:00:12. > :00:17.Mistreatment, misdiagnosis, and management failings may have led to
:00:17. > :00:21.as many as a thousand needless deaths at Stafford General Hospital.
:00:21. > :00:25.How did it happen, and how do we make sure it doesn't happen again.
:00:25. > :00:30.We both believed that hospitals were safe, we didn't know anything
:00:30. > :00:33.else. As soon as we got in the hospital we knew that something was
:00:33. > :00:38.terribly wrong. This is the hospital that's been under the
:00:38. > :00:41.spotlight, but the questions are now much wider. How can patient
:00:41. > :00:46.safety best be protected in the NHS?
:00:46. > :00:49.I speak to one woman whose mother died there, she met the Prime
:00:49. > :00:53.Minister tonight. The lie that destroyed Chris Huhne,
:00:53. > :00:58.what a difference a year makes. innocent of these charges and I
:00:58. > :01:02.intend to fight this in the courts, I'm confident a jury will agree.
:01:02. > :01:07.I have pleaded guiltied today. Until very recent days, still
:01:07. > :01:11.talked about as a possible future Deputy Prime Minister, today Chris
:01:11. > :01:17.Huhne faces the possibility of prison.
:01:17. > :01:23.He was Shakespeare's number one villain. Now is the winter of our
:01:23. > :01:27.discontent, made glorious summer by this son of York. Richard III,
:01:27. > :01:37.exhumed and now identified, should he be rehabilitated. I will ask the
:01:37. > :01:38.
:01:38. > :01:42.direct to Richard Eyre, and Tudor historian, Suzannah Lipscomb.
:01:42. > :01:45.Good evening, the devastating events at Stafford General Hospital,
:01:45. > :01:50.which may have contributed to the unnecessary deaths of hundreds of
:01:50. > :01:54.patients in the hospital's care, between 2005-2009, reveals
:01:54. > :01:58.something rotten in the NHS. The public inquiry into the NHS
:01:58. > :02:02.foundation Trust will report on Wednesday. It is likely to have
:02:02. > :02:05.far-reaching implications for the management and nursing in the NHS,
:02:05. > :02:09.in relation to candour, transparency, training and
:02:09. > :02:13.responsibility. Ahead of the report, the Health Secretary, Jeremy Hunt,
:02:13. > :02:18.blamed a culture of targets and performance management, which
:02:18. > :02:21.defined the NHS under Labour. Why of the culture so especially bad at
:02:21. > :02:31.Stafford General Hospital, who will accept responsibility, and could
:02:31. > :02:35.
:02:35. > :02:39.anything like it ever happen again? The stories from Stafford Hospital
:02:39. > :02:43.have proved shocking. Described as horrific and haunting for patients
:02:43. > :02:47.and their families. Hundreds are alleged to have died needlessly,
:02:47. > :02:55.through lack of care and fundamental deficiencies. There
:02:55. > :03:00.have already been a string of investigations. Robert Francis QC
:03:00. > :03:03.led a public inquiry back in 2010, his full inquiry reports back this
:03:03. > :03:07.week. In his first report he described his shock at hearing
:03:07. > :03:11.about suffering to patients, that included being left in unwashed
:03:11. > :03:15.sheets, unable to reach food and drink, or without adequate pain
:03:16. > :03:21.relief. He said it was failure on a scale that cannot be adequately
:03:21. > :03:27.expressed in statistics. Julie Bailey's 86-year-old mother,
:03:27. > :03:30.Bella, was admitted to Stafford Hospital in 2007, for what should
:03:30. > :03:34.have been a routine hernia operation. We believed that she was
:03:34. > :03:39.going into somewhere safe. We both believed that hospitals were safe,
:03:39. > :03:42.we didn't know anything else. As soon as we got in the hospital we
:03:42. > :03:48.knew that something was terribly wrong. It was just really out of
:03:48. > :03:52.control. Just going on to the wards, there was just screaming and
:03:52. > :03:56.shouting. She says she saw chaos on the wards, and decided she was not
:03:56. > :04:01.going to leave her mother there alone. So she and other members of
:04:01. > :04:04.the family stayed, 24-hours a day, for eight week, to care for Bella
:04:04. > :04:08.themselves. They used to tell us off, and there was no clean sheets
:04:08. > :04:11.to change the bed with. There was another woman that had fallen
:04:11. > :04:16.opposite, there was just blood everywhere. They had to go and pick
:04:16. > :04:20.patients off the floor and try to patch them up, and then hunt for
:04:20. > :04:26.staff. It wouldn't have marred some days, because the staff, I would
:04:26. > :04:30.say 60% of them shouldn't have been on the wards. They weren't nursing.
:04:30. > :04:34.A succession of Labour health secretaries was encouraging NHS
:04:34. > :04:41.managers to seek Foundation Trust status for hospitals, with emphasis
:04:41. > :04:47.on targets to bring down waiting times and tighter financial control.
:04:47. > :04:52.In 2009 one regulator did attempt to find out what was going on at
:04:52. > :04:55.Mid Staffs. Dr Heather Wood was sent in by the Healthcare
:04:55. > :05:01.Commission, because mortality rates appeared to be higher than expected.
:05:01. > :05:09.What does she think went wrong at Stafford? A struggle Trust,
:05:09. > :05:14.completely lost its way, had the wrong priorities, and pursued
:05:14. > :05:18.Foundation Trust status, really at the expense of its core business of
:05:18. > :05:22.looking after patients safely. Relatives of patients say it was
:05:22. > :05:29.not just lack of care, but a lack of openness when things went wrong,
:05:29. > :05:36.that let people down. Frank and Janet Robinson's 20-year-
:05:36. > :05:42.old son, John, was injured in an accident on his mountain bike in
:05:42. > :05:47.2006, he was taken 0 Stafford A&E Department, but was discharged and
:05:47. > :05:52.told he had bruised ribs. couldn't walk out, he was pushed
:05:52. > :05:58.out in a wheelchair and given a container to be sick in. They had
:05:58. > :06:04.to ask for painkillers because he was still in a lot of pain. John
:06:04. > :06:08.died a few hours later with a ruptured spleen, his parents blame
:06:08. > :06:11.the hospital for not identifying the injury. In 2006 a report
:06:11. > :06:16.prepared by an A&E consultant in at the hospital, not present on the
:06:16. > :06:20.day of the accident, concluded that John's unfortunate and untimely
:06:20. > :06:24.death may have been avoided had he been more proper low assessed.
:06:24. > :06:28.had an accident, and we appreciate he had an accident and was badly
:06:28. > :06:33.injured. Had John have died as a result of that accident it would
:06:33. > :06:40.have been hard to accept, but you accept them sort of things. John
:06:40. > :06:44.needed care, and the A&E Department at Stafford was in meltdown.
:06:44. > :06:47.Robinsons are seeking a new inquest, because the A&E's consultant
:06:47. > :06:51.internal report was sent to the Trust lawyers, but did not reach
:06:51. > :06:54.the coroner or the family. The lawyers from that time told us
:06:54. > :06:58.there was never any attempt to cover up the facts of John's death.
:06:58. > :07:05.And their first duty was to the Trust, and not to patients. Legal
:07:05. > :07:09.regulators have agreed. Today the hospital is under new
:07:09. > :07:19.management. In response to the family's concerns over the care of
:07:19. > :07:30.
:07:30. > :07:34.Bella Bailey and John Robinson, the She also gave her sincere apologies
:07:34. > :07:39.to Mr and Mrs Robinson, and said the Trust has apologise today Julie
:07:39. > :07:44.Bailey. She said today Stafford is a very different place. In his
:07:44. > :07:48.second report, Robert Francis looks more widely at NHS management, at
:07:48. > :07:52.questions he says constantly went through his mind. Why did those in
:07:52. > :07:57.charge not detect that something so serious was going on, and why was
:07:57. > :08:02.nothing done about it? I think Mid Staffs was a perfect
:08:02. > :08:08.storm, where everything came together. I think at that time it
:08:08. > :08:12.was a target culture and it was very prevalent. People, doctors,
:08:12. > :08:17.were pushed into situations, and I don't think they were always
:08:17. > :08:24.comfortable with that. Elective cases were prioritised. I would
:08:24. > :08:30.hope that has been altered, and changed. But I do think there are
:08:30. > :08:35.pockets around the country where that may still be a problem.
:08:35. > :08:39.expectation is that the report will be highly critical of NHS
:08:39. > :08:42.structures, the plethora of regulating bodies and the
:08:42. > :08:45.individuals in management at the time. That may include the chief
:08:45. > :08:49.executive of the NHS in England, Sir David Nicholson, who cases
:08:49. > :08:53.calls to resign. He was chief executive -- who faces calls to
:08:53. > :09:00.resign. He was chief executive of the two strategic health
:09:00. > :09:05.authorities from 2005-2006, before taking up his current role. He has
:09:05. > :09:10.evidently been at the heart of the development of the command and
:09:10. > :09:19.control structure in the NHS. I don't think I'm alone in thinking
:09:19. > :09:24.that he, and the cadre of people that he has appointed and also have
:09:24. > :09:29.very senior positions, that those people are not the right leaders to
:09:29. > :09:33.change that culture. But Sir David has a pivitol role in
:09:33. > :09:37.the Government's full-scale reorganisation of the NHS in
:09:37. > :09:41.England. It ordered this full public inquiry after pledging to go
:09:41. > :09:45.beyond Labour's first independent inquiry. So it will want to show it
:09:45. > :09:49.has done all it can to avoid a repeat of Mid Staffs. Sir David
:09:49. > :09:54.himself has said he has not seen anything yet that would make him
:09:54. > :09:58.think he should resign. Last week he apologised for those affected on
:09:58. > :10:03.behalf of the NHS. He said patients will be given a bigger say. There
:10:03. > :10:08.is also renewed interest in a concept known as "zero harm", based
:10:08. > :10:12.on Florence Nightingale's edict, that the hospital should the sick
:10:12. > :10:17.no harm. Antony Sumara was parachuted in to fix Mid Staffs. He
:10:17. > :10:24.said there must be a wholesale change in culture, removing targets
:10:24. > :10:31.where say 95% of patients remain free of hospital-acquired
:10:31. > :10:37.infections. The concept of "zero harm" greatly appeals to him.
:10:37. > :10:43.zero harm, airlines use it, the building construction industry use
:10:43. > :10:49.it, but the NHS has an idea that it is OK to harm people. What would he
:10:49. > :10:56.do? I would be tougher to make sure that those who work in the NHS are
:10:56. > :11:02.held directly to account for patient safety and care. And we
:11:02. > :11:09.don't have this idea that it is OK to harm some people and compared to
:11:09. > :11:13.other Trusts we are not that bad. After her experiences at Stafford
:11:13. > :11:17.Julyy Bailey founded Curet The NHS, with other families. They will be
:11:17. > :11:21.the toughest judges of the response on Wednesday, for them apologise
:11:21. > :11:24.will not be enough, they want nothing less than a new world of
:11:24. > :11:30.health cautious breaking the concept that harm is inevitable.
:11:30. > :11:32.Just before we came on air I spoke to Deb Hazeldine, whose mother was
:11:32. > :11:35.treated at Stafford General Hospital, and who spoke to the
:11:35. > :11:41.Prime Minister about the public inquiry earlier today.
:11:41. > :11:46.What happened to your mother when she went into hospital? Mum was 67,
:11:46. > :11:50.she was admitted into Mid Staffs in July of 2006. She had a fall at
:11:50. > :11:55.home, not sustained any injuries, but we were told that she would
:11:55. > :11:59.need on going physiotherapy to get back on her feet after the
:11:59. > :12:05.physiotherapy she had. She was put straight on to an open ward, even
:12:05. > :12:08.though we asked she be put in an isolation ward. She quickly
:12:08. > :12:14.contracted C-diff and MRSA. Then what happened to her general health
:12:14. > :12:20.and care? The care was appalling. There was some very kind nurses,
:12:20. > :12:23.but lots of nurse and doctors who weren't kind and didn't support --
:12:23. > :12:26.nurses and doctors who weren't kind and didn't support mum. You work in
:12:26. > :12:30.the NHS and you know about the atmosphere. What kind of things
:12:30. > :12:34.happened to your mum? Entering the ward one day, I could hear my mum
:12:34. > :12:39.screaming at the top of her voice, she was in so much pain. I dropped
:12:39. > :12:43.my bag and ran into her. She was half on a komode, half on the floor.
:12:43. > :12:49.That is when she grabbed my hand and said "please don't let me die
:12:49. > :12:52.in here". I fed my mum, I cleaned my mum. My mum had ulcers on her
:12:52. > :12:57.leg because she was left in a wet bed for such a long time. She had
:12:57. > :13:00.pain in her back, she would constantly say she was in pain.
:13:00. > :13:04.there any sense of embarrassment or worry from the general staff there?
:13:04. > :13:08.Yes, the nurse that is were really caring. There were a couple on the
:13:08. > :13:11.ward would try 0 do their very best. There were some nurses that were
:13:11. > :13:15.very dismissive as well, they didn't try to help. I tried to be
:13:15. > :13:20.there as much as I can. I had to say to my mum's consultant could
:13:20. > :13:25.you please write in the notes that I can visit, because of the abuse I
:13:25. > :13:30.got off staff members when I went in. You didn't make a complaint?
:13:30. > :13:34.a family we couldn't be there 24/7, I was worried because mum would be
:13:34. > :13:38.in there. We decided when mum came home we would complain.
:13:38. > :13:42.Unfortunately she never came home. She didn't come home and you have
:13:42. > :13:47.been part of the big campaign. You saw David Cameron earlier this
:13:47. > :13:55.evening. I did. What was the general demeanor of
:13:55. > :13:58.the meeting? It was very respectful, I think, to our loved ones. It was
:13:58. > :14:02.very respectful. What did you ask from him? Accountability, that is
:14:02. > :14:06.the main thing to me. There were hundreds of people who died
:14:06. > :14:10.horrifically, and nobody, at this point, has been held accountable.
:14:10. > :14:13.What concrete changes do you want to see happen now, and presumably
:14:14. > :14:18.you spoke to David Cameron about those? Yes, I did. We need
:14:18. > :14:21.accountability to come back into the NHS. Poor care is insulting to
:14:21. > :14:26.all of the caring and compassionate staff, as well as all the patients.
:14:26. > :14:29.We need the recommendations of the Francis Report to be implemented,
:14:29. > :14:32.and a complaints system fit for purpose, it currently isn't, the
:14:32. > :14:40.patients don't have a voice if something goes wrong. Who should
:14:40. > :14:43.resign over this, you say nobody has gone yet. Who should? If you
:14:43. > :14:47.look it public inquiry, anybody found to be failing, that starts
:14:47. > :14:51.with David Nicholson. Now head of the NHS in England? Yes, there is
:14:51. > :14:55.no accountability, we cannot let this one continue to run the NHS.
:14:55. > :14:59.Thank you very much indeed. We invited Sir David Nicholson on
:14:59. > :15:03.to the programme tonight, but he didn't want to speak ahead of the
:15:03. > :15:08.inquiry report on Wednesday. We also contacted mid-Staffordshire
:15:08. > :15:11.Foundation Trust for a comment. They said they have apologised to
:15:12. > :15:15.Miss Hazeldine for the poor care given to her mother in 2006, and it
:15:15. > :15:18.is suffering cause today her and her family. There were systemic
:15:18. > :15:22.problems at Stafford Hospital at that time, which meant that the
:15:22. > :15:25.care provided to these patients and others in some areas of the
:15:26. > :15:30.hospital was inadequate. Such a poor standard of care is
:15:30. > :15:33.inexcusable and indefensible, today Stafford is a very different place.
:15:33. > :15:36.External regulators have verified and acknowledged the improvements
:15:36. > :15:40.that have been made, is what they said.
:15:40. > :15:45.Joining me is Mike Farrer, chief executive of the NHS Confederation.
:15:45. > :15:50.And Peter Walsh, from the group who campaign for patient safety. He has
:15:50. > :15:53.helped some of those involved in the Mid Staffs case.
:15:53. > :15:57.Peter Walsh, do you think the NHS in England has lost its way?
:15:57. > :16:00.Something has gone very wrong with the NHS. That is obvious. Obviously
:16:00. > :16:04.the inquiry started to be all about what happened at Stafford, but it
:16:04. > :16:08.is much wider than that now. I would love to say this was a
:16:08. > :16:14.totally isolated incident, but as a national charity, we see pockets of
:16:14. > :16:18.what happened at Stafford in hospitals around the country.
:16:18. > :16:23.Farrer, I was struck by something Debbie Hazeldine said, talking
:16:23. > :16:27.about the nurses, they weren't nursing. What's happened to
:16:27. > :16:32.compassion and care? Jeremy Hunt seems keen that is put at the heart
:16:32. > :16:38.of the NHS again, clearly that was lacking? I think the evidence from
:16:38. > :16:41.Mid Staffs is absolutely horrendous, speaking as one who came into
:16:41. > :16:45.National Health Service to do good for people, I feel ashamed of what
:16:45. > :16:48.happened there. What I can say is we absolutely use this as an
:16:48. > :16:53.opportunity to learn every single lesson we can and make sure it
:16:53. > :16:57.doesn't happen again. I think what we do to guarantee to the public
:16:57. > :17:00.that these horrendous issues are dealt with, requires us to take a
:17:00. > :17:06.fundamental look at everything, from the nursing on the wards,
:17:06. > :17:10.through to the ways in which the NHS organisations judge themselves
:17:10. > :17:13.and they are accountable to the public, and how they operate in the
:17:13. > :17:16.wider system. This is a moment in time to get this right. You heard
:17:16. > :17:21.Deb Hazeldine saying they didn't want to complain while their mother
:17:21. > :17:26.was in hospital, in case it affected her mother adversely.
:17:26. > :17:29.There has clearly been a breakdown in trust between patients and
:17:29. > :17:34.nursing staff. Whether they be auction sillies, doctors or porters,
:17:34. > :17:38.there is a complete breakdown of trust? Yes, and I think that is
:17:38. > :17:42.inexcusable that the people who need us at that great time of
:17:42. > :17:46.problem can't trust us. Whether that is the nursing staff, the
:17:46. > :17:50.management of hospitals, or indeed, the way in which we account for
:17:50. > :17:55.ourselves. We have to do better, we have to rebuild trust. That starts
:17:55. > :17:58.by being much more open. We have to listen to patients. It is
:17:58. > :18:05.inexcusable in today's environment that we're not listening to
:18:06. > :18:10.patients as part of the whole process of care. But there can't be
:18:10. > :18:18.just tinkering. Let's talk about zero harm, something like C-diff,
:18:18. > :18:24.it might be we don't want more than 5% of patients to get that, now it
:18:24. > :18:28.is 0 per cent, there should never be a -- 0%, there should never be a
:18:28. > :18:31.presumption that anyone should get this in hospital? We gave evidence
:18:31. > :18:35.to the inquiry about vitally important patient safety alerts,
:18:35. > :18:39.life and death matters, where trusts around the country were
:18:39. > :18:44.failing to implement. Mortality rates, strong indicators of
:18:44. > :18:47.something going wrong. Duty of candour, are you really saying that
:18:47. > :18:51.a nurse auction silly could actually call out a consultant for
:18:51. > :18:54.doing something wrong, it is such a hierarchical organisation, I
:18:54. > :19:01.couldn't imagine that ever happening? There is lots of
:19:01. > :19:04.platitudes to be spoken about Stafford, and the recommendations.
:19:05. > :19:08.Change of culture and openness, the challenge for Jeremy Hunt will be,
:19:08. > :19:12.will he fully implement the recommendations, which I'm sure
:19:12. > :19:16.will include a statutory, meaningful duty of candour. What
:19:16. > :19:21.kind of health service would not guarantee as an essential standard
:19:21. > :19:25.openness with patients and family when things go wrong. A duty of
:19:25. > :19:29.candour, should that be implemented if recommended on Wednesday? I do,
:19:29. > :19:34.and Peter is absolutely right. I would say that resource to a legal
:19:34. > :19:37.duty, to be open and honest with patients, is really an indictment
:19:37. > :19:40.to the fact that the culture we have at the moment doesn't honestly
:19:40. > :19:43.share with patients and their families what is going on in terms
:19:43. > :19:48.of their care. And the first thing that happens, of course, if there
:19:48. > :19:52.is a complaint, it seems to be in mid-Stafford, that rather than
:19:52. > :19:55.dealing with the complaint, you hire an army of lawyers to defend
:19:55. > :20:00.you. That the lawyers' obligation is to the Trust and not the
:20:00. > :20:04.patients. How could things be as skewed as that, Mike Farrer? If we
:20:04. > :20:08.were getting this right, and now we must, we can't fail this time. We
:20:08. > :20:15.would have a situation where staff on the wards were reviewing care,
:20:15. > :20:18.with the families, the families know their loved one is well and
:20:18. > :20:22.making sure we could do everything we comfortable it would be a
:20:22. > :20:26.culture where you didn't have to recourse a lot or whistle blow,
:20:26. > :20:30.because we would be learning what we need to as we went along. That
:20:30. > :20:37.is the critical bit. You look down the list of different organisations
:20:37. > :20:40.involved in patient care, there must be 20 or 30 or 40. There is a
:20:40. > :20:44.myriad organisations which dilute the idea of accountability? Yes,
:20:44. > :20:48.things are being made more complex. When you make things more complex
:20:48. > :20:51.and fragmented, you introduce more risk. What we need is a tough
:20:51. > :20:56.regulator, rather than more regulation, we need better
:20:56. > :21:01.regulation. A regulator, like the aviation industry, that would act
:21:01. > :21:05.on single indicators of a lack of safety. Mortality rates, patient
:21:05. > :21:07.safety alerts, but fundamental is openness and transparency.
:21:08. > :21:12.Protecting whistleblowers, and ensuring that patients are
:21:12. > :21:16.empowered, not just by information, by honesty about what then goes on,
:21:16. > :21:20.but independent support with their complaints. It looks a if there is
:21:20. > :21:23.going to be, Mike Farrer, an absolute recommendation, and
:21:23. > :21:28.presumably it will be statutory soon, that the ratio of nursing
:21:28. > :21:32.staff to patients will have to change, and are we even having
:21:32. > :21:37.enough nurses to do that? There is a very important point here that
:21:37. > :21:41.builds off Peter's point. We can look externally at the regulation
:21:41. > :21:46.levels, and setting standards for nursing levels, but it is people in
:21:46. > :21:49.the hopts that have to take the responsibility. They are the ones
:21:49. > :21:52.there 24/7, 365 days a year. It is their responsibility to know what
:21:52. > :21:56.is safe care. If you have a difficult patient on a ward you
:21:56. > :22:00.might need to increase staffing. It is their responsibility, they are
:22:00. > :22:03.the ones, not the regulators, who need to make sure the buck stops
:22:03. > :22:07.with them, and management. Then we need a regulatory system that gives
:22:07. > :22:11.confidence that what is happening in the NHS is open and transparent.
:22:11. > :22:14.Where we need to step in we K the responsibility of quality of care
:22:14. > :22:18.lies with the hospital and all of us in the National Health Service.
:22:18. > :22:23.That is where we should look first. We await the report on Wednesday.
:22:23. > :22:28.It still seems some what incredible, but there now may be a royal
:22:28. > :22:34.funeral, Richard III, the last King of England to die in battle may be
:22:34. > :22:38.interned somewhere, maybe Westminster Abbey, after a deformed
:22:38. > :22:43.skeleton with battle wounds has been identified as king after lying
:22:43. > :22:46.under a car park in Leicester for many years. He was Shakespeare's
:22:46. > :22:55.arch villain, accused of killing his brother's soon. We will talk to
:22:55. > :23:02.our guests in a moment. First this. Now is the winter of our discontent.
:23:02. > :23:05.Made glorious summer by this son of York. They found Richard III! In
:23:05. > :23:14.the absence of any other broadcaster willing to hammer this
:23:14. > :23:20.story to death, it falls to us, soberly and gravely, to train the
:23:20. > :23:25.spotlight of Newsnight scholarship on this subject.
:23:25. > :23:29.Hidden under a car park in Leicester, one of the most
:23:30. > :23:34.notorious kings in our history. A ruthless power-snatcher, and
:23:34. > :23:39.alleged child killer, the only thing Richard III hasn't been
:23:39. > :23:44.accused of is failing to pay-and- display. The pith and marrow of
:23:44. > :23:51.this story concerns a swab in the mouth of a blameless Canadian. But
:23:51. > :23:57.how can it be? Now here is the science part. Richard III had an
:23:57. > :24:00.older sister, Anne of York, skip forward a few generations and her
:24:00. > :24:05.17th great-grand nephew is a Canadian carpenter living in London,
:24:05. > :24:12.Michael Ibsen. The Leicester university team took his DNA, and
:24:12. > :24:17.that of another distant descendant of Anne as, and compared that with
:24:17. > :24:21.the car park skeleton. The scans matched, and the team announced,
:24:21. > :24:27.alongside all the other evidence, this put the identity of the
:24:27. > :24:33.skeleton beyond reasonable doubt. The skeleton exhumed at Greyfriars
:24:33. > :24:41.in 2012, is indeed Richard III the last Plantagenet King of England.
:24:41. > :24:46.It is exciting in terms of methodology, DNA put together with
:24:46. > :24:49.archaeology, research and desk- based research, that is impressive.
:24:49. > :24:53.It is exciting, I'm not sure how much it means beyond the excitement
:24:53. > :24:58.of the process, but yes, today is a thrilling day to be a medieval
:24:58. > :25:05.historian. A horse, a horse, my kingdom for a horse. So now we know
:25:05. > :25:09.it was him under the car park, why are we so fascinated by Richard any
:25:09. > :25:12.way? Some historians insist he wasn't so much worse than other
:25:12. > :25:16.Monarchs. Maybe it is Shakespeare, the gap between the black
:25:16. > :25:22.propaganda put about in the 16th century, and crystalised in
:25:22. > :25:25.Shakespeare. The gap between that and the truth of Richard's regin,
:25:25. > :25:28.which is he didn't do a lot of bad things, just one or two extremely
:25:29. > :25:35.bad things. Someone who should know all about
:25:35. > :25:39.this is actor Jonjo O'Neil, who has given his Richard III at Stratford.
:25:39. > :25:43.Immediate instinct of probably towards humour, finding the glee in
:25:43. > :25:53.it. There is a lot of humour in Richard, he's a very funny
:25:53. > :26:00.character. I immediately started to find parallels in characters in
:26:00. > :26:04.South Park and other modern stuff that I have enjoyed and that I saw
:26:04. > :26:13.in Richard. When it comes to the canon, most
:26:13. > :26:18.good judges give props to Richard III. Is it he is most enjoyed
:26:18. > :26:21.villain, possibly? One of the most celebrated villains, certainly, in
:26:21. > :26:26.Shakespeare. It is the second- biggest part to hamlet, in terms of
:26:26. > :26:30.the sheer -- Hamlet, in terms of sheer volume and the amount he has,
:26:30. > :26:35.the second-largest amount of lines in all Shakespeare, second to
:26:35. > :26:39.Hamlet. It also emerged today that this car lot isn't just a dig of
:26:39. > :26:45.world historical interest. This is CSI boss worth! In the case of the
:26:45. > :26:51.larger wound, if the blade had penetrated seven sent meeters into
:26:51. > :26:55.the braifpb, -- centimeters into the brain, which we can't determine,
:26:55. > :26:59.death would have been instant. didn't have his hands bound, he was
:26:59. > :27:03.stabbed through the heart with a knife. This is obviously a burial
:27:03. > :27:08.designed to humiliate. Richard's remains may end up here at St
:27:08. > :27:15.Martin's, and Leicester will share with Paris the unlikely distinction
:27:15. > :27:21.of boating a Cathedral with a famous hunchback.
:27:21. > :27:27.Sir Richard Eyre is an award- winning theatre director, drink
:27:27. > :27:33.bringing Richard III to life on the age. Suzannah Lipscomb is an expert
:27:34. > :27:38.in the Tudor period. Good king bad king, does it make a difference to
:27:38. > :27:46.how we view him? It doesn't make a difference. Richard has this
:27:46. > :27:50.reputation from Sir Thomas Moore and Shakespeare of being a crooked
:27:50. > :27:54.man with a crooked back. There is this thing about his physical
:27:54. > :27:58.deformties and his character. We are beyond that now. We discovered
:27:59. > :28:04.he did have a curved spine. So they weren't just doing him down? No, I
:28:04. > :28:07.think the slightly surprising thing coming out today is the Tudor
:28:07. > :28:11.propaganda wasn't just an invention, there was something in it.
:28:11. > :28:15.exciting day, or overplayed, the arrival of Richard III in the scene
:28:15. > :28:20.again? An exciting day for the University of Leicester, and the
:28:20. > :28:23.car park attendants. I would have been much more excited if they had
:28:23. > :28:27.exhumed another draft of Shakespeare's play. I think the
:28:27. > :28:33.reason we are having this conversation at all is because
:28:33. > :28:40.Shakespeare's done Richard III a huge favour. This is terribly bad
:28:40. > :28:44.news for Richard III Society, they have said he's a man who is
:28:44. > :28:50.absolutely blameless. What's more, that he had had a perfectly
:28:50. > :28:55.straight spine. I think this revelation actually does, at least
:28:55. > :29:02.allow Shakespeare something more than mere poetic license. When you
:29:02. > :29:06.directed Richard III, how did you, you directed Ian McKellan in it,
:29:06. > :29:10.what were your lines on how to play Shakespeare's Richard III. Do you
:29:10. > :29:16.think there is a lot of fun in it? There is a lot of fun. Of course
:29:16. > :29:24.he's a soldier. His first speech is telling you how terrible it is for
:29:24. > :29:34.him that peace has broken out, and grim visage to all has vanished, to
:29:34. > :29:36.
:29:36. > :29:40.be replayed by all the efeninecy of peace. He will tell you he will do
:29:40. > :29:43.terrible things and he does do terrible things. It is interesting
:29:43. > :29:50.seeing Chris Huhne saying he was innocent today, and Richard III
:29:50. > :29:54.does that in the first seen. He convinced Lady Anne that he is
:29:54. > :29:59.uncorrupt and uncorruptible. He turns to the audience, having
:29:59. > :30:07.seduced her and convinced her of an innocence, and says "was ever woman
:30:07. > :30:11.in this humour wooed, was ever woman in this humour won". He he is
:30:11. > :30:16.an utterly beguiling villain. The great defenders of Richard III
:30:16. > :30:21.traduced the play, because the play is actually an extraordinary
:30:21. > :30:25.complex play about politic. It is a handbook for tyranny. He was a
:30:25. > :30:33.complex man, we now know there were certain enlightened aspects of
:30:33. > :30:38.things, the first man to give bail. But he died a horrific and
:30:38. > :30:43.humiliating death. And henry VII had to establish himself and give
:30:43. > :30:48.him a humiliating death? He was the last king to die on the battlefield
:30:48. > :30:53.in England, quite fairly, Henry the Tudor, I will upset a lot of
:30:53. > :30:57.Ricardians, but henry the Tudor won, the problem for that is that
:30:57. > :31:01.Richard III had the reputation as a Great War yo, we discover he was
:31:02. > :31:05.probably attacked from behind, and then humiliating wounds. That was
:31:05. > :31:11.necessary to demonstrate he was dead. He was carried through
:31:11. > :31:17.Leicester to say he hasn't gone into hiding, he actually is dead,
:31:17. > :31:26.and Henry Tudor is now Henry VII, king. That has to be the way it
:31:26. > :31:31.worked out. The big debate is where will his bones be buried? The Queen
:31:31. > :31:34.has to give her permission for Westminster Abbey. Leicester?
:31:35. > :31:38.have been buried in all sorts of places. Canterbury, Reading,
:31:38. > :31:43.Gloucester, not necessarily Westminster Abbey. I suppose it
:31:44. > :31:48.might be wise to consider putting him somewhere where he knew success.
:31:48. > :31:53.Somewhere like Richmond, maybe York, perhaps not Leicester. I'm sure the
:31:53. > :31:59.University oflessor would be very sad if he went -- University
:31:59. > :32:04.oflessor would be sad if he went elsewhere. Who are the best lines,
:32:04. > :32:10.in terms of actors that you have seen play it and the best lines,
:32:10. > :32:15.you have directed Ian McKellan, what are the best actors and best
:32:15. > :32:24.lines? My favourite line is when Elizabeth says to the old Queen
:32:24. > :32:27.Margaret, I'll misquote the line, but it is "teach me how to curse my
:32:27. > :32:32.enemies". This is the unrevealed part of the play is that it has
:32:32. > :32:42.some of the most powerful parts for women in the whole of the
:32:42. > :32:46.Shakespearian canon. And far from being glorification of revelling in
:32:47. > :32:51.the Godfather-like revelling in the villainy and viciousness, it shows
:32:51. > :32:55.you the consequences of it. The most devastating scene is the scene
:32:55. > :33:00.with three women who have all lost people. What is your favourite bit
:33:00. > :33:05.of Richard III, or as a Tudor you don't have any bits? I suppose
:33:05. > :33:09.everybody is struck by the opening. Nobody can walk away from that play
:33:09. > :33:13.and forget that dramatic opening, I would have to go with the classic
:33:13. > :33:19.lines about the winter of our discontent. Thank you very much.
:33:19. > :33:23.As Richard Eyre was saying, now for a very modern tragedy, Chris Huhne
:33:23. > :33:28.once a cabinet high flyer, today fell to the ground with a
:33:28. > :33:32.resounding crash, exposed as a liar. He announced he would resign as MP
:33:32. > :33:36.for Eastleigh. After years of lying he admitted a speeding offence, and
:33:37. > :33:44.now faces the prospect of a jail sentence. In the course of today's
:33:44. > :33:47.events, texts between his son and himself were admitted into evidence.
:33:47. > :33:54.Chris Huhne is the kind of politician to not just cross the
:33:54. > :33:59.road to pick up a fight but get in a car and race to it. The ambitious
:33:59. > :34:01.Lib Dem was accused of being in such a hurry to get on he would
:34:01. > :34:05.frequently speed there. Chris Huhne didn't rush to the position he
:34:05. > :34:08.found himself today, after a year of saying he didn't ask his wife to
:34:08. > :34:12.accept points on her driving license on his behalf, today the
:34:12. > :34:19.former cabinet minister pleaded guilty. I have pleaded guilty today,
:34:19. > :34:23.I'm unable to say more, while there is an outstanding trial. But having
:34:23. > :34:29.taken responsibility for something which happened ten years ago, the
:34:29. > :34:33.only proper course of action for me is now to resign my Eastleigh seat
:34:33. > :34:38.in parliament, which I will do very shortly. If all political careers
:34:38. > :34:40.end in failure, few end in court. At some point in the last seven
:34:40. > :34:46.days Chris Huhne made a decision that wraps up seven-and-a-half
:34:46. > :34:51.years as an MP. A one-time contend Tory lead his party, and until very
:34:51. > :34:54.recent days, still talked about as a possible future Deputy Prime
:34:54. > :34:57.Minister, today Chris Huhne faces the possibility of prison.
:34:57. > :35:01.That quote about all political lives ending in failure goes on to
:35:01. > :35:04.say that they do so because of human affairs. In the last two
:35:04. > :35:09.years, the Huhne family have been all too human. Huhne admitted
:35:09. > :35:13.having an affair in June 2010. His marriage to the respected economist,
:35:13. > :35:19.Vicky Pryce, broke down, and a year later allegations were published in
:35:19. > :35:22.the newspaper. In 2003, now a decade ago, when the then Lib Dem
:35:22. > :35:26.MP was trying to fast and furiously win election to Westminster, he was
:35:26. > :35:29.alleged to have been in such a hurry, his car had been caught by
:35:29. > :35:34.cameras speeding between Stanstead Airport and London. The prosecution
:35:34. > :35:38.alleged that Huhne had bust the speed limit so frequently, he was
:35:38. > :35:42.facing political ruin before his career started, he asked his wife
:35:42. > :35:45.to take the point, but the cabinet minister denied this. I want to say
:35:45. > :35:49.simply that these allegations are simply incorrect. They have been
:35:50. > :35:54.made before and they have been shown to be untrue. I very much
:35:54. > :36:00.welcome the referral to the police as it will draw a line under the
:36:00. > :36:05.matter. Throughout he would see a funny side. Philip Hammond, the
:36:05. > :36:10.Transport Secretary, said people who break the speed limit are
:36:10. > :36:14.perfectly decent people. Apparently Philip had broken the speed limit
:36:14. > :36:18.and got some points. I put my haunds and lost my license from
:36:18. > :36:22.speeding so I'm in a good position to say. Huhne had to eventually
:36:22. > :36:26.stand down from cabinet, he vowed to fight the charge and believing
:36:26. > :36:30.he would eventually return to political life. Today the judge
:36:30. > :36:35.revealed that Huhne's lawyer fought hard to have the case dismissed,
:36:35. > :36:38.not once but twice, and the judge overruled this, and he published
:36:38. > :36:48.fresh evidence, text messages between Huhne and his 18-year-old
:36:48. > :37:04.
:37:04. > :37:08.I'm shocked and saddened by what's happened, but I believe that Chris
:37:08. > :37:14.Huhne has taken the right decision in resigning as an MP.
:37:14. > :37:18.Why does it matter? He was central to the coalition negotiations with
:37:18. > :37:22.the Conservative Party after the hung parliament election of May
:37:22. > :37:26.2010, clearly one of the leading Lib Dems in the cabinet. Many
:37:26. > :37:28.people would have assumed that if he had been found not guilty or
:37:28. > :37:33.acquitted, for some reason over these charges, he would have
:37:33. > :37:37.returned to the fray. Either to the cabinet, quite quickly, or even
:37:37. > :37:41.potentially as a future leader of the Lib Dem party, were Nick Clegg
:37:41. > :37:46.to step down at some point. Suddenly all of that is over.
:37:46. > :37:51.Instead of racing down the M11, the strategists of Westminster will
:37:51. > :37:55.right now be familiarising themselves to another motorway, the
:37:55. > :38:00.M3 to Eastleigh, where they will spend the days and weeks ahead. As
:38:00. > :38:02.fits the cabinet minister most agrossive to Tory colleagues in
:38:03. > :38:05.Government, the battle for Eastleigh will be bitter. It is the
:38:05. > :38:09.first time in this parliament where the coalition partners go up
:38:09. > :38:16.against each other. Newsnight hit the road to see how quickly the
:38:16. > :38:20.Tories had hit the road, not very, up past Strawberryfields, the Tory
:38:20. > :38:25.HQ had not a leaflet ready. It came as a surprise to you, we weren't
:38:25. > :38:29.expecting a by-election, as it is better to be prepared and not miss
:38:29. > :38:34.a opportunity, but we have spoken about it, but no hotel rooms have
:38:34. > :38:40.been booked. Eastleigh is one of 20 Lib Dem seats targeted by the
:38:40. > :38:46.Tories, if they can't win here, a majority in 2015 is tricky. UKIP is
:38:46. > :38:51.a problem for them. UKIP take votes from all parties. It is amazing,
:38:51. > :38:56.people will vote liberal locally, but UKIP nationally. They take from
:38:56. > :39:06.everybody. That will be shared out amongst us. The Lib Dems are road
:39:06. > :39:12.testing a strategy, that they think will help them outperform
:39:12. > :39:18.competitors. Elbow grease. Chris Huhne hadn't given you a signal of
:39:18. > :39:21.what he was going to do, do you have a candidate? We have a
:39:21. > :39:25.candidate. We will go through democratic processes to get a
:39:25. > :39:29.candidate, we have a good pool of talent waiting to be considered as
:39:29. > :39:38.a potential MP for Eastleigh. another high-profile politician
:39:38. > :39:43.admitted telling an untruth, with such unauspicious settings, the
:39:43. > :39:48.scene is set for a bloody battle. David Cameron face as revolt of
:39:49. > :39:51.over 100 MPs tomorrow as the Commons votes on the same-sex
:39:51. > :39:56.Marriage Bill, which he has championed.
:39:56. > :39:59.Tonight, in an effort to win over colleagues, George Osborne, William
:39:59. > :40:02.Hague and Theresa May published a joint letter to the Telegraph, in
:40:02. > :40:08.which they questioned whether it was any longer acceptable to
:40:08. > :40:13.exclude people from marriage simply because they love someone of the
:40:13. > :40:17.same sex. We talk to two Conservative MPs who plan to vote
:40:17. > :40:21.differently on gay marriage tomorrow.
:40:21. > :40:24.Anne McIntosh, why shouldn't gai people get married? I think there
:40:24. > :40:28.is confusion here between rights for gay people and religious
:40:28. > :40:32.freedoms. What saddens me mostly about the debate, I have worked
:40:32. > :40:37.very closely with Nick and I have high regard for him and the
:40:37. > :40:40.arguments that the other side are putting forward. I think in the
:40:40. > :40:44.countryside the church plays a very special role. It is not necessarily
:40:44. > :40:48.just getting married in church, it is getting married full stop?
:40:48. > :40:52.you can't redefine marriage in this way. I would have no problem, if
:40:52. > :40:56.for example, civil partnership could be blessed in urge ch, that I
:40:56. > :41:00.think would be already -- church, that would be already a great step
:41:00. > :41:04.forward. We were specifically told when we voted on civil partnerships
:41:04. > :41:07.this wouldn't lead to marriage. This is a breakdown in trust.
:41:07. > :41:10.is nothing Nick Herbert would say to change your mind? No, I have
:41:10. > :41:13.made a public promise to my electorate. It wasn't something
:41:13. > :41:16.raised at the election, this has come out of the blue. But my
:41:16. > :41:20.electorate understand exactly where I stand on this issue. What about
:41:20. > :41:24.your electorate? It is a free vote and people are entitled to their
:41:24. > :41:27.view, it is an issue of conscience. All of the independently conducted
:41:27. > :41:30.opinion polls are showing a majority of the public are in
:41:30. > :41:35.favour of this change. That is a majority that is growing very fast
:41:35. > :41:39.in this country, as it has in others. We know that particularly
:41:39. > :41:46.amongst younger people there is very strong support indeed. What
:41:46. > :41:49.you are doing is looking ahead. Because ComRes poll for ITN news
:41:49. > :41:52.suggests today that as a result of this going through, if it does go
:41:52. > :41:56.through, which we expect, you are likely lose more votes than you
:41:56. > :42:00.will gain at the moment. That particular poll has been quite
:42:00. > :42:04.criticised by other pollsters for asking leading questions, and
:42:04. > :42:08.excluding all the other things people will vote on. There are
:42:08. > :42:12.bigger issues. Does it sadden you that Anne McIntosh doesn't believe
:42:12. > :42:15.that you should get married in church, or get married full stop?
:42:15. > :42:19.Of course I would like as many members in parliament to vote for
:42:19. > :42:22.it, I think it will pass tomorrow with a substantial majority. I'm
:42:22. > :42:27.happy about that. I'm happy because I don't think it is right any
:42:27. > :42:30.longer to exclude two people who love each other from an institution.
:42:30. > :42:34.Religious freedom is protected. The churches that don't want to do this
:42:34. > :42:39.won't have to. You say religious freedom is not protected. Churches
:42:39. > :42:43.don't have to agree to it? I don't think that will stand up in law, as
:42:43. > :42:49.a Scottish advocate I would argue that. Can I also say, this is the
:42:49. > :42:52.narrow step along, the first step along a long road, in France they
:42:52. > :42:58.are redefining how you describe wives and husbands and parents can
:42:58. > :43:01.no longer be described as mothers and fathers. Are you really saying
:43:01. > :43:05.that is the outcome of this? It is happening in France and other
:43:05. > :43:08.countries where this law has been passed. It is the law of unintended
:43:08. > :43:13.consequences. I personally believe a loving relationship is one thing,
:43:13. > :43:16.I don't dispute that. But you don't want people to have the same
:43:16. > :43:23.rights? Marriage is very special, you can't rewrite the law.
:43:23. > :43:28.special for you. That it is one man and one woman. Today two eminent
:43:28. > :43:32.QCs told the Times that it was inconceivable to have a legal
:43:32. > :43:36.challenge, because the European Court on human rights protects
:43:36. > :43:41.marriage. Gay marriage has been in the netherlands for over ten years
:43:41. > :43:43.and Spain for seven years, there is no legal challenge successful. It
:43:43. > :43:47.is important for people to understand that the Church of
:43:47. > :43:50.England, the Catholic Church that don't want to do this won't have to.
:43:50. > :43:54.Why shouldn't other religious organisations, like the quakers,
:43:54. > :43:58.liberal Jews, Unitarians do it. concerned are you about a split in
:43:58. > :44:02.the party over this. If it gets through, it won't get through
:44:02. > :44:05.because of Conservative support, it will be because of Liberal Democrat
:44:05. > :44:09.and Labour members support it. Are you disappointed that David Cameron
:44:09. > :44:15.wasn't managed to convince you. He has shown leadership in as much as
:44:15. > :44:19.he has championed sh, but he has not convinced -- championed it, but
:44:19. > :44:22.he has not convinced you? The whole way it is raised is unfortunate. If
:44:22. > :44:25.it was in the general election and we had the opportunity to debate it,
:44:25. > :44:29.if I had the opportunity to explain my view to the electorate, to
:44:29. > :44:35.explain why I stood, then I could have said this is what I was going
:44:35. > :44:39.to do. Is this damaging? David Cameron has made it clear. We did
:44:39. > :44:43.not stand on this in the manifesto, it wasn't in the coalition
:44:43. > :44:46.agreement either, I stood my campaign on the coalition agreement.
:44:46. > :44:50.David Cameron's first speech as party leader to the conference, he
:44:50. > :44:56.made it clear and won applause. He's reflecting the fact that
:44:56. > :44:59.attitudes have changed. These laws do come accepted, Ann voted against
:44:59. > :45:04.civil partnerships when proposed, and now says they are a good thing.
:45:04. > :45:09.Attitudes have changed. Look what Maria Miller said today, she
:45:09. > :45:13.likened this to attitudes, prosive attitudes that her party stands d
:45:13. > :45:17.progressive attitude that is her party stand for, do you accept
:45:17. > :45:19.that? That is completely different. I don't think you can have a
:45:19. > :45:23.marriage physically between anything other than a man and a
:45:23. > :45:28.woman. This could be handled so much better. There is reason to
:45:28. > :45:34.delay. To delay or not do it at all? I stood on the manifesto, we
:45:34. > :45:38.were committed, Nick and I, to introduce tax allowances for
:45:38. > :45:42.married couples, that hasn't gone through, this is proceeding apace,
:45:42. > :45:46.and if there are court cases they will come before the next election.
:45:46. > :45:49.How big a landmark will it be for gay people? It will be incredibly
:45:49. > :45:56.important, it is immensely meaningful, and tomorrow, millions
:45:56. > :46:02.of people will be watching this vote, and asking themselves whether
:46:02. > :46:05.actually Members of Parliament are understanding that we are accepting
:46:05. > :46:15.the place in society. That is all we have time tonight, until
:46:15. > :46:18.
:46:18. > :46:22.we have time tonight, until tomorrow, a very good night.
:46:22. > :46:27.The break from the winter weather was all too short, it is back a
:46:27. > :46:32.cold, icey windy start to Tuesday, some disruptive snow across parts
:46:32. > :46:35.of northern England. The band of snow across the Pennines, an amber
:46:35. > :46:40.warning from the Met Office, be prepared for disruption. For south-
:46:40. > :46:44.east England it is a dry start. Despite the sunshine, colder than
:46:44. > :46:48.recent mornings. Rain and sleet elsewhere, and stormy in Cornwall,
:46:48. > :46:53.gusts overnight of 70 miles an hour. Strengthening again during Tuesday.
:46:53. > :46:56.Watching this area of showers in shout Wales, the valleys with
:46:56. > :47:00.accumulating snow could cause problems in the morning. Icey in
:47:00. > :47:05.Wales. Northern Ireland with fresh snow on the ground, after the
:47:05. > :47:10.showers overnight. Heavy snow showers in Scotland. Blizzards on
:47:10. > :47:16.the hills. The met thofs amber warning here, particularly across -
:47:16. > :47:20.- Met Office amber warning here, particularly across the Highland.
:47:20. > :47:23.No snow settling in the London area it will come later in the day and
:47:23. > :47:27.will fizzle out, it will feel bitterly cold in the strong winds.
:47:27. > :47:30.As for Wednesday, it is an Arctic wind, snow showers more to the east
:47:30. > :47:34.than anywhere else, sunshine on offer. Thursday and Friday, the