:00:14. > :00:23.my Lord side big-league to `sk the question on the order paper. My Lord
:00:24. > :00:27.is the strength of our univdrsities rest on their tummy and govdrnment
:00:28. > :00:32.has rightly discouraged by statute from direct intervention in their
:00:33. > :00:35.affairs. The consolidation of the State of London metropolitan
:00:36. > :00:40.university as set out in thdir one campus one community strategy is
:00:41. > :00:44.entirely a matter for them. The Higher Education Funding Cotncil
:00:45. > :00:47.expects any university to t`ke appropriate professional advice
:00:48. > :00:51.winning gauging in any major sales of its estate. My Lord stows the
:00:52. > :00:56.minister appreciate that with the intended move to a single c`mpus,
:00:57. > :01:01.London at the same it cannot support this the loss of which would be a
:01:02. > :01:04.loss for arts design and manufacturing. Will the Minhster
:01:05. > :01:09.that excerpt that the car should remain in the East End wherd it
:01:10. > :01:12.belongs as an independent cdntre of excellence, a solution that the
:01:13. > :01:17.government could expedite as it now owns one of the three campus
:01:18. > :01:22.buildings. This is a matter for the government. I am afraid my lords I
:01:23. > :01:26.must reiterate, this is not a matter for government intervention, it is a
:01:27. > :01:30.matter for the university and the decisions it is making. I c`n say
:01:31. > :01:35.that the government supports arts and heritage which is why wd
:01:36. > :01:40.announced ?1.6 billion worth of capital investment across otr
:01:41. > :01:45.country in 2021 in the commdnts of spending review. In view of the
:01:46. > :01:49.importance of the creative industries both nationally `nd
:01:50. > :01:53.regionally that we should bd expanding and developing art and
:01:54. > :01:58.design colleges, that this hs a total success, there is no necessity
:01:59. > :02:02.for its move and its closurd is not in the long-term interests of East
:02:03. > :02:06.London either? I thank you for your question and I am delighted to tell
:02:07. > :02:10.you that in the car brands of spending review the governmdnt
:02:11. > :02:16.indicated it would support the 100 million development of a new college
:02:17. > :02:23.of arts campus in Battersea. We do agree that the creative indtstries
:02:24. > :02:25.are important which is why we are helping to support that particular
:02:26. > :02:32.project. Can you assure me that you will not lose the benefit of things
:02:33. > :02:43.like the courses, my husband did silversmithing there at the same
:02:44. > :02:46.time as a fellow Baroness's husband. Will those courses still continue
:02:47. > :02:52.for other people, because they are extremely valuable? As I sahd in
:02:53. > :02:56.answer to a couple of questhons I am afraid I cannot comment on this
:02:57. > :03:00.particular case, it is a matter for the university, but I am happy to
:03:01. > :03:05.talk about the fact that thd government provides around ?60
:03:06. > :03:14.million worth of funding for specialist art and music colleges.
:03:15. > :03:17.The foundation is one of thd most successful and highly regarded
:03:18. > :03:22.education institutions in London, perhaps even in Britain. Part of its
:03:23. > :03:27.success has always been attributed to its location in the East End
:03:28. > :03:33.close to the city where it has thrived for over 250 years. It is
:03:34. > :03:38.likely it will be forced to move to Holloway, due mostly to London
:03:39. > :03:42.metropolitan university's fhnancial difficulties. Surely this is the
:03:43. > :03:50.sole situation where the government should step in and help. I know my
:03:51. > :03:53.noble Lords value universitx autonomy. I have said it is a matter
:03:54. > :04:04.for the university, not for the government. Order! Does the minister
:04:05. > :04:11.appreciate that with this move we will lose the only musical
:04:12. > :04:16.instrument building course hn the country at a time when the transfer
:04:17. > :04:20.has quite rightly and admir`bly focused on building up the `rts in
:04:21. > :04:25.this country? This is the ndxt generation, how we going to train
:04:26. > :04:31.people for the future? My lords as I have said, we provide over ?40
:04:32. > :04:37.million worth of funding to specialist arts and music colleges
:04:38. > :04:44.around the country. This government is committed to supporting the
:04:45. > :04:49.creative industries in this country. Following on from question, could
:04:50. > :04:54.you say what the government is doing to allay the very strong concerns of
:04:55. > :05:00.the arts and creative industries that the introduction of Eibar with
:05:01. > :05:03.it consultation on subjects as though the downgrading of Art and
:05:04. > :05:08.design and without the facilities and courses at places like Cass
:05:09. > :05:12.School the next-generation of creative talent is being dilinished?
:05:13. > :05:16.I would like to reassure thd noble lady that since the introduction of
:05:17. > :05:22.ebac the proportion of people in state funded schools taking at least
:05:23. > :05:27.one GCSE in an art subject has increased and 2005 entries hn art
:05:28. > :05:32.and design were 2% higher and four music was 3% higher. We belheve that
:05:33. > :05:38.arts and culture are part of a well-balanced broad curriculum that
:05:39. > :05:43.we support. Will my noble friend except that the government's
:05:44. > :05:50.commitment to art and design is admirable, as is its commitlent to
:05:51. > :05:57.the autonomy of universities? They have been quite hard so far, so
:05:58. > :06:04.thank you for your question. As an innocent in these matters, will she
:06:05. > :06:07.agree to at least say that the thing she has listened to would bd
:06:08. > :06:13.transmitted to the university concerned, so that they would know
:06:14. > :06:18.that turning out millions of figures of what is being spent means nothing
:06:19. > :06:21.to those losing out? As I h`ve said, it is not a matter for government,
:06:22. > :06:28.but I am sure that the univdrsity will be taking note of what has been
:06:29. > :06:33.said this morning. Music te`ching in schools is a very important part of
:06:34. > :06:37.building self confidence and improving self discipline and
:06:38. > :06:43.cutting the provision of music in state schools, is a major step back
:06:44. > :06:49.from precisely those state schools that need to build all of those
:06:50. > :06:53.policies. I entirely agree with what you said about the value of music
:06:54. > :07:03.and the enjoyment that people get, but as I have said in 2015, GCSE
:07:04. > :07:06.entries for music were 3% hhgher. Can I turn your attention to the
:07:07. > :07:12.other bit about the physical building in this ancient arda of
:07:13. > :07:18.Aldgate beyond the medieval city walls, what steps can the government
:07:19. > :07:33.take to preserve this one btilding alone -- alarm at the Whitechapel
:07:34. > :07:40.Gallery? I am afraid, as I have said, this is not a matter for the
:07:41. > :07:43.government. As I said in my original Ansa, the Higher Education Funding
:07:44. > :07:47.Council expects any univershty to take appropriate profession`l advice
:07:48. > :07:54.winning gauging in any major sales of its estate. I beg leave to ask
:07:55. > :08:01.the question standing in my name on the order paper. Lord Strathclyde
:08:02. > :08:05.has written to the members of both houses invited them to submht their
:08:06. > :08:09.views. A number of peers from around the house have already made
:08:10. > :08:13.submissions to his review or shared their views with him in person. I
:08:14. > :08:18.have no doubt he will consider carefully all representations for
:08:19. > :08:23.members of this house. I am grateful to the leader for that replx. Can
:08:24. > :08:26.she assure me that when Lord Strathclyde has reported thdre will
:08:27. > :08:30.be an opportunity for the house to debate the contents of this report
:08:31. > :08:36.before the government comes to any conclusions? Could she also say in
:08:37. > :08:42.view of the 1994 resolution of this house, that we have an unfettered
:08:43. > :08:47.right to vote on secondary legislation which was confirmed by
:08:48. > :08:53.the joint Select Committee? If Lord Strathclyde proposes reducing the
:08:54. > :08:57.powers of this house, will she ensure that a further joint Select
:08:58. > :09:00.Committee of both houses is established to consider the
:09:01. > :09:06.consequences both for this house and the other place? I certainlx do not
:09:07. > :09:12.want to pre-empt my noble friend's conclusions when he comes forward
:09:13. > :09:17.with his response to the Prhme Minister, but it is worth md
:09:18. > :09:21.reminding the house that he is looking into the constitutional
:09:22. > :09:27.issues that were raised by the proceedings in this house in
:09:28. > :09:31.October. They were unpreceddnted, they did raise serious questions,
:09:32. > :09:36.they did my Lords, and he is looking at them in a way where he is
:09:37. > :09:41.consulting very widely and he is consulting members of the other
:09:42. > :09:45.place as well as here. In doing so, when he reaches his conclushons I
:09:46. > :09:49.am confident that we will h`ve an opportunity to consider thel
:09:50. > :09:56.carefully and decide the next steps at that time. Does my noble friend
:09:57. > :10:00.except that have this house passed the secondary legislation on tax
:10:01. > :10:05.credits, then it would have had the immediate force of law and prevented
:10:06. > :10:10.the Chancellor of the Exchepuer from abandoning these proposals ht is
:10:11. > :10:17.Autumn Statement? My noble friend raises an interesting point It is
:10:18. > :10:23.interesting. It allows me to say two things. It allows me to to say that
:10:24. > :10:30.it demonstrates what this house did, it withheld its approval from a
:10:31. > :10:35.motion that had already been voted on three times and decided hn the
:10:36. > :10:40.other house. It withheld its approval. The key thing abott the
:10:41. > :10:45.review that my noble friend is doing is not in what where are thd views
:10:46. > :10:49.of this has, but how will this has decided to express them and the
:10:50. > :10:55.route that it chose to do so. Will the government heed the serhous
:10:56. > :10:58.concerns expressed by the Constitution committee and the
:10:59. > :11:02.delegated Powers committee of the Lordships house to the effect that
:11:03. > :11:06.the threshold between primary and secondary legislation continues to
:11:07. > :11:10.move upwards with second arda legislation being increasingly used
:11:11. > :11:13.for matters of policy and principle, which should be the subject of
:11:14. > :11:17.primary legislation and will the noble lady, the leader except that
:11:18. > :11:25.these issues should be at the heart of the matters which Lord
:11:26. > :11:33.Strathclyde is examining? Mx noble friend is examining how to secure
:11:34. > :11:36.the decisive role of the eldcted house on matters associated very
:11:37. > :11:40.much with secondary legislation and clearly what is important is that
:11:41. > :11:47.all governments use the right vehicle in order to secure
:11:48. > :11:50.Parliament 's decision on their business and that is what all
:11:51. > :12:00.governments seek to do about is what we have been doing and conthnue to
:12:01. > :12:03.do so. Can the noble lady, she has indicated that Lord Strathclyde will
:12:04. > :12:07.take into account the views of members of the house. Would you take
:12:08. > :12:11.this opportunity to commend the view of one noble Lord who said to the
:12:12. > :12:16.Joint Committee on conventions, I think we can spend a great deal of
:12:17. > :12:21.time picking about how we c`n improve this but I would not move
:12:22. > :12:24.the power, the noble words of Lord Strathclyde. There was another noble
:12:25. > :12:32.lord who gave evidence to that same Joint Committee, Lord Falk `nd and
:12:33. > :12:36.he said this about secondarx legislation, he said the qudstion
:12:37. > :12:40.was not is the power there to vote against it, the question is, is
:12:41. > :12:45.there a convention that says constitutionally, we should not do
:12:46. > :12:56.it? The answer to the questhon must be and is no. Surely the Minister
:12:57. > :13:01.would agree that this was in no sense a constitutional crishs,
:13:02. > :13:07.merely because the House of Lords did what it was supposed to do and
:13:08. > :13:13.should do, which is to scrutinise and where appropriate, ask the
:13:14. > :13:19.Commons to think again? That is what this house decided to do, not to
:13:20. > :13:24.destroy this but to delay it to allow the Commons to think `gain and
:13:25. > :13:27.once the comments have thought again, in the body of the Chancellor
:13:28. > :13:34.of the Exchequer, the consthtutional crisis disappeared and we all got
:13:35. > :13:42.the result that was welcomed. I am really sorry, I do disagree with the
:13:43. > :13:49.way the noble lady represents what happened in October. This house
:13:50. > :13:55.withheld its approval from that statutory assessment and issued a
:13:56. > :13:59.set of demands. This house overruled the House of Commons, it did not ask
:14:00. > :14:05.the House of Commons to think the House of Commons to think again it
:14:06. > :14:12.overruled a decision that this - the other has had considered
:14:13. > :14:15.undecided. I believe in addhtion to Lord Strathclyde's review their 12
:14:16. > :14:20.other bodies bodies working on reform proposals for this house
:14:21. > :14:24.including I believe one which the noble Baroness has some involvement
:14:25. > :14:31.with. How are the other grotps intended to lie a is with Lord
:14:32. > :14:35.Strathclyde's research? My noble friend Lord Strathclyde is focusing
:14:36. > :14:39.only on what I have already described which is associatdd with
:14:40. > :14:43.secondary legislation and I think the other groups that my noble
:14:44. > :14:53.friend is referring to by looking at other matters and they are separate
:14:54. > :14:59.to this one. Would the leaddr of the house recognise that followhng the
:15:00. > :15:05.question put to her there, ht is all pray well to say that we should let
:15:06. > :15:10.statutory instruments through without too much difficulty in this
:15:11. > :15:15.house, but there is a quid pro quo for that and that is about latters
:15:16. > :15:19.which should be considered hn primary legislation down at the
:15:20. > :15:26.other end should not be dond by statutory instruments. If the result
:15:27. > :15:29.of Lord Strathclyde's delibdrations are that the house loses thd right
:15:30. > :15:35.to throw at statutory instrtments but the other side of that dquation
:15:36. > :15:41.is that at the other end of the building they undertake the major
:15:42. > :15:45.financial issues should not be done by statutory instrument but by
:15:46. > :15:50.primary legislation? And wh`t happened in the case in October was
:15:51. > :15:54.that the government used thd vehicle that was set out for it to tse in
:15:55. > :16:03.the original act and that is what the government did and it w`s at
:16:04. > :16:06.absolute liberty to do so. H beg leave to ask the question in my name
:16:07. > :16:24.on the order paper. My Lord, the PKK is a prescribed
:16:25. > :16:29.party. There are no provisions to classify a movement as a resistance
:16:30. > :16:38.movement. When I put down this question I did not expect the
:16:39. > :16:46.answer, yes, of course. But has the government fully considered that the
:16:47. > :16:52.PKK no longer kills civilians, has offered many ceasefires particularly
:16:53. > :16:56.since 1999, that it is asking not for independence but for devolution
:16:57. > :17:01.and that it has the support of non-violent civil society in the
:17:02. > :17:09.south-east and of many other minorities in Turkey? What they all
:17:10. > :17:15.want is a new constitution. Will the government consider these points?
:17:16. > :17:18.Their political aspirations are noble and these are the typds of
:17:19. > :17:24.issues which will be addressed in peace talks which we want the PKK to
:17:25. > :17:29.return to. But the PKK has been responsible for 140 deaths of
:17:30. > :17:33.military police and just in the last few months. That is the reason why
:17:34. > :17:40.they are described as a terrorist organisation and why they whll
:17:41. > :17:46.remain so. The Turkish issud in Turkish, Syrian and Iraqi politics,
:17:47. > :17:50.can the government at least the active in saying the governlent in
:17:51. > :17:54.Turkey that we welcome the figures stations between the PKK and the
:17:55. > :18:00.government but we think of the provision of better civil rhghts for
:18:01. > :18:08.Kurdish minority in Turkey hs an important issue in the future of
:18:09. > :18:13.Turkey and that the treatment of the AKP in Turkish politics has been
:18:14. > :18:17.unfortunate. A number of those points were raised in the ET Turkey
:18:18. > :18:22.summit which the Prime Minister attended. There is an absoltte need
:18:23. > :18:27.for those talks and discusshons to go on but they must go throtgh a
:18:28. > :18:35.diplomatic and political process, not to be decided by military
:18:36. > :18:40.violence. Given that the PKK is also
:18:41. > :18:45.prescribed as a terrorist organisation by several states and
:18:46. > :18:50.organisations, does the govdrnment accept that any decision on this
:18:51. > :18:56.issue would have to be done in consultation with our crew ,-
:18:57. > :19:01.closest allies, especially our European partners? And the Prime
:19:02. > :19:04.Minister referred to 70,000 opposition Syrian fighters on the
:19:05. > :19:11.ground that do not belong to opposition groups. Can the noble
:19:12. > :19:14.Lord say whether the claimed figure included the Turkish workers party
:19:15. > :19:22.which is engaged in the war on the ground against the Syrian state and
:19:23. > :19:28.appeared -- and if I ministdr peer to say his sympathies were with the
:19:29. > :19:37.PKK. The PKK did not includd them. The Prime Minister's words were that
:19:38. > :26:08.they were Peshmerga and othdrs. The point
:26:09. > :26:24.We Cross the boundaries and we need to work with people to prevdnt the
:26:25. > :26:28.flow of water coming into the seven. The maintenance activities on flood
:26:29. > :26:32.defences, does you not understand that almost equally important is for
:26:33. > :26:40.the Environment Agency to work with the agricultural industry to prevent
:26:41. > :26:45.unnecessary flow of the land of mud and sailed that causes much of the
:26:46. > :26:48.damage and for the local authorities and planning authorities to try and
:26:49. > :26:54.ensure there is not unnecessary run-off from hard standing `nd
:26:55. > :26:59.concreting and all the other things that are fundamental reason for much
:27:00. > :27:05.of the flooding? I think my noble friend is absolutely right, with not
:27:06. > :27:09.only need to protect property but we need to protect that agricultural
:27:10. > :27:13.land, production of our food is safeguarded. That is why more than
:27:14. > :27:20.90% of arable land is either protected by flood risk assdts and
:27:21. > :27:25.there has been no risk of flooding in those areas. But my nobld friend
:27:26. > :27:28.is absolutely right. We need to get our planning guidance right. That is
:27:29. > :27:34.where there has been a revision or planning guidance so that wd avoid
:27:35. > :27:38.the risk of flash flooding. We're working with the NFU and our joint
:27:39. > :27:42.action plan on that is vital because the way in which we farm ne`r
:27:43. > :27:49.watercourses, we need to reflect on that. And indeed, particularly in
:27:50. > :27:52.relation to my noble friend to ask this question, we are working on
:27:53. > :27:57.slowing the flow in Pickering because working with local farmers,
:27:58. > :28:02.we have done great work in preventing flooding in Pickdring. As
:28:03. > :28:08.the noble Minister has alre`dy said, the memory of the last
:28:09. > :28:17.disastrous flooding of the winter of 2013-14 is still with us. Is the
:28:18. > :28:28.minister confident that the flood defences offered for barbers? It was
:28:29. > :28:32.my privilege to take that projects through the House. It is expected to
:28:33. > :28:39.cover the one or two macro percent of households which are most in
:28:40. > :28:46.risk. So that the people of those households can find affordable flood
:28:47. > :28:49.insurance. That will be takhng place next spring and it will be ` great
:28:50. > :28:55.advantage for people in those situations. Will my noble friend
:28:56. > :28:58.update the House on the progress being made with partnership funding
:28:59. > :29:03.which can enable schemes to progress which would not otherwise? Ly noble
:29:04. > :29:09.friend is absolutely right. Partnership funding, which hs in
:29:10. > :29:14.addition to the ?2.3 billion of government spending, capital
:29:15. > :29:18.expenditure that we wish to have in our six year investment programme,
:29:19. > :29:22.we think there are ?600 million of partnership funding from prhvate
:29:23. > :29:26.sources, local enterprise partnerships and public bodhes and
:29:27. > :29:31.local levies. This will be very portland. It will have a degree of
:29:32. > :29:36.flexibility so that -- are very important. It will have a ddgree of
:29:37. > :29:40.flexibility so that we can work in the areas where we can most help
:29:41. > :29:46.people protect their properties I would like to declare an hnterest
:29:47. > :29:49.because my own village was `ffected by flooding last year. Can the
:29:50. > :29:53.Minister assure the House that the government has had discussions with
:29:54. > :29:59.insurance companies to ensure that payments made are made promptly when
:30:00. > :30:05.people are badly affected and have to leave their homes? The B`roness
:30:06. > :30:08.because I have not had personally because I have not had personally
:30:09. > :30:12.those discussions I would lhke to ask colleagues about that and I will
:30:13. > :30:23.write to the noble Baroness. Clearly it is important and my insurance
:30:24. > :30:28.company was very cooperativd when I have my house flooded. So I think it
:30:29. > :30:31.is very important. I think what the noble Baroness said is about payment
:30:32. > :30:35.of bills and when somebody has this dreadful position of having their
:30:36. > :30:37.property flooded, we will nded to rally round and the insurance
:30:38. > :30:40.companies need to pay.