:00:40. > :00:46.Morning, welcome to the veritable Sunday Politics. We have Alastair
:00:46. > :00:52.Charmichael. We'll ask him what Sunday Politics. We have Alastair
:00:52. > :00:56.Moore hadn't. Ken Clarke just keeps has that his predecessor Michael
:00:56. > :01:03.Moore hadn't. Ken Clarke just keeps going on and on and on. He'll bang
:01:03. > :01:06.Free of the shackles of Government, former Energy Secretary Chris Huhne
:01:06. > :01:16.Here in the East: We are looking at will be with us. We'll ask him for
:01:16. > :01:20.Here in the East: We are looking at our academies. Are they the solution
:01:20. > :01:22.or just part of the problem? And it
:01:22. > :01:24.or just part of the problem? says we've misunderstood the problem
:01:24. > :01:38.of human trafficking and that men pundits who we try to shuffle out of
:01:38. > :01:44.a job but failed miserably, Mick watt, Miranda Green Andijan an
:01:44. > :01:56.Ganesh. They'll Tweet like mad as if Is Ed Miliband's Labour Party moving
:01:56. > :02:01.chid owe Cabinet reshuffle was seen a a shift to the lot of. Two have
:02:01. > :02:09.announced policy changes which could Pensions Secretary Rachel Reeves
:02:10. > :02:14.says Labour will be tougher on the Tories. While Tristram Hunt says
:02:14. > :02:23.Labour loves Tory-style free schools after all. Here he is on the BBC
:02:23. > :02:25.viewers. If you are a group of parents, social entrepreneurs,
:02:25. > :02:30.teachers, interested in setting parents, social entrepreneurs,
:02:30. > :02:33.school in areas where you need new school place, the Labour Government
:02:33. > :02:39.will be on your side. That's free enterprise and innovation. It will
:02:39. > :02:42.will be on your side. That's free be in areas of need. We have a
:02:42. > :02:52.school places crisis going on. It teachers in these schools. And
:02:52. > :03:02.accountability. What is going on with the Al Madina school is because
:03:02. > :03:07.of terrible mistakes with Michael I'm not sure if the policies have
:03:07. > :03:10.changed, the change of tone is I'm not sure if the policies have
:03:10. > :03:12.changed, the change of tone is remarkable, both on welfare and
:03:12. > :03:16.changed, the change of tone is schools. A significant change of
:03:16. > :03:23.reshuffle on the Labour frontbench last week was init wered as a purge
:03:24. > :03:31.of Blair rights. It seemed to be a purge of anti-reform thinking.
:03:31. > :03:35.Rachel Reeves was not saying anythi different on substance but saying
:03:35. > :03:41.Labour will be tough than the Tories on welfare. You've seen that clip
:03:41. > :03:47.from Tristram, free schools will be allowed to be set up in areas of
:03:47. > :03:51.need. Greater oversight. But a completely different change of tone,
:03:51. > :03:58.we are on the side of parents and social entrepreneurs who want to set
:03:58. > :04:06.these up. A different change. Why are they doing this? On education,
:04:06. > :04:11.polarised. You've had the Michael department. This weekend, we've
:04:11. > :04:14.polarised. You've had the Michael leaked memos from one of Michael
:04:14. > :04:18.Gove's advisers which are extreme views about the state of education.
:04:18. > :04:25.And on the other side teaching unions. It hasn't led to a healthy
:04:25. > :04:29.debate which represents what parents want out of schools or employers.
:04:29. > :04:33.This is a huge move from the Labour Party to sound more reasonable.
:04:33. > :04:37.This is a huge move from the Labour have been silent on education which
:04:37. > :04:45.is a huge policy area on the left. Is this a focus group-driven change?
:04:45. > :04:52.They've seen the polls. Welfare reforms are hugery popular and free
:04:52. > :04:57.only apiece the focus groups by changing the policy substantially. I
:04:57. > :05:01.always thought a test for this Labour reshuffle was not whether Ed
:05:01. > :05:06.Miliband would promote Blair rights, it is clear he did, it is whether
:05:06. > :05:11.they would be allowed to be Blair rights. When Stephen Twigg carried
:05:11. > :05:15.the education portfolio it was clear his own views were closer to the
:05:15. > :05:20.Government than he was allowed to let on. He was constrained. There is
:05:20. > :05:24.no point of giving Tristram Hunt this job if he is not allowed to say
:05:24. > :05:28.what he thinks. I wouldn't mind betting privately he thinks free
:05:28. > :05:35.schools should be available beyond just areas of need. He hasn't yet
:05:35. > :05:43.defined need. It could be, we've run schools are so bad we need schools.
:05:43. > :05:55.If that is it, it is the same Asics itsing Government policy. In they
:05:55. > :05:59.unsatisfactory that's no different. He wanted to say he was in favour of
:05:59. > :06:05.higher educational standards and rigour, he had to tell the audience
:06:05. > :06:09.he has a Cambridge PhD to attack Michael Gove. That was difficult for
:06:09. > :06:17.Tristram Hunt he had to mention that. Is that worth something, a PhD
:06:17. > :06:24.from Cambridge? Obviously to him it is. He said they would demand proper
:06:24. > :06:34.teaching qualifications. That could teaching? Independent schools do not
:06:34. > :06:38.have to have teachers with formal teaching qualifications. I've never
:06:38. > :06:48.been to one? What about you? That decision by Michael Gove to allow
:06:48. > :06:53.free schools to employ nonunionised and non-trained people, so he has to
:06:53. > :06:58.Watch this space. The dust settled after the party resufficients. Do
:06:58. > :07:10.the Tories look a bit more like Britain. Do the Tories look more
:07:10. > :07:15.#4 With reshuffles, you're never really certain. There's whispers,
:07:15. > :07:21.rumours, guesses. But the only way to know it is underway is keeping
:07:21. > :07:27.beady eyes on a front door. Up until now, the only way we knew who was in
:07:27. > :07:30.and who was out was who came walking down this bit of Downing Street
:07:30. > :07:34.and who was out was who came walking a smile on their face after going to
:07:34. > :07:38.see the boss. The once who are to be sacked, they usually go round the
:07:38. > :07:47.back. Not this time. No, something new alerted us all. The-PM started
:07:47. > :07:50.can't remember a triple decker reshuffle where you've three parties
:07:50. > :07:57.changing ministerial teams at the resufficient happened on Twitter.
:07:57. > :08:04.Not that the press stopped watching the door as well. News was a bit
:08:04. > :08:09.Charmichael replaced Michael Moore, the first to be pounced on. I'm
:08:10. > :08:14.disappointed to be leaving office now but pleased at what I've been
:08:14. > :08:18.able to achieve in the last couple of years. Not as pleased as one
:08:18. > :08:34.imagines as the man receiving the welcome that went on, and on and
:08:34. > :08:42.simultaneously having Jeremy Browne, in a sense seen off the premises of
:08:42. > :08:57.the Home Office in conspiracy to let # Blowing hi Jude through a traffic
:08:57. > :09:02.Democrats. We tend to think they are herbivorous. Sacking a Cabinet
:09:02. > :09:04.Minister, another minister, Jeremy Browne. By lunch time, the Tory
:09:04. > :09:09.ranks were shifting too. The PM Browne. By lunch time, the Tory
:09:09. > :09:11.to boost the numbers of telegenic women walking into Government and
:09:12. > :09:20.turning perceptions around. He tipped a so-called flatcap to men
:09:20. > :09:23.backgrounds with room for some which fitted neither label but are friends
:09:23. > :09:29.of George Osborne. And, all the while, those new Tory ministers
:09:29. > :09:33.of George Osborne. And, all the learning of Labour's changes. Labour
:09:33. > :09:36.too knows the value of new young blood striding into the limelight.
:09:36. > :09:42.Again some with TV experience of that. Tristram Hunt and Gloria de
:09:42. > :09:46.peer row would be hard to describe as hard left. But Blairbrushing
:09:46. > :09:51.peer row would be hard to describe past out of the picture seemed to be
:09:51. > :09:57.the name of the day. Liam Byrne With Diane Abbott also gone, was
:09:57. > :09:59.this really a Blair right cull? It depends what you mean. Blair right
:09:59. > :10:03.used to mean someone who wanted depends what you mean. Blair right
:10:03. > :10:07.Blair to be leader of the Labour Party. Somebody who worked closely
:10:07. > :10:10.with him. Now it means sometimes people who believe in a certain
:10:10. > :10:14.with him. Now it means sometimes of ideologyies or ideas. There are
:10:14. > :10:17.still very much those kind of Blair rights within the party. But we
:10:17. > :10:20.still very much those kind of Blair seeing the group around Tony Blair
:10:20. > :10:27.are not long assassin flew enjoys as they once were. By evening, it was
:10:27. > :10:31.over. New bees were sharing the ministers quietly thanked commits
:10:31. > :10:45.raters. Or -- commiserators. Or ministers quietly thanked commits
:10:45. > :10:50.disified. How much much someone standing here might want it to be
:10:50. > :10:58.the case, you are unlikely to get someone coming out of that do going
:10:58. > :11:04."how could." And running off crying! And the brand, spanking new Scottish
:11:04. > :11:11.Secretary Alastair Charmichael joins us from Orkney on a line that hasn't
:11:11. > :11:17.been used since the fleet was used in the outbreak of World War I! I
:11:17. > :11:20.wasn't around at the time. I'm hearing you loud and clear. Why
:11:20. > :11:25.wasn't around at the time. I'm you agreed to run a department?
:11:25. > :11:29.wasn't around at the time. I'm you wanted to abolish six years
:11:29. > :11:30.wasn't around at the time. I'm Hello? Maybe our connections are not
:11:30. > :11:37.Charmichael. Can you hear me? I Hello? Maybe our connections are not
:11:37. > :11:41.hear you now. There was a nasty second there where you disappeared.
:11:41. > :11:43.Let me try the question again. Why have you agreed to run a department
:11:43. > :11:49.you wanted to abolish six years have you agreed to run a department
:11:49. > :11:53.Because this is the, probably one of the most important jobs in British
:11:53. > :12:00.politics at the moment. To ensure that Scotland remains part of the
:12:00. > :12:05.UK. Even when I was talking about the reconfiguration of rep sen Taigs
:12:05. > :12:10.of Scotland -- representation of Scotland within Whitehall, there was
:12:10. > :12:14.always a job to be done. That is true in spades now. I will focus on
:12:14. > :12:17.making sure the UK Government has a real voice in that debate. What
:12:17. > :12:18.making sure the UK Government has a you that Michael Moore didn't have?
:12:18. > :12:24.Look, I think Michael Moore did you that Michael Moore didn't have?
:12:24. > :12:31.excellent job. The work he did delivering the Edinburgh agreement
:12:31. > :12:40.clear legal and decisive referendum, the work delivering extra powers to
:12:40. > :12:47.substantial piece of work. I'm not friend of mine. I will say that
:12:47. > :12:47.substantial piece of work. I'm not we go forward into this, this is now
:12:47. > :12:52.about the actual debate itself. we go forward into this, this is now
:12:52. > :13:01.will be putting the case, with some passion, I hope, for Scotland to
:13:01. > :13:08.just some abstract debate about nationhood, sovereignty, this is a
:13:08. > :13:16.their livelihoods, the cost of their mortgage. That and an awful lot
:13:16. > :13:24.challenge. I understand that. But if you're being put in there to save
:13:24. > :13:29.the union, every pole has the no -- poll has the no campaign margin
:13:29. > :13:34.alley ahead. Mr Moore was doing pretty well to save the union. I
:13:34. > :13:41.suspect you've been given the job to Scotland? And lieu, you misread
:13:41. > :13:44.suspect you've been given the job to situation if you -- Andrew, you
:13:44. > :13:48.misread the situation new think anybody is going to be the person
:13:48. > :13:50.who will save the union. The people who will save the union are the
:13:50. > :13:53.people of Scotland if they turn who will save the union are the
:13:53. > :13:58.next year and vote to save the union. We have to put the case for
:13:58. > :14:04.that. That is what I will be doing. Look at the position of your own
:14:04. > :14:11.party. You came fourth in the last Scottish parentry elections. You
:14:11. > :14:17.were even behind the Conservatives. The latest poll has you still in
:14:17. > :14:22.fourth. Are you there because you're a bruiser and you will pep up the
:14:22. > :14:25.Liberal Democrats opportunity in Scotland. If I had a pound for
:14:25. > :14:29.everybody to referred to me as being Scotland. If I had a pound for
:14:29. > :14:33.a bruiser, I wouldn't need to be sitting here this morning. I could
:14:33. > :14:38.have retired by now. The truth of this, if I can address it once and
:14:38. > :14:44.for all, I have done probably one of the most complex and subtle jobs in
:14:44. > :14:50.three-and-a-half years, Liberal Democrat Chief Whip in a Coalition
:14:50. > :14:53.survived in that job a week, let alone three-and-a-half years, if I
:14:53. > :14:59.was the sort of person who went around picking unnecessary fights.
:14:59. > :15:03.So, can we just please forget about this business about being a bruiser.
:15:03. > :15:07.As far as the position of the party in the polls, this is true also
:15:07. > :15:10.As far as the position of the party the referendum vote, opinion polls
:15:10. > :15:13.are a snapshot. They are not a prediction of what will happen in
:15:13. > :15:19.the future. I will be out there putting the case. Neither the next
:15:19. > :15:24.election nor the referendum is one or lost yet. One of the things I
:15:24. > :15:31.really want to be guarding against because we are a good margin ahead
:15:31. > :15:39.today, 12 months out from the actual polling day, that it is in the bag.
:15:39. > :15:42.Believe me, Andrew, it is not. As you know, wasn't for the Liberal
:15:42. > :15:52.Democrats. Not just talking about the polls. You came fourth in the
:15:52. > :16:02.You said you were happy to facial ex-Salmond in a TV debade. Should
:16:02. > :16:14.David Cameron face him? I am happy debate. Should David Cameron face
:16:14. > :16:18.him? No, because that allows Alex Nationalists to portray this as
:16:18. > :16:22.him? No, because that allows Alex sort of contest or choice between a
:16:22. > :16:24.vision of Scottish social democracy and English conservativism, which it
:16:24. > :16:29.is not. This is a debate that has to is not. This is a debate that has to
:16:29. > :16:37.be held in Scotland about the future of Scotland amongst Scots. David
:16:37. > :16:42.Cameron has a very important part in Scotland's public life, but he is
:16:42. > :16:47.not Scottish and I think he will accept Commies edit himself in fact,
:16:47. > :16:56.the person who should be debating Darling. He has got a Scottish name
:16:56. > :17:03.wealthiest of Scotland at some stage in the past. Anyway, you described
:17:03. > :17:09.the campaign to keep the union together as lacking passion, were
:17:10. > :17:16.you referring to the campaign or referring to Alistair Darling. I
:17:16. > :17:23.think what I was saying is that referring to Alistair Darling. I
:17:23. > :17:29.we move into this new stage, and Alistair Darling said it himself, we
:17:29. > :17:35.are now campaigning for people Alistair Darling said it himself, we
:17:35. > :17:41.hearts because if you look at the range of papers the Government has
:17:41. > :17:49.published, it is pretty clear the arguments lie in relation to the
:17:49. > :17:55.head. I am not giving up the battle for the hearts and Scotland because
:17:55. > :17:57.there is a good strong case, as somebody who is proud to be Scottish
:17:57. > :18:02.and to be British, for Scotland somebody who is proud to be Scottish
:18:03. > :18:09.remain part of the UK. You come somebody who is proud to be Scottish
:18:09. > :18:14.distilleries and I understand you celebratory drink for your new post.
:18:14. > :18:21.Not a drop has touched my lips. celebratory drink for your new post.
:18:21. > :18:26.supporting local business! I will be making up for lost time on the
:18:26. > :18:28.supporting local business! I will be of November, I will be doing it
:18:28. > :18:33.supporting local business! I will be aid of Macmillan Cancer care and if
:18:33. > :18:39.website, they can donate. It is worthwhile. I cannot think of a
:18:39. > :18:49.better cause. One Cabinet minister who many thought might get Reef
:18:50. > :18:53.better cause. One Cabinet minister Clarke. Welcome to Sunday Politics.
:18:53. > :19:02.minorities, where did you fit in? I minorities, where did you fit in? I
:19:02. > :19:08.would describe myself as the elder statesman, to be polite, but it
:19:08. > :19:10.would describe myself as the elder difficult to replace them. I enjoy
:19:11. > :19:13.it. It is a great privilege to have a role in Cabinet and I will carry
:19:13. > :19:18.on as long as David wants me to a role in Cabinet and I will carry
:19:18. > :19:24.I have seen many reshuffles, they are dreadful and I seem to have
:19:24. > :19:29.survived them so far. Did David Cameron talk to you before this
:19:29. > :19:37.reshuffle? No, he didn't. I would have had expected a phone call,
:19:37. > :19:47.asking, how do you think about stepping down, but he didn't and my
:19:47. > :19:51.role is one of giving my wit and wisdom to the Cabinet and meetings
:19:51. > :19:56.of the Security Council so he has got to put up with me a bit longer.
:19:56. > :20:02.You said you are going to stand again at the next election, why
:20:02. > :20:05.You said you are going to stand you keep going? What do you hope to
:20:05. > :20:10.achieve in politics? I am mostly a political anorak, I have been since
:20:10. > :20:16.I was very small, by the process of politics but the older I get I get
:20:16. > :20:20.governance of the country and at the moment the combination of problems
:20:20. > :20:25.is quite appalling. The difficulty of tackling the modern world is
:20:25. > :20:28.is quite appalling. The difficulty difficult and I find it fascinating.
:20:28. > :20:29.The old argument that attracts every decent person into politics, you
:20:29. > :20:34.might be able sometimes to make decent person into politics, you
:20:34. > :20:37.bit of difference, and I try to decent person into politics, you
:20:37. > :20:39.that. I try not to hark back on decent person into politics, you
:20:40. > :20:43.experience but we will have a lot of tough problems which I think the
:20:43. > :20:50.Conservative Government will have to tackle. You opposed referenda on
:20:50. > :20:56.Maastricht, the Lisbon Treaty, you were even against one on Britain
:20:56. > :21:03.adopting the euro. It must follow that you are against the referenda
:21:03. > :21:12.on Britain's membership to the EU? I accountable to the long-term and
:21:12. > :21:18.representatives, but this is a minority now and my colleagues have
:21:18. > :21:23.firmly decided a referendum needs to be held to settle the question of
:21:23. > :21:27.Britain's relationship with the European Union which I think is
:21:27. > :21:31.Britain's relationship with the of the most important things in
:21:31. > :21:37.Britain's place in the modern world politicians are able to look after
:21:37. > :21:44.the living standards, the economy, the safety against terrorism. Last
:21:44. > :21:48.the living standards, the economy, summer you said that only extreme
:21:48. > :21:53.nationalists wanted a silly EU referendum. It follows your party
:21:53. > :21:59.must be full of extremely silly nationalists. The people who are
:22:00. > :22:06.desperate to have a referendum are all the people who actually want to
:22:06. > :22:11.referendum will involve the public and people like me have got to get
:22:11. > :22:14.across to the public, don't just feel angry about the last thing
:22:14. > :22:16.across to the public, don't just read in the newspaper about what the
:22:16. > :22:21.commission is or is not doing, do commission is or is not doing, do
:22:21. > :22:28.bear in mind this is our base in the modern world. We happen to be a
:22:28. > :22:35.leading member, almost as valuable and rich as the Americans, from
:22:35. > :22:40.influence in events. That is not just how the politicians get on
:22:40. > :22:47.influence in events. That is not politicians look after us when we
:22:47. > :22:51.spilling over from the Middle East, or we face public services being
:22:51. > :23:00.threatened. You didn't even turn up to vote for the bill which will
:23:00. > :23:03.threatened. You didn't even turn up engagements on the Friday concerned.
:23:03. > :23:06.It seemed to get through without my participation. You didn't want to be
:23:06. > :23:16.seen voting for something your heart Look, many of your colleagues I
:23:16. > :23:23.seen voting for something your heart interviewed say that if the choice
:23:23. > :23:28.was between the state -- the status quo with the European Union and
:23:28. > :23:32.leaving, they would leave. The truth is that you would vote to stay in
:23:32. > :23:40.even on the status quo, wouldn't supporting the EU to leave now if I
:23:40. > :23:45.got chance. I think our economy supporting the EU to leave now if I
:23:45. > :23:54.investment, as in Washington last been if we were outside the EU.
:23:54. > :24:01.investment, as in Washington last week. We are trying to roll forward
:24:01. > :24:04.the prospect of free trade and I have to reassure Americans that
:24:04. > :24:09.the prospect of free trade and I are not likely to leave the EU to
:24:09. > :24:14.That is true but it also needs reform. The cry for reform, which is
:24:14. > :24:22.particularly Germany, is a good reform. The cry for reform, which is
:24:22. > :24:24.Even if David Cameron came back reform. The cry for reform, which is
:24:24. > :24:33.nothing from Brussels, you would still vote to stay in, correct?
:24:33. > :24:39.one which is dwindling in comparison with others, in the modern world it
:24:39. > :24:43.would be dangerous. I also think the dangers of the Middle East and the
:24:43. > :24:53.dangers of some of the countries disengage. I will take that as a
:24:53. > :25:00.strengthen the case, and of some members of the public don't agree
:25:00. > :25:06.persuaded when David delivers his reforms. The latest poll gives
:25:06. > :25:10.Labour a ten point lead over the Tories and the reason why it has a
:25:10. > :25:14.ten point lead is because UKIP are up there with 18% of the vote and
:25:14. > :25:19.ten point lead is because UKIP are the Tory vote has slumped in the
:25:19. > :25:25.Paul to 27%. How would you see off UKIP? By saying you need a strong
:25:25. > :25:30.Paul to 27%. How would you see off and effective Government. We faced
:25:30. > :25:35.terrible problems. Every Government I have been in has been behind in
:25:35. > :25:40.the polls. This Government is not as popular as the previous Government I
:25:40. > :25:42.have served in under the three previous prime ministers. When you
:25:42. > :25:45.get an election, people have to previous prime ministers. When you
:25:45. > :25:52.themselves who do we want to decide the issues of war and peace in this
:25:52. > :25:58.country? Who do we want to get us out of our economic problems. I
:25:58. > :26:03.don't think Ed Miliband is up to it. That generalised stuff will not
:26:03. > :26:07.don't think Ed Miliband is up to it. off UKIP. People will not listen to
:26:07. > :26:11.that. When people answer an opinion poll, they tell you how annoyed
:26:11. > :26:16.that. When people answer an opinion are by something that has recently
:26:16. > :26:20.upset them, but people are more sensible than this. Every Government
:26:20. > :26:27.I have served in has been behind in the polls. At a general election you
:26:27. > :26:36.have to mobilise the public to start thinking, who do we want to govern
:26:36. > :26:44.us? They did take over a calamitous important problems to be decided
:26:44. > :26:48.going forward. UKIP represents anti-immigration, anti-foreigners,
:26:48. > :26:51.anti-Europe, anti-politics but I don't think it will get 18% of the
:26:51. > :27:25.Thank you. Once upon a time, a politician whose career ended in
:27:25. > :27:28.disgrace might choose to lie low for a while, perhaps to spend a bit
:27:28. > :27:30.disgrace might choose to lie low for time tending the tulips and doing
:27:30. > :27:31.the odd bit of charity work. Not Chris Huhne. He walked free from
:27:31. > :27:34.prison only five months ago but Chris Huhne. He walked free from
:27:35. > :27:38.former Energy Secretary is already back in the public eye - a column in
:27:38. > :27:42.the Guardian, a job with a renewable interview. So is he working on a
:27:42. > :27:46.political rehabilitation? Chris Politics. The answer to that is
:27:46. > :27:49.clearly know, and thank you for inviting me back. You have set your
:27:49. > :27:54.career in politics is over so what does the future hold for you? I
:27:54. > :27:57.career in politics is over so what happy doing what I am doing, I am
:27:57. > :28:02.passionate about green energy and climate change, so I am doing things
:28:02. > :28:08.on that front in terms of business non-governmental organisations,
:28:08. > :28:08.on that front in terms of business I am doing a column for the Guardian
:28:08. > :28:13.on Mondays. You obviously get a I am doing a column for the Guardian
:28:13. > :28:20.of material from the Sunday Politics to write about. Have you embarked on
:28:20. > :28:24.political rehabilitation? It was clear from the point of view of
:28:24. > :28:28.political rehabilitation? It was George when I was sentenced, he
:28:28. > :28:32.rehabilitating you, because I had not offended for ten years, it was
:28:32. > :28:38.actually about stopping people like you, Andrew, Ron doing the same
:28:38. > :28:44.thing. It was a deterrent effect for the public. That is I think why
:28:44. > :28:46.thing. It was a deterrent effect for prosecution was brought. I had not
:28:46. > :29:17.offended for ten years on this, rehabilitate yourself in the public?
:29:17. > :29:23.coalition to the bitter end? Or should they re-establish their own
:29:23. > :29:29.Coalition agreement is for the whole Parliament, and the Lib Dems are
:29:29. > :29:32.going to stay, and should stay. What would be a good result for the Lib
:29:33. > :29:40.Dems in 2015? The loss of ten, would be a good result for the Lib
:29:40. > :29:45.interesting election because I think you will have essentially three
:29:45. > :29:54.party leaders, all of whom are negative ratings so it will be a
:29:54. > :30:00.battle between the walking wounded. In those circumstances, in my view,
:30:00. > :30:11.the Lib Dems can come out very well. But you will lose seats, won't
:30:12. > :30:16.the Liberal Democrats do badly in next year's European elections,
:30:16. > :30:16.the Liberal Democrats do badly in could come fourth on fifth behind
:30:16. > :30:24.leadership be in jeopardy? I've could come fourth on fifth behind
:30:24. > :30:30.in countless cycles where we've could come fourth on fifth behind
:30:30. > :30:34.very low poll ratings. The normal pickup to the subsequent general
:30:34. > :30:39.election on average has been 10 percentage points. So he's not in
:30:39. > :30:41.jeopardy? I think Nick will be there at the next general election. I
:30:41. > :30:44.think he'll lead the party into at the next general election. I
:30:44. > :30:47.next general election. I expect we'll do much better than most
:30:47. > :30:52.people think. If we are heading we'll do much better than most
:30:52. > :30:56.another hung Parliament, which is Let's be honest, you'd rather be in
:30:56. > :31:00.coalition with the Labour Party Let's be honest, you'd rather be in
:31:00. > :31:05.have a repeat of the Conservatives? One of the key things I sawed to
:31:05. > :31:09.colleagues, whatever your personal preference, I used to be a Labour
:31:09. > :31:14.Party member, you can derive from that I'm on the left of centre of
:31:14. > :31:20.the party. I always said to my colleagues in the party, it is
:31:20. > :31:23.the we are in politics because we are Liberal Democrats, not because
:31:23. > :31:28.we are either Conservatives or second best Labour. If you don't
:31:28. > :31:33.take that view, you don't have any bargaining position when it comes to
:31:33. > :31:37.coalition. You have to be able, genuinely, to do a coalition with
:31:37. > :31:41.either of the other parties. I understand that, but you'd prefer
:31:41. > :31:45.Labour? Your personal preference really should not come into this. It
:31:45. > :31:52.is about making sure you get the best possible deal for the things
:31:52. > :31:55.you get that with one party rather than another, that's fine. You stand
:31:55. > :31:59.up for Liberal Democrat values, than another, that's fine. You stand
:31:59. > :32:04.for Conservative or Labour second best values. You said you're keeping
:32:04. > :32:10.up your interest in energy matters. Is Ed Miliband right to promise
:32:10. > :32:13.up your interest in energy matters. temporary price freeze? There's
:32:13. > :32:17.up your interest in energy matters. pop ewe louse posturing. It is not a
:32:17. > :32:22.sensible policy. It was tried in California in 2,000 and 2001 which
:32:22. > :32:27.led to blackouts. We had the Prime Minister promising we should sift
:32:27. > :32:34.everybody automatically to the unfortunately we're at the stage in
:32:34. > :32:41.the political cycle where we are getting clap trap. You're against
:32:41. > :32:44.the freeze? It is a bad idea when we are trying to encourage investment.
:32:44. > :32:50.When the market can give us some of the lowest gas and electricity
:32:50. > :32:53.son-in-law of the lowest? Not our base price? The other European Ian
:32:53. > :32:58.prices are only higher because they put a lot more taxes on to it? Our
:32:58. > :33:03.base energy prices are among the highest in Europe? No, if you look
:33:03. > :33:05.at EU comparisons in what goes out to people's households. That's after
:33:05. > :33:10.all the taxes have been put on them? to people's households. That's after
:33:10. > :33:50.green taxes is George Osborne with should no better. One the-hip ok
:33:50. > :34:00.not want it. We do not need it to agreement because the Conservatives
:34:00. > :34:02.not want it. We do not need it to electricity system. It was a revenue
:34:02. > :34:06.raising measure by the Tories. It set off a whole load of hairs about
:34:06. > :34:12.green taxes which are now coming home to roost. Final point to you,
:34:12. > :34:17.wish we'd more time to talk, you're a big supporter of Leveson-style
:34:17. > :34:21.press regulation. Will you stop writing for The Guardian if it
:34:21. > :34:27.refuses to sign up to the Leveson charter? I think that's neither
:34:27. > :34:30.refuses to sign up to the Leveson nor there. The Guardian gives me a
:34:30. > :34:35.up to what you believe in will you up to what you believe in will you
:34:35. > :34:41.support it? No because I'm sure they'll allow me to make that that
:34:41. > :34:45.point. I think newspapers will sign up for it. They've had a collapse in
:34:45. > :34:49.public trust and confidence in recent years. Unparalleled. They
:34:49. > :34:53.need a third party endorsement to say these guys have cleaned up their
:34:53. > :34:59.act. If they are going to get trust haven't signed up, which they won't,
:34:59. > :35:06.you can come back and we'll talk You're watching the Sunday politics.
:35:06. > :35:29.is fit for office in the speaker's chair.
:35:29. > :35:36.So many of our MPs entering the race to sit in the Speaker 's chair?
:35:36. > :35:39.And as more and more of our schools become sponsored academies, are they
:35:39. > :35:45.providing the answer to ball performance or not?
:35:45. > :35:48.I started my own website regarding these problems. It has been one
:35:48. > :35:52.fiasco after the other. Plus some of the faces rising
:35:52. > :35:56.through the party ranks. But first, let's meet our guests
:35:57. > :36:02.this week. We have the Lib Dem MP Simon Wright for Norwich South, and
:36:02. > :36:07.the Labour MP for Luton cell. Gavin, it is your hometown I would like to
:36:07. > :36:12.start with. In March, in 2009, the homecoming parade of the Royal
:36:12. > :36:14.Anglian is, there was a protest by a handful of Islamic extremists.
:36:15. > :36:19.Following that, the English Defence League was formed, headed up by
:36:19. > :36:25.Tommy Robinson, who this week explained why he was leaving the far
:36:25. > :36:30.right organisation. What I want to do now is be in control of myself. I
:36:30. > :36:33.would do would have been shouted down for four and a half years as a
:36:33. > :36:38.racist and extremist, usually to do with what other people have been
:36:38. > :36:41.doing. I want to be in control of myself. When I seasoned bean, it is
:36:41. > :36:46.me. What will it mean to the people of
:36:46. > :36:49.Luton that Tommy Robinson and Kevin Carroll are now leaving? I think it
:36:50. > :36:54.is in their word extremely positive that they have chosen to acknowledge
:36:54. > :36:58.the pain they have cause to my hometown. We have faced an enormous
:36:58. > :37:04.amount of negative publicity because of what they have done. Financially,
:37:05. > :37:08.the implications have been massive, policing costs in the millions
:37:08. > :37:11.because of their violent street protests. I hope this is a step in
:37:11. > :37:16.the right direction, and also that they can find a route through
:37:16. > :37:20.whereby they can denounce the extremism of their organisation.
:37:20. > :37:23.Simon Wright, there have been UDR marches in Norwich two. Are you
:37:23. > :37:30.concerned about where that far right element will go now? Yes, they did
:37:30. > :37:33.visit Norwich. They were outnumbered ten to one by counter protest is.
:37:33. > :37:38.Gavin is right, this comes at enormous cost whenever they have a
:37:38. > :37:42.protest. I think Tommy Robinson has admitted that those protests had
:37:42. > :37:47.very little effect anyway. What happens now is a matter of great
:37:47. > :37:51.concern. If what happens is a national organisation splinters into
:37:52. > :37:59.a number of regionals acts that make go below the line, off the radar,
:37:59. > :38:02.that will be difficult to police. We have seen the English Defence League
:38:02. > :38:07.fragment recently anyway, becoming harder to manage, and I suspect some
:38:07. > :38:12.of the leaders' decisions to get out at this stage is related to that.
:38:12. > :38:16.Let's move on to the changing face of our schools. The flagship Tory
:38:16. > :38:20.policy in education has been establishing thousands of
:38:20. > :38:22.academies, schools that are free from local authority control and
:38:22. > :38:27.funded directly from central government. Here in the east, about
:38:27. > :38:32.one in every six of our schools is an academy, giving us around 575,
:38:32. > :38:38.but it is a number that is going up all the time. Many of the newest
:38:38. > :38:41.academies have sponsors. They are supposed to drive up standards, but
:38:41. > :38:44.the academic performance of these schools is lower than average, and
:38:44. > :38:50.there are now calls for the government to decent thing about it.
:38:50. > :38:56.Arriving at the Basildon Lower Academy, parents attending its
:38:56. > :39:01.opening evening. The Basildon academies were formed in 2009
:39:01. > :39:05.following the merger of two secondary schools. Under Labour's
:39:05. > :39:08.Academy programme, it was designed to turn failing schools around. I've
:39:09. > :39:12.not had any problems with the school. I know plenty of parents who
:39:12. > :39:16.have, but I am under the impression that if a child wants to learn, they
:39:16. > :39:19.will learn, so I will give the school the benefit of the doubt. It
:39:19. > :39:27.hasn't had very good press, but my daughter has come through, so swings
:39:27. > :39:31.and roundabouts. For me, it is about what they have got to offer, and if
:39:31. > :39:35.they have ironed out the previous problems. We will go from there. But
:39:35. > :39:38.academies have had more than their fair share of problems. There have
:39:38. > :39:44.been several heads in four short years, and the last one, who was
:39:44. > :39:47.praised by inspectors, resigned in a dispute with the sponsor and
:39:47. > :39:50.governors over how to run the school. The academies have been in
:39:50. > :39:56.special measures since March 2012 will stop. A former teacher who
:39:56. > :40:02.doesn't want to be identified believe children are being let down.
:40:02. > :40:06.Where do you go if you know your leadership is inadequate? Where can
:40:06. > :40:11.you go in an Academy system? Who can you speak to? The chair of governors
:40:11. > :40:15.is employed by the sponsor. We have a very unusual situation at the
:40:15. > :40:19.Basildon academies, where the chairman of governors is a paid
:40:19. > :40:21.employee. No one from the Academy good comment, but a statement from
:40:21. > :40:40.the chair of governors said: Basildon's problems are mirrored in
:40:40. > :40:43.Thetford, where the Academy replaced to schools rated as good or
:40:43. > :40:49.satisfactory in every department. Since it was set up in 2010, there
:40:50. > :40:54.has been a succession of principles. It has caused a lot of problems with
:40:54. > :40:58.people not knowing who is in control. There have been a lot of
:40:58. > :41:02.teachers leaving. Just last year, my youngest daughter had three
:41:02. > :41:06.different maths teachers in the space of a year. Last year, there
:41:06. > :41:12.were also three different heads of six form. And the school is in
:41:12. > :41:16.special measures. Yes, without even mentioning special measures. First
:41:16. > :41:21.of all, failing its Ofsted report, and then getting a damning HMI
:41:21. > :41:28.report, saying its recovery plan was inadequate, and it needs to step up
:41:28. > :41:34.a gear. Now, the new trust that has taken over here intends to change
:41:34. > :41:41.all that. You got me as the principal, and I believe I've got
:41:41. > :41:47.the necessary skills and drive to get the parents, staff, students
:41:47. > :41:52.behind the Academy. Pupils have started classes in the new £19
:41:52. > :41:56.million building in the last few weeks. Ofsted, who criticised the
:41:56. > :42:00.sponsors of this Academy, its leadership and its teaching, are
:42:00. > :42:04.expected back at any moment. It is going to take is at least a year to
:42:04. > :42:07.get out of special measures here. The results this summer were so
:42:07. > :42:12.poor, we have such a lot of work to do. It is not easy, and it is not
:42:12. > :42:16.overnight. However, we should see a good difference in a year, and in
:42:16. > :42:25.three years, I am hoping to be outstanding, and for Ofsted to
:42:25. > :42:28.tellers that. And ambition reflecting the first set of sponsors
:42:28. > :42:32.here, who have now gone. The same cannot be said for Basildon. I feel
:42:32. > :42:38.completely let down by everyone who said they recognise there is a
:42:38. > :42:41.problem at Basildon, from Ofsted to Michael Gove. Everyone has said
:42:41. > :42:46.there is a problem, no one has said they are coming to help.
:42:46. > :42:50.We will keep an eye on the results of that Ofsted inspection at
:42:50. > :42:54.Basildon Lower Academy. Earlier this week, I spoke to education Minister
:42:54. > :43:01.and Norbert Empey Elizabeth Truss, whose constituency includes Thetford
:43:01. > :43:06.and its Academy. How can governors be independent, I asked, if the
:43:07. > :43:09.chair is implied by the sponsor? The governors are independent, and if
:43:09. > :43:12.they are not doing a good job, if the sponsor is not doing a good job
:43:12. > :43:16.on the school is not improving fast enough, the Secretary of State, the
:43:16. > :43:21.Department for Education, takes action. In my constituency, the
:43:21. > :43:25.Thetford Academy, the results had improved, but Ofsted found that the
:43:25. > :43:31.school had not improved enough. A new sponsor was put in, the
:43:31. > :43:35.Inspiration Trust. They are now doing a fantastic job in a great new
:43:35. > :43:40.building, and delivering the education for students in Thetford.
:43:40. > :43:44.If the situation is not good enough, the government will
:43:44. > :43:48.intervene, but in general, we are finding that academies do perform
:43:48. > :43:53.better than their equivalents in the maintained sector. You mentioned the
:43:53. > :44:02.excellent leadership, and that is the point, isn't it? The school
:44:02. > :44:07.itself in Thetford fail. It did not turn the Academy around. Isn't it
:44:07. > :44:12.down to the success and quality of the headteacher? Well, of course the
:44:12. > :44:16.headteacher is very important. The quality of teaching is the most
:44:16. > :44:21.important factor in whether or not a schoolboy forms for its students.
:44:21. > :44:24.What happened in Thetford is, results did improve from its
:44:24. > :44:27.predecessors, but they did not improve enough, and Ofsted found
:44:27. > :44:32.that the education still was not good enough, which is why the
:44:32. > :44:39.sponsor was replaced with a new sponsor, the Inspiration Trust. That
:44:39. > :44:42.shows the system is working and the sponsored academies improve
:44:42. > :44:48.results. They were not improved enough, so a new sponsor was found,
:44:48. > :44:52.a new principle put in place. For years and years, the town of Bedford
:44:52. > :45:00.had been underserved by its high schools, that were not delivering
:45:00. > :45:03.results. —— Thetford. You say you are seeing a turnaround, but let's
:45:03. > :45:08.take Basildon. They have been in special measures for 19 months. We
:45:08. > :45:12.have evidence that on the whole, on average, sponsored academies perform
:45:12. > :45:18.better than their predecessors school 's, and than maintained
:45:18. > :45:20.schools in a similar position. We are dealing with difficult
:45:20. > :45:25.circumstances in many of these cases, where there had been years of
:45:25. > :45:30.underperformance, but sponsored academies like Thetford, like the
:45:30. > :45:35.Nicholas Hammond Academy in Swaffham are the best way of getting out of
:45:35. > :45:38.those circumstances. Now, there are cases where perhaps things do not
:45:38. > :45:42.work out, where there may be a problem, in which case, the
:45:42. > :45:45.Department for Education looks at that very seriously and intervenes,
:45:45. > :45:49.but we are following up a situation where some schools have been allowed
:45:49. > :45:54.to languish for 20 or 30 years or more, and that is a difficult
:45:54. > :45:59.situation to turn around. What we know is, sponsored academy status is
:45:59. > :46:05.helping those schools get out of that situation. 19 months in special
:46:05. > :46:11.measures for Basildon. Various supposed to be a cut after two
:46:11. > :46:14.years. What happens then? The Department for Education looks at
:46:14. > :46:18.the situation in the sponsored academy and can intervene, so I have
:46:18. > :46:23.given you the example of Thetford, a case in my constituency, and I know
:46:24. > :46:27.about, where there was specific intervention by the relevant
:46:27. > :46:31.minister to put in place a new sponsor. What we know is, good
:46:31. > :46:36.schools are where there are good teachers, good teachers need good
:46:36. > :46:40.leadership, and a good sponsor to support the headteacher to get the
:46:40. > :46:44.best out of students in that school. Last year, there was a £1 billion
:46:44. > :46:49.overspend on the academies programme. Some might say this is a
:46:50. > :46:54.rather expensive mistake. It is not an expensive mistake. It is all
:46:54. > :46:57.about money following the child, making sure that parents and
:46:57. > :47:04.children have a choice of good schools. We have introduced over
:47:04. > :47:10.3000 academies, free schools, studio schools, UTCs, which are vastly
:47:10. > :47:14.changing the education landscape. Parents are delighted by the level
:47:14. > :47:19.of choice they have. Thank you very much.
:47:19. > :47:23.Simon, UR a former maths teacher. Isn't the success of a school down
:47:23. > :47:26.to the teachers, and ultimately be had? I think the most effective
:47:27. > :47:31.difference that can be made into classrooms is having the best
:47:31. > :47:33.teachers there, and we know we have the best generation of teachers
:47:33. > :47:38.there has ever been. We need strongly the ship in schools, and
:47:38. > :47:41.that is for the head and the governing body to make sure that an
:47:41. > :47:45.ethos of learning is developed and fostered within the school, and the
:47:45. > :47:49.best teachers are attracted. Sponsored academies can have an
:47:49. > :47:53.important role to play. If a school wants to go down the Academy route
:47:53. > :47:56.and a strong sponsor comes in which can provide a lot of external
:47:56. > :48:00.scrutiny and support, they can bring a lot to the school, and while it is
:48:00. > :48:05.true that many schools that have become sponsored academies have
:48:05. > :48:09.underperformed to start with and found it difficult to become great
:48:09. > :48:11.schools, nonetheless, the trend of improvement is positive, and
:48:12. > :48:19.sponsored academies are outperforming the rest of the
:48:19. > :48:23.sector. Gavin, would let Labour 's return go's Academy to local
:48:23. > :48:26.authority control? Where schools are succeeding, we don't think they will
:48:26. > :48:30.change the structure, but we won't extend the programme. We think that
:48:31. > :48:33.is the right place to be. The last Labour Academy programme to failing
:48:34. > :48:37.schools, those that were underperforming, and put in place
:48:37. > :48:41.decent leadership. There are a couple in my constituency. What has
:48:42. > :48:45.happened since this government has come to power...
:48:45. > :48:50.Basildon was one of those, wasn't it?
:48:50. > :48:55.Exactly my point. Since the coalition has come to power, all the
:48:55. > :48:59.work has gone into ideology, saying everything must be an academy. Eyes
:48:59. > :49:03.are taken up the underperforming schools, and we now have to go in
:49:03. > :49:09.and put in mitigating measures. What would Labour do? Let's be clear.
:49:09. > :49:12.Where schools are succeeding, we don't care about structure, but we
:49:12. > :49:17.don't believe that's re—schools, where you are bringing in an
:49:18. > :49:22.oversupply of capacity such as in Luton, is the right way to go.
:49:22. > :49:25.Simon, you were saying that they could sponsor and good leadership
:49:25. > :49:33.can really do wonders for his school. What about a bad sponsor? It
:49:33. > :49:43.doesn't work then. Academies are accountable just as all schools are,
:49:43. > :49:46.both to Ofsted, and... But we heard that teachers say,
:49:46. > :49:51.where do you go when something goes wrong? True, which is why free
:49:51. > :49:54.schools are also accountable to the Department for Education. There is a
:49:54. > :49:57.reciprocal funding agreement, and Michael Gove can act as Secretary of
:49:57. > :50:01.State when a school is underperforming. Isn't the point
:50:01. > :50:04.that Michael Gove does not want to act in those places? He has decided
:50:04. > :50:08.the policy, and he has decided the only route is free schools and
:50:08. > :50:15.academies. He wants every school to be like that, and you see shocking
:50:15. > :50:19.complacency such as with Liz truss. Clearly there is an issue, and the
:50:19. > :50:23.Department is not responding to it because of their ideology. Liz truss
:50:23. > :50:30.was telling me that she brings the model of sponsors paying the chair
:50:30. > :50:36.of governors is absolutely fine. Do you agree, Simon? It is a slightly
:50:36. > :50:40.unusual setup. I would say many schools have problems in attracting
:50:40. > :50:46.the very best governors. Ultimately, it should be down to schools. They
:50:46. > :50:48.have to be independent, surely? Given the independence of strong
:50:49. > :50:51.leadership to the governors, it should be down to schools to make
:50:51. > :50:55.their own decisions about how to get the best people providing the
:50:55. > :50:59.governors, and Ofsted also recognise the importance of school governance,
:50:59. > :51:03.which is why under their revised inspection framework, they take the
:51:03. > :51:07.governance very seriously. Gavin, here is a quote. "Today, hardly
:51:07. > :51:19.anyone thinks local authorities should directly run schools." Whose
:51:19. > :51:24.works? You tell me. Stephen Twigg. What role does local authority have
:51:24. > :51:28.in schools? I personally think every school should be a great school, and
:51:28. > :51:31.I also think the country head of system that produced me and many
:51:31. > :51:41.others is a real good system to be at. # comprehensive. In Luton, the
:51:41. > :51:44.only way to get capacity was to get a free school. We had to create an
:51:44. > :51:49.arm's—length body to get funding. That cannot be right. We have to
:51:49. > :51:52.leave it there. Westminster has been gripped by
:51:52. > :52:01.election fever all week. There has been lots of preening, mass urging
:52:01. > :52:04.of egos, and of course, I am talking about the Westminster dog of the
:52:04. > :52:10.year awards. Several of our MPs entered their dogs for the title.
:52:10. > :52:14.The winner was Noodle. He is owned by Alan Duncan. It was a brief
:52:14. > :52:20.distraction from the other big election next week, choosing a new
:52:20. > :52:23.deputy speaker to replace Nigel Evans. There are seven candidates,
:52:23. > :52:28.five from this region. Let's hear from them.
:52:28. > :52:31.I believe in the sovereignty of Parliament. I think politicians are
:52:31. > :52:39.a much maligned class, and I want to be part of the journey as we restore
:52:39. > :52:44.the prestige of Parliament as it was when I entered the place in 1993.
:52:44. > :52:47.Have you ever been in the boardroom where there is major disagreement?
:52:48. > :52:51.I'd chair a board. I understand that. Have you ever been in a
:52:52. > :52:55.council meeting where there is major disagreement? I have chaired those
:52:55. > :53:01.too. I think my personality is strong enough to stop you either go
:53:01. > :53:04.into Parliament to get a ministerial career or to go down this avenue. I
:53:05. > :53:07.am fascinated by the traditions and processes of Parliament, and it is
:53:07. > :53:10.something I have always had my eye on.
:53:11. > :53:14.This job is at the heart of the management of Parliament. Whoever
:53:14. > :53:17.gets it will work alongside the speaker to run Parliament. It is one
:53:17. > :53:23.of the oldest offices, and I believe it requires someone with the right
:53:23. > :53:27.skill set, someone who is competent and then get on with colleagues.
:53:27. > :53:31.This is not an election about personality. It is an election for
:53:31. > :53:35.who is in the best position to do the job, the best job for the smooth
:53:36. > :53:42.running of the House of Commons. But it helps if you get on. It does and
:53:42. > :53:44.it doesn't. The history of politics is littered with people who have
:53:44. > :53:50.done a great job working together even though they don't get on.
:53:50. > :53:52.Simon Burns famously made that disparaging comments about speaker
:53:52. > :53:57.John Bercow, which included the words sanctimonious and dwarf will
:53:57. > :54:00.stop if you become deputy speaker, you are no longer allowed to take
:54:01. > :54:04.part in Commons debate, unless you are chairing them, or question
:54:04. > :54:09.ministers in public. We now come to a debate on fishing
:54:09. > :54:13.policy. One person you should know all about the job is the MP for
:54:13. > :54:17.saffron Walden, Sir Alan Hazlehurst, who was deputy speaker
:54:17. > :54:22.for 13 years before standing down in 2010. It is a Christie just job, and
:54:23. > :54:29.a mark of confidence if you are the one who is chosen. —— prestigious.
:54:29. > :54:31.People on all sides of the house believing your integrity,
:54:31. > :54:37.impartiality, and basically they like you. Why do you think there are
:54:37. > :54:42.so many candidates from the East? I don't know. It doesn't personally
:54:42. > :54:46.appealed to me. I like going into Parliament and standing up and
:54:46. > :54:49.making points on behalf of my constituents. You can't do that in
:54:49. > :54:54.that role. We need a referee, but I would rather be on the pitch
:54:54. > :54:58.playing. It is an important role, isn't it, Simon? They're actually
:54:58. > :55:04.hasn't been a Lib Dem speaker since 1920. No, that is right. It is a
:55:04. > :55:08.shame there is no candidate this time, but it means I have the
:55:08. > :55:12.freedom of being a floating voter in this. I haven't quite decided who I
:55:12. > :55:17.will vote for, but it won't been a teen diaries, I have to say, on the
:55:17. > :55:25.basis that I am happy with their on the backbenches. —— Mick Deane
:55:25. > :55:30.lorries. When she makes a speech is about how will it be a we will see
:55:30. > :55:34.get the job on Wednesday. There have been a number of winners
:55:34. > :55:44.and losers in the reshuffle. Who is in, who is out? Here it comes.
:55:44. > :55:51.It started with Simon Burns and Chloe Smith, stepping down ahead of
:55:51. > :55:54.the B shovel. I want to do more work with my constituents, because that
:55:54. > :55:59.is what I am most passionate about, and I think it is rather important
:55:59. > :56:02.to remember who put you in a job. Attempting to look casual, George
:56:02. > :56:07.Osborne's former chief of staff Matt Rand cock left Downing Street with a
:56:07. > :56:11.promotion to Minister of State for skilled and enterprise, and a
:56:11. > :56:16.delighted shade —ish Bara returns the government that the justice
:56:16. > :56:21.minister. I am delighted. Clearly it is a surprise, but I am very much
:56:21. > :56:26.looking forward to my new role. Good news to four Patrick O'Flynn, who
:56:26. > :56:28.will lead you get's candidates in the East for the forthcoming
:56:29. > :56:33.European elections. And a tribute to the former foreign affairs Minister
:56:33. > :56:37.Alistair Burt, who lost his job this week. He is a very significant loss
:56:37. > :56:40.to the government, and in all my dealings with them on the Middle
:56:40. > :56:42.East, I admire both his skill, intellect, courtesy and his
:56:42. > :56:52.consistently courteous approach. Kind words therefore Alistair Burt.
:56:52. > :56:59.We have saved the best to last. In Labour's reshuffle, , you have moved
:56:59. > :57:01.from DEFRA to Shadow Minister International development. Why you
:57:01. > :57:06.looking forward to it? Yes, delighted, and when you get the
:57:06. > :57:12.phone call — except when it cuts out! —, it is a fantastic moment.
:57:13. > :57:15.One of the reasons there has been so much conservative blood on the
:57:15. > :57:20.carpet is because you Lib Dems are taking all the ministerial roles,
:57:20. > :57:24.that is what the Tories say. Brilliance. Great for us. We're
:57:24. > :57:29.trying to build a stronger economy, a fairer society. The more of us,
:57:29. > :57:35.the better. Your dream job in Parliament, gentlemen. What would it
:57:35. > :57:42.be? I must say Shadow Minister International development ! MP for
:57:42. > :57:46.Norwich South ! Oh, come on ! You can throw caution to the wind. I am
:57:46. > :57:55.just getting enjoying getting stuck in on in by Roman 's, jobs, and I am
:57:55. > :57:58.very happy with what I'm doing. Thank you both very much indeed for
:57:58. > :58:03.joining us. That is all for now. Next week, we will look at the
:58:03. > :58:05.future of our biofuel industry in the light of new moves in Europe to
:58:05. > :58:09.limit food grown for fuel. Join us the light of new moves in Europe to
:58:09. > :58:12.and these tactics were plain wrong. That is all we have time for. Back
:58:12. > :58:26.ministerial team this week with That is all we have time for. Back
:58:26. > :58:31.commentators calling it the purge of the Blairites, but one poor lamb who
:58:31. > :58:36.fell victim to this perch was Diane Abbott, not somebody who worshipped
:58:36. > :58:40.at the altar of Tony Blair. Life on the backbenches means she can pursue
:58:40. > :58:47.other interests such as attending the Cheltenham literary Festival,
:58:47. > :58:51.and where she joins us now. Welcome. Why did Ed Miliband fire you? He
:58:51. > :58:58.think the thing that did it for Why did Ed Miliband fire you? He
:58:58. > :59:04.was me coming out on Syria. This was Why did Ed Miliband fire you? He
:59:05. > :59:09.a purge of the Blairites, how did you become collateral damage? I
:59:09. > :59:11.a purge of the Blairites, how did no idea but the fact that I was
:59:11. > :59:14.a purge of the Blairites, how did one member of the front bench to go
:59:14. > :59:21.public about my concerns on Syria probably tipped my enemies in the
:59:21. > :59:25.party machinery over the edge. But he went your way on Syria, in the
:59:25. > :59:32.end he agreed with your line on Syria so why would that be for
:59:33. > :59:36.dismissal? I agree with you - you're fired. Because I actually spoke
:59:36. > :59:39.dismissal? I agree with you - you're and it was the fact that I spoke up,
:59:39. > :59:48.which was like a pebble falling and it was the fact that I spoke up,
:59:48. > :59:55.forest or something. I am glad I spoke up on Syria. He doesn't like
:59:55. > :00:11.people around them than who are outspoken, who speak their minds? I
:00:11. > :00:14.think he's convinced he needs people who read from the scripts. People
:00:14. > :00:20.increasingly upset that even though who read from the scripts. People
:00:21. > :00:27.I was speaking party policy, I was reading from the script. Since Mr
:00:27. > :00:33.Miliband bid you farewell, you've said he's doing his best. Is his
:00:33. > :00:38.best good enough? I am sure it will be. I've always said the Labour
:00:38. > :00:43.Party chose the right Miliband. be. I've always said the Labour
:00:43. > :00:49.will remain loyal to him on the backbenches. You're going to be
:00:49. > :00:54.loyal? However, I want to join in the debate. You're going to be
:00:54. > :00:58.loyal? Absolutely. I was loyal both in public and private when others
:00:58. > :01:04.were bitching about him behind the from the backbenches, I hope to
:01:05. > :01:07.were bitching about him behind the involved in the debate particularly
:01:07. > :01:11.around nick policy. Et's see how loyal you are. You must be happy
:01:11. > :01:19.with all this new tough talk on welfare and free schools? Well,
:01:20. > :01:23.with all this new tough talk on think both Rachel and Tristram are
:01:23. > :01:28.very talented. We're going to have to see how this all plays out. The
:01:28. > :01:32.issue of free schools, they are to see how this all plays out. The
:01:32. > :01:34.thing. But diminishing the role to see how this all plays out. The
:01:34. > :01:42.local authorities is another. There need strong local authorities. I'm
:01:42. > :01:44.local authorities is another. There sure Tristram will be aware of that.
:01:44. > :01:50.As for welfare, I'm sure Rachel knows some of the cuts the Tories
:01:50. > :01:55.have made have been counter prod ublingtive in -- productive in terms
:01:55. > :01:57.of spending. You wouldn't call that your full-hearted endorsement, would
:01:57. > :02:05.you? What are you on, and lieu? your full-hearted endorsement, would
:02:05. > :02:10.haven't seen the detail of Rachel's new position. You have to wait and
:02:10. > :02:14.see the detail. It is in the papers. You haven't stopped reading the
:02:15. > :02:20.papers. It was the Observer. When will you announce you're running for
:02:20. > :02:25.Mayor of London? I have no plans to announce that I'm running for Mayor
:02:25. > :02:25.Mayor of London? I have no plans to of London. No plans. That's what
:02:25. > :02:29.Michael his I will Tyne used to of London. No plans. That's what
:02:29. > :02:34.me. He had no plans to run against Margaret Thatcher. Are these the
:02:34. > :02:41.same kind of plans you have? I know. No, no. I have no plans. You know
:02:41. > :02:51.going for it. Everybody knows you're going for it. Just fess up to your
:02:51. > :02:57.old mate! ! I have no plans to run. If you did run, who would be, what
:02:57. > :03:06.would be your biggest threat other than yourself? I think there's a lot
:03:07. > :03:15.of very talented candidates, David They are all talented. I would have
:03:15. > :03:20.to weigh up the field. What do you think your chances would be of
:03:20. > :03:27.getting the taxi drivers' vote? Well, you know, Andrew, some of
:03:27. > :03:31.getting the taxi drivers' vote? most loyal viewers of This Week
:03:31. > :03:34.getting the taxi drivers' vote? were taxi drivers and their wives.
:03:34. > :03:38.I'm not frightened of reaching out to middle England. You will find if
:03:38. > :03:45.you walk around London sub usual ya, they all know me and they all love
:03:45. > :03:49.This Week. Love This Week. I thought you were going to say they all love
:03:49. > :03:54.you. One person who loves you, is Michael Portillo. He wasn't a happy
:03:54. > :04:00.chappie on Thursday night. You can't see it but you can hear. This is
:04:00. > :04:06.what he said. I was disappointed for her. She had decided to leave this
:04:06. > :04:11.something else in politics. She wanted to do something serious.
:04:11. > :04:13.something else in politics. She had taken what appeared to be a
:04:13. > :04:15.something else in politics. She position but taken it extremely
:04:15. > :04:22.serious and was committed to the issues. I'm quite disappointed for
:04:22. > :04:28.her. Why would Ed Miliband do such a thing. You just mentioned about
:04:28. > :04:37.London mayor, did Diane not ask thing. You just mentioned about
:04:37. > :04:39.Someone who's an eminent person thing. You just mentioned about
:04:39. > :04:43.this programme, I don't know how he could do that. I think Michael's
:04:43. > :04:50.missing you. Are you free this Thursday night? Make him a happy
:04:50. > :04:54.man, come back to the fold. I think I may be free this Thursday night.
:04:54. > :04:59.So, if he'll have me, I'll be there. My people will speak to your people.
:04:59. > :05:03.We'll get it sorted out. Diane, watch that big vase behind you,
:05:04. > :05:10.you're not insured for. That thanks Does she have a chance of being
:05:10. > :05:12.Mayor of London? She's very well known as Michael pointed out. That
:05:12. > :05:19.is important. People who are outside known as Michael pointed out. That
:05:19. > :05:20.the party fold have traditionally done well in the mayoral election.
:05:21. > :05:26.The job of being a London mayor done well in the mayoral election.
:05:26. > :05:30.running an economy the size of a nation. It is a very serious job.
:05:30. > :05:38.There may be problems with her running? That was a transparent
:05:38. > :05:42.There may be problems with her for it. She's potentially a very
:05:42. > :05:51.compelling Coll ticks. People have left-winger but she's quite tough
:05:52. > :05:59.and conservative. Michael Gove said he had fallen in love with Diane
:05:59. > :06:06.which That's one vote he has. What do you think? I thing about Diane
:06:06. > :06:10.Abbott is she has a fantastic way of connecting. She has a really good
:06:10. > :06:16.way of connecting wi people. She would be a very strong candidate in
:06:16. > :06:22.candidate. It will probably be a Labour win next time. Depends, if
:06:22. > :06:28.Labour wins the 2015 election it may be more difficult. There's a danger
:06:28. > :06:30.for Labour that Diane is the big personality liked by the party
:06:30. > :06:37.primary but isn't necessarily a personality liked by the party
:06:37. > :06:42.in come the London general election? That's true. London is traditionally
:06:42. > :06:48.a Labour city. But Boris managed to win as an outsider. There are big
:06:48. > :06:52.dangers for Labour with that. I think, as I said before, somebody
:06:52. > :06:59.who seems a bit independent from their own party machinery tend to do
:06:59. > :07:05.We've only had mayors so far that were independent? Indeed. And how
:07:05. > :07:09.Not that far behind bar Is Johnson. well Ken Livingstone did last time.
:07:09. > :07:11.Not that far behind bar Is Johnson. He was and is much more left-wing
:07:11. > :07:20.than Diane Abbott. Diane didn't He was and is much more left-wing
:07:20. > :07:28.stray on Syria, it was immigration. Why was Jeremy brown replaced by
:07:28. > :07:33.This is very much to do with Clegg deciding he has to go back to those
:07:33. > :07:37.people who abandoned the Liberal Democrats the day they went into
:07:37. > :07:42.coalition with the Conservatives really, and convince them there
:07:42. > :07:46.coalition with the Conservatives some holy areas of policy, sacred
:07:46. > :07:48.areas which they will defend. That includes civil liberties. In the
:07:48. > :07:51.Home Office, that incident with includes civil liberties. In the
:07:51. > :07:57.immigration vans went down very badly across the whole nation. Went
:07:57. > :08:02.down particularly badly with Liberal Democrats and voters. In the Home
:08:02. > :08:12.somebody there to put a shield on purpose behind it. And Nick Clegg
:08:12. > :08:17.has won the argument against the left, Vince Cable on the economy,
:08:17. > :08:21.away day in July, briefings say DrCable's been put in his box. He's
:08:21. > :08:26.won the argument on economic policy against the left. When it comes
:08:26. > :08:28.won the argument on economic policy the touchstone issue in the Home
:08:28. > :08:32.Office, he wants to shore up that vote on the left. And please The
:08:32. > :08:38.Guardian. This is important for something else going on which is
:08:38. > :08:43.that Nick Clegg has to keep his parliamentary party happy. That
:08:43. > :08:47.involves giving them ministerial jobs. A lot of Liberal Democrats
:08:47. > :08:58.losing their jobs, Michael Moore, because vacancies have to be created
:08:58. > :09:06.for number people to come in. By Liberal Democrat MPs will have been
:09:06. > :09:12.on the payroll. It is effective party management. I want to move on
:09:12. > :09:14.to press regulation. Brian Leveson's famous report, appeared before the
:09:14. > :09:19.parliamentary select committee. famous report, appeared before the
:09:19. > :09:30.will run you a clip from Connor politicians got involved in this. We
:09:31. > :09:36.moved away from the press 300 years ago. The centr commitment is Lord
:09:36. > :09:44.Leveson wanted a system the press self-regulation. This is state
:09:44. > :09:50.involvement which I worry about profoundly. He sits on the media
:09:50. > :09:55.interviews and investigations into the media. Chris Huhne said earlier
:09:55. > :10:00.he thought all the newspapers would sign up to the Government-backed
:10:00. > :10:06.Royal Charter. I think he's totally should. But he did say they would. I
:10:07. > :10:11.think he's wrong. They won't sign up. All the mood music when that
:10:12. > :10:18.Royal Charter was agreed on Friday was they would not sign up. It is
:10:19. > :10:20.Maria Miller, is essentially saying to the press industry, if you don't
:10:21. > :10:24.sign up, the Royal charter will to the press industry, if you don't
:10:24. > :10:30.ahead. I cannot control the Labour to the press industry, if you don't
:10:30. > :10:32.industry is wind the clock back to the press industry, if you don't
:10:32. > :10:40.what they are calling the Puttnam stage. That was earlier this year,
:10:40. > :10:44.Lord Puttnam was tack amendments which would introduce statutory
:10:44. > :10:54.regulation. Maria Miller says you statutory legislation but if you
:10:54. > :11:01.don't sign up to this, it will be a lot worse. Will that work? Playing
:11:01. > :11:05.the good cop, bad cop routine? Will that pressurise everyone to sign up.
:11:05. > :11:10.Lots of people are saying this will be a club with no members. It won't
:11:10. > :11:16.work. As Nick and I broke the story last week that the Government was
:11:16. > :11:20.going to reject the newspaper-backed one, I'm certain that the newspapers
:11:20. > :11:27.now, most of them maybe, not all, but most, will go the legal route
:11:27. > :11:32.and to judicial review on what the Government's proposing and will
:11:32. > :11:32.and to judicial review on what the it to strains Bowring where freedom
:11:33. > :11:41.of the press is enshrined. They it to strains Bowring where freedom
:11:41. > :11:44.fight this? There is enough fury amongst Fleet Street to result in
:11:44. > :11:48.that. The big political question going forward is which of the party
:11:49. > :11:52.leaders does the press blame the most for the emergence of press
:11:52. > :11:58.regulation? The Tories are very confident they'll blame Ed Miliband
:11:58. > :12:03.the most. They'll target him before 2015. David Cameron gave us Brian
:12:03. > :12:11.Leveson. You appoint a judge who shouldn't be surprised with what you
:12:11. > :12:15.got in the Leveson report? I big chunk of press will look at David
:12:15. > :12:29.Cameron saying, you were the guy who intended what will happen. If he had
:12:29. > :12:32.have appointed Brian Leveson. If they face more punitive fines over
:12:32. > :12:37.Labour ale cases they take that they face more punitive fines over
:12:37. > :12:44.Europe. The Daily Mail and the tallest presumably will have to
:12:44. > :12:50.suspend their campaign of Britain to leave the European Convention of
:12:50. > :12:59.suspend that. We must never come out Churchill was behind it. He was
:12:59. > :13:00.indeed. But it is actually a major constitutional issue whether you
:13:00. > :13:05.regulate the press or not. There was constitutional issue whether you
:13:05. > :13:10.a lot of ill feeling that this Marie ya miller statement was snubbing out
:13:10. > :13:16.on Friday afternoon. Somebody said freedom of the press too important
:13:16. > :13:20.to sneak out on afully afternoon. The whole subject should be treated
:13:20. > :13:27.with respect. We've run out of time. I'll be back next Sunday with the
:13:27. > :13:37.Communities Secretary Eric Pickles at our usual time of 11.00am. If