:00:08. > :00:15.We're not going to be bullied by anybody, least of all
:00:16. > :00:18.the unelected, charming though he may be, Jean-Claude Juncker.
:00:19. > :00:29.The British thing to do is to fight inside the European Union.
:00:30. > :00:32.With 15 days to go, 2 politicians made their case in 60
:00:33. > :00:33.minutes of argument, so was there a winner?
:00:34. > :00:36.It was certainly a chance for Nigel Farage to lead
:00:37. > :00:54.Do you think your company has outgrown your ability to manage it?
:00:55. > :00:56.Probably, a long time ago. Also tonight: Is this another,
:00:57. > :00:58.unacceptable face of capitalism? And why did it take a newspaper,
:00:59. > :01:02.rather than the authorities to spot I stand with Hillary
:01:03. > :01:06.because I'm a woman. But why are so many women not
:01:07. > :01:10.supporting the democrat No one has had a busier
:01:11. > :01:21.day than Nigel Farage. The man who is not at the helm
:01:22. > :01:24.of the Leave campaign, This afternoon, he was defending
:01:25. > :01:30.himself against attack This evening, he was in front
:01:31. > :01:36.of an audience in one of the set-piece TV
:01:37. > :01:47.events of the campaign. There was no knockout blow. But it
:01:48. > :01:48.presented a much better way to see Nigel Farage perform than we have
:01:49. > :01:56.seen so far. The official Leave
:01:57. > :01:58.campaign think Mr Farage is unhelpful to their cause,
:01:59. > :02:00.driving voters away, But the truth is, the Leave campaign
:02:01. > :02:04.has only started breaking through, since it took a leaf or two out
:02:05. > :02:07.Mr Farage's campaign book. Our political editor,
:02:08. > :02:13.Nick Watt, has been looking We will get your take on Nigel
:02:14. > :02:19.Farage's base in the debate, but a quick summary of how you thought the
:02:20. > :02:24.IDV extravaganza when? -- ITV extravaganza when. David Cameron
:02:25. > :02:30.came under pressure regarding the edge rated claims regarding the
:02:31. > :02:33.effects on the economy, and also the area he does not want to talk about,
:02:34. > :02:38.immigration, Nigel Farage came under pressure for those comments he made
:02:39. > :02:45.linking cologne attacks with members of the European Union, and also a
:02:46. > :02:53.testy in cancer with a black British motor about Ukip's view of those
:02:54. > :02:59.voters -- testing encounter with a black British voter. The Prime
:03:00. > :03:06.Minister will be happy, because Nigel Farage has been put centre
:03:07. > :03:10.stage and the Leave campaign believes he is toxic, but Nigel
:03:11. > :03:14.Farage is happy because he is back where he believes he should be, on
:03:15. > :03:19.terrestrial television. Few other things quickly. Midnight tonight,
:03:20. > :03:24.registration for voting in the referendum closes. If you have not
:03:25. > :03:31.done it by then you will not have a vote, and so what will we know about
:03:32. > :03:34.the electorate? We will get a statement tomorrow on the numbers of
:03:35. > :03:39.people who have registered to vote and the indications are that more
:03:40. > :03:45.people are registering to vote than registered for the general election,
:03:46. > :03:49.and it appears that the 18-24 year old age group and people who live
:03:50. > :03:52.abroad are registering in higher numbers than they did last year and
:03:53. > :03:59.those are the kind of people who might vote for Remain and that might
:04:00. > :04:08.be good news for them. If it is a low turnout, below 55%, that is good
:04:09. > :04:11.for Brexit but if it is 65%, it is good for Remain, but if you go back
:04:12. > :04:18.about 75% it is good news for Brexit. There is good news for
:04:19. > :04:22.Leave, as well? Lord Hayward, he is one of the people who got closest to
:04:23. > :04:29.the general election prediction last year. He is not a pollster? He
:04:30. > :04:35.analyses them, former Conservative MP, he is a Remain supporter but he
:04:36. > :04:39.is going to call the referendum for Leave and he will say barring some
:04:40. > :04:43.unforeseen accident, he thinks that Leave are on course to win and he
:04:44. > :04:54.says he notices demographics who he thinks should be Remain, they are in
:04:55. > :05:00.fact Leave, and that is motorway man. We will bring you a bit of that
:05:01. > :05:04.debate and a bit more Nigel Farage later.
:05:05. > :05:07.With me now is the former shadow home secretary Yvette Cooper
:05:08. > :05:09.who supports Britain remaining in the EU and the Conservative
:05:10. > :05:11.MP Kwasi Kwarteng who wants Britain to leave.
:05:12. > :05:22.Do you agree on the debate, it was a score draw? The significant thing
:05:23. > :05:26.that you did not refer to is the fact that Nigel Farage did admit
:05:27. > :05:33.that there would be tariffs, which he shrugged off the impact, on jobs,
:05:34. > :05:36.I thought that was a serious point, especially the dismissal of the
:05:37. > :05:40.pharmaceutical industry is something, we can watch them leave
:05:41. > :05:43.the country, that would not matter. They are bad guys because they have
:05:44. > :05:48.been hitting alternative medicine, that was a strange moment. The Leave
:05:49. > :05:54.campaign are being cavalier with people's jobs and livelihoods. It
:05:55. > :06:00.might not be Nigel Farage who is hit by this. I will answer your
:06:01. > :06:06.question. Rather than rerunning the debate. The question is fair, the
:06:07. > :06:10.Prime Minister made interesting points and Nigel Farage also held
:06:11. > :06:15.his own, it was a score draw as you suggested. I'm not going to rerun
:06:16. > :06:18.the debate. We can talk about that later. And now a taste of the debate
:06:19. > :06:25.right now. So, yes, the reform
:06:26. > :06:27.goes on, but of course Here is what really
:06:28. > :06:31.happens if we leave. Of course we would still want
:06:32. > :06:34.to sell into that single market, so we would still have to meet
:06:35. > :06:37.all the rules and regulations that Brussels lays down,
:06:38. > :06:40.but we won't be at the table. We will be like a country
:06:41. > :06:42.with our ear and face pressed up against the glass,
:06:43. > :06:45.trying to find out what is happening with the other 27 countries, making
:06:46. > :06:48.rules that affect our country. I would say that is no way
:06:49. > :06:51.for the fifth biggest economy We need to be in this organisation,
:06:52. > :07:09.fighting the British The use of the word quitting came up
:07:10. > :07:16.quite a lot. We can carry on the discussion for now. Kwasi, Nigel
:07:17. > :07:24.Farage has basically been excluded by the official campaign, they think
:07:25. > :07:28.he is to Marmite. He is campaigning in his own way and he makes
:07:29. > :07:37.outlandish statements which get attention, but I think the campaign
:07:38. > :07:40.can be run on its merits and the Leave campaign is getting its
:07:41. > :07:44.message through and the race is tightening. Do you think that Leave
:07:45. > :07:53.should give him more prominence question not he's a consummate
:07:54. > :07:57.performer. -- prominence? I'm not going to praise the skies, I will
:07:58. > :08:04.give him seven out of ten, I thought he made the case about immigration.
:08:05. > :08:07.I'm the son of an immigrant, it is not about being against immigration,
:08:08. > :08:11.but it is about control and I thought he did that effectively.
:08:12. > :08:19.Would you like to see the Leave campaign like to put more weight on
:08:20. > :08:24.Nigel Farage? The Leave campaign have been shifting to a Nigel Farage
:08:25. > :08:30.style approach, the cavalier approach to the facts, for example.
:08:31. > :08:35.The claim about the ?350 million on the bus which is a load of rubbish.
:08:36. > :08:43.That is not Nigel Farage's claim. That is his style. Also, Turkey
:08:44. > :08:49.about to join Europe, we know that Cyprus would veto it, Cyprus. It was
:08:50. > :08:54.official government policy, the policy of your government, as well.
:08:55. > :09:01.You think that Turkey is about to join the EU? Our million Turks going
:09:02. > :09:11.to join any moment? -- are a million Turks. We don't need an argument. Do
:09:12. > :09:15.you think that the Remain side are running out of ideas question mark
:09:16. > :09:21.David Cameron repeats the lines about the economy and the single
:09:22. > :09:25.market. Maybe you need another six phrases, things which sound a bit
:09:26. > :09:31.more positive and reasons to stay. There is a bigger argument about our
:09:32. > :09:36.place in the world and the influence that we have in the world. If we cut
:09:37. > :09:41.ourselves off, the reason we as a small island have such impact in the
:09:42. > :09:46.world is because we are a member, not just the European Union about
:09:47. > :09:50.other organisations. If we pull out, we cut ourselves off and that makes
:09:51. > :09:51.us weaker for the future. There are those ardent scum and the other
:09:52. > :10:00.items we have been there are those arguments and the
:10:01. > :10:08.other is the Labour Party has been trying to put forward, the likes of
:10:09. > :10:15.workers' rights which are so important. The most radical Labour
:10:16. > :10:20.government was 1945, they reshaped the welfare state, and that nothing
:10:21. > :10:26.to do with the EU. It is regarded, become at the government, as one of
:10:27. > :10:32.the shining lights -- the Clement Attlee government. That is
:10:33. > :10:35.absolutely true. The British government has always done a whole
:10:36. > :10:47.series of things... We will carry on doing so. We can carry on doing all
:10:48. > :10:55.kinds of things without the EU. What about the parting shot of David
:10:56. > :11:01.Cameron? Great Britain... Do not fall for Nigel Farage's little
:11:02. > :11:06.England vision. I don't share that vision and I can't speak for Nigel
:11:07. > :11:09.Farage. I'm not a little England, my parents have come from Ghana, part
:11:10. > :11:13.of the British Commonwealth and I feel very connected to other parts
:11:14. > :11:18.of the world and I spent a year in America. We are very international
:11:19. > :11:22.in our outlook and I feel it is Great Britain against little England
:11:23. > :11:27.is false, that is not what the debate is about. It is that national
:11:28. > :11:32.sovereignty and controlling immigration, and having some control
:11:33. > :11:38.of our own destiny. Can I have a comment from each of you about where
:11:39. > :11:42.the state of play is at the moment? This news that Rob Hayward, Lord
:11:43. > :11:49.Hayward, he's one expert, he seems to be: yet for Leave. -- calling it
:11:50. > :11:53.for Leave. It is a good thing that more young people are registering to
:11:54. > :11:57.vote, the clock is still ticking, still time for people to register.
:11:58. > :12:03.It will be about young people's future, that is what will decide it.
:12:04. > :12:07.It will be very close. The polls are tightening, and I want as many
:12:08. > :12:11.people to vote as possible. The idea we want a restricted turnout is
:12:12. > :12:15.false, I want as many people do indoors whatever decision the
:12:16. > :12:22.British people make as possible. -- to endorse. Laax. We
:12:23. > :12:29.Away from the referendum, the most absorbing political
:12:30. > :12:31.spectacle today was the appearance in front of the Business Select
:12:32. > :12:33.Committee of Mike Ashley, the founder of Sports Direct.
:12:34. > :12:36.The MPs wanted to ask him about his unusually brutal
:12:37. > :12:38.treatment of staff - if you're a minute late,
:12:39. > :12:41.you lose 15 minutes of pay was one example of his munificence.
:12:42. > :12:43.He had originally declined to meet the committee,
:12:44. > :12:47.Our new Business Editor, Helen Thomas was watching
:12:48. > :12:52.The tough guy of British retail arriving for a showdown
:12:53. > :12:57.His public image, that of a truculent wealthy boss,
:12:58. > :13:00.obsessed with profits over the welfare of his workforce.
:13:01. > :13:10.Instead, Westminster was surprised by a dose of Mike Ashley candour.
:13:11. > :13:12.Do you accept that the company was effectively paying workers
:13:13. > :13:24.On that specific point, for that specific bit of time, yes.
:13:25. > :13:32.This, an admission that the time staff had spent in security checks
:13:33. > :13:33.at Sports Direct's massive Derbyshire warehouse
:13:34. > :13:39.If you were a minute late, you got docked 15 minutes pay.
:13:40. > :13:46.You asked me what I think, I think that is unacceptable.
:13:47. > :13:49.If one of my kids went to work somewhere and they were two minutes
:13:50. > :13:52.late and they got fined 15 minutes pay I would not be very
:13:53. > :13:57.He even issued an open invitation to prying MPs.
:13:58. > :14:00.Could we turn up unannounced at a date we don't tell you about?
:14:01. > :14:06.But all I want is fairness and balance.
:14:07. > :14:09.You will be let in and everything else.
:14:10. > :14:13.I'm telling you, you will find things wrong, but then let's do it
:14:14. > :14:18.MPs don't want this kind of planned press tour.
:14:19. > :14:20.They are interested in an unvarnished look.
:14:21. > :14:23.The horror stories of fearful employees working through sickness,
:14:24. > :14:27.of one woman giving birth in the toilet and of
:14:28. > :14:29.a business overly reliant on zero hours contracts.
:14:30. > :14:33.That is workers with limited rights and no guarantee of work.
:14:34. > :14:36.But Sports Direct has not just been taking flak from trade
:14:37. > :14:45.Investors have also bulked at Mr Ashley's grip on the company
:14:46. > :14:50.Today, for the first time, a hint that there could be change.
:14:51. > :14:52.In the boardroom as well as on the shop floor.
:14:53. > :14:54.You are someone who has created an extraordinary company.
:14:55. > :15:02.You have created a lot of wealth and a lot of it has gone to you.
:15:03. > :15:06.You have created a lot of wealth and done something remarkable,
:15:07. > :15:10.but do you think your company has outgrown your ability to manage it?
:15:11. > :15:14.Some of the things you have said today would actually lead me
:15:15. > :15:17.to believe that it has definitely outgrown me.
:15:18. > :15:20.Mike Ashley did not want to come to London.
:15:21. > :15:23.Trade unions, politicians and investors, they have all tried
:15:24. > :15:28.to get him to change the way he does business, none have succeeded,
:15:29. > :15:30.but today he admitted that as the company has grown,
:15:31. > :15:38.Sports Direct has failed its low paid staff.
:15:39. > :15:42.The irony is that it took the kind of media and political circus that
:15:43. > :15:47.Mike Ashley appears to so despise to hold the company to account.
:15:48. > :15:51.Today, Mike Ashley, tomorrow BHS bosses will face MPs.
:15:52. > :15:53.Some of the more colourful parts of British business are being
:15:54. > :16:06.dragged, like it or not, into the spotlight.
:16:07. > :16:09.A lot of people look at Mike Ashley, or at recent events at BHS,
:16:10. > :16:11.or low-tax paying multinationals and wonder whether there
:16:12. > :16:13.is some kind of problem with capitalism, or capitalists.
:16:14. > :16:21.But you might also ask, where are the authorities in this?
:16:22. > :16:26.Are we soft on anti social businesses?
:16:27. > :16:29.The man to tell us is Sir David Norgrove, chairman
:16:30. > :16:32.That has the job of assessing the minimum wage, not enforcing it.
:16:33. > :16:34.He was also chairman of the Pensions Regulator,
:16:35. > :16:37.which governs workplace pensions, a big issue in the BHS case.
:16:38. > :16:46.Good evening to you. It's interesting that this happened.
:16:47. > :16:49.Should the authorities be worried that people think it is better to
:16:50. > :16:59.hit them by going to read newspaper, rather than reporting them? A lot of
:17:00. > :17:03.people are. H MRC pinfalls it. More people should go to them and
:17:04. > :17:08.complain if they think they are not getting the amount of money they
:17:09. > :17:16.think they should be getting. -- HMRC is responsible for it. What
:17:17. > :17:25.proportion of that is detected, this below minimum wage payment? It is
:17:26. > :17:28.difficult, possibly rough estimates are possible. Give me a rough
:17:29. > :17:34.estimate, it must be a few hundred cases. It is in the thousands, the
:17:35. > :17:54.complaints that get followed up. The estimate is roughly about .5% of
:17:55. > :18:01.employees. Are? Page below. -- paid below. Do you think the penalties
:18:02. > :18:06.are big enough? The penalties have quadrupled over the past few years,
:18:07. > :18:11.they are real or higher... You can be fined up to ?20,000 per employee.
:18:12. > :18:18.For example, one employer we know of was fined ?500,000, when a few years
:18:19. > :18:25.ago they would have only had to pay a fuse house in pounds. There has
:18:26. > :18:29.been a big increase. -- a few thousand pounds. Thanks to naming
:18:30. > :18:35.and shaming this has had an effect. Mike Ashley has reached an agreement
:18:36. > :18:41.with HMRC. We don't know what the agreement is. At some stage it will
:18:42. > :18:49.be published. Why won't it be public straightaway? You would have to ask
:18:50. > :18:52.HMRC. I don't know. Don't you find it odd, it should be open justice,
:18:53. > :18:58.do we sit and negotiate with these people who have done something quite
:18:59. > :19:04.bad? In many cases they are published. Penalties are published.
:19:05. > :19:08.The company has to account to local newspapers, or local television when
:19:09. > :19:11.it has done something wrong. Is it good enough that he pays the money
:19:12. > :19:15.he should have paid to his staff, and maybe pay some extra, and
:19:16. > :19:21.doesn't, for example, do a few nights in jail, or have to come you
:19:22. > :19:26.know, do community service for a couple of weeks... We would like to
:19:27. > :19:31.see more prosecutions than there are. Criminal prosecutions, we are
:19:32. > :19:37.talking about four, five. Yes, very small numbers. We want to see more.
:19:38. > :19:41.I don't want to sound wimpish. Prosecutions are very expensive and
:19:42. > :19:46.time-consuming. I think this is what makes the public so angry. The idea
:19:47. > :19:49.that they will go after a false benefit claimants. Would they treat
:19:50. > :19:54.an employer in the same way as a benefit cheat? Somebody who makes a
:19:55. > :20:03.false claim... I don't know enough about the net and -- about benefit
:20:04. > :20:06.claimants. Standing back from the minimum wage commission, do you
:20:07. > :20:11.think we are a soft touch? The pensions regulation is just catching
:20:12. > :20:15.up with what has been going on at BHS, a lot of money has been taken
:20:16. > :20:24.out of the company, the pension is now in deficit, and it is now on a
:20:25. > :20:29.state sponsored insurance system... I do think life is changing a bit.
:20:30. > :20:32.As the world becomes more international it becomes more
:20:33. > :20:36.legalistic, bit more like America, where people play up to the limit of
:20:37. > :20:41.the rolls. There is a case for us being tougher. We have seen that the
:20:42. > :20:50.city with financial regulation. -- of the rules. Interesting
:20:51. > :20:54.reflection. You mentioned in the US, you would see people being
:20:55. > :20:57.handcuffed and walked out of the office, white-collar criminals,
:20:58. > :21:02.utterly humiliated. Not named and shamed, not find money, but
:21:03. > :21:09.absolutely being trashed on television, probably live. I'm not
:21:10. > :21:13.sure they would lock up people who failed to pay the minimum wage. In
:21:14. > :21:19.America they have a different system. It is very legislation and
:21:20. > :21:25.litigation based. And not a lot up to that point. They have a nuclear
:21:26. > :21:29.deterrent, and nothing which is conventional before that. We have
:21:30. > :21:33.graduated approach. Maybe we could use the extreme options more than we
:21:34. > :21:39.do. But there are some advantages in being to have discretion and make
:21:40. > :21:44.people stick to principles. I don't want to put words in your mouth. But
:21:45. > :21:47.you think we could not it on to being a bit tougher, don't you? I
:21:48. > :22:11.do. -- nudge it. Lets get the latest on today's
:22:12. > :22:16.political news... The man on the left called the referendum, but it
:22:17. > :22:20.was the man on the right to cause to the referendum to be held after
:22:21. > :22:25.placing the idea of a UK exit from the EU firmly into the political
:22:26. > :22:29.mainstream. Will the real David Cameron please stand up. Despite his
:22:30. > :22:33.role in triggering the referendum, Nigel Barrett has found his role
:22:34. > :22:41.downgraded after a rival Brexit group, Vote Leave, won the
:22:42. > :22:47.resignation. He believes they only appeal to a narrow section of the
:22:48. > :22:53.electorate. They became embroiled with aggressive account is. You are
:22:54. > :23:00.anti immigration. You are scaremongering. In your campaign you
:23:01. > :23:07.have gone against people who do not look white. Discrimination. I want
:23:08. > :23:14.to know what you're going to do about it, that is what I want to
:23:15. > :23:19.know. If we have an Australian style points system rather than an open
:23:20. > :23:22.door, actually, there is big support for this amongst the ethnic
:23:23. > :23:26.minorities in this country, who know that our current open door policy is
:23:27. > :23:31.damaging all of our communities. Here is our chance, maybe our only
:23:32. > :23:37.chance as a nation, to get a grip on this issue. The Prime Minister also
:23:38. > :23:43.came under pressure on one of his weak spots, immigration. I have no
:23:44. > :23:47.GP. I cannot get onto the housing ladder and I have three children in
:23:48. > :23:57.one room. The place where I grew up used to a lovely area but is now a
:23:58. > :24:01.no-go zone. How is this system working for somebody like me? There
:24:02. > :24:04.are good ways of controlling immigration and bad ways of
:24:05. > :24:09.controlling immigration. A good way is just what I explained, people can
:24:10. > :24:14.come here, work, contribute, but they have to pay in before they get
:24:15. > :24:20.anything out... Difficult encounters for both, but they left reasonably
:24:21. > :24:24.happy. The Prime Minister avoided debating fellow Tories, and Nigel
:24:25. > :24:27.Farage returned to centre stage. He regards that as his rightful place
:24:28. > :24:36.because he said it is his ideas that are driving the Leave campaign. Vote
:24:37. > :24:40.Leave members say you are toxic. That's why they don't want me in the
:24:41. > :24:43.campaign. They have no comprehension about how to fight a proper
:24:44. > :24:50.campaign. Just because they followed my lead, on understanding open
:24:51. > :24:53.borders, the effects of mass immigration on normal people, now
:24:54. > :24:59.they followed my lead it will probably lead to a win. Remain as
:25:00. > :25:02.having a bumpy ride and they agree. They say their opponents in the
:25:03. > :25:09.official campaign are being controlled whether they like it or
:25:10. > :25:13.not by a hidden hand. One senior Remains strategist has likened the
:25:14. > :25:26.influence of the Ukip leader to the dark but largely unseen figure of
:25:27. > :25:30.Keyzer Soze. Some people are saying that you are the invisible dark
:25:31. > :25:38.force and was running it. To be compared to Peter Mandelson is a
:25:39. > :25:41.large compliment. Although Leave have pinched a lot of his ideas,
:25:42. > :25:46.they are keeping them at the distance from him come because they
:25:47. > :25:53.believe he repels voters. The official Vote Leave campaign hope
:25:54. > :25:58.that he will go the way of Keyzer Soze. But the Ukip leader and the
:25:59. > :26:01.Remain campaign hope to upend the film and ensure he keeps his role in
:26:02. > :26:10.the referendum movie. It's been such a tumultuous
:26:11. > :26:16.year in US politics, you might have overlooked
:26:17. > :26:18.the momentous point the fact that for the first time,
:26:19. > :26:22.one of the two main parties appears to have more or less
:26:23. > :26:25.now settled on a woman Hillary Clinton has
:26:26. > :26:37.certainly made history. Now her fight is to be back in the
:26:38. > :26:45.White House, not as first Lady, but as first female president. We are on
:26:46. > :26:51.the brink of an historic unprecedented moment. But we still
:26:52. > :26:55.have work to do, don't we? One of the striking features of the
:26:56. > :26:58.Democratic presidential race is that Hillary has not found she
:26:59. > :27:02.automatically gets backing from women voters. And particularly the
:27:03. > :27:07.younger ones have been charmed by Bernie Sanders. Is this now the
:27:08. > :27:08.moment to shed any political misgivings about Hillary and to
:27:09. > :27:24.rejoice? We can now discuss this. Jill, you
:27:25. > :27:28.are a supporter of Clinton, do you have any reservations, or is this
:27:29. > :27:36.the time for women to celebrate her elevation to this point? I do think
:27:37. > :27:44.it is a moment to celebrate. It is almost eerie that it was exactly to
:27:45. > :27:50.the date, you know, in 2008 when she made her famous concession speech
:27:51. > :28:01.when she talked about having made 18 million cracks in the hardest glass
:28:02. > :28:07.ceiling of all. Now today, these years later, she, as you pointed
:28:08. > :28:14.out, it will be the first woman nominee of a major US party. That is
:28:15. > :28:19.history making. But I think you are absolutely right, that for someone
:28:20. > :28:26.who is more my generation, that is far more meaningful than a lot of
:28:27. > :28:29.younger women. Can I just ask you, are you supporting her because you
:28:30. > :28:33.like her politics, and she happens to be a woman, and you are glad for
:28:34. > :28:37.that, or are you basically excited and supporting her because she is a
:28:38. > :28:44.woman, this is a feminist thing, this is a gender thing? It is not
:28:45. > :28:50.the latter, no, it isn't a gender thing. I think she is very well
:28:51. > :28:55.qualified to be president. And most of the time she has good judgment.
:28:56. > :29:05.She has the experience to do the job. What we are not mentioning is
:29:06. > :29:09.compared to whom? I think Donald Trump is getting the attention of
:29:10. > :29:15.the younger women right now. He has stolen the show, he is the big story
:29:16. > :29:22.of the year. It's true, he led the news today. Let me put all of this
:29:23. > :29:31.to Tennessee. You are not so thrilled by Hillary Clinton, why is
:29:32. > :29:37.that? It is about a lot of things. My generation have been activated.
:29:38. > :29:41.My friends, people who felt like their voices were completely unheard
:29:42. > :29:45.by politicians, have registered to vote and showing up because there is
:29:46. > :29:48.somebody talking about all of the things that are really important to
:29:49. > :29:54.us. People struggling in this country, people who are being killed
:29:55. > :29:57.because of the colour of their skin, put in prison, you know, there is a
:29:58. > :30:05.lot of really serious things going on. Tennessee, just let me ask you
:30:06. > :30:11.this, when you hear someone in say you should be supporting Hillary
:30:12. > :30:15.Clinton as a sort of sisterhood thing, does that make you more
:30:16. > :30:22.inclined to, how does that play, that argument? Obviously, there need
:30:23. > :30:26.to be more women in politics. There needs to be more diversity in
:30:27. > :30:35.politics. But, you know, the politics should come first, not the
:30:36. > :30:40.gender. I don't want Hillary Clinton to be the first female president of
:30:41. > :30:44.the US. You are going to vote for Hillary, rather than Donald Trump, I
:30:45. > :30:51.am guessing, correct, so you will rally around? Of course. Just for
:30:52. > :30:55.women's reproductive rights issues alone, we have to vote for as many
:30:56. > :31:00.Democrats as we can. It is a crazy time right now in this country.
:31:01. > :31:07.In terms of the relationship of women with American politics, one of
:31:08. > :31:13.the criticisms of Hillary Clinton, she talks about feminism and women's
:31:14. > :31:16.rights, but she has a conservative stance in the Democrat spectrum, she
:31:17. > :31:25.is not the best person for women, is that fair? I don't think that is
:31:26. > :31:29.fair. Regarding many issues, like foreign policy, she is more of a
:31:30. > :31:37.hawk than the progressive wing of the Democratic party, so she is out
:31:38. > :31:43.of step and her vote on the Iraq war is one of the things that is really
:31:44. > :31:54.disturbing to younger progressive voters. On women's issues her record
:31:55. > :32:02.is almost flawless. She has been fighting for reproductive rights for
:32:03. > :32:08.her whole life, practically. She has worked very hard for better
:32:09. > :32:13.childcare laws and she wants to raise the minimum wage which would
:32:14. > :32:21.be very meaningful to women service workers. Does that hold much weight
:32:22. > :32:30.with you, Tennessee? Do you think of her as not being grateful women? --
:32:31. > :32:34.great for women? She is a woman and that is good for women, but to use
:32:35. > :32:42.that to get people to vote for her is inappropriate given all of the
:32:43. > :32:46.other issues. And we have this other candidate Bernie Sanders who is also
:32:47. > :32:50.a feminist, being a feminist is not just about being a woman, it is
:32:51. > :32:55.about where they stand on all these issues. Hillary Clinton has a lot of
:32:56. > :33:02.critics and clearly if they criticise her ankles you can dismiss
:33:03. > :33:05.that as misogyny or people who have a difficulty imagining someone in
:33:06. > :33:13.his role as president who is a woman. She has many more critics
:33:14. > :33:18.than you might expect. I wonder if you think her critics are basically
:33:19. > :33:27.misogynists or are they people that raise valid points? The horse was of
:33:28. > :33:30.her voice, sometimes she has been shouting, people born that outcome
:33:31. > :33:39.is that sexist or just part of the cut and thrust of ordinary one ticks
:33:40. > :33:43.question mark -- people point that out, is that sexist or just hard of
:33:44. > :33:52.the cut and thrust of ordinary politics? I don't actually think
:33:53. > :33:56.that is the most... Those are the most important criticisms of her,
:33:57. > :34:05.there are legitimate criticisms of her. She's very slow to apologise
:34:06. > :34:09.for making mistakes. When she left the State Department it was a
:34:10. > :34:14.mistake to sign up with a very well-known speakers bureau and
:34:15. > :34:21.charge millions of dollars for her speeches. It is a mistake for her to
:34:22. > :34:33.not reveal the text of those speeches. The criticisms of the
:34:34. > :34:37.Clinton foundation, some of those, I was an investigative reporter for
:34:38. > :34:43.decades covering money and politics, and some of those concerns concern
:34:44. > :34:52.me to, but on balance she has a very strong record and I don't think
:34:53. > :34:57.she's a dishonest and trustworthy or as Donald Trump would say, that she
:34:58. > :35:08.is crooked. I think she has shown poor judgment. Thanks for joining
:35:09. > :35:14.us. With less than an hour to go, until voters cannot register for the
:35:15. > :35:21.referendum any more, we understand the voter registration website has
:35:22. > :35:25.crashed. A busy night for their computer? We heard that people were
:35:26. > :35:28.registering to vote in their hundreds of thousands in recent days
:35:29. > :35:33.and we have been talking to Martin Lewis who runs the money-saving
:35:34. > :35:37.expert website and he says careful language, the site is crashing in
:35:38. > :35:41.parts. He says you can get onto the first page, but when you try to
:35:42. > :35:45.input your information you can't get there and that element appears to be
:35:46. > :35:51.crashing for some users. If you look at the Cabinet Office website at the
:35:52. > :35:58.moment, it says as we speak 29,782 people are actually trying to input
:35:59. > :36:05.their data. How'd you know that? This is live service usage. Our
:36:06. > :36:10.colleague spotted that at 1015 tonight 50,000 people were trying at
:36:11. > :36:15.the same time and I think we will hear from Martin Lewis, he says that
:36:16. > :36:18.is a lot of people. Martin joins us over the internet from money-saving
:36:19. > :36:24.website. Have you had complaints about this? Yes. Someone tweeted to
:36:25. > :36:28.say the website was not working very well and they could not get through
:36:29. > :36:36.and I'd waited out, is anyone else having problems -- I tweeted out. I
:36:37. > :36:40.looked at the voter registration page, it maxes out at 50,000 people,
:36:41. > :36:44.that is not a lot of traffic in terms of just viewing a website, but
:36:45. > :36:48.this is like a transactional website, you have got to put data in
:36:49. > :36:52.and out that number of consecutive uses at one time being processed,
:36:53. > :36:56.that is a huge demand on the service and I'm not surprised has crashed.
:36:57. > :37:03.You don't set up a website for such enormous numbers. The normal traffic
:37:04. > :37:09.is trivial. This is huge. The real question is, in my suspicion, I
:37:10. > :37:13.study web traffic, it is like a 200 camel, you get peeks at lunchtime
:37:14. > :37:20.and in the evening. -- two hunt camel. At 1115 it drops onto 1130,
:37:21. > :37:26.and I think from 1130 people will find it much easier. If you have the
:37:27. > :37:30.time, keep trying. There is a democratic question, what about the
:37:31. > :37:33.people trying between ten and 11, who have got to go to bed because
:37:34. > :37:38.they have got to get up early, and of course they should have done it
:37:39. > :37:41.earlier, but they haven't. And we say the voter registration is open
:37:42. > :37:46.until midnight, but it hasn't been for them. You were to jest they keep
:37:47. > :37:52.it open for another half an hour? -- you would suggest. They can't take
:37:53. > :37:58.it into tomorrow. But what about the early hours of the morning? They
:37:59. > :38:02.could, but I don't see... I don't know the logistics, but I think to
:38:03. > :38:07.be fair, you want to communicate that this has gone down and keep it
:38:08. > :38:10.open for at least a morning. When we have deals on the website where
:38:11. > :38:13.something like this happens can we try to arrange for an extra day or
:38:14. > :38:19.an extra few hours, because that seems fair. If you drive a half an
:38:20. > :38:23.hour, they had gone away, and they might have gone to bed right now,
:38:24. > :38:27.and if they can't register for this, the most important decision in their
:38:28. > :38:31.lifetimes, then I think they need to be given the opportunity to do so.
:38:32. > :38:35.You have spoken to the Cabinet Office? We are waiting to hear back
:38:36. > :38:40.from them, they sing to have a good idea that things are not perhaps
:38:41. > :38:45.going brilliantly -- they seem. There is a law that it has to be why
:38:46. > :38:48.midnight? The timetable is set in law and I think it would be very
:38:49. > :38:53.difficult for them to have any discretion over this. Nick, thanks
:38:54. > :38:58.for joining us. That is it for tonight. You have 50 minutes to
:38:59. > :39:07.register in the referendum, but don't bother!
:39:08. > :39:11.But we leave you with the observation that senior members
:39:12. > :39:13.of the Conservative party on both sides of the Brexit debate seem
:39:14. > :39:16.to have all been afflicted with the same strange disorder.
:39:17. > :39:18.Whenever they appear in public, they mysteriously strike a pose
:39:19. > :39:20.in tribute to a certain 1950's film star.
:39:21. > :39:22.It's almost like they're doing it on purpose.
:39:23. > :39:59.# Take me away # John Wayne
:40:00. > :40:31.# He stands so high #
:40:32. > :40:32.Some of the thunderstorms will continue overnight, but most will