:00:00. > :00:20.Tonight, we talk to the man who organised it.
:00:21. > :00:27.Suffering from the cold and hot weathers and bad nights and the
:00:28. > :00:33.people here who don't like us because we make a lot of mess here.
:00:34. > :00:38.We have got to go and walk, and see what Europe can do for us.
:00:39. > :00:43.We'll also be focussing on the cause - the war in Syria,
:00:44. > :00:45.hearing from the man in charge of the US-led coalition.
:00:46. > :00:51.We have really never seen anything like this before so it is a global
:00:52. > :00:53.fight, it is a threat to everyone, and something we need a global
:00:54. > :00:54.coalition to confront. As he continues to dominate
:00:55. > :00:58.the polls, Donald Trump's They are talking about Mexican
:00:59. > :01:09.rapists. FROM AUDIENCE: They're
:01:10. > :01:11.talking about the wall! They can only win...
:01:12. > :01:13.They're talking about the wall. I love the idea of the
:01:14. > :01:16.Great Wall of Trump. The polemicist Ann Coulter explains
:01:17. > :01:18.the Trump phenomenon. We've got an official astronaut
:01:19. > :01:22.in space, at last. Newsnight looks back at the lost
:01:23. > :01:24.history of the British Europe is keen to end the year
:01:25. > :01:39.repairing its vision of a continent In the face of a migration crisis
:01:40. > :01:45.and security concerns, It is to bolster
:01:46. > :01:49.the external border. Or to put it another way,
:01:50. > :01:52.it's about helping Greece and Italy cope with those arriving
:01:53. > :01:55.on their shores with a new European Border
:01:56. > :01:58.and Coast Guard. It will replace the Frontex agency
:01:59. > :02:00.which is actually only Well, as the year draws to a close,
:02:01. > :02:06.this programme is looking at the migration issue by catching
:02:07. > :02:09.up on some of the characters whose images were beamed around
:02:10. > :02:11.the continent this summer. In the second of our series -
:02:12. > :02:15.the faces of the migrant crisis - Katie Razzall meets the man behind
:02:16. > :02:18.an event which proved a turning point in how the migrants
:02:19. > :02:49.were perceived and received. It was the moment that changed the
:02:50. > :02:56.course of the refugee crisis. When was this photo taken? In a train
:02:57. > :03:02.station when I was explaining to people what we have to do and how we
:03:03. > :03:10.will walk. That's you? Yes, that's me. When Muhammad led a column of
:03:11. > :03:16.refugees on a march across Hungary, the pictures helps define the scale
:03:17. > :03:20.of the crisis facing Europe. At the start of September, with Hungary
:03:21. > :03:27.cracking down on migrants, thousands were corralled for days in
:03:28. > :03:34.Budapest's main train station. I get this plant that we have got to walk,
:03:35. > :03:40.no one can stop us. I told them, don't be afraid, we can do a break,
:03:41. > :03:44.walk today for eight hours, tomorrow eight hours, and stop every time we
:03:45. > :03:51.are feeling tired. We have got to walk and we have got to not do any
:03:52. > :03:55.mess. The Hungarian people will give us a lot of food and water and
:03:56. > :04:02.everything, and the most important thing is that we don't mess the
:04:03. > :04:09.place or the town or the street. Why did you think that? Because with the
:04:10. > :04:15.cameras shooting us, the European people will see that we are walking
:04:16. > :04:19.and we are doing mess. They say, these people are not good, every
:04:20. > :04:24.time they eat they throw the things in the street and it is not
:04:25. > :04:32.acceptable. Ever strategic, he invited TV crews to join his march.
:04:33. > :04:37.I think the police or the Government cannot hurt us because we will be
:04:38. > :04:46.shot on the TV. You knew about the power of television to protect you.
:04:47. > :04:51.Yes, when I was at the train station I requested three channels, they
:04:52. > :05:00.said, OK we will go with you. This was just days after the Syrian boy
:05:01. > :05:04.washed up on a beach. The migrants' plight was making headlines. Even at
:05:05. > :05:13.night, when negotiating the arrival of bosses, Mohammed made sure the
:05:14. > :05:18.camera was there. I said to them don't be afraid, I am going to send
:05:19. > :05:23.with you a cameraman and I will send with you also one guy, he will have
:05:24. > :05:30.a car and he will follow you. Clearly a natural organiser,
:05:31. > :05:35.Mohammed is still leading. Another march to take asylum seekers to the
:05:36. > :05:40.local gym for a kickabout. A Syrian who used to work in Dubai and found
:05:41. > :05:43.he couldn't go back home when the war started, Mohammed is now in
:05:44. > :05:47.Germany. You were all over the newspapers and
:05:48. > :05:52.the television in September with that march, then you disappeared
:05:53. > :05:58.like everyone else to start your new life. What is your new life like?
:05:59. > :06:02.Sometimes I am walking in the street, I don't feel like I am in
:06:03. > :06:08.Germany, it is like a dream. The place is very nice, the people are
:06:09. > :06:12.very kind. There have been demonstrations against refugees,
:06:13. > :06:18.haven't there? Yes, it is happening, but it is just small people,
:06:19. > :06:28.walking. Me and my friend here, they organised the walk also on Saturday.
:06:29. > :06:32.It is with refugees. And do you think Germany, at some point, will
:06:33. > :06:41.have to say we cannot have any more refugees? I think they will not say
:06:42. > :06:47.this. Why not? I think in Germany they need more people because there
:06:48. > :06:51.is a lot of people here who are really old, and maybe after ten
:06:52. > :06:58.years, 20 years, a lot of houses will be empty. Germany also wants
:06:59. > :07:03.people to work so I think they want more people, they want good people.
:07:04. > :07:08.If you look back to your childhood, as a child would you ever have
:07:09. > :07:16.thought I'm going to go to Germany? Did you know about Germany? When I
:07:17. > :07:23.was a kid, I like to come to Germany because I love cars. I really like
:07:24. > :07:27.BMW and Mercedes. Lots of people in Britain look at pictures of young
:07:28. > :07:32.men coming from Syria as refugees fleeing war, and they say your
:07:33. > :07:35.country is at war, you should be fighting for your country, you
:07:36. > :07:43.should be there fighting. What would you say to that? Actually you have
:07:44. > :07:47.got to ask this question, it is correct to ask this question, but
:07:48. > :07:52.the answer is you don't know which one is fighting for the good. If
:07:53. > :07:56.something is coming from other countries, like for example other
:07:57. > :08:02.countries want to come to Syria and take Syria, and they want to kill
:08:03. > :08:07.people there, we won't go out of Syria and we will fight for our
:08:08. > :08:12.country. So you would have fought against another country invading?
:08:13. > :08:18.Yes, but when you don't know what is the good things and bad things,
:08:19. > :08:25.better to go. There, they are just killing each other. They will go to
:08:26. > :08:32.the army and they will send me to kill my brother or my uncle, this is
:08:33. > :08:36.not acceptable. This is why people go out of Syria, they are running
:08:37. > :08:41.away from the Army. What do you think about other countries like
:08:42. > :08:48.Britain bombing Syria? I agree with this, and this is the solution for
:08:49. > :08:54.them. Because the people who stay in Syria, they are very weak. It is a
:08:55. > :09:00.good thing that the Europeans start to do Army or such things for them.
:09:01. > :09:04.You see yourself as staying in Germany for your whole life? I think
:09:05. > :09:10.I would like to stay here in Germany. I would like to build my
:09:11. > :09:16.future here. Working, having a house, getting married. Spending my
:09:17. > :09:20.life here. I think this is a good place to build my future, it is a
:09:21. > :09:29.good country and everything here is good. And what does he think of his
:09:30. > :09:31.role in this historic moment in the refugee crisis?
:09:32. > :09:36.Do you think you will ever do something like that again in your
:09:37. > :09:41.life? I think no, it is only once in my life and I am going to tell this
:09:42. > :09:43.to my children when I have a family, and they will be proud of this.
:09:44. > :09:47.And you can see the third film in that series tomorrow.
:09:48. > :09:48.From the consequences of a migration crisis,
:09:49. > :10:03.The man in effective charge of the American led coalition
:10:04. > :10:05.fighting so-called Islamic State is President Obama's Special Envoy
:10:06. > :10:09.He's been in post less than two months, but was in London today.
:10:10. > :10:12.A good chance to take stock on the war.
:10:13. > :10:15.In many ways this is different than anything we've faced before.
:10:16. > :10:18.30,000 foreign fighters from all around the world.
:10:19. > :10:20.100 countries of the world, coming into Syria.
:10:21. > :10:23.We have really never seen anything like this before.
:10:24. > :10:36.And it is something we need a global coalition to confront.
:10:37. > :10:43.Just characterise the enemy for me, if you would.
:10:44. > :10:46.Do you see them as rational in any way, in their own terms?
:10:47. > :10:50.There is no question about their overall ideology.
:10:51. > :10:52.There is no question about, as we see them on the ground,
:10:53. > :10:55.in terms of the number of suicide bombers even in just daily
:10:56. > :10:57.engagements, sometimes ten to 12 suicide bombers in
:10:58. > :11:01.We have had in Iraq sometimes 60 suicide bombers in a single month.
:11:02. > :11:03.All the suicide bombers we assess are foreign fighters,
:11:04. > :11:06.so they're coming from all around the world.
:11:07. > :11:12.So people like this cannot be reasoned with and that is why
:11:13. > :11:15.we are determined, as the president said, to destroy Isil.
:11:16. > :11:18.Do they have, what is your best guess, do they have much support
:11:19. > :11:21.on the ground among the population over whom, whose territory
:11:22. > :11:26.So Ramadi, Isil pretended to be the defenders of the people
:11:27. > :11:30.Eventually, when they really took over Ramadi back in May,
:11:31. > :11:33.they cleansed the city of anyone that disagreed with them.
:11:34. > :11:36.They tried to impose their doctrinaire, eighth
:11:37. > :11:40.And now in Ramadi as Iraqi security forces have been
:11:41. > :11:44.on the counterattack for two months and as Daesh is focused on the core
:11:45. > :11:46.centre of the city, they have blown the last bridge,
:11:47. > :11:48.basically isolating themselves in the centre of the city
:11:49. > :11:56.and eventually the Iraqi security forces are confident,
:11:57. > :11:59.it will take some time, we'll clear them from the centre of Ramadi.
:12:00. > :12:02.But importantly, the fighters in Ramadi, based on our information,
:12:03. > :12:04.you have Chechens, you have people speaking Russian,
:12:05. > :12:06.you have Egyptians, you have foreign fighters from all around the world.
:12:07. > :12:08.Holding human shields, the citizens of Ramadi,
:12:09. > :12:12.So any notion that this barbaric terrorist group was serving some
:12:13. > :12:16.sort of legitimate end has really been revealed as a total lie.
:12:17. > :12:21.So the objective is clear, it is to degrade and destroy Isis,
:12:22. > :12:28.it is not to contain or to contain and degrade,
:12:29. > :12:32.it has absolutely moved to destroying them.
:12:33. > :12:38.Everybody says, in order to achieve that goal,
:12:39. > :12:40.there has to be a ground force at some point.
:12:41. > :12:43.And the great mystery of this war has been who's
:12:44. > :12:47.Can you throw any light on who it is going to be that
:12:48. > :12:54.Well, it's different forces in different parts.
:12:55. > :13:00.Let me go around the Horn, I will go clockwise.
:13:01. > :13:04.So if you just take Syria and Iraq and the core, again this is not
:13:05. > :13:07.just about the core, it is the networks and affiliates.
:13:08. > :13:09.But it really is the core that we have to focus on,
:13:10. > :13:16.To the west of the Euphrates River there is about a 98 kilometre strip
:13:17. > :13:18.of border which Daesh still controls, with Turkey.
:13:19. > :13:20.We are working that very aggressively with the Turks
:13:21. > :13:24.And also with a group of Sunni opposition forces near the town
:13:25. > :13:27.of Mara, which we call the Mara line, to begin pushing
:13:28. > :13:31.But I will say the Russian air campaign has made
:13:32. > :13:35.The Russians say they are attacking Daesh, and they are in some
:13:36. > :13:37.respects, but they're also attacking moderate opposition forces
:13:38. > :13:41.So the Russians have made that particular terrain a little
:13:42. > :13:44.So in that part, Sunni Arab opposition forces.
:13:45. > :13:46.East of the Euphrates, the entire border region with Turkey
:13:47. > :13:51.It is Syrian Kurds and also increasingly Arabs and Christians,
:13:52. > :13:55.which we are prepared to work with to push down and isolate Raqqa.
:13:56. > :13:57.Those forces are actually having some real success.
:13:58. > :13:59.Over to the east near the Iraqi border they have now cleared
:14:00. > :14:01.an operation in just the last three weeks,
:14:02. > :14:33.1000 square kilometres of very critical terrain.
:14:34. > :14:40.We hope to continue and advance this process and eventually begin to
:14:41. > :14:50.de-escalate the conflict between the opposition and the regime. 70,000
:14:51. > :15:04.would-be above your own estimate? I think it is with -- within our own
:15:05. > :15:07.estimate. We cannot get to a ceasefire unless we have a very
:15:08. > :15:12.credible political process, but that will free up an awful lot of force
:15:13. > :15:13.to focus on extremist groups. Special envoy Brett McGurk, thank
:15:14. > :15:15.you. The last official inflation figure
:15:16. > :15:17.to be published this year was released this morning,
:15:18. > :15:19.and continued the extraordinary pattern that's been
:15:20. > :15:21.with us through 2015. Not deflation, but not
:15:22. > :15:28.really inflation either. This year of no-flation
:15:29. > :15:31.is another of those massive To think that two years ago,
:15:32. > :15:35.Bank of England economists were expecting inflation now
:15:36. > :15:40.to be at the target 2%. We'll be looking back and looking
:15:41. > :15:47.ahead with two commentators in a moment, but first
:15:48. > :15:50.think about this year. As a measure of what a special year
:15:51. > :15:54.this has been, just have a look That flat bit at the end,
:15:55. > :16:02.that's inflation This is how far you have to go back
:16:03. > :16:14.to get to a comparable period. Yes, all the way back to 1960,
:16:15. > :16:17.when Harold Macmillan was Prime Minister, so long ago
:16:18. > :16:19.no-one had even heard Now there is another way this year
:16:20. > :16:38.has been interesting. 2015 saw the end of the long great
:16:39. > :16:38.squeeze. Post-crash, we've had the longest
:16:39. > :16:40.fall in average wages that Inflation - the red line,
:16:41. > :16:44.was above pay rises - the blue one, leaving
:16:45. > :16:51.ordinary people worse off. Years in which companies have had it
:16:52. > :17:04.easy, profits have been high and workers have
:17:05. > :17:07.suffered, has shifted. Not from higher wages note,
:17:08. > :17:10.but from lower inflation. Well, inflation probably can't
:17:11. > :17:16.stay as low as it is, as oil prices can't
:17:17. > :17:19.keep falling as much as they have. tomorrow and we could follow
:17:20. > :17:24.in the next 18 months. New hazards may come along,
:17:25. > :17:26.but at least at last, we've had the first proper
:17:27. > :17:32.respite since the crash. Well, joining me now to chew over
:17:33. > :17:35.all of this are George Magnus, the economist and writer,
:17:36. > :17:37.and Rain Newton-Smith who is the head of
:17:38. > :17:50.economics for the CBI. Welcome. George, this year is
:17:51. > :17:59.interesting, did you see it coming. The has has performed this year was
:18:00. > :18:09.pretty double. -- predictable. The alp turned is not bad. -- out turn.
:18:10. > :18:13.Low inflation also was not a surprise, what we did not see was a
:18:14. > :18:20.further drop in oil prices which has just begun. The scorecard for the
:18:21. > :18:28.year probably better than you could have hoped for. Rain, has it been
:18:29. > :18:33.OK, for business, our businesses seeing profits squeezed with low
:18:34. > :18:39.prices or do they love the low oil prices. If you talk to businesses as
:18:40. > :18:43.a whole they see the UK as one of the bright lights in the global
:18:44. > :18:47.economy this year and in the next couple of years, driven by the twin
:18:48. > :18:51.engines of consumption and investment. One of the things that
:18:52. > :18:58.struck me talking to businesses for the past six months is how resilient
:18:59. > :19:02.the recovery is. It is more related to the sector you're in how you feel
:19:03. > :19:09.about that and party that is how oil prices affect businesses and the
:19:10. > :19:13.exchange rate. Living standards were a big thing this year, years of
:19:14. > :19:22.unpleasantness for working households on average, that turned.
:19:23. > :19:24.Can that continue. Of course economic slipknot known as the
:19:25. > :19:31.dismal science for nothing. It would be churlish not to sound a little
:19:32. > :19:35.note of caution for the year ahead. Everyone has their own favourite
:19:36. > :19:41.issues they worry about. The three things I worry about in the UK,
:19:42. > :19:45.productivity, which has started to turn after years of terrible
:19:46. > :19:52.performance. The hourly output. Exactly. The efficiency of labour.
:19:53. > :19:57.We have got to be, we hopefully can be confident that will keep going.
:19:58. > :20:02.If not then the real incomes you pointed out in your package will
:20:03. > :20:07.start to go in the other direction. Secondly is investment, although
:20:08. > :20:11.that has picked up, the rate of investment in the UK is still many
:20:12. > :20:17.percentage points of GDP lower than ten or 15 years ago. And third, the
:20:18. > :20:22.corrosive impact of inter-generational inequality. The
:20:23. > :20:26.difference between the way in which older citizens have made out during
:20:27. > :20:32.the last few years and younger people. Young people really in terms
:20:33. > :20:38.of income, housing, affordability, education, they have been screwed.
:20:39. > :20:46.That is a terrible condition, it is corrosive. I think it should be a
:20:47. > :20:52.big issue for the government. Do you agree with that. I think over the
:20:53. > :20:59.longer term there is a concern about some intergenerational shifts we're
:21:00. > :21:04.seeing at the moment. In a way the key to improved living standards in
:21:05. > :21:08.the long term is productivity as George said. On that we are seeing
:21:09. > :21:14.encouraging signs, economists have got it wrong before so we do need to
:21:15. > :21:16.have some humility. But I think we expect business investment to
:21:17. > :21:20.contribute around one third of growth in the next couple of years
:21:21. > :21:24.and that should help productivity now and in the future. And there was
:21:25. > :21:30.room for upward expansion in productivity, it is an opportunity
:21:31. > :21:36.as well as a problem. Well we can ask where this goes now because
:21:37. > :21:41.interest rate, tomorrow the US will make the decision. Expect patient is
:21:42. > :21:49.they will move. What do you expect for the UK. Things have changed a
:21:50. > :21:54.lot. Mark Carney said earlier this year he thought the situation would
:21:55. > :21:59.become clear by the end of the year and he said today it is not clear!
:22:00. > :22:06.So the consensus seems to be interest rates in the UK will not
:22:07. > :22:11.move until the end of 2016 or even to those on they may go earlier, by
:22:12. > :22:17.the middle of the year I think we will have the first rise in rates.
:22:18. > :22:24.Well we are at the point at which there is no inflation. We do not
:22:25. > :22:27.want to make the mistake of looking at inflation now and making a
:22:28. > :22:30.decision on policy based on that, we need to look to the future and when
:22:31. > :22:35.we talk to businesses they speak about skill shortages and how
:22:36. > :22:42.difficult it is to find the right people to expand their business. I
:22:43. > :22:45.think that is why all eyes are on the labour market and whether we
:22:46. > :22:51.could see page picking up more strongly than expected. What is the
:22:52. > :23:00.CBI predicting for growth next year. 2.5%. Sort of average. It is a lot
:23:01. > :23:05.of consensus around the UK economy but there is a lot of fragility as
:23:06. > :23:10.well and concerns around some global risks. But also whether some
:23:11. > :23:11.headwinds could have more of an impact on investment than we
:23:12. > :23:14.currently expect. In less than two hours,
:23:15. > :23:16.Donald Trump will take part in the latest US Republican
:23:17. > :23:19.Presidential TV debate in Las Vegas. Other candidates will of course be
:23:20. > :23:22.there, but in truth, the debate in the Republican party
:23:23. > :23:25.is mainly about Mr Trump. He continues to flourish
:23:26. > :23:28.in the polls, notwithstanding his controversial proposal that foreign
:23:29. > :23:30.Muslims should be barred He is not the bookies' favourite
:23:31. > :23:35.to be next president, One of his supporters, possibly even
:23:36. > :23:41.one of his inspirations, is the right wing polemicist
:23:42. > :23:43.and best-selling author Ann Coulter. She introduced Trump,
:23:44. > :23:46.and praised his stance on immigration, at a campaign
:23:47. > :23:50.rally in Iowa in August. Since Donald Trump has announced
:23:51. > :23:54.he's running for president, I can't believe I turn on TV,
:23:55. > :24:00.he's on prime time TV every night about anchor babies,
:24:01. > :24:03.they're talking about sanctuary cities, they're talking
:24:04. > :24:06.about Mexican rapists. FROM AUDIENCE: They're
:24:07. > :24:08.talking about the wall! They can only win...
:24:09. > :24:11.They're talking about the wall. I love the idea of the
:24:12. > :24:18.Great Wall of Trump. Well, Ann Coulter joins
:24:19. > :24:20.us now from Las Vegas, where that debate
:24:21. > :24:26.is soon to be held. Is it correct that Donald Trump took
:24:27. > :24:33.some inspiration from you, Is it correct that Donald Trump took
:24:34. > :24:40.talked about Mexican rapists before he talked about them. I have tried
:24:41. > :24:45.to push the immigration issue on a lot of Republican candidates. A few
:24:46. > :24:51.in particular I had long conversations with. And sent
:24:52. > :24:57.advanced copies of my book adios America too. Donald Trump saw me in
:24:58. > :25:03.an interview one week before my book came out, I was on the way to the
:25:04. > :25:09.airport in Miami and got an e-mail from him asking for an advanced copy
:25:10. > :25:14.of my book. My book has a lot of startling facts in it and is
:25:15. > :25:17.carefully documented. I think it is the first time there was a lot of
:25:18. > :25:21.discussion about a lot of the criminal cultures and launched my
:25:22. > :25:29.country and the country just has no unity to that. -- immunity. We are
:25:30. > :25:34.used to criminals being dumb and living there DNA all over the place.
:25:35. > :25:38.A lot of people come into the country have a lot of criminal
:25:39. > :25:45.habits, massive insurance frauds, and we have no immunity to that.
:25:46. > :25:48.Have you had contact with European counterparts who think in a similar
:25:49. > :25:52.way to you, the National front in France for example, are you talking
:25:53. > :26:00.to these guys or in completely separate worlds. I guess I wish you
:26:01. > :26:04.the best, I used to like to go on vacation there but I am American and
:26:05. > :26:11.care about America. As we are finding out, so do a lot of
:26:12. > :26:15.Americans. I want to talk to the language and tone of the campaign.
:26:16. > :26:21.You have used words referring to Muslims or people of Arab descent,
:26:22. > :26:29.rag headed camel jockey, is that right. It was a joke and a funny
:26:30. > :26:32.joke and people did laugh. You have to give the full context of my
:26:33. > :26:38.remarks. It is interesting, Donald Trump I do not think is used these
:26:39. > :26:45.kind of terms. He has steered clear, why do you think he does not use
:26:46. > :26:48.that language? I think you're wrong, I think we used similar language and
:26:49. > :26:55.get attacked in the same way which is completely lifting little
:26:56. > :27:00.snippets out and acting as if it was said with earnest anger which is why
:27:01. > :27:05.two weeks after Donald Trump announced I brought some Hollywood
:27:06. > :27:08.friends speaking out to group in LA and they were sceptical of him. They
:27:09. > :27:12.walked out of the room saying that they laughed more than they do at
:27:13. > :27:19.comedy clubs. He is extremely funny and when you see these clips of him,
:27:20. > :27:24.or of me, where you cut off the point, cut off the job, it is just
:27:25. > :27:29.one of the many ways that the media lies. I think in much of western
:27:30. > :27:35.society people would avoid making jokes using racially disparaging
:27:36. > :27:38.words. I wonder if you think it is acceptable or would be helpful to
:27:39. > :27:43.the Donald Trump campaign if he started to use racist language more
:27:44. > :27:51.overtly. I do not use racist language. You have to go back to a
:27:52. > :27:57.speech from 2006 and take two words from a joke, a joke about political
:27:58. > :28:02.correctness. And things going on in the world at that time. 10,000
:28:03. > :28:07.people in the room laughed, that is funny. What Donald Trump is doing is
:28:08. > :28:12.not, the big issue of the campaign is immigration. A lot of that has to
:28:13. > :28:18.do with this always being the pushback. We try to speak about what
:28:19. > :28:24.is good for the country and the only response is to hear epithets, you
:28:25. > :28:30.are racist, you are a bigot. He is challenging that as well, that PC
:28:31. > :28:33.regime that people are fed up with. I'm getting a slightly different
:28:34. > :28:38.point, whether the tone that you adopt and which I think he has been
:28:39. > :28:42.less adopting off, whether that tone is helpful to the cause you're
:28:43. > :28:48.trying to promote. Whether for example using terms that disparage
:28:49. > :28:55.people weren't that are rather coarse in the way you characterise
:28:56. > :28:58.people, it is whether that makes those people better American
:28:59. > :29:02.citizens and better disposed to you and less happy to think of you
:29:03. > :29:06.getting killed in a terrorist outrage. It is whether these things
:29:07. > :29:13.work or not. I call it funny. The New York Times euphemism for funny
:29:14. > :29:19.is Softworks. Other people find it funny and it is a good way to get
:29:20. > :29:25.the message across. People do listen to me and of course, Winston
:29:26. > :29:30.Churchill gave speeches, of course he was self promoting, that is how
:29:31. > :29:35.you get heard. And to be nit-picking a joke from eight years ago, it
:29:36. > :29:40.shows you the pushback whenever we try to talk about immigration which
:29:41. > :29:43.is driving down wages. Every one of your topics tonight, it is a
:29:44. > :29:49.question of immigration. Dumping more and more poor and needy people,
:29:50. > :29:53.demanding people, on the country, who sometimes flip up and commit
:29:54. > :30:01.mass murder. But we cannot talk about that. I have not said you
:30:02. > :30:05.cannot talk about immigration. We are talking about my language. That
:30:06. > :30:11.was the languished you used, not immigration. One thing I do not
:30:12. > :30:17.understand about Donald Trump, what he says about his daughter. Yes,
:30:18. > :30:21.she's really something, what a beauty. If I were not happily
:30:22. > :30:28.married and did not know her father... Or perhaps I would be
:30:29. > :30:31.dating her. And a reference to her in Playboy magazine. What is he
:30:32. > :30:47.talking about? He's just being funny that he has an
:30:48. > :30:50.attractive daughter. He is famous for dating models, it is
:30:51. > :30:55.self-deprecating. He is saying I have a beautiful daughter, a lot of
:30:56. > :31:04.fathers say that about their daughters. You are against gay
:31:05. > :31:10.marriage. What's worse, two men getting married or a 69-year-old
:31:11. > :31:19.talking about dating his daughter, which is more creepy? I thought we
:31:20. > :31:26.got our sense of humour from the British! He says his daughter is
:31:27. > :31:30.pretty, and again we are nit-picking a joke rather than discussing the
:31:31. > :31:36.important issues of the day, which is that Donald Trump is soaring in
:31:37. > :31:40.the polls because he is the only one talking about immigration, something
:31:41. > :31:44.American people have been asking for for 40 years. After this debate
:31:45. > :31:48.there will be no one else on stage and Donald Tripp will have to start
:31:49. > :31:50.doing card tricks or something because they will be wiped out.
:31:51. > :31:51.Thank you. You probably didn't know
:31:52. > :31:54.there was such a thing as a digital age of consent, so it can only be
:31:55. > :31:58.a surprise a proposal is afoot The most striking consequence
:31:59. > :32:12.would be that no one would be able to process data of an under
:32:13. > :32:13.16-year-old So young teens would not be able
:32:14. > :32:17.to go on social media Which raises the question -
:32:18. > :32:21.is social media a healthy pastime Joining me now from Dublin
:32:22. > :32:30.are Mary Aiken, a cyber psychologist and adviser to the UN on this issue,
:32:31. > :32:43.and vlogger Lex Croucher. Mary, what do you think is the
:32:44. > :32:48.problem with 13, 14, 15-year-olds unregulated by adults going into
:32:49. > :32:53.social media sites? The issue we are talking about at the moment, the
:32:54. > :33:00.current guidelines centre on those who are under 13. What we know in
:33:01. > :33:03.terms of studies is that 39% of 9-12 -year-olds have social media
:33:04. > :33:08.accounts. Clearly the current guidelines are not being adhered to.
:33:09. > :33:14.This is another step forward in terms of data protection, where the
:33:15. > :33:19.EU is proposing to adjust that age to 16, which effectively means
:33:20. > :33:22.15-year-olds and under. Take me through what some of the
:33:23. > :33:28.psychological problems are with those 15-year-olds being on Facebook
:33:29. > :33:33.chatting to each other and whatever. I think chatting on Facebook doesn't
:33:34. > :33:37.cause psychological problems, I think the issue is about periods of
:33:38. > :33:44.development. For example, if you take a young child who is eight or
:33:45. > :33:48.nine and develops a large network, really are they developmentally
:33:49. > :33:54.mature enough to be able to cope with huge numbers of friends,
:33:55. > :33:58.whether they are eight, nine, ten or 11, and particularly prior to
:33:59. > :34:04.fundamental development periods such as Ericsson 's identity formation,
:34:05. > :34:13.which happens between nine, ten, 11, 12, 13. There's a recommended number
:34:14. > :34:19.in cyber psychology, for relationships it is actually 150. As
:34:20. > :34:23.humans, once we build networks beyond that number, we begin to
:34:24. > :34:29.suffer from social stress and exhaustion. Can you imagine the
:34:30. > :34:40.burden for very young children with thousands of connections? Lex, how
:34:41. > :34:46.many Facebook friends do you have? Not that many, only about 300. Do
:34:47. > :34:52.you recognise any of this problem Mary was describing? I think when we
:34:53. > :34:57.are talking about 9-12 -year-olds, that's a bit of a different issue
:34:58. > :35:03.but I also see different changes coming about. I find that people who
:35:04. > :35:09.have similar interests may be made friends they wouldn't be able to on
:35:10. > :35:15.the Internet. So you can find niche groups. You are in your 20s now and
:35:16. > :35:20.you started at what age? I was on social media forums from the age of
:35:21. > :35:25.about 14. So you would have been affected by the raising of the age.
:35:26. > :35:30.Mary, take me through what it goes to somebody in a state of
:35:31. > :35:38.development, the harm it can do to them. What harm can come to someone
:35:39. > :35:45.who is 14 or 15, and has created an avatar online and they are out there
:35:46. > :35:49.being that person? It is an interesting construct. As a
:35:50. > :35:54.behavioural scientist, this is an area we study. I think behavioural
:35:55. > :35:59.scientists are lagging behind in terms of being able to advise
:36:00. > :36:03.caregivers in relation to these issues. For example, if a child
:36:04. > :36:09.creates an idealised version of themselves on a social media site,
:36:10. > :36:14.which is a highly manipulated self, I mean physically manipulated,
:36:15. > :36:18.better skin, more shiny hair, stretched to be five pounds lighter,
:36:19. > :36:27.that virtual self may be increasingly distant from the
:36:28. > :36:28.real-world self which can lead to psychological conflict,
:36:29. > :36:35.hypothetically. I conduct research in this area, we are looking at
:36:36. > :36:39.these transitions over time. In ten years we will be able to tell you
:36:40. > :36:44.the impact of spending that amount of time on social media for children
:36:45. > :36:48.at certain ages, but we would recommend that we don't have to wait
:36:49. > :36:56.for the longitudinal studies and we pay attention to the issues now.
:36:57. > :37:01.That's interesting, that there is a gulf between the online self and
:37:02. > :37:06.your real self, is that true of you, do you think? Were you jealous of
:37:07. > :37:11.others with clean skin and fewer spots online? It was a different
:37:12. > :37:15.culture from the ten years ago, so these issues might be more prevalent
:37:16. > :37:19.now. I just felt I made more connections with people, I found
:37:20. > :37:23.friends online that I couldn't interact with in person so for me it
:37:24. > :37:28.was positive experience but the culture is changing. Do you agree
:37:29. > :37:33.with changing the age and saying you have got to have parental consent? I
:37:34. > :37:41.just cannot see how it would be enforced. Would you advise parents,
:37:42. > :37:48.Mary, to say yes to their 14-year-old who says can I go on
:37:49. > :37:55.Facebook? If the law stipulated that they should be 16, I would never
:37:56. > :37:58.advise a parent... But that law would state with parental permission
:37:59. > :38:07.you could go on. What an adult into that space that is at the moment not
:38:08. > :38:11.governed with an authority figure. I think it depends on the child.
:38:12. > :38:16.Parents are best placed to decide how their child should proceed on a
:38:17. > :38:20.particular platform, but I would also question, how much do parents
:38:21. > :38:25.really know about what their children are doing online? When an
:38:26. > :38:30.app is developed to allow a minor to take an explicit image and send it
:38:31. > :38:35.and the image dissolves, now you are into an ethical and moral issue. We
:38:36. > :38:39.have just had a case in Colorado where a group of young people were
:38:40. > :38:47.using ghost apps which effectively can look like a screen calculator,
:38:48. > :38:54.with collections of images which they were sharing, and parents had
:38:55. > :39:00.no idea. Mary, we do need to stop now. I know there are many parents
:39:01. > :39:04.desperate for advice of the kind you can give. Thank you to you both.
:39:05. > :39:08.There is no doubt what has been the top story of the day
:39:09. > :39:11.British man gets to space, without having to emigrate
:39:12. > :39:15.Well done to flight engineer Tim Peake who arrived at the door
:39:16. > :39:18.of the space station at half past five and who had to wait another two
:39:19. > :39:22.Well done to flight engineer Tim Peake who arrived at the door
:39:23. > :39:26.of the space station at half past five and who had to wait another two
:39:27. > :39:29.It's like the immigration queue at JFK.
:39:30. > :39:31.Tim Peake is described as the first "official" British astronaut,
:39:32. > :39:34.but don't let that mislead you - Britain is not a newcomer
:39:35. > :39:37.to the space race, though many schemes have sadly
:39:38. > :39:39.Talking of which, here's Stephen Smith.
:39:40. > :39:42.Perhaps to Tim Peake's surprise, he is on the left here,
:39:43. > :39:44.and certainly to ours, Britain has found herself
:39:45. > :39:48.involved in a bone fide space launch today.
:39:49. > :39:54.You might never guess at the heartache and manly tears
:39:55. > :39:57.witnessed in lonely corners of our island as the unsung British
:39:58. > :40:03.space programme struggled for liftoff.
:40:04. > :40:05.My name is Doug Millard and I am the space
:40:06. > :40:17.The secret history goes right the way back to
:40:18. > :40:23.We had a rocket called Skylark and that was one of the first
:40:24. > :40:29.Way back in something called the international geophysical year.
:40:30. > :40:31.The rocket downstairs, that was built on
:40:32. > :40:37.At least it was tested on the Isle of Wight.
:40:38. > :40:45.Black Arrow launched a British satellite in 1971.
:40:46. > :40:50.The Americans launched their rocket from Cape Canaveral,
:40:51. > :41:08.Multicoloured sand and chalet bungalows.
:41:09. > :41:17.There is a glorious juxtaposition, so you have
:41:18. > :41:18.a satellite manufacturing centre in Stevenage.
:41:19. > :41:20.You have smaller satellites being put together in Guildford.
:41:21. > :41:23.There is a bit of a spacecraft that landed on Titan,
:41:24. > :41:30.Saturn's largest moon, it is about the size of a pencil
:41:31. > :41:34.and that was built, well they started building it
:41:35. > :41:36.in Canterbury and then they moved up to Milton Keynes.
:41:37. > :41:40.The first bit of that spacecraft to hit Titan was made in England.
:41:41. > :41:42.Is that the nose cone or is that the foot?
:41:43. > :41:51.So it is a little thing about the size of a pen.
:41:52. > :42:02.And it actually went kind of crzsssh.
:42:03. > :42:03.Tim Peake arrives on the International Space Station
:42:04. > :42:12.Even though he has put years of British
:42:13. > :42:15.underachievement in space behind him, some things never change.
:42:16. > :42:17.With classic English reserve, the astronaut keeps his feet
:42:18. > :42:35.I think you would call today a spectacular day in the office.
:42:36. > :42:44.You may remember the story of Lonesome George.
:42:45. > :42:47.He was the century-old tortoise left wandering alone for decades
:42:48. > :42:49.after all of the other Pinta Island tortoises died out.
:42:50. > :42:52.His death in 2012 was thought to be the end of his species.
:42:53. > :42:57.An expedition in the Galapagos Islands has discovered
:42:58. > :42:59.what scientists believes are some of his blood
:43:00. > :43:01.With careful breeding, they're hoping they can
:43:02. > :43:07.So, we thought we'd leave you with some of George's best bits.
:43:08. > :43:26.# I hope I live to relive the days gone by.
:43:27. > :43:35.# Well tonight I'm gonna live for today.