Victoria Derbyshire Debate

:00:08. > :00:12.It is 10am. Good morning. I'm Victoria Derbyshire. Today with just

:00:13. > :00:17.over two weeks to go before the referendum on the future of

:00:18. > :00:28.Scotland, we are live in Dundee. APPLAUSE

:00:29. > :00:38.My name is Steve Burns and I will be voting no. The SNP want a divorce,

:00:39. > :00:41.but they want to continue to use the joint credit card. It is

:00:42. > :00:47.unreasonable. I'm Neil. I'm unemployed, I will be voting yes

:00:48. > :00:55.because I want a better future for my children. I'm Sarah and I'm

:00:56. > :01:01.undecided. This is the hardest decision Scotland had to make and

:01:02. > :01:13.neither side won my vote yet. First, let's bring you the latest

:01:14. > :01:19.news. Thank you. First, let's bring you the latest

:01:20. > :01:26.news. Thank Good morning. I'm Simon McCoy. Too risky and too expensive,

:01:27. > :01:30.the option of building an airport on so-called Boris Island has been

:01:31. > :01:35.officially reject. Boris Johnson described it as a temporary setback.

:01:36. > :01:38.The chair of the airports commission says a network of airports would be

:01:39. > :01:45.a better option for London rather than one large airport.

:01:46. > :01:52.Our view is that one huge airport way out east is not the right answer

:01:53. > :01:55.for London. We think a network of competing airports is likely to

:01:56. > :01:59.produce a better solution for the passengers of London. But also, of

:02:00. > :02:06.course, one has to note that it is a long way away from other centres of

:02:07. > :02:13.population. This is all really a gigantic smoke screen for a U-turn

:02:14. > :02:17.on Heathrow. The great merit of estuary scheme is it is

:02:18. > :02:21.environmentally sensitive and solves our problem in the long-term. What

:02:22. > :02:28.we're careering towards is a third runway at Heathrow followed by a

:02:29. > :02:34.fourth Runway. South Yorkshire Police has announced an

:02:35. > :02:39.investigation into the child sexual exploitation in Rotherham. A report

:02:40. > :02:47.last week suggested that children had suffered abuse over a 16 year

:02:48. > :02:51.period. Labour announced it is suspending three councillors. Labour

:02:52. > :02:58.are suspending four members in Rotherham, three of whom are sitting

:02:59. > :03:08.councillors. One is a former councillor. Now, they go on to say

:03:09. > :03:12.that further action is possible. The Chief Constable and the

:03:13. > :03:21.Director-General of the BBC will before MPs today to answer questions

:03:22. > :03:28.about the police reporting of the search of Sir Cliff Richard's home.

:03:29. > :03:30.They will face members of the Home Affairs Select Committee this

:03:31. > :03:33.afternoon. Prosecutors are reviewing the case

:03:34. > :03:41.against a British couple who removed their ill son from a hospital in

:03:42. > :03:49.Southampton. The Kings' whose son has a brain tumour spent the night

:03:50. > :03:54.in a Spanish hospital. Mr and Mrs King said they took their son abroad

:03:55. > :03:59.because they wanted him to have a treatment not available on the NHS.

:04:00. > :04:04.Nick Clegg said he would like to see the family reunited. This is a

:04:05. > :04:09.family in a state of real anguish who have taken this step of moving

:04:10. > :04:13.their sick child to another country because they think that's what is

:04:14. > :04:17.best for their child. Now, we can debate whether it is or it is not,

:04:18. > :04:21.but that seems to be their motives. Those are not motives I can argue

:04:22. > :04:26.with. I don't think any parent can argue with. That's why I think

:04:27. > :04:32.throwing the full force of the law at Mr and Mrs King who appear to be

:04:33. > :04:39.doing what they believe to be best for their own family, I don't think

:04:40. > :04:42.is an appropriate thing to do. A senior Russian security official

:04:43. > :04:47.says Moscow is reviewing its military strategy because of NATO's

:04:48. > :04:52.response to the Ukraine conflict. The deputy head of the Kremlin

:04:53. > :04:58.advisory Security Council told Russia's news agencies that NATO was

:04:59. > :05:02.ratcheting up tensions by boosting its military presence on Europe's

:05:03. > :05:06.eastern flank. Back to Victoria with the Scotland

:05:07. > :05:18.Debate. Good morning. It is just over two

:05:19. > :05:22.weeks to go until people here in Scotland decide if they want to live

:05:23. > :05:26.in an independent country or stay as part of the United Kingdom. And

:05:27. > :05:29.today, we're here with an audience of 300 voters, you have heard them

:05:30. > :05:40.already. Let's hear them again. We're live in Dundee. I'm Victoria

:05:41. > :05:44.Derbyshire and today, we're broadcasting on Five Live, the BBC

:05:45. > :05:48.News Channel and BBC Two. Our programme is coming from the Caird

:05:49. > :05:53.Hall where according to their website, The Beatles, Frank Sinatra

:05:54. > :06:03.and the Clash have performed. Yes, The Clash have been on this stage

:06:04. > :06:07.and sung Should I Stay Or Should I Go. September 18th is going to be a

:06:08. > :06:13.huge moment in this country as you know. The arguments on currency,

:06:14. > :06:18.nuclear weapons and the impact on the rest of the UK have been raging

:06:19. > :06:22.and let's be clear, change is coming. However, Scotland votes. The

:06:23. > :06:26.purpose of today is to ask as the campaign reaches its climax, how are

:06:27. > :06:32.people living in Scotland going to vote and why? And for those who at

:06:33. > :06:38.this late, late stage still claim to be undecided, what is it that is

:06:39. > :06:43.going to move them one way or the other in the intense final days? The

:06:44. > :06:50.300 people in this room are evenly split between the yeses and the Noes

:06:51. > :06:54.and we have some undecideds too. They have been asked a series of

:06:55. > :06:57.questions to find out more about their potential voting intentions so

:06:58. > :07:01.we have done our best to make sure there is a balanced audience here

:07:02. > :07:10.this morning. And wherever you are in the UK, you can join us too via

:07:11. > :07:16.social media. So a simple question to begin with. Tell us how you're

:07:17. > :07:25.going to vote and why. Good morning. Good morning. My name is Anna and

:07:26. > :07:28.I'm from Perth. I've never done anything like this before. Why are

:07:29. > :07:33.you doing it now then? Because this summer I went to Denmark, a country

:07:34. > :07:37.with my research, I'm a cancer researcher and I looked at this

:07:38. > :07:41.population, four million, fantastic healthcare system. Brilliant

:07:42. > :07:46.education. Excellent quality of life. Higher taxes, but much better

:07:47. > :07:51.salaries and I thought, wait a minute, can Scotland not do this? I

:07:52. > :07:57.went home. I've drilled into the research and do you know what? Yes,

:07:58. > :07:59.we can be an independent prosperous small country. So that's why I'm

:08:00. > :08:09.voting yes. APPLAUSE

:08:10. > :08:15.Good morning. Hello. I'm Dougie and I work in Tesco's and I'm voting no

:08:16. > :08:21.because I don't believe that I have the right because I'm of an age, I'm

:08:22. > :08:26.58 now and I don't think I should be gambling with the future of my

:08:27. > :08:31.cousins and my nephews and the rest of my family. Why do you describe it

:08:32. > :08:38.as gambling? There is no certainty. There is no certainty whatsoever.

:08:39. > :08:42.OK. Everything is guesswork, hope, we think, maybe, maybe not. OK.

:08:43. > :08:45.We'll drill down into a little bit of that later.

:08:46. > :08:55.APPLAUSE Hello. Hi, good morning. Hi. I'm Ellie and

:08:56. > :08:58.I'm from Dundee. I'm undecided, but I'm leaning more towards the yes

:08:59. > :09:01.side. I'm undecided because I feel like when I watch these debates on

:09:02. > :09:04.TV and on the radio, it is more arguing and sniping at each other

:09:05. > :09:08.rather than giving the people the facts that they want to hear that

:09:09. > :09:12.will help them make a decision. But I am leaning more towards yes

:09:13. > :09:16.because I feel like the powers that we don't currently have, we could

:09:17. > :09:19.take them on and be a small, but great country on our own. You're

:09:20. > :09:25.nearly in that yes section, aren't you? You're nearly there, but let me

:09:26. > :09:32.ask you. Are you expecting more facts in the next 16 days? Yeah, I

:09:33. > :09:36.think so. Who from? The media will be showing more coverage as we're

:09:37. > :09:45.getting closer every day now. Hi. Hi. I am a student at Dundee. I just

:09:46. > :09:48.want to stay to the undecided voters. You heard the facts. You

:09:49. > :09:51.have seen both sides, what they're putting down, the cards they're

:09:52. > :09:57.putting on the table. You know what they're both going to say and I

:09:58. > :10:01.think especially as we come close to the referendum, you've #2k3w09 to

:10:02. > :10:04.think with -- got to think with your heart and use your natural instincts

:10:05. > :10:08.and Scotland is a great country and we have the potential to be an even

:10:09. > :10:14.greater country. So I think especially this close you have to go

:10:15. > :10:17.with your natural instincts. OK. Hello. Good morning. Are you going

:10:18. > :10:24.with your natural instincts? Are you going with your heart? No, I am not.

:10:25. > :10:33.Good morning, everybody. I'm Dotty Kennedy. I am a No voter. I would

:10:34. > :10:37.like to say to the undecideds. With independence there is an enormous

:10:38. > :10:41.financial black hole which I'm worried about how we're going to

:10:42. > :10:46.fill and from what I've heard so far, it has been filled by a wing

:10:47. > :10:50.and a prayer perhaps by oil. Perhaps by immigration, but these are all

:10:51. > :10:56.things that we are not certain about. I would ask you to think

:10:57. > :11:01.carefully about that. Dotty UK Plc has a black hole as well. The UK has

:11:02. > :11:05.a deficit, doesn't it? It does. The UK is living beyond its means? But

:11:06. > :11:09.we have lived with a union that worked extremely well and I do not

:11:10. > :11:15.want to go with something that I'm just going with my heart. I'm very

:11:16. > :11:28.Scottish. Very patriotic, but I would rather stay with the UK.

:11:29. > :11:33.APPLAUSE I'm Verity and I'm undecided. How

:11:34. > :11:38.undecided are you? I'm heading towards yes. I'm 80% towards yes

:11:39. > :11:42.partly because of a lot of the negativity and both sides have given

:11:43. > :11:47.negativity, it is not just one, but the gentleman here says he was

:11:48. > :11:54.gambling with the children's future and it was uncertainty. The Better

:11:55. > :11:58.Together Campaign have not said what we will have and what we will get if

:11:59. > :12:00.we stay in the Union. The Yes Campaign have put out a white paper,

:12:01. > :12:03.not everyone agrees with it and Campaign have put out a white paper,

:12:04. > :12:06.not everyone agrees with it like the lady said if I was to vote with my

:12:07. > :12:10.heart, it would have been yes long ago, but I want hard facts.

:12:11. > :12:16.heart, it would have been yes long to know why I'm better in the Union?

:12:17. > :12:20.Why I shouldn't vote yes without anyone attacking the yes side

:12:21. > :12:25.because it has been a constant barrage of negativity. We won't have

:12:26. > :12:31.this or we won't have that. Tell me what I can have. Right, well, why

:12:32. > :12:35.don't we do that right now? Who would like to talk to Verity from

:12:36. > :12:42.this side. Don't all jump at once. Jenny. I'm Jenny Marra. What I would

:12:43. > :12:46.say to Verity is I think all the social progress we have achieved in

:12:47. > :12:50.this country has been done hand-in-hand with our friends, our

:12:51. > :12:56.family in England and Wales. If you think about how we set-up the

:12:57. > :13:00.national Health Service, how we fought fascism together and

:13:01. > :13:03.instigated the minimum wage, better conditions for workers. All these

:13:04. > :13:06.things were done by joining hands with our friends and family across

:13:07. > :13:10.the United Kingdom and across the European Union to make conditions

:13:11. > :13:15.better. Yes, I think Dundee needs to be better. I think more jobs need to

:13:16. > :13:18.come to this city. I think our public services need to be better,

:13:19. > :13:22.but I think we do this within the stronger economy of the United

:13:23. > :13:25.Kingdom because the speaker behind me was right, there is going to be a

:13:26. > :13:31.big financial black hole if we go independent. OK.

:13:32. > :13:43.APPLAUSE Hello. Good morning. I'm from the

:13:44. > :13:50.Dundee Pensioners Forum. I'm undecided. I'm 74. I'm going out the

:13:51. > :13:54.door. I have not heard that - the NHS is terrible just now in

:13:55. > :13:58.Scotland. I'm just out of hospital. Don't make it out to be it is a

:13:59. > :14:02.great NHS, it is not. It is terrible. There is not enough staff

:14:03. > :14:07.at weekends. Everybody knows that. You can't get a porter. I can only

:14:08. > :14:14.say please think before you vote. OK, well you said you are undecided.

:14:15. > :14:19.On that scale of one to ten, one you haven't got a clue. Ten, you're

:14:20. > :14:29.almost there? I'm almost there, yes. Which way? To the no. OK. All right.

:14:30. > :14:33.APPLAUSE OK. Is there any chance of winning

:14:34. > :14:37.somebody like that back? You are a minister in the Scottish Government,

:14:38. > :14:42.an SNP member as well. What would you say to this gentleman? The NHS

:14:43. > :14:45.is very much a cherished institution. It treats hundreds of

:14:46. > :14:48.thousands of people every year. It doesn't always get it right, but it

:14:49. > :14:52.is an institution that we should all be rightly proud of. Going forward

:14:53. > :14:56.in terms of protecting public services, the question is do we

:14:57. > :15:01.think they are more protected in the hands of the Tories, as George

:15:02. > :15:06.Osborne said there is ?25 billion of cuts coming in addition to the cuts

:15:07. > :15:16.we have already had? We depend on funding from the NHS through the

:15:17. > :15:21.Barnet Formula. Any privatisation of the NHS has a direct affect on

:15:22. > :15:25.Scotland... That's disgraceful. I didn't attack you Jenny Marra. In

:15:26. > :15:29.terms of protecting the NHS, the best way to protect the NHS is with

:15:30. > :15:33.a Yes vote so we can take forward the NHS and make sure we continue to

:15:34. > :15:46.fund it in the way that it needs to be funded. I'm Daniel Johnstone. I'm

:15:47. > :15:51.a business owner in Edinburgh. Shona, which year in the last four

:15:52. > :15:56.years has the NHS budget in England gone down? Which year? Any of them?

:15:57. > :16:00.No, none of them. It has gone up year after year. What you just said

:16:01. > :16:04.is not true and very misleading. It is the sort of statement which

:16:05. > :16:07.people are getting sick of in this debate. I think you should be

:16:08. > :16:11.ashamed of yourself. APPLAUSE

:16:12. > :16:15.If you look at what people in England are saying, the Labour Party

:16:16. > :16:19.in England... Up or down? Are talking about privatisation and the

:16:20. > :16:25.threat to the NHS. Is it going up or down? People are on the march to

:16:26. > :16:31.protect the NHS. A Professor who is an expert says the privatisation of

:16:32. > :16:39.the NHS is a threat. Are all these people wrong? It is just not

:16:40. > :16:42.happening. Here is Jo Swinton, a representative of the British

:16:43. > :16:47.Government. It is just not true what you are saying about the NHS. The

:16:48. > :16:51.NHS is a beloved institution that we cherish up and down the UK. It is

:16:52. > :16:55.not something we only love here in Scotland. People in the rest of the

:16:56. > :16:57.country love it, too. It is something which has been protected

:16:58. > :17:00.in terms of the spending year-on-year, despite the difficult

:17:01. > :17:04.times. The bigger threat to the NHS, if Scotland were to become

:17:05. > :17:07.independent, is the fact that the Institute for Fiscal Studies have

:17:08. > :17:10.pointed out there would be a ?6 billion black hole that would need

:17:11. > :17:14.to be found by an independent Scotland and the ability, therefore,

:17:15. > :17:17.of an independent Scotland to fund services like the NHS would be put

:17:18. > :17:20.at risk. Let's hear from this gentlemen. Good

:17:21. > :17:25.morning. APPLAUSE

:17:26. > :17:33.My name is Alistair. I'm a GP in this area. I have worked in the NHS

:17:34. > :17:38.for 36 years. I'm entirely dedicated to it. I think it is a fantastic

:17:39. > :17:42.institution. I would like to address some comments to the undecided. What

:17:43. > :17:46.you have just heard in the last two minutes is probably why most of you

:17:47. > :17:50.are undecided. It is nothing but political bickering and chucking

:17:51. > :17:53.huge financial sums at each other. APPLAUSE

:17:54. > :17:57.What is your point? What I would like to say is I started off this

:17:58. > :18:01.referendum campaign voting no because I was persuaded by some of

:18:02. > :18:04.the economic arguments. I have spoken to GPs in England and

:18:05. > :18:08.patients' representatives in England. They are devastated by what

:18:09. > :18:11.is happening down there. Cancer services are being handed out to

:18:12. > :18:18.private companies. You know what private companies do, in terms of it

:18:19. > :18:22.is profit first, patient second. That cannot be dissputed by anybody.

:18:23. > :18:25.If you want to go home from hospital, Sir, in a Tesco van, in

:18:26. > :18:41.five years' time, you will vote no. My name is Moira. I know a lot about

:18:42. > :18:47.the NHS. I have worked in it for 58 years. Em-- 38 years. I need

:18:48. > :18:51.assurance about the future running of the NHS. At the moment it is

:18:52. > :18:55.shambles. Managers, some of them who have never nursed before, don't know

:18:56. > :18:59.what is going on, on the shop floor and we need to know what is

:19:00. > :19:05.happening. So, what is the assurance that you want? And from whom? More

:19:06. > :19:09.staff. Firstly, more staff. This gentlemen from the Pensioners' Forum

:19:10. > :19:14.is right. He and I know what is going on. The GP knows what is going

:19:15. > :19:19.on? Do you want to know what is going on? Tell us. It is a shambles

:19:20. > :19:25.at the moment. So, I don't know if you can give that guarantee, if you

:19:26. > :19:31.are able to, in the event of a No vote that there be more staff. The

:19:32. > :19:36.national health service in Scotland is completely under the control of

:19:37. > :19:41.the Scottish Parliament. So any problems with the NHS in Scotland

:19:42. > :19:45.has to be at the door of the government in Scotland which is the

:19:46. > :19:48.SNP which has been in power for seven years. I think every public

:19:49. > :19:53.sector institution needs reform to keep it modern. The SNP have done

:19:54. > :20:03.nothing whatsoever in Scotland over the past seven years to reform the

:20:04. > :20:07.NHS. It is in control of the government in Scotland. It is under

:20:08. > :20:13.no threat at all. This lady wants the assurance of more staff in the

:20:14. > :20:18.event of a Yes vote. Talk to her. We have put more staff into the NHS.

:20:19. > :20:22.You haven't. She works there. I accept everything is not perfect but

:20:23. > :20:25.it is a huge institution that is now performing better in terms of

:20:26. > :20:29.waiting lists. The yes is more staff in the convenient of the Yes vote.

:20:30. > :20:33.There are more staff and nurses in the NHS. It is just not happening.

:20:34. > :20:37.Well, there are more staff. The statistics show that. What we

:20:38. > :20:41.obviously have to do is to make sure the staff are in the right places

:20:42. > :20:45.and to make sure on the ground, on the frontline that the staff are

:20:46. > :20:49.there in the wards. What we need to do, though s to keep people -- is to

:20:50. > :20:53.keep people from going into hospital in the first place which is why we

:20:54. > :20:56.are integrating health with social care, to keep older people,

:20:57. > :21:00.particularly, in their own homes instead of a hospital bed which is

:21:01. > :21:05.quite often the wrong and last place an older person needs to be. There

:21:06. > :21:10.is more work to be done. It is not going to improve with a No vote W a

:21:11. > :21:15.Yes vote we will have more resources to invest. There is no more money. I

:21:16. > :21:20.still need to be convinced on that. So, what is going to do that in the

:21:21. > :21:23.next 16 days? I'm worried about you. I'm worried about myself and the

:21:24. > :21:29.NHS. I'm worried about nurse, the day-to-day running. But on voting

:21:30. > :21:39.day - you have heard the responses from both sides, what will happen? I

:21:40. > :21:45.Am swaying towards a yes. Morning. I'm a pharmacist. I live in

:21:46. > :21:49.Aberdeen. I would like to say I'm voting no. Basically in the NHS in

:21:50. > :21:54.Scotland we are actually quite lucky in a sense that I am able to provide

:21:55. > :21:59.service that is my colleagues in England and Wales can't do. I'm able

:22:00. > :22:02.to prescribe medicines on some service that is are funded through

:22:03. > :22:08.the Scottish government. This is due to the security we get from the UK

:22:09. > :22:13.economy. I believe that if we went independent - you may laugh - but if

:22:14. > :22:17.we went independent, I believe there will be a financial backhole as the

:22:18. > :22:19.lady in the front said and we will have a serious problem when it comes

:22:20. > :22:32.to the NHS. OK. We are over here. I'm Gordon Ada.

:22:33. > :22:37.I'm in just outside Dundee -- Adam. I would like to highlight the

:22:38. > :22:42.Scottish National Party's hypocrisy is overwhelming. They spend a

:22:43. > :22:45.fortune, hundreds of millions on private commissions to reduce

:22:46. > :22:48.waiting list initiatives throughout Scotland. Preaching about

:22:49. > :22:54.privatisation is a bit rich. Why are you voting the way you are voting?

:22:55. > :22:58.Why are you voting no? Why am I voting? First and foremost because

:22:59. > :23:08.I'm British as well as Scottish. Here, here. Secondly, because, I

:23:09. > :23:12.believe in preserving over 200,000 workers' jobs in the financial

:23:13. > :23:16.service sector, several thousand jobs in the ship-building industry

:23:17. > :23:19.and 20% of the workforce are employed by companies who are based

:23:20. > :23:24.in England, Northern Ireland and Wales. Would they move? Yes. How

:23:25. > :23:29.many of these companies are going to hang about when they are subjected

:23:30. > :23:34.to new taxation systems, newlations, and new trade barriers? - no

:23:35. > :23:42.regulations. I fear for those jobs and I fear for my country.

:23:43. > :23:50.APPLAUSE I'm Morag. I work in the university

:23:51. > :23:56.here in Dundee. I'm a Scot, I'm a Brit, I'm a European. I'm a

:23:57. > :24:00.humanitarian, feminist and pacifist an awful lot of things but that

:24:01. > :24:04.isn't the factor for me. You can talk about the trouble the Scottish

:24:05. > :24:08.Government has. The Westminster Government doesn't have a monopoly

:24:09. > :24:12.on bad decisions plenty have been made lobely. The important thing --

:24:13. > :24:16.locally. The important thin is by voting yes we put the decisions in

:24:17. > :24:20.the hands of the Scottish Parliament and we let them make the decisions

:24:21. > :24:24.now. Right now they are making those decisions based on the budget they

:24:25. > :24:28.are getting and doing their damnedest. Their best. People talk

:24:29. > :24:32.about lowering taxes. I want to see higher tax that is fund a better

:24:33. > :24:37.quality of life for everyone in this country. OK.

:24:38. > :24:42.APPLAUSE I'm Ivan McKee. I run manufacturing

:24:43. > :24:47.businesses in Scotland, England and across Europe in employing people.

:24:48. > :24:50.The point about business will leave Scotland fp independent, nonsense.

:24:51. > :24:54.People said this before devolution, the businesses are still here.

:24:55. > :24:59.Business will do business where they can make money. Money is there to be

:25:00. > :25:02.made in Scotland. If you look across the last five years, the data we

:25:03. > :25:08.have the facts for, if Scotland had been independent, we had the same

:25:09. > :25:16.percentage of UK spending, as raised in UK taxes, we would have been ?8.5

:25:17. > :25:21.billion better off. If you accepted what Jenny Marra

:25:22. > :25:27.said, as if it was the only country in the world have done all these

:25:28. > :25:31.things. Plenty of other countries in the world have done that. They have

:25:32. > :25:35.better services than us. Please don't talk over each other, or else

:25:36. > :25:39.nobody can hear you. We will continue you the conversation and

:25:40. > :25:44.I'll continue to ask you how you are going to vote and why you are still

:25:45. > :25:50.undecided. We have heard with a lot of the undecided they are leaning

:25:51. > :25:52.heavily one way or the other. Verity mentioned earlier, the negative

:25:53. > :25:58.campaigning. I want to talk about the campaign. I want to ask you

:25:59. > :26:02.whether you think the campaigning has risen to the challenge? Has

:26:03. > :26:07.risen to the occasion? Really interested in your views about this.

:26:08. > :26:14.If we can get a microphone here. Hello. How would you describe the

:26:15. > :26:17.campaign? I think there has been many different layers to the

:26:18. > :26:22.campaign. I'm Philip from Dundee a member of the Socialist Party

:26:23. > :26:24.locally. I have been involved in the socialist campaign for independence.

:26:25. > :26:27.I think in terms of the "yes" side there have been all sorts of

:26:28. > :26:31.different layers. We have been organising public meetings up and

:26:32. > :26:34.down the country with people like Tommy Sheridan speaking, putting a

:26:35. > :26:38.case for how the powers of independence can be used to end

:26:39. > :26:42.poverty and austerity. I have to laugh when I hear Jo Swinton and

:26:43. > :26:47.Jenny Marra make the case with social progress? What social

:26:48. > :26:50.progress is it, with 1 million people using food banks over the

:26:51. > :26:53.last three years. APPLAUSE

:26:54. > :26:57.What kind of social progress do we have with record numbers of zero

:26:58. > :27:03.hour contracts, fallen wages, benefit cuts that are destroying

:27:04. > :27:07.lives and families. I till, I'm not just -- I tell you, I'm not just

:27:08. > :27:11.speaking for myself. Hundreds of people are voting yes to escape from

:27:12. > :27:15.austerity and cuts. We need to ensure that the powers of

:27:16. > :27:18.independence are used to end these 21st century scandals by

:27:19. > :27:21.distributing wealth from the elite and big business, to ordinary

:27:22. > :27:26.working people. CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

:27:27. > :27:30.Before we get some more views. I would very much like to ask you what

:27:31. > :27:34.you have made of the campaigning, but as a broad and clearly

:27:35. > :27:39.unscientific snapshot. And do answer with a loud, yes or no, who here

:27:40. > :27:43.feels they have been able it get straight -- to get straight-forward

:27:44. > :27:51.facts and information. NO.

:27:52. > :27:56.As I said unscientific but I would say more noes than yeses. How would

:27:57. > :28:01.you describe the campaign? Has it risen to the occasion? It is a

:28:02. > :28:04.serious moment. It is excessive. The reason why we are sitting here is

:28:05. > :28:09.because of the amount of bickering that has happened from both sided.

:28:10. > :28:13.We are, not just in this section, but across the country, we are the

:28:14. > :28:17.votes that can swing your way or your way, you are not convincing us,

:28:18. > :28:22.you are bickering, causing issues. We want you to be upfront, honest to

:28:23. > :28:27.make the decision which is the best for Scotland. How undecided are you,

:28:28. > :28:31.really? Most people have said, seven or eight. I'm still sitting at a 1.

:28:32. > :28:36.I'm probably the only 1 that's completely... You really don't vb a

:28:37. > :28:41.clue -- don't have a clue? I could either sit on my house or worse, go

:28:42. > :28:46.down there and write down, "undecided" which would really annoy

:28:47. > :28:49.a lot of people. Has the campaign not been long enough for you? It's

:28:50. > :28:54.went on a while. All right. In the next two weeks,

:28:55. > :28:58.what are you hoping to hear that you haven't heard in 18 months?. For me

:28:59. > :29:03.it is tuition fooes and the -- fees and the NHS. I fear if I bring that

:29:04. > :29:07.up again, the bickering is going to start. You will have to do your own

:29:08. > :29:14.research. Hello, good morning. I'm Tim Allan. I'm a private

:29:15. > :29:19.business owner in Dundee. I'm a no voter. We have spent ?150 million so

:29:20. > :29:23.far developing the waterfront here. I have employed hundreds of men for

:29:24. > :29:27.the last eight years working down here in Dundee. It is a great city.

:29:28. > :29:31.One of myp complaints about the -- my complaints about the campaign,

:29:32. > :29:36.and I will address this to the undecided. Some might remember a

:29:37. > :29:41.film called the Usual Suspects. The greatest trick the devil pulled is

:29:42. > :29:44.making you believe it didn't exist. The greatest trick the SNP have been

:29:45. > :29:49.doing, is telling the same lies long enough and loud enough to object if

:29:50. > :29:54.I skate the matters. Everybody is hungry for facts. I am

:29:55. > :30:01.a founder and director of a company in England. All the management is

:30:02. > :30:04.Scotland. They move their pension fund away from Scotland, because of

:30:05. > :30:07.the uncertainty of the capital situation up here. So actually this

:30:08. > :30:09.erosion of our economy is taking place now because of the pernicious

:30:10. > :30:20.campaign run by the Yes campaign. campaign run by the

:30:21. > :30:24.A pernicious campaign? Morning, I'm goery Phillips I'm Dundee and I'm

:30:25. > :30:29.votingle. I would say that -- voting yes. I would say the greatest issue

:30:30. > :30:35.out of this is that unyooists politicians are not entightling

:30:36. > :30:42.their constituents to have the facts by acting out of their own interests

:30:43. > :30:47.and impartiality. Who wants to respond to that? I'm a student at

:30:48. > :30:52.the University of Edinburgh. I am a No voter, but I have found it very

:30:53. > :30:57.frustrating... Why are you in the undecided section then? I am a No

:30:58. > :31:05.voter, but I find it frustrating the way the No Campaign presents people

:31:06. > :31:09.voting yes. What the gentleman said about benefits cuts, these are

:31:10. > :31:16.concerns, but the way it is portrayed in the media. It is as if

:31:17. > :31:19.they are just nationalists, no, they want independence for legitimate

:31:20. > :31:25.reasons. I have plenty of friends who are left leaning, but feel the

:31:26. > :31:30.Better Together And other campaigns don't do them justice. Talk to the

:31:31. > :31:40.Better Together people. They are right here. I agree with a lot of

:31:41. > :31:48.what you are saying. We all want a better Scotland. We all want more

:31:49. > :31:56.jobs. Sorry, you're not answering his point. We do need to talk about

:31:57. > :32:00.how devolution might work. All three pro-European parties do have

:32:01. > :32:06.concrete black and white proposals, all similar... His point was the

:32:07. > :32:11.Better Together Campaign have been portraying people... What I want to

:32:12. > :32:18.talk more about... Why don't you just tell him. The man has concerns

:32:19. > :32:24.about social and justice. Patrick. Patrick you have concerns. Sorry,

:32:25. > :32:32.can we address his point? He doesn't like the way you have run your

:32:33. > :32:36.campaign. Talk to him. It is the way it is portrayed in the media and the

:32:37. > :32:44.way Better Together ran the media campaign. The way young people feel

:32:45. > :32:50.dis-I I -I illusioned. You can strive for social justice and be

:32:51. > :32:54.young and vote no. Dennis Canavan, we haven't heard from you. Good

:32:55. > :33:00.morning. My name is Dennis Canavan. I used to be a Labour MP at

:33:01. > :33:11.Westminster and then an Independent MSP in the Scottish Parliament. I

:33:12. > :33:21.chair the advisory board of the Yes Scotland Campaign. We have chaired a

:33:22. > :33:27.Scotland with higher social justice and a Scotland that would put more

:33:28. > :33:31.importance on welfare rather than warfare by getting rid of nuclear

:33:32. > :33:34.weapons in Scotland. APPLAUSE OK,

:33:35. > :33:38.we're going to talk more. We've got another hour of conversing to do. Do

:33:39. > :33:41.stay with us. This is Five Live, BBC Two and the BBC News Channel and in

:33:42. > :33:45.the next half an hour, we're going to talk more about the issues that

:33:46. > :33:50.are outstanding. So many of them as you have heard so far today. We're

:33:51. > :33:54.going to talk about the polls and an area which has less attention than

:33:55. > :33:58.the others. What Scotland might look like if there is a No vote. We have

:33:59. > :34:01.a representative of the UK Government and a represent of the

:34:02. > :34:07.Scottish Government here as well. You're welcome to join us using

:34:08. > :34:12.social media. The hashtag is Scotland decides. It is time for

:34:13. > :34:17.latest news. I am Simon McCoy. South Yorkshire

:34:18. > :34:22.Police announced an investigation into the force's handling of an

:34:23. > :34:28.investigation into child sexual exploitation. An investigation last

:34:29. > :34:34.week revealed that 1600 children had suffered abuse over a 14 year

:34:35. > :34:39.period. Ross Hawkins has more. Labour have announced this morning

:34:40. > :34:48.that they are suspending four of their members in Rotherham. Three of

:34:49. > :34:54.whom are sitting counsellors. One is a former councillor. Now, they go on

:34:55. > :35:06.to say that further action is possible. Too risky and too

:35:07. > :35:12.expensive is the opinion on building an airport on the so-called Boris

:35:13. > :35:14.Island. The chair of the airport's commission said a network of

:35:15. > :35:20.airports would be a better option for London rather than one large

:35:21. > :35:26.hub. Our view is that one huge airport way out east is not the

:35:27. > :35:30.right answer for London. We think a network of competing airports is

:35:31. > :35:34.likely to produce a better solution for the passengers of London. But

:35:35. > :35:39.also, of course, one has to note that it is a long way away from

:35:40. > :35:45.other centres of population. This is all really a gigantic smoke screen

:35:46. > :35:49.for a U-turn on Heathrow. The merit of the estuary scheme is it is

:35:50. > :35:54.environmentally sensitive. It solves our problem in the long-term. What

:35:55. > :35:59.we are really careering towards is a third runway at Heathrow followed

:36:00. > :36:02.then by a fourth runway. South Yorkshire's Chief Constable

:36:03. > :36:07.and the Director-General of the BBC will appear before MPs today to

:36:08. > :36:14.answer questions about the Corporation's reporting of a police

:36:15. > :36:19.search of Sir Cliff Richard's home. The force head and BBC boss will

:36:20. > :36:22.face members of the Home Affairs Select Committee this afternoon.

:36:23. > :36:30.Prosecutors are reviewing the case against a British couple who removed

:36:31. > :36:34.their seriously ill son from hospital in Southampton. Mr and Mrs

:36:35. > :36:41.King spent the night in a Spanish prison after they refused to return

:36:42. > :36:45.to the UK. Mr and Mrs King say they took their son abroad because they

:36:46. > :36:49.wanted him to have a treatment not available on the NHS. This is a

:36:50. > :36:53.family in a state of real anguish who have taken this step of moving

:36:54. > :36:57.their sick child to another country because they think that's what is

:36:58. > :37:00.best for their child. Now, we can debate whether it is or it is not,

:37:01. > :37:05.but that seems to be their motives and those are not motives that I can

:37:06. > :37:11.argue with. Nick Clegg. That's a summary of the news. Now, it is back

:37:12. > :37:16.to Victoria in Dundee. Will Scotland vote to stay or quit

:37:17. > :37:20.the United Kingdom after one of the longest referendum campaigns ever? I

:37:21. > :37:25.have spoken to a couple of people in the last few days who say it hasn't

:37:26. > :37:28.been long enough, but maybe that's just Dundee. We will have the answer

:37:29. > :37:35.to that in over a couple of weeks time. Ahead of that result, we're

:37:36. > :37:43.broadcasting on the BBC News Channel and BBC Two and on Five Live with an

:37:44. > :37:46.audience of 300 voters live in Dundee.

:37:47. > :37:52.APPLAUSE Let me read some messages on Twitter

:37:53. > :37:57.and text messages from people listening around the country.

:37:58. > :38:01."Scotland, it is a divorce, plain and simple. Scotland should accept

:38:02. > :38:08.its fair share of the UK debt as it leaves the house." This listener

:38:09. > :38:15.says, "We, as a people, are not going to change overnight. Why

:38:16. > :38:22.should we be afraid of that." The Caird Hall looks stunning. My dad

:38:23. > :38:26.saw Sinatra play there in 1963. John in Devon says there is a silver

:38:27. > :38:31.lining if the Scots decide to stand on their own two feet. The Labour

:38:32. > :38:38.Party will become unelectable in England. That would be beneficial to

:38:39. > :38:45.me. Roger is an ex-pat Scot in Exeter. How is Scotland proposing to

:38:46. > :38:50.patrol its waters? The question on the ballot paper would be this -

:38:51. > :38:56.should Scotland be an independent country? What have the polls been

:38:57. > :39:05.suggesting? Professor John Curtis is it here from Strathclyde University,

:39:06. > :39:10.and also Brian Taylor and people will not know, you two have

:39:11. > :39:16.performed in here as a child. Oh, thanks a bunch! I was a boy soprano,

:39:17. > :39:24.but I drifted. I appeared on the stage with the BBC Choir. I won't

:39:25. > :39:29.ask you to reprice it now? When I was an infant. I am a supporter of

:39:30. > :39:31.Dundee United Football Club. APPLAUSE

:39:32. > :39:33.John Curtis, we're going to talk about the polls and there is another

:39:34. > :39:38.one out today. A health warning, first of all, this referendum has no

:39:39. > :39:41.precedent, it is difficult to predict the outcome of an

:39:42. > :39:45.referendum, the pollsters don't have anything to measure their poll

:39:46. > :39:48.results against, do they? You are correct. The challenge this

:39:49. > :39:52.referendum poses is a substantial one. Normally pollsters learn from

:39:53. > :40:00.their previous mistakes. If they make a mistake at the previous

:40:01. > :40:03.election, they try to correct it next time around. This issue has

:40:04. > :40:09.never been put to Scottish voters before and it does pose the

:40:10. > :40:15.pollsters with a challenge which is rather greater than trying to

:40:16. > :40:20.estimate what is going to happen in an election. The polls might be red,

:40:21. > :40:24.but we shouldn't be absorbed by them. What have the polls been

:40:25. > :40:28.suggesting? We have had 81 opinion polls that have posed the question

:40:29. > :40:31.should Scotland be an independent country? Since the question is to

:40:32. > :40:36.appear on the ballot paper was settled in February of last year. Of

:40:37. > :40:41.those polls, 80 have put the no side ahead and that's the reason why the

:40:42. > :40:46.no side are the odds on favourites to win. That said however, point

:40:47. > :40:50.number one is the polls have disagreed with each other about how

:40:51. > :40:58.far the no side are ahead and some have long said no, it is around 45,

:40:59. > :41:05.46, 47% for the yes side, it is a narrow race. Other polls have tended

:41:06. > :41:10.to suggest, no, it is around 41%, 42% for yes and it looks as if it is

:41:11. > :41:14.over. Well, the health warning is the more recent polls, over the last

:41:15. > :41:18.two or three weeks have been suggesting that perhaps tz yes side

:41:19. > :41:21.have been making further progress. In particular, we have a poll, it is

:41:22. > :41:25.only one poll, but it is an interesting poll, from a polling

:41:26. > :41:31.organisation YouGov which has been one of the pollsters which has been

:41:32. > :41:36.putting it around the 41%, 42%, this morning saying that yes are at 47%,

:41:37. > :41:45.if you take the average of a last half a dozen opinion polls, we are

:41:46. > :41:48.looking at yes at 45% and no at 55%. So certainly, no are still ahead,

:41:49. > :41:52.but it looks as though the yes side may have gained some momentum in the

:41:53. > :41:57.last two or three weeks and that's the reason why this last fortnight

:41:58. > :42:00.both sides are going to fight this campaign very hard indeed because

:42:01. > :42:05.the no side can't now be sure of winning and the yes side still have

:42:06. > :42:09.hope that they can pull it off. These people sitting behind you,

:42:10. > :42:16.again, we heard some leaning one way or the way. How crucial will the

:42:17. > :42:24.undecideds be? There is not many people left who say, "I have no idea

:42:25. > :42:28.at all." People in Scotland lie on a spectrum of indecision. Some people

:42:29. > :42:32.made their minds up years ago and will never change. There are still

:42:33. > :42:41.people who say, "I think I'm going to vote yes, but maybe I'll vote no,

:42:42. > :42:46.but are saying I'm not there, I might change my mind. " They are not

:42:47. > :42:50.talking to voters who have no idea of what they are going to do. If the

:42:51. > :42:54.yes side are going to succeed in persuading some of the folk behind

:42:55. > :42:57.me to vote no, they will have to change their minds and if the no

:42:58. > :43:02.side are going to make ground, they are going to have to persuade other

:43:03. > :43:06.people behind me who are thinking of voting yes that they should vote no.

:43:07. > :43:09.That's a difficult job for both campaigns than talking to people who

:43:10. > :43:13.have no idea at all. And the turnout? Well, it looks as if the

:43:14. > :43:18.one piece of good news that perhaps everybody in this room could embrace

:43:19. > :43:22.and accept as being good news is that we're going to get a high

:43:23. > :43:26.turnout in the referendum. What is crucial, is that both sides accept

:43:27. > :43:30.that this referendum result, whatever it is, does represent the

:43:31. > :43:42.collective judgement of Scotland's voters and the higher the turnout,

:43:43. > :43:46.the more if we get 80% turnout, the argument will be clearly won. Brian

:43:47. > :43:50.Taylor, what are you expecting from both campaigns in the last few days?

:43:51. > :43:55.The question is should Scotland be an independent country? But there is

:43:56. > :44:02.a second question lurking in the shadows, is what sort of Scotland

:44:03. > :44:10.would that independent Scotland be? It could be a gal tarian, it could

:44:11. > :44:17.be the opposite. There is no reason why an independent should go down

:44:18. > :44:20.the Galatarian route. We are discussing what would happen with

:44:21. > :44:26.the powers and it is the secondary argue the that is causing the

:44:27. > :44:29.discussion. You have a discussion about the bold facts and figures of

:44:30. > :44:34.independence, but at the same time you have a discussion about the NHS

:44:35. > :44:38.and about the future of the welfare system and it is those questions

:44:39. > :44:43.which are secondary to the question of independence. It is the secondary

:44:44. > :44:45.questions that grab the interest of the voters and the viewers and

:44:46. > :44:49.listeners to this programme. They want to hear what would happen with

:44:50. > :44:59.independence and that's why you have almost on both sides, it is phishers

:45:00. > :45:05.within the argument. This isn't an election. It is not an election

:45:06. > :45:09.where people are putting forward a manifesto for one side, two, three,

:45:10. > :45:13.four other parties and people judge between those. It is a single

:45:14. > :45:18.proposition, should Scotland be an independent country? You either

:45:19. > :45:23.endorse that or you negate that and that's where the tensions lie. To

:45:24. > :45:27.those who say it has been bickering and argumentative, hey, welcome to

:45:28. > :45:32.politics. These are tough, hard, decisions, you don't settle the

:45:33. > :45:38.future of a country which a group hug. You have got to have a tough

:45:39. > :45:43.argument. How would you describe the tone of the edate? -- debate The

:45:44. > :45:46.accusation that the Better Together side have been negative, I think

:45:47. > :45:50.misses the point. They are seeking to negate a proposition. So

:45:51. > :45:53.understandably they put forward things that say - independence is

:45:54. > :45:57.not a particularly good idea. At the same time, they have sought to put

:45:58. > :46:01.forward alternatives but it is alternatives, plural, which I think

:46:02. > :46:06.perhaps has been the problem for them at some point. There isn't a

:46:07. > :46:12.single coherent offer. We say - we heard it said earlier, it is the

:46:13. > :46:17.overlap, at diagram at points, there isn't a single offer. The gentlemen

:46:18. > :46:23.from the Socialist Party might take a different perspective from some in

:46:24. > :46:26.the SNP, who might take a different look at what would happen, after

:46:27. > :46:30.independence. The problem is independence, you either endorse it

:46:31. > :46:36.or negate it. Good morning. I'm the student

:46:37. > :46:41.president at Aberdeen University at Dundee. On a personal capacity I

:46:42. > :46:44.would vote yes but in terms of representing stuntsd and young

:46:45. > :46:47.people within the city, I think it is positive to see so many

:46:48. > :46:50.schoolchildren or young adults, as they might want to be called and

:46:51. > :46:54.really positive that they are engaging in this debate. I think

:46:55. > :46:57.some of the points that Brian was making there, this is less about

:46:58. > :47:01.party politics, this is more about what people have said earlier about

:47:02. > :47:05.people's futures. Have you found that to be quite that sort of

:47:06. > :47:10.soul-searching - what kind of a country do I want to live in, that

:47:11. > :47:13.has been healthy? I think it has been healthy, as like, a 20-year-old

:47:14. > :47:19.who has never experienced that within politics before, in my

:47:20. > :47:23.lifetime. I think these debates and these campaigns have brought that to

:47:24. > :47:27.light and brought that young people - that's what politics should be

:47:28. > :47:32.about. And kind of, I don't know, fearful, if it is a No vote and we

:47:33. > :47:35.go down the route of a Westminster Government, will 16 and 17-year-olds

:47:36. > :47:39.be given the franchise, is that a possibility in the future? I think

:47:40. > :47:43.this debate and this campaign has demonstrated that young people are,

:47:44. > :47:47.you know, it is their future and their country that they want to be a

:47:48. > :47:48.part of. I think it is really important in politics going forward.

:47:49. > :47:59.APPLAUSE I think it is very important for

:48:00. > :48:07.people to realise that the "yes" Scotland campaign is not simply an

:48:08. > :48:14.SNP campaign. It feels like it to some people.

:48:15. > :48:22.A yes vote in the referendum is not a vote Alex Salmond or any

:48:23. > :48:27.particular politician. A yes vote in the referendum is a vote for a

:48:28. > :48:31.better Scotland and there is an absolute guarantee that Scotland

:48:32. > :48:34.will be governed by a government, elected by the people of Scotland

:48:35. > :48:38.and ask theable to the people of -- elected by the people of Scotland

:48:39. > :48:44.and accountable to the people of Scotland instead of what we have

:48:45. > :48:52.now. A Tory coalition which the magnificent total of one, one member

:48:53. > :48:59.representing Scotland. OK. Hello, good morning. I'm Frances. I

:49:00. > :49:04.am voting no. I think Brian Taylor has highlighted the real crux of the

:49:05. > :49:09.matter - what of the future? Not our future but our children's future, as

:49:10. > :49:13.regards to nationalism. Because, although we are being told

:49:14. > :49:20.continually that it is not a vote for the SNP, if we vote yes, let's

:49:21. > :49:25.be logical about it. The SNP really are the only one in a position, at

:49:26. > :49:31.the moment, to put forward a government. And they will definitely

:49:32. > :49:37.be voted in the next one because they have the machinery and also

:49:38. > :49:45.because they have this - if you are not for us, you are against us -

:49:46. > :49:55.attitude. All right, well, sorry... Have we looked at what does

:49:56. > :50:01.nationalism mean? Why do you rule the world nationalism out? Because

:50:02. > :50:06.it has caused wars. Family against... That's the history. I'm

:50:07. > :50:09.not talking about Scottish nationalism. Nationalism in general.

:50:10. > :50:14.What are the Scots? We are a mixture. We have come from all areas

:50:15. > :50:19.and parts of the world and yet we get people saying - the English have

:50:20. > :50:29.done this to us and they have done that to us. You cannot deny it.

:50:30. > :50:35.BOOS Would you like to respond? I was

:50:36. > :50:41.fwhorn Redcar near Middlesbrough. Born in England. My mum is a

:50:42. > :50:46.Manchester lady. My sister is up visiting now. A bigger "yes"

:50:47. > :50:50.supporter you could not find. It is not about nationalism. Or ethnicity.

:50:51. > :50:54.It is about the future of our country. Everybody in this country,

:50:55. > :50:58.wherever they are from, can join together to make Scotland the better

:50:59. > :51:01.place that we know it can be. That is what is going to happen on 18th

:51:02. > :51:06.September. CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

:51:07. > :51:11.Shona Robison, as a representative of the Scottish Government, I want

:51:12. > :51:14.to ask you - so we are clear - when Alex Salmond says an independent

:51:15. > :51:18.Scotland will use the pound come what may, do you accept that Mr

:51:19. > :51:22.Cameron and Mr Miliband and Mr Clegg could keep their promise to veto a

:51:23. > :51:26.formal currency union? Well, they are not saying that we can't use the

:51:27. > :51:30.pound. I want it establish that and everybody accepts that. What the

:51:31. > :51:34.debate is about, is about a formal currency union. What we have said is

:51:35. > :51:37.that part of the discussion, about the assets and liabilities of the

:51:38. > :51:42.UK, we are more than prepared to take on our share of debt - which

:51:43. > :51:45.should be about ?100 billion, ?5 billion servicing that debt every

:51:46. > :51:49.year. Are you accepting that they could keep their promise and pledge

:51:50. > :51:55.and veto that? We don't believe they will, because what I'm about to tell

:51:56. > :51:59.you is... So all three are bluffing? I believe it is part of the

:52:00. > :52:03.campaign. Why would you not want to have Scotland take on a share of the

:52:04. > :52:07.debt? Why would you want to impose that on England, Wales and Northern

:52:08. > :52:11.Ireland? There is an opportunity it here to go forward in a currency

:52:12. > :52:15.union. We absolutely believe that is what will happen. You would use the

:52:16. > :52:20.pound without a formal currency union? We will, nobody can stop us,

:52:21. > :52:24.but we are confident there will be a currency union. It makes sense for

:52:25. > :52:30.businesses north and south of the border. Jo Swinton, can I ask you

:52:31. > :52:34.first - why do so many people think your boss, and your other boss, are

:52:35. > :52:38.bluffing? I think this is - I think wishful thinking. I mean it is not

:52:39. > :52:41.even about the politicians. It is about the voters in Manchester or in

:52:42. > :52:46.Cornwall and why they would want their politicians in what would be

:52:47. > :52:50.the rest of the UK, to agree to be the lender of last resort for a

:52:51. > :52:55.totally foreign country? There is no reason why that would be the case.

:52:56. > :52:58.APPLAUSE Without having any say over how

:52:59. > :53:02.those banks, for example, would be regulated. So, yes, Scotland could

:53:03. > :53:10.use the pound in the way Panama uses the dollar, but we wouldn't have the

:53:11. > :53:14.savings in our banks being dump backed up by lender of last resort.

:53:15. > :53:18.It is irresponsible for a potential independent Scotland to suggest it

:53:19. > :53:24.wouldn't pay its debts. That wouldp send sky high interest rates and

:53:25. > :53:27.affect mortgages and bills. I want it follow this through. Let's

:53:28. > :53:32.imagine for a moment those Westminster politicians mean it - no

:53:33. > :53:37.formal currency union. So and Scotland uses the pound without that

:53:38. > :53:43.formal agreement, you wouldn't have a Central Bank, no lender of last

:53:44. > :53:49.resort. No ability to print your money. You have already said you

:53:50. > :53:55.would not take your share of the debt so. International investors may

:53:56. > :53:59.not lend you money. There are two scenarios. I'm putting the first one

:54:00. > :54:04.now. Potentially big banks could leave Scotland, potentially you

:54:05. > :54:08.would have to cut public spending dramatically. Is that a fair

:54:09. > :54:12.summation? Let's take that scenario that Scotland would be debt-free.

:54:13. > :54:17.Why would you be debt-free? You would have to borrow to maintain the

:54:18. > :54:23.levels of public spending? If we don't have that, initially we would

:54:24. > :54:28.be in surplus. And therefore the credit rating...

:54:29. > :54:34.ALL TALK AT ONCE One of the biggest credit rating

:54:35. > :54:38.agents have said Scotland would have a top rating because of its

:54:39. > :54:41.financial position. But can I say about the currency union - we

:54:42. > :54:45.believe there would be a currency union. Why would you want to saddle

:54:46. > :54:48.the rest of the UK with additional debt, Jo, it doesn't make sense? Why

:54:49. > :54:52.would a Government turn around to its people and say - we are going to

:54:53. > :54:56.saddle you with additional debt. In terms of the default, there would be

:54:57. > :54:59.no default because the UK Government has already said it is legally

:55:00. > :55:03.liable to the debt. It has issued that to the market there. Would be

:55:04. > :55:07.no default. We are happy to take on our share but there has to be a

:55:08. > :55:14.discussion of liabilities, as well as assets. The UK Government has

:55:15. > :55:18.responsibly made sure that there is confidence in the UK economy in

:55:19. > :55:22.terms of the fact that as a country we will make sure the debts are

:55:23. > :55:26.paid. As a Scottish Government, coming into and state, that would

:55:27. > :55:30.already face a challenge of credibility as a new country that

:55:31. > :55:35.didn't, therefore, have a track record, if its first act was to say,

:55:36. > :55:38.we are not going to pay our debts, our fair share, frankly, that would

:55:39. > :55:40.be catastrophic for the Scottish economy.

:55:41. > :55:45.APPLAUSE We will bring someone else in. We

:55:46. > :55:50.will pay our fair share. Introduce yourself. I don't know why they

:55:51. > :55:56.don't get it. One of your persons put in before saying - if you leave

:55:57. > :56:01.the house you don't take some of the liabilities. If you are don't own

:56:02. > :56:04.part of the house, then you are not responsibility for the mortgage. In

:56:05. > :56:07.a situation where we are not taking part of the assets, we will not be

:56:08. > :56:10.responsibility for those liabilities, that's the reality of

:56:11. > :56:13.what would it be. As far as the markets are concerned, the markets

:56:14. > :56:17.will lend to people that have the capacity to pay back, and if we are

:56:18. > :56:19.not saddled with a huge debt, if anything, you will get more

:56:20. > :56:23.favourable terms from the market. One final point that Brian said

:56:24. > :56:27.earlier - he said we weren't sure what we are going to get. What we

:56:28. > :56:29.are going to get, is whatever the people of Scotland decide we want to

:56:30. > :56:33.get. This is all about whether we people of Scotland decide we want to

:56:34. > :56:36.have the confidence to stand on our own two feet, make our own

:56:37. > :56:40.decisions, use our own resources for the benefit of this country or

:56:41. > :56:44.whether we are happy to let somebody else carry on making the mess that

:56:45. > :56:48.they have done n previous decades. APPLAUSE

:56:49. > :56:52.If it is your country, why does it matter on both sides? It matters for

:56:53. > :56:55.those advocating independence because they are seeking to offer

:56:56. > :56:58.reassurance, it is a much bigger version of retaining the Queen in an

:56:59. > :57:02.independent Scotland. It is stressing that there will be

:57:03. > :57:09.elements of continue uity, elements of reassurance. Why is it an acute

:57:10. > :57:11.dilemma for Salmond is? He wishes to offer that reassurance, he knows

:57:12. > :57:18.people welcome the pound sterling and wish to keep T but to do so, he

:57:19. > :57:22.requires endorsement from those in whose political interests it lies to

:57:23. > :57:26.say a currency union will not take place. It is a dilemma for the First

:57:27. > :57:30.Minister and those advocating independence more generally. I'm

:57:31. > :57:34.from Newcastle originally but I have lived in Dundee for a few years.

:57:35. > :57:37.from Newcastle originally but I have am undecided. Do I want to live in

:57:38. > :57:39.from Newcastle originally but I have country where it is more

:57:40. > :57:45.democratically accountable? Yes. Do I want to live in a country where

:57:46. > :57:49.the country is friends and still friends that it formally was? Yes. I

:57:50. > :57:52.think it is atrocious the way the UK Government, I'm talking about

:57:53. > :57:56.Westminster, has acted in letting Scotland rip itself apart and become

:57:57. > :58:00.more decided. -- divided. It is up to Scottish people. Of course it is.

:58:01. > :58:03.But I'm saying the way the UK Government has acted in saying -

:58:04. > :58:06.take your referendum and go fight about it, there has not been a

:58:07. > :58:13.mature political debate coming from Westminster at all. They are handing

:58:14. > :58:17.the keys and going - do whatever you want. What is going to help you

:58:18. > :58:21.decide in the next couple of weeks? I would like to see more goodwill

:58:22. > :58:24.from Westminster. Let's assume that doesn't happen, just for the

:58:25. > :58:29.purposes of this conversation. Who are you listening to? Is it your

:58:30. > :58:34.mum? Your partner, your sister, what is it? All women there I would

:58:35. > :58:41.happily listen to any woman. There is enough of them in this room. With

:58:42. > :58:46.my heart, I have generally feel I'm leaning more towards yes but I would

:58:47. > :58:52.like to see more reassurance and less scaremongering.

:58:53. > :59:00.OK. Do you have a point here? You are on, good morning. I'm Martin,

:59:01. > :59:05.I'm from Dundee, obviously. Are you reading that off your notepad? In

:59:06. > :59:11.case you forget your name. Welcome. I would like to he it Tait the

:59:12. > :59:14.statement from 65 top be academics relating to higher educating funding

:59:15. > :59:18.in an independent Scotland. Universities thrive in Scotland and

:59:19. > :59:21.in no small part thanks to lots of research funding from British

:59:22. > :59:26.institutions and bodies and EU funding as well. If we take that

:59:27. > :59:29.away from our students, we deny our brightest academics the chance to

:59:30. > :59:35.pursue research degrees. We also go back to the kind of - sort of

:59:36. > :59:39.elitist financially-p driven education system we have been trying

:59:40. > :59:43.to undo for the last 300 years. This is more complaints and bodies coming

:59:44. > :59:49.through regarding funding. I would like to put to our MSP who said they

:59:50. > :59:53.can't all be wrong. We have 65 be a domestics this week coming out with

:59:54. > :59:57.200 business owners last week. We have had every economist under the

:59:58. > :00:01.sun. It is not economically viable whatsoever.

:00:02. > :00:05.There is no point shouting, unless you have a microphone. Briefly, we

:00:06. > :00:09.have the news. We have had lots of businesses coming forward, backing

:00:10. > :00:14.independence and academics for Yes, have made the point that Scottish

:00:15. > :00:16.universities being so brilliant as they are, will continue to attract

:00:17. > :00:22.the research funding, not just across the UK but from Europe and

:00:23. > :00:26.beyond, in a common research area. Cancer Research UK says it doesn't

:00:27. > :00:30.matter what the outcome of the referendum is, because they'll still

:00:31. > :00:42.continue to invest research in the fantastic institutions we have here

:00:43. > :00:47.in Scotland and quite, right, so. Sir Philip Cohen which set up the

:00:48. > :00:50.life sciences is completely against the proposition of independence for

:00:51. > :00:53.his research funding. People at Dundee University told me that

:00:54. > :00:58.independence would be the mother of all disasters for the cancer

:00:59. > :01:04.research, and diabetes research and the local economy in this city.

:01:05. > :01:12.We're coming up to the news. You have been very patient. I'm John

:01:13. > :01:17.Mackay. I take part in the Business for Scotland Campaign in Glasgow. I

:01:18. > :01:22.want to thank Tim for calling me pernicious. I take exception to

:01:23. > :01:27.that. I wanted to address, if you let me go back to your original

:01:28. > :01:30.question about how has the campaign been con ducted, am I satisfied with

:01:31. > :01:35.it? I am satisfied with the Yes Campaign. That doesn't surprise me

:01:36. > :01:40.at all. On the ground, it has been fantastic. What I am unhappy about

:01:41. > :01:45.is the campaign in the media and I'm unhappy about BBC Radio Scotland and

:01:46. > :01:50.their lack of impartiality. I'm particularly... I don't work for BBC

:01:51. > :01:53.Radio Scotland. If they were here, they would defend themselves. In

:01:54. > :02:03.relation to that, I take exception to the BBC paying licence fee payers

:02:04. > :02:07.money to the CBI, I take great exception to that. Thank you. Well,

:02:08. > :02:12.it is just after 11am. I'm Victoria Derbyshire. As the clock ticks down

:02:13. > :02:14.to Scotland's historic vote on its future, this morning, we are live in

:02:15. > :02:25.Dundee. Good morning. I'm Simon McCoy.

:02:26. > :02:28.A summary of the news. Too risky and too expensive - the

:02:29. > :02:31.option of building an airport on so-called Boris Island in the Thames

:02:32. > :02:33.Estuary has been officially rejected. London Mayor, Boris

:02:34. > :02:35.Johnson, described it as a very temporary setback. The chair of the

:02:36. > :02:38.Airports Commission, Sir Howard Davies, says that a network of

:02:39. > :02:40.airports would be a better option for London, rather than one large

:02:41. > :02:44.airport. South Yorkshire Police

:02:45. > :02:53.Our view is one huge airport way out east is not the right answer for

:02:54. > :02:57.London. We think a network of competing airports is likely to

:02:58. > :03:01.produce a better solution for the passengers of London, but also, of

:03:02. > :03:07.course, one has no note that it is a long way away from other centres of

:03:08. > :03:12.population. This is all really a gigantic smoke screen for a U-turn

:03:13. > :03:16.on Heathrow. The great merit of the estuary scheme is it is

:03:17. > :03:21.environmentally sensitive. It solves our problem in the long-term. What

:03:22. > :03:23.we're really careering towards is a third runway at Heathrow followed by

:03:24. > :03:30.a fourth runway. South Yorkshire Police has announced

:03:31. > :03:33.an independent investigation into the force's handling of child sexual

:03:34. > :03:36.exploitation in Rotherham. A report last week revealed at least 1,400

:03:37. > :03:38.children had suffered abuse over a 16 year period. Meanwhile Labour

:03:39. > :03:40.today says it has suspended three councillors over the scandal. Ross

:03:41. > :03:50.Hawkins has more. Labour have announced this morning

:03:51. > :03:55.that they are suspending four of their members in Rotherham, three of

:03:56. > :04:05.whom are sitting councillors, one is a former councillor. Now, they go on

:04:06. > :04:09.to say that further action is perfectly possible.

:04:10. > :04:12.Hawkins has more. South Yorkshire's Chief Constable

:04:13. > :04:14.and the Director-General of the BBC will appear before MPs today to

:04:15. > :04:17.answer questions about the corporation's reporting of a police

:04:18. > :04:20.search of Sir Cliff Richard's home. Sir Cliff denies allegations of a

:04:21. > :04:23.sexual assault on a young boy in 1985. Force head David Crompton and

:04:24. > :04:24.BBC boss Lord Hall will face members of the Home Affairs Select Committee

:04:25. > :04:34.this afternoon. Prosecutors are reviewing the case

:04:35. > :04:38.against a British couple who removed their seriously ill son from a

:04:39. > :04:42.hospital in Southampton. Brett and Naghmeh King, whose five-year-old

:04:43. > :04:45.son Ashya has a brain tumour, spent the night in a Spanish prison after

:04:46. > :04:49.they refused to return to the UK. Mr and Mrs King say they took their son

:04:50. > :04:50.abroad because they wanted him to receive a treatment not available to

:04:51. > :04:59.him on the NHS. The Deputy Prime From this morning, every child in

:05:00. > :05:07.their first three years of primary school in England should receive a

:05:08. > :05:09.free school meal. The government says 98% of schools will provide hot

:05:10. > :05:12.food. But the Local Government

:05:13. > :05:19.Let's return to Victoria Derbyshire in Dundee.

:05:20. > :05:27.We've got a problem with that. We'll go back to Victoria in a moment. New

:05:28. > :05:30.figures show the number of people admitted to hospital for skin cancer

:05:31. > :05:38.treatment has risen by a third in five years. In 2007 there were

:05:39. > :05:41.87,000 admissions while in 2011 there were over 123,000. I can now

:05:42. > :05:48.hand you back to Victoria in Dundee. I'm Victoria Derbyshire as the clock

:05:49. > :05:51.ticks down to Scotland's historic vote on its future, this morning, we

:05:52. > :05:59.are live in Dundee. APPLAUSE

:06:00. > :06:06.And in the next half an hour, we're going to find out if any of those

:06:07. > :06:10.here who say they are still undecided are any closer to reaching

:06:11. > :06:14.that decision. We've heard some who are close. But any closer to

:06:15. > :06:17.reaching a decision on how they will vote in the referendum in just over

:06:18. > :06:26.two weeks time and you can join us too. We're live on Five Live and the

:06:27. > :06:32.BBC News Channel. You can text us this morning or via social media

:06:33. > :06:36.using the hashtag Scotland decides. Thank you.

:06:37. > :06:40.APPLAUSE OK, let me read more texts and tweets

:06:41. > :06:45.before we hear more from the audience here today in Dundee. My

:06:46. > :06:50.name is Max from Glasgow says this tweeter. There is no credible plan

:06:51. > :07:00.for this and that's why I'm voting no amongst other reasons. I love the

:07:01. > :07:05.idea of this magical independent Scotland. A listener on Twitter

:07:06. > :07:10.says, "It isn't about oil, ship building or whisky, it is about

:07:11. > :07:17.Scotland being able to determine its own destiny. " John says, "I dislike

:07:18. > :07:21.referendums as the average person doesn't have enough knowledge to

:07:22. > :07:27.make such big decisions as this. It should be left to the politicians."

:07:28. > :07:33.That's the worst idea I have heard all day! Nick in Cambridge, "Voting

:07:34. > :07:40.for independence simply because you don't like the Tories at Westminster

:07:41. > :07:43.won't make Scottish people's lives better in any way."

:07:44. > :07:50.APPLAUSE Good morning. Morning. I'm David and

:07:51. > :07:52.I'm one of your fabled young voters. This is the first time I will be

:07:53. > :07:59.voting in anything. What do you think about that? It is quite

:08:00. > :08:02.interesting. Quite interesting. LAUGHTER

:08:03. > :08:05.But one of the things I feel most strongly about is the fact that the

:08:06. > :08:09.No Campaign say that everything will be milk and honey in an independent

:08:10. > :08:13.Scotland and yet they say there will not be one single thing which will

:08:14. > :08:18.work. They say we can't have a currency, we can't have research

:08:19. > :08:22.funding and they say we can't have this, we can't have that. It would

:08:23. > :08:28.be massively in the UK's interest to have a currency union because

:08:29. > :08:38.Scotland massively reduces the UK's deficit of payment and their reasons

:08:39. > :08:44.for this are saying, "We won't be your lender of last resort, but as

:08:45. > :08:51.that, we will just take your debt anyway." The point is if the

:08:52. > :08:58.politicians in Westminster are faced with the chance of debt later or off

:08:59. > :09:02.loading the debt they have created on an independent Scotland, surely

:09:03. > :09:06.they would choose to off load their debt on Scotland if it declared

:09:07. > :09:11.independence. Why would they say, you can't have that? Why would they

:09:12. > :09:15.say, "We are giving you a gift of no debt." They would need to say yes to

:09:16. > :09:23.a currency union because it is massively in their interests to do

:09:24. > :09:27.so. OK. APPLAUSE

:09:28. > :09:33.My name is Kirsten. I am also a first time voter and I'm just

:09:34. > :09:37.wondering, assuming that Scotland does peep the pound and its -- keep

:09:38. > :09:41.the pound and its share of the debt and as well as having the plaque

:09:42. > :09:44.hole money that -- black hole money that we're going to need to find. As

:09:45. > :09:49.English students come up to study in Scotland, as part of an EU state,

:09:50. > :09:53.they will have, they will be entitled to free tuition, on top of

:09:54. > :09:59.having the debt in Scotland, how will the Scottish Government be able

:10:00. > :10:06.to ensure that Scottish students will also be continuing to be

:10:07. > :10:11.entitled to free tuition? Before we answer that - sorry, our first time

:10:12. > :10:16.voter over here described the prospect of him as voting for the it

:10:17. > :10:20.first time as interesting. How would you describe it? It is really

:10:21. > :10:26.interesting. Goodness, we're going up the scale. Do respond. It is

:10:27. > :10:30.worthwhile recalling it was a Westminster Parliament that

:10:31. > :10:38.introduced tuition fees and it was a Scottish Parliament that abolished

:10:39. > :10:45.tuition fees, all right? Now, you pointed out that come independence

:10:46. > :10:54.there will be an anomaly whereby English students maybe entitled to

:10:55. > :11:02.free twu wirks. That -- tuition. That could be solved by Westminster

:11:03. > :11:06.abolishing tuition fees south of the border. And we can give the Scottish

:11:07. > :11:15.students a grant to pay their tuition fees and that's it. English

:11:16. > :11:21.students will be entitled to free tuition here. Yes, they maybe

:11:22. > :11:26.entitled to free tuition. No, they will be. If the present regime

:11:27. > :11:31.continues. If the Scottish Parliament were to give Scottish

:11:32. > :11:34.students domiciled in Scotland and attending Scottish universities, if

:11:35. > :11:38.they were to give them a grant to enable them to pay the tuition fees

:11:39. > :11:44.to the Scottish university then that would get rid of the anomaly under

:11:45. > :11:47.European Union law, but a fairer system is if Westminster abolished

:11:48. > :11:53.tuition fees completely for students in England and Wales. Last word to

:11:54. > :11:57.you. I'm not talking about Westminster abolishing their tuition

:11:58. > :12:02.fees though. Pardon? I'm not talking about Westminster abolishing their

:12:03. > :12:08.tuition fees, I'm talking about English students coming up to

:12:09. > :12:18.Scotland and taking our places. Hi. Hi. My name is richle. -- Rachel. I

:12:19. > :12:25.am currently an undecided voter, but I have found myself slightly being

:12:26. > :12:29.back and forth this morning, but I have a question for both sides of

:12:30. > :12:33.the campaign. As we have seen today, people here are very passionate yes

:12:34. > :12:36.and No voters, what I would like to know whatever the outcome of the

:12:37. > :12:41.referendum, what steps will be taken to unite such a divide nation's

:12:42. > :12:52.opinion afterwards? Whatever the outcome. I don't mind who answers.

:12:53. > :12:58.First of all, your question on the tuition fees, we would seek an

:12:59. > :13:07.exception in Europe because of the exceptional circumstances of us

:13:08. > :13:12.having free tuition and a referendum taking place that would give our

:13:13. > :13:16.nearest neighbour the opportunity to take free tuition. We would, on the

:13:17. > :13:20.basis of that, seek an exception which Russell has been discussing

:13:21. > :13:24.with the European Union. So we're confident that we can make a case

:13:25. > :13:28.that actually because of the exceptional circumstances post the

:13:29. > :13:33.referendum that we would be able to maintain that. We would seek that.

:13:34. > :13:39.The young lady makes a very important point and for all of the

:13:40. > :13:43.fierce debate, we on the 19th September will come back together,

:13:44. > :13:47.no matter what the outcome in the referendum because we all want what

:13:48. > :13:50.is best for Scotland and as a Scottish Government minister,

:13:51. > :13:57.whatever the outcome, of course, we will take Scotland forward in the

:13:58. > :14:02.best way. If it was a No vote would the SNP embrace further devolution?

:14:03. > :14:11.We have already signed the Edinburgh Agreement and we always want what is

:14:12. > :14:17.best for Scotland and it would be a missed opportunity not to take that

:14:18. > :14:22.opportunity on the 18th September. Rachel's point is a really good one,

:14:23. > :14:26.we have got passionate views here in this hall today, but I have found it

:14:27. > :14:31.on doorsteps and within friendship groups, you have got people who take

:14:32. > :14:34.different views and that's the democracy that we live in and in

:14:35. > :14:38.some cases that gets heated and we don't want that to lead to division

:14:39. > :14:43.and we will respect the outcome of the referendum and in the case of a

:14:44. > :14:47.No vote then we have said that within a month of the No vote

:14:48. > :14:49.happening we will be convening a convention would we get the

:14:50. > :14:53.political parties together, not just those that have been on the no side,

:14:54. > :15:00.but those who have been on the yes side too to forge the next step in

:15:01. > :15:09.Scotland's constitutional journey. If there was a No vote, what the Lib

:15:10. > :15:13.Dems promising? Sir Menzies Campbell set out our home rule position. All

:15:14. > :15:19.income tax should be set. Up to 15 set out our home rule position. All

:15:20. > :15:24.tax. In total then the Scottish tax. In total then the Scottish

:15:25. > :15:27.Parliament would be responsible for raising the majority of the money

:15:28. > :15:33.that it spends. That's really important. Oil revenues, control of

:15:34. > :15:39.its oil revenues? Some things are better left at Westminster level.

:15:40. > :15:45.But the corporation tax receipts, but the corporation tax receipts

:15:46. > :15:48.would come to Scotland. I thought it was a burden to have the oil. It

:15:49. > :15:52.depends where oil companies are, but that would mean some of that would

:15:53. > :15:56.go to the Scottish Parliament. Would it cut corporation tax? We are

:15:57. > :15:59.saying it would be better to have one rate of corporation tax across

:16:00. > :16:03.the United Kingdom, it is about the receipts of corporation tax rather

:16:04. > :16:06.than having different regimes. It is beneficial for business to have one

:16:07. > :16:11.regime that they can deal with rather than having the extra costs

:16:12. > :16:17.of dealing with different tax rates in different parts of the country.

:16:18. > :16:21.The Conservatives and the Labour Party have also said they would

:16:22. > :16:25.offer more powers to the Scottish Parliament in the event of a No

:16:26. > :16:29.vote. Can you sum-up what they are each offering? Labour are talking

:16:30. > :16:33.enhancing income tax power. The Tories are proposing to devolve the

:16:34. > :16:36.whole of income tax. It is an intriguing situation, where the

:16:37. > :16:39.Conservatives, who were the most sceptical, the most hostile about

:16:40. > :16:44.devolution in the first place, and as a consequence over a period of

:16:45. > :16:49.some 40 years, saw their vote decline in Scotland, very sharply

:16:50. > :16:54.from a position when in the year I was born they were the largest party

:16:55. > :17:00.in Scotland - I will leave you to work that out when that that was --

:17:01. > :17:05.and now they are very much not. But now they have endorsed devolution to

:17:06. > :17:09.an extent where they are on some elements outpacing the Labour Party

:17:10. > :17:14.on terms of what they offer. Each of the parties who are advocating a No

:17:15. > :17:18.vote, say there is common ground between those, you heard the offer -

:17:19. > :17:22.a convention convened. One thing that will happen shortly after the

:17:23. > :17:30.vote on September 18th. The Moddiate of the General Say acceptably -- the

:17:31. > :17:37.Moderating, of the General Assembly of the Church of Scotland is

:17:38. > :17:43.proposingal service for healing. Good luck with that. Many people are

:17:44. > :17:48.leaning one way or the other, the undecided. I will ask you, in a

:17:49. > :17:53.couple of minutes, if any of you have reached a decision or are close

:17:54. > :17:58.to making a decision to stand up. Not yet. Don't peak too soon. I

:17:59. > :18:05.realise it could be a total anticlimax. Nobody may stand up. It

:18:06. > :18:11.might be telling. Obviously I'm not suggesting in this hour or so we

:18:12. > :18:15.have tipped you one way or the other but potentially you may have heard

:18:16. > :18:18.something from our guests and passionate audience that has done

:18:19. > :18:21.that. Let's hear from two well-known names with their reasons why

:18:22. > :18:25.Scotland should become independent and why, Scotland should stay as

:18:26. > :18:30.part of the UK. I'm Ricky Ross. I'm honoured to be

:18:31. > :18:36.able to share my vision with people who are watching this 2349 Cared

:18:37. > :18:44.Hall in my only City of Dundee -- in the Cair Hall. Here is what I dream

:18:45. > :18:49.B I want to live in a country which has the courage to talk to itself

:18:50. > :18:58.without thinking it has to talk via London. I want to live in a country

:18:59. > :19:03.where people come first and everyone gets a fairer share of our enormous

:19:04. > :19:06.wealth. I want a country which plays an increasingly positive role in

:19:07. > :19:11.international relations and doesn't carry the threat of nuclear weapons

:19:12. > :19:15.to get its way. I want to live in a country where unemployment continues

:19:16. > :19:20.to come down, but where those in work are not harnessed at zero hour

:19:21. > :19:26.contracts, are respected by trade unions and are paid a living wage. I

:19:27. > :19:34.want a country which doesn't just pay lip service to the idea of a

:19:35. > :19:38.National Health Service but enshrines its existence within a

:19:39. > :19:44.written constitution. I want to live in a country where payment to a

:19:45. > :19:48.political party doesn't buy you power in an unelected chamber. And

:19:49. > :19:52.finally, I want to live in a country where newcomers are not feared or

:19:53. > :19:58.vilified but welcomed as equal parters in a new igs in a. If you

:19:59. > :20:03.want these things -- a new nation. If you want these things and more,

:20:04. > :20:08.vote yes on September, 18. Th. Hello done dee. I'm Tony Robinson. I

:20:09. > :20:11.watched the two big debates. I thought the politicians missed out

:20:12. > :20:15.one really important issue, which is this - birds don't recognise

:20:16. > :20:20.national boundaries. Nor do fish or pollution or bacteria or rising sea

:20:21. > :20:29.levels. The big issues are the next 50 years, are going to be

:20:30. > :20:33.environmental. And they are going to affect the whole island. Not just

:20:34. > :20:36.parts of it. They are going to need a strong, absolutely co-ordinated

:20:37. > :20:39.response. There are countless examples of neighbouring countries,

:20:40. > :20:43.falling out big time over things like access to water, and flooding

:20:44. > :20:48.and how to react to epidemics or national dises asters. We know what

:20:49. > :20:52.the relationship was like, prior to the Act of Union between Scotland

:20:53. > :20:56.and England. Fractious, to say the least. Do we really think that

:20:57. > :21:00.something similar won't happen next time? And we can't think that

:21:01. > :21:09.bureaucratic Brussels is going to be able to solve things for us. No, we

:21:10. > :21:15.need a strong government acting in the interests of the island as a

:21:16. > :21:22.whole, not just Scotland or England. In the 19th and 20th centuries we

:21:23. > :21:28.solved some of the most intractable problems on the globe together.

:21:29. > :21:29.Let's do the same in the 21st century.

:21:30. > :21:32.CHEERING AND APPLAUSE Bear with me on this. It may not

:21:33. > :21:35.work. Lovely people in the undecided

:21:36. > :21:39.section. Around 70 or so, if you feel you have made a decision, or

:21:40. > :21:45.are close to making a decision, would you please simply stand up.

:21:46. > :21:50.Wow. Well, let's hear from you. Stay standing, Sir. If you don't mind,

:21:51. > :21:55.stay standing. Can I ask you what decision you have made? I'm Doug

:21:56. > :22:01.from Dundee. I work in Scotland but also work in England. I'm going to

:22:02. > :22:07.be a no now. I think Brian summed it up. If we vote a yes, we are not

:22:08. > :22:14.always going to get guaranteed we are going to get what we want

:22:15. > :22:21.because we have to have another vote to get a government in place. That

:22:22. > :22:27.might not give that chap the socialist government he wants or the

:22:28. > :22:33.university people what they want. There are too many things, for me,

:22:34. > :22:38.that are undecided. OK, all right. Please, ladies and gentlemen, let's

:22:39. > :22:44.hear what these people have to say. How close to that can that decision

:22:45. > :22:49.were you today? More a no than a yes. All right, people who feel they

:22:50. > :22:54.have made a decision or close? I think the referendum is on the SNP's

:22:55. > :22:57.terms and even though there are different left-wing groups involved

:22:58. > :23:02.on that side it will be dominated by the SNP, a political party that

:23:03. > :23:06.wants to reduce corporation tax. How do you reconcile social justice and

:23:07. > :23:11.reducing corporation tax? I don't see how it works on the political

:23:12. > :23:15.agenda. You are a no. You were happily leaning no, anyway. We will

:23:16. > :23:20.pass the microphone around. We will pass it down and tell us what

:23:21. > :23:24.decision you have reached. Good morning and introduce yourself. Yes.

:23:25. > :23:31.OK. I am veering towards yes, I have to say. Can you tell us why?

:23:32. > :23:36.I think what I have heard today is that there are positives and there

:23:37. > :23:43.are negatives on both sides. To be frank, I think they are rather

:23:44. > :23:48.balancing themselves out, so the final decision for me is going to be

:23:49. > :23:53.around the very simple principle of - should we, the people of Scotland

:23:54. > :23:57.elect our government and run our affairs ourselves and I'm coming to

:23:58. > :24:03.the conclusion that we should. OK, pass it down. I'm Len. I, too, am a

:24:04. > :24:09.yes. The bottom line for Mijas been very simple: -- the bottom line for

:24:10. > :24:14.me has been simple. And whether you approve of SNP or not, we have

:24:15. > :24:17.proved that in the last six years. More importantly, would things

:24:18. > :24:22.improve for the people of Scotland if we voted no? I passionately

:24:23. > :24:28.believe that would not be the case. Let me ask you - at what point, you

:24:29. > :24:33.are sitting in the undecided section after an 18-month campaign. At what

:24:34. > :24:38.point did you reach the yes vote? I will be honest with you. Today has

:24:39. > :24:44.reinforced my undecided view. I will be honest, I have already voted yes.

:24:45. > :24:50.Oh, my gosh. Only because... Only because I have a postal vote and I'm

:24:51. > :24:57.going on have acation. Why are you sitting on the undecided section?

:24:58. > :25:05.JEERS FROM THE CROWD Why are you sitting in the und

:25:06. > :25:11.section? -- undecided. It is the old heart verses mind. I was definitely

:25:12. > :25:18.in that position between the time when you first contacted us as to

:25:19. > :25:29.whether I wanted to appear. I was undecided and debating. I had to

:25:30. > :25:34.make my vote and I have. OK, can you pass the microphone to some of the

:25:35. > :25:38.people sitting down who have still not made a decision. So just in

:25:39. > :25:41.front of you, Sir, they are sitting down. Hello. Hi. You have still not

:25:42. > :25:45.decided. I think there is too much argy bargy, politics. If I vote yes,

:25:46. > :25:49.which I'm probably more inclined to do, although I'm not sure, I'm not

:25:50. > :25:53.voting for SNP. The whole idea here seems it be based around the fact

:25:54. > :25:56.that you are voting for a left-wing or right-wing - we'll get what we

:25:57. > :25:59.want if we have a Scottish Parliament of our own. That's our

:26:00. > :26:03.decision and that's irrelevant to a certain extent. You either want

:26:04. > :26:10.independence or you don't. You are not voting SNP. OK. Pass the

:26:11. > :26:15.microphone, if you don't mind to the young lady in front of you.

:26:16. > :26:20.You are still undecided? ? Yes. I live in Dundee I'm originally from

:26:21. > :26:28.the Netherlands. I'm as yet undecided why I want to vote. Can I

:26:29. > :26:35.ask you, sorry to interrupt. What do you think it is going to move you in

:26:36. > :26:42.the next few weeks? It will be in the question. I have lived here for

:26:43. > :26:46.14 years. Feel part of the country. My parents work here, I have friends

:26:47. > :26:50.but most importantly we pay taxes and therefore, I feel it is

:26:51. > :26:54.profoundly unfair that my parents and soon I, are not allowed to vote

:26:55. > :26:58.for Westminster. What will sway me towards yes or no is whether I will

:26:59. > :27:01.be able to vote for a Scottish Parliament in an independent

:27:02. > :27:05.Scotland. Who wants to take up that point, briefly? Well, as an EU

:27:06. > :27:12.citizen - you are from the Netherlands -- well, you should be

:27:13. > :27:15.able to vote. You should be able to vote in the Scottish Parliament.

:27:16. > :27:19.After independence, of course you will be, yes, absolutely. So, I

:27:20. > :27:22.think Brian Taylor, what we should about this completely unscientific

:27:23. > :27:27.snapshot of people popping up -- a lot of people were close to the

:27:28. > :27:34.decision apart from the gentlemen who should have been yes and over

:27:35. > :27:38.there. He was undecided at the point that he reached his indecision. We

:27:39. > :27:43.have people here who are not representative of Scotland as a

:27:44. > :27:47.whole they ared a very Kates for a cause. The -- advocates. The

:27:48. > :27:52.population do not fall into yes, no, or undecided. We are all, as John

:27:53. > :27:56.Curtice said, a spectrum of indecision from one to tevenlt I

:27:57. > :28:00.think that's a healthy situation for the country. This is a really

:28:01. > :28:03.difficult choice with huge implications. People, with the

:28:04. > :28:09.exception, perhaps of those who are the most vigoroused a very Kates are

:28:10. > :28:15.open to persuasion, even from a yes position to a no position or the

:28:16. > :28:19.other way around. All of us, I think in a lather of honourable indecision

:28:20. > :28:22.with regards to this particularly difficult decision. I'm Ellie, I'm

:28:23. > :28:24.from Dundee. You have reached a decision. I'm now going to be a Yes

:28:25. > :28:26.voter. APPLAUSE

:28:27. > :28:30.You were leaning in that direction? Yes, always leaning in that. For how

:28:31. > :28:36.long? The past month or two. What is it about today, if anything that has

:28:37. > :28:39.finally allowed you to say it is a yes. I believe my future will be

:28:40. > :28:43.better off in an independent country. OK. OK, you may take a seat

:28:44. > :28:47.ladies and gentlemen, thank you very much. We will have a quick final

:28:48. > :28:53.pitch from somebody on this side. A quick final pitch from somebody on

:28:54. > :29:01.this side. I'm Bob from Angus. I would like to give the real

:29:02. > :29:07.undecideds, a few points to ponder. I'm very proud of Scotland. I cheer

:29:08. > :29:12.as loud as anyone when Andy Murray wins a set at Wimbledon or the

:29:13. > :29:20.Commonwealth medallists win a med A think about it - did they do it on

:29:21. > :29:26.their own? I somehow doubt T take Alexander Fleming and James Watt,

:29:27. > :29:30.they would never have achieved what they did on their own, we are better

:29:31. > :29:35.together. We keep gettinged to things are foisted on us by

:29:36. > :29:38.Westminster. Fact here, there has not been a single decision in

:29:39. > :29:42.Westminster that hasn't had Scottish input. In fact, two of the last

:29:43. > :29:48.Prime Ministers have been born in Scotland. OK, final point Well, my -

:29:49. > :29:52.we haven't had many answers from the separatists. We'll call them

:29:53. > :29:58.separatist, not nationalists. I aliken it to being in a plane and

:29:59. > :30:03.given a package and say - this may or may not contain a parachute which

:30:04. > :30:03.may or may not work, but jump anyway.

:30:04. > :30:15.APPLAUSE Thank you. Here is the thing. I am

:30:16. > :30:19.not a nationalist, I am not a separatist, I want to be more

:30:20. > :30:22.involved in the world affairs. I want to save the environment if we

:30:23. > :30:26.can. I want to see us fight for social justice. This is about

:30:27. > :30:29.representation and self-determination. This is not

:30:30. > :30:33.about, you know, what we get, it is about the currency, frankly, I don't

:30:34. > :30:36.want the pound. They can keep it. What I want to see is a Scotland

:30:37. > :30:41.where the buck stops in a place where we are fairly represented. I

:30:42. > :30:44.don't want to get all boring about electoral systems. We are fairly

:30:45. > :30:47.represented in the Scottish Parliament. Every single one of you

:30:48. > :30:51.is properly represented in the Scottish Parliament. My vote doesn't

:30:52. > :30:54.count in Westminster. My vote means nothing in Westminster. Your vote

:30:55. > :30:57.whether you are green or anything else can mean something in an

:30:58. > :31:00.independent Scotland. We are fairly represented there. Make the central

:31:01. > :31:05.Government, the Government where we have a say every single one of us.

:31:06. > :31:13.OK. APPLAUSE

:31:14. > :31:17.The vote is in 16 days time. The best coverage of the result and the

:31:18. > :31:22.ramifications on the BBC, I promise you, sir. So thank you very much for

:31:23. > :31:26.having us here today in Dundee. We have had a really good time. Thank

:31:27. > :31:32.you, give yourselves a round of applause.

:31:33. > :31:58.APPLAUSE Good morning. You are watching BBC

:31:59. > :32:03.News. The headlines for you with the time at 11.31am. South Yorkshire

:32:04. > :32:06.Police launch an independent investigation into child sexual

:32:07. > :32:14.exploitation in Rotherham. It comes as the Labour Party suspends three

:32:15. > :32:18.councillors. No to Boris Island, the Airports Commission rejects the

:32:19. > :32:29.Mayor of London's proposal for a Thames Estuary Airport. Mr Johnson

:32:30. > :32:35.brands the decision as myopic. This is a gigantic smoke screen. It

:32:36. > :32:40.solves our problem in the long-term, what we're careering towards is a

:32:41. > :32:47.third runway at Heathrow followed by a fourth runway. The parents of

:32:48. > :32:56.Ashya King are planning legal action against the hospital in Southampton

:32:57. > :33:01.where he was treated. Brett Brett and Naghmeh King are fighting

:33:02. > :33:05.extradition. Free school meals are being introduced for every primary

:33:06. > :33:11.school child up to the age of seven. The Local Government Association

:33:12. > :33:20.warned of a shortfall in funding. A plan to build a new airport on an

:33:21. > :33:27.island in the Thames Estuary has been rejected. The project had been

:33:28. > :33:30.championed by the Mayor of London, Boris Johnson, insisting that the

:33:31. > :33:34.idea was not dead, he said the Airports Commission set the debate

:33:35. > :33:39.back by half a century. Norman Smith has been talking to him. Well, the

:33:40. > :33:44.Airports Commission would not have been clearer. They think the idea of

:33:45. > :33:49.a new super airport in the Thames Estuary is not a runner, it is too

:33:50. > :33:53.expensive, and too uncertain and may never get built and would cost like

:33:54. > :33:58.another HS2 which no Government will commit to. Game over for Thames

:33:59. > :34:03.Estuary Airport? It is game over? I don't think so at all. What you have

:34:04. > :34:07.got to do now is hear from others about what their plans are. We need

:34:08. > :34:12.the same clarity and boldness that we have seen from the estuary

:34:13. > :34:15.airport solution. When people look at the reality of what is involved

:34:16. > :34:20.with a third runway and at the reality of what is involved

:34:21. > :34:24.with a third runway then a fourth runway at Heathrow, they will shy

:34:25. > :34:30.away from that and people will say what is the logical replacement of

:34:31. > :34:34.that? They will look again at the estuary site. You have been one of

:34:35. > :34:40.those saying business has to know. You are just perpetuating the

:34:41. > :34:45.uncertainty? On the contrary. I would like to get on and do it

:34:46. > :34:49.tomorrow. It is a disgrace. Other Victorian forefathers would be

:34:50. > :34:53.turning in their graves to look at how completely hopeless we are in

:34:54. > :35:02.our approach to this. We should be getting on and doing it and we

:35:03. > :35:07.shouldn't be contracting out this decision to distinguish former civil

:35:08. > :35:12.serve ants no matter -- servants, no matter how eminent they are. I have

:35:13. > :35:15.tremendous respect for Sir Howard and this is a political decision and

:35:16. > :35:19.it needs leadership and it needs to be pushed forward. Isn't this just

:35:20. > :35:22.bluster on your part and you are unwilling to accept a decision by

:35:23. > :35:26.the commission which in the end will be accepted by a future Government?

:35:27. > :35:31.There has been no decision. That's the great vacuum at the heart of

:35:32. > :35:40.this. There is no answer. What is the policy going to be? It is not

:35:41. > :35:44.going to be Thames Estuary. This is a gigantic smoke screen for a U-turn

:35:45. > :35:50.on Heathrow. That's what I think. But what we need to hear... If that

:35:51. > :35:54.happens, if that happens... What we need to hear from politicians other

:35:55. > :36:01.than myself is what they mean. Are they in favour of a third runway or

:36:02. > :36:05.not? What do you do if a future Conservative Government says, "You

:36:06. > :36:11.know what, Heathrow is the best option." ? I oppose it. I continue

:36:12. > :36:15.to make my case for the reasons I have given many times. It would be

:36:16. > :36:25.difficult to deliver to a third runway at Heathrow. It has massive

:36:26. > :36:30.environmental disbenefits. It would lead to a huge amount of congestion

:36:31. > :36:35.in West London. We have seen a situation in which Britain, London,

:36:36. > :36:39.has lost connectivity to markets around the world that the French,

:36:40. > :36:43.the Dutch, the Germans are connected to very, very fast and that's

:36:44. > :36:48.because we don't have a hub airport adequate to our purposes. And the

:36:49. > :36:54.problem with Heathrow is it is a brilliant, they do a wonderful job

:36:55. > :36:59.in many ways, but it is slap, bang in the middle western suburbs of

:37:00. > :37:02.London and to continue to expand Heathrow, you are asking people in

:37:03. > :37:08.parts of the city that don't even know it to accept a degradation in

:37:09. > :37:16.their quality of life. How far are you willing to push it? Zac

:37:17. > :37:21.Goldsmith said he would resign. If you became an MP, would you take a

:37:22. > :37:29.similar stance? How far are you prepared to push it? My answer is

:37:30. > :37:34.very simple. I in common with David Cameron and George Osborne, all of

:37:35. > :37:39.us were elected on a clear manifesto to oppose a third runway at

:37:40. > :37:43.Heathrow. That was the right policy. We should stick to it and to the

:37:44. > :37:48.best of nigh knowledge we are going to stick to it. And if you don't

:37:49. > :37:52.stick to it, if Mr Cameron decides to go with the airport commission,

:37:53. > :37:59.that leads to a confrontation between you and him after the next

:38:00. > :38:04.election? There is a mountain of hypothesis built into that question.

:38:05. > :38:07.The policy has been to oppose a third runway and to come up with a

:38:08. > :38:11.better solution. I'm confident that the Government will do so. Boris

:38:12. > :38:15.Johnson, thank you very much for your time. The airport commission

:38:16. > :38:25.may have come up with its view on the Thames he He is He is quarry

:38:26. > :38:34.Airport -- Thames Estuary Airport. Norman, thank you very much. Let's

:38:35. > :38:42.speak to Mary Cray. What is Labour's preference. Heathrow or Gatwick?

:38:43. > :38:46.Well, we are waiting to see what the airport commission's final report

:38:47. > :38:51.comes out with next June. We are not second-guessing what Sir Howard

:38:52. > :38:59.Davies and his colleagues will come up with. ?100 billion project which

:39:00. > :39:05.would have closed Heathrow and added to passenger journey times and put

:39:06. > :39:09.aeroplanes at risk of bird strike. Let's focus on what Labour would do

:39:10. > :39:15.if you were to return to power at next election. In 2009, you gave the

:39:16. > :39:20.go-ahead for a new runway at Heathrow. Would you do the same

:39:21. > :39:23.again? We have to see what the Airports Commission advises whoever

:39:24. > :39:26.is in Government next year. It was set-up to get rid of the deadlock

:39:27. > :39:30.between the Conservatives and the Liberal Democrats around the

:39:31. > :39:35.difficulties of expanding at Heathrow. Gatwick has put forward a

:39:36. > :39:38.very positive case. But as I said... So what's your preference? The

:39:39. > :39:42.commission has to come up with its judgement, but what is your

:39:43. > :39:45.preference at the moment? Well, we're pleased to the original

:39:46. > :39:49.proposal for a third runway at Heathrow has been dropped and that

:39:50. > :39:53.there are now two proposals for Heathrow on the table. Gatwick is

:39:54. > :39:57.also in the mix. It is not right for me, I could be in a position to

:39:58. > :40:01.actually adjudicate on that next year, it is not right for me to say

:40:02. > :40:06.now what the answer is. There is a process underway. We respect ta roe

:40:07. > :40:11.ses and -- that process and we await its outcome. Are we not dragging our

:40:12. > :40:17.feet on this? Other countries, we have seen the new Hong Kong airport

:40:18. > :40:20.built quickly and we seem to have taken years and years and we have

:40:21. > :40:24.not actually come up with a decision on this? We are dragging our feet.

:40:25. > :40:27.The Airports Commission was set-up by this Government at our suggestion

:40:28. > :40:33.to try and get a political consensus. What we need is an end to

:40:34. > :40:38.the political post uerg that we saw demonstrated by the mayor in that

:40:39. > :40:43.interview. His fantasy airport which had ?5 million of public money spent

:40:44. > :40:48.on it is to do with his own political ambitions. Tb fair, it is

:40:49. > :40:51.to the -- to be fair, it is not just about Boris Johnson. It is not just

:40:52. > :40:55.about Boris Johnson, it was an option? I think it was actually all

:40:56. > :41:01.about Boris Johnson and it was a pie in the sky scheme. Howard Davies

:41:02. > :41:06.said the emperor has got no clothes. Boris doesn't like being told he

:41:07. > :41:09.can't have what he wants. You are happy that it is down to a straight

:41:10. > :41:15.choice between Heathrow and Gatwick? I am happy there has been a bit of

:41:16. > :41:19.reality brought back into the debate about the country's airport needs

:41:20. > :41:26.and we have got away from the mayor whose contribution has been building

:41:27. > :41:30.a cable car. Thank you. Theresa May will answer an you

:41:31. > :41:33.urgent question in the Commons on the Rotherham child abuse scandal.

:41:34. > :41:38.Labour's Yvette Cooper is going to be raising the issue. This morning

:41:39. > :41:46.Labour announced it was suspending four members in rother ram and --

:41:47. > :41:49.Rotherham and South Yorkshire Police revealed reports in how the force

:41:50. > :42:00.handled allegations of grooming. From this morning, every child in

:42:01. > :42:03.their first three years of primary school in England should receive a

:42:04. > :42:09.free school meal. The government says 98% of schools will provide hot

:42:10. > :42:10.food. Association says councils are facing

:42:11. > :42:17.a ?25 million shortfall in funding A hot meal for five to

:42:18. > :42:23.seven-year-olds, well, that's the Government's plan at least. Here in

:42:24. > :42:28.Oxford, they are racing to get ready. The biggest challenge across

:42:29. > :42:32.the country has been in schools with no existing kitchens or in remote

:42:33. > :42:36.areas, many have had to start from scratch. And the Local Government

:42:37. > :42:42.Association says several councils have been left out of pocket by

:42:43. > :42:46.central Government's grand plan. We reckon there is a ?25 million

:42:47. > :42:50.shortfall in the bringing together of this programme. So actually a lot

:42:51. > :42:54.of local authorities and schools will be diverting money from other

:42:55. > :42:59.areas. Important areas to put into this programme. The Government says

:43:00. > :43:03.it will support schools that are struggling and it expects the free

:43:04. > :43:04.meals to improve the overall health and education of children and there

:43:05. > :43:09.are benefits for others too. This and education of children and there

:43:10. > :43:13.small firm in west Sussex will cook and deliver meals to local

:43:14. > :43:18.schoolsful its business -- schools. Its business is double in size. This

:43:19. > :43:24.time last year, we were cooking 600 to 650 lunches a day and from, well

:43:25. > :43:29.certainly, Monday next week when all our schools are back, we are looking

:43:30. > :43:33.at 1200 to 1300. England is the first country in the UK to adopt

:43:34. > :43:38.this policy and it is being watched closely by the other home nations. A

:43:39. > :43:43.hot meal for every child in the first three years is a bold promise,

:43:44. > :43:47.but can it be fulfilled? The proof will be in the pudding.

:43:48. > :43:52.Apple and the FBI say we are looking into allegations that the online

:43:53. > :43:56.accounts of around 100 celebrities have been hacked lead to go nude

:43:57. > :44:09.photographs of them being posted online. The actress general fefr

:44:10. > :44:17.Laurence and -- was among those hacked. They are used to appearing

:44:18. > :44:23.on camera. Hollywood stars, fashion models, and celebrity. Now images

:44:24. > :44:30.have emerged, which if genuine, they would never wish to be made public.

:44:31. > :44:39.A photo claimed to have a stack of risque photos of A-list celebrities

:44:40. > :44:43.in various states of address. Among them Jennifer Laurence. A spokesman

:44:44. > :44:56.said it was a violation of privacy. The authorities have been contacted

:44:57. > :45:00.and will anyone who posts the stolen photographs will be prosecuted. It

:45:01. > :45:04.appears at least some of the images may have been accessed from a

:45:05. > :45:10.so-called cloud, an internet storage service in which users NHS and media

:45:11. > :45:15.-- information and media is supposed to be private. Even if you have

:45:16. > :45:19.deleted photos, often times they have been uploaded into the cloud

:45:20. > :45:22.and when you delete them from the phone, they continue to exist. Apple

:45:23. > :45:27.said it was investigating whether any I cloud accounts have been

:45:28. > :45:32.tampered with. The FBI said it was aware of the allegations and was

:45:33. > :45:43.addressing the matter. Anymore photos or videos be released? In a

:45:44. > :45:48.moment a summary of the latest business news. But our latest

:45:49. > :45:50.headlines. South Yorkshire police announce an independent

:45:51. > :45:54.investigation into the pay it handled child sexual exploitation in

:45:55. > :45:58.Rotherham T comes as the Labour Party there suspends three

:45:59. > :46:03.counsellors. -- it comes. The Airports Commission rejects the

:46:04. > :46:06.Mayor of Lo be done's proposal for a Thames Estuary airport. -- the Mayor

:46:07. > :46:10.of London. And prosecutors are deciding whether

:46:11. > :46:12.to drop a case against a British couple who removed their seriously

:46:13. > :46:13.ill son from a couple who removed their seriously

:46:14. > :46:21.ill son from hospital in Southampton.

:46:22. > :46:26.In the business news this hour: Clubs in the Premier League spent

:46:27. > :46:33.?835 million on new players during the summer transfer window.

:46:34. > :46:36.Manchester United alone spent ?150m on new talent - the highest ever

:46:37. > :46:47.Fewer of us have been complaining about our banks and insurers.

:46:48. > :46:49.The Financial Ombudsman Service - where you can go

:46:50. > :46:52.if you're not happy with the way your bank, insurer have dealt with

:46:53. > :46:55.a problem - have seen a drop in the number of people coming to them.

:46:56. > :46:58.For the six months to June they received 191,129 new cases but

:46:59. > :47:01.in the previous six months they saw almost 250,000 new cases.

:47:02. > :47:05.The new boss at Tesco, Dave Lewis, starts his first day

:47:06. > :47:08.by asking his half a million staff to email him with their suggestions

:47:09. > :47:13.The call to arms follows a steep decline in the share price,

:47:14. > :47:16.with rivals stealing Tesco's share in the market.

:47:17. > :47:18.Yet another house builder has had a bumper year.

:47:19. > :47:20.Redrow has announced a nearly doubling in annual pre-tax

:47:21. > :47:25.Coming in at just over ?132 million - in part due to a 27% increase

:47:26. > :47:29.in the total number of homes built - but also charging people 13% more

:47:30. > :47:37.The average selling price now stands at just under ?240,000.

:47:38. > :47:41.Remember, though, that the group's exposure to

:47:42. > :47:44.the runaway London market will have boosted that figure.

:47:45. > :47:48.But it was also boosted by a Government-backed initiative to

:47:49. > :47:56.The Help to Buy scheme accounted for 35% of all residential sales

:47:57. > :48:04.last year and has been most popular in the Midlands and North.

:48:05. > :48:10.The help-to-buy scheme has turbo charged the recovery. There are also

:48:11. > :48:13.other factors. The economy is doing well and employment at record highs,

:48:14. > :48:18.that is all helping the housing market. Help-to-buy scheme is a

:48:19. > :48:19.direct subsidy to house builders, so it is not surprising they are doing

:48:20. > :48:28.well from the scheme. Fewer of us have been complaining

:48:29. > :48:33.about our banks and insurers. The Financial Ombudsman Service -

:48:34. > :48:35.where you can go if you're not happy with the way

:48:36. > :48:38.your bank, insurer have dealt with a problem - have seen a drop in the

:48:39. > :48:42.number of people coming to them. For the six months to June they

:48:43. > :48:45.received 191,129 new cases but in the previous six months they saw

:48:46. > :48:52.almost 250,000 new cases. Zblets' speak to Karl -- let's speak

:48:53. > :48:57.it Caroline Wyman. Thank you for very much for coming in. Does this

:48:58. > :49:00.seem to suggest that banks are doing a better job when it comes to

:49:01. > :49:05.customers? I think it means things are improving but still some way to

:49:06. > :49:10.go. Although the numbers in PPI are down, we still over 1,000 people

:49:11. > :49:12.getting into contact every day with problems over Payment Protection

:49:13. > :49:16.Insurance. We have seen a big fall in the number of PPI complaints but

:49:17. > :49:21.last we can we were hearing banks and loan companies are going to have

:49:22. > :49:25.to reopen 2.5 million cases they thought were closed because the

:49:26. > :49:29.regulators thought perhaps customers were unfairly compensated. Do you

:49:30. > :49:33.think we'll see another rise in PPI claims. I think it could have an

:49:34. > :49:38.affect. Much depends on how well they will be handled second time

:49:39. > :49:41.around. We have to hope they'll be handled better but much will depend

:49:42. > :49:45.like that. How many of the complaints do you get that are

:49:46. > :49:48.upheld? We are still upholding two-thirds of the complaints. That

:49:49. > :49:52.is a high proportion when you consider how long this particular

:49:53. > :49:55.issue last been going on for. What do people generally feel about

:49:56. > :50:00.paying depournt accounts. This seems to be a growing -- paying for

:50:01. > :50:03.current accounts. This seems to be a growing trend in the industry? .

:50:04. > :50:07.Another one where we have seen complaints. People getting in such

:50:08. > :50:11.saying they didn't know they had to pay for accounts and didn't want or

:50:12. > :50:15.need it. And what are the other complaints we are seeing coming in?

:50:16. > :50:19.I see there are other some particular bugbears people have?

:50:20. > :50:22.Yes, a rise in complaints about payday lending. Still relatively

:50:23. > :50:25.small-based considering how many loans there are out there. But

:50:26. > :50:30.overall our banking complaints are up about 7%. Insurance up alittle

:50:31. > :50:35.bit as well. Thank you very much for coming in. Let's check in with the

:50:36. > :50:40.markets. The FTSE is creeping up, just up 13 points at the moment. So

:50:41. > :50:43.a cautious day of trade ahead of the European Central Bank policy

:50:44. > :50:49.decision this week. The biggest rise there at the moment is Weir Group,

:50:50. > :50:52.an engineering firm. Shares up 3%, because Credit Suisse, bank, have

:50:53. > :50:56.upgraded their recommendation on the stock to investors. Some people

:50:57. > :50:59.clearly buying shares there at the moment. That's it for me. More after

:51:00. > :51:06.the 1.00 news. See you then. A date has been announced

:51:07. > :51:08.for the Clacton by-election. The poll was triggered

:51:09. > :51:14.by the resignation Mr Carswell defected

:51:15. > :51:16.from the Conservatives last week and will stand in Clacton as a UKIP

:51:17. > :51:19.candidate. Despite us being warned

:51:20. > :51:21.about the dangers of enjoying too much sun, skin

:51:22. > :51:24.cancer is on the rise in England. England. New figures from Public

:51:25. > :51:28.Health England show then number of people going in to hospital for skin

:51:29. > :51:31.cancer increased by 41% in five years. Experts are blaming the rise

:51:32. > :51:34.on sunbeds and cheap holidays in the sun.

:51:35. > :51:48.With me now is Nicola Smith, Health Information Officer for Cancer

:51:49. > :51:52.Research. Cheap holidays in the sun have been around for sometime. Is

:51:53. > :51:58.this a legacy from some time back, how long does it take for skin

:51:59. > :52:04.cancer to develop? It does take some decades in many cases, so it may be

:52:05. > :52:08.a legacy from package holidays in the late '60s. It is definitely a

:52:09. > :52:14.factor and a number of other factors at play. People not being safe in

:52:15. > :52:21.the sun in the UK and a tan being desirable and the increasing use of

:52:22. > :52:25.sunbeds. Are sunbeds worse than the sun or a myth? They are both

:52:26. > :52:30.increasing your risk of skin cancer. It is best to take care when you are

:52:31. > :52:34.out and about, either in the UK or abroad and obviously to avoid

:52:35. > :52:40.sunbeds. This is hobble not a new message? Why are we so bad? Some

:52:41. > :52:42.people tend to think maybe they are OK when they are out bane in the

:52:43. > :52:45.people tend to think maybe they are OK when UK and use protection when

:52:46. > :52:49.abroad. In September now, we are having a lovely day. It is best to

:52:50. > :52:53.check the UV index to check whether you are at risk. Does it really

:52:54. > :52:57.matter if you don't get burnt, and if you are out and just get a slight

:52:58. > :53:03.tan without obvious damage? Sunburn is a clear sign of the damage, when

:53:04. > :53:08.your skin is red we know the DNA has been damaged but it is best to take

:53:09. > :53:12.caution anyway. If you can cover up, wear long-sleeved t-shirts and a hat

:53:13. > :53:19.and protect yourself, spend time in the shade between 11-3 and use

:53:20. > :53:23.suncream of factor 15. And a high star rating. And it is obviously

:53:24. > :53:28.best to deal with something as early as possible, what are the first

:53:29. > :53:31.signs if you have skin cancer? Survival rates are positive now. We

:53:32. > :53:35.have moved a long way forwards. So, it is really important to catch it

:53:36. > :53:40.early. If you notice any changes in your skin, whether it is a mole or

:53:41. > :53:43.just a patch of skin that has changed in colour, shape, size, if

:53:44. > :53:49.it is itching or bleeding, any changes you notice, get it checked

:53:50. > :53:52.out by your GP. If they think it is something that might need checking

:53:53. > :53:55.out they can refer you to a specialist. When you talk about

:53:56. > :53:58.survival rates improving, what are skin cancer survival rates. It is a

:53:59. > :54:02.perception that is one of those things - if it is a mole or

:54:03. > :54:06.whatever, it can be whipped off and it is a straight-forward thing to

:54:07. > :54:09.diveel? More than -- deal With more than eight in ten people survive

:54:10. > :54:14.skin cancer, the rates are positive. But there are times if it is caught

:54:15. > :54:20.too late t has spread to other parts of the body and it is at its most

:54:21. > :54:24.dangerous. -- it has spread to other parts. You were describing a broad

:54:25. > :54:29.range of any sort of change to something, what about GPs, are they

:54:30. > :54:33.getting better at actually getting better to spot signs of concerns?

:54:34. > :54:38.Well, if they are specialists or know a lot BP skin, then they will

:54:39. > :54:43.probably be able -- know a lot about skin, they will probably be able to

:54:44. > :54:48.diagnose, if not they will refer you to a specialist and get it checked

:54:49. > :54:51.out to make sure you are sure either way. The story today is about the

:54:52. > :54:54.fact that the statistics are increasing in terms of the number

:54:55. > :54:58.people getting it. Your bottom line would be - always put cream on,

:54:59. > :55:04.whether you are intending to sit in the sun for hours on end or whether

:55:05. > :55:08.it is a sunny danchts sun -- sunny day Sun cream is one option but

:55:09. > :55:14.covering up and sitting in the shade is the best way. We know that sun

:55:15. > :55:21.cream is effective but not completely so if you can wear a

:55:22. > :55:25.T-shirt, long sleeved, sunglasses, and spend time in the shade between

:55:26. > :55:31.11-3 when the sun is stroenges. Thank you for coming in and talk to

:55:32. > :55:34.us. South Yorkshire's Chief Constable

:55:35. > :55:37.and the Director-General of the BBC will appear before GPs today to

:55:38. > :55:41.answer questions about the corporation's reporting of a police

:55:42. > :55:47.search of Sir Cliff Richard's home. Sir Cliff denies allegations

:55:48. > :55:51.allegations of a sexual assault in 1985.

:55:52. > :55:53.They will face questions at the Home Affairs Select Committee this

:55:54. > :55:57.afternoon. A senior Russian security officials

:55:58. > :56:02.says Moscow is reviewing its military strategy because of NATO's

:56:03. > :56:08.response to the Ukraine conflict. The Deputy Head of the Kremlin

:56:09. > :56:12.Advisory Cuter cop council told Russian news agencies that NATO was

:56:13. > :56:18.ratcheting up tensions by boosting its presence on the eastern flank.

:56:19. > :56:21.He said Russia would have to adapt its strategy accordingly. We were

:56:22. > :56:25.just talking about skin cancer and the dangers of the sun, let's see

:56:26. > :56:28.what the weather is doing to us right now.

:56:29. > :56:33.Jay has the details. Well, there is a lot of sunshine out

:56:34. > :56:37.there this morning and it is still strong in early September, so you

:56:38. > :56:40.will at usual messages do apply. We are beginning to see some cloud

:56:41. > :56:44.amounts increasing but a decent day across the board. Dry weather to be

:56:45. > :56:49.found and pretty good spells of quite strong, September sunshine A

:56:50. > :56:54.decent say across the board. High pressure in charge at the moment.

:56:55. > :56:59.It'll stick around for a good few days keeping us essentially fine and

:57:00. > :57:03.dry. Good amounts of cloud over the next few days. This weather front

:57:04. > :57:06.over the North Sea will be a feature over the next few days, more

:57:07. > :57:09.particularly overnight. Cloud amounts are now beginning to

:57:10. > :57:12.increase. It'll just be a dry, bright day with really good spells

:57:13. > :57:15.of sunshine. Down through the eastern side of Scotland, across

:57:16. > :57:19.much of England and Wales, that's where the best of the sunshine will

:57:20. > :57:23.be. A bit more cloud towards Northern Ireland and it is the west

:57:24. > :57:26.of Scotland and one or two spits and spots of rain. A decent afternoon

:57:27. > :57:31.across the south-west of England. Winds light and temperatures into

:57:32. > :57:35.the low 20s. 22 or 23 in the London area. With the light winds and some

:57:36. > :57:39.sunshine a very pleasant feel to the day. Notice the temperatures on the

:57:40. > :57:42.east coast just that little lower with a gentle breeze coming in from

:57:43. > :57:46.the North Sea. Northern England has a plesant an afternoon with lengthy

:57:47. > :57:49.spells of sunshine as you will find on eastern side of Scotland. In the

:57:50. > :57:53.western side, the cloud thick enough to produce a spot or two of rain.

:57:54. > :57:57.But that will be it. Northern Ireland a lot of cloud but the odd

:57:58. > :58:01.spot of rain. Most places fine, dry, 18 or 19. Light winds, a pleasant

:58:02. > :58:05.afternoon in spite of a lot of cloud. 20-odd degrees in Cardiff

:58:06. > :58:08.with sunshine A pleasant day here. Through the evening that feature in

:58:09. > :58:13.the North Sea drifts further inland. So that is going to bring low cloud

:58:14. > :58:18.with it. A grey start, fog over the hills. The odd spot of rain to be

:58:19. > :58:21.found in the north and west of Scotland but with all the cloud

:58:22. > :58:26.overnight, temperatures held up nicely. 13 in Glasgow. 15 or 16 for

:58:27. > :58:30.Cardiff and London. Quite a mild, cloudy start. As we get towards the

:58:31. > :58:33.middle to latter part of the morning, we begin to see the cloud

:58:34. > :58:36.beginning to turn over. Sunny spells coming through. That process will

:58:37. > :58:41.continue on through into the afternoon. Brightening up all the

:58:42. > :58:44.while. Another fine and dry day pretty much everywhere.

:58:45. > :58:50.Temperature-wise, probably up a inch or two on today's values. A bit

:58:51. > :58:53.warmer. 19 in Glasgow. 23 or 4. We haven't seen temperatures like this

:58:54. > :58:57.for several weeks. We will do it again on Thursday. Starting cloudy

:58:58. > :58:59.but essentially dry. Into the afternoon, turning over, sunny