:00:00. > :00:13.30 children in one British city living with the threat of murder.
:00:14. > :00:15.When young kids are getting shot at seven years of age,
:00:16. > :00:19.Some people can't believe what has actually happened.
:00:20. > :00:22.A generation growing up with gang violence - and the promise
:00:23. > :00:30.Lee walked up to go to the toilet and the coward shot him in the back.
:00:31. > :00:34.The bullet went straight through his heart.
:00:35. > :00:39.Grenades, machetes and machine guns on the streets.
:00:40. > :00:45.A war over territory, a war over disrespecting.
:00:46. > :00:54.It's a cycle that can only be broken when there's enough bloodletting.
:00:55. > :00:57.Tonight on Panorama, we speak to those at the heart
:00:58. > :01:08.The police don't control the streets.
:01:09. > :01:29.And we ask can the police ever beat the gangs?
:01:30. > :01:34.Salford, Greater Manchester: Population - 234,000.
:01:35. > :01:52.A grenade thrown through the window of a house here.
:01:53. > :01:56.And a man shot dead with a machine gun, on the driveway of his home,
:01:57. > :02:07.There probably isn't a weapon in the books that hasn't been used -
:02:08. > :02:09.machetes, chainsaws, Uzi machine guns, firearms,
:02:10. > :02:19.Patricia Erdmann knows what it's like to live on the front line
:02:20. > :02:23.of one of Britain's bloodiest gang wars.
:02:24. > :02:31.You can see how close we was just by looking at it.
:02:32. > :02:37.He absolutely adored his children, absolutely adored them.
:02:38. > :02:46.She says her son wasn't in gang, but police sources say he fell out
:02:47. > :02:58.Don't get me wrong, he wasn't no angel but if trouble come
:02:59. > :03:08.In this CCTV footage, Lee has just hours to live.
:03:09. > :03:13.Later that night he went to another pub, The Wellington.
:03:14. > :03:21.And in front of around 30 witnesses he was murdered.
:03:22. > :03:29.Lee walked up to go to the toilet and the coward shot him in the back.
:03:30. > :03:34.The bullet went straight through his heart and he just fell
:03:35. > :03:38.to the floor and then he went up to him and shot him in the chest
:03:39. > :03:44.again and the bullet went through his chest and into the floor.
:03:45. > :03:53.And then he just stamped constantly all over his face.
:03:54. > :03:55.After he'd shot Lee, well, he just threatened everybody
:03:56. > :04:04.The killer stole the CCTV footage and not one person has been prepared
:04:05. > :04:12.The police call it a wall of silence.
:04:13. > :04:17.Lee Erdmann's murder in 2011 remains unsolved.
:04:18. > :04:21.There's 30 people in that pub - mothers!
:04:22. > :04:32.Everybody in Salford knows who killed Lee.
:04:33. > :04:35.The police say without more evidence they can't prove it.
:04:36. > :04:38.And they've warned Patricia that her life's at risk
:04:39. > :04:42.She's already been forced to move house.
:04:43. > :04:48.Salford's just gone really horrible since that happened to Lee.
:04:49. > :05:04.It's like the murder never really happened and that's sad.
:05:05. > :05:09.The impression will be that people are above the law
:05:10. > :05:13.and despite everybody's best efforts and the years that have passed
:05:14. > :05:16.since that murder, nobody has been brought to justice and clearly some
:05:17. > :05:26.individuals will feel that they can get away with murder.
:05:27. > :05:29.We're on the Duchy Estate in Salford and this was the scene
:05:30. > :05:37.The traditional crime for Salford criminals was armed robbery.
:05:38. > :05:40.Over the years that's got more difficult to do,
:05:41. > :05:43.so we see them moving in to other areas such as extortion,
:05:44. > :05:53.He was a detective for more than 30 years.
:05:54. > :05:56.When he left the force he ran a council project,
:05:57. > :06:00.project Gulf, to crack down on organised crime.
:06:01. > :06:04.In Salford you have long standing dynastic families who come together
:06:05. > :06:12.I was a detective sergeant here in 1983.
:06:13. > :06:16.We're still talking about the same families, the same names.
:06:17. > :06:20.So they've been around for decades and influencing communities in areas
:06:21. > :06:35.And no one had more influence than this man - Paul Massey.
:06:36. > :06:39.He was filmed in the 1990s for a BBC documentary.
:06:40. > :06:46.I've realised that for years, if it's meant to happen,
:06:47. > :06:55.then it's meant to happen and that's the end of it.
:06:56. > :07:02.I'm prepared to face it but I pity the be said who did it after.
:07:03. > :07:04.I've got personal friends all over and they wouldn't lie in bed
:07:05. > :07:06.at night if something happened to me.
:07:07. > :07:13.The programme was never broadcast because he stabbed a man
:07:14. > :07:21.Former armed robber, Jason Coghlan, who was a member of Massey's firm,
:07:22. > :07:30.says there were two sides to him even back then.
:07:31. > :07:34.Paul Massey helped ten more people than he ever hurt,
:07:35. > :07:43.Paul Massey was able to knock on gangsters doors,
:07:44. > :07:50."Come here, he is in, he is, get him downstairs."
:07:51. > :07:53.Paul would get 'em down, "What you doing, letting shots off
:07:54. > :08:04.I love him and I will love Paul Massey till my dying day.
:08:05. > :08:07.I don't buy it and I don't think the vast majority of people buy
:08:08. > :08:12.Paul Massey, or the Krays or any of these violent,
:08:13. > :08:23.They're nasty villains who deserve to be in prison.
:08:24. > :08:25.But such was his standing within the community,
:08:26. > :08:28.Paul Massey felt confident enough to ask Salford to elect him
:08:29. > :08:37.I've got a passion for Salford because I was born and bred here.
:08:38. > :08:40.I want to help the elderly and I want to help the youth
:08:41. > :08:42.and I want to reduce crime and the problems with drugs
:08:43. > :09:01.Paul Massey said he hated heroine. But he was investigated for dealing
:09:02. > :09:03.in amphetamines. Even so, nearly 2,000 people
:09:04. > :09:05.voted for him. Were they looking to him to do
:09:06. > :09:08.what the police couldn't, I have no doubt whatsoever
:09:09. > :09:14.that there are people who lack confidence in the police
:09:15. > :09:17.and there are all sort of reasons My impression from those who work
:09:18. > :09:23.in intelligence with the police is that they're doing their best but
:09:24. > :09:26.there is still this trust deficit. While Paul Massey was taking
:09:27. > :09:30.advantage of that trust deficit, trying to make his name in politics,
:09:31. > :09:33.a new gang was beginning The A-Team suddenly emerged
:09:34. > :09:44.from nowhere as a group together and began to make in-roads
:09:45. > :09:47.in to the drug dealing in parts of Salford,
:09:48. > :09:56.in quite a forceful way. Panorama has spoken to a leading
:09:57. > :10:00.figure in Salford's gangs. He wouldn't be interviewed on camera
:10:01. > :10:13.so this actor is speaking his words. The A-Team is probably the most
:10:14. > :10:16.powerful gang ever up here. It's strong because of the numbers
:10:17. > :10:19.and the massive amount of loyalty. There's power in numbers
:10:20. > :10:21.and a massive, strong But in July 2014, that
:10:22. > :10:26.loyalty was tested. The A-Team split into opposing
:10:27. > :10:30.factions and went to war. It all started with a row in this
:10:31. > :10:33.cafe, according to these The split was so bitter that one
:10:34. > :10:41.faction even hid tracking devices on the cars of their enemies
:10:42. > :10:46.so they could hunt them down. A woman had her car roof cut off
:10:47. > :10:51.by masked men using a chainsaw. None of those injured co-operated
:10:52. > :10:54.with the police, and all of them Graham Stringer has been an MP
:10:55. > :11:09.here since 1997 and believes the police have let the violence
:11:10. > :11:15.get out of control. A number of acts of violence
:11:16. > :11:20.and murder have been carried out and the culprits haven't
:11:21. > :11:23.been brought to justice. The police need to do more,
:11:24. > :11:26.they need to find these people who've committed crimes
:11:27. > :11:28.and they need to bring I am concerned about the level
:11:29. > :11:35.of violence that has been used in some of these incidents
:11:36. > :11:37.in general because they often have We have a well developed,
:11:38. > :11:47.well resourced, well thought through and planned way to respond
:11:48. > :11:54.to the recent upsurge in violence. But getting on top of the situation
:11:55. > :12:01.might be easier said than done. This footage shows Salford youths
:12:02. > :12:04.attacking CCTV towers Nobody has any respect or confidence
:12:05. > :12:17.in the police in Salford. The police don't control
:12:18. > :12:23.the streets, as seen of late. Gangster turned politician
:12:24. > :12:26.Paul Massey wanted to stand for mayor again this year
:12:27. > :12:29.but his political ambitions He'd dialled 999 himself,
:12:30. > :12:36.telling police he had been shot Paul Massey, the man who'd
:12:37. > :12:46.predicted his own death, was murdered with a machine gun,
:12:47. > :12:59.in a hit linked to the A-Team feud. Will you catch the person that did
:13:00. > :13:03.it or will it become another unsolved murder
:13:04. > :13:12.in Salford? positive about the progress of that
:13:13. > :13:18.investigation. Seven months after his death
:13:19. > :13:21.no-one has been charged. His closest friends say
:13:22. > :13:26.there will be consequences. There's a lot of people that
:13:27. > :13:30.are very unhappy the way it happened and there's a lot of retribution
:13:31. > :13:33.that will take place, Paul Ferris was once one of the UK's
:13:34. > :13:46.most notorious underworld figures. A convicted gun runner,
:13:47. > :13:48.he moved to Salford in the early '90s after being acquitted
:13:49. > :14:00.of a murder in Glasgow. Ferris, who became a close
:14:01. > :14:03.friend of Paul Massey's, now writes books
:14:04. > :14:07.about his criminal past. This is me and Paul just embracing
:14:08. > :14:12.before his mum was laid to rest. Shows a bit of grief
:14:13. > :14:20.and a bit of respect. It's a never ending cycle and it's
:14:21. > :14:23.a cycle that can only be broken Surely street justice,
:14:24. > :14:32.more deaths isn't the way there for law and order
:14:33. > :14:43.and the authorities then you wouldn't need to be doing
:14:44. > :14:45.that in the first place People should have enough trust
:14:46. > :14:50.in the authorities to go up them What if the police find
:14:51. > :14:55.the person that did it? If the police found the person
:14:56. > :14:58.who did it, they've got There are a lot of friends of Paul's
:14:59. > :15:05.who are still in prison. The general public
:15:06. > :15:08.have nothing to fear. Once street justice is served
:15:09. > :15:10.on the people who killed Paul Massey then things in Salford
:15:11. > :15:12.will get back to normal. This will only end one way and it
:15:13. > :15:15.won't end well for the people Panorama understands that there have
:15:16. > :15:24.already been repercussions both Since Paul Massey's killing,
:15:25. > :15:34.there have been seven attempted murders in Salford -
:15:35. > :15:40.six involving guns. Even children have been
:15:41. > :15:45.caught in the crossfire. Gunmen targeted this house looking
:15:46. > :15:50.for a man called Christian Hickey. When his wife Jayne answered
:15:51. > :15:53.the door, they shot her For me it crossed a line where even
:15:54. > :16:04.for those people who do have a distrust of policing
:16:05. > :16:07.or haven't had a positive relationship with policing in that
:16:08. > :16:11.past, that is an incident for me Come forward and tell us
:16:12. > :16:20.what you know about what's happened. At Christmas, the boy asked Santa
:16:21. > :16:24.to help the police catch the men So far the police have
:16:25. > :16:30.been unsuccessful. The fact that you can shoot a child
:16:31. > :16:34.tells me that this is getting very serious and these people are very
:16:35. > :16:45.much out of control. When police believe someone's life
:16:46. > :16:48.is at risk they have a duty Officers hand over a letter
:16:49. > :16:53.- usually in person - Official figures obtained
:16:54. > :17:05.by Panorama reveal that 30 children in Salford live in households
:17:06. > :17:09.where a family member is at risk of being murdered,
:17:10. > :17:13.or murdering someone. That's a whole classroom
:17:14. > :17:20.full of children. Does it sadden you that children
:17:21. > :17:23.are being dragged in to this? It always saddens me when children
:17:24. > :17:26.are dragged in to it, not just children, females,
:17:27. > :17:31.elderly people, non-combatants, But, I think the kind of hatred
:17:32. > :17:41.and disgust at what happened to Paul is underestimated and this will go
:17:42. > :17:49.on for a number of years, The cycle of violence has led
:17:50. > :17:59.to police warning a large number of people in Salford
:18:00. > :18:03.that their lives are at risk. Last year, police say
:18:04. > :18:06.there were more than 100 threat In Sunderland, a similar-sized city,
:18:07. > :18:13.there was just five. Threats to life warnings
:18:14. > :18:14.are collected like birthday It's an everyday occurrence,
:18:15. > :18:22.it's not a big deal. Greater Manchester Police say
:18:23. > :18:29.they have made roughly 170 arrests in the last 12 months in Salford,
:18:30. > :18:33.recovered 18 firearms and taken out 13 civil injunctions against people
:18:34. > :18:44.involved in organised crime. But the police know it'll take more
:18:45. > :18:49.than knocking down doors. They've commissioned research
:18:50. > :18:51.into organised criminal It found that many gang members
:18:52. > :18:57.start young and move quickly What we saw from the research
:18:58. > :19:05.was there were families who seemed to have parents and even
:19:06. > :19:10.grandparents that were If you start to see violence
:19:11. > :19:18.at an early age, then you become more accepting of it and then it's
:19:19. > :19:22.not a great leap to jump from there to understand why some
:19:23. > :19:27.of these individuals are more likely to be prepared to use violence
:19:28. > :19:32.as they become older and more Nazir Afzal helped expose
:19:33. > :19:45.the North West's grooming scandal and believes young people who end up
:19:46. > :19:48.in criminal gangs are exploited I've dealt with grooming for sex,
:19:49. > :19:54.I've dealt with grooming for ideology and there's grooming
:19:55. > :19:58.for organised crime. And a lot of that happens,
:19:59. > :20:01.young people are enticed, It takes enormous courage
:20:02. > :20:10.to step out because - you either end up in
:20:11. > :20:25.Manchester Strangeways or a coffin. It's just a fact of life,
:20:26. > :20:28.it's what happens. In this walk of life,
:20:29. > :20:32.in Manchester and Salford, a lot of your friends will get
:20:33. > :20:34.murdered and there'll be Mick Hurley's research says
:20:35. > :20:43.the violence can mean that some professionals, who should
:20:44. > :20:46.be helping families, are too afraid to intervene
:20:47. > :20:52.and the police can't do it alone. I don't think we can
:20:53. > :20:57.arrest our way out of the problem. There needs to be a role that
:20:58. > :20:59.includes looking at, quite early on, how those
:21:00. > :21:06.individuals who become involved in organised crime find their way
:21:07. > :21:14.in there and to look to stop it. Graham Cooper spent time in prison
:21:15. > :21:33.in his teens and early 20s. He now works with young
:21:34. > :21:34.people in Salford. So how do you try to stop
:21:35. > :21:42.the attraction of organised crime? We are standing up, we are saying
:21:43. > :21:46.stop, enough's enough. We can't put ourselves physically
:21:47. > :21:49.in front of these sort of people. What we can kind of try and do
:21:50. > :21:53.is give alternatives and different options, like youth clubs,
:21:54. > :21:55.places for them to go, He doesn't believe Salford's gang
:21:56. > :22:00.problem is any different The reality is, when they're
:22:01. > :22:04.actually engaged in gangs at a certain age, it might be too
:22:05. > :22:07.late, some people choose to become I think the solution
:22:08. > :22:11.is to start early, 12, We can actually identify traits
:22:12. > :22:15.within young people who are excluded from school, disengaged
:22:16. > :22:19.from Pupil Referral Units, therefore they're getting
:22:20. > :22:22.further and further away. Who needs to be stepping
:22:23. > :22:23.in and helping them? But I think, more importantly
:22:24. > :22:26.in Salford, there are There are lots of jobs going out
:22:27. > :22:29.there but they're not coming With Graham's help, this Salford
:22:30. > :22:40.engineering firm is offering apprenticeships to locals
:22:41. > :22:44.from tough backgrounds. Some - but by no means all - have
:22:45. > :22:52.been in trouble with the police. The first thing I learned
:22:53. > :22:54.about school was how to climb I used to get into all kinds
:22:55. > :23:01.of trouble like nicking cars, Were you
:23:02. > :23:11.on a dangerous path? If I would have carried on,
:23:12. > :23:15.then I probably would have We had nothing to offer
:23:16. > :23:24.them, nothing at all. I mean, I'm here because there's
:23:25. > :23:32.been violence that is so shocking. It's all about money,
:23:33. > :23:37.so they're fighting for patches, people are getting shot,
:23:38. > :23:40.stabbed and stuff like that but it's There's two ways of getting money -
:23:41. > :23:45.you go out and earn it or you go out Taking it you've got the police
:23:46. > :23:48.on your back all the time. No-one wants to live like that,
:23:49. > :23:51.they want to be able to spend their money and relax
:23:52. > :23:56.and enjoy it. That's one of the best
:23:57. > :24:01.rallies we've had that... Graham says the shooting of a child
:24:02. > :24:05.in Salford was a turning point. People are upset and some
:24:06. > :24:14.people can't believe I can't believe it's
:24:15. > :24:17.happened either. He says people in Salford haven't
:24:18. > :24:20.turned their back on the police but they can't do
:24:21. > :24:26.their job for them. This thing about there's a wall
:24:27. > :24:28.of silence in Salford, not when young kids are getting shot
:24:29. > :24:30.at seven years of age. It's not a wall of silence
:24:31. > :24:32.there's a lot of anger, but there's more anger from people
:24:33. > :24:35.like myself about the police saying How do you think that makes people
:24:36. > :24:39.like us feel when we're doing It actually makes you feel like not
:24:40. > :24:44.talking to the police because realistically they've
:24:45. > :24:48.already got that information. It's our responsibility
:24:49. > :24:53.as the police service to do everything we can to bring
:24:54. > :24:56.the skills and the powers that we However, if you are a witness,
:24:57. > :25:02.or you are somebody who's got information about that murder,
:25:03. > :25:04.I do think you also have the responsibility to work
:25:05. > :25:08.with us so that we can successfully prosecute somebody
:25:09. > :25:20.for that incident. It might seem a world away
:25:21. > :25:24.from Salford's streets, but here in the Costa Del Sol
:25:25. > :25:26.Salford is never very far from the thoughts of former armed
:25:27. > :25:34.robber Jason Coghlan. Jason was once one of Britain's most
:25:35. > :25:37.wanted men after breaking out of the dock in court
:25:38. > :25:41.and going on the run. I've done 15-and-a-half years
:25:42. > :25:56.actually in prison. I've got two little girls that have
:25:57. > :26:07.grown up without me around. Jason says he's gone straight
:26:08. > :26:16.but he still deals with criminals. He now works with Spanish lawyers
:26:17. > :26:19.advising ex-pats facing He says it's only now that
:26:20. > :26:28.he realises the cost For anyone, any young person that's
:26:29. > :26:36.getting themselves involved in this kind of life, you know
:26:37. > :26:39.what I would say? I wish you could wind the tape on,
:26:40. > :26:43.I wish you could see what's I couldn't see it, me,
:26:44. > :26:48.when I was a young kid. It just all seemed like fun
:26:49. > :26:51.and games and it's all great - and it is, it is, there's no way
:26:52. > :26:56.getting around it. But the end result of it isn't
:26:57. > :27:08.exciting and fun and games. It comes back and it hurts ya,
:27:09. > :27:13.it really does hurt ya, I've struggled, I've struggled
:27:14. > :27:22.with mental health issues, I have. And all of it is because of
:27:23. > :27:31.the weight of, the gravity of stuff that catches up on ya of what you've
:27:32. > :27:56.done, that's true. This weekend more gunshots
:27:57. > :28:01.were fired in Salford. The police claim that they're
:28:02. > :28:04.winning the battle against the gangs But breaking the cycle of gangs
:28:05. > :28:12.and guns is crucial. Otherwise, another generation
:28:13. > :28:15.will learn the hard way that you can leave the gangs behind, but never
:28:16. > :28:58.the scars of a violent past. I've had a message from China,
:28:59. > :29:01.from my birth mother. How far would you go to save
:29:02. > :29:10.the family who gave you up?