0:00:05 > 0:00:10Tonight, could this be the border that sinks Brexit?
0:00:10 > 0:00:13Newsnight is live in Dublin, and we speak to the DUP's Brexit
0:00:13 > 0:00:17spokesman here in the studio.
0:00:17 > 0:00:21Also tonight, Syria's Aleppo was a year ago, but a new crisis
0:00:21 > 0:00:23is emerging to the east of Damascus.
0:00:23 > 0:00:26Tonight, we bring you exclusive footage from the rebel stronghold of
0:00:26 > 0:00:29Eastern Ghoutta.
0:00:29 > 0:00:32We'll ask the UN live what they can do to stop the suffering.
0:00:32 > 0:00:34And...
0:00:34 > 0:00:38Also tonight - Meghan Markle wows the nation, as she prepares
0:00:38 > 0:00:44to marry Prince Harry.
0:00:44 > 0:00:46The corgies took to you straightaway.
0:00:46 > 0:00:48Over the last 33 years, being barked at.
0:00:48 > 0:00:49This one walks in, absolutely nothing.
0:00:49 > 0:00:52Just laying on my feet during tea, it was very sweet.
0:00:52 > 0:00:54Wagging tails, it was just like ugh!
0:00:54 > 0:00:56She's also called herself a strong, confident mixed-race Woman.
0:00:56 > 0:01:03How much of a moment is this for others of mixed heritage?
0:01:08 > 0:01:10Good evening.
0:01:10 > 0:01:14Tonight, Ireland stands on the verge of snap elections,
0:01:14 > 0:01:17as their Prime Minister promises to do everything he can to bring
0:01:17 > 0:01:18the country back from the brink.
0:01:18 > 0:01:21The dispute is a domestic one, but the implications would be
0:01:21 > 0:01:23profound for the EU and for Brexit.
0:01:23 > 0:01:25Leo Varadkar has threatened to block Brexit talks next month,
0:01:25 > 0:01:28if he believes insufficient progress has been made on the future
0:01:28 > 0:01:32of the border within the island of Ireland.
0:01:32 > 0:01:35This border is one of the most intractable issues Brexit has thrown
0:01:35 > 0:01:38up - how to preserve the openness between north and south,
0:01:38 > 0:01:41and how to comply with the new terms that Britain's vote to leave
0:01:41 > 0:01:44the EU demands.
0:01:44 > 0:01:47Theresa May is desperate to start pushing talks with Brussels
0:01:47 > 0:01:49onto trade, when she meets negotiators next week.
0:01:49 > 0:01:52But they will not be willing to do so until the Ireland
0:01:52 > 0:01:55question is resolved.
0:01:55 > 0:02:04Let's head straight to Dublin and Mark Urban who's there.
0:02:04 > 0:02:08Emily, the things were queueing up, political pressure, messages,
0:02:08 > 0:02:11everything queueing up just the way Ireland wanted it on the border
0:02:11 > 0:02:15issues. A couple of weeks back, the commission in Brussels had got
0:02:15 > 0:02:19squarely behind them with more explicit language than we'd heard
0:02:19 > 0:02:24before saying, well, their preferred solution was that a border be on the
0:02:24 > 0:02:28Irish Sea, ie that Northern Ireland be taken into the same customs and
0:02:28 > 0:02:31single market regime if, indeed, Britain was going to push on and
0:02:31 > 0:02:36leave the single market and customs union. Now suddenly, this political
0:02:36 > 0:02:42crisis has blown up. It's about a police whistle-blower and what the
0:02:42 > 0:02:46Prime Minister's Justice Minister did or didn't know at certain points
0:02:46 > 0:02:55in this, the opposition, have called for her resignation. He's refused,
0:02:55 > 0:02:59Prime Minister, Varadkar, the Taoiseach. It's supposed to come to
0:02:59 > 0:03:02a head tomorrow in the Parliament here right at the time that he
0:03:02 > 0:03:08wanted to be honing the final positions before the Brexit summit,
0:03:08 > 0:03:12the European summit in Brussels in mid-December. It's all remarkable in
0:03:12 > 0:03:26just how intense and difficult the political crisis has become.
0:03:26 > 0:03:29Time's arrow is flying in Dublin.
0:03:29 > 0:03:32A minority government could collapse tomorrow while what some are calling
0:03:32 > 0:03:36an existential question about Brexit and the border with the North needs
0:03:36 > 0:03:40answering quickly.
0:03:40 > 0:03:42And an election poll suggests would change little.
0:03:42 > 0:03:47There is no appetite for a pre-Christmas election.
0:03:47 > 0:03:49TDs, members of Parliament, went back to their
0:03:49 > 0:03:51constituencies this weekend and people were very vocal about the
0:03:51 > 0:03:57fact we don't want an election, especially on December 19, 20th.
0:03:57 > 0:03:59Can you think of a worse time for an election?
0:03:59 > 0:04:01People are deeply concerned about Brexit.
0:04:01 > 0:04:03Irish people on the ground are very alarmed about
0:04:03 > 0:04:06what's happening on the border and for the economy in Ireland.
0:04:06 > 0:04:09In these politically tense times, the
0:04:09 > 0:04:13European Union at least stands foursquare behind the government
0:04:13 > 0:04:18position on the border.
0:04:18 > 0:04:20Ready to block progress in December's EU summit.
0:04:20 > 0:04:23And on that issue of the border, the ruling party and
0:04:23 > 0:04:29opposition FINA foil are great too.
0:04:29 > 0:04:32-- are agreed too.
0:04:32 > 0:04:35If the UK insists on proceeding with this, and there isn't any
0:04:35 > 0:04:36compromise from the British government on this,
0:04:36 > 0:04:38then border controls in Northern Ireland are inevitable.
0:04:38 > 0:04:40That simply can't be countenanced, there's just
0:04:40 > 0:04:41too much at stake.
0:04:41 > 0:04:44We must have a written guarantee and if it isn't
0:04:44 > 0:04:50met, obviously, it's a condition of the trade talks
0:04:50 > 0:04:53that this would be met, then I think that would be helpful.
0:04:53 > 0:04:56I think it would be very helpful if the British government
0:04:56 > 0:05:05was willing to look at a special economic zone for Northern Ireland.
0:05:05 > 0:05:07The potential damage to the north and indeed parts of Ireland, the
0:05:07 > 0:05:09potential damage is catastrophic.
0:05:09 > 0:05:17The border between North and South runs a shade under 500 kilometres.
0:05:17 > 0:05:19People, goods, money and electricity move across it
0:05:19 > 0:05:21without let or hindrance.
0:05:21 > 0:05:23So how can this unique arrangement be preserved if the UK
0:05:23 > 0:05:29leaves the EU's economic space?
0:05:29 > 0:05:31Their hand will be significantly weakened.
0:05:31 > 0:05:35Lucinda Crichton was once Ireland's Europe minister and
0:05:35 > 0:05:40now she advises companies on Brexit.
0:05:40 > 0:05:43I think it's really interesting how robustly and strongly the rest of
0:05:43 > 0:05:47the EU has stood behind Ireland. I expect that to continue up to the
0:05:47 > 0:05:50summit. There's no question of an Irish veto. There never really has
0:05:50 > 0:05:54been a question of the Irish veto. The EU position will be determined
0:05:54 > 0:05:58by whether Dublin is happy and can accede to whatever wording is on the
0:05:58 > 0:06:01table in December and my view is that if the Irish government
0:06:01 > 0:06:04believes it's not sufficient progress, then the EU will adopt the
0:06:04 > 0:06:10same position. So, the issue of a veto won't arise. The issue will
0:06:10 > 0:06:13simply be delayed for another few months.You're in the driving seat
0:06:13 > 0:06:19then?Absolutely. On this issue. And the reason, and you know, always in
0:06:19 > 0:06:24politics tactics are important. The reason that the Irish government has
0:06:24 > 0:06:28engaged in such strong messaging and taken such a strong position on this
0:06:28 > 0:06:33in the last number of weeks in particular, is because this is the
0:06:33 > 0:06:37period of so-called maximum leverage. This is the time that the
0:06:37 > 0:06:48Irish government can really play its hand.
0:06:49 > 0:06:54Ireland's economy is deeply links to that of the United Kingdom, we're
0:06:54 > 0:06:57deeply concerned that bearing no responsibility for the United
0:06:57 > 0:06:59Kingdom removing itself from the European Union that we're going to
0:06:59 > 0:07:03suffer. And may indeed suffer a great deal more than the United
0:07:03 > 0:07:09Kingdom in terms of economic growth. In Dublin bay, that volume of trade
0:07:09 > 0:07:13moving across the Irish Sea to Britain, rather than over the border
0:07:13 > 0:07:22to the north, is obvious enough. The border issue is one that is
0:07:22 > 0:07:25elemental in Irish politics. This is a moment for Irish politicians with
0:07:25 > 0:07:31the backing of the EU to gain reassurances about a much bigger
0:07:31 > 0:07:35picture, the wider trading relationship that they want
0:07:35 > 0:07:41understandings on at this critical time in the Brexit process. If the
0:07:41 > 0:07:45border issue can be settled, it's the very depth of those ties that
0:07:45 > 0:07:50could then lead Ireland to act as an advocate of liberal EU market access
0:07:50 > 0:07:58for the UK. But that discussion seems a long way off right now.
0:07:58 > 0:08:01Mark's still with us in Dublin, and our political editor
0:08:01 > 0:08:02Nick Watt is with me.
0:08:02 > 0:08:05First back to you Mark,
0:08:05 > 0:08:08William Hague is warning tonight that any veto by the Irish
0:08:08 > 0:08:10government on this would be a grave miscalculation.
0:08:10 > 0:08:14we heard voices in your film there saying it's simply -- it simply
0:08:14 > 0:08:19won't happen. What will Leo Varadkar make of that?Well, in a sense, they
0:08:19 > 0:08:24know-it-all too well. They understand just how vulnerable
0:08:24 > 0:08:29Ireland is in this situation, particularly were it to come to that
0:08:29 > 0:08:33disaster scenario of a disorderly Brexit, ie, one without a deal in
0:08:33 > 0:08:40March 2019. They also know, by the way and it's whispered here, that in
0:08:40 > 0:08:43that disorderly Brexit scenario, EU rules lay on Ireland the
0:08:43 > 0:08:47responsibility for putting that hard border into place. So before they
0:08:47 > 0:08:52get near that kind of situation, they want to use what leverage they
0:08:52 > 0:08:57V they believe that now is the moment, because Theresa May wants to
0:08:57 > 0:09:02move the discussion on to the so-called phase two issues, get
0:09:02 > 0:09:07beyond those initial separation issues, citizens' rights, the Budget
0:09:07 > 0:09:10and the Irish border and get to the wider relationship discussions. They
0:09:10 > 0:09:13know that because of her desire to do that and the potential cost to
0:09:13 > 0:09:17the UK economy, if that doesn't happen in December, that now is the
0:09:17 > 0:09:21time to try and get the assurances they want on the border. They know
0:09:21 > 0:09:25they're not going to get a done deal on the border and that the wider
0:09:25 > 0:09:30relationship also has to be defined, but they want in the key EU words
0:09:30 > 0:09:33"sufficient progress". They want reassurances this ethere won't be a
0:09:33 > 0:09:38hard border. They also want a nod and a wink about future trade terms
0:09:38 > 0:09:42between the UK and Ireland as well. Mark, thanks very much. So Nick
0:09:42 > 0:09:47then. Briefly, the UK position on this?Well the UK is acknowledging
0:09:47 > 0:09:51this question of the Irish border is now a greater threat than the actual
0:09:51 > 0:09:56Brexit financial settlement and unless progress is made then it will
0:09:56 > 0:09:59derail UK hopes of moving to the next stage, which is talking about
0:09:59 > 0:10:03transition and talking about the future trading relationship. The UK
0:10:03 > 0:10:09is looking at some new wording, but this has got to be agreed with the
0:10:09 > 0:10:14Irish Republic and with Michel Barnier and looking in two areas:
0:10:14 > 0:10:18Reassuring Leo Varadkar by talking about where there is north/south
0:10:18 > 0:10:23cooperation. This is really serious stuff. Animal health is an
0:10:23 > 0:10:26all-Ireland issue, as is the energy market. It's talking about those air
0:10:26 > 0:10:33quaz. -- areas. There's quite a feeling, reflected in the William
0:10:33 > 0:10:37Hague article that Leo Varadkar has taken himself to the edge a cliff
0:10:37 > 0:10:40and the UK needs to walk him back to that in a way that is comfortable
0:10:40 > 0:10:47for him, but in a way that respects the key UK red line - respect the
0:10:47 > 0:10:50territorial integrity of the United Kingdom.Nick, thanks very much
0:10:50 > 0:10:55indeed. Back to Nick later.
0:10:55 > 0:10:57Sammy Wilson is Brexit spokesman for the Democratic Unionist Party -
0:10:57 > 0:11:00who, of course, have strong feelings about the future of Ireland
0:11:00 > 0:11:03and a strong voice in the debate thanks to their agreement
0:11:03 > 0:11:04with Theresa May's Government.
0:11:04 > 0:11:10Very nice of you to come in: This is a massive problem for you, just to
0:11:10 > 0:11:14work out where this border lies and what it looks like?No, it's not a
0:11:14 > 0:11:18massive problem. Don't forget this was a commitment that the UK
0:11:18 > 0:11:22Government made before we entered into any arrangement with them. They
0:11:22 > 0:11:27said that the UK would leave the EU as a whole, would have the same
0:11:27 > 0:11:31arrangements and as unionists we were happy with that.Had the same
0:11:31 > 0:11:35arrangements as you, as Ulster?That Northern Ireland would have the same
0:11:35 > 0:11:40arrangements as the rest of the UK when we left the EU.But this is,
0:11:40 > 0:11:44just help us understand it. For anyone thinking about it, it is a
0:11:44 > 0:11:49real brain pain this. Either you have, don't you, a hard border
0:11:49 > 0:11:53between Ulster and the Republic or else you have a soft border between
0:11:53 > 0:11:56those two and the UK mainland stays outside, which I know you don't
0:11:56 > 0:12:01want. Or else there has to be something that includes all three
0:12:01 > 0:12:05parts of this, which is it?To a certain extent, I know that some of
0:12:05 > 0:12:07your reports there said tonight that the EU were backing the Irish
0:12:07 > 0:12:12position. I think the Irish are being used by the EU who are trying
0:12:12 > 0:12:16to force the UK to look again at its commitment to leave the single
0:12:16 > 0:12:21market and the customs union.What do you think will happen then?First
0:12:21 > 0:12:26of all, the UK Government has put forward, in August, a very, very
0:12:26 > 0:12:30detailed position paper in which they made clear the kind of
0:12:30 > 0:12:33anningments which could be put in place to ensure that there was no
0:12:33 > 0:12:37hard border. Don't forget -You definitely don't want a hard border?
0:12:37 > 0:12:42No, we don't want a hard border. The Irish have said they don't want a
0:12:42 > 0:12:45hard border. The UK Government doesn't want a hard border. The only
0:12:45 > 0:12:50people who are pushing this now are Mr Barnier, who is really wanting to
0:12:50 > 0:12:55try and force the UK's hand on single market membership as the
0:12:55 > 0:12:59customs union.Away from the negotiations, help us envisage what
0:12:59 > 0:13:05this looks like - if it's not a hard border, then you have an ease of
0:13:05 > 0:13:09movement of goods between Ulster and the Republic. Right. If I'm a
0:13:09 > 0:13:13British firm, I could set up my headquarters now in Dublin and then
0:13:13 > 0:13:18have access through to the EU like that?And don't forget -Is that a
0:13:18 > 0:13:23yes?There's already a physical border on the island of Ireland.
0:13:23 > 0:13:27Let's take this as a template. Currently, there are goods which
0:13:27 > 0:13:31move freely across the border between Northern Ireland and the
0:13:31 > 0:13:34Irish Republic with different tax rates on them. They don't require to
0:13:34 > 0:13:37be stopped at the border -We know that. Yes, but we haven't gone
0:13:37 > 0:13:43through Brexit yet.No. Look, let me explain something. The difficulty
0:13:43 > 0:13:47which some people see is that once we leave the EU, there'll be
0:13:47 > 0:13:53different tax rates in the UK and in the Irish Republic. There'll be
0:13:53 > 0:13:58duties to be paid. That is already a situation which exists at present.
0:13:58 > 0:14:02You envisage that we would -Trade does not have to be checked on a
0:14:02 > 0:14:06day-to-day basis because what happens under trusted trader status
0:14:06 > 0:14:09because the traders invoice the goods they're going to sell in
0:14:09 > 0:14:14Northern Ireland. Then pay the tax on a awerly basis.Would the UK
0:14:14 > 0:14:19still be inside the customs union? No, it would not be.But if I wanted
0:14:19 > 0:14:24to have a head quarter of a British firm in Dublin or a Dublin firm
0:14:24 > 0:14:27wanted access to other trade deals they could just move to Belfast and
0:14:27 > 0:14:32that would be OK?Well, what would happen, the Government has led down
0:14:32 > 0:14:37-Just answer that, would that be OK? What Do You Mean you're talking
0:14:37 > 0:14:40about is an imagination where none of the rules applied and people
0:14:40 > 0:14:44could do what they wanted?No, the rules would apply. You would simply
0:14:44 > 0:14:49have a different way of tracing the trade which takes place, of
0:14:49 > 0:14:53measuring that trade. If there were taxes to be paid, paying those
0:14:53 > 0:14:56taxes, as happens at the fiscal border -- physical border at
0:14:56 > 0:15:01present.You think they would chase tariffs, chase goods?They wouldn't
0:15:01 > 0:15:06have to chase them, because you would have invoicing when the goods
0:15:06 > 0:15:09leave the Irish Republic, coming into Northern Ireland.It's a
0:15:09 > 0:15:13complete fantasy, that. They've said it absolutely makes it right for --
0:15:13 > 0:15:16ripe for smuggling and piracy. You know what people are saying about
0:15:16 > 0:15:20this?I don't think you're listening to me.I am. I'm trying to work out
0:15:20 > 0:15:27how it works in practice?It works at present. For example, if Guinness
0:15:27 > 0:15:31send a load from Dublin to Belfast - Because we're all in the customs
0:15:31 > 0:15:36union. Of course it works.No there are different tax rates when it
0:15:36 > 0:15:43comes to the UK than in the Irish epublic. -- republic. That tax has
0:15:43 > 0:15:47to be collected. You simply have an invoice that under trusted trader
0:15:47 > 0:15:52status, the business will submit and then will pay the tax on a quarterly
0:15:52 > 0:15:55basis. One of the proposals that the Government has put forward is that
0:15:55 > 0:15:5980% of the trade across the border is done by small businesses.I like
0:15:59 > 0:16:02your optimism. Let me ask you brieflyNo, you've asked me a
0:16:02 > 0:16:06question, let me answer it. 80% of the trade is done by small
0:16:06 > 0:16:10businesses.I want to move -That would be exempt and regarded as
0:16:10 > 0:16:13local trade not international trade so there'll be no restrictions on
0:16:13 > 0:16:17it.I'd be interested to hear what our political editor thinks of that.
0:16:17 > 0:16:19If you're suggesting something that you think is going to go through,
0:16:19 > 0:16:23we'll see it in practiceThose are the proposals that the Government
0:16:23 > 0:16:28has put. They've simply been dismissed without any thought of the
0:16:28 > 0:16:31Irish Government on the EU because they seem intent on making this an
0:16:31 > 0:16:40issue which is doesn't need to be made.Thank you very much.
0:16:40 > 0:16:45Picking up on that, is that a realistic budget?Possibly in the
0:16:45 > 0:16:49future but I think the view of the EU is that this is a huge challenge
0:16:49 > 0:16:56that needs a huge answer is about what the relationship is going to be
0:16:56 > 0:17:00in the context of the Good Friday Agreement. Things like the trusted
0:17:00 > 0:17:04trader status, electronic mapping. Maybe you can have that at some time
0:17:04 > 0:17:08in the future when you have a future trade relationship between the UK
0:17:08 > 0:17:15and the EU embedded.A quick word on the Brexit papers, as we are calling
0:17:15 > 0:17:20them, rumblings with Keir Starmer. The Shadow Brokers executor is
0:17:20 > 0:17:24saying that David Davies is arguably in contempt of the house because
0:17:24 > 0:17:27these papers have been released to the Brexit select committee but in
0:17:27 > 0:17:32heavily redacted terms. David Davies says that is because it is
0:17:32 > 0:17:37commercially sensitive and they don't want to do things that harm
0:17:37 > 0:17:42the negotiations. Keir Starmer said that they were meant to be posted in
0:17:42 > 0:17:48their entirety.Thank you very much.
0:17:48 > 0:17:50Meghan Markle gave her first television interview
0:17:50 > 0:17:53since her engagement to Prince Harry to the BBC this evening, and in one
0:17:53 > 0:17:55fell swoop she wowed a nation.
0:17:55 > 0:17:57Confident, articulate, and unafraid to express her emotion.
0:17:57 > 0:18:00She reassured many she was her own person and already had an easy
0:18:00 > 0:18:01relationship with her husband to be.
0:18:01 > 0:18:05This is how the couple described the moment Prince Harry proposed.
0:18:05 > 0:18:07It was, what were we doing, just roasting chicken?
0:18:07 > 0:18:09Roasting a chicken, trying to roast a chicken.
0:18:09 > 0:18:13And it just, just an amazing surprise.
0:18:13 > 0:18:16It was so sweet and natural and very romantic.
0:18:16 > 0:18:19He got on one knee.
0:18:19 > 0:18:21She's already a celebrity in her own right, of course.
0:18:21 > 0:18:24An actress and an American.
0:18:24 > 0:18:27And she's described her pride at being in her words a "strong,
0:18:27 > 0:18:29confident, mixed-race woman".
0:18:29 > 0:18:32Last year Kensington Palace issued a statement which revealed how
0:18:32 > 0:18:37worried Prince Harry had been about the wave of abuse
0:18:37 > 0:18:39and harassment Meghan had faced from some quarters
0:18:39 > 0:18:40when their relationship began.
0:18:40 > 0:18:45It pointed to the racial undertones of comment pieces,
0:18:45 > 0:18:48the sexism and racism of social media trolls, the smear on the front
0:18:48 > 0:18:51page of a national newspaper.
0:18:51 > 0:18:55In a 2015 piece for Elle Magazine, Meghan Markle herself wrote
0:18:55 > 0:18:58of her own difficulties in the past with describing her ethnicity.
0:18:58 > 0:19:01Her words here are spoken by an actor.
0:19:01 > 0:19:04There was a mandatory census I had to complete in my English class.
0:19:04 > 0:19:08You had to check one of the boxes to indicate your ethnicity.
0:19:08 > 0:19:13White, black, Hispanic or Asian.
0:19:13 > 0:19:15There I was, my curly hair, my freckled face, my pale
0:19:15 > 0:19:17skin, my mixed race.
0:19:17 > 0:19:20Looking down at these boxes, not wanting to mess up
0:19:20 > 0:19:24but not knowing what to do.
0:19:24 > 0:19:27You could only choose one but that would be to choose one parent over
0:19:27 > 0:19:29the other and one half of myself over the other.
0:19:29 > 0:19:32My teacher told me to check the box for Caucasian,
0:19:32 > 0:19:38"Because that's how you look, Meghan" she said.
0:19:38 > 0:19:41I put down my pen, not as an act of defiance but rather
0:19:41 > 0:19:43a symptom of my confusion.
0:19:43 > 0:19:46So what does this wedding tell us about Britain now?
0:19:46 > 0:19:49Does it feel like a watershed moment for those of mixed heritage?
0:19:49 > 0:19:51Or is it anachronistic to even think it matters any more?
0:19:51 > 0:19:56Joining me now are the Guardian columnist Georgina Lawton,
0:19:56 > 0:20:00Charlie Brinkhurst-Cuff of gal-dem, an online magazine
0:20:00 > 0:20:02for women of colour - and with us from Madrid
0:20:02 > 0:20:03is the presenter Amal Fashanu.
0:20:03 > 0:20:11Thank you for joining us. Is it a moment for you?Personally I think
0:20:11 > 0:20:16it is a moment. For me, I grew up in Spain and went to school and a log
0:20:16 > 0:20:22of what Meghan was saying, I really identified with. The fact that she's
0:20:22 > 0:20:27standing out, saying she is mixed race, for me it helps me a lot. I've
0:20:27 > 0:20:31been in many occasions at school, exactly what she describes, I don't
0:20:31 > 0:20:34know who I was, why do I have to choose, do I have to be white or
0:20:34 > 0:20:44black? If I want to straighten my hair and I'm all white? It is a big
0:20:44 > 0:20:50deal. -- and I am more white. People have said it shouldn't be a big eel
0:20:50 > 0:20:54but it is, for people who are mixed race I think this is a big step
0:20:54 > 0:20:59forward. -- shouldn't be a big deal. I'm over the moon, I couldn't be
0:20:59 > 0:21:05happier.Does it feel like a big deal for you, is it important to
0:21:05 > 0:21:10talk about being mixed race without being one thing or the other?To a
0:21:10 > 0:21:13degree but when it comes to the representation of mixed race and
0:21:13 > 0:21:18black people we have to remember that extra race people are the
0:21:18 > 0:21:23acceptable face of blackness already. And that's why we are
0:21:23 > 0:21:28fetishised by the elite. So I'm not that excited at the prospect of
0:21:28 > 0:21:33Meghan Markle marrying Prince Harry, because I'm aware of the nuances
0:21:33 > 0:21:40around it and I suppose there is a long way to go when it comes to the
0:21:40 > 0:21:44representation of black people, mixed race people, in general.Does
0:21:44 > 0:21:50this confuse you, as a Republican? It does, I found it quite funny
0:21:50 > 0:21:54because a lot of my black peers are very excited by everything that's
0:21:54 > 0:22:00going on today whereas I think we should abolish the monarchy! Let's
0:22:00 > 0:22:05bring an end to it all.Georgina, could it have that effect, could it
0:22:05 > 0:22:10bring more people of colour towards the monarchy?Definitely, I think
0:22:10 > 0:22:15it's going to make the royal family Morgan 11 and I think it's important
0:22:15 > 0:22:21to have greater representation of mixed race people in the UK. -- more
0:22:21 > 0:22:28representative. We are held up as a beacon of a post-racial society and
0:22:28 > 0:22:34Meghan's closeness to the Palace destroys the notion that to be regal
0:22:34 > 0:22:38or accept it you must be white. It's interesting that we have someone
0:22:38 > 0:22:45close to the Palace like Meghan and it's exciting times.It is a huge
0:22:45 > 0:22:49burden on a young woman's shoulders to think she's suddenly carrying all
0:22:49 > 0:22:56these expectations with her in this new role.To be honest with you I
0:22:56 > 0:23:02think she's going to be great. Can you hear me, sorry?Yes.I think
0:23:02 > 0:23:06she's going to be a great role model and I think we don't have anyone who
0:23:06 > 0:23:11is mixed race in the Royal family until now and look, it's something
0:23:11 > 0:23:15positive. I understand there's a lot of work to be done but any step is a
0:23:15 > 0:23:20good step. The fact that she stood up and said she doesn't have to
0:23:20 > 0:23:25choose who she is, she can be mixed race, it gives a lot of mixed race
0:23:25 > 0:23:28girls the chance to just be mixed race, you don't have to be white or
0:23:28 > 0:23:34black, you are simply mixed race. Can I come in on that? It's
0:23:34 > 0:23:40interesting because I know that growing up I really resisted being
0:23:40 > 0:23:43calledblack, I strongly identified with being mixed race and not being
0:23:43 > 0:23:49one or the other but as I got older I realised a lot of the reasons I
0:23:49 > 0:23:52felt I did not want to be called Black is because I had internalised
0:23:52 > 0:23:58anti-blackness. That's why we have to be careful when we discussed
0:23:58 > 0:24:02that, as mixed race people, the reason why we don't want to be
0:24:02 > 0:24:06identified as black even know that ceremony people see us, and not tied
0:24:06 > 0:24:14up with our own prejudices?Do you agree with that?Sorry to interrupt.
0:24:14 > 0:24:19Personally I don't agree, I think you know, I've never wanted to be
0:24:19 > 0:24:24not called black or white. My mum is white and my father is black and
0:24:24 > 0:24:30white embrace both races -- and I embrace both races, so why do I need
0:24:30 > 0:24:36to choose?I don't think you have do, I think that's the beautiful
0:24:36 > 0:24:41thing about being mixed race.It was an interesting phrase, you talked
0:24:41 > 0:24:46about the acceptable face of a woman of colour. If she had identified as
0:24:46 > 0:24:51black or if she was black?If she was darker skinned it is unlikely
0:24:51 > 0:24:56she'd be marrying Prince Harry.This is uncomfortable territory. If
0:24:56 > 0:25:01Harry, let's say, was next in line to the throne, do you think there
0:25:01 > 0:25:04would have been more racism that would have surfaced? Would it have
0:25:04 > 0:25:10been harder?I definitely think there would have been. People who
0:25:10 > 0:25:14are commenting on the issue and saying we don't need to discuss it,
0:25:14 > 0:25:17it's just two people falling in love, you only need to look at his
0:25:17 > 0:25:21statement last year, them in the racial undertones of the press
0:25:21 > 0:25:25coverage, going through the horrific Twitter comments on the article is
0:25:25 > 0:25:31about the relationship and about the marriage being announced to see that
0:25:31 > 0:25:35we don't live in a post-racial society and we need greater
0:25:35 > 0:25:39representation of extra race people and greater proximity to Buckingham
0:25:39 > 0:25:44Palace will promote cultural change. Let me give you the last word.I
0:25:44 > 0:25:50totally agree with that. You know, it is opening up the conversation.
0:25:50 > 0:25:58Yeah, fair enough, if Harry was next in line, you know, maybe it would be
0:25:58 > 0:26:02more important or maybe she would have suffered more abuse but I don't
0:26:02 > 0:26:07think it wouldn't have happened. I think that love conquers all, we are
0:26:07 > 0:26:12in 2018 and they prove it. We have a very modern royal family which is
0:26:12 > 0:26:23great.Thank you for joining us.
0:26:23 > 0:26:25The eighth round of Syrian peace talks begins tomorrow.
0:26:25 > 0:26:30Syria's government will not attend.
0:26:30 > 0:26:33This long, bloody and seemingly intractable civil war has now been
0:26:33 > 0:26:34going on six years.
0:26:34 > 0:26:36You could be forgiven for having lost
0:26:36 > 0:26:38your way in the twists and turns of this conflict.
0:26:38 > 0:26:40A brief reminder then of how we got here.
0:26:40 > 0:26:43The pro-democracy protests of the Arab Spring erupted in 2011.
0:26:43 > 0:26:44Security forces opened fire on demonstrators
0:26:44 > 0:26:47and by the end of that year, the violence had escalated
0:26:47 > 0:26:48into war.
0:26:48 > 0:26:50Casualties are estimated to be over 400000 and the UN
0:26:50 > 0:26:52believes there are some 5 million Syrian refugees.
0:26:52 > 0:26:55The unrest allowed the so-called Islamic State to rise
0:26:55 > 0:27:00in the region.
0:27:00 > 0:27:02By 2015, the country was split between the government,
0:27:02 > 0:27:05anti-government forces and Isis.
0:27:05 > 0:27:09One of the bloodiest battles centred around Aleppo.
0:27:09 > 0:27:11Government forces surrounded the rebel-held city.
0:27:11 > 0:27:15Ordinary civilians, unable to escape.
0:27:15 > 0:27:17Many starved until an evacuation corridor was agreed.
0:27:17 > 0:27:21Since then, Isis has been in retreat.
0:27:21 > 0:27:23The Assad regime in the ascendant but there are areas still
0:27:23 > 0:27:24held by the rebels.
0:27:24 > 0:27:34One is eastern Ghouta, just east of Damascus,
0:27:34 > 0:27:36where there are fears that another Aleppo-style crisis could emerge.
0:27:36 > 0:27:37Mike Thomson reports.
0:27:37 > 0:27:39We should warn you that his film features
0:27:39 > 0:27:42distressing scenes which some may find upsetting.
0:27:42 > 0:27:50Many believe the war in Syria is now virtually over.
0:27:50 > 0:27:57Try telling that to the people of bombed and besieged eastern Ghouta.
0:27:57 > 0:28:07This has been the area's last two weeks.
0:28:07 > 0:28:10A senior UN spokesman has called what's been happening an
0:28:10 > 0:28:11outrage.
0:28:11 > 0:28:13Casualty figures are impossible to verify given the siege
0:28:13 > 0:28:16situation.
0:28:16 > 0:28:19But they've evidently been mounting steadily.
0:28:19 > 0:28:27We have more than 121 civilians.
0:28:27 > 0:28:30Killed and 905 injuries by 336 air strikes and 2450
0:28:30 > 0:28:36mortars.
0:28:36 > 0:28:40That's all in only ten days.
0:28:40 > 0:28:44The Syrian government claims they are responding to an attack by
0:28:44 > 0:28:49rebel forces on a military base in Ghouta but residents there say they
0:28:49 > 0:28:54are the ones in the crosshairs.
0:28:54 > 0:28:55TRANSLATION:These missiles were targeted at civilians.
0:28:55 > 0:28:57We don't understand why they keep aiming at
0:28:57 > 0:28:59civilians.
0:28:59 > 0:29:01Behind me you can see an example of this.
0:29:01 > 0:29:03A whole family, a mother and her four children died
0:29:03 > 0:29:06there.
0:29:06 > 0:29:11We found them in pieces under the rubble.
0:29:11 > 0:29:18Eastern Ghouta has known horrors before.
0:29:18 > 0:29:21In August, 2013, it was the site of a sarin gas attack
0:29:21 > 0:29:22by Syrian government forces.
0:29:22 > 0:29:25Hundreds died.
0:29:25 > 0:29:27Now, locals claim, similar tactics are being used
0:29:27 > 0:29:31against them again.
0:29:31 > 0:29:33Three days ago the regime has targeted our brothers
0:29:33 > 0:29:35with chlorine gas in Harasta.
0:29:35 > 0:29:42There are no deadly weapons that we haven't been targeted with.
0:29:42 > 0:29:44You who are listening to me, what more are
0:29:44 > 0:29:45you waiting for?
0:29:45 > 0:29:46Our extermination?
0:29:46 > 0:29:49There is nothing we can do.
0:29:49 > 0:29:54A doctor at Dummar hospital in eastern Ghouta
0:29:54 > 0:29:59tells me he's seen signs that back up such claims.
0:29:59 > 0:30:03Yes actually we had several casualties in Harasta where
0:30:03 > 0:30:10there was a chemical attack took place.
0:30:10 > 0:30:14We have signs of phosphorus material were used.
0:30:14 > 0:30:17We can't tell the material because we don't have
0:30:17 > 0:30:25the analysis but from the signs we can say
0:30:25 > 0:30:27that it is phosphoral gas.
0:30:27 > 0:30:30The evidence, he says, was plain to see with many patients suffering
0:30:30 > 0:30:34from severe breathing difficulties after air strikes.
0:30:34 > 0:30:36Malnutrition is another killer in this long besieged
0:30:36 > 0:30:38area.
0:30:38 > 0:30:43Few will forget this photo, taken last month.
0:30:43 > 0:30:48The baby died soon after.
0:30:48 > 0:30:51It's very widespread now.
0:30:51 > 0:30:54We have very large number of children.
0:30:54 > 0:30:57From one statistic we have around 30% of children have malnutrition
0:30:57 > 0:31:06from severe or moderate.
0:31:06 > 0:31:09Two relief convoys were allowed into eastern
0:31:09 > 0:31:15Ghouta recently but the missile hit the roof of a food warehouse and
0:31:15 > 0:31:18destroyed much of the aid they brought in.
0:31:18 > 0:31:21And this man told me he and many others see little point in
0:31:21 > 0:31:27sending in any more.
0:31:27 > 0:31:32If the United Nations get or enters every day, aid
0:31:32 > 0:31:37convoys, that will not be enough for the people
0:31:37 > 0:31:42here and people demand to
0:31:42 > 0:31:45break the siege and open the crossing of eastern Ghouta, not to
0:31:45 > 0:31:50have aid.
0:31:50 > 0:31:52Some see a parallel here with another formerly besieged
0:31:52 > 0:31:53rebel enclave.
0:31:53 > 0:31:56The regime seems to be following a strategy in
0:31:56 > 0:31:59Ghouta similar to what it followed in eastern Aleppo, a strategy of
0:31:59 > 0:32:05besiegement and starvation followed by heavy bombardment.
0:32:05 > 0:32:08Yesterday, 23 more people are reported to have died in the latest
0:32:08 > 0:32:13air attack by Syrian government planes.
0:32:13 > 0:32:16And with winter closing in, bitter cold will be added to the
0:32:16 > 0:32:17growing casualties.
0:32:17 > 0:32:21Malnutrition and lack of fuel and medicines.
0:32:21 > 0:32:26There are children here, there are women
0:32:26 > 0:32:31here, there are 400,000 people in this small place in the world.
0:32:31 > 0:32:34Nobody is talking about them.
0:32:34 > 0:32:38All of the world will regret not doing
0:32:38 > 0:32:39anything when the worst will happen.
0:32:39 > 0:32:43There is hope.
0:32:43 > 0:32:47Peace talks are due to begin in Geneva tomorrow and
0:32:47 > 0:32:52today, Russia called for a ceasefire to be imposed in eastern Ghouta.
0:32:52 > 0:32:55But with government forces seemingly determined to retake this shrinking
0:32:55 > 0:32:58rebel enclave, its people may need to see it before
0:32:58 > 0:33:04they believe it.
0:33:04 > 0:33:06Joining me now Panos Mountzsis, UN's Regional Humanitarian Coordinator
0:33:06 > 0:33:09for the Syria crisis.
0:33:09 > 0:33:12He's in Amman in Jordan tonight and joins us on Skype.
0:33:12 > 0:33:16How does this compare to Aleppo?
0:33:20 > 0:33:23We have seen the horrific scenes in the film. How on the ground does
0:33:23 > 0:33:30this compare to what happened in Aleppo?The situation is really
0:33:30 > 0:33:36extreme in terms of military needs. In terms of civilians, people being
0:33:36 > 0:33:44caught up in extreme situations, (inaudible) Civilians are being
0:33:44 > 0:33:54caught up in the situation. (Inaudible) in the last two weeks or
0:33:54 > 0:33:59several months, I would say, going recently from Raqqa itself,
0:33:59 > 0:34:05including the last few days, looking at actually multiple locations where
0:34:05 > 0:34:08civilians have been caught up and lost their lives. So that's really a
0:34:08 > 0:34:15huge concern from us. But also, in terms of the humanitarian need, and
0:34:15 > 0:34:19assistance, looking at malnutrition, we were there with a convoy about 11
0:34:19 > 0:34:25days ago. A number of children are severely malnourished. We have close
0:34:25 > 0:34:31to 500 cases of people who need to be Medically evacuated out of
0:34:31 > 0:34:35Ghouta. Sadly every day we get reports of several of them who lose
0:34:35 > 0:34:41their lights because the evacuations do not take place. Very importantly,
0:34:41 > 0:34:45the need to urgently be able to provide humanitarian assistance to
0:34:45 > 0:34:51people who are besieged. There is over 420,000 Syrians who are
0:34:51 > 0:34:56besieged at the moment in Ghouta in an extreme situation.Clearly your
0:34:56 > 0:34:59concentration is what's happening on the ground. When you look to the
0:34:59 > 0:35:03Peace Talks tomorrow, which Damascus will not attend, do you see any
0:35:03 > 0:35:11relief coming from there?Well, the need for peace, the need for
0:35:11 > 0:35:17stability is really of huge urgency, a conflict on its sixth year with
0:35:17 > 0:35:21huge impact. On the ground there is more than six million internally
0:35:21 > 0:35:26displaced people. Just this year, we have had an average of close to
0:35:26 > 0:35:307,000 people leaving their homes every day since January 1, because
0:35:30 > 0:35:34of the insecurity. More than five million refugees in the neighbouring
0:35:34 > 0:35:39countries. More than 13 million people who are in need of life
0:35:39 > 0:35:42saving humanitarian assistance. So the Peace Talks really are
0:35:42 > 0:35:46desperately needed to bring some stability on the ground.Thank you
0:35:46 > 0:35:50very much indeed. Thank you for joining us.
0:35:50 > 0:35:53It was 11 long months ago that the Prime Minister first
0:35:53 > 0:35:55launched her vision of an industrial strategy -
0:35:55 > 0:36:00a more hands-on approach by Government to a part
0:36:00 > 0:36:02of the economy her conservative predecessors would have been much
0:36:02 > 0:36:04happier to let the market dictate.
0:36:04 > 0:36:07Today, we saw it - intervention in to boost growth
0:36:07 > 0:36:08in four key sectors - construction, life
0:36:08 > 0:36:10sciences, automotive, and artificial intelligence.
0:36:10 > 0:36:13The announcement came with news of a major new investment
0:36:13 > 0:36:14from the healthcare firm MSD.
0:36:14 > 0:36:16Labour has condemned the strategy as reannounced policies
0:36:16 > 0:36:20and old spending commitments.
0:36:20 > 0:36:22So does it stack up?
0:36:22 > 0:36:24And can a policy on industry ever actually work?
0:36:24 > 0:36:29Here's Helen Thomas.
0:36:29 > 0:36:31There is a long history of governments trying
0:36:31 > 0:36:34to put their stamp on the economy.
0:36:34 > 0:36:36The rationalisation of industry in the 1930s, nationalisation
0:36:36 > 0:36:43a few decades later.
0:36:43 > 0:36:45Archive:
0:36:45 > 0:36:48The Britain that is going to be born in the white heat of this revolution
0:36:48 > 0:36:51will be no place for restrictive practices or for outdated methods
0:36:51 > 0:36:52on either side of industry.
0:36:52 > 0:36:54Then, privatisation.
0:36:54 > 0:36:57Three and a half years ago, defenders of the status quo tried to
0:36:57 > 0:37:05ban denationalisation as irrelevant.
0:37:05 > 0:37:09How absurd it would seem in a few years' time for the state to run
0:37:09 > 0:37:15Pickfords removals and Gleneagles Hotel.
0:37:15 > 0:37:18And here's the latest iteration.
0:37:18 > 0:37:20The future is unfolding before our very eyes.
0:37:20 > 0:37:26New technology is creating new industries are changing
0:37:26 > 0:37:28interesting ones and transforming the way that we live our lives.
0:37:28 > 0:37:32We need to ensure that we are well prepared to prosper in this future.
0:37:32 > 0:37:35It's been a long time since any government tried to put industrial
0:37:35 > 0:37:41strategy at the centre of strategy.
0:37:41 > 0:37:42The problems frankly are rather familiar.
0:37:42 > 0:37:47Ailing productivity, stagnant wages, a London-centric economy.
0:37:47 > 0:37:52And so are some of the solutions, skills, infrastructure, digital.
0:37:52 > 0:37:55So what determines if this is another helping of government
0:37:55 > 0:38:01jargon or is the basis of a long-term overhaul?
0:38:01 > 0:38:03One criteria for success will be whether the benefits
0:38:03 > 0:38:08are genuinely spread around.
0:38:08 > 0:38:13The main problem we have pain related to colonoscopy.
0:38:13 > 0:38:17Work at Leeds University ticks a lot of government boxes.
0:38:17 > 0:38:22This colonoscopy robot could mean a pain-free experience for patients.
0:38:22 > 0:38:28High-tech robotics solving real life health problems and outside London.
0:38:28 > 0:38:32It would be as easy as playing a video game.
0:38:32 > 0:38:35This robot finds and fixes potholes.
0:38:35 > 0:38:38It's come out of the national robotics facility in Leeds but only
0:38:38 > 0:38:42about 10% of research spending goes to the north of the country.
0:38:42 > 0:38:43And the bulk of planned infrastructure is
0:38:43 > 0:38:46earmarked for the South.
0:38:46 > 0:38:51Some see benefits from money being spent more widely.
0:38:51 > 0:38:53I think it's great that the government is recognising that
0:38:53 > 0:38:55excellence is across the entire UK.
0:38:55 > 0:38:57Every part of the UK has been to offer, be it
0:38:57 > 0:38:59through research, training, skills.
0:38:59 > 0:39:00I think that's important.
0:39:00 > 0:39:04Here at Leeds and I think we are a good example of a success
0:39:04 > 0:39:07story where investment has come in, it's made a massive difference,
0:39:07 > 0:39:09not just to the university but more widely, also the region.
0:39:09 > 0:39:12When it comes to sectors, every government has its favourites.
0:39:12 > 0:39:15But focusing on the biggest or most advanced may not
0:39:15 > 0:39:18yield the best result.
0:39:18 > 0:39:2360% of jobs are at firms with productivity below the UK average.
0:39:23 > 0:39:26Many in services.
0:39:26 > 0:39:31About 40 times as many people work in retail as in pharmaceuticals.
0:39:31 > 0:39:33The UK has a huge productivity problem.
0:39:33 > 0:39:36Sectors such as retail, tourism and hospitality,
0:39:36 > 0:39:38like manufacturing, that's where our productivity is much less
0:39:38 > 0:39:43than that of our major competitors in Europe and the United States.
0:39:43 > 0:39:47What we need to see in an industrial strategy is a focus on those sectors
0:39:47 > 0:39:50and not always on the frontier sectors that are the sexy ones
0:39:50 > 0:39:55for government announcements.
0:39:55 > 0:39:59So, good industrial strategy needs to be about Leeds as well as London,
0:39:59 > 0:40:04shopping as well as a science but it also needs to do something simpler.
0:40:04 > 0:40:06It needs to last.
0:40:06 > 0:40:10This stalwart of British retail started here in 1884
0:40:10 > 0:40:12and to be successful, industrial strategy also
0:40:12 > 0:40:16needs to go the distance.
0:40:16 > 0:40:17No chopping, no changing.
0:40:17 > 0:40:21This needs to survive a new Business Minister,
0:40:21 > 0:40:23a new Prime Minister and yes, successive governments,
0:40:23 > 0:40:28meaning cross-party support.
0:40:28 > 0:40:30My biggest concern about the strategy is that it
0:40:30 > 0:40:32won't necessarily be embedded over the long-term.
0:40:32 > 0:40:37They are recommending an advisory council.
0:40:37 > 0:40:40It's a different arrangement from the Office for Budget Responsibility
0:40:40 > 0:40:43for example which is an obvious analogue where it has
0:40:43 > 0:40:47independent experts, its own staff and budget.
0:40:47 > 0:40:52There's nothing like that so there's nothing to stop the seesaw in policy
0:40:52 > 0:40:55that we've seen so often in the past that's been incredibly damaging.
0:40:55 > 0:40:59Will today's government blueprint still be thought useful or relevant
0:40:59 > 0:41:04in 20 or 30 years' time?
0:41:08 > 0:41:11Let's briefly whiz you through the front pages. There's happy smiles on
0:41:11 > 0:41:12the front
0:41:12 > 0:41:14front pages. There's happy smiles on the front of the Daily Mail.The
0:41:14 > 0:41:17stars were all aligned, this beautiful woman just fell into my
0:41:17 > 0:41:23life. A radiant Markle and Harry there. The Daily Mirror has
0:41:23 > 0:41:28something similar. "She tripped and fell into my life" a line from the
0:41:28 > 0:41:32BBC interview this afternoon. He surprised her on one knee as he
0:41:32 > 0:41:37tooked her roast chicken. The Guardian has the MPs fury over
0:41:37 > 0:41:41edited Brexit impact report. Davis in context risk as politically
0:41:41 > 0:41:44embarrassing facts are level out of studies that. Was the story that
0:41:44 > 0:41:49Nick brought us earlier. A story at the bottom that John Profumo, the
0:41:49 > 0:41:52Conservative minister who resigned over the sex scandal in the 60s, had
0:41:52 > 0:41:56previously had a long running relationship with a glamorous Nazi
0:41:56 > 0:41:57spy.
0:41:57 > 0:41:59That's all we've got time for this evening.
0:41:59 > 0:42:02No doubt you've spent the whole day watching the wall to wall coverage
0:42:02 > 0:42:04of Meghan Markle's engagement to Prince Harry.
0:42:04 > 0:42:06An all around feel good story you might think?
0:42:06 > 0:42:09Well, not if you've watched the drama Ms Markle used to act in.
0:42:09 > 0:42:11Fans of Suits will know that, somewhere out there,
0:42:11 > 0:42:14there's a lawyer called Mike who may well be crying his eyes out.
0:42:14 > 0:42:17Good night.
0:42:17 > 0:42:19MUSIC: "Best Thing I Never Had" - Beyonce
0:42:19 > 0:42:21# What goes around comes back around
0:42:21 > 0:42:22# Hey my baby
0:42:22 > 0:42:25# I say what goes around comes back around
0:42:25 > 0:42:32# Hey my baby
0:42:32 > 0:42:34# I say what goes around comes back around
0:42:34 > 0:42:36# Hey my baby
0:42:36 > 0:42:40# there was...Don't talk to me. A time.
0:42:40 > 0:42:45# I thought that you did everything right
0:42:45 > 0:42:50# No lies, no wrong
0:42:50 > 0:42:56# Boy I, must've been outta my mind
0:42:56 > 0:43:01# So when I think of the time that I almost loved you
0:43:01 > 0:43:08# You showed your ass and I, I saw the real you
0:43:08 > 0:43:14# Thank God you blew it Was it romantic?
0:43:14 > 0:43:17# Thank God I dodged the bullet