01/03/2013

:00:12. > :00:14.Tonight, David Cameron says he will Tonight, David Cameron says he will

:00:14. > :00:14.Tonight, David Cameron says he will Tonight, David Cameron says he will

:00:14. > :00:16.win voters back to his party after win voters back to his party after

:00:16. > :00:17.failing the Eastleigh by-election test.

:00:17. > :00:19.test. test.

:00:19. > :00:20.But does he know how? But does he know how?

:00:20. > :00:21.But does he know how? But does he know how?

:00:21. > :00:23.Nick Clegg says it was a stunning Nick Clegg says it was a stunning

:00:23. > :00:24.Nick Clegg says it was a stunning win for the Liberal Democrats after

:00:24. > :00:25.win for the Liberal Democrats after win for the Liberal Democrats after

:00:25. > :00:26.weeks of dire publicity. But the weeks of dire publicity. But the

:00:26. > :00:29.weeks of dire publicity. But the weeks of dire publicity. But the

:00:29. > :00:30.real winners of the night were the real winners of the night were the

:00:30. > :00:31.real winners of the night were the party that came second. Newsnight

:00:31. > :00:32.party that came second. Newsnight party that came second. Newsnight

:00:32. > :00:33.called the results of this by- called the results of this by-

:00:33. > :00:34.called the results of this by- election first when it was

:00:34. > :00:35.election first when it was election first when it was

:00:35. > :00:37.announced three weeks ago. What we announced three weeks ago. What we

:00:37. > :00:38.announced three weeks ago. What we announced three weeks ago. What we

:00:38. > :00:39.didn't see, but we should have done, didn't see, but we should have done,

:00:39. > :00:41.didn't see, but we should have done, didn't see, but we should have done,

:00:41. > :00:41.UKIP did very well. We have a happy UKIP did very well. We have a happy

:00:41. > :00:43.UKIP did very well. We have a happy UKIP did very well. We have a happy

:00:43. > :00:45.UKIP chairman and a less than happy story MP.

:00:45. > :00:45.story MP. -- Tory MP.

:00:46. > :00:47.-- Tory MP. -- Tory MP.

:00:47. > :00:49.-- Tory MP. Back when he was President, a pound

:00:49. > :00:52.Back when he was President, a pound Back when he was President, a pound

:00:52. > :00:54.Back when he was President, a pound could get you nearly $10, now it is

:00:54. > :00:55.could get you nearly $10, now it is could get you nearly $10, now it is

:00:55. > :00:58.�1.50 -- $1.50 and falling. Our �1.50 -- $1.50 and falling. Our

:00:58. > :00:59.�1.50 -- $1.50 and falling. Our �1.50 -- $1.50 and falling. Our

:00:59. > :01:00.leaders seem happy about it, but is leaders seem happy about it, but is

:01:00. > :01:01.leaders seem happy about it, but is debatching the currency the only

:01:01. > :01:04.debatching the currency the only debatching the currency the only

:01:04. > :01:06.debatching the currency the only way out of the mess. And this.

:01:06. > :01:08.way out of the mess. And this. way out of the mess. And this.

:01:08. > :01:09.Harolds is dumping its piian knows Harolds is dumping its piian knows

:01:09. > :01:11.Harolds is dumping its piian knows because nobody wants to buy them

:01:11. > :01:12.because nobody wants to buy them because nobody wants to buy them

:01:12. > :01:13.because nobody wants to buy them any more. We will be -- pianos,

:01:13. > :01:14.any more. We will be -- pianos, any more. We will be -- pianos,

:01:14. > :01:15.because nobody wants to buy them because nobody wants to buy them

:01:15. > :01:17.because nobody wants to buy them because nobody wants to buy them

:01:17. > :01:27.any more. We will be looking at the any more. We will be looking at the

:01:27. > :01:28.

:01:28. > :01:29.any more. We will be looking at the any more. We will be looking at the

:01:29. > :01:30.Fort tunes of the piano forte. Fort tunes of the piano forte.

:01:30. > :01:31.Fort tunes of the piano forte. The Labour candidate for Eastleigh

:01:31. > :01:32.The Labour candidate for Eastleigh The Labour candidate for Eastleigh

:01:32. > :01:33.The Labour candidate for Eastleigh learned he wasn't to be member of

:01:33. > :01:34.learned he wasn't to be member of learned he wasn't to be member of

:01:34. > :01:36.the parliament, he barely increased the parliament, he barely increased

:01:36. > :01:37.the parliament, he barely increased his party's share at all. The

:01:37. > :01:39.his party's share at all. The Conservative candidate, Maria

:01:39. > :01:40.Conservative candidate, Maria Hutchings, attracted 11,000 fewers

:01:41. > :01:43.Hutchings, attracted 11,000 fewers Hutchings, attracted 11,000 fewers

:01:43. > :01:45.votes than in 2010. Westminster had votes than in 2010. Westminster had

:01:45. > :01:46.votes than in 2010. Westminster had prepared for the impact that this

:01:46. > :01:47.prepared for the impact that this prepared for the impact that this

:01:47. > :01:48.by-election might have on the by-election might have on the

:01:48. > :01:50.by-election might have on the coalition. The result has left it

:01:50. > :01:51.coalition. The result has left it coalition. The result has left it

:01:51. > :01:53.pondering the consequences for the pondering the consequences for the

:01:53. > :01:54.Conservatives, as an electoral Conservatives, as an electoral

:01:54. > :01:55.Conservatives, as an electoral proposition, and for UKIP. In a

:01:55. > :01:56.proposition, and for UKIP. In a proposition, and for UKIP. In a

:01:56. > :01:57.proposition, and for UKIP. In a moment we will discuss what both of

:01:57. > :01:59.moment we will discuss what both of moment we will discuss what both of

:01:59. > :02:00.those parties should take from those parties should take from

:02:00. > :02:04.those parties should take from Eastleigh. But first, here is our

:02:04. > :02:06.political editor. political editor.

:02:06. > :02:08.political editor. political editor.

:02:08. > :02:09.I do here by declare that Mike I do here by declare that Mike

:02:09. > :02:11.I do here by declare that Mike Thornton is duly elected member of

:02:11. > :02:13.Thornton is duly elected member of parliament for Eastleigh.

:02:13. > :02:14.parliament for Eastleigh. parliament for Eastleigh.

:02:14. > :02:16.A rickety stage, assembled in a A rickety stage, assembled in a

:02:16. > :02:17.leisure centre somewhere in leisure centre somewhere in

:02:17. > :02:18.leisure centre somewhere in southern England. But the national

:02:18. > :02:22.southern England. But the national southern England. But the national

:02:22. > :02:23.stage too, a result with relevance. stage too, a result with relevance.

:02:23. > :02:24.stage too, a result with relevance. Extremely healthy victory for the

:02:24. > :02:25.Extremely healthy victory for the Extremely healthy victory for the

:02:25. > :02:27.Lib Dems, proof that the by- Lib Dems, proof that the by-

:02:27. > :02:28.election strategy still works, election strategy still works,

:02:28. > :02:30.election strategy still works, despite being in Government. And

:02:30. > :02:31.despite being in Government. And despite being in Government. And

:02:31. > :02:33.despite being in Government. And indeed that the path may be there

:02:33. > :02:34.indeed that the path may be there indeed that the path may be there

:02:34. > :02:35.for a successful general election for a successful general election

:02:35. > :02:36.campaign. Newsnight called the campaign. Newsnight called the

:02:36. > :02:37.campaign. Newsnight called the result of the by-election when it

:02:37. > :02:38.result of the by-election when it result of the by-election when it

:02:39. > :02:40.was first announced three weeks ago. was first announced three weeks ago.

:02:40. > :02:41.was first announced three weeks ago. was first announced three weeks ago.

:02:41. > :02:42.What we didn't see, what we should What we didn't see, what we should

:02:42. > :02:43.What we didn't see, what we should What we didn't see, what we should

:02:43. > :02:44.have done, is UKIP did very well. have done, is UKIP did very well.

:02:44. > :02:47.have done, is UKIP did very well. Earlier in the night these faces

:02:47. > :02:47.Earlier in the night these faces Earlier in the night these faces

:02:47. > :02:49.had got longer. The Tories had had got longer. The Tories had

:02:49. > :02:51.had got longer. The Tories had thought they could snatch the seat.

:02:51. > :02:51.thought they could snatch the seat. thought they could snatch the seat.

:02:51. > :02:52.Their strategy relied on several Their strategy relied on several

:02:52. > :02:53.elements, that David Cameron elements, that David Cameron

:02:53. > :02:55.elements, that David Cameron appeals as a national leader more

:02:55. > :02:55.appeals as a national leader more appeals as a national leader more

:02:55. > :02:56.appeals as a national leader more than Ed Miliband. But this is less

:02:56. > :02:57.than Ed Miliband. But this is less than Ed Miliband. But this is less

:02:57. > :03:00.easy to argue in a by-election, easy to argue in a by-election,

:03:00. > :03:01.easy to argue in a by-election, when the results don't affect a

:03:01. > :03:02.when the results don't affect a national Government. There is

:03:02. > :03:03.national Government. There is national Government. There is

:03:03. > :03:04.another factor. Even though the another factor. Even though the

:03:04. > :03:06.another factor. Even though the another factor. Even though the

:03:06. > :03:08.Tories tried to hit the Lib Dems on Tories tried to hit the Lib Dems on

:03:08. > :03:09.their weaknesses, immigration, their weaknesses, immigration,

:03:09. > :03:10.their weaknesses, immigration, welfare and Europe, another party

:03:10. > :03:13.welfare and Europe, another party welfare and Europe, another party

:03:13. > :03:17.may have scooped those votes, UKIP. may have scooped those votes, UKIP.

:03:17. > :03:19.may have scooped those votes, UKIP. UKIP did better in Eastleigh than

:03:19. > :03:20.UKIP did better in Eastleigh than UKIP did better in Eastleigh than

:03:20. > :03:21.three months before in Rotherham. three months before in Rotherham.

:03:21. > :03:22.three months before in Rotherham. Research published by Lord Ashcroft

:03:22. > :03:23.Research published by Lord Ashcroft Research published by Lord Ashcroft

:03:23. > :03:24.revealed what Newsnight had seen revealed what Newsnight had seen

:03:24. > :03:25.revealed what Newsnight had seen throughout the contest, that UKIP

:03:25. > :03:27.throughout the contest, that UKIP throughout the contest, that UKIP

:03:27. > :03:28.was attracting votes from all the was attracting votes from all the

:03:28. > :03:30.was attracting votes from all the other three parties. Tonight I

:03:30. > :03:30.other three parties. Tonight I don't think anyone should

:03:30. > :03:34.don't think anyone should don't think anyone should

:03:34. > :03:36.underestimate what we have achieved. underestimate what we have achieved.

:03:36. > :03:37.underestimate what we have achieved. We have come second, and pushed

:03:37. > :03:40.We have come second, and pushed We have come second, and pushed

:03:40. > :03:44.Labour back into the position we Labour back into the position we

:03:44. > :03:45.Labour back into the position we Labour back into the position we

:03:45. > :03:47.were in 2010. There is only a were in 2010. There is only a

:03:47. > :03:48.were in 2010. There is only a couple of hundred votes accept

:03:48. > :03:48.couple of hundred votes accept couple of hundred votes accept

:03:48. > :03:49.rating us from the Liberal rating us from the Liberal

:03:49. > :03:50.rating us from the Liberal Democrats. We have made an

:03:50. > :03:51.Democrats. We have made an outstanding impression this evening

:03:51. > :03:53.outstanding impression this evening outstanding impression this evening

:03:53. > :03:54.outstanding impression this evening and with the voters, and I see that

:03:54. > :03:55.and with the voters, and I see that and with the voters, and I see that

:03:55. > :03:56.being replicated next time round being replicated next time round

:03:56. > :03:57.being replicated next time round easily. At the general election?

:03:58. > :03:58.easily. At the general election? easily. At the general election?

:03:58. > :03:59.Absolutely. Voters could switch to Absolutely. Voters could switch to

:03:59. > :04:00.Absolutely. Voters could switch to UKIP on this occasion because it

:04:00. > :04:02.UKIP on this occasion because it UKIP on this occasion because it

:04:02. > :04:04.would not change who is Prime would not change who is Prime

:04:04. > :04:05.would not change who is Prime Minister right now. And, even if

:04:05. > :04:07.Minister right now. And, even if Minister right now. And, even if

:04:07. > :04:08.UKIP voters were defiant last night, UKIP voters were defiant last night,

:04:08. > :04:10.UKIP voters were defiant last night, that may not last. Lord Ashcroft

:04:10. > :04:11.that may not last. Lord Ashcroft that may not last. Lord Ashcroft

:04:11. > :04:11.that may not last. Lord Ashcroft shows that a third of his sample

:04:11. > :04:12.shows that a third of his sample shows that a third of his sample

:04:12. > :04:15.shows that a third of his sample have no idea how they will vote in

:04:15. > :04:16.have no idea how they will vote in a general election. UKIP,

:04:16. > :04:17.a general election. UKIP, traditionally their support has

:04:17. > :04:18.traditionally their support has traditionally their support has

:04:18. > :04:19.mostly come from the Conservative mostly come from the Conservative

:04:19. > :04:19.mostly come from the Conservative mostly come from the Conservative

:04:19. > :04:22.Party, they also took Lib Dem votes, Party, they also took Lib Dem votes,

:04:22. > :04:23.Party, they also took Lib Dem votes, and in the by-elections recently in

:04:23. > :04:24.and in the by-elections recently in and in the by-elections recently in

:04:24. > :04:24.Rotherham and Barnsley, we have Rotherham and Barnsley, we have

:04:24. > :04:26.Rotherham and Barnsley, we have Rotherham and Barnsley, we have

:04:26. > :04:28.seen them take a lot of support seen them take a lot of support

:04:28. > :04:29.seen them take a lot of support from Labour too. They can genuinely

:04:29. > :04:30.from Labour too. They can genuinely from Labour too. They can genuinely

:04:30. > :04:31.appeal from people people from all appeal from people people from all

:04:31. > :04:33.appeal from people people from all appeal from people people from all

:04:33. > :04:34.parties. As a threat their mostly a parties. As a threat their mostly a

:04:34. > :04:36.threat to the Conservatives. threat to the Conservatives.

:04:36. > :04:38.threat to the Conservatives. Because their support tends to be

:04:38. > :04:40.Because their support tends to be Because their support tends to be

:04:40. > :04:41.older, middle-class men, people who older, middle-class men, people who

:04:41. > :04:42.older, middle-class men, people who would otherwise vote Tory. But it

:04:42. > :04:44.would otherwise vote Tory. But it would otherwise vote Tory. But it

:04:44. > :04:46.would otherwise vote Tory. But it is not exclusive, and as a protest

:04:46. > :04:47.is not exclusive, and as a protest is not exclusive, and as a protest

:04:47. > :04:48.group, their protest vote, which is group, their protest vote, which is

:04:48. > :04:50.group, their protest vote, which is group, their protest vote, which is

:04:50. > :04:52.what we are seeing at the moment, what we are seeing at the moment,

:04:52. > :04:54.what we are seeing at the moment, what we are seeing at the moment,

:04:54. > :04:55.is across the board. Do you blame is across the board. Do you blame

:04:55. > :04:56.is across the board. Do you blame the coalition Government? The Tory

:04:56. > :04:58.the coalition Government? The Tory the coalition Government? The Tory

:04:58. > :05:00.the coalition Government? The Tory candidate was tossed about the in -

:05:00. > :05:01.candidate was tossed about the in - candidate was tossed about the in -

:05:01. > :05:03.candidate was tossed about the in - - in the feeding frenzy. Some are

:05:03. > :05:03.- in the feeding frenzy. Some are - in the feeding frenzy. Some are

:05:03. > :05:04.wondering whether a more moderate wondering whether a more moderate

:05:04. > :05:05.wondering whether a more moderate wondering whether a more moderate

:05:05. > :05:07.Tory would have given the Lib Dems Tory would have given the Lib Dems

:05:07. > :05:09.Tory would have given the Lib Dems Tory would have given the Lib Dems

:05:09. > :05:10.a run for their money. Some believe a run for their money. Some believe

:05:10. > :05:13.a run for their money. Some believe the anti-gay marriage and anti-

:05:13. > :05:16.the anti-gay marriage and anti- the anti-gay marriage and anti-

:05:16. > :05:16.Europe Hutchings should have been Europe Hutchings should have been

:05:16. > :05:18.Europe Hutchings should have been Europe Hutchings should have been

:05:18. > :05:19.able to out-UKIP UKIP. It is a by- able to out-UKIP UKIP. It is a by-

:05:19. > :05:21.able to out-UKIP UKIP. It is a by- election, it is disappointing for

:05:21. > :05:21.election, it is disappointing for election, it is disappointing for

:05:22. > :05:22.the Conservative Party, we must the Conservative Party, we must

:05:22. > :05:23.the Conservative Party, we must remain true to our principles and

:05:23. > :05:25.remain true to our principles and remain true to our principles and

:05:25. > :05:27.remain true to our principles and course, and we can win people back.

:05:27. > :05:28.course, and we can win people back. Another surprise to Labour's

:05:28. > :05:29.Another surprise to Labour's detriment, many had assumed

:05:29. > :05:30.detriment, many had assumed detriment, many had assumed

:05:30. > :05:31.tactical voting would end, and tactical voting would end, and

:05:31. > :05:32.tactical voting would end, and tactical voting would end, and

:05:32. > :05:34.those who had voted Lib Dem to keep those who had voted Lib Dem to keep

:05:34. > :05:36.those who had voted Lib Dem to keep the Tories out, would return to

:05:36. > :05:37.the Tories out, would return to the Tories out, would return to

:05:37. > :05:38.Labour. But they didn't. Clearly I Labour. But they didn't. Clearly I

:05:39. > :05:39.Labour. But they didn't. Clearly I would have preferred to get more

:05:39. > :05:40.would have preferred to get more would have preferred to get more

:05:40. > :05:41.would have preferred to get more votes than we Z this was always

:05:41. > :05:41.votes than we Z this was always votes than we Z this was always

:05:41. > :05:42.votes than we Z this was always going to be a tough fight for

:05:42. > :05:43.going to be a tough fight for going to be a tough fight for

:05:44. > :05:45.going to be a tough fight for Labour. It is a seat we have never

:05:45. > :05:45.Labour. It is a seat we have never Labour. It is a seat we have never

:05:45. > :05:47.Labour. It is a seat we have never won. But all it convinced me of, is

:05:47. > :05:48.won. But all it convinced me of, is won. But all it convinced me of, is

:05:48. > :05:49.won. But all it convinced me of, is we need to redouble our efforts to

:05:49. > :05:49.we need to redouble our efforts to we need to redouble our efforts to

:05:49. > :05:51.we need to redouble our efforts to reach out to every part of the

:05:51. > :05:52.reach out to every part of the country, including areas where

:05:52. > :05:56.country, including areas where Labour hasn't traditionally been

:05:56. > :05:57.strong. strong.

:05:57. > :05:59.strong. On polling day, the Liberal

:05:59. > :06:00.On polling day, the Liberal On polling day, the Liberal

:06:00. > :06:02.Democrats say they phoned 120 Democrats say they phoned 120

:06:02. > :06:04.Democrats say they phoned 120 people a minute. Over the three

:06:04. > :06:06.people a minute. Over the three people a minute. Over the three

:06:06. > :06:07.weeks, they say they made 130,000 weeks, they say they made 130,000

:06:07. > :06:08.weeks, they say they made 130,000 weeks, they say they made 130,000

:06:08. > :06:10.phone calls. This has been a by- phone calls. This has been a by-

:06:10. > :06:11.phone calls. This has been a by- phone calls. This has been a by-

:06:11. > :06:14.election we have had to fight in exceptionally difficult

:06:14. > :06:15.exceptionally difficult circumstances. Our opponents have

:06:15. > :06:17.circumstances. Our opponents have circumstances. Our opponents have

:06:17. > :06:18.thrown everything at us. We held thrown everything at us. We held

:06:18. > :06:19.thrown everything at us. We held thrown everything at us. We held

:06:19. > :06:21.our nerve, we stood our grand, we our nerve, we stood our grand, we

:06:21. > :06:23.our nerve, we stood our grand, we our nerve, we stood our grand, we

:06:23. > :06:24.worked as a team, we went out and worked as a team, we went out and

:06:24. > :06:25.worked as a team, we went out and calmed on every doorstep, we

:06:25. > :06:31.calmed on every doorstep, we calmed on every doorstep, we

:06:31. > :06:32.overcame the odds and won a stunning victory.

:06:32. > :06:33.stunning victory. stunning victory.

:06:33. > :06:34.stunning victory. The Lib Dem leader has dragged us

:06:34. > :06:35.The Lib Dem leader has dragged us The Lib Dem leader has dragged us

:06:35. > :06:40.The Lib Dem leader has dragged us all here at dawn to watch him

:06:40. > :06:40.all here at dawn to watch him all here at dawn to watch him

:06:40. > :06:41.Government his party's power is not Government his party's power is not

:06:41. > :06:42.Government his party's power is not diminish. But the trouble for the

:06:42. > :06:44.diminish. But the trouble for the diminish. But the trouble for the

:06:44. > :06:46.Government is that a by-election Government is that a by-election

:06:46. > :06:47.Government is that a by-election Government is that a by-election

:06:47. > :06:49.victory is not a zero-sum game, Lib victory is not a zero-sum game, Lib

:06:49. > :06:50.victory is not a zero-sum game, Lib Dem joy equals Tory pain.

:06:50. > :06:51.Dem joy equals Tory pain. Dem joy equals Tory pain.

:06:51. > :06:52.Dem joy equals Tory pain. The Lib Dems won 32% of Thursday's

:06:52. > :06:53.The Lib Dems won 32% of Thursday's The Lib Dems won 32% of Thursday's

:06:53. > :06:55.The Lib Dems won 32% of Thursday's vote, but it was quite a bit down

:06:55. > :06:56.vote, but it was quite a bit down vote, but it was quite a bit down

:06:56. > :06:56.vote, but it was quite a bit down on their result in 2010, so Nick

:06:56. > :06:58.on their result in 2010, so Nick on their result in 2010, so Nick

:06:58. > :06:59.on their result in 2010, so Nick Clegg is far from sure of keeping

:06:59. > :07:01.Clegg is far from sure of keeping Clegg is far from sure of keeping

:07:01. > :07:01.Clegg is far from sure of keeping all his seats in 2015. But, his

:07:02. > :07:02.all his seats in 2015. But, his all his seats in 2015. But, his

:07:02. > :07:04.strategy at least appears to have strategy at least appears to have

:07:04. > :07:04.strategy at least appears to have held together. The same can't be

:07:04. > :07:05.held together. The same can't be held together. The same can't be

:07:05. > :07:07.held together. The same can't be said for the Prime Minister, and it

:07:07. > :07:08.said for the Prime Minister, and it said for the Prime Minister, and it

:07:08. > :07:08.said for the Prime Minister, and it can't really be said for the leader

:07:08. > :07:09.can't really be said for the leader can't really be said for the leader

:07:09. > :07:10.can't really be said for the leader of the Labour Party. It is Nick

:07:10. > :07:11.of the Labour Party. It is Nick of the Labour Party. It is Nick

:07:11. > :07:12.Clegg that goes into his spring Clegg that goes into his spring

:07:12. > :07:12.Clegg that goes into his spring party conference next weekend, with

:07:12. > :07:16.party conference next weekend, with party conference next weekend, with

:07:16. > :07:18.party conference next weekend, with a bit of a bounce in his step.

:07:18. > :07:20.a bit of a bounce in his step. a bit of a bounce in his step.

:07:20. > :07:21.a bit of a bounce in his step. With me now is the UKIP chairman,

:07:21. > :07:26.With me now is the UKIP chairman, Steve Crowther, and the

:07:26. > :07:27.Conservative MP. Conservative MP.

:07:27. > :07:28.Conservative MP. Conservative MP.

:07:28. > :07:29.I have to ask you, David Cameron I have to ask you, David Cameron

:07:29. > :07:30.I have to ask you, David Cameron gave a very important speech on

:07:30. > :07:32.gave a very important speech on gave a very important speech on

:07:32. > :07:34.Europe, a very important commitment Europe, a very important commitment

:07:34. > :07:36.Europe, a very important commitment to give a referendum on EU

:07:37. > :07:38.to give a referendum on EU membership. It hasn't worked,

:07:38. > :07:39.membership. It hasn't worked, membership. It hasn't worked,

:07:39. > :07:41.wasn't that precisely to stop wasn't that precisely to stop

:07:41. > :07:42.wasn't that precisely to stop wasn't that precisely to stop

:07:42. > :07:43.things like this? I think if we things like this? I think if we

:07:43. > :07:45.things like this? I think if we look at the whole perspective, then

:07:45. > :07:46.look at the whole perspective, then look at the whole perspective, then

:07:46. > :07:47.this was a mid-term by-election, this was a mid-term by-election,

:07:47. > :07:49.this was a mid-term by-election, whilst it was disappointing with

:07:49. > :07:50.whilst it was disappointing with the Conservatives, the whole

:07:50. > :07:51.the Conservatives, the whole the Conservatives, the whole

:07:51. > :07:53.perspective is that for decades and perspective is that for decades and

:07:53. > :07:54.hundreds of by-elections, the hundreds of by-elections, the

:07:54. > :07:55.hundreds of by-elections, the governing party always has a

:07:55. > :07:56.governing party always has a governing party always has a

:07:56. > :07:57.backlash. And there is always a backlash. And there is always a

:07:58. > :07:58.backlash. And there is always a backlash. And there is always a

:07:58. > :07:59.protest vote, and it is in this protest vote, and it is in this

:07:59. > :08:00.protest vote, and it is in this instance that protest vote went to

:08:00. > :08:02.instance that protest vote went to instance that protest vote went to

:08:02. > :08:02.UKIP. You were expecting to come UKIP. You were expecting to come

:08:03. > :08:03.UKIP. You were expecting to come UKIP. You were expecting to come

:08:03. > :08:04.third? No, we did as best as we third? No, we did as best as we

:08:04. > :08:05.third? No, we did as best as we third? No, we did as best as we

:08:05. > :08:06.could. This is a bad result?I could. This is a bad result?I

:08:06. > :08:07.could. This is a bad result?I could. This is a bad result?I

:08:07. > :08:08.think if you look at the poll think if you look at the poll

:08:08. > :08:09.think if you look at the poll conducted by Lord Ashcroft, which

:08:09. > :08:11.conducted by Lord Ashcroft, which conducted by Lord Ashcroft, which

:08:11. > :08:12.you referred to earlier on. That you referred to earlier on. That

:08:12. > :08:13.you referred to earlier on. That you referred to earlier on. That

:08:13. > :08:14.same poll found that many of the same poll found that many of the

:08:14. > :08:15.same poll found that many of the people who voted Ford UKIP would

:08:15. > :08:16.people who voted Ford UKIP would people who voted Ford UKIP would

:08:16. > :08:18.people who voted Ford UKIP would have, if this had been a general

:08:18. > :08:19.have, if this had been a general election, voted for the

:08:19. > :08:20.election, voted for the Conservatives. And Maria Hutchings

:08:20. > :08:20.Conservatives. And Maria Hutchings Conservatives. And Maria Hutchings

:08:20. > :08:21.would have comfortably become the would have comfortably become the

:08:21. > :08:22.would have comfortably become the would have comfortably become the

:08:22. > :08:23.member of parliament. So I think it member of parliament. So I think it

:08:24. > :08:25.member of parliament. So I think it is important to put into

:08:25. > :08:26.is important to put into is important to put into

:08:26. > :08:27.perspective, that since the Second perspective, that since the Second

:08:27. > :08:28.perspective, that since the Second perspective, that since the Second

:08:28. > :08:29.World War, there have been 485 by- World War, there have been 485 by-

:08:29. > :08:30.World War, there have been 485 by- elections, and the governing party

:08:30. > :08:31.elections, and the governing party elections, and the governing party

:08:31. > :08:33.has only won four elections. The has only won four elections. The

:08:33. > :08:34.has only won four elections. The has only won four elections. The

:08:34. > :08:34.last one was in 1982 during the last one was in 1982 during the

:08:34. > :08:35.last one was in 1982 during the last one was in 1982 during the

:08:35. > :08:36.Falklands War. But you heard in all Falklands War. But you heard in all

:08:36. > :08:37.Falklands War. But you heard in all the coverage we have had from

:08:37. > :08:37.the coverage we have had from the coverage we have had from

:08:37. > :08:39.Eastleigh, especially in the last Eastleigh, especially in the last

:08:39. > :08:39.Eastleigh, especially in the last Eastleigh, especially in the last

:08:39. > :08:40.few days, and even in the decision few days, and even in the decision

:08:40. > :08:41.few days, and even in the decision few days, and even in the decision

:08:41. > :08:43.to give that speech, there is a to give that speech, there is a

:08:43. > :08:44.to give that speech, there is a recognition that there is something

:08:44. > :08:45.recognition that there is something recognition that there is something

:08:45. > :08:46.about UKIP which is appealing to about UKIP which is appealing to

:08:46. > :08:47.about UKIP which is appealing to the Conservative core vote. You

:08:48. > :08:49.the Conservative core vote. You the Conservative core vote. You

:08:49. > :08:50.the Conservative core vote. You surely now do have to accept that?.

:08:50. > :08:51.surely now do have to accept that?. surely now do have to accept that?.

:08:52. > :08:53.Kip have two main issues, Kip have two main issues,

:08:53. > :08:54.Kip have two main issues, immigration and the European Union.

:08:54. > :08:55.immigration and the European Union. immigration and the European Union.

:08:55. > :08:55.-- UKIP have two main issues, -- UKIP have two main issues,

:08:55. > :08:57.-- UKIP have two main issues, immigration and the European Union.

:08:57. > :08:58.immigration and the European Union. immigration and the European Union.

:08:58. > :08:59.immigration and the European Union. We have to make sure our message is

:08:59. > :09:01.We have to make sure our message is more effectively communicated to

:09:01. > :09:03.more effectively communicated to more effectively communicated to

:09:03. > :09:04.the public. On immigration the the public. On immigration the

:09:04. > :09:04.figures published yesterday showed figures published yesterday showed

:09:04. > :09:05.figures published yesterday showed that the net immigration figure is

:09:05. > :09:07.that the net immigration figure is that the net immigration figure is

:09:07. > :09:08.that the net immigration figure is down by a third, since the general

:09:08. > :09:09.down by a third, since the general down by a third, since the general

:09:09. > :09:10.election. And on the European Union election. And on the European Union

:09:10. > :09:12.election. And on the European Union we have promised an in-out

:09:12. > :09:13.we have promised an in-out we have promised an in-out

:09:13. > :09:15.referendum on a reformed Europe. referendum on a reformed Europe.

:09:15. > :09:16.referendum on a reformed Europe. referendum on a reformed Europe.

:09:16. > :09:17.Also, but we need to make sure that Also, but we need to make sure that

:09:17. > :09:18.Also, but we need to make sure that the public really take that on

:09:18. > :09:19.the public really take that on the public really take that on

:09:19. > :09:20.the public really take that on board. I come back to the original

:09:20. > :09:21.board. I come back to the original board. I come back to the original

:09:21. > :09:22.board. I come back to the original point, that people voted by way of

:09:22. > :09:22.point, that people voted by way of point, that people voted by way of

:09:22. > :09:23.point, that people voted by way of protest, they are not happy with us.

:09:23. > :09:25.protest, they are not happy with us. protest, they are not happy with us.

:09:25. > :09:26.protest, they are not happy with us. We have had to take a number of

:09:26. > :09:27.We have had to take a number of difficult decisions. You have

:09:27. > :09:28.difficult decisions. You have accepted there something that

:09:28. > :09:29.accepted there something that accepted there something that

:09:29. > :09:30.others have said today, which is others have said today, which is

:09:30. > :09:31.others have said today, which is that the Conservatives are not

:09:31. > :09:32.that the Conservatives are not that the Conservatives are not

:09:32. > :09:34.letting their message get across. letting their message get across.

:09:34. > :09:35.letting their message get across. letting their message get across.

:09:35. > :09:36.The message, he says, was blunt? The message, he says, was blunt?

:09:36. > :09:37.The message, he says, was blunt? The message, he says, was blunt?

:09:37. > :09:38.accept that the message we have to accept that the message we have to

:09:38. > :09:38.accept that the message we have to accept that the message we have to

:09:38. > :09:40.convey to the public has to be convey to the public has to be

:09:40. > :09:41.convey to the public has to be convey to the public has to be

:09:41. > :09:42.conveyed better than it has been so conveyed better than it has been so

:09:42. > :09:43.conveyed better than it has been so conveyed better than it has been so

:09:43. > :09:44.far. But that's not to say that far. But that's not to say that

:09:44. > :09:45.far. But that's not to say that this was a by-election, mid-term,

:09:46. > :09:47.this was a by-election, mid-term, this was a by-election, mid-term,

:09:47. > :09:48.this was a by-election, mid-term, and the results should not be a

:09:48. > :09:48.and the results should not be a and the results should not be a

:09:48. > :09:50.surprise, given that there have surprise, given that there have

:09:50. > :09:51.surprise, given that there have been so many hundreds of by-

:09:51. > :09:52.been so many hundreds of by- elections in similar circumstances,

:09:52. > :09:54.elections in similar circumstances, elections in similar circumstances,

:09:54. > :09:55.where they have always gone against where they have always gone against

:09:55. > :09:56.where they have always gone against the governing party. Doesn't he

:09:56. > :09:57.the governing party. Doesn't he the governing party. Doesn't he

:09:57. > :09:58.have a point, Steve Crowther? When have a point, Steve Crowther? When

:09:58. > :09:59.have a point, Steve Crowther? When have a point, Steve Crowther? When

:09:59. > :09:59.you look at the swing against the you look at the swing against the

:09:59. > :10:01.you look at the swing against the governing party in by-elections in

:10:01. > :10:02.governing party in by-elections in governing party in by-elections in

:10:02. > :10:03.governing party in by-elections in the last 30 years, this one doesn't

:10:03. > :10:04.the last 30 years, this one doesn't the last 30 years, this one doesn't

:10:04. > :10:04.the last 30 years, this one doesn't figure in the top ten. This is a

:10:05. > :10:06.figure in the top ten. This is a classic by-election protest?

:10:06. > :10:08.classic by-election protest? classic by-election protest?

:10:08. > :10:09.don't agree at all. Obviously the don't agree at all. Obviously the

:10:09. > :10:10.don't agree at all. Obviously the other three major parties are

:10:10. > :10:10.other three major parties are other three major parties are

:10:10. > :10:11.extraordinary keen to classify it extraordinary keen to classify it

:10:11. > :10:12.extraordinary keen to classify it as a classic by-election protest.

:10:12. > :10:13.as a classic by-election protest. as a classic by-election protest.

:10:13. > :10:15.as a classic by-election protest. But there has never been one like

:10:15. > :10:16.But there has never been one like But there has never been one like

:10:16. > :10:19.But there has never been one like this. This is a fourth party coming

:10:19. > :10:20.this. This is a fourth party coming this. This is a fourth party coming

:10:20. > :10:22.from behind, and inserting itself from behind, and inserting itself

:10:22. > :10:27.from behind, and inserting itself very thoroughly into a marginal

:10:27. > :10:29.very thoroughly into a marginal very thoroughly into a marginal

:10:29. > :10:30.contest. It is not like...An Exit contest. It is not like...An Exit

:10:30. > :10:31.contest. It is not like...An Exit contest. It is not like...An Exit

:10:31. > :10:32.poll that says 10% of people were poll that says 10% of people were

:10:32. > :10:33.poll that says 10% of people were poll that says 10% of people were

:10:33. > :10:34.planning to vote for UKIP in the planning to vote for UKIP in the

:10:34. > :10:35.planning to vote for UKIP in the planning to vote for UKIP in the

:10:35. > :10:37.next election? 58% said it was part next election? 58% said it was part

:10:37. > :10:37.next election? 58% said it was part of their thinking. And part of

:10:37. > :10:38.of their thinking. And part of of their thinking. And part of

:10:38. > :10:39.their thinking for voting UKIP is their thinking for voting UKIP is

:10:39. > :10:40.their thinking for voting UKIP is their thinking for voting UKIP is

:10:40. > :10:42.they would like us to form a they would like us to form a

:10:42. > :10:43.they would like us to form a Government. The point s we actually

:10:43. > :10:43.Government. The point s we actually Government. The point s we actually

:10:43. > :10:45.Government. The point s we actually stood. What share of the vote do

:10:45. > :10:45.stood. What share of the vote do stood. What share of the vote do

:10:45. > :10:46.you think UKIP will get at you think UKIP will get at

:10:46. > :10:48.you think UKIP will get at Eastleigh at the time of the

:10:48. > :10:49.Eastleigh at the time of the general election? I couldn't

:10:49. > :10:51.general election? I couldn't general election? I couldn't

:10:51. > :10:53.possibly comment. Over 20% like possibly comment. Over 20% like

:10:53. > :10:54.possibly comment. Over 20% like yesterday? Yes. Why not? We fought

:10:54. > :10:55.yesterday? Yes. Why not? We fought yesterday? Yes. Why not? We fought

:10:55. > :10:57.Eastleigh on issues, we didn't Eastleigh on issues, we didn't

:10:57. > :10:58.Eastleigh on issues, we didn't fight, this protest vote thing is

:10:58. > :10:59.fight, this protest vote thing is fight, this protest vote thing is

:10:59. > :11:01.all about convenient, old thinking, all about convenient, old thinking,

:11:01. > :11:02.all about convenient, old thinking, about how to explain away success

:11:02. > :11:03.about how to explain away success about how to explain away success

:11:03. > :11:05.about how to explain away success for a third party during the mid-

:11:05. > :11:06.for a third party during the mid- for a third party during the mid-

:11:06. > :11:06.term for Government. Or indeed an term for Government. Or indeed an

:11:07. > :11:08.term for Government. Or indeed an opposition during the mid-term for

:11:08. > :11:12.opposition during the mid-term for opposition during the mid-term for

:11:12. > :11:13.Government. It is about the issue, Government. It is about the issue,

:11:13. > :11:14.Government. It is about the issue, Government. It is about the issue,

:11:14. > :11:15.and your big issue is Europe. What and your big issue is Europe. What

:11:15. > :11:16.and your big issue is Europe. What the great success has achieved with

:11:17. > :11:18.the great success has achieved with the great success has achieved with

:11:18. > :11:21.the great success has achieved with this result is to make sure the one

:11:21. > :11:22.this result is to make sure the one this result is to make sure the one

:11:22. > :11:26.pro-European Lib Dem was replaced pro-European Lib Dem was replaced

:11:26. > :11:27.pro-European Lib Dem was replaced by another pro-European Lib Dem

:11:27. > :11:29.by another pro-European Lib Dem by another pro-European Lib Dem

:11:29. > :11:29.politician? It was not Europe, but politician? It was not Europe, but

:11:29. > :11:30.politician? It was not Europe, but one of the consequences of the

:11:31. > :11:32.one of the consequences of the one of the consequences of the

:11:32. > :11:34.membership of the European Union, membership of the European Union,

:11:34. > :11:35.which is the transitional which is the transitional

:11:35. > :11:37.which is the transitional which is the transitional

:11:37. > :11:38.arrangements at the end of the year arrangements at the end of the year

:11:38. > :11:39.arrangements at the end of the year to allow Bulgarian and Romanian

:11:39. > :11:40.to allow Bulgarian and Romanian to allow Bulgarian and Romanian

:11:40. > :11:41.citizen to come to this country. citizen to come to this country.

:11:41. > :11:42.citizen to come to this country. That is an issue resonating not

:11:42. > :11:43.That is an issue resonating not That is an issue resonating not

:11:43. > :11:44.That is an issue resonating not just in Eastleigh but all over the

:11:44. > :11:45.just in Eastleigh but all over the just in Eastleigh but all over the

:11:45. > :11:46.just in Eastleigh but all over the country. You helped an MP win that

:11:46. > :11:47.country. You helped an MP win that country. You helped an MP win that

:11:47. > :11:48.doesn't agree with you on that doesn't agree with you on that

:11:48. > :11:49.doesn't agree with you on that doesn't agree with you on that

:11:49. > :11:50.either? We have to make our case. either? We have to make our case.

:11:50. > :11:51.either? We have to make our case. either? We have to make our case.

:11:51. > :11:52.All of the other major parties are All of the other major parties are

:11:52. > :11:53.All of the other major parties are All of the other major parties are

:11:53. > :11:54.not making the case. They are all not making the case. They are all

:11:54. > :11:55.not making the case. They are all not making the case. They are all

:11:55. > :11:56.sitting in the same space, they are sitting in the same space, they are

:11:56. > :11:57.sitting in the same space, they are sitting in the same space, they are

:11:57. > :11:58.all saying, yes it is a shai. The all saying, yes it is a shai. The

:11:58. > :11:58.Liberal Democrats aren't saying, Liberal Democrats aren't saying,

:11:59. > :11:59.Liberal Democrats aren't saying, that the Conservatives are saying

:11:59. > :12:02.that the Conservatives are saying that the Conservatives are saying

:12:02. > :12:03.that the Conservatives are saying that the Conservatives are saying

:12:03. > :12:05.it is a bit of a shame, and we wish it is a bit of a shame, and we wish

:12:05. > :12:06.it is a bit of a shame, and we wish we could do something about T

:12:06. > :12:06.we could do something about T we could do something about T

:12:06. > :12:07.we could do something about T Theresa May said she wish it is

:12:07. > :12:08.Theresa May said she wish it is Theresa May said she wish it is

:12:08. > :12:09.wouldn't happen but there is wouldn't happen but there is

:12:09. > :12:13.wouldn't happen but there is wouldn't happen but there is

:12:13. > :12:15.nothing she could do about it. Eric nothing she could do about it. Eric

:12:15. > :12:16.nothing she could do about it. Eric Picks -- pickles said people would

:12:16. > :12:17.Picks -- pickles said people would Picks -- pickles said people would

:12:17. > :12:17.Picks -- pickles said people would be coming but he doesn't know how

:12:17. > :12:19.be coming but he doesn't know how be coming but he doesn't know how

:12:19. > :12:20.many. That is the biggest thing many. That is the biggest thing

:12:20. > :12:22.many. That is the biggest thing happening on the doorstep. They did

:12:22. > :12:23.happening on the doorstep. They did happening on the doorstep. They did

:12:23. > :12:24.happening on the doorstep. They did catch on to something? UKIP are an

:12:24. > :12:24.catch on to something? UKIP are an catch on to something? UKIP are an

:12:24. > :12:25.opportunistic party. They say all opportunistic party. They say all

:12:25. > :12:26.opportunistic party. They say all opportunistic party. They say all

:12:26. > :12:28.the things that people want to hear. the things that people want to hear.

:12:28. > :12:29.the things that people want to hear. the things that people want to hear.

:12:29. > :12:30.But the people out there, they also But the people out there, they also

:12:30. > :12:31.But the people out there, they also But the people out there, they also

:12:31. > :12:32.want to, but the other thing is want to, but the other thing is

:12:32. > :12:32.want to, but the other thing is want to, but the other thing is

:12:33. > :12:33.they may hear the right things, but they may hear the right things, but

:12:33. > :12:34.they may hear the right things, but they don't hear the solution. What

:12:34. > :12:35.they don't hear the solution. What they don't hear the solution. What

:12:35. > :12:36.they don't hear the solution. What we are trying to do is take the

:12:36. > :12:37.we are trying to do is take the we are trying to do is take the

:12:37. > :12:38.tough decision that is are required. tough decision that is are required.

:12:38. > :12:39.tough decision that is are required. tough decision that is are required.

:12:39. > :12:41.We have now got the worst economic We have now got the worst economic

:12:41. > :12:42.We have now got the worst economic situation that we have had for

:12:42. > :12:43.situation that we have had for situation that we have had for

:12:43. > :12:44.situation that we have had for decades, we have had to take some

:12:44. > :12:45.decades, we have had to take some decades, we have had to take some

:12:45. > :12:46.tough decision. UKIP will talk tough decision. UKIP will talk

:12:46. > :12:47.tough decision. UKIP will talk about immigration and Europe, but

:12:47. > :12:50.about immigration and Europe, but about immigration and Europe, but

:12:50. > :12:51.they won't talk about reducing the they won't talk about reducing the

:12:51. > :12:52.deficit. Creating employment they deficit. Creating employment they

:12:53. > :12:54.deficit. Creating employment they won't talk about the welfare state,

:12:54. > :12:55.won't talk about the welfare state, won't talk about the welfare state,

:12:55. > :12:55.which is just mushrooming under which is just mushrooming under

:12:55. > :12:57.which is just mushrooming under Labour. You will have to think

:12:57. > :12:58.Labour. You will have to think Labour. You will have to think

:12:58. > :12:59.about a pact, aren't you? Isn't about a pact, aren't you? Isn't

:12:59. > :13:01.about a pact, aren't you? Isn't about a pact, aren't you? Isn't

:13:01. > :13:01.that the tough decision you have to that the tough decision you have to

:13:01. > :13:04.that the tough decision you have to think about? We won't be talking

:13:04. > :13:06.think about? We won't be talking think about? We won't be talking

:13:06. > :13:09.about pacts here. Your vote was about pacts here. Your vote was

:13:09. > :13:09.consumately split yesterday? consumately split yesterday?

:13:09. > :13:11.consumately split yesterday? records shows since the Second

:13:11. > :13:13.records shows since the Second records shows since the Second

:13:13. > :13:14.World War that governing parties World War that governing parties

:13:14. > :13:16.World War that governing parties always have a backlash, save for

:13:16. > :13:16.always have a backlash, save for always have a backlash, save for

:13:16. > :13:17.always have a backlash, save for four elections out of 485. You are

:13:17. > :13:18.four elections out of 485. You are four elections out of 485. You are

:13:18. > :13:19.four elections out of 485. You are not going to further your cause on

:13:19. > :13:20.not going to further your cause on not going to further your cause on

:13:20. > :13:21.Europe without having some kind of Europe without having some kind of

:13:21. > :13:23.Europe without having some kind of pact with the Conservatives, surely

:13:23. > :13:24.pact with the Conservatives, surely pact with the Conservatives, surely

:13:24. > :13:25.pact with the Conservatives, surely not? I disagree. The point is this

:13:25. > :13:26.not? I disagree. The point is this not? I disagree. The point is this

:13:26. > :13:27.not? I disagree. The point is this is, we have to keep saying it, it

:13:27. > :13:29.is, we have to keep saying it, it is, we have to keep saying it, it

:13:29. > :13:31.is, we have to keep saying it, it is not the same pattern. The issue

:13:31. > :13:31.is not the same pattern. The issue is not the same pattern. The issue

:13:31. > :13:32.is not the same pattern. The issue we fought on were the issues of

:13:32. > :13:33.we fought on were the issues of immigration from Eastern Europe,

:13:33. > :13:35.immigration from Eastern Europe, immigration from Eastern Europe,

:13:35. > :13:36.the European Union theself, and the the European Union theself, and the

:13:36. > :13:38.the European Union theself, and the people who voted in Lord Ashcroft's

:13:38. > :13:38.people who voted in Lord Ashcroft's people who voted in Lord Ashcroft's

:13:39. > :13:40.people who voted in Lord Ashcroft's poll, that voted for UKIP, and they

:13:40. > :13:42.poll, that voted for UKIP, and they poll, that voted for UKIP, and they

:13:42. > :13:44.were very evenly spread. 30% from were very evenly spread. 30% from

:13:44. > :13:45.Conservatives, 30% from Liberal Conservatives, 30% from Liberal

:13:45. > :13:46.Conservatives, 30% from Liberal Democrats, and 15% for people who

:13:46. > :13:47.Democrats, and 15% for people who Democrats, and 15% for people who

:13:47. > :13:48.Democrats, and 15% for people who had never voted bfr, or not voted

:13:48. > :13:48.had never voted bfr, or not voted had never voted bfr, or not voted

:13:48. > :13:49.had never voted bfr, or not voted for many years -- before, or not

:13:50. > :13:51.for many years -- before, or not for many years -- before, or not

:13:51. > :13:52.voted for many years, coming into voted for many years, coming into

:13:52. > :13:54.voted for many years, coming into the democratic process. And other

:13:54. > :13:55.the democratic process. And other the democratic process. And other

:13:55. > :13:56.issues we fought on the doorsteps, issues we fought on the doorsteps,

:13:56. > :13:56.issues we fought on the doorsteps, issues we fought on the doorsteps,

:13:56. > :13:57.in other words energy. You say we in other words energy. You say we

:13:57. > :13:58.in other words energy. You say we are not proposing solutions, we are.

:13:58. > :14:00.are not proposing solutions, we are. are not proposing solutions, we are.

:14:00. > :14:01.There are solution available to all There are solution available to all

:14:01. > :14:02.There are solution available to all these problems. The issue is

:14:02. > :14:04.these problems. The issue is neither the Government or

:14:04. > :14:06.neither the Government or opposition are actually intending

:14:06. > :14:07.opposition are actually intending opposition are actually intending

:14:07. > :14:09.opposition are actually intending to produce any. Protest votes for a

:14:09. > :14:09.to produce any. Protest votes for a to produce any. Protest votes for a

:14:09. > :14:16.non-governing party. We have run non-governing party. We have run

:14:16. > :14:18.non-governing party. We have run non-governing party. We have run

:14:18. > :14:19.out of time. In a moment: In the out of time. In a moment: In the

:14:19. > :14:21.out of time. In a moment: In the 1920 and 1930s, there were more

:14:21. > :14:22.1920 and 1930s, there were more 1920 and 1930s, there were more

:14:22. > :14:23.1920 and 1930s, there were more pianos than mortar car. My nan had

:14:23. > :14:24.pianos than mortar car. My nan had pianos than mortar car. My nan had

:14:24. > :14:25.pianos than mortar car. My nan had one in her front room, that was the

:14:25. > :14:27.one in her front room, that was the one in her front room, that was the

:14:27. > :14:28.one in her front room, that was the only reason I played it. Are we

:14:28. > :14:31.only reason I played it. Are we only reason I played it. Are we

:14:31. > :14:33.witnessing the strange death of the British piano.

:14:33. > :14:34.British piano. British piano.

:14:34. > :14:36.British piano. Six years ago the pound was worth

:14:36. > :14:37.Six years ago the pound was worth Six years ago the pound was worth

:14:37. > :14:40.more than two American dollars, more than two American dollars,

:14:40. > :14:40.more than two American dollars, more than two American dollars,

:14:40. > :14:41.today it has slid below the $1.50 today it has slid below the $1.50

:14:42. > :14:42.today it has slid below the $1.50 today it has slid below the $1.50

:14:42. > :14:43.mark. It is down 20% since the mark. It is down 20% since the

:14:43. > :14:44.mark. It is down 20% since the mark. It is down 20% since the

:14:44. > :14:45.start of 2013, not just against the start of 2013, not just against the

:14:45. > :14:46.start of 2013, not just against the start of 2013, not just against the

:14:46. > :14:47.dollar but the euro as well. What dollar but the euro as well. What

:14:47. > :14:47.dollar but the euro as well. What dollar but the euro as well. What

:14:47. > :14:49.is curious about this moment in our is curious about this moment in our

:14:49. > :14:50.is curious about this moment in our is curious about this moment in our

:14:50. > :14:51.history, is none of the people in history, is none of the people in

:14:51. > :14:52.history, is none of the people in charge, neither the Governor of the

:14:52. > :14:53.charge, neither the Governor of the charge, neither the Governor of the

:14:53. > :14:53.Bank of England, nor the Chancellor Bank of England, nor the Chancellor

:14:53. > :14:54.Bank of England, nor the Chancellor Bank of England, nor the Chancellor

:14:54. > :14:55.of the Exchequer, nor the leader of of the Exchequer, nor the leader of

:14:55. > :14:57.of the Exchequer, nor the leader of the opposition seems to be very

:14:57. > :14:58.the opposition seems to be very the opposition seems to be very

:14:58. > :14:59.concerned about this. In fact, they concerned about this. In fact, they

:14:59. > :15:00.concerned about this. In fact, they concerned about this. In fact, they

:15:00. > :15:01.seem to think the sinking pound is seem to think the sinking pound is

:15:01. > :15:02.seem to think the sinking pound is seem to think the sinking pound is

:15:02. > :15:03.one of the great benefits we have one of the great benefits we have

:15:03. > :15:03.one of the great benefits we have one of the great benefits we have

:15:04. > :15:04.won from not being in the eurozone. won from not being in the eurozone.

:15:05. > :15:06.won from not being in the eurozone. Some are wondering whether we

:15:06. > :15:10.Some are wondering whether we Some are wondering whether we

:15:10. > :15:11.should be so relaxed about our declining worth.

:15:11. > :15:12.declining worth. declining worth.

:15:12. > :15:13.declining worth. This nation under God shall have a

:15:13. > :15:14.This nation under God shall have a This nation under God shall have a

:15:14. > :15:15.new birth of freedom. That new birth of freedom. That

:15:15. > :15:17.new birth of freedom. That Government of the people, by the

:15:17. > :15:18.Government of the people, by the Government of the people, by the

:15:18. > :15:20.Government of the people, by the people, for the people. In the film

:15:20. > :15:22.people, for the people. In the film people, for the people. In the film

:15:22. > :15:23.Lincoln, we learn how slavery was Lincoln, we learn how slavery was

:15:23. > :15:25.Lincoln, we learn how slavery was abolished in 1860s America, but the

:15:25. > :15:27.abolished in 1860s America, but the abolished in 1860s America, but the

:15:27. > :15:29.abolished in 1860s America, but the Civil War years in the US were also

:15:29. > :15:29.Civil War years in the US were also Civil War years in the US were also

:15:29. > :15:31.inevitably a time of strength for inevitably a time of strength for

:15:31. > :15:32.inevitably a time of strength for the pound against the greenback.

:15:32. > :15:33.the pound against the greenback. the pound against the greenback.

:15:33. > :15:34.the pound against the greenback. For most of the 19th century the

:15:34. > :15:36.For most of the 19th century the For most of the 19th century the

:15:36. > :15:37.pound fetched between four and five pound fetched between four and five

:15:37. > :15:39.pound fetched between four and five dollars, it peeked at almost ten

:15:39. > :15:40.dollars, it peeked at almost ten when American unionists started

:15:40. > :15:41.when American unionists started when American unionists started

:15:41. > :15:42.printing money to finance the war. printing money to finance the war.

:15:42. > :15:44.printing money to finance the war. printing money to finance the war.

:15:44. > :15:45.For the pound it has been down hill For the pound it has been down hill

:15:45. > :15:46.For the pound it has been down hill pretty much since then, against the

:15:46. > :15:47.pretty much since then, against the pretty much since then, against the

:15:47. > :15:50.pretty much since then, against the dollar and the rest of the world's

:15:50. > :15:52.dollar and the rest of the world's dollar and the rest of the world's

:15:52. > :15:54.currencies too. 1931, 1949, we currencies too. 1931, 1949, we

:15:54. > :15:55.currencies too. 1931, 1949, we remember our devaluations as great

:15:55. > :15:56.remember our devaluations as great historical moments. Usually not

:15:56. > :15:57.historical moments. Usually not historical moments. Usually not

:15:57. > :15:58.very happy ones. It doesn't mean very happy ones. It doesn't mean

:15:58. > :15:59.very happy ones. It doesn't mean very happy ones. It doesn't mean

:15:59. > :16:00.that the pound here in Britain, in that the pound here in Britain, in

:16:00. > :16:02.that the pound here in Britain, in that the pound here in Britain, in

:16:02. > :16:04.your pocket or purse or bank has your pocket or purse or bank has

:16:04. > :16:05.your pocket or purse or bank has been devafld. Harold Wilson in 1967,

:16:05. > :16:06.been devafld. Harold Wilson in 1967, been devafld. Harold Wilson in 1967,

:16:06. > :16:12.insisting the pound in our pocket insisting the pound in our pocket

:16:12. > :16:14.insisting the pound in our pocket insisting the pound in our pocket

:16:14. > :16:18.was still worth the same. Today has was still worth the same. Today has

:16:18. > :16:19.been extremely turbulent and been extremely turbulent and

:16:19. > :16:20.been extremely turbulent and difficult. Norman Lamont facing the

:16:20. > :16:22.difficult. Norman Lamont facing the difficult. Norman Lamont facing the

:16:22. > :16:22.music in Downing Street. When the music in Downing Street. When the

:16:22. > :16:24.music in Downing Street. When the markets turned on sterling at the

:16:24. > :16:25.markets turned on sterling at the markets turned on sterling at the

:16:25. > :16:26.markets turned on sterling at the start of 2009, there was no photo

:16:26. > :16:28.start of 2009, there was no photo opportunity, just guilty buildings.

:16:28. > :16:28.opportunity, just guilty buildings. opportunity, just guilty buildings.

:16:28. > :16:29.opportunity, just guilty buildings. The 30% drop in the pound's value

:16:29. > :16:30.The 30% drop in the pound's value The 30% drop in the pound's value

:16:30. > :16:31.at the height of the global at the height of the global

:16:31. > :16:32.at the height of the global financial crisis of the biggest

:16:32. > :16:33.financial crisis of the biggest financial crisis of the biggest

:16:33. > :16:34.financial crisis of the biggest fall since the war, yet it doesn't

:16:34. > :16:34.fall since the war, yet it doesn't fall since the war, yet it doesn't

:16:34. > :16:35.fall since the war, yet it doesn't seem to have been enough. Now the

:16:35. > :16:36.seem to have been enough. Now the seem to have been enough. Now the

:16:36. > :16:38.seem to have been enough. Now the pound is falling again, and you get

:16:38. > :16:38.pound is falling again, and you get pound is falling again, and you get

:16:38. > :16:39.the sense that Britain's leaders the sense that Britain's leaders

:16:39. > :16:40.the sense that Britain's leaders the sense that Britain's leaders

:16:40. > :16:41.would be more worried if it started would be more worried if it started

:16:41. > :16:43.would be more worried if it started would be more worried if it started

:16:43. > :16:44.to head back up. Most of the to head back up. Most of the

:16:44. > :16:45.economic establishment seems to economic establishment seems to

:16:45. > :16:46.economic establishment seems to economic establishment seems to

:16:46. > :16:48.agree, a weak currency is our only agree, a weak currency is our only

:16:48. > :16:50.agree, a weak currency is our only agree, a weak currency is our only

:16:50. > :16:51.way out of this mess. Our decision way out of this mess. Our decision

:16:51. > :16:52.way out of this mess. Our decision to devalue attacks our problems at

:16:52. > :16:53.to devalue attacks our problems at to devalue attacks our problems at

:16:53. > :16:54.to devalue attacks our problems at the root. We can't say yet that it

:16:54. > :16:55.the root. We can't say yet that it the root. We can't say yet that it

:16:55. > :16:56.the root. We can't say yet that it will work. We can say, for sure,

:16:56. > :16:58.will work. We can say, for sure, will work. We can say, for sure,

:16:58. > :17:00.that Harold Wilson was wrong. All that Harold Wilson was wrong. All

:17:00. > :17:00.that Harold Wilson was wrong. All that Harold Wilson was wrong. All

:17:00. > :17:04.those years ago. The pound in our those years ago. The pound in our

:17:04. > :17:05.those years ago. The pound in our pocket is worth less and less.

:17:05. > :17:05.pocket is worth less and less. pocket is worth less and less.

:17:05. > :17:08.pocket is worth less and less. I'm joined by Kate Barker a member

:17:08. > :17:09.I'm joined by Kate Barker a member I'm joined by Kate Barker a member

:17:09. > :17:11.of the Monetary Policy Committee of the Monetary Policy Committee

:17:11. > :17:14.of the Monetary Policy Committee of the Monetary Policy Committee

:17:14. > :17:18.for ten years, and now is a senior for ten years, and now is a senior

:17:18. > :17:20.for ten years, and now is a senior adviser for Credit Suisse. Why is

:17:21. > :17:22.adviser for Credit Suisse. Why is it, certainly people watching

:17:22. > :17:22.it, certainly people watching it, certainly people watching

:17:22. > :17:24.Harold Wilson, battling not to Harold Wilson, battling not to

:17:24. > :17:25.Harold Wilson, battling not to devalue the pound in the 1960s,

:17:25. > :17:26.devalue the pound in the 1960s, devalue the pound in the 1960s,

:17:26. > :17:28.might be surprised that everyone is might be surprised that everyone is

:17:28. > :17:29.might be surprised that everyone is so relaxed about the falling pound.

:17:29. > :17:31.so relaxed about the falling pound. so relaxed about the falling pound.

:17:31. > :17:33.so relaxed about the falling pound. Why are they so relaxed? Part low

:17:33. > :17:34.Why are they so relaxed? Part low Why are they so relaxed? Part low

:17:34. > :17:35.Why are they so relaxed? Part low because, I hesitate to say this, I

:17:35. > :17:36.because, I hesitate to say this, I because, I hesitate to say this, I

:17:36. > :17:37.don't think your presentation of don't think your presentation of

:17:37. > :17:38.don't think your presentation of what happened to the pound was

:17:38. > :17:40.what happened to the pound was what happened to the pound was

:17:40. > :17:42.entirely accurate. The pound has entirely accurate. The pound has

:17:42. > :17:43.entirely accurate. The pound has fallen since the days of Harold

:17:43. > :17:44.fallen since the days of Harold fallen since the days of Harold

:17:44. > :17:48.fallen since the days of Harold Wilson, but not for 20 years. Today

:17:48. > :17:50.Wilson, but not for 20 years. Today Wilson, but not for 20 years. Today

:17:50. > :17:51.Wilson, but not for 20 years. Today the pound is at $1.50 against the

:17:51. > :17:52.the pound is at $1.50 against the the pound is at $1.50 against the

:17:52. > :17:53.the pound is at $1.50 against the dollar. It has gone up and down.

:17:53. > :17:55.dollar. It has gone up and down. dollar. It has gone up and down.

:17:55. > :17:58.dollar. It has gone up and down. 30%. It goes up and down. In 1985

:17:58. > :17:59.30%. It goes up and down. In 1985 30%. It goes up and down. In 1985

:17:59. > :17:59.30%. It goes up and down. In 1985 the pound was worth $1.05, it has

:17:59. > :18:01.the pound was worth $1.05, it has the pound was worth $1.05, it has

:18:01. > :18:03.the pound was worth $1.05, it has gone up 50% in the last 25 years.

:18:03. > :18:04.gone up 50% in the last 25 years. gone up 50% in the last 25 years.

:18:04. > :18:05.It depends what your starting point It depends what your starting point

:18:05. > :18:06.It depends what your starting point It depends what your starting point

:18:06. > :18:07.It depends what your starting point is. What I was going to go on to

:18:07. > :18:08.is. What I was going to go on to is. What I was going to go on to

:18:08. > :18:08.is. What I was going to go on to say, if you look at the average

:18:08. > :18:10.say, if you look at the average say, if you look at the average

:18:10. > :18:12.level of the pound since Margaret level of the pound since Margaret

:18:12. > :18:14.level of the pound since Margaret level of the pound since Margaret

:18:14. > :18:15.Thatcher came to power in 1979, it Thatcher came to power in 1979, it

:18:15. > :18:16.Thatcher came to power in 1979, it has been exactly $1.51, we are

:18:16. > :18:17.has been exactly $1.51, we are has been exactly $1.51, we are

:18:17. > :18:18.right on the long-term average. right on the long-term average.

:18:18. > :18:18.right on the long-term average. right on the long-term average.

:18:19. > :18:19.go back to the original point, we go back to the original point, we

:18:19. > :18:21.go back to the original point, we go back to the original point, we

:18:21. > :18:21.used to worry, if in the space of used to worry, if in the space of

:18:21. > :18:24.used to worry, if in the space of used to worry, if in the space of

:18:24. > :18:25.six weeks the pound had lost 7% of six weeks the pound had lost 7% of

:18:25. > :18:26.six weeks the pound had lost 7% of its value, which has what's

:18:27. > :18:27.its value, which has what's its value, which has what's

:18:27. > :18:28.its value, which has what's happened this year. Why are we not

:18:28. > :18:29.happened this year. Why are we not happened this year. Why are we not

:18:29. > :18:30.worried. Explain to people, why is worried. Explain to people, why is

:18:30. > :18:31.worried. Explain to people, why is worried. Explain to people, why is

:18:31. > :18:33.worried. Explain to people, why is it felt to be a good thing for the

:18:33. > :18:34.it felt to be a good thing for the it felt to be a good thing for the

:18:34. > :18:35.it felt to be a good thing for the economy, maybe? It was one of the

:18:35. > :18:36.economy, maybe? It was one of the breakthrough the of British

:18:36. > :18:37.breakthrough the of British breakthrough the of British

:18:37. > :18:39.economic policy that we stopped economic policy that we stopped

:18:39. > :18:39.economic policy that we stopped worrying about the pound too much

:18:39. > :18:41.worrying about the pound too much worrying about the pound too much

:18:41. > :18:43.in 1992 after Black Wednesday. Now in 1992 after Black Wednesday. Now

:18:43. > :18:43.in 1992 after Black Wednesday. Now in 1992 after Black Wednesday. Now

:18:43. > :18:47.what are the benefits of a weaker what are the benefits of a weaker

:18:47. > :18:48.what are the benefits of a weaker what are the benefits of a weaker

:18:48. > :18:49.pound, they are that the value that pound, they are that the value that

:18:49. > :18:51.pound, they are that the value that British exporters get for selling

:18:51. > :18:53.British exporters get for selling British exporters get for selling

:18:53. > :18:54.their goods abroad goes up. Today, their goods abroad goes up. Today,

:18:54. > :18:57.their goods abroad goes up. Today, their goods abroad goes up. Today,

:18:57. > :18:59.if they sell something for a dollar, if they sell something for a dollar,

:18:59. > :19:00.if they sell something for a dollar, if they sell something for a dollar,

:19:00. > :19:02.or $100, it is worth about �65, as or $100, it is worth about �65, as

:19:02. > :19:04.or $100, it is worth about �65, as or $100, it is worth about �65, as

:19:04. > :19:05.recently as four years ago, if they recently as four years ago, if they

:19:05. > :19:07.recently as four years ago, if they recently as four years ago, if they

:19:07. > :19:08.sold something for $00 it was worth sold something for $00 it was worth

:19:08. > :19:08.sold something for $00 it was worth sold something for $00 it was worth

:19:08. > :19:09.only �50. It makes it much more only �50. It makes it much more

:19:09. > :19:11.only �50. It makes it much more profitable for British companies to

:19:11. > :19:11.profitable for British companies to profitable for British companies to

:19:11. > :19:13.sell their goods and services sell their goods and services

:19:13. > :19:14.sell their goods and services abroad. That is the basic benefit.

:19:14. > :19:15.abroad. That is the basic benefit. abroad. That is the basic benefit.

:19:15. > :19:16.abroad. That is the basic benefit. There are down sides. Do you think

:19:16. > :19:17.There are down sides. Do you think There are down sides. Do you think

:19:17. > :19:19.There are down sides. Do you think this is, is it right to think this

:19:19. > :19:21.this is, is it right to think this this is, is it right to think this

:19:21. > :19:21.this is, is it right to think this this is, is it right to think this

:19:21. > :19:22.is our only way out in a sense, we is our only way out in a sense, we

:19:22. > :19:23.is our only way out in a sense, we is our only way out in a sense, we

:19:23. > :19:24.need to make our goods cheaper in need to make our goods cheaper in

:19:24. > :19:26.need to make our goods cheaper in need to make our goods cheaper in

:19:26. > :19:27.the rest of the world to sell more the rest of the world to sell more

:19:27. > :19:28.the rest of the world to sell more of them? I'm more worried that

:19:28. > :19:30.of them? I'm more worried that of them? I'm more worried that

:19:30. > :19:31.Anatole Kaletsky. We seem to have Anatole Kaletsky. We seem to have

:19:31. > :19:32.Anatole Kaletsky. We seem to have Anatole Kaletsky. We seem to have

:19:32. > :19:33.moved into a stage where we are moved into a stage where we are

:19:33. > :19:35.moved into a stage where we are grasping at quick fixs to get

:19:35. > :19:37.grasping at quick fixs to get grasping at quick fixs to get

:19:37. > :19:38.grasping at quick fixs to get ourselves out of what is a complex

:19:38. > :19:39.ourselves out of what is a complex ourselves out of what is a complex

:19:39. > :19:40.ourselves out of what is a complex mess. Last week it was the GDP

:19:40. > :19:41.mess. Last week it was the GDP mess. Last week it was the GDP

:19:41. > :19:43.mess. Last week it was the GDP target and now it is the falling

:19:43. > :19:44.target and now it is the falling target and now it is the falling

:19:44. > :19:46.target and now it is the falling point pound. I'm not sure I want to

:19:46. > :19:47.point pound. I'm not sure I want to point pound. I'm not sure I want to

:19:47. > :19:48.see the pound further. The see the pound further. The

:19:48. > :19:49.see the pound further. The immediate effect would be to slow

:19:49. > :19:50.immediate effect would be to slow immediate effect would be to slow

:19:50. > :19:50.growth because of the impact on growth because of the impact on

:19:50. > :19:52.growth because of the impact on growth because of the impact on

:19:52. > :19:53.real income. In the long run it is real income. In the long run it is

:19:53. > :19:53.real income. In the long run it is real income. In the long run it is

:19:53. > :19:54.good for exports, only if it stays good for exports, only if it stays

:19:54. > :19:55.good for exports, only if it stays good for exports, only if it stays

:19:55. > :19:57.low. It may not stay low. The other low. It may not stay low. The other

:19:57. > :19:58.low. It may not stay low. The other low. It may not stay low. The other

:19:58. > :19:59.thing is, actually, in the long run, thing is, actually, in the long run,

:19:59. > :20:00.thing is, actually, in the long run, thing is, actually, in the long run,

:20:00. > :20:01.what will make us better off is what will make us better off is

:20:01. > :20:03.what will make us better off is actually if we have better

:20:03. > :20:05.actually if we have better actually if we have better

:20:05. > :20:07.productivity. If you take all the productivity. If you take all the

:20:07. > :20:09.productivity. If you take all the pressure off everybody because you

:20:09. > :20:11.pressure off everybody because you keep devaluing the pound,

:20:11. > :20:13.keep devaluing the pound, productivity doesn't perform well.

:20:13. > :20:14.productivity doesn't perform well. productivity doesn't perform well.

:20:14. > :20:15.Our productivity has not performed Our productivity has not performed

:20:15. > :20:16.Our productivity has not performed Our productivity has not performed

:20:16. > :20:18.well recently we need to move away well recently we need to move away

:20:18. > :20:19.well recently we need to move away well recently we need to move away

:20:19. > :20:20.from qix fixes and get on with the from qix fixes and get on with the

:20:20. > :20:21.from qix fixes and get on with the from qix fixes and get on with the

:20:21. > :20:22.slow -- quick fixes, and get on slow -- quick fixes, and get on

:20:22. > :20:23.slow -- quick fixes, and get on with the slow boring job of

:20:23. > :20:24.with the slow boring job of with the slow boring job of

:20:24. > :20:27.building the economy long-term. building the economy long-term.

:20:27. > :20:28.building the economy long-term. building the economy long-term.

:20:28. > :20:29.you didn't have the easy resort to you didn't have the easy resort to

:20:29. > :20:31.you didn't have the easy resort to cheap currency, we might make tough

:20:31. > :20:32.cheap currency, we might make tough decisions and increase productivity,

:20:32. > :20:33.decisions and increase productivity, decisions and increase productivity,

:20:33. > :20:35.decisions and increase productivity, the way the Germans do? There is a

:20:35. > :20:36.the way the Germans do? There is a the way the Germans do? There is a

:20:36. > :20:37.the way the Germans do? There is a point we don't want the pound to

:20:37. > :20:38.point we don't want the pound to point we don't want the pound to

:20:38. > :20:39.fall without limit, it would be fall without limit, it would be

:20:39. > :20:40.fall without limit, it would be fall without limit, it would be

:20:40. > :20:40.terrible if it fell back to where terrible if it fell back to where

:20:41. > :20:42.terrible if it fell back to where it was under Margaret Thatcher,

:20:42. > :20:43.it was under Margaret Thatcher, it was under Margaret Thatcher,

:20:43. > :20:45.it was under Margaret Thatcher, worth a dollar. And I would agree

:20:45. > :20:46.worth a dollar. And I would agree worth a dollar. And I would agree

:20:46. > :20:48.with Kate that the best outcome with Kate that the best outcome

:20:48. > :20:48.with Kate that the best outcome with Kate that the best outcome

:20:48. > :20:50.would be if the pound stablised at would be if the pound stablised at

:20:50. > :20:51.would be if the pound stablised at around about this level, give her

:20:51. > :20:53.around about this level, give her around about this level, give her

:20:53. > :20:54.around about this level, give her take a few per cent. One doesn't

:20:54. > :20:56.take a few per cent. One doesn't take a few per cent. One doesn't

:20:56. > :20:57.want an ever falling currency. Is want an ever falling currency. Is

:20:57. > :20:58.want an ever falling currency. Is it better to confront big

:20:58. > :21:00.it better to confront big it better to confront big

:21:00. > :21:01.challengers if you are an exporter? challengers if you are an exporter?

:21:01. > :21:02.challengers if you are an exporter? Well, it all depends how much

:21:02. > :21:03.Well, it all depends how much Well, it all depends how much

:21:03. > :21:03.momentum there already is in the momentum there already is in the

:21:04. > :21:05.momentum there already is in the economy. How strong our companies

:21:05. > :21:06.economy. How strong our companies economy. How strong our companies

:21:06. > :21:07.are. There are certainly some are. There are certainly some

:21:07. > :21:09.are. There are certainly some companies in Britain, as in Germany,

:21:09. > :21:10.companies in Britain, as in Germany, companies in Britain, as in Germany,

:21:10. > :21:11.that are capable of exporting that are capable of exporting

:21:11. > :21:12.that are capable of exporting profitably, even with a strong

:21:12. > :21:13.profitably, even with a strong profitably, even with a strong

:21:13. > :21:14.profitably, even with a strong exchange rate. But we know that we

:21:14. > :21:15.exchange rate. But we know that we exchange rate. But we know that we

:21:15. > :21:16.don't have a large enough don't have a large enough

:21:16. > :21:18.don't have a large enough manufacturing sector, we don't have

:21:18. > :21:20.manufacturing sector, we don't have manufacturing sector, we don't have

:21:20. > :21:21.a large enough export sector in a large enough export sector in

:21:21. > :21:23.this country, especially following this country, especially following

:21:24. > :21:25.this country, especially following the decline of the financial sector

:21:25. > :21:26.the decline of the financial sector the decline of the financial sector

:21:26. > :21:27.the decline of the financial sector on which we relied to stimulate the

:21:27. > :21:28.on which we relied to stimulate the on which we relied to stimulate the

:21:28. > :21:29.build up of small companies, which build up of small companies, which

:21:29. > :21:30.build up of small companies, which by definition are going to be

:21:30. > :21:31.by definition are going to be by definition are going to be

:21:31. > :21:33.initial low struggling to sell initial low struggling to sell

:21:33. > :21:34.initial low struggling to sell abroad. You want a weaker --

:21:34. > :21:35.abroad. You want a weaker -- abroad. You want a weaker --

:21:35. > :21:36.initially struggling to sell abroad. initially struggling to sell abroad.

:21:36. > :21:37.initially struggling to sell abroad. initially struggling to sell abroad.

:21:37. > :21:38.You want a weaker pound. We do feel You want a weaker pound. We do feel

:21:38. > :21:39.You want a weaker pound. We do feel You want a weaker pound. We do feel

:21:39. > :21:40.so grateful that we are not in the so grateful that we are not in the

:21:40. > :21:41.so grateful that we are not in the eurozone, and that is what

:21:41. > :21:42.eurozone, and that is what eurozone, and that is what

:21:42. > :21:43.politicians on all sides say, how politicians on all sides say, how

:21:43. > :21:44.politicians on all sides say, how politicians on all sides say, how

:21:44. > :21:44.great it is we are not in the great it is we are not in the

:21:44. > :21:46.great it is we are not in the eurozone and not having the

:21:46. > :21:46.eurozone and not having the eurozone and not having the

:21:47. > :21:47.problems of Spain. Do you sometimes problems of Spain. Do you sometimes

:21:47. > :21:48.problems of Spain. Do you sometimes problems of Spain. Do you sometimes

:21:48. > :21:49.think it is possible in ten years think it is possible in ten years

:21:49. > :21:50.think it is possible in ten years time that they will look rather

:21:50. > :21:50.time that they will look rather time that they will look rather

:21:50. > :21:51.time that they will look rather strong and be forced to make the

:21:51. > :21:52.strong and be forced to make the strong and be forced to make the

:21:52. > :21:53.difficult decisions and do it the difficult decisions and do it the

:21:53. > :21:54.difficult decisions and do it the difficult decisions and do it the

:21:54. > :21:55.hard way, and we will still be hard way, and we will still be

:21:55. > :21:56.hard way, and we will still be grappling around with our cheap

:21:56. > :21:57.grappling around with our cheap grappling around with our cheap

:21:57. > :21:59.currency, do you worry about that currency, do you worry about that

:21:59. > :21:59.currency, do you worry about that currency, do you worry about that

:21:59. > :22:00.at all, it is making us poorer? at all, it is making us poorer?

:22:00. > :22:01.at all, it is making us poorer? at all, it is making us poorer?

:22:01. > :22:02.That is what I'm hinting at. That That is what I'm hinting at. That

:22:02. > :22:03.That is what I'm hinting at. That That is what I'm hinting at. That

:22:03. > :22:05.That is what I'm hinting at. That is what had a is going on, we are

:22:05. > :22:06.is what had a is going on, we are is what had a is going on, we are

:22:06. > :22:07.making ourselves poorer in this way, making ourselves poorer in this way,

:22:07. > :22:08.making ourselves poorer in this way, and not undertaking the struck url

:22:08. > :22:09.and not undertaking the struck url and not undertaking the struck url

:22:09. > :22:10.and not undertaking the struck url reforms. I'm not sure I would want

:22:10. > :22:10.reforms. I'm not sure I would want reforms. I'm not sure I would want

:22:10. > :22:11.reforms. I'm not sure I would want to be in the position that Spain is

:22:11. > :22:13.to be in the position that Spain is to be in the position that Spain is

:22:13. > :22:13.in, with a very high youth in, with a very high youth

:22:14. > :22:15.in, with a very high youth unemployment. They are paying a

:22:15. > :22:15.unemployment. They are paying a unemployment. They are paying a

:22:15. > :22:16.terrible short-term price. But we terrible short-term price. But we

:22:16. > :22:17.terrible short-term price. But we terrible short-term price. But we

:22:17. > :22:18.have to be careful that we use the have to be careful that we use the

:22:18. > :22:19.have to be careful that we use the have to be careful that we use the

:22:19. > :22:20.room we have cut ourselves by being room we have cut ourselves by being

:22:20. > :22:21.room we have cut ourselves by being room we have cut ourselves by being

:22:21. > :22:23.able to devalue, by the fact we able to devalue, by the fact we

:22:23. > :22:24.able to devalue, by the fact we able to devalue, by the fact we

:22:24. > :22:25.still have our own currency s to still have our own currency s to

:22:25. > :22:26.still have our own currency s to undertake these reforms. My worry

:22:26. > :22:27.undertake these reforms. My worry undertake these reforms. My worry

:22:27. > :22:28.undertake these reforms. My worry with the negligent of the pound is

:22:28. > :22:29.with the negligent of the pound is with the negligent of the pound is

:22:29. > :22:30.with the negligent of the pound is we are saying we will -- neglect of

:22:30. > :22:31.we are saying we will -- neglect of we are saying we will -- neglect of

:22:31. > :22:32.we are saying we will -- neglect of the pound is saying we will carry

:22:32. > :22:35.the pound is saying we will carry the pound is saying we will carry

:22:35. > :22:36.on doing the same things and on doing the same things and

:22:36. > :22:37.on doing the same things and putting the reforms off forever,

:22:37. > :22:38.putting the reforms off forever, putting the reforms off forever,

:22:38. > :22:39.putting the reforms off forever, and then in ten years time we look

:22:39. > :22:39.and then in ten years time we look and then in ten years time we look

:22:39. > :22:42.and then in ten years time we look across the channel as we often do,

:22:42. > :22:43.across the channel as we often do, across the channel as we often do,

:22:43. > :22:44.across the channel as we often do, and say we missed a trick.

:22:44. > :22:45.and say we missed a trick. decent Edwardian middle-class

:22:45. > :22:46.decent Edwardian middle-class decent Edwardian middle-class

:22:46. > :22:47.living room would have been living room would have been

:22:47. > :22:49.living room would have been complete without one, but no longer,

:22:49. > :22:50.complete without one, but no longer, complete without one, but no longer,

:22:50. > :22:51.complete without one, but no longer, it seems. You might not have been

:22:51. > :22:52.it seems. You might not have been very preturbed Bihar rods

:22:52. > :22:54.very preturbed Bihar rods very preturbed Bihar rods

:22:54. > :22:54.announcement last month that it was announcement last month that it was

:22:55. > :22:56.announcement last month that it was ditching its piano department. For

:22:56. > :22:56.ditching its piano department. For ditching its piano department. For

:22:56. > :22:58.ditching its piano department. For some it felt like the death notice

:22:58. > :22:59.some it felt like the death notice some it felt like the death notice

:22:59. > :23:01.for a certain kind of social for a certain kind of social

:23:01. > :23:02.for a certain kind of social aspiration that our parents might

:23:02. > :23:05.aspiration that our parents might aspiration that our parents might

:23:05. > :23:13.have understood. What is behind the have understood. What is behind the

:23:13. > :23:14.have understood. What is behind the descending scale of piano sales.

:23:14. > :23:16.descending scale of piano sales. descending scale of piano sales.

:23:16. > :23:17.If you thought we loved and If you thought we loved and

:23:17. > :23:18.If you thought we loved and cherished our dear old pianos, I'm

:23:18. > :23:20.cherished our dear old pianos, I'm cherished our dear old pianos, I'm

:23:20. > :23:28.cherished our dear old pianos, I'm afraid the scales are about to fall

:23:28. > :23:31.afraid the scales are about to fall afraid the scales are about to fall

:23:31. > :23:32.afraid the scales are about to fall from your eyes. This is what top

:23:32. > :23:34.from your eyes. This is what top from your eyes. This is what top

:23:34. > :23:35.store Harolds is doing to the store Harolds is doing to the

:23:35. > :23:36.store Harolds is doing to the pianos. Not literally, dear viewer,

:23:36. > :23:38.pianos. Not literally, dear viewer, pianos. Not literally, dear viewer,

:23:38. > :23:39.pianos. Not literally, dear viewer, as our lawyers are keen for us to

:23:39. > :23:40.as our lawyers are keen for us to as our lawyers are keen for us to

:23:40. > :23:42.point out. But Harrods have closed point out. But Harrods have closed

:23:42. > :23:43.point out. But Harrods have closed point out. But Harrods have closed

:23:43. > :23:45.their piano hall, due to what they their piano hall, due to what they

:23:45. > :23:55.their piano hall, due to what they called the ever changing needs of

:23:55. > :23:55.

:23:55. > :23:56.called the ever changing needs of It is a bit shoddy of them. I

:23:56. > :23:58.It is a bit shoddy of them. I It is a bit shoddy of them. I

:23:58. > :24:00.thought you were supposed to get thought you were supposed to get

:24:00. > :24:00.thought you were supposed to get anything there. An elephant?You go

:24:00. > :24:01.anything there. An elephant?You go anything there. An elephant?You go

:24:01. > :24:02.anything there. An elephant?You go an ask an elephant and ticket to

:24:02. > :24:03.an ask an elephant and ticket to an ask an elephant and ticket to

:24:03. > :24:04.an ask an elephant and ticket to the moon, and I will have a piano,

:24:04. > :24:05.the moon, and I will have a piano, the moon, and I will have a piano,

:24:05. > :24:07.the moon, and I will have a piano, we don't have one of those, please,

:24:07. > :24:08.we don't have one of those, please, we don't have one of those, please,

:24:08. > :24:09.we don't have one of those, please, do us a favour. If it weren't for

:24:09. > :24:10.do us a favour. If it weren't for do us a favour. If it weren't for

:24:10. > :24:12.do us a favour. If it weren't for pianos in house, why there would be

:24:12. > :24:14.pianos in house, why there would be pianos in house, why there would be

:24:14. > :24:16.pianos in house, why there would be no-one to serenade the new year on

:24:16. > :24:17.no-one to serenade the new year on no-one to serenade the new year on

:24:17. > :24:18.BBC Two. That's right, Jools BBC Two. That's right, Jools

:24:18. > :24:19.BBC Two. That's right, Jools BBC Two. That's right, Jools

:24:19. > :24:21.Holland would be doing else for a Holland would be doing else for a

:24:21. > :24:22.Holland would be doing else for a Holland would be doing else for a

:24:22. > :24:25.living. In the 1920s and 30s there living. In the 1920s and 30s there

:24:25. > :24:26.living. In the 1920s and 30s there were more pianos than motorcars. My

:24:26. > :24:27.were more pianos than motorcars. My were more pianos than motorcars. My

:24:27. > :24:28.were more pianos than motorcars. My nan had a piano in her front room,

:24:28. > :24:29.nan had a piano in her front room, nan had a piano in her front room,

:24:29. > :24:30.nan had a piano in her front room, that was the only reason I learned.

:24:30. > :24:31.that was the only reason I learned. that was the only reason I learned.

:24:31. > :24:32.that was the only reason I learned. I fear that the piano has been put

:24:32. > :24:33.I fear that the piano has been put I fear that the piano has been put

:24:33. > :24:34.I fear that the piano has been put to the bottom of the list. Where as

:24:34. > :24:35.to the bottom of the list. Where as to the bottom of the list. Where as

:24:35. > :24:36.to the bottom of the list. Where as of course it should be at the top

:24:36. > :24:37.of course it should be at the top of course it should be at the top

:24:37. > :24:38.of course it should be at the top of the list. Unlike a big flat

:24:38. > :24:40.of the list. Unlike a big flat of the list. Unlike a big flat

:24:40. > :24:41.screen television and new fridge or screen television and new fridge or

:24:41. > :24:42.screen television and new fridge or whatever the thing is, all those

:24:42. > :24:43.whatever the thing is, all those whatever the thing is, all those

:24:43. > :24:44.things you chuck them away after things you chuck them away after

:24:44. > :24:45.things you chuck them away after five years. We know that's what

:24:45. > :24:48.five years. We know that's what five years. We know that's what

:24:48. > :24:49.happens to them. They don't last. happens to them. They don't last.

:24:49. > :24:50.happens to them. They don't last. happens to them. They don't last.

:24:50. > :24:51.As a piano, you will have for As a piano, you will have for

:24:51. > :24:52.As a piano, you will have for yourself, your children and your

:24:52. > :24:52.yourself, your children and your yourself, your children and your

:24:52. > :24:53.children's children. It is one of children's children. It is one of

:24:53. > :24:54.children's children. It is one of children's children. It is one of

:24:54. > :24:55.the few things you buy for a the few things you buy for a

:24:55. > :24:55.the few things you buy for a the few things you buy for a

:24:55. > :24:56.lifetime. It is the only thing I lifetime. It is the only thing I

:24:56. > :25:06.lifetime. It is the only thing I lifetime. It is the only thing I

:25:06. > :25:06.

:25:06. > :25:08.can think of you buy for a lifetime. can think of you buy for a lifetime.

:25:08. > :25:09.can think of you buy for a lifetime. Emotionally young out by scenes of

:25:09. > :25:13.Emotionally young out by scenes of Emotionally young out by scenes of

:25:13. > :25:17.tumbling upright. I have sought out tumbling upright. I have sought out

:25:17. > :25:18.tumbling upright. I have sought out the sanctuary and balmof Finchcocks

:25:18. > :25:19.the sanctuary and balmof Finchcocks the sanctuary and balmof Finchcocks

:25:19. > :25:21.the sanctuary and balmof Finchcocks in Kent. This Georgian pile is now

:25:21. > :25:25.in Kent. This Georgian pile is now in Kent. This Georgian pile is now

:25:25. > :25:27.a piano museum. In the grounds a piano museum. In the grounds

:25:27. > :25:27.restorers labour painstakingly over restorers labour painstakingly over

:25:27. > :25:31.restorers labour painstakingly over restorers labour painstakingly over

:25:31. > :25:33.old models, as they have been for 200 years.

:25:33. > :25:33.200 years. 200 years.

:25:34. > :25:34.They can give instruments like They can give instruments like

:25:35. > :25:35.They can give instruments like They can give instruments like

:25:35. > :25:37.these a new lease of life. They are these a new lease of life. They are

:25:37. > :25:42.these a new lease of life. They are these a new lease of life. They are

:25:42. > :25:43.the boys who take the "no" out of the boys who take the "no" out of

:25:43. > :25:53.the boys who take the "no" out of the boys who take the "no" out of

:25:53. > :25:54.pian-no. Our order book is full of pian-no. Our order book is full of

:25:54. > :25:57.pian-no. Our order book is full of restoration on old Broadwood. There

:25:57. > :25:58.restoration on old Broadwood. There restoration on old Broadwood. There

:25:58. > :26:02.is still interest in old pianos, is still interest in old pianos,

:26:02. > :26:03.is still interest in old pianos, even though sales are declining.

:26:03. > :26:05.even though sales are declining. even though sales are declining.

:26:05. > :26:06.even though sales are declining. There has been a fall in the sales

:26:07. > :26:16.There has been a fall in the sales There has been a fall in the sales

:26:17. > :26:20.

:26:21. > :26:22.of pianos, from 14,000 to 4,000 today.

:26:22. > :26:23.today. today.

:26:23. > :26:24.today. Hello there, after a hard day of

:26:24. > :26:25.Hello there, after a hard day of investigative journalism, there is

:26:26. > :26:27.investigative journalism, there is investigative journalism, there is

:26:27. > :26:30.nothing I like better than nothing I like better than

:26:30. > :26:33.nothing I like better than unwinding over one of Chopin's less

:26:33. > :26:35.unwinding over one of Chopin's less unwinding over one of Chopin's less

:26:35. > :26:36.challenging works. But much as I challenging works. But much as I

:26:36. > :26:38.challenging works. But much as I enjoy this old beauty here, her

:26:38. > :26:40.enjoy this old beauty here, her enjoy this old beauty here, her

:26:40. > :26:41.tone, her quality. She's not very tone, her quality. She's not very

:26:41. > :26:42.tone, her quality. She's not very tone, her quality. She's not very

:26:42. > :26:43.practical for life on the road on practical for life on the road on

:26:43. > :26:44.practical for life on the road on Newsnight assignments. And that is

:26:44. > :26:47.Newsnight assignments. And that is Newsnight assignments. And that is

:26:47. > :26:51.Newsnight assignments. And that is why I have come round to something

:26:51. > :26:55.why I have come round to something why I have come round to something

:26:55. > :26:59.lighter, more portable and whisper lighter, more portable and whisper

:26:59. > :27:09.lighter, more portable and whisper it, "more electronic". Bit heavy on

:27:09. > :27:16.

:27:16. > :27:19.it, "more electronic". Bit heavy on The rise of the machines, back in

:27:19. > :27:20.The rise of the machines, back in The rise of the machines, back in

:27:20. > :27:22.The rise of the machines, back in the music room at Finchcocks, it is

:27:22. > :27:23.the music room at Finchcocks, it is the music room at Finchcocks, it is

:27:23. > :27:25.the music room at Finchcocks, it is time to unmask the culprit in this

:27:25. > :27:26.time to unmask the culprit in this time to unmask the culprit in this

:27:26. > :27:28.whole affair. The electronic piano whole affair. The electronic piano

:27:28. > :27:30.whole affair. The electronic piano has made huge inroads in recent

:27:30. > :27:31.has made huge inroads in recent has made huge inroads in recent

:27:31. > :27:33.years, that is maybe why Harrods years, that is maybe why Harrods

:27:33. > :27:36.years, that is maybe why Harrods are closing their department. We

:27:36. > :27:37.are closing their department. We are closing their department. We

:27:37. > :27:38.know, for example, that typically know, for example, that typically

:27:38. > :27:39.know, for example, that typically 16-20 new electronic pianos are

:27:39. > :27:46.16-20 new electronic pianos are 16-20 new electronic pianos are

:27:46. > :27:50.sold to one acoustic piano. sold to one acoustic piano.

:27:50. > :27:52.sold to one acoustic piano. # Where is my indifference

:27:52. > :27:53.# Where is my indifference # Where is my indifference

:27:53. > :27:54.Bands like Fiction are enthusiastic Bands like Fiction are enthusiastic

:27:54. > :27:56.Bands like Fiction are enthusiastic about what digital key boards can

:27:56. > :27:58.about what digital key boards can about what digital key boards can

:27:58. > :27:59.bring to their music. With a bring to their music. With a

:28:00. > :28:01.bring to their music. With a synthesiser you can edit the sounds

:28:01. > :28:03.synthesiser you can edit the sounds synthesiser you can edit the sounds

:28:03. > :28:04.in numerous different ways. You can in numerous different ways. You can

:28:04. > :28:06.in numerous different ways. You can in numerous different ways. You can

:28:06. > :28:08.have just the bare sound like that, have just the bare sound like that,

:28:08. > :28:09.have just the bare sound like that, and then an arpeggeo on that,

:28:09. > :28:10.and then an arpeggeo on that, and then an arpeggeo on that,

:28:10. > :28:11.and then an arpeggeo on that, change the tempo of that. A lot of

:28:12. > :28:14.change the tempo of that. A lot of change the tempo of that. A lot of

:28:14. > :28:15.change the tempo of that. A lot of the composing I do at home is using

:28:15. > :28:17.the composing I do at home is using the composing I do at home is using

:28:17. > :28:19.computer. So there aren't any computer. So there aren't any

:28:19. > :28:21.computer. So there aren't any sounds on the keyboard.

:28:21. > :28:23.sounds on the keyboard. possiblities are infinate? Yes,

:28:23. > :28:24.possiblities are infinate? Yes, possiblities are infinate? Yes,

:28:24. > :28:25.that is the thing about an that is the thing about an

:28:25. > :28:27.electronic keyboard, particularly a electronic keyboard, particularly a

:28:27. > :28:28.electronic keyboard, particularly a synthesiser, is the variety of

:28:28. > :28:28.synthesiser, is the variety of synthesiser, is the variety of

:28:28. > :28:30.synthesiser, is the variety of sounds. That is why I enjoy using

:28:30. > :28:31.sounds. That is why I enjoy using sounds. That is why I enjoy using

:28:31. > :28:31.sounds. That is why I enjoy using them. You turn it on, and you never

:28:32. > :28:34.them. You turn it on, and you never them. You turn it on, and you never

:28:34. > :28:36.know what sound you will create. know what sound you will create.

:28:36. > :28:37.know what sound you will create. know what sound you will create.

:28:37. > :28:38.Is that it then? The piano has Is that it then? The piano has

:28:38. > :28:41.Is that it then? The piano has fallen silent? And all we can

:28:41. > :28:43.fallen silent? And all we can fallen silent? And all we can

:28:43. > :28:44.expect to hear in London's expect to hear in London's

:28:45. > :28:46.expect to hear in London's glittering West End is Karaoke bar,

:28:46. > :28:47.glittering West End is Karaoke bar, glittering West End is Karaoke bar,

:28:47. > :28:48.glittering West End is Karaoke bar, a fashionable DJ. Or maybe it is

:28:48. > :28:49.a fashionable DJ. Or maybe it is a fashionable DJ. Or maybe it is

:28:49. > :28:50.a fashionable DJ. Or maybe it is just these old ears of mine. I seem

:28:50. > :28:54.just these old ears of mine. I seem just these old ears of mine. I seem

:28:54. > :28:56.just these old ears of mine. I seem to hear the throb of an old-time

:28:56. > :28:58.to hear the throb of an old-time to hear the throb of an old-time

:28:58. > :29:00.upright piano, coming from inside upright piano, coming from inside

:29:00. > :29:02.this famous media pub. this famous media pub.

:29:02. > :29:05.this famous media pub. Coach & Horses of Soho.

:29:05. > :29:05.Coach & Horses of Soho. Coach & Horses of Soho.

:29:05. > :29:11.Coach & Horses of Soho. Yes, it's Baz and Dave, the right

:29:11. > :29:13.Yes, it's Baz and Dave, the right regular knees up.

:29:13. > :29:14.regular knees up. regular knees up.

:29:14. > :29:16.# My old man's a dustman # My old man's a dustman

:29:16. > :29:22.# My old man's a dustman # He wears a dustman's hat

:29:22. > :29:29.# He wears a dustman's hat # He wears a dustman's hat

:29:29. > :29:30.# He wears cor blimey trousers. # He wears cor blimey trousers.

:29:30. > :29:32.# He wears cor blimey trousers. # He wears cor blimey trousers.

:29:32. > :29:34.He put the piano in the pub about He put the piano in the pub about

:29:34. > :29:37.He put the piano in the pub about five years ago to put the

:29:37. > :29:38.five years ago to put the traditional entertainment in the

:29:38. > :29:40.traditional entertainment in the traditional entertainment in the

:29:40. > :29:41.traditional entertainment in the pub. Have you you had a sing-a-

:29:41. > :29:44.pub. Have you you had a sing-a- pub. Have you you had a sing-a-

:29:44. > :29:46.long? We have, they haven't started long? We have, they haven't started

:29:46. > :29:47.long? We have, they haven't started playing Raw Hide yet. What about

:29:47. > :29:50.playing Raw Hide yet. What about playing Raw Hide yet. What about

:29:50. > :29:53.Harolds getting rid of their piano Harolds getting rid of their piano

:29:53. > :29:54.Harolds getting rid of their piano departments? I'm disgusted!The old

:29:54. > :29:55.departments? I'm disgusted!The old departments? I'm disgusted!The old

:29:55. > :29:57.departments? I'm disgusted!The old Johan that may be heard less often

:29:57. > :29:58.Johan that may be heard less often Johan that may be heard less often

:29:58. > :29:59.around the domestic heart, but we around the domestic heart, but we

:29:59. > :30:00.around the domestic heart, but we around the domestic heart, but we

:30:00. > :30:02.didn't we nigh it still has its didn't we nigh it still has its

:30:02. > :30:03.didn't we nigh it still has its didn't we nigh it still has its

:30:03. > :30:04.charm. The piano has been with us charm. The piano has been with us

:30:04. > :30:10.charm. The piano has been with us charm. The piano has been with us

:30:10. > :30:11.since 1698, you hum it and I will since 1698, you hum it and I will

:30:11. > :30:12.since 1698, you hum it and I will since 1698, you hum it and I will

:30:12. > :30:13.play it! Review is up next, Martha play it! Review is up next, Martha

:30:14. > :30:14.play it! Review is up next, Martha Kearney and her guests are in

:30:14. > :30:17.Kearney and her guests are in Kearney and her guests are in

:30:17. > :30:19.Glasgow. I hope you will be Glasgow. I hope you will be

:30:19. > :30:22.Glasgow. I hope you will be watching us tonight, we have Pop

:30:22. > :30:23.watching us tonight, we have Pop Art legend Lichtenstein's modern

:30:23. > :30:24.Art legend Lichtenstein's modern retrospective. Richard Gere plays

:30:24. > :30:26.retrospective. Richard Gere plays retrospective. Richard Gere plays

:30:26. > :30:27.retrospective. Richard Gere plays the villain in his first film in

:30:27. > :30:29.the villain in his first film in the villain in his first film in

:30:29. > :30:31.four years. Jeremy Irons travels four years. Jeremy Irons travels

:30:31. > :30:31.four years. Jeremy Irons travels four years. Jeremy Irons travels

:30:31. > :30:32.the word to expose the problem of the word to expose the problem of

:30:32. > :30:34.the word to expose the problem of the word to expose the problem of

:30:34. > :30:35.pollution. We have the victim of an pollution. We have the victim of an

:30:35. > :30:38.pollution. We have the victim of an on-line stalker, and Sue Perkins

:30:38. > :30:39.on-line stalker, and Sue Perkins on-line stalker, and Sue Perkins

:30:39. > :30:40.on-line stalker, and Sue Perkins moves from Bake Off to sitcom. That

:30:40. > :30:41.moves from Bake Off to sitcom. That moves from Bake Off to sitcom. That

:30:41. > :30:42.moves from Bake Off to sitcom. That is all for this week. Reports of

:30:42. > :30:44.is all for this week. Reports of is all for this week. Reports of

:30:44. > :30:45.is all for this week. Reports of the death of the British piano may

:30:45. > :30:45.the death of the British piano may the death of the British piano may

:30:45. > :30:47.the death of the British piano may turn out to be true, I can't

:30:47. > :30:48.turn out to be true, I can't turn out to be true, I can't

:30:48. > :30:49.turn out to be true, I can't believe they will be, not just yet.

:30:49. > :30:50.believe they will be, not just yet. believe they will be, not just yet.