:00:00. > :00:00.Ireland and experts on hand to analyse the latest assembly results.
:00:00. > :00:09.We can go to them to get up to speed. People have picked up on this
:00:10. > :00:15.as one of the lines of the day, because it sums up the brutal nature
:00:16. > :00:19.of politics. Danny Kennedy, not expected to lose his seat, but he
:00:20. > :00:24.has gone. He feared he was going to lose it. That is why he was so quick
:00:25. > :00:26.out of the traps to say that Mike Nesbitt should not have said what he
:00:27. > :00:51.said about transferrin. It was clear that he had been given
:00:52. > :00:59.transfers before, but I should say, I got something wrong earlier when I
:01:00. > :01:04.said she had worked in his office. That was not so. I don't know how my
:01:05. > :01:18.source got that wrong. But I got that wrong. Hopefully a minor point.
:01:19. > :01:24.One of those things you pick up. Thanks to our viewers who have
:01:25. > :01:26.joined us from the BBC News Channel, this is our continued coverage of
:01:27. > :01:40.the Northern Ireland assembly elections. Thanks for being with us.
:01:41. > :01:44.What have you made of what has been happening in the last couple of
:01:45. > :01:51.hours? Keeping a very close eye on developments. How is the picture
:01:52. > :01:57.filling out? I genuinely did not see the Lord Morrow elimination coming.
:01:58. > :02:04.And if you considered the three Sinn Fein seats there now, that is really
:02:05. > :02:13.quite a big statement. By the Sinn Fein party. Their gonna leaders of
:02:14. > :02:20.unionism who were a bit shocked. Mike Nesbitt looked very weary of it
:02:21. > :02:25.all. It looked like he was relieved to be resigning, and I think
:02:26. > :02:31.possibly because of the Lord Morrow elimination and possibly because the
:02:32. > :02:35.election was more brutal than even she thought it would be, Arlene
:02:36. > :02:40.Foster looked a bit in shock when she was giving her accept and
:02:41. > :02:45.speech. There wasn't a single mention of Sinn Fein anywhere in it
:02:46. > :02:49.-- acceptance. She has declined to be interviewed by the BBC so far,
:02:50. > :02:54.but we're hoping she will talk to us tomorrow. She has opted to go home
:02:55. > :03:04.without giving a detailed interview to the BBC. Uncharacteristic. I do
:03:05. > :03:11.find it strange. She gave an interview to the TV in Ireland. The
:03:12. > :03:17.DUP are hurting tonight and they will regroup. If Mike Nesbitt had
:03:18. > :03:22.not resigned we would be talking more about her position, but
:03:23. > :03:27.politics is a rough trade. It is a dirty and rough business and we saw
:03:28. > :03:31.today how rough it can get. The DUP were surprised by how rough it has
:03:32. > :03:38.got. What about Mike Nesbitt's decision to go? I mentioned the
:03:39. > :03:41.political editor 15 years ago, you work with Mike Nesbitt in this
:03:42. > :03:46.building, as to die, over many years. Were you surprised that he
:03:47. > :03:54.launched that pre-emptive strike and fell on his sword? -- as did I.
:03:55. > :03:58.Earlier than maybe he had to, because people were surprised he did
:03:59. > :04:03.it so quickly. The results are not good but not as bad as it might have
:04:04. > :04:07.been. At this stage. There is a view that it is very bad, he did a bad
:04:08. > :04:11.election the last time and here he is facing the DUP under pressure.
:04:12. > :04:17.Arlene Foster is the goalkeeper and he has the penalty kick and he
:04:18. > :04:23.misses the door. You think he had to go? Yes. When he realised himself he
:04:24. > :04:27.was going to go, is Basic instinct were as a journalist and he wanted
:04:28. > :04:31.to get to the punch line first bash his basic instinct.
:04:32. > :04:37.But then maybe you could get all 18 counts finished and then make an
:04:38. > :04:41.announcement tomorrow, or Sunday. But to do it when people are still
:04:42. > :04:48.fighting for seats within his party, that seemed a little bit previous.
:04:49. > :04:52.Yes, it looks like that, but I think the devastation that he probably was
:04:53. > :04:58.feeling having made no headway against the DUP under such pressure,
:04:59. > :05:00.and watching the Alliance party, it will not be making headway in terms
:05:01. > :05:06.of seats, but they have the same number of seats as they had before
:05:07. > :05:12.it all started. I think the nature of Mike, I've known him 30 years and
:05:13. > :05:17.he just wanted to be rid of this. He will be staying on until they decide
:05:18. > :05:20.what they want to do, and that is a huge moment for the Ulster Unionist
:05:21. > :05:25.Party and I don't think they will take that decision quickly. I want
:05:26. > :05:33.to talk to Peter Wear who is the former education minister.
:05:34. > :05:42.Congratulations to you. You had a bit of a gamble. You did not think
:05:43. > :05:45.you could hold onto your seat, but you moved to where you thought you
:05:46. > :05:55.could win a seat and the gamble has paid off. Facing a fresh challenge,
:05:56. > :06:00.moving from a different number of seats created problems for all
:06:01. > :06:05.parties, but I'm delighted that the people here have placed their trust
:06:06. > :06:11.in me and I hope to repay them. Everybody thought it was a tall
:06:12. > :06:15.order for the DUP to have three outgoing ministers in the battle for
:06:16. > :06:21.seats and to hold them, but you have done that, that's a very good result
:06:22. > :06:30.for the DUP in Strangford. You have got one and so have the Alliance
:06:31. > :06:39.party and the Ulster Unionist Party. You are pleased with our
:06:40. > :06:45.performance. How did you do overall? Sometimes, this is the group of
:06:46. > :06:50.death, you might refer to it, like in the football World Cup. It was a
:06:51. > :06:55.mixed picture, we succeeded in some areas but we are disappointed to
:06:56. > :06:59.lose some great colleagues. And I commiserate with anyone who has lost
:07:00. > :07:02.a seat, it is very tough. Politics can be very brutal, but there is
:07:03. > :07:10.great talent which has been lost to the assembly through the election.
:07:11. > :07:11.That is quite sad. I want to talk about Mike Nesbitt and his decision
:07:12. > :07:28.to resign. Mike has got to make his own
:07:29. > :07:36.decision, think about what happens in the internal mechanism. I wish
:07:37. > :07:42.him well for the future. I wish him well but I don't know what he sees
:07:43. > :07:47.as his future. Maybe this is an opportunity for unionism to come
:07:48. > :07:49.together. We have seen a brutal and action, and one of the
:07:50. > :07:58.disappointments many Unionists will see is that we did not maximise our
:07:59. > :08:02.seats. That is something that we do need to tackle. And also see how
:08:03. > :08:09.best we can move things forward in Northern Ireland. Do you feel Mike
:08:10. > :08:12.Nesbitt's pain this evening? He has been leader five years and he made
:08:13. > :08:17.the claims in this election but he didn't deliver on them and he has
:08:18. > :08:23.now fallen on his sword. There is a personal price in these
:08:24. > :08:26.circumstances. To be fair, we can look at politicians and I know
:08:27. > :08:32.sometimes people can castigate them, but there is a personal life behind
:08:33. > :08:38.that. Family life. It can take a toll on families. I've great
:08:39. > :08:43.personal sympathy for Mike and in whatever avenue he pursues,
:08:44. > :08:49.remaining as a Strangford LMA, I wishing well, and there have been
:08:50. > :08:52.disagreements, areas where myself and colleagues have not agreed with
:08:53. > :09:03.Mike Nesbitt, but it has not been personal. And therefore I wishing
:09:04. > :09:10.well. Congratulations to you. We can go to West Tyrone and talk to Daniel
:09:11. > :09:14.McCrossan. He has held his seat. Congratulations, are you relieved?
:09:15. > :09:19.I'm happy and relieved and looking forward to a rest for a few days
:09:20. > :09:25.before I go back to the assembly on Monday. What about the tussle for
:09:26. > :09:38.the fourth set, the fifth seat. How did it pad out? -- pan. You manage
:09:39. > :09:43.to get home, was it a tight fight? We always had a seat in West Tyrone
:09:44. > :09:46.and I'm very happy to retain it. This is my third election in three
:09:47. > :09:51.years and we have most to increase the mandate of the party here.
:09:52. > :09:55.People came out in force and they offered their support to me, to
:09:56. > :10:01.represent them going forward. Are you confident, briefly, that the
:10:02. > :10:11.assembly will get up and running again sooner rather than later? DUP
:10:12. > :10:14.at one end of the spectrum and Sinn Fein at the other, they seem to have
:10:15. > :10:19.boxed themselves into corners and it is not entirely straightforward to
:10:20. > :10:25.see Stormont reconvening in the way that we might expect it to do. I
:10:26. > :10:29.live in hope. If they can get together before the election, there
:10:30. > :10:35.was no call for the election, but we are faced with it and the same
:10:36. > :10:41.result. My fear and the fit of the public, is direct rule. -- the fear
:10:42. > :10:44.of the public. I hope that Sinn Fein and the DUP don't want that to
:10:45. > :10:47.happen and I hope that they put their differences aside and put the
:10:48. > :10:53.interests of the people on the ground first in terms of health and
:10:54. > :10:56.education. And put aside the them and us, because this is about
:10:57. > :11:01.everybody in Northern Ireland and people are very angry and this
:11:02. > :11:06.election shows it. There has been a big increase in the nationalist
:11:07. > :11:13.turnout. Thanks for joining us. Congratulations again. We are going
:11:14. > :11:19.to go back to the panel and a moment, but first we are going to go
:11:20. > :11:22.to the Titanic exhibition centre in Belfast where the four Belfast
:11:23. > :11:32.counts have been taking place. Thank you. I'm joined by Paul Bradshaw,
:11:33. > :11:40.successfully elected. -- Paula. You must be pleased. To have retained
:11:41. > :11:43.their seats across the board. It is a nice team, people from different
:11:44. > :11:48.backgrounds with different strengths, different constituencies,
:11:49. > :11:51.and it would be nice to get back at Stormont and do what we have to do
:11:52. > :11:57.to get the place up and running again. Do you think that this
:11:58. > :12:01.possible? I think that is why they need the smaller parties, to be in
:12:02. > :12:05.those talks, because it is so divided and I think the middle
:12:06. > :12:12.ground, the progressives, who are coming through, they need to get a
:12:13. > :12:20.voice in there, to make sure that we have a strong mandate. A lot of
:12:21. > :12:25.constituents have put their faith in us to negotiate on there but half to
:12:26. > :12:38.get devolution back up and running -- on their behalf. It depends...
:12:39. > :12:41.The Ulster Unionist Party lost ground, and we have picked up from
:12:42. > :12:47.other parties, as well. 2000 votes ahead. They had to come from
:12:48. > :12:53.somewhere. Some from Unionists but also from the DUP. What about Mike
:12:54. > :12:58.Nesbitt, surprised he resign? No, I wasn't. We have seen so many
:12:59. > :13:06.casualties and a big names like Danny Kennedy. His position was
:13:07. > :13:09.untenable and he gambled so much. It was very ambitious, what he said,
:13:10. > :13:15.but he did not have the party with him. It is very much unfortunate
:13:16. > :13:21.that his political career in terms of leadership has ended. I don't
:13:22. > :13:26.know who is going to fill the void. On a personal level, what about the
:13:27. > :13:33.other casualties? People like Joanne Dobson. You work closely with her.
:13:34. > :13:42.Surprised she lost her sick? Very surprised. -- she lost her seat. We
:13:43. > :13:45.worked on the health committee and we did joint campaigning over things
:13:46. > :13:58.like cancer drugs, and that will be a big loss to them. Robbie on the
:13:59. > :14:02.health committee, as well. There will be big shoes to fill and this
:14:03. > :14:12.is a sad day for them. Thank you very much. We can now go to North
:14:13. > :14:20.Antrim, Ballymena, and hear from our correspondent. The result is
:14:21. > :14:26.completed. Both counts are over in Ballymena in the leisure centre. Mid
:14:27. > :14:29.Auster, looking at both constituencies, if you are looking
:14:30. > :14:33.for any unfamiliar faces you will not find them, but there are
:14:34. > :14:39.unfamiliar faces who have gone. Three Sinn Fein leaders have
:14:40. > :14:53.retained their sick, as did the one DUP member. -- their seat. One SDLP
:14:54. > :15:00.member has claimed a suit. North Antrim, -- has claimed a seat. They
:15:01. > :15:02.are left with Robin is one of the Ulster Unionist Party and Mervyn
:15:03. > :15:14.Storey of the DUP. Stuart McGregor has retained the
:15:15. > :15:21.seat he was co-opted into after the resignation. So many unfamiliar
:15:22. > :15:31.faces and familiar faces gone from Ballymena.
:15:32. > :15:37.We can now hear more about the numbers, crunching them on our
:15:38. > :15:44.behalf, our political editor Mark Davenport. We have to consider two
:15:45. > :15:51.constituencies, not just any constituencies, constituencies which
:15:52. > :15:55.we think might turn out to be crucial in terms of the end game.
:15:56. > :16:00.They are numbers we have had in the back of our mind. One number was the
:16:01. > :16:04.number 30 because that is what any party needs to wield a petition of
:16:05. > :16:09.concern, the veto mechanism on its own. We think potentially South
:16:10. > :16:19.Belfast and Langer Valley could play a role in that. We can have a look
:16:20. > :16:33.at that. South Belfast first of all. Three MLAs elected here. Let's have
:16:34. > :16:41.a look. He is clearly there. The other two came in for the two DUP
:16:42. > :16:50.and a green close behind. This is the battle for the numbers for the
:16:51. > :16:55.DUP. There are less than two unionist quotas but there are also
:16:56. > :16:58.floating votes. It seemed at the beginning quite probable that Clare
:16:59. > :17:02.Bayley would pick up enough transfers from the others to
:17:03. > :17:12.overtake one of the others, but we are not sure which at this stage. We
:17:13. > :17:17.are leaping through a few stages. Clare Bayley has left above
:17:18. > :17:21.Christopher Stortford. The question is where some of the transfers might
:17:22. > :17:24.go and whether they will deliver their Bayley home and whether the
:17:25. > :17:33.DUP will be able to get their couple of seats which they had previously.
:17:34. > :17:43.Paula Rachel and Claire Hammond have been elected -- Paula Bradshaw. That
:17:44. > :17:49.will leave 2000 surplus Foakes which I think will go to Clare Bayley
:17:50. > :17:52.rather than the DUP -- votes. Will the transfer be enough for the DUP
:17:53. > :18:03.candidate. That's one way they could get to 30.
:18:04. > :18:07.If they got those two and every thing else was even. There is
:18:08. > :18:16.another place where the DUP is under threat. These three candidates. This
:18:17. > :18:20.was how they stacked up. Previously the DUP had three seats here, so if
:18:21. > :18:28.they retained those three seats and the two seats, they get to the 30
:18:29. > :18:34.mark. There you can see the SDLP are some way behind. They haven't had a
:18:35. > :18:40.sit there in recent times. If we zoom forward to stage seven it is
:18:41. > :18:47.proven that Pat Catney is proving quite transfer friendly. Yes. You
:18:48. > :18:56.can see that Pat Catney got more transfers ban on the DUP candidates
:18:57. > :19:05.did. The decisive phase will be the transfer of that 3500 surplus from
:19:06. > :19:10.Butler. It could be that enough of them go to Pat Catney, not enough go
:19:11. > :19:16.to Brenda Hale, to give the SDLP a surprise victory. We think these
:19:17. > :19:20.constituencies could be crucial in determining the overall balance. If
:19:21. > :19:27.the DUP lost out in both places they could be down 28 seats, which would
:19:28. > :19:33.be about -- better heat. Under the current rules Sinn Fein would still
:19:34. > :19:45.be entitled to nominate the First Minister? Behind me we have
:19:46. > :19:51.potentially some late drama in Lisbon. We've only been waiting ten
:19:52. > :19:56.hours for an upset and the SDLP are claiming that one potentially is on
:19:57. > :20:00.the cards. As you were saying, Pat Catney and Brenda Hale look like
:20:01. > :20:06.they will flood it out for the fifth and final seat. Currently Pat Catney
:20:07. > :20:10.of the SDLP is 130 votes ahead. They are now in the process of
:20:11. > :20:17.transferring surplus votes from Robbie Butler, the only elected
:20:18. > :20:23.Ulster unionist. The SDLP says that Pat Catney ease transfer friendly to
:20:24. > :20:27.the Olveston in the nest on the basis of what happened previously.
:20:28. > :20:31.They are growing in confidence and saying lots of pacing back and
:20:32. > :20:38.forwards between Brenda Hale is, and Pat Catney. Both to-ing and fro-ing.
:20:39. > :20:43.It has been a while since I spoke to the DUP about this. They were
:20:44. > :20:47.confident at the start of play that they would have three returned. That
:20:48. > :20:52.confidence has waned in the course of the day but pick up a little with
:20:53. > :20:58.the elimination of Jenny Palmer of the Ulster unionists. But coming up
:20:59. > :21:06.is Pat Catney. We are told that they intend to finish this this evening.
:21:07. > :21:14.It could be another hour or so, who knows, but this is some late drama
:21:15. > :21:18.tonight at Lisburn. That is a fascinating situation
:21:19. > :21:24.developing for the final seat. It will be interesting to see if Pat
:21:25. > :21:28.Catney takes that seat and if it does, that is putting emotion
:21:29. > :21:34.arguably what Mike Nesbitt said, that Ulster unionists should think
:21:35. > :21:40.seriously about transferring to the SDLP. In the meantime Mike Nesbitt
:21:41. > :21:49.has resigned. I will pick that up in a moment with a panel. First, your
:21:50. > :21:58.catchphrase is always keep are lit. So you did? -- keep her lit. Yes,
:21:59. > :22:10.but it seems in this election keep her lit didn't seem entirely
:22:11. > :22:16.appropriate. In the first count we had a great day. Sinn Fein has had a
:22:17. > :22:23.great day at the leisure centre because out of the ten we emerged
:22:24. > :22:30.with six of the ten, three in each constituency. If I could just thank
:22:31. > :22:37.people who voted for us. It is very humbling to be in people's houses,
:22:38. > :22:44.to be sitting in their kitchen. We've had custard and fresh cream!
:22:45. > :22:48.Sometimes we've had the old bake together at the canteen. I know you
:22:49. > :22:54.like your apple pie and custard, so that doesn't surprise me! I swear to
:22:55. > :23:02.god I had the happiest election experience, bowing to the people up
:23:03. > :23:08.and down around Tyrone. I think it is the warmest election we ever got.
:23:09. > :23:16.In West Tyrone we got the highest ever vote. We got a cumulative total
:23:17. > :23:28.of 21,000. Previous to that a high watermark would have been around
:23:29. > :23:31.19,000. So we had such success. So much for the folksy stuff, all
:23:32. > :23:35.politics is local. But what about the serious business of the
:23:36. > :23:42.politics? What does the mandate for Barry Michael Gough and for your
:23:43. > :23:53.party, what does that give you a mandate to do over the next few
:23:54. > :23:57.weeks and months? There will be talks and Sinn Fein is arriving at
:23:58. > :24:07.those talks with an enhanced mandate. What is their agenda? Our
:24:08. > :24:10.gender is a quality and respect. I would like to see both governments
:24:11. > :24:15.involved, the Irish government and British government, because they are
:24:16. > :24:18.co- guarantors of the Good Friday agreement, which is very much
:24:19. > :24:24.relevant and needs to be implementing full, not least the
:24:25. > :24:28.bill of Rights, all of things need to be implemented. And I think my
:24:29. > :24:37.message to the DUP, who will be at the table as well, is that we are
:24:38. > :24:40.equal and toe-to-toe. The nationalists and republicans, even
:24:41. > :24:45.with a progressive agenda, have given us a mandate to say to the
:24:46. > :24:52.DUP, we are not less than equal, we are your equal, and that message
:24:53. > :24:57.needs to get home. You've got that mandate and nobody questions that.
:24:58. > :25:01.You also accept that people who voted for the DUP give Arlene Foster
:25:02. > :25:05.and her team coming back a very strong mandate as well? I do. I do
:25:06. > :25:09.accept that and I do respect that very much. But in recent weeks we've
:25:10. > :25:19.heard conciliatory tone and words from the likes of Ian Paisley Jr. I
:25:20. > :25:23.think the DUP need to reflect on their tone and language and their
:25:24. > :25:29.attitude to equality and respect. The society can only go forward on a
:25:30. > :25:32.platform of equality and respect. There are serious allegations of
:25:33. > :25:38.financial impropriety and they need to be dealt with absolutely. There
:25:39. > :25:44.will be a public enquiry which will be reported on later this year. That
:25:45. > :25:47.will happen. Absolutely. Credit to taking the lead and making that
:25:48. > :25:53.happen. Let's bring the two governments in as well. The British
:25:54. > :25:59.Prime Minister should be directly involved in the talks up ahead,
:26:00. > :26:05.because they are co- guarantors of the Good Friday peace agreement and
:26:06. > :26:10.until that is implemented in full, the rights agenda they are contained
:26:11. > :26:13.in as well. Thanks very much and we hope we will see you again before
:26:14. > :26:18.too long. Look forward to it. Right, let's
:26:19. > :26:23.talk about that. Quick word about where we are in terms of Sinn Fein's
:26:24. > :26:28.mandate. What will Sinn Fein do with a mandate? Who knows? I wonder if
:26:29. > :26:32.they know. The question for them was if they bought people out what would
:26:33. > :26:37.the people say? Were people going to blame them. And in bed too long and
:26:38. > :26:43.propping up the DUP, or were they going to row at them? What do they
:26:44. > :26:50.really want? Do they want Stormont back, even supposedly improved in
:26:51. > :26:54.some way, or do they want to go into lengthy negotiations with possibly a
:26:55. > :26:59.different outcome? I wonder how much stomach there is for devolution in
:27:00. > :27:07.the wider national scheme? I wonder how much appetite there is for
:27:08. > :27:10.Stormont among Sinn Fein's wider supporters? Do you think republicans
:27:11. > :27:16.more generally would prefer direct rule? They would prefer it in a
:27:17. > :27:20.positive way, but it had become so sickening to a lot of people and
:27:21. > :27:26.they had been turned off so much by the law and progressive picture of
:27:27. > :27:30.Sinn Fein rolling over in Stormont, which is what a lot of people,
:27:31. > :27:38.including their own supporters, were beginning to say. I think there was
:27:39. > :27:43.a bit of that. I also think Sinn Fein could tolerate a longer period
:27:44. > :27:49.of Stormont being down and out than the DUP could, both because this is
:27:50. > :27:53.in their favour, whether they see it like that or not I don't know. On
:27:54. > :28:02.the grounds that they didn't invest as much personally in each case as
:28:03. > :28:05.the DUP members and they also have their project which is going at the
:28:06. > :28:13.moment quite well for them, their votes going up. The polls are
:28:14. > :28:16.looking better. How much of a stomach they have the negotiation I
:28:17. > :28:20.don't know. How much skill they have for negotiation I don't know.
:28:21. > :28:23.Because they certainly didn't distinguish themselves all that well
:28:24. > :28:31.at many points over the last couple of years. A quick word from other
:28:32. > :28:38.members of the panel. Good news for him and his party leader, they keep
:28:39. > :28:45.their seats. What about the Pat Catney situation? There is the
:28:46. > :28:50.possibility that the best DUP will sneak a seat because of the union
:28:51. > :28:55.transfers. You could say it goes back to what Mike Nesbitt said, that
:28:56. > :29:00.of stee in voters should think of transferring to be SDLP. It seems
:29:01. > :29:08.they may have followed his advice? Yes, and Jenny Palmer's supporters
:29:09. > :29:15.have every reason to want to see the DUP suffer at the hands, given what
:29:16. > :29:22.Jenny Palmer suffered. But there is that issue that Mike Nesbitt jumped
:29:23. > :29:28.out, arguably too soon. You think so? I really do. I think both as a
:29:29. > :29:33.matter of common courtesy, and he is a courteous man, and as a matter of
:29:34. > :29:43.judgement, it was not the day to do it. There were those bad scenes of
:29:44. > :29:47.you asking and pushing, properly, of asking these flummoxed guys as to
:29:48. > :29:51.whether they were ready to pick up the mantle and they barely knew that
:29:52. > :29:55.the mantle had been cast. That's no way to leave the party. But there
:29:56. > :29:58.was a sense that it wasn't just the election results that through Mike
:29:59. > :30:04.Nesbitt. I think a lot of us watching the leader's debate were
:30:05. > :30:09.struck by how nervous he seemed, how shaky his voice was. You know as a
:30:10. > :30:13.presenter, and I do, that if you are in front of a microphone your voice
:30:14. > :30:17.gives you away quite quickly. You're tyred and switched off, whatever.
:30:18. > :30:22.His voice was shaking in that debate. I think he was already
:30:23. > :30:25.shaken, whether because he got such bad feedback from within the party
:30:26. > :30:30.and cause he was nervous about the result, it was as if he had semi-
:30:31. > :30:36.decided before the result that he did it too soon. Let's just hear
:30:37. > :30:46.about an Ofsted success. Our correspondent is down at the Titanic
:30:47. > :30:52.Exhibition Centre. We have a bit of a ray of sunshine? I have. First of
:30:53. > :30:58.all, the final declaration is about to be made in north Belfast and
:30:59. > :31:04.that's going to be Exhibition -- two DUP seats, two Sinn Fein
:31:05. > :31:08.seats. We are just waiting for the announcement in a couple of minutes.
:31:09. > :31:19.As you say, good news in east Belfast for the DUP. What we have
:31:20. > :31:23.left are three DUP candidates. We expect Bunting to be returned. It is
:31:24. > :31:29.a tossup between Robert Newton and David Douglas. The DUP themselves
:31:30. > :31:36.not calling which of those two will be eliminated at this point. But
:31:37. > :31:41.after that point I got reaction. We are delighted. We have increased our
:31:42. > :31:48.vote significantly. We've been working hard since we returned in
:31:49. > :31:53.May. I hope we can get back and get the institutions back. I am
:31:54. > :31:58.committed and that's why I came into politics, to work for ordinary
:31:59. > :32:00.people and deliver for them, whether that be health, infrastructure,
:32:01. > :32:04.education. We will always do right for Northern Ireland. Are you
:32:05. > :32:07.confident you will be able to return to the assembly and make those
:32:08. > :32:11.changes? It will be a long road ahead of us. Let's not take anything
:32:12. > :32:19.for granted. We will go into the negotiations and see what happens.
:32:20. > :32:26.INAUDIBLE. I am delighted we've increased our vote and I look
:32:27. > :32:31.forward to continued to work with the other partners in all four
:32:32. > :32:39.constituents. I've lost good friends, people who I built up
:32:40. > :32:47.relationships with since 2015. I am gutted for Cassandra and Danny. A
:32:48. > :32:51.message? I commend the party under Mike Nesbitt's leadership. He has
:32:52. > :32:57.guided me and he has been strong for me. He has been there and I wish him
:32:58. > :33:01.well. I consider him a colleague and friend. Do you fancy throwing your
:33:02. > :33:06.hat in the ring for the leadership? No. It seems clear that a DUP seat
:33:07. > :33:11.will go in. Your reflections on that? It is disappointing that
:33:12. > :33:15.naturally there will be seats lost right across Northern Ireland.
:33:16. > :33:25.That's disappointing. I spoke in the chamber on the production numbers
:33:26. > :33:28.and although we have to remember that good MLAs have lost seats
:33:29. > :33:33.across all parties. The people of Northern Ireland have been affected
:33:34. > :33:36.and I estimate the cost at ?5 million. An impact on key frontline
:33:37. > :33:41.services. We have to remember that. People were asked to come out to the
:33:42. > :33:45.polls again and they were deeply frustrated and angry. They wanted to
:33:46. > :33:48.get this thing working to get it delivered for the people.
:33:49. > :34:03.Thank you. Yes, Mark, as I said, during the interview, the official
:34:04. > :34:08.results were made for north Belfast, they joining Paul Bradley from the
:34:09. > :34:14.DUP and William Humphrey. North Belfast is complete, we have had the
:34:15. > :34:18.west Belfast count, we expect the east to be completed, and then
:34:19. > :34:22.in the next, I don't know the next in the next, I don't know the next
:34:23. > :34:26.couple of hours. The next couple of hours would be good, I am sure they
:34:27. > :34:34.would be happy with that, thank you. I wanted to pick up on those points.
:34:35. > :34:39.We have covered an awful lot of ground. A couple of things he wanted
:34:40. > :34:44.to pick up on. Two things and I am not sure the body politic in the
:34:45. > :34:49.north has understood this yet. First, Brexit has changed forever.
:34:50. > :34:53.The vote on Brexit, and the fact that a majority of people in the
:34:54. > :35:01.north, in this part of the island, want to remain. In the European
:35:02. > :35:06.Union, with all of its faults. And for the benefit of everyone, for
:35:07. > :35:11.viewers across the UK, who will be thinking, yes, the majority voted to
:35:12. > :35:15.remain in Northern Ireland, but of course it was UK wide and the
:35:16. > :35:21.majority across the UK decided I narrow margin to leave, and that has
:35:22. > :35:25.consequences for Northern Ireland. For people throughout England,
:35:26. > :35:30.Scotland and Wales, and the Scots and Welsh get it, they need to
:35:31. > :35:35.understand this is an island and the partition of the island economically
:35:36. > :35:40.and a European border on this island has had a huge impact on the
:35:41. > :35:45.selection, a huge impact. I live in a border community. I was working in
:35:46. > :35:49.the north. My husband was working in the south. One daughter is in
:35:50. > :35:55.college in Dublin and another is in college in Belfast. That is the
:35:56. > :36:00.first contact. I don't think we can overstate the impact of Brexit on
:36:01. > :36:04.this election. And the fear that people have right across border
:36:05. > :36:06.communities, from the Catholic- Protestant and ethnic...
:36:07. > :36:11.CROSSTALK Has it brought out the vote for Sinn
:36:12. > :36:17.Fein, not just a reaction to the DUP, it was Brexit? Brexit is
:36:18. > :36:21.underlying it. The other thing I saw was the ethnic minority communities
:36:22. > :36:27.coming out and they were coming out and many were voting for Sinn Fein.
:36:28. > :36:30.But the second context, and people will be reflecting tonight, and we
:36:31. > :36:35.talked a little bit about it earlier, there is now 1100 votes,
:36:36. > :36:42.roughly, between Sinn Fein and the DUP. We may have 20, I don't want to
:36:43. > :36:49.speculate on seats, it is looking at 28, whatever... You will be within
:36:50. > :36:57.one or two of each other. The north has changed forever. I know that we
:36:58. > :37:02.have heard the words to the point ad nauseam, respect, quality and
:37:03. > :37:06.integrity. There needs to be a psychological shift in relation to
:37:07. > :37:08.respect for what was the minority in the past.
:37:09. > :37:15.CROSSTALK Just hear me out. There has not been
:37:16. > :37:20.respect for me as an Irish leader, for my grandchild as an Irish
:37:21. > :37:25.speaker. As a six-year-old, he was up in Stormont protesting. I would
:37:26. > :37:31.have preferred if he wasn't. If he didn't need to do it. He was
:37:32. > :37:39.shouting up in Stormont with six -year-olds, red with anger. He said
:37:40. > :37:45.to me, why is Stormont cutting the money to my school? I don't think
:37:46. > :37:51.people get the message of what you're doing to the next generation
:37:52. > :37:57.when decisions like that I made. I don't want my grandson doing that.
:37:58. > :38:04.What needs to happen in society is a psychological shift. Listen, we
:38:05. > :38:09.don't have a DUP representative, we don't have a unionist in the studio
:38:10. > :38:15.but if we had someone from the DUP, I suspect... We don't have an active
:38:16. > :38:21.Unionist politician. Let me make this point. If there was someone
:38:22. > :38:25.from the DUP they would say that you are selective in what you talk about
:38:26. > :38:28.when you discuss the quality and they might think, and Jeffrey
:38:29. > :38:36.Donaldson made the point earlier today, there are examples he could
:38:37. > :38:41.throw at you where you respect things that don't matter to
:38:42. > :38:44.Unionists. In terms of equality, there is legislative framework and
:38:45. > :38:48.there are nine grounds on which you cannot discriminate, and Sinn Fein
:38:49. > :38:52.is clear that you cannot discriminate on political opinion or
:38:53. > :38:58.religious belief, but you also can't, and the DUP has signed up to
:38:59. > :39:03.this, on sexual orientation. But my final point on this... Very quickly.
:39:04. > :39:08.My final point is this is not just about going back to Stormont, this
:39:09. > :39:18.is about the assembly, north- south, rakish -- British - Irish. You are a
:39:19. > :39:25.Unionist but you're not a serving Unionist politician, which is what I
:39:26. > :39:32.think I was getting too. I want to break off before that and bring in
:39:33. > :39:40.our reporter. Confirmation of success and here is the man of the
:39:41. > :39:45.moment. Good evening. It is a double celebration. Not only is he
:39:46. > :39:52.re-elected, it is his 39th birthday. Birthday cake tonight? It won't be
:39:53. > :39:57.my birthday by the time I get out of here, unfortunately, but double
:39:58. > :40:01.cause for celebration, delighted to be re-elected by the people of Foyle
:40:02. > :40:05.and determined to return it to them in terms of the work I do on the
:40:06. > :40:09.issues which matter to them. You predicted that you would win two
:40:10. > :40:12.seats and you have retained them but is there a disappointment for the
:40:13. > :40:18.on first preferences by Sinn Fein, on first preferences by Sinn Fein,
:40:19. > :40:23.that is a worry for the SDLP? There it is a wee bit of disappointment,
:40:24. > :40:28.however we have to look at the result, we have increased 3000
:40:29. > :40:31.votes, and we have managed the vote extremely well, got both candidates,
:40:32. > :40:36.and that is something to be cheerful about. Sinn Fein have increased
:40:37. > :40:40.their vote by even more. We have to look at how they did that. We have
:40:41. > :40:44.to learn from how they did that and we have to see it how we are going
:40:45. > :40:49.to increase hours in the next election. Your uncle, Mark Durkan,
:40:50. > :40:54.will he be worried about the Sinn Fein performance, it has been
:40:55. > :40:57.impressive, and he has a 6000 majority, but he is bound to be
:40:58. > :41:02.worried towards the next Westminster action? I don't think he will be
:41:03. > :41:05.particularly worried, I mean, Sinn Fein has been tremendously
:41:06. > :41:10.impressive, and well done to them for that. We will focus on our
:41:11. > :41:16.performance and I think we can improve further. We are 35% of the
:41:17. > :41:20.electorate -- we have 35% of the electorate who didn't come out to
:41:21. > :41:24.vote and we have to get them to vote SDLP. We are the strongest party
:41:25. > :41:27.against Brexit. We have been the strongest party on the day to day
:41:28. > :41:31.issues but sadly the election has become about more than the
:41:32. > :41:35.day-to-day issues. I think it is important that we look at how to
:41:36. > :41:40.move this place forward. We will be coming back with a strong team to
:41:41. > :41:43.Stormont and we determined to play our part in making Stormont for the
:41:44. > :41:49.people here in terms of delivering better healthcare, stronger welfare,
:41:50. > :41:52.better education system, these are the issues which really matter to
:41:53. > :41:56.people and these are the issues which matter to us. Do you think it
:41:57. > :41:59.can all be put together again on Monday morning when the dust
:42:00. > :42:04.settles, or have they been too many insults traded amongst the parties,
:42:05. > :42:09.with the political ramifications tonight with Mike Nesbitt going, can
:42:10. > :42:14.it be put back together? I sincerely hope that it can. I think the people
:42:15. > :42:18.want it to happen. The people need that to happen for all of the
:42:19. > :42:22.reasons I have outlined already. The SDLP will be determined to play a
:42:23. > :42:26.part in making that happen. Let's just hope that it does. Ultimately
:42:27. > :42:29.it will come down to the bigger parties. I will let you go and enjoy
:42:30. > :42:36.your birthday cake. Happy birthday. It is back to you. Thank you. Let's
:42:37. > :42:41.hear from members of the panel. John, for the benefit of people who
:42:42. > :42:48.don't know your background, you were a member of the Ulster Unionist
:42:49. > :42:53.Party, then the deputy leader of NI21, you were an independent, you
:42:54. > :42:57.lost your seat in May, so you are not an active unionist politician,
:42:58. > :43:01.but you are steeped in unionist politics, how can you respond to the
:43:02. > :43:07.talk about the equality agenda and the respect agenda? On a couple of
:43:08. > :43:13.points, the one thing I would disagree with is that this election
:43:14. > :43:22.was about Brexit. It wasn't on my sense of it, it was the old issues
:43:23. > :43:25.of what have bedevilled with us, dealing with the past, Irish
:43:26. > :43:30.language. People are concerned about Brexit. It wouldn't explain why the
:43:31. > :43:37.SDLP was under pressure given they are very strong against Brexit and
:43:38. > :43:42.campaigned on that. I think this was an election about getting into the
:43:43. > :43:49.sectarian trenches almost... What about the other issues mentioned,
:43:50. > :43:58.LGBT writes, the Irish language? You mentioned my involvement in NI21. --
:43:59. > :44:05.rights. When we had the conference I started my lines in Irish, very
:44:06. > :44:09.badly, bad pronunciation, and the fact that, bizarrely, one of the
:44:10. > :44:17.guys who does translation for Irish in the assembly is a Portadown
:44:18. > :44:21.Orangemen. Unionism as a collective almost tens to say this belongs to
:44:22. > :44:25.something else instead of recognising we need to keep
:44:26. > :44:29.ownership. Here is the reality, there are a lot of unionistplumac-
:44:30. > :44:32.Protestants who have no problem with the Irish language...
:44:33. > :44:36.CROSSTALK It has to be said that there are
:44:37. > :44:40.unionists who have a problem with the Irish language. And you see the
:44:41. > :44:45.thing about putting legislation through the assembly, especially
:44:46. > :44:48.when the DUP have 38 members, anything that they wanted to strike
:44:49. > :44:55.out other legislation that they thought was going to cost too much,
:44:56. > :45:01.instead of getting in and doing it, I mean, I accept things around the
:45:02. > :45:04.respect agenda, and comments made earlier today which Naomi talked
:45:05. > :45:11.about, about one of the biggest recruiters for Sinn Fein, Ireland
:45:12. > :45:17.has mobilised a vote for Sinn Fein, yes, a significant vote for the DUP,
:45:18. > :45:23.but she has mobilised a vote for Sinn Fein, particularly in Kent
:45:24. > :45:29.Stephenson -- consistencies to the west, that is a tremendous result.
:45:30. > :45:33.Can I just bring Stephen in, you are in a unique position to give insight
:45:34. > :45:37.into how this might work, because for the last decade he worked as the
:45:38. > :45:41.head of Kim indications for the executive, so you have been in their
:45:42. > :45:47.working alongside successive DUP and Sinn Fein leaders and trying to help
:45:48. > :45:53.them put forward their partnership agenda. Now, we are where we are, we
:45:54. > :45:56.have had an election, we don't know quite what happens next. Both of
:45:57. > :46:00.those parties go back with renewed mandate. The difficulty seems to be
:46:01. > :46:04.that they seem to think that their mandates are mutually Lousi of, so
:46:05. > :46:10.how can we move on from here? The difficulty has always been that
:46:11. > :46:14.while they could agree on a high level on the sort of things you
:46:15. > :46:18.would expect them to agree on in terms of, we need to pay attention
:46:19. > :46:22.to infrastructure, the health service, education and schools, once
:46:23. > :46:25.you get down into the detail, it all tended to fall apart -- mutually
:46:26. > :46:31.exclusive. And the problem in the politics of all of this is that when
:46:32. > :46:34.the pressure comes on, as it did in the last few weeks running up around
:46:35. > :46:41.Christmas and into the New Year, those parties tend to withdraw into
:46:42. > :46:47.themselves, don't talk to officials particularly, if you are not part of
:46:48. > :46:51.the Sinn Fein and the DUP cognoscenti, you are not part of the
:46:52. > :46:57.argument, and that sense of ourselves alone on both their parts
:46:58. > :47:03.doesn't help, because there is little light getting into this
:47:04. > :47:07.situation, so if you look at the takeaways for the DUP, well, you
:47:08. > :47:12.know, we are still there. We are the biggest unionist party, the biggest
:47:13. > :47:17.party still up for grabs a little bit, but somewhere along the line,
:47:18. > :47:20.you know, there has to be a sense of, well, let's just back this down
:47:21. > :47:24.a little bit. One other thing is, believe it or not, Peter Robinson
:47:25. > :47:28.was good at, was being incredibly magmatic when he had to be and there
:47:29. > :47:30.was a degree of pragmatism required...
:47:31. > :47:34.CROSSTALK The first to deliver pragmatism? She
:47:35. > :47:39.will have to be she is going to continue to be the leader. A quick
:47:40. > :47:44.word? It follows this point, that is why you need to move, and I give
:47:45. > :47:49.Katrina this, if you have respect you move to a genuine power-sharing,
:47:50. > :47:57.we have too many ministers acting as king in their own five -- fiefdoms
:47:58. > :48:05.and that is not good. I need to break in it as we have interesting
:48:06. > :48:12.details, Lisbon, we were talking about the battle for the final seat,
:48:13. > :48:16.we thought Pat Cagney was out of the mix, now we hear that he is back in
:48:17. > :48:23.again, can you confirm those five seats are being declared? Pat Catney
:48:24. > :48:29.will take the fifth and final seat in Lagan Valley. I am still awaiting
:48:30. > :48:35.on the official figure but I am told he beat the DUP's render hail --
:48:36. > :48:47.render hail. He will be thankful for all of the star -- of the -- Ulster
:48:48. > :48:51.you transfers. Earlier the DUP were confident of holding all of their
:48:52. > :49:05.seats and at the end of the night they are down to two. The DUP are
:49:06. > :49:10.represented by Paul given and Edwin Poots. The fifth and final seat,
:49:11. > :49:17.about to be declared, Pat Catney. That is a fascinating development.
:49:18. > :49:21.Thanks very much. Just to clarify, that has happened. It happened
:49:22. > :49:33.because of Ulster Union is transfers. Pat Catney has now won
:49:34. > :49:45.the fifth seat. It is a sweet one for the SDLP. For a long while it
:49:46. > :49:48.was very lonely in Lisburn. I hope Jenny Palmer doesn't get bad
:49:49. > :49:55.treatment of the ground after this from disgruntled DUP supporters, who
:49:56. > :50:00.will say they took Sarah to man across the line. Lisburn is one of
:50:01. > :50:06.the most bitter places behind a semi- civilised facade that I can
:50:07. > :50:09.think of. Jenny Palmer has no control of the
:50:10. > :50:14.voters. You know how such things pan out. We
:50:15. > :50:22.are just looking at pictures of the formal declaration. There is the
:50:23. > :50:28.deputy returning officer. Actually,... Buries Pat Catney as
:50:29. > :50:33.well on the left. Another little ironic thing is that Pat Catney was
:50:34. > :50:38.brought into the party by Ulster McDonald. His period as leader was
:50:39. > :50:45.pretty unhappy and ended on a pretty sad note. It must be ironic for him,
:50:46. > :50:52.watching this. And Pat Catney is a bit off a character. He owns the
:50:53. > :51:00.kitchen bar in Belfast. This could be a significant impact on the DUP
:51:01. > :51:09.Sinn Fein balance. It isn't clear who is coming out. This picture
:51:10. > :51:12.might not become clear tonight, but it will become clear tomorrow
:51:13. > :51:20.morning and that the fascinating thing. Which is really nailbiting
:51:21. > :51:29.four Arlene Foster. And could that be a defining issue for Arlene
:51:30. > :51:34.Foster? Mike Nesbitt's resignation has taken the heat off tonight. But
:51:35. > :51:41.the pressure could be on her again? Enormously. What a parting gift from
:51:42. > :51:47.Mike Nesbitt if Pat Catney gets the seat, the last seat. All bets are
:51:48. > :51:55.off. We get to that position. A fascinating situation. Let's just
:51:56. > :52:03.hear from Mark Devonport who has some more numbers for us. It is very
:52:04. > :52:07.interesting and also especially interesting for those of us who have
:52:08. > :52:14.misspent some of our youth in the kitchen. I owe Pat Catney for quite
:52:15. > :52:17.a lot of plates of mash and needs. We will have to be dealing with it
:52:18. > :52:21.in completely different circumstances. Our current thinking
:52:22. > :52:25.at the moment is that this is quite significant because it deprives DUP
:52:26. > :52:29.of the commission concerned, but we were speaking south Belfast might be
:52:30. > :52:34.the one. Lagan Valley has now nipped in and done that. Absolutely. We are
:52:35. > :52:40.now looking for the DUP finishing on 28 seats, roughly the same as Sinn
:52:41. > :52:43.Fein, although there 28th is not quite certain yet. It is possible
:52:44. > :52:48.Sinn Fein might not get as many as the DUP. One of the whole issues
:52:49. > :52:53.that led to Mike Nesbitt stepping down were those controversial
:52:54. > :52:57.comments he made, that he would give his number, as many of his
:52:58. > :53:01.candidates disagree. Let's look at some of his constituencies, where
:53:02. > :53:05.the whole business of the opposition parties transferring between each
:53:06. > :53:12.other did make a big difference. Here we have the situation where
:53:13. > :53:16.Rosemary started in sixth place and not a brilliant sixth place when
:53:17. > :53:25.there were only five seats to be elected. We have to watch Ritchie
:53:26. > :53:29.McPhillips. Rosemary said she didn't agree with the leader on this and
:53:30. > :53:33.she felt her supporters should transfer in a prounion way, but look
:53:34. > :53:37.what happens. If we raced through, Arlene Foster gets elected. Ritchie
:53:38. > :53:42.McPhillips at this point is down at the bottom. Where do his votes go?
:53:43. > :53:50.Rosemary Barton is still out of the running at this point. Then at the
:53:51. > :53:58.next stage Rosemary Barton says thank you for 1004 to -- 1471
:53:59. > :54:02.transfers. It might seem extraordinary but let's not forget
:54:03. > :54:07.that Ritchie McPhillips took his seat last year because he got over
:54:08. > :54:13.90 transfers from the Ulster unionist. That allows him to
:54:14. > :54:19.leapfrog Morris and Rosemary Barton is elected and Sean Lynch comes
:54:20. > :54:24.through for Sinn Fein. We are looking at someone else where they
:54:25. > :54:35.might also play a role. East Londonderry. Here we have a good
:54:36. > :54:49.performance by Archibald. Clare Sugden doing well. I think we did
:54:50. > :54:52.say Jerry was standing at an independent. As ever you can never
:54:53. > :55:01.predict the fortunes of the single transferable voting system. We have
:55:02. > :55:06.Clare Sugden elected. And John is begin to pick up transfers. What's
:55:07. > :55:12.happened since then is the campus of votes have been redistributed. We
:55:13. > :55:16.are now seeing that the votes from Clare Sugden are heading... They
:55:17. > :55:26.came from the Ulster unionists but may head by a Clare Sugden with
:55:27. > :55:33.John. And Sinn Fein has it in his sights. Yes. Clare Sugden now has a
:55:34. > :55:39.surplus of 600 votes. There is a gap of 81 between John and Catriona. I
:55:40. > :55:48.would have thought enough of those would drift towards the SDLP and
:55:49. > :55:52.keep them on level pegging after the election, in a situation where we
:55:53. > :55:56.have lost six of the assembly seats. The SDLP have done very well in
:55:57. > :56:00.transferring their votes to seats. They fell slightly in the share of
:56:01. > :56:04.the votes but think of the retaining their seats. On that note let's go
:56:05. > :56:20.over to the Titanic Centre.. Thank you. Joining me here are two
:56:21. > :56:25.guests. You must be delighted? Not only delighted, not only have our
:56:26. > :56:29.present it is gone up but if you compared it to last May there is a
:56:30. > :56:35.difference of 3000 additional votes. -- percentages gone up. That's a
:56:36. > :56:43.substantial. One of the main reasons for that is especially a around
:56:44. > :56:51.attitude. That was felt quite a lot on the doors. And also this desire
:56:52. > :56:56.to get the institutions working and to physically give us all a mandate
:56:57. > :57:04.to get in and get things sorted. The DUP have done well as well? But I am
:57:05. > :57:07.not standing for the DUP, I'm standing for Sinn Fein and we are
:57:08. > :57:12.saying that our party leader has said that if we win we win for all.
:57:13. > :57:16.That's the attitude I've had and that's the attitude we will go into
:57:17. > :57:22.the institutions with. But it has been a good election for Sinn Fein.
:57:23. > :57:25.That's the position. Some of the numbercrunching that Nicholas and
:57:26. > :57:30.Mark were doing, do you think is a possibility you will end up with the
:57:31. > :57:35.same of seats as the DUP? I'm not sure, actually. We were looking at
:57:36. > :57:39.some of the figures on the screen and we are getting some late results
:57:40. > :57:43.coming in from East Londonderry, so I don't know. But we have had a
:57:44. > :57:47.really good election and the DUP have had a good election for in the
:57:48. > :57:54.middle of an election. Some of the predictions, possibly not from them,
:57:55. > :58:01.but certainly from pundits and that, have put them at a higher level. But
:58:02. > :58:07.the fact is that we have shown very positive, progressive leadership,
:58:08. > :58:13.energetic leadership, console at a -- consolidating leadership and that
:58:14. > :58:16.something the DUP have to bring back to these institutions. Lots to talk
:58:17. > :58:21.about. Let's condense it and talk about the DUP's election and the 30
:58:22. > :58:25.feet you for the partition of concern is looking guaranteed. I
:58:26. > :58:30.think the DUP would have been looking to get over 30 and they were
:58:31. > :58:33.always going to lose certain seats. They accept that that in certain
:58:34. > :58:38.places by only running two candidates, when previously they ran
:58:39. > :58:42.three. If we step out from the party politics and look at it in broader
:58:43. > :58:45.terms it's a very good election for that centre block of alliance with
:58:46. > :58:52.the Greens and non- aligning parties. It is an outstanding
:58:53. > :58:55.election for nationalism. A complete reversal of the result the
:58:56. > :58:59.Nationalists had ten months ago when Sinn Fein was the biggest loser in
:59:00. > :59:03.terms of the percentage share of the vote. That's reversed this time and
:59:04. > :59:12.it is nothing short of a disaster for unionism. Every unionist party
:59:13. > :59:15.is looking... Mike Nesbitt has quickly accepted what would have
:59:16. > :59:18.been the ultimate outcome of that result for him and Arlene Foster
:59:19. > :59:22.certainly doesn't give any indication that she is planning to
:59:23. > :59:26.follow that at this stage, that I think there will be a lot of
:59:27. > :59:30.pressure on her because to be just one or two seats, if that's where we
:59:31. > :59:34.end up, I head of Sinn Fein, having been ten seats ahead, that's a very
:59:35. > :59:38.bad result for the DUP. When it comes to Mike Nesbitt, do you think
:59:39. > :59:44.he was premature and he should have resigned? I think it pre-empted what
:59:45. > :59:49.was an inevitable decision. By the party and by him. I think it was a
:59:50. > :59:53.clever thing to do in terms of not only not leaving the issue to fester
:59:54. > :59:57.within the party, which it would have done. People were already
:59:58. > :00:01.unhappy at his comments. That was always going to come to a head if
:00:02. > :00:05.they didn't make significant gains, let alone losses, but I think it
:00:06. > :00:12.also puts a focus really back on Arlene Foster. Mike Nesbitt has now
:00:13. > :00:16.gone. The DUP result isn't as bad in many ways, after a bad result. They
:00:17. > :00:20.are still the largest party and a much bigger player. But it is very
:00:21. > :00:23.bad when you look at it across. Losing the chief whip, the party
:00:24. > :00:31.chairman and very significant figures will stop that's not a good
:00:32. > :00:36.election result. What about RHI, was that factor? It is difficult to
:00:37. > :00:41.tell. I think clearly that has reinvigorated nationalism. People in
:00:42. > :00:47.the SDLP say not only that but also Arlene Foster's crocodile remark,
:00:48. > :00:52.from that point there was a hardening of attitude where people
:00:53. > :00:56.who might have voted SDLP said, though, we want to send a message to
:00:57. > :01:01.her. So there were a mixture of factors. I think Arlene Foster's
:01:02. > :01:04.tactic of constantly drawing up the spectre of Sinn Fein being the
:01:05. > :01:08.biggest party possibly brought our voters that wanted to stop that. But
:01:09. > :01:14.I think we also see the opposite effect of that. Nationalism really
:01:15. > :01:18.drove Nationalists towards Sinn Fein to fulfil what Arlene Foster said
:01:19. > :01:23.might happen, if indeed they voted in that way. A final word from you.
:01:24. > :01:27.Did the DUP make it easy for you? Did you make gains with some of the
:01:28. > :01:35.comments they made around the crocodile narrative? I think
:01:36. > :01:39.initially it did. But I think some of the offensiveness from Arlene
:01:40. > :01:45.Foster has prompted people to come out across the board. I think she
:01:46. > :01:50.does need to reflect on what she has done as a leader. I think Mike
:01:51. > :01:55.Nesbitt jumped before he was pushed. But I think it was a collaborative
:01:56. > :01:59.decision. I think Arlene Foster needs to reflect on her own position
:02:00. > :02:05.and I am sure she will do that in the coming days. Thanks very much.
:02:06. > :02:13.We are going to have a good chat with members of my panel in a moment
:02:14. > :02:17.but before that, let's look at the overall state of the parties and
:02:18. > :02:19.bits and bobs to look at with Mark Simpson.
:02:20. > :02:23.It is shaping up to be the closest assembly election in history. More
:02:24. > :02:28.than 80 of 90 seats have been filled, including quite a few in the
:02:29. > :02:33.last couple of minutes. I don't even know what will pop up but we will
:02:34. > :02:39.give it a go. What I know for sure is the biggest party is still Sinn
:02:40. > :02:43.Fein with 26, only two fewer than the party got last time even though
:02:44. > :02:49.it is a small assembly. How close are the DUP? How many seats have a?
:02:50. > :02:53.25. Only one seat behind. It is a long way from the 38 they got last
:02:54. > :02:58.time and it is also short of the magic 30 mark but the DUP are
:02:59. > :03:02.creeping up on Sinn Fein. Who is in third place at the moment? It is on
:03:03. > :03:10.the nationalist side, the SDLP, with 11 seats. I suppose, no big deal in
:03:11. > :03:15.terms of gains for the SDLP, but Colin Eastwood will be relatively
:03:16. > :03:19.happy with that. Who is next, all is the unionist Mike Nesbitt, not
:03:20. > :03:24.happy, hasn't made any real inroads into the DUP. Look at the number of
:03:25. > :03:31.seats, ten. If you want to know why Mike Nesbitt has quit, there is the
:03:32. > :03:34.reason. No big gains for the Alliance party, they have held on
:03:35. > :03:38.with eight seats, and they will be delighted under their leader, Naomi
:03:39. > :03:42.Long. Let's have a look at the scores on the doors to see how the
:03:43. > :03:48.smaller parties and independents have done, here they are, you can
:03:49. > :03:52.see Jim Allister, the leader of the TUV, back at the back of the chamber
:03:53. > :03:56.making plenty of noise, and all eyes will be here on the front of the
:03:57. > :04:00.chamber. There is a big battle going on between the DUP and Sinn Fein,
:04:01. > :04:05.only one seat in it at the moment, to see who is going to win the most
:04:06. > :04:09.seats, it could even be a 28- 28 draw, all we know, Mark, it is going
:04:10. > :04:15.to be a close finish. Looks like it indeed, thank you,
:04:16. > :04:20.Mark. Fascinating situation. I am coming to you first, Stephen,
:04:21. > :04:24.because you are an expert on the numbers, and just to pick up on what
:04:25. > :04:29.Sam McBride, political editor said, he described it as, I think I heard
:04:30. > :04:33.it correctly, a disaster for unionism, is what he said, it is not
:04:34. > :04:37.a good election for Mike Nesbitt and he is gone, but it is not good
:04:38. > :04:42.either for the DUP. They may end up one or two seats ahead but they have
:04:43. > :04:44.lost the Chief Whip and the party chairman, they have lost significant
:04:45. > :04:53.figures like Nelson McAusland, Philip Logan. How much pressure is
:04:54. > :04:58.Arlene Foster likely to come under in the next 24 to 48 hours? I am not
:04:59. > :05:02.sure it will be the next 24 to 48 hours but pressure will be there at
:05:03. > :05:09.eventually. This has been a bad election. Matt McKay she started out
:05:10. > :05:16.the day as leader, 57,000 votes at the last election head of Sinn Fein.
:05:17. > :05:22.She may hold on to the First Minister by the 1200 votes ahead of
:05:23. > :05:26.Sinn Fein if it is a 28- 28 tie. That will send shockwaves through
:05:27. > :05:36.unionism. It absolutely is. And it will be, owning, people have been
:05:37. > :05:41.saying this, but given where she was when she took over, and the
:05:42. > :05:44.honeymoon period with the media, she seemed in vulnerable, and look at
:05:45. > :05:50.what has happened just a few months down the line. Quick word, John?
:05:51. > :05:55.Looking at the numbers, it looks like in people designating unionists
:05:56. > :06:00.and nationals, it will almost be a dead heat, you know, and then the
:06:01. > :06:05.big parties, people talked before the election if the DUP went below
:06:06. > :06:09.30, Arlene would be under real pressure, it is looking very
:06:10. > :06:16.unlikely. If it ends up as a dead heat, 28 apiece, let's speculate,
:06:17. > :06:21.the DUP would still be able to appoint the First Minister rather
:06:22. > :06:25.than the deputy First Minister because there is a margin of 1200
:06:26. > :06:33.between the DUP and Sinn Fein. That is right, isn't it? Yes. It would be
:06:34. > :06:37.enough to claim the First Minister's position, though, of course, as we
:06:38. > :06:42.know, they are equal positions. That is why I want to name them. Which
:06:43. > :06:49.was part of your move. Which is the point I was making earlier. I think
:06:50. > :06:54.people should not be getting hung up on first and Deputy First Minister.
:06:55. > :07:01.Well, the unionists R. Well, there are a lot who don't -- are. This is
:07:02. > :07:06.what I am saying. We need a psychological shift now. It is
:07:07. > :07:12.50-50. Our society in the north is moving and changing and shifting.
:07:13. > :07:18.And also, earlier, John, we were debating Brexit, I am not saying
:07:19. > :07:23.Brexit was... What I am saying is it was one of the key issues and one of
:07:24. > :07:28.the reasons people came out to vote. So many people on the door said to
:07:29. > :07:33.me we don't want to be left here on our own in this little, in the six
:07:34. > :07:37.counties. I don't want to go back to that, because I want to try to look
:07:38. > :07:41.ahead. The reason they support us is not growth in the north but also in
:07:42. > :07:47.the south. Your thoughts as we enter the last minutes? I think for both
:07:48. > :07:52.political communities, it is time for a rethink. I hear what Sinn Fein
:07:53. > :07:58.say about equality and respect and it does resonate very widely in the
:07:59. > :08:02.Catholic community. And in what used to be a minority which is definitely
:08:03. > :08:07.no longer a minority. But they have to carry it a little further than
:08:08. > :08:12.that. They have to watch it on their language always. They need to go
:08:13. > :08:19.easy on things like commemorating, as Michelle did, which of course she
:08:20. > :08:22.had to do, as the first clean skin leader, but they have to watch it
:08:23. > :08:25.because it doesn't look like respect, and for unionism it is a
:08:26. > :08:30.bigger question, they lost the majority in any real sense, that is
:08:31. > :08:34.a big psychological blow right through unionism, and it really
:08:35. > :08:38.ought to call for a rethink not just from Arlene Foster, it has been
:08:39. > :08:45.personalised around her, but she isn't a single voice inside the DUP,
:08:46. > :08:51.she speaks, she spoke for DUP, in her arrogance, that has to be
:08:52. > :09:02.harbouring today. I think viewers on BBC Northern Ireland will be Dell --
:09:03. > :09:09.will be with us. We think that some results are about to come in. They
:09:10. > :09:13.could shake things. It would be otherwise to head to bed when some
:09:14. > :09:21.of the critical announcements might be just about to be made Stephen,
:09:22. > :09:25.Katrina made the point unionists shouldn't get hung up about some
:09:26. > :09:29.other things they get hung up on. You know these people well. You work
:09:30. > :09:33.with them. You have worked with lots of people and you made the point, I
:09:34. > :09:42.don't know if people caught it, you set people are hung up on it and it
:09:43. > :09:47.matters to them. It does matter. It was part of the DUP narrative for
:09:48. > :09:52.the election, front and centre. Just as a side issue for some but an
:09:53. > :10:00.important issue for others. If the DUP get to save 28, I think that
:10:01. > :10:06.their views on same-sex marriage, it will not be as easily come by and I
:10:07. > :10:10.think it would be an amazing and there will be a enormous pressure to
:10:11. > :10:15.making us like the rest of the UK in relation to that. What you think the
:10:16. > :10:21.executive McAllister, if it is running up again, might look like,
:10:22. > :10:27.presumably the DUP and Sinn Fein, but might it include the Alliance
:10:28. > :10:32.party? Do you assume the Also unionists would be in some sort of
:10:33. > :10:37.position? I think the alliance will qualify for the seventh ministry.
:10:38. > :10:45.And whether there is pressure from Sinn Fein to bring justice into it.
:10:46. > :10:49.I don't know. I think Alliance, if... They will stick with their
:10:50. > :10:54.demands on as Naomi said earlier, the things they wanted to look at,
:10:55. > :11:00.that might somehow have naturally... That people might have answered how
:11:01. > :11:09.to change the petition of concern because it is not going to be easy
:11:10. > :11:13.to come by. Unionism, and I do this, I nearly gave up my political career
:11:14. > :11:16.by telling union sometimes you are going down the wrong road on things
:11:17. > :11:21.like Irish language, instead of reflecting the Presbyterians save
:11:22. > :11:25.the language after the famine, that, you know, after the early days of
:11:26. > :11:29.home rule, the Irish and English were on the welcome sight, or when
:11:30. > :11:33.Queen Victoria visited Belfast, somehow someone came along and said
:11:34. > :11:39.this doesn't belong to you, Mark, you know, and we all took a role and
:11:40. > :11:46.went home. Instead of actually just saying this is part of my heritage
:11:47. > :11:52.just as much as yours, I am as Irish as Katrina, but identity shifts, and
:11:53. > :12:00.the fight over the First Minister stuff has worked well for the DUP in
:12:01. > :12:06.the elections I was involved in in '07 and '11 and '16, and it hasn't
:12:07. > :12:11.worked as well this time, but creating these men of straw and then
:12:12. > :12:17.wondering why nobody response, instead of actually, we need to get
:12:18. > :12:20.back to what is it we want to do, we want to be First Minister and
:12:21. > :12:23.minister, unique purpose, you want to deal with that power and
:12:24. > :12:29.responsibility, well, the waiting list is going, rising at a rate of
:12:30. > :12:36.knots, what are we doing on health, and instead of fighting over things
:12:37. > :12:41.that we don't need to, so we turned it into... Sam McBride said there
:12:42. > :12:48.has been an awful day for unionism. And unionism has to reflect. And
:12:49. > :12:52.that's why I have always said moving to one big party isn't a good idea.
:12:53. > :12:58.It is why I was against unionists. You need to give choice and change.
:12:59. > :13:03.And I hope the all star unionist party and DUP stay in the opposition
:13:04. > :13:09.-- all star unionist party. There is a lot of food for thought. There are
:13:10. > :13:18.80 seats which come in would just be Newport up. The DUP and Sinn Fein
:13:19. > :13:22.are closed on this -- on it and tuck. We will be here for the next
:13:23. > :13:26.half-hour on BBC One Northern Ireland but at this stage we say
:13:27. > :13:29.goodbye to viewers on the News Tamil who have been with us for the
:13:30. > :13:36.election coverage. Thank you for your coverage. Goodbye. -- news
:13:37. > :13:37.channel. Good evening. If you're heading to bed wondering what is in