0:01:30 > 0:01:40And in the north-east and Cumbria, when it beat Durham, Newcastle, or
0:01:40 > 0:01:40
0:01:40 > 0:30:15Apology for the loss of subtitles for 1714 seconds
0:30:15 > 0:30:20Sunderland, or investing to be the A warm welcome to your local part
0:30:20 > 0:30:24of the show. A delight to see you. It could help create more
0:30:24 > 0:30:30environmentally friendly businesses like this one, with no less than
0:30:30 > 0:30:40four local bits, what chance do the North East have him becoming the
0:30:40 > 0:30:44new green bank. With us, the Hartlepool MP and Lord Shipley. Art
0:30:44 > 0:30:49and are councils being too heavy- handed with people who won't pay
0:30:49 > 0:30:54council tax, taking court action against them or sending in the
0:30:54 > 0:30:59bailiffs, is that a reasonable way of reclaiming debt. Some think they
0:30:59 > 0:31:06are too quick and have accused private bailiffs of abusing powers.
0:31:06 > 0:31:11Our reporter has met one woman and a man who has been accused of not
0:31:12 > 0:31:17paying council tax. Citizens Advice had sent them a letter offering to
0:31:17 > 0:31:23make a payment, they refused the offer to make the payment, saying
0:31:23 > 0:31:28it must be paid in full. There is nothing I can do, all I can do is
0:31:28 > 0:31:34wait to go to court. They will not take any payment from the unless it
0:31:35 > 0:31:39is in full. You cannot have your windows open, so you feel closed in.
0:31:39 > 0:31:45You must make sure nobody is out there before you shut the door. It
0:31:45 > 0:31:51is quite complicated. When you walk back into your home, you are
0:31:51 > 0:31:58looking to see if anyone is watching you. How common is that
0:31:58 > 0:32:04sort of experience? We asked every council how many occasions bailiffs
0:32:04 > 0:32:09were used to reclaim tax debts last year. Figures obtained by the BBC's
0:32:09 > 0:32:13suggest different councils work differently, in Newcastle more than
0:32:13 > 0:32:1825,000 court summons was issued by the City Council. That compares
0:32:18 > 0:32:22with fewer than 10,000 from the Sunderland, a city with a bigger
0:32:22 > 0:32:29population. Bailiffs got involved in Newcastle in more than 9000
0:32:29 > 0:32:35occasions, 6000 more than Sunderland. They say bailiffs are
0:32:35 > 0:32:40only used as a last resort to protect the interests of taxpayers.
0:32:40 > 0:32:44We signed up to the Association code of conduct, we told all of the
0:32:44 > 0:32:49companies we use that we have high expectations when they are carrying
0:32:50 > 0:32:53out their work. What we are trying to do is much more proactive
0:32:53 > 0:33:01preventive support, working with families in difficulty so we can
0:33:01 > 0:33:06support them and help them to plan how to pay the council tax. Rather
0:33:06 > 0:33:14than sending in bailiffs. Newcastle council deputy leader
0:33:14 > 0:33:20there. Let us speak to the vice chair of Newcastle council, how
0:33:20 > 0:33:24widespread is this case and cases like this? Things are getting
0:33:24 > 0:33:31harder, people are struggling with money, council tax debts are
0:33:31 > 0:33:36getting bigger. A quite heavy- handed approach by bailiffs at
0:33:36 > 0:33:41times? The legislation for Bayliss goes back to medieval times and we
0:33:41 > 0:33:45think it is a brutal instrument. Granted the council must collect
0:33:45 > 0:33:49council tax and people should pay it, but if people have mental
0:33:49 > 0:33:53health problems and are struggling, it is very quick when they take
0:33:53 > 0:33:57action, it builds up quickly and as the interviewer said, the charges
0:33:57 > 0:34:02are sometimes as much as the original debt. People at home will
0:34:02 > 0:34:10have little sympathy. They will say we pay council tax, they must
0:34:10 > 0:34:13expect consequences if they don't. Yes, but the problem is that
0:34:13 > 0:34:18sometimes they get a letter from the council and they just don't
0:34:18 > 0:34:22respond. That is when bailiffs do have to get involved. Our approach
0:34:22 > 0:34:26is to get in earlier with these cases and we are working with the
0:34:26 > 0:34:30council. It costs money to get Baylis to do this work and we would
0:34:30 > 0:34:35rather have this money kept for local people. I would suggest that
0:34:35 > 0:34:38people need to get help quickly, don't ignore a letter from the
0:34:38 > 0:34:42council and make sure you know what you must pay and pay it as soon as
0:34:42 > 0:34:49you can. You can arrange payments with the council around the
0:34:49 > 0:34:53bailiffs or get advice quickly. Thank you. Up till a year ago, John,
0:34:53 > 0:34:59your party was in control. Summons and bailiffs were even higher at
0:34:59 > 0:35:02that point, was there is a policy? Not a deliberate policy but the
0:35:02 > 0:35:08Audit Commission had been critical of Newcastle's collection rates,
0:35:08 > 0:35:12when we collected at. One of the consequences of that has been the
0:35:12 > 0:35:19that people have been very keen to make sure that the council tax
0:35:19 > 0:35:23returns and payments are... Overcame perhaps? A I think it is
0:35:23 > 0:35:27possible that there has been an over-keen approach. You can
0:35:27 > 0:35:32understand why. If people are paying council tax it is
0:35:32 > 0:35:37unreasonable for them to be subsidising people who are not. We
0:35:37 > 0:35:43should just say that the procedures are altering and there are fewer
0:35:43 > 0:35:46incidents now. A huge discrepancy. Sunderland a city not hugely
0:35:46 > 0:35:52different to Newcastle, they collected with far fewer
0:35:52 > 0:35:55interventions with bailiffs. That is true, but while Newcastle has an
0:35:55 > 0:36:00external bailiff service, Sunderland has an internal bailiff
0:36:00 > 0:36:05service. They have six full-time staff. That says something to us
0:36:05 > 0:36:09about how it works. I agree with what has been said, people need
0:36:10 > 0:36:14help and advice. One of the things I hope will come out of this is
0:36:14 > 0:36:19that councils will work closely with the voluntary sector in a
0:36:19 > 0:36:23giving people could debt advice. This is not money counters can
0:36:23 > 0:36:29write off, those who pay council tax probably have to make up for
0:36:29 > 0:36:34those who don't. I think it is a fair approach, it is a case of
0:36:34 > 0:36:38being sensitive to the economic needs but we have had unemployment
0:36:38 > 0:36:42figures rising in the North East and we must be mindful of that.
0:36:42 > 0:36:50What has been said is correct, there must be a sensitive approach
0:36:50 > 0:36:56but much more of an emphasis on prevention. If you are trying to
0:36:56 > 0:37:01identify people that is quite tough isn't it? If there are services in
0:37:01 > 0:37:05place to make sure people don't put their head in the sand, from the
0:37:05 > 0:37:08Citizen Advice Bureau and the council then it is important. I
0:37:08 > 0:37:15understand Newcastle are announcing a Prix bailiff service to help
0:37:15 > 0:37:21people, I think that is probably the right approach. Actually,
0:37:21 > 0:37:26councils are going to want to collect his money, they need it.
0:37:26 > 0:37:31Newcastle, as I understand it, the bailiffs are only called in after
0:37:31 > 0:37:36seven or eight discussions of what attempts to contact a person. In my
0:37:36 > 0:37:41own experience the summonses have been too quick, people can be a way
0:37:41 > 0:37:46or sick. The council is something and then going to bailiffs, perhaps
0:37:46 > 0:37:50more quickly than they should. On the other hand, it is important
0:37:50 > 0:37:54that the tax is collected. Of all of the big cities in England,
0:37:54 > 0:38:01Newcastle has the best collection rate. Thank you very much for now.
0:38:01 > 0:38:09We have a new bank in the north- east, now called Virgin Money.
0:38:09 > 0:38:12Could we get another one? That is a view shared by Sunderland, Durham,
0:38:13 > 0:38:16Newcastle are monks others, for a new investment bank. White vans
0:38:16 > 0:38:20don't normally have a reputation for being green but these will be
0:38:20 > 0:38:25as they are fitted with electric engines. This firm in Washington is
0:38:25 > 0:38:31at the forefront of the low carbon revolution. As it looks to expand
0:38:31 > 0:38:37it could be handed a new green investment bank with �3 million in
0:38:37 > 0:38:41cash somewhere nearby. Innovations need to move forward quickly, our
0:38:41 > 0:38:45business would see access to Green Investment made more simple and
0:38:45 > 0:38:49straightforward by this location in the north-east. The good news for
0:38:49 > 0:38:53the company is there is a big push to bring the Green Investment Bank
0:38:53 > 0:38:58to the North East. Some are making the case that they should be on
0:38:58 > 0:39:02this firm's doorstep in Sunderland. It is easy to understand why
0:39:02 > 0:39:05Sunderland once the bank. It will employ around 80 people but it will
0:39:05 > 0:39:09also make Wareside a more attractive place for new green
0:39:09 > 0:39:14businesses and jobs. One of the reasons that the City believes the
0:39:14 > 0:39:18bid should be taken seriously. have the highest unemployment in
0:39:18 > 0:39:23the country and bringing any jobs to an area like the north-east and
0:39:23 > 0:39:28in particular Sunderland, would be a good thing. Any investments the
0:39:28 > 0:39:32government decides on, investment must be a factor. Sunderland is
0:39:32 > 0:39:36facing fierce competition however, no less than 32 places, from
0:39:36 > 0:39:40Cornwall in the south to Edinburgh in the north, competing to be the
0:39:40 > 0:39:44location for the Green Investment Bank. Sunderland even has
0:39:44 > 0:39:49competition in the north-east, because there are rival bids from
0:39:49 > 0:39:53Teesside, County Durham and Newcastle. Teesside's bid is based
0:39:53 > 0:39:57on the way of industry set up in the area already. This site in
0:39:57 > 0:40:02Middlesbrough is set up by a firm which turns rubbish into thermal
0:40:02 > 0:40:06energy. They believe the bank will be right at home. They want
0:40:06 > 0:40:10expertise in finance which we have in this area, they want support
0:40:10 > 0:40:14from professional firms to understand green energy, green
0:40:15 > 0:40:20activities, so we think we are extremely well placed. The most
0:40:20 > 0:40:26important thing is that we have had that sort of industry here, a low
0:40:26 > 0:40:32carbon future. Teesside's growing businesses are keen on the bank
0:40:32 > 0:40:36moving in. The businesses are struggling to get cash, money, for
0:40:36 > 0:40:41lots of good reasons. They are looking for the investment bank to
0:40:41 > 0:40:44open up that flow of cash and if it is here and then it will be good
0:40:44 > 0:40:51for the businesses it but also for investments because they have
0:40:51 > 0:40:57expertise around them and projects around them. With four North East
0:40:57 > 0:41:04bids, some feel it may have diluted its case and left the road clear
0:41:04 > 0:41:08for others. There may be a separate argument for bids from Teesside and
0:41:08 > 0:41:13County Durham, but to have a a whole set of bits coming in from a
0:41:13 > 0:41:17single labour market is daft. You are up against other areas which
0:41:17 > 0:41:21are much better organised. It will be difficult and it looks
0:41:21 > 0:41:25fragmented. And a decision about where the Green Investment Bank
0:41:25 > 0:41:29will go is expected at the end of the month. If it came to the north-
0:41:29 > 0:41:34east it could help supercharged the economy, but has the region given
0:41:34 > 0:41:40itself the best possible chance of winning?
0:41:40 > 0:41:46ERM, where do you stand on this, do you a broad this? The kind of
0:41:46 > 0:41:51businesses Teesside wants to encourage. I think it is a welcome
0:41:51 > 0:41:54suggestion, I am disappointed it is too little too late. The government
0:41:54 > 0:41:58has admitted that role borrowing powers will not be in place until
0:41:58 > 0:42:022016 at the earliest. In terms of having the injection for growth I
0:42:02 > 0:42:07fail to see how it can help. Having said that, I think it is extremely
0:42:07 > 0:42:10important. Teesside could be the centre of excellence for new low
0:42:10 > 0:42:13carbon green technologies. We have seen that already. If you think
0:42:13 > 0:42:16about the criteria by which the investment bank location will be
0:42:17 > 0:42:21judged, it is difficult to avoid the conclusion that his side is a
0:42:21 > 0:42:25very strong fit. Would it matter that much if it is in Teesside or a
0:42:25 > 0:42:30few miles up the road in Newcastle? I think it sends out a positive
0:42:30 > 0:42:34message. Just a theory is important. Like-minded industries with a
0:42:34 > 0:42:38supply chain close by. It can be a really important way by which
0:42:38 > 0:42:42wealth and job creation can be carried out. I will come back to
0:42:42 > 0:42:48the principle in a minute, but with four bits from the north-east is
0:42:48 > 0:42:54ridiculous, isn't it? Wells has one bid. Is it not diluting our chances.
0:42:54 > 0:42:59Yorkshire has Sheffield and Leeds. A much bigger region... That is
0:42:59 > 0:43:03true, but I don't subscribe to the idea it should not have been four.
0:43:03 > 0:43:10There is a suggestion that we can demonstrate breath and strength of
0:43:10 > 0:43:15the offer in green energy and it is a good story to tell. I think some
0:43:15 > 0:43:21are stronger than others. Durham were say one possible location is
0:43:21 > 0:43:26the see him, could they not have got a a bid together? There is an
0:43:26 > 0:43:31argument for saying that they should each have come together, but
0:43:31 > 0:43:36I do think the Newcastle bid contains a lot about the importance
0:43:36 > 0:43:40of Tees Valley. As long as a decision to locate the Green
0:43:40 > 0:43:45Investment Bank is made for the north-east, the strength of people
0:43:45 > 0:43:49working together on the ground afterwards, seems to me to be fine.
0:43:49 > 0:43:53I don't subscribe to the view that it isn't known goal. Although I
0:43:53 > 0:43:59have no role in it, in this decision, it seems to demonstrate
0:43:59 > 0:44:04the strength of our region. We will see if that is true. Ian Wright
0:44:04 > 0:44:10says it is too little, too late and it will not make a difference.
0:44:10 > 0:44:16are doing it and it has to be set up. There are rules and finances in
0:44:16 > 0:44:23the legality, it will be back on stream in about... A few months'
0:44:23 > 0:44:29time, I don't really subscribe to it. It is important we know what it
0:44:29 > 0:44:34is for, it is less for the No carbon side than for waste and
0:44:34 > 0:44:39offshore wind technology and so on which the region is very strong in.
0:44:40 > 0:44:43Ian Wright, isn't this just addressing a problem of pre-
0:44:43 > 0:44:49existing banks not lending money. Nobody needs public lending if they
0:44:50 > 0:44:52have a good business plan. What we need in this country is a co-
0:44:52 > 0:44:58ordinated industrial policy, other countries like Germany and South
0:44:58 > 0:45:01Korea have got that. Didn't you have 13 years to do that? UK and
0:45:01 > 0:45:05argue that but we need to look to the future and what we need to do
0:45:05 > 0:45:08in this country in the 21st century to be in the Premier League of
0:45:08 > 0:45:18developed nations. Why can't the banks lent to these businesses like
0:45:18 > 0:45:26businesses were always fancied? have had some confusion, there is
0:45:26 > 0:45:30not real clarity in terms of what the Green Investment Bank will do.
0:45:30 > 0:45:37We want it backed up by public money to help Labour in the private
0:45:37 > 0:45:40sector money. Thank you. The Commons has not been sitting this
0:45:40 > 0:45:44week but plenty has gone on including a flying visit to the
0:45:44 > 0:45:53north-east by the Prime Minister. Our reporter has packed the
0:45:53 > 0:45:57political week into 60 seconds. Unemployment in the north-east fell
0:45:57 > 0:46:03by 4000 in the last quarter in 2011. It is still 11.2 per cent, the
0:46:03 > 0:46:06highest in the UK. In Cumbria the jobless total went up by 800. David
0:46:06 > 0:46:10Cameron says tough action is needed to tackle binge drinking. He was
0:46:10 > 0:46:14speaking during a visit to the Royal Victoria Infirmary in
0:46:14 > 0:46:18Newcastle. Police can Stevin, it is against the law to sell to people
0:46:18 > 0:46:23who are drunk, to sell to people who are underrate and you can close
0:46:23 > 0:46:28down bars. We must look at the issue of pricing and how we can
0:46:28 > 0:46:33stop this. Good news for Cumbria motorist with the opening of the
0:46:33 > 0:46:40Carlisle Relief Road, the five MAR link will help cut congestion and
0:46:40 > 0:46:46improve journey times to and from West Cumbria. Finally, after a 3000
0:46:46 > 0:46:50mark walk, Lord Bates has arrived back and the UK. Just about one out,
0:46:50 > 0:47:00my second pair of boots, which is probably just means I am light on
0:47:00 > 0:47:04my feet. There is a man who deserves a rest. John Shipley,
0:47:04 > 0:47:11prime minister talking about our goal this week. Was it just a photo
0:47:11 > 0:47:17opportunity? An extremely important issue. Did he adds to the debate?
0:47:17 > 0:47:21On alcohol I think he did address the debate. We need minimum pricing
0:47:21 > 0:47:25has gone and is proposing to do. I thought his visit was extremely
0:47:25 > 0:47:28helpful. He went to school and afterwards and was discussing a
0:47:28 > 0:47:32whole range of things around independence which would impact on
0:47:33 > 0:47:36our region to. Also the RBI has experience on this and he picked
0:47:36 > 0:47:41one of the cities in the UK with some of the worst problems for
0:47:41 > 0:47:46hospital admissions because of alcohol. Ian Wright, where are you
0:47:46 > 0:47:55on this? The problem, minimum pricing, which John Sibley supports,
0:47:55 > 0:47:59it does not really help poor people who just want a drink does it?
0:47:59 > 0:48:03could be part of a package but if you are trying to address long-term
0:48:03 > 0:48:08cultural issues, I think you need a range of responses of which minimum
0:48:08 > 0:48:13pricing might be one. I would want to make sure it does not penalise
0:48:13 > 0:48:19moderate drinkers. I don't think the Prime Minister added to the
0:48:19 > 0:48:26debate, it was a PR stunt. Was 24 hour drinking a mistake? I think
0:48:26 > 0:48:31the? Is there, but the idea was a laudable one, to have the cafe
0:48:31 > 0:48:36culture. Did it happen? Some elements of Hartlepool, on the
0:48:36 > 0:48:40marina, are very European in terms of drinking culture. But it failed
0:48:40 > 0:48:45to address the 10 pints down the Net culture which is there. We need
0:48:45 > 0:48:50to look at what is actually quite a complex and difficult issue in a
0:48:50 > 0:48:55much more responsible and holistic way. I must say the fact he is
0:48:55 > 0:49:00cutting police officers from the forces does not help address crime.
0:49:00 > 0:49:05It is a bit rich to talk about looking more drum people up and
0:49:05 > 0:49:08targeting this when police numbers are falling, isn't it? The most of
0:49:08 > 0:49:12those are in back-office jobs, so the solution is to stop people
0:49:12 > 0:49:22getting drunk in the first place. Minimum pricing would help with
0:49:22 > 0:49:23
0:49:23 > 0:49:32that. You could get the... You could could seem the limit for a
0:49:32 > 0:49:38man for a week on four or �5. If it was at twice that level it may stop
0:49:38 > 0:49:44some, I believe it would. Scotland is talking about 45 pence per unit,
0:49:44 > 0:49:49why not the same for us. The BBC Inside Out programme has a special
0:49:49 > 0:49:52report on homes for Cumberland this week, a fairly organisation which