Representation of Women in Parliament Committee

:00:23. > :00:28.Can I start by thanking you all for making the time to come and speak to

:00:29. > :00:32.the Select Committee this morning. The inquiry on women in the House of

:00:33. > :00:37.Commons is something we feel strongly about and we felt ht was

:00:38. > :00:40.appropriate to ask you to come together. As Parliamentary

:00:41. > :00:44.colleagues we know this is `n issue you feel strongly about yourself and

:00:45. > :00:50.that we can discuss this in a very sensible manner with four p`rties

:00:51. > :00:59.around the table. So thank xou again for your time and for your hnput. We

:01:00. > :01:04.can start the questions. A historical start here. It is nearly

:01:05. > :01:10.100 years since the first fdmale MP was elected but we just had 452

:01:11. > :01:16.women can appeared in that time Compared to 6005 men, there are more

:01:17. > :01:20.men in the House of Commons now than ever before. I will give yot a

:01:21. > :01:27.little hint about how many from each party. 260 and Labour, London 2

:01:28. > :01:35.SNP, 17 Lib Dem and aching from other parties. What has progress

:01:36. > :01:41.been since then? I think progress has been slow. I think therd is much

:01:42. > :01:46.more of a recognition now bdtween all of the parties as to thd

:01:47. > :01:54.necessity to get better representation across the whole

:01:55. > :01:59.spectrum of society. I think partly a lot has changed in the wax the

:02:00. > :02:03.House of Commons operates. Ht will be interesting to try and fhnd out

:02:04. > :02:13.whether it has had an impact on increasing female MPs as it might

:02:14. > :02:16.have been. I think both mysdlf and Germany have been in the Hotse for a

:02:17. > :02:23.very long time. If you go b`ck to the early days when we would be

:02:24. > :02:29.sitting till 10pm or two rare and quite often, that was something that

:02:30. > :02:33.put off a lot of woman from wanting to be in Parliament. That is

:02:34. > :02:38.possibly why some of the ch`nges have come about. I think thd way in

:02:39. > :02:45.which the Parliamentary year is now structured a bit better so that you

:02:46. > :02:51.can find other time to do constituency business and

:02:52. > :02:55.constituency activity as ch`nge The year is more balance. I think that

:02:56. > :03:02.maybe making some of the differences. Thank you for hnviting

:03:03. > :03:06.us and I hope you will also be taking evidence from women

:03:07. > :03:09.representing all of the polhtical parties, as it seems quite strange

:03:10. > :03:17.to have four white men giving evidence. That is your thought not

:03:18. > :03:23.ours. I see that that I'm vdry proud to be the leader of the Labour Party

:03:24. > :03:28.and to represent our views on it. We have 43% of Labour MPs are women, I

:03:29. > :03:35.wanted to be more and our aspiration is to have at least 50% of women MPs

:03:36. > :03:40.in Parliament. We have had the process over 30 or years of

:03:41. > :03:45.development of women's secthons on forums and the Labour Party and a

:03:46. > :03:49.big debate about all women short lists that was won and we now have a

:03:50. > :03:52.processor number of constittencies have all women short lists which

:03:53. > :03:58.results in a women being selected as the candidate. I think the hssue

:03:59. > :04:01.about women in Parliament is deeper than that goes back to the

:04:02. > :04:04.aspirations of girls and wolen and their interest in public and

:04:05. > :04:11.politics. It is an interesthng dichotomy. I attend local Youth

:04:12. > :04:15.Parliament elections in my constituency and it is

:04:16. > :04:18.overwhelmingly young women who want to be elected and overwhelmhngly

:04:19. > :04:22.young women who are passion`te about politics rather than young len stop

:04:23. > :04:27.somewhere along the line th`t gets reversed and in their late 20s or

:04:28. > :04:35.30s, most political parties are dominated by young men who dnd up in

:04:36. > :04:40.Parliament. There has to be an insurance that we get more women

:04:41. > :04:47.selected. Our party is keen on developing women's interests. We

:04:48. > :04:54.have just set up the Labour's woman network. They will help to promote

:04:55. > :04:58.and train young women who w`nt to be in politics in the memory of the

:04:59. > :05:04.late Jo Cox. We are promoting women in a positive way within thd party.

:05:05. > :05:14.Labour supported female suffrage in the first place. One of our early

:05:15. > :05:22.leaders in Parliament resigns.. Thank you for inviting us. There are

:05:23. > :05:28.other writing of reasons whx progress has been so slow. One of

:05:29. > :05:42.which over the years has bedn the failure of men to take on inequality

:05:43. > :05:45.for a woman and representathon of underrepresented groups. Men as well

:05:46. > :05:49.as women need to take a lead in fighting for equality. It is

:05:50. > :05:58.evidence throughout the citx and the move towards the 30% target of woman

:05:59. > :06:02.on city boards and that has been achieved in no small part bx Inc

:06:03. > :06:09.urging men to realise that was right as well as woman in fighting for

:06:10. > :06:15.that. I would also say when one looks at leadership and

:06:16. > :06:19.participation within politics and public life there is a dangdr that

:06:20. > :06:23.men tend to have a high confidence to ability ratio and women sometimes

:06:24. > :06:31.have the opposite. That is `n observation and you deal with that

:06:32. > :06:38.culturally. As Germany was referring to before. In terms of our failure

:06:39. > :06:43.as an institution and a bodx to reach the levels we are no sooner,

:06:44. > :06:47.we need to reach higher levdls and get towards 50-50 balance in

:06:48. > :06:51.Parliament. If you look at what works around the world therd are two

:06:52. > :06:59.things that massively affect the numbers in the country's Parliament

:07:00. > :07:08.- whether that are restrictdd short lists of appropriate -- short lists

:07:09. > :07:13.for proportional representation If we want to be serious in terms of

:07:14. > :07:14.the organisations and reallx tackling this problem we nedd to

:07:15. > :07:23.address both of those things. Thank you very much. Firstlx, I

:07:24. > :07:27.would make the point that the challenge we have had with the

:07:28. > :07:30.underrepresentation of women is not a challenge that is unique to the

:07:31. > :07:35.UK. I would make the observ`tion that the societal and cultural

:07:36. > :07:41.reasons that have excluded women and other minorities are felt rhght

:07:42. > :07:46.across the world, and if we look at other countries which took this more

:07:47. > :07:51.seriously than the UK did e`rlier, so one can look at our Scandinavian

:07:52. > :07:57.neighbours, they were able to make great strides earlier than we have

:07:58. > :08:02.done. I would just observe that I think all political parties realise

:08:03. > :08:06.that there is a problem. All political parties have been trying

:08:07. > :08:09.to find their way to help promote the involvement of women and

:08:10. > :08:15.minority groups within their parties, with a view to candidacy

:08:16. > :08:20.parliaments, when they have been parliaments, when they have been

:08:21. > :08:24.established, so I would mention the creation of the devolved

:08:25. > :08:27.institutions in the UK, which do involve proportional represdntation,

:08:28. > :08:30.which did discuss their working practices of the parliament and

:08:31. > :08:35.whether the working hours, `s an example, were conducive to family

:08:36. > :08:38.life, have led to a higher representation of women in the likes

:08:39. > :08:44.of the Scottish Parliament than has been the case in the UK Parliament.

:08:45. > :08:47.But just as a starter, I thhnk I would observe that we are ddaling

:08:48. > :08:52.with an international phenolenon on. I think we are some way to dealing

:08:53. > :08:57.with the shortcomings, but we still have a significant way to go.

:08:58. > :09:00.So, what was your party's approach in the last election to getting more

:09:01. > :09:08.women in? I can give you sole figures here. 1033 actually stood.

:09:09. > :09:15.22 for the SNP, Green Party 216 which is the highest, Labour 21 ,

:09:16. > :09:20.conservatives 169, and Lib Dems 164. None of them got in,

:09:21. > :09:25.unfortunately. So how do yot think it can be improved? You havd sort of

:09:26. > :09:29.touched on it, about what your party did to try and get more womdn in the

:09:30. > :09:37.last election. We will go into the other stuff later on.

:09:38. > :09:41.In a number of constituencids, we ensure there was a woman candidate

:09:42. > :09:45.selected. We have done a lot to promote and

:09:46. > :09:51.support women within the party and women's's forums, and indeed, we are

:09:52. > :09:53.taking that further with thd policy-making women's conference,

:09:54. > :09:58.which I think we'll have a big effect in promoting women whthin the

:09:59. > :10:04.party and giving them an opportunity to have a say. So those are two

:10:05. > :10:08.specific areas, and they mentioned the mentoring programme which we do

:10:09. > :10:14.through a local women's network OK. So, we had up until the last

:10:15. > :10:17.election, and indeed, renewdd since, and if we are going to move on to

:10:18. > :10:22.what we're doing in future, I will leave those comments when wd come

:10:23. > :10:25.onto that surely. We have something which beg`n in

:10:26. > :10:30.2010, the leadership progralme, which is about making sure that we

:10:31. > :10:33.funnelled additional support, funding, advice, mentoring, to all

:10:34. > :10:41.be representing groups, but especially women. The consepuence of

:10:42. > :10:52.that was, yes, 164 out of 633 seats in Britain, which is far too few. It

:10:53. > :10:57.is worth bearing in mind th`t of the retiring MP seats, they held seats

:10:58. > :11:00.up until the 2015 election, 55% of candidates for the Liberal Democrats

:11:01. > :11:05.the BLT is, when you get thd the BLT is, when you get thd

:11:06. > :11:09.hammering we got a year last May, pretty much any diversity mdchanism

:11:10. > :11:18.you put in place will be put under immense strain. -- I think the

:11:19. > :11:22.result for diversity, or indeed for result for diversity, or indeed for

:11:23. > :11:27.the party. I think what we have seen, we have

:11:28. > :11:31.seen a good increase since 2005 if you look at our figures before 005,

:11:32. > :11:38.they were absolutely appallhng. They are a bit better now, so we have had

:11:39. > :11:42.organisations such as the one led by Anne Jenkins, which is really pushed

:11:43. > :11:49.and try to support women candidates throughout England. There is more

:11:50. > :11:52.work that is being done on that now. The deputy chairman of the party has

:11:53. > :12:04.been very involved in also helping promote a winning -- Elwood helping

:12:05. > :12:09.to promote women. We're makhng sure they help get through short list and

:12:10. > :12:12.get selected. For us, the Scottish parlialentary

:12:13. > :12:17.elections, our female representation went from 27 to 43% in the course of

:12:18. > :12:21.one election, and that happdned for a very specific reason, bec`use

:12:22. > :12:26.there was intervention. What happened, wherever an incumbent SNP

:12:27. > :12:29.member of the Scottish Parlhament stood down or National Execttive

:12:30. > :12:37.Committee had the power to direct or woman short list in such a seat

:12:38. > :12:40.that resulted in, of the 17 new SNP MSPs, 13, three quarters of them,

:12:41. > :12:48.were women. So there is one conclusion from that - intervention

:12:49. > :12:51.works, and it did work. We have found our own way to do it, and

:12:52. > :12:55.we're having to pick of how we do that for local government elections

:12:56. > :12:58.next year, and we will no doubt come onto what that means for Westminster

:12:59. > :13:00.elections in terms of bound`ry review and things like that. It

:13:01. > :13:04.might take away from the biggest step change in female representation

:13:05. > :13:08.in the SNP is with a mechanhsm with the intention of dealing with an

:13:09. > :13:12.imbalance, it dealt very effectively imbalance, it dealt very effectively

:13:13. > :13:18.with an imbalance. We come onto the boundary rdviews,

:13:19. > :13:22.which we don't know whether they will go through what they look like.

:13:23. > :13:26.So it is slightly difficult to answer. But on current forecasting,

:13:27. > :13:29.and I realise it isn't. And, specifically, considering the Labour

:13:30. > :13:33.Party and the Conservative Party, the Labour Party stands to lose 17

:13:34. > :13:40.women and the Conservative Party stands to lose two. So I want to

:13:41. > :13:44.basically know what actions, I suppose this is more to the Labour

:13:45. > :13:48.Party than the Conservative Party, they aim to do to protect the number

:13:49. > :13:53.of women MPs in the boundarx proposal review. To Jeremy, first.

:13:54. > :13:56.Obviously, it is a hypothethcal question, because we don't know what

:13:57. > :13:59.the boundaries are going to be, or indeed, I would wish they wdren t

:14:00. > :14:02.going ahead at all, because too many going ahead at all, because too many

:14:03. > :14:11.are left uncounted. Let's imagine it is going through.

:14:12. > :14:16.OK. If it goes ahead as it hs, there will be a number of women who would

:14:17. > :14:19.be in a problem because of the delineation of new constitudncies.

:14:20. > :14:23.Our national and it has obvhously got to consider this, and mx wish

:14:24. > :14:26.would be to have all women short lists where we can, and to lake sure

:14:27. > :14:30.that we maintain at least the current percentage of women.

:14:31. > :14:34.What do you mean, where we can? It is a question of how far you can

:14:35. > :14:40.go in imposing things from ` national perspective, when there is

:14:41. > :14:45.a rule that automatically, `n MP with 40% of the population lake up

:14:46. > :14:48.of a new constituency must be short listed in the new constituency

:14:49. > :14:52.selection, and after that, what we know as a trigger ballots could take

:14:53. > :14:56.place in a constituency, whhch would decide whether to have an open

:14:57. > :15:03.contest or not. I will be asking our national lives it to look at this

:15:04. > :15:06.now -- our national executive, to make sure we achieve what wd are

:15:07. > :15:09.determined to do, which is `t least 50% of women representation in the

:15:10. > :15:14.next Parliament from the Labour Party, but we'll so have in place as

:15:15. > :15:23.an indicator a number of other programmes such as women's repeat --

:15:24. > :15:29.representation on all levels of the local level. It is nice as `bout

:15:30. > :15:31.selections. -- it is not just about selections.

:15:32. > :15:34.Specifically to the boundarx, the Labour Party is essentially going to

:15:35. > :15:38.go backwards. It is the next election, not forwards, but that is

:15:39. > :15:45.without even taking into account any particular losses in elections,

:15:46. > :15:48.which as Tim Farron has pointed out, is damning on diversity, because

:15:49. > :15:52.women are more likely to hold marginal seats in the Labour Party

:15:53. > :15:57.and across the board. So I suppose what we are seeking, with rdgard to

:15:58. > :16:00.the boundary review, from all colleagues, is what exactly are you

:16:01. > :16:03.going to do about the reduction and the Labour Party stands to hold the

:16:04. > :16:06.greatest reduction, so the Labour Party stands a chance of gohng the

:16:07. > :16:11.most backwards. I fully understand the dangdr of the

:16:12. > :16:15.situation. I have let you know that we are determined to achievd 50

:16:16. > :16:22.representation, and our nathonal lives could will be considering this

:16:23. > :16:25.burgeoning at my request. -, our national executive will be

:16:26. > :16:29.considering this burgeoning. So as we go into the post boundarx review

:16:30. > :16:34.period, it may well be that we will intervene to ensure that thdre are

:16:35. > :16:37.all women short lists, or in some cases, make sure that women are

:16:38. > :16:43.added to short lists to enstre that there is a choice.

:16:44. > :16:49.Patrick. Well, and Jeremy's point about the make-up of present

:16:50. > :16:52.boundaries, based on data in 20 0, so by the time we get to thd next

:16:53. > :16:55.general election, it will bd 20 years out of date.

:16:56. > :17:00.So I am rather surprised he is so opposed to the changes, which

:17:01. > :17:02.Parliament approved in the last Parliament, and should be

:17:03. > :17:05.intermittent. I think it is important that they are demdnted. I

:17:06. > :17:08.think there is far too much disparity amongst some

:17:09. > :17:12.constituencies at the present time. But if we move on from that...

:17:13. > :17:17.We're here to talk about thd women. Of course. I wanted to respond to

:17:18. > :17:24.what Jeremy said. He made hhs point, and I wanted to make mine as well. I

:17:25. > :17:30.think we have got to do everything we can to ensure that firstly, we

:17:31. > :17:31.don't see a decrease in the amount of women Conservative members

:17:32. > :17:36.parliament, but actually, I want to parliament, but actually, I want to

:17:37. > :17:42.see an increase. One of the things that has made, as far as I'l

:17:43. > :17:45.concerned, the Conservative Party better, is that we've actually got

:17:46. > :17:49.far more diverse representation across all sections of the

:17:50. > :17:53.community, and I don't want to see us go back on that. We will take the

:17:54. > :17:59.necessary actions we have got to take. Without straying to override

:18:00. > :18:03.local associations. The boundary commission of only just published

:18:04. > :18:07.their first stab at it. Obvhously, there are all the represent`tions

:18:08. > :18:11.feel for where we are going, feel for where we are going,

:18:12. > :18:17.probably this time next year, as far as the seats are concerned. But I

:18:18. > :18:20.the Prime Minister taking a very the Prime Minister taking a very

:18:21. > :18:22.direct interest in these matters, she won't want to see the shtuation

:18:23. > :18:27.deteriorate. So at the moment, you don't have

:18:28. > :18:31.any... You haven't identifidd any specific things you are going to do

:18:32. > :18:40.who may be reduced? Well, the party who may be reduced? Well, the party

:18:41. > :18:43.board has agreed in injuncthon with a 1922 committee about proportions

:18:44. > :18:45.of seeds and what happens whth proportions of seats, and h`d a

:18:46. > :18:51.brief section will go on. But there will be some new seats,

:18:52. > :18:57.and some that actually aren't selected as far as candidatds are

:18:58. > :19:01.concerned, and I'm pretty stre, as the last Parliament showed, you

:19:02. > :19:05.actually do get some retirelents. I think one of the impacts of fixed

:19:06. > :19:09.term Parliaments is that it does make people think a lot mord as to

:19:10. > :19:12.whether they want to do another seven or eight years when they are

:19:13. > :19:15.making the decision about whether to stand again.

:19:16. > :19:18.But at the moment, as it st`nds the Conservative Party don't have any

:19:19. > :19:21.particular strategy you could tell it about today with regard to women

:19:22. > :19:26.in the boundary review? The strategy overall for wolen is to

:19:27. > :19:30.get more women into winnabld seats. If you don't mind me interrtpting,

:19:31. > :19:35.that is a laudable strategy, like I have many laudable strategids in my

:19:36. > :19:38.life that never come to fruhtion. One has to know the detail of such

:19:39. > :19:44.us to allergy, rather than just its overarching mission. -- the detail

:19:45. > :19:50.of such a strategy. By think it is more than a laudable

:19:51. > :19:54.strategy, if I may say so. Ht was nearly a laudable strategy, we would

:19:55. > :19:58.not seem to mind is progress. In 2005, 17, at the last gener`l

:19:59. > :20:03.election, 68. We must move forward, so I put that as my defence for my

:20:04. > :20:10.laudable strategy, which has been put into operation.

:20:11. > :20:13.Jeremy, I will move onto thd Labour Jeremy, I will move onto thd Labour

:20:14. > :20:22.Party, so I wonder if I could ask because time is limited, sole closed

:20:23. > :20:25.questions that might help us to get some short answers as well. Would

:20:26. > :20:28.you agree that all women short list of the most effective mechanism we

:20:29. > :20:32.have found for the selection of reselection of women?

:20:33. > :20:36.Absolutely, and I have supported all women short lists from all the time

:20:37. > :20:42.I have been in the Labour P`rty I think it has made an incredhble

:20:43. > :20:45.that the men in the party h`ve to that the men in the party h`ve to

:20:46. > :20:49.play in ending the play in ending the

:20:50. > :20:53.underrepresentation of women, and we initially did it on a regional

:20:54. > :20:57.basis, so we would put all women short lists into most, if not all,

:20:58. > :21:01.selections in a particular region until that region had reachdd the

:21:02. > :21:08.50% that we wanted, and aftdr that, there would be a more open contest

:21:09. > :21:11.where both men and women cotld contest a selection process. I think

:21:12. > :21:14.it has been a wholly good thing I have to say, it was extremely

:21:15. > :21:21.controversial when first promoted in the party and nearly 1970s. It was

:21:22. > :21:24.seen as... I was accused of being a far left extremist for promoting

:21:25. > :21:28.ideas like that. Can you im`gine such a thing!

:21:29. > :21:31.Let me ask you a few things related to the all women short list, then.

:21:32. > :21:37.You said in your first answdr that you believe there is a drop,off for

:21:38. > :21:41.women's representation coming through in perhaps their 20s and

:21:42. > :21:46.30s. What do you think is c`using a drop-off?

:21:47. > :21:55.It is hard to know exactly. Young woman of school and college name are

:21:56. > :22:00.often passionately interestdd in politics and representing their

:22:01. > :22:07.classmates and college mates in school and college elections. The

:22:08. > :22:13.Tehran there seems to be an overtaking of Machell culture and

:22:14. > :22:19.that reduces their representation. I think it is a question of extending

:22:20. > :22:23.the idea of balance representation and office holding. In our

:22:24. > :22:27.constituency parties we reqtire a balance between men and womdn and I

:22:28. > :22:35.think that is an important lessage from the very beginning. In the last

:22:36. > :22:43.18 selections for mayor, do you know how many were women? There hs a

:22:44. > :22:49.problem with this election of Mayors in that in the selections wd just

:22:50. > :22:55.went through for Liverpool, greater Manchester and Birmingham, three men

:22:56. > :23:00.have been selected. In the case of Manchester there were no wolen put

:23:01. > :23:04.forward. In the case of Livdrpool and Merseyside there was ond proof

:23:05. > :23:09.for it. I have asked that the national accept YouTube revhews this

:23:10. > :23:13.to ensure that we do give consideration to all woman short

:23:14. > :23:21.listed for mayor as we do for parliamentary elections. Yot are

:23:22. > :23:26.right to identify it. The 18 Labour mayor since 2002, only two of those

:23:27. > :23:31.have been men. Is there any philosophical reason why an all

:23:32. > :23:37.female short list should not be applied at the level of Mayor?

:23:38. > :23:46.Absolutely not. This was before I became leader. I have asked the

:23:47. > :23:49.national executive to look `t this because it is not acceptabld to have

:23:50. > :23:58.the vast majority of Fat candidates for mayor being men when we want to

:23:59. > :24:01.achieve the same as we want to achieve in parliamentary

:24:02. > :24:09.representation. I want to ASCII some questions about the party wd both

:24:10. > :24:12.belong to. There were 23 potential selections when men and womdn could

:24:13. > :24:20.go head-to-head in a new botndary seat. Based on what you know, how

:24:21. > :24:27.many do you think will be women I would hope that around half because

:24:28. > :24:31.I would hope to get 50%. I `m concerned about this as indhcated in

:24:32. > :24:37.my reply and that is why I've asked the NEC to look carefully at this. I

:24:38. > :24:42.cannot give a definitive answer as to what the rule will be because it

:24:43. > :24:49.has not yet been formulated. I am very determined to achieve 40%

:24:50. > :24:54.representation. Your view on this is very important and your leadership

:24:55. > :24:58.on this is important. That hs why there is a process going through the

:24:59. > :25:08.NEC and I understand that is important. In the Labour Party we

:25:09. > :25:12.have a process where a checker ballot could cause a fool

:25:13. > :25:18.reselection process in a particular seat. If any Labour MP goes through

:25:19. > :25:26.a checker ballot process and they are a woman, do you think it would

:25:27. > :25:32.be appropriate to put in pl`ce an all-female short list there? That

:25:33. > :25:38.could be done. If you looks like we're going to end up with two few

:25:39. > :25:46.women being selected and eldcted I would want to look at that. There

:25:47. > :25:51.was a young woman removed from the NEC by members. She tried to get a

:25:52. > :25:55.sexual harassment policy through the NEC to improve the structurd and

:25:56. > :26:00.culture. And now you are a lember of the NEC and have been for the last

:26:01. > :26:06.year. Why do you think that it not go through. I have now put something

:26:07. > :26:11.through the national executhve which was a statement that came ott of the

:26:12. > :26:19.concerns about racism and wd put forward a policy which prohhbits

:26:20. > :26:27.intimidatory behaviour against individuals or communities `nd

:26:28. > :26:31.anyone caving in a way that is sexist, racist or discrimin`tory and

:26:32. > :26:39.anyway could face action within the party, including expulsion from the

:26:40. > :26:44.party. I am serious about this. I've put this forward personally to the

:26:45. > :26:49.NEC and it has been adopted. That was after I became the leaddr. Do

:26:50. > :26:54.you think that a sufficient on the issue of sexual harassment? We have

:26:55. > :26:58.codes of conduct that apply throughout the whole party that

:26:59. > :27:04.concern behaviour at branch level, constituency level and at any other

:27:05. > :27:08.level within the party about behaviour and attitudes tow`rds

:27:09. > :27:11.people. Members who behave inappropriately can be suspdnded

:27:12. > :27:15.from membership and could bd expelled. There has to be a process

:27:16. > :27:21.to examine each case becausd obviously there are two sidds to an

:27:22. > :27:25.argument but I am determined to resolve these quickly and not to let

:27:26. > :27:34.them drag on. I am very serhous about this. What I read in the

:27:35. > :27:39.newspaper and hear from colleagues is that there is a level of

:27:40. > :27:43.intimidation and trolling which would put the hardest person of

:27:44. > :27:51.going into politics than thd Labour Party. What are you doing about

:27:52. > :27:56.that. It is not coming from within the party, that is abuse on social

:27:57. > :28:00.media that is beyond disgusting If you look through it and see what is

:28:01. > :28:07.there you will see some horrible stuff. If there are people

:28:08. > :28:11.identified as from within otr own party, behaving inappropriately and

:28:12. > :28:19.putting things on Facebook or Twitter, they can be suspended from

:28:20. > :28:23.party membership and investhgated. In the Conservative Party wd have a

:28:24. > :28:38.policy of no one left behind. Do you have that same policy? Are xou going

:28:39. > :28:48.down that route to say that when people retire they will be replaced?

:28:49. > :28:54.Our processes one that the local party makes the decision and has the

:28:55. > :28:59.selection process. They do not have the power to impose candidates or

:29:00. > :29:04.tell people who to select. We do have the power to ensure a process

:29:05. > :29:08.takes place and there is a fierce election and we achieve what we are

:29:09. > :29:12.determined to do which is 50% of female representation. You `re going

:29:13. > :29:23.to make an effort to stop the intimidation? I already am `nd

:29:24. > :29:28.haven't for continued to do so. It is not used to tell local

:29:29. > :29:33.memberships what to do, that disagrees with your view about

:29:34. > :29:38.all-female short list. We both know that no local branch of was to have

:29:39. > :29:43.an all-female short list but we put that on to them. At what level do

:29:44. > :29:49.you think you do now have a role in what local membership does? The

:29:50. > :29:55.national executive of the p`rty can and does require an all-fem`le short

:29:56. > :30:00.list. We have done that for more than 20 years and it has had a huge

:30:01. > :30:06.effect on increasing the nulber of female MPs and we will conthnue with

:30:07. > :30:10.that process. I cannot tell a constituency who to choose

:30:11. > :30:18.preconception parameters. If we have an all women short lists, then

:30:19. > :30:25.obviously they will choose woman. During the leadership campahgn you

:30:26. > :30:30.mentioned a 50-50 represent`tion policy. What are you going to change

:30:31. > :30:36.to bring that back? An examhnation of where we are at the moment on

:30:37. > :30:42.selections for me know what the boundaries will be. What do when

:30:43. > :30:49.ability of those seats are. This goes back a very long way, dven to

:30:50. > :30:52.the 1920s, that women tend to represent more marginal than safe

:30:53. > :30:58.constituencies. This also applies in other parties. I want to look very

:30:59. > :31:03.carefully at all-female short list so it is not just on the totality of

:31:04. > :31:09.constituencies but in ones that are more likely to be one to ensure that

:31:10. > :31:13.we do achieve 50%. So when the bell curve of seats from when a ball to

:31:14. > :31:18.less winnable, you think thhs should be a more woman selected in safe

:31:19. > :31:28.seats? I would like that to be the case. But I do not like seehng safe

:31:29. > :31:37.or unsafe. There is no safe seat. I want to make sure that they get 50%.

:31:38. > :31:42.To go back, you mentioned a drop-off and I posited that there might be

:31:43. > :31:47.something about the culture in the Labour Party, particularly for young

:31:48. > :31:51.woman involved in represent`tion in levels outside Parliament. @s you

:31:52. > :31:57.come across any examples whdre you think there is a particular problem

:31:58. > :32:03.for women? I think sometimes there are behavioural issues that young

:32:04. > :32:08.women are not treated with the respect they deserve and Labour

:32:09. > :32:14.groups and councils and think this probably applies across the board

:32:15. > :32:19.and other parties as well. Ht is a process of respect and educ`tion

:32:20. > :32:24.that is very important. This is why I'm interested in the attittdes of

:32:25. > :32:29.young women towards politics and activity in public life. I have been

:32:30. > :32:32.looking at the way in which Youth Parliament and youth councils

:32:33. > :32:37.operate as a way of ensuring that young woman do continue to be

:32:38. > :32:44.involved and interested in representational politics. They

:32:45. > :32:47.think weather situations with young woman coming forward with c`ses of

:32:48. > :32:56.misogyny and bullying within the Labour Party that we handle does

:32:57. > :33:01.well? I am trying to ensure that they are all examined quickly and

:33:02. > :33:05.sensitively and the names of all parties are withheld until there has

:33:06. > :33:09.been released an initial investigation of it. That w`s on the

:33:10. > :33:16.recommendations to our national executive. I will keep it under

:33:17. > :33:21.review because we have set hn train the process that I have described

:33:22. > :33:25.here, we certain plays the codes of conduct you have described, although

:33:26. > :33:30.they are open to review bec`use you have to check how these things are

:33:31. > :33:35.getting on. It is also a qudstion of the educational culture with an all

:33:36. > :33:40.parties about how people behave towards each other. Parliamdnt sets

:33:41. > :33:49.an appalling example. The attitude of MPs towards each other in the

:33:50. > :33:54.Chamber and in committees, H think we have an example to set as well

:33:55. > :33:59.and we do not. What would bd your message to young woman in the Labour

:34:00. > :34:07.Party who feel they are expdriencing at an addition or abuse bec`use of

:34:08. > :34:10.their gender or age. If thex feel that they are make sure that the

:34:11. > :34:16.officers and the local partx branch know about it and it is invdstigated

:34:17. > :34:20.in a proper way. If they ard not with the uncertain ticket to the

:34:21. > :34:31.stage. Before you finish I know that others want to comment... Journey,

:34:32. > :34:35.you believe in equality, of course. So why is there not all-black short

:34:36. > :34:41.lists or disabled short lists or LGBT short list? There have been

:34:42. > :34:47.suggestions about that. There have been idea is that that should be put

:34:48. > :34:53.forward. I have some sympathy with that. I'll so have sympathy with

:34:54. > :34:58.ensuring that there is a pl`ce on selection processes for people

:34:59. > :35:03.representing LGBT, black or disabled communities. I think there should be

:35:04. > :35:06.processed ensure that happens because Parliament has to bd

:35:07. > :35:12.representative of our society and it is up to all of us to recognise we

:35:13. > :35:17.are in a party political system and that our parties operate in a way

:35:18. > :35:22.that all those groups end up with representation. It is sad that it

:35:23. > :35:26.was not until 1987 that there were four black MPs elected to

:35:27. > :35:31.Parliament, the first one shnce the 1920s and one lost his seat. How

:35:32. > :35:37.will you deliver that withott breaching the equality act? I think

:35:38. > :35:46.you can deliver it by requiring them to be included in the short listing

:35:47. > :35:49.process. Jeremy, you mentioned earlier that this Parliament has a

:35:50. > :35:55.responsibility and I think xou use the word leadership and I agree with

:35:56. > :35:58.you that it is crucial to this. You seem quite philosophical nature

:35:59. > :36:03.about the future and young people and aspirations young woman. I'm

:36:04. > :36:09.interested to know what asstrances will you give to your members right

:36:10. > :36:10.now that your party will do more to end intimidation and bullying that

:36:11. > :36:24.is taking place in your party? You assume the party is rifd with

:36:25. > :36:27.intimidation. It is not. Thdre are some intimidation, and we are in the

:36:28. > :36:30.process of dealing with it. We have codes of conduct and rules, and we

:36:31. > :36:34.are in the process of dealing with it. We are a large party, whth over

:36:35. > :36:38.very fast, and I want to make sure very fast, and I want to make sure

:36:39. > :36:40.that all those new members understand the rules and thd code of

:36:41. > :36:43.behaviour expected from thel within behaviour expected from thel within

:36:44. > :36:49.the party. Just one last question, which is

:36:50. > :36:54.this. Why do you think that a woman doing the job that I do as ` member

:36:55. > :36:57.of Parliament is far more lhkely to receive abuse while doing it than

:36:58. > :37:03.me? The society in which we livd is

:37:04. > :37:09.unfortunately still quite sdxist, in many cases, quite misogynist. Read

:37:10. > :37:13.the style of writing of an `wful lot of popular newspapers that H'm sure

:37:14. > :37:24.see where a lot of the stuff comes see where a lot of the stuff comes

:37:25. > :37:27.from, and the acceptance of... Too ready acceptance of racism, sexism

:37:28. > :37:30.in our society, which is solething in our society, which is solething

:37:31. > :37:32.we must challenge. We are to represent everyone in public life,

:37:33. > :37:38.and we must challenge it. Before we move onto the next set of

:37:39. > :37:42.questions, I know you to le`ve a little early, Jeremy. I will ask you

:37:43. > :37:45.the final question we will `sk to all parties. What commitment will

:37:46. > :37:48.your party make today to thhs committee to make sure that the

:37:49. > :37:53.number of women in your party increases in the 2020 Parli`ment?

:37:54. > :37:58.It is our policy to achieve at least 50-50 representation. We have got a

:37:59. > :38:01.long way towards it with 43$ representation, but it is also

:38:02. > :38:05.important to the cultural development within our partx, and I

:38:06. > :38:08.hope within other parties, that we achieve that representation and

:38:09. > :38:09.that is clearly a route into that is clearly a route into

:38:10. > :38:13.So how many more women will you have So how many more women will you have

:38:14. > :38:18.to get elected at the next dlection to achieve your objective?

:38:19. > :38:22.Well, we have 43% at the molent it clearly depends on how many seats we

:38:23. > :38:26.win at the next election. That say we won... I would put a figtre, but

:38:27. > :38:32.more than 50%. You very much.

:38:33. > :38:35.-- thank you very much. I'm going to question you on the record of the

:38:36. > :38:38.Conservative Party. The former Prime Minister w`s very

:38:39. > :38:40.keen, or did talk about all women keen, or did talk about all

:38:41. > :38:43.short lists, and the Conservative short lists, and the Conservative

:38:44. > :38:47.Party is one of the few parties that doesn't use all women short lists to

:38:48. > :38:52.select its parliamentary candidate, but that hasn't happened. So what

:38:53. > :38:54.are your thoughts on all wolen short list, and do you think it is

:38:55. > :38:58.something the Conservative Party will use in the future?

:38:59. > :39:04.There is nothing to stop all women short lists going for assochations,

:39:05. > :39:11.and I think there have been a few occasions, although I don't have the

:39:12. > :39:13.exact historical record, and was not responsible for those of thd last

:39:14. > :39:17.general election, but I think there was some areas where there were all

:39:18. > :39:20.women short lists, that just naturally happened. We don't impose

:39:21. > :39:25.all women short lists, becatse we do try to get local associations to

:39:26. > :39:29.have as much freedom as possible in the way they go about selecting

:39:30. > :39:32.general election. Different rules general election. Different rules

:39:33. > :39:38.apply in a by-election, but in some cases, I think, there are all women

:39:39. > :39:41.short lists. I was selected from an all women

:39:42. > :39:45.short list that happened naturally, but if you were pushed, and the

:39:46. > :39:49.Prime Minister came to UN s`id, how will we get more conservative women

:39:50. > :39:54.MPs in Parliament, would yot to her, all women short lists are the way to

:39:55. > :40:01.go? I think imposing that on

:40:02. > :40:05.Conservative associations would possibly risk a resentment which

:40:06. > :40:08.would not help that member of Parliament once they were sdlected,

:40:09. > :40:14.or that candidate, once thex were selected. I would rather usd other

:40:15. > :40:17.measures, working with associations, working with women who are on the

:40:18. > :40:22.candidates list or are trying to get on the candidates list. We have

:40:23. > :40:30.various organisations where we do that, so, for example Women To Win,

:40:31. > :40:34.and our deputy chairman of the party has special responsibility for the

:40:35. > :40:36.women candidates -- for all the candidates, and looking aftdr the

:40:37. > :40:42.women candidates as well. Shgh her weird and all those things hn the

:40:43. > :40:45.right way, but I am willing to be persuaded. -- so I hope we have done

:40:46. > :40:52.all those things in the right way. So from what you are saying, using

:40:53. > :40:58.mentoring such as the Women To Win programme and these role models is

:40:59. > :41:03.as effective as all women short lists, or...

:41:04. > :41:08.? Well, we need to see how we are moving along.

:41:09. > :41:14.I think we have come a long way in the Conservative Party in a

:41:15. > :41:17.relatively short time, and last ten years, and with the work thd David

:41:18. > :41:23.Cameron and a razor made it, when Leader of the Opposition, to try and

:41:24. > :41:28.redress the balance a bit. ,- to reason me. I also think that sends a

:41:29. > :41:33.break of message out to constituents' associations H was

:41:34. > :41:36.reflecting on it, that in all the general elections I have fotght in

:41:37. > :41:40.my time standing for Parlialent I have never, ever had a woman

:41:41. > :41:42.candidate against me from any of the party, which is quite staggdring,

:41:43. > :41:48.really. And in terms of the discusshon this

:41:49. > :41:51.morning, much has been on the parliamentary party and tridd to get

:41:52. > :41:56.more female parliamentary c`ndidates in place and elected. But if you are

:41:57. > :42:00.that the Conservative Party as a whole, it is very male dominated. If

:42:01. > :42:04.you look at the professional party, only two out of the ten dirdctors of

:42:05. > :42:08.the party are women. If you look at the voluntary party in my area, the

:42:09. > :42:18.south-east, only eight of the nine area chairman... Eight of the nine

:42:19. > :42:22.area chairman Harold Mann, `nd even in the 1922 committee there is a new

:42:23. > :42:25.one woman out of 12 in that. Does the Conservative Party have a

:42:26. > :42:31.problem with women outside of the parliamentary selection process

:42:32. > :42:35.I think we have awarded points for numbers, and I hope we get ` bonus

:42:36. > :42:40.that the Prime Minister! As to sort of the make-up of parties, but you

:42:41. > :42:43.are right. It is sometimes that people don't want to put thdmselves

:42:44. > :42:48.forward for various bodies, and you can't force them to do that. I take

:42:49. > :42:53.the point on the elections. I don't think I get vote on that, btt you

:42:54. > :42:57.do. In terms of when candidates are

:42:58. > :42:59.selected being selected, I know you thought about boundary changes and

:43:00. > :43:05.one of the areas you have bden working at helping create the number

:43:06. > :43:11.of women MPs and help those potential female MPs that mhght lose

:43:12. > :43:14.their seats in retirement, but historically, the Conservathve Party

:43:15. > :43:20.have been very poor in selecting female candidates for either

:43:21. > :43:24.retirement seats or target seats. Only 28% in the last election of

:43:25. > :43:30.female candidates were in t`rget seats compared to, say, 54% in

:43:31. > :43:32.Labour. So why is it so difficult for female candidates in thd

:43:33. > :43:36.Conservative Party to be selected for either retirement seats or

:43:37. > :43:42.target seats, when they are much more likely to be selected for

:43:43. > :43:47.nonmember seats? Well, as I say, I think there has

:43:48. > :43:51.been progress. There is mord work there needs to be done, but I think

:43:52. > :43:56.actually, we have started to address that and will continue to address

:43:57. > :44:00.that. We have given extra hdlp to women candidates through

:44:01. > :44:05.organisations like Women To Win and other organisations, helping women

:44:06. > :44:09.to get forward in the selections. In the written selection to this

:44:10. > :44:14.committee, you said that a third of Conservative candidates seldcted for

:44:15. > :44:17.2015's general election with e-mail, but the House of Commons library

:44:18. > :44:21.says it is less than that, `round 26%. What is the true figurd?

:44:22. > :44:25.Well, I think the figure I have given this true, but I have not

:44:26. > :44:31.caught up with a discrepancx between the House of Commons librarx, and as

:44:32. > :44:34.we all know, we argue with them members of Parliament seem to take

:44:35. > :44:39.the House of Commons librarx as a certain bylaw which is not to be

:44:40. > :44:43.questioned, but I will check that out. I thought the figure I was

:44:44. > :44:47.given was correct. So are there any specific things you

:44:48. > :44:50.have kind of ruled out? You have ruled out all women short lhsts so

:44:51. > :44:55.together is women into retirement seats in target seats, apart from

:44:56. > :44:59.men touring and, we have highlighted the lack of role models in the

:45:00. > :45:03.Conservative Party -- mentoring is the Reading specific you can do to

:45:04. > :45:06.try and increase the number of female candidates in those seats

:45:07. > :45:10.that are more likely to win? I think the number of things are

:45:11. > :45:15.going on. First and foremost, we would get a better idea what we

:45:16. > :45:18.expect those seats to be, and those people that are affected or not

:45:19. > :45:26.affected by changes in how we work with those. But the work th`t we are

:45:27. > :45:32.doing, there is more to be done I go back to the point that in 20 5,

:45:33. > :45:36.we were 17 women on the Conservative benches. Today, we are 68. So is the

:45:37. > :45:38.party aware of the problem? Is the party tried to address the

:45:39. > :45:43.Yes. Has it been as successful as we Yes. Has it been as successful as we

:45:44. > :45:47.would like? I think we have made good progress in a number of

:45:48. > :45:50.directions, but there is a lot more work to be done, and that is being

:45:51. > :45:55.done through the candidates' department, not just through Women

:45:56. > :45:58.To Win, though that has been very important, and they have bedn very

:45:59. > :46:02.successful in helping us to do that. We had a special video made at the

:46:03. > :46:05.conference about getting wolen selected into winnable seats, which

:46:06. > :46:09.was shown at the conference. So I hope we're made progress along those

:46:10. > :46:15.lines. And just reflecting the boundary

:46:16. > :46:20.changes, the potential impact on female Conservative MPs is not as

:46:21. > :46:27.drastic as it could be, potdntially, on female Labour MPs, but what is

:46:28. > :46:35.the party going to do to ensure that women MPs who may be affectdd are

:46:36. > :46:38.supported through that, and are there specific measures in place to

:46:39. > :46:41.help female MPs deal with boundary changes?

:46:42. > :46:48.There will be. When we're clear on what the changes are, I think all

:46:49. > :46:52.this has to be done... One of the problems in which the legislation

:46:53. > :47:00.was changed, so we can't actually take a decision on these until late

:47:01. > :47:03.2018, does actually leave a shorter period of time for the fixed term

:47:04. > :47:10.Parliament to be able to st`rt looking at this, but I think when we

:47:11. > :47:16.first review that is done, we will first review that is done, we will

:47:17. > :47:19.start to think about those `s the seats to go forward.

:47:20. > :47:24.And the final question, I rdally just want to build on what Jess

:47:25. > :47:27.asked all of you previously, but particularly for the Conservative

:47:28. > :47:31.Party. If the polls are to be believed, the Conservative Party are

:47:32. > :47:34.likely to win the next general election, so the pressure is even

:47:35. > :47:37.harder on you to make sure that if we are going to increase felale MPs

:47:38. > :47:40.across the board, that the Conservative Party have really got

:47:41. > :47:47.to step up, because they ard more likely to produce more of the MPs

:47:48. > :47:52.after 2020. So what is the Conservative Party doing, and you as

:47:53. > :47:57.the chairman doing, to ensure that those MPs that are elected hn 2 20

:47:58. > :48:02.and more likely to be women? Well, the usual cautionary tale is,

:48:03. > :48:05.on polls, inevitably them. There is on the one that matters, and by the

:48:06. > :48:13.time you know the results of that, it is too late. But I think the work

:48:14. > :48:17.that is being done now in drawing up candidates' lists, in preparing

:48:18. > :48:20.women candidates and helping them, giving them extra training courses,

:48:21. > :48:28.all of that is important. I have just appointed a chairman for

:48:29. > :48:37.training, one of our MPs in the West Midlands. She will have a s`y in how

:48:38. > :48:40.we do the training, right across the board for the party, not just on

:48:41. > :48:43.candidate selection. There has been quite a bit of work done on that,

:48:44. > :48:46.Women To Win, and I don't w`nt to Women To Win, and I don't w`nt to

:48:47. > :48:54.undermine what is really bedn a successful organisation. -- what has

:48:55. > :48:58.been a successful organisathon. As the party and government in the

:48:59. > :49:03.UK, and this question is specifically for Patrick...

:49:04. > :49:06.Sorry, I missed what you just said. As the party and government in the

:49:07. > :49:12.UK and the party that hosts the second female Prime Minister, will

:49:13. > :49:16.your party live up to its commitment and its aspirations for a gdnder

:49:17. > :49:23.balanced cabinet and a 50-50 Parliament by 2020?

:49:24. > :49:25.I hope we see an improvement in our overall representation as f`r as

:49:26. > :49:31.women are concerned, yes. Actual figures, I can't give you those

:49:32. > :49:34.actual figures, but I think the Prime Minister has made a vdry

:49:35. > :49:39.important start in the way hn which she formed her first governlent

:49:40. > :49:47.Eight of the Cabinet are felale so I think... And her commitment has

:49:48. > :49:50.gone back for quite some tile. It is not something she has newly come

:49:51. > :49:54.onto. She has actually fought against where she has seen

:49:55. > :50:00.discrimination in the past, and has actually come through it as well.

:50:01. > :50:06.Can I take you back to, I think one of your first answer is, whhch was,

:50:07. > :50:09.what evidence do you have that women who are selected through an all

:50:10. > :50:17.women short list enjoy less legitimacy in parliament? No, what I

:50:18. > :50:25.said was, if you impose it. I think it can get resentment. I'm not

:50:26. > :50:30.saying that, and I don't be that. I was misquoted if I was. But I think

:50:31. > :50:33.the point was made that she was part of an all woman short list, and that

:50:34. > :50:40.is where I was drawing "Is from So your belief is that, while an all

:50:41. > :50:44.women short list is an imposed, that could prevent a woman from dnjoying

:50:45. > :50:50.the full legitimacy? Know, once a member of Parlhament is

:50:51. > :50:53.elected to the Hausa commons, I think we know that one of the things

:50:54. > :50:57.that does not matter when you are actually in the House of Colmons, is

:50:58. > :51:02.actually what sort of majorhty you have got or anything like that. A

:51:03. > :51:04.number of Parliament is tre`ted the same as any other, so that should

:51:05. > :51:08.be. Do you think that there are women in

:51:09. > :51:12.Parliament who feel that thdy have less legitimacy because thex were

:51:13. > :51:21.selected on an all woman short list? No, because once they have got the

:51:22. > :51:24.mandate of their constituency, their rights as members of Parlialent as

:51:25. > :51:33.far as I'm concerned, are the same as any other. Thank you.

:51:34. > :51:40.More women are in marginal seats. What will you do to make sure they

:51:41. > :51:48.are supported in the next election so we can keep up that numbdr? Quite

:51:49. > :51:54.a bit, but I'm not perhaps willing to talk about it in front of the

:51:55. > :51:59.Committee. The evidence points to the fact that in other countries

:52:00. > :52:02.where they have a good numbdr of female representatives that has been

:52:03. > :52:10.achieved by quarters such as all-female short lists and support

:52:11. > :52:20.mechanisms. Some of these c`n be aired by breaking down barrhers Why

:52:21. > :52:24.have you rejected the evidence of good positive discrimination,

:52:25. > :52:28.because we can see in this room that some of us are here because we were

:52:29. > :52:32.wrong all-female short lists and that is why we have representation.

:52:33. > :52:40.I am worried that you are s`ying you do not want to do that. We have made

:52:41. > :52:44.progress. I want to see us lake more progress. I think the progrdss we

:52:45. > :52:49.have made in the last ten ydars has been to measures that have been

:52:50. > :52:52.taken and are acceptable within the Conservative Party. If we wdre not

:52:53. > :52:55.making progress through but have to look at the other means avahlable to

:52:56. > :53:03.us but we have been making progress and want to see that continte. I

:53:04. > :53:08.have to ask the question, the Conservative Party have onlx ever

:53:09. > :53:12.managed to get 123 woman eldcted and we have got thousands of wolen who

:53:13. > :53:17.are members. I hear warm words from you but how are you going to

:53:18. > :53:22.convince this Committee that those warm words world lead to more women

:53:23. > :53:28.and the next election rather than simply a status quo? Judge ts by our

:53:29. > :53:36.actions and what has happendd in recent years. The thing I would say

:53:37. > :53:43.is that we have made lots of progress and we will continte to do

:53:44. > :53:47.that. We have done that by `ctually taking the party with us and not

:53:48. > :53:53.having an issue as far as the parties concerned. There was some

:53:54. > :53:58.resentment and David Cameron tried an alternate list, although that was

:53:59. > :54:04.a balanced a list, but therd was a lot of criticism about that and a

:54:05. > :54:09.lot of woman felt left out, so we are learning from that and working

:54:10. > :54:14.with associations when it bdcomes clear that has a vacancy, when it

:54:15. > :54:16.becomes clear that there is an opportunity, we work with those

:54:17. > :54:21.associations and do a lot more work in the run-up to their selection of

:54:22. > :54:27.their candidates than we have in the past. We have done things lhke open

:54:28. > :54:32.primaries, which I don't thhnk other parties have done, which have been

:54:33. > :54:36.very successful in certain cases. When you're coming to situation of

:54:37. > :54:41.bringing down the size of the House of Commons to 600 then therd are

:54:42. > :54:52.other problems which come into being during that reduction. My

:54:53. > :55:01.objection is to Angus Robertson the leader of the SNP Westminstdr grip.

:55:02. > :55:07.Over the last ten years the party has been a substantial journey and

:55:08. > :55:13.you as the former party chahrman work quite instrumental to some of

:55:14. > :55:18.the more successful elections that we have ever witnessed. What

:55:19. > :55:21.improvements to Jamaica durhng your time this campaign coordinator in

:55:22. > :55:28.business convener of than the party to ensure gender balance and

:55:29. > :55:33.representation of women? Thd first observation is made for the benefit

:55:34. > :55:36.of colleagues who might not understand the timing of our role.

:55:37. > :55:40.It is a structure because I was effectively the person who was

:55:41. > :55:44.chairing the party, chairing the national executive and the

:55:45. > :55:48.conference, at the same timd as having been our campaigns dhrector,

:55:49. > :55:57.how did we win elections and run the party? It would be fair to say that

:55:58. > :56:02.at that time I had inherited a culture of dealing with the issue of

:56:03. > :56:06.women and minority representation from the perspective of we really

:56:07. > :56:10.want this to be better, and we have had some of that today, and we are

:56:11. > :56:16.really going to try and hopd that things get better so we will exhort

:56:17. > :56:22.and encourage, rather than have mechanisms in place. I think by the

:56:23. > :56:29.end of my period in both of those rules, I realised that was not going

:56:30. > :56:34.to be enough. We could exhort as much as we liked and encour`ges much

:56:35. > :56:36.as we liked, we could speak to people who were thinking about

:56:37. > :56:39.becoming candidates and telling them they would be good candidatds, but

:56:40. > :56:43.they would be no mechanisms in place to help that happen. That mhght be

:56:44. > :56:47.the position of some other parties that are giving evidence today. We

:56:48. > :56:59.decided we would look at thhs and change it. That involved a certain

:57:00. > :57:02.retinas between members who did not want the party imposing as well and

:57:03. > :57:06.local democracy, but we havd gone on a journey that has seen a shmple men

:57:07. > :57:12.mechanisms that have led to the significant change. The SNP is a

:57:13. > :57:17.very democratic political p`rties so is not of them happen because one

:57:18. > :57:20.person wanted, there were pdople throughout the party,

:57:21. > :57:25.parliamentarians and members, who is thought that change we are still in

:57:26. > :57:29.a process because what we h`ve now introduced, all women short lists in

:57:30. > :57:33.some circumstances for the Scottish Parliament, is something th`t we are

:57:34. > :57:38.now doing from local Governlent elections in Scotland. It is

:57:39. > :57:44.difficult for us to know wh`t will happen next to increase our

:57:45. > :57:53.representation because we won nearly every seat in the Parliament. We

:57:54. > :57:56.will deal with that women nded to. I'm being encouraged to advhse

:57:57. > :58:04.someone else on the panel. H digress. To bring you back to the

:58:05. > :58:12.point, we have the first felale Prime Minister, First Minister I

:58:13. > :58:16.mean, Nicola Sturgeon. The three main political parties in Scotland

:58:17. > :58:22.each have female leaders, the Conservatives, Labour and the SNP.

:58:23. > :58:27.Do you think the SNP have it targets for a greater proportion of female

:58:28. > :58:33.MPs? How would you like to lake that happen? How can that be achheved? It

:58:34. > :58:36.is more than ensuring you h`ve better representation in Parliament.

:58:37. > :58:40.When you have the opportunity to make decisions as First Minhster Rod

:58:41. > :58:45.Parliamentary group leader, you saw an obligation, I think, to work out

:58:46. > :58:48.what the balances in your parliamentary team. When thd First

:58:49. > :58:50.Minister became First Minister she ensure gender gender balancd

:58:51. > :58:56.Cabinet, one of the few in the world. When I had the good fortune

:58:57. > :59:02.to remain as SNP group leaddr of the party that was the third political

:59:03. > :59:06.party in this place, I was hn a unique situation, no party leader in

:59:07. > :59:10.Westminster has been in this situation, when from six to more

:59:11. > :59:14.than 50 members. I sat down and spent a lot of time ensuring that

:59:15. > :59:20.the rules and responsibilithes within our parliamentary group for

:59:21. > :59:24.gender balance. Yes it is about making decisions that relatd to

:59:25. > :59:27.candidacy is in making sure that you have more female and minority

:59:28. > :59:30.participation, but you also have an obligation to try and make sure that

:59:31. > :59:38.when you can make decisions that will insure you are reflecthng

:59:39. > :59:41.society in terms of the responsibilities within the

:59:42. > :59:46.parliamentary Government, that he do it. Something I would observe that

:59:47. > :59:48.the Prime Minister at a UK level has not another Cabinet nor has read

:59:49. > :59:55.Davidson done it with than her Parliamentary group on the Scottish

:59:56. > :00:07.Parliament. The local Government elections in 2017, and the wider

:00:08. > :00:13.representation in 2020 it is about representation of all ethnic

:00:14. > :00:18.minority groups and the equ`lity strategy includes the MPs as well,

:00:19. > :00:24.of which the SNP has it. I believe that is the highest percent`ge of

:00:25. > :00:32.gay parliamentarians, it is the gayest Parliament in Europe. What do

:00:33. > :00:35.you think in that case can be done to improve the situation looking

:00:36. > :00:41.towards future elections within our party? You are reflecting a question

:00:42. > :00:44.that was posed earlier about other minority groups that I think is

:00:45. > :00:48.interesting, because without any mechanisms we have gone frol being a

:00:49. > :00:59.political party where we had no openly LGBT parties in the ,- LGBT

:01:00. > :01:09.parties in the Cabinet to one of many. I would observe that with the

:01:10. > :01:13.first black - Asian, ethnic minority parliamentarian elected frol

:01:14. > :01:17.Scotland, it would be fair to observe that the visibly ethnic

:01:18. > :01:23.minority community in Scotl`nd is very small. I would posit that we

:01:24. > :01:28.have a good level of represdntation both in Westminster and in the

:01:29. > :01:33.Scottish Parliament where otr colleague as a Minister in the

:01:34. > :01:36.Scottish Government. We had the first Scots Asian parliamentarian

:01:37. > :01:41.the Scottish Parliament we can do more and more but I think there are

:01:42. > :01:43.busy structural difference between the rate of female particip`tion as

:01:44. > :01:49.opposed to other minority participation. As you know, we have

:01:50. > :01:54.systems in place and no othdr parties have them, we have ` woman's

:01:55. > :01:58.Academy and a women's conference and we have the first equality 's

:01:59. > :02:02.conference that brings together the different minority strands,

:02:03. > :02:05.including disabled members. We had a disabled conference as well. We re

:02:06. > :02:10.working hard. I would like to finish on this point. You can encotrage and

:02:11. > :02:15.exhort as much as you like, but it is still going to take more than

:02:16. > :02:19.that. This is a challenge for the SNP and for all of us. We h`ve to do

:02:20. > :02:27.more than just have structural change. We have to proactivdly work

:02:28. > :02:30.to encourage and ensure we have a higher percentage of partichpation

:02:31. > :02:38.across all the minority str`nds and particularly amongst women. I have

:02:39. > :02:43.come to the final conclusion as somebody where both of my SNP leader

:02:44. > :02:48.services were women and not great fans of mechanisms to changd this. I

:02:49. > :02:51.represent a constituency whdre the local party was very resist`nt to

:02:52. > :02:57.the notion of having mechanhsms in place. I am now completely convinced

:02:58. > :03:02.it is the only way that you can write the imbalance and it hs

:03:03. > :03:06.working for us, there is more that we can do, and I would encotrage

:03:07. > :03:10.those behind the curve to look at it seriously. It is not without its

:03:11. > :03:22.challenges, but frankly we need to do it. I do have to say that

:03:23. > :03:34.the Lib Dems do you look at female representation and it seems that

:03:35. > :03:40.your high was in 2005 whethdr a 62 MPs and only ten were women. In 2010

:03:41. > :03:46.that slipped back and then xou had 57 MPs and still only ten of them

:03:47. > :03:49.were women. At the last election, eight MPs were returned to the

:03:50. > :03:56.Parliament and they were all men. I just wanted to have skewed, in the

:03:57. > :04:00.view of that fact you could beat EA in a reserve Jensen 2020. What are

:04:01. > :04:07.you doing to make sure that women will be part of that and will have

:04:08. > :04:12.an equal chance? I should not really see this, but it was worse than

:04:13. > :04:25.that, it was nine and seven. We apologise. I think as lamentable as

:04:26. > :04:32.their service, various things I could say. Our operation and

:04:33. > :04:35.leadership programme did put a majority of the candidates `s a

:04:36. > :04:40.woman candidate, but not ond of them is elected. We talked earlidr about

:04:41. > :04:45.women being in marginal seats and have to say that my evidencd and

:04:46. > :04:49.time in the party since I w`s 1 shows me that there are no safe

:04:50. > :04:56.seats for the Liberal Democrats so that is one challenge that we face.

:04:57. > :05:01.In places where we have proportional representation, not in Scotland at

:05:02. > :05:06.the moment, but in Wales and London and the European Parliament, we have

:05:07. > :05:13.a habit of having 100% female representation in all three of those

:05:14. > :05:16.places. That is not to diminish our record in this place been

:05:17. > :05:22.lamentable. I am of the view for some time, and as party president

:05:23. > :05:26.and party leader, that restricted short list are all-female short

:05:27. > :05:30.lists are clearly part of the hands are full if you look in her career

:05:31. > :05:36.in the world, the Parliaments with the best record for electing women,

:05:37. > :05:40.like South Africa and Sweden, the two things they have in comlon is

:05:41. > :05:45.proportional representation and all women short lists. I cannot do

:05:46. > :05:51.anything immediately about the former but I can about the latter.

:05:52. > :05:54.When I was president, I madd an effort to persuade the partx that it

:05:55. > :05:59.was right to have all women short lists. Three years ago the party,

:06:00. > :06:04.largely led by young women, resistance for many reasons like

:06:05. > :06:09.Angie Seth out before the notion of having all women short lists. In the

:06:10. > :06:15.spring conference this year, we passed a motion that I lead and

:06:16. > :06:25.spoke on in the body of the debate in favour of all women short lists.

:06:26. > :06:31.To give you a quick run through what the motion said, it provided for all

:06:32. > :06:36.women short lists in every region of the country, every region in

:06:37. > :06:43.England, Scotland and Wales are different. There are strong setups

:06:44. > :06:48.there. We also have all dis`bled short lists and I should sax that we

:06:49. > :06:53.are just selected from one of our most winnable seats from thd

:06:54. > :06:59.disabled short lists. Likewhse, although the law does not allow it

:07:00. > :07:04.to have restricted short lists for LGBT, it does allow places

:07:05. > :07:09.restricted on short lists and we will ensure that as well.

:07:10. > :07:14.The other thing we have dond, and there is evidence that this will

:07:15. > :07:19.make a big difference, is to spend quite a lot of time talking to our

:07:20. > :07:23.sister party in Canada, the Liberal Party there, who talked us through

:07:24. > :07:26.what they had done. One of the things they did about affecting

:07:27. > :07:30.culture, and it is about affecting the numbers in this place, `nd I'm

:07:31. > :07:36.absolutely sure that all wolen short lists are a critical and essential

:07:37. > :07:39.part of achieving that, but it is also right to say that if you don't

:07:40. > :07:42.shift the culture at the Gr`ssroots, you are only really dealing with the

:07:43. > :07:47.symptoms, rather than what light be the cause of the problem. What the

:07:48. > :07:55.Canadian Liberals have done, what we are now doing, is demanding an

:07:56. > :07:57.evidence base, an audit trahl, of evidence from all constituencies,

:07:58. > :08:04.irrespective of whether thex are all women short list seats or not, to

:08:05. > :08:08.demonstrate efforts have bedn made to go and talk to underreprdsented

:08:09. > :08:14.groups, women and others, to try to bring people into the fold, not just

:08:15. > :08:20.as candidates, but otherwisd. Otherwise, as has been said, people

:08:21. > :08:22.like the deer of greater gender balance, and indeed, greater

:08:23. > :08:27.representation and underrepresented groups. They might like the idea of

:08:28. > :08:31.it, but do they will to do `nything about a gimmick that is why I would

:08:32. > :08:34.say a more muscular approach is essential.

:08:35. > :08:37.I would agree, let me give ht is the right thing to do, it is thd right

:08:38. > :08:40.thing to do, and if people don't like it, they have just got to get

:08:41. > :08:47.used those ideas, because wd it works. I would just like to produce

:08:48. > :08:50.and the fact that you are s`ying you are making sure they will bd women

:08:51. > :08:53.in safer seats. I know it is difficult in your situation to

:08:54. > :08:59.identify this, but there must be some way you can say, whethdr they

:09:00. > :09:02.all women short list is in ` safe seat or a seat whether you think you

:09:03. > :09:11.can win. Yes, of course. Evdn when we had our sort of post-war high of

:09:12. > :09:19.63 seats in 2006, after Willie Rennie won the dump thermal and

:09:20. > :09:21.by-election, even at that point -- the Dunfermline by-election, our

:09:22. > :09:24.numbers were relatively low in terms of women, and I wouldn't have said

:09:25. > :09:27.any one of our seat is safe. I think the notion of safe seats is

:09:28. > :09:32.ugly, and dismissive of the ugly, and dismissive of the

:09:33. > :09:36.electorate, but it is a feature of the first past the post electoral

:09:37. > :09:39.system, just not for all parties and certainly not for us. So our job is

:09:40. > :09:45.to major women are in winnable seats. One other comment I light

:09:46. > :09:49.make about the boundary changes Wheeler, bright side of lifd. When

:09:50. > :09:52.you are in a situation without a bus number of sitting MPs, you can

:09:53. > :09:56.impose much more easily. We don t have to worry about people being

:09:57. > :10:02.precious and about whether ` seat is there, whether seat X or Y hs theirs

:10:03. > :10:05.or not. The fact is, it is therefore is to be able to use to achheve

:10:06. > :10:12.gender balance under the balance if that is going to be part of our aim,

:10:13. > :10:21.which it is. So I think the rule is, I remember rightly, it is going to

:10:22. > :10:25.be 50-50 in every region, and given that we are neighbours and

:10:26. > :10:31.nationally, that the category of our stronger seats. And a compulsory all

:10:32. > :10:37.women short lists for all hdld seats where the sitting MP steps down

:10:38. > :10:41.Thank you. You have only got eight MPs at the moment after last year's

:10:42. > :10:43.result, so presumably they `re your safest seats. You would hopd,

:10:44. > :10:48.wouldn't you? Every election starts at 0-0. That

:10:49. > :10:51.is the right way to look at it. So I suppose that is somewhdre to

:10:52. > :10:55.start with an all women short list, but I do understand the difficulties

:10:56. > :10:58.around that. You have said ` bit about the boundary changes, but I

:10:59. > :11:04.would like you to comment on why you think women don't come forw`rd. To

:11:05. > :11:08.my mind, you got to identifx the barriers first before you c`n really

:11:09. > :11:11.have all women short lists, but it might not be the women you

:11:12. > :11:17.particularly need to represdnt you, for all sorts of reasons. So, have

:11:18. > :11:23.you identified anything in xour party, and have you started putting

:11:24. > :11:27.any measures to abolish those barriers, so it is easier for women?

:11:28. > :11:30.Well, alongside the Labour Party, and I don't know what the SNP's

:11:31. > :11:37.figures are, but I'm sure Angus can tell us what they are, in Britain as

:11:38. > :11:41.a whole, in the UK wide parties along with Labour, we have the

:11:42. > :11:44.highest proportion of women councillors, about 33%, which is

:11:45. > :11:48.still a lot lower than it should be, but it demonstrates that at the

:11:49. > :11:54.Grassroots, the problem may not be as hideous as we fear. But ht also

:11:55. > :11:58.tells you that we are a long way short of 50-50, and we have to ask

:11:59. > :12:02.record of strength and local record of strength and local

:12:03. > :12:07.government, why is that not even in our better years, in 2001, 2005 and

:12:08. > :12:10.2010, shall we say, why has that not worked its way through in tdrms of

:12:11. > :12:14.women getting elected to parliament? And that tells you an amount,

:12:15. > :12:19.perhaps, about a culture on the ground. And I identify that as being

:12:20. > :12:24.an issue across society. Yes, you can tackle it in some small part,

:12:25. > :12:27.well, in some very signific`nt part, by creating role models and by

:12:28. > :12:32.fixing the numbers at the top, so to speak, which you can do mord easily

:12:33. > :12:34.by restricted short lists. But actually, it is about understanding

:12:35. > :12:40.place, what you need to givd people place, what you need to givd people

:12:41. > :12:43.the opportunity to thrive and to see a parliamentary career, if we can

:12:44. > :12:46.call it that, as something that is desirable, not just for womdn, but

:12:47. > :12:51.from people from other underrepresented backgrounds, I

:12:52. > :12:54.would say as someone who proudly struggles and self working class, it

:12:55. > :12:59.was a more difficult job for me to find myself able to support myself

:13:00. > :13:03.and my family as I became a candidate, an MP, over two

:13:04. > :13:06.elections, one where I was not successful and one where I was. So

:13:07. > :13:08.that gives me some affinity and understanding of the challenges that

:13:09. > :13:13.are therefore underrepresented groups. We tackle that in v`rious

:13:14. > :13:17.ways. We talk about the leadership programme, which was very effective

:13:18. > :13:21.at getting women into our bdtter seats. They did not win thel, but

:13:22. > :13:25.they were in our better seat, 5 of those handovers eat at a wolan

:13:26. > :13:29.candidate last time round. H also think it is important for us to

:13:30. > :13:33.focus on not just the peopld coming forward or not coming forward, but

:13:34. > :13:38.the people who may be a barrier to them coming forward, and th`t means,

:13:39. > :13:41.there is something we did in the last five years, which was to

:13:42. > :13:46.undertake a kind of root and branch review of selections and how they

:13:47. > :13:51.are done, but also selection panel, and frankly, training in unconscious

:13:52. > :13:55.bias. I think there are people in every party who are out and out

:13:56. > :14:01.dinosaurs, but I think therd are also people who consider thdmselves

:14:02. > :14:04.to be liberal, progressive, open-minded, tolerant peopld, but

:14:05. > :14:09.who nevertheless have bias that they did not recognise in themselves and

:14:10. > :14:13.we all need to be trained to understand that. It is also about

:14:14. > :14:17.constituency parties as well, to constituency parties as well, to

:14:18. > :14:22.give a sense of women and other underrepresented groups havhng, if

:14:23. > :14:26.you like, the mission to be in those visible front line positions.

:14:27. > :14:29.non-white woman MP either, over the non-white woman MP either, over the

:14:30. > :14:38.years, so I'm sure you will be wanting to do something abott that.

:14:39. > :14:41.Yes, indeed. And I would hope - I can't give anything away about who

:14:42. > :14:44.is in line to be selected - but I can think of at least one vdry

:14:45. > :14:48.winnable seat where we will have such a person in it.

:14:49. > :14:55.You have a string of supplelentary You have a string of supplelentary

:14:56. > :14:59.questions, Tim. Ben, Gavin, Maria, Jason, Angela. So keep them brief if

:15:00. > :15:03.you can. One of the first campaigns H ever

:15:04. > :15:07.worked on was a campaign in Kingston where a leaflet went out a couple of

:15:08. > :15:12.years ago saying, it is a straight choice, just as the gay candidate

:15:13. > :15:16.just lost his husband, and ht was a Liberal Democrat that was

:15:17. > :15:20.campaigning at that stage. That s also said to me, there is a problem

:15:21. > :15:25.I was campaigning myself for my I was campaigning myself for my

:15:26. > :15:29.constituency, and I said at a hustings that I wanted to h`ve

:15:30. > :15:32.children, so the Liberal Delocrat candidate in Bath, who were standing

:15:33. > :15:39.against me, said on that panel, how can you have children? He is gay. I

:15:40. > :15:43.mean, how can you end up saxing to us on this panel that you bdlieve in

:15:44. > :15:47.equality when your own candhdates are saying such disgraceful things

:15:48. > :15:51.and delivering such disgracdful things, and also, I have a

:15:52. > :15:55.particular question. There `re a huge number of rumours about what is

:15:56. > :15:58.going on during the gay marriage debate as well, particularlx with

:15:59. > :16:06.yourself, Tim, when it is alleged that you went up to my colldagues,

:16:07. > :16:10.openly gay MPs, and said, don't worry, I will pray for you. How is

:16:11. > :16:14.Well, first of all, that is a Well, first of all, that is a

:16:15. > :16:18.downright lie, OK? Why is it the case that nothing is

:16:19. > :16:23.being done? You have just repeated it.

:16:24. > :16:26.This is on the record and on This is on the record and on

:16:27. > :16:32.television, so you have just repeated an untruth. That is why it

:16:33. > :16:35.is out there. You did say it was alleged, but it would be good if you

:16:36. > :16:39.would withdraw that. It is alleged. Can I come b`ck onto

:16:40. > :16:42.the counterpoint? How can wd trust the Liberal Democrat in orddr to

:16:43. > :16:49.promote equality of opportunity when ultimately, I am facing that, when

:16:50. > :16:52.the LGBT community are facing that, and when currently, your tr`nsgender

:16:53. > :16:56.member of Parliament, who is a woman at the moment, in Chippenhal, is

:16:57. > :17:01.facing deselection because she is eight bit freaky? How is th`t right?

:17:02. > :17:06.-- ABTA freaky. I think the issue in terms of things

:17:07. > :17:10.the candidate said, and thex carry the party bat banner, and rdpresent

:17:11. > :17:15.the party in various circumstances, whether in a hustings or anx local

:17:16. > :17:18.council election, frankly, the Liberal Democrats and the Lhberal

:17:19. > :17:24.party before us have a record of promoting LGBT plus rights that

:17:25. > :17:28.pretty much predate anybody else, and is stronger and prouder than

:17:29. > :17:32.anybody else. But it does not mean that we are immune from people

:17:33. > :17:35.choosing to behave in outrageous ways, and I think I am right in

:17:36. > :17:39.saying that in both those c`ses the people you have mentioned, H tell

:17:40. > :17:43.that it is the first ever hdard of it, but frankly, individuals, if

:17:44. > :17:46.there should be a complaint made about individuals like that, and if

:17:47. > :17:50.individuals have been found guilty of bringing the party into

:17:51. > :17:53.disrepute, and such actions, if they are as alleged, potentially could be

:17:54. > :17:58.so, then potential action should be taken.

:17:59. > :18:01.So a firm message coming from you. Would you say your party is in a

:18:02. > :18:04.general election footing, and that has led to selections?

:18:05. > :18:08.It has, yes. So how many seats have you selected?

:18:09. > :18:12.We have selected and the overwhelming majority of se`ts in

:18:13. > :18:16.England and were, and the Scottish party is doing things differently,

:18:17. > :18:21.but will be prepared to havd a list of candidates, should there be an

:18:22. > :18:23.election at some point before May 20 17.

:18:24. > :18:27.I realise it is a snapshot right now, but do you have an ide` of the

:18:28. > :18:31.number of women have been sdlected? Yes, my sense is that we have picked

:18:32. > :18:36.something in the region of 33% of women for those seats, which is not

:18:37. > :18:39.enough. I think my quick caveat for that is that those selections have

:18:40. > :18:43.been done under the old rulds, not been done under the old rulds, not

:18:44. > :18:52.under the rules that we posted our conference in York. And so, those

:18:53. > :18:58.selections expire in summer 201 , if there is not an early electhon. And

:18:59. > :19:02.we would also expect that, given that many of the candidates who are

:19:03. > :19:05.stepping forward to be short-term candidates for us were formdr MPs,

:19:06. > :19:10.and we have already talked `bout how many of them are men, that come the

:19:11. > :19:14.2020 election, should that be the case instead, the gender balance

:19:15. > :19:18.would be significantly bettdr. So under this current systel, you

:19:19. > :19:21.has selected about a third of your candidates, but you believe that

:19:22. > :19:24.there may be changes? Of the candidate is selected, about

:19:25. > :19:29.a third are women, yes. Can I just ask one brief qudstion?

:19:30. > :19:35.Philosophically, is there anything about the ideology of the Lhberal

:19:36. > :19:38.Democrats that would prevent, in effect, kind of positive or lenient

:19:39. > :19:43.discrimination to support women being selected in the mechanism we

:19:44. > :19:47.have talked about? Well, in a sense, there has been. I

:19:48. > :19:51.guess, as I have just indic`ted the party has been in favour of equality

:19:52. > :19:58.of all kinds throughout its existence, and has led on it, often

:19:59. > :20:05.being criticised as a marginal voice calling for equality for LGBT

:20:06. > :20:08.communities, for women, and for BAME people, and then that becomds

:20:09. > :20:15.mainstream in years to come, and you also have this complete contndrum

:20:16. > :20:18.where we are, what, eight straight white blokes in the House of

:20:19. > :20:20.Commons. I think there is a connection, and it is not dhssimilar

:20:21. > :20:26.to some other things that Angus reflecting on earlier on, bdcause

:20:27. > :20:30.the debates I have been involved in as a young member of the party, as a

:20:31. > :20:37.student, one little of that all women short lists back in the early

:20:38. > :20:40.90s, and the late 80s, the response is always look, we are a Liberal

:20:41. > :20:47.Party, we don't go interferhng, and I understand that, but I just think,

:20:48. > :20:50.how can a Liberal Party seek to represent every part of sochety and

:20:51. > :20:54.then not look like it? And actually, I am a believdr in

:20:55. > :20:55.muscular liberalism, in makhng sure that if something is unfair, you

:20:56. > :21:01.don't sit there. And I'm not laissez don't sit there. And I'm not laissez

:21:02. > :21:05.faire about economic, because that does not create a free markdt

:21:06. > :21:12.situation or equality. It enshrines privilege and prevent equalhty.

:21:13. > :21:15.Likewise, we should not be laissez faire when it comes to equality in

:21:16. > :21:19.parliament and across society, across men and women and all other

:21:20. > :21:23.groups, and so it was right for us to fight, and it took sever`l

:21:24. > :21:25.attempts to overcome that. H think it is an understandable twist on

:21:26. > :21:29.liberalism to say that you should step back and hope things gdt

:21:30. > :21:32.better, but that is not the way you make things happen. If you want to

:21:33. > :21:38.make things happen, you havd to bowl of your sleeves and make thdm so. --

:21:39. > :21:41.roll up your sleeves. The impression I get is that the

:21:42. > :21:45.Liberal Democrats are claimhng to things as to why it is not lore

:21:46. > :21:49.representative of the public games. Firstly, PR. Well, we had a

:21:50. > :21:52.referendum on that during the last Parliament, and it seems to be that

:21:53. > :21:57.the Liberal Democrats and rdspecting the result of that referendtm,

:21:58. > :22:00.because that seems like we're going to have first past the post, so it's

:22:01. > :22:03.seems like you will have to live with that and then elect more women

:22:04. > :22:07.MPs with that system that the British public voted for. The second

:22:08. > :22:14.issue is the excuse that yot are only a small party, and so that is

:22:15. > :22:22.why it is white man in Parlhament. But actually, in 2010, you only had

:22:23. > :22:26.one MP than the SNP currently have, and yet they have managed to elect

:22:27. > :22:29.MPs that are representative of the populations they serve. It hsn't

:22:30. > :22:34.about the Liberal Party is of the moment but there are problels there,

:22:35. > :22:38.and you are using those two excuses to say, this is why we are `ll white

:22:39. > :22:47.men? I think first of all, if yot lose an

:22:48. > :22:53.election,... Oh, you to you at the alternative

:22:54. > :22:54.referendum. That was lost, `nd it was not proportional represdntation

:22:55. > :22:56.in any event.