16/08/2016

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:00:00. > :00:11.For many he was the most annoying man in the country.

:00:12. > :00:13.But he was also one of the most dangerous.

:00:14. > :00:16.But alongside Choudary, another man was convicted.

:00:17. > :00:20.Less flamboyant in the media, arguably more of a threat.

:00:21. > :00:24.We have an interview with him, from earlier this year.

:00:25. > :00:28.This term radicalising, you need to define it.

:00:29. > :00:30.Is Jeremy Corbyn radicalising the Labour Party, for example?

:00:31. > :00:34.By the time this airs, you might be in jail.

:00:35. > :00:42.Yearn for the days of the old British Rail?

:00:43. > :00:45.This is the Night Mail crossing the border, bringing the cheque

:00:46. > :00:48.Letters for the rich, letters for the poor,

:00:49. > :00:50.the shop at the corner and the girl next door.

:00:51. > :00:54.Jeremy Corbyn wants the trains back in public ownership.

:00:55. > :01:07.We'll ask his transport spokesman if that's a good idea.

:01:08. > :01:09.And Ainsley Harriet clambers off our Throne of Games to get

:01:10. > :01:30.For years, he enjoyed needling everyone with his silly

:01:31. > :01:32.pronouncements, that Buckingham Palace will become

:01:33. > :01:37.But Anjem Choudary was not just a harmless controversialist -

:01:38. > :01:40.he spread hate for two decades, attempted to radicalise others

:01:41. > :01:43.and for some of that period invited them to join so-called

:01:44. > :01:46.Islamic State, an organisation proscribed under the

:01:47. > :01:54.He could now be handed a maximum jail sentence of ten years.

:01:55. > :01:56.But, while Choudary is very well known, alongside him was another

:01:57. > :02:00.character, Mizanur Rahman, a character who had also done a lot

:02:01. > :02:11.to attract vulnerable minds to jihad.

:02:12. > :02:13.The police said that Rahman and Choudary had stayed just

:02:14. > :02:16.within the law for many years, but when they pledged an oath

:02:17. > :02:18.of allegiance to IS, they had stepped over a line

:02:19. > :02:32.Talk a bit about Anjem Choudary and when he came from. He was not always

:02:33. > :02:36.part of the Islamist scene, he grew up in London and when he went to

:02:37. > :02:41.university he reportedly drank alcohol and had girlfriends. But

:02:42. > :02:46.after qualifying as a solicitor he helped to found a radical group

:02:47. > :02:50.outward jackaroo which was subsequently banned. It kept

:02:51. > :02:53.changing its name all the time to evade the attention of the

:02:54. > :02:58.authorities. And Anjem Choudary became a source of frustration to

:02:59. > :03:05.the authorities who thought he was dangerous but not quite ever

:03:06. > :03:08.breaking the law. Until now. Because today restrictions in court were

:03:09. > :03:14.lifted allowing us to reveal that three weeks ago he was convicted of

:03:15. > :03:18.having pledged support online to Isis and having encouraged in his

:03:19. > :03:22.videos others to support and join the group. This is a significant

:03:23. > :03:28.moment, the general of Anjem Choudary, he has linked -- been

:03:29. > :03:31.linked to 100 British jihadis. The followers for example of his when

:03:32. > :03:36.fourth in the killing of Drummer Lee Rigby in Woolwich. We know other

:03:37. > :03:42.followers of his way involved in 2010 plot to blow up the London

:03:43. > :03:48.stock exchange. Not as Tierney UK, a large number of people have gone to

:03:49. > :03:53.Syria for example, some quite high profile like one who took his young

:03:54. > :03:59.family to Syria. And another killed in a drone strike in Syria last

:04:00. > :04:06.year. Others whose names have never come into the public domain. Once I

:04:07. > :04:15.logged off, a follower from north London who went out to Syria. And

:04:16. > :04:19.another one of his followers to the right of the screen, and I

:04:20. > :04:26.understand that he is now dead. That is Anjem Choudary, and also was this

:04:27. > :04:30.other guy and most people will not have heard of him I think.

:04:31. > :04:34.Absolutely, there is a clique around Anjem Choudary, some of them have

:04:35. > :04:39.higher profiles. His co-defendant Mizanur Rahman in my view was just

:04:40. > :04:43.as significant and perhaps even more so than Anjem Choudary when it comes

:04:44. > :04:45.to the Syrian conflict. How is the campaign to move Britain

:04:46. > :04:48.over to sharia law coming along? Anjem Choudary attracted

:04:49. > :04:52.headlines but amongst jihadi circles he gradually

:04:53. > :04:53.became less significant. In recent years it was his

:04:54. > :04:57.right-hand man, Mizanur Rahman, Rahman had spent four years in jail

:04:58. > :05:05.already for soliciting murder For Islam to prevail,

:05:06. > :05:17.for sharia to be implemented, to support the state, to help,

:05:18. > :05:26.it is not just about financing. Just like Anjem Choudary,

:05:27. > :05:32.Mizanur Rahman was someone that provided the theological basis

:05:33. > :05:34.for people to go But what was different,

:05:35. > :05:37.what sets him apart from someone like Anjem Choudary is the fact

:05:38. > :05:40.that he was very willing and active in engaging directly

:05:41. > :05:42.with people over social media, Giving direct advice,

:05:43. > :05:44.theological advice. In January whilst he was still

:05:45. > :05:47.on bail, I met Rahman. Like Anjem Choudary,

:05:48. > :05:49.he has always been someone These terms, radicalising,

:05:50. > :05:58.you need to define it. Is Jeremy Corbyn radicalising

:05:59. > :06:00.the Labour Party for example? If you mean am I debating people

:06:01. > :06:08.and convincing people that my ideas might be correct, well,

:06:09. > :06:10.that's what you do in a debate. Even if those ideas at times

:06:11. > :06:12.break the law? We have already established

:06:13. > :06:19.that we stay within At times they break

:06:20. > :06:23.the law. By the time this airs,

:06:24. > :06:27.you might be in jail. Because there is a political system

:06:28. > :06:32.in place which doesn't really Rahman tried to be careful

:06:33. > :06:36.in his language. This was an exchange of text

:06:37. > :06:38.messages between him Choudhury says to Rahman,

:06:39. > :06:45."open support for Isis or Jabhat Rahman replies, "maybe condemning

:06:46. > :06:53.Shia and the Free Syria Army and a general call for

:06:54. > :06:55.sharia in Syria without The declaration of a caliphate

:06:56. > :07:02.by Isis pushed Rahman towards more explicit support,

:07:03. > :07:04.but without a passport, One Twitter exchange he had

:07:05. > :07:13.with a young American Muslim He is asked if preaching is more

:07:14. > :07:19.important than helping He replies, preaching is important,

:07:20. > :07:23.but it's also obligatory A few months later, the American

:07:24. > :07:30.was arrested at an airport And the concept of a Khilafah

:07:31. > :07:37.is 1400 years old. You know, someone does not have one

:07:38. > :07:43.twitter conversation and they decide to change their whole

:07:44. > :07:46.life based on one tweet. Rahman insisted in court

:07:47. > :08:08.to that his talks were about general There is a network around these

:08:09. > :08:15.people. What does the conviction of these paired mean for that network?

:08:16. > :08:19.Well when they were arrested in September 2014, at the time the

:08:20. > :08:24.authorities I think are desperate to crack this network, not just in the

:08:25. > :08:28.UK but have franchises across Europe, Belgium, Holland and

:08:29. > :08:31.Denmark. They were worried about the possibility of attacks here and

:08:32. > :08:36.subsequently with this conviction, the network has been significantly

:08:37. > :08:40.disrupted. We have seen large numbers of the network who have

:08:41. > :08:44.already gone to Syria. And I can reveal that recently quite a large

:08:45. > :08:49.number of the followers of Anjem Choudary have been placed on

:08:50. > :08:51.terrorism prevention orders and they're under curfews and restricted

:08:52. > :08:53.access. For headline writers,

:08:54. > :08:55.the words rail and misery seem to flow on to the page together,

:08:56. > :08:59.like fat and cat or rip and off. And today, there are those headlines

:09:00. > :09:01.of rail misery again - regulated train fares

:09:02. > :09:03.are going up, we learned this The usual understandable

:09:04. > :09:06.anger erupted, what with And from the Labour leader,

:09:07. > :09:13.a potential solution. He called it Transport Tuesday -

:09:14. > :09:16.jumping on the Super Saturday bandwagon perhaps -

:09:17. > :09:18.and the solution he promised was public ownership

:09:19. > :09:23.of the railways. There is one specific pledge: I'll

:09:24. > :09:25.quote it to you, from "The plans could see rail passengers

:09:26. > :09:30.save 10 per cent off So the big question is,

:09:31. > :09:33.complain as we might about our trains, would public

:09:34. > :09:35.ownership be a solution or a distraction to the problems

:09:36. > :09:39.of running a railway. We'll talk to Labour's transport

:09:40. > :09:41.spokesman shortly but first, Chris Cook looks at what

:09:42. > :09:47.nationalisation might mean. The idea of allowing companies

:09:48. > :09:51.to run train services was simple - in return for making a profit,

:09:52. > :09:55.private investors would take some risk off the taxpayer,

:09:56. > :09:58.encourage innovation, and use their balance

:09:59. > :10:02.sheet to invest. The misery of Southern Rail

:10:03. > :10:12.is the latest chapter in a long Industrial action, cancelled

:10:13. > :10:18.and overcrowded trains, and growing political

:10:19. > :10:23.support for renationalisation. The best way is for the public

:10:24. > :10:26.to run it, as the public ran the East Coast Mainline,

:10:27. > :10:28.at a profit. This is not a sensible way

:10:29. > :10:31.of running a public railway system which we have all paid

:10:32. > :10:34.for through huge levels of public investment in the track

:10:35. > :10:39.and signalling systems. Today we learned that

:10:40. > :10:43.fares will rise by 1.9% in January in Great Britain,

:10:44. > :10:45.while consumer price And research by trade unions

:10:46. > :10:52.suggests rail fares have increased at double the speed

:10:53. > :10:59.of wages since 2010. Many of the problems we have

:11:00. > :11:03.with our dysfunctional privatised system as it stands at the moment

:11:04. > :11:06.is precisely that the fragmentation and of course the cost of that,

:11:07. > :11:09.which means that instead of our fares going to invest

:11:10. > :11:12.in the rail system, instead they are going out into the hands

:11:13. > :11:17.of private shareholders. The underlying problem

:11:18. > :11:20.is that our railway Back in 2011, an official report

:11:21. > :11:26.implied a journey that would cost around ?1.20 in fare and public

:11:27. > :11:29.subsidy in other European countries So, our fares in 2011 were about 30%

:11:30. > :11:38.higher than those of our peers. The most important reason

:11:39. > :11:44.why our rail is so important The flip side of our very

:11:45. > :11:49.beautiful Victorian stations is we have a lot of Victorian rail,

:11:50. > :11:52.which is expensive We are also, as a country,

:11:53. > :11:59.tending to run a lot more services with relatively

:12:00. > :12:01.few passengers on them, and that, too, boosts our

:12:02. > :12:05.underlying cost base. Those unusually high costs mainly

:12:06. > :12:11.relate to Network Rail, which runs the track,

:12:12. > :12:14.and that's already nationalised. The private train operating

:12:15. > :12:18.companies, they made over ?200 million of profit last year,

:12:19. > :12:21.but that money would only fund Advocates for franchising see that

:12:22. > :12:29.as a price worth paying There is one big number

:12:30. > :12:35.that matters most. Under British Rail, numbers using

:12:36. > :12:38.the railways consistently fell. Since 1995 when it was privatised,

:12:39. > :12:41.journeys have doubled in just 20 years, but I think that franchising

:12:42. > :12:44.has a lot of problems. It's not necessarily a natural

:12:45. > :12:46.way to run railways. All across the world,

:12:47. > :12:48.including here, companies build their railways up,

:12:49. > :12:50.track and train together. Separating them as we do,

:12:51. > :12:53.forcing them to be separate, Southern's recent woes may be

:12:54. > :13:00.another cause for pause. In this case, a private company

:13:01. > :13:03.doesn't actually have that much They are just being paid a fee

:13:04. > :13:08.to administer the railway Right now, it strikes me

:13:09. > :13:14.that we are getting We have the privatised system

:13:15. > :13:17.plus a government that What we would have I think

:13:18. > :13:21.if the company were properly in public hands, and I don't just

:13:22. > :13:25.mean the state, we could have more imaginative systems of mutuals,

:13:26. > :13:28.local authorities getting more involved, but if it were in public

:13:29. > :13:33.hands, for a start, the contract would be fully public

:13:34. > :13:37.so we could see what the terms were, and it would be fully accountable

:13:38. > :13:40.to the public as well. Would a nationalised

:13:41. > :13:42.rail system necessarily Governments are always

:13:43. > :13:49.struggling to contain the cost They are always under pressure

:13:50. > :13:55.to spend more on education. And the experience of British Rail

:13:56. > :13:57.suggests that in that context, it is very hard to politically make

:13:58. > :14:01.the case for spending Britain certainly botched

:14:02. > :14:09.the franchising of its rail services, and we have all paid

:14:10. > :14:35.the price, but renationalisation Shortly before coming on air, I

:14:36. > :14:39.spoke to Andy Mangan on from Labour. He is the Shadow Transport

:14:40. > :14:45.Secretary, and asked how his party would cut 10% from rail fares. It

:14:46. > :14:48.would come from the savings that are to be achieved by getting out of

:14:49. > :14:53.this treble franchising system that leaks so much money out of the

:14:54. > :14:57.system. If we can end that, we have a fund available to deliver those

:14:58. > :15:02.sorts of cuts. It is something in the order of ?1.2 billion going out

:15:03. > :15:07.of the system on an annual basis. You say that, but I am looking at

:15:08. > :15:17.the profits made by those companies. It is not a particularly profitable

:15:18. > :15:19.business. Total profit of ?220 million in 2014-15. Passenger

:15:20. > :15:25.revenue is getting on for ?9 billion. One is diddly squat, one is

:15:26. > :15:31.a large number. If those operating costs were removed by having so many

:15:32. > :15:35.operators in the system, we have ridiculous multiplicity of providers

:15:36. > :15:41.in our country. There are so many players in the railway system that

:15:42. > :15:47.costs escalate. You're going to have a Western Railway, an East Coast, a

:15:48. > :15:52.Southern, they will still be there. That's right, but at the moment we

:15:53. > :15:59.have a subsidy system going straight into these companies, often to

:16:00. > :16:03.Germany, to France, all across the European Union. We are subsidising

:16:04. > :16:09.some of them, but we make money from some of them. The profits which leak

:16:10. > :16:18.out are approximately 2.5% of passenger revenues. You cannot cut

:16:19. > :16:25.rail fares by 10%. You still have 7.5% to find. Research that the TUC

:16:26. > :16:30.have conducted shows that millions can be taken out of the system on an

:16:31. > :16:35.annual basis by changing to directly operated railways. Look at what

:16:36. > :16:42.happened with East Coast, ?1 billion was returned to the Treasury over

:16:43. > :16:46.the duration of that franchise. The TUC report makes estimates of these

:16:47. > :16:51.interface cost, one company having to deal with another and work out

:16:52. > :16:56.whose fault it was that the train was rape. The McNulty report said

:16:57. > :16:59.that much more can be gained by improving the performance of the

:17:00. > :17:02.current system rather than embarking on a costly programme of

:17:03. > :17:07.renationalisation of which is unlikely to lead to an overall

:17:08. > :17:12.reduction in costs. So, McNulty doesn't think that there is a big

:17:13. > :17:17.cost saving to be found. But it isn't an expensive process if you

:17:18. > :17:20.are just allowing franchises to get to them natural termination point

:17:21. > :17:23.and not be renewed. There are no acquisition costs involved in the

:17:24. > :17:28.process if they follow one after the other. We would be saving ourselves

:17:29. > :17:33.fortunate over the term. What might you would agree that this comprises

:17:34. > :17:39.a top-down reorganisation of the railways, wouldn't you? You want to

:17:40. > :17:45.describe it that way. Because you have franchises regularly coming up

:17:46. > :17:50.renewal, it is gradual. It is a top-down reorganisation. Why can't

:17:51. > :17:57.we have the confidence to do what has been done in Germany and France,

:17:58. > :18:03.and in Holland? They are content to have their infrastructure and their

:18:04. > :18:06.operators being under state control. They are extracting value in this

:18:07. > :18:12.country and taking it back over there. They are taking out a tiny

:18:13. > :18:19.proportion, 2.5%. But that is a lot of money. The 10% cut in rail fares

:18:20. > :18:23.is reliant on making hundreds of millions of pounds of savings which

:18:24. > :18:28.the guy who's estimate of the savings you are quoting does not

:18:29. > :18:34.believe our there to be made. You have different commentators coming

:18:35. > :18:40.up with different figures. You quoted the TUC, who are quoting

:18:41. > :18:46.McNulty, and McNulty says you cannot make those savings. I respectfully

:18:47. > :18:50.disagree. There are people like Southern who are getting millions of

:18:51. > :18:55.pounds by way of salaries and bonuses for running the most

:18:56. > :18:58.appalling service. We hand over ?1.1 billion to that company and it

:18:59. > :19:04.doesn't matter what happens in terms of the service they provide, they

:19:05. > :19:09.get paid, come rain or shine. It is unacceptable. In that respect, you

:19:10. > :19:14.make an interesting point, because is the truth about not that this

:19:15. > :19:17.railway system in our country is government-controlled already?

:19:18. > :19:21.Network Rail is part of the public sector. Southern, the Government

:19:22. > :19:25.gets all of the revenue from the passengers in the case of that

:19:26. > :19:32.franchise. It instructs Southern on how to manage the service. It has

:19:33. > :19:40.told Southern to stick to its rules on driverless trains. It is a public

:19:41. > :19:43.ownership of the railway. Not at all. They are given that money

:19:44. > :19:49.whether they perform well or indifferently. As we have just seen,

:19:50. > :19:54.they have taken 341 trains off per day. At the Government's decision.

:19:55. > :20:04.That is a Government decision, not a Southern one. They should be told to

:20:05. > :20:09.get things back in order, then. It is a distraction, the discussion

:20:10. > :20:13.about driverless trains. You want the Government have more say in the

:20:14. > :20:16.well but clearly not the Conservative Government because you

:20:17. > :20:20.say they do not run Southern very well. If your team runs the

:20:21. > :20:28.railways, will you run it better than you run the Labour Party? It is

:20:29. > :20:33.about having the freedom to do what was done by directly operated

:20:34. > :20:39.railways between 2009 and 2014, and look at the success they made of the

:20:40. > :20:42.East Coast service. The highest rate of customer satisfaction, good

:20:43. > :20:46.industrial relations, a very successful service, so it is freeing

:20:47. > :20:51.us up from this rigour of trying to produce dividends and profits to

:20:52. > :20:55.third parties and foreign state-owned companies. Some will say

:20:56. > :20:59.this is ideological. Do you believe that BT should be brought into

:21:00. > :21:04.public ownership as well? That is not my view. Do you think it was

:21:05. > :21:08.right to privatise it? In the fullness of time, I think all of

:21:09. > :21:12.these services can be looked at. Why are we looking at six companies

:21:13. > :21:17.providing energy when what people want is reliable energy as cheap as

:21:18. > :21:20.possible? They don't want to be in competition and trying to switch

:21:21. > :21:25.providers. They simply want to have a good service, reliable and

:21:26. > :21:30.affordable. At the moment, those things don't exist. We have been a

:21:31. > :21:32.big can of worms there. Andy McDonald, thank you very much.

:21:33. > :21:35.On this programme, we first posed the question, what does

:21:36. > :21:37.Brexit actually mean, back on October 28th last year.

:21:38. > :21:41.We didn't manage to get an answer then, and even though a lot of water

:21:42. > :21:44.has passed under the bridge since, it's fair to say we still don't

:21:45. > :21:49.Last year, we took a first look at some of the popular options:

:21:50. > :21:52.Norway and Switzerland for example, and these were much discussed

:21:53. > :21:58.But we missed one then, and it hasn't had much pick up

:21:59. > :22:07.OK, so it is not a very big country, but like Norway, it's

:22:08. > :22:09.in the European Economic Area - unlike Norway, it has restrictions

:22:10. > :22:14.Helen Thomas is in the principality to see if its status could possibly

:22:15. > :22:24.This is Liechtenstein's idea of how to celebrate a national holiday.

:22:25. > :22:33.A garden party, the Royal Family on display, a rather familiar tune.

:22:34. > :22:47.And of course, a hefty dose of national pride.

:22:48. > :22:49.Liechtenstein clearly has a lot to recommend it.

:22:50. > :22:51.Glorious weather, beautiful scenery, and quite a catchy national anthem.

:22:52. > :22:54.But from the UK's point of view, the country also has

:22:55. > :22:58.Liechtenstein, like Norway, is part of the single market

:22:59. > :23:02.through its membership of the European Economic Area.

:23:03. > :23:04.But the country also has a tightly controlled quota

:23:05. > :23:13.Now, that is a combination that some in Europe claim is impossible,

:23:14. > :23:17.that the four freedoms of people, goods, capital and services

:23:18. > :23:27.An example to point to as the UK starts the long and complicated

:23:28. > :23:33.process of extricating itself from the EU?

:23:34. > :23:35.There's an important thing I think is, it's not specifically

:23:36. > :23:40.What they're doing is adopting what are known technically

:23:41. > :23:43.as safeguard measures which then brought them a treaty change.

:23:44. > :23:45.But it doesn't just apply to Liechtenstein.

:23:46. > :23:50.This is not specifically a Liechtenstein solution.

:23:51. > :23:54.And when the EEA was first set up there were actually four countries

:23:55. > :24:04.which took advantage of these provisions.

:24:05. > :24:07.There are some subtle differences between Liechtenstein and the UK.

:24:08. > :24:09.The UK's population is about 1750 times larger.

:24:10. > :24:18.And Liechtenstein is about half the size of the Isle of Wight.

:24:19. > :24:27.So you see, it's really a small country, and for that,

:24:28. > :24:32.Without control, we have a lot of people, a lot of aliens

:24:33. > :24:36.in Liechtenstein and that would be a big problem for Liechtenstein.

:24:37. > :24:38.So it's not clear that the UK will get an invitation

:24:39. > :24:46.It's starting from a different position and that's one reason

:24:47. > :24:49.to question whether the model would work for the UK.

:24:50. > :24:52.It doesn't set a legal precedent given that the provisions under

:24:53. > :24:55.which Liechtenstein has been able to negotiate their situation is one

:24:56. > :25:01.under the EEA agreement of which the UK is not yet a member.

:25:02. > :25:04.The Prime Minister doesn't think the same deal will be on offer.

:25:05. > :25:06.Yeah, I think nowadays it would be almost impossible for Liechtenstein

:25:07. > :25:18.But I think when we would today negotiate such a solution,

:25:19. > :25:24.And you see the discussions in Switzerland, also in the UK,

:25:25. > :25:30.free movement is one of the pillars of the EU.

:25:31. > :25:35.And it's quite difficult to get that special situation.

:25:36. > :25:39.The mechanics of how the UK could replicate Liechtenstein's

:25:40. > :25:44.We would need to join both the European Free Trade

:25:45. > :25:49.Other members could block that happening.

:25:50. > :26:01.But some in Liechtenstein think the UK has scope to negotiate.

:26:02. > :26:07.of the EEA or yet another concept, is open.

:26:08. > :26:11.And I would think that with this Brexit and the pressure from other

:26:12. > :26:13.EU countries, that this immigration issue has to be changed.

:26:14. > :26:15.And it can only be solved with changes.

:26:16. > :26:21.With that, I think that plays into the hands of Britain.

:26:22. > :26:28.Embracing Liechtenstein's model wholesale may prove complicated.

:26:29. > :26:33.But its unique situation could prove an illuminating example.

:26:34. > :26:36.The UK will be looking for any chance to ensure negotiations

:26:37. > :26:58.While some of you have been contemplating what the offspring of

:26:59. > :27:04.Laura Trott and Jason Kenny could achieve in future Olympics, we have

:27:05. > :27:05.been looking at matters closer to home.

:27:06. > :27:09.I say sofa, it's more like a patchwork quilt of

:27:10. > :27:35.I'm so glad the Olympics is only once every four

:27:36. > :27:42.I've been watching you night after night,

:27:43. > :27:44.and you're starting to look a little bit pasty.

:27:45. > :27:46.Because you're not eating the right things.

:27:47. > :28:10.A little coconut milk going in there.

:28:11. > :28:12.If you can't get yak, go straight to coconut.

:28:13. > :28:28.It's so much better when you've cooked it yourself.

:28:29. > :28:45.In the old days, she'd have missed the tape.

:28:46. > :28:51.Because his upper body is somewhere across the line.

:28:52. > :28:53.Should this be track, or should this be in

:28:54. > :28:57.There's a lot of diving going on here, isn't

:28:58. > :29:07.He looks like he's just fallen out of a

:29:08. > :29:19.Is this speeded up, or is this normal?

:29:20. > :29:26.People say, oh you can get up and watch it in the morning.

:29:27. > :29:48.If it was me, I'd have the old waistband up here.

:29:49. > :29:53.Well, partly that, but you're not allowed to

:29:54. > :29:59.Would you like your kids to box, though?

:30:00. > :30:07.Mind you, you might have to spar with them.

:30:08. > :30:19.Have you had any problems with the hips?

:30:20. > :30:25.Well that's great, come on, I'll show you this wonderful...

:30:26. > :30:33.You've been watching Stephen Smith's Throne of Games.

:30:34. > :30:35.And you wonder why Julian Fellowes has taken

:30:36. > :30:43.Don't worry, there will be another programme later today! Good morning!