:00:36. > :00:42.Morning, folks. Welcome to the Sunday Politics. Ed Miliband's on
:00:43. > :00:47.the war path over pay day loans, your energy bill and what he calls
:00:48. > :00:51.the bedroom tax. His spinners say he's resurgent though the polls
:00:52. > :00:55.don't show it. We'll be talking to his right hand woman, Labour's
:00:56. > :00:59.Deputy Leader, Harriet Harman. From resurgent to insurgent. Nigel Farage
:01:00. > :01:08.won an award this week for being a political insurgent. We'll be
:01:09. > :01:11.talking to the UKIP leader. And Harriet hates, hates, hates page
:01:12. > :01:14.three. She wants rid of it. But what do you think? We sent Adam out with
:01:15. > :01:32.some balls. Stay. It is good fun for And in the East Midlands, the
:01:33. > :01:33.council leader planning 800 job cuts joins us
:01:34. > :01:46.It is free choice. In London, the row over the super sewer rumbles on.
:01:47. > :01:50.And with me, fresh from their success at yesterday's Star Wars
:01:51. > :01:55.auditions, Darth Vader. Obi Wan Kenobi and R2D2. Congratulations on
:01:56. > :02:00.your new jobs. We'll miss you. Nick Watt, Helen Lewis and Janan Ganesh.
:02:01. > :02:03.First, the talks with Iran in Geneva. They ended last night
:02:04. > :02:14.without agreement despite hopes of a breakthrough. America and its allies
:02:15. > :02:16.didn't think Iran was prepared to go far enough to freeze its nuclear
:02:17. > :02:20.programme. But some progress has been made and there's to be another
:02:21. > :02:22.meeting in ten days' time, though at a lower level. The Foreign
:02:23. > :02:26.Secretary, William Hague, had this to say a little earlier. On the
:02:27. > :02:35.question of, or will it happen in the next few weeks? There is a good
:02:36. > :02:40.chance of that. We will be trying again on 20th, 21st of November and
:02:41. > :02:46.negotiators will be trying again. We will keep an enormous amount of
:02:47. > :02:54.energy and persistence behind solving this. Will that be a deal
:02:55. > :03:00.which will please everyone? No, it will not. Compromises will need to
:03:01. > :03:04.be made. I had discussions with Israeli ministers yesterday and put
:03:05. > :03:09.the case for the kind of deal we are looking
:03:10. > :03:09.the case for the kind of deal we are interests of the whole world,
:03:10. > :03:15.including interests of the whole world,
:03:16. > :03:20.the world, to reach a diplomatic agreement we can be confident in in
:03:21. > :03:24.this issue. This otherwise will threaten the world with nuclear
:03:25. > :03:27.proliferation and conflict in the future. The interesting thing about
:03:28. > :03:35.this is that it seems future. The interesting thing about
:03:36. > :03:41.prepared to go far enough over the Iraq heavy water plutonium reactor
:03:42. > :03:53.it is building. The people who took the toughest line - the French.
:03:54. > :04:00.France has always had a pretty tough line on Iran. They see it as a
:04:01. > :04:04.disruptive influence in Lebanon I am reasonably optimistic a deal will
:04:05. > :04:09.be done later this month when the talks reconvene. Western economic
:04:10. > :04:16.sanctions have had such an impact on Iran domestic league. They have
:04:17. > :04:21.pushed inflation up to 40%. Dashes-macro domestically. The new
:04:22. > :04:29.president had a campaign pledge saying, I will deal with sanctions.
:04:30. > :04:36.I actually think, by the end of this year, we will see progress in these
:04:37. > :04:44.talks. Should we be optimistic? The next round of talks will be at
:04:45. > :04:49.official level. The place to watch will be Israel. The language which
:04:50. > :04:54.has been coming out of there is still incredibly angry, incredibly
:04:55. > :05:04.defensive. They do not want a deal at all. Presumably John Kerry has to
:05:05. > :05:13.go away and tried to get Israel to be quiet about it, even if they
:05:14. > :05:23.cannot be happy about it. They cannot agree to a deal which allows
:05:24. > :05:27.the Iraq reactor with plutonium heavy water. You do not need that
:05:28. > :05:34.with a peaceful nuclear power programme will stop that is why the
:05:35. > :05:42.Israelis are so nervous. If there is an international deal, Israel could
:05:43. > :05:49.still bomb that but it would be impossible. The French tactics are
:05:50. > :05:53.interesting. It says the French blocked it in part because they are
:05:54. > :05:59.trying to carry favour with Israel but also the Gulf Arab states, who
:06:00. > :06:05.are really nervous about and Iranians nuclear capability. Who is
:06:06. > :06:11.that? Saudi Arabia. Newsnight had a story saying that Pakistan is
:06:12. > :06:19.prepared to provide them with nuclear weapons. You are right about
:06:20. > :06:25.Saudi Arabia. They are much more against this deal than Israel. Who
:06:26. > :06:29.is Herman van Rompuy's favourite MEP? It is probably not Nigel
:06:30. > :06:32.Farage. He plummeted to the bottom of the EU president's Christmas card
:06:33. > :06:36.list after comparing him to a bank clerk with the charisma of a damp
:06:37. > :06:45.rag. And he's been at it again this week. Have a look. Today is November
:06:46. > :06:50.the 5th, a big celebration festival day in England. That was an attempt
:06:51. > :06:53.to blow up the Houses of Parliament with dynamite and destroy the
:06:54. > :07:00.Constitution. You have taken the Dahl, technocratic approach to all
:07:01. > :07:05.of these things. What you and your colleagues save time and again you
:07:06. > :07:09.talk about initiatives and what you are going to do about unemployment.
:07:10. > :07:16.The reality is nothing in this union is getting better. The accounts have
:07:17. > :07:21.not been signed off for 18 years. I am now told it is 19 and you are
:07:22. > :07:25.doing your best to tone down any criticism. Whatever growth figures
:07:26. > :07:30.you may have, they are anaemic. Youth unemployment in the
:07:31. > :07:35.Mediterranean is over 50% in several states. You will notice there is a
:07:36. > :07:40.rise in opposition dashed real opposition. Much of it ugly
:07:41. > :07:47.opposition, not stuff that I would want to link hands with. And Nigel
:07:48. > :07:56.Farage joins me now. Let me put to you what the editor of the Sun had
:07:57. > :08:00.to say. He says, UKIP will peak at the European election and then it
:08:01. > :08:05.will begin to get marginalised as we get closer to 2015 because there is
:08:06. > :08:12.now that clear blue water between Labour and the Tories. What do you
:08:13. > :08:16.say to that? There may be layered blue water on energy pricing but on
:08:17. > :08:21.Eastern Europe, there is no difference at all. When Ed Miliband
:08:22. > :08:25.offers the referendum to match Cameron, even that argument on
:08:26. > :08:31.Europe will be gone. The one thing that will keep UKIP strong, heading
:08:32. > :08:35.towards 2015, is if people think in some constituencies we can win. I
:08:36. > :08:40.cannot sit here right now and say that will be the case. If we get
:08:41. > :08:45.over the hurdle of the European elections clearly, I think there
:08:46. > :08:52.will be grounds to say that UKIP can win seats in Westminster. You are
:08:53. > :08:58.going to run? Without a shadow of a doubt. I do not know which
:08:59. > :09:02.constituency. The welcome I got in Edinburgh was not that friendly
:09:03. > :09:07.Edinburgh is not everything in Scotland. I think we have a
:09:08. > :09:13.realistic chance of winning those elections. If we do that, we will
:09:14. > :09:18.have the momentum behind us. You might be the biggest party after the
:09:19. > :09:24.May elections. The National front is likely to do very well in France as
:09:25. > :09:29.well. They have won the crucial by-election in the South of France.
:09:30. > :09:38.Have you talked about joining full season in Parliament? The leader has
:09:39. > :09:43.tried to take the movement into a different direction than her father.
:09:44. > :09:48.The man she beat, to become leader, actually attended the BNP
:09:49. > :09:53.conference. The problem she has with her party and we have with her party
:09:54. > :09:58.is that anti-Semitism is too deep and we will not be doing a deal with
:09:59. > :10:05.the French national government. You can guarantee you will not be
:10:06. > :10:11.joining such groups. I can guarantee that. Let's move on to Europe. Let's
:10:12. > :10:16.accept that the pro-Europeans exaggerate the loss of jobs that
:10:17. > :10:24.would follow the departure of Britain from the UK. Is there no
:10:25. > :10:32.risk of jobs whatsoever? No risk whatsoever. There is no risk at all.
:10:33. > :10:39.There have been some weak and lazy arguments put around about this We
:10:40. > :10:45.will go on doing business - go on doing trade with Europe. We will
:10:46. > :10:50.have increased opportunities to do trade deals with the rest of the
:10:51. > :10:59.world and they will create jobs The head of Nissan, the head of Hitachi
:11:00. > :11:06.and CBI many other voices in British business, when they all expressed
:11:07. > :11:11.concern about the potential loss of jobs and incoming investment, we
:11:12. > :11:21.should just ignore them. With Nissan, the BBC News is making this
:11:22. > :11:28.a huge story. The boss did not say what was reported. He said there was
:11:29. > :11:33.a potential danger to his future investment. They have already made
:11:34. > :11:37.the investments. They have built the plant in Sunderland, which they say
:11:38. > :11:41.is operating well. We should be careful of what bosses of big
:11:42. > :11:46.businesses say. This man said they may have two leaves Sunderland if we
:11:47. > :11:50.did not join the euro. I do not take that seriously. As for the CBI, they
:11:51. > :11:56.wanted us to join the euro and now they do not. Even within the CBI,
:11:57. > :12:01.there is a significant minority saying, we do not agree with what
:12:02. > :12:05.the CBI director-general is saying. The former boss of the organisation
:12:06. > :12:12.is saying we need a referendum and we need a referendum soon. It
:12:13. > :12:17.depends on the renegotiation. There is not the uniformity. What we are
:12:18. > :12:22.beginning to see in the world, is, manufacturing and small businesses
:12:23. > :12:26.are a lot more voices saying, the costs of membership outweigh any
:12:27. > :12:36.potential benefit. If you look at the polls, if Mr Cameron does
:12:37. > :12:42.repatriate some powers and he joins with Labour, the Lib Dems, the
:12:43. > :12:46.Nationalists in Scotland and Wales, most of business, all of the unions
:12:47. > :12:56.to say we should stay in, you are going to lose, aren't you? In 1 75,
:12:57. > :12:59.the circumstances were exactly the same. Mr Wilson promised a
:13:00. > :13:03.renegotiation and he got very little. The establishment gathered
:13:04. > :13:09.around him and they voted for us to stay in. I do not think that will
:13:10. > :13:16.happen now. The scales have fallen. We do not want to be governed by
:13:17. > :13:19.Herman Van Rompuy and these people. These people are Eurosceptic but
:13:20. > :13:23.they do not seem to feel strongly enough about it that they are going
:13:24. > :13:30.to defy all the major parties they vote for, companies that employ
:13:31. > :13:34.them, unions they are members of. I am absolutely confident there will
:13:35. > :13:38.be a lot voices in business saying, we need to take this opportunity to
:13:39. > :13:51.break free, give ourselves a chance of a low regulation lowball trader.
:13:52. > :14:07.-- global trade. In 1970 53 small publications said to vote yes. I am
:14:08. > :14:12.not contemplating losing. The most important thing is to get the
:14:13. > :14:18.referendum. If UKIP is not strong, there will not be a referendum.
:14:19. > :14:22.Earlier in the year, your party issued a leaflet about the remaining
:14:23. > :14:28.sample parents being able to come to this country. The EU will allow 29
:14:29. > :14:38.million Bulgarians and remaining is to come to the UK. That is
:14:39. > :14:50.technically correct but we both know that is not the case. It is an open
:14:51. > :15:01.door to these people. Why take the risk? By make out there are 29
:15:02. > :15:11.million people? I stand by that verdict. It is an open door. 29
:15:12. > :15:17.million are not going to come. They can if they want. Also 29 million
:15:18. > :15:22.people from France can come. After these countries have joined, we will
:15:23. > :15:29.do another leaflet saying that Mr Cameron wants to open the door to 70
:15:30. > :15:36.million people from Turkey. That is scaremongering. I would not say
:15:37. > :15:41.that. We have a million young British workers between 16 and 4
:15:42. > :15:45.without work. A lot of them want work and we do not need another
:15:46. > :15:50.massive oversupply in the unskilled labour market. Why did you have such
:15:51. > :16:00.a bad time on question Time this week? The folk that did not buy your
:16:01. > :16:03.anti-immigration stick. Do you think that group of people in the room was
:16:04. > :16:09.representative of the voters of Boston? What would make you think it
:16:10. > :16:12.was unrepresentative? When the county council elections took place
:16:13. > :16:16.this year in Boston, of the seven seats, UKIP won five and almost won
:16:17. > :16:20.the other two. I don't think that audience reflected that, but that
:16:21. > :16:24.doesn't matter. How an audience is put together, how a panel is put
:16:25. > :16:29.together, on one programme, it doesn't mean much at all. It shows
:16:30. > :16:33.that your anti-immigrant measure doesn't fly as easily as you hoped
:16:34. > :16:36.it would? The opinion polls which will be launched on Monday that we
:16:37. > :16:40.are conducting and nearing completion, they show two things.
:16:41. > :16:45.Firstly, an astonishing number of people who think it's irresponsible
:16:46. > :16:50.and wrong to open the doer to Romania and Bulgaria, secondly and
:16:51. > :16:53.crucially, a number of people whose vote in the European elections and
:16:54. > :16:56.subsequent general elections may be determined by the immigration
:16:57. > :16:59.issues. This does matter. It would be the perfect run group the
:17:00. > :17:04.European elections in May for you if a lot of Bulgarians and remainians
:17:05. > :17:07.flooded in. You would like that to happen? I think it will happen.
:17:08. > :17:12.Whether I like it or not, it will happen. You think it will be good
:17:13. > :17:17.for you, it will stir things up If you say to people in poor countries,
:17:18. > :17:21.you can come here, get a job, have a safety net of a benefits system
:17:22. > :17:25.claim child allowance for your kids in Bucharest, people will come You
:17:26. > :17:31.are ready with the arguments already? You will be disappointed if
:17:32. > :17:34.only ten turn up? Whether lots come or not we should. Taking the risk
:17:35. > :17:37.and yes, we are going to make it a major issue in the European
:17:38. > :17:41.election. Let's leave it there. Thank you very much, Nigel Farage.
:17:42. > :17:45.The summer of 2013 was not good for Ed Miliband, with questions over his
:17:46. > :17:48.leadership, low ratings and complaints about no policies. He
:17:49. > :17:51.bounced back with a vengeance at the Labour Conference in September,
:17:52. > :17:56.delivering a speech which this week won the spectator political speech
:17:57. > :17:59.of the year aword. In that speech he focussed on the cost-of-living and
:18:00. > :18:04.promised a temporary freeze on energy prices. Even said this. The
:18:05. > :18:11.next election isn't just going to be about policy. It's going to be about
:18:12. > :18:18.how we lead and the character we show. I've got a message for the
:18:19. > :18:27.Tories today. If they want to have a debate, about leadership and
:18:28. > :18:31.character, be my guest And if you want to know the difference between
:18:32. > :18:36.me and David Cameron, here is an easy way to remember it. When it was
:18:37. > :18:41.Murdoch v the McCanns, he took the side of Murdoch. When it was the
:18:42. > :18:45.tobacco lobby versus the cancer charities, he took the side of the
:18:46. > :18:50.tobacco lobby. When the millionaires wanted a tax cut as people pay the
:18:51. > :18:53.bedroom tax, he took the side of the millionaires. A come to think of it,
:18:54. > :18:56.here is an easier way to remember it. David Cameron was a Prime
:18:57. > :19:06.Minister who introduced the bedroom tax. I'll be the Prime Minister who
:19:07. > :19:12.repeals the bedroom tax There we go, that will go down with the party
:19:13. > :19:17.faithful on Tuesday. There will be a debate on the bedroom tax. Labour's
:19:18. > :19:25.Deputy Leader, Harriet Harman, joints me now. Let's begin with the
:19:26. > :19:31.bedroom tax or bedroom subsidy. Nearly 11% of people who've come off
:19:32. > :19:34.Housing Benefits all together after their spare room subsidy was
:19:35. > :19:39.stopped, isn't that proof that reform was necessary? No. I think
:19:40. > :19:43.that the whole way that the bet room tax has been attempted to be
:19:44. > :19:47.justified is completely wrong. What it's said is that it will actually
:19:48. > :19:52.help take people off the waiting lists by putting them into homes
:19:53. > :19:56.that have been vacated by people who've downsized by being
:19:57. > :20:00.incentivised by the bedroom tax so basically if you are a council
:20:01. > :20:04.tenant or Housing Association tenant in a property with spare bedrooms,
:20:05. > :20:08.then because the penalty is imposed, you will move to a smaller property.
:20:09. > :20:12.That is the justification for it. But actually, something like 96 of
:20:13. > :20:15.the people who're going to be hit by the bedroom tax, there isn't a
:20:16. > :20:19.smaller property for them to move into. I understand that. Therefore
:20:20. > :20:23.they are, like the people in my constituency, if they have got one
:20:24. > :20:30.spare bedroom, they are hit by 700 a year extra to pay and that is
:20:31. > :20:34.completely unfair As a consequence of people losing the subsidy for
:20:35. > :20:38.their spare room, they have decided to go out and get work and not
:20:39. > :20:42.depend on Housing Benefit at all? 11% of them. What's wrong with that?
:20:43. > :20:48.Well, they are going to review the way 2 the bedroom tax is working.
:20:49. > :20:53.What is wrong with that? But that's not working. That's the result of
:20:54. > :20:57.Freedom of Information, 141 councils provided the figures, 25,000 who've
:20:58. > :21:01.come off benefits, of the 233,0 0 affected, it's about 11%. These
:21:02. > :21:05.people were clearly able to get a job was having the Housing Benefit
:21:06. > :21:10.in the first place? But of course the people who're on the benefits
:21:11. > :21:13.who're not in work are always looking for work and many of them
:21:14. > :21:18.will find work which is a good thing, but for those who don't find
:21:19. > :21:22.work, or who find work where it s low-paid and need help with their
:21:23. > :21:26.rent, it's wrong to penalise them on the basis of the fact that their
:21:27. > :21:30.family might have grown up and moved away and so you have either got to
:21:31. > :21:34.move out of your home, away from your family and your neighbourhood,
:21:35. > :21:38.or you've got to stay where you are and, despite the fact that you are
:21:39. > :21:43.low-paid or unemployed, you have got to find an extra ?700 a year because
:21:44. > :21:46.of your rent. So it's very unfair The Government that was
:21:47. > :21:50.commissioning independent research on the impact of this work change
:21:51. > :21:54.and welfare policy, particularly on the impact on the most vulnerable,
:21:55. > :21:57.some of which you have been talking about there, shouldn't they have
:21:58. > :22:00.waited until you have got the independent research, that
:22:01. > :22:03.independent investigation before determining your policy? No. In
:22:04. > :22:08.fact, the Government should have waited until they'd have done their
:22:09. > :22:11.independent research before they bought into effect something and
:22:12. > :22:18.imposed it on people in a way which is really unfair. They could have
:22:19. > :22:21.known. Why didn't you wait? What they could have done is, they could
:22:22. > :22:26.have asked councils, are people going to be able to Manifest into
:22:27. > :22:29.smaller homes if we impose the bedroom tax and the answer from
:22:30. > :22:32.councils and Housing Associations would have been no, they can't move
:22:33. > :22:36.into smaller homes because which haven't got them there. They should
:22:37. > :22:39.have done the evaluation before they introduced the policy. We are
:22:40. > :22:44.absolutely clear and you can see the evidence, people are falling into
:22:45. > :22:47.rent arrears. Many people, it's a terrifying thing to find that you
:22:48. > :22:52.can't pay your rent, and some of the people go to payday loan companies
:22:53. > :22:56.to get loans to pay their rent. It is very, very unfair. The
:22:57. > :23:00.justification for it, which is people will move, is completely
:23:01. > :23:06.bogus. There aren't places for them to go. On the wider issue of welfare
:23:07. > :23:09.reform, a call for the TUC showed that voters support the Government's
:23:10. > :23:14.welfare reforms, including a majority of Labour voters. Why are
:23:15. > :23:17.you so out of touch on welfare issues, even with your own
:23:18. > :23:21.supporters? Nobody wants to see people who could be in a job
:23:22. > :23:26.actually living at the taxpayers' expense. That's why we have said
:23:27. > :23:29.that we'll introduce a compulsory jobs guarantee, so that if you are a
:23:30. > :23:33.young person who's been unemployed for a year, you will have to take a
:23:34. > :23:37.job absolutely have to take a job, and if you have been unemployed as
:23:38. > :23:42.somebody over 25, there'll be a compulsory thing after two years of
:23:43. > :23:46.unemployment. So if you have been on welfare two years? So the main issue
:23:47. > :23:50.about the welfare bill actually is people who're in retirement who need
:23:51. > :23:54.support. We have said for the richest pensioners, they shouldn't
:23:55. > :23:59.have to pay their winter fuel allowance. My point wasn't abouts
:24:00. > :24:03.the sub stance, it's about how you don't reflect public opinion --
:24:04. > :24:08.substance. The Parliamentary aid said the political backlog of
:24:09. > :24:13.benefits and social security is "not yet one that we have won. Labour
:24:14. > :24:18.must accept that they are not convincing on these matters,". Well,
:24:19. > :24:22.redo have to convince people and explain the policies we have got and
:24:23. > :24:26.the view we take. So, for example, for pensioners, who're well off we
:24:27. > :24:28.are saying they don't need the Winter Fuel Payment that. 's me
:24:29. > :24:33.saying to you and us saying to people in this country, we do think
:24:34. > :24:37.that there should be that tightening. For young people, who've
:24:38. > :24:40.been unemployed, they should be offered jobs but they've got to take
:24:41. > :24:46.them. So yes, we have to make our case. OK. The energy freeze which we
:24:47. > :24:50.showed there, on the speech, as popular. The living wage proseles
:24:51. > :24:54.have been going down well as well. Why is Labour's lead oaf the
:24:55. > :24:58.Conservatives being cut to 6% in the latest polls? Ed Miliband's own
:24:59. > :25:03.personal approval rating's gotten worse. Why is that? I'm not going to
:25:04. > :25:07.disdues ins and outs of weekly opinion polls with you or anybody
:25:08. > :25:11.else because I'm not a political commentator, but let me say to you
:25:12. > :25:16.the facts of what's happened since Ed Miliband's been leader of the
:25:17. > :25:22.Labour Party. We have got 1,950 New Labour councillors, all of those...
:25:23. > :25:24.But you're... All those who've won their seats against the
:25:25. > :25:29.Conservatives or the Liberal Democrats and no, Andrew you don't
:25:30. > :25:34.always get that in opposition. In 1997 after Tony Blair was elected,
:25:35. > :25:40.the Tories carried on losing council seats. Exceptional circumstances and
:25:41. > :25:46.these days Mr Blair was 25% ahead in the polls. You were six. The economy
:25:47. > :25:50.grew at an annual rate of 3% in the third quarter just gone. Everybody,
:25:51. > :25:53.private and public forecasters now saying that Britain in this coming
:25:54. > :25:58.year will grow faster than France, Italy, Spain, even Germany will grow
:25:59. > :26:01.faster. Your poll ratings are average when the economy was
:26:02. > :26:06.flatlining, what happens to them when the economy starts to grow
:26:07. > :26:10.Well, I've just said to you, I'm not a political commentator or a pundit
:26:11. > :26:13.on opinion polls. We are putting policies forward and we are holding
:26:14. > :26:18.the Government to account for what they are doing and we think that
:26:19. > :26:21.what they did opt economy pulled the plugs from the economy, delayed the
:26:22. > :26:25.recovery, made it stagnate and we have had three years lost growth. I
:26:26. > :26:32.understand that, but it's now starting to grow. Indeed. If you are
:26:33. > :26:35.no political commentator, let me ask you this, you anticipated the
:26:36. > :26:39.growth, so you switched your line to no growth to this is growth and
:26:40. > :26:43.living standards are rising. If the economy does grow up towards 3% next
:26:44. > :26:46.year, I would suggest that living standards probably will start to
:26:47. > :26:50.rise with that amount of growth What do you do then? We have not
:26:51. > :26:53.switched our line because the economy started to grow. All the way
:26:54. > :26:58.along, we said the economy will recover, but it's been delayed and
:26:59. > :27:02.we have had stagnation for far too long because of the economic
:27:03. > :27:06.policies. We have been absolutely right to understand the concerns
:27:07. > :27:10.people have and recognise that they are struggling with the
:27:11. > :27:14.cost-of-living. Sure. And we are right to do that. What kind of
:27:15. > :27:20.living standards stuck to rise next year? -- start to rise next year. I
:27:21. > :27:24.hope they will. For 40 months of David Cameron's Prime Ministership,
:27:25. > :27:27.for 39 of those, wages have risen slower than prices, so people are
:27:28. > :27:32.worse off. I understand that. You will know that the broader
:27:33. > :27:35.measurement, real household disposable income doesn't show that
:27:36. > :27:40.decline because it takes everything into account. Going around the
:27:41. > :27:46.country, people feel it. They say where's the recovery for me. Living
:27:47. > :27:51.standards now start to rise? If that happens, what is your next line
:27:52. > :27:53.There is a set of arguments about living standards, the National
:27:54. > :27:59.Health Service, about the problems that there is in A, which caused
:28:00. > :28:05.-- are caused by the organisation. I can put forward other lines. All
:28:06. > :28:10.right. Let me ask you one other question If no newspapers have
:28:11. > :28:13.signed up to the Government-backed Labour-backed Royal Charter on press
:28:14. > :28:19.regular lace by 2015 and it looks like the way things are going none
:28:20. > :28:23.will have, if you are in power, will a Labour Government legislate to
:28:24. > :28:26.make them? They don't have to sign up to the Royal Charter, that's not
:28:27. > :28:30.the system. What the Royal Charter does is create a recogniser and
:28:31. > :28:33.basically says it's for the newspapers to set up their own
:28:34. > :28:38.regulator. They are doing that. My question is... Let me finish. If
:28:39. > :28:42.they decide to have nothing to do with the Royal Charter that was
:28:43. > :28:46.decided in Miliband's office in the wee small hours, will you pass
:28:47. > :28:49.legislation to make them? The newspapers are currently setting up
:28:50. > :28:54.what they call... I know that, Harriet Harman. Just let me finish.
:28:55. > :28:58.OK. Because the newspapers are setting up the independent Press
:28:59. > :29:03.Standards Organisation. Right. If it is independent, as they say it is,
:29:04. > :29:06.then the recogniser will simply say, we recognise that this is
:29:07. > :29:10.independent and the whole point is that, in the past when there's been
:29:11. > :29:13.skaen deals a tend press have really turned people's lives upside down
:29:14. > :29:18.and the press have said OK we'll sort things out, leave it to us
:29:19. > :29:22.then they have sorted things out but a few years later they have slipped
:29:23. > :29:26.back, all this recogniser will do is check it once every three years and
:29:27. > :29:30.say yes, you have got an independent system and it's remained independent
:29:31. > :29:34.and therefore that is the guarantee things won't slip back. Very
:29:35. > :29:38.interesting. Thank you for that That's really interesting that if
:29:39. > :29:43.they get their act right, you won't force the alternative on them. We
:29:44. > :29:49.want the system as set forward by Leveson which is not statute and
:29:50. > :29:53.direct regulation. I want to stick with the press because I want to
:29:54. > :29:57.ask, is this a British institution or an out-of-date image for a by
:29:58. > :30:02.gone age. The Sun's Page 3 has been dividing the nation since it first
:30:03. > :30:07.appeared way back in 1970. That s 43 years ago. Harriet Harman's called
:30:08. > :30:24.for it to be removed, so we sent Adam out to ask whether the topless
:30:25. > :30:36.photographs should stay or go. We have asked people if page three
:30:37. > :30:46.should stay or go. Page three. What do you think? Nothing wrong with it
:30:47. > :30:57.at all. I think it is cheap and exploits women. It is a family
:30:58. > :31:08.newspaper. Should it stay or go Go. I will look like the bad guy. It
:31:09. > :31:17.should go. You have changed your mind. It is free choice. Girls do
:31:18. > :31:31.not have to be photographed. Old men get the paper just for that. Know
:31:32. > :31:35.when your age does that? Not really. Dashes-macro know what your age
:31:36. > :31:46.Page three girls, should they stay or go? I am not bothered. There are
:31:47. > :31:50.other ways of getting noticed. Page three of the Sun newspaper every
:31:51. > :31:59.day, there is a woman with no top on. We got rid of that about 40
:32:00. > :32:07.years ago in Australia. I am not in favour of censorship. It has been
:32:08. > :32:12.long enough. It can stay there. What is wrong with it? We want to
:32:13. > :32:18.encourage children to read the newspapers. I do not want my
:32:19. > :32:25.children to look at that. It is degrading. Do you think we will see
:32:26. > :32:30.the day when they get rid of it Yes, I do. I am wondering if I can
:32:31. > :32:44.turn this into some kind of a shelter. It is tipping it down. I
:32:45. > :32:50.think the council should do something about their car parks
:32:51. > :32:59.Mother nature, the human body. It should stay. Is some people like it,
:33:00. > :33:05.that is fine. I have nothing against it. You know what has surprised me,
:33:06. > :33:12.lots of women saying it should stay. Maybe they are seeing it as
:33:13. > :33:20.empowering. As I have a baby daughter in there, I am happy to see
:33:21. > :33:29.it go. Imagine my grandad opening up his paper and they're being my bats!
:33:30. > :33:37.It should go. There is nothing wrong with it. He wants it to go. What
:33:38. > :33:45.about people who think that page three should be banned? Idiots. Do
:33:46. > :33:54.you know a girl called Lacey, aged 22, from Bedford? Good luck to her.
:33:55. > :34:01.I do not know her as a person that I have heard she is nice. What about
:34:02. > :34:10.her decision to be on page three? Nothing to lose. Do you think she
:34:11. > :34:16.has made Bedford proud? That is not hard. What have we learned? More
:34:17. > :34:26.people want page three to stay down for it to go. Most people do not
:34:27. > :34:33.really seem to care, do they? You have heard a range of views. I am
:34:34. > :34:38.not arguing it should be banned I have not argued for it to be banned
:34:39. > :34:51.but I have disapproved of it since the 1970s. You do not think it
:34:52. > :34:55.should be banned? I do not think there should be dictating content
:34:56. > :34:59.but I do think, if you arrive from outer space in this country in
:35:00. > :35:04.21st-century Britain, and asked yourself what was the role of women
:35:05. > :35:09.in society... To stand in their knickers and nothing else, I think
:35:10. > :35:19.women have more to aspire to than to be able to take their clothes off in
:35:20. > :35:23.public. The sun no longer has the circulation, or the political
:35:24. > :35:27.importance, that it had in the 1980s when page three was at its height.
:35:28. > :35:34.Aren't people just voting with their feet anyway? The market is sorting
:35:35. > :35:40.this out. Half the number of people buy it now than they did 20 years
:35:41. > :35:45.ago. Until the time the sun does not have page three any more, I am
:35:46. > :35:52.entitled to my view that it is outdated and wrong. I am happy to
:35:53. > :36:02.establish that you do not want to ban it. What should happen? Should
:36:03. > :36:07.people boycott the paper? I have never implied or said it should be
:36:08. > :36:14.banned. I have always been forthright. Should people boycott
:36:15. > :36:20.the paper? I have not called for a boycott. The women's movement, of
:36:21. > :36:24.which I am part, and this is not about politicians censoring the
:36:25. > :36:31.press. I am part of the movement which says women can do better than
:36:32. > :36:37.taking off their clothes and being in their knickers in the newspapers.
:36:38. > :36:44.Why don't you do something about it? I am doing something about it by
:36:45. > :36:50.saying it is outdated. I am not doing anything more about it. Should
:36:51. > :36:55.people buy the paper as long as there is a page three? Would you
:36:56. > :37:03.like to say to viewers, as long as page three is in the sand, you
:37:04. > :37:08.should not buy it? Dashes-macro be Son. I am saying, wake up to what
:37:09. > :37:13.the role of women in society should be, which is more than page three.
:37:14. > :37:19.If they changed it in Australia, which is where Rupert Murdoch came
:37:20. > :37:23.from, why can they not change it in this country? You're watching the
:37:24. > :37:25.Sunday Politics. Coming up in just over 20 minutes... I'll be talking
:37:26. > :37:48.to man leading In the East Midlands, thousands of
:37:49. > :37:51.council staff are under threat of redundancy. We'll be hearing from
:37:52. > :37:54.the leader of Nottinghamshire County Council where 800 jobs are going.
:37:55. > :37:57.And we're also calling in a few of our police and crime commissioners
:37:58. > :37:59.for further questioning. One year on, have the Police and
:38:00. > :38:03.Crime Commissioner is made the impact that was hoped. We have come
:38:04. > :38:06.to Derbyshire to find out. Hello, I'm Marie Ashby, and joining
:38:07. > :38:09.me in the studio this week is Michael Mullaney, a Liberal Democrat
:38:10. > :38:11.Councillor for Hinckley and Bosworth, and the parliamentary
:38:12. > :38:15.candidate for Bosworth, and Paddy Tipping, a former Labour MP and now
:38:16. > :38:20.the Police and Crime Commissioner for Nottinghamshire. Paddy, can you
:38:21. > :38:26.believe it, it has been a year! It has been a year and it has been
:38:27. > :38:32.good. I have done a lot, there is a lot more to do. Are you glad you
:38:33. > :38:38.took it on? It is a great job and I working with good people, police and
:38:39. > :38:43.public. It is a big job. It is, it is a budget of ?200 million. The
:38:44. > :38:47.budget is reducing, we will talk about that in a moment. Michael, you
:38:48. > :38:54.are trying to be an MP, how is that going? Going well. I'm talking to
:38:55. > :38:58.people in Hinckley and buzzwords. Things are going well locally in the
:38:59. > :39:01.campaign. `` Hinckley and Boswells. Last week, we told you the budget
:39:02. > :39:05.proposals from Nottinghamshire County Council would be grim. Now we
:39:06. > :39:08.have the full details. The council says government cuts have left it
:39:09. > :39:11.with a funding gap of ?154 million over the next three years. Its
:39:12. > :39:14.proposals include scrapping 800 jobs and cutting back on services like
:39:15. > :39:20.Trading Standards and highways maintenance. It is also planning to
:39:21. > :39:26.end a grant to the Nottingham Playhouse of ?93,000 a year.
:39:27. > :39:29.In addition, council tax would rise by 1.99%...the highest the council
:39:30. > :39:32.can go without triggering a referendum over its plans. The
:39:33. > :39:35.Labour`run council says government cuts have left it with no choice,
:39:36. > :39:41.but the Conservative opposition says there is an alternative. If they had
:39:42. > :39:49.down as we propose to do, which is proposed `` which is propose ``
:39:50. > :39:53.which is contract at the private sector. Give people the opportunity
:39:54. > :39:57.to save their jobs and increase their responsibilities and maybe
:39:58. > :40:01.look for fresh fields by being an expanding company. They have chosen
:40:02. > :40:10.not to do that. So at least 800 post will go. It will probably be 1800
:40:11. > :40:13.people under notice of redundancy and very uncertain about their
:40:14. > :40:21.future. If they really cared, they could have done it differently.
:40:22. > :40:26.We are joined by Alan Rhodes, the Labour MP, and Kay Cutts says you
:40:27. > :40:34.could have avoided this. She is wrong. They left us with a deficit
:40:35. > :40:38.which we are having to clear up. The government moved the goalposts and
:40:39. > :40:43.created a problem for million pounds hole which we have to fill. We will
:40:44. > :40:48.have to make some extremely difficult decisions. I am very angry
:40:49. > :40:52.about being in this situation. I am also very sorry for the decisions we
:40:53. > :41:00.are having to take and that people will lose their jobs as a result. It
:41:01. > :41:06.sounds that `` it sounds as if you are blaming everybody else. We are
:41:07. > :41:11.not. But when we came into office we inherited a ?130 million mess and
:41:12. > :41:17.the goalposts were moved a few months later. We now have to clear
:41:18. > :41:22.it up. We here it is 800 jobs, some of which are part`time. How many
:41:23. > :41:35.people are really at risk as Mac Kay Cutts says it could be as many as
:41:36. > :41:41.1800 people. That is scaremongering. There are about 750 actual jobs.
:41:42. > :41:42.There are 50 posts already vacant. I have been 0
:41:43. > :41:45.There are 50 posts already vacant. I have been made redundant and it is
:41:46. > :41:52.not pleasant. It is regrettable that we are in this situation. It
:41:53. > :41:55.certainly is. It is because of conservative financial incompetence.
:41:56. > :42:00.We have had no support from central government. Michael Mullaney, you
:42:01. > :42:06.supporter of the Liberal Democrats, did Labour have to make cuts so
:42:07. > :42:07.fast? I can't speak for the council which I run, 0
:42:08. > :42:12.fast? I can't speak for the council which I run, Hinckley and Boswells,
:42:13. > :42:16.we have not had to make any redundancies and we still have one
:42:17. > :42:19.of the top ten lowest council taxes in the country. How have they
:42:20. > :42:25.managed that? By effective management of the council. In some
:42:26. > :42:28.services are done at county council level. So if we are talking from a
:42:29. > :42:32.county perspective, we have in Leicester, a conservative run
:42:33. > :42:38.authority which is proposing cutbacks. We as Liberal Democrats
:42:39. > :42:43.are set alternatives. There was money in the reserves at Leicester
:42:44. > :42:48.county council, which is in the bank for a rainy day, civil goodness sake
:42:49. > :42:51.use it. Alan is saying that the coalition is to blame for this.
:42:52. > :42:59.There are lots of alternatives which we have proposed. Spend some of that
:43:00. > :43:04.?99 million. There are still a lot of money spent on glossy magazines,
:43:05. > :43:08.they could cut back back. There was money spent on middlemen, the
:43:09. > :43:12.council pays a private company to cut the grass which pays a small
:43:13. > :43:18.amount of money to another contractor. By cutting out the
:43:19. > :43:23.middleman in that, they could save money. There were lots of other
:43:24. > :43:30.ways. They can stop; taking place. Paddy, in things like trading
:43:31. > :43:35.standards, that impinges on things in your remit. Are you worried?
:43:36. > :43:40.Yes, I am worried. Trading standards officers have been talking to us.
:43:41. > :43:46.They have been talking about the reductions. They are talking about
:43:47. > :43:52.emergency planning, we are all talking with the fire service etc.
:43:53. > :44:00.We are talking about best use of buildings, CCTV. You have been
:44:01. > :44:05.talking about these cuts. We are talking about ?50 million a year
:44:06. > :44:08.over three years. But we are told your annual budget is ?600 million a
:44:09. > :44:17.year. It doesn't sound that much when you spell it out like that. It
:44:18. > :44:20.is. It is a lot of money. We are delivering services across the
:44:21. > :44:22.county to some of the most vulnerable people in
:44:23. > :44:27.Nottinghamshire. It is a big budget but we have a lot of services to do.
:44:28. > :44:34.On this issue reserves, we have explained many times that we are
:44:35. > :44:37.required by statute to carry a percentage of reserves. There are
:44:38. > :44:43.very few reserves that are unaccounted for. Can't you dip into
:44:44. > :44:47.those? Not for revenue purposes, only for capital purposes. But we
:44:48. > :44:53.have to keep a level of reserves in place. Actually, the comparison
:44:54. > :44:58.between the borough council and the county council is apples and pears.
:44:59. > :45:02.The pressure on Borough councils is much less. Realistically, do you see
:45:03. > :45:08.yourselves getting this budget through? It is a consultation at the
:45:09. > :45:16.moment. We are listening to people and hearing what they tell us. We
:45:17. > :45:21.are very pleased that we have a lot of respondents. We will take
:45:22. > :45:28.responsible military and get the budget through. Lots of people very
:45:29. > :45:33.worried at the moment. Yes, and I have a great deal of sympathy. It is
:45:34. > :45:37.regrettable that we find ourselves in this situation. Alan Rhodes,
:45:38. > :45:41.thank you very much. This time a year ago, election fever
:45:42. > :45:44.was sweeping the country. Queues formed from early in the morning as
:45:45. > :45:47.people waited to vote for the new Police and Crime Commissioners.
:45:48. > :45:51.Well, as you know, it was nothing like that! Elected with just 15% of
:45:52. > :45:55.the vote, they've now been in office for a year, so what difference have
:45:56. > :46:01.they made? John Hess has spent a day with the Derbyshire Police Chief, to
:46:02. > :46:05.find out. It is a year since the police and
:46:06. > :46:09.crime commissioners were elected on the lowest turnout in election
:46:10. > :46:13.history. We have come to Derbyshire to meet Alan Charles, the PCC here
:46:14. > :46:19.to find out if this new role is having an impact. This commissioner
:46:20. > :46:23.wants to make an impact. Today in the Derbyshire market town of
:46:24. > :46:32.Ripley, the focus was on cutting anti`social behaviour. The
:46:33. > :46:37.commissioner has a plan. To curb the sale of high`strength blues. It is
:46:38. > :46:41.an idea first tested in Ipswich. They managed to get independent
:46:42. > :46:46.retailers to remove anything above 6.5% from the shelves. If we can
:46:47. > :46:54.roll that out to Derbyshire towns and Derby city, it will have an
:46:55. > :46:59.impact on local people. If we can get a locally elected official to
:47:00. > :47:03.get `` to take initiatives, it will be a good thing. One year into
:47:04. > :47:07.office, Alan Charles believes that on the streets and public meetings,
:47:08. > :47:12.people are becoming more aware of his public role. To find out from my
:47:13. > :47:15.perspective what is important to people about policing and also that
:47:16. > :47:22.they know why I'm here and what I can do. The Derbyshire force has
:47:23. > :47:32.3000 officers and staff, a budget, set by the Commissioner, of 140
:47:33. > :47:43.month million pounds. Do I. `` do I contest the budget? Yes, of course I
:47:44. > :47:47.do. This labour commissioner warns of rising crime caused by the
:47:48. > :47:51.coalition's welfare reforms. The Home Secretary is saying that crime
:47:52. > :47:57.is falling even though we have had budget cuts. It is not. What we find
:47:58. > :48:03.in deprived areas is that crime is starting to go up. Crime is going up
:48:04. > :48:10.and Derby compared to what it was last year and that follows years of
:48:11. > :48:16.falling crime. Meet the apprentice. The Derbyshire falls as 12 of them,
:48:17. > :48:20.getting appearance `` getting experience of a job which the
:48:21. > :48:25.Commissioner is turning to keep in the public eye. If there are
:48:26. > :48:37.efficiencies to be found, I want to find those and reinvest those into
:48:38. > :48:44.the public. The next elections are in 2016. At safeguarding communities
:48:45. > :48:47.is his immediate priority. We've got another police chief in
:48:48. > :48:50.the studio to join Paddy Tipping from Nottinghamshire, Alan Hardwick
:48:51. > :48:53.is the independent PCC for Lincolnshire. Allen, one year on,
:48:54. > :48:58.what difference have you made in Lincolnshire? The best thing about
:48:59. > :49:05.the job is that I can get out and about of the office `` out of the
:49:06. > :49:13.office and meet the people that I serve. What difference have I made?
:49:14. > :49:20.Our police force numbers have gone up. They were going to go down. I
:49:21. > :49:24.have close the funding gap of ?3.5 million. No jobs will be lost more
:49:25. > :49:29.than will they be lost on my watch. We are trying all floors of new
:49:30. > :49:34.developments in technology. Body worn cameras, portable
:49:35. > :49:39.fingerprinting... A long list of success? Yes. It sounds arrogant,
:49:40. > :49:43.but I'm doing a job on behalf of the people of Lincolnshire and I take it
:49:44. > :49:47.seriously. As was said earlier, I enjoy it. One of your key pledges
:49:48. > :49:51.was to get money back to Lincolnshire which and had been
:49:52. > :49:57.taken away by the government. And he been successful? No, I haven't. Do
:49:58. > :50:01.you feel you have let Lincolnshire down? No. All I can do is do my best
:50:02. > :50:01.on behalf of the people that I serve. 0
:50:02. > :50:05.on behalf of the people that I serve. I have spoken personally to
:50:06. > :50:11.the Home Secretary. Basically, it is a case of the government having
:50:12. > :50:15.their own problems. I would like to say leave Lincolnshire alone because
:50:16. > :50:20.we make the best use of the money from the government. We are the most
:50:21. > :50:25.cost`effective force in the country. If every four 's was run
:50:26. > :50:32.like ours, we would save ?1 billion. I have told the government that and
:50:33. > :50:38.got no reply. Michael Mullaney, the the Liberal Democrats were sceptical
:50:39. > :50:43.about policing crime commissioners. It sounds as if it is working. The
:50:44. > :50:48.big problem was politicisation of the police force. In Leicestershire,
:50:49. > :50:51.we have a conservative Police Commissioner. We didn't stand
:50:52. > :50:55.because we didn't believe in the political involvement in the police
:50:56. > :51:00.force. So he has not won you over with his successors? There with the
:51:01. > :51:05.costs, the cost of running those elections in which only one in seven
:51:06. > :51:11.people budget. ?75 million, that money could have been spent putting
:51:12. > :51:16.more police on the street. Let's hear what Paddy thinks about what
:51:17. > :51:25.differences he has made. As you have successors to? I said we would
:51:26. > :51:28.recruit an 0 successors to? I said we would
:51:29. > :51:32.recruit an extra 150 police officers. We have recruited them.
:51:33. > :51:40.They are hitting the streets plus 100 PCSO 's. I said we would reduce
:51:41. > :51:45.anti`social behaviour by 50%. We are working with councils to do that.
:51:46. > :51:48.Domestic violence has been a big a few assume you're putting extra
:51:49. > :51:54.resources in there. Women can begin to feel, and their children, a bit
:51:55. > :52:02.safer. All well and good, but what about this week, tweeting about
:52:03. > :52:14.dogs. Is that really important, when crime is still there? We have police
:52:15. > :52:30.dogs working hard, and apprehending people, . No one would argue that
:52:31. > :52:33.they do a good job of? But we look after police officers in retirement,
:52:34. > :52:38.what about the dogs? Is this about the popular vote? It is right that
:52:39. > :52:43.police officers should take these dogs home in retirement and they do
:52:44. > :52:50.it out of their own pocket. They should have their vets' fees paid. I
:52:51. > :52:56.think we should treat animals and people with respect. Seems
:52:57. > :52:59.reasonable? Yes, of course. But the police commissioners, where they
:53:00. > :53:07.were launched, there was this big Guha that there would be `` there
:53:08. > :53:14.was this big noise that they would be people that prevented them defy
:53:15. > :53:18.with. But most people don't know who they are. `` there was this big
:53:19. > :53:23.noise that they would be people that we could identify with. They have
:53:24. > :53:32.not made the impact. One person in a big county like Leicestershire can't
:53:33. > :53:36.make the impact. The local PCC of Leicestershire, Sir Clive Loader,
:53:37. > :53:39.said he was too busy to come. He signed up to a part`time job.
:53:40. > :53:45.Perhaps he is saying that because he was not a politician. Do you have
:53:46. > :53:51.sympathy with that? I do have sympathy. I worked 70 hours a week.
:53:52. > :53:59.But he must realise was a full`time job! I did this with my eyes open.
:54:00. > :54:05.Lincolnshire crime has gone down by 14%. The latest figures I have is
:54:06. > :54:11.that it has gone down another 2.5% `` 2.7%. That is a success, isn't
:54:12. > :54:14.it. As for being invisible, that is nonsense. If we were invisible,
:54:15. > :54:20.people would not bother with what we say or do. I am approached every
:54:21. > :54:25.single day by the media asked if I have a comment to make. They would
:54:26. > :54:33.not ask a nobody to comment. As for the whole thing being in nonsense, I
:54:34. > :54:38.disagree. Does the name of your party give the game away? You all
:54:39. > :54:42.about democracy. Yes, but policing should not be a matter for
:54:43. > :54:46.elections. It should not be politicised. It is dangerous to have
:54:47. > :54:51.one person at the top with too much power. You can have tensions between
:54:52. > :54:59.police commissioners and chief constables. You certainly can. It is
:55:00. > :55:02.a recipe for instability. What we want is local police, people being
:55:03. > :55:09.able to contact their local beat officers. We have the police
:55:10. > :55:12.commissioners in the studio. We will be talking about that in a second.
:55:13. > :55:15.A BBC poll has found that many people don't even know they have a
:55:16. > :55:16.Police and Crime Commissioner, let alone who 0
:55:17. > :55:19.Police and Crime Commissioner, let alone who it is. But how well`known
:55:20. > :55:24.are our police chiefs in the East Midlands? Des Coleman has been
:55:25. > :55:28.making inquiries. Four faces that you should
:55:29. > :55:34.recognise. Let's see if people in Derby know him. No, you must be a
:55:35. > :55:39.politician. The face looks familiar but... The name escapes me. Is he a
:55:40. > :55:43.Labour 0 but... The name escapes me. Is he a
:55:44. > :55:48.Labour councillor? Not quite. I'm in Castle Donington in Leicestershire.
:55:49. > :55:56.Let's see if people know who Sir Clive Loader is? Do you know this
:55:57. > :56:00.man? Know. What if I said his name was Sir Clive Loader? Still means
:56:01. > :56:09.nothing. Do you know this gentleman? Know. No. Tell the camera. No. In
:56:10. > :56:18.Nottingham, let's see if people know who Paddy is. Do you recognise this
:56:19. > :56:26.man? No, Lewis E? Paddy Tipping, Nottingham policing crime
:56:27. > :56:34.Commissioner. `` who is he? Do you know this man if I showed you this
:56:35. > :56:42.picture? Paddy Tipping. We love you! He is the chief of the police, isn't
:56:43. > :56:50.he? Surely people would know this man, used a beer TV presenter `` he
:56:51. > :56:58.used to be a TV presenter. You know this gentleman? Know. Do you know
:56:59. > :57:05.this man? Alan Hardwick. He is policing crime Commissioner. Before
:57:06. > :57:14.you, she knows him! Well done. You got two each. But 50%
:57:15. > :57:21.of the people near me. You can't be too impressed. That's not a
:57:22. > :57:28.scientific survey. 70% of people knew about the police authorities.
:57:29. > :57:33.70% no about policing crime commissioners. That is a tenfold
:57:34. > :57:39.increase. That is based on what you are telling me, but what we found on
:57:40. > :57:46.the streets was not bad. Recognition is important. The whole point of the
:57:47. > :57:51.job... But how will people know to come to you if they don't know who
:57:52. > :57:56.you are? I would think that most people in Lincolnshire would know
:57:57. > :58:01.who I was although I am. How do you get the message across? I spent all
:58:02. > :58:02.week meeting the people 0 get the message across? I spent all
:58:03. > :58:10.week meeting the people that Weise serve. I have done 135 engagements
:58:11. > :58:14.with the public over the past year and the amount of work that has come
:58:15. > :58:20.into my office is double the amount that come into the `` that came into
:58:21. > :58:29.the police authority's. We are one year in. So you are saying they are
:58:30. > :58:39.warming to you? It feels as if they are setting me on fire! So you have
:58:40. > :58:45.had an impact, they have had an impact, people are turning up to the
:58:46. > :58:48.meetings. The populations are about a million, when you're talking about
:58:49. > :59:00.the people who go, it is tiny portion. The reality is we could say
:59:01. > :59:05.this money and users on front line policeman we don't want to get up
:59:06. > :59:09.political. Time for a round`up of some of the
:59:10. > :59:17.other political stories in the East Midlands this week ` here's John
:59:18. > :59:20.Hess with 60 seconds. Married people in the East Midlands
:59:21. > :59:24.could save up to ?200 a year thanks to a new tax break. That's according
:59:25. > :59:27.to Loughborough Conservative MP Nicky Morgan. She says 345,000
:59:28. > :59:35.people here could benefit from the married couples' allowance. But they
:59:36. > :59:39.will have to wait for a while. `` they will have to stay married for a
:59:40. > :59:41.while. The measure won't come in for 18 months.
:59:42. > :59:44.There was support at Westminster from both sides for miners who have
:59:45. > :59:47.lost their concessionary fuel after the collapse of UK Coal. Mansfield's
:59:48. > :00:02.Alan Neill wants the government to step in. In a lot of people say this
:00:03. > :00:08.is a benefit, it is a negotiated arrangement. The government is now
:00:09. > :00:11.considering ways of helping former miners who have lost out.
:00:12. > :00:14.And the Conservatives have announced their candidate for Newark at the
:00:15. > :00:16.next general election. Sitting MP Patrick Mercer resigned the
:00:17. > :00:19.Conservative whip after lobbying allegations. Robert Jenrick, a
:00:20. > :00:22.director of Christie's auction house, is the new candidate.
:00:23. > :00:26.That's the Sunday Politics in the East Midlands, thanks to Paddy
:00:27. > :00:27.Tipping and Michael Mullaney. Now back to
:00:28. > :00:38.more equipment so they can see cyclists. Back to you, Andrew.
:00:39. > :00:43.We learned this week that no more warships will be built at
:00:44. > :00:47.Portsmouth, the home of the Royal Navy since the days of the Mary Rose
:00:48. > :00:50.and Francis Drake. But has the city been sacrificed to save jobs on the
:00:51. > :00:54.Clyde in Scotland? Is England the loser in an effort to keep the
:00:55. > :01:04.United Kingdom intact? Let's speak to Eddie Bone, he leads the campaign
:01:05. > :01:08.for an English Parliament. Is England the loser in this attempt to
:01:09. > :01:16.doubt, Andrew. We would look at it from the campaign for the English
:01:17. > :01:21.Parliament that the British governance is bribing the Scots to
:01:22. > :01:27.stay with the union at the cost of English jobs. What is the best
:01:28. > :01:31.outcome for England when Scotland votes in the referendum next year?
:01:32. > :01:35.We have got to have an English parliament. What I mean by that is
:01:36. > :01:41.an endless governor and with a first minister speaking on behalf of the
:01:42. > :01:45.people of England. -- and English government. If Scotland votes for
:01:46. > :01:52.independence, that is the union coming to an end. It will be
:01:53. > :01:59.dissolved legally. England would be going to negotiating table without
:02:00. > :02:05.true representation. The union continues but it continues without
:02:06. > :02:09.Scotland. I want to come back to my... That is the constitutional
:02:10. > :02:14.position. You may not agree with me but that is the constitutional
:02:15. > :02:20.position. Do you want Scotland to vote for independence next year We
:02:21. > :02:26.want a fair deal with equality for England. If that can be maintained
:02:27. > :02:30.or England can have a fair deal within the union, that is brilliant.
:02:31. > :02:34.Let's have a federal system are all the nations are treated equally If
:02:35. > :02:43.that cannot happen and Scotland decides to stay, if Scotland goes,
:02:44. > :02:48.it is an independent England, isn't it? If Scotland votes to leave the
:02:49. > :02:52.union, what is left of the United Kingdom would be so dominated by
:02:53. > :02:57.England at Westminster would, in effect, Beale English Parliament,
:02:58. > :03:04.wouldn't it? I do not agree with you. I think that is a British, deny
:03:05. > :03:09.list approach. The act of union was a fusion with the King of England to
:03:10. > :03:14.the King of Scotland. That would come to an end. The Welsh are very
:03:15. > :03:18.concerned. They are a very small nation. If you have a botched
:03:19. > :03:23.British come English Parliament the Welsh would be in a very vulnerable
:03:24. > :03:28.situation. They would not be listened to. Also a situation with
:03:29. > :03:31.Northern Ireland. There are voices in Northern Ireland talking about
:03:32. > :03:36.trying to reunite Northern Ireland. It would be a very volatile
:03:37. > :03:41.situation. Would you prefer England to become an independent nation
:03:42. > :03:45.separate from what was left of the UK, which would be Wales and
:03:46. > :03:51.Northern Ireland? Would you like to see England have a seat in the UN? I
:03:52. > :03:58.want their representation for the people of England. English jobs were
:03:59. > :04:05.sacrificed because the British government wanted Scotland to
:04:06. > :04:14.remain... You have answered that very quickly. I am -- very clearly.
:04:15. > :04:20.Would you want England, without Northern Ireland and Wales to become
:04:21. > :04:24.a separate nation state? If that is what it takes for people of England
:04:25. > :04:28.to have their representation - representation that looks at
:04:29. > :04:32.policies of the NHS, education very different from Wales and Northern
:04:33. > :04:37.Ireland - then so be it. Independence will need to be the way
:04:38. > :04:48.forward. We have a small window of opportunity that the federal system
:04:49. > :04:56.might still work. D1 indenting have a system like Scotland? -- do you
:04:57. > :05:02.want England to have a system like Scotland? What we need to do now is
:05:03. > :05:08.implement the process is to get their representation for England. I
:05:09. > :05:13.would urge your viewers to join our campaign because it is the only way
:05:14. > :05:18.to protect jobs in England, protect the NHS, protect education.
:05:19. > :05:21.Otherwise we will see the people in England continually penalised by the
:05:22. > :05:27.British government is trying desperately to save the union by
:05:28. > :05:33.giving more to Scotland and Wales. Nice to talk to you. Helen, on this
:05:34. > :05:37.business of the Clyde versus Portsmouth, it would have been
:05:38. > :05:41.pretty inconceivable of the British government that believes in the
:05:42. > :05:47.union to have allowed the Clyde to close. That would have been a
:05:48. > :05:51.disaster. It would have been. It's dumped Nicola Sturgeon. Hang on a
:05:52. > :05:54.minute, if there was Scottish independence, England were not allow
:05:55. > :05:59.its warships to be built in a foreign country. She was unable to
:06:00. > :06:04.admit there were any downsides to Scottish independence. It would be
:06:05. > :06:09.dangerous for Scotland to talk about this. You have a Lib Dem and a
:06:10. > :06:13.Conservative MP with reasonable majorities. They will find that a
:06:14. > :06:19.killer on their doorstep in the next election. There are no results in
:06:20. > :06:25.this for Mr Cameron. He has one MP and he will be lucky to have two.
:06:26. > :06:30.And the South of England, I know Portsmouth is quite an industrial
:06:31. > :06:34.area, but the South of England is overall Tory territory. He has
:06:35. > :06:38.backed the Clyde where there are no Tory votes. The Tory problem in
:06:39. > :06:42.Scotland is crucial. The trend to look out for is the rise of English
:06:43. > :06:47.nationalism within the Conservative Party. They have the word Unionist
:06:48. > :06:51.in their official title. If, in election after election, they failed
:06:52. > :06:55.to win a significant presence in Scotland, and they are failing to
:06:56. > :07:01.win a majority in Westminster because of that, it is not hard to
:07:02. > :07:09.imagine that in ten years time that would be a party which has more
:07:10. > :07:14.autonomy. One person we know who does not sign up to that. David
:07:15. > :07:18.Cameron is a romantic Unionist at heart he may say that are not any
:07:19. > :07:25.vote in Scotland but he want to keep the union together. With the Clyde,
:07:26. > :07:29.you saw a rival together of economic and political interests. It is
:07:30. > :07:33.economic or the case the greatest shipbuilding capability in the
:07:34. > :07:36.United Kingdom is in the Clyde. It is politically very helpful for this
:07:37. > :07:40.government to say to people in Scotland, look at the benefits of
:07:41. > :07:44.being in the United Kingdom and under their breath, or in the case
:07:45. > :07:51.of Alistair Carmichael to a camera, look what might go if you leave
:07:52. > :07:55.That came together very conveniently to the government. Now, how do you
:07:56. > :07:58.like your politicians? Squeaky clean with an impeccable past? Or are you
:07:59. > :08:01.happy for them to have a few skeletons in the closet? Well, last
:08:02. > :08:05.week the Toronto Mayor Rob Ford admitted smoking crack cocaine. He
:08:06. > :08:08.said he took the drug about a year ago whilst in a drunken stupor. So,
:08:09. > :08:12.what impact do confessions have on a political career? In a moment, we'll
:08:13. > :08:21.hear what our panel has to say, but first, take a look at this. Yes I
:08:22. > :08:26.have smoked crack cocaine. Am I an addict? No. Have I tried it?
:08:27. > :08:32.Probably one of my drunken stupor is, about a year ago. I have used
:08:33. > :08:39.drugs in the past. I have used class a drugs in the past. About 30 years
:08:40. > :08:45.ago at university, I did smoke cannabis. I took cannabis is a few
:08:46. > :08:52.times at university and it was wrong. Have you snorted cocaine I
:08:53. > :09:17.tried to but unsuccessfully years ago. I sneezed. The people around
:09:18. > :09:24.you who took cocaine, they went .. Is it better to confess or the that
:09:25. > :09:30.get you into even more hot water? It is absolutely better. The confession
:09:31. > :09:36.by Jacqui Smith was without glamour. Finding a Labour politician who once
:09:37. > :09:42.smoked cannabis 25 years ago... I do not think it makes you think that
:09:43. > :09:46.she cannot be a serious politician. Politicians should brace thing about
:09:47. > :09:52.them which everyone knows. In the case of Ed Miliband, he should not
:09:53. > :10:03.deny being geeky. That would reek of in authenticity. The Tory MP meant
:10:04. > :10:08.to be regarded as a rising star turns out he was claiming to heat
:10:09. > :10:14.his horses stables at the expense of the tax payer. He had made a
:10:15. > :10:17.generous claim for energy bills in his constituency home. He went
:10:18. > :10:21.through the papers and found he had been using it to heat the stables
:10:22. > :10:27.and he laid it all out and did the right thing. He was completely
:10:28. > :10:35.honest. Is that the end of it? It will still haunt in because energy
:10:36. > :10:40.is such a big issue. He was right to be honest about it. Helen was
:10:41. > :10:44.saying, absolutely, you need to be honest about your past. Harriet
:10:45. > :10:49.Harman said she smoked pot at university. If you have smoked pot,
:10:50. > :10:57.you can have a front line career. If you have taken class a drugs, you
:10:58. > :11:00.cannot have a front line career There is the politician confessing
:11:01. > :11:04.and the remarkable willingness of the public to forgive. It is
:11:05. > :11:09.enlightened and progressive to forgive a politician for an affair
:11:10. > :11:14.or taking soft drugs at university. To smoke crack cocaine and demand be
:11:15. > :11:19.mad of following the Mayor of Toronto does astonishes me. There
:11:20. > :11:25.was an example in America a few years ago. It was crack cocaine He
:11:26. > :11:32.was elected having confessed to smoking crack cocaine. I draw the
:11:33. > :11:38.line around class a drugs. We will put the team on to investigate him.
:11:39. > :11:41.Help to Bible come back into the headlines again. Mr Cameron will
:11:42. > :11:45.surroundings by the people who are benefiting from buying their homes
:11:46. > :11:51.on this scheme in the same way that this is that you used to visit those
:11:52. > :11:55.who had bought their council houses. It will become hugely politicised.
:11:56. > :12:03.The Bank of England thinks that unemployment will drop late 201 ,
:12:04. > :12:08.early 2015. They will put interest rates up. Those with 95% mortgages
:12:09. > :12:13.will have two find an extra ?40 a month to pay them off. I would not
:12:14. > :12:25.be surprised if David Cameron is setting up himself with this
:12:26. > :12:34.trouble. They will not want to raise interest rates. Mark Carney was very
:12:35. > :12:38.careful to give himself three get out clauses. If unemployment hits a
:12:39. > :12:42.certain level, Key has three measures which have to be fulfilled
:12:43. > :12:46.before he goes ahead and raises interest rates. As a Tory
:12:47. > :12:51.strategist, would you rather go into the election with low and implement
:12:52. > :13:00.or low interest rates? I think they would stick to low interest rates.
:13:01. > :13:04.-- low unemployment. It is not just panellists who are raising questions
:13:05. > :13:11.about it, it is senior figures people in senior economic positions.
:13:12. > :13:15.They are saying the scheme is fine at the moment. David Cameron will be
:13:16. > :13:20.surrounded by people who have taken mortgages out at low levels and it
:13:21. > :13:26.is all fine right now but if interest rates go up, it will not be
:13:27. > :13:29.cosy. That's all folks. The Daily Politics is back tomorrow on BBC Two
:13:30. > :13:32.at midday. I'll be back next Sunday at the normal time of 11am.
:13:33. > :13:43.Remember, if it's Sunday, it's the Sunday Politics.