:00:00. > :00:08.This combination of influences on demand supply and the exchange
:00:09. > :00:11.rate, could lead to a materially lower path for growth and a notably
:00:12. > :00:20.Another day, another warning of the risks of Brexit.
:00:21. > :00:25.The Governor of the Bank of England had his say today.
:00:26. > :00:31.For the Leave campaign, a former chancellor will have his say.
:00:32. > :00:35.We've been bringing you the future since 1922...
:00:36. > :00:37.Is our content distinctive enough for you?
:00:38. > :00:38.We'll debate whether the Government's plans
:00:39. > :00:42.for the BBC have gone too far - or not far enough.
:00:43. > :00:44.And are the workers in this Preston chocolate factory delighted
:00:45. > :00:53.Well, to be honest, I think he gave too much.
:00:54. > :01:01.Because then they all start coming over and the NHS...
:01:02. > :01:17.The Governor of the Bank of England has issued a stark warning that
:01:18. > :01:20.voting to leave the European Union could damage the British economy
:01:21. > :01:22.and possibly trigger a technical recession.
:01:23. > :01:24.Only last month, Mark Carney insisted, perhaps somewhat
:01:25. > :01:26.optimistically, that "assessing and reporting risks does not mean
:01:27. > :01:28.becoming involved in politics", but tonight his unprecedented
:01:29. > :01:29.intervention has placed him at the centre of
:01:30. > :01:38.Leave campaigners have accused him of inviting
:01:39. > :01:40.speculators to short the pound, while one Conservative
:01:41. > :01:58.backbencher has called for his immediate resignation.
:01:59. > :02:04.In a moment Lord Lamont will give his response. First, we can set the
:02:05. > :02:12.scene with Adam. What exactly has Mark Carney said? This revolves
:02:13. > :02:16.around the release of two documents today. One is the regular inflation
:02:17. > :02:20.report, the other is the minutes of the monetary policy committee. If
:02:21. > :02:22.anyone is not an expert on these things, that's fine, these are
:02:23. > :02:29.normally technical, serious, economic documents. They do not
:02:30. > :02:33.normally set your heart flutter. However, what Mark Carney did today
:02:34. > :02:40.was weighed first foot deeply forward into the Brexit debate.
:02:41. > :02:44.Making some very clear points. -- wade. The much unprecedented. It
:02:45. > :02:48.starts at the front of this document saying the most significant risks
:02:49. > :02:55.concern the referendum. And it continues to make that point, saying
:02:56. > :02:58.we had financial stability risks around Stirling, unemployment,
:02:59. > :03:03.inflation, investment, it is quite a long shopping list. -- sterling.
:03:04. > :03:09.Appearing to cover many bases. The most recent weakness reflects
:03:10. > :03:11.in part the forthcoming referendum, on the UK's membership
:03:12. > :03:13.of the European Union, which has pushed up uncertainty
:03:14. > :03:16.measures to levels not seen More profoundly, a vote to leave
:03:17. > :03:19.the European Union could have material economic effects
:03:20. > :03:21.on the exchange rate, on demand The facts that could affect
:03:22. > :03:37.the appropriate setting He went on to say that in the event
:03:38. > :03:40.of a British exit, and he thought one of the possibilities was a
:03:41. > :03:45.technical recession. That would be six months of contraction in the
:03:46. > :03:49.economy. That is a technical expression. But that single word,
:03:50. > :03:53.recession is bound to cause a very significant political response.
:03:54. > :03:57.Especially because of who has uttered it. We have heard it from
:03:58. > :04:01.the world and its wife about what the economic impact might be. The
:04:02. > :04:06.words of President it is getting thrown around. But for the governor
:04:07. > :04:11.of the bank of England to do it this time, how significant is that? Very.
:04:12. > :04:16.This debate is framed a lot around economic reports. We have had a
:04:17. > :04:21.blizzard of them recently. The Bank of England is different. It is our
:04:22. > :04:25.central bank. It is independent and political. Doesn't have shareholders
:04:26. > :04:29.to think about. It's specific remit is to analyse the UK economy, and
:04:30. > :04:34.that is what the governor says he is doing. -- its. He said it would be
:04:35. > :04:42.more political not to release this. Is the economic side of this done
:04:43. > :04:48.and dusted, the debate? We have had a series of reports. This one will
:04:49. > :04:55.get a lot of publicity. We have had the OECD, the ISS, the Treasury's
:04:56. > :05:02.report, and plenty of others. -- IFS. They have all body said the
:05:03. > :05:06.same thing. The IMF will speak tomorrow. It is expected to say
:05:07. > :05:10.similar things. It raises one question, if the economic argument
:05:11. > :05:15.has been decided, and I am sure you will hear the other side of that, is
:05:16. > :05:18.there going to be pressure on the league campaign to look for other
:05:19. > :05:27.areas in which to expand its argument. -- Leave campaign. Lord
:05:28. > :05:34.Lamont will give his view. Former Chancellor of the Exchequer who is
:05:35. > :05:38.currently voting for Leave. He was regarded as an astonishing coup for
:05:39. > :05:41.George Osborne when he was appointed. Arguably the most
:05:42. > :05:47.successful central bank in the world at the time. Are we lucky to have
:05:48. > :05:50.his insights? He came here with a very high reputation, having been a
:05:51. > :05:58.successful governor of the bank of Canada. I think he is in danger of
:05:59. > :06:06.getting too involved in politics. What most afraid about his that --
:06:07. > :06:09.is that he is in danger of creating a self-fulfilling prophecy. He ought
:06:10. > :06:12.to be careful with his words, because when the governor says
:06:13. > :06:18.things it has a great effect. There is no reason why there should be a
:06:19. > :06:22.downturn, or a recession, if Britain votes to leave. There might be a
:06:23. > :06:27.degree of uncertainty. There is no reason for dramatic contraction to
:06:28. > :06:33.take place. Let me finish... For the governor to say this is in danger of
:06:34. > :06:38.creating a crisis where a crisis is completely avoidable and completely
:06:39. > :06:42.unnecessary. It would have been far easier and far more, I think,
:06:43. > :06:47.judicious for him to suit the have said, we are prepared for all
:06:48. > :06:50.contingencies. All eventualities. You are not saying his analysis is
:06:51. > :06:56.wrong, you are saying you should not have said anything? I think it is
:06:57. > :07:02.quite likely to be wrong. I'm not saying it is right. All nine members
:07:03. > :07:13.agree. The monetary policy committee and the governor in August 2013 told
:07:14. > :07:16.the world that when unemployment reached 7% interest rates would
:07:17. > :07:21.rise. Unemployed and it is now 5%. Interest rates have still not risen.
:07:22. > :07:27.I need to be clear, you are not suggesting Mark Carney is in anyway
:07:28. > :07:30.misleading, or trying to deceive the British public? This is a
:07:31. > :07:37.unanimously agreed analysis of what an exit would entail. If you read
:07:38. > :07:44.what they said, it is full of the word "Could". I think it was
:07:45. > :07:49.unnecessary to use the word recession. I don't believe anybody
:07:50. > :07:55.could forecast that there would be a recession after... Recessions are
:07:56. > :08:00.rarely seen by any forecaster. I cannot recall any recession that has
:08:01. > :08:04.been foreseen by forecasters. Really, this was alarmist. What I
:08:05. > :08:07.think is happening, alas, and I think it is demeaning, is that all
:08:08. > :08:13.of these great institutions, the Treasury, the Bank of England, the
:08:14. > :08:17.OECD, the IMF, have become highly politicised. There is a close
:08:18. > :08:20.interaction between the civil servants and all of them into
:08:21. > :08:27.changing, working together, and, you know, that is a consensus. You have
:08:28. > :08:30.used the word politicised to use economic analysis which does not fit
:08:31. > :08:34.with your own on this issue. The Bank of England is much more
:08:35. > :08:39.independent today than when you were Chancellor, and more than it has
:08:40. > :08:43.been since its inception. To accuse all of the committee to be motivated
:08:44. > :08:49.by anything other than sincerity, true, objectivity is a little bit,
:08:50. > :08:53.well, that is perhaps... I don't agree. I think it was unnecessary to
:08:54. > :08:58.talk. There is no justification for talking about a recession. Nobody
:08:59. > :09:03.can foresee a recession. There is the reason why. There are risks, of
:09:04. > :09:09.course, but there are risks both ways. To say that the risks are all
:09:10. > :09:13.one way is a distortion. Of course, but it is the Bank of England's job
:09:14. > :09:18.to look at these issues, to analyse them effectively, and then, in your
:09:19. > :09:23.view, to stay silent. If there was any intent to persuade a political
:09:24. > :09:31.narrative to shift one way or another, if there was any interest
:09:32. > :09:36.vested by them, they would keep quiet. If you take something like
:09:37. > :09:40.the exchange rate. And we were told in chilling terms there might be a
:09:41. > :09:45.fall in the exchange rate. Not so long ago we were being told that the
:09:46. > :09:48.exchange rate, which actually is at the same level when the referendum
:09:49. > :09:55.was announced, we were told it would fall through. The exchange rate is
:09:56. > :10:00.actually... It has been much lower during the lifetime of this
:10:01. > :10:04.government than the previous Coalition Government. It is nothing
:10:05. > :10:08.very alarming. They cannot say for sure what will happen to the
:10:09. > :10:11.exchange rate. But they can provide guidance. It is not just the
:10:12. > :10:16.exchange rate, housing prices will crash, family income will be
:10:17. > :10:20.affected, economic growth which is already contracting would collapse
:10:21. > :10:23.further. I want to be clear about this, Lord Lamont, obviously no
:10:24. > :10:26.forecaster is infallible. Are you saying that he think the governor of
:10:27. > :10:30.the Bank of England and all nine members of the monetary policy
:10:31. > :10:36.committee are wrong, or somehow biased, or something else? I think
:10:37. > :10:44.the NPC are entitled to highlight potential risks. Possibilities. --
:10:45. > :10:49.MPC. But the language used afterwards in the press conference
:10:50. > :10:55.was too certain, emphatic, and two in accordance with the government's
:10:56. > :10:56.view. -- too in accordance. Thanks very much indeed.
:10:57. > :10:59.Earlier today I spoke to the French Finance Minister, Michel Sapin.
:11:00. > :11:01.He was in town for the anti-corruption summit
:11:02. > :11:03.so effectively brought to our attention by David Cameron's
:11:04. > :11:04.fantastically indiscreet descriptions of Nigeria
:11:05. > :11:07.and Afghanistan, but I began by asking him about the referendum
:11:08. > :12:04.and whether he sympathised with Mark Carney's intervention.
:12:05. > :12:06.As Finance Minister of France, can you envision a future
:12:07. > :12:10.in which we would be able to trade freely, the British would be able
:12:11. > :12:12.to trade freely with you, but the freedom of movement
:12:13. > :12:24.between our two countries would be curtailed?
:12:25. > :12:44.Every voter in Britain is imagining hypotheses at the moment, Minister.
:12:45. > :13:30.but would you, as Finance Minister, envision an entente
:13:31. > :13:32.How has this debate, whatever its outcome proves to be,
:13:33. > :14:48.how has it impacted on domestic French politics?
:14:49. > :14:50.the risk of war in Europe, is that to your mind
:14:51. > :15:19.The Government today unveiled a major overhaul
:15:20. > :15:23.Inevitably, some commentators opined that there wasn't enough actual
:15:24. > :15:25.overhauling on the way, while others insisted that there
:15:26. > :15:30.Our job, as ever, is to consider thesis and antithesis in the hope
:15:31. > :15:32.of securing some sort of synthesis, and we'll start doing that
:15:33. > :15:36.In the very first instance, though, viewers need to know that they'll
:15:37. > :15:39.have to pay the licence fee for at least the next eleven years,
:15:40. > :15:41.and programme-makers need to start wrestling
:15:42. > :15:43.with the Culture Secretary John Whittingdale's demand for more
:15:44. > :15:46.Newsnight's political editor, Nicholas Watt, has been delving
:15:47. > :16:20.They feared the worst. It turns out that Tess an Claudia can relax.
:16:21. > :16:25.Strictly keeps its #3r50i78 Saturday evening slot, the BBC license fee is
:16:26. > :16:28.safe for the next decade and the Royal Charter underpinning the
:16:29. > :16:33.corporation will last a full 11 years, though there is a review
:16:34. > :16:38.after five. I think that John Whittingdale's fox
:16:39. > :16:42.has been shot by his own side. Simply because he has had to reign
:16:43. > :16:47.in all of those terrible things he wanted to do to the BBC.
:16:48. > :16:52.But there are concerns over the creation of a new supervisory board.
:16:53. > :16:56.Labour and the BBC believe the Government wants to give itself too
:16:57. > :17:01.great a role in appointing members. We have an executive board that does
:17:02. > :17:05.all the editorial, sort of ultimate responsibility at the BBC. There are
:17:06. > :17:09.no Government appointments on that, there never have been. We are
:17:10. > :17:13.creating a unitary board and we accept that there could be a role
:17:14. > :17:16.for the chairman and vice-chairman, being selected through a public
:17:17. > :17:20.appointment process, we would like to discuss safeguards on that to
:17:21. > :17:25.reflect the BBC's independence, but I think for the rest of the
:17:26. > :17:28.non-execs our starting point they should be a appointed by the
:17:29. > :17:34.chairman, chairing the nominations committee in the same way a plc
:17:35. > :17:39.would. The main concern I have left, is the proposals that he had for
:17:40. > :17:43.appointing the new unity broad, and I think there are a lot of concerns
:17:44. > :17:48.still about those. The White Paper also says that the board has control
:17:49. > :17:52.of editorial direction, it is going to be looking at output after the
:17:53. > :17:56.event. We all know the chilling effect that that can have on
:17:57. > :18:00.creative people, if you get told off for what you did afterwards.
:18:01. > :18:04.But the Government believes that it is right to keep a close eye on an
:18:05. > :18:12.organisation that is funded by the public, to the tune of ?4 billion.
:18:13. > :18:16.They have huge power and authority, and that without accountability is
:18:17. > :18:21.unhealthy. You have to remember that all of the trusts are appointed by
:18:22. > :18:25.the BBC and formally the Governor os of the BBC were appointed by the
:18:26. > :18:31.Government. What is the difference really? Today's squabbles will be
:18:32. > :18:35.resolved, no doubt guaranteeing another generation of blockbuster
:18:36. > :18:39.BBC dramas. The big dilemma in the future will
:18:40. > :18:44.revolve round a question that is left unanswered in the White Paper.
:18:45. > :18:50.Does it put the BBC on a sustainable footing for the decades ahead? Or
:18:51. > :18:54.has the Government set in motion a mechanism to gnaw away at the BBC's
:18:55. > :19:00.funding and structures in the digital age? The license fee is hot
:19:01. > :19:03.safe because the technological changes that will Dominic Grieve the
:19:04. > :19:10.demands of the consumer will make the license fee irrelevant.
:19:11. > :19:14.-- that will drive. Supporters of the BBC believe that all roads
:19:15. > :19:19.eventually lead to the license fee. I think there will always be a tight
:19:20. > :19:24.leash on the BBC, a tight leash on the finances of the BBC, and if the
:19:25. > :19:27.Secretary of State could find an alternative, to the license fee,
:19:28. > :19:32.believe you me he would have found it. The fact he hasn't is because
:19:33. > :19:36.the public can't see an alternative, and none of the commercial companies
:19:37. > :19:42.that compete with the BBC want to compete with them on revenue. None.
:19:43. > :19:47.The BBC will be safe as it moves towards its sentry over the next
:19:48. > :19:51.decade. But the Government has definitelied a clear message. One of
:19:52. > :19:55.the biggest public broadcasters cannot be immune from the digital
:19:56. > :19:59.revolution that is shredding media organisations across the globe.
:20:00. > :20:08.Not release because you have spot add way that our two main stories
:20:09. > :20:13.can be knitted together. The referendum campaign, and the
:20:14. > :20:18.possibility of a new look BBC. This happened when John Whittingdale the
:20:19. > :20:22.churl secretary, one of the Cabinet ministers campaigning for a Brexit
:20:23. > :20:25.told ITV news said he has sympathy with the unease about ITV's decision
:20:26. > :20:28.to invite Nigel Farage who is not part of the formal vote leave
:20:29. > :20:31.campaign to take part in one of the referendum debates. Now, what the
:20:32. > :20:36.Labour Party are saying, is this goes to the heart of their concerns
:20:37. > :20:41.about the Government's role in appointing members of the new
:20:42. > :20:45.unitary board. And they are saying well jonth Whittingdale may have
:20:46. > :20:50.said he was speaking in a personal capacity, but he has a form of quasi
:20:51. > :20:54.judicial role and maybe in future if you have heavy Government
:20:55. > :20:57.involvement maybe you could have a cabinet minister saying I am
:20:58. > :21:01.speaking in a personal capacity but they carry weight. The Government
:21:02. > :21:05.had made clear today it would have liked to appoint some members of the
:21:06. > :21:07.unitary board but they say the BBC has the right to appoint the
:21:08. > :21:12.majority of its members. Waheed Alli, Lord Alli,
:21:13. > :21:14.is a media entrepreneur and Labour life peer,
:21:15. > :21:16.and journalist Stephen Glover is a columnist for the Daily Mail
:21:17. > :21:30.newspaper, they join me now. We will start with you, which
:21:31. > :21:34.expected fireworks have we seen many If you asked the BBC a year ago when
:21:35. > :21:40.John Whittingdale what they expected there was fear and panic, because he
:21:41. > :21:44.was billed as a ferocious Thatcherite and what he has produced
:21:45. > :21:48.today, is, with one or two exception, is more of the same, the
:21:49. > :21:55.BBC has its future secured for the next 11 year, it is going to have a
:21:56. > :21:59.real increase in license fee for the next FIA year, so I think Lord Hall
:22:00. > :22:04.the Director-General will be happy this evening. Why would
:22:05. > :22:06.the Director-General will be happy the ferocity of Thatcherism with a
:22:07. > :22:13.desire to wouldn't that is what they thought.
:22:14. > :22:16.They thought that the Whittingdale was a ferocious Thatcherite and
:22:17. > :22:21.fact, many people who know him, I don't know him he has a reputation
:22:22. > :22:26.for being a cautious person and he was never going to take on the BBC.
:22:27. > :22:30.Behind him, he has a government which doesn't want to fight with the
:22:31. > :22:34.BBC, a few weeks before the referendum. There has been little
:22:35. > :22:39.cautious about your criticism of the BBC over... I wouldn't say that at
:22:40. > :22:44.all. I am balanced and reasonable. That is why you are here. Were you
:22:45. > :22:49.pleased with what came out. There is some good things. I have, I would
:22:50. > :22:53.like to see more evidence that the BBC is going to curtail its
:22:54. > :22:57.like to see more evidence that the which has done a lot to destroy the
:22:58. > :23:00.or undermine the website of newspapers, which are in, you know
:23:01. > :23:05.have big financial problems at the moment, many of them. I I would like
:23:06. > :23:10.have big financial problems at the to have well, I mean, on that point,
:23:11. > :23:13.it should be said it's a good thing that that the BBC has been
:23:14. > :23:18.it should be said it's a good thing give a few million pounds of scraps
:23:19. > :23:22.to local newspapers, 150 journalist, because the effect of
:23:23. > :23:26.to local newspapers, 150 journalist, website, on local newspapers, has
:23:27. > :23:32.made worse, has accelerated the decline. These aren't the headline
:23:33. > :23:33.issues, the notion of making less popular problems, that must trouble
:23:34. > :23:39.you. I doubt, this is sort popular problems, that must trouble
:23:40. > :23:42.are just exhortations, aren't they. We will see. Lord Alli, I presume
:23:43. > :23:46.you perhaps are a bit We will see. Lord Alli, I presume
:23:47. > :23:50.than Steven Glover We will see. Lord Alli, I presume
:23:51. > :23:52.the fireworks. Not really I think the Secretary of
:23:53. > :23:56.the fireworks. Not really I think from an overt attack on the BBC to a
:23:57. > :23:57.the fireworks. Not really I think detail. So if you
:23:58. > :24:03.the fireworks. Not really I think Paper, there are ticking time bombs
:24:04. > :24:07.in there, that he has set to explode over the coming months
:24:08. > :24:09.in there, that he has set to explode independence, we have touched on the
:24:10. > :24:11.appointment of the directors to the board. That needs to be an
:24:12. > :24:17.independent process, it is an board. That needs to be an
:24:18. > :24:20.Government has to give up appointing like a state controlled
:24:21. > :24:22.Government has to give up appointing who is on the board of the BBC. If
:24:23. > :24:28.you look at the license fee, they guaranteed it but in five years'
:24:29. > :24:32.time there is to be a health check and they have taken some of that
:24:33. > :24:35.money, and they have given it to commercial broadcasters, these are
:24:36. > :24:40.commercial broadcasters that are doing very well, without taking
:24:41. > :24:45.license fees, payer's money to make programmes. And the third and
:24:46. > :24:49.probably the most distressing point, is this notion of distinctive
:24:50. > :24:55.programming, it is a Trojan horse, it is put in there to say to the
:24:56. > :24:58.BBC, you need to make distinctive programming, curtail making popular
:24:59. > :25:01.programming, and make distinctive programming. This is to clarify the
:25:02. > :25:06.notion it should be programmes that nobody else would make and the
:25:07. > :25:09.reason they wouldn't is because known wants to watch them. Therefore
:25:10. > :25:13.what happens is the ratings fail in the -- fall in the beak, the
:25:14. > :25:16.Government can say, oh, you are not serving your audience, therefore we
:25:17. > :25:20.want to take more of the license fee away from you. It's a sophisticated
:25:21. > :25:26.plan. Of course it is. They always are. When you can't win your
:25:27. > :25:29.argument, by standing up and making it in public, you hide behind the
:25:30. > :25:34.detail. And that is what the Secretary of State has done and we
:25:35. > :25:37.have to in Parliament protect the license fee payer, and do what the
:25:38. > :25:42.public want. You know, every time we look like we are enjoying ourself,
:25:43. > :25:44.every time we have popular programme, there is always a
:25:45. > :25:49.politician passing by, that wants to take them away from us. Or a
:25:50. > :25:53.journalist, even. Are you comfortable with the BBC making
:25:54. > :25:58.popular and populist programmes? Well, it makes a lot of them, but it
:25:59. > :26:03.seems to me the BBC, but it seems to me, there is no point point of the
:26:04. > :26:06.BBC unless it does some things that the market doesn't do. That I think
:26:07. > :26:13.is the point of what you were talking about. There are some things
:26:14. > :26:18.like documentaries or religious programmes or children's programmes
:26:19. > :26:24.which the BBC, it does, tries to make us laugh. There is a huge
:26:25. > :26:28.amount of output. All one is saying that the BBC needs to attend to
:26:29. > :26:33.those prosecution, which the market doesn't produce, otherwise what is
:26:34. > :26:38.the point of BBC? Briefly cast your mind back a decade or three, did you
:26:39. > :26:44.sit there feeling a sense of resentment as you were chuckling way
:26:45. > :26:48.to more come and wise or Porridge. If they only made programme like
:26:49. > :26:51.that now. You can't make... The argument is not that the BBC
:26:52. > :26:57.shouldn't produce popular programme, it is it should do things with the
:26:58. > :27:04.market may not do. May not produce. If it doesn't do that what is the
:27:05. > :27:10.point of the BBC? Should it can make the Bake Off Of course. Our scones
:27:11. > :27:13.are safe. Gentlemen, many thanks to both of you.
:27:14. > :27:15.You don't need a degree in psephology to realise that,
:27:16. > :27:18.as things stand, the EU referendum will be decided by the votes
:27:19. > :27:22.Research shows that women are more likely than men to fall
:27:23. > :27:26.Men, apparently, are more likely to lie about having already arrived
:27:27. > :27:28.And many observers believe that the old Labour
:27:29. > :27:31.heartlands could hold the key to victory for either side.
:27:32. > :27:33.Accordingly, in the latest of Newsnight's Referendum Road
:27:34. > :27:46.series, Katie Razzall headed to Preston.
:27:47. > :27:57.I want England to be as great as it used to be.
:27:58. > :28:01.I don't like to be told by somebody sat in Belgium what I should do.
:28:02. > :28:15.She is taking her shoes off - I love it!
:28:16. > :28:17.In her prime, June Gregson was goingly for the most successful
:28:18. > :28:23.women's football team of the 20th century.
:28:24. > :28:30.In fact, he burned my football boots.
:28:31. > :28:42.He picked them up and threw them on the fire.
:28:43. > :28:47.June's team, the Dick Kerr Ladies were famous.
:28:48. > :28:49.Named after the Preston munitions factory where they worked,
:28:50. > :28:51.from the off in 1917, her predecessors attracted
:28:52. > :29:01.But when a staggering 53,000 turned out at Everton's Goodison Park
:29:02. > :29:03.in 1920, the largest crowd that had ever been recorded
:29:04. > :29:06.in the Football League, male or female, the fate
:29:07. > :29:12.The FA banned them from playing in their stadiums.
:29:13. > :29:15.Clever young goalie June played for the team in the 1950s,
:29:16. > :29:25.Instead of accepting the mill or shop job that was her lot,
:29:26. > :29:28.she took work in Greece and France - but that doesn't
:29:29. > :29:37.I think this country is big enough, strong enough,
:29:38. > :29:39.and it's certainly got the, oh, what do they say,
:29:40. > :29:48.Let's do it while we have the chance to do it now.
:29:49. > :29:50.And are lots of people, you know, saying
:29:51. > :29:56.There's not many people that I have spoken to,
:29:57. > :30:00.or speak to, is wanting to stay in it.
:30:01. > :30:03.They're sick of the interference in their ordinary lives.
:30:04. > :30:06.June's home town Preston may have changed over the years,
:30:07. > :30:11.but its political affiliations have stayed solidly Labour.
:30:12. > :30:15.That party is officially backing the Remain cause but what of its
:30:16. > :30:17.traditional support base in places like this?
:30:18. > :30:27.Many here seem to hark back to a time before we joined.
:30:28. > :30:31.Beech's Chocolate has been on this site since 1920.
:30:32. > :30:33.Despite losing contracts to factories in eastern Europe,
:30:34. > :30:36.where labour is cheaper, they are going for glory
:30:37. > :30:50.I clocked in and joined the shift.
:30:51. > :30:59.I'll pick it up and take it to the bin for you.
:31:00. > :31:13.So you know, it's quite appropriate we are doing Turkish Delight,
:31:14. > :31:20.To be honest, I think it's too much.
:31:21. > :31:27.Because then they will start coming over and using the NHS
:31:28. > :31:38.Here they sit happily alongside Polish workers,
:31:39. > :31:41.but they are still concerned about the pressures on services
:31:42. > :31:44.caused by freedom of movement within the EU.
:31:45. > :31:47.I had to go to the dentists yesterday, because mine was closed,
:31:48. > :31:51.I hope not too much chocolate?
:31:52. > :32:01.When I went there, there was a lady saying "Are you paying
:32:02. > :32:06.After me, there was eight people come in, none of them paid,
:32:07. > :32:10.You are saying the eight people who came in on benefits,
:32:11. > :32:28.I just think it is because of, with the National Health Service
:32:29. > :32:37.being stretched to the maximum, and the border controls more
:32:38. > :32:40.than anything, because I think with that being stretched,
:32:41. > :32:42.and more people coming in, it's going to be stretched even
:32:43. > :32:45.further, and I think the borders need to be controlled more.
:32:46. > :32:48.Anybody is coming in and you don't know where they are going.
:32:49. > :32:52.We do rely on people coming to work for us, different nationalities
:32:53. > :32:54.and things like that, because if we didn't have these
:32:55. > :32:56.people, we wouldn't be able to do our jobs,
:32:57. > :32:59.we wouldn't be able to get the orders out.
:33:00. > :33:02.I am concerned how many people we are letting in the country.
:33:03. > :33:04.A quarter of semi and unskilled workers recently polled said
:33:05. > :33:13.Some analysts predict the undecided are more likely to vote to stay,
:33:14. > :33:15.but here, everyone I spoke to told me they hadn't made
:33:16. > :33:18.up their minds, before saying in fact life would be
:33:19. > :33:33.How many stars are there on the EU flag?
:33:34. > :33:36.Across town, Newsnight hijacked a pub with a few EU
:33:37. > :33:44.What is the date of the EU referendum?
:33:45. > :33:45.Meet the Pink Ladies, a networking group for
:33:46. > :33:48.Lancashire business women - their very own northern powerhouse.
:33:49. > :33:50.Are people talking about the referendum?
:33:51. > :33:55.I talk to customers, they will discuss it with us.
:33:56. > :34:06.You know, and there is so many for and against, but most people
:34:07. > :34:08.are kind of sat on the fence with it, because -
:34:09. > :34:11.but they are more wavering towards the better the devil you
:34:12. > :34:19.What is the name of agreement signed by the EU states, but not the UK,
:34:20. > :34:28.which led to the abolition of border checks between those countries?
:34:29. > :34:33.Just as plenty across our country don't know how they are going
:34:34. > :34:39.More women than men say they are undecided.
:34:40. > :34:42.I want to know whether it is going to be right or wrong.
:34:43. > :34:45.I want to know whether we are going to stay the same.
:34:46. > :34:49.Yes, Europe make decisions for us, but they are not all bad.
:34:50. > :34:53.Nobody can tell us what is going to happen afterwards,
:34:54. > :34:55.so all that is happening at the moment, everybody is telling
:34:56. > :35:01.us if we leave it will be negative and it will be terrible.
:35:02. > :35:04.And if we stay, then it is positive, but nobody knows, the truth
:35:05. > :35:07.about what is going to happen should we leave.
:35:08. > :35:09.I think that is why everybody is very undecided -
:35:10. > :35:11.they don't really know, because nobody told us
:35:12. > :35:16.I employ a Latvian seamstress, who is wonderful.
:35:17. > :35:25.She is here because of the freedom of movement.
:35:26. > :35:28.There is a shortage of nurses, doctors and those kind of services,
:35:29. > :35:31.and there are jobs there to be filled, but we need that type
:35:32. > :35:34.of person coming in, whereas at the moment, anyone can.
:35:35. > :35:36.Whereas if we had control of our own borders, we could choose
:35:37. > :35:52.June will be a big month for Britain in Europe,
:35:53. > :35:53.the referendum of course, and also football's
:35:54. > :36:01.And it seems our June hasn't quite hung up her boots.
:36:02. > :36:03.Who would you like to take on from the Premier
:36:04. > :36:07.Who do you reckon you would have a good go at?
:36:08. > :36:28.I doubt it very much, but I would have a damn good try!
:36:29. > :36:40.And so to speak to the Oxford union tomorrow and worn that... Update
:36:41. > :36:47.your pardon, to warn the Conservative campaigners are
:36:48. > :36:53.beginning to seem like Europe. -- John Major is going to speak to. The
:36:54. > :36:54.decision about which way to vote can be influenced by all sorts of
:36:55. > :37:00.factors. Many people have said they speak
:37:01. > :37:03.for business in this debate. But as for the entrepreneurs
:37:04. > :37:05.themselves, their decision about which way to vote can be
:37:06. > :37:08.defined by all sorts of factors. So we asked John Timpson,
:37:09. > :37:10.boss of the eponymous key cutting, engraving and "so much more"
:37:11. > :37:13.business to tell us about how he's making his decision about Britain's
:37:14. > :37:24.future membership of the EU. I think that someone
:37:25. > :37:25.who is a process-driven, box-ticking, careful sort of guy,
:37:26. > :37:29.or girl, is going to vote for in, because they are worried
:37:30. > :37:33.about the uncertainty. If someone is more like me,
:37:34. > :37:36.a bit of a maverick, who likes the idea of there
:37:37. > :37:38.being more opportunities, I'll be voting to come out,
:37:39. > :37:49.but I sent an e-mail to my three teenage grandchildren,
:37:50. > :37:51.and asked them the question. I think actually they don't
:37:52. > :38:01.know anything else. They were born in Europe
:38:02. > :38:03.and they have lived I'm starting to now
:38:04. > :38:07.wonder whether perhaps But I don't think that,
:38:08. > :38:12.I think it's typical of somebody who has my experience or remember
:38:13. > :38:15.what it was like when I've met plenty of people who have
:38:16. > :38:19.been to Brussels, who actually are worried about the whole
:38:20. > :38:21.bureaucracy that's being set up Do I find anything about the In
:38:22. > :38:28.argument persuasive? Certainly it does give you a very
:38:29. > :38:37.strong, almost guarantee of peace. No conflict between us
:38:38. > :38:41.and any other part of Europe. And that has got to be -
:38:42. > :38:44.that was really the attraction of the Common Market community
:38:45. > :38:49.in the first place. But it comes at a hell
:38:50. > :38:52.of a price, in giving What I think we should
:38:53. > :38:59.be looking at is not the next four months,
:39:00. > :39:01.or even four years, but ten years ahead,
:39:02. > :39:03.where we have an opportunity to really do much more
:39:04. > :39:06.off our own bat, and show what we in the UK can do,
:39:07. > :39:23.without being tied down The Guardian has John Major warning
:39:24. > :39:29.Brexit Tories they risk morphing into Ukip if they focus too heavily
:39:30. > :39:34.on immigration. The Daily Mail goes after Cameron for ducking a TV
:39:35. > :39:38.debate with the same Brexit Tories. China planning a secret takeover of
:39:39. > :39:44.the nuclear power station in the Times. And the FT picks up the story
:39:45. > :39:49.we covered earlier, Mark Carney's warning to the UK if we quit the
:39:50. > :39:54.European Union. Some might not have been paying too much attention to
:39:55. > :40:01.the contemporary art world, but the Turner prize nominations are out.
:40:02. > :40:04.There are three candidates on the list. Here is a taste of their work.
:40:05. > :40:42.Good night. The heat of the day triggered some
:40:43. > :40:44.lively showers in southern counties. Rumbles of thunder.
:40:45. > :40:46.lively showers in southern counties. overnight. Then we pick up this
:40:47. > :40:47.northerly