08/03/2014

:00:00. > :00:08.Spring has sprung, the sun is out and that can only mean one thing.

:00:09. > :00:12.It's political conference season and its Plaid Cymru today. Stay with us

:00:13. > :00:25.for coverage from the conference between now and 4:30pm. Good

:00:26. > :00:32.afternoon. Welcome to the programme. Over the next two hours will be

:00:33. > :00:35.talking Europe, the pop tracks, childcare and of course where Plaid

:00:36. > :00:41.would like to go next on the devolution journey. We be heading to

:00:42. > :00:44.the conference shortly to hear Plaid Cymru's parliamentary leader Elfyn

:00:45. > :00:55.Llwyd. They are discussing what migration means to Wales. First, we

:00:56. > :01:02.shall shortly reveal the contents of the whole two. This is our chief

:01:03. > :01:09.anorak, Vaughan Roderick. Where is Plaid Cymru at the moment?

:01:10. > :01:16.They are on Newport Road in Cardiff! I think Plaid are in a difficult

:01:17. > :01:21.spot coming up to an election, a sequence of elections, first of all

:01:22. > :01:25.the European followed by the general and the assembly election in 2016

:01:26. > :01:30.and the first of those could well be the trickiest for Plaid Cymru.

:01:31. > :01:35.That's because of the way the voting system operates. Plaid had two seats

:01:36. > :01:41.in Europe at one time, and they have had seen since 1999. This time it

:01:42. > :01:47.looks tricky because of the rise of UKIP and because Labour are in

:01:48. > :01:52.opposition big -- which means Labour supporters may come out in greater

:01:53. > :01:58.numbers. There is also a difficulty that they face with what's happening

:01:59. > :02:02.in Welsh politics more generally wear because David Cameron and

:02:03. > :02:07.Westminster politicians are playing at Labour's record in Wales. In

:02:08. > :02:13.essence, Welsh politics is becoming quite British at moment, becoming

:02:14. > :02:17.quite... Revolving around arguments between Labour and Conservatives,

:02:18. > :02:23.rather than specifically Welsh arguments. So it's a tricky period.

:02:24. > :02:28.But they had a good victory in the Anglesey by-election and good cancer

:02:29. > :02:34.results last year. Organisationally common... The party is looking quite

:02:35. > :02:40.good. And Leanne Wood has been leading for

:02:41. > :02:45.two years. How was she doing? I don't sense that anyone in the

:02:46. > :02:50.pliant -- Plaid Cymru is hatching a challenge of trying to undermine her

:02:51. > :02:54.leadership. On the other hand, most people within Plaid would privately

:02:55. > :03:00.tell you that she is so very much a new leader who is on a learning

:03:01. > :03:04.curve. They are saying that she will be the finished article by the time

:03:05. > :03:08.of the next assembly elections but she's not the finished article yet.

:03:09. > :03:13.She wasn't that experienced politician when she was first

:03:14. > :03:19.elected. And in terms of targets, Europe is

:03:20. > :03:25.very tricky. Then comes the next general election. What about that?

:03:26. > :03:27.The Westminster election will be interesting for Plaid because they

:03:28. > :03:34.currently hold three seats and of those three, when of them only

:03:35. > :03:38.totally safe and that is to formally honoured. They're going to have to

:03:39. > :03:43.fight hard to keep Caernarfon and they going to have to fight hard to

:03:44. > :03:50.keep Caernarfon -- Carmarthen East. But they have a target seat in

:03:51. > :03:54.Anglesey, and they may have a slim hope in Ceredigion.

:03:55. > :04:00.Let's go over to the conference hall now at Holland House -- Holland

:04:01. > :04:07.House in Cardiff. Elfyn Llwyd is on his feet.

:04:08. > :04:16.The manifesto sets out Scotland's future and has put the yes camp and

:04:17. > :04:22.the front foot. So far, they have yet to propose a single memorable

:04:23. > :04:27.policy aside from saying what the Scots won't get if they're tenacious

:04:28. > :04:31.enough to vote to determine their own future. The incompetence of some

:04:32. > :04:36.members of the no campaign has made the yes campaign 's case even

:04:37. > :04:41.stronger. For example, the tremendous comment made by the

:04:42. > :04:46.leader of Scottish Labour, less than a fortnight ago that the Scots are

:04:47. > :04:52.not genetically programmed to make political decisions. If that is the

:04:53. > :04:57.line that Labour takes, it certainly would explain a great deal about the

:04:58. > :05:01.decision-making of our Labour colleagues in Cardiff Bay. On behalf

:05:02. > :05:06.of the Westminster group and all of us, I'd like to send our friends in

:05:07. > :05:19.the yes campaign our heartfelt best wishes for the months ahead.

:05:20. > :05:23.Obviously obviously, I like everybody in this conference will be

:05:24. > :05:27.advocating the yes vote but whatever the result and that referendum one

:05:28. > :05:31.thing is certain, the make-up of this union will never be the same

:05:32. > :05:36.again. It's no wonder that Labour had such a loss as to what their

:05:37. > :05:40.strategy is all should be. The Unionist parties can rightly be

:05:41. > :05:44.accused of putting politics ahead of policy and ahead of the best

:05:45. > :05:49.interests of the people they purport to serve. The Scottish National

:05:50. > :05:53.party on the other hand, and the entire yes campaign, have shown that

:05:54. > :06:00.they are motivated, upbeat and able to back off any cynical attitudes

:06:01. > :06:02.from London, because they want a better future for Scotland. There is

:06:03. > :06:06.no reason at all better future for Scotland. There is

:06:07. > :06:11.should be less ambitious for our future, for the future of our nation

:06:12. > :06:16.and our people. The changes advocated by the silk reports show

:06:17. > :06:18.that momentum is finally building amongst the other political parties

:06:19. > :06:22.to demand more power for the assembly in Cardiff and once again,

:06:23. > :06:29.Plaid Cymru has paved the way for the debate on what direction

:06:30. > :06:34.devolution should be taking in Wales. It's certainly gratifying

:06:35. > :06:38.that the Silk Commission second report has advocated many of

:06:39. > :06:42.Plaid's policies and whether Silk Commission has demonstrated that

:06:43. > :06:46.there is a case to transfer responsibilities to the National

:06:47. > :06:51.Assembly, we must make sure that we push for this transfer to happen at

:06:52. > :06:55.the earliest possible opportunity. The UK government has indicated that

:06:56. > :06:59.a Wales Bill will be part of the upcoming Queen 's speech and we in

:07:00. > :07:04.the Westminster team will be ready to bow to demands on the record.

:07:05. > :07:09.Recently, my friend and colleague Hywel Williams used his temporary

:07:10. > :07:13.place on the Welsh temporary affairs select committee to table amendments

:07:14. > :07:17.of the report on the draft will spill, aimed at removing the

:07:18. > :07:20.lockstep that would limit the assembly's ability to vary income

:07:21. > :07:27.tax bands individually from the face of the bill. However a vote on the

:07:28. > :07:32.amendment on which Welsh Labour MPs and stained, despite their

:07:33. > :07:36.colleagues in Cardiff saying the lockstep as a Tory trap and that it

:07:37. > :07:42.should be removed, not for the first time, Labour presents two faces, one

:07:43. > :07:45.in Cardiff and another in Westminster. They have been sitting

:07:46. > :07:50.on their hands so long it's a wonder there is any blood left in them at

:07:51. > :07:54.all but we, at least, won't compromise on our principles and

:07:55. > :07:57.scrutinising this bill. It's only common sense that the Silk

:07:58. > :08:02.Commission has recommended adopting a reserved powers model for Wales,

:08:03. > :08:07.which Plaid has long said would provide greater clarity about the

:08:08. > :08:12.assembly's unit and allow for more details and more effective scrutiny.

:08:13. > :08:17.It is frustrating to see that such little progress is being made in

:08:18. > :08:22.creating a Welsh legal jurisdiction. The assembly 's powers over planning

:08:23. > :08:29.consents for energy development will be limited to projects generating a

:08:30. > :08:34.350 megawatts or less. The Silk Commission also failed to recommend

:08:35. > :08:39.the devolution of control over Crown Estates and broadcasting

:08:40. > :08:45.capabilities except for S4C. It is courtesy the 12 has been a little

:08:46. > :08:49.short changed in the short term. Had the Silk Commission recommended to

:08:50. > :08:53.the devolution of powers over the Crown estate including all of Wales

:08:54. > :08:57.'s natural resources, we would not be facing this exasperating

:08:58. > :09:03.situation of being an energy rich nation with limited powers to tackle

:09:04. > :09:06.the farewell poverty which blights thousands of our households. But we

:09:07. > :09:12.are where we are and our priority now and over the coming months must

:09:13. > :09:16.be to fight for the implementation of the reports recommendations at

:09:17. > :09:19.the earliest possibility and we will tolerate no less. But for now at

:09:20. > :09:25.least, many of the crucial decisions which affect the people of Wales

:09:26. > :09:28.remain under the control of Westminster and that is why it is so

:09:29. > :09:33.important that the real act Hywel Williams for

:09:34. > :09:35.important that the real act Hywel Edwards for Carmarthen East, Liz

:09:36. > :09:37.Saville Roberts four to formally honoured, and of course, John

:09:38. > :09:43.Saville Roberts four to formally Rowlands were Ynys Mon, Mike Parker

:09:44. > :09:57.for Ceredigion in the 2015 general election. Because the need for a

:09:58. > :10:00.strong voice fighting for Wales is interested in Westminster has never

:10:01. > :10:06.been more important. Over the past year, our team has worked tirelessly

:10:07. > :10:09.to keep Wales on the agenda and also to ensure that our constituents and

:10:10. > :10:15.the people of Wales remain at the centre of debates. In Jonathan

:10:16. > :10:18.Edwards, we have a politician of conviction who is one of the most

:10:19. > :10:25.hard-working members of Parliament Wales has or has ever had. Jonathan

:10:26. > :10:28.has that own policies which would you distribute wealth, tackle

:10:29. > :10:33.inequality, and strengthen our economy here in Wales. He has called

:10:34. > :10:39.for an economic failure spells, a bank of Wales, fair funding follows

:10:40. > :10:43.from HS2 expenditure, and a financial transaction tax. Locally

:10:44. > :10:46.he has led the campaign to protect fire services and told the Labour

:10:47. > :10:51.council to account. He fights tirelessly for the people of

:10:52. > :10:54.Carmarthenshire and we will never -- he will never settle for anything

:10:55. > :10:59.then the best deal possible for Wales. Hywel Williams has

:11:00. > :11:06.vociferously oppose the proposed changes to benefits and implement

:11:07. > :11:08.nation of universal credit and a malicious bedroom tax, as well as

:11:09. > :11:15.the government 's changes to pensions. Howard has promoted Plaid

:11:16. > :11:21.'s plans for energy woes and has made a case for fear of fairness,

:11:22. > :11:26.advocating a fuel duty stabiliser to help those in rural areas as well as

:11:27. > :11:33.early payment of the winter payment -- winter fuel allowance. He has

:11:34. > :11:38.championed the causes of those most in need of help do to this

:11:39. > :11:43.government 's pernicious policies. Giving committee stage of the water

:11:44. > :11:49.bowl, Holocaust vote that would have devolved full control of water

:11:50. > :11:54.policy to Wales and insured Wales is telling total integrity. Once again

:11:55. > :11:59.Welsh Labour MPs undermined their Welsh first Minister and failed to

:12:00. > :12:03.support our amendments. In the second chamber, Dafydd Wigley has

:12:04. > :12:07.continued to fight winces corner, covering a mammoth amount of

:12:08. > :12:13.legislation, hosting debates on Wilson 's economy, fighting for the

:12:14. > :12:16.composition rights of victims of mesothelioma, careless rights, and

:12:17. > :12:21.securing a legacy for Wales out of the Olympic games. He is as we know

:12:22. > :12:27.a bit of an Olympian himself, in the form of a multi-event. Proving that

:12:28. > :12:32.the best retirement for workaholics is no retirement at all but we

:12:33. > :12:36.couldn't do without him, I tell you that. Myself, I continue to sit on

:12:37. > :12:41.the Justice committee and have fought against the devastating

:12:42. > :12:46.changes being proposed to legal aid, the courts, and the prison estate.

:12:47. > :12:52.Following on from the success of our stalking enquiry, which resulted in

:12:53. > :12:55.changes to the law in 20 to 12. The recently established an all-party

:12:56. > :13:12.group on stalking and harassment. Last week I presented a ten minute

:13:13. > :13:14.rule Bill which would strengthen the bill on domestic violence. Today, as

:13:15. > :13:17.we mark International women's Day, and the impairment nation of Clare

:13:18. > :13:19.'s law, the need to show proper support for victims of these

:13:20. > :13:21.horrendous crimes has never been more vital. Our group was united in

:13:22. > :13:23.our opposition to military intervention in Syria and encourage

:13:24. > :13:26.the government to pursue diplomatic and humanitarian solutions. We have

:13:27. > :13:32.argued that the UK should grant access to refugees from Syria in

:13:33. > :13:37.spite of the government 's refusal to join the UNHCR 's resettlement

:13:38. > :13:43.programme. The team continues to fight to give Wales a platform just

:13:44. > :13:46.not just in UK politics, but internationally as well. Earlier

:13:47. > :13:51.this month, I attended a heads of government conference in Athens as

:13:52. > :13:55.acting chair of the House of Commons Justice select committee

:13:56. > :14:01.representatives and 28 nations discussed topics such as migration

:14:02. > :14:04.and tackling violent extremism. In the company of dignitaries from

:14:05. > :14:09.across the continents, I was very glad to be able to dispel the myth

:14:10. > :14:14.that not everyone from the few British Isles is anti-European.

:14:15. > :14:19.Despite the hysteria and indeed scaremongering currently is so --

:14:20. > :14:23.surrounding the immigration debate in the UK. With the European

:14:24. > :14:27.elections around the corner, it was a timely reminder to me of the

:14:28. > :14:31.importance of fostering strong links between Wales and elsewhere on the

:14:32. > :14:36.continent and highlighting the many benefits brought to Wales by our

:14:37. > :14:40.membership of the European Union. Our agricultural industry as we

:14:41. > :14:46.know, forms a vital part of the Welsh economy and is boosted by the

:14:47. > :14:50.EU policies and projects. Our young people at universities to, receive

:14:51. > :14:55.vital youth funding and support that insures that Wales 's institutions

:14:56. > :14:58.are able to offer an excellent standard of education and compete

:14:59. > :15:08.with the best institutions in the UK and beyond. But membership of the EU

:15:09. > :15:12.doesn't just help foster progress and ambition. Some of those's cup

:15:13. > :15:16.poorest communities receive millions of pounds of European funding is

:15:17. > :15:20.helping to close the gap with more prosperous areas. Which is why it

:15:21. > :15:26.was so dismaying last year to see Labour MPs from Wales gang up with

:15:27. > :15:30.some of the Tories most extreme right-wingers to vote in favour of a

:15:31. > :15:35.cut to the EU budget. This billion pound betrayal serves as a stark

:15:36. > :15:43.reminder that Labour in Wales will take its orders from Westminster.

:15:44. > :15:51.But we know that Wales needs a first Minister whose ambitions are

:15:52. > :16:02.informed by what's best for the Wales news Leanne Wood at the helm.

:16:03. > :16:06.What says Plaid Cymru is from the other parties and it comes to Europe

:16:07. > :16:13.is clear and consistent support for Wales as membership of the EU. Our

:16:14. > :16:17.stance on this debate is driven by principle rather than political

:16:18. > :16:25.posturing. Our vision and principles find a chord across the continent.

:16:26. > :16:28.As UKIP makes progress in the polls the London parties and increasingly

:16:29. > :16:33.willing to dance to the tune for fear of losing support. We know UKIP

:16:34. > :16:47.will not dictate anything to Plaid Cymru. While I believe the EU is far

:16:48. > :16:51.from perfect, I am firmly of the view that change from the inside is

:16:52. > :16:56.better than being stuck on the sidelines with fewer friends and

:16:57. > :17:00.foes. European Union is good for Wales and I would argue anyone who

:17:01. > :17:07.cares about nation 's future to turn out to vote in May and make sure we

:17:08. > :17:11.have the strongest voice possible in Brussels because Wales needs Plaid

:17:12. > :17:17.Cymru at the European table. The only party that refuses to buckle to

:17:18. > :17:20.the narrow ideologies of the London parties and the xenophobic attitudes

:17:21. > :17:25.of the tabloid press. Confidence, over the next six months I would

:17:26. > :17:31.relationship with two unions will be the subject of great debate. Our job

:17:32. > :17:36.now is to make certain that we get the best possible deal for Wales in

:17:37. > :17:43.the speedy implementation of silk 's proposals as a bare minimum and the

:17:44. > :17:54.pre-election of Jill Evans as the plant -- Plaid Cymru MEP in May.

:17:55. > :17:58.Thank you. There we go, applause for the

:17:59. > :18:08.parliamentary leader. The Silk Commission mentioned, the report is

:18:09. > :18:14.published this week, but Plaid Cymru wanted to go further. The other two

:18:15. > :18:16.parties have internal tensions regarding the Silk Commission. Part

:18:17. > :18:20.one is what will be paying regarding the Silk Commission. Part

:18:21. > :18:26.to over the next few months. regarding the Silk Commission. Part

:18:27. > :18:30.all about money. I do think we're going to hear an awful lot more

:18:31. > :18:36.about the Silk Commission part two. It is in the refrigerator. The next

:18:37. > :18:40.step on that will be to do with the party 's manifesto was come the next

:18:41. > :18:45.general election. And then whatever happens in terms of possible

:18:46. > :18:55.coalition talks if it is another hung parliament. It could be on the

:18:56. > :19:03.back burner. We talk about silk part two, but it lists a lot of things

:19:04. > :19:08.that might be devolved. There was this thing about reserved powers.

:19:09. > :19:16.Walk me through that without going into the fridge! It is a model which

:19:17. > :19:18.says these are the powers that are reserved to Westminster rather than

:19:19. > :19:24.these other powers devolved to Cardiff. The reason that is

:19:25. > :19:27.important, that is the Scottish model incidentally, it is much

:19:28. > :19:32.clearer. We have had a number of court cases where there have been

:19:33. > :19:37.arguments whether something was devolved or not. For instance, the

:19:38. > :19:44.agricultural wages board. The Welsh Government wants to establish a

:19:45. > :19:55.replacement. Is that a question of agriculture which is devolved, or

:19:56. > :19:58.employment which isn't? This is something the Labour Party in

:19:59. > :20:00.Westminster and in Cardiff Bay can agree on. If you have a Labour

:20:01. > :20:03.government in the next election we will be seeing reasonably rapid

:20:04. > :20:06.moves on that. When it will be seeing reasonably rapid

:20:07. > :20:09.particular extra will be seeing reasonably rapid

:20:10. > :20:14.devolved, we saw it this week Ann will be seeing reasonably rapid

:20:15. > :20:18.Clwyd looking at the Welsh health service, she is reluctant to give

:20:19. > :20:27.more powers. There are a lot MPs who feel like that. The deserved powers

:20:28. > :20:32.model is something perhaps that will all could come rapidly after the

:20:33. > :20:38.general election. We will come back to that. Let's go to the conference

:20:39. > :20:46.and join our political editor and his guest.

:20:47. > :20:50.You join me in one of the side rooms to the main auditorium. Elfyn

:20:51. > :20:55.Llwyd's speech has just finished. Earlier on today we heard from Jill

:20:56. > :20:59.Evans, the current MEP hoping to be re-elected. The subject of the

:21:00. > :21:05.European elections is at the forefront of conversation at the

:21:06. > :21:09.conference. Let's have a chat now with two of those candidates, Steven

:21:10. > :21:16.Cornelius and Marc Jones. Good afternoon. It is interesting, I

:21:17. > :21:21.thought, I caught up with Jill Evans and she was comparing this European

:21:22. > :21:25.election with five years ago. She felt it was much more high profile

:21:26. > :21:29.on the doorstep because of the involvement, primarily, of UKIP and

:21:30. > :21:38.the prospect of an in out referendum. People are engaging on

:21:39. > :21:43.the doorstep. The problem with the Europe election in the past is it

:21:44. > :21:50.has been a chance for people to vote how they like, it is a freebie. But

:21:51. > :21:58.this one is much more serious. We are the only party that will stand

:21:59. > :22:04.up for Wales. The media has given UKIP an easy ride. Now, they are

:22:05. > :22:08.coming under it more scrutiny. How are you finding things on the

:22:09. > :22:12.doorstep. We are finding that is a lot more awareness of the European

:22:13. > :22:17.election. A lot more people adding gauged because it is a high-stakes

:22:18. > :22:20.election. We have got a lot of work to do. We are determined to make

:22:21. > :22:27.sure we have Plaid Cymru MEP returned. Was Leanne Wood wise to go

:22:28. > :22:34.on the attack in the way that she did and UKIP? The reason I frame

:22:35. > :22:41.that question is I spoke to Lord Elis-Thomas who described the attack

:22:42. > :22:47.as facile in the way she connected a vote for UKIP are somehow a vote

:22:48. > :22:52.against national interest of Wales. I think Ian Wood was perfectly

:22:53. > :22:58.right. You can't ignore UKIP. It would've been facile to ignore UKIP.

:22:59. > :23:03.What she has done is being precisely correct in analysing what UKIP is

:23:04. > :23:08.all about. They didn't want a Welsh Assembly with any democratic rights

:23:09. > :23:13.or powers. UKIP is thinking about the south-east of England and it is

:23:14. > :23:18.ironic we have a party which claims to be run by a public schoolboy. She

:23:19. > :23:23.takes them more seriously than that? A lot of people in Wales

:23:24. > :23:30.support UKIP? Is that underestimating them? As you get

:23:31. > :23:33.close to the election and more light shone on UKIP, but the consequences

:23:34. > :23:41.of their policies will be, we come shone on UKIP, but the consequences

:23:42. > :23:45.They don't stand up for Wales in shone on UKIP, but the consequences

:23:46. > :23:48.Europe. As shone on UKIP, but the consequences

:23:49. > :23:57.that more and more, I think people will come to see UKIP for the

:23:58. > :24:03.dangerous agenda that they are. On the border point of Europe and how

:24:04. > :24:10.people feel towards Europe, Jill Evans said people had lost faith in

:24:11. > :24:16.the EU. Do you agree with that? How would you turn it around? Our job is

:24:17. > :24:26.to make sure that Europe works for Wales. That is about changing the

:24:27. > :24:31.EU. The EU as it is is a nightmare. It spends millions of pounds on

:24:32. > :24:35.going to Strasborg every month. We need to stop that nonsense. We have

:24:36. > :24:42.got to be totally honest with people. There are aspects of the EE

:24:43. > :24:50.which are nonsensical. We have two face up to that and change Europe

:24:51. > :24:57.from within. We talk about UKIP but they have traction out there with

:24:58. > :25:03.the public. What arguments are you using to try to get people to

:25:04. > :25:07.support Plaid Cymru? The choice in this election is clear. Who do you

:25:08. > :25:13.trust to fight for Wales in Europe? I think when that question is put to

:25:14. > :25:18.people it is clear it is a Plaid Cymru MEP Winnie. One of the

:25:19. > :25:25.policies that came out yesterday is to create a private sector led

:25:26. > :25:30.section which would advise public servants how to spend money. Is it

:25:31. > :25:33.an acknowledgement we haven't used the EU funds as

:25:34. > :25:38.an acknowledgement we haven't used have? There has been some success

:25:39. > :25:41.stories. If you look at the big picture it becomes quite clear that

:25:42. > :25:45.we haven't done as well as we might have done. GDP across West Wales and

:25:46. > :25:51.the Valleys has fallen over that period. We need to ask why the Welsh

:25:52. > :25:59.Labour government hasn't been making a better job of it. It is right that

:26:00. > :26:09.outcome is looking at that again. -- that Plaid Cymru is looking at that

:26:10. > :26:17.again. How do we do that? We have frittered it away on smaller

:26:18. > :26:25.schemes. Sum of those smaller schemes have been useful. We need to

:26:26. > :26:30.involve grassroots organisations and give them more power about how

:26:31. > :26:34.things are done. There is a crying need for infrastructure projects and

:26:35. > :26:44.what have you in Wales. That hasn't really happened with the European

:26:45. > :26:50.money. Many thanks to you both. From the conference in Cardiff, I have is

:26:51. > :26:54.the Internet to European candidates, back to you. We will be back there

:26:55. > :26:59.later. The theme of Europe figured strongly

:27:00. > :27:14.in yesterday 's speech by Leanne Wood.

:27:15. > :27:23.Our final national gathering before the Europe in elections in just a

:27:24. > :27:28.few weeks time. This city, although in Europe's youngest capitals, has

:27:29. > :27:33.been at the centre stage at key moments in our nation 's history.

:27:34. > :27:44.It's youthfulness betraying a millennia of the Welsh national

:27:45. > :27:50.story. It was in this city that the great ifor Bach and body the great

:27:51. > :27:57.Welsh spirits by scaling the walls of Cardiff Castle to confront the

:27:58. > :28:00.mighty Norman overlords. Rhun ap Iorwerth may have been small in

:28:01. > :28:34.height but he was great in determination. In September,

:28:35. > :28:41.Scotland has the opportunity to step permanent clean and confidently out

:28:42. > :28:59.of the shadows. And friends, when the people of Wales want it Wales

:29:00. > :29:06.will follow. Plaid Cymru firmly believes that Wales can and will

:29:07. > :29:15.shine and will not be left behind. Just like Ifor Bach, we have always

:29:16. > :29:18.reached those walls in the past from generation to generation. It is the

:29:19. > :29:23.unlikely story of a country 's triumph against the odds. Over the

:29:24. > :29:33.decades, we have faced seemingly insurmountable challenges and we

:29:34. > :29:38.face them together as one. Lastly, last week marked the anniversary

:29:39. > :29:44.when so many of us thought that Welsh nationhood had been lost. When

:29:45. > :29:50.so many thought that was one wall too many for Wales to breach. When

:29:51. > :29:59.our country rejected devolution by a landslide margin of 10-1. We feared

:30:00. > :30:06.we had voted ourselves out of existence. But within two decades,

:30:07. > :30:20.that was all undone. Our nationhood has been secured. We proved that we

:30:21. > :30:23.could bounce back. today we face new opportunities and new challenges. We

:30:24. > :30:28.will be required to summon the same strength and determination that have

:30:29. > :30:34.carried our hopes before. The party of Wales is firmly fixed on

:30:35. > :30:40.transforming this country to enable our people to win for themselves a

:30:41. > :30:44.better future. We have a restless party, never standing still. We are

:30:45. > :30:50.driven by our belief that Wales party, never standing still. We are

:30:51. > :30:56.and will do better, that's the next generation can and will have it

:30:57. > :31:02.better than the last. It is precisely that Welsh drive that

:31:03. > :31:06.slides to the unlikely election of the daughter of a the Rhondda bus

:31:07. > :31:22.driver as the leader of the whale -- party of Wales. Both my parents were

:31:23. > :31:29.told not to bother sitting there are 11 plus exams. Their future had been

:31:30. > :31:37.predetermined, a B and placed on their potential. But they did not

:31:38. > :31:42.play such limits on their children. The 11 plus may now be history but

:31:43. > :31:50.to children in Wales today face a different kind of barrier, a barrier

:31:51. > :32:00.in the form of a Labour government that has failed children in all

:32:01. > :32:06.parts of this country. As Wales itself our children are not allowed

:32:07. > :32:15.to reach their full potential after 15 years of Labour government for

:32:16. > :32:21.education authorities are in special measures and we're still slipping

:32:22. > :32:29.down the pizza lovers. The Prime Minister has said that he has taken

:32:30. > :32:37.his eye off the ball. He has no strategy. It is quite obvious that

:32:38. > :32:43.if we carry on to do everything in the same way, we shall get the same

:32:44. > :32:51.results it's time to believe in something better. And by looking to

:32:52. > :32:56.the future, Plaid Cymru is determined to ensure a future for

:32:57. > :33:02.the Welsh language, so that it may grow. This means investing in a

:33:03. > :33:11.childcare system which secures sufficient to supply of Welsh medium

:33:12. > :33:14.care for children, to win sure that's the next generation has the

:33:15. > :33:50.right to begin their lives bilingually. may I take this

:33:51. > :33:54.opportunity to congratulate Ceredigion council and Plaid

:33:55. > :34:15.Cymru's leadership there, which has contributed to a excellent Western

:34:16. > :34:21.reports. We reject an education system which sets school against

:34:22. > :34:25.School, school against school, teacher against teacher. A system

:34:26. > :34:32.where banding is more important than results. Plaid Cymru once a new

:34:33. > :34:37.attitude based on cooperation, not competition. We want to release

:34:38. > :34:44.teachers to have the time to develop and to teach so that they can

:34:45. > :34:54.cooperate and share the best practice. Plaid Cymru will work with

:34:55. > :34:58.teachers, to reduce the bureaucratic burden rather than working from the

:34:59. > :35:07.top-down. We shall trust teachers and them the freedom to decide how

:35:08. > :35:13.to do their work. We shall free up teachers so that they can carry on

:35:14. > :35:19.with the task of teaching. Wales has a first Minister without a plan. He

:35:20. > :35:27.was also a first Minister without the backing of his own party. And

:35:28. > :35:30.local government reorganisation, on income tax devolution, on hospital

:35:31. > :35:38.centralisation, his party is publicly protesting in open defiance

:35:39. > :35:43.of his leadership. And doesn't it tell us all we need to know about

:35:44. > :37:16.the state of the Unionist consensus in Wales today that the two main

:37:17. > :37:22.unionist parties are split and in it has required us to compromise. We

:37:23. > :37:27.would have preferred to go one further. At last, our country has

:37:28. > :37:34.the opportunity to gain meaningful powers in a variety of areas. I want

:37:35. > :37:38.to take this opportunity to thank Doctor Ivor Quill for what he is

:37:39. > :38:00.achieved through our country through the process of the Silk Commission.

:38:01. > :38:04.And be in no doubt, Conference, without Plaid Cymru, none of this

:38:05. > :38:09.would've happened. We have won the argument on the devolution of

:38:10. > :38:14.taxation, the devolution of policing, and Conference, after

:38:15. > :38:30.decades long struggle, we won the argument on putting those 's Wales

:38:31. > :38:34.water in favour's hounds. -- hands. It is vital now that we get on with

:38:35. > :38:41.implementing the recommendations as soon as possible but the in game

:38:42. > :38:46.wouldn't response of using -- unionists and minds the whole

:38:47. > :38:53.process. As the leader of the National party, I want to be clear

:38:54. > :39:00.with the people of Wales. Do not think that our ambition for our

:39:01. > :39:29.country is limited. I want to see the people of Wales have control

:39:30. > :39:34.over all of Westminster's Someone once said Wales has an assembly

:39:35. > :39:41.because it is a nation but the powers of that assembly are limited

:39:42. > :39:49.in case Wales acts like a nation. The referendum of 2011, words spoke

:39:50. > :39:54.and behaved as a nation. Devolution can no longer be a process that has

:39:55. > :40:00.a pit stop at every juncture. This year, in the context of tectonic

:40:01. > :40:07.change in these islands, we cannot allow Wales to be a mere spectator.

:40:08. > :40:28.Winners must be a full participant in the process of changing Britain.

:40:29. > :40:32.When Scotland has weapons of mass destruction is removed from its

:40:33. > :40:34.country, words should be able to insist that not one of those

:40:35. > :40:59.warheads is relocated to our shores. The UK is an unbalanced state,

:41:00. > :41:03.socially, politically, and economically. The opportunity must

:41:04. > :41:09.be taken after September to rebalance the British state. I

:41:10. > :41:15.advocate a new council of ministers for the UK that will comprise of all

:41:16. > :41:23.the nations. This cancer should be a forum post seeking agreement on

:41:24. > :41:27.matters, giving of rice to the people through their government is a

:41:28. > :41:36.recognition of the 70 of the people. But talk alone is cheap. We

:41:37. > :41:43.must be empowered to. The Tories are keen to talk about UK opt out, from

:41:44. > :41:48.burdensome EU decisions or decisions deemed to be at odds with the UK's

:41:49. > :41:53.interests. It may surprise you to hear that I'm not opposed in

:41:54. > :42:02.principle to opt outs but I'd like to start closer to home with a right

:42:03. > :42:05.to opt out for Wales from unjust and unacceptable UK policy decisions

:42:06. > :42:11.that affect us. Real empowerment would mean a Welsh opt out and Welsh

:42:12. > :42:30.say on big decisions like welfare and warfare. No more bedroom taxes,

:42:31. > :42:36.forced on Wales. No more young Welshman and women being dragged

:42:37. > :42:41.into illegal wars against the express will of the people of Wales

:42:42. > :42:54.and their government. Wales should be able to say no and mean no. A

:42:55. > :42:59.forum such as this could be an adequate interim measure until our

:43:00. > :43:03.nation is ready for a more permanent settlement as an independent

:43:04. > :43:09.country. Plaid Cymru is ambitious for Wales and we trust the people of

:43:10. > :43:16.Wales with the big decisions. We've seen how project fear in Scotland

:43:17. > :43:21.has sought to bully instead of presenting at positive case. And how

:43:22. > :43:25.they roped in others, like the commissionaire who did the cause of

:43:26. > :43:31.European cooperation in no good at all when he intervened in

:43:32. > :43:36.Scotland's democratic process. No unelected European Commissioner has

:43:37. > :43:40.the right to tell the people of a democratic nation that they express

:43:41. > :43:58.will will be ignored. You won't believe Scotland and you won't

:43:59. > :44:11.believe Wales either. -- bully. And it's precisely that kind of

:44:12. > :44:16.intervention that that That's strong voice that Wales has been able to

:44:17. > :44:21.count on through Jill Evans. Who else will speak for the Welsh

:44:22. > :44:29.national interest? Who else will advocate and EU for the people, and

:44:30. > :44:33.EU that is a member, responsive partnership of nations, and EU that

:44:34. > :44:39.will listen to Wales. We have to be in it to change it. It is the party

:44:40. > :44:47.of Wales that has inherited the mantle of progressive outfit looking

:44:48. > :44:51.politics in Wales. We may well be often frustrated at the lack of

:44:52. > :44:57.agility of the European Union but were fully committed to our

:44:58. > :45:01.continued membership as an active participant. I know that many people

:45:02. > :45:15.in Wales who share our vision of a European Wales have agreed Wales,

:45:16. > :45:20.will feel I urge you today not to let the despondency resolved in

:45:21. > :45:27.staying away from the polling booths. European elections are

:45:28. > :45:32.notorious for their low turnout. But if despondent liberal Democrats and

:45:33. > :45:36.Greens, and sure of what to do at that huge staying at home number it

:45:37. > :45:55.will only benefit the Europhobia cracked. I -- Europhobic right. This

:45:56. > :46:01.could very well be our last ever Europe he and election if we do not

:46:02. > :46:07.make our voices heard and our votes count. -- European election. Don't

:46:08. > :46:12.forget what is at stake in this election. Do not forget all that

:46:13. > :46:22.will be put at risk if dangerous right-wing Europhobia is victorious.

:46:23. > :46:29.Friends, we have two choices. Two possible futures. We should battle

:46:30. > :46:37.for Wales, a prosperous Wales, free within the European Union ought to

:46:38. > :46:46.see our nation be dragged down by London parties. I, and my party,

:46:47. > :46:53.choose the right shining Path for Wales. Our businesses rely on ?5

:46:54. > :46:59.billion worth of trade with our EU partners every year. Our country is

:47:00. > :47:08.benefiting from investment in infrastructure. More than one in ten

:47:09. > :47:14.jobs is directly dependent on our membership of the EU. That is

:47:15. > :47:22.150,000 reasons to vote Plaid Cymru in this maze election. -- made's

:47:23. > :47:28.election. This year marks a significant centenary for Europe.

:47:29. > :47:34.The autumn of 1914 marked the beginning of a mindless period of

:47:35. > :47:42.mass death. Of unspeakable butchery and suffering. It is grotesque that

:47:43. > :47:49.elements of the British state seek to use this centenary to glorify

:47:50. > :47:56.their worldview. There is no glory in war, least of all the First World

:47:57. > :48:02.War. One lesson for all of us in this centenary year is the act

:48:03. > :48:07.despite its many faults and frustrations, the Europe of 2014 is

:48:08. > :48:13.a far better place for its citizens than the Europe of 100 years ago.

:48:14. > :48:21.Sowing this ease of division in our country and in this continent has no

:48:22. > :48:26.place. I say to the purveyors of division today, I say to UKIP today,

:48:27. > :48:33.your politics has no place in this country. Not now, not ever. Your

:48:34. > :48:40.values are not the values of Wales. A vote for UKIP is a vote against

:48:41. > :48:46.Wales, a vote against the Welsh national interest. We cannot and

:48:47. > :49:09.will not let their ugly politics divide us in May.

:49:10. > :49:17.I tell them here and now that we are one Wales. Not immigrant versus low

:49:18. > :49:26.call, one Wales. Not rule versus urban, one Wales. Not Welsh speaking

:49:27. > :49:33.versus English-speaking, one Wales. Not North, not south. Friends, we

:49:34. > :49:40.stand together in the face of division as one Wales. More than

:49:41. > :49:47.ever, our nation needs to pull together, our communities need to

:49:48. > :49:51.pull together. Four years of Tory enforced austerity, the dismantling

:49:52. > :49:56.of the welfare state and a cut of ?1.7 billion to the Welsh budget

:49:57. > :50:02.have plunged families to the breadline. Have put fear into the

:50:03. > :50:07.work and they seek to divide. Conference, Wales can't rely on

:50:08. > :50:13.others to champion our national interest. The people of Wales no

:50:14. > :50:21.that Plaid Cymru can be trusted to put Wales first every time, every

:50:22. > :50:27.day. I was proud to unveil earlier this year my new shadow cabinet,

:50:28. > :50:30.Wales 's cabinet in waiting. As a team, we have hit the ground running

:50:31. > :50:36.and failing policy peoples and proposals that will help to

:50:37. > :50:42.transform our country. Our plans to recruit a thousand extra doctors to

:50:43. > :50:47.the welfare -- Welsh health service contrasts to the current

:50:48. > :50:51.government's managed off-line. We are consulting on a new approach to

:50:52. > :50:56.tear down barriers between Health and Social Care Act, to put an end

:50:57. > :51:03.to bed blocking and at last, to put the patient front and centre of

:51:04. > :51:06.health and social services. We are determined to end the perverse

:51:07. > :51:14.situation where an energy rich country like ours is burdened with

:51:15. > :51:18.fuel poverty. We demand control over our natural resources so that the

:51:19. > :51:23.wealth creators from them and if it's communities and families with

:51:24. > :51:31.bills kept down, not just for 20 months, but for good. Natural

:51:32. > :51:34.resources in national hand. We are reaching creativity as well and that

:51:35. > :51:38.is why we have renewed calls for the devolution of broadcast and so our

:51:39. > :51:45.creative industries can flourish, boosting our economy and enhancing

:51:46. > :51:50.our cultures. We have given Wales a voice on matters with a too long we

:51:51. > :51:55.have been ignored. On migration, it is high time we federalised

:51:56. > :52:02.decisions so we have a Welsh migration system that works for our

:52:03. > :52:07.country, our priorities, our needs. Just yesterday I was proud to unveil

:52:08. > :52:12.our vision for a modern childcare system that will end the postcode

:52:13. > :52:16.lottery provision aiding parents to get back into the workplace and

:52:17. > :52:20.giving our children the start in life that these so thoroughly

:52:21. > :52:27.deserved. Plaid Cymru is not standing still while others pretend

:52:28. > :52:31.to stand up for Wales. Each and every one of our policy initiatives

:52:32. > :52:36.is driven by a motivation to release the potential of the country and

:52:37. > :52:41.match the aspirations of the people. We are getting on with the job of

:52:42. > :52:48.fighting for the Wales that people are yearning to see. Above all, we

:52:49. > :52:53.have a laser focus on turning around our country's economic performance

:52:54. > :53:00.and it will be for the long-term. A durable recovery that will last and

:53:01. > :53:04.will be universally felt. You see, all this talk of recovery now will

:53:05. > :53:10.be meaningless if it follows previous patterns. Where the

:53:11. > :53:14.south-east of England and the bloated London region hoovers the

:53:15. > :53:24.industry and talent from the rest of the UK. This must not again be a

:53:25. > :53:28.hollow recovery for Wales. Earlier, I mentioned the need for a political

:53:29. > :53:32.rebalancing of Britain and there is need as well for the economic

:53:33. > :53:39.rebalancing of the British state. There is a danger of an upgraded

:53:40. > :53:44.growth forecast resulting for more than a spreadsheet recovery. Where

:53:45. > :53:47.the social and economic condition of our country as some have asked and

:53:48. > :53:54.do not reveal what is, for many, a reality. Zero hours contracts, a

:53:55. > :53:58.race to the bottom in wages, extortionate bills for essentials

:53:59. > :54:04.such as public transport and energy. A structural realignment

:54:05. > :54:08.economically is vital. That is way the party of Wales advocates a

:54:09. > :54:16.publicly owned energy company so prices are always capped as low as

:54:17. > :54:21.possible. -- kept. A public rail network that puts people ahead of

:54:22. > :54:25.the fast buck and is affordable as well as reliable. A business culture

:54:26. > :54:32.where innovation is encouraged and small and medium-sized enterprises

:54:33. > :54:35.can flourish. I have spoken often of my desire for Wales to be at the

:54:36. > :54:43.forefront of a new industrial revolution. To do so, Welsh

:54:44. > :54:49.businesses must be at the heart of everything we do. A narrative of

:54:50. > :54:56.putting private sector against the public sector has emerged recently.

:54:57. > :55:02.A meaningless division in vented to suit no row, party political

:55:03. > :55:06.interests at Westminster. -- narrow. Many tell you on top and there's

:55:07. > :55:15.today that Plaid Cymru led Welsh Government will be a business

:55:16. > :55:23.friendly government. May I tell you enter openness. Over 80,000 Welsh

:55:24. > :55:29.businesses will benefit and our plans to overhaul the business rates

:55:30. > :55:34.system with more than 70,000 been removed from paying great

:55:35. > :55:39.altogether. -- paying rates altogether. There has been a

:55:40. > :55:44.disconnect between the opportunities provided by European funding and the

:55:45. > :55:48.long-term economic benefits. Billions of European funds have been

:55:49. > :55:56.spent in recent years. Billions more will come. But Plaid Cymru once a

:55:57. > :56:01.change in culture and a strategic shift in how European funds up at to

:56:02. > :56:09.use. Last week, we were given a chilling reminder of the scale of

:56:10. > :56:15.the task that faces us. GDP in West Wales and the Valleys has declined

:56:16. > :56:37.again. From 65% of the EU average to 64%. Our Valleys communities deserve

:56:38. > :56:41.that than this. I want to maximise the potential of Welsh businesses

:56:42. > :56:46.and ex-teas and talents for the good of the entire nation. -- and

:56:47. > :56:52.expertise. We will begin a consultation with as Mrs and others

:56:53. > :56:55.as to how we can transform our economy by maximising the

:56:56. > :56:59.possibilities of European funds, especially, private capital

:57:00. > :57:03.resources from the Welsh and UK Government. The new cycle of

:57:04. > :57:08.European structural funds is underway and we may never get a same

:57:09. > :57:14.level of European funding as we will get from this year to 2020. I will

:57:15. > :57:20.therefore be consulting on establishing a new body outside of

:57:21. > :57:26.Welsh Government. This new body will be private sector led and will

:57:27. > :57:29.proactively seek opportunities to invest European funds, other public

:57:30. > :57:39.funds and private capital for the maximum long-term economic benefit.

:57:40. > :57:48.It will establish a presence for Wales within the investment sector

:57:49. > :57:51.2-mac eight -- match ideas. It will transform the mentality of risk

:57:52. > :57:59.aversion in the current culture of administering rather than driving.

:58:00. > :58:03.The new body will bring together the best and the brightest, working with

:58:04. > :58:08.our universities, trade unions and communities. For too long I will

:58:09. > :58:12.approach to using EU funds especially has been fragmented,

:58:13. > :58:19.lacking indirection and lacking in focus. Where has it got us) the new

:58:20. > :58:24.agency I propose will be overarching, nimble and will seek

:58:25. > :58:31.out opportunities and realise them. It will not sit back and wait for

:58:32. > :58:47.things to happen. That is Labour 's way, not Plaid Cymru's. The Labour

:58:48. > :58:52.government may have given up on driving up our GDP but Plaid Cymru

:58:53. > :59:00.will use every tool in government to add billions in value to our economy

:59:01. > :59:05.so first we reach the UK average for prosperity and in time we will

:59:06. > :59:13.exceed it. The party of Wales is the party of designers and innovation.

:59:14. > :59:18.We mean business. A healthy business environment goes hand-in-hand and

:59:19. > :59:21.not in contradiction with fake conditions for workers. The

:59:22. > :59:28.countries with less levels of productivity are those where workers

:59:29. > :59:32.are respected and treated well. It is a central aim for Plaid Cymru to

:59:33. > :59:40.end the absurd practice of these eight subsidising poor working

:59:41. > :59:45.conditions and poor levels of pay. I want to congratulate Plaid Cymru led

:59:46. > :59:51.Gwynedd Council in increasing the wages of the lowest paid workers

:59:52. > :00:07.moving towards the living wage. This is very welcome. This is very, very

:00:08. > :00:17.welcome and indeed it represents Plaid Cymru's drive to increase

:00:18. > :00:25.wages and boost living standards. I have hope that the rest of this

:00:26. > :00:30.sector will follow this lad to want to watch. Ten out of 50,000 Welsh

:00:31. > :00:35.workers currently receive a wage that is currently below a living

:00:36. > :00:39.wage. Reducing this number will Grant was not just for appropriate

:00:40. > :00:46.workers but for America as a whole and for the public purse. But a

:00:47. > :00:51.business in a position of readership and overcoming worlds as low wage

:00:52. > :00:58.economy in the central plank of Plaid Cymru's business tool. Just as

:00:59. > :01:04.I return to bridge gaps in standards and pay, so too must bridge gaps

:01:05. > :01:10.between our communities and between the quality of services across the

:01:11. > :01:21.country. The headlines that created a web -- winnings from -- report. I

:01:22. > :01:25.can't think of another example in the world where the government has

:01:26. > :01:33.been advised by any condition it appointed itself to effectively

:01:34. > :01:40.rewrite so programme of government. At things as targets would want to

:01:41. > :01:45.be inconsistent and clear, a reflection of the Welsh Government

:01:46. > :01:50.and labour. And it is totally unacceptable that a different level

:01:51. > :01:56.of two when he exists in the transfer of patients times between

:01:57. > :02:02.one council area and another. But what struck me more than anything

:02:03. > :02:09.else in that report was the to join the poverty and aspiration that

:02:10. > :02:24.exists and will ball. It said it reaching the average had That is not

:02:25. > :02:30.good enough and that is not the the danger posed by global governance

:02:31. > :02:36.performance. Plus some opinion polls that suggest an increase in

:02:37. > :02:42.anti-Jewish feelings. Neighbours to performance threatens the very

:02:43. > :02:50.future of --) performance threatens devolution. But when asked to people

:02:51. > :02:55.being asked to want to approach Westminster parliament? Wouldn't ask

:02:56. > :03:05.that, because when you don't get the services you deserve, a children's

:03:06. > :03:08.education is adequate, the economic are hampered, he wouldn't have

:03:09. > :03:19.situation of those in charge of institution. -- is an institution,

:03:20. > :03:29.and of those in charge of the institution. The people of rows in

:03:30. > :03:33.the final change of direction and Conference, the change of government

:03:34. > :03:41.and Cardiff Bay will deliver that. Food and culture of. Striving for

:03:42. > :03:47.excellence buttons and run across all departments and all sectors.

:03:48. > :03:52.This will always have its day tractors who will tell us that were

:03:53. > :04:00.too small, too stupid, too weak to reach such levels of excellence. But

:04:01. > :04:04.once in a generation, enrolment presents itself with the group of

:04:05. > :04:12.determined people have the opportunity to transfer the cause of

:04:13. > :04:24.revolution. We're about to enter an electoral cycle is a party that will

:04:25. > :04:29.begin away -- in a bit of in 2016. When asked to reflect on this

:04:30. > :04:34.period, let us make sure that it is this moment, here and now, that's

:04:35. > :04:42.the point to as the moment the course of our country changed for

:04:43. > :04:51.good. The politics of hope must triumph this very. Wales must

:04:52. > :04:59.triumph this Very. I began this afternoon by recalling how Ifor Bach

:05:00. > :05:05.skills and -- skills and apparently impregnable wall in the pursuit of

:05:06. > :05:13.justice. The rules we face today collectively as a nation of laws

:05:14. > :05:19.that only exist in our minds and are about and the final lack the

:05:20. > :05:27.confidence to achieve. So the worlds that stand between Barack and want

:05:28. > :05:34.to be. There is no role to Ohio to stop the will of the Welsh nation.

:05:35. > :05:39.The barrier so insurmountable to store all the tide of national

:05:40. > :05:56.aspiration. This right this together.

:05:57. > :06:03.Leanne Wood speaking yesterday and will have a word with you shortly.

:06:04. > :06:10.Pastrana temporarily cut. I'm not sure if the owner so much as

:06:11. > :06:14.that of the world to go and attack. There are voted on by Solanki, if

:06:15. > :06:19.you want to do the job out, voted Plaid Cymru. The Plaid Cymru tried

:06:20. > :06:22.something similar in with the England. But two of the set Cymru

:06:23. > :06:25.tried something similar in Finn Russell England. Paxton), bandaged

:06:26. > :06:29.and picking up some votes certain elements of certain elements of

:06:30. > :06:37.saying what they think about those to clever tactical thinking as well.

:06:38. > :06:43.Not everybody thinks this attack is clever. This left Lord Elis-Thomas

:06:44. > :06:54.said something interesting. He describes it as a facile. He is

:06:55. > :06:58.responding to something that was described as irrational and capable

:06:59. > :07:02.of Welsh. Lord Elis-Thomas as it is not Plaid Cymru struck to define

:07:03. > :07:09.what is Welsh and not Welsh. If Welsh voters want to vote pick-up

:07:10. > :07:17.and that is a valid vote for Welsh voters, it's not arise. Let's as

:07:18. > :07:25.part of yourself. Can you clarify, because Dafydd

:07:26. > :07:32.Elis-Thomas is not impressed with the never attacked cab. Isn't an

:07:33. > :07:38.Welsh to vote in the cup? It's against the Welsh national

:07:39. > :07:44.interest and that is well I had specialist. There are time of jobs

:07:45. > :07:50.dependent upon our membership of the European Union, that's 150,000 jobs

:07:51. > :07:56.in total but at risk if the progressives get their way and what

:07:57. > :07:58.I've argued is that it simply because interesting ways to back

:07:59. > :08:01.Plaid Cymru because there because interesting ways to back

:08:02. > :08:07.real risks associated with not having a Plaid Cymru voice in the

:08:08. > :08:12.European Parliament. You will remember that there was a vote that

:08:13. > :08:18.took place in Parliament and the EU budget and it was only Plaid Cymru

:08:19. > :08:23.MPs who voted in the Welsh national interest not to cut that budget. MPs

:08:24. > :08:29.from other parties all voted against the Welsh national interest.

:08:30. > :08:37.Why is it that more people according to the polls, more people in Wales

:08:38. > :08:42.seem to be backing UKIP ahead of this poll in May than they do Plaid

:08:43. > :08:45.Cymru? There are plenty of polls which is a

:08:46. > :08:53.plenty of things. I am looking at the actual -- election results in

:08:54. > :08:58.Ynys Mon in which we took 60% of the vote and there have been cancelled

:08:59. > :09:03.by election since... They are heading when the polls in

:09:04. > :09:08.Europe. And telling the people back then that they are wrong?

:09:09. > :09:17.There are plenty of people that want to vote for moving out of the EU but

:09:18. > :09:22.there are also plenty of people who want to remain in the EU and I am

:09:23. > :09:27.appealing to those people at a black -- back Plaid Cymru this summer

:09:28. > :09:31.because there is a lot at stake. If there are also plenty of people who

:09:32. > :09:33.want to remain in the EU and I am appealing to those people at a black

:09:34. > :09:44.-- back Plaid Cymru this summer because there is a lot at stake. If

:09:45. > :09:49.the regressive. All those issues will be taken away from the

:09:50. > :09:54.political agenda. Before the World Cup, just clarify

:09:55. > :10:02.whether or not Lord Elis-Thomas is wrong to call their attack facile.

:10:03. > :10:09.Well, Dafydd Elis-Thomas has got fleas on a range of things where we

:10:10. > :10:14.may not exactly see eye to eye. But we are gathered at the conference,

:10:15. > :10:17.peoples spirits are very high and the determination from our members

:10:18. > :10:22.to go out onto the streets to talk to people and explain to them what

:10:23. > :10:26.is at stake in this election, while it's important to support Plaid

:10:27. > :10:31.Cymru, that is something we're all focused on and to be honest,

:10:32. > :10:36.everything else is a sideshow. Let's move on to something else.

:10:37. > :10:41.You talked about several oxides, that is alike is to opt out from

:10:42. > :10:47.several policies from a UK government, including on defence.

:10:48. > :10:52.You said no more Welsh yen and men dragged into illegal wars. How would

:10:53. > :10:59.that work. If you join the Army and you come from Wales, to go to war or

:11:00. > :11:03.don't you? There is more than one country that

:11:04. > :11:07.makes up the United Kingdom. The situation might change in September

:11:08. > :11:14.depending on the outcome of the vote in Scotland. What is important is

:11:15. > :11:20.that Wales, being a small company -- country, as a clear say on the

:11:21. > :11:22.matter is that are non-devolved. War is one of those, Rhydfelen is

:11:23. > :11:36.another, and there is one of those, Rhydfelen is

:11:37. > :11:42.if you are in the Army and you are from Wales, to say, look don't go to

:11:43. > :11:47.war, boys and girls? What I'm saying is if the Welsh

:11:48. > :11:52.Government took a position that was different to the UK government, that

:11:53. > :11:59.that position should feature in the decision-making process. I'm a

:12:00. > :12:03.question like where, there are of people throughout the United Kingdom

:12:04. > :12:08.who are opposed to going into the Iraq war. There was no ability for

:12:09. > :12:12.Wales to have an input into that decision and I'm arguing that people

:12:13. > :12:17.in Wales and know best about what in the interests and should have some

:12:18. > :12:23.way of having a say about those decisions which affect us deeply.

:12:24. > :12:30.You said that Plaid is the party of business. And with that, Adam Price,

:12:31. > :12:37.a former MP, has said he would like taxes for the rich to come down. To

:12:38. > :12:41.back that? Adam has put forward an argument

:12:42. > :12:45.that it will accept should be removed, but this should be

:12:46. > :12:51.considered. We're not going to make any decisions on the tracks at this

:12:52. > :12:55.stage. From circling over that tax-raising powers, if they do come

:12:56. > :13:00.to Wales, were to be here until 2021. We know we've got a grave in

:13:01. > :13:05.our economy now that we've no idea what the situation will be in 2021.

:13:06. > :13:09.I hope you will have turned around our economic situation by then and

:13:10. > :13:16.that the economic picture facing woes won't be the same. So not

:13:17. > :13:18.prepared to outline our taxation policies. At the

:13:19. > :13:26.prepared to outline our taxation having a healthy debate and ensure

:13:27. > :13:32.that will continue. No policy has been passed on this

:13:33. > :13:35.yet and none will be passed on our tax policies until winning a

:13:36. > :13:40.realistic position to see those policies implemented.

:13:41. > :13:45.You mentioned in the body you would like to set to control investments

:13:46. > :13:54.run by the private sector. I'm talking about some kind of WGA was

:13:55. > :13:59.something instead of Finance Wales? It's not an argument for bringing

:14:00. > :14:04.back the WDA but there is a case for business to have more of a role in

:14:05. > :14:12.determining policies and expenditure and business. I think we're missing

:14:13. > :14:17.a trick by not involving business much male and when we know that last

:14:18. > :14:23.week we saw the latest figures out from 2011 which showed that in West

:14:24. > :14:29.Wales and the valleys, GDP has gone down from 65% to 64% of the EU

:14:30. > :14:33.average, we need to do something different because carrying on as

:14:34. > :14:37.usual will only get you what you always get so I'm going to be

:14:38. > :14:44.consulting business and this is to hear from them exactly how they're

:14:45. > :14:51.going to input into this process and I'm hopeful of a very positive

:14:52. > :14:58.response. You said an independent Scotland be allowed to automatically

:14:59. > :14:59.remain in the European Union? The question about Scotland's

:15:00. > :15:02.membership of the The question about Scotland's

:15:03. > :15:17.contentious when and it is a Scotland is a successful country, it

:15:18. > :15:21.is doing well financially and it would be an asset to the European

:15:22. > :15:27.Union. After the vote has taken place in Scotland next September a

:15:28. > :15:29.lot of these issues which are then contentious as part of the

:15:30. > :15:35.referendum debate will not be contentious any more. They will be

:15:36. > :15:39.more clear-cut. I am confident if Scotland becomes independent

:15:40. > :15:45.European Union will welcome it with independent arms. Should Wales have

:15:46. > :15:53.a say whether it should keep the pound? I didn't catch that. Should

:15:54. > :15:59.Wales have a say whether and not Scotland should keep the pound?

:16:00. > :16:03.Again, on the question on whether Scotland gets to keep the pound,

:16:04. > :16:09.that is an issue that will not be contentious after September. It is

:16:10. > :16:13.in all of our interest for Scotland to remain with the pound. That is

:16:14. > :16:19.why the yes campaign have advocated that eventuality. It isn't just in

:16:20. > :16:25.the best interest of the people of Scotland but in the interest of the

:16:26. > :16:31.whole of the UK. If there is a Yes vote in September, that became clear

:16:32. > :16:41.that people. Should Wales have a say in its? Wales should have a say on

:16:42. > :16:47.all aspects after Scotland becomes independent. I have asked for Wales

:16:48. > :16:51.to have a seat at the negotiating table to make sure our interest

:16:52. > :16:55.represented and we don't get left behind. Wales should be involved in

:16:56. > :17:01.on ago she shares after that important vote in Scotland. You have

:17:02. > :17:06.been at the helm for two years, what we do say your greatest achievement

:17:07. > :17:12.is so far? The Anglesey by-election was the happiest days since I have

:17:13. > :17:19.become leader of Plaid Cymru, it was a phenomenal success. The other

:17:20. > :17:24.parties were trailing well behind. I hope we can replicate that success

:17:25. > :17:27.not just in those ages where Plaid Cymru is traditionally seen strong

:17:28. > :17:33.support but in communities across Wales. That is what we are

:17:34. > :17:40.determined to do as a party. Thank you for joining us.

:17:41. > :17:45.Scotland, it is looming hugely over this year in terms of the

:17:46. > :17:48.Constitution. Whatever happens it shifts the whole constitutional

:17:49. > :17:55.debate. That is why Leanne Wood was kicking

:17:56. > :18:00.around some of these ideas of Council of government and so on. It

:18:01. > :18:06.seems unformed. That question you are asking about the Armed Forces,

:18:07. > :18:11.she didn't really seem to have an answer. She said Wales should have

:18:12. > :18:17.an input in decisions. Did that mean a veto? Did she mean the Welsh

:18:18. > :18:21.Government? Over the last ten years of President has been established

:18:22. > :18:27.where we don't go to vote without -- war without a vote in Parliament.

:18:28. > :18:32.That seemed to me informed. I do wonder, there was quite a difficult

:18:33. > :18:38.shift for some of the grassroots of Plaid Cymru in that speech. It was

:18:39. > :18:44.to move the party into a pro-business movement. It is

:18:45. > :18:51.traditionally been a party for the Socialist left. I wonder if that was

:18:52. > :18:57.a little bit of pacifist red meat, if that isn't a contradiction in

:18:58. > :19:00.terms! There is a long, long tradition of opposing military

:19:01. > :19:05.action and pacifism within Plaid Cymru. I will if that was thrown in

:19:06. > :19:11.there for party members because she thought the business thing would be

:19:12. > :19:14.difficult. She talked about the narrow meaningless division between

:19:15. > :19:20.the private and public sectors. You could argue they have been part of

:19:21. > :19:30.that division. It is not a party that is crammed full of businessmen.

:19:31. > :19:36.Traditionally, Plaid Cymru have talked about cooperatives, user

:19:37. > :19:42.cooperatives, worker cooperatives. They opposed every single

:19:43. > :19:47.privatisation there has ever end. To present itself as being a party that

:19:48. > :19:55.is business friendly and not just friendly to small businesses both

:19:56. > :20:01.friendlies are big business. Wider shift? Who is playing their? I think

:20:02. > :20:06.this is the influence of Adam Price who has had the journey himself from

:20:07. > :20:12.being a man of the left to being someone who, perhaps, has got

:20:13. > :20:15.different fields. What we might be seeing, it is interesting, Leanne

:20:16. > :20:21.Wood is the most left-wing leader ever elected by Plaid Cymru. What we

:20:22. > :20:22.may be saying -- seeing is a shift towards the centre ground or even

:20:23. > :20:32.the centre-right. towards the centre ground or even

:20:33. > :20:34.them ground? Who knows? What it would do depending other

:20:35. > :20:39.mathematics, it'd make the possibility of the rainbow,

:20:40. > :20:45.something young would says she can't see happening, the coalition

:20:46. > :20:51.involving Plaid Cymru, Conservatives and the Liberal Democrats. It's a

:20:52. > :21:02.book that more possible if Plaid Cymru would be more is this

:21:03. > :21:07.friendly. Now for another speech from yesterday. The North Wales

:21:08. > :21:13.Assembly Member is the party's natural resources spokesman. He

:21:14. > :21:17.urged councils to buy locally and praised Gwynedd Council for the way

:21:18. > :21:24.it sources its school meals. A company that supplies vegetables

:21:25. > :21:30.to Gwynedd Council told me the contract allows them to apply to

:21:31. > :21:37.members additional members of staff. Fruit suppliers said they contract

:21:38. > :21:40.meant six additional staff full stop another six workers able to stay in

:21:41. > :21:45.the locality to earn a living and raise their families. The variation

:21:46. > :21:49.between the councils is quite astonishing. It demonstrates what is

:21:50. > :21:54.possible with a clear policy on procurement in the government. As a

:21:55. > :21:57.parent, I want to know the food my children are being given in school

:21:58. > :22:01.is, whenever possible, locally sourced and supplied and adding

:22:02. > :22:08.value to my local economy. What hope do high half -- I have if the

:22:09. > :22:12.catering company is based in Newton Abbot of Rochdale? Wales has

:22:13. > :22:18.catering company is based in Newton food producers. If it's possible for

:22:19. > :22:21.the county such as Gwynedd to use local suppliers, surely it isn't

:22:22. > :22:27.beyond the weight of other councils to follow suit. It is a scandal that

:22:28. > :22:31.food sector jobs are lost in Wales where our run councils are not using

:22:32. > :22:36.them to the maximum effect. We need a lead from the Welsh, to help local

:22:37. > :22:42.farmers, food producers and encouraging more food producing

:22:43. > :22:48.industries. I compare Welsh economy to eight leaking bucket. -- to a

:22:49. > :22:55.leaking bucket. We need to keep the money circulating in the Welsh

:22:56. > :23:01.economy. Plaid Cymru is estimating that if we can keep 75% of the value

:23:02. > :23:06.of public sector contracts winning Wales that will create an additional

:23:07. > :23:12.46,000 jobs. As with naked huge dent in the jobless figures stop -- that

:23:13. > :23:19.would make a huge dent in the jobless figures. When anybody tells

:23:20. > :23:24.you Wales is a work in entry look them in the eye and tell them they

:23:25. > :23:30.are wrong. We face severe economic challenges and we have a long way to

:23:31. > :23:36.go but in terms of our Natural Resources Wales in terms of the

:23:37. > :23:43.natural asset we have, the currency of the future, Wales is stretch.

:23:44. > :23:47.The party 's lead candidate in this year 's European election is the

:23:48. > :23:50.current MEP, Jill Evans. She gave her speech this morning. He said the

:23:51. > :23:54.European Parliament is important but that did not mean things could not

:23:55. > :24:00.be improved. I steered a new law through

:24:01. > :24:04.Parliament restricting the use of hazardous chemicals in electronic

:24:05. > :24:10.goods so they can be recycled safely, so they are not sent to the

:24:11. > :24:14.poorest countries and burnt and children sifting through the rubbish

:24:15. > :24:20.looking for metals they can sell. Too much of Parliament is time now

:24:21. > :24:26.and money is spent on so-called own initiative reports. What does that

:24:27. > :24:32.mean? It means that MEPs write reports on issues on interest to

:24:33. > :24:35.them. They go through the committees, the plenary session,

:24:36. > :24:40.they are voted on, they go through the process but at the end of the

:24:41. > :24:46.day they are just an opinion. They are not law, they don't change the

:24:47. > :24:54.law. Last year we dealt with nearly 200 of these reports. Taking up all

:24:55. > :24:59.of that time. It is time Parliament focused on making laws. Its real

:25:00. > :25:06.purpose. In A.D. Is whether Disney's international regulation. Like GM

:25:07. > :25:10.knows and climate change. One example of an issue that that you

:25:11. > :25:15.deals with which I know matters very much to people in Wales is animal

:25:16. > :25:20.welfare. As a result of pressure from people in Wales and across

:25:21. > :25:35.Europe we succeeded in getting a van on cosmetics tested on animals stop

:25:36. > :25:36.-- eight Ann. -- a ban. The European Commission has now drafted the

:25:37. > :25:41.comprehensive law on animal welfare Commission has now drafted the

:25:42. > :25:43.which will cover all kinds of aspects of this issue. It will be

:25:44. > :25:49.debated aspects of this issue. It will be

:25:50. > :25:53.months. This issue is so important, I get so many letters and e-mails

:25:54. > :25:58.from constituents about these issues that I believe it is time we had a

:25:59. > :26:01.Commissioner with specific responsibility for animal welfare.

:26:02. > :26:10.It would not only mean that these issues were dealt with prop in the

:26:11. > :26:13.when we are framing new EU laws, it send a message to the rest of the

:26:14. > :26:20.world that the EU takes animal welfare very seriously. The bottom

:26:21. > :26:25.line for Plaid Cymru is that our future lies in Europe but in a new

:26:26. > :26:36.and better Europe. While the UK Prime Minister votes on Wales's a

:26:37. > :26:39.half in the European Council. Wales has interests will never be taken

:26:40. > :26:45.into account. We had a stark example of that recently when Wales was left

:26:46. > :26:51.completely off the map of key European transport routes. That's

:26:52. > :26:56.what happened. It was Plaid Cymru that raised that issue that noticed

:26:57. > :27:01.this had been done. The Welsh Government had not objected. Wales

:27:02. > :27:08.will always lose out unless we have our own voice and no room vote. It

:27:09. > :27:13.is no secret that not only does Plaid Cymru wants Wales to stay in

:27:14. > :27:17.the EU but we want the most radical change of the EU of all, we want

:27:18. > :27:23.Wales to be an independent member state. We want that voice and that

:27:24. > :27:31.vote in the council. We want nine state. We want that voice and that

:27:32. > :27:35.MEPs, not four. We would have older and commissioner, that is the kind

:27:36. > :27:42.of change we want to see. We work with sister parties across Europe

:27:43. > :27:45.towards this game. We work, of course, with the Scottish National

:27:46. > :27:50.Party and the Catalans. We know about the referendum, the momentous

:27:51. > :28:08.events which are happening later this year. Scotland will join the EU

:28:09. > :28:14.as an independent member state. Whatever President Barroso says,

:28:15. > :28:18.Scotland will either. That we there. Wales will chart its own course, our

:28:19. > :28:27.own unique course like every nation does. But I can assure you that we

:28:28. > :28:30.will not be left behind in Europe. We, in Plaid Cymru, understand that

:28:31. > :28:39.the EU project is so much more than money. It is about democracy, it is

:28:40. > :28:43.about justice, it is about promoting Wales on the international stage, to

:28:44. > :28:48.work with similar nations and regions across the country, to share

:28:49. > :28:57.digs agencies and to strengthen and to support each other. -- to share

:28:58. > :29:03.experiences. We could stage so many exhibitions and meetings to promote

:29:04. > :29:09.the rest of what we have in Wales. We have done so much of it in the

:29:10. > :29:20.past 18 months, people are referring to one area of Parliament as the

:29:21. > :29:26.Welsh corner. But it is also about. This year

:29:27. > :29:32.marks the centenary of the First World War. 100 years ago a terrible

:29:33. > :29:39.war was about to start. A war that caused an imaginable death and

:29:40. > :29:43.destruction. In 2012 the European Union won the repeat -- Nobel Peace

:29:44. > :29:50.Prize in maintaining peace in Europe. For some, it is a big joke.

:29:51. > :29:57.Many scoffed at it. But I believe that in this special year we have an

:29:58. > :30:00.opportunity for the EU to build on that, to establish a new role for

:30:01. > :30:06.itself will stop instead of moving towards setting up a European army

:30:07. > :30:15.which is what some are trying to do, let's establish a European civilian

:30:16. > :30:20.Peace Corps. Not sold is that, lawyers, all those peoples with

:30:21. > :31:00.skills that can work in areas of potential conflict, to prevent

:31:01. > :31:05.violence and increased tolerance. Plaid Cymru is the only party that

:31:06. > :31:10.protects their Welsh national interest and promotes that interest

:31:11. > :31:30.in the European Parliament. That means we are the only party that

:31:31. > :31:36.Those is a job to do after this election and we mean business.

:31:37. > :31:39.Myself and the team of candidates in the election. I want to thank all of

:31:40. > :31:45.the people who are already working hard campaigning and to urge anyone

:31:46. > :31:50.who would like to help, who would like to join us in this crucial

:31:51. > :31:54.campaign, to get in touch. I'm proud to be a member of a party that

:31:55. > :32:10.outward looking and forward thinking. We go into these elections

:32:11. > :32:16.with confidence. We know that We put Wales first always.

:32:17. > :32:26.Jill Evans speaking this moment -- morning. Simon Thomas said teachers

:32:27. > :32:30.were tied up with fresh tape and he attacked the government on education

:32:31. > :32:35.and said Plaid Cymru government would be unstoppable.

:32:36. > :32:40.Recognising that many schools have excellent teaching, I want to free

:32:41. > :32:46.up successful teachers and leaders excellent teaching, I want to free

:32:47. > :32:51.to teach and cuts down on red tape. This government blames teachers and

:32:52. > :32:56.Micro manages them. I trust teachers and I trust professional teachers

:32:57. > :33:16.and support staff. In government we will move with the trades unions and

:33:17. > :33:19.the We will focus on outcomes and achievement. The quid pro quo is

:33:20. > :33:24.that we're teaching is Paul made mediocre, we will intervene to

:33:25. > :33:30.improve things. Again the best people to improve teachers are

:33:31. > :33:34.professional teachers themselves so continual professional development

:33:35. > :33:38.will be at the heart of what we do. Millions professional managers in

:33:39. > :33:55.schools to free up head teachers to get back who do want to devolve

:33:56. > :34:00.teachers pay and conditions. These are things we want to do in

:34:01. > :34:07.government so how do we get here? Get these policies in chase so

:34:08. > :34:11.that's the people of Wales have what they deserve and it starts here

:34:12. > :34:18.today. It means putting Wales first in the European elections. Imagine a

:34:19. > :34:27.European Parliament without a Plaid Cymru MEP, nobody to stop Labour.

:34:28. > :34:32.Nobody to speak out for farmers and environment. Learn to advocate for

:34:33. > :34:37.higher education institutions. Because unlike other MEPs, our MEP

:34:38. > :34:41.does not take orders from outside Wales especially as your captors.

:34:42. > :34:52.I'm not happy with everything the EU does. But I don't protect 150,000

:34:53. > :34:57.jobs and trade by pulling out of a massive single market that has

:34:58. > :35:01.opened doors and protected workers. He gathered by having a voice in

:35:02. > :35:13.Europe that speaks for Wales only and put Wales first. If you rejoice

:35:14. > :35:19.in diversity, if you want to see climate change taken seriously, if

:35:20. > :35:23.you want a strong and proud of her rise that challenges the system and

:35:24. > :35:29.doesn't just go down the pub and challenge the system, if he wants to

:35:30. > :35:35.tackle poverty, and have a thriving economy than we need to make sure

:35:36. > :35:39.that Jill Evans is re-elected MEP in ten weeks time. The route to a Plaid

:35:40. > :35:46.Cymru government starts with his European elections. The day we

:35:47. > :35:51.remove Labour, is the day Wales rediscovers its ambition and its

:35:52. > :35:57.soul. Simon Thomas. Yesterday, a Pinellas

:35:58. > :36:06.discussed Labour 's proposal to increase tax for high earners. -- a

:36:07. > :36:16.Pinellas -- a panel discussed. I'm in a minority because I think

:36:17. > :36:21.that if we had hired the Silk powers without the lockstep, which would

:36:22. > :36:30.have allowed as to forget the top higher rate, but the existing higher

:36:31. > :36:37.rates, I would have been in favour of cutting the higher rate in Wales

:36:38. > :36:42.because that's an arm of your inward investment policy. If I'm trying to

:36:43. > :36:47.get global entrepreneurs to come to Wales because it's a fantastic

:36:48. > :36:52.country to be successful in, which it is, we have the skills go space

:36:53. > :36:58.here than I am also able to say, by the way, you'll pay less tax than

:36:59. > :37:06.you will over the border in Bristol, and I want that a lever and I'm

:37:07. > :37:14.sorry, but you know, my own view is that we have a casualty of

:37:15. > :37:22.capitalism as it has played out in this country. There are other models

:37:23. > :37:25.that are different, but we can't afford to not allow ourselves that

:37:26. > :37:33.flexibility and freedom where we are now. That doesn't mean that we give

:37:34. > :37:40.up on our values of social justice, but we need to be very much focused

:37:41. > :37:44.on the real issue which is unless we have entrepreneurs creating jobs in

:37:45. > :37:48.Wales, then all the other great things we wanted to do to create a

:37:49. > :37:54.Scandinavian style decent society, we won't be able to do it unless we

:37:55. > :37:59.have that economic base. So we may be in agreement more than you

:38:00. > :38:02.expected but there is a debate to be had and I understand the reasons

:38:03. > :38:08.people would take a different theory but in the rails of 2014, where we

:38:09. > :38:13.are at the moment, then actually I would like to say to that rest of

:38:14. > :38:18.the world, we are open for business, it's a great place to come and grow

:38:19. > :38:23.a successful business and yes, what's the difference between giving

:38:24. > :38:27.and entrepreneur attacks kept and giving him a grant. The difference

:38:28. > :38:32.is the grant is a run-off. They take the money and they run. Give them a

:38:33. > :38:37.lower tax rate and they wanted the next year and the next year and in

:38:38. > :38:46.ten years and in 20 years and they will stay.

:38:47. > :38:51.You know what, I never thought I would be at a Plaid Cymru conference

:38:52. > :38:55.where the audience clapped. I don't suppose in Wales we've got many in

:38:56. > :39:00.that band and I suppose what I suppose what Adam is saying is that

:39:01. > :39:12.if ours was different from the English tax rates, we'd get more of

:39:13. > :39:18.them in so the tax take would go The additional rate is now 45%. In

:39:19. > :39:26.the case of Wales, if you remove that so it's reverted to 40%, it

:39:27. > :39:30.would cost us in gross terms ?20 million a year, that's all. You

:39:31. > :39:38.would hope that you would get more people coming in but also by the

:39:39. > :39:44.way, I must watch what I say, but when you have high marginal rates of

:39:45. > :39:49.tax, a lot of people take legal approaches to avoid that attacks. It

:39:50. > :39:54.is probably in the area when Alastair Darling puts the top rate

:39:55. > :39:57.up to 50% I started getting lots of letters from various accounting

:39:58. > :40:04.firms saying we can help you avoid that 50% rate. It makes it

:40:05. > :40:09.worthwhile to spend money to save on tax. There is a moral case for

:40:10. > :40:13.taxation, and Plaid Cymru are clear on that, but nevertheless, if you

:40:14. > :40:23.put the marginal rates up high, that encourages people to take legal

:40:24. > :40:31.avoidance steps. But maybe, Jocelyn, we should finish on this note.

:40:32. > :40:39.I was wondering whether we would have richer people moving to Wales

:40:40. > :40:45.and having second homes in Bucks! What about lower taxes for the

:40:46. > :40:50.rich? Leanne Wood made it clear that it is not party policy, but an

:40:51. > :40:58.interesting debate. Fascinating. There is a name for

:40:59. > :41:03.Adam Price's argument, trickle-down economics. There are only created

:41:04. > :41:06.jobs at the bottom was to cut taxes at the top. I'm sure Adam Price

:41:07. > :41:11.would say he was talking about a specific situation in Wales, that

:41:12. > :41:16.Rose has a shortage of entrepreneurs but that's what it is. We see it

:41:17. > :41:21.being exercised in America to this day. Cut taxes at the top, create

:41:22. > :41:27.jobs at the bottom and most economies on the left would say it

:41:28. > :41:31.doesn't work that. On that stage, you so the shifts developing.

:41:32. > :41:36.Jocelyn on the left, adamant moving to the right. It's a fascinating

:41:37. > :41:42.dynamic and it does tie in with some of the things we heard in buying --

:41:43. > :41:46.Leanne Wood's speech. That suggests that there is

:41:47. > :41:49.something in the economic field workers a tectonic shift going on

:41:50. > :41:54.amongst the leading thinkers and Plaid Cymru.

:41:55. > :41:59.We'll have more from you shortly, but now were going back to the

:42:00. > :42:05.conference hall. No, they're not ready. Forum, in terms of the

:42:06. > :42:14.economy and dedication, we felt about Europe, and may the 22nd, what

:42:15. > :42:21.will the big teams be? To an extent they vote on Europe in

:42:22. > :42:25.that it's a low turnout election, so those who turnout are quite well

:42:26. > :42:29.politically informed full stop there aren't many low information voters

:42:30. > :42:33.so the question of Europe to motivate Plaid Cymru voters who

:42:34. > :42:39.traditionally turn out very well in European elections and the issue of

:42:40. > :42:45.Europe to motivate UKIP voters. When it comes to the Labour Party, the

:42:46. > :42:53.key is can Labour get more of the people out than last results in the

:42:54. > :43:01.rock-solid Labour constituencies, only about 4000 people voted Labour.

:43:02. > :43:06.If Labour can get their vote out, then that's what really puts Jill

:43:07. > :43:13.Evans's seat in peril. What will drive Labour voters? A desire to

:43:14. > :43:23.give a kick to the Westminster government. So really, Europe is a

:43:24. > :43:29.driving part pass force for some parties.

:43:30. > :43:34.The party is also gearing up for next year 's Westminster election.

:43:35. > :43:40.Our political editor is joined by two people who are hoping to win

:43:41. > :43:46.seats next year. Thank you. Let's fast forward to

:43:47. > :43:51.this time next year when were going to be talking about the general

:43:52. > :43:56.election. I've got to parliamentary candidates would meet Liz Simon

:43:57. > :44:30.Roberts and Mike Barker, the candidate for Ceredigion. I'm

:44:31. > :44:35.electioneering at this I am interested in that the local economy

:44:36. > :44:39.will only have the lowest salaries in Britain and will need full

:44:40. > :44:43.employment. Mike, you're approaching

:44:44. > :44:49.Ceredigion. What angrily taking in terms of the way you're describing

:44:50. > :44:53.the economy and the challenges facing that earlier? I have been

:44:54. > :44:59.conducting a survey of constituents about the cost of living.

:45:00. > :45:06.We hear so much about recovery. Two people in Ceredigion, this is not

:45:07. > :45:11.apparent. People are on zero hours contracts and peoples wages are

:45:12. > :45:17.stagnating. The cost of living is serving so the tourney, Lib Dem,

:45:18. > :45:25.were all having a recovery, has not yet reached wrestlers and it's not

:45:26. > :45:33.going to Leanne Wood talked of a spreadsheets

:45:34. > :45:39.recovery yesterday. But the GDP figures, the unemployment rate is

:45:40. > :45:43.lower in Wales. But on the ground people are having a tough time of

:45:44. > :45:51.it. We have a so-called recovery which has been linked A.D. Age old

:45:52. > :45:59.dream of lighting the blue touch paper of property prices. It causes

:46:00. > :46:05.immense damage. It is a one trick pony, this government. The people I

:46:06. > :46:14.talk to, thousands of them, they are not feeling it. They are feeling the

:46:15. > :46:18.opposite. They feel that the hidden costs of people who work in, we do

:46:19. > :46:29.have respectable rate of employment, but the costs associated with it,

:46:30. > :46:35.the cost of petrol, the cost of fuel, those are the issues affecting

:46:36. > :46:42.people from day to day. Yes, you can look at it in terms of the recession

:46:43. > :46:48.is gradually receding in London but we're not seeing any difference in

:46:49. > :46:54.north-west Wales. The general election will be the Conservative,

:46:55. > :46:56.Labour battle ground. How do you make sure that Plaid Cymru doesn't

:46:57. > :47:07.get marginalised within that debate? Locally, we have an

:47:08. > :47:10.effective mechanism which of the big British parties have, we have

:47:11. > :47:17.Facebook and Twitter and we have people on the ground. We can talk to

:47:18. > :47:22.people. You are in a safe Plaid Cymru seat. You are in a Liberal

:47:23. > :47:34.Democrat seat. How do you try to deal with that challenge? Ceredigion

:47:35. > :47:40.is a strange old seat. It is between two parties that don't feature in

:47:41. > :47:44.the narrative. I am finding a lots of people are fed up with the

:47:45. > :47:51.government in London. The Lib Dems are centre stage in that. Our MP is

:47:52. > :47:59.trying to duck the bullet. He can't duck the bullet. He has caused

:48:00. > :48:05.immense suffering. -- his government has caused immense suffering. Why do

:48:06. > :48:12.you think the impact on the Scottish referendum will be? It will raise

:48:13. > :48:17.our word expectations. It is a game changer. It be very close. I was in

:48:18. > :48:27.Scotland last week and I detect a great deal more enthusiasm for the

:48:28. > :48:35.Yes and the don't know camps. It will be a game changer whether it is

:48:36. > :48:38.a Yes Henri Noma. Thanks very much. From two parliamentary candidates,

:48:39. > :48:43.back to you. Looking at those parliamentary

:48:44. > :48:47.elections, we have got the EULA elections coming up and then the

:48:48. > :48:53.Assembly elections. How do they stagger their many? -- we have got

:48:54. > :49:04.the EULA elections coming up. For UKIP, we have the elections where

:49:05. > :49:08.they hope to develop a permanent base. For the Conservatives, Labour

:49:09. > :49:13.and Liberal Democrats, it is the general election. That election is

:49:14. > :49:22.important for Plaid Cymru. They have only got one safe seat. They have

:49:23. > :49:38.two defend to. They have two try and take their number one target. They

:49:39. > :49:43.have got to be shepherding their resources very carefully. Quotes to

:49:44. > :49:52.their advantage, Labour is it against things. One thing to their

:49:53. > :49:57.advantage. We could have a few by-elections

:49:58. > :50:08.thrown in. Let's go to the conference hall now and speak to

:50:09. > :50:21.their new Assembly Member, Rhun ap Iorwerth. Let me at the start of

:50:22. > :50:27.this cycle of elections over the next three years, it is vitally

:50:28. > :50:54.important for all of us in Wales that Plaid Cymru strengthens its

:50:55. > :51:03.presence at all levels. It is lovely to be back here in Cardiff. As 4pm

:51:04. > :51:09.on Thursday, after three days in the Assembly, I left Cardiff for

:51:10. > :51:18.Anglesey. At nine o'clock Friday morning, I left Anglesey to come

:51:19. > :51:29.back to Cardiff. It is a tribute to my wife's cooking that I was willing

:51:30. > :51:36.to travel 400 miles to have one night at home. It is important that

:51:37. > :51:44.I spend as much time as I can at home. It isn't easy. But everyone

:51:45. > :51:52.here knows that we have to work hard for the future of Wales. It is

:51:53. > :52:04.something that pushes us to go that extra mile. The challenge we face as

:52:05. > :52:12.the party is to prove that dedication to the people of Wales.

:52:13. > :52:20.We have to understand the challenges that face Wales. We are trying to

:52:21. > :52:29.transform the nation. Rhun ap Iorwerth addressing the conference.

:52:30. > :52:33.Let's rejoin our political editor. Let's get a bit more reaction to

:52:34. > :52:37.Leanne Wood's speech yesterday. I am tried by Lord Elis-Thomas. The

:52:38. > :52:42.former presiding officer at the Assembly. We were talking earlier in

:52:43. > :52:48.relation to that strong attack from Leanne Wood against UKIP and the

:52:49. > :52:53.attack is a rose for UKIP is a vote against Wales. You felt that was a

:52:54. > :53:10.facile criticism. What did you mean? We add in danger of trying to

:53:11. > :53:14.define what is for against Wales. The positive effect that European

:53:15. > :53:15.policies have especially on the environment, agriculture and

:53:16. > :53:18.fisheries and all those at the environment, agriculture and

:53:19. > :53:21.fisheries and all those pages. It is important first not to try to define

:53:22. > :53:26.a party which is a party fighting elections is Wales is somehow an

:53:27. > :53:40.Welsh. I and a study argument she said. -- I understand. What is also

:53:41. > :53:47.of interest to me, the Conservatives in the UK seem to be overreacting to

:53:48. > :53:58.UKIP in the same way. It must be because UKIP are registering in the

:53:59. > :54:03.polls. Early on I was speaking to some candidates for the European

:54:04. > :54:09.elections and I put this to them. They agreed with it wholeheartedly.

:54:10. > :54:12.They feel it is their view UKIP policies are against the interests

:54:13. > :54:18.of Wales. As a result, Leanne Wood was perfectly justified to launch

:54:19. > :54:23.the attack in the way she did. I think it is a mistake for parties to

:54:24. > :54:27.use value all airtime or speech time in attacking the parties. They

:54:28. > :54:34.should put forward a positive message about how we would do things

:54:35. > :54:39.differently. My experience in the European Parliament during the

:54:40. > :54:49.present Parliament in promoting aspects of the common agricultural

:54:50. > :54:52.policy on behalf of my own committee, I have positive supports

:54:53. > :54:57.from all the Welsh MEPs. That is how we should operate. We should

:54:58. > :55:01.represent Wales positively rather than falling into this trap that

:55:02. > :55:08.that is a big hike about withdrawal, as if that wasn't not shown. A

:55:09. > :55:10.speech about hard edged electioneering, very strong attack

:55:11. > :55:16.against the Labour Welsh Government. She said they were threatening the

:55:17. > :55:22.future of evolution. What do you make of that? I don't understand

:55:23. > :55:28.that argument. The target for me is not the Welsh Government but the

:55:29. > :55:31.target is the UK Government. The people threatening devolution are

:55:32. > :55:36.those who would give us more of it. The people of Wales, all the polls

:55:37. > :55:38.indicate, want is to have an effective Welsh Government and the

:55:39. > :55:42.National Assembly to call that governments to account. That means

:55:43. > :55:47.changing the way in which powers are set out to that the UK Government

:55:48. > :55:57.rather than holding and giving powers, the -- the feigning powers,

:55:58. > :56:04.and then they should allow us to do the rest. On that point, back to you

:56:05. > :56:10.in the studio. But have our final word with Vaughan

:56:11. > :56:17.Roderick. Why did you make of that? What is he playing at? I don't think

:56:18. > :56:21.he is playing at anything. Dafydd Elis-Thomas is at a stage in his

:56:22. > :56:26.career where he feels he is free to speak his mind. That embarrasses, at

:56:27. > :56:30.a time, his leaders and other people within the party that he feels he is

:56:31. > :56:35.saying things the party needs to year. There is no secrets in the

:56:36. > :56:41.fact that Dafydd Elis-Thomas has a warm relationship with some of the

:56:42. > :56:44.Labour figures in the Assembly, he has an supportive of the Welsh

:56:45. > :56:50.Labour government on a number of occasions where his party have felt

:56:51. > :56:55.colder towards them. In a sense, what he is trying to do is keep open

:56:56. > :57:00.the lines of communication because what Dafydd Elis-Thomas wants to see

:57:01. > :57:06.is a coalition between Labour and Plaid Cymru. To come full circle,

:57:07. > :57:10.comebacks of the European elections, will they get a fourth seed? The

:57:11. > :57:17.mathematics here is pretty insert and? The mathematics is fascinating.

:57:18. > :57:21.Then a four seat. If Labour can get a double the votes of either the

:57:22. > :57:27.Conservatives or UKIP or Plaid Cymru, Labour will get two seats. If

:57:28. > :57:31.that happens, one of the other three is going to fall off the bottom of

:57:32. > :57:36.the list. Whoever comes first or second in those three will get

:57:37. > :57:41.seat. The maths can go a number of ways. A sickly, the questions

:57:42. > :57:51.revolve around the turnout of Labour supporters. -- basically. That MEP

:57:52. > :57:58.position is crucial for Plaid Cymru. It brings in a lot of cash.

:57:59. > :58:08.It's brings in a lot of cash because Jill Evans is a senior V. -- senior

:58:09. > :58:17.MEP. It will be a big blow words you to lose the seat. Will they win it?

:58:18. > :58:21.My own view is the moment is polling suggests they would lose it. Because

:58:22. > :58:28.it is a low turnout election they could hang on. Thank you. Final

:58:29. > :58:35.public will be back tomorrow on Radio Wales at eight o'clock. That

:58:36. > :58:39.is it from us. Don't forget, until tomorrow, you can follow the

:58:40. > :58:43.conference online and in our bulletins. From all others on the

:58:44. > :58:45.programme, for your company, goodbye.