:00:10. > :00:13.in the Palace of Arts in Exhibition Park.
:00:14. > :00:16.Half the audience is over 60 and half is under 30.
:00:17. > :00:19.How different is life for them and how divided are they over
:00:20. > :00:50.Tonight, a Newsbeat Newsnight special on the generation gap,
:00:51. > :00:52.the world of work, a chance to study without huge debt, the likelihood
:00:53. > :00:56.of owning a home, the kind of country you want to live in,
:00:57. > :01:00.are the younger and older generations worlds apart,
:01:01. > :01:06.and which of the parties offers the best deal?
:01:07. > :01:14.Joining us in Newcastle, 70 people and seven politicians
:01:15. > :01:16.and our resident fact checker, number cruncher, from the
:01:17. > :01:18.Resolution Foundation, Thorsten Bell.
:01:19. > :01:19.Are we right, is there a generational divide?
:01:20. > :01:22.I think everyone agrees there is a generational divide,
:01:23. > :01:24.and the hard job for politicians is pursuing that gap,
:01:25. > :01:27.because they need votes from the young and the old.
:01:28. > :01:29.All right, so, we know that there is an issue, so,
:01:30. > :01:30.what is government's priorities? First, let's hear how the government
:01:31. > :01:36.spends our money and who benefits. Meet Betty Boomer
:01:37. > :01:37.and Millennial Matt. She was born in the post-war years,
:01:38. > :01:41.grew up listening to the Beatles and the Beach Boys,
:01:42. > :01:44.and got her first smartphone He doesn't remember a time
:01:45. > :01:58.before wireless internet. and graduated during
:01:59. > :02:00.the financial crisis. Betty is part of a generation
:02:01. > :02:03.who hold more wealth than the entire A group which is more
:02:04. > :02:07.than twice their size. But who is getting
:02:08. > :02:09.more from the state? The government has increased
:02:10. > :02:22.the health budget. You might think that this
:02:23. > :02:23.benefits everyone. But two fifths of NHS spending
:02:24. > :02:32.is spent on those over 65. An 85-year-old Betty will cost
:02:33. > :02:35.the NHS seven times more than Matt. it isn't just that the government
:02:36. > :02:39.is spending different amounts It is also protecting
:02:40. > :02:43.policies which Betty The triple lock, which is designed
:02:44. > :02:46.to make sure pensions continue to rise and Betty's benefits have
:02:47. > :02:48.been protected In fact, there has been an 8.1% rise
:02:49. > :02:54.in pension benefits since 2007-2008. In contrast, since 2009, working age
:02:55. > :03:17.benefits have fallen by 10%. Joining us tonight, an audience
:03:18. > :03:20.of over 60s and under 30s. And politicians from all the main
:03:21. > :03:22.parties are here, too, so I'm going to ask politicians
:03:23. > :03:25.first, do you accept there is a generational divide
:03:26. > :03:32.and you should be doing something to solve it?
:03:33. > :03:35.Certainly it's a challenge, the two things you have got to do,
:03:36. > :03:39.you have to have a strong economy, and since 2010, we have seen
:03:40. > :03:46.3,000,000 new jobs created. That's hugely important
:03:47. > :03:49.for the young people here. But also to create the revenue,
:03:50. > :03:52.both to invest in 3 million new apprenticeships but also to
:03:53. > :03:56.raise the state pension by ?1250, which we have managed to do...
:03:57. > :04:08.I'm afraid that is over 20 seconds(!)
:04:09. > :04:11.So I'm moving on, to Labour. From Labour, do you accept that
:04:12. > :04:13.there is a divide but actually you have the responsibility to make
:04:14. > :04:16.sure that each person is treated fairly in the divide?
:04:17. > :04:19.Both young and old have been failed by the Tory government,
:04:20. > :04:23.but the truth is, given that this is the first generation that looks
:04:24. > :04:25.set to be poorer than its parents, clearly there is a divide.
:04:26. > :04:27.And it is up to government, the Labour government,
:04:28. > :04:31.to make sure that we see we are stronger together and we are
:04:32. > :04:34.for the many, not the few. Liberal Democrats.
:04:35. > :04:38.How do you characterise that divide? Well, I am always struck by an old
:04:39. > :04:43.quote I remember, "Times are hard, the young don't respect the old."
:04:44. > :04:46.I say old because that was said by Cicero, in the first century,
:04:47. > :04:49.I say old because that was said by Cicero, in the first century,
:04:50. > :04:52.if there is a generational divide, it has always been here.
:04:53. > :04:53.It is up to politicians to offer policies to ameliorate that,
:04:54. > :04:59.restoring housing benefits for the under 21s and triple lock.
:05:00. > :05:01.We are going to talk about policies, you accept there is a divide,
:05:02. > :05:04.you have a responsibility, now moving to the SNP.
:05:05. > :05:06.How does the SNP plan to address that divide?
:05:07. > :05:09.Well, in the SNP, we don't want there to be a generational gap,
:05:10. > :05:12.we want to have intergenerational fairness, we believe the way to do
:05:13. > :05:18.that is to reject Conservative austerity agenda and invest
:05:19. > :05:20.in public services and people. Let's hear from Ukip now,
:05:21. > :05:22.because David Kirton, you have a different view.
:05:23. > :05:27.What problem exists between the generations?
:05:28. > :05:29.I wouldn't use the word divide but there is different needs
:05:30. > :05:32.between the older generation and the younger generation,
:05:33. > :05:34.what I think is the main issue we need to address is everyone
:05:35. > :05:37.is talking about the skills gap, we certainly haven't been training
:05:38. > :05:42.young people with the skills they need, particularly
:05:43. > :05:49.technical skills. Where do you see the
:05:50. > :05:55.divide hurting most? There is a divide within
:05:56. > :05:58.generations. Over 1 million pensioners
:05:59. > :06:05.in poverty, if you are 16 years old, minimum wage of ?4 an hour,
:06:06. > :06:07.if you're older, maybe ?7 an hour work,
:06:08. > :06:10.the question we fundamentally have do ask, who is the economy for,
:06:11. > :06:13.there is enough money to not have this generational divide at all.
:06:14. > :06:15.Where do you see the divide hurting most?
:06:16. > :06:18.There is a divide, but I would say, a lot of the issues that
:06:19. > :06:21.are important to young people are important to old people as well.
:06:22. > :06:24.We advocate an approach that gives care to those people that have
:06:25. > :06:27.paid in over the years, as they look back on it,
:06:28. > :06:29.and add altered that has been one of relative prosperity and giving
:06:30. > :06:32.hope at the same time to a generation that
:06:33. > :06:32.for the first time in many generations without hope.
:06:33. > :06:39.-- as they look back on an adult hood.
:06:40. > :06:44.We have heard just about enough from the politicians for now(!)
:06:45. > :06:46.Let's get to the audience before time ticks away from us.
:06:47. > :06:53.You are going to tell us about your experience in foster care. From my
:06:54. > :06:58.experience in foster care, you can very clearly see the impact of
:06:59. > :07:02.austerity and cuts. Social workers are absolutely overstretched with
:07:03. > :07:05.caseloads that are not manageable anymore, two of my social workers
:07:06. > :07:10.had to leave the profession work is the amount of stress that was forced
:07:11. > :07:15.on them by the nature of their jobs. They are the forgotten kids. They
:07:16. > :07:19.are not really given a voice. There needs to be a lot more done to
:07:20. > :07:25.support them, especially with mental health. That is a massive issue. Do
:07:26. > :07:29.you think younger people get enough help from the government, present
:07:30. > :07:33.government or previous governments, in terms of the money that you pay
:07:34. > :07:36.in taxes coming back to help? Absolutely not, I would say that our
:07:37. > :07:41.generation have greater mental health issues, I think that is a
:07:42. > :07:45.massive issue that affects us, more so than the other generations. Also
:07:46. > :07:50.massive stigma around it. The cuts to the NHS are resonating deeply,
:07:51. > :07:55.and they are breaking people, it is political policy that kills people.
:07:56. > :08:03.Anyone got a different view on a different benefit they have received
:08:04. > :08:12.from the government? I was not sure about the personally, the main thing
:08:13. > :08:16.I would like to put forward as regards benefits and state and young
:08:17. > :08:20.people, first of all, I've got to speak faster, I'm sorry, first of
:08:21. > :08:24.all I would like to say I do not believe the young... I have been
:08:25. > :08:34.through the mill of mental health, I don't believe the young have any
:08:35. > :08:41.worse... Have it any worse than past generations. I have seen so much
:08:42. > :08:51.mental illness as a volunteer in care homes. I myself suffer from
:08:52. > :08:56.manic depression. I would like to make it quite clear that I don't
:08:57. > :09:01.feel that, whilst the young may feel hard done by, I don't think it
:09:02. > :09:05.should be a competition. But the danger is, let's talk to the Liberal
:09:06. > :09:09.Democrats, it turns into a competition, a lot of people feel
:09:10. > :09:15.that the elderly are over served, and if you look at the figures, the
:09:16. > :09:20.younger generation are getting less correspondingly? I think that is
:09:21. > :09:24.true, looking at the things the previous generations have had in
:09:25. > :09:27.terms of house prices, free education grants, the rest of it,
:09:28. > :09:32.and the older generation look at young people with baffled amazement.
:09:33. > :09:35.I don't think we can talk too much about Liberal Democrats and free
:09:36. > :09:38.education, frankly, right now. LAUGHTER
:09:39. > :09:44.I think there are things that are very clear, Dominic, that you have
:09:45. > :09:45.in the past very clearly said, we, the older generation, inclined to
:09:46. > :09:50.vote more. So let's make sure that the older
:09:51. > :09:53.generation is well served, and then you had an issue
:09:54. > :09:55.with your manifesto on the triple lock and suddenly it
:09:56. > :09:57.wasn't going to be quite so rosy for pensioners.
:09:58. > :10:01.And they are not very happy about it.
:10:02. > :10:03.And Kirsty, there are no easy decisions here.
:10:04. > :10:05.On top of having a strong economy, which I mentioned before,
:10:06. > :10:10.which pays the revenue, we have talked about the wish
:10:11. > :10:14.list of things we want, but they have to be paid for,
:10:15. > :10:16.and on top of that, you have to take difficult decisions.
:10:17. > :10:19.One of the things we have had to do is take difficult decisions in
:10:20. > :10:24.relation to some of those benefits. Equally, we have cut
:10:25. > :10:27.the government deficit, the difference between how much is
:10:28. > :10:30.brought in and how much it spends, by 100 billion,
:10:31. > :10:31.we opposed every inch of the way. Spending on education,
:10:32. > :10:38.look at the statistics, spending on education
:10:39. > :10:40.is going to fall... Kirsty, Kirsty, we have taken the
:10:41. > :10:42.difficult decisions for two reasons, one,
:10:43. > :10:45.we don't think the 100 billion should be left in debt and taxes
:10:46. > :10:48.for all the young people here. And, two, so that we can invest more
:10:49. > :10:50.in education, we have 3 million more apprenticeships,
:10:51. > :10:57.1.8 million more kids going to schools that are good
:10:58. > :11:01.or outstanding compare to 2010. Who wants to come back at Dominic.
:11:02. > :11:05.The Tories often talk about good schools as if there is some decide
:11:06. > :11:13.where there is good schools and bad schools,
:11:14. > :11:16.and it speaks to the policy they have on grammar schools.
:11:17. > :11:19.They are designing a two tier system in education that will see the kids
:11:20. > :11:21.in the poor backgrounds fall behind, and the kids in the more affluent
:11:22. > :11:24.backgrounds get better, that is iniquitous.
:11:25. > :11:26.That is why the Liberal Democrat people premium, which we brought
:11:27. > :11:27.in in coalition, has seen the attainment gap close,
:11:28. > :11:35.we want to sustain that. My view is that there is definitely
:11:36. > :11:36.a generational divide in my experience,
:11:37. > :11:45.I went to university, not only did I not have
:11:46. > :11:48.to pay tuition fees, I was given a grant!
:11:49. > :11:50.So that I could live, I could pay my rent and go
:11:51. > :11:53.out and enjoy myself. I came down here with no
:11:54. > :11:55.debt, got a job, one of five that was offered
:11:56. > :11:58.to me, quite easily! I then got a house, easily bored,
:11:59. > :12:01.for three times what I was earning. Today, the same house would cost
:12:02. > :12:03.ten times what someone in the same position as me
:12:04. > :12:05.would be earning today. That is ten times
:12:06. > :12:06.against three times. We will come into housing.
:12:07. > :12:10.He is rubbing it in. I came in under the ?9,000
:12:11. > :12:13.a year scheme, I get a maintenance loan and a grant,
:12:14. > :12:16.I'm one of the lucky ones, really. In terms of recent students coming
:12:17. > :12:18.in aren't getting grants at all. In particular, nursing students.
:12:19. > :12:21.Which is inherently unfair and leaving them in even more debt.
:12:22. > :12:23.When I think about the amount I'm going to accumulate,
:12:24. > :12:25.it is in the 40,000s. It's very difficult
:12:26. > :12:27.to manage sometimes. The problem is not necessarily
:12:28. > :12:37.with tuition fees, it's more of a housing issue as well.
:12:38. > :12:45.We will come to that. Let me bring in the SNP. The SNP's position is
:12:46. > :12:51.that the triple lock will stay, and also, there will be no means tested
:12:52. > :12:56.fuel allowance, and in Scotland you also do not have tuition fees, and
:12:57. > :12:59.the economy is not doing as well as in the other parts of the United
:13:00. > :13:03.Kingdom, so a situation where there is not endless pots of money. Why
:13:04. > :13:07.can you say, actually, a proportion of these people in here over 60 can
:13:08. > :13:14.afford to pay fuel allowance and do not need as much in their pension as
:13:15. > :13:18.8% increase, why not even it out? In the long term, these guys will not
:13:19. > :13:21.be able to pay for it. There certainly is not an endless pot of
:13:22. > :13:26.money and anyone who suggested that would be wrong but what you can have
:13:27. > :13:29.is different priorities. In Scotland, the Scottish Government is
:13:30. > :13:34.investing in education from the point of preschool years, we have 16
:13:35. > :13:39.hours free childcare for three and four-year-olds every week. Plus the
:13:40. > :13:43.most vulnerable to-year-olds. We have free school meals. We are
:13:44. > :13:49.investing ?120 million in a pupil equity funds to close the attainment
:13:50. > :13:51.gap, and of course, we have free education... Free higher education
:13:52. > :14:17.which saves ?27,000 a year... Labourer, you're going to help the
:14:18. > :14:20.under 30s when they have kids, by providing free childcare. If that is
:14:21. > :14:25.a policy for the younger generation it will cost the earth. Jeremy
:14:26. > :14:31.Corbyn this morning could not cost it. Did not know how much it would
:14:32. > :14:34.cost. I do not think the most important quality in a Prime
:14:35. > :14:39.Minister is to memorise the balance sheet. It will cost ?5 billion. That
:14:40. > :14:44.is an embarrassment for all generations. For young parents who
:14:45. > :14:54.know having good quality childcare enables them to go up to work and
:14:55. > :14:58.contribute to the economy. But grandparents acting as carers,
:14:59. > :15:03.they're taking it up. This liberates younger and older. And most
:15:04. > :15:06.importantly, and this is the difference between us and the
:15:07. > :15:11.Conservatives, they see all public services as some kind of money sink.
:15:12. > :15:16.This enables our economy to be stronger and better because we have
:15:17. > :15:19.well cared for children and parents who can contribute to the economy.
:15:20. > :15:28.That is why we are investing in it. You want to come in on that?
:15:29. > :15:31.I would like to say there is a whole group of women who are finding it
:15:32. > :15:34.difficult to take up those caring responsibilities now.
:15:35. > :15:39.A group of women born in the 1950s, expecting to retire at 60.
:15:40. > :15:41.Not getting their pension when they expected it.
:15:42. > :15:44.Not being informed of the change in their age.
:15:45. > :15:48.They would love to be looking after their grandchildren,
:15:49. > :15:51.they're having to continue to work and because they are working,
:15:52. > :15:53.they may be contributing to paying taxes, but they are unable to make
:15:54. > :16:01.that wonderful contribution of looking after their grandchildren
:16:02. > :16:03.and helping with childcare. So clearly a divide
:16:04. > :16:08.within that issue itself between the generations.
:16:09. > :16:17.But what about the divide in the workplace?
:16:18. > :16:22.We've grown used to the idea that our children's lives will be
:16:23. > :16:25.easier than our own. But is that true for
:16:26. > :16:28.Millennial Matt and his friends? If we look at this graph,
:16:29. > :16:30.we can see that earnings have increased year on year since Betty
:16:31. > :16:37.was a girl. Until the financial crisis in 2008.
:16:38. > :16:40.Everyone was hit hard. But the youngest were hit hardest.
:16:41. > :16:46.Matt has experienced a 12% real pay fall whereas Betty's
:16:47. > :16:49.went down just 3.7%. This means that Matt is ending
:16:50. > :16:54.?8,000 less in his 20s than his parents did.
:16:55. > :16:58.For the first time ever, he cannot expect to be better off
:16:59. > :17:00.than his mum and dad. Partly this is because annual pay
:17:01. > :17:04.increases have gone down while the cost of living
:17:05. > :17:08.has gone up. In other words, he has less money
:17:09. > :17:12.coming in and more going out. The typical annual real pay increase
:17:13. > :17:15.for employees has fallen from a healthy 4% when Betty
:17:16. > :17:19.was in her 20s too close to zero today for Matt.
:17:20. > :17:22.Perhaps this explains why a quarter of adults still needed help
:17:23. > :17:28.from the Bank of Mum and Dad by the age of 35.
:17:29. > :17:32.Let's now talk about inequalities at work and concerns people have
:17:33. > :17:36.about jobs and being worse off than the generation before.
:17:37. > :17:42.Do you worry about being worse off than your parents or grandparents?
:17:43. > :17:46.I do in a way. I do feel worse off because I feel
:17:47. > :17:49.I think Labour have caused us to be in dire straits with the economy
:17:50. > :18:01.because of the spending they did in their previous government.
:18:02. > :18:07.It has left us with a poorer future. Who is worried about that here?
:18:08. > :18:12.Lots of people worried about debt. What are your concerns about debt
:18:13. > :18:16.and not actually being able to save? I graduate this year,
:18:17. > :18:19.I will be ?27,000 in debt. I'm going to move home,
:18:20. > :18:22.I have not got prospects of a job and I'm finding it difficult to get
:18:23. > :18:26.on the housing ladder. It is pretty bleak.
:18:27. > :18:30.It is worrying me and I do not think, I do not blame older people,
:18:31. > :18:34.but I'm jealous of the benefits they have had.
:18:35. > :18:36.That is interesting because this young woman is jealous
:18:37. > :18:43.of the benefits that you have all had in your lives.
:18:44. > :18:45.Do you think you have had it better than the younger
:18:46. > :18:48.generations are having today? Tell me why you think you do.
:18:49. > :18:52.We did not have tuition fees, we had grants.
:18:53. > :18:57.We could easily find a job. And we can get back there, I think
:18:58. > :19:01.with the Labour Party policies, and having growth and investment,
:19:02. > :19:06.we can get back to that. Gentleman in the background?
:19:07. > :19:10.I also think it is quite an issue that the kinds of jobs that young
:19:11. > :19:14.people are now being offered involve them in sort of arrangement
:19:15. > :19:17.like zero hours contracts, having to work well below their actual
:19:18. > :19:20.expectations after university. In order to actually even get
:19:21. > :19:29.a permanent long-term job. I feel that is quite unfair.
:19:30. > :19:32.What expectations do you have of your working career?
:19:33. > :19:37.The research says that actually you are much less likely
:19:38. > :19:43.to see your earnings increase because you're going to be too
:19:44. > :19:46.scared to move jobs. You're going to be worried about
:19:47. > :19:47.moving jobs, worried about job insecurity.
:19:48. > :19:50.I wonder does anyone actually have an ISA,
:19:51. > :19:51.even a private pension for example, they are paying into?
:19:52. > :19:54.Gentleman at the back has a private pension.
:19:55. > :19:56.Anyone else like to talk about their concerns
:19:57. > :19:57.about the world of work? Heather, I should come
:19:58. > :20:00.to you straightaway because you are about to be starting
:20:01. > :20:03.mental health nursing and you reckon 60,000
:20:04. > :20:06.is what it is going to cost you. Yes.
:20:07. > :20:09.I do not come from a well-off background.
:20:10. > :20:12.I have been saving for quite a few years to put
:20:13. > :20:17.towards my university fees. But when I graduate it will be
:20:18. > :20:20.towards the ?60,000 mark. I'm going into mental health nursing
:20:21. > :20:22.so working for the NHS, that in itself scares me.
:20:23. > :20:32.Given the direction it is going in right now.
:20:33. > :20:35.And I am worried I'm going to spend so much money on this education,
:20:36. > :20:38.will I even get a job at the end of it as a qualified nurse,
:20:39. > :20:41.will I even be able to provide for my future family?
:20:42. > :20:44.A theme emerging I think on this side of the room about low wages,
:20:45. > :20:49.low expectations in terms of the careers you can
:20:50. > :20:51.hope to go on to do. Dominic from the Conservatives,
:20:52. > :20:54.things are looking grim for this half of the room at the moment,
:20:55. > :20:56.there is no denying that. I think grim is wrong,
:20:57. > :20:59.I think which can be optimistic about the future.
:21:00. > :21:01.But it is difficult I think for this generation.
:21:02. > :21:04.We cut youth unemployment from the 20% we inherited to 12%.
:21:05. > :21:06.And we have left the average basic rate taxpayer,
:21:07. > :21:08.low and middle income earners, with ?1000 more in their pockets.
:21:09. > :21:11.We have introduced the national minimum wage.
:21:12. > :21:13.I think a big issue is housing. We have seen 300,000 more
:21:14. > :21:15.affordable homes built. But we are ambitious
:21:16. > :21:18.to build even more. But there is no getting away
:21:19. > :21:26.from the basic fundamentals, you need a strong economy to deliver
:21:27. > :21:29.the jobs and investment. Let me come in here, Dominic keeps
:21:30. > :21:32.talking about a strong economy but you never ask the question
:21:33. > :21:34.who is the economy for. The fact is the Conservatives have
:21:35. > :21:36.cut corporation tax, that is a tax on the profits
:21:37. > :21:38.of big corporations. Since 2010.
:21:39. > :21:41.To the point where we could perhaps be getting 20 million,
:21:42. > :21:43.?20 billion a year, 8 billion of which could pay for Heather's
:21:44. > :21:46.tuition fees, another 12 billion could go into actually providing
:21:47. > :21:52.those decent jobs and investing. It doesn't have to be this way.
:21:53. > :21:55.You have a whole bank of people over 60 wanting in here on this.
:21:56. > :22:02.On the question of jobs, job security, pay and so forth.
:22:03. > :22:05.Gentleman in the front. Do you think that actually you have
:22:06. > :22:07.had it a lot better than this generation?
:22:08. > :22:11.No, I have been through the world of work now since I was 16.
:22:12. > :22:14.I have not been in a single job for more than three years.
:22:15. > :22:17.I have not got a pension, I have had to, towards the end
:22:18. > :22:23.of this I have been better paid so I bought a flat to rent out,
:22:24. > :22:25.to use as my pension. And thank you again
:22:26. > :22:33.to the Conservatives for taking tax off me because they have changed
:22:34. > :22:36.the tax rules on renting. Do you think this generation has
:22:37. > :22:38.got to harden up a bit and take it on the chin?
:22:39. > :22:42.There is part of that. But also I think they were sold down
:22:43. > :22:45.the river with the tuition fees for universities.
:22:46. > :22:49.Because they were promised that those tuition fees would never
:22:50. > :22:54.be shown as being part of their loans and debt.
:22:55. > :22:58.As part of the older generation, would you have been prepared to pay
:22:59. > :23:00.more tax to make sure this generation had a free
:23:01. > :23:04.university education? I'm already doing that.
:23:05. > :23:07.Yes. Hands up how many would be prepared
:23:08. > :23:10.to pay a little more tax, the radio is listening in here,
:23:11. > :23:13.and it is a full house. I would like to say practically
:23:14. > :23:17.every person over 60 says they would be prepared to pay more
:23:18. > :23:21.tax, a hypothecated tax, to have young people going to college
:23:22. > :23:25.and university free. The gentleman with the purple
:23:26. > :23:28.shirt in the background. This is the difficulty,
:23:29. > :23:32.you're talking about strong economy but most of these people are not
:23:33. > :23:36.even going to be able to engage in that strong economy
:23:37. > :23:38.because they're not going to be able to earn a living wage,
:23:39. > :23:41.they're not going to be able, they will be weighed down by huge
:23:42. > :23:45.amount of debt. It is just ridiculous.
:23:46. > :23:47.You're not even going to be to earn a living wage.
:23:48. > :23:49.Gentleman here. I worked part-time along
:23:50. > :23:52.with my undergraduate degree, I'm now doing a masters degree
:23:53. > :23:54.so in total I will have about ?60,000 worth of student debt.
:23:55. > :23:58.Which is unbelievable. The Tories will tell you you do not
:23:59. > :24:02.have to pay it back until you earn over 21 grand and that is fine.
:24:03. > :24:05.But the reality is there is no incentive for me to want to earn
:24:06. > :24:07.over 21 grand because I'm never going to pay more than
:24:08. > :24:11.the interest I am accumulating. So you are stuck?
:24:12. > :24:14.He is stuck? I do not know, it is
:24:15. > :24:18.a personal situation. But he is telling you.
:24:19. > :24:21.I understand. I did a masters and I had to pay
:24:22. > :24:23.towards my fees for my masters at that stage and I know
:24:24. > :24:26.it is difficult. But we also need the younger
:24:27. > :24:28.generation to think about the choices they are making
:24:29. > :24:32.and see whether it is worth while for them.
:24:33. > :24:34.Do you think it is worth someone going to university to come out
:24:35. > :24:42.with ?60,000 worth of debt, and not have the possibility
:24:43. > :24:46.of having a job in anything like that income bracket?
:24:47. > :24:50.I would say I want to go into academia and near
:24:51. > :24:52.enough all the Ph.D. stipends are EU funded.
:24:53. > :24:55.The government said it is going to replace the funding we will lose
:24:56. > :24:57.from leaving the EU but do I believe that?
:24:58. > :25:07.Do I believe the 350 million for the NHS?
:25:08. > :25:10.This is probably a good time to go to independent expert Torsten
:25:11. > :25:12.Bell. Is it with these guys even bothering to go to university,
:25:13. > :25:17.forking out for those tuition fees, if they live in England,
:25:18. > :25:23.for the wages that they are going to earn in their various careers?
:25:24. > :25:25.Everyone would prefer not to have tuition fees or fees
:25:26. > :25:28.for anything you are doing. There is a big difference
:25:29. > :25:30.between the world that a lot of people here have been talking
:25:31. > :25:33.about when they went to university because only five
:25:34. > :25:35.or 10% of the population went to university.
:25:36. > :25:38.25 year olds now have a third of them will have gone to university.
:25:39. > :25:41.We do need to be careful because lots of the older generation
:25:42. > :25:44.did not go to university, they did not all get free grants.
:25:45. > :25:47.So yes the small numbers that did go to university got good jobs.
:25:48. > :25:49.If we look at the employment practices, the level of employment
:25:50. > :25:52.amongst those older generations, far fewer of them had unemployment
:25:53. > :25:54.than the young people today. Man in the front row.
:25:55. > :25:56.Starting out on a career, we had good support,
:25:57. > :25:59.we had reasonable wages, we had free education and we worked
:26:00. > :26:02.hard, every bit as hard as you guys are working,
:26:03. > :26:05.but we got rewards for it. And that is what is missing
:26:06. > :26:09.for this generation. And it is a tragedy.
:26:10. > :26:13.The Labour Party say they want to put up a living wage
:26:14. > :26:19.to ?10 an hour by 2020. I think that is right.
:26:20. > :26:21.But there are worries that that will hit the lowest paid
:26:22. > :26:23.because employers simply will not be able to pay it.
:26:24. > :26:26.You cannot just throw money at the issue of low wages.
:26:27. > :26:29.A low-wage, low skill economy is the reason why some people
:26:30. > :26:31.here do not think it is worthwhile going to university.
:26:32. > :26:34.We all benefit from a high skill, high wage economy.
:26:35. > :26:38.And raising the minimum wage to ?10 an hour by 2020
:26:39. > :26:41.which is what we have committed to do, that will give people
:26:42. > :26:45.a better incentive to work and also reduce the benefits that we pay out,
:26:46. > :26:49.the subsidy the state pays for people to stay in low-wage,
:26:50. > :26:55.low-income jobs and it will help transform our economy.
:26:56. > :26:57.We cannot make our way in the world as a low-wage, low-income economy.
:26:58. > :27:06.That is what Dominic does not understand.
:27:07. > :27:09.We need high skills. ?10 an hour, still
:27:10. > :27:12.not film star wages. Is that a good living wage to hope
:27:13. > :27:15.for even in five years' time? The gentleman in the
:27:16. > :27:17.T-shirt in the front. Going back to the university
:27:18. > :27:22.question, I have a degree, I now regret going for that degree.
:27:23. > :27:27.Because I was told if I went into a place where jobs were needed
:27:28. > :27:33.in various parts of the country, which I did, and I came out of that
:27:34. > :27:36.degree and no jobs at all. You had to travel to go to free
:27:37. > :27:39.internships in certain places in Manchester and London.
:27:40. > :27:42.I now regret that because every time I now go for a job I'm
:27:43. > :27:48.either overqualified or do not have experience.
:27:49. > :27:52.So it is a barrier, sometimes I take it off my CV.
:27:53. > :27:55.What do you say to that? I also want to come back
:27:56. > :27:58.to the mental health nurse to be and I thank you for going into that
:27:59. > :28:01.profession because mental health is very much the unsung profession
:28:02. > :28:04.within the health service. What would you do about public
:28:05. > :28:08.sector pay to make sure Heather did not get 1%?
:28:09. > :28:12.The cap, lift the 1% cap because right now a new nurse
:28:13. > :28:16.like Heather is going to be will be ?530 a year worse off by the end
:28:17. > :28:20.of this decade as a result of that 1% year on year rise,
:28:21. > :28:26.based on a 2% inflation. You're just not getting the money
:28:27. > :28:29.to keep pace with inflation. Gentleman in the background.
:28:30. > :28:33.Instead of freezing wages as they do with the 1% cap,
:28:34. > :28:40.why not link it to what the MPs get? They would think about it then.
:28:41. > :28:43.Guaranteed applause for that line! I just wonder if there is anyone
:28:44. > :28:46.on this over 60s half of the room who is still working,
:28:47. > :28:48.let us not have the impression that all sitting pretty in retirement
:28:49. > :28:54.on huge wads of cash? Quite a few of you.
:28:55. > :28:58.I have been made redundant several times throughout my working life.
:28:59. > :29:02.I'm running my own business at the moment but earning next to nothing.
:29:03. > :29:05.Having said that I still pay tax and would gladly pay more
:29:06. > :29:10.to support these young people through their education.
:29:11. > :29:14.On the question of jobs and helping, I wonder in the bank of over 60s,
:29:15. > :29:19.who has been, who has had to be the bank of mum and dad or the bank
:29:20. > :29:27.of Granny and grandad? Just one two, three.
:29:28. > :29:30.Not many. My children were fortunate enough
:29:31. > :29:33.to get grants to go to university. But if not you would have had
:29:34. > :29:36.to help, or they just would not have gone to university?
:29:37. > :29:40.Yes. I wonder if any of you actually
:29:41. > :29:43.regret, apart from this gentleman here, in the under 30s,
:29:44. > :29:48.regret your career path because actually you have come out
:29:49. > :29:51.worse than you thought you would be? Holly in the front?
:29:52. > :29:55.I'm a teacher, I just do not feel for what I do,
:29:56. > :29:58.the amount of work I put in, I do not feel I'm getting enough.
:29:59. > :30:01.And going back to the motivation, of the students and teaching,
:30:02. > :30:03.saying to them you will have to pay this much for university,
:30:04. > :30:05.there is going to be so much competition,
:30:06. > :30:07.and no job security. You're going to be working
:30:08. > :30:10.until you are at least 70. Those young adults.
:30:11. > :30:16.It is just, it is really difficult for me to be motivating.
:30:17. > :30:23.I wonder if you don't necessarily resent but question the fact that
:30:24. > :30:29.triple lock on state pensions means that pensions have risen 8% since
:30:30. > :30:33.2005, and if the triple lock continues, will continue to rise, so
:30:34. > :30:38.basically you have the chance that the minimum is going to be 2.5%,
:30:39. > :30:42.increase for pensioners, each year, how do you feel about that? This lot
:30:43. > :30:51.don't look too old! LAUGHTER They don't look too old! Howedes
:30:52. > :30:55.feel about that? I don't want any division. -- how do you feel like
:30:56. > :31:00.about that? Any to be more cohesive, certain parties are trying to divide
:31:01. > :31:15.the young and old, I think that is difficult. We have concerns about
:31:16. > :31:25.jobs. Now, to a pretty stark difference, housing.
:31:26. > :31:28.If we look at Betty's generation, 65% of them own their own home.
:31:29. > :31:30.By comparison, Millennial Matt has struggled to get
:31:31. > :31:34.At the age of 30, only 40% of his generation owns a property.
:31:35. > :31:37.So was it easier to buy a house in the 1970s?
:31:38. > :31:41.In 1974 Betty was 26 and was able to buy her first term for 2.5
:31:42. > :31:58.a 30-year-old Matt is struggling to buy his first home.
:31:59. > :32:00.The property will cost on average more than four
:32:01. > :32:04.So Matt and his friends are stuck renting from private landlords.
:32:05. > :32:08.Matt will spend on average ?44,000 more on rent than Betty did.
:32:09. > :32:13.And to make matters worse,
:32:14. > :32:16.he is probably paying his rent to Betty!
:32:17. > :32:20.Half of all rent that goes to private landlords,
:32:21. > :32:23.around ?4 billion a year, goes to those over 60.
:32:24. > :32:26.The effect of this is a two thirds of the aggregate wealth created
:32:27. > :32:28.since 2007 went to Betty and her generation while wealth
:32:29. > :32:39.format and those aged 16 to 34 has fallen.
:32:40. > :32:43.Let's start this section with a quick show of hands, this will be
:32:44. > :32:49.interesting, on the younger side of the room, how many people already
:32:50. > :32:56.own their own home? One man! Sheepishly putting his hand up. The
:32:57. > :32:59.most dead, only his own home! And just out of interest, how many of
:33:00. > :33:05.you expect to own your own home before you are 30? One, two, three,
:33:06. > :33:10.four... Just a few of you. There is a glimmer of hope there. Let's go to
:33:11. > :33:14.Dean, in the back row, you are saving hard to buy your own home,
:33:15. > :33:21.how much are you putting away a month? ?700 a month, that is the
:33:22. > :33:26.maximum I can put away for a help to buy ISA and I saved ?2400 last year.
:33:27. > :33:32.How much were you saving each month? I have saved ?2400 per year, that
:33:33. > :33:39.will do well towards a deposit. What about your social life? I live with
:33:40. > :33:44.mother and father, so...! Interesting, help to buy scheme,
:33:45. > :33:47.Labour is going to phase out the help to buy scheme by 2020 and yet
:33:48. > :33:51.it is the only lifeline that many young people have of the possibility
:33:52. > :33:56.they will get on the housing ladder, why phase out help to buy? What we
:33:57. > :34:03.have found is that helps to buy has been going to people who have over
:34:04. > :34:07.?100,000, and it has not succeeded in changing the housing market. --
:34:08. > :34:11.Help to Buy. What we are hoping to do is to build investor build 1
:34:12. > :34:22.million new homes over the next Parliament. So no? ... So no Help to
:34:23. > :34:29.Buy? We will be building affordable homes that young people can afford.
:34:30. > :34:35.Who likes Help to Buy? Anybody else? You are doing it. How much has Help
:34:36. > :34:39.to Buy given new optimism that you might get on the housing ladder
:34:40. > :34:43.question mark it has given me a lot of optimism, I'm saving ?200 a month
:34:44. > :34:47.as well, living with mum and dad helps as well, so it has given me
:34:48. > :34:50.optimism, especially with the extra money the government give you, it
:34:51. > :34:53.gives a boost to your savings and makes it easier to save.
:34:54. > :34:58.Who is paying through the nose for rent at the moment? Whose biggest
:34:59. > :35:06.bill is rent? Probably pretty much all of you. In the second row...?
:35:07. > :35:10.The lady in the blue. I'm studying at college at the moment, just
:35:11. > :35:14.because I'm a student I am allowed to be a bit more flippant with my
:35:15. > :35:18.spending, but I don't have a job at the moment, that's practically
:35:19. > :35:23.impossible, I don't quite know what to do, really, it's impossible for
:35:24. > :35:25.me. That in a vicious circle. Who has had terrible accommodation that
:35:26. > :35:32.they cannot believe they have had to pay for? We have had housing,
:35:33. > :35:35.student housing, for the last three years, one of the being in halls,
:35:36. > :35:42.private renting for the rest of it, we have gone through these,
:35:43. > :35:47.administration fees, hundreds of pounds each year paid just to go for
:35:48. > :35:53.the house, just to put the paperwork through, shoddy work done for
:35:54. > :35:57.repairs, the heating, I am sure most people remember the student has been
:35:58. > :36:03.cold and damp, and all the horror stories that you hear are true,
:36:04. > :36:08.basically. Let me bring the greens in here, because you have, on the
:36:09. > :36:13.question of private renting, do you accept it is often really badly
:36:14. > :36:19.maintained, terrible rents, and you have a plan to change that? You have
:36:20. > :36:23.to get the heart of why there is a problem, the 2011 census showed we
:36:24. > :36:26.have more rooms per head of population than we have had in our
:36:27. > :36:30.history, this is not about generations competing, it is that
:36:31. > :36:34.housing has been turned into a speculative commodity, fuelled by
:36:35. > :36:39.buy to let landlords, trying to make money from young people and old
:36:40. > :36:42.people. If you take the subsidy away from the buy to let landlords, put
:36:43. > :36:46.it into social housing, allow councils to borrow against that,
:36:47. > :36:51.increase the supply, take the heat out of the housing market, have rent
:36:52. > :36:55.controlled as well, give local authorities the opportunity to cap
:36:56. > :36:58.rents and control them so we have a living rent. We can do it if we have
:36:59. > :37:02.the political will. This has been framed as young versus old.
:37:03. > :37:06.Actually, it really is not like that, there is enough money, if we
:37:07. > :37:11.have the political will, does not need to be taken from the old to
:37:12. > :37:14.give to the young. We can altogether have it. Shared responsibility from
:37:15. > :37:17.the greens. The fact is all the parties will promise to build
:37:18. > :37:23.however many new homes it is, the SNP, you cannot... Naomi, the
:37:24. > :37:28.government is not building homes in any parts of the UK that are
:37:29. > :37:32.anything like at the required rate. First of all, I'm 24 years old, I'm
:37:33. > :37:36.acutely aware of all of these difficulties that you are discussing
:37:37. > :37:41.from your accommodation when you are a student through to saving in your
:37:42. > :37:45.ISAs and things like that. -- Mairi. The Scottish National Party has
:37:46. > :37:48.built 50,000 affordable homes and helped people into home ownership,
:37:49. > :37:54.22,000, by shared equity schemes, and we have scrapped the right to
:37:55. > :37:58.buy, and we are going to restore housing benefit for 18 to 21-year
:37:59. > :38:03.old, that is something the Tories scrapped. In all these ways, we are
:38:04. > :38:07.trying to help young people in Scotland make the really important
:38:08. > :38:14.move into the housing ladder. Dominik, in 2015, the Tories pledged
:38:15. > :38:23.to build million new homes by 2020, since March, last year, you have
:38:24. > :38:32.built 100 watts...? I know that -- 100 and what? It has been 168,000
:38:33. > :38:38.350. That is not on track to build 1 million homes by 2020. We have seen
:38:39. > :38:45.300,000 affordable homes made since 2010, and plans for 400,000 new ones
:38:46. > :38:54.for both encouraging social housing in councils to create housing for
:38:55. > :38:58.rent, but also. What about borrowing, to build affordable
:38:59. > :39:01.homes. We talk about borrowing and the wish list, the money tree that
:39:02. > :39:08.keeps giving money, but the Scottish Government deficit is three times...
:39:09. > :39:13.We need to do this in a responsible way. You are taking the debt and
:39:14. > :39:16.putting it around the neck of young people. We keep racking up these
:39:17. > :39:24.debts, these young people have to pay them off. Taking public debts...
:39:25. > :39:31.It is not right to promise 1 million homes, then, is it? We are
:39:32. > :39:35.redoubling efforts, to deal with rental as well as homes to buy. We
:39:36. > :39:40.need to hear from somebody on the older side of the room am a new has
:39:41. > :39:44.a spare room, wouldn't mind mind renting it out? In all seriousness,
:39:45. > :39:49.who has a fairly big cows, plenty of room in it, but you are still living
:39:50. > :39:56.in it and maybe it could help solve the housing crisis? Two, in four
:39:57. > :40:00.bedroom, but I would like to say, I don't think it was any different in
:40:01. > :40:05.our day, getting on the housing ladder, we needed to pay 15%, in my
:40:06. > :40:15.language that equated to almost two years salary, gross, not net, gross.
:40:16. > :40:19.OK. Then, we went through the process just over 1990, where the
:40:20. > :40:24.interest rate on the mortgage actually went up to 16, 17%, every
:40:25. > :40:29.month getting a letter to say it was going up and up and up, when we
:40:30. > :40:38.bought the house, when we bought the house, our mortgage doubled. And we
:40:39. > :40:43.had to give into something. And that was our main thing to do, to pay the
:40:44. > :40:46.mortgage. Sounds like a lot of these guys have given up on owning their
:40:47. > :40:50.own home, is this an impossible dream? Should young people not worry
:40:51. > :40:59.about owning their own home? What about that, will we be a property
:41:00. > :41:06.owning democracy? This generation will not see the same home ownership
:41:07. > :41:09.rates that baby boomers saw. 80% for baby boomers, these guys are around
:41:10. > :41:13.half that and will never get up to 80%, there were hired first-rate,
:41:14. > :41:19.but the flip side, house prices in Britain have gone through the roof
:41:20. > :41:23.over the last 30 years. I would like to go back to the point made by
:41:24. > :41:32.Dominic on borrowing being a barrier to affordable home building.
:41:33. > :41:36.Absolutely note credibility 1 billion in government debt to 1:7...
:41:37. > :41:43.1 trillion, to 1.7 trillion, how on earth do you think your government
:41:44. > :41:51.track record is credible at all. Until you have paid off the deficit,
:41:52. > :41:55.you cannot... Until you pay off the deficit, you cannot... You cannot
:41:56. > :42:00.get the debt down, we have... The debt is increasing, the debt is
:42:01. > :42:06.increasing. Until you get the deficit down... That shows you how
:42:07. > :42:10.important it is... Austerity... Austerity... Right back to where we
:42:11. > :42:15.started. Austerity is an ideological choice, you can grow your way out of
:42:16. > :42:18.debt, wrote to a surplus. We are not going to take lessons from the SNP
:42:19. > :42:24.on economics. LAUGHTER Lot of the policies we are pursuing
:42:25. > :42:29.in Scotland... The Scottish economy contracted at the end of 2016, your
:42:30. > :42:32.budget deficit is three times... That is a key indicator of
:42:33. > :42:36.economic... The gentleman on the second row, in the under 30 section.
:42:37. > :42:41.I grew up in quality housing, I have lived with high costs and poor
:42:42. > :42:45.conditions for a long time, I don't think... It has got worse and worse
:42:46. > :42:48.in recent years... I don't think that is because the economy is
:42:49. > :42:54.rigged for the old, it is because it is rigged for the rich, it is no
:42:55. > :42:58.coincidence that 70% of Tories Tory MPs are landlords, they have
:42:59. > :43:02.modelled on revenge evictions, the wealthiest Tory MP in the country
:43:03. > :43:05.has jacked up rents, so the families who lived there all their lives
:43:06. > :43:08.could not afford to live there anymore. How much longer are we
:43:09. > :43:14.going to go on with 3 million children living in damp and mould
:43:15. > :43:17.and vermin in the sixth richest economy in the world, how much
:43:18. > :43:21.longer will we accept this? What would you do if you were in power?
:43:22. > :43:28.She is bang on the money, 1 million new homes, half... Half public,
:43:29. > :43:32.half... It is possible, if you stop building luxury flats and start
:43:33. > :43:34.building affordable homes. And if you have a bit of planning and
:43:35. > :43:47.strategy rather than just... To bring in Ukip. You heard that
:43:48. > :43:52.this is the end of a property owning democracy in the same way it was
:43:53. > :43:55.before. Do we just have disabled people are not going to be able to
:43:56. > :44:00.afford their own homes in the future and it will all be landlords perhaps
:44:01. > :44:03.from this bracket who will be renting out their homes? It is not
:44:04. > :44:08.acceptable but decisions have been made over the past 20 years which
:44:09. > :44:13.have led to the situation we're in. There is a lot of unreality in what
:44:14. > :44:18.I've been hearing, we talk about affordable homes but those could be
:44:19. > :44:23.80% of market price if the market price is 300,000 unaffordable home
:44:24. > :44:27.is 240,000. That is still not affordable. Everyone has made
:44:28. > :44:32.promises to build and for 20 years it has not happened. We have not
:44:33. > :44:36.mentioned as Ukip have mentioned often, you cannot separate the
:44:37. > :44:42.housing crisis from immigration levels that we have had. And over
:44:43. > :44:49.the last 20 years there has been huge increase in immigration which
:44:50. > :44:52.has been a deliberate policy of Tony Blair, David Cameron and Theresa May
:44:53. > :44:56.and together with not building enough homes for the demand. Who
:44:57. > :45:02.thinks that the housing crisis is due to immigration, show of hands?
:45:03. > :45:09.Two or three hands. It is basic supply and demand and you cannot
:45:10. > :45:17.separate the two. It is a factor as it is in schools. There are many
:45:18. > :45:23.empty homes in deprived areas in parts of Wales. People cannot afford
:45:24. > :45:25.to buy them. The Conservative representative has talked about
:45:26. > :45:29.controlling national debt and they have failed to get to grips with
:45:30. > :45:35.that but they're happy with young people going heavily into debt. Many
:45:36. > :45:39.of them will not reach the pain threshold for when they start to pay
:45:40. > :45:47.back their student loan. That is the reality of the problems young people
:45:48. > :45:53.are facing. I'm getting confused and irritated to some extent. I have
:45:54. > :45:59.five children, two of them bought good houses in this area in their
:46:00. > :46:05.mid-20s. Just in the past five years. I do not understand all this
:46:06. > :46:08.difficulty. Do not tell the people down south for goodness' sake but
:46:09. > :46:15.one of the benefits of living in this area is housing is affordable.
:46:16. > :46:21.I do not understand most of the arguments. And I have examples.
:46:22. > :46:27.Let's bring in the Labour representative. As previous and
:46:28. > :46:32.leave this area, housing was one of the top three issues constituents
:46:33. > :46:35.came to see me about every week. House prices are more reasonable
:46:36. > :46:42.here but the incomes are much lower and the ability to save for the
:46:43. > :46:44.deposit also lower. So I have a young woman constituent of working
:46:45. > :46:47.for the government on a very good wage and she cannot afford to buy
:46:48. > :47:01.her home. That is not being reckless. Does that ring true with
:47:02. > :47:07.anyone from the under 30s? I'm from London and am considering, I have to
:47:08. > :47:13.move back home now and it is embarrassing, but that is just the
:47:14. > :47:20.issue. Prices are now extortionate. Do not be embarrassed. Is there a
:47:21. > :47:24.geographical split, a difference? There are geographical differences
:47:25. > :47:28.in house prices and earnings across the country. The north-east has a
:47:29. > :47:33.higher rate of home ownership but it is not just a London issue. Places
:47:34. > :47:38.like west Yorkshire and Greater Manchester, over a 50% decline in
:47:39. > :47:44.home ownership amongst young families since just the 1990s. And
:47:45. > :47:52.the older half of the audience? I'm a bit let landlord, I invested in
:47:53. > :47:58.buy to let. I did not want to, did that because I want attention and
:47:59. > :48:01.annuity rates have crashed. One of the reasons that, one of the
:48:02. > :48:07.benefits for being young nowadays is interest rates are so low. What I
:48:08. > :48:13.was playing, 15% interest on a mortgage in the 1980s. The only way
:48:14. > :48:18.that I could build up a pension fund was to go into buy to let. What
:48:19. > :48:22.you're saying is that housing for you is an investment and not a place
:48:23. > :48:31.to live. Exactly but only because I cannot get a decent annuity rate. Do
:48:32. > :48:34.you understand how some landlords are rapacious and actually some of
:48:35. > :48:41.them have bad properties that they do not maintain. Do you think that
:48:42. > :48:47.you really set the fair rent? I said just below the market rent. But I do
:48:48. > :48:52.everything in accordance with the law and the returns on buy to let
:48:53. > :48:56.are pretty poor if you do everything properly. This guy has several
:48:57. > :49:04.houses. Who sees it as a realistic investment for the future? Nobody.
:49:05. > :49:07.House prices have steadily been increasing and will continue to
:49:08. > :49:13.increase as long as we have a strong economy. The only way to do that is
:49:14. > :49:19.to get a Conservative government. We are running short of time on
:49:20. > :49:24.housing. I think there is a clear split in the room over that. With
:49:25. > :49:29.Brexit ahead what kind of country do we want to live in?
:49:30. > :49:34.Older and younger voters have always been polarised.
:49:35. > :49:38.So we would expect them to disagree. 65% of Betty and her buddies think
:49:39. > :49:42.that membership of the EU has eroded British identity.
:49:43. > :49:46.But less than a third of Matt's mates would agree.
:49:47. > :49:51.In fact, almost 43% of those under 30 consider themselves
:49:52. > :49:54.to be Europeans first. In the days after the Brexit vote,
:49:55. > :49:58.Matt was one of the three out of four young people
:49:59. > :50:02.who voted to remain. He complained that his identity had
:50:03. > :50:06.been taken away by the 64% of over 60s who voted to leave.
:50:07. > :50:11.Betty might argue that more young people ought
:50:12. > :50:14.to have turned out to vote. There was a 64% turnout amongst 18
:50:15. > :50:18.to 24-year-olds, whereas 90% of Betty's friends voted.
:50:19. > :50:21.But now that Article 50 has been triggered,
:50:22. > :50:26.just how much do Betty and Matt disagree?
:50:27. > :50:29.Not so much, is the answer. The under 30s overwhelmingly think
:50:30. > :50:34.that EU citizens already living here should be allowed to stay.
:50:35. > :50:37.And 78% of the over 60s agree. Betty and Matt also agree that EU
:50:38. > :50:39.companies should be able to continue to trade goods and services
:50:40. > :50:42.as they do now. In fact while most under 30s think
:50:43. > :50:44.that British companies should continue to comply with EU
:50:45. > :50:55.regulations more than half of Betty's generation agrees.
:50:56. > :51:03.are we ready as divided as we think? Let's look at the banks of young
:51:04. > :51:11.people. What kind of Britain do you want to live in, a Britain that has
:51:12. > :51:19.fewer migrants, more migrants? I was not old enough to vote in the EU
:51:20. > :51:22.referendum. But my future has been plunged into uncertainty by the
:51:23. > :51:27.older people who voted to leave the EU. I will not have the chance to
:51:28. > :51:32.study abroad if we have to pull out of a Razma. I will not have the
:51:33. > :51:36.chance to have foreign lecturers and I want to live in a country where we
:51:37. > :51:39.can accept these people, except people from other countries and
:51:40. > :51:49.embraced the culture they bring and embrace them as citizens. I think a
:51:50. > :51:54.lot of what is being said amongst young people in the wake of the
:51:55. > :51:59.referendum is scaremongering in terms of Erasmus, immigration and
:52:00. > :52:04.other things. The whole reason, the reason I think a lot of people voted
:52:05. > :52:07.to leave is because they wanted to control, not necessarily because the
:52:08. > :52:11.numbers needed to come down but they needed to be control. People study
:52:12. > :52:18.abroad outside of the EU and you can still do that. So voted to leave
:52:19. > :52:24.amongst the over 60s question this young lady says you're still our
:52:25. > :52:30.future. -- you have stolen our future. I'm not against people
:52:31. > :52:34.coming in from different countries but I just think, I feel our
:52:35. > :52:39.culture, it is the culture, I feel it has changed too much and I'm
:52:40. > :52:46.worried for my granddaughters. Did you granddaughters get a vote? One
:52:47. > :52:52.is just coming up to 19 so she is going to vote. Did you talk to them
:52:53. > :52:59.about voting? Absolutely. What they think? They have own thoughts that I
:53:00. > :53:04.gave them mine as well! And the gentleman just behind, digit Vote
:53:05. > :53:13.Leave? I see Brexit in the town I live in, Hartlepool, 70% leave, I
:53:14. > :53:18.see the town and whole country becoming much more mean-spirited and
:53:19. > :53:24.narrow-minded and like this lady I'm worried about my grandchildren. They
:53:25. > :53:32.go to a school where there are 13 nationalities, asylum seekers,
:53:33. > :53:38.refugees, and their education has been greatly enriched and it is a
:53:39. > :53:47.wonderful school. And if that was to stop then this country would be
:53:48. > :53:50.poorer for it. That gentleman is saying that having these different
:53:51. > :53:56.nationalities in a classroom is an enriching experience. The young
:53:57. > :54:00.woman behind people who voted Brexit have stolen her future as a kind of
:54:01. > :54:04.of international person. Absolutely not, we're still going to be friends
:54:05. > :54:08.with European countries, we will still have links and friendships
:54:09. > :54:12.with people all around the world. People will still be able to visit
:54:13. > :54:17.and add we will still give out student visas. What we have seen
:54:18. > :54:21.since Brexit I think, all of the fear, all the things that people
:54:22. > :54:26.said were going to happen that were bad have not happened. We have not
:54:27. > :54:36.had Brexit yet. Since the referendum. I think the gentleman
:54:37. > :54:44.says we have not seen anything but people have been -- have become more
:54:45. > :54:48.) scared of different people. I never experienced racism before
:54:49. > :54:53.Brexit but I have since. Apart from these other logistical things it has
:54:54. > :54:59.created a narrower society. Do you think that all, that older people
:55:00. > :55:03.have stolen your future in the sense that they made a decision about your
:55:04. > :55:08.future and not their future? I do not want to blame all of people but
:55:09. > :55:14.I feel some of them have done that. I will not have free movement, not
:55:15. > :55:18.be able to travel abroad if I want to, so many things. I think that our
:55:19. > :55:23.culture is enriched by migration. I'm a descendant of an Irish
:55:24. > :55:28.immigrant and I have given a lot to this country. Things like public
:55:29. > :55:36.services are built on migration, 40% of NHS nurses are EU immigrants. We
:55:37. > :55:42.need free movement. Dominic Bradley, can you look these people under 30
:55:43. > :55:49.in the eye and said that if we do not get the deal we want it will be
:55:50. > :55:51.OK if we cut herself loose? I understand the nerves of young
:55:52. > :55:55.people but there are also opportunities here and we are
:55:56. > :56:02.fighting for a successful Brexit. Let me finish the argument. My
:56:03. > :56:07.vision is an optimistic vision, Britain as a self-governing
:56:08. > :56:12.democracy, strong relationships with European friends but also a global
:56:13. > :56:17.horizon. That is important because the jobs of the future will come
:56:18. > :56:29.from trading with emerging economies and free trade is also a great way
:56:30. > :56:33.to bring down prices. Blaming older people for the Brexit result, a
:56:34. > :56:39.massive proportion of young voters did not bother to turn out. And a
:56:40. > :56:42.lot of the older people who voted Brexit with the same ones that voted
:56:43. > :56:47.to join the EU and the first place and they have seen the progression
:56:48. > :56:52.of the political union. A key point is that a lot of people, young
:56:53. > :56:57.people, did not turn out. Would that have made a difference if they had
:56:58. > :57:01.turned out? No and it is not right to see -- to say there was a low
:57:02. > :57:08.turnout amongst young people at the Brexit referendum. In the Brexit
:57:09. > :57:14.referendum we had a higher turnout amongst younger people than
:57:15. > :57:19.previously. 60% as opposed to 50% in general elections. The question now
:57:20. > :57:22.is if they're going to turn out to vote in this coming general
:57:23. > :57:34.election. There has been hired registration in the coming weeks. --
:57:35. > :57:42.higher. I voted remain and I voted remain because I agree that we may
:57:43. > :57:47.be are stealing the future from youngsters. I also remain the cover
:57:48. > :57:54.believe we may now be facing a crash in the economy. -- also voted
:57:55. > :58:02.remain. It could well happen. So it is right to remain. I voted remain
:58:03. > :58:08.but I understand the reasons of those who voted for Brexit. One is
:58:09. > :58:13.cultural, and that was mentioned just over there. I think it is
:58:14. > :58:16.important for anyone coming to this country or for those of us who are
:58:17. > :58:23.British going elsewhere, to go into whichever environment we are in and
:58:24. > :58:27.learn and absorbs the culture and be part of that environment. I
:58:28. > :58:31.understand why they did that, I think it is important to integrate
:58:32. > :58:34.people properly. I'd also those who voted for Brexit because they were
:58:35. > :58:38.afraid for their jobs, being taken by people coming into the country,
:58:39. > :58:46.we have to go back to the changing world that we have. When we spoke
:58:47. > :58:50.earlier about going to university, you must go and study the right
:58:51. > :58:55.things, have the right skills. The world is changing in terms of work
:58:56. > :59:01.so what is important is that schools, education, it is
:59:02. > :59:07.appropriate. We have not heard from the Liberal Democrats. Just how hard
:59:08. > :59:12.are you prepared to stand up against a hard Brexit? Very hard. You began
:59:13. > :59:18.to see the Leave campaign evaporate on the morning of the 24th of June.
:59:19. > :59:22.The ?350 million pledge. We believe those who started the process should
:59:23. > :59:30.be given the final say on the deal, the British people. If there is any
:59:31. > :59:34.deal. It is astonishing to hear the rhetoric from Dominic, this is the
:59:35. > :59:39.opportunity stuff when he has no comfort for the many millions of
:59:40. > :59:44.citizens from the EU used as bargaining chips in this country.
:59:45. > :59:47.Another show of hands, who is feeling optimistic about their
:59:48. > :59:55.future in the UK? If you're listening on the radio, just a
:59:56. > :00:05.handful of hands on either side. Anyone want to quickly tell us why
:00:06. > :00:09.they feel optimistic? I think we have a great opportunity now, an
:00:10. > :00:13.opportunity to speak to other countries which we did not have the
:00:14. > :00:17.chance to before. America is reaching out to us, we have plenty
:00:18. > :00:22.of other countries outside the EU who want to make deals with us. They
:00:23. > :00:25.want to talk with us and our negotiations and trade deals. It is
:00:26. > :00:31.all there regardless of what happens with the EU. I feel optimistic
:00:32. > :00:36.because the polls are closing, there's a chance we might elect a
:00:37. > :00:41.compassionate and real human being as a leader. If we can bring in
:00:42. > :00:54.Jeremy Corbyn, we will create a revolution and hope for the future.
:00:55. > :01:06.We are in charge of our own borders. Infrastructure cannot cope with open
:01:07. > :01:13.borders. It cannot. We're running out of time. Lady behind you. I
:01:14. > :01:22.think that was a mainly Tory press headline. Very quickly on the front
:01:23. > :01:26.row. I'm optimistic because the thing I know about the British, we
:01:27. > :01:32.have this ability to see an opportunity in any situation.
:01:33. > :01:40.That is all we have time for, from Newcastle, thank you to our
:01:41. > :01:44.audience, whatever age you are, and to the politicians as well. That is
:01:45. > :01:57.it from the generation gap, just eight days to go until that
:01:58. > :02:06.all-important vote. From Newsnight and Newsbeat, good night.
:02:07. > :02:27.Hello, cooler, clear and night for many of us overnight leading to a
:02:28. > :02:31.bright and sunny start on Wednesday, more clout across southern England
:02:32. > :02:32.and into Wales, that will tend to break up some