09/09/2011

:00:10. > :00:14.Afternoon afternoon. It's political conference - and first up, Plaid

:00:14. > :00:19.Cymru here in Llandudno. After disappointing election in in May,

:00:19. > :00:29.this this ALL: About renewal so so where next for Plaid Cymru? Stay

:00:29. > :00:40.

:00:40. > :00:43.with us for the hours hours for all the speeches ALL: The debate.

:00:44. > :00:46.In the next half an hour or so - Ieuan Wyn Jones will deliver his

:00:47. > :00:50.last speech to conference as as leader before he stands down in the

:00:51. > :00:55.spring. We'll bring you that live, all the reaction, and all the

:00:55. > :01:00.debate about who should succeed him and which direction he or she

:01:00. > :01:04.should take the party. Watching every move, our political editor.

:01:04. > :01:08.Good afternoon. And to you. Let's put it in context. It's a difficult

:01:08. > :01:11.year for Plaid Cymru. Yes, exceedingly difficult. They have

:01:11. > :01:16.had a taste of government. Ieuan Wyn Jones took them into government,

:01:16. > :01:21.and then had this bruising defeat in May's election and lost their

:01:21. > :01:25.grip on power - not just that, but dropped to third place in Welsh

:01:25. > :01:28.Assembly politics. The meeting in Llandudno, they're not down and out

:01:28. > :01:32.by any means or flat, either, I think they're up for a fight, but

:01:32. > :01:37.the bad news is they've got a fight on their hands. They need to find a

:01:37. > :01:47.new leader and find fundamentally where they're going now as a party.

:01:47. > :01:47.

:01:47. > :01:57.We'll introduce the rest of the team in the hall bringing us the

:01:57. > :02:00.

:02:00. > :02:06.events is Kill Elin Gwilym. Ieuan Wyn Jones is expected on stage at

:02:06. > :02:09.2.30. It's his heart speech as party leader. We'll hear from him

:02:09. > :02:15.later on in the programme. Thank you very much. Outside the hall

:02:15. > :02:19.talking to all the delegates, Mark Hannaby. How is it looking? I hope

:02:19. > :02:23.to speak to delegates from across the length and breadth of Wales to

:02:23. > :02:25.answer the question you put earlier: what next for Plaid Cymru?

:02:26. > :02:29.This is a real crossroads moment for them because not only are they

:02:29. > :02:32.about to say goodbye to Ieuan Wyn Jones, but they've got that odd

:02:32. > :02:37.situation where they've achieved a number of their main aims, and

:02:37. > :02:40.helping bring about the full powers, law-making powers for the National

:02:40. > :02:46.Assembly, statement as they suffered electorally. What is the

:02:46. > :02:51.answer to that conundrum? How does a new leader put it forward? I'll

:02:51. > :02:56.be trying to get as much information as I can. Back to Ieuan

:02:56. > :03:00.Wyn Jones this afternoon. He's got to get the tone right, hasn't he?

:03:00. > :03:03.It's a very personal speech we're expecting. What is the mood going

:03:03. > :03:08.to be like because he's famous on deciding on the mood beforehand how

:03:08. > :03:12.he does it, so he either learns it all and doesn't have a copy of

:03:12. > :03:15.anything in front of him, or other times he's bound to the desk and

:03:15. > :03:19.had reads the speech. He said, clearly, it's going to be very

:03:19. > :03:23.different. It must be, because he wants to set out some sort of path

:03:23. > :03:26.that he thinks is right for this party in the future, but he can't

:03:26. > :03:29.bind or tie the bind or tie the hands standing standing here next

:03:29. > :03:35.year giving the speech. We know what he, don't, don't we that the

:03:35. > :03:39.duty for Plaid Cymru is to get back into - to take things slowly, to on

:03:39. > :03:43.the proper on the proper found they they decide where they go next, but

:03:43. > :03:47.that they not not treat to the treat to the hard go go back to

:03:47. > :03:51.that come zone zone of their Welsh- speaking heart, they have to, they

:03:51. > :03:55.have to try as as a range of voters as possible because the number one

:03:55. > :03:57.aim has to be to get back into government. What about the aim of

:03:57. > :04:02.independence? We talk about it in every conference, but they are

:04:02. > :04:08.discussing this tomorrow, and some moves about let's trumpet it a bit

:04:08. > :04:11.more? Yes, they've gone full circle on this a few times, it seems to me.

:04:11. > :04:13.Many times in the past, they'll have done that again. There were

:04:13. > :04:16.those conferences where they were not to mention the word

:04:16. > :04:23."independence", and you and I and other reporters will be listening

:04:23. > :04:29.for the "i" word. Then there was the conference a fou years ago

:04:29. > :04:35.where Where elyin Jones said it. Adam Price said the party should

:04:35. > :04:38.own that word. It sounds like Louis and the X Factor saying you need to

:04:38. > :04:42.owe that stage, but rather than people throwing it at us, let's use

:04:42. > :04:45.it and explain what you mean by it. We're not going to get there

:04:45. > :04:50.without people's support. If you don't want it, it will not happen.

:04:50. > :04:53.They seem to be coming back to the view that Plaid will say what

:04:53. > :04:56.independence means to them. Let's face it, what is happening in

:04:56. > :05:01.Scotland, people will be seeing and reading about that, aware what

:05:01. > :05:06.independence actually means now. Does it mean having your own

:05:06. > :05:10.fighter jets? What does independence mean for those Welsh

:05:10. > :05:14.voters? Dafydd Elis Thomas leadership candidate, possibly,

:05:14. > :05:19.saying it's a mirage to talk about independence. Let's talk about real

:05:19. > :05:23.politics and that's got one or two hot under the collar here while the

:05:23. > :05:27.party is trying to reclaim the word but all sorts of fundamental issues

:05:27. > :05:37.that Plaid need to decide. mentioned the leadership contest.

:05:37. > :05:38.

:05:38. > :05:43.Who is in it now? Who are the official candidates so far? Elin

:05:43. > :05:48.Jones, Dafydd Thomas saying he's intending to go for it as well. The

:05:48. > :05:54.first name I heard Leanne Wood towards the left of the party, a

:05:54. > :05:58.very different appeal perhaps to Elin Jones. Simon Thomas is

:05:58. > :06:01.mentioned - I think it's pair to say that perhaps there was an

:06:01. > :06:04.obvious name in Adam Price but given he can't stand, is not

:06:04. > :06:09.standing, then he's not an obvious candidate. It's a pretty open field.

:06:09. > :06:14.But people are not grabbing for the one name, they're saying, "Let's

:06:14. > :06:17.listen to what they have to say." And there is no rush, is there?

:06:18. > :06:23.it will be next March before we know who the next leader is. It can

:06:23. > :06:26.work in a party's favour or it can get messy. Plaid's job is with

:06:26. > :06:29.these fundamental decisions is to keep them as clean as possible and

:06:29. > :06:37.not make them messy, I suppose. Ieuan Wyn Jones in 20 minutes will

:06:37. > :06:43.stand up there, an emotional time for him. Really - because there's a

:06:43. > :06:46.game going on, bingo about the speech? What does that mean an

:06:46. > :06:51.interesting debate from this morning was about the future of

:06:51. > :06:56.broadcasting in Wales. There was a motion down calling on conference

:06:56. > :06:59.calling for those to fight for the future of S4C and indeed

:06:59. > :07:03.broadcasting in all its glory in Wales at the moment, or lack of.

:07:03. > :07:06.That bit is easy. Then there is this added little bit asking

:07:06. > :07:12.conference to support those who will decide not to pay their

:07:12. > :07:15.licence fee, in other words, break the law. You had Lord Dafydd Ellis

:07:15. > :07:18.Thom mace say don't do this, we're a constitutional political party.

:07:18. > :07:22.Let's not move the clock back to those days when we were, if you

:07:22. > :07:26.like, campaigning a movement, a pressure group. We're not that. But

:07:26. > :07:31.you had a fleet of other speakers saying no, hang on, we need to

:07:31. > :07:36.deserve that title "national political party". Leanne Leanne

:07:36. > :07:44.Wood saying it's not just about institutions, it is about

:07:44. > :07:47.campaigning. In the end, I saw two hands going up in support of Lord

:07:47. > :07:50.Ellis's argument, nearly unanimous not quite calling on people to not

:07:50. > :07:56.pay their license but supporting those who won't. What is Plaid

:07:56. > :08:01.going to be about? How will it communicate its message? Eurfyl ap

:08:01. > :08:05.Gwilym is the one who will be telling them what he has found over

:08:05. > :08:08.the last few months. An example where things can get a bit heated

:08:08. > :08:11.and a bit messy but where there will need to be a clean decision in

:08:12. > :08:17.the end. We will bring you more by the way on that debate.

:08:17. > :08:22.First, let's go back to Mark Hannaby. I can see delegates going

:08:22. > :08:32.into the hall ready for their speech. They're being stopped by

:08:32. > :08:35.

:08:35. > :08:38.Mark. Yes, people getting excited by that speech. I'm joined by three

:08:38. > :08:41.members of Plaid. I want to ask you each of you in

:08:41. > :08:46.turn, what are you looking for from this speech? I think more than

:08:46. > :08:50.anything some reflection, but also looking forward. Obviously, it will

:08:50. > :08:53.be his last speech as our leader and I think the fact that he has

:08:54. > :08:56.been the leader so long to reflect on that time and think where we go

:08:56. > :08:59.now forward as a party in a positive way. Do you think there's

:08:59. > :09:04.a danger you can spend a bit too much time thinking about where you

:09:04. > :09:07.go next? It's already a few months since the election. Are you looking

:09:07. > :09:10.for Ieuan Wyn Jones in putting down the baton to give a clear

:09:10. > :09:14.indication of where the party goes next? We're in a period of

:09:14. > :09:17.reflection, but it is a very strong sense in the party that we want to

:09:17. > :09:23.move on, move from perhaps being, aiming to be the second party to

:09:23. > :09:26.being the major party to leading our nation because having secured

:09:26. > :09:29.the referendum on law-making powers, it's all to play for. I think we

:09:29. > :09:33.have had enough of Labour since the election wasting that opportunity

:09:33. > :09:37.of our first law-making parliament and we want to move on, be able to

:09:37. > :09:41.use it, and I think perhaps if I've got any frustrations at all about

:09:41. > :09:45.the last election, maybe we didn't make enough of the norms strides

:09:45. > :09:50.that we made in government. I want maybe to reflect on that a little

:09:50. > :09:58.bit, the huge growth in affordable housing, the first Welsh language

:09:58. > :10:02.act to really extend into the private sector. I want to hear

:10:02. > :10:06.reflect position tiflg on what he's done, not just for the party but

:10:06. > :10:10.for the nation. We had a briefing with Ieuan Wyn Jones a couple of

:10:11. > :10:14.days ago. He seemed to be suggesting he would be putting a

:10:14. > :10:22.positive view on things, do you want him to look towards the future

:10:22. > :10:26.though very much? Yes, I would be look to to Ieuan, a small part of

:10:26. > :10:30.reflection on his very good career as a First Minister, and the people

:10:30. > :10:36.much Wales owe a debt of gratitude to him, but I would be looking to

:10:36. > :10:40.him to inspire the members of Plaid Cymru to rally around the new

:10:40. > :10:45.leader whoever it is - not all have declared yet - but I would be

:10:45. > :10:48.looking to Ieuan to rally us to get behind our new leader and get our

:10:48. > :10:51.message across to the people of Wales. It's a positive message that

:10:51. > :10:56.we have. This conference is buzzing. It's really vibrant. Look around at

:10:56. > :11:00.all the young people. I feel a positive old man here and it is

:11:00. > :11:03.great, it's really great to see. be fair there is certainly a good

:11:03. > :11:06.atmosphere here, perhaps better than you expect when you had a

:11:06. > :11:12.pretty rotten assembly election, you lost four seats. What went

:11:12. > :11:16.wrong? We've also ha fantastic year in terms of gaining for Wales that

:11:16. > :11:20.referendum, so we are positive. took the credit for it? Some things

:11:20. > :11:22.are more important. We've moved the country forward, so we're happy.

:11:22. > :11:26.You know, it's not just about winning elections. Those are very

:11:26. > :11:30.nice and very important, and in the next assembly election, we want to

:11:30. > :11:33.be gaining seats. Of course we do, so we can progress the nation

:11:33. > :11:37.further. But this time, yes, we can learn lessons, but also focus on

:11:37. > :11:42.what we've achieved for Wales, and I'm happy to be honest to think

:11:42. > :11:45.about we've adhevd. It must be a frustration that you didn't seem to

:11:45. > :11:49.get electoral credit for what those advances may have been, most

:11:49. > :11:53.notably for law-making in the assembly. If there was a trade-off

:11:53. > :11:56.to be made, this was the one to do it. For us, we're a political party

:11:56. > :12:00.obviously but we're also a national movement. What Plaid is for is for

:12:00. > :12:05.a stronger, fairer, Wales. And we will achieve that through the

:12:05. > :12:14.referendum, and we're delighted we did that. In terms of moving

:12:14. > :12:20.forward, it's been an an norms leap - enormous leap and we're proud of

:12:21. > :12:23.that. I hear what everybody is saying about your pleas to wake

:12:23. > :12:28.foils word. Do you know what went wrong in the last election? I think

:12:28. > :12:35.it's obvious we didn't tell people what we achieved, and that message

:12:35. > :12:40.has to be more succinct next time, and we've already got this review

:12:40. > :12:43.taking place led by one of Wales' greatest thinkers. We've got a lot

:12:44. > :12:47.of thinkers in Wales. They'll put it right. We as a conference and as

:12:47. > :12:51.members will debate it, and we'll make sure that next time we'll get

:12:51. > :12:55.our message across. We heard that a member of the Scottish Parliament

:12:55. > :12:59.today how the SNP achieved. They were in the doldrums, they were

:12:59. > :13:03.riding high, and we can do just that. There's nothing like a Welsh

:13:03. > :13:06.team that is down. We will rally, and the country will rally behind

:13:06. > :13:11.us, as we will on Sunday morning. Let's hope for that result on

:13:11. > :13:15.Sunday morning to go the right way. Thank you all for joining me.

:13:15. > :13:18.Thank you, Mark. By the way, Ieuan Wyn Jones will be joining us

:13:18. > :13:23.straight after his speech, so if you've got a question for him,

:13:23. > :13:26.Tweet us if you're following us on Twitter, at Wales politics. Let us

:13:26. > :13:30.know what you would like to ask the departing leader. He'll be joining

:13:30. > :13:35.us at about 3.30. As we await his speech in the main hall, let's look

:13:35. > :13:45.back at some. Events taking place this morning. That broadcasting

:13:45. > :13:46.

:13:46. > :13:52.debate which Betsan mentioned earlier.

:13:52. > :13:56.The Western Mail reported that The politics Show, and other programmes,

:13:56. > :13:59.could face the axe, as well as all political conference coverage, and

:13:59. > :14:03.live coverage of Wales international football matches. In

:14:03. > :14:09.a country which is is exceptionally dependent on the BBC for its media

:14:09. > :14:12.coverage, this is deeply disturbinging, and I think I had

:14:12. > :14:20.better make the point quickly as the cameras are rolling, we may not

:14:20. > :14:23.have the privilege on that basis! What is the BBC for? Clause IV

:14:23. > :14:26.clause - one of the clauses is one of the purposes is representing the

:14:26. > :14:29.UK, its nations, regions and communities. Under the agreement

:14:29. > :14:34.between the BBC and the UK government signed at the time of

:14:34. > :14:37.renewal of the BBC charter in July 2006, the BBC undertook a number of

:14:37. > :14:41.commitments in respect of this charter principle. For example,

:14:41. > :14:44.developing and renewing the purpose remit for representing the UK, its

:14:44. > :14:48.nations, regions and communities. The Trust must, amongst other

:14:48. > :14:51.things, seek to ensure that the BBC promotes awareness of different

:14:51. > :14:55.cultures and alternative viewpoints, through content that reflects the

:14:55. > :14:59.lives of different people in different communities within the UK.

:14:59. > :15:02.Under the public purpose remit representing the UK, its nations

:15:02. > :15:06.and communities, the BBC undertakes to represent the different nations,

:15:06. > :15:09.and to cater for the different nations, and to represent the

:15:09. > :15:12.regions and communities to the rest of the UK.

:15:12. > :15:16.The reality, as we know, is very different. As illustrated, for

:15:16. > :15:24.example, by the panels and questions on Question Time and any

:15:24. > :15:28.answers. In the Any Questions from Gowerton in May 2010 there was no

:15:28. > :15:32.Welsh panellists in respect of of Wales. This is metropolitan BBC

:15:32. > :15:36.moving around the country like some Royal progress from the Middle Ages.

:15:36. > :15:40.Welcome though the jobs are in Cardiff Bay, I see no fulfilment of

:15:40. > :15:43.the BBC's public purposes remit in Doctor Who or Torchwood. Their

:15:43. > :15:47.visible connection to Wales is limited. A thriving media industry

:15:47. > :15:50.is to be welcomed and encouraged but this would not matter if there

:15:50. > :15:54.were other series which did fulfil the commitment to represent Wales

:15:54. > :15:58.to the rest of the UK but these are noticeable by their absence. The

:15:58. > :16:01.BBC complaints provider is - procedure is a sham, protected by

:16:01. > :16:06.they are as a huge exemption by the Freedom of Information Act in the

:16:06. > :16:11.name of journalistic freedom as I know personally. They entirely fail

:16:11. > :16:15.to live up to their promises and now want to cut BBC Wales with the

:16:15. > :16:19.scant regard this will cause in the cultural, political, and economic

:16:19. > :16:22.life of Wales. Does this scenario remind you of anything? The BBC has

:16:22. > :16:26.still not understood the meaning of devolution. Their attitude is

:16:26. > :16:29.wholly unacceptable. The BBC have failed to fulfil their remit of

:16:29. > :16:31.reflecting what is going on in different parts of the UK. It seems

:16:32. > :16:36.they're more concerned about the latest reality programmes from

:16:36. > :16:41.America than what is happening in the UK outside London. There

:16:41. > :16:45.therefore must be devolution for the BBC. Devolution in politics has

:16:45. > :16:52.at last given the people of Wales a voice in a political severe if it

:16:53. > :16:58.is time that the principle is allied in the media severe. Does

:16:58. > :17:04.anybody believe Jeremy Hunt knows anything about the cultural life of

:17:04. > :17:09.Wales despite his protestations. The BBC itself should have a

:17:09. > :17:12.federal structure. The treatment of S4C despite its statutory status,

:17:12. > :17:15.must make it clear to one and all that decisions about broadcasting

:17:15. > :17:19.in Wales can be made in Wales. We cannot afford to rely on the

:17:19. > :17:23.priorities of London to safeguard our interests. With power comes

:17:23. > :17:27.responsibility. Wales must be prepared to pay for the public

:17:27. > :17:31.broadcasters it wants, including S4C. As a party whose ambition is

:17:31. > :17:34.independence, we must plan for a sustainable public sector

:17:34. > :17:39.broadcasting future in both our languages.

:17:39. > :17:42.The current licence fee is nothing more than at that flat tax. Unlike

:17:42. > :17:50.general taxation, licence fee income in Wales is the same per

:17:50. > :17:54.head as it is in England. This licence fee is imposed on

:17:54. > :17:57.every household for the principle of watching programmes that the BBC

:17:57. > :18:02.decides to produce, with no real accountability to anyone, it seems

:18:02. > :18:07.to me. Licence fee income for the BBC in

:18:07. > :18:11.2010/11 was over 3.5 billion, so Wales' share of this would be

:18:11. > :18:18.abouts �175 million. In addition, the BBC had income from other

:18:18. > :18:21.activities of nearly 1.5 billion. Some of that should at least relate

:18:21. > :18:24.to programmes such as Doctor Who and Torchwood. This should form

:18:24. > :18:27.this financial framework - this financial framework should form the

:18:27. > :18:32.background for looking at the financial impact of Wales relying

:18:32. > :18:38.on its own licence fees paid directly from the licence payers to

:18:39. > :18:42.BBC Wales rather than going via London. In a devolved UK, BBC Cymru

:18:42. > :18:46.Wales should also be devolved. It should receive the licence fee paid

:18:46. > :18:51.in Wales directly, and an appropriate relationship both in

:18:51. > :18:53.respect of funding and programme developed with S4C. BBC Cymru Wales

:18:53. > :18:58.should buy in the content that it does not produce itself from the

:18:58. > :19:03.BBC centrally and other suppliers as it sees fit.

:19:03. > :19:07.In this way, BBC Cymru Wales could properly plan for its own budget

:19:07. > :19:11.rather than rely on what is left over when hoards of extraordinarily

:19:11. > :19:15.highly paid executives have lifted their snouts from the central

:19:15. > :19:18.trough and where dozens of reporters seem to be dispatched to

:19:18. > :19:23.tea-parties in the US when perhaps just one or two might do. These are

:19:23. > :19:27.difficult times, and require difficult decisions. This issue is

:19:27. > :19:32.by - this issue is the question of by whom those decisions are made,

:19:32. > :19:38.and for whom those decisions are made. Our democracy and society

:19:38. > :19:40.needsor a public sector broadcaster reflective of its cultural, social,

:19:40. > :19:50.economic and political aspirations. I therefore urge you to support

:19:50. > :20:26.

:20:26. > :20:29.When I submitted the motion, I didn't expect any rejection. I'm

:20:29. > :20:35.disappointed to see amendment one and I want to speak against

:20:35. > :20:41.amendment 1. I remember, as many of you, I'm sure, the long and

:20:41. > :20:48.difficult campaign in the 1970s and the 1980s to secure a channel for

:20:48. > :20:52.Wales. The establishment of S4C was one of the seminal events of the of

:20:52. > :21:01.the campaign to save the Welsh language. The Tory government had

:21:01. > :21:05.to give in and keep their promise. Here we are, once again, backing

:21:05. > :21:10.for S4C against another London government - Tories and Lib Dems

:21:10. > :21:15.this time - ten years after establishing the assembly, they

:21:15. > :21:22.published their plans for S4C without even letting the government

:21:22. > :21:25.of Wales know that in itself, as Madoc said, proves the naed to

:21:25. > :21:32.transfer responsibilities for broadcasting to the assembly, so

:21:32. > :21:36.that our politicians, our elected Welsh politicians, are responsible

:21:36. > :21:42.for S4C. But in the meantime, we must act on every level to defend

:21:42. > :21:48.it, and I, as several others, have refused to pay my licence fee in

:21:48. > :21:53.protest. The attack on S4C is an attack on the Welsh language, and

:21:53. > :22:01.it deserves the strongest possible response. So I would ask conference

:22:01. > :22:05.to show support for the campaign. We, as a party, co-operate on all

:22:05. > :22:11.levels - Westminster, assembly, local and national, and on the

:22:11. > :22:15.European level too. I have taken this up with the commissioner with

:22:15. > :22:20.responsibilities for languages. Britain has signed the minority

:22:20. > :22:25.languages charter which places a duty on the government to ensure

:22:25. > :22:30.broadcasting in those languages. So this campaign is much more

:22:30. > :22:34.important than the campaign for Wales only. It is important beyond

:22:34. > :22:39.Wales and should be seen in that European context.

:22:39. > :22:45.The protest of refusing to pay the licence fee is one part of the

:22:45. > :22:48.campaign for S4C but it is an important part. It shows how strong

:22:48. > :22:53.strong and how angry people feel, and it gives us a different

:22:53. > :23:03.platform. Of course, every individual chooses

:23:03. > :23:06.the best way he or she can act. Not everyone does the same. If every

:23:06. > :23:12.campaign acts the same, of course, but we as a party who have

:23:12. > :23:20.supported and who have led similar campaigns in the past, we should

:23:20. > :23:24.give every support now to everyone who campaigns for the future of S4C,

:23:24. > :23:30.so please don't vote for the amendment, and please support those

:23:30. > :23:40.of us who have chosen to take part in this protest. We cannot lose

:23:40. > :23:44.

:23:44. > :23:51.this opportunity. It is too important. Thank you. APPLAUSE

:23:51. > :23:54.Dafydd Elis Thomas to introduce the motion. Thank you, members and

:23:54. > :23:58.speaking on behalf of the group. I think what we have here is a motion

:23:58. > :24:03.that goes part of the way to opening new discussion on

:24:03. > :24:10.broadcasting - that discussion - in the sessions and committees of the

:24:10. > :24:13.national stefrmly, but we must also move forward quickly to a more

:24:13. > :24:17.influence on broadcasting on the agricultural policy. I think it's

:24:17. > :24:21.very important to realise, if we haven't already, as we use our

:24:21. > :24:26.media, as we have today, we should be discussing broadcasting, we

:24:26. > :24:30.should be discussing all platforms of communication. What we need is a

:24:30. > :24:34.clear communication policy for Wales through all media and through

:24:34. > :24:39.all platforms, and this policy statement is an important step

:24:39. > :24:45.towards that. But I do speak against what the

:24:45. > :24:52.president said, because I don't think amendment 1 belongs now - the

:24:52. > :24:55.paragraph, I'm sorry change in amendment belongs to the policy

:24:55. > :25:00.development of a constitutional party in its conference. It's not

:25:00. > :25:04.up to us to call on our members or any other - or any other to join

:25:04. > :25:11.any direct action campaign. That is a matter for everyone, as you said,

:25:11. > :25:16.how we wish to act. What is important is not to confuse the

:25:16. > :25:20.squgs of which we're part on a political level by adding

:25:21. > :25:26.conditions to that discussion that we support - to that discussion

:25:26. > :25:30.that we support particular organisations. I have been a member

:25:30. > :25:37.- I was a chair of the Welsh language board, but my main

:25:37. > :25:41.function here today is to ask you to concentrate Plaid Cymru's

:25:41. > :25:44.discussion on our work, ensuring there is a co-ordinated and

:25:44. > :25:48.reasonable communication policy for Wales. Can I say one other thing,

:25:48. > :25:55.we need to have democratic and effective control of public bodies

:25:55. > :25:59.in Wales which act for us. The accountability of the S4C authority,

:25:59. > :26:03.and the management of everyone in the communications field to the

:26:03. > :26:07.people of Wales, is something that we need to consider as a matter of

:26:07. > :26:13.urgency. I wish well to the new names who have moved to positions

:26:13. > :26:16.of influence within the S4C board, but we're not talking about one

:26:16. > :26:20.authority for one channel today, we're talking about the Welsh

:26:20. > :26:30.language and the Welsh nature on all communication platforms,

:26:30. > :26:31.

:26:31. > :26:36.including this excellent one here on my right.

:26:36. > :26:41.I have had a load of slips from people who wish to speak. I do

:26:41. > :26:47.apologise beforehand. Anybody who arrived late, I will miss out on

:26:47. > :26:51.the opportunity because we have two other motions we have to have in

:26:51. > :27:00.before half-past ten. The briefer your contributions, the, month of

:27:00. > :27:05.you will be able to speak. I'm supporting the motion with

:27:05. > :27:11.facts and figures which show just how bad English language television

:27:11. > :27:16.is in Wales. Madoc has dealt with the report in Western Wales and the

:27:16. > :27:20.costs to the BBC. Really, how many English language programmes dot ITV

:27:20. > :27:26.and BBC produce for us? The answer is very, very little. We don't have

:27:26. > :27:31.a national TV service in English. The reality is Welsh speakers who

:27:31. > :27:38.have S4C have a far better service. It only broadcasts 125 hours a week.

:27:38. > :27:41.The three English Channel broadcast 460 hours a week, and that puts it

:27:41. > :27:47.in perspective. The three channels broadcast Welsh news, politics,

:27:47. > :27:49.current affairs, sport and entertainment. But for the week

:27:49. > :27:58.beginning 14 May, when parliament and the certainlyly were in session,

:27:58. > :28:07.and were reported upon, BBC1, 4.5% of its production was Welsh, BBC2

:28:07. > :28:13.was 2%, ITV was under 3%. For the Eisteddfod week, BBC Wales

:28:13. > :28:17.broadcast three half-hour programmes, BBC2 bails, three half-

:28:17. > :28:24.hour programmes, ITV1 Wales, one half-hour programme, so, three and

:28:24. > :28:27.a half hours of non-news programmes on six days out of a total of 21

:28:27. > :28:33.days. That's the situation. The cuts that have been suggested could

:28:33. > :28:40.see the end of AM/PM in Cardiff Bay, we'll still get the daily politics

:28:40. > :28:44.on BBC2. Remember the for the general election, the leaders'

:28:44. > :28:48.debates. That was on network television.

:28:48. > :28:52.But we weren't involved in it. The voting public demand and need

:28:52. > :28:59.information about what our politicians are doing and saying

:28:59. > :29:01.and campaigning on, and they need it from investigative journalists

:29:01. > :29:05.working to the National Union journal I have to say' code of

:29:05. > :29:11.conduct, not from press releases and stuff pushed through letter-

:29:11. > :29:16.boxes. If we go back to predevolution days, when we weren't

:29:16. > :29:20.- when Welsh news didn't cover the assembly, we would get little, if

:29:21. > :29:26.any, TV coverage at all. The only way we're going to get a proper TV

:29:26. > :29:30.service for English and Welsh speakers that identifies and

:29:30. > :29:33.conforms to our national identity and culture is to have the

:29:33. > :29:43.broadcasting come under the control of the assembly, and have a system

:29:43. > :29:49.

:29:49. > :29:57.and a service that works for us, the people of Wales. Thank you.

:29:57. > :30:02.I think that the motion sets out the threats to broadcasting in

:30:02. > :30:07.Wales and touches on the importance of S4C to the Welsh economy. It's

:30:07. > :30:11.curious, isn't it, that the government can find billions much

:30:11. > :30:16.pounds much money to support the bankers, because that is important

:30:16. > :30:20.to the south-east of England. But it is different in Wales, for a

:30:20. > :30:26.part of our economy that is strategically important to us, that

:30:26. > :30:33.that funding isn't there for Wales. It's curious, isn't it? Maybe not

:30:33. > :30:36.that curious. We only need to look at examples like Can question Time,

:30:36. > :30:40.-- Question Time, to see that the way they treat Welsh politics is

:30:40. > :30:45.entirely different to the way in which they treat Scottish politics,

:30:45. > :30:52.for example, and the way in which they underestimate the importance

:30:52. > :30:59.of Welsh politics. For Wales, read England, is Question Time's motto.

:31:00. > :31:05.I've decided not to pay my license. Well, for those of you who know our

:31:05. > :31:09.family, Branwen has decided, and I've agreed with her, that we're

:31:09. > :31:19.not paying our license. I've done it for a specific reason. I've done

:31:19. > :31:23.it for my four-year-old daughter. I think it's important that she has a

:31:23. > :31:27.broadcasting channel that is dedicated to her language and the

:31:27. > :31:34.language of her home. I'm not paying my license on that basis.

:31:34. > :31:42.But I would like to turn now to the amendment. The curious position of

:31:42. > :31:48.the assembly group. This party has a long history of

:31:48. > :31:51.supporting campaigns. If taken at face value, the amendment by the

:31:51. > :31:54.assembly group would have meant over the years, because we're a

:31:54. > :31:59.constitutional party now, we don't support those kinds of campaigns,

:31:59. > :32:04.do we, any more? It would have meant that we wouldn't have

:32:04. > :32:08.supported the friction dynamics workers here. We shouldn't have

:32:08. > :32:12.them on the the stage, we shouldn't support those kind of campaigns. We

:32:12. > :32:16.shouldn't support the poll tax campaigners - we shouldn't have

:32:16. > :32:19.supported the poll tax campaigners, throughout the 1970s and the 1980s,

:32:19. > :32:24.we shouldn't have supported the anti-apartheid campaign. That is

:32:24. > :32:27.part of who we are. We do support campaigns. We do

:32:27. > :32:36.support other campaigning organisations, and I expect this

:32:36. > :32:46.party to support me and others who have decided not to pay our license.

:32:46. > :32:48.

:32:48. > :32:55.APPLAUSE I wanted to say a word because I

:32:55. > :33:01.was surprised - surprised and I was say it again that the assembly

:33:01. > :33:06.group of Anglesey this this major vision of asking us not to support

:33:06. > :33:14.this. I happen to be in the middle of the campaign. I was given the

:33:14. > :33:19.job in the campaign to obtain S4C, the campaign, not to pay the

:33:19. > :33:28.license. I have all their names and I've said my book - that's a plug!

:33:28. > :33:33.Concerning these names, over 2,500, and not only that, but they also

:33:33. > :33:38.paid, the working - we collected all these in addition as the money

:33:38. > :33:47.that they didn't pay to the BBC, they paid to us, into a fund. No-

:33:47. > :33:53.one else put a penny back, and that went to Plaid. It had considerable

:33:53. > :33:58.effect in the major campaign. There were so many facets to that

:33:58. > :34:05.campaign. As far as I can see, perhaps this is a first crisis that

:34:05. > :34:11.S4C has faced, really, since then. I mean, things have been rocky, but

:34:11. > :34:15.now it's a crisis. All we're saying in this explosion is asking for

:34:15. > :34:20.support. You don't have to do anything, just that you say, "We

:34:20. > :34:26.support." That's all we're asking for. Heavens above, some people say

:34:26. > :34:36.we shouldn't express our support. It sounds very odd to me, and I'm

:34:36. > :34:46.very sad to me that. All I'm asking you is please reject this useless

:34:46. > :34:47.

:34:47. > :34:51.amendment. Thank you. APPLAUSE

:34:51. > :34:56.2 I want to speak against this amendment too, because I take the

:34:56. > :35:00.view that if you feel strongly about something, you've got to do

:35:00. > :35:05.something about it. Conference, we are a political party. Our members

:35:05. > :35:09.get involved in campaigns, often more than one campaign at a time,

:35:09. > :35:14.and we are members of a number of different campaigning organisations.

:35:14. > :35:18.Of course, there are plenty of ways to campaign. And the witholding of

:35:18. > :35:25.the TV licence fee may not be for everyone, but I would argue that

:35:25. > :35:29.just like the non-payment of the poll tax, it is a valid campaigning

:35:29. > :35:34.tactic. Now, if conference votes to delete this last paragraph in this

:35:35. > :35:42.motion, as per the amendment, it will be interpreted by some as a

:35:42. > :35:46.signal that Plaid Cymru does not support the campaign to save S4C.

:35:46. > :35:50.Politics is much more about institutions and elections. It is

:35:50. > :35:57.about campaigning, it's about rolling up your sleeves and getting

:35:57. > :36:01.involved at a grassroots level. For me, democracy is about maximising

:36:01. > :36:07.people's participation in politics. Politics and democracy should not

:36:08. > :36:12.be allowed to be the sole preserve of politicians. Now, this party has

:36:12. > :36:17.a very proud history of campaigning and linking up with campaigning

:36:17. > :36:21.groups who share our values and our principles not only in Wales but

:36:21. > :36:27.right throughout the world. I would ask you please reject this

:36:27. > :36:30.amendment, let this party support those of us who are not paying our

:36:30. > :36:38.TV licenses as part of this campaign, and let's give this

:36:38. > :36:48.campaign all the strength that we possibly can.

:36:48. > :36:50.

:36:50. > :36:53.APPLAUSE Keith Parry, I'm a Councillor in

:36:53. > :36:56.Cardiff city. What I was going to draw people's attention to is radio

:36:56. > :36:59.Wales which on the whole produces some excellent political and

:36:59. > :37:06.documentary programmes, but, unfortunately, cannot be heard in

:37:06. > :37:09.large parts of Wales. It's available on AM, that's medium

:37:09. > :37:12.waive radio, which is going out of fashion, and in fact the government

:37:12. > :37:16.is threatening to close down all the medium waive radio stations

:37:17. > :37:21.within the next couple of years. It's available to about 60% of the

:37:21. > :37:26.population on FM, and largely in North Wales not available at all.

:37:26. > :37:33.It's also available on the new DAB radio which is supposed to be

:37:33. > :37:38.taking over from medium waive radio. It's available on DAB along the M4

:37:38. > :37:44.corridor, and nor where else in in Wales, and it's very unlikely to

:37:44. > :37:49.become available in most of Wales for many years to come.

:37:49. > :37:54.These decisions are being taken by London. They've spread DAB radio

:37:54. > :38:01.across Wales which broadcasts eight UK national stations, which is all

:38:01. > :38:08.well and good, but you cannot get BBC Cymru or BBC Wales radio on DAB

:38:08. > :38:12.for most of the country. The effect of that is less and less people are

:38:12. > :38:18.hearing news about what is going on in our country. We have a crisis in

:38:18. > :38:21.television, as HD television comes in, there is no local programming,

:38:21. > :38:25.we have this crisis in the press where the sales of the local papers

:38:25. > :38:30.are in decline, particularly in the Western Mail, and we have this

:38:30. > :38:34.crisis in radio where the current good radio service is disappearing.

:38:34. > :38:42.We need control of broadcasting in this country devolved to the

:38:42. > :38:52.government of this country before we disappear altogether.

:38:52. > :38:53.

:38:53. > :39:00.APPLAUSE Can you be brief, there are a

:39:00. > :39:06.couple more to speak. I have the pleasure of working in broadcasting

:39:07. > :39:12.for almost 12 years before S4C, I had the privilege then of working

:39:12. > :39:16.for S4C for another ten years. I'm sure it is difficult for people to

:39:17. > :39:25.realise and remember today the amazing, tremendous difference

:39:25. > :39:30.there was between those two periods, the paltry few broadcast in the

:39:30. > :39:37.pre1982 years, and the enormous wave of good programmes since then.

:39:37. > :39:44.We are today facing a situation we can revert to that pre1982 scarcity

:39:44. > :39:48.of Welsh programmes before S4C, so please support the motion, and

:39:48. > :39:57.appeal perhaps to ensure that the clause when we're talking about the

:39:57. > :40:02.public bodies measure, and taking S4C out of that measure. The bill,

:40:02. > :40:12.which would allow the government ministers do what on earth they

:40:12. > :40:13.

:40:13. > :40:17.want with S4C. Now, I hadn't heard the Welsh Conservative Party, and

:40:17. > :40:24.they've become very prominent in their their Welshness, recently,

:40:24. > :40:28.haven't they? I haven't heard them say they're going to defend S4C.

:40:28. > :40:32.Jeremy Hunt says that he's got a great deal of money to give to

:40:32. > :40:42.local television. We don't want it to go to local television, we want

:40:42. > :40:43.

:40:43. > :40:48.it to go to national television. For heaven's sake, convince the

:40:48. > :40:52.candidates and the Conservative Welsh, so-called, members in this

:40:52. > :40:57.constituency. Tell them what we want to see: national television in

:40:57. > :41:07.Wales, and I make that appeal lastly. I'm a grandfather, a recent

:41:07. > :41:09.

:41:09. > :41:14.grandfather, and very proud of that. Again, perhaps, the appeal is what

:41:14. > :41:21.S4C is offering at this moment to the children of Wales is excellent.

:41:21. > :41:25.The output is good. If we lose that, we shall have lost an extremely

:41:25. > :41:35.valuable contribution to their future, and their Welshness. Thank

:41:35. > :41:40.

:41:40. > :41:45.you. APPLAUSE

:41:45. > :41:54.Good morning, conference. May I thank you for this motion relating

:41:54. > :42:01.to broadcasting in Wales. I have a specific interest about the fate of

:42:01. > :42:05.S4C for a number of reasons. The statement on the back of an

:42:05. > :42:09.envelope, not the back of a stamp on by the UK minister, was a

:42:09. > :42:13.extremely - about the funding method of the SC4. That's what's

:42:13. > :42:17.kraoted this crisis. Let's be careful of one thing that we had

:42:17. > :42:21.the discussion about the S4C relates to structure. That's not

:42:21. > :42:26.the most important argument. I think the important argument

:42:27. > :42:35.relates to content, quality, and the ability of the channel to

:42:35. > :42:41.attract and retain viewers, and attract wairbl-speaking and non-

:42:41. > :42:48.wairbl speaking. Another part of the vitally important argument is

:42:48. > :42:51.the economic importance of S4C, where there are independent

:42:51. > :42:55.companies that employ large numbers of people that maintain their

:42:55. > :42:59.villages, communities, where Welsh is the main language, and that is

:42:59. > :43:06.most important. We all agreed on that, I'm sure,

:43:07. > :43:13.and we all agree with the motion as it stands were it not for one part.

:43:13. > :43:19.This encouragement to support direct action campaign, in case you

:43:19. > :43:27.think I'm scared of campaigns like that, I will probably be facing a

:43:27. > :43:30.legal challenge by one company concerning the Bangor car park at

:43:30. > :43:35.the moment, and a beautiful train company that refuses to provide

:43:35. > :43:42.anything in Welsh, and who knows what will happen there? We as Plaid

:43:42. > :43:47.members are not scared of direct campaigning. We're not afraid to

:43:47. > :43:56.show the responsibilities, even if that means in court, but we need to

:43:56. > :44:01.be clear as to our role, and I think the (inaudible), it's not our

:44:01. > :44:06.role to encourage individuals. That is a matter for individuals. Let us

:44:06. > :44:10.be wary of the word "support". I don't think we need to say support

:44:10. > :44:17.without action. I don't think that would be wise or honest. I think

:44:17. > :44:21.the amendment is very appropriate, and enables everyone to make his or

:44:21. > :44:24.her own decision and support. was this morning. By the way, the

:44:24. > :44:29.motion was carried. Now, we must cross into the hall because it's

:44:29. > :44:39.the highlight of the day, and the departing speech of the leader,

:44:39. > :45:18.

:45:18. > :45:26.Ieuan Wyn Jones, his last speech to Thank you. Thank you very much For

:45:26. > :45:36.that welcome. As everybody knows by now, this will be my last address

:45:36. > :45:41.to Plaid Cymru as their leader. Normally, of course, the speech

:45:41. > :45:45.would normally summarise the others - summarise the year, and look

:45:45. > :45:50.forward to the year we face. This time, I'm sure you'll forgive me

:45:51. > :45:54.for not adhering to those rules strictly. I'll follow a different

:45:54. > :45:58.pattern this time, by looking perhaps at a Juan vase that is a

:45:58. > :46:03.little bit wider. The first thing I want to do is to thank from the

:46:03. > :46:08.bottom of my heart all the support that I've received during this

:46:08. > :46:14.period as leader of Plaid Cymru. I would like to pay particular

:46:14. > :46:18.tribute to the members of the party, the members of the party across

:46:18. > :46:26.Wales for their support. It's been something that has sustained me

:46:26. > :46:32.during all this time. I would also like to pay a certainly special, if

:46:32. > :46:37.you you tribute, if you'll forgive me, in Anglesey for their support

:46:37. > :46:41.during this time. They've seen their member being a national

:46:41. > :46:47.leader, and a minister, and spending quite a lot of time away

:46:47. > :46:50.from what is happening, and so my thanks to the members of there is

:46:50. > :46:54.something I would like to make quite public today.

:46:54. > :47:01.I would also like to thank the staff of the party and the offices

:47:01. > :47:04.of the - officers of the party for their support throughout this

:47:04. > :47:10.entire period. And, of course, this is not just an end to the period

:47:10. > :47:14.for me as leader of the party, it's start of a new period for a new

:47:14. > :47:19.chief executive, Rhianna Richards, and I wish her all the best within

:47:19. > :47:28.her new post. I would also like to thank

:47:28. > :47:31.particularly the elected members of the party on every level,. Being in

:47:31. > :47:36.a leadership role means you need the support of those who work

:47:37. > :47:42.closest to you, and I would like to thank all those people on every

:47:42. > :47:49.level. Naturally, there were a number of members who gave me

:47:49. > :47:53.support during this most recent period in the One Wales Government

:47:53. > :47:58.who we've now lost from the assembly, and I would like to thank

:47:58. > :48:08.Helen, Dai, Nerys and Chris during their support during that period.

:48:08. > :48:08.

:48:08. > :48:16.Please, would you give them a warm thanks for us for their support.

:48:16. > :48:21.APPLAUSE Andrew - those four, as you heard

:48:21. > :48:23.fromenerries this - from Nerys this afternoon, a huge contribution to

:48:23. > :48:27.make to the party. Although, of course we are disappointed, and it

:48:27. > :48:31.was a massive disappointment, I would like to thank Gareth Jones,

:48:31. > :48:37.and Janet Rider who have retired from the assembly, and wish them

:48:37. > :48:42.well. We now welcome new members in Simon

:48:42. > :48:46.and Lindsey, who I can tell you in Plaid Cymru, that's where the best

:48:46. > :48:52.talent lies. Thank you, the three of you, for reinforcing the work of

:48:52. > :48:56.the party in the assembly. It's been a privilege.

:48:56. > :49:00.It's been a privilege to lead this party at such an exciting period in

:49:00. > :49:08.Welsh history, and I would like to talk a little bit about that

:49:08. > :49:17.history, but, the period of 11 years in a leadership role is quite

:49:17. > :49:22.enough, and it's now time to hand over the reins, and I do so in the

:49:23. > :49:31.certainty that this party has a central place in the politics of

:49:31. > :49:35.Wales. Now, naturally, people question the

:49:35. > :49:37.role and the place of Plaid Cymru after each election, and this next

:49:38. > :49:45.period will be no different, I would have thought. But, for those

:49:46. > :49:52.of us who have seen the ebb and flow of the political world, I

:49:52. > :49:58.think the best advice I could give is not to make rash decisions -

:49:58. > :50:06.that's the best advice I can give. We've already asked (inaudible) for

:50:06. > :50:10.reviewing and renewing the work of the party and ask (inaudible) to

:50:10. > :50:12.lead his team and continue that work at the end of the year and

:50:12. > :50:15.beginning that year, to consider his recommendations carefully, and

:50:15. > :50:19.we have the time to do that. Local elections are happening next

:50:19. > :50:23.year, but then afterwards, there will be a period without elections

:50:24. > :50:29.on the national stage. We haven't had an opportunity like

:50:29. > :50:33.that for several years. We have had elections, and now we have an

:50:33. > :50:37.opportunity, a real chance, to sit back and consider seriously what

:50:37. > :50:44.the next steps to be taken in the history of the party and more

:50:44. > :50:48.importantly than that, what are the next steps in the story of Wales.

:50:48. > :50:54.Now, I want to remind people who don't know that I have been a

:50:54. > :51:01.member of Plaid Cymru since 1965, and for those of you who can do the

:51:01. > :51:08.maths in your head, that's 40 six years.

:51:08. > :51:14.I have a record here, because this is the membership card, the first

:51:14. > :51:18.membership card, I ever had as a member of the party in 1965.

:51:18. > :51:24.: "Mr Ieuan Wyn Jones, signed by Mr Evans."

:51:24. > :51:33.It's dated 6 October 1965. So, ivg been a member of this party

:51:33. > :51:39.for quite a long time. But I can tell you now I didn't join the

:51:39. > :51:43.party at that particularly good good time in its history. In 1964,

:51:43. > :51:49.the party did very disappointingly in the general election. In truth,

:51:49. > :51:56.it had lost ground. For those of you who are old enough to remember

:51:56. > :52:06.or have read your history books, in March of 1966, Plaid Cymru did

:52:06. > :52:09.

:52:09. > :52:14.appallingly badly in the elections in March of 1966. Within less than

:52:14. > :52:20.four months, we won at car marathon. So, you see, that's what politics

:52:20. > :52:24.is. You think that you're in a period of ebb and then suddenly

:52:24. > :52:30.flow comes along. If you talk to these pundits, they think that

:52:30. > :52:36.politics is something perfect, but, actually, things don't happen like

:52:36. > :52:42.that. The fact that we won in 1966 transformed of course what was

:52:42. > :52:50.happening in the politics of Wales in the period that followed in 1964.

:52:50. > :52:54.We got 69,000 votes, 69,500, to be accurate, there was no sightful

:52:55. > :53:00.getting an MP, no parliament in Wales, no representation at all as

:53:00. > :53:04.you know in the European parliament, and only a handful of councillors.

:53:04. > :53:13.In 2011, when people say we have had a doing election, we've got

:53:13. > :53:17.more than 182,900 votes, nearly three times as much as 1964, three

:53:17. > :53:27.out (inaudible) in the parliament of Wales, and one member in the

:53:27. > :53:27.

:53:27. > :53:31.parliament, and more than 200;, academic intellectuals in their

:53:31. > :53:37.ivory towers saying after the 2011 election, "What is the point of

:53:38. > :53:46.Plaid Cymru now?" Is there any purpose to the existence of Plaid

:53:46. > :53:50.Cymru?" Well that same question is being asked back in 1964, and if

:53:50. > :53:56.Gwinfar Evans and all those parties then had listened to those

:53:56. > :54:03.intellectuals, they'd have have given up. If Plaid Cymru had given

:54:03. > :54:09.up in 1964, the history of this nation would have been very

:54:09. > :54:15.different to what it is now. And though we've walked a very, very

:54:15. > :54:18.long way since 1964, though we are far more confident nation in 2011,

:54:18. > :54:28.there is now more of a need of Plaid Cymru on this nation than

:54:28. > :54:29.

:54:29. > :54:35.ever before. APPLAUSE

:54:35. > :54:38.We would not have had a referendum in 2011 were it not for Plaid Cymru.

:54:38. > :54:45.Not only would we not have had a referendum, we wouldn't have won

:54:45. > :54:49.the referendum in 2011 were it not for Plaid Cymru. I can say this

:54:49. > :54:59.with certainty that the next step on the national journey will not be

:54:59. > :55:00.

:55:00. > :55:06.taken unless Plaid Cymru leads it. APPLAUSE

:55:06. > :55:11.I'm proud, as I'm sure you are, of the contribution to the party in

:55:11. > :55:17.government over the last four years. I would like to pay tribute this

:55:17. > :55:20.afternoon to my fellow ministers, to Ely, Fred, Jocelyn, for what

:55:21. > :55:28.they achieved as ministers, and for the group for supporting me. I'm so

:55:28. > :55:36.proud of them, and so proud of the work they did. APPLAUSE

:55:36. > :55:39.If I have one concern, amongst others, possiblyly, it's worth

:55:39. > :55:44.noteing what we achieved in government, and looking back, we

:55:44. > :55:48.would have been better off making more of that, of those achievements

:55:48. > :55:55.during the election, crow about what we had achieved. We must list

:55:55. > :55:58.some of those things. Do you remember them? Keeping hospitals

:55:58. > :56:02.open; organising that there is a comprehensive health service

:56:02. > :56:06.available in all parts of Wales; building more than 8,000 affordable

:56:06. > :56:11.homes. There are 8,000 families now in

:56:11. > :56:14.those homes with a roof above their heads because a Plaid Cymru

:56:14. > :56:18.minister ensured that money would be available.

:56:18. > :56:23.Those of you who do the travelling from north to south, you'll see

:56:23. > :56:25.some of the things we've done to improve the links between north and

:56:25. > :56:30.South, transforming the way we support businesses and companies,

:56:30. > :56:33.creating more apprentices, keeping tuition fees down and the new Welsh

:56:33. > :56:42.language act, establishing a federal college, creating a

:56:42. > :56:44.strategy to plan an implementation for Welsh education. A new plan for

:56:44. > :56:49.newcomers to the agricultural industry, implementing a plan to

:56:49. > :56:53.get rid of TB in cattle, and, of course, winning the referendum to

:56:53. > :57:03.get a proper legislative parliament for Wales. That is a record that

:57:03. > :57:03.

:57:03. > :57:07.any party would be proud of. APPLAUSE

:57:07. > :57:11.I'm sorry, I would like to say this. It's the responsibility of every

:57:11. > :57:17.National Party to ensure that they're ready to govern their

:57:17. > :57:20.country. Wales is our country, and it's our responsibility to ensure

:57:20. > :57:26.that the governments of Wales delivers the aspirations of the

:57:26. > :57:30.nation. I never felt that our role was delegating that responsibility

:57:30. > :57:39.to another party and then complain when things went wrong.

:57:39. > :57:43.If we had done that in 2007, consider seriously what would have

:57:43. > :57:52.happened. Rhodri Morgan being led by Peter Hain, our friend? And no

:57:52. > :57:54.parliament for Wales. Is that what the fate of Wales is to be? An

:57:54. > :57:59.unbroken (inaudible) of government, weak.

:57:59. > :58:04.APPLAUSE A weak government without a back

:58:04. > :58:08.bone under the thumb of people like Peter Hain and ed etd balls, or a

:58:08. > :58:12.government with steel in its character, with enough backbone to

:58:12. > :58:17.stand up to London and say actually it's the priority of people of

:58:17. > :58:27.Wales that come first for us, not the plyorities - priorities of the

:58:27. > :58:32.people of the Labour Party. Labour in London did everything

:58:32. > :58:36.they could to stop the referendum from happening. They used every

:58:36. > :58:46.possible tactic. Some of you will remember them.

:58:46. > :58:47.

:58:47. > :58:54.Wales will never vote in favour of a parliament in 2011. We will

:58:54. > :59:00.endanger the future of Wales by insisting on having a referendum in

:59:00. > :59:07.2011 and even on the 11th hour, when we are setting the motion down

:59:07. > :59:11.in the assembly, they tried to stop it at the last minute. The plain

:59:11. > :59:21.truth is they didn't care about the future of Wales. They cared more

:59:21. > :59:24.about the future of the Labour Party and its MPs in the

:59:24. > :59:27.Westminster parliament. Though the step was taken to us was very

:59:27. > :59:33.important, and I don't want to belittle that at all, that's not

:59:33. > :59:39.the end of the journey for the party, or for Wales. Wales needs

:59:39. > :59:44.Plaid Cymru more than ever. Plaid Cymru has given the aspirations for

:59:44. > :59:49.the people of Wales a voice in the 86 years since its formation, and

:59:49. > :59:53.from now on, Plaid Cymru needs to raise its voice once more as

:59:54. > :59:59.another chapter in the national journey opens up in front of us.

:59:59. > :00:06.How can you justify a situation where a governing body is not

:00:06. > :00:12.accountable for the money it's spending here? Wales? How can you

:00:12. > :00:15.justify an arrangement with a - where the smallest community

:00:15. > :00:25.council has the right to raise money but the government of a

:00:25. > :00:31.country hasn't the right to raise a How can you justify a situation

:00:31. > :00:37.where the Senate, the parliament of the country, is utterly blind on

:00:37. > :00:43.the Treasury in London for its budget. -- utterly reliant. We

:00:43. > :00:51.cannot even bother of a penny to build hospitals and schools. --

:00:51. > :00:57.borrowed a penny. The grip of the Treasury are like shackles on the

:00:57. > :01:02.hands of Wales, treating us like unruly children. It is stifling

:01:02. > :01:12.entrepreneurship. It is time for us to get rid of those shackles and to

:01:12. > :01:17.insist on the right of Wales. APPLAUSE The right of Wales to take

:01:17. > :01:25.more responsibility for its own fate. We have a chance to do so. It

:01:25. > :01:30.is going to rear its head quicker than you think. Before long, we

:01:31. > :01:34.will be discussing all of those issues. And think of what an

:01:34. > :01:41.advantage that will be in the current economic climate. Let us

:01:41. > :01:47.say that Wales needs Plaid Cymru. But why? Some people may say, you

:01:47. > :01:54.have got the Senate now, but the next step, it is just as important.

:01:54. > :01:59.-- Senedd. The right to raise money, to be accountable, and that final

:01:59. > :02:04.proof, in any democracy, is that it will be accountable and take

:02:04. > :02:09.responsibility for what it does. The question that I will be asking

:02:09. > :02:15.myself as I deliver my final speech as leader, from the conference

:02:15. > :02:20.floor, is, where is the party going? Where does it go from here?

:02:20. > :02:25.In this decentralised world, there is only one place that can go. And

:02:25. > :02:35.that is to aim to be the biggest party in Wales. The party that

:02:35. > :02:40.

:02:40. > :02:45.leads Wales. The party that governs Wales. And in our modern politics,

:02:45. > :02:49.with a proper parliament, with the obvious potential for more powers,

:02:49. > :02:55.with the people of Wales chomping at the bit for a full government

:02:55. > :03:00.with a clear vision, the great mission for us is to offer the

:03:00. > :03:05.leadership, to strengthen that feeling of identity, to make people

:03:05. > :03:13.proud to be Welsh, to take pride in what Wales has to offer the world.

:03:13. > :03:22.Does that mean that we will lose our reason to be as a party, lose

:03:22. > :03:26.our vision, lose Our Seoul? -- lose Our Seoul. The one thing we have to

:03:26. > :03:32.acknowledge in this political world, there is no such thing as a sure

:03:32. > :03:38.thing. After all, Plaid Cymru is not a religious sect, it is not a

:03:38. > :03:41.set of beliefs, it is a dynamic movement. It has a set of values

:03:41. > :03:47.that can adapt to meet the challenges of the age. We are rain

:03:47. > :03:53.National Party looking for the best for Wales. What is best for Wales

:03:53. > :04:00.in 2011 is very different to what was best for Wales in 1925, and

:04:00. > :04:05.certainly different to what it was in 1997. The party has the same

:04:05. > :04:09.values. It is a party that believes in fairness and equality, it is to

:04:10. > :04:12.the left of centre on the political spectrum. It is a party that wants

:04:12. > :04:21.to see community's thriving economically, culturally and

:04:21. > :04:27.socially. But now, Plaid Cymru is a party with experience of government.

:04:27. > :04:32.Though there have been restrictions and many hindrances, and though in

:04:32. > :04:40.spite of the election result in 2011, I'm confident that we can say

:04:40. > :04:43.that Wales have marched forward. There is a need for Plaid Cymru to

:04:43. > :04:49.take its responsibility and when the responsibility comes in the

:04:49. > :04:54.future, to lead the government of Wales. When the opportunity arises,

:04:54. > :05:04.we need to take that opportunity. We own the future, friends, and we

:05:04. > :05:12.

:05:13. > :05:18.must now grasp it. A's -- APPLAUSE. As this is my last conference

:05:18. > :05:24.speech as leader of the party, I want to cast my eye over the past

:05:24. > :05:28.few years. Don't worry, this is not going to be history lesson.

:05:29. > :05:33.Although I hope there will be one are two lessons that the party will

:05:33. > :05:39.remember as we face the next period in our journey as a party and as a

:05:39. > :05:46.proud nation. Let us begin by remembering one thing above

:05:46. > :05:53.everything. This party was formed because Wales needed a party but

:05:53. > :05:58.was prepared to put the interests of Wales above all else. In our

:05:58. > :06:02.long history, the party has faced enormous challenges. We have

:06:02. > :06:06.witnessed differing fortunes depending on an electoral cycle.

:06:06. > :06:12.Yet even in the scenes of our greatest triumphs, as well as our

:06:12. > :06:18.worst moments, we have not forgotten that central mission,

:06:18. > :06:22.which is to put the interests of Wales first. I'm sure we can all

:06:22. > :06:28.remember occasions were we have put the interests of Wales even before

:06:28. > :06:32.the interests of our own party. That is what defines us in the

:06:32. > :06:37.politics of modern Wales, because know what the party has ever been

:06:37. > :06:42.prepared to do that. No other party will put the interests of Wales

:06:42. > :06:50.before their own interests. For them, political calculations or

:06:50. > :06:56.political advantage weighs heavily. It does not with us. And yet the

:06:56. > :07:01.paradox is this. Wales needs a strong and resolute Plaid Cymru to

:07:01. > :07:07.make sure that Wales moves to the next stage of our national journey.

:07:07. > :07:12.In the past, London has listened. When Plaid Cymru was strong and

:07:12. > :07:16.seen as an electoral threat, if you read the Cabinet papers of the

:07:16. > :07:21.Sixties and Seventies, you will see that. And yes, the British state

:07:21. > :07:28.made concessions to Wales when Plaid Cymru was winning or

:07:28. > :07:37.increasing its share of the vote. That was true until 1997. Then, of

:07:37. > :07:40.course, the political dynamic change to. -- changed. There is the

:07:40. > :07:48.feeling that Whitehall can ignore Wales because it has its own

:07:48. > :07:52.Assembly. That phenomenon applies, whichever party is in power. It was

:07:52. > :07:56.true for Scotland as well. Now that Wales has its Assembly and Scotland

:07:56. > :08:02.has its parliament, we can forget about them, to the north and the

:08:02. > :08:09.West. But it was only true for Scotland until the SNP became the

:08:09. > :08:13.largest party. There is a lesson for us there in Wales. It is no

:08:13. > :08:19.longer good enough for Plaid Cymru to be making small advances here

:08:19. > :08:23.and there, winning the board seat now and again. -- the odd seat. For

:08:23. > :08:33.Wales to succeed now, Plaid Cymru has to be in the Government of

:08:33. > :08:35.

:08:35. > :08:41.Wales. To put it another way, Wales cannot succeed if Plaid Cymru is

:08:41. > :08:48.content to be in permanent opposition. Does Whitehall treat

:08:48. > :08:55.Wales and Scotland the same in 2011? Of course it doesn't. Why?

:08:55. > :08:59.Because Scotland is a majority SNP Government. Wales has a minority

:08:59. > :09:04.Labour government. What has been happening since May? Who has been

:09:04. > :09:07.making the running for extra powers? Who insisted on an early

:09:07. > :09:11.meeting with the Chancellor of the Exchequer to get more fiscal

:09:11. > :09:16.autonomy for the nation? Who has been demanding greater self-

:09:16. > :09:23.determination for their nation? Was at Alex Salmond? Or was it Carwyn

:09:23. > :09:31.Jones? That is not a rhetorical question, there is an answer to it.

:09:31. > :09:36.It is Alex Salmond, of course it is. Labour in government went into the

:09:36. > :09:39.election after the 2011 Election, seemingly afraid of their own

:09:39. > :09:44.shadow. Constantly looking over their one shoulder, wondering if

:09:44. > :09:51.they are upsetting their bosses at the other end of the M4. What is

:09:51. > :09:55.the deal for Scotland? The Calman Commission has delivered borrowing

:09:55. > :10:00.powers of �3 billion. It has more powers to set income tax rates. It

:10:00. > :10:04.has more powers to levy Scottish taxes. Pollen all, the Scottish

:10:04. > :10:08.Parliament is responsible for one- third of the money it spends. --

:10:08. > :10:13.all in all. Alex Salmond did not stop there. He has called for even

:10:13. > :10:19.more powers. More powers to borrow money, control over corporation tax

:10:19. > :10:24.and money from the fossil fuel levy. Wales has no powers to raise a

:10:24. > :10:27.silver -- a single penny of the money we spend. So we have already

:10:27. > :10:33.fallen miles behind Scotland in securing formal powers over our own

:10:33. > :10:38.finances. That is what the SNP Government under Alex Salmond have

:10:38. > :10:43.secured and called for. What does Labour ask for Wales? Well, they

:10:43. > :10:46.won the immediate introduction of the Barnett formula, some borrowing

:10:46. > :10:53.powers and powers over small taxes which someone on flatteringly

:10:53. > :10:56.called Mickey Mouse taxes. That will raise only 2% of the money

:10:56. > :11:04.that will Spence. The reason for that, let us be clear, Ed Balls

:11:04. > :11:07.will not allow Carwyn Jones to call for reform of the Barnett formula.

:11:08. > :11:14.There we have it. Scotland is powering ahead, and nation on the

:11:14. > :11:18.march, in Top Gear. The SNP Government, and Wales lagging

:11:18. > :11:28.behind with low ambition, in reverse gear, going nowhere under a

:11:28. > :11:33.

:11:33. > :11:40.Labour government. A's -- APPLAUSE. We said in the general election

:11:40. > :11:43.that Wales would standstill on the Labour. We were wrong. -- stand

:11:43. > :11:48.still under Labour. Wales is going back under Labour. We are losing

:11:48. > :11:53.ground. We are run reverse gear at a time when people are facing

:11:53. > :11:59.unprecedented cuts in public spending. It is time to stand up

:11:59. > :12:03.for Wales. At a time when people are losing their benefits, when

:12:03. > :12:07.people with disabilities are being denied their benefits, it is a time

:12:07. > :12:12.to stand up for Wales. At a time when people are losing their

:12:12. > :12:18.housing benefit and more and more people are becoming homeless, it is

:12:18. > :12:24.time to stand up for Wales. Do you remember who use that slogan in the

:12:24. > :12:30.election? It was Labour's slogan. It is not a case of Labour standing

:12:30. > :12:32.up for Wales, they are standing aside. It is Plaid Cymru's role to

:12:32. > :12:37.be the Government of Wales. We would never stand aside because we

:12:37. > :12:43.would stand up for the people of Wales. I'm not actually saying that

:12:43. > :12:50.we should rush into government immediately. A party, from time to

:12:50. > :12:56.time, as now, will need some time, some occasions to reflect, to renew,

:12:56. > :13:04.to reinvigorate itself. I'm sure we will need time to reflect on the

:13:04. > :13:10.2011 election. Not rushing to hasty conclusions, and allow the

:13:10. > :13:15.commission to look at things and bring forward recommendations. But

:13:15. > :13:21.when the time is right, we should never turn down the call to lead

:13:21. > :13:26.our nation. It is our duty and we should always step up to the plate.

:13:26. > :13:31.Being in government demands discipline. As I said, it can be

:13:31. > :13:36.intensely frustrating. At times, it involves making difficult decisions.

:13:36. > :13:40.You have to make tough choices, but it is our responsibility to lead

:13:40. > :13:46.Wales. We have seen what happens when Labour is left to do it on

:13:46. > :13:51.their own. Wales has already started on the long journey to be a

:13:52. > :14:01.more self-confident, more self- reliant and more mature nation. The

:14:01. > :14:05.train has left the station. There is no going back now. Labour will

:14:05. > :14:11.try to take us down some sidings, but they will hit the buffers.

:14:11. > :14:15.Plaid Cymru has to lead to get Wales back on track. It will not

:14:15. > :14:20.always be an easy journey. At times, it will be a bumpy ride. Sometimes

:14:20. > :14:28.we will have to stop for refuelling, but getting back into the driver's

:14:28. > :14:38.seat, we must. One Wales was the beginning, not the end for Plaid

:14:38. > :14:41.

:14:41. > :14:51.Cymru. And I have no hesitation in saying today that it is the best

:14:51. > :14:53.

:14:53. > :14:58.government Wales had since 1999. We A mistake we made in 2011 was not

:14:58. > :15:05.telling people what we did in government. We should have told

:15:05. > :15:09.people what we achieved. Wales is a better place because of that

:15:09. > :15:13.government and Plaid is responsible for that. We must be able to sell

:15:13. > :15:19.ourselves better, not be afraid to claim credit for the things that we

:15:19. > :15:24.did. However, striving to be a party of government, becoming the

:15:24. > :15:32.biggest party in Wales, means we have to accept certain challenges.

:15:32. > :15:38.We cannot run after every hair off follow every house. We have to

:15:38. > :15:41.persuade people that we are ready to run Wales. That does not mean we

:15:41. > :15:46.give up campaigning or speak out on issues but it does mean that we

:15:47. > :15:53.have to be checked to people who have never voted for Plaid in the

:15:53. > :15:57.past ought not voted for us more than once or twice. We must make

:15:57. > :16:04.Plaid Cymru oh a comfortable home for the majority of the people of

:16:05. > :16:10.Wales, what ever the language they speak, whatever their background.

:16:10. > :16:17.We did good things in One Wales but there is still more to do.

:16:17. > :16:22.Education needs to be sorted out. Levels of literacy and numeracy are

:16:22. > :16:27.a scandal. The health service needs firm direction, tackling the causes

:16:27. > :16:36.of ill health as well as healing the sick. Making sure cancer and

:16:36. > :16:41.stroke treatments are given vital early train and -- treatment and

:16:41. > :16:49.making a end of life care as good as it can be. Making sure gone

:16:50. > :16:56.people are given the skills they need to meat that challenges --

:16:56. > :17:03.young people are given the skills they need to meet challenges. It is

:17:03. > :17:07.about that rather indefinable thing called confidence. I believe that

:17:07. > :17:13.the people of Wales now have the confidence to go to the next stage

:17:13. > :17:17.on that journey. History teaches us that the nation's march on freedom

:17:17. > :17:23.has to be based on the support of its own people but also on the

:17:23. > :17:27.willingness of its leaders to take calculated risks. In the past, it

:17:27. > :17:31.is true that Wales has been held back as a result of that

:17:31. > :17:37.indefinable thing called lack of self-confidence or lack of self-

:17:37. > :17:45.belief. I have lost count of the number of people who have told me

:17:45. > :17:54.that Wales would never vote yes in 20th March 11. They kept telling

:17:54. > :17:58.meet Wales is still not ready for it. They would never vote yes, they

:17:58. > :18:04.kept telling me. They lacked the essential self-belief that is

:18:04. > :18:10.necessary to win. I can understand why people were nervous. It took

:18:10. > :18:15.more than a little courage to take that step. But I knew that the

:18:15. > :18:20.people of Wales were ready to take that step. Any he journeys to deal

:18:21. > :18:27.to take decisions like that and Wales, I believe, is ready to take

:18:27. > :18:34.further steps. The timing has to be right but nothing will be came to -

:18:34. > :18:37.- gained by being timid. Plaid needs to be bold, to set out

:18:37. > :18:45.clearly our vision for Wales, to make sure Wales has the resources

:18:45. > :18:49.to bring better prosperity to our people. My time as a leader is

:18:49. > :18:55.coming to an end. Candidates to become the next leader are

:18:55. > :18:59.beginning to declare themselves. Any more today, I wonder?! It has

:18:59. > :19:05.been a great honour to be president and party leader for the past 11

:19:05. > :19:14.years. The party has only had eight Peter's in its history, and to be

:19:14. > :19:20.one of them is a rare privilege. -- 8 leaders. A new leader opens a new

:19:20. > :19:25.chapter in the party's history, a new face giving voice to power

:19:25. > :19:29.hopes and aspirations for a better Wales. Wales needs Plaid Cymru more

:19:29. > :19:36.than out there and we need to give our next leader all the support

:19:36. > :19:41.needed to make Plaid the natural party to govern Wales. As I take my

:19:41. > :19:46.leave of the leadership stage, in the spring of next year, I pledge

:19:46. > :19:53.my support to the next leader and to the party I have been a member

:19:53. > :19:58.of for 46 years. TRANSLATION: The think you very much for your

:19:58. > :20:05.support. Thank you for the privilege of leading you and as I

:20:05. > :20:09.leave the stage before long, were confident is that the party has

:20:09. > :20:15.taken Wales further on his journey to freedom. We have a long way yet

:20:15. > :20:25.to go. As the old saying goes, it has been a great beginning, the

:20:25. > :20:51.

:20:51. > :20:56.DUE joke: there we are, or the best is yet to come, the message to his

:20:56. > :21:03.party. Receiving have very warm reception from delegates in this

:21:03. > :21:13.hall. He is not always one that has been comfortable, or seems to enjoy

:21:13. > :21:25.

:21:25. > :21:31.the spotlight, but obviously this moment, he is enjoying. His wife

:21:31. > :21:36.greeting him as he leaves the stage. The past 11 years he has spent at

:21:36. > :21:41.the helm of his party and it has been quite a roller-coaster. He was

:21:41. > :21:50.keen to list the achievements of the party, how far they have come

:21:50. > :22:00.since he joined the party in 1964. Also keen to list the achievements

:22:00. > :22:03.

:22:03. > :22:07.in government with flavour as well Let us look in detail at the speech

:22:08. > :22:14.with our political correspondent, John Stevenson. There is something

:22:14. > :22:19.about leaders departing a stage, they tick deep. Absolutely. I do

:22:19. > :22:24.not think the word passion is normally associated with a speech

:22:24. > :22:30.by a Ieuan Wyn Jones but there were rare flashes of passion which

:22:31. > :22:33.suggested to me that there was a man feeling liberated. It is a key

:22:33. > :22:37.month since he was liberated from the pressures of office in

:22:37. > :22:43.government but this afternoon we saw a man liberated from the change

:22:43. > :22:47.of leadership. Also liberated from the expectations of his own party

:22:47. > :22:52.members and maybe of his own political expectations as well. It

:22:52. > :22:57.was a rare glimpse that we do not seem very often of Ieuan Wyn Jones.

:22:57. > :23:04.It is very much his swansong and in the mould of the speeches of

:23:04. > :23:08.departing leaders. You address the delegates in the whole but you are

:23:08. > :23:12.reaching out as well to go wider watching public and the people who

:23:12. > :23:22.read the newspapers tomorrow. You she saw a glimpse they're not just

:23:22. > :23:29.of reaching MP on the whole -- not just we chink out beyond the hall,

:23:29. > :23:34.but reaching out to his own past. And admitting that he has made

:23:34. > :23:40.mistakes as well. Not least, not trumpeting the successes, as he saw

:23:40. > :23:46.it, of One Wales. That was a crucial part of the speech, it same

:23:46. > :23:54.we made a big speech by being in that government with Labour --

:23:54. > :24:03.saying. Almost going as far as to say it was arid cheap and that made

:24:03. > :24:10.that government a success but admitting dated not make enough of

:24:10. > :24:15.it in the election -- our achievement that made the

:24:15. > :24:24.government a success. The comparison, I can, eg do not push

:24:24. > :24:28.it too far, is a very apt. A lot of people in the party, and would not

:24:28. > :24:33.say they like Tony Blair, but they respected his achievement, and I

:24:33. > :24:37.think there is a lot of respect for Ieuan Wyn Jones, at not least

:24:37. > :24:43.because of his skills as a political strategist. I think there

:24:43. > :24:48.will be a sense of loss for that. I am reading the diaries of Chris

:24:48. > :24:58.Mullin's at the moment and there is a telling sentence in their. A

:24:58. > :25:02.

:25:02. > :25:06.fascinating read, by the way! I am not advertising! After the 1997

:25:06. > :25:10.election, the first meeting of the Parliamentary Labour Party, Chris

:25:10. > :25:17.Mullin said it is very strange adapting to our new circumstances

:25:17. > :25:22.and the thing that is very true of Labour after 1997 and very true of

:25:22. > :25:32.Plaid Cymru after it this year. Unless I missed it, not a single

:25:32. > :25:33.

:25:33. > :25:37.mention of the word independence. He avoided it. Exactly. The whole

:25:37. > :25:43.purpose of us being here is looking at the political nuances in the

:25:43. > :25:47.speech and it was very telling. A lot of reference to Alex Salmond

:25:47. > :25:53.and to Scotland steaming ahead. One of the reasons for that is that

:25:53. > :25:58.Alex Salmond made no secret that the whole reason for the SNP is the

:25:58. > :26:03.business of independence. Not a whisper in this speech about

:26:03. > :26:08.Independent. I think that was very telling. We can asking why because

:26:08. > :26:12.he will be joining us very shortly. Meanwhile, lots of delegates

:26:12. > :26:22.flooding out of the whole. Letter speak to some of them.

:26:22. > :26:25.

:26:25. > :26:29.I am joined by three delicate. Can I ask you your immediate response?

:26:29. > :26:34.I think it was a very exciting speech and a speech that was needed

:26:34. > :26:39.for us as a party because he managed to confirm the context for

:26:39. > :26:43.us as a party and what our role is, and that is not only a role to move

:26:43. > :26:53.Wales forward but to do that in government and two main to be the

:26:53. > :26:54.

:26:54. > :26:59.majority government of Wales. took aim to be. There was an

:26:59. > :27:06.element of looking at to see how far Plaid Cymru had come, did that

:27:06. > :27:10.meet with your approval? Absolutely. It was exciting, looking forward,

:27:10. > :27:17.and we cannot wait under the leadership of Eurfyl ap Gwilym to

:27:17. > :27:21.look to the future of the party. Was there enough there about how

:27:21. > :27:27.you move forward, perhaps more about what is wrong with Labour

:27:27. > :27:32.than exactly how do other come your electoral difficulties? I think

:27:32. > :27:37.what was important was that Ieuan Wyn Jones, even as he is stepping

:27:37. > :27:40.down, was out lining to the members what needs to be done. He is taking

:27:40. > :27:45.stock of what has happened and telling us this is what you have to

:27:45. > :27:50.do. Do not be scared, do not apologise but look forward. Not

:27:50. > :27:54.enough has been made of the fact that Ieuan Wyn Jones has delivered

:27:54. > :28:00.for us, behind-the-scenes, in the immense amount of work that he put

:28:00. > :28:03.into the One Wales agreement. He has been the architect of this

:28:03. > :28:09.country's future and I have to admit she that I was in tears by

:28:09. > :28:13.the end of the speech today. He has been a brilliant leader for us.

:28:13. > :28:19.there not a point there that you could say that the last few years

:28:19. > :28:23.seem to have been a good period for Plaid Cymru but that has not been

:28:23. > :28:28.reflected in the electoral success. How do you solve that conundrum?

:28:28. > :28:33.think that is the challenge and Ieuan Wyn Jones was right to remind

:28:33. > :28:37.us that we need to tell people about our achievements. Because

:28:37. > :28:41.Plaid has made a difference in government. That is a learning

:28:41. > :28:46.process to understand that our contribution to Wales has got to be

:28:46. > :28:49.in Government and the people of Wales note that it is Plaid Cymru

:28:49. > :28:57.only that can stand up for wells, particularly when we have this dish

:28:57. > :29:03.has coalition in Westminster -- for Wales. What do you think went wrong

:29:03. > :29:09.in that election? We have delivered the referendum for Wales and got a

:29:09. > :29:13.yes vote. Plight, with the party of Wales. We're not looking to feather

:29:13. > :29:19.our own at best, we are looking forward to a better Wales and that

:29:19. > :29:24.is what is important. We as members, as a party, look what is best for

:29:24. > :29:31.Wales, not for ourselves. I would rather have that yes vote than

:29:31. > :29:34.bring any MPs. And yet Ieuan Wyn Jones was clear that you do not get

:29:34. > :29:42.that the us but unless you get back into Government. How do you do

:29:42. > :29:48.that? If you look at football analogies, there is the danger of a

:29:48. > :29:53.quick counter attack were you need yourself exposed at the back. He

:29:53. > :29:57.was pointing at that you need a slow build up. You can have a

:29:57. > :30:02.cyclical ebb and flow in politics by what you need to do is to insure

:30:02. > :30:08.certain things. The referendum secured something tangible for

:30:08. > :30:13.Wales and Ieuan Wyn Jones held to love for that. We look back at

:30:13. > :30:17.these election results any say they are disappointing but the actual

:30:17. > :30:24.results were very similar to what they were four years ago. The

:30:24. > :30:34.difference is that the mass happen to go our way this time. In four

:30:34. > :30:41.

:30:41. > :30:46.years' time, I have no doubt we So, the delegates liked it. What

:30:46. > :30:51.about the man and self? Ieuan Wyn Jones, a warm welcome. You have

:30:52. > :30:58.done 20 speeches, when we consider the spring conferences. This one

:30:58. > :31:03.must have felt very different. was entirely different. I was

:31:03. > :31:07.trying to think back, but the result was a degree of pressure.

:31:08. > :31:10.You feel that as a leader because there is an expectation did you

:31:10. > :31:16.articulate the view of the party, not just to the members in the hall,

:31:16. > :31:19.but outside. The result was a degree of pressure. This time, I

:31:19. > :31:25.was more relaxed because it was my last speech and there were many

:31:25. > :31:33.things there, some messages I wanted to leave. How do you feel

:31:33. > :31:38.right now? You have delivered it. feel entirely relaxed. It was an

:31:38. > :31:44.important speech but in a different way. In your leader will need to

:31:44. > :31:47.articulate some vision as well. I was content with saying, this is

:31:47. > :31:51.where I think we have reached an this is where a think we should go,

:31:51. > :31:56.and offering suggestions. And the one-hour free man. As the leader,

:31:56. > :32:00.you must think, I'd better not say that, better not say this, and when

:32:01. > :32:09.you were a minister, you cannot say certain things. The pressures on

:32:09. > :32:11.previous speeches. Enormous. Different pressures. There is a

:32:11. > :32:15.pressure when things are not going so well and the party and people

:32:15. > :32:22.are questioning your ability to carry on. Is he the right man to

:32:22. > :32:26.lead the party, etc? And in those kind of speeches, you have to rise

:32:26. > :32:34.to the occasion. People like yourself saying it is the most

:32:34. > :32:36.important speech of his life, and that increases the pressure. I

:32:36. > :32:44.remember my first speech as a minister, entirely different again.

:32:44. > :32:47.You knew you were speaking not just as the party leader, but the Deputy

:32:47. > :32:51.First Minister. There was a certain expectation about things you could

:32:51. > :33:00.have said. So you enjoyed that one more than previous ones two today,

:33:00. > :33:03.yes. -- previous ones? Today, yes. Normally I get help in writing

:33:03. > :33:12.speeches and people offer suggestions, but I wanted to make

:33:12. > :33:17.this a personal speech, a speech about why I felt Plaid Cymru was

:33:17. > :33:22.important to Wales. I wrote it on my own. The best is yet to come,

:33:22. > :33:27.you say. At that point, do you almost feel a tear running down

:33:27. > :33:33.your cheek? Not really. We're all human beings. It was an emotional

:33:33. > :33:39.moment. I knew the time was coming to an end, particularly near the

:33:39. > :33:44.end of the speech, I suppose. I felt I needed to leave the feeling

:33:44. > :33:49.to the party, that, you know, the party needs to look forward to the

:33:49. > :33:56.future under a new leader, with the new voice, to voice the aspirations

:33:57. > :34:01.of the party. Let us look at the substance of the speech. Is it all

:34:01. > :34:06.about keeping come and carrying on? Keep going, we have ploughed the

:34:06. > :34:11.furrow, stay in it, or does the party need a new direction? I do

:34:11. > :34:17.not think it needs a new direction. Devolution meant that the party had

:34:17. > :34:20.to Act differently. Up until 1997, there was no way the party would

:34:20. > :34:27.ever be the majority party in any form of legislature in which it was

:34:27. > :34:30.fighting elections. It could only be a voice of opposition. Now and

:34:30. > :34:36.again, it could influence but basically it was a voice of

:34:36. > :34:43.opposition. But you have been a party of government. And the vote

:34:43. > :34:52.went down. It did not like you in government. -- they did not like

:34:52. > :34:55.you. I wish politics was that simple. There were a few reasons I

:34:56. > :35:00.gave today why we did not do as well as we could have done. We did

:35:00. > :35:05.not claim credit for what we had done. That is down to you. That is

:35:05. > :35:09.down to me and the people we're talking about, because we had many

:35:09. > :35:13.meetings talking about our strategy. There was a feeling that people do

:35:13. > :35:20.not vote on past records, they vote on what you're going to do next.

:35:20. > :35:24.The danger was that although people knew that we were doing good things,

:35:24. > :35:31.they did not identify that with us. You suffer with the Little Brother

:35:31. > :35:35.syndrome. Yes, to a certain extent. Given our time again, we would do

:35:36. > :35:43.things differently. Your clearly keen for the party to go back into

:35:43. > :35:50.coalition. At any price, with anybody? Not at any price. We need

:35:50. > :35:54.to drive a hard bargain. Realistically, the electoral system

:35:54. > :36:00.in Wales and Scotland, by and large, will not deliver a majority

:36:00. > :36:03.government. It has only delivered one in either country since

:36:04. > :36:07.devolution. You have to collude with the parties. So we deal with

:36:07. > :36:13.the current Labour Party, is that on the cards? As things currently

:36:13. > :36:21.stand, I do not think that Carwyn Jones will want a coalition. If he

:36:21. > :36:27.did? The party needs time to reflect. That will be over by the

:36:27. > :36:30.spring of next year. Then, we will see how things go. It will be

:36:30. > :36:33.difficult for a minority administration to last five years.

:36:33. > :36:38.It may be that at some time during the next five years, there will be

:36:38. > :36:43.an opportunity for a rethink. We should not turn it down. We should

:36:43. > :36:47.not say on principle but we will never go into coalition. Andorra

:36:47. > :36:53.two motions try to turn that down on principle here. My view is that

:36:53. > :36:57.that would be the wrong way to goal. -- and there are two motions of.

:36:57. > :37:03.will hear from the SNP shortly. You mention them, doing great things in

:37:03. > :37:08.Scotland. Why are you not giving that? The situation in Scotland is

:37:08. > :37:16.different. The analogy a destroying was that in order to get things

:37:16. > :37:20.done for Scotland, they needed an SNP government. You can draw a

:37:20. > :37:23.distinction between the SNP in Edinburgh, Labour in Cardiff, and

:37:23. > :37:29.the development of the two countries is different. But there

:37:29. > :37:33.is a reason for that. We advance questions on Twitter. -- we have

:37:33. > :37:37.had questions. This one, quite simple, or what are you most proud

:37:37. > :37:43.of and disappointed of? I am most proud of being in government and

:37:43. > :37:48.delivering a yes vote in a referendum. As well as delivering

:37:48. > :37:52.in government. On that point, you took your eye off the ball for the

:37:52. > :37:55.elections. I also said in a speech that there are occasions where the

:37:55. > :38:00.party is prepared to put the interests of Wales before the

:38:00. > :38:03.interests of the party. It could be that we did that in the referendum.

:38:04. > :38:12.And your disappointment? biggest disappointment is the

:38:12. > :38:16.result of the election. We felt that we deserved better. But I take

:38:16. > :38:22.my share of responsibility for it. I would like to leave people with

:38:22. > :38:26.the idea, do not think that you will have to take radical changes

:38:26. > :38:29.because of one election. Look at the bigger picture. You will find

:38:29. > :38:37.that the party is in a stronger place in 2011 and it was when I

:38:37. > :38:40.joined. On the whole debate, which is taking place loudly on

:38:40. > :38:44.independence here. Potentially, it will be in the constitution

:38:45. > :38:52.tomorrow. You did not mention it at all. Were you careful not to?

:38:52. > :38:55.not think so. You do not like the word, do you? No. The reality is

:38:56. > :39:00.that the constitutional journey of Wales is different to Scotland. I

:39:00. > :39:04.remember the last time we had a debate on independence was in 2003

:39:04. > :39:09.and after what people saw as a difficult election result. There is

:39:09. > :39:16.the feeling that you need to hang on to certain things. Or be clear

:39:16. > :39:19.about it. The SNP do that for stomp we have been clear about our

:39:19. > :39:26.objectives. It is just that Wales is in a different place and needs

:39:26. > :39:30.to understand that the constitutional path is one of

:39:30. > :39:35.progress at each step. We have taken a big step in March and has

:39:35. > :39:39.another one on fiscal autonomy that we need to take. -- there is

:39:39. > :39:43.another one on fiscal autonomy. you leave the stage, and you're not

:39:43. > :39:49.going till spring, what next for view? You are not going to leave

:39:49. > :39:55.politics. I am not. I will still be the Assembly member for my

:39:55. > :39:59.constituency and I will be working in the Assembly. There is one thing

:39:59. > :40:02.that is absolutely certain, I do not want to do nothing. I feel that

:40:02. > :40:06.I have more to offer, perhaps in different ways, and I will be

:40:06. > :40:13.thinking about that now and over the next six months. A think tank,

:40:13. > :40:17.maybe? I think we have to fill the vacuum and Wales. If there is one

:40:17. > :40:21.major disappointment outside the party, it is that we have not

:40:21. > :40:24.really had a proper debate about policy direction. We are

:40:24. > :40:28.distinguishing ourselves from what is happening in London but there is

:40:28. > :40:33.no real policy research behind it. I really think that that is

:40:33. > :40:38.something that we need to redress. Your family is here, waiting for a

:40:38. > :40:41.hug. What is the plan for the family tonight? Well, there is a

:40:41. > :40:51.party dinner tonight, but tomorrow night, we will have the opportunity

:40:51. > :41:00.to relax informally. Thank you very much. We will have a look at what

:41:00. > :41:07.the SNP member was saying earlier, Hamsey Yusef. This is what he had

:41:07. > :41:12.to say. -- Humza Yousaf. Thank you very much for this great honour to

:41:12. > :41:16.be representing the SNP here at your annual conference. I bring

:41:16. > :41:20.with me the best wishes of the First Minister of Scotland, Alex

:41:20. > :41:30.Salmond. The First Minister of the Scottish Parliament's first ever

:41:30. > :41:30.

:41:31. > :41:33.majority government. APPLAUSE it is a real pleasure to be with you here

:41:33. > :41:37.in Wales, to join you for your annual conference.

:41:38. > :41:44.I think you wholeheartedly for the kind invitation. It is such an

:41:44. > :41:47.honour for me to be in the position as an MS P and P elected

:41:47. > :41:53.representative. It was just 70 years ago that my great grandfather

:41:53. > :41:58.and his son were working in their family run tailoring business in

:41:58. > :42:02.India. They were master tailors who would so during the morning and

:42:02. > :42:06.afternoon and choose to shut up shop in the evening. Instead of

:42:06. > :42:10.going back home for their dinner, they would take to the streets in

:42:10. > :42:14.non-violent protests and fight for the independence of India and

:42:14. > :42:18.Pakistan from British rule. They gained their reward of full

:42:18. > :42:22.independence in 1947. Little could be imagined that nearly seven

:42:22. > :42:26.decades later, their great grandson would be continuing on this proud

:42:26. > :42:30.family condition of fighting for independence in a country called

:42:30. > :42:34.Scotland, a country that in truth they had probably never heard of. I

:42:34. > :42:38.tell you that story not to bore you into submission, but to get across

:42:38. > :42:41.to you a sense of the central message, the reason that our

:42:41. > :42:45.visions for our respective countries is the right one is

:42:45. > :42:49.because we believe that an independent Scotland and Wales can

:42:49. > :42:55.be prosperous. We know that Wales is awash with opportunities and

:42:55. > :42:59.with potential. Her greatest asset is her people and always has been.

:42:59. > :43:03.That is why independent self determination, more autonomy is so

:43:03. > :43:08.important. The prize is so great. Not as an end within itself, but

:43:08. > :43:14.the tools it gives us in order to shape a better future for our

:43:14. > :43:19.country men, women and children. As nationalists, we value our

:43:19. > :43:24.relationship with Plaid Cymru. We share in each other's successes but

:43:24. > :43:28.we show solidarity through the tough times. In the parliamentary

:43:28. > :43:32.elections in two dozen did three, the SNP lost a number of seats in

:43:32. > :43:36.the Scottish Parliament. We had gone backwards. The death knell was

:43:36. > :43:40.ringing for the nationalist cause. Column inch after column inch had

:43:40. > :43:44.just written off as a political force. John Swinney, are then

:43:44. > :43:48.leader, announced he was stepping down, and we were apparently on the

:43:48. > :43:55.brink of a civil war, the final nail in the coffin for independence.

:43:55. > :43:59.Or so we were told. I'm sure you recognise the headlines well. Take

:43:59. > :44:07.heart from our journey from then on. The loss of seats did not mean a

:44:07. > :44:12.loss of determination of conviction. Far from it. Instead, it gave us a

:44:12. > :44:16.renewed sense of purpose. The effect was galvanising. We needed

:44:17. > :44:22.to refocus and renew our vision and I know that is a central theme of

:44:22. > :44:27.this conference. The effect of that was to reinvigorate our party

:44:27. > :44:32.members and supporters. You will have a difficult task, but you are

:44:32. > :44:37.starting a process now. Award -- the rewards can be handsome, but

:44:37. > :44:43.only if you choose to be bold and radical. That is exactly what the

:44:43. > :44:47.SNP has done. Our structures were old, cantankerous. The period of

:44:47. > :44:53.introspection and reflection was welcome. The internal change was

:44:53. > :44:56.very much needed. The result was that in the next election, four

:44:56. > :45:00.years on, we had the first nationalist government in the

:45:00. > :45:04.history of the country. Few would have predicted an SNP government

:45:04. > :45:09.within the first 10 years of the re-establishment of the parliament.

:45:09. > :45:14.Fewer would have predicted, including many of our own party,

:45:14. > :45:18.the majority government that we now have. Despite the electoral system,

:45:18. > :45:23.designed to prevent single party majorities, and Lord Robertson

:45:23. > :45:29.preparing -- declaring that abolition would kill nationalism,

:45:29. > :45:39.despite the combined efforts of the Unionist parties and despite a

:45:39. > :45:41.

:45:41. > :45:46.hostile press, the SNP won in spectacular fashion. Plight Cymru

:45:46. > :45:51.did not achieve the success we had hoped for in may have been -- in

:45:51. > :45:57.May. -- Plaid Cymru. We must take the rough with the smooth. It must

:45:57. > :46:01.be viewed not as a challenge, but as an opportunity. With strength of

:46:01. > :46:06.conviction and a renewed sense of purpose, he will fight future

:46:06. > :46:12.elections and you will become a force, the dominant vision for the

:46:12. > :46:16.people of Wales once again. Of course, this is the challenge ahead.

:46:16. > :46:20.Defining what that vision is for the people of Wales. During the

:46:20. > :46:26.recent Holyrood elections, or message was quite simple. We

:46:26. > :46:32.repeated our mantra over and over and over again. Until I never

:46:32. > :46:35.wanted to hear the words record, team and vision ever again. However,

:46:35. > :46:38.I think he will no doubt build a formidable record in opposition,

:46:38. > :46:42.old and the Welsh government to account, not pausing for the sake

:46:42. > :46:45.of all posing, but as you have always done, in the interests of

:46:45. > :46:50.the Welsh people, you are in the process of building a team. I have

:46:50. > :47:00.no doubt that fresh blood will galvanise the party. However, the

:47:00. > :47:02.

:47:03. > :47:12.most important component, in my We often think people know what it

:47:12. > :47:18.is we refer to. In truth, we have not articulated the vision fully

:47:18. > :47:22.enough. How many people here know what it is that we mean by

:47:22. > :47:29.independence or more autonomy. Gone are the days when Scottish and

:47:29. > :47:38.Welsh independence movements can be dismissed. Nothing could be further

:47:38. > :47:44.from the truth, apart from one or two party members, I am sure! And I

:47:44. > :47:52.like my shortbread and by daffodils! Our movements are about

:47:52. > :47:56.empowering people. And a brand of civic nationalism is the most

:47:56. > :48:03.inclusive Liberal movement in the world, I firmly believe that. Just

:48:03. > :48:13.one example is, perhaps, myself standing here today in the field of

:48:13. > :48:16.

:48:16. > :48:20.community cohesion. I always say to people, when I have been doing

:48:21. > :48:26.speeches on community cohesion, all you have to do is look at

:48:26. > :48:30.Scotland's cuisine. Our two favourite dishes are chicken tikka

:48:30. > :48:36.and spaghetti bothered pays! Since I have just been fasting for

:48:36. > :48:42.Ramadan, I hope she will allow me to expand on what metaphor. You

:48:42. > :48:51.will spot on the menu in Scotland this gourmet menu of chips and

:48:51. > :48:59.curry sauce. They terrific advertisement for cultural

:48:59. > :49:03.diversity! This must be the essence of our vision to the people, not

:49:03. > :49:09.takeaways, but a positive, clear vision of what we mean by

:49:09. > :49:14.independents and what we mean by greater powers. We seek

:49:14. > :49:19.independence to create jobs, to protect education, to give

:49:19. > :49:24.opportunity to the most vulnerable in our society. Perhaps Alex Salmon

:49:24. > :49:29.put it best when he said about the independence question that it is

:49:29. > :49:34.not an arcane question removed from the people, it is the people, it is

:49:34. > :49:38.how will we protect our society and grow our economy. No nation should

:49:38. > :49:44.send it young men and women into an illegal war that we collectively

:49:44. > :49:54.disagree with, nor should we play host to weapons of mass destruction

:49:54. > :49:57.

:49:58. > :50:02.as we do in power hosting of Trident. There is nothing negative,

:50:02. > :50:08.conference, nothing narrow-minded. I have noticed recently that it is

:50:08. > :50:17.the unionist parties that now resort to flag-waving tactics.

:50:17. > :50:21.Protect our fish and chips is the cry, Protect Our custard creams.

:50:21. > :50:27.However, the old adage of stronger together and weaker apart is given

:50:27. > :50:33.us reasons to maintain the Union. But these are poor reasons. The

:50:33. > :50:37.union constraints a respective nations. We do not have control

:50:37. > :50:42.over the economic mechanisms that a last to have dynamic and

:50:42. > :50:47.competitive economies. The legacy of successive Westminster

:50:47. > :50:51.governments is deep-rooted poverty and disenfranchised communities. It

:50:51. > :50:57.is time for all of that to change. There was a real buzz in the air

:50:57. > :51:02.when the SNP won in 2007. Across Scotland, people were excited by

:51:02. > :51:05.the freshness of a new government and a new agenda. Since then, it's

:51:05. > :51:11.got and has grown as a nation and has gained greater confidence than

:51:11. > :51:18.it has had in a long time. It is that, because that cause more

:51:18. > :51:22.Scott's than ever before to vote for the SNP in May. -- more

:51:22. > :51:26.Scottish people. Not every person is ready to vote for independence

:51:26. > :51:29.but they're certainly ready to listen and take part in the debate.

:51:29. > :51:34.Scotland has never had the opportunity to have a proper debate

:51:34. > :51:39.about independence but now we're ready for it and we, in the SNP,

:51:39. > :51:42.I'm really ready for it. It is an object to that few nations get from

:51:42. > :51:48.one that I feel personally privileged to have an opportunity

:51:48. > :51:53.to participate in. I look forward to an independence, and that leaves

:51:53. > :51:59.-- leads the world not because of the size of its military, put the

:51:59. > :52:03.cars we are at the forefront of human rights and social justice --

:52:03. > :52:07.but because. By recognise the extent of the challenge that lies

:52:07. > :52:14.before us. Scotland has a bright future and so does Wales and we

:52:14. > :52:19.will realise that bright future by taking control of our own destinies.

:52:19. > :52:27.Our independence movements are not about separation but about

:52:27. > :52:31.fulfilling Our potential. It is easy to be downtrodden by the

:52:31. > :52:38.relentless and par for voices of the unionists, but it is not for

:52:38. > :52:41.them to determine the future of any nation in the union. It is for the

:52:41. > :52:49.people of Scotland, for the people of Wales and for the people of

:52:49. > :52:53.England to decide for themselves. The SNP has spread its -- expend

:52:53. > :52:59.its fair share of time in the electoral doldrums. That can be

:52:59. > :53:02.turned around more quickly than you might think. But your heart be bold

:53:03. > :53:08.and radical and seize the opportunity put in front of you. --

:53:08. > :53:18.it you have to be bowled. You have to change the internal structures

:53:18. > :53:19.

:53:19. > :53:24.where the party has perhaps been... Retain your vision, rebuild your

:53:24. > :53:29.movement. It will not be long until you off firmly on your way to a

:53:29. > :53:39.more prosperous, dynamic and ultimately independent Wales. Thank

:53:39. > :53:44.

:53:44. > :53:49.Humza Yousaf, from the SNP, addressing the Congress earlier.

:53:49. > :53:56.Several members of tipping him as a future leader. Let us go back to do

:53:56. > :54:02.leader's speech. Ieuan Wyn Jones was with us earlier and I am joined

:54:02. > :54:07.by the leader of the party and the director of policy. He was a man

:54:07. > :54:11.liberated, wasn't he? Yes, he was and I think the speech was a very

:54:11. > :54:18.difficult one to make, and he pulled it off because he was able

:54:18. > :54:28.to give us a snapshot of where we are in the party and we all felt

:54:28. > :54:31.

:54:31. > :54:37.uplifted. We are in a decent position as a party. We are at a

:54:37. > :54:41.situation where it seems to me that is similar to where the

:54:41. > :54:47.Conservatives were in London three or four years ago. I thought it was

:54:47. > :54:51.a very good speech. I have always been of great fan of Ieuan Wyn

:54:51. > :54:57.Jones but he has done hard work for Plaid Cymru and for Wales and we

:54:57. > :55:01.should respect him for that. said that the party should not

:55:01. > :55:04.refuse the opportunity to lead Wales. Many in this conference

:55:04. > :55:08.would doubt that, because they do not want go back into coalition

:55:09. > :55:14.with Labour and certainly do not want go into coalition with the

:55:14. > :55:17.Conservatives. Isn't power crucial to any party? We are all in

:55:17. > :55:22.politics because we think we have the best politics to move our

:55:22. > :55:25.nation forward. We should be using opportunities that present

:55:25. > :55:33.themselves to implement those policies as we have done in the One

:55:33. > :55:39.Wales government and Ieuan Wyn Jones quite Reece -- rightly listed

:55:39. > :55:44.the achievements. We have a lot to be grateful for, we have a lot that

:55:44. > :55:48.we achieved. But how much of that has been communicated to the people

:55:48. > :55:56.of Wales? The fact that we have done things that make their lives

:55:57. > :56:02.better. So is it keep calm and carry on or do you need to change

:56:02. > :56:05.our tactics? We have just heard from the SNP and look at their

:56:05. > :56:09.successes in Scotland. There is no breed a cross between what is

:56:09. > :56:14.happening in Wales and Scotland, there are two completely different

:56:14. > :56:19.entities. To national a sister parties who always work together in

:56:19. > :56:25.Westminster. The new work together and hence I know the difference is

:56:25. > :56:30.between us. In Wales it is a time for renewal. Yes, we need to look

:56:30. > :56:34.at a tactics. Yes, we need to look at the ways we did not bring out

:56:34. > :56:37.all the good things that happened in the National Assembly. For some

:56:38. > :56:42.reason we decided we would not push that which I thought rather strange

:56:42. > :56:47.at the time. You spend your time knocking Labour instead of saying

:56:48. > :56:52.what you had done. Not simply that, but there were other things. If

:56:52. > :56:57.you're asking me if it is time to change tactics, yes it is. It is

:56:57. > :57:02.time to look at everything. Stuffing, structures, the way we

:57:02. > :57:05.organise the party, internal and external, and we must ordinator a

:57:05. > :57:10.little better. These are some of the things we will be discussing

:57:10. > :57:15.over the coming months. I can see a bright future for us but we need to

:57:15. > :57:20.work harder and change the way that we do things. Who should lead you

:57:20. > :57:26.into that future? There is a question! A few people already I in

:57:26. > :57:33.the race and we are expecting a few more. Who'd he fancy at the moment?

:57:33. > :57:39.We know Elin Jones, Simon Thomas, where would you go? I'm going to

:57:39. > :57:49.wait to see who declares and think about it then. The membership here

:57:49. > :57:53.is surprisingly upbeat. Things are going well. What would be a word of

:57:53. > :57:56.advice to Ieuan Wyn Jones, what should he do now? Take some time

:57:56. > :58:01.off and then he will be an excellent Assembly Member as he