:00:08. > :00:11.attitude on the periphery. Tonight on Newsnight Scotland, when you're
:00:11. > :00:14.choosing a school for your child, every parent wants the best, so
:00:14. > :00:22.what information should be available to inform that choice? Is
:00:23. > :00:25.new government policy making the whole process more difficult?
:00:25. > :00:28.And, what are the magic ingredients that have made Glasgow an
:00:28. > :00:31.internationally renowned centre for contemporary art?
:00:31. > :00:33.Good evening. What's your first thought when the government decides
:00:33. > :00:36.to stop letting you see information? No doubt you are
:00:36. > :00:39.suspicious. So what is behind the move by the education department to
:00:39. > :00:42.stop collating and publishing statistics on the number of so-
:00:42. > :00:45.called placing requests by parents who are trying to get their child
:00:45. > :00:48.into another school? It has confounded educationalists who
:00:48. > :00:50.believe tables of information help parents and policy-makers and it
:00:50. > :01:00.coincides with an initiative in Edinburgh to encourage pupils to
:01:00. > :01:11.
:01:11. > :01:16.use their local school rather than It may be the best years of our
:01:17. > :01:22.lives, but it can be an agony for parents. Choosing a school for your
:01:22. > :01:26.little darlings is an enshrined right. It didn't used to be. You
:01:26. > :01:34.have no choice until the 1980s but to send your child to be designated
:01:35. > :01:41.local score -- school. But since placing requests came in, thousands
:01:41. > :01:48.of families opt for a different establishment. At the last count
:01:48. > :01:53.two years ago, it was nearly 30,000. The government had been collecting
:01:53. > :01:58.the figures for years and publishing them. Now after a review
:01:58. > :02:05.and a consultation, they have decided to ask government bean-
:02:05. > :02:10.counters to start adding them up. Does it matter? Evidence is
:02:10. > :02:17.required for public policy. It will be known by government, local
:02:17. > :02:22.authorities and schools. What has been ended is the ability for
:02:22. > :02:27.parents and other people to get hold of that figures.
:02:27. > :02:30.placements remain a central part of the educational system. Parents
:02:30. > :02:35.value the opportunity they have to make a choice. They might not
:02:35. > :02:42.exercise their right, but they welcome that opportunity. And for
:02:42. > :02:49.those who do want to choose the school their child goes to will be
:02:49. > :02:52.against the restriction. There is little doubt that there is pressure
:02:52. > :02:58.on councils to keep control of requests as parents make their own
:02:58. > :03:02.judgment of the schools on offer. Some of the schools are very poor.
:03:02. > :03:06.We have a parental charter and parents can choose the school that
:03:06. > :03:10.they send their children to and what we are doing is encouraging
:03:10. > :03:15.parents to go to their local catchment school before they enrol
:03:15. > :03:19.their children, told to the head teacher, have a look round and talk
:03:19. > :03:23.to the children. I think they will be pleasantly surprised. We are
:03:24. > :03:30.trying to persuade parents to use their local primary school. Taken
:03:30. > :03:34.together, you might be forgiven for thinking there is a trend
:03:34. > :03:44.developing. Don't bother the council and ignore the fact that
:03:44. > :03:47.
:03:48. > :03:49.many parents and others are I'm joined now from Edinburgh by
:03:50. > :03:59.Lindsay Paterson, Professor of Educational Policy at Edinburgh
:04:00. > :04:01.
:04:01. > :04:07.University and by the former leader of East Lothain Council Dave Berry.
:04:07. > :04:10.This rather detailed point about statistics. This particular set of
:04:10. > :04:14.statistics, and nationwide figure of how many parents are choosing to
:04:14. > :04:18.send their children outside the catchment area - why is it
:04:18. > :04:25.important for parents that it should be there? The annual
:04:25. > :04:28.publication is more detailed than that. You have the figures from all
:04:28. > :04:32.local authorities and you get it separately for primary and
:04:33. > :04:38.secondary schools. As the general evaluation of how content parents
:04:38. > :04:41.are with local schools, they are a broad and valuable contribution to
:04:41. > :04:48.the public debate. They are not everything that is needed because
:04:48. > :04:57.you need more research, but as a starting point for debate, it is
:04:57. > :05:04.invaluable. Presumably, is it right the trend has been upwards? Slowly
:05:04. > :05:09.upwards. It grows very rapidly at first and has risen slowly since
:05:09. > :05:18.the legislation was in Greece. Once more schools are fall, especially
:05:18. > :05:22.when local authorities are under financial pressures, local are up
:05:22. > :05:28.his -- local authorities cannot refuse a placement on the grounds
:05:28. > :05:36.of cost. The other thing that is new is this role that Primary One
:05:36. > :05:44.class sizes are capped at 25. It means that they are having to
:05:44. > :05:53.enjoy another -- employee another teacher or build another classroom.
:05:53. > :06:03.Essentially it is stable, but stable at a high level. But the
:06:03. > :06:05.
:06:05. > :06:12.problem is that officially, although it is ambiguous, parental
:06:12. > :06:18.choice was encouraged. Now there are legal caps on class sizes which
:06:18. > :06:26.militate against parents having a choice. Scotland is ambivalent
:06:26. > :06:36.about placemen choice. It was introduced in the 1980s and became
:06:36. > :06:39.
:06:39. > :06:48.instantly very popular. Everyone knows they the right - that
:06:48. > :06:53.everyone knows they have been right to make a choice. No political
:06:53. > :06:57.party it will touch with a barge pole any formal proposal to end the
:06:57. > :07:00.bike to a placement requests, but all of them apart from the
:07:00. > :07:06.Conservatives are trying to nudge in that direction and therefore we
:07:06. > :07:10.end up with a confused situation. This is the problem. There is an
:07:10. > :07:16.ambivalence towards this. Everyone will say parental choice is a great
:07:16. > :07:22.thing, but the legal cab at 25, irrespective of its merits on its
:07:22. > :07:31.own terms, the effect of that has been to deprive parents of choice.
:07:31. > :07:34.Edinburgh council to they said that almost 40% of parents who requested
:07:34. > :07:38.a school outside their catchment area were rejected this time
:07:38. > :07:42.compared to about only 10 or 11 % the year before. That is the direct
:07:43. > :07:52.result of this cap. A I am not surprised they had been rejected
:07:53. > :07:54.
:07:54. > :08:04.because there are limited places because of the changes in the
:08:04. > :08:04.
:08:04. > :08:07.classroom size. Education is for the children and parents need to
:08:07. > :08:12.understand that academic achievement is not the only factor.
:08:12. > :08:20.Children go to school to get an education and that includes social
:08:20. > :08:24.skills. If they spend their time travelling to and from the locals
:08:24. > :08:31.call -- to and from a school outside the catchment area, they
:08:31. > :08:35.are not making friends locally. parents are thinking of the state
:08:35. > :08:45.are telling me they do not want me to choose which call my parents go
:08:45. > :08:48.to. -- which school. We are not trying to stop people doing things.
:08:48. > :08:53.Parents have to understand the broader picture before they make
:08:53. > :08:58.that choice. No-one is arguing about taking the choice the way,
:08:58. > :09:02.but parents are generally not experience about the education
:09:02. > :09:06.system. They have not had a lot of interaction with it and there are
:09:06. > :09:12.other factors that they need have an understanding of. Just shipping
:09:12. > :09:17.a child across the city may not be the right thing. Everyone would
:09:17. > :09:21.agree with what has just been said. Of course you want children --
:09:21. > :09:24.parents to look at their local school, but that quickly shades
:09:24. > :09:34.into you are a nuisance because you want your child to go to a school
:09:34. > :09:43.
:09:43. > :09:49.that does not suit us, the We know from research that most of
:09:49. > :09:52.the influence on children's progress is inherited. Of
:09:52. > :09:58.environmental influence, about three-quarters come from parents
:09:58. > :10:03.and family. On the one-quarter from school. Parents are the major
:10:03. > :10:06.influence on their children's progress. The practice not to
:10:06. > :10:11.exercise the right of parents would replace their child flies in the
:10:11. > :10:16.face of evidence. I know one of the things you were floating when
:10:16. > :10:20.you're running East Lothian was some sort of, I presume it was an
:10:20. > :10:23.attempt to get the sense of community, was taking schools
:10:23. > :10:28.partially outside of the control of local authorities. Did anything
:10:28. > :10:33.happen with that? The difficulty we have with that was that engaging
:10:33. > :10:37.with the local community and having people take responsibility for the
:10:37. > :10:41.running of the schools, even partially, we did not get enough
:10:41. > :10:46.enthusiasm. Obviously, we have to be prepared to give up some of
:10:46. > :10:51.Faherty, but there has to be people ready to take it on and look at how
:10:52. > :10:59.we can run the school. The issue here is the community. Education
:10:59. > :11:05.does not happen in a vacuum. Each of our towns in East Lothian have a
:11:05. > :11:15.very good community. But children, the parents are all part of the
:11:15. > :11:15.
:11:15. > :11:23.same community. We would much rather they stayed in the community.
:11:23. > :11:27.There is more for the children. you see this being resolved in any
:11:27. > :11:32.satisfactory way, Lindsay Paterson? You suggested area that politicians
:11:32. > :11:37.have every interest in not talking about this. I do not think it will
:11:37. > :11:41.be resolved. The dilemma for politicians is it is expensive and
:11:42. > :11:46.causes planning difficulties. But the genie is out of the bottle and
:11:46. > :11:52.it has been out of the bottle since the Conservatives introduced this
:11:52. > :11:59.legislation 30 years ago. It cannot be put back in. I do not see any
:11:59. > :12:04.sense of turning back the tide, four and a desire to do so. We
:12:04. > :12:09.should be encouraging parental involvement in education. I would
:12:09. > :12:13.like to say I am very much for that as well, but the schools need to be
:12:13. > :12:17.comparable. There cannot be a huge range of capabilities within the
:12:17. > :12:25.schools. They must be equal in status then the parental drive will
:12:25. > :12:31.be limited. We will have to leave this particular discussion there.
:12:31. > :12:35.It may not be apparent to many of its citizens, but Glasgow is world
:12:35. > :12:40.famous for something more edifying than poor health and heavy drinking.
:12:40. > :12:48.We have produced five Turner Prize winners and have a 50-50 chance of
:12:48. > :12:57.producing another one. Two of the four nominees are based in Glasgow.
:12:57. > :13:06.What attracts artists to live and He Glasgow has been one of the most
:13:06. > :13:11.creative and inventive cities in the world. At the heart of design.
:13:11. > :13:16.But after the Second World War, the city entered a decline as its
:13:17. > :13:22.industrial base was eroded. Something happened in the 1980s
:13:22. > :13:25.that turned Glasgow from a post- industrial city down on its luck
:13:25. > :13:29.into one of the most important artistic cities not only in Britain,
:13:29. > :13:35.but in the world. For those in the know, they say
:13:35. > :13:42.this cannot be emphasised enough. People recognise Glasgow as a
:13:42. > :13:47.centre for art as they do with New York, London and Berlin. People in
:13:47. > :13:51.Glasgow do not realise this is what they are recognised for. And if
:13:51. > :13:56.proof was needed of Glasgow's success, a yardstick is the Turner
:13:56. > :14:06.Prize. Since 1986 there have been 12 finalists from the city and five
:14:06. > :14:09.
:14:09. > :14:13.of them have been winners. It is a good city to work from. You can be
:14:13. > :14:17.out and socialise and be part of everything that is going on, or you
:14:18. > :14:23.can hide away and get on with things. For me it was always about
:14:23. > :14:33.people. The art school, and the transmission Gallery became an
:14:33. > :14:38.
:14:38. > :14:42.He the Glasgow School of Art is the foundation on which the Glasgow Art
:14:42. > :14:46.Scene has been built. Because Glasgow was in a situation where
:14:46. > :14:53.there was not a great deal going on it created a ground zero which was
:14:53. > :14:58.quite excited the -- exciting for people to make art and music. There
:14:58. > :15:03.was an upsurge of lots of grass roots activity from the 1970s.
:15:03. > :15:06.Transmission Gallery, the women's gallery, they all had their genesis
:15:06. > :15:13.in that moment which was quite economically depressed and there
:15:13. > :15:17.was not much art infrastructure. You might hear some hyperbole from
:15:17. > :15:22.certain quarters saying it is the centre of contemporary art in
:15:22. > :15:26.Europe or the UK. They are kind of right outside of London, may be
:15:26. > :15:30.Berlin, Glasgow is the place. People will look back on this
:15:30. > :15:39.period and say it is an extraordinary explosion of talent
:15:39. > :15:43.and different ways of thinking of doing art. In 2001 there were 415
:15:43. > :15:49.professional artists. It is estimated there are more now. They
:15:49. > :15:52.contribute millions to the Glasgow economy. In 2006, Glasgow
:15:52. > :15:56.International was very successful and an economic survey was done.
:15:56. > :16:01.They found for every point that they spent on Glasgow International,
:16:01. > :16:05.�9 came back. That was a real tipping point and made people and
:16:05. > :16:12.Glasgow City Council thing, this really does work for the economy of
:16:12. > :16:17.the city. It boosts the profile of Glasgow and is generating income.
:16:17. > :16:22.The artists are very much part of the city. Also the citizens of the
:16:22. > :16:25.city have been brought up in the city that is culturally lead.
:16:25. > :16:30.Whether they recognise that or not, I think if they go anywhere else
:16:30. > :16:40.they would realise it may be is missing and somehow you feel very
:16:40. > :16:40.
:16:40. > :16:43.much part of film, poetry, writing music that happens in the city.
:16:43. > :16:50.there a good opportunity that someone from Glasgow will win the
:16:50. > :16:57.Turner Prize this year? There is a 50% chance. We have two out of four
:16:57. > :17:01.listed artists. I think Karla, whose work is in the gallery, has
:17:01. > :17:06.emerged as the favourite. I think she is doing some extraordinary
:17:07. > :17:16.things with the idea of structure - - sculpture, almost exploding the
:17:16. > :17:21.idea of the sculpture. And think, Carla is the favourite at the
:17:22. > :17:26.moment, but everyone would be delighted if Maarten one. If one of
:17:26. > :17:31.the two Scottish art this is successful, it will only go to
:17:31. > :17:34.reinforce Glasgow's dominance in the contemporary art market.
:17:34. > :17:39.However there is concern due to the state of the economy if we do not
:17:39. > :17:44.invest in two new talent, Glasgow could damage its hard-won
:17:44. > :17:50.reputation for excellence. Five am joined by the head of fine
:17:50. > :17:54.art at Glasgow School of Art. Professor Roger Wilson, of what is
:17:54. > :18:00.interesting about this is that obviously there are some hallowed
:18:00. > :18:04.institutions of the arts in Glasgow, your own not least amongst them.
:18:04. > :18:11.There is a sense that the art scene in Glasgow has created itself
:18:11. > :18:15.almost spontaneously. I wish that it were spontaneous. They do not
:18:15. > :18:19.think it is spontaneous. If you think of the Glasgow School of Art
:18:19. > :18:24.has been an exceptionally good art school for over 100 years, this is
:18:24. > :18:31.not a recent development. The students are from a long line of
:18:31. > :18:35.graduates who have been attracted to the art school. Good students
:18:35. > :18:41.make good art schools. It is that long-term quality that we are
:18:41. > :18:46.talking about here. Not a recent clash in the pan or novelty. That
:18:46. > :18:52.is the difference between Glasgow and many other institutions. It has
:18:52. > :18:57.been a bit up and down, hasn't it? Glasgow has had its periods were it
:18:57. > :19:02.has been pretty much in the lead or alongside London and the UK. I am
:19:02. > :19:08.curious as to why you think now is a time which seems to be one of
:19:08. > :19:13.where it is flourishing. There is a modern version of civic pride in
:19:13. > :19:18.Glasgow that is part of the art school ethos as well. It is quite
:19:18. > :19:24.contagious. Students, even from outside of Glasgow or the UK, pick
:19:24. > :19:27.it up quite quickly. There is a welcoming, warming appreciative
:19:27. > :19:34.atmosphere about the place which you really do not get in other
:19:34. > :19:38.places. That has gently eroded any of the difficulties that higher
:19:38. > :19:43.education has had and the underfunding of higher education is
:19:43. > :19:49.now legendary. It is actually easing off, that problem of Roy
:19:49. > :19:54.period of time. One of the points the film was making is that hit a
:19:54. > :19:57.third is not just your particular field of Fine Arts, it is the fact
:19:57. > :20:03.that is embedded in a city where there is literature and poetry
:20:03. > :20:09.going on. Does that help, so that Glasgow becomes a brand which young
:20:09. > :20:17.artists become attracted to? Absolutely. In many respects the
:20:17. > :20:23.museum and gallery strata of any institution is any part and of it.
:20:23. > :20:28.Students find their own levels which are largely underground. Yes,
:20:28. > :20:33.that is true. The City's culture behind the official culture is
:20:33. > :20:37.terribly attractive. I am curious as well, do you think you could be
:20:38. > :20:43.badly affected by the change in the fee system that is coming in next
:20:43. > :20:48.year? The Glasgow Art Scene -- Glasgow art scene is not just
:20:48. > :20:56.Scottish, it is very international. If you start charging 9,000. Fees
:20:56. > :21:02.to students from the rest of the UK, but could put them off. It could. I
:21:02. > :21:06.am not going to be an apologist for student fees here. But actually, if
:21:06. > :21:11.you are obliged to spend that money, you have to ask the question where
:21:11. > :21:20.would you rather spend it. We will have to leave it there. A quick
:21:20. > :21:30.look at tomorrow's front pages. The Herald, Leeds on Robert Black's
:21:30. > :21:38.
:21:38. > :21:43.The Scotsman, top bosses pay rises 50% in one year.
:21:43. > :21:53.That is all for this week, we will be back again on Monday. Until then,
:21:53. > :21:57.
:21:57. > :22:01.It is the season of mists and mellow fruitfulness. There could be
:22:01. > :22:08.missed in the morning. Be aware of that if you're on the move at first
:22:08. > :22:14.thing. Most of us will have a lovely day with a lot of sunshine.
:22:14. > :22:20.Temperatures nothing spectacular. For East Anglia and the south-east,
:22:20. > :22:25.it will stay cloudy with the odd spot of rain. For such western
:22:26. > :22:32.parts of England, we have lost the rain clouds. It'll be a sober
:22:32. > :22:35.afternoon for much of the south- west. Much of Wales as well. For
:22:35. > :22:44.Northern Ireland, it will be a bright and breezy afternoon, the
:22:44. > :22:50.rain clouds holding off. Most of Scotland will have a fine day, the
:22:50. > :22:57.best of the sunshine further south and east you go. Looking ahead, it
:22:57. > :23:00.will turn rather cloudier with outbreaks of rain. Head southwards,
:23:00. > :23:07.its day's drive. The cloud will come and go and there will be some
:23:07. > :23:13.sunshine. As we go through this weekend we will be reporting some