:00:00. > :00:08.It has been fast and furious in the Newsnight office today -
:00:09. > :00:14.a string of exclusive stories, from arms sales to Saudi Arabia,
:00:15. > :00:16.to a row over classifying athletes for the Paralympics and Hollywood's
:00:17. > :00:19.hottest comedy property, Amy Schumer.
:00:20. > :00:23.This is how the Saudis are fighting the war in Yemen.
:00:24. > :00:27.Tonight, we've learned a committee of MPs is about to demand a pause
:00:28. > :00:41.This is how the Saudis are fighting the war in Yemen.
:00:42. > :00:44.Tonight, we've learned a committee of MPs is about to demand a pause
:00:45. > :00:47.in arms sales to Saudia Arabia because of attacks like this one.
:00:48. > :00:50.At around 4.00pm in the afternoon patients, doctors, nurses here could
:00:51. > :00:53.Now, they didn't think it would strike, not only because this
:00:54. > :00:56.is a residential area, but because this is a hospital.
:00:57. > :00:58.However, an air strike did hit, right over here, killing
:00:59. > :01:03.After the success of 2012, the Paralympics begin in Rio
:01:04. > :01:04.tomorrow, dogged by controversy over doping, ticket sales
:01:05. > :01:07.Now, we reveal troubling questions about how
:01:08. > :01:17.Both national and international classification, I think it's
:01:18. > :01:18.not fit for purpose, it's not sufficiently robust
:01:19. > :01:36.We meet the irrespressible American comedian, Amy Schumer.
:01:37. > :01:38.If it isn't Hillary in November, does your act change?
:01:39. > :01:42.My act will change because I'll need to learn to speak Spanish
:01:43. > :01:53.because I will move to Spain or somewhere.
:01:54. > :01:58.Newsnight has seen a leaked report which suggests that the Government
:01:59. > :02:01.may be heading for a major embarrassment over its continued
:02:02. > :02:05.support for British arms sales to Saudi Arabia.
:02:06. > :02:08.Over the past year, our reporter, Gabriel Gatehouse, has repeatedly
:02:09. > :02:10.documented the targeting of civilians and civilian
:02:11. > :02:13.infrastructure, including factories and hospitals,
:02:14. > :02:16.in the Saudi-led bombing campaign in Yemen.
:02:17. > :02:19.And yet, as late as yesterday, the Foreign Secretary, Boris Johnson,
:02:20. > :02:22.defended British arms sales to Saudi Arabia for use in Yemen,
:02:23. > :02:24.saying the campaign is not in clear breach
:02:25. > :02:32.But Gabriel has now learned that the Commons Committee
:02:33. > :02:37.of Arms Export Controls takes a very different and damning view.
:02:38. > :02:45.What's the story? A background to this. In July this year, on the last
:02:46. > :02:50.day of parliament before the summer recess, in what is known as take out
:02:51. > :02:51.the trash day. The day the Government releases potentially
:02:52. > :02:55.embarrassing information. The Foreign Office made a startled a MiG
:02:56. > :02:59.when it said over a period of six months the Government had assessed
:03:00. > :03:04.that Saudi Arabia wasn't in breach of international humanitarian law in
:03:05. > :03:10.Yemen it admitted it had made no such assessment at all. It replied
:03:11. > :03:13.on Saudi assertions. You mentioned Boris Johnson's continued support
:03:14. > :03:16.for arms sales to Saudi Arabia saying there wasn't enough evidence
:03:17. > :03:21.to suggest that Saudi Arabia was committing war crimes. Well, this
:03:22. > :03:26.report from the committee on arms export control. It's a draft report,
:03:27. > :03:29.it concludes the opposite. It says the weight of evidence is so great
:03:30. > :03:33.that the UK should suspend arms sales to Saudi Arabia for use in
:03:34. > :03:37.Yemen until an independent and international inquiry can establish
:03:38. > :03:42.the truth. Now, both sides in this conflict have been accused of
:03:43. > :03:51.committing war crimes, but the UN says 60% of the civilian casualties
:03:52. > :03:55.are caused by Saudi led air strikes. This programme highlighted targeting
:03:56. > :03:59.of countryians. We saw that Yemen last year. We travelled travelled
:04:00. > :04:04.with our correspondent who has been back to Yemen for a documentary for
:04:05. > :04:11.Our World. She's come back and here is some what she found.
:04:12. > :04:13.Yemen has been under constant bombardment for the last 18 months.
:04:14. > :04:15.A conflict between Houthi rebels and a Saudi-led coalition.
:04:16. > :04:19.Both sides have been accused of war crimes, but it is the Saudis
:04:20. > :04:24.that the UK and its western allies are backing.
:04:25. > :04:28.I was in Houthi-held territory in northern Yemen,
:04:29. > :04:30.three weeks ago, when a nearby Medecins Sans Frontieres' hospital
:04:31. > :04:36.This footage was filmed by local residents immediately
:04:37. > :04:46.after the attack, which ended up killing 19 people.
:04:47. > :04:48.TRANSLATION: All the patients were at ease, some were sleeping.
:04:49. > :04:51.There were sleeping children and there were mothers giving birth.
:04:52. > :04:55.There were no Houthis or any armed people in the hospital only
:04:56. > :05:01.the doctors and nurses who work here.
:05:02. > :05:03.At around 4.00pm in the afternoon, patients, doctors, nurses
:05:04. > :05:06.here could hear aeroplanes flying overhead.
:05:07. > :05:09.They didn't think it would strike, not only because this
:05:10. > :05:15.is a residential area, but because this is a hospital.
:05:16. > :05:17.But an air strike did hit, right over here by the emergency
:05:18. > :05:23.TRANSLATION: People lost their jobs and homes.
:05:24. > :05:26.All of this is nothing compared to the loss of people's life.
:05:27. > :05:30.Who's responsible for what is happening to us?
:05:31. > :05:35.Saudi Arabia claims that the targeting of the hospital
:05:36. > :05:38.was a mistake, but MSF insists that all parties to the conflict have
:05:39. > :05:40.been provided with clear GPS coordinates of the
:05:41. > :05:58.TRANSLATIoN: It is markings for the coalition to
:05:59. > :06:06.They were fully aware and we contact them on a daily basis and tell them
:06:07. > :06:09.of MSF's whereabouts and this logo is painted on the roof
:06:10. > :06:11.to differentiate this building from all other buildings and yet
:06:12. > :06:35.19-year-old Amon was a local MS volunteer.
:06:36. > :06:41.He had just driven his ambulance through the hospital gates
:06:42. > :06:45.He and the patients in the back of his ambulance were all killed.
:06:46. > :06:48.TRANSLATION: He came home at 1.00pm to have lunch and went back to work.
:06:49. > :06:51.At 3.00pm we heard the bombing of the air strike.
:06:52. > :06:53.I was screaming, "my son, my son, my son."
:06:54. > :06:57.Someone else said he was in the ambulance,
:06:58. > :07:00.I found my son underneath the cupboards,
:07:01. > :07:04.completely burnt, like a piece of coal.
:07:05. > :07:07.This was the fourth MSF hospital to have been destroyed
:07:08. > :07:20.The charity has now withdrawn from northern Yemen.
:07:21. > :07:21.The country's infrastructure has been devastated.
:07:22. > :07:23.Meanwhile, nearly 4,000 Yemeni civilians have been killed
:07:24. > :07:32.What is in the committee report? The committee is made up of MPs from
:07:33. > :07:33.four other select committees, defence, foreign affairs,
:07:34. > :07:37.international development and business. All the committees
:07:38. > :07:41.involved in the export of arms. This copy that we've got hold of is a
:07:42. > :07:43.draft. The committee will meet tomorrow to discuss possible
:07:44. > :07:50.changes. We don't know what the final language is going to sound
:07:51. > :07:55.like. As it stands, the report says that the weight of evidence of
:07:56. > :07:58.violations of international humanitarian law, by the Saudi-led
:07:59. > :08:03.coalition in Yemen, is now so great that it is very difficult to
:08:04. > :08:10.continue to support Saudi Arabia while maintaining the credibility of
:08:11. > :08:15.our arms licencing regime. Now, in the summary it says that given the
:08:16. > :08:22.scale and the history of UK arms exports to Saudi Arabia it's
:08:23. > :08:24."inevitable" that any violations of international law by the Saudi-led
:08:25. > :08:29.coalition would involve arms supplied by the UK. The fact that
:08:30. > :08:34.the Government has not supported efforts to establish an independent
:08:35. > :08:39.international inquiry, the report says, "has allowed for the transfer
:08:40. > :08:46.of items to Saudi Arabia very possibly in contravention of the
:08:47. > :08:50.UK's legal obligations while doubt and uncertainty about IHL compliance
:08:51. > :08:59.in Yemen exists the default position of the UK Government should be not
:09:00. > :09:06.to sell weapons" to us spend weapon sales. What does the law is a? Where
:09:07. > :09:10.there is a clear risk items might be used in commission of serious
:09:11. > :09:14.violation of international humanitarian law. It's whether there
:09:15. > :09:18.is insufficient evidence to support that, as the Government contends.
:09:19. > :09:22.This report concludes there is ample evidence. The Government says it has
:09:23. > :09:27.one of the strictest licencing regimes in the world. Since the
:09:28. > :09:29.conflict began it hasn't refused a single export licence to Saudi
:09:30. > :09:34.Arabia. This is what the draft report has to say on the matter. "We
:09:35. > :09:38.have found that the Government's arms export licencing regime, which
:09:39. > :09:45.it repeatedly asserts is robust, is in fact, to a large extent, opaque
:09:46. > :09:49.and the Government too often relies on assertion rather thanes positive
:09:50. > :09:53.evidence. " What weight does the committee report actually have, will
:09:54. > :09:56.have, when it comes out? The committee has weight, but it doesn't
:09:57. > :10:01.have the power to force the Government to change policy. It does
:10:02. > :10:04.have the power to force it to come and explain itself in front of the
:10:05. > :10:08.committee. There is another thing going on. There is a legal case, the
:10:09. > :10:12.campaign group, Campaign Against The Arms Trade, is taking the Government
:10:13. > :10:16.to court over its arms sales to Saudi Arabia. It will go to judicial
:10:17. > :10:19.review. There will be a hearing early next year. I spoke to their
:10:20. > :10:24.lawyers this evening. They have written to the Ministry of Defence
:10:25. > :10:26.urgently seeking clarification about these assertions that they'd
:10:27. > :10:29.assessed, the Government had assessed, that Saudi Arabia wasn't
:10:30. > :10:34.in breach of international humanitarian law. They say that the
:10:35. > :10:36.Government has apparently placed inaccurate and misleading statements
:10:37. > :10:40.before the court. They haven't yet heard back. Gabriel, thanks vuch
:10:41. > :10:50.indeed. -- thanks very much indeed. When the Paralympics
:10:51. > :10:53.begin in Rio tomorrow the competition will be fierce and,
:10:54. > :10:56.for the athletes, it will be the culmination of everything
:10:57. > :10:58.they have worked for. But after the triumph of London
:10:59. > :11:01.2012, it feels like a key moment for the Paralympics,
:11:02. > :11:03.with problems over tickets sales, the exclusion of the Russian team
:11:04. > :11:06.because of a doping scandal, sponsorship issues,
:11:07. > :11:07.and now the latest - Here's our exclusive
:11:08. > :11:17.report by Hannah Barnes. From its humble origins as a
:11:18. > :11:19.competition for injured British servicemen and women after the
:11:20. > :11:29.Second World War, the Paralympic legacy has gone from strength to
:11:30. > :11:35.strength. Just 16 people took part in the fist contest in 1948, but
:11:36. > :11:40.over the next 10 days more than 4,000 athletes will vie for the
:11:41. > :11:44.medals in Rio. But could there be a problem with the foundations the
:11:45. > :11:48.Paralympics are built upon It's something that's been going on for
:11:49. > :11:52.decades. It's the worst kept secret in sport. As with any system of
:11:53. > :11:58.clarification there will be potential for people to be at the
:11:59. > :12:02.higher end or the lower end. Increased success and status for the
:12:03. > :12:06.Paralympics has brought increased scrutiny with questions being raised
:12:07. > :12:10.about the classification process which determines which category
:12:11. > :12:15.athletes should be placed in to ensure competition is fair. So, how
:12:16. > :12:19.does it work? The aim of the classification system is to make
:12:20. > :12:24.sure that athletes are competing against opponents who have similar
:12:25. > :12:28.or equal impairments. To start with, there are 10 broad categories that
:12:29. > :12:34.athletes are assigned to. They include eight physical groups of
:12:35. > :12:42.impairments, fore, loss of limb or limb deficient i or conditions
:12:43. > :12:50.common to people with cerebral palsy. On top of these there are two
:12:51. > :12:53.further groups. Visual impairment and intellectual impairment. Within
:12:54. > :13:00.those different categories it's broken down further to try to make
:13:01. > :13:04.things even fairer. Let's take track athletes, for example, who have
:13:05. > :13:07.cerebral palsies or other neurological conditions that affect
:13:08. > :13:12.muscle co-ordination and control. Within this group there are eight
:13:13. > :13:15.separate classes that an athlete can be place in depending on the
:13:16. > :13:20.severity of their condition. The first four are for athletes who need
:13:21. > :13:24.a racing wheelchair to compete. The others are for those who compete
:13:25. > :13:33.standing up. Now, the idea is that as you go through these classes,
:13:34. > :13:37.they are numbered 31-38 in this case an athletes condition becomes less
:13:38. > :13:41.severe. Several people, including former medal winning British
:13:42. > :13:47.Paralympians, have voiced concerns about how the classification process
:13:48. > :13:51.is working in practice. Both national and international
:13:52. > :13:57.classification I think it is... It's not fit for purpose. It's not
:13:58. > :14:07.sufficiently robust. It is too easily manipulated. Michael Breen's
:14:08. > :14:14.daughter is competing for Team GB in Rio. She was diagnosed with cerebral
:14:15. > :14:17.palsy as a young child. He complained to UK athletics saying
:14:18. > :14:25.that classification doesn't appear to be working. When you watch the
:14:26. > :14:29.Paralympics over the coming weeks, and you see one athlete running
:14:30. > :14:35.significantly further ahead than the rest of the other athletes, I would
:14:36. > :14:40.simply say that you should perhaps ask yourself the question - whatever
:14:41. > :14:45.impairment that particular athlete has, is it the same as the
:14:46. > :14:51.impairments of the other athletes who are say 20 or 30 meters behind?
:14:52. > :14:55.UK athletics told Newsnight that his complaint was fully investigated by
:14:56. > :14:59.them and the International Paralympic Committee and was found
:15:00. > :15:04.to be without any merit. An email, seen by Newsnight, confirms he
:15:05. > :15:08.wasn't alone in being worried. Last year Great Britain's head coach
:15:09. > :15:14.emailed athletes to say she had to deal with parents, coaches and
:15:15. > :15:18.others who felt discontent about the classifications of some athletes.
:15:19. > :15:23.Email says that British athletics will have no hesitation in taking
:15:24. > :15:28.legal action against anyone found to have made basesless allegations in
:15:29. > :15:34.the public domain. UK athletes insists they were not discouraging
:15:35. > :15:37.whistleblowers but trying to avoid unsubstantiated allegations being
:15:38. > :15:42.aired publicly. There are also concerns from people who have been
:15:43. > :15:46.denied classification. Daniel Brown suffers from complex regional pain
:15:47. > :15:54.syndrome. After winning gold in archery at both the Beijing and
:15:55. > :15:57.London Paralympics, she was told by two IPC classifiers,
:15:58. > :16:01.psychotherapists who she said didn't consult her medical history she was
:16:02. > :16:06.too able-bodied to compete any more. I went through a whole identity
:16:07. > :16:13.crisis. I was an elite athlete, I wasn't. I'm a disabled person, and
:16:14. > :16:18.I'm not disabled enough. I get frustrated doing simple things like
:16:19. > :16:22.carrying a cup of tea and throwing it yaefr where and I want to say -
:16:23. > :16:23.why can't they see that and understand my life is affected this
:16:24. > :16:32.way. It's critical people have faith in
:16:33. > :16:36.the classification system. You want to know what you're watching is what
:16:37. > :16:40.you think you're watching. I believe the classification system delivers
:16:41. > :16:42.that. There will be people who feel unhappy with some of the decision
:16:43. > :16:45.that is have been made. If people have strong claims they need to
:16:46. > :16:50.bring the evidence to back up those claims.
:16:51. > :16:57.Millions of people will tune in and over the next ten days to watch one
:16:58. > :17:01.of the world's most fiercest fought sporting competitions. Those in
:17:02. > :17:03.charge of the Games will hope questions over the classification
:17:04. > :17:07.will not cast too much of a shadow over the event.
:17:08. > :17:08.A UK Athletics spokesperson told us that...
:17:09. > :17:10."Classification of all international para-athletes is handled exclusively
:17:11. > :17:16.by the International Paralympic Committee.
:17:17. > :17:18.UK Athletics is confident of the classification of all British
:17:19. > :17:21.athletes who will be competing in Rio and we always co-operate 100%
:17:22. > :17:24.with the IPC to ensure that all GB athletes are correctly classified
:17:25. > :17:30.Where concerns have been raised, UKA has correctly responded
:17:31. > :17:37.by requesting that the IPC check medical and procedural records
:17:38. > :17:39.to either ratify or change the athlete's classification."
:17:40. > :17:42.Joining us from Rio is Doctor Peter Van de Vliet,
:17:43. > :17:44.he's Medical Director of the International
:17:45. > :17:54.Good evening. First, do you believe that the system is absolutely
:17:55. > :18:01.watertight, robust and utterly fair? The system is as fair as it is with
:18:02. > :18:05.the actual knowledge for the moment. I think it is also fair to say that
:18:06. > :18:09.we remain very critical and we owe it to our athletes to be very
:18:10. > :18:14.critical that the system can be improved. And with further our
:18:15. > :18:18.understanding and our knowledge on the relationship between impairment
:18:19. > :18:22.and activity limitations on a daily basis and that knowledge needs to
:18:23. > :18:25.translate in the rules to secure classification for the future. It is
:18:26. > :18:33.interesting to do acknowledge you do have problems and I wonder about a
:18:34. > :18:38.system where medical history isn't is taken into account. It is the
:18:39. > :18:47.effort on the day that is assessed for impairment of whatever degree.
:18:48. > :18:52.Is that a failing? No. It is very important to make a distinction that
:18:53. > :18:56.when we look at the relationship between impairment and inactivity,
:18:57. > :19:01.it is not the race time, it is not the performance in the final result,
:19:02. > :19:06.it is the key components of the discipline, of the sport the athlete
:19:07. > :19:11.is participating in. And if classifiers who are certified and
:19:12. > :19:15.trained for their purpose have reviewed this is something that
:19:16. > :19:18.might fluctuate a little bit, they tell the athlete in review. So they
:19:19. > :19:25.observed the athlete on multiple occasions throughout their career.
:19:26. > :19:29.More broadly, what about the classification? The classification
:19:30. > :19:33.is done at a national level and I wonder if you are confident that it
:19:34. > :19:38.is equable across all nations? Because what you are asking is a big
:19:39. > :19:47.ask of classifiers to have exactly the same rules. Exactly the same
:19:48. > :19:52.interpretations of the rules. There is a certain degree of diversity
:19:53. > :19:56.within the nations and it depends on how the nations themselves train
:19:57. > :19:58.their classifiers. We are working now with the international
:19:59. > :20:02.federations to ensure that they assist the nations to have a
:20:03. > :20:07.transparent and standardised approach to classification across
:20:08. > :20:13.all nations. When an athlete starts competing internationally, the
:20:14. > :20:16.mandate of classification is transferred to international
:20:17. > :20:19.classifiers, all trained and certified by the International
:20:20. > :20:23.Federation responsible. Do you think at the moment there is a problem
:20:24. > :20:26.with the kind of national level of classification? You seem to be
:20:27. > :20:32.suggesting there are different approaches and that could perhaps be
:20:33. > :20:37.improved. That is correct. And that is why we engage now at this very
:20:38. > :20:43.moment with the national bodies. We have significant investments over
:20:44. > :20:47.time with national classification expert capacity built up and we are
:20:48. > :20:53.very happy to engage with all of these twin sure that at the onset of
:20:54. > :20:56.an athlete's career, they can give guidance to the classification in
:20:57. > :21:01.the most appropriate way. Finally, we are going to see something
:21:02. > :21:07.incredible, sporting achievements, over the next 11 days. I wonder if
:21:08. > :21:11.we see somebody winning by an overwhelming, way ahead of the rest
:21:12. > :21:15.of the field, the margin is very great, should we be concerned
:21:16. > :21:23.something is not working correctly? I don't think so. We have all
:21:24. > :21:27.measures put in place to ensure that those athletes competing here in Rio
:21:28. > :21:31.have been seen, have been properly classified in the final lead up to
:21:32. > :21:36.these games. I think what we will see is unique athletic performance,
:21:37. > :21:40.which is just on the basis of skill, training and very hard work by those
:21:41. > :21:42.athletes. Thank you very much for joining us tonight.
:21:43. > :21:44.While the Government and the civil servants are grappling
:21:45. > :21:47.with the construction of a bespoke Brexit, institutions are having
:21:48. > :21:51.to divine what it will mean for them and how to deal with uncertainty.
:21:52. > :21:53.Chief among them, the universities and colleges who have
:21:54. > :21:56.to plan their intake of undergraduates from the EU.
:21:57. > :21:59.Our policy editor, Chris Cook, is here with news of
:22:00. > :22:01.a deal for universities and what the Prime Minister
:22:02. > :22:04.is planning to do about selective schools, known to you and me
:22:05. > :22:11.Let's start first with universities, what is happening. Doping The big
:22:12. > :22:18.thing to remember about universities is they work on three or four year
:22:19. > :22:21.cycles. Secondly, EU students are treated like British students, they
:22:22. > :22:26.pay the same fees and they get the same access to loans. At the moment,
:22:27. > :22:31.today, right now, as of this morning, it has been possible to
:22:32. > :22:35.apply for it degree at a British university for next year, 2017.
:22:36. > :22:39.Universities are really worried students from the EU, about 5% of
:22:40. > :22:43.their student body, will not apply because they do not know the fee
:22:44. > :22:47.regime potentially in Twenty20 and they are not certain they will have
:22:48. > :22:52.access to the student loan scheme. So they may run out of money. They
:22:53. > :22:56.are appealing tomorrow, Dame Julia Goodfellow, the vice Chancellor of
:22:57. > :23:01.Ghent University and President of universities UK, she is giving a
:23:02. > :23:05.speech calling on the government to guarantee people with crude for next
:23:06. > :23:11.year will have the full rights as EU citizens to finish their degrees
:23:12. > :23:16.Tashkent University. Or there is too much uncertainty? Yes, and they are
:23:17. > :23:20.worried they will lose students. Universities are great lobbyists in
:23:21. > :23:24.Whitehall, this is a scream of desperation. And there was news
:23:25. > :23:29.today from an unexpected source under somebody's about selective
:23:30. > :23:34.schools. The Prime Minister, we have strong suspicions, wants to bring
:23:35. > :23:37.back grammar schools to England and that is very difficult because
:23:38. > :23:41.bringing back grammar schools requires you to change the 1998
:23:42. > :23:46.education act. It is hard-wired into statute and very difficult to do.
:23:47. > :23:52.You can see on the screens behind us, there is a senior civil servant,
:23:53. > :23:55.Jonathan Slater, the permanent secretary at the Department for
:23:56. > :23:59.education, he walked into Downing Street brazenly holding a piece of
:24:00. > :24:03.paper revealing a number of things. It does confirm the government does
:24:04. > :24:08.want to bring back grammar schools and Justine Greening, the Education
:24:09. > :24:12.Secretary, says these ideas should be presented as an option and should
:24:13. > :24:15.only be pursued once it is clear we can work with existing grammar
:24:16. > :24:19.schools to deal with the problems associated with grammar schools.
:24:20. > :24:24.Namely, the poor kids do worse and rich kids do better. Where does this
:24:25. > :24:30.leave us? Jonathan Slater's proposal is, why not have a scheme whereby we
:24:31. > :24:34.introduced the House of Lords a proposal to amend the 1998 education
:24:35. > :24:39.act only after we have got the grammar schools to work out some
:24:40. > :24:42.sort of deal whereby they show they can improve the way they perform so
:24:43. > :24:48.they do not harm social mobility as much. That is what it -- week in the
:24:49. > :24:50.trade call kicking the tray down the road. Thank you very much indeed.
:24:51. > :24:53.The Parliamentary Labour Party has, as expected, voted to request
:24:54. > :24:56.the NEC bring forward a rule change at conference to reinstate elections
:24:57. > :24:58.to the Shadow Cabinet, a move interpreted by Jeremy Corbyn's
:24:59. > :25:01.supporters as designed to rein him in should he win
:25:02. > :25:05.He has countered by suggesting that party members, or party conference,
:25:06. > :25:08.should elect some members of the Shadow Cabinet team.
:25:09. > :25:14.In a moment, I'll be speaking to the man who was at the centre
:25:15. > :25:17.of the battle for the survival of the Labour Party in the '80s,
:25:18. > :25:21.But first, our political editor, Nick Watt, observed a musical day
:25:22. > :25:35.Labour may be in the throes of a battle for its soul, but when it
:25:36. > :25:43.comes to music, the party's reading figures appear to be united in their
:25:44. > :25:46.taste for retro- chic. Today, Jeremy Corbyn was endorsed by an iconic
:25:47. > :25:53.band which was the scourge of Thatcherite. Your band, formed in
:25:54. > :25:59.the late 1970s, during a time of increasing youth unemployment, then
:26:00. > :26:06.went on to become this iconic name, UB40. But critics couldn't resist
:26:07. > :26:11.saying winning the endorsement of a bunch of ageing rockers may show how
:26:12. > :26:16.Jeremy Corbyn's worldview has not changed in three decades. A view
:26:17. > :26:20.vehemently rejected by UB40. In the end, what we have proved is we were
:26:21. > :26:24.right to be complaining about what they were doing during the Thatcher
:26:25. > :26:28.period. They were deregulating the banks, they were selling off houses
:26:29. > :26:33.and now those are the problems we are dealing with. We were right what
:26:34. > :26:37.we said then and we are right now, it is obvious. And the band members
:26:38. > :26:42.are not amused by any suggestion that a split among the original
:26:43. > :26:46.members of UB40 could provide something of an awkward metaphor for
:26:47. > :26:54.the future of Labour under a renewed Corbyn leadership. What a great
:26:55. > :27:00.question! I don't think one has anything to do with the other, do
:27:01. > :27:05.you? It wasn't really a split, so much as our lead singer left eight
:27:06. > :27:11.years ago. We still UB40. The party could live on with different people.
:27:12. > :27:14.Exactly. That is a novel idea. At the event, there was an unusual
:27:15. > :27:18.sighting, a politician with a genuine interest in the Arts who
:27:19. > :27:24.loves music when it has a political theme and when it moves him. We
:27:25. > :27:30.associate music with times in your life. I got to love Caribbean music
:27:31. > :27:34.in the 1960s when I worked in Jamaica RAF Marham years and that
:27:35. > :27:41.taught me a thing about original reggae bands -- for eight years. One
:27:42. > :27:47.is attracted to the music of some who have done great political
:27:48. > :27:53.things, like Joan buyers with that incredible voice she has got. But
:27:54. > :27:58.Corbyn's interest in music does have its limits. You secretly jealous of
:27:59. > :28:03.Ed Balls and would you like to be in that bowtie and Strictly Come
:28:04. > :28:09.Dancing? Within the confines and seclusion and privacy of this room,
:28:10. > :28:14.can I let you and perhaps you will tell the others, I have absolutely
:28:15. > :28:18.no desire whatsoever to go on Strictly Come Dancing! I wish Ed
:28:19. > :28:23.Balls well. Our strictly star is out in London tonight celebrating the
:28:24. > :28:28.publication of his memoirs in the presence of his new dance partner
:28:29. > :28:33.and some once mighty figures in the Labour Party. They cut a small
:28:34. > :28:36.figure these days, but one of their number, a retired musician, could
:28:37. > :28:41.not help and barking on something of a battle of the bands. I don't think
:28:42. > :28:48.there is a particular advantage in linking yourself to a particular
:28:49. > :28:55.musical form. Let alone one that is about from 30 or 40 years ago. I
:28:56. > :29:03.think Jeremy is dating himself a bit iffy is looking for UB40. UB40, Read
:29:04. > :29:08.Read Wine is all I remember. And many of his critics would be saying
:29:09. > :29:16.that they are hearing whining from Jeremy! I don't believe you. And in
:29:17. > :29:22.a sign of how bitter this battle has become, Alan Johnson even suggested
:29:23. > :29:25.that Jeremy Corbyn would have been on the wrong side of one of the
:29:26. > :29:31.greatest musical debates of the modern era. Jeremy and I think a lot
:29:32. > :29:35.of his supporters were the people he wanted Bob Dylann to stay with
:29:36. > :29:39.blowing in the wind. And his harmonica he had around his neck.
:29:40. > :29:45.And they booed and they jeered him when he brought out the electric
:29:46. > :29:54.guitar. I was postal electric rather than the pre-electric. -- postal
:29:55. > :30:00.electric. Our aged politicians know music has moved on since the 1980s.
:30:01. > :30:04.Rudimentary has endorsed Jeremy Corbyn, perhaps giving him the edge
:30:05. > :30:09.as Labour's tribes call to a new generation.
:30:10. > :30:12.Well, with me is Lord Whitty, Larry Whitty, who was General
:30:13. > :30:14.Secretary of the Labour Party for nine years during the last
:30:15. > :30:26.Good evening. I wonder what you make of this current war? Well, we've
:30:27. > :30:32.just seen a gentle film. I'm afraid the current war is pretty vicious.
:30:33. > :30:35.The two sides seem incapable of reaching any compromise. I think
:30:36. > :30:41.this slugging each other off has got to stop. I think once this contest
:30:42. > :30:46.is over, we need to have a real review of where the Labour Party is
:30:47. > :30:50.going and we need to do that very rapidly otherwise we are in very
:30:51. > :30:55.serious difficulty. Who do you hold responsible for the state of the
:30:56. > :30:57.party? Almost everybody. I think... I didn't vote for Jeremy.
:30:58. > :31:01.I thought Jeremy should have been given more time. I wasn't in favour
:31:02. > :31:06.of that hand fisted rolling coup we had in July. I also feel that some
:31:07. > :31:14.of these problems are fairly long-term. We've had two basic
:31:15. > :31:20.tendencies in the last few years. The leader's office has gained a
:31:21. > :31:24.leader and the leader's office have gained power which started under
:31:25. > :31:30.Tony Blair and has continued with Ed Miliband. Talking about Ed Miliband.
:31:31. > :31:34.When Ed Miliband got rid of the elections to the Shadow Cabinet you
:31:35. > :31:40.were against that and refused to take part? That wasn't the reason I
:31:41. > :31:45.refused to take part, I refused to take part with his affiliation - Why
:31:46. > :31:49.did you refuse to take part, I'm interested? The proposal he had on
:31:50. > :31:55.the table on how we treat member affiliation and who is the electoral
:31:56. > :32:02.college I didn't agree with. I still don't agree with it. In part, any
:32:03. > :32:04.country, any party, has to have checks and balances. There are
:32:05. > :32:08.different centres of power. Any large party is a coalition. We have
:32:09. > :32:14.to recognise that. We are getting to a situation where is polarised. If
:32:15. > :32:20.we get into a position where there are no checks and balances will one
:32:21. > :32:23.side go. There will have to be a victor that will mean there will be
:32:24. > :32:26.a split? I don't think we will get to that this. There is hope, at the
:32:27. > :32:32.end of this contest, whoever wins the party will come to its senses.
:32:33. > :32:39.Maybe some of the great movers and and shakers will intervene. It may
:32:40. > :32:44.be them again, it might not. Last time round, the trade unions were on
:32:45. > :32:53.the side of getting militant out. This time it's not that simple. It's
:32:54. > :32:58.not that simple. Militant were ill filtrated to the party. We had a
:32:59. > :33:01.split to the right with the SDLP going. We are in a similar situation
:33:02. > :33:05.in terms of the way people are treating each other. I think this is
:33:06. > :33:11.has been am playified because of the existence of social media. We need
:33:12. > :33:15.to calm down and we need to look at - Is the social media issue can be
:33:16. > :33:20.laid at Jeremy Corbyn's feet? I don't think it can be entirely led
:33:21. > :33:23.at one side or the other. There are pretty vicious comments going in
:33:24. > :33:28.both directions. In general it's been more associated with the
:33:29. > :33:31.momentum side than with - individuals... You said the Labour
:33:32. > :33:35.Party has to be for the white working-class. It has to be for the
:33:36. > :33:38.liberal provesals and ethnic minorities. If it's not for that, do
:33:39. > :33:41.you think Jeremy Corbyn can win an election? Could you think that
:33:42. > :33:43.Jeremy Corbyn could be Prime Minister? I think Jeremy Corbyn
:33:44. > :33:47.could become the Prime Minister if the party can pull it together. We
:33:48. > :33:52.are not at present on course for that. Whether Owen or Jeremy wins in
:33:53. > :33:57.a few weeks' time we have to get back on course. My message today is
:33:58. > :34:00.really - the people who matter in the party, the members, if MPs have
:34:01. > :34:01.to put this contest behind them and move forward. Thank you very much
:34:02. > :34:13.indeed, Lord Whitty. The American comedian,
:34:14. > :34:15.Amy Schumer, is on tour. All over the US, a few dates
:34:16. > :34:18.in Europe, two in the UK Her screwball no-holds-barred US TV
:34:19. > :34:22.sketch show, Inside Amy Schumer, has run for four seasons
:34:23. > :34:24.and picked up two Emmys and an army of fans,
:34:25. > :34:27.but she won a new audience last year with her self-penned movie,
:34:28. > :34:29.Trainwreck, which was funny Now, she's written her first book,
:34:30. > :34:33.a memoir and series of essays, The Girl with the Lower Back Tattoo,
:34:34. > :34:36.which coincides with her big tour. Emily met her for a
:34:37. > :34:41.woman-to-woman talk. Amy, it's OK, she grew up
:34:42. > :34:58.during a different time. Tell him to start mowing the lawn
:34:59. > :35:01.by the pool so it'll The bit in your book which really
:35:02. > :35:06.struck a chord with me - and I haven't heard anyone
:35:07. > :35:10.describe it, I don't think - was the introversion,
:35:11. > :35:17.that women constantly feel it's up to them to fill the gaps and smooth
:35:18. > :35:20.over the social awkwardness and just And I'm wondering about the moment
:35:21. > :35:26.when you suddenly kind of went - oh, don't have to,
:35:27. > :35:29.don't have to do that? Probably sooner than I
:35:30. > :35:30.should have. Yeah, it was going to a wedding
:35:31. > :35:36.with my boyfriend at the time and I just was in, like,
:35:37. > :35:39.my mid-20s and just was like, I really hate
:35:40. > :35:47.this and I can't do it. Like, I can't be this social
:35:48. > :35:50.with this many people for this long. And then getting to a place
:35:51. > :35:53.where I didn't think something was wrong with me and that I thought
:35:54. > :35:57.it was OK and that I actually liked, I really liked that I know that
:35:58. > :36:08.I needed time on my own to recharge. And do you say no
:36:09. > :36:10.to more weddings now? I mean, they're just
:36:11. > :36:12.events where you think, I cannot stand that,
:36:13. > :36:14.I can't be there? I can't do a weekend,
:36:15. > :36:19.a full weekend wedding. And my friends are still getting
:36:20. > :36:21.married. Like, why are people
:36:22. > :36:25.still doing this? You know, it's not just
:36:26. > :36:28.affairs that are that big. It can be just the smalltalk
:36:29. > :36:33.with someone in an elevator. Do you ever just say,
:36:34. > :36:35.I'm just going to be Or I'll say, you know,
:36:36. > :36:43.I really just can't talk Where is that, is it locking
:36:44. > :36:50.yourself in a loo, or is it...? I've, like, sat in a Starbucks
:36:51. > :36:57.bathroom and just sat on the floor Nobody was waiting,
:36:58. > :37:01.so it wasn't rude. The girl who played me
:37:02. > :37:03.as a little girl in Trainwreck, she's nine years old,
:37:04. > :37:08.her name's Devon, and she came up to me at the premiere and she said,
:37:09. > :37:12."I overheard my agent tell my mom that my cheeks are too big,
:37:13. > :37:15.so I don't get a lot of work. But then I thought, well,
:37:16. > :37:17.my cheeks made me look like you and I'm so grateful
:37:18. > :37:21.I have these cheeks." And so I just kind of leaned down
:37:22. > :37:26.and I just said, you know, well, "What does
:37:27. > :37:28.that mean, Devon?!" You probably go to, you know,
:37:29. > :37:35.hundreds of awards ceremonies But whenever I do and I'm
:37:36. > :37:39.kind of stuck there... And you see these speeches and I'm
:37:40. > :37:46.always struck by the fact that women accept awards and the first thing
:37:47. > :37:49.they do, quite often, is apologise. They apologise for not being funny,
:37:50. > :37:51.they apologise for not They apologise for,
:37:52. > :37:54.you know, this isn't I wonder what you make of that,
:37:55. > :38:01.how did we get to that place? It's, I think, because so many
:38:02. > :38:04.people hate women. I'd be on set and I'd want to give
:38:05. > :38:16.a suggestion to Judd Apatow You talked yourself out
:38:17. > :38:28.of it. I say sorry a lot less
:38:29. > :38:34.than I probably should. If you said the name
:38:35. > :38:36.Hillary Clinton in America, There will be those who love her,
:38:37. > :38:40.there will be those Well, that's what I'm saying
:38:41. > :38:44.with the not being informed. Because those people aren't
:38:45. > :38:45.informed. If you go, why don't
:38:46. > :38:48.you like Hillary? They'll go, she lied
:38:49. > :38:50.about her e-mails, what else People get one fact
:38:51. > :38:54.and that's what they latch I'm like, well, Donald Trump
:38:55. > :39:02.has a fake college. Donald Trump doesn't
:39:03. > :39:04.pay his workers. There's never been a nominee who's
:39:05. > :39:13.ever not released their taxes. I haven't had a conversation
:39:14. > :39:20.with anyone who doesn't like Hillary where they've had
:39:21. > :39:24.anything meaningful to say. If it isn't Hillary in November,
:39:25. > :39:27.does your act change, My act will change because I'll
:39:28. > :39:32.need to learn to speak Spanish, because I'll move
:39:33. > :39:34.to Spain, or somewhere. It's beyond my comprehension
:39:35. > :39:40.if Trump won. The sort of Hollywood
:39:41. > :40:19.portrayals of sex are very squeaky clean and romantic,
:40:20. > :40:22.and the Amy Schumer portrayal of sex is that half
:40:23. > :40:25.the time, it's quite crap. You know, you can be
:40:26. > :40:28.quite lazy, nothing Yeah, I mean, I don't know the kind
:40:29. > :40:34.of sex that you're having, but I'm showing the kind of sex that
:40:35. > :40:37.I mostly have. If it's not, like, sex
:40:38. > :40:44.within a relationship and you're sleeping with someone new,
:40:45. > :40:46.most likely, it doesn't go well and something
:40:47. > :40:49.weird or hurtful happens. And, yeah, there are just
:40:50. > :40:52.these moments where you question yourself and -
:40:53. > :40:54.what are you willing You say this is not
:40:55. > :41:03.a self-help book, but it's You show women how
:41:04. > :41:06.to masturbate. I had to figure it out
:41:07. > :41:15.on my own when I was, like, older. Like, guys are jerking off
:41:16. > :41:22.when they're like, I think, you know, maybe it speeds
:41:23. > :41:33.them up a couple of years. I remember when I was 18 or 19,
:41:34. > :41:36.this guy came to visit me. I'd met this guy in Montana
:41:37. > :41:41.and he was, like, really cute and whimsy and a hiker and he came
:41:42. > :41:44.and visited me in New York. And in that environment,
:41:45. > :41:48.he was very gross. I was, like, 19 and -
:41:49. > :41:55.oh, he flew all the way here, I'll just drink enough that my body
:41:56. > :41:57.will, like, that I'll Because I felt like I owed him
:41:58. > :42:02.something. And I think as a young woman,
:42:03. > :42:08.you might get confused about that. So what I'm saying is,
:42:09. > :42:12.like, you don't have to do anything you don't want to do and don't feel
:42:13. > :42:18.you owe someone something.