:00:09. > :00:12.Hello from Manchester. Scene of the annual gathering of the dominant
:00:12. > :00:16.part of our Government. Some hours ago, the Chancellor of the
:00:16. > :00:20.Exchequer, stood up, in this hall, and told us how he's hoping to save
:00:20. > :00:25.the economy. He mentioned a technique to help business, but
:00:25. > :00:29.even his own ministers found it hard to explain exactly what it was.
:00:29. > :00:34.This cabinet minister understands credit easing, as doubtless, do
:00:34. > :00:37.almost all of these 80-odd Tory members, they may even agree what
:00:37. > :00:40.it is, they certainly don't agree on Europe. Neither does this man,
:00:40. > :00:45.who might have been leader of the party, and this eminent Liberal
:00:45. > :00:47.Democrat, who is here to put the Euro-sceptics right, mix in a
:00:47. > :00:57.couple of irritating commentators and we ought to have the makings of
:00:57. > :01:02.
:01:02. > :01:07.We are not emphatically not to call the main scheme to boost the
:01:07. > :01:12.economy by the Chancellor today, a dodge, a wheeze, a bit of creative
:01:12. > :01:16.accounting, or indeed charge on the taxpayer. When he announced he was
:01:16. > :01:19.introducing called credit easing, even the Chancellor's own ministers
:01:19. > :01:23.hadn't a clear idea what he was talking about. David Grossman will
:01:23. > :01:27.explain it all in a moment. The prevailing tone of the Chancellor's
:01:28. > :01:33.speech to the 4,000 though members of his party here was somber, or
:01:33. > :01:38.calling a spade a spade, dull. Dull, because he didn't have much to say.
:01:38. > :01:42.This is no time for gagsters. Here is David Grossman with everything
:01:42. > :01:46.you ever wanted to know about credit easing.
:01:46. > :01:51.There is not so much good news to be had on the economy right now.
:01:51. > :01:57.The black hole of the debt crisis sits on top of the conference like
:01:57. > :02:02.a, black hole. Many would cheer to the rafter on things like more
:02:02. > :02:07.defence spending and tax cuts, but they have all been lost into the
:02:07. > :02:15.spinning more. But the ministers are keen that the electoral chances
:02:15. > :02:22.don't follow them into the abyss, so out of the back hole a little
:02:22. > :02:29.light emerged. To adapt PDWodehouse there is a comparison between a
:02:29. > :02:34.Chancellor with a a hole to fill and a ray of sunshine. The doom and
:02:34. > :02:39.gloom thing isn't playing well, but they don't want to give up the idea
:02:39. > :02:42.that they will rip up the deficit strategy. What to do, not so much
:02:42. > :02:45.plan B, as plan, be a bit more cheerful.
:02:45. > :02:54.Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome the Chancellor of the
:02:54. > :02:58.Exchequer, George Osborne. George Osborne gave his party a
:02:58. > :03:06.flash of the smile that has been absent from his speeches in recent
:03:06. > :03:10.years, as well as some encouraging words. I don't want anyone to
:03:10. > :03:15.underestimate the gravity of the situation facing the world economy.
:03:16. > :03:23.But he also don't want anyone to think that the situation is
:03:23. > :03:27.hopeless. That there is nothing we can do. Yes, the difficulties are
:03:28. > :03:31.great. But we should be careful not to talk ourselves into something
:03:31. > :03:36.worse. This being a party conference, the Chancellor's
:03:36. > :03:43.starting point was a pop at the Labour Party. In the process, a pop
:03:43. > :03:49.at one of his cabinet colleagues as well. Economic adviser to Gordon
:03:49. > :03:59.Brown, I'm not sure I would put that on my CV if I was Ed Balls.
:03:59. > :03:59.
:03:59. > :04:06.It's like personal trainer to Eric Pickles! Claim - The Chancellor
:04:06. > :04:10.wasn't just giving out smiles and gags too, there was money too, �805
:04:10. > :04:16.million to pay for a council tax freeze in England only. �145
:04:16. > :04:21.million on new infrastructure, like spreading mobile phone coverage,
:04:21. > :04:26.and �50 million for research. All to be paid for by using money
:04:26. > :04:31.unspent from existing budgets. But this was definitely not Mr Osborne
:04:31. > :04:34.relaxing his fiscal grip. The overall spending will stay the same.
:04:34. > :04:39.Not only Labour, but some Conservatives as well, want a
:04:39. > :04:44.change to. That they want tax cuts, especially for businesses. Don't
:04:44. > :04:50.think I haven't thought hard about what more we could do, that I don't
:04:50. > :04:53.explore every single option. I do. But borrowing too much is the cause
:04:53. > :04:57.of Britain's problems, not the solution.
:04:57. > :05:02.APPLAUSE But perhaps the most significant
:05:02. > :05:07.thing the Chancellor did today was to introduce us to a new bit of
:05:07. > :05:11.economic jargon. I have set the Treasury to work on ways to inject
:05:11. > :05:14.money directly into parts of the economy that need it such as small
:05:14. > :05:19.business. It's known as credit easing.
:05:19. > :05:24.In short, this means the Treasury lending money to businesses, even
:05:24. > :05:26.if the banks won't. Is there a problem with this, we did have
:05:26. > :05:31.Project Merlin which was supposed to get lending going to businesses?
:05:31. > :05:33.If that was working, if Project Merlin was working really
:05:33. > :05:37.effectively, you might think there wasn't a great need for Government
:05:37. > :05:41.support to businesses. It may be, and there probably is the case that
:05:41. > :05:45.there are businesses out there that can't get money from banks. There
:05:45. > :05:48.are two sorts, one sorts where Government, or whoever lends them
:05:48. > :05:51.will make money because they are viable enterprise, and others not
:05:51. > :05:55.getting money for good reason, which is they couldn't pay it back.
:05:55. > :05:58.How has the speech gone down. At the weekend this senior
:05:58. > :06:02.Conservative MP described the Government's long-term economic
:06:02. > :06:08.policy as "inconsistent and incoherent". Today, well he was
:06:08. > :06:12.full of praise for the Chancellor. I'm greatly encouraged by the
:06:12. > :06:14.speech. Particularly the emphasis on making sure we protect people's
:06:14. > :06:19.living standards. A relentless drive to secure growth in the
:06:19. > :06:23.economy. But what's this? If we rewind the
:06:23. > :06:27.tape, we see this positive take followed a lengthy chat with Steve
:06:27. > :06:33.Hilton, the Prime Minister's head of strategy. Evidence, according to
:06:33. > :06:38.some, of a bit of political nobbling. However, if we rewind the
:06:38. > :06:41.tape even further, we can see that Steve Hilton, with three other
:06:41. > :06:46.senior Number Ten insiders, just happened past the site of the
:06:46. > :06:50.interview, it was the MP who wanted the chat. Steve, one point. Let's
:06:50. > :06:53.go in there. However, if Steve Hilton will have to put his arm
:06:53. > :06:58.around every critic of the Government's economic policy, well,
:06:58. > :07:02.he will be a very busy man. With us now is the Transport
:07:02. > :07:06.Secretary, Philip Hammond. Now this credit easing, how much money is
:07:06. > :07:09.involved? We don't know yet, there is not a fixed limit. You don't
:07:09. > :07:13.know? The Chancellor hasn't set a fixed limit. He has asked the
:07:13. > :07:15.Treasury to look at the ways in which the Treasury could use its
:07:15. > :07:20.balance sheet, to deliver credit directly to the parts of the
:07:20. > :07:25.economy that need it, and then we will estimate the quantity of
:07:25. > :07:30.demand for that kind of credit. much money might be available for
:07:30. > :07:35.it? It could be billions of pounds. How many billions, roughly? This
:07:35. > :07:40.isn't a totally new idea as suggested by David in the tape.
:07:40. > :07:43.you haven't had time to work it out? In opposition we talked about
:07:43. > :07:48.a national loan guarantee scheme, it is designed to do the same thing,
:07:48. > :07:52.get money to the parts of the economy that aren't been reached, a
:07:52. > :07:56.few tens of billions of pounds if that was the demand. When there l
:07:56. > :07:59.it be available? The Chancellor has tasked the Treasury with looking
:07:59. > :08:02.for the openings for delivering the credit easing. It is likely there
:08:02. > :08:07.will be different types of approach, that are appropriate for different
:08:07. > :08:13.types of business. So mid--cap businesses, which could act. What
:08:13. > :08:17.does a mid-cap business? Middle- sized companies. Companies
:08:17. > :08:21.employing 200-300 people, could be cable to access a bond mark. That
:08:21. > :08:25.could be done relatively quickly. Packaging up much smaller loans to
:08:25. > :08:29.smaller businesses may take a bit longer. Does this appear on the
:08:29. > :08:33.Government's books? If the Government uses its balance sheet
:08:33. > :08:38.to lend to businesses through credit easing, it wouldn't add to
:08:38. > :08:44.the deficit, because the Government would be buying liquid financial
:08:44. > :08:48.instruments in exchange. Is it similar to PFI or other wheezes
:08:48. > :08:50.used by the previous Government? is similar to what the Bank of
:08:50. > :08:55.England is doing to the quantitative easing, it is buying
:08:55. > :08:57.Government debt, this would be something that got credit directly
:08:57. > :09:01.through to private sector business that is couldn't get credit from
:09:01. > :09:06.the banking system. So it is an admission that project
:09:06. > :09:09.merllirn, the scheme to get banks to - Project Merlin, the scheme to
:09:10. > :09:13.get banks to lend to businesses has failed? It hasn't failed. In the
:09:13. > :09:18.first half of the year the banks have met their target for lending
:09:18. > :09:22.to small and medium enterprises. that case you set the target too
:09:22. > :09:25.small? The target for the banks was set to what they could deliver on
:09:25. > :09:29.the basis of the balance sheets they have. There is clearly more
:09:29. > :09:34.demand in the economy for credit than the banking system, crippled
:09:34. > :09:36.as it is. Than you realise? No, the banking system, because of the
:09:36. > :09:40.problems we have been through is able to meet. You were talking
:09:40. > :09:45.about this ages ago, you knew Project Merlin would not be enough?
:09:45. > :09:48.No, we were talking about a national loan guarantee scheme in
:09:48. > :09:53.opposition, as way of adding to the lending the banks could get through,
:09:53. > :09:58.to small and medium-sized businesses. This monetary activism,
:09:58. > :10:04.that the Chancellor is talking about, is that another, what he
:10:04. > :10:07.called, Ponzi scheme? Not at all. You could describe this as a form
:10:07. > :10:11.of monetary activism. What the Chancellor is keen to emphasise is
:10:11. > :10:17.we are not going to back down or compromise in any way, our
:10:17. > :10:20.commitment to closing the fiscal deficit. Eliminating the structural
:10:20. > :10:25.fiscal deficit over the life of this parliament. That doesn't mean
:10:25. > :10:31.we are powerless to act to hp business and stimulate growth. We
:10:31. > :10:36.can do that through monetary activism, making sure interest
:10:36. > :10:39.rates remain low and credit gets through to the economy. Some
:10:39. > :10:44.people's brains will short circuit at the moment about what is on and
:10:44. > :10:50.off the Government books. Is it accurate, that if you start
:10:50. > :10:54.investing in these small or medium enterprise companies, and they go
:10:54. > :10:59.belly-up, the taxpayer is exposed to the loss is that right? It is
:10:59. > :11:03.true that the Government would put its balance sheet at risk during
:11:03. > :11:09.the exercise, that is the point of the exercise. The risk has to be
:11:09. > :11:14.properly priced by an independent credit rating institution. Who will
:11:14. > :11:21.make the decision? In terms of lending, it depends on the conduit.
:11:21. > :11:25.If it is bonds purchased in the market they are bonds done in the
:11:25. > :11:29.usual way, by bond credit agencies. If it is packages of small business
:11:29. > :11:31.loans packaged together for the purpose, it will probably be the
:11:31. > :11:36.banks who have the existing relationships with those businesses
:11:36. > :11:39.who are charged with making the credit and lending decision. So the
:11:39. > :11:42.Government, and therefore the taxpayer, could lose money on this?
:11:42. > :11:47.Well, there is a contingent liability, but that will be priced
:11:47. > :11:50.for. This will not be free money. That is a way of saying yes, a
:11:50. > :11:55.contingent liability? That means there is a risk, of course there is
:11:55. > :12:00.a risk. But nobody is suggesting that there is no risk. But what we
:12:00. > :12:04.believe is that given the demand for credit in the economy, the
:12:04. > :12:07.urgent need to support small and medium-sized businesses, this is a
:12:07. > :12:11.risk that the Government should be prepared to take, provided it is
:12:12. > :12:15.properly priced and managed. Just on the broader question of how
:12:15. > :12:19.this party now looks to you today. A lot of people are saying this
:12:19. > :12:26.looks a very different kind of Tory Party to the Tory Party we were
:12:26. > :12:30.familiar with. Do you think it's different? No, I don't think so. If
:12:30. > :12:34.you are talking about credit easing this is the direct descentant of
:12:34. > :12:36.the national loan guarantee system. I mean the people here, and how
:12:36. > :12:40.they greeted George Osborne's economic strategy today, the sort
:12:40. > :12:43.of things they are worried about. Does it seem to you a different
:12:43. > :12:48.Tory Party? The party has clearly changed over the six years since
:12:48. > :12:52.David Cameron took the leadership. It has become younger, more diverse,
:12:52. > :12:57.and we're all believing that is a good thing. It has changed? Over
:12:57. > :13:03.the last six years, definitely. Let's go to some of the audience
:13:03. > :13:08.now. Let's start off with George Osborne, who is excited by credit
:13:08. > :13:14.easing? Three people were, four people were. Very good, you in the
:13:14. > :13:17.front row, go on. As an 18-year-old, I'm extremely worried by the
:13:17. > :13:22.structural deficit we have inherited from Labour, and
:13:22. > :13:26.therefore, a scheme that is a value waited risk, that will put money
:13:26. > :13:30.into businesses to deliver jobs and growth, has to be a good thing for
:13:30. > :13:33.my future and this country. Are you an economist? I did an economics A-
:13:33. > :13:38.level last summer. That is good enough in this Government, I
:13:38. > :13:43.imagine! All right, you are slightly more qualified. The lady
:13:43. > :13:47.at the back there, very hard to see you in the darkness. I'm a local
:13:47. > :13:54.councillor in Bedford, I'm really pleased that more money will come
:13:54. > :13:59.into local Government. Do you feel the fact the Chancellor had to
:13:59. > :14:03.announce this, is an indication that what has been advocated
:14:03. > :14:07.previously, the Project Merlin, to get the banks, allegedly, to lend,
:14:07. > :14:10.has succeeded or failed? pleased he has identified there is
:14:10. > :14:13.an extended need for small businesses to get money. I'm
:14:13. > :14:17.pleased he has identified that we need in local Government more money.
:14:17. > :14:23.That's terrific. Lady in the second row with your
:14:23. > :14:29.hand up? I have been working with a start-up company, and they have
:14:29. > :14:32.been to over 90 different avenues to get credit. This is a small-
:14:32. > :14:37.smedum enterprise, it is British, they can't - small-medium
:14:37. > :14:42.enterprise, it is British, they can't get credit. Anything for them
:14:42. > :14:47.I'm for. All you Tories, what you really want is tax cuts? Yes.
:14:47. > :14:51.Anyone not want tax cuts right now? Does anybody disappointed. You can
:14:51. > :14:59.have your say in a minute. Was anybody disappointed the Chancellor
:14:59. > :15:04.didn't say anything about tax cuts today? You're all very loyal! Go on
:15:04. > :15:07.then, Philip? We all want tax cuts when it is affordable. We are a
:15:07. > :15:11.tax-cutting party. We believe that lower taxes are the way to
:15:11. > :15:14.stimulate enterprise and get the economy growing. But we also know
:15:14. > :15:19.that we have an immediate challenge in getting rid of the deficit we
:15:19. > :15:28.have inherited from Labour. The Chancellor's policy was endorsed
:15:28. > :15:32.today by SMP, reaffirming, the ratings agency. Who have such a
:15:32. > :15:36.dodgy record. They reaffirmed Britain's Triple A credit rating,
:15:36. > :15:40.means people can go on looking forward to low cost interest rates
:15:40. > :15:43.and borrowing, and the Government can borrow at German rates of
:15:43. > :15:46.interest, even though we have a Greek level of debt. Going back to
:15:46. > :15:50.earlier, talking about how much this party has changed. Here we
:15:50. > :15:57.have about what, 80 Conservatives, and there is not one of them wants
:15:57. > :15:59.a tax cut now. That is a mark of how it has changed? This is
:15:59. > :16:03.responsible Government. Every one of these people. They are not in
:16:03. > :16:08.Government. Would like to see tax cuts when it is affordable and
:16:08. > :16:11.sustainable. The boy with the economics A-level is nodding his
:16:11. > :16:16.head! As the Chancellor said we don't want tax cuts for Christmas,
:16:16. > :16:22.Ed Balls side, that have to be reversed 18 months or a year later.
:16:22. > :16:30.APPLAUSE. I tell you what their loyalty hasn't changed, has it!
:16:30. > :16:35.Let's fix the deficit w when we can - And when we can afford it, let's
:16:35. > :16:40.treat ourselves to a tax cut. love that dare not speak its name
:16:40. > :16:46.inside the conference hall is, wait for it, Europe. With the euro
:16:46. > :16:49.threatening to plunge the economy into intensive care, it is all over
:16:49. > :16:53.the fringe meetings like a nasty rash. The state of the single
:16:53. > :16:56.currency has made plain the extent to which anxiety over membership of
:16:56. > :17:02.the project has not been eradicated from the party's nervous system, it
:17:02. > :17:06.has just been dormant. There was a crisis in the eurozone, and can be
:17:06. > :17:10.seen on the streets of Greece. But the reverbations are being felt
:17:10. > :17:13.back here in Britain. The Chancellor is leaving the
:17:13. > :17:16.Conservative conference early to meet the EU finance ministers
:17:16. > :17:21.tomorrow. The eurozone needs to end all the speculation, decide what
:17:21. > :17:29.they are going to do with Greece, and then stick to that decision.
:17:29. > :17:34.APPLAUSE Britain is not immune to all this
:17:34. > :17:38.instability. And he could have said, neither is his own political party.
:17:38. > :17:42.In recent years the Conservatives have been relatively united on
:17:42. > :17:47.Europe, putting aside those divisions that characterised the
:17:47. > :17:51.last period in office. Now new divisions are opening up, over how
:17:51. > :17:55.to prevent a Greek tragedy turning into a bigger drama for Britain.
:17:55. > :18:00.And a rather bizarre venue has been chosen to hold some of those
:18:00. > :18:06.discussions. And, this is no jo, these Conservatives have come to
:18:06. > :18:09.take advice from a foreigner. A leader of an increasingly Euro-
:18:09. > :18:14.sceptic party in Finland, and doesn't see the current bailout of
:18:15. > :18:20.Greece as a laughing matter. He favours a referendum on EU
:18:20. > :18:26.membership. I wouldn't know know what I would want if I was British.
:18:26. > :18:30.What would you vote? No, get out. Only a handful of MPs believe the
:18:30. > :18:40.current crisis is the perfect time to hold a referendum on EU
:18:40. > :18:41.
:18:41. > :18:46.The Foreign Secretary wasn't exactly rushing to respond to this,
:18:46. > :18:48.when invited by Newsnight. How are you doing.
:18:49. > :18:55.I'll give interviews at the scheduled time, thank you.
:18:55. > :18:57.Some MPs take up slightly more subtle approaches, they want to
:18:57. > :19:01.renegotiation the relationship with Europe, then put the question to
:19:01. > :19:05.the people. People feel we get a lousy deal with Europe, some people
:19:05. > :19:11.want to renegotiate the deal in a fundamental way, some people say
:19:11. > :19:14.why bother, just get out. I'm happy to support a referendum, but I
:19:14. > :19:18.would like our Government to engage in a renegotiation. It would be
:19:18. > :19:22.better to say to the European partners, there are terms we would
:19:22. > :19:28.consider saying, we would need the permission of the British people,
:19:28. > :19:35.negotiate the terms and ask the people. By far those on the
:19:35. > :19:40.backbenches believe the current environment provides the chance to
:19:40. > :19:44.rewrite history, without the need of a vote. Talk of referendums is
:19:44. > :19:48.premature, and a distraction from the important thing, what do we
:19:48. > :19:52.want the European Union to do in the 21st century. We have to do the
:19:52. > :19:55.heavy lifting and ask how do we take powers back in employment
:19:55. > :20:01.policy, social policy, health and safety policy. What do we need to
:20:01. > :20:03.do to get there. And, when we finally did catch up
:20:04. > :20:08.with a more talkive Foreign Secretary, seemed to be suggesting
:20:08. > :20:14.he was a prisoner of a coalition, longing to be free.
:20:14. > :20:17.I do think the European Union has too much power. We set out in our
:20:17. > :20:21.manifesto, if there had been an entirely Conservative Government,
:20:22. > :20:26.some of the areas that the, the Prime Minister areas, in which we
:20:26. > :20:29.believe it has - prime areas, in which we believe it has too much
:20:29. > :20:33.power. I don't believe it is up to the European Union to set the
:20:34. > :20:35.working hours of junior doctors in the hospital in my constituency. I
:20:35. > :20:39.don't think that has anything interest there.
:20:40. > :20:42.There may be no change at all when Britain's relationship with the EU,
:20:42. > :20:46.the great fear of many Conservatives is the influence of
:20:46. > :20:49.the Liberal Democrats will mean an opportunity for reform will be lost.
:20:49. > :20:54.I think they are doing too much wagging of the dog f that's what
:20:54. > :20:57.you mean. I think we ought to show a bit more leadership. And he had
:20:57. > :21:01.this message for the Foreign Secretary. I would say to William,
:21:01. > :21:05.listen to the views of the party. They elect us, they select us, they
:21:05. > :21:08.support us. It's about time we listened to them a little more.
:21:08. > :21:13.Chancellor wants to see greater stability in the eurozone, to help
:21:13. > :21:16.the world economy. That, in turn, may also help quell demands from
:21:16. > :21:23.party activist, for a more radical transformation in Britain's
:21:24. > :21:28.relationship with the rest of the Philip Hammond is still here, we
:21:28. > :21:32.have been joined by the Liberal Democrat MP, Don Foster, here in
:21:32. > :21:35.Manchester, making a film for a programme called The Daily Politics,
:21:36. > :21:41.and by David Davis, the former shadow Home Secretary, who has
:21:41. > :21:44.edited a book out today, that sets out the future of Conservatism.
:21:44. > :21:47.Philip Hammond, I know you have to go in a second or two. But quite
:21:47. > :21:51.clearly the vast majority of your party want to have a referendum,
:21:51. > :21:56.why can't they have it? Well, I think the pressing issue, at the
:21:56. > :22:01.moment, is to stablise the situation in the eurozone. We do
:22:01. > :22:05.50% of your trade with the EU, 40% of our trade with the eurozone, and
:22:05. > :22:10.the immediate threat to Britain's prosperity and British jobs is from
:22:11. > :22:15.the on going crisis in the eurozone. Let's focus on the big issues.
:22:15. > :22:18.Nobody is saying let's have a referendum in the next few weeks,
:22:18. > :22:22.nobody is suggesting it in that time frame. Why not promise them
:22:22. > :22:25.one next year? In the long-term, what most people in this country
:22:25. > :22:28.want to see is a rebalancing of our relationship with the European
:22:28. > :22:33.Union. They want to see a guarantee that more powers will not be
:22:33. > :22:37.transferred, we have given that guarantee. And they want to see,
:22:37. > :22:42.eventually, repatriation of powers over areas like employment law,
:22:42. > :22:46.social policy. Those are the things that actually matter. Completing
:22:46. > :22:49.the single market, making sure that we can continue to benefit from
:22:49. > :22:51.free trade with Europe is the key issue. Clearly it matters to large
:22:51. > :22:56.numbers of your members, it even matters to the Liberal Democrats.
:22:56. > :23:00.The Liberal Democrats at one point, recently, wanted a referendum on
:23:00. > :23:04.membership of the euro, and the European Union. Your own
:23:04. > :23:09.backbenchers want it, why are you flying in the face of all of them?
:23:09. > :23:13.My own personal is the immediate pressing issue is to deal with the
:23:13. > :23:16.challenges the economy faces. have said all that, it is not next
:23:16. > :23:20.week. We have to see the eurozone stablising and progress on
:23:20. > :23:25.completing the single market, so Britain can get the maximum
:23:25. > :23:29.possible benefit from its membership of the EU. Let's focus
:23:29. > :23:32.on those things that deliver practical benefit to people in this
:23:32. > :23:36.country. Once we have focused on them. Then can they have a
:23:36. > :23:40.referendum? Well, these things are for the future. I think we should
:23:40. > :23:44.focus on the immediate challenges. Why are you so wriggley on it?
:23:44. > :23:47.Because I think this is not the moment to be standing back and
:23:47. > :23:51.looking at this very long-term. doesn't have to be this moment t
:23:51. > :23:55.could be next year or the year after? I think we need to focus on
:23:55. > :24:02.the real need for our own interest, to stablise what is going on in the
:24:03. > :24:06.eurozone. Chaos in the eurozone will cost jobs in Britain.
:24:06. > :24:10.Let's ask one or two members of the audience, how many of you, just a
:24:10. > :24:18.show of hands, how many of you would like to a referendum in
:24:18. > :24:22.Europe, in or out? What is that, you are impartial, you two tell us
:24:22. > :24:25.you are on different sides of the face, I would say that is about 50-
:24:25. > :24:29.50. It is not a representative audience at all, it is entirely
:24:29. > :24:34.arbitary, because these people have nothing else to do at this time of
:24:34. > :24:38.night! One of you who had your hand up, why is it that, do you think,
:24:39. > :24:43.how long can they hold the line on not giving you a referendum?
:24:43. > :24:51.wants a referendum, put your hand up again? You in the front row.
:24:51. > :24:54.What do you feel about being denied the referendum? I really do believe
:24:54. > :24:58.that we were promised a referendum, I believe. I think it would be
:24:58. > :25:02.beneficial for the country to have it and then the question could be
:25:02. > :25:06.put to rest. We would know one way or the other the will of the people.
:25:06. > :25:10.Do you understand why you are not getting one? Not really, no.
:25:10. > :25:14.Anyone else, who else wants a referendum, you in the front row?
:25:14. > :25:23.think the French dumb is very important for the UK. I would also
:25:23. > :25:28.like to say on referendums, a message to his High Excellency Alex
:25:28. > :25:31.Salmond in Scotland, that this is the only referendum that really
:25:31. > :25:36.matters. Right at the back there? think it is something that affects
:25:36. > :25:40.every single person in the UK, we should be able to have a say on it.
:25:40. > :25:44.Do you accept it is not a good time do it? Not now, but we could have
:25:44. > :25:48.one in a few years, at least say it is a possibility, rather than not
:25:48. > :25:52.answering the question at all. you unhappy not being given one?
:25:52. > :25:57.One of the reasons I lost trust with Labour is we were promised it
:25:57. > :26:01.and it was taken away. I really hope it doesn't happen again.
:26:01. > :26:07.Don Foster, you campaigned on the promise of a referendum, didn't
:26:07. > :26:12.you? Yeah. And they haven't got it? Well, what we said and what I still
:26:12. > :26:14.believe is we should have a referendum when there is any
:26:15. > :26:19.significant change in the relationship between this country
:26:19. > :26:22.and the rest of Europe. I also believe that referendum shouldn't
:26:22. > :26:25.just be about whether people accept the change, but it should be the
:26:25. > :26:30.opportunity to have a straight forward, in-out referendum, which
:26:30. > :26:33.very many people in this country do want to have, and very many people
:26:33. > :26:37.who are particularly younger people, have never had an opportunity to
:26:38. > :26:42.have a say in that particular issue. So when we have a change, in the
:26:42. > :26:46.relationship, that is the time to have it. Just for the avoidance of
:26:46. > :26:52.doubt who among you feel there ought to be a referendum? I would
:26:52. > :26:59.vote definitely for. More power to Europe? It is not, no, no, come on,
:26:59. > :27:03.Jeremy. You are trying to wind everybody up. Philip has already
:27:03. > :27:09.given us the figures. 50% of our trade is with the European Union.
:27:09. > :27:14.That is no reason to let them run our lives? �200 billion worth of
:27:14. > :27:17.trade. 3.5 million jobs in this country are dependant on our
:27:17. > :27:22.relationship with the European Union. Do you think it is
:27:22. > :27:26.legitimate to deny people a referendum indefinitely?
:27:26. > :27:30.indefinitely. We will have in the next coming years huge
:27:30. > :27:35.transformations in the eurozone. The euro corrections will be
:27:35. > :27:39.enormous, whether we will see a more federal or fiscal Europe is
:27:39. > :27:45.coming. It is fair to say to people, what sort of relationship will you
:27:45. > :27:49.have, I'm not as Euro-sceptic as my friend her, not necessarily in-out,
:27:49. > :27:54.do you want a trading relationship or political relationship. That is
:27:54. > :27:58.a fair thing to put to them. Euro-sceptic is David Cameron, he
:27:58. > :28:01.has used the words himself, is he sceptical about Europe? He is
:28:01. > :28:06.sceptical, I have known him 20 years and throughout that time he
:28:06. > :28:12.has been Euro-sceptic. But he is in a coalition, he has to be leader
:28:12. > :28:15.and diplomat at the same time. he imprisoned by people like Don
:28:15. > :28:20.Foster? Imprisoned it a little strong, he's shackled to them!
:28:20. > :28:24.David Cameron knows, not only the trade benefit, but he also knows we
:28:24. > :28:27.can't tackle things like pollution problems, international crime, all
:28:27. > :28:31.those sorts of issues, we need to work together. Some people will say
:28:31. > :28:34.the way we are doing it needs to be reconfigured. I would accept that's
:28:34. > :28:39.why we have to have further discussions. Put him right?
:28:39. > :28:42.Illusion problems, sure, there are international pollution problems we
:28:42. > :28:47.need treaties over. International crime, I don't think there is much
:28:47. > :28:51.use out of Europe on international crime. Most of the effects of the
:28:51. > :28:55.European Arrest Warrant have been to have miscarriages of justice and
:28:55. > :28:58.use up police time unnessly there are lots of other areas -
:28:58. > :29:03.unnecessarily. There are lots of other areas I don't think Europe
:29:03. > :29:06.should have a say. Why should they dictate how long a junior doctor
:29:06. > :29:09.works, what has that to do with Brussels? That is surely why many
:29:09. > :29:14.people want a discussion about the nature of the relationship, then if
:29:14. > :29:18.it changes, that is when you have the referendum. You certainly don't
:29:18. > :29:21.do it now? We're not talking tomorrow, in the next couple of
:29:21. > :29:26.years. Let's sort out the current crisis we have got, that is the
:29:26. > :29:30.most important thing. If you had your way we would have been in the
:29:30. > :29:35.euro, wouldn't we? We said we would have gone in if the conditions were
:29:35. > :29:38.right, they were not right. That is what we said, that was the facts,
:29:39. > :29:43.come on. How much of the audience are
:29:43. > :29:51.persuaded by the protestations of Mr Foster here, his good intentions
:29:51. > :29:59.on the euro? None of you believe him? Why don't you believe him, he
:29:59. > :30:04.seems a trustworthy chap? Well there we are.
:30:04. > :30:07.Do you feel, David Davis, that what you could do in Government on
:30:07. > :30:12.Europe is actually circumscribed by the fact that the Liberal Democrats
:30:12. > :30:16.are in Government with you? course it is, that's, a coalition.
:30:16. > :30:19.Do you resent that? No, I approve of the coalition. It is better than
:30:19. > :30:24.the alternative, if you wanted Gordon Brown sitting here.
:30:24. > :30:29.APPLAUSE The simple truth is. We found
:30:29. > :30:32.something the audience aproves of! The simple truth is there are
:30:32. > :30:37.compromises on both sides. There are things the liberals are having
:30:37. > :30:41.to do I'm sure they don't like. We have to compromise with them. If
:30:41. > :30:46.this was a Tory-only Government, we would be much more robust on Europe,
:30:46. > :30:52.and rightly so. We will talk about some of this in a moment or two,
:30:52. > :30:55.who can forget Theresa May, now Home Secretary, talking about how
:30:56. > :30:59.many people thought of the Tories as the nasty party. They are not
:30:59. > :31:03.being nasty any longer about their coalition partners, the Liberal
:31:03. > :31:06.Democrats, as you have seen, the people they were calling feckless
:31:06. > :31:09.and unfit for Government only 18 months ago. That is in contrast to
:31:09. > :31:13.the talk at the Liberal Democrats own conference, where they spent
:31:13. > :31:18.much 6 their time talking about how left of their own devices,
:31:18. > :31:21.Conservatives would be sending small children up chimneys. Liberal
:31:21. > :31:25.Democrat ministers are the guarantors of fairness in a
:31:25. > :31:31.Government that would be an absolute nightmare without them.
:31:31. > :31:35.warning to the Conservative right here, we need no Tea Party tendency
:31:35. > :31:39.in Britain. In Government, yes, it means
:31:39. > :31:44.sometimes we have to be a bit awkward. As our coalition partners
:31:44. > :31:49.are finding out on a daily basis. Nick Clegg stuck with our
:31:49. > :31:52.agreements all the same. And we should always have the generosity
:31:52. > :32:01.of spirit to recognise the contribution he makes to turning
:32:01. > :32:04.this country around. Unfortunately, unlike today, in
:32:04. > :32:10.their long battle, our predecessors did not always have the good
:32:10. > :32:14.fortune of being supported by the liberals. Well, Don Foster and
:32:14. > :32:18.David Davis are still with us, why are you so ungracious? I don't
:32:18. > :32:22.think we are. There was some jokes. These people gave you your first
:32:22. > :32:26.chance in Government for 70 years, and all we saw at the Liberal
:32:26. > :32:29.Democrats conference was a lot of people being beastly about the
:32:29. > :32:32.Conservatives? Two things I would say, the first thing I would say, I
:32:32. > :32:35.don't think we were being beastly. I told some jokes at the conference
:32:35. > :32:41.about Tories, but I also told them about Liberal Democrats. There were
:32:41. > :32:44.more about the Liberal Democrats. An equality of beastliness!
:32:44. > :32:51.second thing is, the Tory Party didn't give us our opportunity to
:32:51. > :32:54.be in Government, the public decided that no one party should be
:32:54. > :32:58.in overall control of this party. We looked as a possible deal with
:32:58. > :33:01.the Labour Party, that didn't work, they didn't want it any way. For
:33:01. > :33:05.the sake of the country we came together. As David Davis
:33:05. > :33:07.acknowledges, and the vast majority of the people at the conference
:33:07. > :33:11.have acknowledged, that the two parties coming together has been in
:33:11. > :33:14.the public interest, it is actually working. Both parties are having to
:33:14. > :33:19.make compromises. Look at the problem we had over tuition fees,
:33:19. > :33:22.or the problem we are facing with the issue of for instance, police
:33:22. > :33:25.commissioners, which we are not particularly happy with, and we are
:33:25. > :33:29.accepting it as part of the deal. Both parties have made compromises
:33:29. > :33:32.for the sake of the country. Apart from keeping Gordon Brown out of
:33:32. > :33:40.Government what have the Liberal Democrats given you? Well, the
:33:40. > :33:44.votes to stay in Government! Look, there are...What Has the presence
:33:44. > :33:47.in Government given you? Some of it has been a liberal tendency. Sadly,
:33:48. > :33:53.I say they haven't been strong enough in some of their liberal
:33:53. > :33:57.tendencies. Sometimes I'm the most liberal person on the Tory benches.
:33:57. > :34:00.Crikey! The simple truth is we all have to make compromises. What you
:34:00. > :34:03.are seeing in the liberal conference is fear, fear of
:34:03. > :34:06.political extinction. Fear of what's been happening to them in
:34:06. > :34:10.local Government elections. They want to distance themselves and
:34:10. > :34:14.create a political difference. That is what's going on there. I'm
:34:14. > :34:18.afraid I wise crack on occasions that the liberals have the best
:34:18. > :34:21.seats on the aircraft but no parachutes. That is it, they feel
:34:21. > :34:24.trapped sometimes. You see people like people like Tim Farron being
:34:24. > :34:28.rude about Tories. It is no surprise, we can take it, we don't
:34:28. > :34:33.need to be rude back. We need a proper debate about what the
:34:33. > :34:36.coalition should be doing. I would be interested to hear from the
:34:36. > :34:38.audience here. What do you think the Lib Dems, leaving aside the
:34:38. > :34:42.possibility of a Labour Government or continued Labour Government,
:34:42. > :34:49.that aside, what has the presence of Liberal Democrats in a coalition
:34:49. > :34:53.Government given you guys? Can anybody think of it? Somebody has
:34:53. > :34:57.shouted not much. Can anybody think of anything positive? One hand gone
:34:57. > :35:01.up there, in the green shirt? they have done what they said. In
:35:01. > :35:06.the national interest hef come together with us, to help - they
:35:06. > :35:10.have come together with us, to form a Government, we have been able to
:35:10. > :35:13.put forward many of our manifesto commitments that we wouldn't have
:35:13. > :35:18.done in a minority Government. I'm pleased about that. Some of the tax
:35:18. > :35:21.policies aren't too bad, taking people earning less than �10,000
:35:21. > :35:26.out of the tax system completely is very effective, something we should
:35:26. > :35:30.have thought of ourselves. What do you think you could have done if
:35:30. > :35:33.you had an unfettered, free hand, anybody with any suggestions. What
:35:33. > :35:43.about the Human Rights Act, for example? They have stuck you with
:35:43. > :35:44.
:35:44. > :35:48.that? You're all happy about that? Right at the back? I think one
:35:48. > :35:50.issue that troubles me is the renewable agenda coming from the
:35:50. > :35:54.Liberal Democrats is not necessarily economically viable,
:35:54. > :35:58.that was something George Osborne raised today. Our renewable agenda
:35:58. > :36:02.is important, we must get it right, but not to the detriment of
:36:02. > :36:06.economic benefit of the country. We can't go bankrupt because we must
:36:06. > :36:12.have wind turbines, we wouldn't have that if we didn't have
:36:12. > :36:17.liberals in the department. other points? This point that, take
:36:17. > :36:20.the green agenda there, and George Osborne said today that we were
:36:20. > :36:23.promising, David Cameron was promising we would be the most
:36:23. > :36:26.green Government in Europe. George Osborne says this is nuts, we will
:36:26. > :36:31.go at the pace of every other country in Europe, are you days
:36:31. > :36:37.poifrpbted by that as a Liberal Democrat? - disappointed by that as
:36:37. > :36:40.a Liberal Democrat? I am glaed you raised that. I think everybody has
:36:40. > :36:43.to come together to take action. Some of the things the coalition
:36:43. > :36:47.Government has announced that came from Liberal Democrats, for
:36:48. > :36:52.instance the green deal, insulating far more homes, afterall, our homes
:36:52. > :36:57.give off more energy, waste more energy, than in Scandinavia. The
:36:57. > :37:01.temperatures are much lower in Scandinavia. We will create 100,000
:37:01. > :37:06.jobs to get our homes insulated. Nobody would disagree with that.
:37:06. > :37:12.Very few people would disagree with the world's first, the Green
:37:12. > :37:17.Investment Bank, that will actually have �3 billion to invest in
:37:17. > :37:21.British industries, creating renewable technologies, produce
:37:21. > :37:26.turbines in some ports that are no longer building ships. I suspect
:37:26. > :37:29.very few people disagree with that. That has told you! It is
:37:29. > :37:33.interesting looking at this audience, they don't seem to me to
:37:33. > :37:37.have profound. There are some significant policy differences, but
:37:37. > :37:41.there is not a profound agravation at the presence of a restraining
:37:41. > :37:44.influence on Government, on both sides. The same was true at the
:37:44. > :37:48.Liberal Democrat Conference, they were rather proud of the fact they
:37:48. > :37:52.stopped you guys, as I said, sending children up chimneys?
:37:52. > :37:57.was in our manifesto, wasn't it. every manifesto, I believe!
:37:57. > :38:01.Something has changed in politics, hasn't it, do you get that sense?
:38:01. > :38:05.little bit. Let me be fair Tory the Liberal Democrats than he was
:38:05. > :38:09.initially. One area where they have actually been, I think, quite brave,
:38:09. > :38:14.given their own history, is on the whole question of the cuts agenda.
:38:14. > :38:18.The Chief Secretary last been a Lib Dem. That's quite an interesting
:38:18. > :38:23.position. You're the man in charge of all the cuts, is a Lib Dem. So
:38:23. > :38:26.there has been some interesting things. Also, of course, I had a
:38:26. > :38:31.Conservatives with David Cameron day after the election, before the
:38:31. > :38:36.negotiations started, I said to him, there are two areas where there are
:38:36. > :38:41.clear overlaps, one is the liberty agenda, and one is the green agenda.
:38:41. > :38:45.I don't particularly agree with the green agenda, but there were
:38:45. > :38:48.obvious overlaps. It is less unfom for the table than you might think.
:38:48. > :38:53.But at the end of the day there are lots of things we would rather do
:38:53. > :38:57.in a different way. The tax agenda would be different with a Tory-only
:38:57. > :38:59.Government. The European agenda would be different with a Tory-only
:38:59. > :39:03.Government. Maybe some of the balance of decisions over the cuts
:39:03. > :39:07.agenda would be different. Maybe we would have more emphasis on defence
:39:07. > :39:12.and so on than we had before. There is a whole set of areas where there
:39:12. > :39:15.are differences, none of them are deal-breakers. Not one of them is a
:39:15. > :39:23.deal-breaker. During his speech, the Chancellor
:39:23. > :39:29.talked about something called FRAPH fen, it is a brilliant discover -
:39:29. > :39:35.graphene, it is a brilliant thing, it conducts electricity brilliantly.
:39:35. > :39:40.It was discovered by a couple of scientists in Manchester using
:39:40. > :39:45.sticky tape, and they won a Nobel Peace Prize. The Chancellor said
:39:45. > :39:50.whatever we turn it into, it is a British project. To get a feel for
:39:50. > :39:56.what graphene could mean, think Stone Age, Iron Age, silicone age.
:39:56. > :40:01.Scientists think the next stage could be the graphene age, it is
:40:01. > :40:07.that remarkable. Its elagance is in its simplicity, graphite, just like
:40:07. > :40:12.the middle of a pencil, but shaved into layers a single at tomorrow
:40:12. > :40:16.thick, with at tomorrows arranged in Hexagons, once in inch-thick
:40:16. > :40:20.sheets it takes on exciting properties, hence the tag of
:40:20. > :40:24.miracle material. It is uniquely strong and conductive. It might be
:40:24. > :40:30.tweakable to produce a vast range of products, a bit like plastic, or
:40:30. > :40:33.even added to plastic to create new kinds of touch screen technologies,
:40:33. > :40:39.that avoid scarce rare earth elements. The real excitement is
:40:39. > :40:43.the potential to bring us truly fast computing, faster, cheaper,
:40:43. > :40:47.smaller electronic devices, that are also thinner and flexible.
:40:47. > :40:52.Roll-up wearable computers and smartphones, perhaps rb. So much
:40:52. > :40:56.buzz in a field less than ten years old is rare. Some scientists warn
:40:56. > :41:02.this is all just so much potential so far, with products at least five
:41:02. > :41:07.years away. They don't want to promise more than they can deliver.
:41:07. > :41:11.Here it is, the substance that will save the national economy, behold,
:41:11. > :41:17.a single crystal of graphene, surrounded by various bits of
:41:17. > :41:21.graphite. This single crystal is as big as it gets, it is worth about
:41:21. > :41:24.�10,000. We are only borrowing from the nice people at graphene
:41:24. > :41:28.industries. There is some challenges to scale it up into
:41:28. > :41:36.aircraft wings and the like. Two people who know very little indeed
:41:36. > :41:40.about graphene, but are interested in the politicians who marvel at it,
:41:40. > :41:44.are Kevin McGuire and Fraser Nelson. Were you impressed by George
:41:44. > :41:48.Osborne's speech? He didn't have a lot to say and no plan. I have
:41:48. > :41:53.never been to North Korea, I have an idea what it is like. The
:41:53. > :41:56.enforced loyalty there. I think it is voluntary loyalty? Oh yeah. I
:41:56. > :42:01.think in this bubble there is a smugness. We have had more people
:42:01. > :42:11.outside protesting than we have had actually people in this conference.
:42:11. > :42:15.I don't think that is true, is it? There is 30-odd,000 people -
:42:15. > :42:20.30,000-odd people protesting and then you have this here. I thought
:42:20. > :42:26.that would stir them up? Not effectively. Were you impressed
:42:26. > :42:31.by it, it strikes me as being a dull thing? He normally likes
:42:31. > :42:36.pyrotechniques, he's saving these ones for November, I'm sure it will
:42:36. > :42:42.be a dazzling display. Delivery was pretty good, he baffled everybody
:42:42. > :42:51.with his strange credit easing plan that he has got. But there is some
:42:51. > :42:55.uplands at the end of it, a little zipididoda. It was not one that you
:42:55. > :42:59.will remember. People will wake up tomorrow and think, Amanda Knox is
:42:59. > :43:02.free. What about the credit easing, what is that all about? Basically a
:43:02. > :43:07.rather, Government likes to print money. This is a way of doing it.
:43:07. > :43:12.So you can go to small businesses and in a way where they can borrow
:43:12. > :43:17.where they can't from banks A year ago he and David Cameron said
:43:17. > :43:20.Britain was out of the danger zone. It was their equivalent of no more
:43:20. > :43:27.boom and bust. It is clearly not happening, the economy has slipped
:43:27. > :43:31.back, 0.% of growth in the last 10 months, he's blaming the eurozone.
:43:31. > :43:37.I remember Gordon Brown blaiming the Americans, and they would sneer
:43:37. > :43:42.and say it is not the case. Now he's using the same trick, blaming
:43:42. > :43:45.people abroad rather than taking the responsibility himself. Did you
:43:45. > :43:51.detect any qualitative difference between credit easing and some of
:43:51. > :43:57.the wheezes Gordon Brown used to get up to? Those wheezes he used to
:43:57. > :44:01.call desperate, now he's adopting them himself. We have state
:44:02. > :44:06.controlled banks, get them lending, don't get something on the back of
:44:06. > :44:09.it that nobody understands and won't help small businesses. After
:44:09. > :44:16.listening to Philip Hammond I'm not sure about that. Fraser Nelson, did
:44:16. > :44:19.you feel it was a Tory policy? Credit easing? Yes. It is something
:44:19. > :44:25.Gordon Brown could have come up with, because it involves concealed
:44:25. > :44:29.debt. You do think if Gordon Brown was watching, he would be thinking,
:44:29. > :44:32.why didn't he come up with that. I can't say I'm wild about it. If you
:44:32. > :44:37.think banks are bad at lending money, you wait until Government
:44:37. > :44:43.does it. I have a feeling this will not be the great silver bullet.
:44:43. > :44:51.What about the party as a whole, from what we see here? Huge morale.
:44:52. > :44:56.They are pretty happy. I would say. I don't know quit - quite what you
:44:56. > :45:00.expected. Look at that, they are whistling while they work. These
:45:00. > :45:03.were the guys who fought for the Conservative manifesto and seeing
:45:03. > :45:13.pretty much all of it delivered by a coalition Government. Looked a
:45:13. > :45:18.ral kal school reform and welfare reform. - radical school reform and
:45:18. > :45:22.health reform. They pay to come here. Not here, it was free. Look
:45:22. > :45:25.at that, Conservative, it doesn't mention t they have eradicated the
:45:25. > :45:29.party. You go round on the fringe and you will find a lot of
:45:29. > :45:34.complaints, you mentioned them, the Human Rights Act, about Europe.
:45:34. > :45:36.Both of which Nick Clegg has David Cameron in a headlock and won't let
:45:36. > :45:40.him go. There you hear complaints about why aren't we getting tax
:45:40. > :45:46.cuts now to get the economy going. They don't want increased
:45:46. > :45:54.investment in public service bes, they want - public services, they
:45:54. > :45:57.want tax cuts and they want them no now. Grieve grove grieve is against
:45:57. > :46:02.abortion and Human Rights Act, the Conservatives were having these
:46:02. > :46:06.arguments before coalition. They have rediscovered the trick of
:46:06. > :46:12.loyalty. Loyalty was the party's secret weapon? It has come back.
:46:12. > :46:16.There isn't that much to get really angry about. Hang on. Fraser, look
:46:16. > :46:20.at what's happening to the economy, look at what's happening to
:46:20. > :46:24.unemployment, public services, look what's happening to living
:46:24. > :46:27.standards. Before you start blaming it on Labour's structural deficit,
:46:27. > :46:31.remember that David Cameron and George Osborne were committed to
:46:31. > :46:35.Labour's spending up to 2010. It was only the global financial
:46:35. > :46:42.collapse that sent that haywire. will continue this argument
:46:42. > :46:46.tomorrow, I think. Thank you very tonight. We will have an audience
:46:46. > :46:50.of Tory women to see if the party can recover its support from that
:46:50. > :46:57.part of the country at large, and I will be speaking to Boris Johnson.
:46:57. > :47:01.will be speaking to Boris Johnson. Until then, goodnight.
:47:01. > :47:05.Hello, the weather is on the change. Through the rest of this week it
:47:05. > :47:09.will feel much more like autumn should feel. We start the day with
:47:09. > :47:13.dry weather but a lot of cloud. Limited brightness, the best across
:47:13. > :47:15.the more eastern parts of the UK. Temperatures will be as much as 10
:47:15. > :47:22.degrees lower than they have been. You notice the difference out there.
:47:22. > :47:26.A reasonable sort of day, it has to be said A small chance of a shower,
:47:26. > :47:31.generally dry, breezy, rather cloudy, but brightness from time to
:47:31. > :47:35.time. Across the more western parts of England and Wales cloud, thicker
:47:35. > :47:39.here, dampness for parts of Cornwall and western parts of Wales.
:47:39. > :47:43.To the east of the hills a better chance it will stay essentially dry.
:47:43. > :47:47.For Northern Ireland a fairly cloudy scene, but again, mostly dry.
:47:47. > :47:51.Some showers across the northern coastal areas and some more
:47:51. > :47:55.meaningful showers peppering western Scotland on a stiff breeze.
:47:55. > :47:58.Further east we will see brighter spells. For the next few days it is
:47:58. > :48:02.topsy turvy, that's for sure, wet and windy weather in northern
:48:02. > :48:06.western areas on Wednesday. Strong winds and potentially heavy rain.
:48:06. > :48:09.Further south, essentially we will see outbreaks of rain. The first
:48:09. > :48:15.significant rain many places have seen for quite a while. On
:48:15. > :48:18.Wednesday it is a story of rain initially across the north and west,