49 > 0:19:5458% of the electorate here voted to remain in the EU.
0:19:54 > 0:20:00Two weeks after the nation voted to leave the EU,
0:20:00 > 0:20:06James Wharton, the pro-Brexht Minister for the Northern
0:20:06 > 0:20:09powerhouse, came to York to visit the newly crowned best high street
0:20:09 > 0:20:10in the country, Bishopthorpd Road.
0:20:10 > 0:20:13I wanted to test the mood here and see what effect Brdxit
0:20:13 > 0:20:14has had on confidence.
0:20:14 > 0:20:16A Dutch flower exporter had just arrived with a delivery
0:20:16 > 0:20:19which had become 20% more expensive because of the exchange ratd.
0:20:19 > 0:20:23He fears for his business.
0:20:23 > 0:20:27At the moment, we only export to the UK, it is my main market
0:20:27 > 0:20:29I am not planning on changing it.
0:20:29 > 0:20:32The shops are going to buy less quality flowers because thex have
0:20:32 > 0:20:38to buy more and selling less flowers.
0:20:38 > 0:20:39-- to pay more.
0:20:39 > 0:20:40And that is bad news for this florist.
0:20:40 > 0:20:43It might mean that we might lose these fantastic lorries comhng
0:20:43 > 0:20:45in with such a wonderful supply of fresh flowers.
0:20:45 > 0:20:48And there is no way we could grow them in England.
0:20:48 > 0:20:51We don't have the daylight, we don't have the weather,
0:20:51 > 0:20:52the conditions.
0:20:52 > 0:20:55We are not geared up for it.
0:20:55 > 0:21:05Next door, Lee Preston and his wife Lucy opened this coffee shop
0:21:06 > 0:21:11three years ago with the redundancy package from his IT job.
0:21:11 > 0:21:14I have lived here my whole life pretty much, and I've never seen
0:21:14 > 0:21:15much evidence of a Northern Power...
0:21:15 > 0:21:18Certainly less so now than probably ever, because the things th`t made
0:21:18 > 0:21:20the North and north, which is the industry,
0:21:20 > 0:21:21is not here any more really.
0:21:21 > 0:21:25The darkening skies seem to reflect the mood here, and as the r`in began
0:21:25 > 0:21:29to fall, the Minister for the Northern powerhouse
0:21:29 > 0:21:31was as unprepared for the wdather as his fellow Brexiteers sedmed
0:21:31 > 0:21:33to be for a future outside the EU.
0:21:33 > 0:21:36He has only been here for 14 minutes, but already he has
0:21:36 > 0:21:39boosted the local economy, because, like me, he has
0:21:39 > 0:21:40had to buy a brolly.
0:21:40 > 0:21:42If the powerhouse is going to deliver, it needs to start
0:21:42 > 0:21:46to rebalance that economy, to create growth across the board
0:21:46 > 0:21:49that matches growth we have seen elsewhere in the country.
0:21:49 > 0:21:52That would be more better jobs, more long-term investment.
0:21:52 > 0:21:56This is about taking it to the next level.
0:21:56 > 0:21:58Four months on, and after George Osborne's sacking,
0:21:58 > 0:22:00James Wharton has been moved to another department
0:22:00 > 0:22:03and there is a new Minister for the Northern powerhouse.
0:22:03 > 0:22:12Andrew Percy, the Goole MP.
0:22:12 > 0:22:16His first act was to grant Sheffield a city region devolution de`l.
0:22:16 > 0:22:19The devolution deals we havd signed the government will bring ?3 billion
0:22:19 > 0:22:21of funding that would otherwise be spent and determined
0:22:21 > 0:22:24in London, in Whitehall.
0:22:24 > 0:22:28As somebody who is from the north, a proud Northerner, I have `lways
0:22:28 > 0:22:31argued that we make better decisions from ourselves.
0:22:31 > 0:22:34And we require a mayor as p`rt of that, because we expect
0:22:34 > 0:22:36there to be a strong figure of accountability.
0:22:36 > 0:22:39Following on from London's layor, there are going to be votes
0:22:39 > 0:22:44for so-called Metro Mayors in Manchester, Liverpool,
0:22:44 > 0:22:49Tees Valley and right here in Sheffield,
0:22:49 > 0:22:51where just four years ago, in a referendum, voters rejdcted
0:22:51 > 0:22:53the idea of an elected mayor.
0:22:53 > 0:22:55Critics fear the government will use devolution of power to shift
0:22:55 > 0:22:58the blane to local government for The Deep cuts in servicds.
0:22:58 > 0:23:01But the think tank Centre for Cities is more positive about the hdea
0:23:01 > 0:23:04of devolving financial powers to a city region mayor.
0:23:04 > 0:23:07Very big debate about whether devolution is about managing
0:23:07 > 0:23:10cuts or is about making surd you can make the most of the money.
0:23:10 > 0:23:12So what we are doing through devolution is getting places
0:23:12 > 0:23:15the chance to take their own decisions about what works.
0:23:15 > 0:23:17People in Whitehall don't know what is going to work best
0:23:17 > 0:23:18in Sheffield city region.
0:23:18 > 0:23:28Save Bis jobs...
0:23:28 > 0:23:30250 civil service jobs in Sheffield at the Departmdnt
0:23:30 > 0:23:32for Business, Innovation and Skills are being cut.
0:23:32 > 0:23:36Many staff working on the concept of the Northern powerhouse
0:23:36 > 0:23:37face losing their jobs or moving to London.
0:23:37 > 0:23:40The irony of this is not lost on them.
0:23:40 > 0:23:43It is crazy.
0:23:43 > 0:23:49Move the big departments out of Whitehall.
0:23:49 > 0:23:51London is overheating, the government is moving in the wrong
0:23:51 > 0:23:53direction with this decision.
0:23:53 > 0:23:55Nearby in Rotherham, privatd sector jobs are being created,
0:23:55 > 0:23:58but this has nothing to do with the Northern powerhousd.
0:23:58 > 0:24:01The advanced manufacturing Park is a high-tech hub with dirdct links
0:24:01 > 0:24:03to education and a nearby cdntre to train apprentices.
0:24:03 > 0:24:06And if we are going to keep our brightest and best in the north
0:24:06 > 0:24:10we need to make sure there `re well skilled jobs, to keep them `way
0:24:10 > 0:24:11from the lure of London.
0:24:11 > 0:24:14I am on my way to meet a man who, with a first-class masters
0:24:14 > 0:24:17and doctorate in physics from Oxford, could have had his pick
0:24:17 > 0:24:22of high-tech jobs anywhere in the country.
0:24:22 > 0:24:26Most of my friends from Oxford went off to London or other major
0:24:26 > 0:24:30cities around the world.
0:24:30 > 0:24:40But Richard found work here, in his home in the Lake District.
0:24:41 > 0:24:44At Siemens plant, he's workhng on a prototype cable that
0:24:44 > 0:24:47will have a 30 year life sp`n three miles beneath the sea,
0:24:47 > 0:24:50and plugs that can handle the output of a small nuclear power st`tion.
0:24:50 > 0:24:54I was afraid that I might h`ve to get a job in the south e`st
0:24:54 > 0:24:57if I wanted to work in rese`rch andf development, so I was
0:24:57 > 0:24:58delighted when I had
0:24:58 > 0:25:00the opportunity to come up `nd do some high-tech work
0:25:00 > 0:25:01in the north-west.
0:25:01 > 0:25:04Even within this company, there is enough varied work to keep
0:25:04 > 0:25:05you going on a long career.
0:25:05 > 0:25:09I mean, I have been here for four years now and I have had thd chance
0:25:09 > 0:25:12to work on brand-new research, I have been able to do mech`nical
0:25:12 > 0:25:14design, electrical design, actually testing the compondnts that
0:25:14 > 0:25:19I have spent so long working on
0:25:20 > 0:25:22But for Richard, it is not all about the job.
0:25:22 > 0:25:24This is the landscape that surrounds him on his
0:25:24 > 0:25:30commute to work.
0:25:30 > 0:25:33So, as you cycle to work through all of this every morning,
0:25:33 > 0:25:36Richard, do you ever wonder what the rat race would be like
0:25:36 > 0:25:41I prefer not to!
0:25:41 > 0:25:44I prefer just to enjoy the ride into work and on a day
0:25:44 > 0:25:47like today enjoy the sunshine and peace and quiet.
0:25:47 > 0:25:50There is not really anything in London to draw me away from such
0:25:50 > 0:25:51a beautiful place of birth.
0:25:51 > 0:25:53But Richard's employer is Gdrman and investment is key
0:25:53 > 0:25:55if the Northern powerhouse is going to work.
0:25:55 > 0:25:57Siemens has already invested heavily in the north, including
0:25:57 > 0:26:00the ?310 million wind turbine blade factory and hold back.
0:26:00 > 0:26:02-- in Hull.
0:26:02 > 0:26:05Now they say Brexit threatened such investment in the future.
0:26:05 > 0:26:06Short-term, in terms of any investment decisions
0:26:06 > 0:26:09you might want to make here, especially those which revolve
0:26:09 > 0:26:14in exporting to the European Union, they will be nice.
0:26:14 > 0:26:15-- be on ice.
0:26:15 > 0:26:18There is no question about that
0:26:18 > 0:26:19Doctor Craig Berry is a political economist
0:26:19 > 0:26:22at Sheffield University specialising in the Northern economy.
0:26:22 > 0:26:24He fears Brexit poses a major threat to the success
0:26:24 > 0:26:31of the Northern powerhouse.
0:26:31 > 0:26:36The Brexit vote was a vote to take back control but it undermines
0:26:36 > 0:26:38the ability of the North to take back control, primarily
0:26:38 > 0:26:43because the very specific effect of the European structural
0:26:43 > 0:26:48investment fund has been withdrawn from the region
0:26:48 > 0:26:50and the North was in receipt of billions of pounds up
0:26:50 > 0:26:53to 2020 from these funds, and it is quite uncertain how much
0:26:53 > 0:26:56of that will actually no end up in the region.
0:26:56 > 0:26:58What could the effect be on investment and jobs,
0:26:58 > 0:27:00for example in Sunderland?
0:27:00 > 0:27:02These are worrying times for the north-east, not least
0:27:02 > 0:27:06to car manufacturing.
0:27:06 > 0:27:10They will not be all be at risk but even if a big investor
0:27:10 > 0:27:13like Nissan moves out, some of those jobs will be taken up
0:27:13 > 0:27:16by other firms picking up the pieces of the industry.
0:27:16 > 0:27:17Since leaving office, former Chancellor George Osborne has
0:27:17 > 0:27:20set up the Institute for the Northern powerhouse and has
0:27:20 > 0:27:21defended his legacy.
0:27:21 > 0:27:23The Northern powerhouse is not just a slogan.
0:27:23 > 0:27:31And it is not just saying everything in the North is great.
0:27:31 > 0:27:34No wonder why some Northerndrs fail to look at you as the champhon
0:27:34 > 0:27:37of the North when we saw thd cuts, can you really be a champion
0:27:37 > 0:27:40of the North after being in charge of the austerity budget?
0:27:40 > 0:27:42When I became Chancellor, people were being laid off,
0:27:42 > 0:27:44unemployment was rising, investment was not coming
0:27:44 > 0:27:45to the north of England.
0:27:45 > 0:27:48The big goal here is to try to turn around something that has
0:27:48 > 0:27:51blighted our country for 100 years, which is the North, South dhvide,
0:27:51 > 0:27:52and it cannot be done overnhght
0:27:52 > 0:27:53We are now post Brexit.
0:27:53 > 0:27:56Already we have heard from people like Siemens and Nissan
0:27:56 > 0:27:58that they are putting their investment in the North
0:27:58 > 0:28:00on hold until they know what is happening.
0:28:00 > 0:28:02This is very much reliant on investment, is it not?
0:28:02 > 0:28:05In a Brexit world, it is evdn more important that the North
0:28:05 > 0:28:06sells itself around the world.
0:28:06 > 0:28:14You know, I was with the le`ders of the different cities and we went
0:28:14 > 0:28:17to China and, as a result, Chinese investment has started
0:28:17 > 0:28:18to flow into Manchester and Sheffield and Leeds.
0:28:18 > 0:28:21It is an example of how collectively the North can punch
0:28:21 > 0:28:22above its weight.
0:28:22 > 0:28:24There are still major obstacles to realising the vision
0:28:24 > 0:28:28of a Northern powerhouse.
0:28:28 > 0:28:30Vital transport improvements are long overdue and the success
0:28:30 > 0:28:32of George Osborne's big ide` will largely come down
0:28:32 > 0:28:33to one thing, money.
0:28:33 > 0:28:39Will there be enough?
0:28:39 > 0:28:41That is all from us here in Rotherham.
0:28:41 > 0:28:43Make sure you join us next week
0:28:44 > 0:28:46When we'll be looking at the devastating effects
0:28:46 > 0:28:50of diabetes and meeting a woman who is doing her best to be`t this
0:28:50 > 0:28:53terrible disease before it destroys her health.