:01:21. > :01:27.Coming up on Sunday Politics in the East Midlands:
:01:27. > :01:29.a Tory MP it warns the Lib Dems not to cut up rough over boundary
:01:29. > :01:39.changes. Will European rules save our pig
:01:39. > :01:39.
:01:39. > :31:33.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 1793 seconds
:31:33. > :31:36.Hello, I'm Marie Ashby and my guests in the East Midlands this
:31:37. > :31:41.week are two of our members of the European Parliament, Lib Dem Bill
:31:41. > :31:43.Newton Dunn and UKIP's Derek Clark. Coming up:
:31:44. > :31:46.Is the Eurozone crisis really a good opportunity for us to
:31:46. > :31:50.renegotiate the terms of our EU membership?
:31:50. > :31:54.And our farmers say the EU is making a pig of a job of enforcing
:31:54. > :31:57.new rules on animal welfare. First, seven of our region's
:31:57. > :32:02.Conservative MPs this week put the knife into Lib Dem ambitions to
:32:02. > :32:05.reform the House of Lords. One of them, Andrew Bridgen, is with me
:32:05. > :32:09.now. You've made your point. But at what
:32:09. > :32:11.cost? David Cameron is apparently incensed and the Lib Dems are
:32:12. > :32:14.warning that if the Tories don't come good with Lords Reform,
:32:14. > :32:22.they'll withdraw support for those boundary changes your party so
:32:22. > :32:26.desperately wants. Yes, I don't think you can give in
:32:26. > :32:29.to blackmail. Is that how you would describe it? Absolutely. The
:32:29. > :32:33.boundary changes will not be confirmed until one year this
:32:33. > :32:37.October, if we give in to those blackmail threats we will come back
:32:37. > :32:42.here again and again because blackmailers always come back. It
:32:42. > :32:48.is not fit point of principle. This is not about reform of the House of
:32:48. > :32:55.Lords, it is about the abolition of the House of Lords. You can see by
:32:55. > :32:59.the ropes on Tuesday night there was no consensus. Andrew says they
:32:59. > :33:03.will not give in to blackmailers. He was elected on a Tory manifesto
:33:03. > :33:08.saying he would reform the House of Lords so he is defying his own
:33:09. > :33:12.league and manifesto. I am in favour of reforming the House of
:33:12. > :33:17.Lords by looking at retirement age or a test to see if you are
:33:17. > :33:22.mentally agile and there are a lot of ways that numbers can be reduced
:33:22. > :33:27.but this is quite different. This also threatens the primacy of the
:33:28. > :33:32.House of Commons, I was not elected to see their how was denigrated.
:33:32. > :33:38.This is a very important point. It is an unstable constitution do have
:33:38. > :33:42.one chamber that makes all the rules. Every other country where a
:33:42. > :33:46.has a written constitution that is a safeguard. You need a safeguard
:33:46. > :33:51.and Britain does not have one. is absolutely wrong. The upper
:33:51. > :33:54.chamber is not elected, it is a revealing and revising chamber that
:33:54. > :33:59.analyses decisions made in the House of Commons. You're talking
:33:59. > :34:08.about a major change to undermine our constitution. We did not have a
:34:08. > :34:11.constitution! Your party wants a hybrid house. The yes. Why? All the
:34:11. > :34:15.wailing traditionalist, I have got to admit that we are looking a bit
:34:15. > :34:19.old fashioned. We are the only party -- we are the only country
:34:19. > :34:27.apart from one other in the world that has an unelected second
:34:27. > :34:34.chamber. I think that is wrong in the modern era. We would suggest
:34:34. > :34:43.400... 200 Upper House elected, Lord's or senators, call them what
:34:43. > :34:53.you will. Does this offer a better way out? Another 100 appointed,
:34:53. > :34:57.
:34:57. > :35:02.plus bishops and 12th... Others. That is another option, isn't it?
:35:02. > :35:07.Is elected Halsall Lords will be cut down and they were her staff
:35:08. > :35:12.and offices but it will cost more than the other system. This current
:35:12. > :35:18.system has an unelected appointed Upper Cheyne in Canada and Germany
:35:18. > :35:21.so we are not the only country with up. It is not a legislature, it is
:35:21. > :35:26.a revealing chain and it works well. There is much more discussion do
:35:26. > :35:30.have on this. Well, Andrew Bridgen is also one of
:35:30. > :35:33.a number of Conservative MPs who see the crisis in the Eurozone as
:35:33. > :35:36.an opportunity to renegotiate the terms of our membership of the EU.
:35:36. > :35:42.This week they called for a reduction in EU spending for a
:35:42. > :35:47.start. Is this really the time we should be you negotiating this when
:35:47. > :35:51.you look at the mess the Eurozone is in? Our relationship with Europe
:35:52. > :35:56.will change. They are going to have to change their relationship. Full
:35:56. > :36:00.fiscal union will change our relationship with Europe. It is in
:36:00. > :36:06.our joint manifesto, our coalition agreement to get how was back from
:36:06. > :36:10.Europe, if not now, when? Would you like to name it how you would like
:36:10. > :36:14.to bring that? No one says anything? I would bring back the
:36:14. > :36:19.social chapter straight away. We read the -- we need reform of
:36:19. > :36:25.farming policy and fishery policy. Those have devastated our fish
:36:25. > :36:29.stocks. Do we pay too high a price for our membership? No, we do not.
:36:29. > :36:33.We are a family of nations and in every family there is a give-and-
:36:33. > :36:37.take. No one has it all their own way. If you're outside on your own
:36:37. > :36:42.you have your own way but you have no significance and no influence.
:36:42. > :36:46.We want to be a part of the family so we are a rich cut -- we are one
:36:46. > :36:49.of the richer countries so we should pay in. How far would you be
:36:49. > :36:55.prepared to take this? Are you happy to leave Britain on the
:36:55. > :36:58.sidelines? We are in the gladiatorial contest and we are
:36:58. > :37:04.sitting in the stalls watching people being eaten by the Lions,
:37:04. > :37:07.would you rather be a spectator or a participant? This is a huge
:37:07. > :37:11.crisis. We are the second biggest net contributor after Germany and
:37:11. > :37:17.we get very little out of this relationship. We get an enormous
:37:17. > :37:22.amount out of it. Terry Kharkiv shaking his head. -- Derek Clark is
:37:22. > :37:27.shaking his head. We just want to get out but we do not mean we will
:37:27. > :37:30.pull up the drawbridge and go home with no deals. It means we go one
:37:30. > :37:34.as we work before there was a European Union, trading with all of
:37:34. > :37:38.those countries. I come from Bristol and I have seen it happen
:37:38. > :37:43.all the time with ships in the harbour. What relationship the one
:37:43. > :37:49.with Brussels? We do not need one. We just need to get out. After that
:37:49. > :37:53.we will restore or continue our trade links. We will maintain items
:37:53. > :37:57.of common interest but what more do you want? Some people wonder why
:37:57. > :38:04.you turn up in Europe if you think that? We are there to try and draw
:38:04. > :38:12.dip -- attention to its deficiencies. The enormous weakness
:38:12. > :38:16.of the UK position is that Britain could technically leave -- the UKIP
:38:16. > :38:19.position. We would have no stay over the rules of trading with the
:38:19. > :38:27.rest of Europe. We would have to adapt to the rules that the rest of
:38:27. > :38:33.Europe make. There is no problem with that. Of course there is.
:38:33. > :38:38.sorts of country's trade with the European Union. I went to a
:38:38. > :38:41.motorbike factory not long ago and asked them, how would you get on
:38:41. > :38:46.with satisfying the different requirements for your bikes across
:38:46. > :38:49.the world? It is not a problem. We know where they're going and we
:38:49. > :38:53.just put the bits on that they want and take the bits of that they
:38:53. > :38:56.don't want so there is not a problem with the in the different
:38:56. > :39:01.requirements. It is totally unacceptable to a large proportion
:39:01. > :39:05.of my electorate for the EU budget to increase every year when we have
:39:05. > :39:09.to deal with our deficit for the European gravy train to carry on
:39:09. > :39:14.and keep expanded and expecting more money. The last increase was
:39:14. > :39:18.an extra �750,000 a year from my constituency which I did not
:39:18. > :39:21.support when it went through the Commons and I will support no more
:39:21. > :39:27.increases. Thank you very much for joining us in the
:39:27. > :39:29.Next, you won't find many fans of the EU among our pig farmers. 13
:39:29. > :39:32.years after they accepted improved welfare standards, their European
:39:32. > :39:34.competitors have finally been ordered to do the same. But being
:39:34. > :39:37.the EU, it's not that simple. Jane Dodge reports.
:39:37. > :39:44.It makes for uncomfortable viewing. Pregnant pigs kept in cages so
:39:44. > :39:48.narrow they can't turn round. They're known as sow stalls.
:39:48. > :39:58.But you won't find them on this pig farm in Arnold, or any other farm
:39:58. > :39:58.
:39:58. > :40:02.in the UK. Sow stalls were banned in 1999 on animal welfare grounds.
:40:02. > :40:12.I think they are fairly barbaric ways to keep a very intelligent
:40:12. > :40:12.
:40:12. > :40:17.animal and we have never ever had our fouls installed at all. -- our
:40:17. > :40:20.sows installs. 13 years after it was banned in the
:40:20. > :40:23.UK, the rest of Europe is finally playing catch up. From January next
:40:23. > :40:26.year it'll be illegal to use sow stalls across the EU. But several
:40:26. > :40:28.countries have already said they won't be ready to comply with the
:40:28. > :40:32.ban. And look at the small print and
:40:32. > :40:36.you'll see it's only a partial ban. Farmers in the rest of the EU will
:40:36. > :40:40.still be able to put pigs in sow stalls for up to four weeks. It
:40:40. > :40:44.leaves farmers like Richard worried about his future. The cheaper
:40:44. > :40:48.European pork will continue to be imported, particularly with the
:40:48. > :40:55.exchange rate helping it and it will undercut our attempts to
:40:55. > :40:58.produce peeks under our present high welfare conditions. -- pigs.
:40:58. > :41:01.In an attempt to reassure farmers like Richard some of the larger
:41:01. > :41:09.retailers have said they won't buy pork from those EU countries
:41:09. > :41:12.flouting the ban. UK retailers have a vigorous system of thought
:41:12. > :41:18.traceability which means they know exactly which farm or even which
:41:18. > :41:28.building within the farm the meat has come from. There are no issues
:41:28. > :41:28.
:41:28. > :41:30.for UK retailers about being confident of the need to have good
:41:30. > :41:33.produce. So who are the countries not ready
:41:33. > :41:36.to ban these sow stalls? We did ask, but the European Commission wasn't
:41:36. > :41:42.able or willing to name names. But it insisted those who don't
:41:42. > :41:48.comply will be punished. We are saying right now to the member-
:41:48. > :41:51.states that the sure if you do not comply it on 1st January then by
:41:51. > :41:54.much you will get a letter from the commission saying that you have to
:41:54. > :42:03.compile and we will keep on reminding you that you have to
:42:03. > :42:07.comply and then the procedure will the one. -- go on.
:42:07. > :42:09.But hen farmers say they've heard it all before. At the start of this
:42:09. > :42:13.year the European Commission imposed another ban, this time on
:42:13. > :42:15.the use of cramped cages for laying hens. Yet they're still in use in
:42:15. > :42:18.nine EU countries, none of whom have been punished yet.
:42:18. > :42:21.Roger Hosking, a hen farmer in Etwall in Derbyshire, believes
:42:21. > :42:26.it'll be the same for the ban on sow stalls. When somebody says in
:42:26. > :42:31.Europe we will enforce this, there is not the political will to do it
:42:32. > :42:35.because people want cheap food and there is not any money available
:42:35. > :42:38.for inspectors to go round and check up what is happening because
:42:38. > :42:45.they have got other things they could be doing with their money
:42:45. > :42:48.rather than putting pig people out of business. It will not happen.
:42:48. > :42:55.But animal welfare organisations are keen to reassure farmers that
:42:55. > :43:00.the EC will enforce the law. nations are not complying they can
:43:00. > :43:05.take them to court and they can give them finds and so
:43:05. > :43:08.realistically, these will be of an extent that the farmers and the
:43:08. > :43:13.nations that are not complying they will have to pay attention and
:43:13. > :43:16.comply eventually. But by the time that happens it may be too late for
:43:16. > :43:19.Richard Blant. After 40 years in pig farming he's now thinking of
:43:19. > :43:25.selling up. With us now the chairman of the
:43:25. > :43:29.National Pig Association, Richard Longthorp.
:43:29. > :43:32.The EU Commission cannot identify the country at the moment that have
:43:32. > :43:37.said they will not -- have said that they will comply with these
:43:37. > :43:41.rules, are you any the wiser? course there are a lot of promises
:43:41. > :43:46.from various people about what will happen. At the end of the day this
:43:46. > :43:51.is a real test, it is a test of the integrity that are making the new
:43:51. > :43:54.law. It is a test of those people to implement and enforce the law
:43:54. > :43:58.and a test of the integrity of the people who will be selling the
:43:59. > :44:07.pigmeat from those big farmers we have heard about. Isn't this one of
:44:07. > :44:10.the things that exasperated -- excess Greece people most about --
:44:10. > :44:14.exasperated the people most the way we are not sure which countries
:44:14. > :44:18.will drag their feet? It is exasperated but they have another
:44:18. > :44:24.five months to do it so it is natural we cannot be exactly sure.
:44:24. > :44:26.One of the jobs of MEPs like us will be to put questions and make
:44:26. > :44:31.sure the commission are up to the task of finding out what is going
:44:31. > :44:34.on and reporting back to was. That is what we can do. All we really
:44:35. > :44:38.want, and he is a note of controversy, we need more power was
:44:39. > :44:43.in Brussels soap they can intervene in these countries and go directly
:44:43. > :44:49.to the farms in Romania or Bulgaria and point out they are not doing it
:44:49. > :44:53.and punish them with a fight. that work? More effective power was,
:44:53. > :44:58.perhaps. I am not sure about more powers. We are told that the
:44:58. > :45:01.countries that might not comply include France, Italy and Poland.
:45:01. > :45:05.What should MEPs like Bill and Derek be doing? What pressure
:45:05. > :45:10.should they put on this? They should bring pressure to bear on
:45:10. > :45:15.the commission to find out exactly what the committee intends to do in
:45:15. > :45:19.terms of finding out those which are not complying and what they are
:45:19. > :45:24.going to do about enforcing it. What will happen to those people
:45:25. > :45:29.who were not complying. They should know that now. That is the issue.
:45:29. > :45:35.They should know it now as we are speaking but I don't believe they
:45:35. > :45:39.do. Derek, what are you doing about this issue? Once again we have got
:45:39. > :45:45.the UN forcing something. What is all this end forcing, and forcing
:45:45. > :45:50.them forcing. I want to know from a pig farmer, weather and the pigs
:45:50. > :45:55.really do need a revision of their quarters? Is it necessary? Did you
:45:55. > :46:00.see the pictures on the film? DDC the pens that they are putting? Did
:46:00. > :46:04.you think those conditions were acceptable? Well, I don't know. It
:46:04. > :46:08.was a very short clip and it is difficult to see if the pig is
:46:08. > :46:13.suffering or not. In this country farmers are complying with those
:46:13. > :46:18.rules and that is the issue. If we do it, why shouldn't they? Yes, it
:46:18. > :46:23.is going back to the situation with eggs. How many products are support
:46:23. > :46:26.-- imported from the 10th that are kept in the small cages which are
:46:26. > :46:31.illegal. There is all this enforcement but it does not really
:46:31. > :46:34.work. The you have any work they will that -- do you have any hope
:46:34. > :46:38.they will make more progress on this than they did on the Henie
:46:38. > :46:42.she? Well they have had the bitter experience of the fiasco around
:46:42. > :46:47.hems and we have asked them all this year and we continue to press
:46:47. > :46:51.them so I hope that they will do a better job this time around.
:46:51. > :46:54.Fingers crossed. When it comes to the EU rules it seems as though we
:46:55. > :47:00.are the ones that apply them and other countries can just get round
:47:00. > :47:06.them or not comply. That does not seem fair. It is a generalisation
:47:06. > :47:09.but there's a lot of truth in it. That is why I would like to see a
:47:09. > :47:13.group in Brussels who can go where the rules are not being forced and
:47:13. > :47:19.say, come along with me, you will be lapped up and punished or will
:47:19. > :47:24.you obey the rules? Let us be more specific about the problems? Take
:47:25. > :47:27.the loss of the jobs at Bombardier in Derby. Our Government stuck to
:47:27. > :47:32.the letter of the Thames Link bidding process where other
:47:33. > :47:36.countries would take into account the social impact of losing. They
:47:36. > :47:42.mull did their bit in the light of all those social requirements so
:47:42. > :47:45.they got the contract. Bombardier did not. Why, I do not know.
:47:45. > :47:54.Perhaps they are not first enough in EU requirements and I don't know
:47:54. > :47:57.where they did not do that. There has been other countries who have
:47:57. > :48:02.been offering bribes to countries to give them the contract. It has
:48:02. > :48:06.boosted a bank balance which is one of the criteria that the government
:48:06. > :48:12.said was the reason for government contracts, they had a good strong
:48:12. > :48:15.bank balance. A Labour MP this week tabled a motion that would require
:48:15. > :48:20.social and environmental criteria to be considered in all future
:48:20. > :48:25.contracts, are you with a? Yes, I am sorry to say she did not ask me
:48:25. > :48:30.to sign it, which would have been a good idea. She ought to have away
:48:30. > :48:35.support. She has not asked us, that is a mistake. This could stop a
:48:35. > :48:38.East -- this could stop a future Bombardier fiasco happening again.
:48:38. > :48:42.We are all about putting pressure on people, we are not a
:48:42. > :48:47.dictatorship, we are about democracy and powers. If you put
:48:47. > :48:51.pressure on people, they might just move so it is worth trying.
:48:51. > :48:54.Time marches on and it goes even faster in our Sixty Second round-up
:48:54. > :48:59.of some of the other political stories in the East Midlands this
:48:59. > :49:02.week. Labour have denied Tory allegations
:49:02. > :49:08.that they're snubbing the Queen by not inviting her to open Derby's
:49:08. > :49:12.new council house. Labour say they want a community champion to do the
:49:12. > :49:15.honours. The MP for Nottingham South, Lilian
:49:15. > :49:17.Greenwood, laid into Grantham MP Nick Boles at PMQs. He's called for
:49:17. > :49:26.free bus passes and other pensioner concessions to be means-tested.
:49:26. > :49:30.Where, she demanded, did the Prime Minister stand? At the last
:49:30. > :49:36.election I made a very clear promise about bus passes and
:49:36. > :49:37.television licences and winter fuel payments, we are keeping all those
:49:37. > :49:39.policies. Leicestershire Conservatives have
:49:39. > :49:42.elected Nick Rushton as their acting leader. It follows the
:49:42. > :49:45.resignation of David Parsons, who's facing a police investigation over
:49:45. > :49:47.his expenses for trips to Europe. Nottingham City Council is spending
:49:47. > :49:49.�1 million to create another 160 jobs for young people.
:49:49. > :49:52.And finally, a national survey by Nottingham Trent University
:49:52. > :50:02.suggests most young people are interested in politics, but,
:50:02. > :50:05.
:50:05. > :50:15.surprise, surprise, they've little It could be worse, Derek. At least
:50:15. > :50:15.
:50:15. > :50:20.politicians are above bankers when it comes to public esteem. Not in
:50:20. > :50:24.the UK press over the last few years, know they are not. With all
:50:24. > :50:30.of these dwindling and the second homes and all of the rest of it. I
:50:30. > :50:35.have to say, for once I think the EU have got something right. People
:50:35. > :50:40.like Bill and myself get a flat 300 euros a day allowance for being
:50:40. > :50:45.there and that covers everything. You don't have to put in a receipt
:50:45. > :50:48.for a Mars bar and you just pay for your hotel and your meals and if
:50:49. > :50:53.there is anything left over then it is for you. Encouraging feature
:50:53. > :50:57.going back to the survey is that at least these students have a real
:50:57. > :51:04.interest in politics. It is their world. Derek and I have got grey
:51:04. > :51:08.hair and we will soon be retiring. It is terrific that these kids are
:51:08. > :51:13.interested but they should get involved and try and takeover and
:51:13. > :51:17.do a better job than half. We want young people to beat interested and
:51:18. > :51:21.involved but they should not go straight into politics. They should