:00:14. > :00:22.What happens now? It has revealed a deeply divided country and has the
:00:23. > :00:30.main political parties falling apart. What is the way forward?
:00:31. > :00:36.We are in Birmingham this evening, a city that was almost evenly divided
:00:37. > :00:41.between Leave and Remain. The audience reflects the split. A panel
:00:42. > :00:48.haven't seen any questions in advance. We have the Conservative
:00:49. > :00:54.justice minister, Dominic Raab. The deputy leader of Ukip, Paul Nuttall
:00:55. > :01:00.and the parish priest and Guardian columnist, Giles Fraser. On the side
:01:01. > :01:10.of Remain, the conservative Business Minister, Anna Soubry. The SNP Alex
:01:11. > :01:11.Salmond. And Labour's Shadow International Development Secretary,
:01:12. > :01:22.Diane Abbott. APPLAUSE
:01:23. > :01:36.If you want to use Facebook or Twitter to comment, you can do that
:01:37. > :01:42.on our hash tag: Let's get the first question. It comes from Chris
:01:43. > :01:46.Abbott, please. Project fear has failed, the peasants have revolted.
:01:47. > :01:51.After decades of ignoring the working class, how does it feel to
:01:52. > :02:02.be punched in the knows? APPLAUSE
:02:03. > :02:10.Anna Soubry, how does it feel? That is the sort of language we have got
:02:11. > :02:16.to get away from and move forward. We have got to come together. I can
:02:17. > :02:20.assure you my roots, somebody who was bought up in North
:02:21. > :02:26.Nottinghamshire, and I like to think I keep in touch, not only with my
:02:27. > :02:32.constituents, but where I came from. I think this debate and this
:02:33. > :02:35.referendum has not been our country's greatest hour. I have to
:02:36. > :02:41.say, I have witnessed, witnessed language on the street, which is
:02:42. > :02:46.where I have been in the East Midlands, which is where I am from.
:02:47. > :02:50.I have heard words used and language used, immigrants, get all these
:02:51. > :02:57.immigrants out. I have not witnessed that since I was a student in
:02:58. > :03:04.Birmingham back in the mid-70s. I am worried about the state of our
:03:05. > :03:11.nation. I think what has happened is the tolerance we are rightly proud
:03:12. > :03:16.to have as part and parcel of our fundamental values, to a large part
:03:17. > :03:21.has been put aside by too many people. We need to rebuild
:03:22. > :03:28.communities and we need to move on. And we need to put, if I may say,
:03:29. > :03:33.hope over hatred and stop preying on prejudice and fuelling fears. We are
:03:34. > :03:40.where we are. Now we have got to come together and get on with it.
:03:41. > :03:45.Decades of ignoring the working-class, there was a clear
:03:46. > :03:48.division in the results of this referendum. The more prosperous and
:03:49. > :03:52.London, Scotland, you know, Scotland. On the other hand, there
:03:53. > :03:57.were people who seemed to feel, according to everything they said,
:03:58. > :04:00.disaffected, left out in the countryside and the poorest cities.
:04:01. > :04:04.A lot of people who voted leader-macro came from all classes
:04:05. > :04:07.in our society and background. Many people who voted Leave, voted for
:04:08. > :04:14.reasons, although I don't agree with them, were completely honourable.
:04:15. > :04:21.People also voted Leave for things I am deeply troubled by, that was the
:04:22. > :04:27.immigration thing and it was wrong. What has been exposed by this
:04:28. > :04:31.referendum is deep divisions within the country and Labour strongholds
:04:32. > :04:36.like Walsall, my hometown, have voted to leave. All over the
:04:37. > :04:42.country, they have chosen the same idea to leave. In the past, that
:04:43. > :04:50.would never have happened. There is massive disconnect from the parties
:04:51. > :04:57.and their electorate to not be able to galvanise the voter. Giles
:04:58. > :05:03.Fraser? Did you say Walsall? I was a vicar in Blakelaw Heath for a while.
:05:04. > :05:07.Many people there felt left behind by globalisation, felt they haven't
:05:08. > :05:13.been listened to. I can understand the anger that comes from it. Some
:05:14. > :05:18.of the anger has been misdirected, some of it has been exploited by the
:05:19. > :05:30.far right in absolutely disgraceful ways. It has to be said. But that
:05:31. > :05:40.anger is... Who do you mean by the far right, Ukip? I think the Ukip
:05:41. > :05:47.poster was absolutely disgraceful. It soiled an important argument we
:05:48. > :05:52.were having. The gentleman is right, there is a legitimate anger in
:05:53. > :05:59.places where people have been ignored for a very long time. They
:06:00. > :06:05.have been ignored I London. Now they are being sneered at for being
:06:06. > :06:12.angry, as if they were... You know bastion mark I just want to say one
:06:13. > :06:15.thing, there are not 17.4 million racists in this country. And that is
:06:16. > :06:20.important to say. APPLAUSE
:06:21. > :06:28.Do you want to respond to what he said about Ukip? Ukip isn't a far
:06:29. > :06:32.right party, we have campaigned against the European Union since our
:06:33. > :06:35.inception. I think this was the people versus the establishment. It
:06:36. > :06:40.was ordinary working-class people against the Brussels elite, against
:06:41. > :06:45.the big banks, against the business, against project fear. I want to know
:06:46. > :06:52.whether Chancellor is at the moment? He seems to have disappeared
:06:53. > :06:58.altogether. Giles spoke about the sneering now because people were
:06:59. > :07:02.angry. I can give you an example. A Guardian columnist yesterday wrote
:07:03. > :07:09.we have Brexit because of northern, crappy towns, places like Preston in
:07:10. > :07:15.my constituency, places like Wigan, black burn and Burnley. I have had
:07:16. > :07:23.enough of this London centric, metropolitan snobbery... Alex
:07:24. > :07:26.Salmond? I can reveal whether Chancellor is, he has been
:07:27. > :07:34.kidnapped. But nobody is going to pay the ransom and that is why you
:07:35. > :07:40.haven't seen him! In reality, there were two project fears. There was
:07:41. > :07:43.the project fear on the economy led by the Prime Minister and the
:07:44. > :07:48.Chancellor. But also the other project fear, the one on
:07:49. > :07:53.immigration, which was at the heart of the Outer campaign. The
:07:54. > :07:56.consequence given that the Outer campaign fund, the consequences for
:07:57. > :08:04.society of that project fear of very deep. Politicians should be doing,
:08:05. > :08:07.not worrying about the dislocation in their own parties, but worrying
:08:08. > :08:15.about the dislocation in my causing communities. I am not signed up
:08:16. > :08:21.member of the British establishment. I am not. I am proud one political
:08:22. > :08:24.leader who wasn't turned over by the electorate on Thursday was Nicola
:08:25. > :08:31.Sturgeon, who got a resounding vote to remain in Scotland and Europe
:08:32. > :08:34.last Thursday. I do recognise the political establishment to have been
:08:35. > :08:40.rejected by their electorate, better start facing and reconnecting and
:08:41. > :08:49.how you do that and offer hope. There is only one antidote to fear,
:08:50. > :08:54.whether it is fear of the economy or fear of immigration and that is to
:08:55. > :08:58.offer people hope and the way forward. Let's hear from our
:08:59. > :09:03.audience. You at the back in the striped shirt. I think it is really
:09:04. > :09:10.important to acknowledge the fact, acknowledge the role of the media.
:09:11. > :09:16.The tabloid press on a daily basis, much of the nuanced debate has been
:09:17. > :09:18.lost about sovereignty, it is just immigration, immigration,
:09:19. > :09:24.immigration. Speaking from the point of view of a teacher, our younger
:09:25. > :09:30.students, if the only thing they are hearing is this one note debate of
:09:31. > :09:36.immigration, immigration, immigration, that is all they will
:09:37. > :09:42.here and we'll ignore the rest. This woman here. While we are talking
:09:43. > :09:44.about in sensitivities and inappropriate behaviour from
:09:45. > :09:51.different parties throughout this complaint, I would like to ask Paul
:09:52. > :09:56.Nuttall how he feels about Aaron Banks running polls after the death
:09:57. > :10:04.of Jo Cox and how appropriate and sensitive he feels it is and was? I
:10:05. > :10:12.have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I am not up with
:10:13. > :10:18.those polls at all, I am sorry I cannot comment. I just don't know.
:10:19. > :10:25.The woman here in pink. It is too easy to pull all the results on
:10:26. > :10:29.Friday down to immigration. It is patronising and far too easy. We are
:10:30. > :10:32.in Birmingham which is extremely significant in my city. It is the
:10:33. > :10:36.most culturally diverse and ethnically diverse city in this
:10:37. > :10:43.country. To say the result is fear of immigration is wrong. There are
:10:44. > :10:46.so many more complexities as to why people voted Leave, democracy,
:10:47. > :10:50.sovereignty, and economics. It is disingenuous. What you make of Chris
:10:51. > :10:52.Abbott's view the peasants have revolted, people are going
:10:53. > :11:01.establishment and that is how it broke? To an extent, I believe that
:11:02. > :11:06.is true. I grew up on a council estate, my parents still live on a
:11:07. > :11:10.council estate. People believe they are not being listened to. And where
:11:11. > :11:14.we have negative impact on certain policies around immigration, those
:11:15. > :11:20.are the people who feel it does inform some of their opinion. But it
:11:21. > :11:23.does not inform all of it. Were you surprised by the outcome? For
:11:24. > :11:30.Birmingham, I was surprised, yes. Diane Abbott. There is no question
:11:31. > :11:36.this boat has come out of the EU was a roar of anger against Westminster
:11:37. > :11:42.elite. It is the most important political vote of my lifetime. I
:11:43. > :11:48.don't believe we should rerun it. We have to respect the results of the
:11:49. > :11:55.vote. There are also progressive reasons to want to come out of the
:11:56. > :12:06.EU. Tony Benn, all his life campaign to come out of the EU. But, members
:12:07. > :12:11.parts of the Leave campaign, notably Ukip, dot down in the gutter around
:12:12. > :12:16.immigration on this campaign. It is right to say it is not all about
:12:17. > :12:20.immigration, but I am telling you, there are people who are frightened
:12:21. > :12:26.and wondering what is their country becoming. It is so important we come
:12:27. > :12:31.together and reassure people that this vote isn't an endorsement of
:12:32. > :12:36.the politics of Ukip. This vote isn't about trying to make
:12:37. > :12:42.immigrants and people of colour feel frightened and feel they don't
:12:43. > :12:46.belong here. I respect the vote, but let's not hide what an unpleasant,
:12:47. > :12:56.ugly aspect there was. APPLAUSE
:12:57. > :13:07.Paul? The young lady in the audience is right, to pin this on immigration
:13:08. > :13:15.is right. Places with large South Asian populations go out and vote to
:13:16. > :13:20.leave. Let me finish. We do have to accept immigration did play a part,
:13:21. > :13:24.because as we know, and the Bank of England have said, and trade unions
:13:25. > :13:27.and Lord Rose of the remaining campaign, uncontrolled, mass
:13:28. > :13:32.immigration drives down wages. We're not going to refight the campaign.
:13:33. > :13:38.We are talking about the consequences. Diane Abbott, you said
:13:39. > :13:43.Tony Benn was in favour of pulling out? Always. Are you veering towards
:13:44. > :13:48.supporting the idea of leaving? Is Jeremy Corbyn not veering to audit?
:13:49. > :13:55.No, some aspects of this campaign, notably the role Ukip late, I find
:13:56. > :14:00.totally repellent. But we respect the vote, we come together and bring
:14:01. > :14:02.people together. APPLAUSE
:14:03. > :14:08.Dominic Raab, there have been a number of attacks on the Leave
:14:09. > :14:16.campaign, what do you make of those assertions? Most of them were at
:14:17. > :14:21.Ukip. On my side and in voter leave, we wanted to talk about immigration
:14:22. > :14:27.but also the huge opportunities that this country to go from strength to
:14:28. > :14:32.strength, be a global player, take control of our economy and
:14:33. > :14:38.democracy. We can rerun the debate. It was four months and people were
:14:39. > :14:44.tired of it at the end. We have also had a remarkable, direct democratic
:14:45. > :14:49.mandate to leave. 17 million people, 72% turnout, I have never seen
:14:50. > :14:53.anything or anyone get a democratic mandate like that. Three things have
:14:54. > :14:56.to happen now. First of all, what ever are different views, we
:14:57. > :15:04.Democrats only have two respect the verdict and make it work. We need to
:15:05. > :15:10.calm down and we need stability. On the economic side I was pleased at
:15:11. > :15:13.what Sajid Javid said, what Mark Carney said, this economy is strong
:15:14. > :15:18.enough to weather any short-term volatility and the Bank of England
:15:19. > :15:26.will do anything it can to make sure it is the case. But this case needs
:15:27. > :15:32.to shift from the divisive part of this campaign, to work out how we
:15:33. > :15:36.mitigate the risks, take this golden opportunity and carried the 48% of
:15:37. > :15:40.people who are nervous at this moment in time.
:15:41. > :15:49.How do you carry the 48% who said they wanted to remain? First of all,
:15:50. > :15:55.it's about the tone. Second, we need to mitigate the risks. What do you
:15:56. > :15:59.mean by that? People are concerned about financial instability. If you
:16:00. > :16:04.look at the FTSE 100, is a very strong statement by Mark Carney, we
:16:05. > :16:08.are well placed to weather that. We also need to take the positives and
:16:09. > :16:11.the opportunities. We've talked about the negative stuff on both
:16:12. > :16:15.sides and I don't want to get into that because we're raking over
:16:16. > :16:23.Coles, but if you look at the international reaction from the EU,
:16:24. > :16:27.Angela Merkel, and the BDI, the German equivalent of the
:16:28. > :16:32.Confederation of British industry,... Mitigate the risks,
:16:33. > :16:39.David, but let's take this golden opportunity to make this country
:16:40. > :16:42.even greater. Anna Soubry. He's your colleague in government, is it
:16:43. > :16:47.possible to do that? Yes, because at the end of the day you've got to put
:16:48. > :16:50.the country before your party and before the divisions. I completely
:16:51. > :16:54.agree with everything that Diane Abbott has said about these deep
:16:55. > :16:58.divisions that have occurred in relation to immigrants and people
:16:59. > :17:04.who are not white. The other thing that concerns me is about the views
:17:05. > :17:07.of a lot of younger voters, who feel that for their generation, their
:17:08. > :17:11.opportunities in many ways have been stolen, if I may say, this is their
:17:12. > :17:16.view and I don't necessarily subscribe to it but it has a lot of
:17:17. > :17:21.merit, they feel another generation, older people, have taken away there
:17:22. > :17:26.opportunities for the future. A lot of young people do feel that.
:17:27. > :17:37.APPLAUSE They do and 75% of under
:17:38. > :17:41.24-year-olds voted to Remain. The question is, they didn't turn out in
:17:42. > :17:49.sufficient numbers. It is a good point you make. But we are where we
:17:50. > :17:54.are. Only 40% of 18-year-olds to 24-year-olds went out and voted. But
:17:55. > :17:57.we are where we are and we have to repair and move forward and we have
:17:58. > :18:02.to take into account there are a lot of young people who are feeling very
:18:03. > :18:06.sore at the moment. I take massive issue with the fact that this has
:18:07. > :18:10.been portrayed as a working class revolt. Usually working-class
:18:11. > :18:18.revolts aren't headed by people like Michael Gove and Boris Johnson.
:18:19. > :18:23.Also, 48% of people might feel a bit nervous, but there are a hell of a
:18:24. > :18:29.lot more people on the streets, people of colour and immigrants who
:18:30. > :18:31.are not just a bit nervous but terrified because of abuse have
:18:32. > :18:36.received. APPLAUSE
:18:37. > :18:37.A lot of hands up but I want to take a question from Andrew Burroughs
:18:38. > :18:50.Emma it comes to the point that Dominic
:18:51. > :18:57.Raab was making. "Do The panel believe Europe will punish the UK
:18:58. > :19:05.for leaving to quash any similar rebellion in Europe?" Who would like
:19:06. > :19:09.to start on this? One reason is that the UK does not have a negotiating
:19:10. > :19:16.platform. The way to minimise the economic damage from Brexit was to
:19:17. > :19:20.say right, we will go for the European economic area, we will go
:19:21. > :19:23.for some sort of associate membership like Switzerland or
:19:24. > :19:28.Norway. The difficulty with that is that the bulk of the league campaign
:19:29. > :19:32.was against free movement for Labour, because immigration actually
:19:33. > :19:37.was at the heart of their campaign. Therefore they couldn't argue that,
:19:38. > :19:41.therefore there is not a serious proposition to negotiate with. You
:19:42. > :19:52.mean the Leave campaign don't have a view about coalition? I compared it
:19:53. > :19:57.to the Robert Redford movie when he wins a Senate campaign in California
:19:58. > :20:02.and turns and says what do we do now? That is a bit like the Leave
:20:03. > :20:05.campaign. I would just point out that is probably why Michael Gove
:20:06. > :20:09.and Boris Johnson looked like they were going to burst into tears at
:20:10. > :20:16.their victory press conference! The other side is, there will be a
:20:17. > :20:22.tendency in many European countries that they don't want to give an easy
:20:23. > :20:28.ride to a UK exit in case it encourages other countries to do the
:20:29. > :20:30.same thing. So this is going to be a real rough, tough negotiation
:20:31. > :20:34.because one side doesn't know what it wants and the other side wants to
:20:35. > :20:40.make a point. It's not going to be an easy two years. Dominic Raab.
:20:41. > :20:46.Picked up on the point, if you would, that two of the leaders of
:20:47. > :20:48.the leave campaign were looking startled or surprised or about to
:20:49. > :20:55.burst into tears when they discovered they had won! We were all
:20:56. > :20:58.a bit sleep deprived, won't we? It's a long campaign. Do you know what
:20:59. > :21:05.you're going to do? Yes, how long are you going to give me to give you
:21:06. > :21:09.the extent -- explanation. A minute! Let me answer the question, show me
:21:10. > :21:14.that courtesy and I will show you the same. The more we say about what
:21:15. > :21:17.we're going to do the more they were setting us up to criticise us
:21:18. > :21:23.because we were a campaign and not a government. The lady asked... The EU
:21:24. > :21:27.statement by the president said very clearly that we were going to have a
:21:28. > :21:32.close partnership. Angela Merkel specifically rejected the idea of a
:21:33. > :21:36.punitive approach. There is a good reason, because there are German
:21:37. > :21:39.elections coming up in 2017 and there is no German Chancellor in
:21:40. > :21:43.their right mind who would approach that looking to put out of jobs
:21:44. > :21:50.manufacturing exporters. We know that the European firms sell ?68
:21:51. > :21:54.million more in goods and services every year than we sell them. We
:21:55. > :21:57.were told in the lead up to this campaign that we have been hung up
:21:58. > :22:02.to dry for years, creating interminable uncertainty. Now the EU
:22:03. > :22:07.say they would like to crack on. That's good for us, it strengthens
:22:08. > :22:13.our leverage, we can take our time and trigger article 50 every time.
:22:14. > :22:17.They want to crack on and you want to take it easy but that plays into
:22:18. > :22:21.your hands? We can trigger the formal negotiations whenever we
:22:22. > :22:24.want, which is our right. The fact that they would like us to do it
:22:25. > :22:32.sooner rather than later strengthens minds and our negotiating position.
:22:33. > :22:37.Let's hear from you, sir. I'm very alarmed and concerned that the
:22:38. > :22:41.Remain campaign is still fighting a war that is over, it's done, get
:22:42. > :22:44.over it, it's gone. What I am concerned about is that they are
:22:45. > :22:49.still saying we've got to be involved with the new generation,
:22:50. > :22:52.the new politics. I have a fundamental issue with the ones
:22:53. > :23:01.telling us there was going to be a nuclear war and also a European war
:23:02. > :23:07.negotiating contracts. Well, who... All of them, the Remain team. Anna
:23:08. > :23:11.Soubry, are the Remain team going to be involved in negotiations? We hope
:23:12. > :23:16.so because we now have to make sure we get the best deal for our
:23:17. > :23:20.country. I was with somebody who has a small business who told me he's
:23:21. > :23:24.already lost, this is the real world, he has lost two' contacts,
:23:25. > :23:32.they were cancelled on Friday as a result. We are in immediate economic
:23:33. > :23:36.shock. I can tell you where the Chancellor is. The Chancellor is
:23:37. > :23:46.sitting and working out and making the phone calls and putting some
:23:47. > :23:53.stability... Hang on, hang on. This is true and this is what has been
:23:54. > :23:58.happening. I've been involved, as has Sergei Javier Colomo have been
:23:59. > :24:01.putting the stability in in some important work in relation to the
:24:02. > :24:04.steel industry which I'm sure you all aware of, which is extremely
:24:05. > :24:08.sensitive and we are now very concerned about our economic
:24:09. > :24:15.situation. That is the work we are doing and it has to be done
:24:16. > :24:20.privately. You gave an example of a company that lost to contracts. What
:24:21. > :24:25.has he lost? He is in construction and he was due to do two projects in
:24:26. > :24:28.North Nottinghamshire, both of which have been cancelled because of the
:24:29. > :24:35.fears and instability in the economy. That's why we have to
:24:36. > :24:37.restore that stability. I think the Chancellor is crafting his
:24:38. > :24:45.resignation speech right now, that is my opinion... Not once in this
:24:46. > :24:48.campaign did I endorse the fear tactics on the economy and neither
:24:49. > :24:52.did Nicola Sturgeon, who made a point of saying that is not... We
:24:53. > :24:56.had a bucket full of that sort of stuff two years ago in Scotland and
:24:57. > :25:00.I would never endorse that sort of campaign. There is an old saying in
:25:01. > :25:05.American politics, if you break something, you own it. It is the
:25:06. > :25:09.Brexit campaign who won the referendum across the UK and now
:25:10. > :25:16.they have to tell us what the future is. You cannot expect the
:25:17. > :25:20.politicians and David Cameron was right to resign and the Chancellor
:25:21. > :25:24.will be right to resign, who acted against it, to act as if they can do
:25:25. > :25:31.something. Who do you want to speak for the leave campaign? Boris
:25:32. > :25:34.Johnson? It is the party of Michael Gove and Boris Johnson and we will
:25:35. > :25:34.see if they are as good at the helm as they work...
:25:35. > :25:46.APPLAUSE I want to see a Brexit government
:25:47. > :25:51.because after all the Brexit side won. I want to see a exit the man
:25:52. > :25:57.who will go to Brussels and negotiate hard. Well, you've only
:25:58. > :25:58.got one Ukip MP, you're not going to have much chance!
:25:59. > :26:03.APPLAUSE LAUGHTER
:26:04. > :26:08.What is a Brexit government, Paul? It is one that is going to be headed
:26:09. > :26:15.by Michael Gove or Boris Johnson. And nobody in the government who was
:26:16. > :26:22.in favour, like Anna Soubry? Anna can be part of the government. Thank
:26:23. > :26:26.you... In reality... You asked what would happen next but of course, as
:26:27. > :26:29.an EPI will be out of a job, which is probably a good thing.
:26:30. > :26:36.CHEERING APPLAUSE
:26:37. > :26:41.Hang on, why when do you think you will be out of a job, three-year is
:26:42. > :26:45.down the line, five, six? There will be no more European elections and
:26:46. > :26:49.that will be a good thing. At the moment when article 50 is triggered,
:26:50. > :26:53.it will be two years and then we will be out. We can have a bespoke
:26:54. > :26:57.British Steel. We have a huge trading deficit with the European
:26:58. > :27:02.Union, which means, in many ways, they need us more than we need them.
:27:03. > :27:15.There are elections in France and Germany next year. You, sir, in the
:27:16. > :27:18.pink shirt. I would just ask, Paul Nuttall, you have said you have got
:27:19. > :27:26.this plan and you are doing everything. You say you would put up
:27:27. > :27:28.a hard order between the north and south of Ireland if necessary. You
:27:29. > :27:36.have no consideration for peace in Europe. You sniggered... The first
:27:37. > :27:45.war we could see could be on our owned and, in Ireland. -- our own
:27:46. > :27:48.land. That is Project Fear again. De Villiers, the Secretary of State,
:27:49. > :27:51.has said it's not going to happen. There will not be a border between
:27:52. > :27:56.the north and south of Ireland. What do you make of that argument? The
:27:57. > :28:03.idea that we need a Brexit government is absolute nonsense.
:28:04. > :28:07.APPLAUSE I didn't vote for Michael Gove, I
:28:08. > :28:08.didn't vote for Boris Johnson when I voted for aggro leave.
:28:09. > :28:17.It wasn't like a general election when you're voting for people like
:28:18. > :28:22.that. We need a government of national unity.
:28:23. > :28:26.APPLAUSE The most important thing... The way
:28:27. > :28:30.you've set this up to night I understand, but this has all gone
:28:31. > :28:36.now, this division. This debate is all what has happened before. Now
:28:37. > :28:40.it's going forward and we'd all together have two work-out. As a
:28:41. > :28:45.vicar, I have to say one thing. I know this is not a religious
:28:46. > :28:53.programme... We a reading and it was "Love your neighbour as yourself".
:28:54. > :28:59.Never before -- we need to love each other and attend to each other. We
:29:00. > :29:02.need to stop these divisions and go forward and that means particular
:29:03. > :29:08.stopping the racism too. APPLAUSE
:29:09. > :29:15.Let's just deal with the issue of divisions. Michael Foakes has a
:29:16. > :29:23.question which I would like to take briefly. Fire away. How can the
:29:24. > :29:27.electorate trust the Remain politicians to uphold the democratic
:29:28. > :29:35.decision of the British public to leave the EU? So, you have the
:29:36. > :29:40.referendum and the have -- we have the referendum result. But just
:29:41. > :29:44.under 500 650 MPs in the House of Commons are Remainers. I think the
:29:45. > :29:48.question on a lot of people's minds, and David Lambie of Labour raised
:29:49. > :29:52.this, was whether the House of Commons will actually go along with
:29:53. > :29:55.this if the majority of them are against what do you think? I think
:29:56. > :29:59.the suggestion that the House of Commons should vote down the
:30:00. > :30:06.reverend and is quite wrong. We have to respect the will of the people.
:30:07. > :30:16.I will say this, I thought Paul not all wanting a Brexit government is
:30:17. > :30:21.chilling. Presumably this is a government where Ukip as the whip
:30:22. > :30:27.hand. Nobody voted for this last Thursday. What about to do with the
:30:28. > :30:34.EU issue? We certainly cannot have a Brexit negotiation dominated by Ukip
:30:35. > :30:43.and the Tory right. We want to have all voices, we want the voices of
:30:44. > :30:48.working people to get a deal in the exit, which is not just the
:30:49. > :30:51.stockbrokers and Ukip, but for ordinary people. We want a
:30:52. > :30:54.negotiation team which will reflect all voices. Jeremy Corbyn... Jeremy
:30:55. > :31:00.Corbyn wouldn't go on a platform with a Tory, so how do you get a
:31:01. > :31:07.joint operation between Labour and Tory? We know what happens when the
:31:08. > :31:12.Labour Party went on a platform with Tories in Scotland. But that is a
:31:13. > :31:19.different question. What Jeremy did not want to do was to be seen as
:31:20. > :31:25.part of a Westminster elite telling people what to do. That is a
:31:26. > :31:30.different question from saying we want working people and the voices
:31:31. > :31:34.of working people to be part of this exit negotiation. So you are
:31:35. > :31:38.suggesting some sort of co-operation between all parties in the House of
:31:39. > :31:41.Commons, labour and Tory on the negotiations with the EU? I am
:31:42. > :31:46.suggesting the Labour Party will draw up an agenda for Brexiter and
:31:47. > :31:52.we want the agenda to be reflected in the negotiations. We represent
:31:53. > :31:54.millions of people who don't trust Paul Nuttall with their best
:31:55. > :31:56.interests. APPLAUSE
:31:57. > :32:04.What will be SNP do because they have heard but the people of the UK
:32:05. > :32:09.have said and they won't be party to this. In this United Kingdom, there
:32:10. > :32:13.are four Nations. Two of these nations, Northern Ireland and
:32:14. > :32:18.Scotland didn't vote the 6% for Brexiter. In the case of Scotland it
:32:19. > :32:25.was 24% majority for Remain. My thing and English and a Welsh MP has
:32:26. > :32:30.no choice but to follow the mandate from the people in the referendum,
:32:31. > :32:33.just as I think no Scottish Northern Ireland champion should do anything
:32:34. > :32:40.but followed the mandate from the electorate. Nicola Sturgeon is ahead
:32:41. > :32:44.because she is the only politician over the last 48 hours who has been
:32:45. > :32:53.talking coherent sense as every other political party disintegrates
:32:54. > :32:57.around them. The first and most important thing is to have
:32:58. > :33:00.stability. In relation to the Bank of England and the financial
:33:01. > :33:04.uncertainty, the tools will be in place. We will have a new Prime
:33:05. > :33:09.Minister in about three months. I am convinced it will need to be a broad
:33:10. > :33:14.reaching team, not just some divisive racketeer operation. --
:33:15. > :33:19.Brexiteer. I would reach out to Anna and other colleagues, and say let's
:33:20. > :33:24.hammer a stronger sense of unity going forward. Let's take the
:33:25. > :33:27.opportunity here. And beyond the government dealing with the
:33:28. > :33:32.negotiation, and what we are talking about is to make sure we secure
:33:33. > :33:36.ongoing trade, we have other Vendy forms of cooperation and take back
:33:37. > :33:40.democratic control so people in the House of Commons are making the
:33:41. > :33:42.decisions, rather than politicians and bureaucrats who are not
:33:43. > :33:49.accountable to the people watching this show or in the audience. But it
:33:50. > :33:54.would regard to reach out to broader members of civic society, whether it
:33:55. > :34:00.is the unions, business groups, all parts of the United Kingdom, to make
:34:01. > :34:07.sure we get it right. But we need to make sure we move away from the
:34:08. > :34:12.divisiveness of the referendum campaign. If we do that, we will see
:34:13. > :34:17.the number of people that were concerned about this drop, but we
:34:18. > :34:30.have to be committed to it. Who do you want as Thai minister? It is
:34:31. > :34:40.very tempting, but I am not going to get into any of the runners and
:34:41. > :34:48.riders. I will not be running. But I will not get into any of that now.
:34:49. > :34:55.Would it have to be a Brexiter? What is important is the next leader of
:34:56. > :34:58.the Tory party has a good democratic, social mobility message
:34:59. > :35:03.to an aspirational society. Anyone here. Should we have had the
:35:04. > :35:06.referendum when we didn't have all of the correct information? Indeed,
:35:07. > :35:13.let me take with that, a question from Claudia and we will put the two
:35:14. > :35:18.together. It has become apparent and number of leave voters based their
:35:19. > :35:25.choice on lies. With this in mind, is the outcome of the referendum
:35:26. > :35:30.valid? Who would like to go on this? The outcome is a valid. I come from
:35:31. > :35:37.a country where a government we didn't elect a proposed referendum
:35:38. > :35:42.we didn't want. Now proposes to take our country out of Europe against
:35:43. > :35:48.the will of the Scottish people. You are part of the United Kingdom at
:35:49. > :35:51.this point in time. Every time people dismiss Scotland's
:35:52. > :35:58.recognition as a nation, we are a country and not a county. People of
:35:59. > :36:02.Scotland listen to that and say, why isn't our national rights recognised
:36:03. > :36:07.within the United Kingdom? Nicola Sturgeon propose to David Cameron
:36:08. > :36:15.the referendum should be conducted in a way that had to have a majority
:36:16. > :36:20.in all four countries of the United Kingdom. He dismissed that as silly.
:36:21. > :36:24.He probably thinks it is a lot more sensible now. But the rapper Rendon
:36:25. > :36:27.is the referendum. All political campaigns had misinformation at
:36:28. > :36:31.their heart. What was the misinformation on your side of the
:36:32. > :36:37.argument. Project via on the economy was a rerun of the Scottish
:36:38. > :36:41.referendum in 2014. It is Mr Cameron and Mr Osborne who didn't
:36:42. > :36:46.understand, they had others to do their dirty work. The Daily Mail,
:36:47. > :36:51.the Daily Telegraph, the Sun newspaper. This time they were
:36:52. > :36:57.trying to get the sewage out but didn't have the sewer to translate
:36:58. > :37:00.it to the electorate so they ran it with no transmission mechanism. But
:37:01. > :37:04.I deplore that, I'd appreciate it. But nothing like the project via
:37:05. > :37:10.that divides communities on the basis on the colour of a person's
:37:11. > :37:16.skin. I know people who voted out are not racist, but the campaigns,
:37:17. > :37:19.not just the unofficial one of Ukip, but the other campaign which
:37:20. > :37:24.featured immigration at their heart because they believed it was their
:37:25. > :37:28.winning card and it turned out to be their misinformation. Giles Fraser.
:37:29. > :37:32.Misinformation because they have not promised to deliver? We don't need
:37:33. > :37:37.to go to Nigel Farage's poster. People from the European Union,
:37:38. > :37:40.people who were denied a vote in this referendum, hard-working people
:37:41. > :37:45.paying their taxes but still denied a vote in this country on their own
:37:46. > :37:55.future. Sorry, I thought you were making another point. Giles Fraser.
:37:56. > :37:59.I am glad you said you accept the consequences and the results of this
:38:00. > :38:03.referendum. But there was a rapper Rendon not very long ago for
:38:04. > :38:09.Scotland to stay in the European, stay in the UK. And I seem to
:38:10. > :38:16.remember you lost that one. More recently there was an alleged chin
:38:17. > :38:22.-- election in Scotland last month where Nicola Sturgeon put in her
:38:23. > :38:26.manifesto if there was a material change in circumstances the Scottish
:38:27. > :38:36.people have the right to another referendum. Hang on... Hanged on. It
:38:37. > :38:44.is a disgrace 5 million in Scotland and the SNP are trying to hold to
:38:45. > :38:49.ransom, 55 million people. Very simple question, do you believe the
:38:50. > :38:58.outcome of this referendum is now Scotland leave the union? Yes.
:38:59. > :39:03.Absolutely certain? I have talked about the scare tactics from the
:39:04. > :39:07.remain macro side and how it rebounded on the economy. But the
:39:08. > :39:14.litany of scare tactics was when John Major said during the campaign.
:39:15. > :39:18.We cannot have our country taken out of Europe against the expressed will
:39:19. > :39:26.of the Scottish people. Incidentally, if you manage to get a
:39:27. > :39:31.majority of MPs... Dominic Raab. Wait, wait. Would the government
:39:32. > :39:39.grant another referendum because it is a Westminster decision to have a
:39:40. > :39:44.referendum in Scotland. You are the justice minister, if Scotland asks,
:39:45. > :39:50.will they get one? I don't think there is a case for it now. Would
:39:51. > :39:54.you stop it. Please answer my question. You said you didn't think
:39:55. > :39:58.there was a case for it. Would you prevent a new Scottish referendum if
:39:59. > :40:04.they wanted to leave because of Brexiter. Alex is asking for an
:40:05. > :40:08.immediate referendum. Because of the deterioration of the Scottish budget
:40:09. > :40:13.deficit, I don't think they would want it now. We should consider this
:40:14. > :40:16.when we have our exit deal with ongoing trade relationships,
:40:17. > :40:21.friendly cooperation. Then there will be a choice. Scotland would
:40:22. > :40:27.either stay in a strong economy in the United Kingdom with a strong
:40:28. > :40:37.economy giving more democratic powers to Scotland. Enough, let's
:40:38. > :40:42.leave Scotland now. Enough. The woman up there in the black and
:40:43. > :40:48.white dress. Everybody agrees here that unity is what is needed now for
:40:49. > :40:52.this country to move forward. Whatever the decision was and the
:40:53. > :40:55.outcome and bringing it all together, all the infighting,
:40:56. > :41:01.particularly from Scotland, you are part of the UK at this point in time
:41:02. > :41:04.and you voted to remain with us. And the turmoil and fighting Nicola
:41:05. > :41:11.Sturgeon is creating, trying to split it, it is not the right time
:41:12. > :41:16.to discuss Scotland's splitting when we are fighting the EU to get the
:41:17. > :41:23.rights of the British people deserve. I wanted to ask Dominic
:41:24. > :41:30.Raab, talking about golden opportunities. I am a law student at
:41:31. > :41:36.the University of Birmingham. Like me, the majority of young people
:41:37. > :41:42.voted to remain. What are the golden opportunities to students now we
:41:43. > :41:46.have left the European Union? Can I add to that, Ayew alarmed at the
:41:47. > :41:52.high proportion of young people who are really upset by the way the vote
:41:53. > :41:58.went, because the proportion of them, the larger proportion of them
:41:59. > :42:02.voted to remain. I am concerned to make sure the 48%, including the
:42:03. > :42:07.younger generation are carried with us. The EU has been disastrous for
:42:08. > :42:10.the younger generation, given the levels of youth unemployment in the
:42:11. > :42:17.EU and in particular the Eurozone, rising to 50%. We need to do more to
:42:18. > :42:21.spell out the positive vision to carry your generation, but also the
:42:22. > :42:24.whole country with us. What opportunities do you think will come
:42:25. > :42:30.from Brexit? Better opportunities for jobs, higher wages. I would love
:42:31. > :42:38.to have answered your question, David moved on. I know Anna alluded
:42:39. > :42:46.to it earlier, but what would she say to this 19-year-old who voted
:42:47. > :42:51.Leave. A lot of my generation was incredibly naive in this referendum.
:42:52. > :42:58.Many of my friends talked about a thought they could get change in the
:42:59. > :43:03.EU. All the evidence, such as David Cameron's re-negotiation and the
:43:04. > :43:05.structure of the EU showed we were not going to get that.
:43:06. > :43:12.APPLAUSE Diane Abbott and then I will come to
:43:13. > :43:18.you. We are where we are, we have had the rapper Rendon, people have
:43:19. > :43:24.spoken and they voted for us to leave the EU. Now we must come
:43:25. > :43:29.together and we must negotiate on behalf of everybody the best deal.
:43:30. > :43:33.The other thing that needs to be said is this. The decades, not me
:43:34. > :43:37.because I always believed we were better off in the EU, but
:43:38. > :43:42.politicians from both parties had said the EU was the root of most of
:43:43. > :43:47.our troubles. And also, let's be honest, nobody had really made the
:43:48. > :43:52.case, positive case for immigration into our country. If there is
:43:53. > :43:57.anything that comes out of this, and I can give you this promise,
:43:58. > :44:02.whatever my future may not be, I will not stand back any longer and
:44:03. > :44:08.make the positive case for migration and immigration in our country. It
:44:09. > :44:11.has delivered the decades, for the benefit of our nation, both
:44:12. > :44:19.economically and socially. Nobody has said that. You said the positive
:44:20. > :44:27.case was not made? It has been a failing of all of us as policy
:44:28. > :44:34.sessions. I am talking about me, if I dare say. I put my hands up, I
:44:35. > :44:37.have always been liberal on immigration. I have always said
:44:38. > :44:41.these things, they have not often found a voice and people haven't
:44:42. > :44:45.this on. Now as a society, let's debate immigration and let the
:44:46. > :44:53.positive voice sing out about the positive benefits of people who come
:44:54. > :44:59.here to work. I will be positive about immigration. Immigration is
:45:00. > :45:04.exceptionally positive when it is controlled. That is what we have got
:45:05. > :45:09.now, we will get control of our own borders and the people who make the
:45:10. > :45:16.decisions will be the people we elect at Westminster. It is the
:45:17. > :45:22.right way to do it. Whilst we are in the European Union signed up to
:45:23. > :45:27.freedom of movement, we can take back control and be like Australia.
:45:28. > :45:33.The man in the green shirt. Can I say how upset I am with the remain
:45:34. > :45:36.macro side of the argument. The only considered EU migrants in this
:45:37. > :45:39.country, is a non-EU migrants, we have been discriminated hugely by
:45:40. > :45:45.the UK immigration system because the high numbers coming in from the
:45:46. > :45:49.EU and all the opportunities, the chances, the jobs are going to EU
:45:50. > :45:53.nationals and is non-EU nationals have had no rights whatsoever.
:45:54. > :46:04.Diane Abbott. I understand that argument but I put it to you that if
:46:05. > :46:08.you really think the right of the Conservative Party and Ukip want to
:46:09. > :46:12.have fewer Eastern European migrants so they can have more Commonwealth
:46:13. > :46:17.migrants, you haven't been paying attention.
:46:18. > :46:23.APPLAUSE On the question of lies and
:46:24. > :46:28.misrepresentation which somebody raised, some of the promises made by
:46:29. > :46:33.the Leave people on travel within hours, so Dominic is now telling us
:46:34. > :46:39.we want to take our time. Loads of people voted thinking we would come
:46:40. > :46:45.out of Europe today. Immigration, controlling immigration... You guys
:46:46. > :46:49.just want to rerun the debate. We need to move forward is not
:46:50. > :46:52.backwards. It's important to show how the promises that people voted
:46:53. > :46:59.on have unravelled within hours. They haven't! Hours after the poll,
:47:00. > :47:03.Daniel Hannan was saying we're not going to bring down the numbers of
:47:04. > :47:09.migrants. As for the millions of pounds that the Leave people said
:47:10. > :47:15.would be spent on the NHS, Nigel Farage said we never actually said
:47:16. > :47:22.that... Their story is unravelling! So you would like a referendum
:47:23. > :47:33.fought again. It's an important vote and I respect the vote. Nigel
:47:34. > :47:42.Farage... It was vote leave that had that slogan on the side of the bar
:47:43. > :47:48.-- side of the bus, so please stop scaremongering. I'm sick of it!
:47:49. > :47:53.We're sick and tired of it, OK! There was an interview on This
:47:54. > :48:00.Morning with Nigel Farage and the presenter challenged him on the ?350
:48:01. > :48:02.million. That was vote leave. Nigel Farage was nothing to do with vote
:48:03. > :48:11.leave. The ?350 million, we all knew it was
:48:12. > :48:19.a lie. I will take a question from Margaret Sutton and then take
:48:20. > :48:24.general question that the end. Remain threatened that a vote to
:48:25. > :48:31.leave would bring Armageddon. As Armageddon arrived for our political
:48:32. > :48:35.parties instead? -- has it? APPLAUSE
:48:36. > :48:42.When we went on air, I think Diane Abbott, Jeremy Corbyn had lost ten
:48:43. > :48:46.members of the Shadow Cabinet. While we've been on air, you won't know
:48:47. > :48:52.this, he has lost another one, the shadow Attorney General, Kyle
:48:53. > :48:57.Turner. From Labour's point of view, the party seems to be unravelling
:48:58. > :49:03.under the pressure of this referendum. People seem very unhappy
:49:04. > :49:07.with what Jeremy Corbyn did. On the Armageddon, I think the Project Fear
:49:08. > :49:11.stuff was exaggerated and in the end didn't convince people and that is
:49:12. > :49:15.why Leave won. On the question of Jeremy Corbyn, it's a funny thing.
:49:16. > :49:19.One of the clear lessons of this vote to come out of the EU is that
:49:20. > :49:27.people all over the country don't want politics as usual. And if there
:49:28. > :49:29.is any party leader who stands for not politics as usual, it is Jeremy
:49:30. > :49:35.Corbyn. APPLAUSE
:49:36. > :49:38.The truth is that the Labour MPs who have been running round in circles
:49:39. > :49:44.today have been planning this for months. Because they have never
:49:45. > :49:49.accepted the result of last summer's leadership election. It's because
:49:50. > :49:52.they didn't accent that he played a proper part in the Leave campaign.
:49:53. > :49:58.No, they've been talking about this for months. It's irrelevant how he
:49:59. > :50:01.ran the campaign? They've used this... They've been talking about
:50:02. > :50:06.this for months. Following on from this vote we should be talking about
:50:07. > :50:09.the people. We should be reconstructing our relationships in
:50:10. > :50:15.our base, we shouldn't be running around playing Westminster games.
:50:16. > :50:21.All right, Alex Salmond. I think the lady had a great question. Nicola
:50:22. > :50:26.Sturgeon looks in fine fettle at the present moment. Well, she does!
:50:27. > :50:31.Let's not have that the SNP is the answer to every question. The Prime
:50:32. > :50:36.Minister has gone, 11 members of the Shadow Cabinet have gone, Jeremy
:50:37. > :50:38.Corbyn might be going... David, I'm just glad you're still here!
:50:39. > :50:46.LAUGHTER APPLAUSE
:50:47. > :50:51.You are a fixture. I hate to tell you, I'm not part of the
:50:52. > :50:56.constitution! Be going of Karl Turner is very significant. He is no
:50:57. > :51:00.Blairite or troublemaker, he is quite far into the left of the
:51:01. > :51:04.Labour Party and its deeply significant that Carl has gone, I
:51:05. > :51:07.have a lot of time for him. Obviously Diane doesn't want to talk
:51:08. > :51:13.about the meltdown in the Labour Party. I will more than happily talk
:51:14. > :51:18.about my party. But we need a good, strong opposition. Let's talk about
:51:19. > :51:25.a good strong government. Do you want Boris as Prime Minister,
:51:26. > :51:29.leading your party? I'm not friends with Boris at the moment... There's
:51:30. > :51:34.a good argument that having led this, he should jolly well get on
:51:35. > :51:38.and make the best of what he has brought us to. But I want a leader
:51:39. > :51:44.who can be a proper world player, who is a grown up leader with the
:51:45. > :51:49.credibility and has also had senior experience in national government.
:51:50. > :51:55.Anyone in mind? Actually I have an open mind. Genuinely, I say what I
:51:56. > :52:00.think, you know me. There are some very good people coming forward.
:52:01. > :52:05.It's the qualities we need first that will determine the person.
:52:06. > :52:10.Giles Fraser. I'm a Jeremy Corbyn fan. I think the Blairites are
:52:11. > :52:13.making their move now because the Chilcot report is coming out, what
:52:14. > :52:19.is it, next month... And we know what is going to happen the day
:52:20. > :52:26.after that! To be serious, the problem is, for the Labour Party, it
:52:27. > :52:29.is much deeper. What this referendum has revealed is how out of touch so
:52:30. > :52:38.many of the Labour Party are with their base. It's extremely worrying,
:52:39. > :52:41.I think, because the people who might be beneficiaries of that are
:52:42. > :52:47.the far right and that worries me enormously. By my watch we have got
:52:48. > :52:51.just over five minutes to go. We've heard a lot of arguments. There's
:52:52. > :52:56.one particular thing I want to raise, because 3 million people who
:52:57. > :53:01.voted to remain have now asked for another vote, in a petition. I want
:53:02. > :53:04.to hear from people who voted remain and feel that somehow things went
:53:05. > :53:08.wrong for them or they are discontented with the answer. You
:53:09. > :53:13.are, sir? I think the British public not only voted for Brexit but it was
:53:14. > :53:18.a no-confidence vote in this government, show we should have a
:53:19. > :53:25.general election. Did you vote Remain? Yes. If we did have a
:53:26. > :53:31.general election and the winning side explicitly campaign not to
:53:32. > :53:35.invoke Article 50, is it a realistic possibility that there could be a
:53:36. > :53:40.second referendum? You would have a general election and then a second
:53:41. > :53:47.referendum after negotiations? Yes, provided... There is a petition up
:53:48. > :53:54.at the moment... 3 million. And there is 300,000 of them who sign up
:53:55. > :54:02.from Vatican City, which only has 800 people living there! Looking at
:54:03. > :54:07.the details, it's only about 400,000 people who signed that petition who
:54:08. > :54:11.are eligible to vote in this country. I literally feel that the
:54:12. > :54:14.Westminster jigsaw has been thrown on the floor and they're going to
:54:15. > :54:17.have to put this back together. I don't think in the long-term the
:54:18. > :54:22.Labour Party can survive in its current form. If Jeremy Corbyn gets
:54:23. > :54:26.35 signatories, he will go back on that ballot paper will -- ballot
:54:27. > :54:34.paper and he will be re-elected. People like Chuka Umunna and
:54:35. > :54:44.Tristram Hunt... Have Ukip now done its bit and can now retire? No,
:54:45. > :54:46.absolutely not. There is a fragmentation between the Labour
:54:47. > :54:53.Party, the parliamentary party and its base particularly in working
:54:54. > :55:00.class seats. That is where Ukip's future lies. They had the biggest
:55:01. > :55:06.vote for Brexit. Open house. You, please. With the request for another
:55:07. > :55:13.referendum, what happens if people still vote Leave in a second
:55:14. > :55:15.referendum? Do we just continue having referendum after referendum
:55:16. > :55:22.until people get it right? APPLAUSE
:55:23. > :55:26.You, yes. So, I voted remain. It has left me feeling quite upset about
:55:27. > :55:31.leaving the EU, but also with a deep mistrust of politicians from both
:55:32. > :55:34.sides of the campaign. I've heard a lot of rhetoric about, we're going
:55:35. > :55:38.to build hope and bring people together, but what are you actually
:55:39. > :55:44.going to do? What is it that worries you? It worries me that there are a
:55:45. > :55:46.lot of parts of society that now feel marginalised and don't feel
:55:47. > :55:54.part of this country, which I think led a lot of people to vote to leave
:55:55. > :55:58.and now a lot of other people feel marginalised and not part of
:55:59. > :56:02.society. I think there needs to be a real engagement in politics. I'm
:56:03. > :56:06.quite strongly Labour and I think Jeremy Corbyn is a really good
:56:07. > :56:09.leader. People spend a lot of time trying to undermine him because he
:56:10. > :56:11.does something different to usual politicians.
:56:12. > :56:16.APPLAUSE You, sir, at the back. Do you think
:56:17. > :56:25.it was irresponsible of Cameron not to negotiate a scenario for a Brexit
:56:26. > :56:29.when he went to negotiate the terms for remaining. He should have done
:56:30. > :56:33.the two things at the same time, so we had two scenarios. I think if
:56:34. > :56:37.there is something that has gone wrong... The problem is that you
:56:38. > :56:42.can't say to people after decades of telling them the EU is not good, in
:56:43. > :56:46.four months, to say to people, actually, not only is it rather good
:56:47. > :56:54.but positively go out and vote for it! That has been a problem we have
:56:55. > :56:59.had in politics. Do you agree? On what aspect? You weren't listening!
:57:00. > :57:03.I was focused on the question about the political class being broken. I
:57:04. > :57:10.don't see how trust in the political class has been broken, I don't see
:57:11. > :57:14.how the answer to that would be to ignore the outcome of a referendum
:57:15. > :57:20.where we have the biggest direct mandate for change certainly in my
:57:21. > :57:23.lifetime. The answer has to be to respect that verdict but make sure
:57:24. > :57:26.and try and find some stronger unity of purpose to go forward in the
:57:27. > :57:35.manner in which we conduct that exit negotiation. One more, from you.
:57:36. > :57:42.With 4% of the world's scientists and 16% of the world's highly
:57:43. > :57:48.respected scientific papers, those rely on ?8.8 billion of EU funding.
:57:49. > :57:53.How do you expect to have a leading role in a world economy if you can't
:57:54. > :58:00.find that research? The funding of research. He is right, but we lost.
:58:01. > :58:04.We have to move on. We have to move on. It's all to play for. I'm sorry,
:58:05. > :58:19.we've come to the end of our hour. We have had a special edition of
:58:20. > :58:24.Question Time. We have the regular edition on Thursday in Preston,
:58:25. > :58:27.after the news. My thanks to our panel and to all of you who came
:58:28. > :59:01.here to Birmingham this evening. From Question Time, good evening.
:59:02. > :59:04.Rolls-Royce Corniche - one of the best of the very best.
:59:05. > :59:09.It may only be half as powerful, a tenth as reliable.