04/03/2017

:00:10. > :00:16.With just two months to go until the local elections all the parties will

:00:17. > :00:21.be looking to -- looking to gain councillors and local control.

:00:22. > :00:34.Welcome to Conference 2017. Good afternoon. Welcome to the first of

:00:35. > :00:39.our Spring party conference programmes. We will be bringing you

:00:40. > :00:42.coverage of the main parties and we are starting with Plaid Cymru who

:00:43. > :00:53.are meeting in Newport. You can join in the debate. New year but usual

:00:54. > :00:59.line-up. Joining me is our Welsh affairs editor. What are we

:01:00. > :01:03.expecting from today from Plaid Cymru leading up to the local

:01:04. > :01:09.elections? Plaid Cymru is in a pretty bullish mood. They are

:01:10. > :01:13.favoured for these partly because Labour had a good set of local

:01:14. > :01:17.elections last time so Labour would probably be losing ground anyway,

:01:18. > :01:21.even of the party was not in disarray and was not in power in

:01:22. > :01:25.Cardiff Bay and in a number of authorities. The Conservatives are

:01:26. > :01:28.in power in Westminster you would not expect them to be doing

:01:29. > :01:33.particularly well which leaves an opening for Plaid Cymru although

:01:34. > :01:36.they will be worried in some areas a Ukip presence might get some of the

:01:37. > :01:43.vaults that might otherwise go to Plaid Cymru. We have no idea how

:01:44. > :01:48.many candidates Ukip or put up or what sort of campaign they will be

:01:49. > :01:54.able to run. To be an eye on the comings and goings, we will have

:01:55. > :01:59.more from you later this afternoon. Our correspondent is keeping an eye

:02:00. > :02:03.on what is going on. I will be talking to delegates and members. It

:02:04. > :02:08.is interesting to see the disparity between what the party wants to be

:02:09. > :02:14.discussing, local elections, Brexit, proposals to raise the basic rate of

:02:15. > :02:18.income tax by 1p to pay for health and education and social services.

:02:19. > :02:25.What everybody is talking about is the future of Neil McEvoy. He was

:02:26. > :02:28.suspended for a month yesterday after some comments he made to a

:02:29. > :02:32.card of council official. The talk today is whether he should be

:02:33. > :02:37.suspended as a Plaid Cymru assembly member while the investigation is

:02:38. > :02:42.going on into what happened. Two senior assembly members have told me

:02:43. > :02:45.off the record that they think he should be suspended. He is meeting

:02:46. > :02:55.with the party chairman to see what happens next. He said that everybody

:02:56. > :03:02.should have the right and freedom to express himself. He arrived couple

:03:03. > :03:06.of hours ago. A buzz, the likes of which you do not get to see very

:03:07. > :03:10.often in these Welsh political party conferences. You have to feel sorry

:03:11. > :03:18.for Leanne Wood because in the past could rely on Thomas to cause a bit

:03:19. > :03:24.of distraction. He has gone and has seemingly been replaced by Neil

:03:25. > :03:32.McEvoy. Thomas is the usual preconference boiler but is now part

:03:33. > :03:36.-- not part of the ranks anymore. Turning to the leader's speech given

:03:37. > :03:40.by Leanne Wood. She said she wanted to rebalance Wales and be bothered

:03:41. > :03:46.not have to accept what she called second best. I hope to speak to her

:03:47. > :03:52.live later that this is what she had to tell her party. Good afternoon.

:03:53. > :03:58.It is fantastic to be here in the city of charters for Plaid Cymru's

:03:59. > :04:04.Spring conference. It was a series of events in and around Newport

:04:05. > :04:08.during the 1930s which saw the emergence of a liberation movement.

:04:09. > :04:14.Our ancestors in the Welsh working-class and the middle classes

:04:15. > :04:22.stood up to demand their political and democratic rights. Williams said

:04:23. > :04:26.they were fighting against all the odds. The revolt was not just

:04:27. > :04:33.confined to the city. They were was support in Armagh than sure and in

:04:34. > :04:38.the industrial coal field. It was here in Gwent where the colliers and

:04:39. > :04:47.the iron men defended the people's charter with their lives. It was

:04:48. > :04:51.here they called for a republic with full voting rights and accountable

:04:52. > :04:58.government for the people, well, for men at least. It was a stark! It was

:04:59. > :05:06.a utopian vision. It echoed the French racial, revolution decades

:05:07. > :05:13.before. Even though the chartists were defeated the struggle for the

:05:14. > :05:17.charter and democracy carried on. It had caught the imagination. It laid

:05:18. > :05:21.the foundation for the people in Wales to be given the vote and for a

:05:22. > :05:28.whole series of reforms for the working man. I am sure many of you

:05:29. > :05:33.will remember that iconic mural in John Frost Square commemorating the

:05:34. > :05:37.Chartist rising. It was terrible to see that mural destroyed by

:05:38. > :05:47.developers while building a shopping centre.

:05:48. > :05:54.While of course that investment was good for the city we must insist

:05:55. > :05:59.that local councils do more to protect our heritage and history

:06:00. > :06:04.when development takes place. New developments should not erase

:06:05. > :06:10.special and unique local features, history of place names. What is

:06:11. > :06:14.progress if we forget those who went before us? It is important to

:06:15. > :06:20.remember those political struggles for they give us our rights. They

:06:21. > :06:27.remind us that our rights were hard one. Plaid Cymru will always speak

:06:28. > :06:38.out against those who want to sell off our heritage and history to the

:06:39. > :06:45.highest bidder. The chief aim of the chartists was control. Many people

:06:46. > :06:50.felt they had so little control, like today. That is why we can learn

:06:51. > :06:55.from this history. Our democracy is not the living for so many people.

:06:56. > :06:59.People in many parts of Wales feel like they are not getting their fair

:07:00. > :07:02.share, they are being left out, neglected. Able have found

:07:03. > :07:09.themselves on the outside and that is why we need a new charter for

:07:10. > :07:13.democratic control. Central to that should be the premise that decisions

:07:14. > :07:33.about Wales should be made in Wales. A modern-day charters should

:07:34. > :07:37.consider matters of equality, especially income inequality and

:07:38. > :07:43.justice. It must mean that following the vote to leave the European Union

:07:44. > :07:46.Wales does not lose any funding, any of the democratic rights and

:07:47. > :07:55.protections that we currently enjoy. It must mean that we do not lose any

:07:56. > :08:00.aspect of our nationhood. A modern-day Welsh charter designed to

:08:01. > :08:05.defend our country, extend our democracy, protect our environment

:08:06. > :08:10.and strengthen our communities, a tour for governing ourselves as a

:08:11. > :08:12.nation, for taking more responsibility whether in the

:08:13. > :08:18.assembly or in the council chamber or anywhere else. Instead of leaving

:08:19. > :08:24.it to others elsewhere to govern us on our behalf we should make and

:08:25. > :08:31.enforce our laws and run our justice system. That is control. The party

:08:32. > :08:36.of Wales says no to concentrating power in London and yes to making

:08:37. > :08:42.our own choices and our own decisions. It is only through voting

:08:43. > :08:47.for Plaid Cymru that we in Wales would be in control of our own

:08:48. > :08:52.lives. The party of Wales will settle for nothing less. We will

:08:53. > :08:57.stand up for Wales and for the principle of taking more control

:08:58. > :09:04.over our own affairs so that we can make improvements in people's lives.

:09:05. > :09:08.Following last me's elections there has been progress on a number of

:09:09. > :09:13.Plaid Cymru's priorities. In fact you would be hard pressed to find

:09:14. > :09:18.any progress in Cardiff Bay that is not down to Plaid Cymru. Take the

:09:19. > :09:23.example of the new treatments fund. This will open up new medicines and

:09:24. > :09:29.treatments for rare diseases especially cancer. A policy that was

:09:30. > :09:36.inspired by the Williams, who will help some people's lives saved and

:09:37. > :09:39.help others to live longer. The party of Wales said that the way the

:09:40. > :09:45.drugs were being accessed in Wales was not there. We called for the

:09:46. > :09:49.system to be changed. The First Minister said it could not be done

:09:50. > :09:56.but Plaid Cymru made it happen. By challenging and persuading, we have

:09:57. > :10:01.made other things happen as well. That budget included extra funds for

:10:02. > :10:05.childcare, apprenticeships, local government, mental health services

:10:06. > :10:12.and our capital investment priorities. The job now is to make

:10:13. > :10:17.sure that all of it is delivered to benefit every part of this country.

:10:18. > :10:21.We will do that by continuing to hold this Labour government to

:10:22. > :10:26.account. Too many communities in Wales feel neglected, left behind by

:10:27. > :10:31.the government in Cardiff Bay and the government in Westminster. My

:10:32. > :10:38.message to people in those communities is that Plaid Cymru will

:10:39. > :10:41.stand up for you. We will never apologise for securing investment

:10:42. > :10:54.for places which are not getting their fair share.

:10:55. > :11:04.There is no doubt that we live in an unbalanced Wales. An unequal Wales.

:11:05. > :11:09.Anyone who tries to travel around this country can see first-hand the

:11:10. > :11:13.problems we have got transport infrastructure. Too many people are

:11:14. > :11:16.without broadband communications. Jobs, wealth, prosperity, are not

:11:17. > :11:26.spread evenly throughout the country. I hear the same feelings of

:11:27. > :11:31.neglect in different places. Challenging those geographic

:11:32. > :11:34.inequalities is vital. At Westminster under the Tories wealth

:11:35. > :11:39.and opportunity is being redistributed in the wrong way.

:11:40. > :11:44.Robin Hood in reverse. The same is happening in Wales. The Labour

:11:45. > :11:48.government is recreating the problem here where there is an overheated

:11:49. > :11:54.centre at the expense of everywhere else. Here in the south-east hopes

:11:55. > :12:02.of being pinned on a city region deal. The deal spends a relatively

:12:03. > :12:08.small pot of money on, amongst almost half of our country's local

:12:09. > :12:12.authorities and half of our population. ?1.2 billion spread over

:12:13. > :12:20.20 years. How will that rebalance the economy? It is not good enough.

:12:21. > :12:24.Elsewhere in our country we saw plans at election time for a North

:12:25. > :12:29.Wales metro. That plan features a map of North Wales which includes

:12:30. > :12:36.tester and Liverpool but not Conway and Gwyneth. It is not serious about

:12:37. > :12:42.rebalancing Wales with the new Welsh revenue authority. Wrexham and

:12:43. > :12:48.others were overlooked despite having 400 existing tax workers

:12:49. > :12:51.between them. The revenue authority will be a relatively small

:12:52. > :12:57.organisation with just 40 posts initially but that number of jobs

:12:58. > :13:03.will grow and even 40 jobs would make a far greater impact in a

:13:04. > :13:09.smaller town. As it stands the decision has been made to locate the

:13:10. > :13:13.revenue authority in Treforest. When I called for as many of those jobs

:13:14. > :13:19.possible to be filled locally, what was the First Minister's and so?

:13:20. > :13:23.Most of the jobs will go to specialists from London. The First

:13:24. > :13:27.Minister is responsible for skills in Wales. Doesn't that say at all

:13:28. > :13:31.that they do not have the skills to fill those posts and doesn't it say

:13:32. > :13:37.at all about Labour's lack of ambition for Wales? Do making Wales

:13:38. > :13:43.more equal Plaid Cymru is aiming to unite this country. Inequality

:13:44. > :13:49.divides people and regions. That is why we are on a mission to rebalance

:13:50. > :13:55.Wales, to equalise Wales, and we have started already. Putting the

:13:56. > :14:00.rail link on the agenda. Securing ?300,000 for a feasibility study

:14:01. > :14:04.bringing that project closer to reality. When completed Plaid Cymru

:14:05. > :14:11.will have secured the most significant railway in Wales since

:14:12. > :14:13.the cuts of the 1960s. We will be doing everything in our power to get

:14:14. > :14:28.that delivered. In south-east Wales we are pushing

:14:29. > :14:36.for the City Deal to include guaranteed investment in former

:14:37. > :14:40.coalfield communities and specifically designated role for

:14:41. > :14:43.Newport. We have said that work on the metro should begin at those

:14:44. > :14:49.points furthest away from the centre. We will not back a City Deal

:14:50. > :14:55.which sucks people and even more traffic into Cardiff where Plaid

:14:56. > :14:59.Cymru councillors have been campaigning against ingestion and

:15:00. > :15:05.overdevelopment. The party of Wales is proud of our capital city. We

:15:06. > :15:10.will do everything in our power to protect its people from Labour's

:15:11. > :15:16.local development plan. We will back a City Deal which shares the wealth.

:15:17. > :15:24.Properly. We want the next Admiral, the next Welsh success story, to be

:15:25. > :15:30.housed somewhere which other regional policy which creates viable

:15:31. > :15:32.communities connected to it. A thriving Cardiff and a prosperous

:15:33. > :15:47.land. Plaid Cymru has maximised our

:15:48. > :15:50.advantage to wrestle concessions from Government. You have seen our

:15:51. > :15:56.programme for opposition setting out what it is we want to achieve. What

:15:57. > :16:01.we have won so far will help people in all of our communities and it

:16:02. > :16:06.will help rebalance Wales. But that is only a glimpse of the change that

:16:07. > :16:11.Wales needs. They're just small steps on the journey to a stronger,

:16:12. > :16:17.self-sufficient nation. Imagine how much more we could do if the party

:16:18. > :16:21.of Wales replaced Labour as the strongest party in Wales. Look at

:16:22. > :16:25.the talent that I have got in the Plaid Cymru team in the Assembly.

:16:26. > :16:31.Look at the ideas and the determination coming out of that

:16:32. > :16:37.team. Plaid Cymru remains the change Wales needs. I want to reiterate

:16:38. > :16:42.today that a Plaid Cymru Government is our number one aim. The Assembly

:16:43. > :16:48.isn't the only arena where we're making a difference, Plaid Cymru has

:16:49. > :16:53.the hardest working Welsh MPs in Westminster in 2016 and that is

:16:54. > :16:58.official. More contributions, more questions and more activity than any

:16:59. > :17:03.other party. And don't we need them? Where was the official opposition

:17:04. > :17:09.when the Article 50 vote went through? What use is it after the

:17:10. > :17:18.event to say the real fight starts now? How exasperating. The real

:17:19. > :17:22.fight started before June 23rd, but the official opposition weren't

:17:23. > :17:27.listening. Plaid Cymru had a raft of amendments to the legislation, all

:17:28. > :17:33.intended to protect the Welsh national interest. We said after the

:17:34. > :17:38.referendum that we would use every platform we had to hold the Leave

:17:39. > :17:44.side to account for their promises. It was about making the Prime

:17:45. > :17:51.Minister recognise what is good for Wales, but also what is at stake for

:17:52. > :17:55.Wales Our Westminster team refused to give the Prime Minister a blank

:17:56. > :18:00.cheque to carry out the hardest most damaging form of Brexit. People who

:18:01. > :18:06.don't want to sever ties with Europe will remember that it was Plaid

:18:07. > :18:10.Cymru who stood up for them and voted against this Conservative

:18:11. > :18:22.Westminster Government. APPLAUSE

:18:23. > :18:29.There can be no greater priority for our party right now than upholding

:18:30. > :18:34.the Welsh national interest during the months ahead as the UK

:18:35. > :18:39.Government begins the process of leaving the European Union. Scotland

:18:40. > :18:43.has a confident and strong Government standing up for their

:18:44. > :18:48.interests. Northern Ireland has a special position due to the peace

:18:49. > :18:52.process. But what about Wales? Initially, Labour didn't know

:18:53. > :18:56.whether it wanted us to be in the single market or out. Do you

:18:57. > :19:01.remember how they ended up voting with the Conservatives and Ukip to

:19:02. > :19:05.rule out participation in the European economic area or the

:19:06. > :19:09.European free trade association? Having criticised Labour for that

:19:10. > :19:13.vote, we couldn't allow for that to be the Welsh position ahead of the

:19:14. > :19:18.negotiations with Theresa May and the UK Government. She would have

:19:19. > :19:23.used that vote as evidence that Wales wanted nothing to do with the

:19:24. > :19:28.European single market. When we had an opportunity to step up to the

:19:29. > :19:34.plate and co-author the Welsh White Paper for the EU negotiations we had

:19:35. > :19:40.to take it. We set out a clear set of demands to secure Wales' future.

:19:41. > :19:46.In that paper, single market participation is the priority for

:19:47. > :19:51.the Welsh economy. This means we want EEA or membership in a soft

:19:52. > :19:56.Brexit, or the same tariff-free access to the European single market

:19:57. > :20:00.as we have now. Being in the European single market is not just

:20:01. > :20:06.about trade, it means setting a high bar, not lowering it when it comes

:20:07. > :20:10.to workers' rights, consumer rights and protecting our precious

:20:11. > :20:15.environment. Environmental regulation isn't red tape, it is

:20:16. > :20:19.ensured cleaner beaches and seas, helping to transform the coastline

:20:20. > :20:26.of Wales and tourism here. It makes sure that countries have a legal

:20:27. > :20:30.duty to reduce pollution, to have a healthy natural environment to leave

:20:31. > :20:36.to our children. We can keep these benefits when we're outside the EU

:20:37. > :20:42.and we must. The party of Wales will not sign up to deregulation,

:20:43. > :20:48.cost-cutting or a T-tip style deal with America. Plaid Cymru will not

:20:49. > :20:52.endorse any Brexit which weakens our public services or stops our

:20:53. > :20:57.students and young people from having the right to study abroad and

:20:58. > :21:03.we will keep repeating this. In the Welsh NHS you are more likely to be

:21:04. > :21:10.treated by a migrant than to see one in the queue. We can not and we will

:21:11. > :21:14.not support any deal which makes it harder to recruit those skilled

:21:15. > :21:22.workers that we need. And I reiterate to those people who want

:21:23. > :21:29.to come to Wales to work as doctors, as nurses, as engineers, you are

:21:30. > :21:45.welcome. APPLAUSE

:21:46. > :21:54.And to all of those people who have moved here from overseas, the party

:21:55. > :21:58.of Wales will never join in with the calls from those who make you feel

:21:59. > :22:03.you don't deserve to be here. We will speak out for you when your

:22:04. > :22:08.rights are infringed at home or abroad. The new presidency in the

:22:09. > :22:13.United States has seen travellers from a host of majority Muslim

:22:14. > :22:19.countries put under instant suspicion and the suspicion is now

:22:20. > :22:28.being felt by Welsh people who are Muslim, as well. A Welsh maths

:22:29. > :22:32.teacher born in Swansea, loved by his pupils and respected by parents

:22:33. > :22:35.and colleagues at their school, he was thrown off a plane when

:22:36. > :22:40.officials denied him the right to visit the country on a school trip.

:22:41. > :22:45.He's been given no reason and no explanation. Well, I think I know

:22:46. > :22:51.the reason. They think there's something wrong with his surname. It

:22:52. > :22:57.sounds too Bangladeshi perhaps? Too Muslim maybe? He wrote to me after

:22:58. > :23:03.the incident. He said that he believed that Plaid Cymru would

:23:04. > :23:06.support him. And we will. I will be working with him until we get an

:23:07. > :23:12.explanation, that's the very least he can expect.

:23:13. > :23:32.APPLAUSE In case there was any doubt at all,

:23:33. > :23:36.Plaid Cymru will stand up for all citizens in this country, everyone

:23:37. > :23:41.who belongs to Wales should be treated with respect. If you live

:23:42. > :23:45.here and you want to be Welsh, then as far as we're concerned, you are

:23:46. > :23:57.Welsh and your rights will be defended by the party of Wales.

:23:58. > :24:02.APPLAUSE Conference, I want to reaffirm today

:24:03. > :24:06.that Plaid Cymru will not accept any negotiation which undermines our

:24:07. > :24:10.farming sector and our rural communities. I've already told the

:24:11. > :24:15.UK Secretary of State for EU withdrawal that we expect all of our

:24:16. > :24:21.farming payments to be guaranteed for the future, not a Barnet share,

:24:22. > :24:27.but nothing less than the amount our farmers are already getting now. We

:24:28. > :24:32.expect a fair financial deal for Welsh agriculture and we expect

:24:33. > :24:39.control in Wales as to how that money is allocated. Plaid Cymru

:24:40. > :24:42.would then use that policy to control and prioritise the

:24:43. > :24:48.struggling hill farmers and dairy farmers. In these uncertain times,

:24:49. > :24:53.the party of Wales wants the whole country to stand behind Welsh

:24:54. > :24:58.farming. The people who work our land and produce top quality food

:24:59. > :25:02.are essential to our way of life and to the Welsh language. So I will

:25:03. > :25:06.pledge today that a Plaid Cymru Government in Cardiff as well as

:25:07. > :25:12.Plaid Cymru-led local authorities will do all they can to buy local

:25:13. > :25:18.and to buy from Wales and I would urge all people wherever you are to

:25:19. > :25:23.buy Welsh meat and Welsh dairy and all other Welsh food products

:25:24. > :25:28.because when times are tough, we in Plaid Cymru don't walk away from our

:25:29. > :25:41.rural communities, we stand with them.

:25:42. > :25:47.APPLAUSE Conference, it's fair to ask what

:25:48. > :25:52.happens when the Prime Minister and her Brexit team reject the Welsh

:25:53. > :25:55.position, when they confirm a hard Brexit which doesn't prioritise our

:25:56. > :26:00.membership of the single market? Plaid Cymru will continue to speak

:26:01. > :26:06.for Wales as the situation evolves. Signing up to the joint White Paper

:26:07. > :26:09.with the Welsh Government doesn't procollude us from developing our

:26:10. > :26:15.own proposals and doesn't mean we're tide to any party. We will produce

:26:16. > :26:19.our own contingency plans. I am not going to show our cards too early.

:26:20. > :26:24.Wales and Scotland are currently still negotiating with the UK

:26:25. > :26:29.Government. But what ever happens, Plaid Cymru is planning its vision

:26:30. > :26:35.for Wales in the world. We'll make sure that the idea that we've

:26:36. > :26:39.reached the end of Welsh nationhood is completely rejected, it won't

:26:40. > :26:47.happen. Those who might be happy for Wales as an entity to disappear are

:26:48. > :26:50.going to be very disappointed. And a Plaid Cymru Government, Wales will

:26:51. > :26:54.develop the full international presence enjoyed by Europe and the

:26:55. > :27:03.world's most powerful sub-state nations. Learning lessons from

:27:04. > :27:06.stateless nations like the Basque country, and Quebec. Wales will

:27:07. > :27:10.become more active on the international scene and we will

:27:11. > :27:15.retain substantial links with the rest of Europe. But even more

:27:16. > :27:22.importantly, Plaid Cymru will do everything in our power to secure

:27:23. > :27:27.Welsh nationhood. The days of settling for second best are long

:27:28. > :27:32.over and we say that any deal offered to Scotland over Brexit must

:27:33. > :27:36.also be available to Wales. When it comes to sustaining our nationhood

:27:37. > :27:40.and making our own decisions, the Wales bill that is now going through

:27:41. > :27:45.parliament is a grave disappointment. Plaid Cymru believes

:27:46. > :27:49.that it could lead to a Westminster power grab, that Welsh legislation

:27:50. > :27:55.and Welsh power could be undermined by the UK Government. That's why our

:27:56. > :27:59.team in Westminster will be launching a hands off our parliament

:28:00. > :28:05.campaign and I'd encourage everyone who wants greater control in Wales

:28:06. > :28:09.to get behind that campaign. When the so-called great repeal bill is

:28:10. > :28:14.tabled the party of Wales will ensure that there are political

:28:15. > :28:19.consequences for any Government or any party which tries to use that

:28:20. > :28:24.bill to strip powers away from Wales. I was part of the St Davids

:28:25. > :28:30.Day process, the Tories asked party leaders what we wanted to see in the

:28:31. > :28:35.Wales bill. It gives me no pleasure to say it was the worst way of

:28:36. > :28:39.drawing up legislation that I have ever witnessed. The Welsh

:28:40. > :28:43.Conservative leader veteod the devolution of policing even though

:28:44. > :28:48.policing powers were being transferred to Greater Manchester.

:28:49. > :28:53.Good enough for Manchester, but not apparently good enough for Wales.

:28:54. > :28:57.That was bad enough but at least no devolution of policing to Wales is

:28:58. > :29:02.Conservative policy. Labour MPs from Wales disagreed with their own

:29:03. > :29:07.policy and their own First Minister by joining in with that veto. We are

:29:08. > :29:13.stuck here again with a piece of legislation that doesn't give people

:29:14. > :29:18.the powers that they deserve. It is true we can partially devolve income

:29:19. > :29:22.tax and improve the electoral system but we strongly believe that our

:29:23. > :29:27.powers will be limited in other areas and that bill could lead to a

:29:28. > :29:34.Westminster power grab and that's why we refuse to give our consent to

:29:35. > :29:41.the Wales bill. The days of Plaid Cymru signing up to weak deals are

:29:42. > :29:45.over. Friends, there are at present other threats to our nationhood.

:29:46. > :29:50.Ukip has a presence in our National Assembly on the back of people's

:29:51. > :29:57.grievances. In the last election of the major parties Plaid Cymru and

:29:58. > :30:00.Ukip were the only two parties to see the vote share increase. This

:30:01. > :30:04.means there are two different options for Welsh voters who are

:30:05. > :30:10.disillusioned with Labour and the Conservatives. The Welsh nationalism

:30:11. > :30:14.of Plaid Cymru, a party rooted in Welsh communities, proudly standing

:30:15. > :30:19.up for Wales and believing in equality and justice for all,

:30:20. > :30:26.outward looking, welcoming, internationalist. Or, the nostalgic

:30:27. > :30:31.British nationalism of Ukip, looking for opportunities to sow division

:30:32. > :30:37.and questioning any move to make Wales more self-governing or more

:30:38. > :30:42.self-respecting. They are inward looking and isolationist. I wouldn't

:30:43. > :30:47.agree that Ukip has shaken up the Senaad, if anything they've settled

:30:48. > :30:50.in. They're deliberately holding back from proposing anything

:30:51. > :30:52.controversial and are happy to support the motions and ideas of

:30:53. > :31:03.other We should be wary about that.

:31:04. > :31:07.Especially at local level. We saw how Ukip tried to muscle in on the

:31:08. > :31:18.campaign against Welsh medium education. TRANSLATION: I and many

:31:19. > :31:25.other parents have chosen to give our children Welsh education as well

:31:26. > :31:29.as English medium education but it was a tragedy seeing Ukip

:31:30. > :31:39.politicians interfering and intervening, trying to stop more

:31:40. > :31:43.children from benefiting. As we saw a campaign in homes. It reminds us

:31:44. > :31:50.all to choose our friends carefully. It also reminds us of our

:31:51. > :32:01.responsibility, whatever party we may be, to tackle the decline in the

:32:02. > :32:07.language and also it remains other parties who support the aim of

:32:08. > :32:12.getting 1 million Welsh speakers, that empty words are not enough and

:32:13. > :32:18.that there is a need to act and there is a need to support the

:32:19. > :32:38.decisions of parents as one County Council did.

:32:39. > :32:44.People in Wales now that Plaid Cymru will work to secure the best

:32:45. > :32:49.possible deal for Wales as the negotiations to leave the EU take

:32:50. > :32:53.place. People now are our values and they expect us to stand up for

:32:54. > :33:00.Wales. They also know the business of the country of running the

:33:01. > :33:03.country will carry on regardless. Wales still needs the same changes

:33:04. > :33:09.are dead during the assembly elections last year. On May the

:33:10. > :33:18.force you will again go to the ballot box to a lecture local

:33:19. > :33:22.councillors. These should be about how Wales is governed at local

:33:23. > :33:26.level. People have an opportunity to send a message to Labour in Cardiff

:33:27. > :33:32.and to the Tories in Westminster Abbey will no longer stand by and

:33:33. > :33:37.allow our communities to be ignored as local services are downgraded,

:33:38. > :33:42.closed down or sold off. There are those who might not be convinced

:33:43. > :33:47.that Wales needs change. That Wales doesn't need to send some kind of

:33:48. > :33:53.message at these local elections. But the need for change is evident.

:33:54. > :33:59.Does anyone need reminding a quarter of Welsh people live in poverty? A

:34:00. > :34:04.third of Welsh children. In some councils senior officer P is way out

:34:05. > :34:12.of control while lower pay grades are just being unfrozen. In Labour

:34:13. > :34:18.led Caerphilly not far from here the peace candle cost ?4.5 million that

:34:19. > :34:29.could have been spent on local services -- pay scandal. There are

:34:30. > :34:34.cards in place on senior officer pay where Plaid Cymru has had influence.

:34:35. > :34:39.Wales has gone backwards when ministers promised improvement.

:34:40. > :34:45.Welsh workers are getting paid 10% less than the UK average. Waiting

:34:46. > :34:49.times in health like behind Scotland and England with 25% of Welsh

:34:50. > :34:58.patients waiting longer than six weeks for an MRI. I could go on.

:34:59. > :35:03.Wales cannot afford to keep the boarding a legacy of failure. Plaid

:35:04. > :35:08.Cymru is your local party. Your community party. We are on the side

:35:09. > :35:12.of the people not the political establishment or the bureaucratic

:35:13. > :35:17.elite. In an increasing number of places we are the people. We come

:35:18. > :35:22.from our communities and represent the people in them. I want this

:35:23. > :35:27.party to be rooted in the towns, villages and cities of Wales. I'm

:35:28. > :35:35.not interested in the party that speaks to people. Plaid Cymru speaks

:35:36. > :35:42.for people. With people. Our convent, conversations are a two-way

:35:43. > :35:47.dialogue not a broadcast. The tide is turning. Beneath the surface

:35:48. > :35:50.something is happening. In the last year Plaid Cymru gained more council

:35:51. > :35:55.seats in by-elections than any other party. Labour and the Conservatives

:35:56. > :36:04.went backwards. In Grangetown in Cardiff, and in Carmarthenshire,

:36:05. > :36:09.people backed our local Plaid Cymru teams, and I want to thank our

:36:10. > :36:23.community champions for securing victory.

:36:24. > :36:32.While citizens know that Plaid Cymru has a strong track record in local

:36:33. > :36:37.government. Where we lead the local authorities we are pushing ahead

:36:38. > :36:40.with improvements. Our priorities are strengthening our communities,

:36:41. > :36:45.caring for people with compassion and building affordable housing

:36:46. > :36:50.targeted at local need. In Carmarthenshire, shovels are already

:36:51. > :36:54.on the ground. The Plaid Cymru council is building some of the

:36:55. > :37:00.county's first council houses for many years. Carmarthenshire has

:37:01. > :37:02.risen up the league table for preventing homelessness. Since Plaid

:37:03. > :37:08.Cymru took over the Wales audit office has commended Carmarthenshire

:37:09. > :37:13.for delivering improved outcomes. Plaid Cymru is restoring the

:37:14. > :37:17.county's good name. Another council is spending the most money per pupil

:37:18. > :37:23.for education in the Hall of the country. Under the party of Wales it

:37:24. > :37:29.is in the top three councils for most all of the major education

:37:30. > :37:34.indicators. In the league table for people's perception of the quality

:37:35. > :37:37.of council services or four Plaid Cymru led authorities score above

:37:38. > :37:44.average with Plaid Cymru led council dropping the league. Gwynedd Council

:37:45. > :37:52.has been innovative in its compassion and care for local

:37:53. > :37:56.people. It has alleviated more than ?600,000 of bedroom tax payments,

:37:57. > :38:16.enough to protect 1409 households from the insidious Tory bedroom tax.

:38:17. > :38:23.Plaid Cymru councils are innovating and leading Wales in areas as

:38:24. > :38:28.diverse as social housing, education and clean streets that we can all be

:38:29. > :38:34.proud of. All of us in this conference hall can be proud of our

:38:35. > :38:37.excellent Plaid Cymru councils. They make the case for there to be more

:38:38. > :38:45.Plaid Cymru control light across the country. Friends, control over our

:38:46. > :38:50.communities is in our hands. Cast your minds back to last year's

:38:51. > :38:55.elections when we said Plaid Cymru was the change Wales needs. We know

:38:56. > :38:59.from the Wales election study that most people who saw the election we

:39:00. > :39:05.had the best campaign. They also thought that we did the best in the

:39:06. > :39:07.TV debates and yes, that study says that we had the best candidate for

:39:08. > :39:22.First Minister. But the same data showed that most

:39:23. > :39:29.people did not watch the coverage at all. In recent weeks we have seen a

:39:30. > :39:33.continued decline in Welsh newspaper sales and a far lower investment in

:39:34. > :39:40.BBC Wales than Scotland is going to receive. There is no short cut

:39:41. > :39:44.around the Welsh media deficit. In the last election people voted for

:39:45. > :39:49.Plaid Cymru in the greatest numbers where we were the most active on the

:39:50. > :39:55.ground. That is where we can make a difference. It is as simple as that.

:39:56. > :40:00.To everyone who wants to see a Plaid Cymru community Champion standing up

:40:01. > :40:03.for their local patch, I say, get out there and support your local

:40:04. > :40:10.Plaid Cymru candidates. There is still the time to make a difference

:40:11. > :40:13.and you can make it. Let's demonstrate that the party of Wales

:40:14. > :40:22.is on the up, that the Welsh nation is moving forward stronger, and

:40:23. > :40:26.let's show people that our team is a winning team. To all of the people

:40:27. > :40:34.who make up this wonderful nation avers, I say, we do not have to keep

:40:35. > :40:38.accepting second best. We do not have to keep putting up with neglect

:40:39. > :40:45.with the same political parties who have let people down time and time

:40:46. > :40:48.again. We do not have to put up with dirty streets, downgraded services,

:40:49. > :40:53.young people struggling to find opportunities. This is an

:40:54. > :41:00.opportunity for your community and for your country. Do not let Wales

:41:01. > :41:06.be ignored. Send that message that we exist, that the matter. Stand up

:41:07. > :41:14.for your interests and for your own control. Just like the chartists did

:41:15. > :41:17.all those years ago. Give your backing to Plaid Cymru. Join with us

:41:18. > :41:23.as we put in place the building blocks of a successful, more equal

:41:24. > :41:28.and outward looking Wales. Building a strong nation starts in your

:41:29. > :41:44.street. Building the new Wales starts with us and with you. The

:41:45. > :41:47.Plaid Cymru leader Leanne Wood speaking yesterday about

:41:48. > :41:50.geographical inequalities, saying there was an overheated centre at

:41:51. > :41:59.the expense of everywhere else, even talking about wanting to see the

:42:00. > :42:03.next Admiral based in the max else. A lot of politicians talk about

:42:04. > :42:09.redistributing wealth. It is difficult. It is. Do you use your

:42:10. > :42:19.major cities as the wider economic driver? Or do you try to attract and

:42:20. > :42:27.Admiral elsewhere? It seems a huge debt. What Leanne Wood is trying to

:42:28. > :42:34.do is cash in on a sentiment that exists in Wales very strongly in

:42:35. > :42:38.north-east and north-west Wales and Swansea and Newport, this idea that

:42:39. > :42:41.Cardiff gets everything. To an extent that exists in every single

:42:42. > :42:47.country that they think the capital city gets too much. It is a potent

:42:48. > :42:54.message particularly when you are running against Labour in a large

:42:55. > :43:00.number of local authorities. It is a race with Labour. Is there a danger

:43:01. > :43:04.that could be viewed as anti-Cardiff? This is where the

:43:05. > :43:09.concentration of people is and most of the money is. I thought the

:43:10. > :43:12.speech was clever. Cardiff has a contentious local development plan

:43:13. > :43:17.which is pretty unpopular in large parts of the city. Being fought

:43:18. > :43:22.aggressively by Plaid Cymru councillors. What she was trying to

:43:23. > :43:25.say, whether it would work politically or not was, this would

:43:26. > :43:28.take the heat off of Cardiff, helping these other places would

:43:29. > :43:33.mean you would not have to put up with increased traffic congestion,

:43:34. > :43:40.green fields being built on. Quite cleverly tailored, the message. How

:43:41. > :43:45.politically realistic it would be as a government policy is another

:43:46. > :43:49.matter. As an electoral message it is pretty well tailored. Before the

:43:50. > :43:59.conference Leanne Wood said people on the doorstep were more concerned

:44:00. > :44:04.with Borg mess than Brexit. We heard quite a bit about Brexit. Is Leanne

:44:05. > :44:09.Wood conceding that she is not going to see a lot of the things in the

:44:10. > :44:13.Brexit negotiations she would want to see, namely membership of the

:44:14. > :44:17.single market? She has to be in that position. Reason she would say she

:44:18. > :44:24.is in that position is because Labour is not fighting for those

:44:25. > :44:27.things. Labour at a UK level, Welsh level is different, seems to more or

:44:28. > :44:33.less have conceded that it will be some form of hard Brexit. People

:44:34. > :44:40.within the Labour Party, some of them are not happy about that. There

:44:41. > :44:44.is an interesting group of voters. Myths about the way people voted in

:44:45. > :44:50.the referendum. Two thirds of people who voted Labour in 2015 voted to

:44:51. > :44:53.remain. Yet they feel the Labour Party has become obsessed with the

:44:54. > :44:59.one third of Labour voters who voted to leave and has been accepting the

:45:00. > :45:03.Conservatives Brexit strategy because of that third. The Liberal

:45:04. > :45:08.Democrats have spotted that group of voters and Plaid Cymru have and the

:45:09. > :45:16.evidence of that labour voters who voted remain feel far more strongly

:45:17. > :45:22.about that than Labour voters who voted Brexit feel about Brexit. The

:45:23. > :45:25.St Anthony Labour voters that Plaid Cymru are going after. --

:45:26. > :45:39.disenchanted. Let's turn to two people who will be

:45:40. > :45:42.talking a lot about the local election campaign. You will both be

:45:43. > :45:45.standing, two councillors, somebody standing for the first time and

:45:46. > :45:50.somebody who is more experienced. Not standing for the first time,

:45:51. > :45:54.stood a couple of times before. You are standing for Carmarthenshire

:45:55. > :45:59.County Council for the first time, why now is the time to stand? I

:46:00. > :46:03.think basically I have grown up with the idea that young people don't get

:46:04. > :46:09.into politics, we see especially - often you see a lot of grey hair and

:46:10. > :46:14.not many young people. I think if I can just locally prove that young

:46:15. > :46:18.people do have a place in politics, if that can get somebody else

:46:19. > :46:22.involved in politics at a young age I will be happy. Was there anything

:46:23. > :46:26.that was a trigger, you didn't see anything, we talk about Brexit all

:46:27. > :46:30.the time, it wasn't anything specific, it's just you want more

:46:31. > :46:36.young people into politics? That's the main thing, obviously when you

:46:37. > :46:39.see the mess under Labour's rule, it makes you angry and want to make a

:46:40. > :46:42.difference, since Plaid Cymru has taken over a difference has been

:46:43. > :46:47.made, that's why I would be happy to join that team and be that

:46:48. > :46:50.progressive change. We heard on Friday, yesterday, Leanne Wood

:46:51. > :46:54.saying on the doorstep Brexit isn't coming up often, people are keen to

:46:55. > :46:57.talk about dog mess, is that what you are finding, are people more

:46:58. > :47:03.interested in not necessarily dog mess, but local things and bins and

:47:04. > :47:07.recycling, rather than Brexit? I think definitely, I think our role

:47:08. > :47:11.as councillors or candidates is to ensure that local people get local

:47:12. > :47:15.issues sorted. You have MPs who can deal with the constitutional issues.

:47:16. > :47:20.But they need people they can trust, at a local level to deal with local

:47:21. > :47:28.issues who have time and energy to deal with those, those are issues I

:47:29. > :47:31.have come across. How are things looking in your council area, I am

:47:32. > :47:36.expecting you to say good things there, but on a Wales-wide basis? We

:47:37. > :47:41.are working hard, I think Labour are on their uppers by the look of it

:47:42. > :47:46.with a split between the Corbynists and the Blairites, I suppose they

:47:47. > :47:50.would call themselves. We have a good chance of taking control in

:47:51. > :47:54.Carmarthenshire, for example. I am hoping we will in my council, as

:47:55. > :48:00.well, although we have only one Labour member. I think if you look

:48:01. > :48:08.down at councils where, down to South Wales where we have held

:48:09. > :48:11.councils before, in Caerphilly we will be knocking on the doors down

:48:12. > :48:16.there quite hard in order to get that control back. Presumably, given

:48:17. > :48:20.as you were saying, that the Labour Party is facing some troubles at the

:48:21. > :48:26.moment, let's just say that, if it's not - if the time isn't right now

:48:27. > :48:30.for Plaid Cymru to make big gains and breakthrough, presumably when

:48:31. > :48:34.will be a better time? We are hoping this will be a time when we can

:48:35. > :48:39.regain the strength we had at the beginning of the millennium,

:48:40. > :48:43.actually. There's work going on all over Wales to strengthen. We heard

:48:44. > :48:47.this afternoon Powys beginning to awake to the fact they need Plaid

:48:48. > :48:51.Cymru councillors there, as well, to help lead. Isn't therein a danger,

:48:52. > :48:55.what we have seen from Plaid Cymru in the last couple of elections is

:48:56. > :49:00.inertia, the 2015 general election didn't really make big gains, other

:49:01. > :49:04.than Leanne Wood in the Rhondda last year, didn't really make big gains,

:49:05. > :49:08.how much of a pressure is on Plaid Cymru now to make - to show there is

:49:09. > :49:12.momentum there? I hope there will be momentum. I am fairly confident we

:49:13. > :49:17.will see momentum this time. I think people are just fed up. The cuts

:49:18. > :49:24.that we have had to suffer instigated by a Tory and Lib Dem

:49:25. > :49:30.coalition in London way back whenever it was under David Cameron

:49:31. > :49:36.and that's been continually year after year and I have seen since I

:49:37. > :49:40.have become leader a cut of 25% in the revenue budget, well, that's not

:49:41. > :49:47.sustainable if we want to keep good services in our schools and with our

:49:48. > :49:53.older people. We need proper funding and that's my fight. Also, economic

:49:54. > :49:57.development going forward because as I say, lots - there is a danger now

:49:58. > :50:01.with Brexit that we will lose ?55 million that's come in to the

:50:02. > :50:09.farmers and structural funds. If that's not replaced from London,

:50:10. > :50:15.then we are going to be really badly off. You have just heard all the

:50:16. > :50:20.problems that councillors are facing there, cuts, Brexit, everything that

:50:21. > :50:29.may or may not come. Why do you want to go into that? Do you want to

:50:30. > :50:41.cancel your candidacy live! That's why we need as many Plaid Cymru

:50:42. > :50:45.councillors. We have had a Plaid - the cuts will come from the Tories

:50:46. > :50:50.and Labour, that's why we need at a local level Plaid Cymru. Is it more

:50:51. > :50:54.difficult for a younger person to take tough decisions than somebody

:50:55. > :51:00.who's got more life experience, do you think? I think that is

:51:01. > :51:03.definitely a view shared by many, but what I say is that because you

:51:04. > :51:06.are young you have to prove yourself and that's what I will be hoping to

:51:07. > :51:10.do and those decisions, some might be mistakes but you learn from those

:51:11. > :51:17.mistakes and that's what I am hoping to do and strive on that. I said

:51:18. > :51:20.earlier that the party wants to talk about Brexit, council elections, dog

:51:21. > :51:24.mess. Actually a lot of people here are talking about the future of Neil

:51:25. > :51:28.McEvoy, suspended now as a Cardiff councillor. What do you make of it,

:51:29. > :51:31.two Assembly members have told me he should be suspended from the party

:51:32. > :51:35.while there are investigations going on about his future, what do you

:51:36. > :51:42.make of it? As a member who is also bound by the code of conduct, and

:51:43. > :51:49.have been since I became an elected member in 99 we all have to keep to

:51:50. > :51:51.the code of conduct. It would seem that this external panel that has

:51:52. > :51:55.looked into the case has seen that there was a case to answer. Now,

:51:56. > :51:59.whether the chairman of the party wishes to look into that more

:52:00. > :52:03.closely, well, that's up to him and I am not chair of the party at this

:52:04. > :52:07.point, I have been in the past, I have had to deal with difficult

:52:08. > :52:11.situations then. So I am sure he will in due course have to look at

:52:12. > :52:19.this case, as well. But you are a prominent Plaid Cymru member. If you

:52:20. > :52:24.were in that position now and we know that - do you think he should

:52:25. > :52:28.be suspended? He has been suspended as a councillor for a month anyway.

:52:29. > :52:32.We need to cool it a bit and step back and look closely at what

:52:33. > :52:37.actually happened, from a party political point of view. As I say, I

:52:38. > :52:43.have every confidence in the present chair to do that on our behalf. I

:52:44. > :52:47.don't know how many conferences you have been coming to but there is

:52:48. > :52:51.quite a buzz around this one mainly because of the discussions around

:52:52. > :52:55.Neil McEvoy's future. As a conference, how do you think it's

:52:56. > :52:59.been going so far? It's been great, it's different to the last few, we

:53:00. > :53:03.have council leaders talking and that brings home this is a grass

:53:04. > :53:08.roots party, we haven't the big money of Tory and Labour, we need

:53:09. > :53:13.these people and local councillors to come to the conference and speak

:53:14. > :53:17.up and make sure that not only do MPs hear our problems, but that we

:53:18. > :53:20.can make sure that our voices are heard at a local level. You have

:53:21. > :53:24.shared it with the party and the BBC, as well. Thank you both. That's

:53:25. > :53:28.the voice for local Government and we will be sharing more from the

:53:29. > :53:32.other political parties over the next few conferences. For the

:53:33. > :53:36.moment, back to the studio. Thank you very much. Brexit is at

:53:37. > :53:41.the top of the political agenda these days. Let's get the view from

:53:42. > :53:45.the European Parliament now. Jill Evans is Plaid Cymru's MEP. Here's

:53:46. > :53:51.what she had to say to the conference.

:53:52. > :53:56.I am confident after yesterday and hearing our fantastic team of local

:53:57. > :54:03.council candidates speaking here on the platform and in the hall that

:54:04. > :54:08.they offer people a real voice in shaping the future of their

:54:09. > :54:13.communities. It's been a massive honour and responsibility to have

:54:14. > :54:19.been your voice, Plaid Cymru's voice and Wales' voice in Europe for many

:54:20. > :54:25.years now. It's a great feeling to have been able to raise Wales'

:54:26. > :54:30.profile and help people in however small a way and I know from my years

:54:31. > :54:36.as a councillor and today I still see changes that I could achieve as

:54:37. > :54:42.a councillor but the only way any of us can do those things is by working

:54:43. > :54:46.with people in the community because the people who live in those

:54:47. > :54:53.communities know what is needed to improve them. By strengthening our

:54:54. > :54:59.communities we strengthen and build our nation. Disaffection and

:55:00. > :55:03.alienation are two of the factors that led to the rejection of EU

:55:04. > :55:10.membership by some communities in Wales. As we know, some of those

:55:11. > :55:14.communities benefitted most from EU membership financially. I was born

:55:15. > :55:18.in the Rhondda and I have always lived there. The name is famous

:55:19. > :55:23.around the world because of the coal industry. It produced enormous

:55:24. > :55:30.wealth but not for the people of the Rhondda. The money was exported with

:55:31. > :55:36.the coal. It's the same story, isn't it, in our communities up and down

:55:37. > :55:39.the country. Those communities were, by their nature, immigrant

:55:40. > :55:44.communities, people came from all over Wales, from the UK and other

:55:45. > :55:52.parts of the world to work in those heavy industries. The communities

:55:53. > :55:55.were multicultural and multilingual. They were and still are close

:55:56. > :56:03.communities, well-known for the warmth and generosity of the people

:56:04. > :56:07.and I know that growing up in one of those communities it certainly

:56:08. > :56:11.enriched my life. Today, few people move into our communities to work

:56:12. > :56:17.because there are few jobs to come for. Young people are more likely to

:56:18. > :56:22.leave, taking their skills and talents with them. So things have to

:56:23. > :56:29.change. We can not allow that to continue. But neither can we go

:56:30. > :56:35.back. We have to take this opportunity to rethink, to reengage

:56:36. > :56:43.and to revitalise our politics. We can not leave it as a people, we

:56:44. > :56:47.must give control to people in Wales, encouraging and supporting

:56:48. > :56:52.community action. And we have to take the responsibility for that. We

:56:53. > :57:00.have to work against hate crime and racism. Our language is positive and

:57:01. > :57:03.our message is hopeful. As Leanne said yesterday, we welcome everyone

:57:04. > :57:09.who has chosen to make Wales their home, whether for just a few years

:57:10. > :57:13.to study or to learn new languages, or whether permanently to raise a

:57:14. > :57:20.family or to retire. It's uplifting to me to see people from all over

:57:21. > :57:25.the world who have come to live in Wales identify strongly with our

:57:26. > :57:32.nation and want to play their full part in building its future. We

:57:33. > :57:38.should have an enlightened and inclusive and a progressive path.

:57:39. > :57:43.I've been involved in many campaigns over the years, whether working for

:57:44. > :57:47.justice for Kurdish people, for Palestinian people, whether

:57:48. > :57:51.protesting against wars on nuclear weapons for the peace movement but

:57:52. > :57:59.one of the most memorable campaigns that I have been involved in was the

:58:00. > :58:03.local campaign to close the notorious landfill site in the

:58:04. > :58:08.Rhondda. This polluting rubbish tip was on top of the mountain right

:58:09. > :58:14.opposite my home, so I didn't just smell it, but every morning when I

:58:15. > :58:19.got up and opened the curtains I could see it. What started as a

:58:20. > :58:27.small protest because of the nuisance from the flies and the

:58:28. > :58:32.smells in the local community, grew into a real huge community action.

:58:33. > :58:37.It became a permanent camp on the site blockading the road to the tip.

:58:38. > :58:42.Because what had happened, people complained of course to the local

:58:43. > :58:47.council in the beginning about the nuisance from the tip. And they were

:58:48. > :58:50.ignored and they were fobbed off with answers and people kept

:58:51. > :58:54.complaining and more people complained and the problems got

:58:55. > :59:03.worse and worse and worse. People wrote letters. We had meetings. We

:59:04. > :59:09.had protests at the council offices. But people stood there hold placards

:59:10. > :59:13.that were not only ignored by the council but the people were ignored

:59:14. > :59:19.and weren't believed. So people realised that they had to take a

:59:20. > :59:28.different type of action. When the camp was set up at the entrance to

:59:29. > :59:31.the site it became a real microcosm of the community because older

:59:32. > :59:36.retired men would go up there first thing in the morning to light the

:59:37. > :59:39.fire, young parents would turn up after taking the children to school

:59:40. > :59:44.and then they would go back and bring the children back with them.

:59:45. > :59:50.Local shops and food and hot drinks, everybody played a part. Women and

:59:51. > :59:55.men of all ages and all backgrounds who had never been involved in

:59:56. > :00:01.politics soon became experts on certainly how the local authority

:00:02. > :00:06.works, but also the dangers of toxic waste, the dangers of landfill,

:00:07. > :00:12.about EU environmental law and much, much more. Of course when Plaid

:00:13. > :00:18.Cymru took control of the council in Rhondda we did close the tip, with

:00:19. > :00:22.the help of a petition to the European Parliament and using

:00:23. > :00:27.European environmental laws on waste. Now why am I saying this, do

:00:28. > :00:38.you think? It's several years ago now. I wouldn't for a minute wish

:00:39. > :00:42.that on any other community. But if we can mobilise that kind of

:00:43. > :00:48.enthusiasm and strength of feeling to work for the good of our

:00:49. > :00:51.communities and for the good of Wales against the dangers of leaving

:00:52. > :01:00.the European Union, then anything is possible.

:01:01. > :01:08.In the words of the often quoted Williams, I have quoted them many

:01:09. > :01:13.times, because I can often find something in the books to guide and

:01:14. > :01:19.inspire me, he wrote, the Welsh have danced among these giant cog wheels

:01:20. > :01:26.before. Welsh other people have lived by and remaking themselves in

:01:27. > :01:32.generation after generation. That is the challenge that faces us. In the

:01:33. > :01:38.aftermath of the EU referendum we have to create a new Wales. A new

:01:39. > :01:44.Wales in Europe. Because we always have been and we still are a

:01:45. > :01:48.European nation. We are not defined by the vote to leave the EU as a

:01:49. > :01:53.people or party. We need to understand that and we need to show

:01:54. > :02:02.people in Wales what drives as other party. We exist to protect and

:02:03. > :02:08.promote the interests of all the people in every part of Wales. Our

:02:09. > :02:13.interest are best served by working hand-in-hand with the rest of Europe

:02:14. > :02:21.and beyond. We want Wales to take its place on the international stage

:02:22. > :02:26.and perform with enthusiasm. Our role as a proud and confident nation

:02:27. > :02:32.of strong and vibrant communities. A force for good and a voice for peace

:02:33. > :02:36.and justice. We are ambitious. Because the people of Wales deserve

:02:37. > :02:48.nothing less than a party with vision and drive. A party on a

:02:49. > :02:55.mission. And we are. Plaid Cymru MEP Jill Evans. I much longer she or any

:02:56. > :02:59.other MEP will be there is anyone's guess. I am joined by Leanne Wood

:03:00. > :03:07.the leader of Plaid Cymru. Good afternoon. Good afternoon. Lots of

:03:08. > :03:11.your speech yesterday focused on what to call our geographical

:03:12. > :03:15.inequalities in Wales. You talked about an overheated centre at the

:03:16. > :03:18.expense of everywhere else in Wales. Do you think these issues have been

:03:19. > :03:23.there since the start of devolution and if so what did you do about it

:03:24. > :03:30.in your time when you were power-sharing? I was not in

:03:31. > :03:34.government as you know. I have been the leader of Plaid Cymru for five

:03:35. > :03:37.years and we were in coalition government prior to that. Labour has

:03:38. > :03:45.led the government in years for 18 years. We have seen inequalities

:03:46. > :03:51.grow and it is unacceptable that in the north of our country 21% of the

:03:52. > :03:56.people live there and 17% of capital investment is spent in the north. We

:03:57. > :04:01.want to see wealth and prosperity spread to every community throughout

:04:02. > :04:06.this country. We are community champions. Community is very

:04:07. > :04:10.important to us, strengthening our communities will be our top phrase

:04:11. > :04:15.for the local elections. That is why in my speech yesterday I made a

:04:16. > :04:21.pitch to all communities in Wales and said that under a Plaid Cymru

:04:22. > :04:26.government we would look out for everyone. If you are to redistribute

:04:27. > :04:31.wealth across Wales it would mean you would have to move something

:04:32. > :04:38.from Cardiff or south-east Wales to another part of the country. What

:04:39. > :04:42.would you move from the economic centre? You are making an

:04:43. > :04:46.assumption. We are talking about future expenditure. We have talked

:04:47. > :04:49.about the need for regional development and we have different

:04:50. > :04:54.needs in different parts of the country. We believe that economic

:04:55. > :05:08.development should be done on a regional basis, meeting the needs of

:05:09. > :05:37.those local communities, and future expenditure should be considered on

:05:38. > :05:39.an all Wales basis. We have an overheating south-east and future

:05:40. > :05:42.investment is planned for a year which is great and obviously our

:05:43. > :05:48.capital city is very important to us. But the city region deal that is

:05:49. > :05:50.on the cards we want to make sure that the places furthest away from

:05:51. > :05:54.the centre for example with a metal are started first so that those

:05:55. > :05:56.areas that are most deprived tend up getting some investment. You talked

:05:57. > :05:59.about wanting to see the next Admiral based in a town in the

:06:00. > :06:01.valleys. How could you make sure that would happen if you were First

:06:02. > :06:02.Minister? There are things that government can do. If you had a

:06:03. > :06:04.regional industrial plant. The government we have now does not have

:06:05. > :06:06.one. Take the Welsh revenue authority. That is going to be set

:06:07. > :06:10.up in Treforest ten miles north of Cardiff. There will be 40 jobs

:06:11. > :06:13.initially. You could say not many. That can make a huge impact will

:06:14. > :06:20.stop good news for your constituents. Well, it would be

:06:21. > :06:25.excellent news for my constituents if those jobs were going to be from

:06:26. > :06:32.the local area. When I asked the First Minister about this he said

:06:33. > :06:38.that we do not have the skills in Wales for those tax jobs apparently,

:06:39. > :06:43.even though he is responsible for those skills. Those jobs are going

:06:44. > :06:47.to be filled by experts from London. That is outrageous that shows lack

:06:48. > :06:50.of ambition on the part of the First Minister who is responsible for

:06:51. > :06:54.skills. He knew really be having tax-raising powers at some point and

:06:55. > :06:59.it should've been up for him to make sure have people in Wales with the

:07:00. > :07:03.skills to do though is very important jobs. Looking to the local

:07:04. > :07:06.elections, before the conference you said people on the doorstep were

:07:07. > :07:15.more concerned with dog mess than Brexit. Do you believe that? That

:07:16. > :07:21.was in response to a question that you asked me I think which was how

:07:22. > :07:26.much is Brexit coming up on the doorsteps? It is not in great

:07:27. > :07:32.number. People are more concerned about local issues, local services,

:07:33. > :07:38.and dog mess is coming up a lot. Your version of Brexit, you are

:07:39. > :07:41.losing the battle, you want to see membership of the single market,

:07:42. > :07:50.would you concede that argument has long gone? We lost the battle on

:07:51. > :07:55.June 23 if you like. We are trying, while accepting the result, we know

:07:56. > :08:00.we are going to leave the EU, what is important is how we leave. And

:08:01. > :08:05.the manner, the type of Brexit, hard or soft, whether retaining

:08:06. > :08:09.membership of the single market or not, these are questions still up

:08:10. > :08:12.for debate and discussion and as long as they are up for debate and

:08:13. > :08:17.discussion Plaid Cymru will be putting forward the case for the

:08:18. > :08:23.best interests of Wales and we have said all along that it is jobs and

:08:24. > :08:26.the economy that are at the top of the agenda for us and that is why

:08:27. > :08:30.our continued membership of the single market is so important. What

:08:31. > :08:36.are your hopes for the local elections? What have your council

:08:37. > :08:42.leaders -- one of your council leaders said Labour are on their

:08:43. > :08:48.uppers. If so, we can expect Plaid Cymru to gain overall control, can

:08:49. > :08:52.we? We are in control in four councils already. We would be

:08:53. > :08:56.looking to maintain that of course and I think this election is going

:08:57. > :09:01.to be an interesting one. We are looking to make gains in a host of

:09:02. > :09:05.communities throughout the country and I would like to see Plaid Cymru

:09:06. > :09:10.and control in more than the four we hold. This is not just don't Plaid

:09:11. > :09:15.Cymru's election results. We have to see how the other parties do and

:09:16. > :09:19.which parties we could work with, which we could have similar

:09:20. > :09:22.manifestos. There is going to be quite a bit of discussion and

:09:23. > :09:28.negotiation after the local elections. I am confident Plaid

:09:29. > :09:34.Cymru will put in a good show. Would you concede your track record in

:09:35. > :09:37.elections so far would not instil confidence in your activists looking

:09:38. > :09:42.ahead to the local elections? You to over just after the last set of

:09:43. > :09:48.local elections and since then you lost councillors, you haven't gained

:09:49. > :09:52.MEP or MP, you gained one assembly member and there has been a

:09:53. > :09:59.defection. It is not an inspiring record. Is it? You put this point to

:10:00. > :10:07.me every conference. My members are very positive in a strong mid-and I

:10:08. > :10:12.think we are confident of making gains in the local elections. I have

:10:13. > :10:16.said clearly to my activists time and again the way we win votes in

:10:17. > :10:21.Plaid Cymru is to connect with people in their communities and that

:10:22. > :10:25.is why the doorstep to be conversations has been so important.

:10:26. > :10:28.It is down to the members on the ground to deliver the results in me

:10:29. > :10:31.and we have everything else in place, it is about the local

:10:32. > :10:39.activity and I am going to be looking to my members to make sure

:10:40. > :10:43.they put in the graft. There has not been a Thomas spoiler to this

:10:44. > :10:48.conference but there have been negative pressure guarding one of

:10:49. > :10:53.your assembly members and councillors, Neil McEvoy, after the

:10:54. > :11:00.judgment in the tribunal yesterday. Do you believe that Neil McEvoy is a

:11:01. > :11:05.bully? Let me tell you, we take bullying very seriously in Plaid

:11:06. > :11:11.Cymru, but we also take process very seriously. This is a matter that has

:11:12. > :11:15.been referred to the party chairman. There is a process being undertaken

:11:16. > :11:20.and I respect that process and it is important that all of us respect

:11:21. > :11:23.that process. One of your fellow Plaid Cymru members said on social

:11:24. > :11:29.media that the leadership should not let someone speak the day after this

:11:30. > :11:37.result, we cannot condone this behaviour and ignore in our own

:11:38. > :11:41.ranks. Is she right? I have a lot of sympathy with what better than

:11:42. > :11:45.Jenkins has said and I listened to all of my members and I take on

:11:46. > :11:50.board all of their views very seriously but there is a process in

:11:51. > :11:53.place, the party chairman has decided alongside the steering

:11:54. > :11:57.committee that the conference as plant will go ahead, but the

:11:58. > :12:02.conversations will take place next week in terms of the process and

:12:03. > :12:08.that has to be stuck to. I cannot add anything further. Would you like

:12:09. > :12:14.to see him suspended as an assembly member? I am not going to comment on

:12:15. > :12:20.that. There is a process in place. I take process is extremely seriously

:12:21. > :12:25.as I do accusations of bullying. This will be dealt with according to

:12:26. > :12:33.the connect processes. Do you think Neil McEvoy is an asset or

:12:34. > :12:38.liability? I have a lot of members in my party. They do a lot of work

:12:39. > :12:42.for Wales and for their communities and many of them will be standing

:12:43. > :12:48.for election in May and I am supportive of my members' activity

:12:49. > :12:55.on the ground. That is all I want to say. After the hearing your McEvoy

:12:56. > :12:59.continued to refer to the process as a sham, kangaroo court. He said it

:13:00. > :13:06.was politically motivated. Do you agree? I am not going to comment on

:13:07. > :13:10.the further illness. There is a process in place and I am going to

:13:11. > :13:19.dear the process. Thank you, Leanne Wood. The conference has heard from

:13:20. > :13:27.all of Plaid Cymru's leading figures, amongst them the health

:13:28. > :13:35.Guzman. -- spokesperson. To me it says a lot that the promise of

:13:36. > :13:39.health spending, the ?350 billion for the NHS, was so influential in

:13:40. > :13:44.the EU referendum. Its influence came from the fact that the promise

:13:45. > :13:54.that played on a matter that is so important to people. The future of

:13:55. > :14:04.the NHS. It was here in Gwent that inspiration was found, strength to

:14:05. > :14:10.go on and established the NHS. Here likened the rest of Wales there is a

:14:11. > :14:13.realisation that his vision is being held back from its potential. There

:14:14. > :14:17.is excellent in the NHS in Wales. Devoted skilled staff second to

:14:18. > :14:24.none. We are lucky to have them and we cannot thank them enough. They

:14:25. > :14:31.are being asked to do more and more. Through lack of government support

:14:32. > :14:37.to deliver the impossible. Since I became Plaid Cymru shadow secretary

:14:38. > :14:40.for health and social care I noticed a pattern of behaviour whenever it

:14:41. > :14:46.comes to an issue on which Labour has a poor record. Several issues

:14:47. > :14:51.where Labour should be running the NHS in a better way, recruitment of

:14:52. > :14:55.doctors and nurses, management of waiting lists, diagnosis and

:14:56. > :15:00.treatment and preparing for the pressures of winter. We talk about

:15:01. > :15:09.that every year as if winter comes as a surprise. People do not want to

:15:10. > :15:14.lose the hope that the NHS really can deliver on the original vision.

:15:15. > :15:19.Labour's approach to the issues raised about the NHS's performance

:15:20. > :15:23.often go through a process similar to what we might recognise as the

:15:24. > :15:28.responses to a loss, the five stages of grief. Denial of the problem.

:15:29. > :15:31.Comments like those figures cannot be compared. That was an isolated

:15:32. > :15:41.incident. We will be told you are attacking

:15:42. > :15:46.hard working staff, they might even say that the media isn't getting it

:15:47. > :15:51.right. What does that sound familiar? But when the issue we are

:15:52. > :15:57.raising won't go away, Labour will then move on to the third stage,

:15:58. > :16:02.bargaining. They'll announce a new initiative perhaps to tackle the

:16:03. > :16:06.problem, they'll offer the patients who are concerned about performing

:16:07. > :16:10.or about performance a review on the way forward and they'll promise, as

:16:11. > :16:15.in the chamber in the Assembly, that things will be better by this time

:16:16. > :16:21.next year. When my predecessor as Shadow health Minister first raised

:16:22. > :16:25.the issue of cancer waiting targets being repeatedly missed, both the

:16:26. > :16:30.then health Minister and the First Minister made a promise to the

:16:31. > :16:38.Assembly. They promised the targets would be hit by October. October

:16:39. > :16:46.2013. It's now March 2017 and those targets still haven't been met and

:16:47. > :16:50.performance is still as bad today with those promises quietly

:16:51. > :16:55.forgotten. But when we continue to highlight poor performance after the

:16:56. > :17:00.bargaining we then see depression. We'll be told that Wales is just too

:17:01. > :17:07.ill compared to others. Which is sort of an echo of of the argument

:17:08. > :17:11.that we're too poor, to self-govern, it's about as accurate, as well, it

:17:12. > :17:14.was dispelled by the audit office several years ago. We will be told

:17:15. > :17:20.the Barnett formula is unfair and Labour doesn't have the resources to

:17:21. > :17:26.fully meet the needs of Wales. I am sorry, but the extra funds that we

:17:27. > :17:31.do need simply don't explain the performance gap. Particularly when

:17:32. > :17:34.we can point to examples of incompetence, of financial waste,

:17:35. > :17:38.such as spending hundreds of millions of pounds on agency staff

:17:39. > :17:43.because of the failure to plan the workforce properly. And of course

:17:44. > :17:52.they'll blame patients for being too ill. They'll blame high attendance

:17:53. > :17:57.at A on people who should have gone to the GP. They'll blame the

:17:58. > :18:02.high rates of obesity and smoking, they're blaming obesity and smoking

:18:03. > :18:08.in Wales as if everybody in Scotland and England live perfectly healthy

:18:09. > :18:14.lifestyles. It's made to seem as if poor performance is inevitable. What

:18:15. > :18:21.can they do, they've only been in Government running the Welsh NHS for

:18:22. > :18:29.18 years? Then of course there is the 5th stage. Acceptance. Sadly

:18:30. > :18:34.this hasn't happened yet. We still haven't seen Labour accepting that

:18:35. > :18:39.our health service can and should do better for Wales. Genuinely. Plaid

:18:40. > :18:46.Cymru does accept that and that's why we have focussed on solving

:18:47. > :18:50.problems, not denying them and not deciding they're somehow inevitable.

:18:51. > :18:54.We will train and recruit doctors we need for all parts of Wales,

:18:55. > :18:59.including the establishment of medical education in the north. We

:19:00. > :19:03.do want to retain the nurse bursary, we will set ambitious targets for

:19:04. > :19:07.cancer diagnosis, that cancer charities themselves want and that

:19:08. > :19:13.the Welsh Government continues to deny are needed to improve survival

:19:14. > :19:17.rates. And we will focus on making our NHS as good as anywhere in the

:19:18. > :19:22.world and not just breathe a sigh of relief when new figures aren't quite

:19:23. > :19:30.as bad as they could be or were expected to be. That's not good

:19:31. > :19:36.enough. APPLAUSE

:19:37. > :19:43.Is finance a problem for health, like the rest of the public service

:19:44. > :19:48.in Wales? Of course it is. Wales has been starved of funding by Tory

:19:49. > :19:56.austerity. Just like it was by Labour's refusal to change funding

:19:57. > :20:04.form lass. Remember that. But it's a pretty grim mix that we have now.

:20:05. > :20:09.The resolute austerity of the Tories and the resolute left edge of

:20:10. > :20:18.Labour, seeking to run Wales like managers. Don't get me wrong, a good

:20:19. > :20:24.manager can work wonders. But Labour isn't managing, isn't coping.

:20:25. > :20:30.Frankly, we don't need just management, we need vision, we need

:20:31. > :20:36.leadership, that's what Plaid Cymru is offering. It's time for Wales to

:20:37. > :20:43.say we can do better. It's time for Wales to say let's aim higher. It's

:20:44. > :20:53.time for Wales to unite in search of a new way of doing things. It's time

:20:54. > :20:56.for Wales. APPLAUSE

:20:57. > :21:01.The Plaid Cymru health spokesperson addressing delegates there. Vaughan,

:21:02. > :21:05.we haven't talked about the Plaid campaign looking ahead to the local

:21:06. > :21:13.elections and the seats that they and the councils they might look to

:21:14. > :21:18.win. Which are they? Well, you have, if you like, the traditional Plaid

:21:19. > :21:23.Heartlands, Gwynedd is a council they normally hope to control, also

:21:24. > :21:26.Conway they lead at the moment, that's leading at a disparate group

:21:27. > :21:30.of councillors. Then the big prize for them this time I think would be

:21:31. > :21:34.Carmarthenshire. That's a council they never controlled outright. They

:21:35. > :21:37.lead it at the moment in alliance with independents. They do think

:21:38. > :21:40.they have an outside chance of taking outright control.

:21:41. > :21:48.Carmarthenshire is one of the biggest local authorities in Wales

:21:49. > :21:50.so that would be a major prize. Elsewhere, Caerphilly and Rhondda,

:21:51. > :21:56.traditionally very good places for the party. The party's controlled

:21:57. > :22:01.them before. But they're working a pretty hard face there, a

:22:02. > :22:04.particularly if you get Ukip candidates coming in, as well.

:22:05. > :22:09.Ironically enough, Ukip and Plaid Cymru attract a similar sort of

:22:10. > :22:12.voter in working class constituencies, people is enchanted

:22:13. > :22:17.with Labour who want to give the local Labour Party a kicking and

:22:18. > :22:23.Cardiff I think, you were talking about Neil McEvoy, the truth is the

:22:24. > :22:26.quandry for Plaid Cymru is at times Neil McEvoy embarasses them but he

:22:27. > :22:31.is also the man who reaches the part no other Plaid politician has ever

:22:32. > :22:33.managed to reach before. He has an appeal in Cardiff which is something

:22:34. > :22:38.that Plaid have been searching for, for the best part of 50 years. So it

:22:39. > :22:46.will be interesting to see how they manage that. That's the local level.

:22:47. > :22:48.I think now we can speak to someone who represents the party on a

:22:49. > :22:54.national level. Yes, thank you. Joining me now is

:22:55. > :23:01.the member of parliament, thank you for joining us. A lot of our viewers

:23:02. > :23:05.will have seen on the news a student who was debe deported to Sri Lanka

:23:06. > :23:13.months before the end of her degree, what's the latest you can tell us

:23:14. > :23:16.about that? I saw it on Thursday, she's extremely relieved to be back

:23:17. > :23:20.and her mother, and is getting on with her studies. She's been

:23:21. > :23:24.allowed, I think, this is the terms she's been allowed to do her exams,

:23:25. > :23:29.but we will have to fight the case for a more permanent solution but

:23:30. > :23:33.she's now got a very good legal representation. What's the hope in

:23:34. > :23:39.the longer term, that she will be allowed to remain here? She's been

:23:40. > :23:43.here since she was 12. In some ways she comes from Bangor now but she is

:23:44. > :23:47.a Londoner, lived there since she was 12. I should imagine that any

:23:48. > :23:52.sensible Government would see she's such an asset. She's doing a degree,

:23:53. > :23:55.she's going to get a first. It's an area where there is a huge skills

:23:56. > :24:00.shortage. We would be crazy to send her back. One of the other issues

:24:01. > :24:06.discussed a lot by you in Westminster over the last few days,

:24:07. > :24:11.weeks, months, is Brexit. Isn't Plaid Cymru on the wrong side of the

:24:12. > :24:15.debate, aren't you losing the debate looking at keeping full membership

:24:16. > :24:18.and access, full membership of the single market, do you get the sense

:24:19. > :24:22.this is an argument you are losing? I get the sense the Government isn't

:24:23. > :24:28.listening and they're determined to get either a minimal deal or

:24:29. > :24:31.otherwise to crash out of all the European arrangements and just

:24:32. > :24:38.taking a chance and I think that would be disastrous for the UK but

:24:39. > :24:42.specifically for Wales. We have our position which we think would be

:24:43. > :24:49.advantageous for us and would expect us to argue for anything else and I

:24:50. > :24:52.hope the Government will see sense. Doesn't your position become more

:24:53. > :24:57.difficult when you consider that Wales as a whole voted to leave the

:24:58. > :25:03.EU, knowing more than likely that would involve or could involve

:25:04. > :25:07.leaving the single market as well? Well, I didn't hear anybody before

:25:08. > :25:10.the debate - before the vote saying they'll crash out of the markets and

:25:11. > :25:14.will have to take a chance on the world stage. I didn't hear a single

:25:15. > :25:19.farmer saying we hope to export a lot of lamb to New Zealand. It would

:25:20. > :25:23.be crazy to say those things. The Government are now ascribing all

:25:24. > :25:26.kinds of things to the voters saying it was about immigration and this

:25:27. > :25:30.that and the other. I don't think that's how it is. I think there

:25:31. > :25:35.should be an opportunity to think carefully. There isn't that much

:25:36. > :25:40.clarity it seems to me, you are more than likely to correct me, doesn't

:25:41. > :25:43.seem clarity in terms of what's your settled view now on immigration,

:25:44. > :25:48.what should the model be after Brexit? Well, clearly the

:25:49. > :25:53.immigration is very good for us in Wales, we have skills shortages and

:25:54. > :26:01.shortages of people in social care and in health. Obviously as an - we

:26:02. > :26:06.would want to control the level of immigration and sort of imgrags or

:26:07. > :26:11.have agreement as we have had with the EU for free movement. We are not

:26:12. > :26:14.in that position at the moment. We can say what our aspirations and

:26:15. > :26:18.principles are. You are not saying what you want to see after Brexit

:26:19. > :26:21.now under the current circumstances, without Wales being an independent

:26:22. > :26:25.country. It's virtually impossible to do that. We don't know what the

:26:26. > :26:29.proposed... What do you want to see? We would like to see our membership

:26:30. > :26:34.for the markets and if that's contingent, if that is dependent on

:26:35. > :26:38.having freer movements than is envisaged we would be happy. You can

:26:39. > :26:41.say and I guess with some justification that voters didn't

:26:42. > :26:44.know whether or not single market membership was going to continue. I

:26:45. > :26:47.think you can say to a greater degree of certainty immigration and

:26:48. > :26:51.controlling immigration was a big issue for a lot of people in Wales

:26:52. > :26:56.to vote to leave. Aren't you therefore going against that element

:26:57. > :27:00.of that vote? We started this conversation talking about my

:27:01. > :27:04.student going to be thrown out. As many people have come up to me,

:27:05. > :27:07.yesterday I walked across the road and five people stopped me and said

:27:08. > :27:13.what a good thing it was she was allowed to stay. At least one of

:27:14. > :27:19.those I know is an ardent Ukip supporters. Don't you think people

:27:20. > :27:23.voted to regain control and immigration does have that sense of

:27:24. > :27:27.belonging to elements of the debate? I can see that as I said in my

:27:28. > :27:30.speech this afternoon I think there are people on both sides of the

:27:31. > :27:33.debate who have mixed views and there are good people, I would say

:27:34. > :27:37.it's a good majority of people on both sides of the debate who

:27:38. > :27:42.certainly don't want to go into the narrow sort of exit that MrsMay

:27:43. > :27:47.seems to be proposing and if that fails, she's proposing to launch us

:27:48. > :27:52.into the perilous waters of world trade without any guarantees at all.

:27:53. > :27:55.If that happens and that's the threat, that unless the European

:27:56. > :28:01.counterparts, the remaining 27 countries play ball, she will walk

:28:02. > :28:04.away and go for a low corporation tax, lower regulation economy. If

:28:05. > :28:07.she does that, under those circumstances you would say you

:28:08. > :28:14.would have to have a general election before she would be allowed

:28:15. > :28:20.to carry on with that. She has to to have approval of some sort. She is a

:28:21. > :28:22.Prime Minister who hasn't been approved by a general election. From

:28:23. > :28:27.what I understand from her she doesn't want to go before 2020

:28:28. > :28:30.either. Would you be happy MPs have a said on that or is that a

:28:31. > :28:33.fundamental shift in the UK's economy that you would say that has

:28:34. > :28:39.to go to the British people for a vote? My personal view I have to say

:28:40. > :28:44.is that a general election would decide this on a UK basis, we would

:28:45. > :28:48.have to see about voters in Wales. On the whole, MPs should be having a

:28:49. > :28:52.vote. I have to say I am against the referendum, because on the whole,

:28:53. > :28:59.they're not about the question on the ballot paper, so often. If you

:29:00. > :29:04.look at the reasons why people voted for or against, there are all kinds

:29:05. > :29:08.of reasons and I think we really need to confirm whatever the terms

:29:09. > :29:11.are. Lastly, looking at the debate over Brexit and the votes that we

:29:12. > :29:16.have seen in the House of Commons, in parliament, House of Commons and

:29:17. > :29:22.House of Lords, isn't it showing the need to have a non-elected appointed

:29:23. > :29:25.second chamber in the UK that can look more dispassionately at things

:29:26. > :29:31.like Brexit without the pressure of having to seek election? Well, if we

:29:32. > :29:37.had an elected second chamber they wouldn't... They wouldn't have been

:29:38. > :29:43.able to speak freely. Depends what the term is. It's one of the things

:29:44. > :29:46.offered. So you have a people with a certainty of tenure but can't stand

:29:47. > :29:50.for re-election, then you have that degree of independence but also the

:29:51. > :29:54.degree of legitimacy in terms of election. Would you get the

:29:55. > :29:58.expertise, would leading figures in science and academia want to ever

:29:59. > :30:06.stand for election, isn't it showing that what you have is a revising

:30:07. > :30:11.chamber full of experts, a few hereditaries as well, they can look

:30:12. > :30:18.dispassionately at Brexit? And Bishops. You forgot Bishops. When we

:30:19. > :30:23.had a vote about eight years ago, you could have 80% elected and 20%

:30:24. > :30:26.appointed or systems in Ireland where a large proportion are elected

:30:27. > :30:30.but then sectors of the economy nominate their own people. There is

:30:31. > :30:36.lots of ways of doing this apart from having a Prime Minister

:30:37. > :30:40.appointing who he or she likes or who they have donated most to the

:30:41. > :30:44.party, if I may say so. Speaking of difficult decisions for party

:30:45. > :30:49.leaders, you will be aware a lot of talk has been about the future of

:30:50. > :30:51.Neil McEvoy. I will ask you the question is he an asset or a

:30:52. > :31:01.liability? On that basis he is a very effective

:31:02. > :31:07.and very industrious assembly member and counsellor. Anybody like that is

:31:08. > :31:15.an asset. One has to concede there is a down and said -- downside in

:31:16. > :31:18.that he has had this hearing and we take this seriously. No party would

:31:19. > :31:23.like to have this judgment against them and I am not sure what Neal

:31:24. > :31:28.will be doing if he can do anything to contest that. In the meantime

:31:29. > :31:33.while there is this uncertainty, investigations, should he be

:31:34. > :31:38.suspended? As two assembly members have said to me today. I understand

:31:39. > :31:44.that if the position for the chairman who is going to be taking

:31:45. > :31:49.the investigation forward. In some cases I would be calling for Arlene

:31:50. > :31:55.Foster to stand back while the investigation is ongoing and that is

:31:56. > :32:02.not unreasonable. It is not my decision. You say that maybe he

:32:03. > :32:08.should be suspended? It is to be considered. I do not know the

:32:09. > :32:10.details of the case. It is something we take incredibly seriously. We

:32:11. > :32:16.need a quick investigation because he has work to do as we all have.

:32:17. > :32:22.That is the last of the contributions from the conference

:32:23. > :32:31.floor. Neil McEvoy. You said he was able to

:32:32. > :32:37.reach the parts not many members of Plaid Cymru unable to reach. How

:32:38. > :32:42.difficult a position are the party in with this one? It is a difficult

:32:43. > :32:47.position because it is so close to the local elections. Any sort of

:32:48. > :32:51.suspension, were it for more than a month that he has been suspended

:32:52. > :32:59.for, by the tribunal, would be difficult. It also raises a question

:33:00. > :33:02.of double jeopardy in that this ruling was a ruling by the body

:33:03. > :33:07.about the code of conduct for councillors. It was something he did

:33:08. > :33:12.as a counsellor not as an assembly member. He was not an assembly

:33:13. > :33:16.member at the time. It would be a question whether it would be a

:33:17. > :33:21.double punishment. Not so much of it was the party punishing him but if

:33:22. > :33:24.it was the assembly gets. That is why I am surprised that assembly

:33:25. > :33:28.members were talking about this because he was not an assembly

:33:29. > :33:32.member. If the assembly group were to take action that would be very

:33:33. > :33:38.problematic. Is it also a problem because he has a very large fan

:33:39. > :33:42.base? Within the party but also amongst people who year has managed

:33:43. > :33:47.to entice from other parties especially where he lives locally.

:33:48. > :33:52.They might be disenfranchised perhaps if further action was taken

:33:53. > :33:56.against him? If your McEvoy walked away from Plaid Cymru a lot of

:33:57. > :34:03.people would leave them. There is no sign as far as I can see that he has

:34:04. > :34:06.any intention of doing that. We have seen people tweeting that they are

:34:07. > :34:13.more convinced than ever that Neil McEvoy will one day be the leader of

:34:14. > :34:16.Plaid Cymru. He is a more might personality and within the context

:34:17. > :34:23.of the assembly group, quite a small group of people, ten people, there

:34:24. > :34:27.are people who like Neil McEvoy and people who hate him. That is the

:34:28. > :34:32.difficulty. That is lively and we these people keep going on about

:34:33. > :34:36.process it could so easily become about personality and that is what

:34:37. > :34:40.they are trying to avoid. Policy, hoping to hear from Adam Price

:34:41. > :34:46.before the end of this programme. He is going to be talking about the

:34:47. > :34:52.possibility of raising tax in Wales, putting a penny on the basic rate of

:34:53. > :34:56.income tax. A very brave politician who talks about raising taxes. In

:34:57. > :35:03.this context wheels would be the highest taxed part of the UK. Yes.

:35:04. > :35:08.It is politically not always stupid. You remember Paddy Ashdown ran a

:35:09. > :35:15.successful campaign based on a penny on income tax to spend on education.

:35:16. > :35:19.Abstract talk about a tax increase can be quite effective in terms of

:35:20. > :35:26.the voters. The difficulty is in Wales the tax base is tiny. An extra

:35:27. > :35:30.penny on income tax in Wales would not bring in very much money at all.

:35:31. > :35:39.It is not something that would transform health or education. It

:35:40. > :35:43.strikes me as being... Symbolic? If you wanted to be kind you would call

:35:44. > :35:47.it symbolic and if not you might call it a gimmick in that the amount

:35:48. > :35:53.of money it would bring in would not really be transformational for the

:35:54. > :35:57.Welsh government or public spending. Are they on a sticky wicket? Adam

:35:58. > :36:03.Price was advocating lowering the top rate of tax in 2014. Since then

:36:04. > :36:07.the money the Welsh government has been spending especially on health

:36:08. > :36:13.has gone up quite considerably. It is hard to see why they were

:36:14. > :36:18.advocating a tax cut before 2014 and now spending on health has gone up

:36:19. > :36:22.and they are advocating a tax rise. Yes, Adam Price is an interesting

:36:23. > :36:27.politician and sometimes he is in politician mode, like when he is

:36:28. > :36:32.talking about a tax increase, and sometimes he is in deep thinker

:36:33. > :36:37.Maud, and what he was seeing a few years ago was the point that was

:36:38. > :36:41.made by the Economist who frequently advises the Welsh government which

:36:42. > :36:45.is the one of the most effective thing she can do to try to increase

:36:46. > :36:51.the wealth of Wales... Would be to bring in the big earners. If you

:36:52. > :36:56.paid less tax if you chose to live in one part rather than in the

:36:57. > :37:00.Cotswolds. That is an academic argument. Adam Price with his

:37:01. > :37:06.student had on he might make that argument. Very difficult argument

:37:07. > :37:16.for a politician to make. Let us hear from him. He is walking out on

:37:17. > :37:27.stage. Adam Price. Talking about tax and other things. TRANSLATION: I had

:37:28. > :37:36.the privilege of being in the city

:37:37. > :37:41.during my 20s and getting to know the vitality of its culture and its

:37:42. > :37:48.warmth. The warmth of its people. It is great to revisit and reconnect

:37:49. > :37:56.and make my home here over the few days of conference. A full

:37:57. > :38:02.generation has passed since this nation of ours decided to place its

:38:03. > :38:08.future in our hands. This was not just a decision to replace one group

:38:09. > :38:16.of men and women with another. This was a decision to create a new

:38:17. > :38:21.Wales. A Wales in which poverty of ambition and circumstance were

:38:22. > :38:30.abolished and a new era of leadership, purposeful,

:38:31. > :38:35.inspirational, transformational, was placed at the very heart of our

:38:36. > :38:41.Constitution. And the public life of our nation. We wanted for our

:38:42. > :38:49.country, so long a land of wasted potential, to be instead a land of

:38:50. > :38:55.opportunity. Our hopes, demands for our country, were by no means

:38:56. > :39:02.radical. By all prevailing standards they were modest. That our children

:39:03. > :39:09.could grow up three of poverty, that the education of our young and our

:39:10. > :39:13.care for elderly was at least on a par with our nearest neighbours.

:39:14. > :39:20.That we gave the best chances we could do people at the start of life

:39:21. > :39:30.and the best care possible at the end. 1997 was, to use that phrase,

:39:31. > :39:35.sometimes on the most curious of lips, a vote for change. Not change

:39:36. > :39:41.for change's sake but change for a purpose, the founding purpose of any

:39:42. > :39:50.democracy, to lift up the people by the people's hand. It was not a new

:39:51. > :39:57.state we wanted to build. So much as a new society. Distinguished by

:39:58. > :40:08.social justice, economic dynamism and cultural achievement. Yes,

:40:09. > :40:11.tolerance, kindness and love. 1997 ended 18 years of Conservative rule

:40:12. > :40:18.and that was undoubtedly a liberation. But much more than that,

:40:19. > :40:23.it ended the studied disdain of distance, social and geographic,

:40:24. > :40:30.that flowed from 500 years of being ruled not by our peers, not by our

:40:31. > :40:36.own people, but by the gilded mansions of another nation.

:40:37. > :40:42.Self-government for Alice has never been an end in itself. It was the

:40:43. > :40:48.means to self-advancement, self-improvement,

:40:49. > :40:52.self-determination, to prise ourselves not individually but

:40:53. > :41:02.collectively out of the rut of poverty, ignorance and disease into

:41:03. > :41:06.which accident at birth had cast generation after generation.

:41:07. > :41:12.Government by our own people meant for us government for the people

:41:13. > :41:21.above all else, a new Wales, a new chance. I could hear the sentiments

:41:22. > :41:27.of a young man who fought for his country's freedom but never enjoyed

:41:28. > :41:32.its roots, Michael Collins. He more than any would have been celebrating

:41:33. > :41:36.that headline then -- from yesterday, Unionists lose majority

:41:37. > :41:47.for the first time in the Northern Ireland assembly. Unionists, or

:41:48. > :41:55.their real title British nationalists, if they can do it, so

:41:56. > :41:58.can we. I was surprised to see a political hero being named the other

:41:59. > :42:04.day with some half baked analogy between the Irish free states treaty

:42:05. > :42:07.and the Wales bill. I guess they both sparked a civil war although in

:42:08. > :42:13.the latter did was confined to the Labour Party. One thing Michael

:42:14. > :42:18.Collins would never have done is to join the Conservative Party. A short

:42:19. > :42:25.while before he was killed he gave one last speech on building up our

:42:26. > :42:33.land. Setting out his vision for the future of his country -- Ireland.

:42:34. > :42:38.And such is its engineering power, this is what he said. The growing

:42:39. > :42:44.wealth of Ireland well, we hope, be diffused through all of our people,

:42:45. > :42:48.all sharing in the growing prosperity, each receiving according

:42:49. > :42:54.to what each contributes in the making of that prosperity so that

:42:55. > :42:58.the wealth of all is a sure. How are we to increase the wealth of Ireland

:42:59. > :43:01.and ensure that all producing it shall share in it? That is the

:43:02. > :43:06.question that will engage the attention of the new government.

:43:07. > :43:13.What we must aim at is the building up of a sound economic life in which

:43:14. > :43:19.great discrepancies cannot occur. We must not have the destitution of

:43:20. > :43:24.poverty at one end and at the other an excess of riches in the

:43:25. > :43:31.possession of a few. That was Ireland on the cusp of freedom over

:43:32. > :43:36.90 years today. Over 90 years ago. When we look at the Wales of today,

:43:37. > :43:44.we are more connected through technology than ever before but we

:43:45. > :43:49.have an epidemic of loneliness. We have a wealth of opportunity. This

:43:50. > :43:55.single device has more computing power within it than the Apollo

:43:56. > :44:02.spacecraft that was used 50 years ago. To escape from Earth's orbit

:44:03. > :44:06.and returned safely from the moon. Yet we are continually confronted by

:44:07. > :44:13.evidence of sell your to solve the most basic problems of everyday

:44:14. > :44:18.life. We have the highest proportion of children living in poverty of any

:44:19. > :44:26.nation in the UK, one in three. 200,000 lives blighted right at the

:44:27. > :44:33.very beginning. We have had in Wales since 2010 a statutory commitment to

:44:34. > :44:37.eradicate child poverty by 2020. While poverty in Scotland and the

:44:38. > :44:41.north-east of England has been going down it has increased here compared

:44:42. > :44:50.to ten years ago. It is said to increase even further. What is the

:44:51. > :44:52.Welsh government policy response? To end our biggest anti-poverty

:44:53. > :45:06.programme communities first and put nothing in its place. 25 years ago I

:45:07. > :45:11.wrote this report for a major conference on the future of the

:45:12. > :45:16.valleys, rebuilding our communities, with Professor Kevin Morgan who went

:45:17. > :45:22.on to lead the 1997 Yes campaign. The depressing fact is that or an

:45:23. > :45:26.rereading this report it is just as relevant now as it was then because

:45:27. > :45:31.nothing much fundamentally has changed.

:45:32. > :45:38.In this report we quoted David Markwint, who was then a member of

:45:39. > :45:45.the Labour Party and has subsequently left to join us and he

:45:46. > :45:51.is here in the room with his wife, as well.

:45:52. > :45:58.APPLAUSE I think all four of us, I suspect,

:45:59. > :46:01.are natural co-operators, progressive pluralists by

:46:02. > :46:07.inclination, striving to find the Common Ground which can often be our

:46:08. > :46:12.best chance for change. Kevin and I ended our report then with these

:46:13. > :46:17.words, if the unpretentious claims of the Valleys for decent jobs, for

:46:18. > :46:23.better public services, and for a clean environment are to be met, we

:46:24. > :46:30.simply must come to terms with the fact that what we have in common is

:46:31. > :46:37.far more enduring than what divides us here in South Wales. It's that

:46:38. > :46:41.characteristically Welsh motivation, the disposition to co-operate for

:46:42. > :46:47.the common good that brought us together under one banner in 1997 in

:46:48. > :46:53.Yes for Wales and ten years later in One Wales. It's why we work where we

:46:54. > :46:57.can, even now in opposition, through the Welsh National White Paper on

:46:58. > :47:02.the withdrawal from the European Union, for example, to embody the

:47:03. > :47:09.politics of the united front, not that of a broken and divided nation.

:47:10. > :47:16.But the problem, and I say this in regret as much as in reproach, the

:47:17. > :47:22.problem in all this is glaringly obvious, it's called the Labour

:47:23. > :47:29.Party. This is a party born from the struggle for social change which now

:47:30. > :47:34.prop gates in our country at least the mindset of social inertia. The

:47:35. > :47:41.First Minister, by temperament and belief, is about as far as possible

:47:42. > :47:45.as is possible to be, from embodying the radical urgency of now. There

:47:46. > :47:50.was a time when stung by my criticism of his bad political

:47:51. > :47:54.posture, he started standing up straight at that elect turn in First

:47:55. > :48:01.Minister's questions. -- lecturn. But now he is slouched back into the

:48:02. > :48:07.slow and easy complacency of unchallengeable supremacy. A session

:48:08. > :48:12.at FMQs is like being inrolled at a poor quality university, being

:48:13. > :48:16.lectured at but learning nothing. A few weeks ago, he proudly told us,

:48:17. > :48:24.arm resting on his rostrum, how he had come up with the idea for the

:48:25. > :48:28.South Wales Metro at a rugby club. Sometimes if I close my eyes I can

:48:29. > :48:33.hear him saying to strangers at the bar in the rugby clubs of his

:48:34. > :48:41.retirement, I used to run a country once.

:48:42. > :48:46.LAUGHTER Labour in Wales is failing and it

:48:47. > :48:53.will fall. The only question is who will be there to pick up the pieces?

:48:54. > :49:00.For the future of our nation at this time there can only be one answer to

:49:01. > :49:07.that question. It has to be us. Not us in the narrow sense of this

:49:08. > :49:12.party, but us in the collective sense, represented by this party of

:49:13. > :49:17.our taking responsibility for our own problems, the solutions to which

:49:18. > :49:23.as we hold up a mirror to the state of our nation, are quite literally

:49:24. > :49:28.staring us in the face. That task of moving from

:49:29. > :49:34.complainants to controllers of our own fate, authors of our destiny,

:49:35. > :49:40.shapers of our future, begins with a local elections in May. Wales will

:49:41. > :49:47.not be liberated by a mass march in Cardiff or even a match in Cardiff.

:49:48. > :49:54.It's those small steps we take down a farmyard lane, up and down a

:49:55. > :49:58.Valleys terrace, the time you take to listen that will liberate Wales.

:49:59. > :50:04.Brick by brick, the new Wales will be built up - built from the blessed

:50:05. > :50:10.ground up. Governing locally is how we demonstrate to people nationally

:50:11. > :50:14.that there is a better way, that we don't have to accept the

:50:15. > :50:19.inevitability of poverty, disadvantage and decline. That

:50:20. > :50:25.another Wales is not just possible, but the urgent imperative of the

:50:26. > :50:29.times in which we live. We have underinvested for generations in the

:50:30. > :50:38.skills of our young and the care of our elderly. The new tax powers give

:50:39. > :50:42.us new possibilities and we as a nation must now decide on our

:50:43. > :50:47.priorities so we as a party will ask the people of Wales over the summer

:50:48. > :50:54.how these new powers should be utilised. Should we raise a penny

:50:55. > :50:59.for a purpose dedicated to transforming our beleaguered NHS?

:51:00. > :51:04.?200 million for our schools and colleges could close the gaping

:51:05. > :51:09.chasm of funding for students between Wales and our neighbours. We

:51:10. > :51:15.could, if we choose to, build a health and education system that was

:51:16. > :51:20.equal to the best. We could become the test bed nation for solving the

:51:21. > :51:27.societal challenges of the next generation. And it's in that spirit

:51:28. > :51:31.I am pleased to announce we as a group in the National Assembly are

:51:32. > :51:38.about to create an ideas lab focussing on new ideas for our

:51:39. > :51:45.economic transformation which given our guiding inspiration is that new

:51:46. > :51:52.Wales, we have a restless desire to build we will call Novacambria, it

:51:53. > :52:02.was the first attempt to create a new Welsh homeland in south America,

:52:03. > :52:06.some 15 years before in Brazil, led by the visionary Thomas Phillips.

:52:07. > :52:14.The community failed when many of its members, some of whom were

:52:15. > :52:19.Colliers from the old County of Gwent decided to work in nearby

:52:20. > :52:23.mines owned by others, rather than attempt to grow their own cotton.

:52:24. > :52:27.There is something of a metaphor there for the Welsh predictment, I

:52:28. > :52:33.think. STUDIO: Just as dam Price was --

:52:34. > :52:36.Adam Price was taking us down memory lane we will leave him there and

:52:37. > :52:43.turn to our political editor. Good afternoon. What's it been like

:52:44. > :52:50.there today, has this saga surrounding Neil McEsri overshadowed

:52:51. > :52:54.everything? -- McEvoy? I think so. Broadly, this is actually my fourth

:52:55. > :53:00.spring conference I have been to for Plaid. I think it's been quite flat,

:53:01. > :53:03.admittedly I am comparing it with the Assembly campaign and dmreks,

:53:04. > :53:08.maybe it's a reflection of where we are in the electoral cycle. We have

:53:09. > :53:12.council elections coming up, but it's difficult to characterise those

:53:13. > :53:16.and get your head around those because they're 22 separate battles,

:53:17. > :53:24.so many local factors. So I think that was the backdrop with which the

:53:25. > :53:33.McEvoy circus arrived today. A bit of breaking news. In the cafe behind

:53:34. > :53:38.me the talks between the party's chair and Neil McEvoy have broken up

:53:39. > :53:43.in which they were going to discuss that decision from the panel

:53:44. > :53:48.yesterday. Having spoken to Alan Jones today, he said he is not going

:53:49. > :53:52.to revisit that panel and kind of repeat all the decision-making

:53:53. > :53:58.process that went on, which would suggest that they are going to

:53:59. > :54:02.accept the findings and that would suggest then that it would be a

:54:03. > :54:08.logical extension, this is speculation, that some kind of

:54:09. > :54:12.action would be taken. The problem for the party clearly is that this

:54:13. > :54:16.is an independent official panel that has upheld a complaint of

:54:17. > :54:21.bullying and particularly for Leanne Wood I think, who has been a high

:54:22. > :54:25.profile campaigner against bullying herself, that's the pressure she

:54:26. > :54:31.will come under some pressure. On the flip side, Neil McEvoy, as no

:54:32. > :54:36.doubt you have been reflecting so far, has come out fighting and we

:54:37. > :54:41.have all seen what a one-man publicity machine as a politics he

:54:42. > :54:46.can be. On the policy front we were hearing from Adam Price talking

:54:47. > :54:51.about this penny for a purpose, a penny on the basic rate of income

:54:52. > :54:57.tax. It's a bold thing to be putting out, isn't it? Yeah, it is. You

:54:58. > :55:01.know, it's not particularly going to be attractive to a lot of voters you

:55:02. > :55:07.would have thought talking about tax rises. It's that early first firing

:55:08. > :55:13.gun, isn't it, to these powers that are coming down the track in terms

:55:14. > :55:16.of the devolved financial powers and in that sense I think it is

:55:17. > :55:21.interesting. No one's going to want to see any increase in income tax.

:55:22. > :55:25.The calculation the party is making is to raise income tax for

:55:26. > :55:32.specifically the NHS and public services, then that could be a

:55:33. > :55:37.different matter. So, that is what they were looking to capitalise on.

:55:38. > :55:41.Of course, I think it will potentially lead to some real

:55:42. > :55:45.differents in the future, the Conservatives are talking openly

:55:46. > :55:51.about this, about their plan to proprocess reductions in tax. Welsh

:55:52. > :55:53.Labour don't want to touch it, they don't want to bring in any

:55:54. > :55:57.difference between Wales and England. Plaid, if they go down this

:55:58. > :56:03.route, we are looking at a potential increase. We will have to see how

:56:04. > :56:07.that goes. Elsewhere in terms of the economic policies, the one big thing

:56:08. > :56:11.Leanne Wood talked about was focussing on this imbalance, the

:56:12. > :56:15.inequality, geographically and regionally, you could argue she is

:56:16. > :56:19.dusting down an old policy here, the kick Cardiff routine which the party

:56:20. > :56:22.are at strains to say is not the case, they just want a greater

:56:23. > :56:27.regional spread in terms of economic development, to be fair to them, I

:56:28. > :56:30.think it will a policy that will go down well on the doorstep and over

:56:31. > :56:35.the weeks that's what they need, particularly when it comes to local

:56:36. > :56:40.council elections. Finally, quickly on Brexit. Leanne Wood's political

:56:41. > :56:44.friend is Nicola Sturgeon, they're singing from the same hymn sheet in

:56:45. > :56:48.terms of membership of the single market but the two things Leanne

:56:49. > :56:54.Wood doesn't have that Nicola Sturgeon has is that Wales voted to

:56:55. > :56:59.leave and she doesn't have this threat up her sleeve of an

:57:00. > :57:06.independence referendum, how weak a hand does Leanne Wood have? Well,

:57:07. > :57:11.that's the point, isn't it? At the same time, though, I think what you

:57:12. > :57:15.have a sense of today and yesterday is that because the party is wedded

:57:16. > :57:19.to the remain side of things and it is worth pointing out that really it

:57:20. > :57:26.was the Highpoint in terms of Leanne Wood's speech was the applause when

:57:27. > :57:30.she talked about immigration and the Brexit-related matters, quite

:57:31. > :57:34.clearly that is what everyone has got worked up about. The party

:57:35. > :57:39.cannot change its tune. It is too far on one side and I think the

:57:40. > :57:42.calculation again is that it will represent the numbers of people who

:57:43. > :57:46.voted to remain, even though the majority voted to leave in Wales.

:57:47. > :57:50.Thank you very much indeed. The final word to Vaughan before we

:57:51. > :57:55.leave. How much of a factor do you think

:57:56. > :57:58.Brexit will be in the local elections, we heard Leanne Wood and

:57:59. > :58:02.discussed how much people are talking about dog mess according to

:58:03. > :58:05.Leanne Wood on the doorstep, do you think Brexit will be a case of

:58:06. > :58:10.revisiting the referendum vote again? No, I don't think Brexit will

:58:11. > :58:15.be a huge issue in terms of Brexit being an issue. I think what will be

:58:16. > :58:19.an issue and will affect the campaign is the disarray in the

:58:20. > :58:23.Labour Party. The disunity that was caused, well, it's begun with Corbyn

:58:24. > :58:27.but everything that's happened in the Labour Party since the

:58:28. > :58:32.referendum, the lack of clarity, you know, that's where the opening for

:58:33. > :58:36.Plaid Cymru is. It's the problems the Labour Party faces, because in

:58:37. > :58:42.urban Wales the seats Plaid Cymru can hope to win by and large are

:58:43. > :58:45.Labour seats. Not long to go now until everybody goes to the polls.

:58:46. > :58:49.Vaughan, thank you very much. Our time is up for today. Don't forget

:58:50. > :58:53.you can follow all the latest on Twitter.

:58:54. > :58:54.Next Saturday, it's the turn of the Welsh Liberal Democrats. For now,

:58:55. > :59:00.thank you for watching. Goodbye. # You can shake an apple

:59:01. > :59:13.off an apple tree # Shake-a, shake-a, sugar

:59:14. > :59:17.but you'll never shake me