:00:00. > :00:00.Privilege and patronage still pays off - whether its young
:00:07. > :00:08.Etonians at the Kremlin or working-class candidates all
:00:09. > :00:15.What's all this got to do with the Great Gatsby.
:00:16. > :00:21.On the day of a damning report by the Social Mobility Commission,
:00:22. > :00:26.More Labour manoeuvres - a bid to reintroduce democratic
:00:27. > :00:29.The Corbynistas are dead against it now.
:00:30. > :00:34.People around Ed Miliband are spinning this as his clause four
:00:35. > :00:36.moment, where he demonstrates strong leadership by beating
:00:37. > :00:49.I just think he's misread the situation.
:00:50. > :00:51.We'll talk to the Labour MP who is behind the move.
:00:52. > :00:56.The territory did just that in 1984 and Brussels banned the seal trade.
:00:57. > :00:58.It's been difficult when you sit on the outside.
:00:59. > :01:02.It would be a lot easier to sit on the inside, at the table, and say
:01:03. > :01:17.And, by the way, I don't like this mic.
:01:18. > :01:19.Whoever the hell brought this mic system, don't pay him.
:01:20. > :01:23.Is Trump versus Clinton America's weirdest election ever?
:01:24. > :01:27.We convene America's freshist commentators.
:01:28. > :01:33.Today there were two stark reminders of how much class still matters.
:01:34. > :01:40.In a variation of the adage "too posh to push", today's report
:01:41. > :01:43.by the Social Mobility Commission suggests if you're posh you don't
:01:44. > :01:45.need to push to make your way into employment in areas such
:01:46. > :01:49.Indeed, you might be best qualified for the job,
:01:50. > :01:52.but if you don't have the right attire, for example,
:01:53. > :01:56.if you're male - brown shoes and a loud tie - or the right accent
:01:57. > :01:59.or you don't carry yourself well - you can forget it.
:02:00. > :02:03.While all the Old Etonians might have been kicked out of the Cabinet,
:02:04. > :02:05.we learned that Young Etonians are more than welcome
:02:06. > :02:09.Would there have been such a warm welcome from Vladimir Putin
:02:10. > :02:11.for a bunch of male sixth formers from a local comp?
:02:12. > :02:14.Social mobility is apparently at the top of Theresa May's bucket
:02:15. > :02:16.list, but does any politician really have the political courage
:02:17. > :02:27.Our policy editor, Chris Cook, reports.
:02:28. > :02:32.Britain has a particular issue with social mobility. We can't seem to
:02:33. > :02:40.get people moving in the right direction. Dress code is the latest
:02:41. > :02:45.suspect. A new report in the City found that few paws that wearing
:02:46. > :02:50.brown shoes with a suit were hobbling the careers of people from
:02:51. > :02:55.less grand backgrounds. Meanwhile, a group of Etonians on a trip to
:02:56. > :02:59.Moscow spent time in the Kremlin, even meeting Vladimir Putin. No
:03:00. > :03:02.brown shoes there. You can see why Theresa May made the opportunity
:03:03. > :03:05.agenda central to her opening statement as Prime Minister. If
:03:06. > :03:10.you're a white, working-class boy, your' less likely than anybody else
:03:11. > :03:16.in Britain to go to university. If you're at a state school, you're
:03:17. > :03:20.less likely to reach the top professes than if you are educated
:03:21. > :03:24.privately. Perhaps we shouldn't be too surprised that Britain has a
:03:25. > :03:30.social mobility problem. Economists have described something known as
:03:31. > :03:38.the Great Gatsby curve after the novel of a bootlegger in the roaring
:03:39. > :03:41.20s.s. That hes a the name for observation with countries with
:03:42. > :03:49.higher inequality you tend to get lower social mobility. These bar
:03:50. > :03:53.show how closely linked, the higher the bar, the more important your
:03:54. > :03:58.family back underis. The higher bar means worse social mobility. You can
:03:59. > :04:02.see the Great Gatsby effect. In more unequal countries, like the US and
:04:03. > :04:08.the UK, social mobility is a bigger problem. In more equal countries,
:04:09. > :04:12.like Sweden and Germany, things are a bit better. Social mobility then
:04:13. > :04:16.is a rather bigger issue than just city recruit am. In fact, it's been
:04:17. > :04:21.a major issue in Westminster, in particular, for the last 10 years or
:04:22. > :04:28.so. Ever since research emerged which suggests that poor people born
:04:29. > :04:32.in 1970 had worst life chances than people born in 1958. One of the
:04:33. > :04:36.authors of that research thinks things may have got better. When the
:04:37. > :04:39.social mobility in the UK was falling, yes, there was a stronger
:04:40. > :04:42.link between family background and education. When we look more
:04:43. > :04:47.recently, through children going into Edinburgh education in the 90s,
:04:48. > :04:51.we could see that there was a real catch-up for poor kids and that many
:04:52. > :04:57.more were getting good GCSEs and doing well. In general terms we've
:04:58. > :05:01.seen disadvantaged pupils at school do better and make a faster rate of
:05:02. > :05:05.progress in their educational attain am than the average. There has been
:05:06. > :05:09.a closing of the gap. We know that's a pretty decent proxy for what's
:05:10. > :05:14.likely to happen to some element of social mobility in the future. Is
:05:15. > :05:19.education the key thing though? Is let's go back to that graph. We can
:05:20. > :05:22.actually estimate how much of our social mobility problem can be
:05:23. > :05:26.explained by the fact that educational achievement is unequal.
:05:27. > :05:35.That is the portion in red. So you can see in Germany, where it's
:05:36. > :05:38.selected schools, education seems to be the driver of mobility. In
:05:39. > :05:41.Britain who ends up with which qualifications accounts for about
:05:42. > :05:47.half of the problem. It's other things. Things like brown shoes that
:05:48. > :05:51.account for the rest. So do we need to focus on things other than
:05:52. > :05:54.education? Yes. I think we are learning more about the importance
:05:55. > :05:58.of other factors. Of course, education is always important, but
:05:59. > :06:03.if you look at the United States and the recent studies in there in some
:06:04. > :06:08.cities, like Seattle, higher levels of social mobility than other cities
:06:09. > :06:10.like Atlanta. Part is education, but part is how concentrated poverty is
:06:11. > :06:16.within a city and how distributed it is. It's also urban transportation
:06:17. > :06:19.systems, it's how the city has been planned. These other broader factors
:06:20. > :06:23.about city development are very important.
:06:24. > :06:27.NEWS REEL: Today decide 07... As anyone who
:06:28. > :06:30.visited Eton would know, parents have very different sets of
:06:31. > :06:35.resources with which to make sure their kids do well. Inequality makes
:06:36. > :06:38.the policy objective of aiding social mobility.
:06:39. > :06:44.Tougher. If there's an arms race in that children are constantly being
:06:45. > :06:49.pushed to do better and richer parents are better prepared for that
:06:50. > :06:52.kind of arms race, they can prepare their children using private tutors,
:06:53. > :06:56.giving the information they need about the best universities. It's
:06:57. > :07:01.hard to know what public policy can do about that and if indeed it would
:07:02. > :07:07.want to intervene. Getting poor kids to rise above their richer peers
:07:08. > :07:12.means fixing a lot. But if you do that, richer parents will fight
:07:13. > :07:14.back. Optimism on mobility is thin on the ground.
:07:15. > :07:21.Well, joining me now from Southampton is
:07:22. > :07:23.Lord David Willetts, who, until 2014, was in
:07:24. > :07:25.David Cameron's Cabinet as Universities Minister and now
:07:26. > :07:27.Executive Director of the Resolution Foundation,
:07:28. > :07:31.Faiza Shaheen, director of the Class think-tank, and writer Poppy Noor.
:07:32. > :07:39.Hello to all of you. David Willet is. This is meant to be Theresa
:07:40. > :07:43.May's big push, after Brexit, of course. What can she do that David
:07:44. > :07:48.Cameron couldn't? I hope that we can, first of all, see more people
:07:49. > :07:53.going to university and then employers recruiting from a wider
:07:54. > :07:56.range of universities. This specific report today on investment banking
:07:57. > :07:59.shows that part of the problem they are looking to four or five
:08:00. > :08:04.universities and the initiatives that are underway that broaden
:08:05. > :08:08.employers horizons so they recruit more broadly is very significant.
:08:09. > :08:12.Secondly, the reason why I'm one of the optimists, I think the big data
:08:13. > :08:18.revolution is arriving with social mobility and it will be increasingly
:08:19. > :08:22.possible for employers to design their own ways of boosting social
:08:23. > :08:26.mobility, saying they want to look at students, applicants in the top
:08:27. > :08:31.10% or 20er % of their class which ever type of school they were at. It
:08:32. > :08:36.doesn't exist at the moment. I want to bring Poppy Noor in here. You
:08:37. > :08:42.were homeless, you were on benefits, and you went to Cambridge. Was that
:08:43. > :08:49.pure luck and hard work or did you actually have state help? Yep. That
:08:50. > :08:52.was happening at a time when there was a much more robust welfare
:08:53. > :08:58.system for people from my background. In terms of university
:08:59. > :09:01.you had Educational Maintenance Allowance. Maintenance grants for
:09:02. > :09:05.pupils from poorer backgrounds which you don't have now. You have to have
:09:06. > :09:09.loans. There was a lot more financial assistance. You had a
:09:10. > :09:14.teacher who backed you, pushed you, you weren't going to have anywhere
:09:15. > :09:19.to live when it wasn't term time. This teacher insisted the college,
:09:20. > :09:23.said to Trinity - is there somewhere she can live. That made a difference
:09:24. > :09:27.or you wouldn't have gone? It would have made a big difference. The
:09:28. > :09:30.question is - how do we make the university system more accessible
:09:31. > :09:34.for people who don't have those kind of teachers. What was it like? What
:09:35. > :09:40.attitudes did you come up against at Cambridge? I think once you get to
:09:41. > :09:43.university, if you are from a working-class background, it's a
:09:44. > :09:47.long experience of trying not to be bullied out. It really is. People
:09:48. > :09:53.kind of... I speak about the fact that when I first started at Trinity
:09:54. > :09:56.I was chased through the gates on a daily basis by officials asking me
:09:57. > :10:02.if I went there. Because, you know, passing the interview and getting my
:10:03. > :10:07.grades wasn't enough. Poppy would agree she has become more
:10:08. > :10:12.middle-class, your accent changed. It shows that social mobility is a
:10:13. > :10:19.big issue? Sure. Social mobility and the lack of it is a big issue. The
:10:20. > :10:22.issue I have, it's an inspiring story, Poppy beat the odds to get
:10:23. > :10:26.there. Exceptional. She was the exception. The point is social
:10:27. > :10:32.mobility, I really think it's a flawed concept. What it says is that
:10:33. > :10:37.- as long as you... We have people rising up, it's fine to have huge
:10:38. > :10:40.levels of inequality, fine to leave people behind in a bad flight
:10:41. > :10:43.plight. It plays into the idea that life should be a rat ration. I don't
:10:44. > :10:48.think it's a good vision for society. There should be dignity for
:10:49. > :10:53.all, not a matter of - you have to go to Oxford or Cambridge shall -.
:10:54. > :10:57.What you're saying those who rise up there will have to be those who come
:10:58. > :11:02.down. See saw will always exist? Not just that. It's matter of... A sense
:11:03. > :11:05.of like you have to move out of your working-class background. We should
:11:06. > :11:10.be ashamed of that background and should look down at people that
:11:11. > :11:15.haven't made it to the top. Isn't that right, Lord David Willetts,
:11:16. > :11:19.that it's not OK. One must strive at least to be middle-class, that
:11:20. > :11:24.actually being working-class is something you have to try and get
:11:25. > :11:28.rid of nowadays? I think it's good that people have aspirations to get
:11:29. > :11:31.on into well-paid jobs and have professional careers. I think it
:11:32. > :11:37.would be a really bad message to send that was somehow an aspiration
:11:38. > :11:41.we want to oppose. I do accept that then across society people do a
:11:42. > :11:43.whole range of jobs and a lot of where you end up is luck. It
:11:44. > :11:47.shouldn't be the case that because you've ended up in a particularly
:11:48. > :11:52.well-paid job or profession you look down on or think this is somehow
:11:53. > :11:55.some judge of your moral worth. So in the way that Poppy has been
:11:56. > :11:58.talking about her own circumstance, that would have been open to a whole
:11:59. > :12:03.lot more people if a lot of the maintenance grants and so forth had
:12:04. > :12:08.still been kept. She said it was a more benign atmosphere, if it could
:12:09. > :12:13.be call benign then than it is now. I would argue, as students don't pay
:12:14. > :12:17.up front there is no reason why I student should be put off going. As
:12:18. > :12:20.we have got rid of the control of the number of students going, there
:12:21. > :12:24.are more students going, particularly more students from
:12:25. > :12:27.lower income backgrounds. It's an argument based on privilege and the
:12:28. > :12:32.idea that one day you will be able... I mean, the fact that you
:12:33. > :12:36.don't have to pay upfront doesn't make you any more nervous about your
:12:37. > :12:44.ability to pay it later on. Why should it be. Why should you be
:12:45. > :12:48.thinking about you could do a degree because of the money you have got.
:12:49. > :12:54.No student has to think about how much money they've got. The
:12:55. > :13:01.evidence... The evidence is that more applicants apply for university
:13:02. > :13:08.from low income backgrounds. Let us look at the signifiers in society.
:13:09. > :13:12.Before we talk about the young Eton eatians at the Kremlin. Let's talk
:13:13. > :13:16.about attitudes in banking, simple things like you dress wrongly, your
:13:17. > :13:20.accent is wrong, brown shoes with a suit. These are signifiers that you
:13:21. > :13:24.can laugh about them, they actually made a huge difference to certain
:13:25. > :13:29.applicants? Yes. I think that's shocking. In fact, what's even more
:13:30. > :13:31.shocking is the number of privately educated people in investment
:13:32. > :13:35.banking appears to be going up, not down. It's bad for investment
:13:36. > :13:40.banking. They need to recruit from a wider, more diverse talent pool and
:13:41. > :13:44.particularly that means looking out beyond four or five universities. It
:13:45. > :13:48.is interesting how this evening we focused on getting to came bridge.
:13:49. > :13:53.That is fantastic. No. Poppy went there. We are not focussing on
:13:54. > :13:58.getting to Cambridge, Poppy'ses exceptional story. Coming to talk
:13:59. > :14:02.about that. The signal that it sends also that Putin will have young
:14:03. > :14:06.Etonians there where I don't think he would have somebody from a
:14:07. > :14:09.comprehensive from Newcastle there. It wouldn't have matter. They were
:14:10. > :14:16.showing something by being able to get to him. That privilege still
:14:17. > :14:20.exists? It reminds us it's who - who you know. I want to go back very
:14:21. > :14:25.quickly on that issue of debt. When you come out of uni from a less
:14:26. > :14:28.privileged background you come out with ?53,000 of debt. I mean,
:14:29. > :14:33.actually to pay that back, when you are from a richer background, you
:14:34. > :14:40.pay that back sooner. Those from... Will find it hard to buy a house. It
:14:41. > :14:44.does disadvantage you still. All political parties talk the talk over
:14:45. > :14:47.social mobility. Poppy, what do you think would actually be something
:14:48. > :14:53.they could achieve and achieve quickly?
:14:54. > :15:01.have been told for so long the reason therein isn't more int about
:15:02. > :15:04.things like education, it is about they haven't got the right grades,
:15:05. > :15:11.maybe they haven't worked hard enough. What the report shows is it
:15:12. > :15:15.doesn't matter how well you do your class back ground will act against
:15:16. > :15:17.you. That is a good argument for positive discrimination.
:15:18. > :15:25.In a motion to reintroduce elections for the Shadow Cabinet a bid to heal
:15:26. > :15:28.divisions in the party or a cunning plan to thwart Jeremy Corbyn?
:15:29. > :15:30.When Parliament returns on Monday, Labour backbencher, Clive Betts,
:15:31. > :15:32.will table a motion for the PLP meeting in order,
:15:33. > :15:35.as his motion put it, "To ensure that the Shadow Cabinet
:15:36. > :15:38.has the support of backbench Labour MPs and that the entire PLP can
:15:39. > :15:44.The elections were scrapped by Ed Miliband five years ago,
:15:45. > :15:47.so you'd think that the Corbynistas would be in favour.
:15:48. > :15:50.Well, all is not quite as it seems in Labour land.
:15:51. > :15:57.I'm joined by our political editor, Nick Watt.
:15:58. > :16:03.Nick, tell me about Monday's vote? That is right. There a debate on
:16:04. > :16:07.this on the motion in the PLP on Monday and probably a vote on it on
:16:08. > :16:12.Tuesday, and as you were saying this was the system that was in place in
:16:13. > :16:16.the long years of opposition under Michael Foot and Neil Kinnock and
:16:17. > :16:18.established by Ed Miliband must to the conster macing of one
:16:19. > :16:23.backbencher at the time. I hear that people around
:16:24. > :16:28.Ed Miliband are spreading this as his clause four moment,
:16:29. > :16:30.where he demonstrates strong leadership by beating
:16:31. > :16:31.the party into submission. I just think he's
:16:32. > :16:43.misread the situation. Ed Miliband dropped them because of
:16:44. > :16:49.the whole of the Shadow Cabinet was more of a David Miliband complexion.
:16:50. > :16:53.We will hear from Clive Beths who is tabling this motion who is saying
:16:54. > :16:57.it's a matter of promoting unity. The Corbyn camp may be smelling a
:16:58. > :17:02.rat. I think the view in the Corbyn camp may well be that he did an
:17:03. > :17:06.inclusive Shadow Cabinet when he became leader, appointed Tony
:17:07. > :17:10.Blair's former flatmate and there is a feeling this is a delayed part of
:17:11. > :17:16.the coup an attempt to make Jeremy Corbyn perhaps a prisoner of a hoes
:17:17. > :17:22.style Shadow Cabinet. Maybe they can say election, that is a great idea,
:17:23. > :17:26.why don't we widen the franchise beyond the PLP and allow the
:17:27. > :17:28.Conference to elect the members of the Shadow Cabinet. Thank you.
:17:29. > :17:32.Joining us from Sheffield is the MP who has tabled that
:17:33. > :17:44.It is hard to see this anything other than an attempt to hobble the
:17:45. > :17:48.man you think is going to win the leadership election, Jeremy Corbyn.
:17:49. > :17:54.First I don't know who is going to win the election, that is clearly
:17:55. > :18:00.ongoing, well, it is very easy to see it is an alternative way, my
:18:01. > :18:05.motion talks about unity, getting the whole of the Parliamentary
:18:06. > :18:10.Labour Party working together. In recent weeks I have talked to party
:18:11. > :18:14.members and lots of Labour Party voters in my constituency, and they
:18:15. > :18:19.say one simple thing, for heavens sake get your act together, start
:18:20. > :18:22.working in a united way in Westminster, start being an
:18:23. > :18:27.effective opposition to this right-wing Tory Government. We are
:18:28. > :18:31.fed up of you falling out. This is a pragmatic motion, a motion to try
:18:32. > :18:36.and help achieve that objective. Clearly only a few weeks ago we
:18:37. > :18:39.weren't working together, there was sackings, resignation, and whoever
:18:40. > :18:42.wins the leadership election we can't go back to that sort of
:18:43. > :18:47.situation. Imagine a scenario where Jeremy Corbyn does win the
:18:48. > :18:51.leadership, and elections to the Shadow Cabinet produce people like
:18:52. > :18:56.for example Yvette Cooper, Angela Eagle, all sorts of people who
:18:57. > :18:59.wouldn't perhaps it would be fair to say would not sit comfortably with,
:19:00. > :19:04.beside Jeremy Corbyn now, how is that going to heal divisions? The
:19:05. > :19:06.fact they would have to sit down, however uncomfortably and work
:19:07. > :19:10.together, that would be a major step forward in my view, and that is a
:19:11. > :19:13.you have to achieve. People recognise that there are divisions
:19:14. > :19:16.and differences from the inception of the Labour Party, we have had
:19:17. > :19:20.people of different view, backgrounds, coming together with
:19:21. > :19:24.one objective, and that is to get Labour MPs elected to get Labour
:19:25. > :19:28.councillors elected and challenge and beat the Tory, what we have to
:19:29. > :19:32.do, we can't win an election for some time to form a government is to
:19:33. > :19:35.be an effective opposition and get people of different views, who
:19:36. > :19:40.probably haven't got on in the past, to sit down together. My motion is
:19:41. > :19:45.an attempt to achieve that. I have been a member of the Labour Party
:19:46. > :19:50.for 47 year, I have been an MP for 24 year, what I feel strongly is we
:19:51. > :19:53.need party unity. That is what the members are telling me, what the
:19:54. > :19:56.voters in Sheffield are telling me. I think they are telling us up and
:19:57. > :19:59.down the country, get together and work together and be an effective
:20:00. > :20:04.opposition. My motion tries to achieve that. You will have heard
:20:05. > :20:09.our political editor say there could be some unintended consequences
:20:10. > :20:16.here, perhaps the Shadow Cabinet could be indeed elected, perhaps by
:20:17. > :20:22.the PLP, but what about wisening that and make it elected at the
:20:23. > :20:28.Labour Conference, would that not be more democratic We have the election
:20:29. > :20:33.of the Labour Party leader is done by all members and beyond, there are
:20:34. > :20:36.elections for the NEC, when we come down to the Shadow Cabinet it is
:20:37. > :20:41.right that the Parliamentary Labour Party have a say in that process to
:20:42. > :20:44.heal some of the divisions that are around now, that is my objective
:20:45. > :20:49.around my intention, you know, the other spin on it that you put s
:20:50. > :20:54.somehow it is part of the ongoing plot to curb Jeremy, if he gets back
:20:55. > :20:57.as leader, that isn't certain yet of course, that is ridiculous this is
:20:58. > :21:01.my motion, I have put the motion down, I haven't been going round
:21:02. > :21:05.talking to people and plotting with people, and trying to enlist
:21:06. > :21:09.support. I am tabling for my colleagues to reflect on whether as
:21:10. > :21:12.MPs we don't have a responsibility to Labour voters to try and sort our
:21:13. > :21:16.problems out and try and start working together more effectively.
:21:17. > :21:21.Thank you very much indeed. That is my sole objective. Back to you,
:21:22. > :21:24.there is more. Yes, this is not the only idea coming down the pipeline.
:21:25. > :21:29.I am told there is a move to try and get the Labour Conference this year,
:21:30. > :21:33.to vote on bringing back the old electoral college system. That would
:21:34. > :21:37.be seen as deeply hostile to a future Jeremy Corbyn, because
:21:38. > :21:40.obviously it would dilute the grass roots members who look like they
:21:41. > :21:44.might put him back in to office, they would only have a third of the
:21:45. > :21:48.vote. It would be the trade unions who would have the other third and
:21:49. > :21:52.MPs and MEPs who would have the other third. The reason for the rush
:21:53. > :21:54.is to vote it in as the Conference, the national executive committee the
:21:55. > :21:58.Labour Party would have to say we think you should have a vote on it.
:21:59. > :22:02.There has been an election to the NEC, it's a move to the left but
:22:03. > :22:05.crucially the new members don't take up their voting positions until
:22:06. > :22:09.after the Conference, so perhaps you could sneak it in, really important
:22:10. > :22:13.point to make, the outgoing members of the NEC are highly sensitive.
:22:14. > :22:15.There has been an election, they would be wary of being part of a
:22:16. > :22:18.stitch up. The word "Greenland" probably didn't
:22:19. > :22:21.cross the lips of Cabinet members at Chequers when they were dreaming
:22:22. > :22:23.up their bespoke Brexit model, but the experience of the world's
:22:24. > :22:26.largest island, an autonomous territory of Denmark,
:22:27. > :22:27.might have lessons for the way the UK proceeds -
:22:28. > :22:29.even the relationships between Scotland, Northern Ireland
:22:30. > :22:32.and the rest of the United Kingdom. We sent our reporter,
:22:33. > :22:34.James Clayton, to learn Usually Greenland waters,
:22:35. > :22:51.most seals are usually Because it's easier
:22:52. > :22:57.for them to see the fish. They represent the country's
:22:58. > :23:03.latest battle with the EU, a journey that started
:23:04. > :23:08.four decades ago. In 1982, fed up of European
:23:09. > :23:10.fishing trawlers, Greenland chose to leave the EU -
:23:11. > :23:18.then the EEC. Just like that, the union lost
:23:19. > :23:20.almost half its territory. In the subsequent negotiations,
:23:21. > :23:28.Greenland has agreed to give EU In the subsequent negotiations,
:23:29. > :23:30.Greenlanders agreed to give EU limited fishing quotas
:23:31. > :23:32.in exchange for cash. That deal took three
:23:33. > :23:34.years to complete. This man was part of
:23:35. > :23:40.the negotiating team. While it was very difficult
:23:41. > :23:44.to the European Union and the Europeans to understand why
:23:45. > :23:52.we wanted to get out, and why we didn't want the money,
:23:53. > :23:58.but the fact is that there was no money, there was minimal investment
:23:59. > :24:01.in infrastructure, which we needed badly,
:24:02. > :24:09.so that is why we could see that there was no economic
:24:10. > :24:13.reason to stay. The deal has generally been seen
:24:14. > :24:20.as good for Greenlandic fishermen, Every time it comes
:24:21. > :24:49.up, shoot beside it. In 2010, the EU banned the sale
:24:50. > :24:55.of seal products within the union. There is an Inuit exception
:24:56. > :24:57.to the ban, but it has Mitzy owns a travel shop
:24:58. > :25:07.in Greenland's capital. So when the EU banned seal products,
:25:08. > :25:13.what happened to your business? They had been more slow to sell them
:25:14. > :25:30.to another place in Europe, Before the EU ban, how many seal
:25:31. > :26:10.skins were you selling? This man is an MP for the Democrats,
:26:11. > :26:13.the minority party in I definitely think it would have
:26:14. > :26:22.been easier, with more bargaining We would go, "You guys want fish
:26:23. > :26:28.more, we want to sell seal skins, That is still the argument
:26:29. > :26:31.we are making, but it is really difficult
:26:32. > :26:33.when you sit on the outside. It would be easy to sit
:26:34. > :26:36.on the inside at the table, and say "Hey guys, this is the deal,
:26:37. > :26:40.we are part of this too." Fortunately for the marine life,
:26:41. > :26:42.Lars was better at hitting The only thing he brought
:26:43. > :26:45.back in his boat was For other industries,
:26:46. > :26:48.Greenland's exit from the EU Nikolai has just started
:26:49. > :27:06.exporting beer to the EU. Like in Germany and so on,
:27:07. > :27:14.if we were a Danish company in Denmark, we would have to pay 25%
:27:15. > :27:17.on everything we buy But because we are outside the EU,
:27:18. > :27:27.we have the possibility, of deducting the 25%
:27:28. > :27:29.when we take it up here. if we were a member of the EU,
:27:30. > :27:35.it would be easier for paperwork and handling
:27:36. > :27:36.all the practical matters. Being a part of the kingdom
:27:37. > :27:39.still gives us certain advantages and it is easier to use Denmark
:27:40. > :27:42.as a stepping stone It is almost as easy to export
:27:43. > :27:49.to Denmark as if we When the goods are in Denmark,
:27:50. > :27:53.they are in the EU. The runway in the capital isn't long
:27:54. > :28:01.enough to land large aircraft and there are no interconnected
:28:02. > :28:05.roads in Greenland - this is as far as you can
:28:06. > :28:09.get in the capital. Some believe that Greenland's size,
:28:10. > :28:15.and more importantly its potential mineral wealth means if Greenland
:28:16. > :28:17.were in the EU it would be Basically, EU is a place that has
:28:18. > :28:22.a lot of money. They get a lot of money
:28:23. > :28:24.from the member states and they redistribute it,
:28:25. > :28:29.and we basically wanted the goods that would get more money back
:28:30. > :28:36.than we would get in. It should be a no-brainer,
:28:37. > :28:38.economically. We should get in there and get
:28:39. > :28:41.access to that big pot of money. It would be difficult to say that
:28:42. > :28:44.Greenland has thrived It is heavily subsidised by Denmark,
:28:45. > :28:48.alcoholism here is rife, and the country boasts
:28:49. > :28:51.the unenviable claim as the suicide Nicola Sturgeon has floated the idea
:28:52. > :28:59.of doing a reverse Greenland, with Scotland staying inside the EU,
:29:00. > :29:06.as the rest of Britain exits. Well, I was surprised
:29:07. > :29:16.by the opposite policies there, because you don't get the more
:29:17. > :29:20.independence joining European Union. But you might get independence
:29:21. > :29:24.from the UK. If that is the only case
:29:25. > :29:27.that the Scots have, then it is excellent,
:29:28. > :29:37.but going to European Union is actually giving your political
:29:38. > :29:40.freedom to someone. When asked, most people
:29:41. > :29:57.here are only vaguely conscious of the EU, but Greenland does offer
:29:58. > :30:00.the UK an imperfect template In many ways, it has
:30:01. > :30:03.benefitted from leaving, but it has also been left out
:30:04. > :30:07.in the cold when major policy decisions were being made
:30:08. > :30:09.about the future of one In this post-Brexit environment,
:30:10. > :30:18.every scrap of economic data is being poured over to see
:30:19. > :30:21.if we can get a sense of what impact our planned departure
:30:22. > :30:23.from the EU will have. Today, we had another
:30:24. > :30:25.important indicator. Our business editor,
:30:26. > :30:33.Helen Thomas, is here. Today, we had the PMI figures for
:30:34. > :30:37.manufacturing in August. They showed a sharp recovery from the month
:30:38. > :30:40.before. This is survey data. They ask firms about their levels of
:30:41. > :30:47.business activity, new business and so on. It's really widely followed.
:30:48. > :30:50.It had a sharp drop in July. Consistent with a potential
:30:51. > :30:52.recession. That was part of what prompted the Bank of England to take
:30:53. > :30:58.action, cutting interest rates and so on. This bounce back is really
:30:59. > :31:01.quite comforting. We've seen some quite good data from the consumer
:31:02. > :31:05.since the referendum on spending and confidence and so on. This now
:31:06. > :31:11.suggests that business hasn't fallen off the economic cliff as well. Now,
:31:12. > :31:15.the weaker pound is helping that boosted exports, makes our goods
:31:16. > :31:19.cheaper overseas. The psychological aspect is important. July, people
:31:20. > :31:23.were in shock. We had political turmoil. We didn't have a Prime
:31:24. > :31:26.Minister for part of the month. Now, this suggests that work may have
:31:27. > :31:31.been postponed, but we're getting back to business as usual. Does this
:31:32. > :31:38.suggest that we'd be giving any kind of recession a body swerve? Well, we
:31:39. > :31:43.can hope so, but I think it's too soon to make any judgment on that
:31:44. > :31:47.front. I mean, for a start, we are not in a post-Brexit environment so
:31:48. > :31:50.how business reacts when Article 50 is triggered when you have
:31:51. > :31:54.negotiations about our place in the world remains to be seen. Good data
:31:55. > :31:59.tends to mean the pound strengthens a bit. That helping hand starts to
:32:00. > :32:03.wane. Most importantly, this was manufacturing data. That hes a only
:32:04. > :32:07.10% of the economy. What we're really waiting for are construction
:32:08. > :32:17.numbers tomorrow and then services numbers tomorrow. Next week. If you
:32:18. > :32:22.see a rebound in services it feels like the post-vote shock factor
:32:23. > :32:23.lifted quickly. That would be good Helen, thanks very news. Much
:32:24. > :32:30.indeed. From now until the US presidential
:32:31. > :32:33.election on November 8th, we'll be hearing from the cream of American
:32:34. > :32:35.political commentators on the programme regularly as we tap
:32:36. > :32:38.into the expectations and anxieties We will make America great again!
:32:39. > :32:55.We'll fix it together! The day after Donald Trump made
:32:56. > :32:57.a big speech on immigration, we're joined by Ana Marie Cox,
:32:58. > :32:59.senior political correspondent for MTV News, who is in Minneapolis,
:33:00. > :33:03.and Josh Barro, a senior editor at Business Insider,
:33:04. > :33:11.who is speaking to us from New York. Good evening to both of you. We
:33:12. > :33:15.asked you both to pick your clips which kind of for you encapsulate
:33:16. > :33:18.the way this election is playing out. Ann Marie Cox let's see your
:33:19. > :33:22.clip fist. Have you even read the United
:33:23. > :33:41.States Constitution? Why did you choose that clip Well,
:33:42. > :33:46.there are a few instances. An clip of an immigrant family of colour.
:33:47. > :33:49.That has become a big issue in this election, both people of colour and
:33:50. > :33:53.white supremacy as well as immigration. Second of all, that
:33:54. > :33:58.clip shows how there has been a reversal of polls when it comes to
:33:59. > :34:04.which party is associated with being pro-America. Which party is being
:34:05. > :34:08.associated with patriotism and love of country and which party is
:34:09. > :34:13.considereded pro-military, for that matter. It's significant that the
:34:14. > :34:17.most emotionally resonate moments of the entire campaign has come not
:34:18. > :34:20.from someone involved in the campaign specifically. It didn't
:34:21. > :34:25.come from Hillary Clinton. One of the most powerful arguments for her
:34:26. > :34:30.presidency came from someone else besides her. Let's look at your
:34:31. > :34:34.clip, Josh. We didn't discuss payment
:34:35. > :34:36.of the wall, that'll They don't know it yet, but they're
:34:37. > :34:49.going to pay for the wall. Josh, why does that clip encans late
:34:50. > :34:52.what is going on for you? The second part was not from a later date, it
:34:53. > :34:56.was from several hours later on the same day. It reflects how Donald
:34:57. > :34:59.Trump has had this ideaed that he can, basically, change his mind and
:35:00. > :35:02.change his statements on any topic as quickly as he wants. Say whatever
:35:03. > :35:06.he thinks is best for the audiences that he is in front of and sell both
:35:07. > :35:10.of them on the idea that he's on their side. This has been a fixture
:35:11. > :35:14.of his business career going back 40 years. I think he has been learning
:35:15. > :35:18.in the reaction to his flip flop on the wall that we've seen this week
:35:19. > :35:23.is that people notice what he says in front of both those audiences and
:35:24. > :35:27.it's catching up with him. Looking at the way that certainly here the
:35:28. > :35:32.media tends in a way to look at Trump as a kind of cartoonish
:35:33. > :35:36.figure. As the campaign goes on, he has been cutting through albeit his
:35:37. > :35:41.approval ratings are dipping behind Hillary Clinton's, we have under
:35:42. > :35:47.estimated his power to get to feel, for people to feel enfranchised by
:35:48. > :35:52.him? Well, I think he was under estimated a year ago. I think now
:35:53. > :35:54.he's not under estimated. I think Clinton had the right formulation
:35:55. > :35:58.that, you know, you don't have to take him seriously, but the prospect
:35:59. > :36:02.of his presidency you have to take very seriously. Ann Marie, looking
:36:03. > :36:05.at these candidates, both candidates, in a sense this time
:36:06. > :36:09.round we don't have a hero candidate, if I might call Obama
:36:10. > :36:16.hero candidate, they are both flawed candidates. How does that change the
:36:17. > :36:21.way the campaign goes? Well, I think that both of our candidates are
:36:22. > :36:26.heroes to some people. There are a lot of women in the country who
:36:27. > :36:30.consider Hillary Clinton a hero. She will be the first female president.
:36:31. > :36:34.This is a campaign largely of of negatives. The two most unpopular
:36:35. > :36:40.candidates we have had. That is one of the reasons this race turned so
:36:41. > :36:44.nasty. Turned into arguments against the other candidate than any other
:36:45. > :36:48.race I can remember. I feel like, you know, I want to speak to the
:36:49. > :36:53.caricature of Trump whether he is a cartoon character. I think that's a
:36:54. > :36:58.danger for all us in the media he can seem ridiculous. I can't think
:36:59. > :37:05.of an election in my lifetime that has had... I choose that clip of Mr
:37:06. > :37:09.Khan I feel our constitution is under threat. Donald Trump poses a
:37:10. > :37:17.threat to American democracy, really. Actually, Josh, if you look
:37:18. > :37:21.at how, what he says goes with different communities, then, let us
:37:22. > :37:25.take something like the wall and the row it has developed today on
:37:26. > :37:28.Twitter between himself and the Mexican president and so forth. It
:37:29. > :37:31.seems to be a disconnect between what he is saying, what the Mexican
:37:32. > :37:35.president is saying, it doesn't seem to damage Donald Trump. He is very
:37:36. > :37:39.resilient? Well, I think it's because Donald Trump has never been
:37:40. > :37:43.about policy and the wall has never really been about the Wallace a
:37:44. > :37:48.physical structure as such. It's about being tough, standing up to
:37:49. > :37:52.these outside forces that trump and many of his voters blame for their
:37:53. > :37:55.troubles and what they perceive as the troubles of the United States. I
:37:56. > :37:59.thought that trip to Mexico went quite well for him. For whatever
:38:00. > :38:04.reason the Mexican president wases extremely gracious to him. Sought
:38:05. > :38:10.his presence in Mexico City. Only politely rebuked him for the fact he
:38:11. > :38:14.spent much of his campaign fillifying Mexico. He got what he
:38:15. > :38:19.wanted out of that, a demonstration of strength. His voters are not
:38:20. > :38:23.holding him accountable line byline, he said he will implement this
:38:24. > :38:26.policy. It isn't about policy he makes the right enemies for them.
:38:27. > :38:37.They perceive him as standing up for them. What is frustrating about
:38:38. > :38:40.covering this election as a urn Lists is how pointless it is. They
:38:41. > :38:44.have two different visions of what America ought to be and who has real
:38:45. > :38:50.claim over America. That hes a an important conversation. It tends to
:38:51. > :38:55.be a pretty stupid conversation. I wonder, looking at the ten Europe of
:38:56. > :39:00.Donald Trump's comments in Mexico and indeed the toning down and his
:39:01. > :39:06.new team and so forth. If we're going to see more toning down, as it
:39:07. > :39:12.were, in Trump's manner, in the next six weeks? I think your' going to
:39:13. > :39:16.continue to see this that Josh's clip pointed out. He will continue
:39:17. > :39:23.to try to do day time Trump and Trump after dark. I think he's going
:39:24. > :39:30.to try to talk out of both sides of his mouth. His ardent fans don't
:39:31. > :39:33.care he is doing this. As long as he sends the signal to them that will
:39:34. > :39:37.he is still the same person that they thought he was, I think that
:39:38. > :39:42.has to do, quite frankly, with a lot of bigotry. I think as long as he
:39:43. > :39:46.sends that signal he is still that person and still has those feelings,
:39:47. > :39:50.they are willing to let him do what he needs to do in order to win. To
:39:51. > :39:56.finish, on that question, I think Trump said as well he was the Brexit
:39:57. > :40:00.man. A lot of the establishment here, Mr Brexit he called himself, a
:40:01. > :40:04.lot of people in the establishment under estimated the vote to leave
:40:05. > :40:09.the EU. It might be the establishment in America, have
:40:10. > :40:15.underestimated his ability to turn out the vote on 8th November? I
:40:16. > :40:19.don't buy that comparison. I realise almost everybody expected the Brexit
:40:20. > :40:25.vote to lose. I expected it to lose. Half the polls had Leave ahead of
:40:26. > :40:28.Remain. They were ignoring polling evidence out there. In the United
:40:29. > :40:33.States nearly all the polling had Hillary Clinton ahead. Well North of
:40:34. > :40:37.90% of the polls conducted this year have her leading. Even now it's
:40:38. > :40:40.about her being ahead by four instead of eight. Presidential
:40:41. > :40:46.elections in the United States in recent decades do not go by enormous
:40:47. > :40:52.margins. Eight would be a blow out win. The biggest since 2004. A four
:40:53. > :40:54.point win would be a good within. People in the establishment have
:40:55. > :40:58.good reason to believe Hillary is ahead because she has been ahead
:40:59. > :40:59.through almost this entire thing. Thank you very much. We have the
:41:00. > :41:03.debates to come. When a flying pig named Algie
:41:04. > :41:07.materialised above the V Museum this week, it turned out that it
:41:08. > :41:10.heralded the announcement of a 50th Algie, you'll recall, first appeared
:41:11. > :41:14.on a 1977 album cover, before escaping and floating off
:41:15. > :41:16.to 30,000 feet, causing havoc Here he is back in his heydey,
:41:17. > :41:43.complete with the wrong music. # Remember when you were young
:41:44. > :41:45.# You shone like the sun # Shine on you crazy diamond...