:00:36. > :00:41.There's another candidate in the race to become Ukip's next
:00:42. > :00:43.leader: Suzanne Evans, the party's former deputy chairman,
:00:44. > :00:50.This man might have something to say about that.
:00:51. > :00:53.Paul Nuttal was Nigel Farage's deputy for many years.
:00:54. > :00:56.So is he now ready to throw his hat in the ring?
:00:57. > :01:01.The battle for Mosul: the Iraqi army and its allies advane
:01:02. > :01:04.on the country's second city which has been in the hands of
:01:05. > :01:12.In the North East and Cumbrha.. from this key clash?
:01:13. > :01:16.Would thousands of pounds persuade you to back fracking near your home?
:01:17. > :01:19.And fears for our A Es and maternity units,
:01:20. > :01:20.as health managers look for big savings.
:01:21. > :01:23.one of the richest cities in the world. Should all private landlords
:01:24. > :01:28.be licensed to help tackle the squalor?
:01:29. > :01:32.And with me - as always - the best and the brightest political
:01:33. > :01:35.panel in the business: Toby Young, Polly Toynbee and Tom Newton Dunn -
:01:36. > :01:44.The last leader was in the job a mere 18 days before she decided
:01:45. > :01:50.The favourite to succeed her then quit the party after a now infamous
:01:51. > :01:55.Ukip's biggest donor says the party is at "breaking point".
:01:56. > :02:02.This morning, the former Deputy Chairman, Suzanne Evans,
:02:03. > :02:04.announced that she would be running for the leadership.
:02:05. > :02:09.I've thought long and hard about this leadership bid,
:02:10. > :02:12.and one of the reasons I've perhaps delayed announcing it is
:02:13. > :02:15.because I wanted to be absolutely sure that I had the support
:02:16. > :02:19.And I can confirm that I have more than enough signatures
:02:20. > :02:22.on the nomination form already to be able to go forward.
:02:23. > :02:25.Let's not forget that 3,000 people signed a petition in support of me
:02:26. > :02:31.I know head office was besieged with letters in support.
:02:32. > :02:34.I would not be doing this if I didn't have the backing
:02:35. > :02:37.of our members, because our members are the most important
:02:38. > :02:45.Well, Paul Nuttall was Nigel Farage's deputy for many years
:02:46. > :02:48.and plenty of people saw him as a leader-in-waiting.
:02:49. > :02:57.Let's ask the man himself - Paul Nuttall joins me now.
:02:58. > :03:04.Yes. I've made the decision that I'm going to put my name forward to be
:03:05. > :03:09.the next leader of Ukip. I have huge support across the country, not only
:03:10. > :03:13.amongst people at the top of the party in Westminster and with the
:03:14. > :03:18.MEPs, but also the grassroots. I want to be the unity candidate. Ukip
:03:19. > :03:22.needs to come together. I'm not going to gild the lily. Ukip is
:03:23. > :03:34.looking over a political cliff at the moment. It will either step four
:03:35. > :03:36.step back, and I want to tell us to step backwards. You say it faces an
:03:37. > :03:39.ex-distension or threat, which means it's possible it has no future at
:03:40. > :03:45.all. Students of political history know that political parties take a
:03:46. > :03:50.long time to get going. They can disappear pretty quickly. Ukip is
:03:51. > :03:55.facing an existential crisis. What happened over the summer has put us
:03:56. > :04:00.on a... We could be on a spiral that we can't get off. But I believe I am
:04:01. > :04:03.the man to bring the factions together, to create unity within the
:04:04. > :04:08.party, and to build on the structure and get us ready for the common
:04:09. > :04:12.challenges. Why didn't you stand last time? Because I have spent the
:04:13. > :04:17.last four or five years of my life travelling around the country. I
:04:18. > :04:22.have done more Ukip meetings than anybody else, spending a lot of time
:04:23. > :04:27.away from home. With Brexit, I felt that my job and Nigel's job was done
:04:28. > :04:31.and we could hand over to the next generation. That doesn't seem to be
:04:32. > :04:36.the case, and maybe it's time for someone who is an old hand. I'm very
:04:37. > :04:41.experienced and I know the party inside out. Maybe it's time to step
:04:42. > :04:48.in and bring the party together. You told the Liverpool Echo on the night
:04:49. > :04:51.of July that you didn't wish to take on Nigel Farage, you didn't want
:04:52. > :04:59.that to happen to your family and friends. What has changed? The party
:05:00. > :05:03.is facing an existential crisis, and is facing an existential crisis and
:05:04. > :05:09.I want to make sure that Ukip is on the pitch to keep the ball into the
:05:10. > :05:15.open net we have in politics. We have a Conservative Party who is
:05:16. > :05:20.moving toward Brexit, but we have to be there too. Why would you be
:05:21. > :05:26.better than Suzanne Evans? Suzanne would be an excellent candidate I
:05:27. > :05:29.thought the 2015 manifesto was the best out of all the political
:05:30. > :05:33.parties. I would be the best candidate because of my experience.
:05:34. > :05:39.I am not part of any faction within the party. Is she? I get on well
:05:40. > :05:45.with everybody, and I believe I could be the man to bring the party
:05:46. > :05:50.together. Do you get on with Iain Banks, -- Aaron Banks, who is
:05:51. > :05:55.supporting one of your rivals? Yes, I get on well with him. He is able
:05:56. > :06:00.to choose whoever he wants to be the next leader of the party. After
:06:01. > :06:04.November 28, the leadership election, we all say, the past the
:06:05. > :06:13.past. It becomes Daisy row for the new leader. We forget all that has
:06:14. > :06:16.before and move on. You won the referendum. Mrs May is adopting some
:06:17. > :06:22.of your policies, like grammar schools. What is the point of Ukip
:06:23. > :06:26.these days? Twofold. We don't have Brexit. Mrs May said she would not
:06:27. > :06:31.invoke Article 50 until the end of March, and we don't know if that
:06:32. > :06:37.will happen. We need to ensure a strong Ukip to make sure that Brexit
:06:38. > :06:41.really does mean Brexit. We have a huge opportunity in working class
:06:42. > :06:45.communities where the Labour Party no longer represents them. I believe
:06:46. > :06:49.Ukip can become the voice of working people. If you were the leader,
:06:50. > :06:54.would Ukip be a bigger threat to Labour in the north or the Tories in
:06:55. > :06:59.the South? You save Labour in the north, and people often to make that
:07:00. > :07:03.mistake. There's working class communities right across the country
:07:04. > :07:15.is. There are working-class communities in Bristol just
:07:16. > :07:19.as in Newcastle. We are second in a number of northern seats, and
:07:20. > :07:22.southern seats as well, and I believe the party can move into
:07:23. > :07:25.these communities. It can only do so if Ukip is on the pitch, and I
:07:26. > :07:30.intend to make sure that's the case. I don't think we have portrayed a
:07:31. > :07:37.good image over the summer. Is that called British understatement? A
:07:38. > :07:42.bit. It is dysfunctional. We have to move on beyond Nigel Farage. We have
:07:43. > :07:47.to build a strong national Executive Committee. We need to ensure our
:07:48. > :07:51.branches are ready for the fight and concentrate on local elections. I've
:07:52. > :07:57.got the experience. I'm now throwing my hat into the ring, and I'm the
:07:58. > :08:02.only person who can keep Ukip in the game. What role would you give Nigel
:08:03. > :08:06.Farage, if any? I will be the candidate of compromise. I would see
:08:07. > :08:10.what Nigel wanted to do. Would you keep in the leader of the freedom
:08:11. > :08:14.and democracy group in the European Parliament? There would have to be
:08:15. > :08:21.compromise on both sides, and we would need to talk about it. I don't
:08:22. > :08:25.know what Nigel wants to do. Do you think his support, his association
:08:26. > :08:30.with Donald Trump, helps Ukip win female votes in this country?
:08:31. > :08:34.Personally, I would not have gone out and campaigned or said anything
:08:35. > :08:40.about Donald Trump, but I don't think Ukip has come out and backed
:08:41. > :08:44.Donald Trump 100%. Personally, I wouldn't have even spoken about the
:08:45. > :08:50.American election, because I think the two candidates are quite
:08:51. > :08:54.appalling. Some up for us. If you win, what would be the hallmark of
:08:55. > :09:00.your Ukip leadership? The first couple of months would be ensuring
:09:01. > :09:06.that Ukip unifies. Saying no to factions, bringing people together.
:09:07. > :09:11.Suzanne Evans, Nigel Farage, all of the MEPs, and ensuring that Ukip can
:09:12. > :09:15.move forward. If we don't unify, Ukip will not be around for much
:09:16. > :09:17.longer. Thanks for being with us this morning.
:09:18. > :09:20.We won't have to wait too long to find out who Ukip's
:09:21. > :09:22.new leader will be - the winner will be announced
:09:23. > :09:32.Who would be the best leader for Ukip? I think the difference between
:09:33. > :09:36.the field a few weeks ago and today is that this field is a lot
:09:37. > :09:43.stronger. Whether it's Paul or Suzanne, I think... It is hard to
:09:44. > :09:53.say, with Aaron Banks and apparently Nigel Farage hacking another
:09:54. > :10:03.candidate, Raheem, but I want Ukip to be a strong force in British
:10:04. > :10:09.politics. I think the fact there is a stronger field now is good news
:10:10. > :10:16.for Ukip. Is it a Labour's worst nightmare in the north of England?
:10:17. > :10:19.It is. I think the personality difference and presentational
:10:20. > :10:23.difference is interesting. Suzanne Evans is going for the Conservative
:10:24. > :10:27.county vote. There's a lot to be taken there by Ukip. He would
:10:28. > :10:34.probably be more appealing to the Labour vote. It is interesting. At
:10:35. > :10:47.the moment, pollsters say that the Ukip vote splits pretty easily
:10:48. > :10:53.between Labour and Tory. But things always collapse. When they have made
:10:54. > :10:57.inroads into Tower Hamlets and Barking, they collapse, because they
:10:58. > :11:08.fight amongst each other so much. But not always with fists! Does Ukip
:11:09. > :11:14.have a future? And who would best secure that future? It does for at
:11:15. > :11:20.least two years, until we Brexit. We have to believe that that will
:11:21. > :11:23.happen. That was an impressive pitch there from Paul, certainly as the
:11:24. > :11:28.unity candidate, after the car crash we have seen on TV screens this
:11:29. > :11:33.morning. But it doesn't go beyond May 20 19. What then? There is no
:11:34. > :11:39.point being called the United Kingdom Independence party any
:11:40. > :11:44.longer. What will happen after May 2019? If you want to hoover up votes
:11:45. > :11:49.of the back of Brexit, you need to start looking further ahead than two
:11:50. > :11:53.years. The person who wins that leadership contest is the person who
:11:54. > :11:56.will sum that up the best. We shall see.
:11:57. > :11:59.In June 2014, the group which calls itself the Islamic State in Iraq
:12:00. > :12:01.and the Levant captured Iraq's second city, Mosul.
:12:02. > :12:03.Later that month the group announced it was establishing a 'caliphate',
:12:04. > :12:05.or an Islamic state, on the territories it
:12:06. > :12:15.This week 30,000 Iraqi troops, aided by Iranian-backed Shia fighters,
:12:16. > :12:20.Kurdish Peshmerga and Western air support, began the assault
:12:21. > :12:37.Then they spot a truck bomb from so-called Islamic State.
:12:38. > :12:42.They destroy it before it destroys them.
:12:43. > :12:45.These are the first steps in the battle for Mosul,
:12:46. > :12:50.the Northern Iraqi city IS has made its stronghold since 2014.
:12:51. > :12:55.Controlling the city of around 2 million people means
:12:56. > :12:59.that they established governance, they establish a territorial base.
:13:00. > :13:02.This is what has obsessed everyone, because with a territorial base
:13:03. > :13:06.you are capable of doing more than if you are simply an insurgency
:13:07. > :13:11.movement in the fabric of another society.
:13:12. > :13:15.It's being billed as the biggest military operation in Iraq
:13:16. > :13:19.since the war in 2003, the biggest moment in the international effort
:13:20. > :13:24.Here is how the various forces are approaching the city.
:13:25. > :13:29.Heading to Mosul from the south, the elite troops of the Iraqi army.
:13:30. > :13:31.Known as the Golden division, trained and accompanied
:13:32. > :13:38.From the North, a force made up of Kurds, known as the Peshmerga,
:13:39. > :13:43.Also from the South, a militia made up of Shia fighters
:13:44. > :13:46.who have been accused of human rights abuses.
:13:47. > :13:49.British planes have bombed outlying villages, reportedly guided
:13:50. > :13:57.in by British personnel on the ground.
:13:58. > :13:59.To the North West, a corridor has been left for some
:14:00. > :14:02.of the 3000 plus IS fighters, in theory an escape route
:14:03. > :14:05.which could limit the bloodshed when fighting starts in the city.
:14:06. > :14:07.We've had 4-5 days of battle and it's taking place
:14:08. > :14:10.in the outlying villages and there have been some
:14:11. > :14:13.successes and some failures, but the momentum is building.
:14:14. > :14:16.And the real question will be when the attackers get
:14:17. > :14:20.towards the city itself, how strong are the defences?
:14:21. > :14:27.It will crack but it might crack within 48 hours or 2-3 weeks.
:14:28. > :14:31.IS has fought back, on Friday they attack sites
:14:32. > :14:34.in the city of Kirkuk, including a power station.
:14:35. > :14:36.The United Nations believes hundreds of thousands of families
:14:37. > :14:39.have been rounded up as potential human shields.
:14:40. > :14:43.The battle could be bloody, but what about when it's over?
:14:44. > :14:46.The Shia militias, the Iraqi army, the Peshmerga guerrillas,
:14:47. > :14:49.some of the Turkish elements, they all want a share of the action.
:14:50. > :14:53.They are in Mosul, not for altruistic reasons.
:14:54. > :14:56.They are there because they want to be part of whatever happens next.
:14:57. > :15:01.The biggest issue is how the Sunni majority in Mosul reacts to the Shia
:15:02. > :15:05.militias which have helped to liberate them.
:15:06. > :15:07.ARCHIVE FOOTAGE: When Sir Francis Humphrey went to Mosul
:15:08. > :15:11.If it all seems like something from the archive, when the Middle
:15:12. > :15:13.East went up in flames and was then carved up,
:15:14. > :15:17.it is because that is what is happening in Iraq right now.
:15:18. > :15:22.National identity has been cut across by other identities such
:15:23. > :15:32.And that means that putting together a so-called nation state again
:15:33. > :15:38.Almost certainly there will be a new form of Kurdish state,
:15:39. > :15:41.almost certainly in northern Iraq at the end of this crisis,
:15:42. > :15:44.and what is happening in Mosul is a microcosm of what is happening
:15:45. > :15:48.elsewhere across the Levant which is that it is melting down.
:15:49. > :15:51.Big questions, questions that come after the battle.
:15:52. > :15:53.The coalition forces are advancing but this is just the beginning.
:15:54. > :16:03.I'm joined now by the International Development Minister Rory Stewart.
:16:04. > :16:05.In a former life he was the coalition Deputy-Governor of two
:16:06. > :16:13.provinces in Southern Iraq following the Iraq intervention of 2003.
:16:14. > :16:24.Is there any doubt that at some stage Mosul will fall to the forces
:16:25. > :16:33.of Iraq and its allies? The first thing is that war is very uncertain
:16:34. > :16:36.and there are cliches about it being the graveyard of predictions and we
:16:37. > :16:41.don't want to make confident predictions but the basic structure
:16:42. > :16:51.is that there are 30,000 Iraqi forces outside and only a few
:16:52. > :16:53.thousand Daesh fighters inside and I would say it is overwhelmingly
:16:54. > :17:01.likely that the batter will one STUDIO: -- the battle the won by the
:17:02. > :17:09.Iraqi forces. June 2014 was a great success, they
:17:10. > :17:15.took a city of over in people and they created what they tried to
:17:16. > :17:17.create a million state of 7 million people, stretching across the Iraqi
:17:18. > :17:23.Syrian border, but since then they have lost territory quite rapidly.
:17:24. > :17:27.Now they are losing the outskirts of Mosul, and that is a fundamental
:17:28. > :17:30.blow. Islamic State is all about territory and holding state, that is
:17:31. > :17:37.what makes it different from Al-Qaeda. If they lose Mosul that
:17:38. > :17:42.will be a cynic -- significant blow to their credibility. Hillary
:17:43. > :17:45.Clinton said on Wednesday's presidential debate that when Iraqi
:17:46. > :17:49.forces with their allies including the United Kingdom gain control of
:17:50. > :17:56.Mosul they should continue to press into Syria to take back Raqqa which
:17:57. > :18:01.is the de facto capital of the caliphate, what is left of it, do we
:18:02. > :18:09.want Iraqi forces to pursue IS into Syria? Very important question.
:18:10. > :18:11.Delayed in Raqqa needs to come from people on the Syrian side of the
:18:12. > :18:17.border and that is an important principle -- the lead. In the end of
:18:18. > :18:22.that enemy, Islamic State, is a common enemy for odd members of the
:18:23. > :18:29.coalition including the Iraqi government. -- all members. There is
:18:30. > :18:33.likely to be a humanitarian crisis especially if it ends up with street
:18:34. > :18:38.to street fighting and IS are difficult to dislodge what are we
:18:39. > :18:43.doing about that? We are doing very detailed scenario planning. It is
:18:44. > :18:47.very uncertain what the scenario will be but much investment has gone
:18:48. > :18:57.into creating a network of camps, refugees STUDIO: Refugee camps
:18:58. > :19:03.around cash refugee camps, and that is where money, British money, ?40
:19:04. > :19:07.million has gone recently into supporting that, especially in terms
:19:08. > :19:14.of medical support to people. The United nation's emergency response
:19:15. > :19:17.budget is ?196 million but only one third funded which sounds like we
:19:18. > :19:22.are putting up a big chunk of what is already being funded. Why is
:19:23. > :19:25.that? The international committee can't say they haven't seen this
:19:26. > :19:32.assault coming, and the humanitarian fallout they may see from it. You
:19:33. > :19:35.are absolutely right. We have seen it coming and we have been planning
:19:36. > :19:41.since debris and we have put in about ?167 million into this --
:19:42. > :19:45.planning since February. There has been a change in the nature of the
:19:46. > :19:48.appeal, and if there is a lag in the accounting of it, but the money we
:19:49. > :19:53.need at this stage is in place and we do have the support structure in
:19:54. > :19:56.place for those refugees. You are right the United Nations is
:19:57. > :20:00.continuing with its appeal and is asking for more money at the moment.
:20:01. > :20:04.The converse magazine wrote this week that preparations for a big
:20:05. > :20:10.exodus of people leaving the city have been made -- Economist
:20:11. > :20:15.magazine. But confidence is not high in the preparations, is that a
:20:16. > :20:18.unfair conclusion? If you can imagine the different scenarios, it
:20:19. > :20:21.could be a few thousand and it could be a few hundred thousand coming out
:20:22. > :20:27.of the city through a front line where the war is going on, that is
:20:28. > :20:30.very difficult. You have to screen those people and disarm them, and
:20:31. > :20:34.keep families together, and transport them and you have to bring
:20:35. > :20:38.them into the refugee camps. The people working on this have been
:20:39. > :20:42.working on this for long time, we have mapped the different routes we
:20:43. > :20:48.have good camp infrastructure in place and we have people who have
:20:49. > :20:52.worked in south to dam and other areas who are putting their
:20:53. > :20:55.structures in place -- South Sudan. It is never easy but I think we have
:20:56. > :21:00.done everything we can in the preparation for this. What is the
:21:01. > :21:06.British role in what will probably be an even bigger issue, assuming
:21:07. > :21:11.that Mosul is liberated and retaken, the humanitarian crisis is dealt
:21:12. > :21:17.with, what role will we play in the rebuilding of Mosul? That will be
:21:18. > :21:23.crucial to the future of Iraq, the second-biggest city and it will need
:21:24. > :21:28.to be rebuilt. It will need to be rebuilt as a community as well as
:21:29. > :21:32.bricks and mortar. And eight Sunni community that is not harassed by
:21:33. > :21:39.the Shia. -- and eight. You are right. One of the core drivers is
:21:40. > :21:41.that the Sunni community felt excluded and they did not feel they
:21:42. > :21:47.have the trust from the Baghdad government. A lasting solution is
:21:48. > :21:53.stopping some of Islamic State coming back, that involves making
:21:54. > :21:57.sure the Sunni community have a stake in their future. That is
:21:58. > :22:02.making sure that the governing structures are in place. The UK s
:22:03. > :22:07.response is twofold, we have got to get the humanitarian aid right, that
:22:08. > :22:12.is the short term, people who might be malnourished, coming out of the
:22:13. > :22:16.front line. The second thing is working with the Iraqi government to
:22:17. > :22:20.make sure that as we rebuild Mosul we do so in a way that that
:22:21. > :22:27.population feels a connection to the Iraqi state. Islamic State is losing
:22:28. > :22:32.territory everywhere in the Levant, it is almost finished in Iraq, we
:22:33. > :22:37.think. It is down to one district in Libya, as well, just one small part
:22:38. > :22:42.of the town. I suppose the risk is, if life is becoming more difficult
:22:43. > :22:48.across these areas, it can start to look more in Europe and the United
:22:49. > :22:54.Kingdom as a place to continue its terrorist attacks? That is a real
:22:55. > :22:58.danger. You are right. This is a group which has proved over the last
:22:59. > :23:00.five years very unpredictable and it changes for it quickly full stop
:23:01. > :23:05.often it does unexpected things. In often it does unexpected things In
:23:06. > :23:11.2009 its predecessor had been largely wiped out in Iraq and when
:23:12. > :23:14.it was under pressure in Syria it went back into Iraq, and in the past
:23:15. > :23:18.it didn't hold territory but now it holds territory, so you are right.
:23:19. > :23:23.There is a serious risk that as it gets squeezed in the middle East it
:23:24. > :23:27.will try to pop up somewhere else and Mac could include Europe and the
:23:28. > :23:31.United States -- that could. They say that is something they have
:23:32. > :23:36.focused on full stop we also have a big focus on counterterrorism
:23:37. > :23:43.security and making sure that we keep the United Kingdom and Europe
:23:44. > :23:50.say. One final question. -- say -- safe. Maybe events in Mosul could
:23:51. > :23:55.add to the migration crisis in Europe, is that a possibility?
:23:56. > :24:01.Again, you are right, we have seen in Syria it can push migration, the
:24:02. > :24:04.biggest push the migration was the conflict in Syria, and that's the
:24:05. > :24:08.reason why we have but so much energy into getting those refugee
:24:09. > :24:10.camps in place and getting the humanitarian response in place --
:24:11. > :24:15.humanitarian response in place - put so much energy. People will want
:24:16. > :24:17.to remain in their homes, this is their country, but we have got to
:24:18. > :24:22.make it possible for them and that means in the short term looking
:24:23. > :24:25.after their shelter and in the medium to long-term making sure they
:24:26. > :24:31.have livelihoods, jobs and an economic development which is why
:24:32. > :24:34.our support in Iraq is in the UK National interests because it deals
:24:35. > :24:41.with these issues of migration and terrorists. Thanks for joining us.
:24:42. > :24:48.I'm joined now by the Shadow Defence Secretary.
:24:49. > :24:59.Does Labour support British participation in this offensive? We
:25:00. > :25:03.participation in this offensive We fully support the participation in
:25:04. > :25:08.this offensive, extremely important move forward and we voted for this
:25:09. > :25:12.back in 2014. We are asking the government question is, of course, I
:25:13. > :25:18.was asking the Secretary of State this week about this very offensive
:25:19. > :25:21.but we are fully behind our RAF pilots out there and be trading that
:25:22. > :25:27.has been going on to help the forces on the ground. -- the training full
:25:28. > :25:33.stop that is very clear. I wonder if you'll lead it shares that clarity
:25:34. > :25:36.and that position. -- is your leader. This is what Jeremy Corbyn
:25:37. > :25:38.has said. What's been done in Iraq
:25:39. > :25:40.is done by the Iraqi government, and currently
:25:41. > :25:42.supported by the British government. I did not support it
:25:43. > :25:44.when it came up. Well, I'm not sure how successful
:25:45. > :25:48.it's been, because most of the action now appears to be
:25:49. > :25:59.moving in to Syria, so I think we He doesn't sound very supportive.
:26:00. > :26:02.The issue about Mosul, it has been very carefully prepared as Rory
:26:03. > :26:07.Stewart said and I hope we have learned the lessons from previous
:26:08. > :26:12.offensives where we haven't learnt sufficiently, and that is going to
:26:13. > :26:17.be crucial in this context. How the aftermath is going to be dealt with.
:26:18. > :26:22.Of course will stop that clip was from November last year, and things
:26:23. > :26:28.have changed. Two weeks ago he told the BBC" I'm not sure it is
:26:29. > :26:32.working", in reference to air strikes in Iraq, but it is working.
:26:33. > :26:36.We have got to see what happens in Mosul, it is a very high-risk
:26:37. > :26:40.operation, but we also have to face the fact that the people there are
:26:41. > :26:47.living under tyranny at the moment. We have to ask very cirrus question
:26:48. > :26:50.shall stop he says he's not sure it is working, when Mosul is the last
:26:51. > :26:55.major target be cleared of Islamic State in Iraq. The combination of
:26:56. > :26:59.Allied air power has worked, why is he not sure it is working? Because
:27:00. > :27:05.we have seen difficulties in the past. But this was two weeks ago. It
:27:06. > :27:09.is essential that the work is done, both planning for the refugees as
:27:10. > :27:12.Rory Stewart referred to, but also in terms of reconstruction of the
:27:13. > :27:18.city and its community as you mentioned. These are vital. This was
:27:19. > :27:23.about the ability to make progress with Allied air power, special
:27:24. > :27:28.forces in Iraq, on the ground, do you accept so far that has a
:27:29. > :27:40.strategy that seems to be working to read Iraq of Islamic -- to read Iraq
:27:41. > :27:53.of Islamic State the question of the car began placement. Ulloa -- we
:27:54. > :27:55.can't be complacent. The problems they are creating where ever they
:27:56. > :28:01.are urged that we must continue to pursue them. This is the first time
:28:02. > :28:04.we have spoken to since you have become the Shadow Defence Secretary.
:28:05. > :28:09.I hope we will have a longer interview. Will Labour's next
:28:10. > :28:15.manifesto include a commitment to the renewal of Trident? It will We
:28:16. > :28:19.made that commitment in 2007, that is a firm commitment and we will
:28:20. > :28:22.honour that to our coalition allies and our industrial partners and that
:28:23. > :28:26.is the vote which was taken democratically and repeatedly has
:28:27. > :28:32.been reaffirmed by Labour conference and we are a democratic party vote
:28:33. > :28:38.up you have squared that with Jeremy Corbyn? He's in favour of democracy
:28:39. > :28:41.and he understands the situation, but we also want to push for the UK
:28:42. > :28:46.to play a much bigger role on the international stage on multilateral
:28:47. > :28:51.disarmament talks. You were very clear there, I thank you for that.
:28:52. > :28:55.Support for Trident will be in the next Labour manifesto. What has
:28:56. > :29:01.happened to Labour's review of Trident policy? That review has been
:29:02. > :29:06.taking place over the year, we had a very clear reaffirmation in the
:29:07. > :29:07.conference boat this year, we are reaffirming our commitment to
:29:08. > :29:14.Trident -- vote. The review can t Trident -- vote. The review can't
:29:15. > :29:17.change that? There is a process of review and a fair number of issues
:29:18. > :29:22.related to defence, all parties do this. Of course. The review can t
:29:23. > :29:26.this. Of course. The review can't change the commitment to Trident? We
:29:27. > :29:32.are not changing the commitment to Trident. Russia is now the main
:29:33. > :29:34.strategic threat to this country? It is a major strategic threat and we
:29:35. > :29:38.have got to work with our Nato allies very closely and make sure
:29:39. > :29:42.that we respond and that we do not let things pass. For example, we
:29:43. > :29:48.should be calling out Russia for the way it has been a bombing
:29:49. > :29:50.humanitarian aid and we should be taking them to international court
:29:51. > :29:58.over this, but we should also be strengthening sanctions, somewhat
:29:59. > :30:03.imposed over Ukraine. We try to do that, but the Italians wouldn't let
:30:04. > :30:04.us. The Italians did not want to participate in the European
:30:05. > :30:11.initiative but that doesn't stop individual countries for the Britain
:30:12. > :30:14.should step up? Yes, we should look at what is practical to impose.
:30:15. > :30:19.Thanks for joining us. Mosul is not the only major battle
:30:20. > :30:22.being waged in the Middle East. The city of Aleppo in northern Syria
:30:23. > :30:25.has seen some of the heaviest bombardment since Syria's
:30:26. > :30:28.five-year-long civil war began. This week Russian warships,
:30:29. > :30:32.in a deliberate show of power, sailed west through the English
:30:33. > :30:36.channel en route to Syria. Nato says it's Russia's "largest
:30:37. > :30:39.surface deployment" since the end of the Cold War in what is thought
:30:40. > :30:42.to be preparation for a final assault
:30:43. > :30:46.on the besieged city of Aleppo. In the city itself fighting
:30:47. > :30:50.resumed overnight - following a 3-day ceasefire -
:30:51. > :30:55.with more air strikes and heavy clashes in the city's
:30:56. > :30:58.rebel-held eastern districts. Almost 500 people have been
:30:59. > :31:01.killed and 2,000 injured since Syrian government forces,
:31:02. > :31:05.backed by Russian air strikes, This week Theresa May condemned
:31:06. > :31:12.Vladimir Putin's involvement in Syria, accusing Moscow
:31:13. > :31:15.of being behind "sickening atrocities" in support
:31:16. > :31:18.of President Assad's regime. But European leaders are divided
:31:19. > :31:22.on how to respond and, with the United States preoccupied
:31:23. > :31:25.with domestic politics, President Putin senses this
:31:26. > :31:28.is his moment to bring the Syrian I'm joined now by the BBC's former
:31:29. > :31:37.Diplomatic and Moscow Correspondent, Bridget Kendall, who is now Master
:31:38. > :31:50.of Peterhouse College in Cambridge. Welcome. Good to see you in the BBC
:31:51. > :31:56.studio again. Let me put up this satellite image of Aleppo here, to
:31:57. > :32:02.get an idea of the scale. It was the biggest city in Syria. It was the
:32:03. > :32:07.commercial capital and a huge cultural hub as well. Almost the New
:32:08. > :32:12.York of Syria, to give you an idea of its significance to the country.
:32:13. > :32:17.Let me show you now how it's been divided. The rebels are now in
:32:18. > :32:24.control of the eastern part, about eight miles long and three miles
:32:25. > :32:28.wide there, they're in purple. They are under great attacks still. Is it
:32:29. > :32:37.inevitable that that purple part falls to the regime? That is what
:32:38. > :32:42.President as Saad, the Russians and the Iranians hope. The fierce
:32:43. > :32:47.bombardments we have seen is part of that. I'm reminded very much in the
:32:48. > :32:52.Russian tactics of what happened in grudgingly in Chechnya in 2000, when
:32:53. > :32:58.the Russians said, a warning for all civilians to lead, and then they
:32:59. > :33:03.went ahead and they basically raised it to the ground. They are talking
:33:04. > :33:09.about Al Nusrah as being one of the rebel groups. They got rid of all of
:33:10. > :33:13.the terrorists. They talk about it being an Al-Qaeda offshoot. The
:33:14. > :33:17.purpose of going in is to get rid of them. You get the civilians out and
:33:18. > :33:22.then you take it. But this isn't like Chechnya. It is much more
:33:23. > :33:27.complex. We have seen an attempt to take Aleppo before, and then there
:33:28. > :33:31.was a rebel counter offensive. It's not so certain. And there are so
:33:32. > :33:35.many different parties involved. We have seen the alarm in the west of
:33:36. > :33:45.the extent of the civilian casualties. There have been
:33:46. > :33:47.rumblings in the west of, shouldn't the United States do something?
:33:48. > :33:51.Shouldn't they stop the Syrian air force? This Russian aircraft carrier
:33:52. > :33:57.steaming its way towards the Eastern Mediterranean is a symbolic gesture,
:33:58. > :34:03.both to its own people, but also to the West, to say, don't get involved
:34:04. > :34:09.in Aleppo if we go ahead. Don't try and stop us because we could up the
:34:10. > :34:13.ante. They have not been great visual pictures, because the
:34:14. > :34:20.aircraft carrier looks a bit clapped out, belching out smoke! If the
:34:21. > :34:24.rebel controlled area does fall it would be seen as a great victory for
:34:25. > :34:29.President as Saad and his Russian allies. What is the aim of Russia
:34:30. > :34:34.here? What would they then do, if Aleppo Falls? It is part of a plan
:34:35. > :34:40.that President Putin set out in his UN speech in 2014, before Russia
:34:41. > :34:44.went into Syria. The aim is to put President Assad back in charge.
:34:45. > :34:49.President Putin said this weekend that either is Assad in Damascus, or
:34:50. > :34:54.its Al Nusrah. There is nothing in between. They want to eliminate the
:34:55. > :34:59.argument for a moderate opposition. They want to make it plain that the
:35:00. > :35:07.only way to get a stable Syria is to have Assad back in charge. Even sue
:35:08. > :35:16.argue for a rump steak lit, leaving aside what is happening with IAS.
:35:17. > :35:20.They have already said they want to have an enlarged military presence
:35:21. > :35:28.at their bases. And they have a big naval base. It is. It is a chance to
:35:29. > :35:34.push for this when he sees the West is being distracted and divided.
:35:35. > :35:39.Europe and America, by elections and so on. Just before the US elections.
:35:40. > :35:44.The Americans are worried about that, Europeans are being distracted
:35:45. > :35:49.by Brexit. He can push to his maximum advantage now, before there
:35:50. > :35:59.is a new US president. If they do take that part of Aleppo, and that
:36:00. > :36:04.part of northern Syria, does Mr Putin want us to recognise, to
:36:05. > :36:10.admit, that that is now his sphere of influence? I think the rhetoric
:36:11. > :36:15.from the Russians is that they want the West to recognise that they are
:36:16. > :36:19.an equal powerful partner. It's not just the US that runs the writ in
:36:20. > :36:25.the Middle East. Russia is as important as it is. It is engaging
:36:26. > :36:30.with Saudi Arabia and has mended fences with Turkey. Syria is the
:36:31. > :36:35.place from which it can launch its message that it is a big player in
:36:36. > :36:40.the Middle East. Russia wants the West to understand that this isn't a
:36:41. > :36:45.country that was dismembered after the end of the Soviet Union and is
:36:46. > :36:47.now a week. It is back, and it is strong. That is an important
:36:48. > :36:51.message. Looking at the economy. strong. That is an important
:36:52. > :36:53.message. Looking at the economy It message. Looking at the economy. It
:36:54. > :36:59.is in recession. GDP has been falling, partly because of the price
:37:00. > :37:04.of oil. It is highly dependent on hydrocarbons, and is expected to
:37:05. > :37:09.fall again. Its people are falling again. People don't realise how
:37:10. > :37:16.small the Russian economy is. Its GDP is about the size of Italy's. It
:37:17. > :37:23.is smaller than the UK economy. Bigger than it was 15 or 20 years
:37:24. > :37:29.ago. But so is Britain's does it help to take people's mind of this?
:37:30. > :37:35.A huge shock to the Russian economy was a drop in the price of oil and a
:37:36. > :37:40.price of gas. A drop in the price of the ruble as well. This is hurting
:37:41. > :37:46.the people of Russia. On the one hand, it is the war in Syria, which
:37:47. > :37:51.is very important for Russia to sort out that part of the world and
:37:52. > :37:58.dispensed terrorists who might be danger to -- is dangerous to Russia.
:37:59. > :38:03.But he had also has presidential election is going up. They are
:38:04. > :38:05.supposed to be 2018, but some feel he will bring them forward to 2 17,
:38:06. > :38:10.he will bring them forward to 2017, because the economy is not doing so
:38:11. > :38:12.well. But you need a good story for the Russian people. Thank you very
:38:13. > :38:14.much. We say goodbye to viewers
:38:15. > :38:24.in Scotland who leave us now Hello and welcome to your
:38:25. > :38:26.local part of the show. More spending than ever before
:38:27. > :38:31.on the NHS, yet still acciddnt and emergency departments
:38:32. > :38:33.and maternity units We report on health managers' plans
:38:34. > :38:38.to find more than ?1 billion in savings.
:38:39. > :38:42.Labour Shadow Cabinet member and MP for Wansbeck, Ian Lavery,
:38:43. > :38:45.is here to talk about that. Alongside him, the Conservative MP
:38:46. > :38:47.for Thirsk and Malton, will a cash handout be enough
:38:48. > :38:54.to persuade householders to allow fracking for shale gas
:38:55. > :38:56.near their homes? Inflation up to 1% this week
:38:57. > :39:03.and likely to head higher with the rising price of petrol
:39:04. > :39:06.and food imports. Unemployment in the region
:39:07. > :39:08.has fallen, though - down 9,000 on the last quarter
:39:09. > :39:11.in the North East. There were falls too in the numbers
:39:12. > :39:13.claming Job Seekers' Allowance Ian Lavery, is there really
:39:14. > :39:19.a cause for concern here? Inflation is still historic`lly low
:39:20. > :39:22.and 1%, we would be celebrating another times
:39:23. > :39:24.if inflation was that low. Jobs figures show that our
:39:25. > :39:27.economy is in good shape? It doesn't show that the economy
:39:28. > :39:29.is in good shape. The reality, in context
:39:30. > :39:33.with regards to employment, we are still as a region
:39:34. > :39:36.the highest region for We are still the region
:39:37. > :39:44.where there is least employment, we are a blackspot for zero hours
:39:45. > :39:49.contracts, for part-time employment. We have got the lowest wages
:39:50. > :39:53.in the whole of the UK. Not really something
:39:54. > :39:58.we should be celebrating. But it's what type of employment
:39:59. > :40:11.we have here in the North E`st. And we are in a low-wage economy
:40:12. > :40:14.in a -- and spiralling down. And it will cause huge problems
:40:15. > :40:17.if there is a continued increase in inflation, an increase in prices
:40:18. > :40:24.for people who already... We have a record number of people
:40:25. > :40:27.in work claiming benefits Using food banks, we cannot do too
:40:28. > :40:30.much in terms of celebrating Kevin Hollinrake, that's
:40:31. > :40:33.the point, isn't it? With inflationary pressures growing,
:40:34. > :40:37.it will be the poorest, a lot of people in our
:40:38. > :40:39.region, who will suffer. Nationally, we are one
:40:40. > :40:41.of the fastest-growing economies Our economy was in recession
:40:42. > :40:45.in 2010, there has been a miracle There have been 2 million jobs
:40:46. > :40:52.created in the private Generally, record employment,
:40:53. > :40:55.record low unemployment. Do you expect that to continue
:40:56. > :41:00.with all the pressure is a head? Certainly, there are question marks
:41:01. > :41:02.over what our future relationship We need to get that right,
:41:03. > :41:06.to secure our job prospects, But at the moment, the economy
:41:07. > :41:12.is growing, it is growing a decent levels and we need to make
:41:13. > :41:16.sure that is the case. Clearly, the lowering
:41:17. > :41:18.of sterling in terms of world I'm sure those issues will be
:41:19. > :41:25.discussed many times over the next A protest to protect the local
:41:26. > :41:30.NHS began this weekend with marchers making their way
:41:31. > :41:32.from North Yorkshire They say hospital services
:41:33. > :41:35.in their area, including accident and emergency departments
:41:36. > :41:38.and maternity units, But as the NHS across the region
:41:39. > :41:42.looks to save money, The government says efficiencies
:41:43. > :41:46.are vital but denies We're marching from the hospital
:41:47. > :41:54.in Northallerton to Darlington Jo and her friends have become
:41:55. > :42:02.so concerned about what might happen to the services where they live
:42:03. > :42:05.they are marching from hospital All services in our NHS footprint
:42:06. > :42:11.area, which is the area that we are walking,
:42:12. > :42:15.are under threat. The NHS Trust bosses and CCGs have
:42:16. > :42:21.denied the existence of these documents but we have seen them,
:42:22. > :42:25.we know that we could end up I found out about this
:42:26. > :42:34.through googling and The NHS exec hasn't been sharing
:42:35. > :42:42.this with us. They haven't been open
:42:43. > :42:44.and transparent, as far What Jo and other campaigners
:42:45. > :42:54.are worried about are what hs known about sustainability
:42:55. > :42:55.and transformation plans. These have been drawn up
:42:56. > :42:57.for each health region, or footprint, across
:42:58. > :42:59.the country and have now bedn In the North East and Cumbrha,
:43:00. > :43:04.draft plans and other documents this programme has seen says that this
:43:05. > :43:07.NHS here will be more than ?1 billion over budget by 021
:43:08. > :43:10.if it doesn't make efficiency savings and change the way
:43:11. > :43:13.health care is delivered. On Teesside, that might mean
:43:14. > :43:16.the downgrading of accident and emergency units at either
:43:17. > :43:20.or both the North Tees Hosphtal in Stockton, or here
:43:21. > :43:25.at the Darlington Memorial Hospital. And across the wider Teesside area,
:43:26. > :43:28.the delivery of acute medicine and surgery,
:43:29. > :43:31.orthopaedics, gynaecology, maternity, neonatal,
:43:32. > :43:34.intensive care and paediatrhc This is going to have
:43:35. > :43:42.massive impact in my area. The North East is one of thd areas
:43:43. > :43:48.in the country that has the lowest life expectancy,
:43:49. > :43:50.the poorest health. These aren't savings, or efficiency,
:43:51. > :43:54.these are cuts to the NHS btdget at a time when, because of an ageing
:43:55. > :43:57.population and because of complex health needs, we need to have more
:43:58. > :44:02.spent on the NHS in the North East. This is going to have
:44:03. > :44:05.a devastating blow. We asked those behind the NHS
:44:06. > :44:07.sustainability and transforlation plans for Durham and Teesside
:44:08. > :44:12.for an interview, but they declined. We were also given only very limited
:44:13. > :44:15.information and details of their plans for health
:44:16. > :44:18.care in the area. But the Health Secretary told
:44:19. > :44:54.a select committee this week that a more efficient health service does
:44:55. > :44:57.not mean a worse one. What I don't accept is that in order
:44:58. > :45:00.to make those efficiency savings, you have to make changes that will
:45:01. > :45:08.impact negatively on patient care. And I think that there are of course
:45:09. > :45:12.those easy ways to make savings, which is to reduce the availability
:45:13. > :45:24.of care for patients and there is the harder way,
:45:25. > :45:27.but the right way, which is to ways that improve care and improve
:45:28. > :45:30.efficiency at the same time. With winter approaching,
:45:31. > :45:32.the NHS is under pressure. And in the longer term,
:45:33. > :45:35.what the NHS does and what hs spent on it is once more becoming a battle
:45:36. > :45:38.ground between the Well, the Prime Minister was this
:45:39. > :45:41.week asked to intervene to save a maternity unit
:45:42. > :45:43.in Cumbria from closure. Copeland's MP Jamie Reed urged
:45:44. > :45:46.Theresa May to take up the hssue. Removal of 24-hour consultant-led
:45:47. > :45:48.maternity services from the West Cumbria Hospital
:45:49. > :45:51.in Whitehaven will cost livds. And this is a decision
:45:52. > :45:54.which ultimately, the government Will the Prime Minister please
:45:55. > :45:58.commit today to visit my constituency to see what the effect
:45:59. > :46:01.of this decision will be upon West Cumbrian families,
:46:02. > :46:04.women and children. I say to the honourable gentleman,
:46:05. > :46:10.I recognise that this is not the first time he has
:46:11. > :46:12.raised his concerns in relation Can I say to him that the point of
:46:13. > :46:18.the way in which we are approaching this is that decisions are taken
:46:19. > :46:20.and generated from the local level. It is at the local area
:46:21. > :46:23.that they will be looking at the services that
:46:24. > :46:26.are necessary for people. Kevin Hollinrake, called
:46:27. > :46:29.deficiencies, savings, ?1 billion that needs to be found
:46:30. > :46:40.in an overstretched health service. As Labour says, that sounds
:46:41. > :46:42.like a crisis. I want to take issue with one
:46:43. > :46:45.of the comments by Ian Wright. There is record amounts of spending
:46:46. > :46:49.going into the health service. More than any other political
:46:50. > :46:53.party has committed to. Also, the money spent
:46:54. > :46:55.in the North East is far greater per person than is spent
:46:56. > :46:57.in North Yorkshire. So what we do need to make sure
:46:58. > :47:00.is that taxpayers' money So it is quite right,
:47:01. > :47:04.within the NHS, the way it's managed, that services come
:47:05. > :47:06.together, whether that be hdalth trusts, local authorities
:47:07. > :47:10.or the Clinical Commissioning Groups which commission the care,
:47:11. > :47:13.to make sure they are using that But ?1 billion is an awful
:47:14. > :47:20.lot of money. And the suspicion is,
:47:21. > :47:22.whatever Jeremy Hunt says, You will see accident
:47:23. > :47:25.and emergency services going. In some of those documents that
:47:26. > :47:35.were leaks, there were suggestions -- in some of those documents that
:47:36. > :47:41.were leaked, The budget is not being cut
:47:42. > :47:47.but the NHS needs to work This is taxpayers' money,
:47:48. > :47:50.this is patient care. It is quite right that we look
:47:51. > :47:53.to make efficiencies and work The financial figures are there
:47:54. > :48:02.more money is going in. The problem is that Labour's answer
:48:03. > :48:05.appears to be don't close anything, I think it's important that we keep
:48:06. > :48:10.what we got in the NHS. the reality is the savings, or cuts,
:48:11. > :48:13.in real terms to the NHS, what it will result in in otr area
:48:14. > :48:16.is closure is of A E, closures of maternity units and it
:48:17. > :48:19.might even mean closures The Northumberland, Tyne
:48:20. > :48:24.and Wear Trust by 2021 is looking If they have got that deficht,
:48:25. > :48:32.how on earth can they cut that without cutting services
:48:33. > :48:36.and closing hospitals? Because as Kevin Hollinrake says,
:48:37. > :48:42.the government is putting more money The government are not putting more
:48:43. > :48:55.money in the NHS in real terms. . When we look at the situation,
:48:56. > :48:57.these five-year plans... These footprints, these secret
:48:58. > :49:00.meetings which are taking place these meetings where you cannot get
:49:01. > :49:02.sight of any minutes, where there isn't any
:49:03. > :49:04.accountability, there isn't any transparency within these
:49:05. > :49:07.footprints committees, And the general public
:49:08. > :49:17.are loose any confidence... -- the general public are losing
:49:18. > :49:20.confidence. There is real terms growth in NHS
:49:21. > :49:24.spending from central government and the vicious need to Google that,
:49:25. > :49:28.Google King 's fund, an independent The only place that has had real
:49:29. > :49:42.terms cuts is Wales, which hs run Let me raise one issue
:49:43. > :49:45.which Labour did raise. It's very difficult for members
:49:46. > :49:49.of the public to try and ways through, and even the journ`list,
:49:50. > :49:52.to find out what is going on with these proposals
:49:53. > :49:53.and these trust. And that can lead to scare stories
:49:54. > :49:56.but also reality is being hhdden. These proposals were published
:49:57. > :49:59.in December, the idea for those were published
:50:00. > :50:02.in December 2015 by the NHS. But the trust are not telling us
:50:03. > :50:06.what they are proposing? Jeremy Hunt, when he came up
:50:07. > :50:08.to the hospital in Cramlington on a private visit, wouldn't talk
:50:09. > :50:11.to journalists and ended up interviewing himself
:50:12. > :50:12.on social media. This is going into consultation
:50:13. > :50:14.I've had into this consultation. -- I have had input into thhs
:50:15. > :50:27.consultation. and the commissioning groups should
:50:28. > :50:31.listen, as should central government, to make sure th`t we get
:50:32. > :50:35.this right and we don't make cuts where that will cost lives,
:50:36. > :50:37.but is absolutely right that we have an efficient hdalth
:50:38. > :50:39.service and that is What is the answer, Ian Lavdry?
:50:40. > :50:47.It can't just be about more money. The sustainability and
:50:48. > :50:50.transformation five-year pl`ns, there are 44 footprints
:50:51. > :50:52.across the country. They are not consulting
:50:53. > :50:58.with anybody, they are not providing any evidence.
:50:59. > :51:00.There is no transparency. Is that the way to operate such
:51:01. > :51:02.a great institution? The Labour Party is quite fhrm
:51:03. > :51:06.and the polls show that the general public believe that the NHS is much
:51:07. > :51:09.safer in the hands When not in the business of looking
:51:10. > :51:14.to the cut the budget for the NHS... Kevin Hollinrake, if Theresa May
:51:15. > :51:17.sticks to her decision that she doesn't want to put any
:51:18. > :51:20.more money into the NHS, any extra, there will be
:51:21. > :51:23.a winter crisis, won't that? Well, of course we have got to make
:51:24. > :51:25.sure that the efficiencies, We committed to a budget colmitment
:51:26. > :51:35.to the NHS leading through the 2020 that was exactly
:51:36. > :51:38.what Simon Stephens asked for, who was the Chief
:51:39. > :51:39.Executive of the NHS. She has said that we have to work
:51:40. > :51:42.within that budget. Beyond that, we have to look again
:51:43. > :51:47.at health services and at adult social care to make sure th`t we
:51:48. > :51:50.have a properly funded system. Now, we know there are plenty
:51:51. > :51:55.of protests when people find an open cast coal mine or a wind farm
:51:56. > :51:58.is planned near their homes. But to make it more palatable,
:51:59. > :52:01.it's long been the case that areas affected by such planning decisions
:52:02. > :52:04.receive compensation to bendfit Well, the Government is taking that
:52:05. > :52:08.idea a stage further when it comes to the controversial issue
:52:09. > :52:10.of drilling for shale gas - High in the Durham Dales,
:52:11. > :52:15.these turbines have been Generating power and clocking up
:52:16. > :52:18.cash for nearby Esh Winning. The village community centrd's
:52:19. > :52:22.kitchen is the latest to be kitted out with cash from a fund sdt up
:52:23. > :52:25.by the wind farm developer. In the last year alone,
:52:26. > :52:28.?200,000 from such communitx benefit funds has been doled
:52:29. > :52:32.out in County Durham. I think it's really important that
:52:33. > :52:34.local communities who have in their environment,
:52:35. > :52:37.in this case, renewable energy sources, contributing
:52:38. > :52:41.to the national need for renewable energy, they receive
:52:42. > :52:44.some benefits for that. And because these benefit ftnds
:52:45. > :52:47.are awarded from a community panel, it is the community panel
:52:48. > :52:50.that make the decision, it's a great way for
:52:51. > :52:52.the local community to take But can cash really
:52:53. > :53:03.over, controversy? Protesters hoping to hold plans
:53:04. > :53:08.to extract shale gas They failed and now
:53:09. > :53:19.fracking, as some call it, Behind those green gates
:53:20. > :53:22.are the sites that have Where the shale gas
:53:23. > :53:25.will be extracted. But the government says communities
:53:26. > :53:27.around here could share in this Bit like the wind farms,
:53:28. > :53:31.proceeds from shale gas extraction But in nearby Kirby Misperton,
:53:32. > :53:35.opposition seems undimmed. There may be more
:53:36. > :53:38.temptation on the way. To corrupt a famous catchphrase
:53:39. > :53:40.the government doesn't just want to give communities this
:53:41. > :53:42.cheque, it is also considerhng Consulting on whether individual
:53:43. > :53:49.householders get up to ?20,000 The fund will get 10% of the tax
:53:50. > :53:57.revenues from shale gas. ?20,000 to accept fracking near your
:53:58. > :54:08.home, Deal or no Deal? Definitely no Deal.
:54:09. > :54:09.You can keep it. I think it's a cynical ploy, it s
:54:10. > :54:13.a bribe to try to get people onside. Firstly, you could get to ?20,0 0,
:54:14. > :54:20.but you have to price will fall. -- but you will house price will
:54:21. > :54:27.fall. -- but your house price. Secondly, it's very poor
:54:28. > :54:29.compensation for the risks that people are going
:54:30. > :54:32.to face from these wells. Their health and their well,being,
:54:33. > :54:34.implications of fracking. It's an unknown industry
:54:35. > :54:35.in this country, still. This holiday complex
:54:36. > :54:38.is run by Lorraine. She sees no problem
:54:39. > :54:41.in the communities or individuals benefiting from an industry
:54:42. > :54:42.she welcomes. If they are near a shale gas
:54:43. > :54:46.well and they've got to have the inconvenience
:54:47. > :54:48.of trucks going past for a temporary amount of time,
:54:49. > :54:50.then why shouldn't And imagine the trade that `ll this
:54:51. > :54:55.activity would bring for all the different businesses
:54:56. > :54:57.in this area. The government consultation on how
:54:58. > :55:00.the Shale Welfare Fund But so far, there are plentx
:55:01. > :55:05.of people in Ryedale who are not yet persuaded their community
:55:06. > :55:14.will be better off. Kevin Hollinrake, the protesters
:55:15. > :55:18.are right, this is bribery? The decision to push ahead
:55:19. > :55:22.with shale gas exploration was taken in Parliament by 2015,
:55:23. > :55:24.passed by a huge majority, 250 beds, because it is
:55:25. > :55:32.a national opportunity. 22 million homes in the UK tse gas
:55:33. > :55:37.to heat their homes. So if we've got it
:55:38. > :55:40.and we can produce it, Because if you import it,
:55:41. > :55:46.then you export jobs. Now, of course when it comes local
:55:47. > :55:49.at that point, some people are bound to have concerns and tempor`rily
:55:50. > :55:51.have some inconvenience in terms of noise pollution, light pollution,
:55:52. > :55:53.traffic movements... So individual payments are fine
:55:54. > :55:55.from your point of view? I think it's right that local people
:55:56. > :55:58.who suffer the inconvenient should But it's for inconvenience,
:55:59. > :56:05.not for pollution I think those are scare stories that
:56:06. > :56:08.are absolutely without foundation. The particular development
:56:09. > :56:10.in your constituency in Kirby Misperton,
:56:11. > :56:12.is subject to a High Court How confident are you that it
:56:13. > :56:15.will still go ahead. But one thing viewers should
:56:16. > :56:19.look at, in your clip, you were studied in front
:56:20. > :56:26.of what is actually a gas wdll pad. And all you can see
:56:27. > :56:33.is a collection of trees. That will not industrialise
:56:34. > :56:35.the countryside in Ryedale. If it did, or there was a likelihood
:56:36. > :56:38.that it would, I was up -- Ian Lavery, the principle
:56:39. > :56:43.is the same, why shouldn't I'm not sure that anybody living
:56:44. > :56:47.next to an opencast mine has Individuals haven't
:56:48. > :56:50.as yet, but you agree The government came up inithally
:56:51. > :56:56.with the compensation in terms of the shale wealth fund
:56:57. > :56:59.for the communities to prob`bly use for infrastructure programmds,
:57:00. > :57:03.skills and development. They have changed their view now
:57:04. > :57:09.because that was not widely received in the communities and now
:57:10. > :57:12.they are trying to bribe individuals, but neighbour
:57:13. > :57:14.against neighbour, friend Well, Labour was lukewarm
:57:15. > :57:20.on fracking, now it And yet, as Kevin Hollinrake says,
:57:21. > :57:25.a lot of imported gas, why not Well I was on the energy select
:57:26. > :57:30.committee for five years I gave fracking a chance,
:57:31. > :57:37.by the way, I thought it was important...
:57:38. > :57:39.Your party doesn't. What is really important is
:57:40. > :57:42.that we listen to what commtnities And it's quite obvious that
:57:43. > :57:46.communities want no part What happened to localism
:57:47. > :57:49.in the Conservative Party? He has made that same point
:57:50. > :57:56.for housing development, We as MPs get complaints
:57:57. > :57:59.about all these things. I understand that communitids
:58:00. > :58:02.are concerned and I have worked very hard over the last 18 months to meet
:58:03. > :58:05.those concerns, to reduce the numbers of well pads,
:58:06. > :58:08.to make sure we have the proper regulations in place
:58:09. > :58:09.and the supervision. Because that is what they
:58:10. > :58:11.are concerned about. But there are too many scard
:58:12. > :58:13.stories going around. Now, contrasting fortunes for
:58:14. > :58:20.libraries in the region this week. And a visit to Westminster
:58:21. > :58:23.for council leaders on Teesside Just a couple of the stories making
:58:24. > :58:26.the news in our regular Council leaders in the Tees Valley
:58:27. > :58:35.have met Local Government Secretary Sajid Javid to the final totches
:58:36. > :58:39.to the devolution deal. The Minister says
:58:40. > :58:41.Teesside will benefit. He criticised those other
:58:42. > :58:43.counties in the North East And that's really bad for local
:58:44. > :58:50.people in terms of jobs and growth Berwick MP Anne Marie Trevelyan has
:58:51. > :58:55.told a Westminster debate that changes to the way homes
:58:56. > :58:57.are provided for military personnel could drive families away from bases
:58:58. > :59:01.into privately rented homes, increasing isolation
:59:02. > :59:04.and damaging morale. Many families have been sayhng to me
:59:05. > :59:07.this would be the last straw, A public hearing is taking place
:59:08. > :59:10.in Carlisle about planned boundary changes which could see West Cumbria
:59:11. > :59:18.lose a parliamentary seat. And finally, The Word,
:59:19. > :59:20.a ?1.6 million library and cultural It's part of South Tyneside
:59:21. > :59:24.Council's plan to regenerate In Sunderland, councillors blamed
:59:25. > :59:27.government cuts for the closure of their city centre
:59:28. > :59:44.library and its relocation Ian Lavery, to bring up the
:59:45. > :59:45.libraries. To Labour councils, different outcomes. South Tyneside
:59:46. > :59:50.has a nice new one and Sunddrland has a nice new one and Sunddrland
:59:51. > :59:53.bemoaning removing theirs. Doesn't it show that this is local
:59:54. > :59:58.decision-making, not blaming government cuts? We have to look at
:59:59. > :00:03.government cuts. When you look at the grand system which in Tory hails
:00:04. > :00:10.councils, they have had a cut of councils, they have had a cut of
:00:11. > :00:17.something like ?60 per household. In the Labour seat,, it is nearly
:00:18. > :00:24.300... Still a lot of money coming here rather than the south. I feel
:00:25. > :00:28.really sorry for these councils. Councillors do not go into the
:00:29. > :00:31.business of running local authorities to keep cutting and
:00:32. > :00:33.cutting. Libraries are very important. I think they havd got
:00:34. > :00:33.cutting. Libraries are very important. I think they have got a
:00:34. > :00:39.important. I think they havd got a duty to look at where they needed
:00:40. > :00:44.pay... They are so important, I need to ask the other guest! This is
:00:45. > :00:50.happening in your area. Libraries handed the volunteers. My area as
:00:51. > :00:55.well as suffering from cuts. You may be point that my local area gets a
:00:56. > :01:00.lot less from central government grant than urban areas. We get a
:01:01. > :01:03.worse deal but we are still getting cuts. The library services hn terms
:01:04. > :01:05.cuts. The library services in terms of their budgets have been cut. We
:01:06. > :01:10.haven't seen any closures ydt. haven't seen any closures yet.
:01:11. > :01:14.Community groups are setting in which is good. But we are still in
:01:15. > :01:15.this country is spending ?70 billion a year more than...
:01:16. > :01:18.And that's about it from us for this week.
:01:19. > :01:28.So, Brexit, airports, Calais and the chances
:01:29. > :01:51.With what Rory Stewart was saying there, it is clear that Islamic
:01:52. > :01:57.State is losing territory in Iraq now, and could come under pressure
:01:58. > :02:05.in Syria as well. It used to control a whole swathe of the coast of
:02:06. > :02:09.Libya, and is now down to a small area of Sirte in Libya. But
:02:10. > :02:14.curiously, it could make them more dangerous here if they are being
:02:15. > :02:19.driven out of the Maghreb and the Levant, they could be more dangerous
:02:20. > :02:25.here. Discuss. That was a very interesting admission from a
:02:26. > :02:30.government minister, of all people, and a well-informed one. Chasing
:02:31. > :02:34.Isis around the Middle East is about... Like chasing Al-Qaeda
:02:35. > :02:44.around Afghanistan and Pakistan. You smash them somewhere, and they pop
:02:45. > :02:51.up somewhere else. He is right to warn that these guys will go
:02:52. > :03:00.somewhere. And it may well be, in Sirte, for example, across the magic
:03:01. > :03:05.oration -- across the Mediterranean into Italy. A lot of the foreign
:03:06. > :03:12.fighters in Mosul have already gone, we heard, which raises the question,
:03:13. > :03:16.to where? I think it is quite right for government ministers to warn
:03:17. > :03:21.that it might have repercussions here. We have been involved in this,
:03:22. > :03:26.with full public consent, as far as we can tell. If it doesn't happen,
:03:27. > :03:32.if there are horrors and outrages here and in the rest of Europe,
:03:33. > :03:36.that's fine. If it does happen, at least the government is prepared. We
:03:37. > :03:47.knew surprised about how categorical Nia Griffith was? She was
:03:48. > :03:53.categorical about support for the Allied action in Iraq, and
:03:54. > :03:58.categorical about Russia. So much so that perhaps written should take
:03:59. > :04:03.tougher sanctions on its own, even if it can't get the Europeans to
:04:04. > :04:08.fall in line. I found that interesting. I was surprised by
:04:09. > :04:12.that. Tom may be right that Rory said more than perhaps he was
:04:13. > :04:17.intending, but I thought that some of what she said sounded politically
:04:18. > :04:22.imprudent in the current context of the Labour Party. I'm not sure she
:04:23. > :04:27.cleared those lines with the Labour office. I'm not sure she and Jeremy
:04:28. > :04:31.are in the same place about it. I'm not sure there is that much
:04:32. > :04:35.leadership. People at the moment get out there and say what they think
:04:36. > :04:41.it's right for the party. She sounded dead right to me. Whether it
:04:42. > :04:49.is ill-advised or not, people should answer... I want to move on, because
:04:50. > :04:52.Brexit never goes away. This week we saw Hilary Benn, former Shadow
:04:53. > :04:56.Foreign Secretary. He is going to be the chair of the select committee in
:04:57. > :05:00.the Commons which will monitor the Department for Brexit. All sorts of
:05:01. > :05:01.people will be coming to give testimony and so one. Let's hear
:05:02. > :05:04.what he told Andrew Marr. I think it will be very important
:05:05. > :05:07.for the government to indicate that if it is not possible within the two
:05:08. > :05:11.years provided for by Article 5 to negotiate both our withdrawal
:05:12. > :05:13.agreement and a new trading relationship, market access,
:05:14. > :05:15.including for services, 80% of our economy, million jobs,
:05:16. > :05:17.in financial services, that it should tell the House
:05:18. > :05:20.of Commons that it will seek a transitional arrangement
:05:21. > :05:32.with the European Union. If the deal is not done at the end
:05:33. > :05:38.of the two-year Article 50 process, would the government go for an
:05:39. > :05:43.interim agreement, or would it fall back on WTO, World Trade
:05:44. > :05:46.Organisation, Rawls? My understanding is the article 15
:05:47. > :05:50.negotiation doesn't specifically include what Britain's future
:05:51. > :05:55.trading relationship with the EU would be. It is perfectly possible
:05:56. > :06:00.that Article 50 could be triggered, and after two years we don't have a
:06:01. > :06:13.trade deal, but the trade deal negotiations are ongoing when we are
:06:14. > :06:15.outside the EU. But the trade deal negotiations are the most important
:06:16. > :06:17.thing. If Article 50 doesn't cover it, what is it about? Absolutely
:06:18. > :06:22.essential. The trade deal with Canada has taken nine years, and now
:06:23. > :06:32.it looks like it is fading, because of the Walloons. Just one small part
:06:33. > :06:37.of the country. If you cannot do a free-trade deal with Canada, a
:06:38. > :06:41.progressive, social Democratic Canada, who can the EU do a trade
:06:42. > :06:46.deal with? You would think it would be easy with us, because we have all
:06:47. > :06:50.of the level playing field agreements in place. You would hope
:06:51. > :06:54.it would be easier, but it may not be, because in the end, it will
:06:55. > :07:04.hinge on the single market and if we are in or out. If we are in, can we
:07:05. > :07:07.have a small break on immigration? It looks like not. What is
:07:08. > :07:11.interesting about the opinion polls is, in the last two opinion polls
:07:12. > :07:15.there was a significant change in public opinion, where people are now
:07:16. > :07:20.saying they think that actually trade, the economy, the single
:07:21. > :07:24.market is more important than immigration. If it is really true,
:07:25. > :07:29.as the observer is reporting today, that banks are on the move, and in a
:07:30. > :07:34.year's time there could be a significant collapse in the income
:07:35. > :07:46.we get from finance, the income that the Treasury gets, then public
:07:47. > :07:48.opinion might change. They may say, we don't want more immigration, but
:07:49. > :07:54.this isn't a price worth paying. Everything tends to be seen through
:07:55. > :08:00.the Brexit lens at the moment. Things are not always as they seem.
:08:01. > :08:01.The Canadian- EU free trade agreement was about increasing free
:08:02. > :08:06.trade between the EU and Canada, and trade between the EU and Canada and
:08:07. > :08:10.therefore subject to the ratification of all members. Any
:08:11. > :08:15.deal we do will not give us the same access we have at the moment. The
:08:16. > :08:22.question is, how much will it be diminished? It may not be subject to
:08:23. > :08:24.the same ratification process. Absolutely right. Another
:08:25. > :08:31.unbelievably technical point that we still don't know is, if we can get
:08:32. > :08:35.this free-trade deal with the EU at the same time as our Brexit talks
:08:36. > :08:44.and deal, the divorce deal as well as the remarriage deal, then one
:08:45. > :08:52.gets signed off by QM V. The trade deal may still need all 28, all 27,
:08:53. > :08:59.including the people from the Walloons. And the MEPs. The majority
:09:00. > :09:02.of parliament. This is exactly why Theresa May would like the
:09:03. > :09:06.transitional deal to push this one deeper. I was surprised to hear
:09:07. > :09:11.Hilary Benn pushing this line this morning. The remainers have been all
:09:12. > :09:16.over the place. They wanted a vote after Article 50 had been triggered
:09:17. > :09:24.about the deal. Then they wanted a vote before Article 50. Now they are
:09:25. > :09:28.talking about a vote before article Article 50 is triggered about a
:09:29. > :09:33.trade deal. They need to make up their minds about what it is they
:09:34. > :09:39.are pushing for, and what their best hope of obstructing Brexit is, and
:09:40. > :09:44.stick with it. Something else we see through the Brexit lens, which isn't
:09:45. > :09:47.always helpful, is Calais. The French bulldozers will move in
:09:48. > :09:53.tomorrow. We will see some pretty disturbing scenes on the TV. We will
:09:54. > :09:57.see some horrible scenes. The government has handled this very
:09:58. > :10:03.badly. Having passed an amendment in April saying we would take something
:10:04. > :10:06.like 3000 children, a lot of those children have disappeared. Save the
:10:07. > :10:10.Children, one of the charities there, are very worried that people
:10:11. > :10:18.traffickers have been in there, and a lot of those children have
:10:19. > :10:22.vanished. We haven't sent social workers in. No preparations have
:10:23. > :10:29.been made what ever. You are raising an interesting point. We don't know
:10:30. > :10:33.how many we are meant to be taking. The huge argument has arisen over
:10:34. > :10:40.what the age is of some of the ones coming in. Is this another problem
:10:41. > :10:45.for the Home Office? To some extent. Didn't Theresa May 's too well to
:10:46. > :10:49.survive six weeks of this? Amber Rudd has been there for three
:10:50. > :10:53.months. It is clear that the Home Office didn't prepare for this. They
:10:54. > :11:01.didn't prepare for the age verification or when it will go. It
:11:02. > :11:07.needs to be an perfect. We don't know how many we will take, because
:11:08. > :11:11.the Home Office will not say. I want to talk about airport capacity, but
:11:12. > :11:16.I won't, because I don't think we have anything to say about it until
:11:17. > :11:21.the statement on Tuesday from Transport Minister Grayling. When
:11:22. > :11:24.you look at the polls and see the decision on airport runway expansion
:11:25. > :11:29.being kicked into the long grass for a year, are we heading for an early
:11:30. > :11:34.election next year or not? I think Theresa May will do everything she
:11:35. > :11:41.can to avoid it. If there is an election before 2020, it is bound to
:11:42. > :11:44.be about Europe, and that is a much harder case for her to win than just
:11:45. > :11:49.a question of who is the best Prime Minister. She will have a tough
:11:50. > :11:54.time, because it will be a general election about in or out of the
:11:55. > :11:59.single market. Half of her party will peel away. How do she conduct a
:12:00. > :12:04.general election when the likes of Anna Soubry will not stand on the
:12:05. > :12:14.same platform? It will be difficult. But she may reach such a stalemate
:12:15. > :12:16.that she just calls one. No general election next year because it will
:12:17. > :12:20.split the Tory party. There will be won in 2019 when she cannot get
:12:21. > :12:25.Brexit through the House of Commons. You really can have too much of a
:12:26. > :12:30.good thing. I just want to show a little clip of the former Shadow
:12:31. > :12:33.Chancellor, Ed Balls, from Strictly last night. Let's just watch this.
:12:34. > :12:46.There he is. Where is the hand? That is the
:12:47. > :12:53.worrying bit! We will no longer be saying that Ed Balls is a safe pair
:12:54. > :12:58.of hands! Can we agree on that? Remarkable that he was once the man
:12:59. > :13:06.most feared by David Cameron! Labour leader 2021. He has hit popular
:13:07. > :13:12.culture in the way that many few politicians do. Charm, gusto,
:13:13. > :13:19.bravery, no worries about being embarrassed. All the things that you
:13:20. > :13:22.don't like about being a politician. We have run out of time. You can get
:13:23. > :13:25.it on social media. Jo Coburn will be back
:13:26. > :13:27.with the Daily Politics tomorrow And I'll be back here next
:13:28. > :13:31.Sunday at the same time. Remember if it's Sunday,
:13:32. > :14:04.it's the Sunday Politics. Everyone's living these
:14:05. > :14:06.amazing lives, You're like a...
:14:07. > :14:17.Different person? Delve deeper.
:14:18. > :14:27.Ordinary Lives continues... They have something on me
:14:28. > :14:28.that I can actually remember. They have something on me
:14:29. > :14:32.that I can actually remember. The final chapter between
:14:33. > :14:37.Gibson and Spector.