:00:16. > :00:19.Welcome to you at home, to our audience here
:00:20. > :00:23.and to our panel - who, as ever, don?t know the questions.
:00:24. > :00:25.They are Conservative Secretary of State for Wales David Jones,
:00:26. > :00:27.Labour?s Shadow Health Minister, Liz Kendall,
:00:28. > :00:37.The Spectator and Daily Telegraph columnist Isabel Hardman,
:00:38. > :01:03.star of the BBC?s documentary The Call Centre.
:01:04. > :01:08.is from Helen Garner, please. Given that we have a national health
:01:09. > :01:10.service, why are patients in Wales being subjected to a second-class
:01:11. > :01:18.service compared to those in England? Is that true, David Jones?
:01:19. > :01:22.It is not as good as it is in England. This is one of the major
:01:23. > :01:25.complaint is that all Welsh politicians get. That they are
:01:26. > :01:27.paying the same rate of income tax, they are paying the
:01:28. > :01:28.politicians get. That they are paying the same rate of income same
:01:29. > :01:32.rate of national insurance contributions as everybody else, and
:01:33. > :01:36.yet, if they want to go for a hip replacement operation, to the
:01:37. > :01:40.nearest hospital in England, they have a waiting time of 26 weeks. The
:01:41. > :01:47.English patient in the bed next door has only been waiting for 18 weeks.
:01:48. > :01:51.There is really no use for it. Is there an explanation? Yes, that the
:01:52. > :02:06.Labour Party runs the National health service in Wales.
:02:07. > :02:11.The NHS in Wales is supported at a better rate than the NHS in England
:02:12. > :02:15.because of the Barnett formula. Nevertheless, we are seeing an
:02:16. > :02:20.increasing decline in the Health Service in Wales. One of the most
:02:21. > :02:23.important messages will be trying to deliver over the next 12 months is
:02:24. > :02:27.if you want to see what the Labour Party would do to the Health Service
:02:28. > :02:34.in England, just look at what is happening in Wales. I don't think
:02:35. > :02:39.you would want that. Liz Kendall? Helen, I think there are examples
:02:40. > :02:43.where people wait too long and where people have poor standard of care.
:02:44. > :02:47.That happened in Wales, Scotland, England and Northern Ireland. I
:02:48. > :02:52.think any examples of poor care, where health suffers, has got to be
:02:53. > :02:55.rigourously exposed, investigated and action taken. Is it a
:02:56. > :03:01.second-class service compared with England? I don't believe that. There
:03:02. > :03:07.will be statistics flying around but, for example, cancer survival
:03:08. > :03:11.rates, in Wales they have improved faster than any other part of the
:03:12. > :03:14.country. Your wait times for cancer treatment, you have more people
:03:15. > :03:19.being seen within two months. In fact, this year, for the first time,
:03:20. > :03:26.this week, for the first time in England, the English NHS missed a
:03:27. > :03:29.cancer target. What I think is a problem is when this issue becomes a
:03:30. > :03:33.political football. The Health Service is so important to us all,
:03:34. > :03:41.all of our families. It was important to my grandma and grandpa,
:03:42. > :03:45.they used the Health Service here. All health services need to improve.
:03:46. > :03:48.What I'm worried about is the approach the Tories are taking by
:03:49. > :03:53.trying to attack the Health Service in Wales without having a balanced
:03:54. > :03:58.approach, because it is the English NHS that is going backwards. We have
:03:59. > :04:02.have the worst A in aid decade in England. We have a delayed
:04:03. > :04:06.discharges from hospital for very elderly people going up in England,
:04:07. > :04:13.when they are coming down in Wales. So Wales is better than England? You
:04:14. > :04:17.might not believe me on a thing because I am a politician, but an
:04:18. > :04:20.independent organisation did the first-ever study into the four
:04:21. > :04:24.nations, what was happening in the Health Service, they said in on of
:04:25. > :04:32.them were massively ahead or behind. Sir Bruce Keogh, England's medical
:04:33. > :04:39.director, writing to his Welsh counterpart, saying he is worried
:04:40. > :04:42.about persistently high death rates, which warrant investigating in six
:04:43. > :04:49.Welsh hospitals. Right or wrong to say that? Those hospitals are
:04:50. > :04:57.rightly being looked into. Actually the Welsh Gutmann was the crew had
:04:58. > :05:00.refused the inquiry. If they were concerned, they would listen to Sir
:05:01. > :05:12.Bruce Keogh and instigated inquiry here. Do you think it is right for a
:05:13. > :05:18.British prime is to come and say the border is the line between life and
:05:19. > :05:28.death? I think he is highlighting the fact that the NHS in Wales is
:05:29. > :05:34.not... Waiting times... Of course, spending is high in Wales, but we
:05:35. > :05:39.have a higher demand. If you look at what the Labour government has done
:05:40. > :05:42.over the last few years, they have prioritised spending on important
:05:43. > :05:46.things like education and the economy. But spending on health has
:05:47. > :05:52.not been prioritised. That is one of the reasons why we are where we are
:05:53. > :05:56.today. One thing that disappointed me is that a Labour MP offered to
:05:57. > :05:59.give evidence to the assembly committee looking into the Health
:06:00. > :06:02.Service and they refused to listen. I can't understand why politicians
:06:03. > :06:06.would refuse to listen to evidence, especially from someone from their
:06:07. > :06:09.own party. I thought that was a disgrace.
:06:10. > :06:19.I appreciate this is maybe something that affected your family in the
:06:20. > :06:25.past. It is something that is affecting my
:06:26. > :06:28.family right now. When you are the director of the National Ambulance
:06:29. > :06:31.Service, would you think it was acceptable that, consistently,
:06:32. > :06:36.ambulance waiting times and hand over times are not being met? In
:06:37. > :06:40.some cases, people are waiting several hours in ambulances because
:06:41. > :06:42.there are not the resources in hospitals because there is not the
:06:43. > :06:49.spending in Welsh hospitals. Do you think that is acceptable? Indirect
:06:50. > :06:53.answer to that, I don't think it is acceptable that people are stuck in
:06:54. > :06:56.ambulances outside hospitals. I actually have the same problem,
:06:57. > :07:01.often with the East Midlands and billing service. I think any of
:07:02. > :07:04.those issues must be tackled head-on. -- Ambulance Service. We
:07:05. > :07:10.should not accept poor standards of care anywhere in the NHS in this
:07:11. > :07:11.country. I will speak from personal experience. The Welsh NHS is
:07:12. > :07:23.appalling. My son waited seven hours in A in
:07:24. > :07:28.Morriston with a broken arm. No care whatsoever. My mother and father
:07:29. > :07:34.have recently been in Morriston Hospital. My mother with a hip
:07:35. > :07:41.operation, she caught an infection. She wanted a nurse to lift her up,
:07:42. > :07:47.no, I haven't been trained. It's pathetic. I think we must
:07:48. > :07:52.differentiate between the people that work in the NHS, dedicated
:07:53. > :07:56.people who give the care that people need and work very long hours, and
:07:57. > :07:59.the people that run it and decide the political direction that it's
:08:00. > :08:03.going to be taking. We have to be clear we are not attacking NHS staff
:08:04. > :08:07.and the people that are delivering a fine service, in many cases.
:08:08. > :08:19.When my father was in hospital, he was nearest by foreign nurses that I
:08:20. > :08:23.could not conversed with. If we want jobs in Wales, and we need jobs in
:08:24. > :08:34.Wales, why can we not train proper Welsh people to nurse? Why do nurses
:08:35. > :08:40.have to go to university... The man here, in blue. Sunni the NHS in
:08:41. > :08:45.Wales is appalling, I completely agree. I have been at the end of
:08:46. > :08:51.what people would describe as being appalling. Ambulances were not
:08:52. > :08:55.available when I broke my leg. They sent a paramedic car and then the
:08:56. > :08:58.Welsh air ambulance, which costs money for them and then, when I get
:08:59. > :09:03.into the air, they realise they cannot go to the hospital because
:09:04. > :09:07.there are three hour waiting times being stuck outside in ambulances.
:09:08. > :09:09.You were saying about targets not being met for the first year. The
:09:10. > :09:11.Welsh NHS has being met for the first year. The
:09:12. > :09:16.Welsh NHS not met targets since 2009.
:09:17. > :09:24.You, madam? I don't think that we can generalise about the whole of
:09:25. > :09:30.the NHS. The NHS covers from accident and emergency until
:09:31. > :09:35.end-stage illness. Personally, I am retired from the NHS, five years
:09:36. > :09:42.ago. I have had to call on the services of the NHS during those
:09:43. > :09:50.five years. Two of them were, as, you would say, emergency. One was
:09:51. > :09:54.for cancer treatment, where I could not hold my treatment. I was treated
:09:55. > :10:01.within the time scales, professionally, etc. My second
:10:02. > :10:05.engagement was with an injury in my eye. I am still been treated for
:10:06. > :10:10.that, I could not fault it. Where there are pressures in the NHS are
:10:11. > :10:16.things like trauma and orthopaedic, hip replacement, knee replacement.
:10:17. > :10:22.Unfortunately, I have waited, I was put on the waiting list for a total
:10:23. > :10:29.knee replacement on the 31st of May last year. I now have a date for
:10:30. > :10:36.surgery, I go in on the 29th of this month and the 30th. You were in the
:10:37. > :10:41.NHS? I was. What do you make of what the Prime Minister said about
:10:42. > :10:50.between Wales and England, life and death? Is the NHS in England so much
:10:51. > :10:52.better? I would not say so. With the big issues they have had in England,
:10:53. > :11:05.with some of the horrors that have happened in England, I think we have
:11:06. > :11:09.a good health service in Wales. The point that you make about hip and
:11:10. > :11:18.knee replacements is absolutely bang on. Elective surgery is the biggest
:11:19. > :11:24.problem. The waiting time in Wales is 189 days, in England, about 86
:11:25. > :11:27.days. That is not right. If you are paying your national insurance
:11:28. > :11:28.contributions, your taxes, you are entitled to a conference or service,
:11:29. > :11:42.wherever you live. I do feel for Liz. She's having to
:11:43. > :11:46.defend decisions made by colleagues across the border, when she is an
:11:47. > :11:50.English Labour MP. It is very difficult when you have a party that
:11:51. > :11:54.may be taking a different direction to yours. That said, I can
:11:55. > :11:58.understand why the Tories are going after Labour on this. Next year's
:11:59. > :12:03.general election will be about the NHS. The Tories desperately want to
:12:04. > :12:07.steal the crown of the party of the NHS from Labour, after Mid-Staffs,
:12:08. > :12:12.after what is happening in Wales. But I don't think Labour's response
:12:13. > :12:15.should be as offensive as it is. Our institutions always improve when
:12:16. > :12:19.they are under Scuderia. The Royal family have a dreadful time in the
:12:20. > :12:27.1990s, came out on top after scrutiny. The NHS will come out on
:12:28. > :12:32.top after scrutiny. The areas that don't do well are often the areas
:12:33. > :12:35.that don't have scrutiny. Geriatric care in England is terrible because
:12:36. > :12:48.people do not scrutinise it. It is only that spotlight that will
:12:49. > :12:54.improve services. I agree, I don't like the NHS being used as a
:12:55. > :12:57.political football. You can't really compare Wales with England. It is a
:12:58. > :13:00.much poorer country. Look at the demographics, we have a lot more
:13:01. > :13:05.elderly people, high rates of diabetes, depression. We live in a
:13:06. > :13:08.post-industrial society. Going back to what this gentleman said, it is
:13:09. > :13:15.not just about the ambulances getting there. We need decent rail
:13:16. > :13:18.links and roads. Where I am from, I am no defender of Welsh Labour, but
:13:19. > :13:25.they are going to centralise everything to the hospital, so
:13:26. > :13:28.people from Aberystwyth, Haverfordwest, they have to travel
:13:29. > :13:36.such a long way. There is not a rail link. What are we doing about that?
:13:37. > :13:41.I am not convinced of the premise in my neighbour's question, that the
:13:42. > :13:47.Health Service in Wales is in anyway second-class. I have had the
:13:48. > :13:51.misfortune to make use of the NHS, in various parts of North Wales
:13:52. > :13:55.recently, and I can say that, on balance, the service is good. There
:13:56. > :13:59.is anecdotal evidence, people tell tales of how long they have waited,
:14:00. > :14:06.but the same sort of tales IKEA in England as well. I really do not --
:14:07. > :14:09.high here in England as well. I am really not convinced. I went to the
:14:10. > :14:12.trouble of looking at the Nuffield report, mentioned by a panel
:14:13. > :14:19.member, and there is no second-class service in Wales.
:14:20. > :14:25.I agree with what the panel said, a lot of people working in the service
:14:26. > :14:33.on the ground, nurses and doctors, they can in a difficult situation.
:14:34. > :14:37.My father had a heart attack and it took 45 minutes for an ambulance to
:14:38. > :14:41.get to him. I think that is a total disgrace. In terms of cardiac care,
:14:42. > :14:44.this week there has been information about hospitals in South Wales,
:14:45. > :14:50.where people are literally dying on waiting lists before they can get I
:14:51. > :14:56.pass surgery. -- bypass surgery. For you it is a second class service. If
:14:57. > :14:59.you have you it is a second class service. If
:15:00. > :15:06.you a kidney problem you have to go to Bristol. Cardiac patients have to
:15:07. > :15:11.go to Green Green from here. You have to travel to the care. We must
:15:12. > :15:16.leave it there. We've had quarter of an hour on that topic.
:15:17. > :15:31.You can join via text or Twitter. Last week when Joey Barton was on we
:15:32. > :15:35.had the biggest traffic ever. 150,000 Tweets during the programme.
:15:36. > :15:53.We, boy, did we trend! We move on to another question. From
:15:54. > :15:56.Stephen Clear, please. This week the European Commission
:15:57. > :16:06.criticised Britain's council taxes. Is this thaefd the EU is too big,
:16:07. > :16:08.too bossy and too interfering? Nev Wilshire?
:16:09. > :16:25.Yes. I think the vote was so strongly in
:16:26. > :16:28.favour of UKIP, for the Prime Minister to stand up and say, we
:16:29. > :16:32.need to put a strong voice into Europe, suggesting we do things in a
:16:33. > :16:37.different way, I think the vote has got to be in or out.
:16:38. > :16:43.It's as simple as that. You are not going to change Europe. Are we in or
:16:44. > :16:49.out? I believe - I can remember when Tony Blair and John Major were vying
:16:50. > :16:53.for the election and the Referendum Party that were gathering a lot of
:16:54. > :16:57.votes were put to bed because they both agreed that whoever got in was
:16:58. > :17:02.going to have a referendum. What was that? 18 years ago? Where is it?
:17:03. > :17:04.Let's have a referendum! Get on with it!
:17:05. > :17:12.APPLAUSE Do you think it is right for the
:17:13. > :17:15.European Commission to say we ought to reform taxation of land and
:17:16. > :17:20.property and other advice, or is that being bossy? I don't think they
:17:21. > :17:23.should. What Europe needs to be focussing on is creating jobs and
:17:24. > :17:28.growth. That's what people want. And one of
:17:29. > :17:33.the things I found frustrating this week and I have probably a different
:17:34. > :17:36.view, I am pro-Europe. It is really important for jobs in Wales and
:17:37. > :17:41.across the country n my constituency a lot of jobs rest on trade with
:17:42. > :17:46.Europe. I think all of the discussion we've heard this week is
:17:47. > :17:49.about who will get the commission presidency. I don't think they
:17:50. > :17:53.should be talking about jobs for the boys. They should be talking about
:17:54. > :17:57.jobs for people in this country. Unless we get that growth in Europe,
:17:58. > :18:00.it will not work for us and not work for people across that continent.
:18:01. > :18:03.So, I don't think they should be telling us anything about council
:18:04. > :18:07.tax. They should focus on what matters to people, which is getting
:18:08. > :18:10.good jobs, growing the economy, so we can properly compete in the
:18:11. > :18:14.world. APPLAUSE
:18:15. > :18:20.So when the Prime Minister says Brussels has got too big, too bossy,
:18:21. > :18:26.too interfering, for once you agree? Europe needs to change. I think it
:18:27. > :18:30.is unambitious to say that we cannot, together, with other
:18:31. > :18:35.countries, reform Europe. It is not just about our relationship with
:18:36. > :18:39.Europe. Europe... APPLAUSE
:18:40. > :18:43.Given the fact there's a thread of negativity about the EU I am not
:18:44. > :18:47.sure this is the appropriate time for the EU to be introducing things
:18:48. > :18:53.which frankly may not matter. If you put me in a ballot-box right now and
:18:54. > :19:00.I had to vote whether we stayed in or out, I would be honest with you,
:19:01. > :19:04.I do not know what to vote. I regard myself as being fairly well
:19:05. > :19:10.informed. I would not know of any independent body. If somebody from
:19:11. > :19:15.UKIP suggested I listen to what they say. I am not aware at the moment of
:19:16. > :19:18.any independent body that could give me information from that side,
:19:19. > :19:22.information from the other side and information from the mid-. So, I
:19:23. > :19:27.would not -- from the middle. I so I would not know what to vote, yes or
:19:28. > :19:32.no! This woman here. My understanding is
:19:33. > :19:37.the reason the EU wanted to interfere was because our council
:19:38. > :19:41.tax has not been, levels have not been revisited since 1991 and the
:19:42. > :19:45.value of property has changed dramatically since then. And we are
:19:46. > :19:49.paying disproportionately more council tax or lower value
:19:50. > :19:55.properties than on higher value properties. Frankly I think that is
:19:56. > :19:59.a good reason for having some kind of...
:20:00. > :20:03.That is an extremely good point. If we are talking about Governments
:20:04. > :20:07.interfering in the way council tax is run. People in this room will
:20:08. > :20:11.know that people at home in England will know that council tax in Wales
:20:12. > :20:15.was changed a few years ago. We have new bands in Wales. Everybody here
:20:16. > :20:19.was affected by it, I think. When the Government saw the effect on
:20:20. > :20:22.Wales, they decided not to do it in England. If we are talking about
:20:23. > :20:26.interfering in council tax, it has happened here already.
:20:27. > :20:34.APPLAUSE Yes, Sir.
:20:35. > :20:39.The man in the green shirt. Yes. I am 82 years and I come to this at a
:20:40. > :20:44.different angle after recent elections. I was delighted this
:20:45. > :20:48.country thrashed the far right, the British National Front. What did
:20:49. > :20:52.concern me and does concern me is the rise of the far right in Europe
:20:53. > :20:59.as a whole, with increased anti-Semitism there, we had the
:21:00. > :21:09.recent massacre in Belgium. I am concerned that we are getting an
:21:10. > :21:14.increased... It is a good reason for me why I would vote out. This
:21:15. > :21:18.country has shown, we don't want to know anything about Nazis and far
:21:19. > :21:22.right. We are receptive to be friendly to everybody. You think
:21:23. > :21:25.that rather than reform of the EU itself, which would change people's
:21:26. > :21:32.view? I don't think it would. I think the far right has got too big
:21:33. > :21:35.a hold now. Think of Le Pen and how she walked through France. I am
:21:36. > :21:39.concerned because I am young enough to know what happened in the last
:21:40. > :21:43.war. I don't want a repeat of that. We don't give up against the far
:21:44. > :21:48.right. That is the point. We work together.
:21:49. > :21:53.I think the rise of the far right makes this report which could have
:21:54. > :21:57.been comal in its timing after the results serious. It shows the
:21:58. > :22:01.European elite don't want to listen to the electorate. Only a few days
:22:02. > :22:06.after the National Front had done so well in France, across Europe,
:22:07. > :22:10.parties which were showing voters' discontent with the EU. They
:22:11. > :22:15.published a report advising Governments what to do. Some advice
:22:16. > :22:20.was sound and something which many have raised. A revaluation of
:22:21. > :22:26.council tax bands is something we debate. However, that is an issue
:22:27. > :22:30.for national Parliaments to discuss. It is not a job to tell us how to
:22:31. > :22:37.run our economy. APPLAUSE
:22:38. > :22:42.I just want to disagree with the last speaker, in the sense that not
:22:43. > :22:47.being in the European Union did not protect us in 1939 from the rise of
:22:48. > :22:51.the far right. We need tone gauge, take them on and make sure we are
:22:52. > :23:01.working with people in Europe and across the world.
:23:02. > :23:08.Liz said they talk about jobs for the boys rather thanes for
:23:09. > :23:11.everybody. The important -- rather than jobs for everybody. The
:23:12. > :23:15.important thing is the person who wants to take the job will cause
:23:16. > :23:21.more problems for this country because he is such a Europhile.
:23:22. > :23:27.If politicians are not listening to what happened two weeks ago with the
:23:28. > :23:31.strong vote for populist parties across Europe, they do need to think
:23:32. > :23:36.where they are coming from. The fact is that the European
:23:37. > :23:41.Commission, making pronouncements about issues such as council tax,
:23:42. > :23:45.only a few days after the people of Europe had shown they did not want
:23:46. > :23:50.micromanagement of their economies, that they wanted the EU to do the
:23:51. > :23:55.things that the EU was there for. Which is thicks which are -- things
:23:56. > :23:59.which are done better at a super national level. We need to
:24:00. > :24:05.renegotiate our position with Europe. Europe has become too
:24:06. > :24:09.medalsome it is too far top-down. It is far too dictatorial. There are
:24:10. > :24:13.things at a national level that are better done at a national level.
:24:14. > :24:17.That is why we need to have that renegotiation and at the end of that
:24:18. > :24:21.period, to lance the boil, because there is certainly a desire in this
:24:22. > :24:25.country that there should be a referendum on whether or not we
:24:26. > :24:28.remain part of the EU. Then we must hold that referendum so, that the
:24:29. > :24:35.people of this country can have a say on their future in Europe. A
:24:36. > :24:41.couple of things... Michael Gove said if there was no renegotiation,
:24:42. > :24:50.if he was asked now if he would stay or go, he would leave. Would you?
:24:51. > :24:56.The question doesn't arise. I am not going to be tempted down
:24:57. > :25:02.that route. I actually believe there are tremendous benefits to being in
:25:03. > :25:14.Europe - Princefully free trade. That I see no reason why the EU
:25:15. > :25:19.should tell me about the shape of a banana. That is not what it is there
:25:20. > :25:23.for. We need to get the best deal in that negotiation and put it to the
:25:24. > :25:26.people of Europe. Who would you like to see as President of the
:25:27. > :25:32.commission? It is clear David Cameron and your party don't want...
:25:33. > :25:37.Who would you like to see? I would like to see someone. A woman!
:25:38. > :25:40.I would like to see someone who recognises that the sentiment in
:25:41. > :25:46.Europe is changing. I would like to see somebody... A
:25:47. > :25:50.name please. Tony Blair? Well Tony Blair of course is at
:25:51. > :25:55.great pains to deny he wants the job, so probably does. Of Why don't
:25:56. > :26:00.you suggest a woman? I actually think that we need
:26:01. > :26:08.something who is a -- somebody who is a 21st century politician.
:26:09. > :26:16.Christine Lagarde. She is a very capable woman. It is a European
:26:17. > :26:23.super state. We have four levels of Government. We used to have two.
:26:24. > :26:29.You, Sir and then any other women? You, Sir? Unless I am missing
:26:30. > :26:34.something I don't understand this UKIP. They have more now MEPs than
:26:35. > :26:45.ever before. They want out of Europe. Is that like turkeys voting
:26:46. > :26:50.for Christmas? And you Sir? What I don't understand
:26:51. > :26:55.about pro-European people, why can't we trade with Europe? We will not
:26:56. > :27:00.get the same deal if we are on the outside. I am sorry...
:27:01. > :27:05.As far as I am concerned we are being told by Europe what to do. We
:27:06. > :27:12.should be, I am quite proud living on an island 22 miles from one coast
:27:13. > :27:16.to the other. Why can't we trade with each country individually?
:27:17. > :27:21.Because we'll get penalties. We will not get the same deal and we will
:27:22. > :27:26.not want to have companies investing in this Europe because they see we
:27:27. > :27:30.are a gateway to a wider Europe. APPLAUSE
:27:31. > :27:35.Am I right in saying... We would not get the same deal on regional policy
:27:36. > :27:39.as well. People here know how much money goes... This is the Plaid
:27:40. > :27:44.Cymru mantra, that overlooks the fact we are net contributors to
:27:45. > :27:49.Europe. All we do is get our own money back.
:27:50. > :27:57.Wales is a beneficialry from Europe and we should not forget that. ?55
:27:58. > :28:02.million is what we pay Europe every day. That comes from the taxpayers.
:28:03. > :28:10.Now another question. I am so many here. I think I will try this one
:28:11. > :28:16.from Chandra Dodgson, please. Given the allegations of corruption
:28:17. > :28:22.in relation to the 2022 bid should Qatar be allowed to host the
:28:23. > :28:28.competition? Isabel Hardman? I am not a massive
:28:29. > :28:32.of football fan. I am more of a cricket girl. I think this is
:28:33. > :28:41.another example of an international Governing body which is hugely
:28:42. > :28:45.unaccountable. What are our options? The only option is to pull out of
:28:46. > :28:50.the World Cup. I don't think we would want to do that on our own.
:28:51. > :28:53.Why? I don't think we have enough might to bring the competition
:28:54. > :28:58.falling down around us. We would have to act with other countries: If
:28:59. > :29:01.we were able to do and that find others who wanted to do that,
:29:02. > :29:08.perhaps that would rock FIFA enough to realise it is accountable. This
:29:09. > :29:10.is going back to ins tugsss which think -- institutions which think
:29:11. > :29:30.they cannot being scrutinised. looking forward to the World Cup.
:29:31. > :29:37.It's no surprise, is it? Qatar getting the World Cup, and we find
:29:38. > :29:44.that it is corrupt. At the time, when it was offered, a lot of people
:29:45. > :29:54.said it was corrupt. Sepp Blatter and Michel Platini called us
:29:55. > :29:58.whingeing poms, basically. So it's no surprise it was corrupt. I would
:29:59. > :30:02.forward the suggestion that the Russian World Cup would have gone
:30:03. > :30:09.the same way. When is that? The one before? What do you think, wearing a
:30:10. > :30:12.football shirt? Personally, I think that FIFA must be absolutely loving
:30:13. > :30:19.this. It's going to Russia, take country that is anti-gay, racist and
:30:20. > :30:23.we are completely ignoring that and looking eight years in the future.
:30:24. > :30:27.This season, is anything Petersburg signed a black, non-Russian player.
:30:28. > :30:33.All of their fans rioted outside the stadium because that happened. You
:30:34. > :30:37.cannot walk down the street and kiss somebody of the same sex as you, you
:30:38. > :30:42.can get arrested. A World Cup has been given there? I think FIFA as
:30:43. > :30:44.belonging that we are ignoring up and talking eight years in the
:30:45. > :30:59.future. That is a massive mistake, to give it to a country like that.
:31:00. > :31:04.I was thinking if we were part of some broader European Union, we
:31:05. > :31:18.might have some cloud in pulling out. I'm not a huge football fan...
:31:19. > :31:21.You don't have to say that, it's an issue of principle and bribery,
:31:22. > :31:26.corruption. Looking from the outside, it seems that the process
:31:27. > :31:30.that decided on Qatar stank to high heaven, as far as I could see. I'm
:31:31. > :31:34.not aware what happened behind closed doors at FIFA. It seems to me
:31:35. > :31:43.to be an organisation which is ripe for reform. Certainly, my only take
:31:44. > :31:52.on it, to the front, as a Welsh Nationalist, is that I wish that
:31:53. > :31:56.Wales had got into the World Cup. I think if those allegations are true,
:31:57. > :32:06.it should definitely be completely rerun. I think it stinks. Money can
:32:07. > :32:13.buy anything. It has just become overwhelmed with money, this sport.
:32:14. > :32:17.I am an MP in Leicester, our fans love the game. To feel it can be
:32:18. > :32:26.bought and sold, just like that, it seems awful. I think it is even
:32:27. > :32:28.worse than that. Jim Murphy, our Shadow International Development
:32:29. > :32:35.Secretary, he went to Qatar to see what was happening with the building
:32:36. > :32:39.work. He found appalling conditions. This is happening with no
:32:40. > :32:43.oversight, no control. What is FIFA erring about those people, and those
:32:44. > :32:50.appalling conditions? This is a disgrace. What are our countries,
:32:51. > :32:54.our clubs, doing? We got to sort this out. People are passionate.
:32:55. > :33:03.People care more than they care about politics and politicians. They
:33:04. > :33:08.feel passionately about football. We've got to make it work. I totally
:33:09. > :33:13.agree with you. If corruption is found, it's got to go for a revote.
:33:14. > :33:19.It's not just the FIFA setup the league of Wales matches have been
:33:20. > :33:22.fixed, allegedly. There is a spot fixing in cricket. It is going
:33:23. > :33:26.across sport. It's because there is so much money. That is the bottom
:33:27. > :33:32.line, there is so much money invested. You, sir? As with the
:33:33. > :33:36.European issue before, I don't think we should dismiss our negotiating
:33:37. > :33:42.position. The Premier League is widely admired. The biggest sport,
:33:43. > :33:45.followed all around the world. As with our European position, we can
:33:46. > :33:49.negotiate and take a leadership point of view. We have to wait for
:33:50. > :33:56.the legal decisions. But, you know what, FIFA is rotten to the core and
:33:57. > :34:01.it's got it coming. Do you agree, FIFA rotten to the core? I think it
:34:02. > :34:05.is an organisation in urgent need of reform. The fact is, it is
:34:06. > :34:09.unaccountable. I understand there is a New York lawyer called John
:34:10. > :34:16.Garcia, carrying out an inquiry into FIFA. Anybody who saw the
:34:17. > :34:21.allegations in the Sunday Times would be saying, extend your inquiry
:34:22. > :34:26.into what happened in Qatar. It was always very, very surprising that a
:34:27. > :34:32.country which has got temperatures in the summer of 40 degrees gets a
:34:33. > :34:38.summer competition. Frankly, suggestions you can air conditioned
:34:39. > :34:41.football stadiums, ludicrous! FIFA is an organisation that appears, to
:34:42. > :34:57.me, to become Pisi unaccountable. I hope that the glare of publicity
:34:58. > :35:04.they have will lead to an investigation. One brief thing? Are
:35:05. > :35:16.we strong enough to stand up to all this corruption? Match fixing,
:35:17. > :35:21.European whatnot... Aren't Britain's strong enough? You're talking about
:35:22. > :35:26.free trade, we can't deal with anybody. We are the best, or used to
:35:27. > :35:33.be. Someone fight for us! Someone fight for us. What we wanted someone
:35:34. > :35:41.to fight for us? A government strong enough. Stephen Jones. When
:35:42. > :35:45.considering the Welsh Assembly's poor track record, is it wise they
:35:46. > :35:49.may be offered further powers by Westminster? This goes to the very
:35:50. > :35:57.heart of devolution. Scotland is being offered, if they vote no, huge
:35:58. > :36:00.extra powers. This question is if the poor track record of the Welsh
:36:01. > :36:06.Assembly means it is wise to offer future powers. We have the Wales
:36:07. > :36:10.Bill going through Parliament at the moment. It will be giving the Welsh
:36:11. > :36:12.Assembly the power to hold a referendum on whether or not they
:36:13. > :36:17.should have income tax raising powers. I think that is a good
:36:18. > :36:20.thing. I think it's a good thing for several reasons. First, it will
:36:21. > :36:26.bring accountability into the Welsh Assembly for the first time. So far,
:36:27. > :36:29.the assembly government has just been the recipient of money from
:36:30. > :36:32.Westminster, which means it is in the wonderful position of
:36:33. > :36:36.complaining about not getting enough money from Westminster and, at the
:36:37. > :36:40.same time, not being accountable for the way the money is raised. For the
:36:41. > :36:44.first time, the party standing in assembly elections will have to say
:36:45. > :36:50.what they will do with the money that they raised directly from the
:36:51. > :36:53.taxpayers. I think that is a sign of maturity in government. I actually
:36:54. > :36:59.believe, also, it would be good for Wales. If they are wise, they will
:37:00. > :37:06.call that referendum on the basis that they will reduce the basic rate
:37:07. > :37:09.of tax. I think that, again, would show maturity on the part of the
:37:10. > :37:15.Welsh Assembly. It would show that they were willing to take a punt at
:37:16. > :37:20.making Wales a more competitive place. One of the big problems it
:37:21. > :37:28.has had is that is not being competitive. That would give Wales a
:37:29. > :37:31.little competitive edge. Stephen Jones's question started considering
:37:32. > :37:37.the Welsh Assembly's poor track record? I don't agree it has had a
:37:38. > :37:41.poor track record. Like any government you could do better. One
:37:42. > :37:50.thing I am jealous of, that I would like in my constituency, Jobs Growth
:37:51. > :37:54.Wales, it has been phenomenal and getting young people back to work.
:37:55. > :37:58.80% of young people in private-sector jobs have gone on to
:37:59. > :38:02.a proper job, and higher levels for graduates. We desperately need, I
:38:03. > :38:05.desperately want something in England and I want it in my
:38:06. > :38:13.constituency. So I don't agree it has got a poor track record. I have
:38:14. > :38:17.always believed in, you know, giving power back as close to people as
:38:18. > :38:20.possible. I think Labour is the party of devolution. We have
:38:21. > :38:24.delivered it, we want to go further. I think it needs to go down further
:38:25. > :38:32.as well, not just down to the different nation states, in England
:38:33. > :38:35.to city regions, but right down to communities. Do you think they
:38:36. > :38:40.should have tax-raising powers as well? We said there should be tax
:38:41. > :38:47.varying powers. You didn't initially, you didn't want
:38:48. > :38:53.devolution. We've been very clear. You been far from clear! We said
:38:54. > :38:56.that they should be subject to a referendum on tax varying powers. I
:38:57. > :39:01.don't want to see a race to the bottom, different countries
:39:02. > :39:05.undercutting each other. I believe that devolution and further
:39:06. > :39:08.devolution gives the best of both worlds. Do you agree with what the
:39:09. > :39:24.Conservative government is offering to Wales? No. You seem a bit
:39:25. > :39:33.doubtful. It was kind of nnn...yes. Ultimately, I think we are stronger
:39:34. > :39:34.together. Our policy has been that by the strength of our
:39:35. > :39:37.together. Our policy has been that by the common endeavour we achieve
:39:38. > :39:41.more together than alone. That is what I think a strong Welsh
:39:42. > :39:47.Assembly, backed up by security and strength, has been giving to the
:39:48. > :39:53.United Kingdom. With Labour's record with health and education in Wales,
:39:54. > :39:57.and the Coalition Government's record on the economy in England,
:39:58. > :40:04.should Labour be trusted with any money whatsoever? I would have grave
:40:05. > :40:12.concerns about the Welsh Assembly having tax-raising powers. Grave
:40:13. > :40:15.concerns. Maybe it is a lack of confidence in the ability of the
:40:16. > :40:19.people that are running it. I don't believe that we have first-rate
:40:20. > :40:27.politicians running the Welsh Assembly. If I was running for
:40:28. > :40:30.politics, I would want to be in Whitehall, not the Welsh Assembly. I
:40:31. > :40:36.think most of the better MPs would be there. We now have four levels of
:40:37. > :40:40.government. It's a fact, when I was growing up, you had Whitehall, you
:40:41. > :40:45.had local councils. Now we have the Welsh Assembly and we have Europe.
:40:46. > :40:53.It's no coincidence that our levels of taxation have gone up, up and up.
:40:54. > :40:57.More waste. It is more waste, thank you for that. I believe United we
:40:58. > :41:00.stand, divided we fall. It does concern me that Scotland looked like
:41:01. > :41:03.they are heading for independence. I think the Commonwealth games being
:41:04. > :41:08.held in Scotland, the Ryder Cup being held in Scotland, the 200th
:41:09. > :41:11.anniversary of Bannockburn, they will play Braveheart on the
:41:12. > :41:21.television the night before the vote and I think it is doomed.
:41:22. > :41:27.I do find it slightly strange that Welsh Labour boast about the number
:41:28. > :41:30.of jobs they have created for young people. Actually, a lot of those
:41:31. > :41:34.jobs have gone to young people who could have got a better job
:41:35. > :41:40.straightaway if they had better education. If you look at Welsh
:41:41. > :41:44.education, Wales and England have the same potential, yet they have
:41:45. > :41:49.vastly different public services. The amount of education that Nev has
:41:50. > :41:53.to give some of his employees just to get them to work, it is shopping
:41:54. > :41:56.they don't arrive at his call centre with better education from the
:41:57. > :42:01.schools they are given. I think it is a public tragedy. -- shocking.
:42:02. > :42:06.Again, that is an ardent for accountability. If the Welsh
:42:07. > :42:09.government are having to raise taxes, directly from the people of
:42:10. > :42:13.Wales, they are going to be answerable to the people of Wales
:42:14. > :42:17.for the money is spent. If they are policing poor education results,
:42:18. > :42:22.which they are, and declining education results, they will have to
:42:23. > :42:31.explain themselves. The woman up there, at the back. Wales is seen as
:42:32. > :42:36.the poor man in the UK. How, by raising taxes, if Wales has ability
:42:37. > :42:44.to raise taxes in Wales, how are we going to lose that stigma of being
:42:45. > :42:49.the poor man in the UK? You, sir. I am a GP, at the chalk face of the
:42:50. > :42:54.Health Service in North Wales. People at the Health Service are
:42:55. > :42:59.working extremely hard. I dread to have more devolution to Wales as it
:43:00. > :43:12.stands. You already have full power, autonomous control of the health
:43:13. > :43:22.economy. You spent 15 minutes slagging each other off. You want to
:43:23. > :43:27.increase taxes to Wales. We have a major recruitment programme. We are
:43:28. > :43:31.nearly in crisis bringing GPs to Wales. How are we going to bring
:43:32. > :43:37.them if we are paying more tax? Nobody is proposing more tax. Lets
:43:38. > :43:46.get real, we are not going to get lower taxes in Wales. The proposal
:43:47. > :43:49.in the Wales Bill is that the assembly takes responsible as he
:43:50. > :43:55.fought taxes, which are now going to London. It is not more tax, it is
:43:56. > :44:01.who takes the tax. Out of that, the Welsh Assembly will then be able to
:44:02. > :44:07.borrow some money and be able to improve the M4, the M5. You may
:44:08. > :44:14.borrow the tax, but you have to pay it back. You will increase tax if
:44:15. > :44:22.you get those powers. I think Labour are a bit iffy about this. Of
:44:23. > :44:26.course, Labour will then be the government that has to take
:44:27. > :44:29.responsibility for raising this tax and spending it, and for accounting
:44:30. > :44:34.to you and the other people in Wales as to what they have done with it. I
:44:35. > :44:38.think Labour feel quite comfortable with the situation they are in at
:44:39. > :44:46.the moment, where they get large lumps of money from London and don't
:44:47. > :44:50.have to account for it. One of the reasons that local Government in
:44:51. > :44:53.England has been stocked with some less than impressive councillors,
:44:54. > :44:59.not across the board, obviously, but in the same way you feel some of
:45:00. > :45:04.your Assembly representatives are unimpressive s so much power was
:45:05. > :45:07.taken away from them. By giving local representatives an opportunity
:45:08. > :45:11.to choose what decisions are made in their area, that is how you
:45:12. > :45:18.encourage people into Government. They will have a sense of power and
:45:19. > :45:21.not just about bins. Having witnessed the Welsh Assembly's
:45:22. > :45:26.ability to waste money, I think if they are given more, if they are
:45:27. > :45:31.given any tax-raising powers, all it will do is cost every person in
:45:32. > :45:33.Wales a lot more money. APPLAUSE
:45:34. > :45:38.We leave it there. A question now from Rob Maximus, please.
:45:39. > :45:48.Hello, everyone. Nice name. I like it too!
:45:49. > :45:53.Get on with it! ? Is it right to exchange prisoners with the Taliban
:45:54. > :45:59.or any terrorist group? Of course the American President has
:46:00. > :46:02.exchanged a Sergeant for five Taliban members.
:46:03. > :46:07.Isabel Hardman? Well, I think the mantra that you
:46:08. > :46:12.don't leave a soldier behind is clearly very important in this
:46:13. > :46:16.situation. I think also the problem is that there's a huge fear about
:46:17. > :46:20.who's being sent back as part of this exchange.
:46:21. > :46:24.And also about the circumstances in which this soldier who is being
:46:25. > :46:29.brought back actually disappeared. There are allegations he deserted.
:46:30. > :46:33.Do you mean he could have been left there? Not at all. The point
:46:34. > :46:37.President Obama made was you don't leave a soldier behind even if he
:46:38. > :46:42.has deserted. The point about whether his return should be
:46:43. > :46:45.celebrated in his home State. He is still someone's son who should come
:46:46. > :46:49.home. What do you think about the rightness of exchanging? I think it
:46:50. > :46:52.is a hugely difficult choice, but then choices in foreign policy
:46:53. > :46:57.always are very difficult. There's no, I don't want to say there's no
:46:58. > :47:01.purity in foreign policy, but you cannot make these simple purist
:47:02. > :47:04.decisions that you have to be able to negotiate with different groups.
:47:05. > :47:09.Were the Republicans right to say he had broken an agreement, that the
:47:10. > :47:13.White House would consult Congress before doing deals like this? I'll
:47:14. > :47:16.be honest, I don't know enough about the situation. I will not pass
:47:17. > :47:25.judgment. I'll have some humility here and say I don't know enough.
:47:26. > :47:28.OK, Liz Kendall? I think overall, there are rightful concerns about
:47:29. > :47:33.doing deals with terrorists because you don't know who you will be
:47:34. > :47:38.letting free. I know that if I was in the soldier's family though, I
:47:39. > :47:42.would be thanking the Lord and thanking President Obama that my
:47:43. > :47:46.son, my husband, my brother, was coming home. I don't know the
:47:47. > :47:52.background of who the people were who were returned, who danger r
:47:53. > :47:57.threat they posed. We -- danger or threat they posed. On issues like
:47:58. > :48:02.that, the security of your country and not putting your countrymen at
:48:03. > :48:06.risk by terrorists would be the overwhelmling thing. I think
:48:07. > :48:10.anything to get our boys and girls home. We would have had a lot of
:48:11. > :48:15.intelligence from these people. We will put them back. Put them under
:48:16. > :48:19.surveillance. Technology these days. We can see where they are going. Get
:48:20. > :48:22.our boys and girls back while we can.
:48:23. > :48:26.OK and you, Sir. I think that ultimately we'll have
:48:27. > :48:31.to discuss issues with the Taliban, anyway. They will not go away. They
:48:32. > :48:35.are going to, the Americans, as far as I understand, are already talking
:48:36. > :48:42.to the Taliban. They have opened an embassy in Qatar. So, you can't just
:48:43. > :48:47.make a decision like that and separate it out.
:48:48. > :48:52.Every conflict is going to be resolved in discussion and dialogue,
:48:53. > :48:57.otherwise you carry on killing each other. It is a difficult moral
:48:58. > :49:02.issue. Liz says if it was my son, then I would certainly be concerned
:49:03. > :49:05.to get him back. The problem is when you start to negotiate with
:49:06. > :49:10.terrorists, frequently the result can be that you encourage further
:49:11. > :49:14.terrorism. If the terrorist group know they can swam swap some of
:49:15. > :49:19.their own members for an American or British soldier, that will encourage
:49:20. > :49:22.them to kidnap another British or American soldier. So, it is an
:49:23. > :49:27.extremely difficult, moral, decision. My own feeling is it
:49:28. > :49:35.extremely dangerous to negotiate with terrorists. I would start the
:49:36. > :49:36.whole consideration with, whose other life
:49:37. > :49:43.whole consideration with, whose other am I imperilling as a re--
:49:44. > :49:47.imperilling as a result of that. The White House had broke an pledge and
:49:48. > :49:49.shouldn't have done it? I think the White House should certainly have
:49:50. > :49:55.further discussions. It is a hard decision. One
:49:56. > :50:02.understands from, at a human level why one wants that prisoner
:50:03. > :50:11.released. Maybe you should think again.
:50:12. > :50:15.Hywel. Robin Cook said he wanted a moral fld policy. I think that was
:50:16. > :50:20.attractive at the time. Rather unrealistic. That is how it proved
:50:21. > :50:24.to be. The reality is that Government talks the other side the
:50:25. > :50:27.other time. The Thatcher Government when they were swearing they were
:50:28. > :50:33.not talking to the IRA of course were talking to them through back
:50:34. > :50:37.channels. That is the reality of relations like that. I think in that
:50:38. > :50:42.situation we must make sure that our hands are as clean as possible and I
:50:43. > :50:46.am afraid that our intervention in Iraq and Afghanistan means that we
:50:47. > :50:57.don't have very clean hands. APPLAUSE
:50:58. > :51:01.I agree if it was my son I would want him home under any
:51:02. > :51:06.circumstances. As a businessman, 5-1 is not a very good deal. I think it
:51:07. > :51:11.is also worth remembering, maybe because I am old I remember these
:51:12. > :51:17.things, but the first bill that President Obama passed when he first
:51:18. > :51:21.got in was, he released lots of prisoners from Guantanamo Bay.
:51:22. > :51:29.And there was nobody coming back this way.
:51:30. > :51:33.Or America's way. He must like releasing prisoners. I don't
:51:34. > :51:40.understand everything, but that one baffled me.
:51:41. > :51:47.Say again. You say 5-1 for a soldier. Israel paid 1,000-1 for one
:51:48. > :51:51.of theirs. They have the same attitude, we must
:51:52. > :51:56.get our boys back. It is a very difficult answer. Your wider point,
:51:57. > :52:00.that in the end it is always a political settlement that solves
:52:01. > :52:03.these problems. It is never ultimately a military, it is a
:52:04. > :52:10.political settlement that is required, is absolutely spot-on.
:52:11. > :52:17.Alan Morgan, please. Should it be the telephone provider
:52:18. > :52:23.that blocks unwanted calls from sales organisations?
:52:24. > :52:29.This strikes home here! I will not come to you first. We will point out
:52:30. > :52:33.that yours is the business that makes cold calls to people and they
:52:34. > :52:38.have to go to their telephone and it is not somebody they want to speak
:52:39. > :52:43.to. It is a recorded message from somebody or somebody they have never
:52:44. > :52:48.heard of. David Jones, the do you think it would be good if it could
:52:49. > :52:54.be banned and telephone providers could block these type of calls? I
:52:55. > :52:57.have spent a bit of time this week telephone canvassing for a
:52:58. > :53:01.by-election. I can say I know how Nev feels. Everybody is delighted to
:53:02. > :53:06.get the telephone call. I think people can make their own decisions
:53:07. > :53:10.if they wish to do so, then they can sign up to the Telephone Preference
:53:11. > :53:15.Service. I know a lot of people actually like
:53:16. > :53:22.having cold calls, believe it or not. Nev told me earlier on how
:53:23. > :53:28.delighted they are. He would say, that wouldn't he!
:53:29. > :53:33.What do you think? I obviously have a vested interest in this one.
:53:34. > :53:42.Perhaps you don't want to answer it. It was quite a shock to find out
:53:43. > :53:46.from David earlier on that, with the by-election how much telly
:53:47. > :53:49.canvassing they do, when there are certain politicians trying to nobble
:53:50. > :53:54.our industry totally. That was, I thought a little bit hypercritical.
:53:55. > :53:59.But the industry employs over one million people. What do you want to
:54:00. > :54:03.do? Do you want to put them out of work? Do you want to export more
:54:04. > :54:12.jobs. Our factories have gone. Do you want to export these as well?
:54:13. > :54:22.APPLAUSE Were you fined once for call cold
:54:23. > :54:28.gssing? Yes -- call colding? Yes. Are you in favour of being called?
:54:29. > :54:33.Personally I hate being cold called. I agree with David Jones, I have a
:54:34. > :54:38.brain. I can tell people I am not interested. The problem I have is
:54:39. > :54:46.the cleverness of the electronics of these companies, that I have had, I
:54:47. > :54:49.don't know, 60/70 texts, phone calls and e-mails about a loan I have
:54:50. > :54:52.applied for, that I have never applied for. I have to go through
:54:53. > :54:59.and the number changes every time, so that every single timevy to reply
:55:00. > :55:06.to the text -- time, I have to reply to the text to say, "Stop." It is
:55:07. > :55:11.fine if I talk to one company and say, no thanks. But the fact it is
:55:12. > :55:17.60-70 different numbers coming through, I have to keep blocking
:55:18. > :55:23.them. It is the pizza leaflets through my door... This is not a
:55:24. > :55:29.question about pizza leaflets. I wonder what the hit rate is. I am
:55:30. > :55:35.amazed you manage to make a profit for this. It is not so bad. I have
:55:36. > :55:40.never bought a pizza from one of those leaflets. This is telephone
:55:41. > :55:49.calls! Nev Wilshire, what do you think? --
:55:50. > :55:54.Hywel Williams, what do you think? When they phone me up and say about
:55:55. > :55:59.some windows, I say, put them in. What about a kitchen. We like toast
:56:00. > :56:04.in our house. Life insurance, insured up to my ears. The calls
:56:05. > :56:09.tail off because they know I am not a good mark. Actually, I have got
:56:10. > :56:13.nothing against people trying to go out and sell, make money, run their
:56:14. > :56:19.businesses, a lot of our economy is built on the back of good sales
:56:20. > :56:24.people. I get annoyed. I would never of course shout and swear and leave
:56:25. > :56:29.a message or anything like. That I am more irritated by US e-mail spam.
:56:30. > :56:33.I can not bear that. They are of try... Does your telephone ring in
:56:34. > :56:39.the house just as you are getting a cup of coffee and the dog is in the
:56:40. > :56:43.way and you have not shaved yet... No, you probably don't shave every
:56:44. > :56:49.morning, like I do! You are in the middle of do other
:56:50. > :56:54.things. -- doing other things. The only
:56:55. > :56:59.people who have my land line is my mum and my friend, Sam. They know
:57:00. > :57:05.not to ring unless it is on a Sunday. If I don't know who it is on
:57:06. > :57:09.my phone, I don't pick it up. Yes, you have spoken already. I want
:57:10. > :57:14.to go to somebody who has not spoken. Yes, the woman over there on
:57:15. > :57:18.the right. Isn't it true the TPS only works in the UK. It does not
:57:19. > :57:24.screen out calls from other countries. You can ask this one and
:57:25. > :57:28.then we can stop. To be honest, I don't know.
:57:29. > :57:32.If the Government made it illegal for us to cold call in this country
:57:33. > :57:37.then it would not be illegal from me to call you from South Africa or
:57:38. > :57:39.inds ya. We have to -- India. We have to stop.
:57:40. > :57:42.inds ya. We have to -- India. We have We'll be in King's Lynn next
:57:43. > :57:46.week. We have Iain Duncan Smith for the Tories. We have Ian Hislop for
:57:47. > :57:53.Private Eye. And the week after that, we are giving Away, by public
:57:54. > :57:58.demand for a football match, between Japan and Greece.
:57:59. > :58:03.Unmissable. But we are back the week after that,
:58:04. > :58:10.in Wolverhampton. So, if you would like to take part in either
:58:11. > :58:16.programme, apply on our website, the site is on the screen there or call
:58:17. > :58:21.us: We will cold call you back and see
:58:22. > :58:25.if you can come. If you are listening on 5 Live there is more on
:58:26. > :58:30.Question Time Extra Time. My thanks to our panel. To all of you who came
:58:31. > :58:32.here tonight to take part in this programme. Until next Thursday, from
:58:33. > :58:39.all of us, good night.