:00:11. > :00:18.Really has the United States traditional motto felt less
:00:19. > :00:26.relevant, as rival groups and protesters clashed outside a rally,
:00:27. > :00:33.is the hyper charged policy poisonous? The motto, e pluribus
:00:34. > :00:39.unum. It's difficult to see them finding any kind of common ground.
:00:40. > :00:41.18 men from two of the most notorious gangs in Birmingham are
:00:42. > :00:44.banned from the city centre, our police finally getting to grips with
:00:45. > :00:51.the gang problem, we hear from the mother of one innocent victim. I
:00:52. > :00:58.I felt angry and disgusted to see that 14 years on, the same gangs,
:00:59. > :01:04.the same two names, still terrorise and parts of Birmingham. Not
:01:05. > :01:10.painting but seen by numbers, autistic writer shares his
:01:11. > :01:13.experience with savant syndrome and synaesthesia. In my mind, each
:01:14. > :01:16.number had a shape. -- In my mind, each number had
:01:17. > :01:19.a shape - complete with colour and texture,
:01:20. > :01:20.and occasionally motion, a neurological phenomenon
:01:21. > :01:31.scientists call synaesthesia. The next US election
:01:32. > :01:34.is in on the 3rd November 2020. But, for President Trump
:01:35. > :01:39.the campaigning is well underway. In the early hours of
:01:40. > :01:45.this morning, our time, the President took to the stage
:01:46. > :01:47.for nearly an hour-and-a-half at his "Make America Great Again"
:01:48. > :01:50.rally in Phoenix, Arizona. It was a classic Trump performance,
:01:51. > :01:53.one of promise, defence, Some of his most barbed comments
:01:54. > :01:56.were made about the, as he would put it,
:01:57. > :01:58."fake news" media, blaming them for giving far right
:01:59. > :02:03.groups "a platform". We'll talk about that in a moment,
:02:04. > :02:05.but first, Gabriel Gatehouse reports from Phoenix,
:02:06. > :02:07.where America's increasingly polarised political debate spilled
:02:08. > :02:22.out onto the streets. VOICEOVER: Bikers for Trump, they
:02:23. > :02:25.came to Phoenix, to show support for their president, and, they said, to
:02:26. > :02:30.stop protest is from harassing those who wanted to attend the rally.
:02:31. > :02:36.Charlottesville is still fresh in the memory. Two radically opposing
:02:37. > :02:41.visions for America clashed, but was built, people died. We don't want to
:02:42. > :02:46.see anybody get hurt. The bikers condemned white supremacists and
:02:47. > :02:49.neo-Nazis, and so, eventually, did Donald Trump, but he was slow and
:02:50. > :02:56.equivocal. Many saw in him a president who emboldened racist. For
:02:57. > :03:01.all of us to protect people from threats of violence by protesters.
:03:02. > :03:04.America is in the grip of a cultural war so polarising, you might wonder
:03:05. > :03:09.whether these two sides lived on the same planet. Basel has emboldened
:03:10. > :03:12.people for the last eight years to come out and be violent because
:03:13. > :03:18.there has been no consequences for any of it, telling people that the
:03:19. > :03:23.only person in the world that can be a racist is a white man. So, yeah,
:03:24. > :03:27.it concerns me that that is the atmosphere in the country.
:03:28. > :03:31.Off-camera, one man told me he hated black people. On camera, others
:03:32. > :03:36.rejected the Ku Klux Klan, more reticent, but no less angry. I think
:03:37. > :03:44.they are trying to start a civil war, to be honest. Who? The
:03:45. > :03:49.government. Why would they do that? I don't know, who knows. I would be
:03:50. > :03:55.the first to take up arms, man, take up arms, for my country. If they
:03:56. > :04:00.come down on our soil, I am ready to defend it, that is the way that I
:04:01. > :04:04.look at it. All these other liberals, goody-goody, they want
:04:05. > :04:09.everybody to... This and that... Nothing ever gets done, all talk,
:04:10. > :04:13.all behind doors. We need to bring more stuff out, get things more
:04:14. > :04:17.done. Do you think Donald Trump is getting things done? Slowly, yes,
:04:18. > :04:21.he's trying, I believe he is really trying, he has to clean up the
:04:22. > :04:26.mess... Clean up the parking lot to make it liveable. Shame on you,
:04:27. > :04:30.shame on you. In downtown Phoenix, protest is gathered throughout the
:04:31. > :04:37.sweltering afternoon as they watched Donald Trump supporters arrive.
:04:38. > :04:42.Shame on you, racist! Neo-Nazi sympathisers! Get out of here! Each
:04:43. > :04:47.side taunted the other, across a police cordoned designed to prevent
:04:48. > :04:51.a repeat of Charlottesville. If you have been shot by a police officer
:04:52. > :05:00.while resisting arrest... You might lead out and die... -- bleed out. It
:05:01. > :05:03.is really extraordinary that the sitting president, with all the
:05:04. > :05:07.respect Americans have for this office, could produce this kind of
:05:08. > :05:12.reaction, that the Gulf between this side and that side is so great that
:05:13. > :05:24.it is very hard to see them finding any kind of common ground at all.
:05:25. > :05:26.Both sides in vogue those same three letters, USA, but in Trump's
:05:27. > :05:30.America, they are having trouble on agreeing what USA should actually
:05:31. > :05:34.mean? Do any of you have any understanding about where the people
:05:35. > :05:40.on the other side of the barricades are coming from? You do? Raise your
:05:41. > :05:49.hand, if you do. You have family... Right... Tell me about that. They
:05:50. > :05:54.feel very strongly that what Mr Trump began with the ideas about the
:05:55. > :06:00.economy, meant something, and that he can make change. And they, I
:06:01. > :06:03.don't think, are willing to now say, that is not working, it is
:06:04. > :06:08.backfiring, it is turning into a campaign of hate... And we are
:06:09. > :06:13.having trouble talking to each other. If that is happening in my
:06:14. > :06:20.own family...!... I'm pretty sure that a lot of people over there are
:06:21. > :06:22.having those same kinds of emotions. Arizona has some of the most relaxed
:06:23. > :06:27.gun laws anywhere in the United States, and on both sides, weapons
:06:28. > :06:34.were paraded in plain sight. I'm an American. There were some angry
:06:35. > :06:39.confrontations, but no violence. Between Trump's supporters and his
:06:40. > :06:43.detractors, his presidency may be divisive but it is also invigorating
:06:44. > :06:47.political debate. Trump is getting nothing done, the only thing he has
:06:48. > :06:53.signed his legislation... No, you are wrong.
:06:54. > :06:58.Inside the conference centre, the president was on classic form,
:06:59. > :07:03.untethered from the teller prompt, his routine is a compelling hybrid.
:07:04. > :07:10.He didn't say it fast enough... He didn't do it on time... Why did it
:07:11. > :07:17.take a day... He must be a racist... -- teleprompter. It is part stand-up
:07:18. > :07:21.comedy, part the work of a demagogue. The very dishonest media,
:07:22. > :07:26.those people right up there with all of the cameras... BOOING
:07:27. > :07:30.He quoted selectively from his own response to Charlottesville,
:07:31. > :07:35.accusing the media of doing exactly that as well. This is Donald Trump
:07:36. > :07:39.in his element, with all his contradictions and his audience love
:07:40. > :07:43.him for it. CHANTING By the time it was over, night had
:07:44. > :07:45.fallen, the protesters were still there, the police presence had
:07:46. > :07:54.increased. There were more heated arguments,
:07:55. > :08:00.detailed debate about race, crime, statistics. You are holding the
:08:01. > :08:04.numbers and you are lying. Percentage per capita of the
:08:05. > :08:08.representation of the United States... No... Per capita! But
:08:09. > :08:12.trouble came not between supporters and opponents of the president but
:08:13. > :08:19.it when protesters and the police. You have a responsibility, not to
:08:20. > :08:22.him, but to us! Officers said that the anti-trumped demonstrators threw
:08:23. > :08:32.rocks and bottles, they responded with tear gas, pepper spray and
:08:33. > :08:35.flash bangs. Go, go, go! The police are advancing out, all the people
:08:36. > :08:42.from the rally have been led away, this is now between the police and
:08:43. > :08:45.the anti-Trump protest is. It took several hours to clear the
:08:46. > :08:49.streets... Acrid clouds of tear gas lingered, as the protesters
:08:50. > :08:55.dispersed. It was heavy-handed but they kept the peace, the day ended
:08:56. > :08:58.without serious violence. But with divisions as entrenched as ever.
:08:59. > :09:03.If there's a debate about how voters see Trump,
:09:04. > :09:06.there's no question over how the President sees the press.
:09:07. > :09:09.In his latest attack he said it's time to expose the crooked media
:09:10. > :09:11.deceptions and accused the journalists of fomenting
:09:12. > :09:13.divisions trying to take away America's history and heritage.
:09:14. > :09:15.So, is this bluster or a real threat to the relationship
:09:16. > :09:18.between the press, the white house and the public?
:09:19. > :09:22.And how much blame does a partisan press have to take?
:09:23. > :09:25.Eugene Robinson, is the Chair of the Pulitzer Prize Board and also
:09:26. > :09:26.the Associate Editor of the Washington Post,
:09:27. > :09:43.Initially, then, your reaction to what we heard from the president in
:09:44. > :09:47.Phoenix. It worries me, speaking with my Pulitzer prize hat on, right
:09:48. > :09:52.now, that these kinds of attacks... We are used to politicians running
:09:53. > :09:57.against the media, that is a standard sort of technique, and we
:09:58. > :10:01.have thick skin. If you are a journalist, you ought to have a
:10:02. > :10:05.thick skin, that is fine. As an Trump's rhetoric is something we
:10:06. > :10:12.have not heard, referred to the media as enemies of the American
:10:13. > :10:17.people, he has said, as he did last night, they don't love their
:10:18. > :10:21.country, they don't want to make America Great Again they don't want
:10:22. > :10:26.to make America great... And he has escalated the rhetoric in a way
:10:27. > :10:34.that, frankly, worries me. It could be dangerous. It is very troubling.
:10:35. > :10:39.I think it is something we need to speak out about. Define
:10:40. > :10:49.dangerous...? You perhaps are familiar with the story...
:10:50. > :10:52.Pizzagate... The e-mails of the campaign chairman, John Podesta,
:10:53. > :10:56.were hacked, a lot of them were about ordering pizza, because that
:10:57. > :11:01.is what political campaigns do... They order pizza, working late into
:11:02. > :11:05.the night... And spirited theorists saw these e-mails, and they deduced
:11:06. > :11:10.there must be some kind of code, and somehow lead to the conclusion that
:11:11. > :11:16.Hillary Clinton was running a paedophile ring out of a specific
:11:17. > :11:19.pizza restaurant, here in Washington...! So, one month after
:11:20. > :11:24.the election, a man from North Carolina drove to Washington, went
:11:25. > :11:27.to the restaurant, carrying a loaded military style automatic rifle...!
:11:28. > :11:32.He fired a shot, and he demanded to be taken to the basement of the
:11:33. > :11:37.restaurant, so that he could free the enslaved sex enslaved children!
:11:38. > :11:41.There is no basement, of course there were no children, this is
:11:42. > :11:44.complete fabrication! It is fortunate that the customers and
:11:45. > :11:48.employees were not injured in this incident and the man was arrested.
:11:49. > :11:54.But the potential for disaster was there. A restaurant where parents
:11:55. > :12:00.take children to eat. It is not a leap to worry that such a thing
:12:01. > :12:04.could happen to a newsroom. Let's ask you, we saw in the report from
:12:05. > :12:08.Phoenix tensions running high on both sides, both extremes, the story
:12:09. > :12:18.you have told us about the pizza restaurant, how much is that the
:12:19. > :12:21.real America that we are seeing? My view is that, neither America is
:12:22. > :12:27.more real than the other, no one's America is more real than anyone
:12:28. > :12:32.else's, here is what bothers me... It seems to me... In the piece your
:12:33. > :12:36.correspondent did, at one point, there was an argument on the street
:12:37. > :12:40.over a statistic, over facts, we oughta be able to agree on facts.
:12:41. > :12:46.The Pulitzer Prize has been around for 101 years, all the journalists
:12:47. > :12:52.and playwrights and authors and poets, and composers, who have won
:12:53. > :12:57.Pulitzer Prizes, they share one thing in common, all engaged in a
:12:58. > :13:05.search for the truth. We must believe that there is truth, that
:13:06. > :13:08.truth does exist and that it can be ascertained as near as possible and
:13:09. > :13:12.we can agree on at least what the facts are, and then, let's argue
:13:13. > :13:18.about them, let's agree on what the facts are. And now, sadly, that sort
:13:19. > :13:24.of consensus about literally a chronicle of events, inside the
:13:25. > :13:29.facts, that consensus seems to have broken down. When you look at a
:13:30. > :13:32.Harvard University report which studied the coverage that President
:13:33. > :13:38.Trump got in his first 100 days, in print and on television, it reported
:13:39. > :13:42.the coverage was 80% negative. How fair is it to say that perhaps this
:13:43. > :13:49.is not wholly a one-way street, there is some blame from the media?
:13:50. > :13:54.I suppose it is a matter of degree... I certainly cannot or
:13:55. > :13:59.would not defend every single-storey that has been written, but this is a
:14:00. > :14:06.president who speaks in ways no president has, including a total
:14:07. > :14:13.disregard, at times, for fact. That is the truth. If he does it again
:14:14. > :14:17.and again, four times in a day, which is not uncommon!... Then it
:14:18. > :14:22.will be reported four times in a day, and the fifth story will report
:14:23. > :14:26.that he said something that actually is based in fact, and so, there you
:14:27. > :14:34.have your 80% negative and your 20% positive. It is an unusual
:14:35. > :14:39.situation, granted. But, what are we to do, except report the facts, as
:14:40. > :14:44.we know them. That is what you and your colleagues must do. How much
:14:45. > :14:46.are you in and your colleagues, how much are you victims of a cultural
:14:47. > :14:55.conflict being played out? I don't think we're victims at all.
:14:56. > :15:03.We are certainly privileged to do what we do, I've done it my entire
:15:04. > :15:11.career and I think journalism is an incredible way of seeing the world,
:15:12. > :15:16.and I think it provides a real public service. But yes, there is a
:15:17. > :15:24.real cultural divide in the United States. I'm not sure we fully
:15:25. > :15:32.understand its dimensions and its potential staying power, but it
:15:33. > :15:36.exists and we report on it and try to understand it, try to help
:15:37. > :15:43.Americans understand it. Is it in any way fuelled by bitterness? The
:15:44. > :15:47.position that the media enjoyed up until this president was pretty
:15:48. > :15:50.strong, but now we have a president who takes to twitter, who goes over
:15:51. > :15:55.the heads of you and your colleagues. How much is that the
:15:56. > :16:01.feeling from the media side? Well certainly we are in a new era when
:16:02. > :16:04.the president, who has umpteen million followers on Twitter, is
:16:05. > :16:09.able to communicate directly with that many people, without the
:16:10. > :16:18.intervention of the media. That is something we all have to get used
:16:19. > :16:22.to. We all -- also have to get used to the fact that on the web the
:16:23. > :16:30.traditional barriers of entry to be a major player in media have fallen.
:16:31. > :16:35.So you don't have two build a printing plant and buy ink by the
:16:36. > :16:40.barrel and paper by the time and higher press men and all of that. In
:16:41. > :16:45.fact, you set up a website and on the web we are all equivalent,
:16:46. > :16:50.basically. And so that's a new environment and we have delivered by
:16:51. > :16:59.our wits, and trust that the cream rises to the top. Briefly, is this
:17:00. > :17:03.sustainable? The relationship between the White House, the
:17:04. > :17:06.president and the media? Well, it will be sustained because there will
:17:07. > :17:20.be the White House and the media, the relationship I hope that yours
:17:21. > :17:21.and call soft some. We will have to because we're not going anywhere.
:17:22. > :17:23.Thank you for your time. How much jurisdiction will European
:17:24. > :17:25.judges have over our laws For the government the answer
:17:26. > :17:29.is simple - none whatsoever. But, as with all things Brexit,
:17:30. > :17:31.it may be more complicated. For Theresa May this is one
:17:32. > :17:34.of her red lines: Having full control over the law
:17:35. > :17:37.is an essential part of the UK So, you'd expect that
:17:38. > :17:41.after we we leave the EU and the transition is
:17:42. > :17:43.done, that's it... Today, the Government set out
:17:44. > :17:48.a discussion document. So, when will we "take
:17:49. > :17:50.back control?" Chris Cook has been taking a look
:17:51. > :17:58.at what ministers want. One of the things we thought we knew
:17:59. > :18:03.about life after we leave EU was that the European Court
:18:04. > :18:07.of Justice wouldn't be part of it. But let me be clear, we are not
:18:08. > :18:12.leaving the European Union today to give up control of immigration
:18:13. > :18:16.again, and we're not leaving only to return to the jurisdiction
:18:17. > :18:20.of the European Court of Justice. So we will take back control
:18:21. > :18:23.of our laws and bring an end to the jurisdiction
:18:24. > :18:25.of the European Court We want to make sure
:18:26. > :18:29.that we are ending, that we are ending the jurisdiction
:18:30. > :18:34.of the European Court of Justice. For some Brexiters it was enormously
:18:35. > :18:37.important that all of our laws should be written by our parliaments
:18:38. > :18:40.and they should be interpreted by our courts, including
:18:41. > :18:43.the supreme courts. That meant ending the role
:18:44. > :18:47.of the European Court of Justice. The ECJ is the body that make sure
:18:48. > :18:50.EU law is evenly applied It's a thing that turns the rights
:18:51. > :18:58.and responsibilities Let's suppose after Brexit
:18:59. > :19:04.that we sign a comprehensive free trade deal that lets European
:19:05. > :19:07.businesses trade freely The Government's plan is that
:19:08. > :19:12.here in Britain our courts should enforce those rights,
:19:13. > :19:17.with no cases sent to the ECJ. The thing is, though,
:19:18. > :19:20.to take a few examples, the EU's agreements with Canada,
:19:21. > :19:25.Singapore and the members of the European Economic
:19:26. > :19:27.Area contain courts. For the same reason our government
:19:28. > :19:35.is proposing a new UK-EU court. We need a sort of enforcement
:19:36. > :19:37.mechanism, that's really Because if we've gone to the bother
:19:38. > :19:45.of agreeing rules in some deep and comprehensive free trade
:19:46. > :19:47.agreement, the people who feel perhaps they're not getting
:19:48. > :19:50.the access they should under that agreement, want some way
:19:51. > :19:51.of getting readdress. So if you've been trying
:19:52. > :19:54.to export to an EU country, you think its rules
:19:55. > :20:02.are discriminating against you, you want some way of appealing
:20:03. > :20:04.to another authority, to say - actually, these people
:20:05. > :20:07.aren't abiding by the rules. I think, overall, this is a really
:20:08. > :20:10.informative and pretty useful paper. What came through most strongly
:20:11. > :20:13.for me is the fact that so much attention is being devoted to how
:20:14. > :20:15.to ensure alignment between our legal system and the EU legal
:20:16. > :20:18.system after we've left, means the Government now has one
:20:19. > :20:21.of its priorities to ensure we can keep trading,
:20:22. > :20:23.by making sure our legal system is as closely aligned to that
:20:24. > :20:26.of the EU as possible. But there may be problems,
:20:27. > :20:31.not least with escaping First, a deep relationships
:20:32. > :20:36.with the EU probably means But the more we do that,
:20:37. > :20:42.the more the ECJ will matter. For example, in the field
:20:43. > :20:49.of aviation, outside the EU, if there is an arbitration panel,
:20:50. > :20:51.and these arbitrations wouldn't be at the European Court of Justice,
:20:52. > :20:56.but since all the rules and all the regulations are adopted
:20:57. > :20:59.at EU level, they continue to be interpreted by the European Court
:21:00. > :21:02.of Justice and this arbitration would really be instructed to take
:21:03. > :21:05.all that case law into account. Second, the EU may want
:21:06. > :21:08.a bigger role for the ECJ For me, there are two
:21:09. > :21:17.potential sticking point. The first is to do with
:21:18. > :21:19.the ratification, because, remember, this is about the trade deal
:21:20. > :21:22.and the trade deal has to be approved not just
:21:23. > :21:24.by the European Council, but by the national Parliaments
:21:25. > :21:26.of the member states, and therefore I wonder
:21:27. > :21:29.whether all parliaments will agree to setting up a bespoke
:21:30. > :21:32.new adjudication mechanism. And the big problem is,
:21:33. > :21:34.there are still some areas like the rights
:21:35. > :21:37.of EU citizens in the UK, where the EU is insisting that
:21:38. > :21:39.EU law should apply, and for that you have to have a role
:21:40. > :21:43.for the European Court of Justice. And there's no obvious
:21:44. > :21:46.or easy way round that. Third, you can have enforce your EU
:21:47. > :21:49.rights at a local court, but who will get to take cases
:21:50. > :21:53.to the new EU-UK body? It's not clear to me that these
:21:54. > :21:57.proposals would allow a business which has difficulties exporting
:21:58. > :22:01.to France, for example, to actually access a court directly
:22:02. > :22:04.and make their claims This would all have to be done
:22:05. > :22:09.between the UK Government and the European Union,
:22:10. > :22:13.and so not only business, but if there rights also for people
:22:14. > :22:16.to move, or other rights, they would not be directly
:22:17. > :22:18.enforceable in the same Our government now has a settled
:22:19. > :22:23.view on which court should be supreme, but the ECJ may not go
:22:24. > :22:25.away, and businesses in particular may worry about how
:22:26. > :22:35.they enforce their rights. In 2003, two innocent girls
:22:36. > :22:39.were leaving a party in Birmingham. Charlene Ellis
:22:40. > :22:43.and Letisha Shakespeare were gunned down in a gang related
:22:44. > :22:46.drive by shooting. The feuding gangs were the Johnson
:22:47. > :22:49.Crew and the Burger Bar Boys. 14 years later, West Midlands police
:22:50. > :22:53.is still dealing with gang violence in the city and specifically
:22:54. > :22:56.the same two gangs which killed Today, those gangs were given
:22:57. > :23:01.what police are calling the largest Think of a gang injunction
:23:02. > :23:09.as similar to an ASBO. It requires a lower burden of proof
:23:10. > :23:12.than a criminal conviction and is designed to disrupt
:23:13. > :23:14.and prevent gang related For the next two years,
:23:15. > :23:20.eighteen men, aged between 19-29 are banned from parts of Birmingham
:23:21. > :23:23.and must register phones A little earlier I spoke
:23:24. > :23:34.to Marcia Shakespeare, How she felt when she heard the
:23:35. > :23:37.names of the two gangs who killed her daughter again today.
:23:38. > :23:42.I felt angry and disgusted to know that 14 years on,
:23:43. > :23:46.I'm constantly hearing the same gangs, the same two names
:23:47. > :23:49.are still terrorising parts of Birmingham,
:23:50. > :23:59.and I can't understand why they are not stamped out.
:24:00. > :24:02.I know when I went and did some initial research within New York,
:24:03. > :24:04.when I met some Bloods and Crips over there,
:24:05. > :24:07.and they seemed to be quite faded, so I can't understand
:24:08. > :24:09.why these gangs are continuously happening and continuously
:24:10. > :24:17.So there's been a marked uptick in violence this year,
:24:18. > :24:21.with a number of fatal shootings, not necessarily involving any
:24:22. > :24:23.of the people who are subject to this injunction, but why do
:24:24. > :24:31.Well, I know from speaking to young people who I work with,
:24:32. > :24:34.young boys in particular, they state that the problem
:24:35. > :24:39.is what they're getting is they're walking on the streets,
:24:40. > :24:42.and when they're walking on their own, they're
:24:43. > :24:44.being attacked by people, large groups are trying
:24:45. > :24:52.They're been threatened with knives, and because of this
:24:53. > :24:55.a lot of the young people have decided to join
:24:56. > :24:57.gangs, because they feel safe if they're within a group,
:24:58. > :25:03.So that is another area that also needs to be challenged,
:25:04. > :25:10.about young people joining gangs, because...for protection.
:25:11. > :25:12.It's not just the knives or the weapons, they're actually
:25:13. > :25:15.The West Midlands Police and Crime Commission said
:25:16. > :25:19.in an interview today that what will help back it up
:25:20. > :25:25.is that the eyes and ears of the community will focus on these
:25:26. > :25:29.people and if they see any of these gang members in the wrong area,
:25:30. > :25:31.they will phone the police and therefore the police
:25:32. > :25:34.You'd have to be mighty brave to shop one of these gang
:25:35. > :25:39.Yes, because I know from my case, through the trial, it took a lot
:25:40. > :25:45.And even when they did come forward, there were points when they actually
:25:46. > :25:48.decided they were going to turn around and not give evidence,
:25:49. > :25:56.solely because of the threat level of the gangs trying to control them,
:25:57. > :25:58.and also trying to attack them or family members.
:25:59. > :26:02.So yes, although you've got the gang injunctions and it states it that it
:26:03. > :26:06.will stop gangs going in different areas, I can't see
:26:07. > :26:09.the difference between tagging and gang injunctions.
:26:10. > :26:12.But as I said, I'm open-minded and hope.
:26:13. > :26:17.I appreciate you're not the architect of it,
:26:18. > :26:19.but isn't that where this whole idea could actually fall down?
:26:20. > :26:21.You almost need like a witness protection programme,
:26:22. > :26:24.if I'm going to shop some of these people,
:26:25. > :26:27.I want to know that my family and I are going to be
:26:28. > :26:35.Yes, and that is very hard, and I know through work previously,
:26:36. > :26:40.working with the police in New York and the one thing they did state
:26:41. > :26:43.that a lot of the witness protection, many family
:26:44. > :26:47.members have had to move towns, cities and countries.
:26:48. > :26:50.So, yes, it's a big ask, and that's why I say,
:26:51. > :26:54.even though you have gang injunctions, it cannot
:26:55. > :26:59.There have to be other things in place.
:27:00. > :27:04.Now the only thing that is curious to me is, OK,
:27:05. > :27:08.you have the gang injunctions, but who is monitoring it?
:27:09. > :27:12.Is this a 24-hour watch, where police are within the community,
:27:13. > :27:17.monitoring and seeing these people within the gangs?
:27:18. > :27:20.You've also got social networks where people obtain
:27:21. > :27:23.different sim cards, where they can actually make
:27:24. > :27:25.different phone calls and they can contact people.
:27:26. > :27:35.So I'm very curious to see how this is going to work.
:27:36. > :27:37.Can I put it to you, you're quite close, obviously,
:27:38. > :27:40.Do you think they have the necessary resources?
:27:41. > :27:44.Finally, what sustains you in your work?
:27:45. > :27:55.When you see young people, there are a lot of great young
:27:56. > :27:57.people within Birmingham, however it's about
:27:58. > :28:05.A lot of them, unfortunately, don't have the opportunities
:28:06. > :28:09.and they're not educated, because unfortunately sometimes
:28:10. > :28:12.they're just grouped into one particular group and they give up
:28:13. > :28:20.So when you see hard young people, you know that you've got
:28:21. > :28:23.to keep going to allow some young people to have those opportunities.
:28:24. > :28:25.Marcia Shakespeare, thanks for joining us tonight.
:28:26. > :28:30.Kirk Dawes used to work for the West Midland Police.
:28:31. > :28:33.He founded The Centre for Conflict Transformation,
:28:34. > :28:36.which was credited with reducing gangland violence in the city
:28:37. > :28:41.between 2004 and 2012 - when it was shut.
:28:42. > :28:48.He is in Birmingham tonight. The same question if I can that I put to
:28:49. > :28:54.the campaign and victim's mother, wide Birmingham? I think that
:28:55. > :28:59.between 2004-12, as you say, there was a lot of great work through what
:29:00. > :29:03.was called Birmingham reducing gang violence, that enabled us to reduce
:29:04. > :29:09.the number of firearms offences, knife offences and the like and the
:29:10. > :29:13.number of people in gangs. Wide Birmingham? I think there is a
:29:14. > :29:17.resurgence, in regard to some of the youngsters coming up right now. One
:29:18. > :29:23.of the things I would say is there was a good strategy and that
:29:24. > :29:29.strategy effectively stopped in 2012. It's fair, is it not, to
:29:30. > :29:33.question whether West Midlands police have the personnel and
:29:34. > :29:42.resources to implement this? It is fair. The reduction to the police
:29:43. > :29:45.services has taken away their capacity to deal with the upsurge
:29:46. > :29:49.they have now. What we are forgetting is the great work that
:29:50. > :29:53.was done at that time by community groups, specialists in the role of
:29:54. > :30:01.dealing with gangs. In essence, what you got was... If we go back to the
:30:02. > :30:05.gang injunction itself, one big part of the gang injunctions are positive
:30:06. > :30:08.requirements. That's what was utilised, with people from the
:30:09. > :30:14.community, to enable us to actually become involved in moving gangs away
:30:15. > :30:17.from their lifestyle and towards better opportunities. That's why
:30:18. > :30:23.positive requirements are there. What we have seen today, what I've
:30:24. > :30:26.read in the media, is quite simply lots of things around in
:30:27. > :30:32.enforcement, disruption and the like, but I haven't heard anything
:30:33. > :30:37.about positive requirements. What are those requirements? Anything
:30:38. > :30:41.that the public authorities, with partner agencies, consider
:30:42. > :30:46.reasonable. Such as... Discharging a firearm means there is a conflict
:30:47. > :30:49.and with that conflict, just by saying X cannot meet why cannot
:30:50. > :30:54.travel down a certain street will be in a certain part, you'd do not deal
:30:55. > :31:00.with the conflict. A positive requirements was in the past, when
:31:01. > :31:05.it first came out, things like mediation, conflict management, job
:31:06. > :31:08.coaching. You have to give these people are realistic and appealing
:31:09. > :31:13.alternative from the lifestyle they are engaged in. How cost-effective
:31:14. > :31:17.Will this be. You and your colleagues did some research on to
:31:18. > :31:23.the cost of policing prosecuting murders? At the moment the cost of a
:31:24. > :31:26.murder is about ?2 million. Certainly that figure was never the
:31:27. > :31:30.amount in any particular year that was given towards the interventions
:31:31. > :31:37.that were being utilised, that brought the figures right the way
:31:38. > :31:43.down. When we started mediation, for instance, it was never expected to
:31:44. > :31:47.work but it did work we engage these people in the conflict ended up
:31:48. > :31:51.discharging a firearm. Isn't this wishful thinking? Set for two years,
:31:52. > :31:55.you're going to turn some of these men around in two years, pie in the
:31:56. > :32:02.sky? I don't think so. That was set in 2004. Like Marcia sake I went to
:32:03. > :32:06.the United States and spent a lot of time in Northern Ireland. Within two
:32:07. > :32:10.years of gun injunctions coming in and the sort of work the community
:32:11. > :32:15.were bringing in, the numbers fell dramatically. Lastly, the community,
:32:16. > :32:20.the eyes and ears, shopping these gang members, you are on the front
:32:21. > :32:24.line, how likely is that? It is difficult for a lot of people to
:32:25. > :32:28.shop at them, but the challenge is for the community and for the
:32:29. > :32:32.police, but I will always say you've still got to deal with the conflicts
:32:33. > :32:46.themselves. Thank you very much for your time tonight.
:32:47. > :32:48.In the niche world of staggering mathematical feats, the big question
:32:49. > :32:51.is 'Who can recite Pi to the most decimal places?' A record-holder
:32:52. > :32:54.in the field is Daniel Tammett, who managed to recall Pi to more
:32:55. > :32:57.He's been diagnosed as a high-functioning autistic savant,
:32:58. > :33:00.and in his acclaimed books and lectures, he's shown himself
:33:01. > :33:02.to have a rare and eloquent insight into the condition.
:33:03. > :33:05.His new book, Every Word is a Bird we Teach to Sing,
:33:06. > :33:07.published tomorrow, is a collection of essays about languages
:33:08. > :33:13.Daniel Tammett has been speaking to our Culture
:33:14. > :33:28.I kept a list of words, according to their shape and texture. Words round
:33:29. > :33:41.as a three, gobble, covered, cabbage... Pointy as a 4: jacket,
:33:42. > :33:42.wife, quick. Shimmering, as a five. Kingdom... Shoemaker...
:33:43. > :33:51.Surrounded... Numbers felt like my first language
:33:52. > :33:56.in a way that English never did, it felt like a foreign language, being
:33:57. > :34:02.able to the site these numbers like a poem, composed in numbers, or
:34:03. > :34:05.story, was, for me, a way of expressing myself, communicating
:34:06. > :34:09.with other people. -- cite. And realising for the first time that I
:34:10. > :34:12.had a gift for communication, which is paradoxical, because I am also on
:34:13. > :34:18.the autistic spectrum, all with what we call high functioning autism
:34:19. > :34:23.today, and often people on that spectrum find language difficult,
:34:24. > :34:27.even at the highest end, but it is something I have learned how to
:34:28. > :34:31.master. VOICEOVER: He may have started with numbers but Daniel also
:34:32. > :34:37.has an intense relationship with words. He speaks several languages,
:34:38. > :34:42.his new book is part travelogue, part meditation, on the subject of
:34:43. > :34:51.how we communicate in all its variety. One of my favourite word is
:34:52. > :34:59.Icelandic, it means midwife, but it literally means light mother, and
:35:00. > :35:07.this is the first ten, 12 digits of pi, the number is -- the word is
:35:08. > :35:16.Ljosmoour. How Mick Lacy did you manage to get to with this? 22,000
:35:17. > :35:21.514. -- how many bases. How did you do that? -- how many places. When
:35:22. > :35:26.somebody sees calligraphy, squiggles on a page, Chinese ideograms, to
:35:27. > :35:30.have them memorise it would be impossible, but numbers, for me,
:35:31. > :35:34.they are not squiggles on a page, they have shaped and colours and
:35:35. > :35:41.textures and meanings. -- 22,514. These meanings are intuitive, but...
:35:42. > :35:47.They are so full of poetry. In my mind, each number had a shape.
:35:48. > :35:53.Complete with colour and texture and occasionally motion. A neurological
:35:54. > :35:59.phenomenon which scientists call synaesthesia, each shape a meaning.
:36:00. > :36:10.The meaning could be pictographic. 89 was dark blue, the colour of the
:36:11. > :36:13.sky. Threatening storm. You are looking at, reaching some tentative
:36:14. > :36:17.conclusions, about the changing relationship between the written and
:36:18. > :36:24.the spoken word. In this age of digital communication. Yes. Can you
:36:25. > :36:27.tell us about that? What is fascinating is that language is
:36:28. > :36:32.merging in a way that linguists had not expected, 50, even 30 years ago.
:36:33. > :36:36.We are seeing with computers now and people writing more and more online
:36:37. > :36:41.that they are using essentially spoken language but in a way that is
:36:42. > :36:46.written. Using the same abbreviations, the same slang. The
:36:47. > :36:49.same expressions that we would not have seen written in the past. And
:36:50. > :36:55.it is changing our relationship with language. There are people who say,
:36:56. > :37:02.it is a form of dumbing down. Standards dropping... I am more
:37:03. > :37:07.optimistic. Talking about autism, what would you say to parents, young
:37:08. > :37:14.people, who are faced with this condition and are perplexed about
:37:15. > :37:17.it, concerned about it. It brings benefit, there have been wonderful
:37:18. > :37:23.poets, autism does bring benefit, and many writers in the past, maybe
:37:24. > :37:28.that in Nabokov, Lewis Carroll, they may have been on the spectrum. We
:37:29. > :37:35.know that there is this fantastic potential. What the barrier is in
:37:36. > :37:39.part is society, society up until very recently did not realise that
:37:40. > :37:43.people on the autistic spectrum had creativity and could create, they
:37:44. > :37:50.assumed that people could memorise, that they could be like machines, in
:37:51. > :37:52.a way, robots, calculators, but not writers, not artists, sculptures. --
:37:53. > :38:03.sculptors. One day, intent on my reading, I
:38:04. > :38:14.happened upon lollipop, and a shock of joy coursed through me. I read it
:38:15. > :38:18.as, 1,011, and I thought it was the most beautiful thing I had yet read.
:38:19. > :38:31.Half number, half word. What does pound sign
:38:32. > :38:35.barcamp mean to you? Not a lot I expect, but it's
:38:36. > :38:38.historic because it was the first time a hashtag,
:38:39. > :38:40.as it's now of course known, appeared on twitter,
:38:41. > :38:43.and that was ten years ago today. Here's the man who came up
:38:44. > :38:46.with the idea, Chris Messina, telling #newsnight
:38:47. > :38:48.about how it happened. Ten years ago today I was one
:38:49. > :38:51.of the first users of social media, and I saw the great potential
:38:52. > :38:53.of this platform to The problem with early Twitter,
:38:54. > :38:56.early platforms, especially in the early days of the iPhone,
:38:57. > :39:00.was that it was just a mess. We needed a way of actually
:39:01. > :39:01.organising conversations I thought the hashtag would be
:39:02. > :39:09.a great way to do that, and I wrote up my ideas,
:39:10. > :39:12.I shared it on the web, I spent the next several years
:39:13. > :39:14.actually promoting this idea Ten years later, I'm super thrilled
:39:15. > :39:18.with how much it's grown, how much it's expanded and how
:39:19. > :39:21.people are actually using it to find people who they want to connect
:39:22. > :39:23.with, have conversations with and use to understand
:39:24. > :39:40.the world around them. That's nearly all for tonight,
:39:41. > :39:42.but in tribute to Chris Messina's invention we thought we'd leave
:39:43. > :39:46.you with some hashtag highlights.