:00:38. > :00:42.It's Sunday morning and this is the Sunday Politics.
:00:43. > :00:45.A row has broken out between Number Ten and former
:00:46. > :00:48.Cabinet minister Nicky Morgan over Brexit and, believe it or not,
:00:49. > :00:52.the price of Theresa May's leather trousers.
:00:53. > :00:55.I feel as though I'm one of the people that
:00:56. > :00:58.If you do that, you are likely to attract attention,
:00:59. > :01:10.It's not just Nicky Morgan making life difficult
:01:11. > :01:13.for the Prime Minister - we'll be taking a look at the rest
:01:14. > :01:16.Fully paid-up rebel Ken Clarke joins us live.
:01:17. > :01:18.Protestors disrupted a speech by Jeremy Corbyn yesterday,
:01:19. > :01:20.but is his biggest problem Labour's miserable performance
:01:21. > :01:26.Here... and Corbyn critic Chris Leslie
:01:27. > :01:29.Why do children in the South have better prospects than those living
:01:30. > :01:33.And claims air pollution in parts of the region are
:01:34. > :01:53.think of it as an early Christmas present from us.
:01:54. > :01:55.We guarantee you won't be disappointed.
:01:56. > :01:56.And speaking of guaranteed disappointments - I'm joined
:01:57. > :01:59.by three of the busiest little elves in political journalism.
:02:00. > :02:01.It's Iain Martin, Polly Toynbee and Tom Newton Dunn.
:02:02. > :02:08.So, we knew relations between Theresa May and some
:02:09. > :02:14.of her backbenchers over Europe weren't exactly a bed of roses.
:02:15. > :02:20.But signs of how fractious things are getting come courtesy of this
:02:21. > :02:23.morning's Mail on Sunday which has the details of a series of texts
:02:24. > :02:26.from one of Mrs May's senior advisers to and concerning
:02:27. > :02:31.the former Cabinet minister Nicky Morgan.
:02:32. > :02:35.Mrs Morgan is one of those arguing for a so-called soft Brexit,
:02:36. > :02:38.and has been pressing the PM to reveal more of her negotiation
:02:39. > :02:44.She's also apparently irked Downing Street by questioning
:02:45. > :02:52.Mrs May's decision to purchase and be photographed in a ?995 pair
:02:53. > :02:57.She said she had "never spent that much money on anything apart
:02:58. > :03:07.Mrs Morgan was due to attend a meeting at Number 10 this week
:03:08. > :03:11.But that invitation seems to be off, after a fairly extraordinary
:03:12. > :03:13.argument by text message with Mrs May's joint chief
:03:14. > :03:23.She texted the MP Alistair Burt, another of those arguing
:03:24. > :03:30.for a so-called soft Brexit, cancelling Nicky Morgan's invitation
:03:31. > :03:34.and telling him to not "bring that woman to Number Ten again".
:03:35. > :03:36.The following day Nicky Morgan texted Fiona Hill, saying
:03:37. > :03:39."If you don't like something I have said or done, please
:03:40. > :03:53.If you don't want my views in future meetings you need to tell them."
:03:54. > :03:58.Shortly afterwards she received the reply "Well, he just did.
:03:59. > :04:02.And according to the Mail, Mrs Morgan, who you'll see
:04:03. > :04:05.in our film shortly, has now been formally banned
:04:06. > :04:21.So, Tom, much ado about nothing or telling you about the underlying
:04:22. > :04:24.tensions over Brexit? Both, if I am allowed to choose both. It says
:04:25. > :04:28.something about British politics today, that this is the most
:04:29. > :04:32.important thing we can find to talk about, because the Government are
:04:33. > :04:34.not giving us anything to talk about cs especially on Brexit because they
:04:35. > :04:40.don't have a plan as we know. There is is a lot of truth that are being
:04:41. > :04:44.spoken from this row, one is that Mrs May comes into Downing Street
:04:45. > :04:48.with a lot of baggage including spectacular fall outs with Cabinet
:04:49. > :04:55.Ministers in the past. Nicky Morgan being one. We heard about the row
:04:56. > :05:00.over banning children from school. She fell out with Boris Johnson, so,
:05:01. > :05:07.she then enters Number Ten with history. When you are in Number Ten
:05:08. > :05:15.you start, you cannot be controversial and my way but the
:05:16. > :05:19.high way, which is why Fiona Hill kept Theresa May in the Home Office.
:05:20. > :05:25.You need to behave differently in the top job. It is surprising Nicky
:05:26. > :05:31.Morgan hats taken such a robust line. She seemed such a gentle soul
:05:32. > :05:36.as a minister. She did, Brexit has done funny things to people.
:05:37. > :05:40.Everything has been shaken up. It reveals really how paranoid they
:05:41. > :05:46.are, I mean you cannot have a situation really in which the, in
:05:47. > :05:52.which you know, Number Ten has got realise if the Prime Minister's
:05:53. > :05:56.entire stick is her authenticity and incredible connection, which is
:05:57. > :06:01.genuine, with voters outside the Metropolitan bubble, when she
:06:02. > :06:05.chooses to wear ?995 leather trousers you have to anticipate that
:06:06. > :06:09.journalists and MPs are going to take the mickey, that is how life
:06:10. > :06:13.works, but I think they are trying to run Number Ten as they ran the
:06:14. > :06:17.Home Office, and you see that in the rows they have had with Mark Carney
:06:18. > :06:22.and Boris Johnson this week, now you might be able to run one Government
:06:23. > :06:26.department in that control freakish way but not Government will hold
:06:27. > :06:29.together for too long, if it is run in that fashion. By try doing the
:06:30. > :06:35.whole Government like one department. This is just the start,
:06:36. > :06:41.Polly, we are still several months away from triggering Article 50. We,
:06:42. > :06:46.The Tory party is split down the middle, the thing that mattered most
:06:47. > :06:50.to the nation since the last war, it is not frivolous. It may look as if
:06:51. > :06:56.it is about trousers, it is about the most serious thing. What was
:06:57. > :07:01.split down the middle? Aren't the Euro-files and the Eurosceptics used
:07:02. > :07:06.to be the outliers, it is now the Europhiles, it is not a split down
:07:07. > :07:10.the middle. They won't vote against Brexit but they will, I think exert
:07:11. > :07:14.the maximum influence they can, to make sure that it is not a Brexit, a
:07:15. > :07:18.self-harming Brexit, to make sure that the country understand, when it
:07:19. > :07:23.comes to that point, that there may be really hard decision to make, do
:07:24. > :07:29.you want a real economic damage to be done to the country, to your own
:07:30. > :07:33.wallet, in, in exchange for being able to stop free movement or is
:07:34. > :07:37.that trade off in the end going to be just too expensive? We have seen
:07:38. > :07:43.polls suggesting people are beginning to move, and not willing,
:07:44. > :07:47.a poll out now saying people wouldn't be willing to sacrifice any
:07:48. > :07:50.money at all, for the sake of stopping immigration. So if itself
:07:51. > :07:58.comes to that trade off, the people are going to need to be confronted
:07:59. > :08:01.with that choice. The Irony is, I think the Tories are in the most
:08:02. > :08:07.exceptionally strong position, I mean what is happening here is that
:08:08. > :08:12.British politics is being realigned and remade along leave and remain
:08:13. > :08:19.lines, if the Prime Minister's luck hold, the Tories are looking at
:08:20. > :08:23.being somewhere 45, 46, 47% of the vote with an opposition split
:08:24. > :08:26.between a far left Labour Party and depleted Liberal Democrats, that
:08:27. > :08:32.sound like a recipe for something similar to what happened in the
:08:33. > :08:36.1980s. You are seeing extraordinary alliances between left and right.
:08:37. > :08:41.The Scottish referendum rebuilt Scottish politics along the lines of
:08:42. > :08:46.pro independence, anti-independence and now Brexit maybe doing the same.
:08:47. > :08:48.So, rows within the Conservative Party over the price
:08:49. > :08:51.of trousers might be new, but over Europe, not so much.
:08:52. > :08:53.And this week's Commons vote on when the Government will fire
:08:54. > :08:56.the starting gun on Brexit, and what it will say
:08:57. > :08:58.about its plans before it does so, confirmed that instead
:08:59. > :08:59.of the eurosceptics being the outsiders,
:09:00. > :09:02.it's now the Remainers who are leading the resistance.
:09:03. > :09:11.While the Prime Minister was schmoozing in the gold-plated
:09:12. > :09:14.Gulf this week, back home the Commons was voting
:09:15. > :09:17.on a Labour motion forcing her to publish a plan for Brexit.
:09:18. > :09:18.Through some parliamentary jiggery-pokery, the Government
:09:19. > :09:20.basically got its way, but it did provide a platform
:09:21. > :09:26.for some mischiefmaking by Tory MPs who voted to remain,
:09:27. > :09:35.We are getting somewhat tired, are we not, of this constant level
:09:36. > :09:38.of abuse, this constant criticism that we are somehow Remoaners
:09:39. > :09:41.that want to thwart the will of the people,
:09:42. > :09:46.go back on it and that we don't accept the result.
:09:47. > :09:51.I don't like the result, and yes, I do believe the people
:09:52. > :09:54.It's not good enough that these things are dragged
:09:55. > :09:56.out of the Government by opposition day motions.
:09:57. > :09:59.I'm pleased that it's happened but I wish the Government was taking
:10:00. > :10:03.Is Nicky Morgan really listening to her constituents
:10:04. > :10:11.I think I'm one of the people who stuck their head
:10:12. > :10:14.above the parapet so if you do that you're likely to attract attention,
:10:15. > :10:17.you're likely to attract abuse, but also actually levels of support.
:10:18. > :10:20.I'm having e-mails from around the country with people saying thank
:10:21. > :10:22.you for what you are doing, party members around
:10:23. > :10:24.the country saying thank you for what you are doing
:10:25. > :10:28.and saying, and I and others will continue to do that.
:10:29. > :10:31.I just think, as a backbench Member of Parliament,
:10:32. > :10:33.you've got to be there, particularly when we have a weak
:10:34. > :10:36.opposition, to ask the question that government needs to be scrutinised
:10:37. > :10:43.on before we embark on such a huge issue.
:10:44. > :10:46.Nobody comes into politics to become a thorn in their party leader's
:10:47. > :10:49.side, but at the end of the day it's such a massive issue that
:10:50. > :10:52.if you don't stand up for what you believe in,
:10:53. > :10:58.I'm not sure what the point is of going into politics.
:10:59. > :11:01.That puts her on a collision course with activists in her local
:11:02. > :11:03.party like Adam Stairs, a committed leader who accuses
:11:04. > :11:08.Nicky has promised me and the rest of our Conservative association
:11:09. > :11:11.she will be voting for Article 50 and she will support
:11:12. > :11:13.the Prime Minister's timetable, and we have just got to trust that
:11:14. > :11:16.and hope that goes ahead, but there's a lot of people
:11:17. > :11:18.who think she's taking sideswipes at the Government
:11:19. > :11:22.The Conservatives are very popular, she wants to be a Conservative MP
:11:23. > :11:24.and we want to see a Conservative government being
:11:25. > :11:32.I have no idea what she's playing at, I think she just needs to get
:11:33. > :11:35.on with her job as an MP, which she does very well,
:11:36. > :11:38.Now let's head to Anna Soubry's constituency nearby to see
:11:39. > :11:40.how her stance is going down with the voters.
:11:41. > :11:43.If Anna Soubry doesn't fully back Brexit, what does
:11:44. > :11:48.Well, she's going to have a little bit of a problem because the voters,
:11:49. > :11:51.especially in this area, they voted to come out of the EU
:11:52. > :11:54.so she will definitely have a little bit of a problem.
:11:55. > :11:56.She should stick for what she believes in,
:11:57. > :11:58.but I guess from a democratic perspective she does...
:11:59. > :12:14.She has admitted the fact over and over again that she wanted
:12:15. > :12:17.to remain, but her views at the moment, even in her e-mails,
:12:18. > :12:19.depicted the fact she's anti-Brexit still.
:12:20. > :12:24.Theresa May will host her most pro-European MPs at Downing Street
:12:25. > :12:26.this week to discuss the countdown to Brexit.
:12:27. > :12:34.Although now we know not everyone is invited.
:12:35. > :12:41.And the MP leading the resistance in the Commons on Wednesday
:12:42. > :12:43.was Ken Clarke, he was the only Conservative MP who voted
:12:44. > :12:46.against the Government's plan to trigger Article 50 by the end
:12:47. > :12:49.of March and he joins us now from Nottingham.
:12:50. > :12:54.Welcome back to the programme Ken Clarke. Now, tell me this when David
:12:55. > :13:00.Cameron resigned after losing the referendum, you had to pick a new
:13:01. > :13:04.leader, which candidate did the Tory Europhiles like you put up to
:13:05. > :13:10.deliver a so-called soft Brexit, or no Brexit at all? Well, I can't
:13:11. > :13:16.speak for the others but I voted for Theresa May, I gave a notorious
:13:17. > :13:21.interview, it wasn't meant to be, I was chatting to Malcolm Rifkind but
:13:22. > :13:24.somebody turned a camera on, I called her a bloody difficult woman
:13:25. > :13:27.which the Tory party probably needs, compared with Margaret Thatcher and
:13:28. > :13:33.said I was going to vote for her, I gave a vote for one of the younger
:13:34. > :13:39.ones first, but I told Teresa I would vote for her, she was the only
:13:40. > :13:41.serious candidate in my view. You voted for somebody you thought was a
:13:42. > :13:45.difficult woman, she is being difficult in ways you don't like,
:13:46. > :13:51.your side of the Tory party, you had your chance to put up somebody more
:13:52. > :13:56.in line with you, instead you shut up, so, why the complaints about it
:13:57. > :14:00.not going in your direction? I am not making complaint, it is not
:14:01. > :14:04.Teresa's fall we are in the dreadful mess, she was on the Remain side,
:14:05. > :14:07.she made a good speech during the campaign on the referendum, setting
:14:08. > :14:10.out the economic case for being in, setting out the security case for
:14:11. > :14:15.being in, which was Home Secretary, she was particularly expert in, it
:14:16. > :14:20.wasn't her fault that not a word it was reported anywhere, in the
:14:21. > :14:23.national media. Now, my views have been the same, I am afraid
:14:24. > :14:28.throughout my adult life, for the 50 years I have been in politics, and
:14:29. > :14:31.my views have been the mainstream policy of the Conservative Party
:14:32. > :14:37.throughout all that time, I don't expect to have a sudden conversion
:14:38. > :14:41.on the 24th June, and I think what I owe to my constituency, and to
:14:42. > :14:46.Parliament, is that I exercise my judgment, I make speeches giving my
:14:47. > :14:50.reasons, I make the best judgment that I can, of what is the national
:14:51. > :14:57.interest. I understand that. I would be a terrible hypocrite if I... Of
:14:58. > :15:02.course that is not what I am asking. How many Conservative MPs do you
:15:03. > :15:09.think you can count on to oppose this so-called hard Brexit? Is it
:15:10. > :15:13.40, 20, 10, 5, 1? I have no idea, because Anna, and Nicky, who you
:15:14. > :15:15.have just seen on the video who are also sticking to their principle,
:15:16. > :15:20.they are only saying what they are been saying ever since they have
:15:21. > :15:31.been in politics, probably may have more idea than me.
:15:32. > :15:39.That is three, how many more? I don't know, we will find out. We are
:15:40. > :15:44.living in a bubble in which the tone of politics is getting nastier and
:15:45. > :15:48.the reporting is getting sillier, so it is all about Theresa May's
:15:49. > :15:53.trousers and whether Boris has made some inappropriate jokes. What we
:15:54. > :15:57.need if we are going to abandon the basis upon which we made ourselves a
:15:58. > :16:01.leading political power in the world for the last 40 years and the basis
:16:02. > :16:05.upon which our economy has prospered because Margaret Thatcher got the
:16:06. > :16:09.others to adopt the single market and we benefited from that more than
:16:10. > :16:16.any other member state, so now we need a serious plan, a strategy.
:16:17. > :16:20.What is our relationship going to be in the modern world? How will our
:16:21. > :16:30.children and grandchildren make the best union they can? We need
:16:31. > :16:35.Parliament's approval of a White Paper and then start years of
:16:36. > :16:40.negotiation. This will run and run. This interview hasn't got time to
:16:41. > :16:43.run and run so let me get another question in. You seem to be quoted
:16:44. > :16:49.in the mail on Sunday this morning as saying if the Prime Minister
:16:50. > :16:54.sides too much with the heart Brexit group, she won't survive, is that
:16:55. > :16:58.your view? Yes because only a minority of the House of Commons
:16:59. > :17:01.think it is frightfully simple and you can just leave. The referendum
:17:02. > :17:06.campaign, the only national media reporting of the issues were
:17:07. > :17:12.completely silly and often quite dishonest arguments on both sides.
:17:13. > :17:17.Let me just check this, explain to me the basis... Know, excuse me, I
:17:18. > :17:21.have to interrupt because you said the Prime Minister won't survive so
:17:22. > :17:27.just explain to our viewers why she won't survive. She will be in a
:17:28. > :17:31.minority she starts adopting the views of John Redwood or Iain Duncan
:17:32. > :17:34.Smith. It's clear majority of the House of Commons doesn't agree with
:17:35. > :17:39.that and it would be pretty catastrophic if that is what we were
:17:40. > :17:45.going to do when we turn up and faced 27 of the nation state, and
:17:46. > :17:53.tell them we are pulling out of the biggest market in the world. How
:17:54. > :18:00.long do you give the Prime Minister then? If you don't think she will
:18:01. > :18:06.survive by going for a heart Brexit? I don't think she will go for a
:18:07. > :18:12.heart Brexit. Really, surrounded by David Davis and Liam Fox? Do you
:18:13. > :18:19.think Liam Fox will determine the policy of the Cabinet? Liam has
:18:20. > :18:23.always been ferociously against the European Union although he served in
:18:24. > :18:30.a government that was pro-European for about two and a half years. Does
:18:31. > :18:34.he not survive either? You're trying to reduce it to my trying to
:18:35. > :18:38.forecast Cabinet reshuffle is which I haven't got a clue whether there
:18:39. > :18:46.will be a Cabinet reshuffle, they may be ministers for the next ten
:18:47. > :18:50.years, I have no idea. Liam and me, but also Liam and the majority of
:18:51. > :18:54.his Cabinet colleagues don't start from the same place. The way forward
:18:55. > :18:59.is for them to produce a White Paper setting out the strategy on which
:19:00. > :19:03.all the Cabinet are agreed. People should stop leaking the Cabinet
:19:04. > :19:11.papers they are getting, they should stop leaking against each other, get
:19:12. > :19:14.down and do the work when they have got the agreed strategy. I'm sorry
:19:15. > :19:22.to interrupt again but we haven't got much time. We saw in our film
:19:23. > :19:29.that a number of constituency members in those areas which are
:19:30. > :19:34.strongly Remain MPs like yourself, in our case in this film it was
:19:35. > :19:38.Nicky Morgan, the constituency party members are unhappy about this.
:19:39. > :19:44.What's your message to them? Don't they deserve an MP that reflects
:19:45. > :19:50.their way of thinking? Leavers are unhappy and Remainers are very
:19:51. > :19:59.grateful. Mine don't go in for abuse... That's probably because
:20:00. > :20:03.you're not on e-mail, Mr Clarke. I get more from Remainers. I'm a great
:20:04. > :20:07.fan of Anna Soubry and Nicky Morgan, I don't agree with them on
:20:08. > :20:11.everything, but the views they are putting forward are the ones they've
:20:12. > :20:15.always held and I think we are doing the Government to favour by saying
:20:16. > :20:23.what it now depends on is your success in agreeing a policy and
:20:24. > :20:27.then explaining to the public what you want to do. I shall be surprised
:20:28. > :20:31.if they manage that by the end of March, I think it is best to get the
:20:32. > :20:39.policy right first but we shall see. Have you been invited then, you say
:20:40. > :20:45.you are being helpful, have you been invited to this meeting in Downing
:20:46. > :20:49.Street on Wednesday for the soft Brexiteers? No, because I haven't
:20:50. > :20:52.been joining any of these groups. It's fair to say most of my
:20:53. > :20:59.colleagues know exactly what my views are. No doubt those that
:21:00. > :21:06.haven't had this kind of discussion with their colleagues before have
:21:07. > :21:10.been invited. I didn't expect to be invited. I get on perfectly well
:21:11. > :21:14.with Theresa May but I haven't been invited, but I don't think there's
:21:15. > :21:20.much significance in that. What do you think of the way Downing Street
:21:21. > :21:25.has handled Nicky Morgan? I feel sorry for women in politics. I'm
:21:26. > :21:29.glad to say men in politics don't have great lead stories about what
:21:30. > :21:33.they are wearing. Apart from my suede shoes, I'm lucky because I'm
:21:34. > :21:39.not a very snappy dresser. It is tedious in these days that we still
:21:40. > :21:51.have a absurd pop newspaper stories about what they are wearing.
:21:52. > :21:57.That commenting on the Prime Minister's trousers, is it really
:21:58. > :22:04.grounds for banishment? No, of course not. Nikki and Teresa will
:22:05. > :22:07.have serious political discussions and if they want to have an argument
:22:08. > :22:15.about what they are wearing, their closest friends will advise them to
:22:16. > :22:23.keep it private. It is absurd. Given that the party appears to be
:22:24. > :22:28.deciding it has been all -- ordered to changes policies about Britain's
:22:29. > :22:33.relationship with the world, it needs to be taken seriously and this
:22:34. > :22:37.Lola. Is filling a vacuum before the serious discussion starts. Thank you
:22:38. > :22:39.for filling our vacuum this morning and of course no one would ever
:22:40. > :22:43.criticise how you dress. Of course. Now, seasoned observers will warn
:22:44. > :22:45.against reading too much into parliamentary by-elections,
:22:46. > :22:47.but they can provide a vital boost for a party leader under pressure,
:22:48. > :22:50.or provide damaging ammunition Following a disappointing result
:22:51. > :22:53.for Labour last week in Richmond, Jeremy Corbyn may have been hoping
:22:54. > :22:56.for an early Christmas present at this week's
:22:57. > :22:57.contest in Lincolnshire. In Sleaford and North Hykeham,
:22:58. > :23:06.a constituency that supported Leave in the EU referendum,
:23:07. > :23:08.there was little Christmas cheer for Labour as it fell from second
:23:09. > :23:13.in 2015 to fourth place. That was at least a better
:23:14. > :23:15.performance than in Remain-supporting Richmond Park,
:23:16. > :23:19.where the party's candiate lost his deposit after attracting
:23:20. > :23:21.fewer voters than the reported number of local
:23:22. > :23:25.Labour Party members. Speaking for the Labour Party this
:23:26. > :23:31.week, MP Vernon Coaker said their policies on other major
:23:32. > :23:35.issues were "lost to an extent Some MPs feel that a lack of clarity
:23:36. > :23:47.is holding the party back. This week three frontbenchers
:23:48. > :23:51.were among the 23 Labour MPs to defy the party line and vote
:23:52. > :23:59.against a motion to begin the process of leaving the EU
:24:00. > :24:02.by the end of March. And a number of Labour MPs we've
:24:03. > :24:05.spoken to since Thursday's vote have said they fear the party now runs
:24:06. > :24:08.the risk of being squeezed by the Lib Dems and UKIP,
:24:09. > :24:11.or in the words of one, "being cannabilised,
:24:12. > :24:15.eaten from both ends". To compound their troubles,
:24:16. > :24:16.a national poll released on Friday put Labour
:24:17. > :24:19.at a seven-year low, trailing 17 It's still a season of joy
:24:20. > :24:26.for many of Mr Corbyn's supporters - they point to a series of victories
:24:27. > :24:28.under his leadership, including a by-election win
:24:29. > :24:30.in Tooting and the London mayoral Though neither candidate was a
:24:31. > :24:37.Corbynite. But there's a distinct lack
:24:38. > :24:41.of goodwill on the party of his critics - although having
:24:42. > :24:43.failed comprehensively to challenge him this summer,
:24:44. > :24:54.what they intend to do This morning Diane Abbott played
:24:55. > :24:59.down the significance of the results. The reports of the Labour
:25:00. > :25:03.Party's demise are exaggerated, we are the largest social Democratic
:25:04. > :25:06.party in Europe and the surging membership is down to the current
:25:07. > :25:11.leadership. We have the right policies on the NHS, investing in
:25:12. > :25:15.the economy, and as you know the Tories are fatally split on Europe.
:25:16. > :25:17.And we're joined now by the former mayor
:25:18. > :25:18.of London Ken Livingstone, and the former Shadow
:25:19. > :25:27.Ken Livingstone, in the most recent by-election Labour collapsed from
:25:28. > :25:32.second to fourth place, the one before that your party lost its
:25:33. > :25:38.deposit. What is the positive gloss on that? There's nothing new in
:25:39. > :25:47.this, where you have got seats which are solidly Tory, often voters
:25:48. > :25:53.switched to Lib Dem to kick other voters out. We have had good swings
:25:54. > :25:58.that indicate a Labour government so don't pay too much attention. It is
:25:59. > :26:03.like Orpington 50 years ago. Labour voters switched just to kick the
:26:04. > :26:12.Tories out. Don't read too much into these results, Labour did win
:26:13. > :26:15.tooting so it is OK. First of all I don't think it was a problem with
:26:16. > :26:21.the candidates in the by-elections, they did a really good job locally,
:26:22. > :26:26.but there is an issue with those residents and their attitudes to the
:26:27. > :26:30.national party, and I just think that when you have warning bells
:26:31. > :26:34.going off like that, we have to listen to what people are saying. I
:26:35. > :26:39.think what they are saying is they want an opposition party to have a
:26:40. > :26:42.plan. So yes we have got to attack the Conservatives where they are
:26:43. > :26:48.going wrong on the NHS, running headlong over the cliff for a hard
:26:49. > :26:55.Brexit, but we also need a plan for what Labour's alternative will be.
:26:56. > :27:00.When do we get that plant? Effectively you have got it already.
:27:01. > :27:06.John McDonnell has gone on relentlessly for the need for a
:27:07. > :27:11.massive public investment. For decades now under Labour and Tory
:27:12. > :27:16.governments we haven't invested in infrastructure, our roads are a
:27:17. > :27:20.disgrace, a broadband is antique. We need to be honest about this, if
:27:21. > :27:25.Theresa May can come back and say I've done a deal, we are leaving the
:27:26. > :27:30.EU, we will control our borders, we won't have to pay 350 million a year
:27:31. > :27:36.and stay in the single market, well... But that won't happen. If we
:27:37. > :27:41.are going to stumble along for two years heading for an economic
:27:42. > :27:44.disaster, that's why only eight MPs voted to leave, because they knew
:27:45. > :27:49.the harm it would do to their voters. If you have got a plan, why
:27:50. > :27:55.are things getting worse for you in the national polls, 17 points
:27:56. > :27:59.behind? If you look back, when I was leader of Chelsea my poll rating
:28:00. > :28:05.went down... But you have not been as bad since 1983 when you lost an
:28:06. > :28:10.election by a landslide. Over the next two years our economy will not
:28:11. > :28:15.grow strongly, it will limp along at best, as we get closer to Brexit it
:28:16. > :28:19.will get worse. All Labour MPs should be focusing on the economic
:28:20. > :28:25.alternative because nobody ever wins an election without a credible
:28:26. > :28:30.economic strategy. So as long as the country goes to hell in a hand
:28:31. > :28:33.basket, Labour will be fine. That's not good enough. You're not a
:28:34. > :28:41.commentator any more, you are part of the leadership of the party. It
:28:42. > :28:43.is to you. I will continue to argue the case for credibility,
:28:44. > :28:50.particularly in our policies, but the leadership cannot just sit back
:28:51. > :28:54.and watch this drift. On the Brexit situation, the Conservative
:28:55. > :28:58.manifesto at the last general election promised it would be yes to
:28:59. > :29:02.the single market, why aren't we holding them to account for the
:29:03. > :29:08.broken promise potentially they are about to do? If I had still been an
:29:09. > :29:13.MP, I would have been voting with you, rebelling, because we are not
:29:14. > :29:17.going to get any good deal to leave. Theresa May will stumble on for a
:29:18. > :29:20.couple of years trying to balance... The party policies were heard from
:29:21. > :29:26.Diane Abbott this morning is to get the best possible deal to leave. And
:29:27. > :29:32.I will believe it when it happens. So you don't believe a central part
:29:33. > :29:39.of Jeremy Corbyn's policy? Jeremy has accepted the fact people voted
:29:40. > :29:43.to leave. He now said we now need to get the best possible deal and you
:29:44. > :29:48.don't think it's achievable. I don't, because why would the other
:29:49. > :29:55.27 members give us a better deal staying outside? You've confused me,
:29:56. > :29:57.why are you such a big supporter of Corbyn with his policy you don't
:29:58. > :30:08.think it's achievable? Everybody knows we are not going to
:30:09. > :30:12.get a soft exit, so we either have the hard Brexit and we lose perhaps
:30:13. > :30:18.millions, certainly hundreds of thousands of jobs, or we have to say
:30:19. > :30:23.we got it wrong. I mean, you, a lot of people have been saying that all
:30:24. > :30:27.Labour's unclear on Brexit, that is why it is going wrong, I would
:30:28. > :30:31.suggest to you, that actually what the concentration on is the Tories
:30:32. > :30:36.are unclear about Brexit, they are in power, that is what matters, a
:30:37. > :30:41.bigger problem for Labour is whether Mr Corbyn's leadership will cut
:30:42. > :30:45.through or not. I think the YouGov poll this weekend not only gave us
:30:46. > :30:51.that double punch of a 17 point lead for the Conservatives but it had a
:30:52. > :30:56.33 point lead, 33 point, for Theresa May over Jeremy Corbyn, so part of
:30:57. > :31:00.the plan, think, has to be to address this leadership issue, to
:31:01. > :31:07.make sure it is also a party that is listening to the wider public and
:31:08. > :31:13.not just the small number of members or the trotsites in Momentum or
:31:14. > :31:23.whoever is the latest Marxist on the... You The thing that is ox
:31:24. > :31:28.fibbing Labour. One MP said Labour has quoted bunkum. We have has 18
:31:29. > :31:34.months of Labour MPs stabbing Jeremy in the back and some in the front.
:31:35. > :31:37.The vast majority of Labour MPs have stopped undermining Jeremy. You
:31:38. > :31:40.weren't doing that well before. Can you imagine a situation in which you
:31:41. > :31:44.have elected a new leader and the first year it is all about getting
:31:45. > :31:49.rid of imand undermining him. I disagree with Tony Blair on lots of
:31:50. > :31:52.policy issue, I didn't run wound saying this man is not fit to
:31:53. > :31:58.govern. That is because you had no support for that at the time. The
:31:59. > :32:03.idea people will take lectures from Ken on divisiveness, that is like
:32:04. > :32:08.takes lectures from Boris Johnson on diplomacy, you have to make sure,
:32:09. > :32:13.yes, that we find some accommodation after the leadership election this
:32:14. > :32:20.summer, but the plan is not there right now, and you and the rest of
:32:21. > :32:24.the leadership has to be held accountable for delivering that, I
:32:25. > :32:31.want to hear what the plan is. It is FDR he told us earlier. If you have
:32:32. > :32:35.got now because as we saw in the Autumn Statement, debt to GDP ratio
:32:36. > :32:40.at 90%, you can't convince the public by saying we will throw more
:32:41. > :32:44.money at the problem, the public want a credible plan, where the sums
:32:45. > :32:49.add up, that you are not making promises that won't be delivered.
:32:50. > :32:55.They want that plan. We need to point out our history, when Labour
:32:56. > :33:03.Waugh the election in 45 Government debt was two times that it was now..
:33:04. > :33:07.Now.. They generated exports and within 50 years we virtually paid
:33:08. > :33:14.off that debt. Austerity is not the way to go. Our economy is a disgrace
:33:15. > :33:17.compared with Germany. I agree. What we have to start saying, there is
:33:18. > :33:22.decent jobs, where are they going to be coming from, can we have a
:33:23. > :33:26.society based on fair play and prosperity for everybody not just
:33:27. > :33:28.the wealthy, that means saying, some time, that people have to
:33:29. > :33:32.contribute, they have to put in, so we have to listen to what the public
:33:33. > :33:37.are saying on issues for instance like immigration, as they said in
:33:38. > :33:41.the Brexit referendum, but make sure we have our approach set out
:33:42. > :33:47.clearly, so people know there is a ability to manage, and control these
:33:48. > :33:55.things, not just ignore them. Those tax dodgers who launder their money
:33:56. > :34:02.through Panamanian banks. If we crackdown on what might be 150
:34:03. > :34:08.billion a year of tax evasion and avoidance. That is a real outlier
:34:09. > :34:12.estimate as you know, way the highest, you cannot build the FDR
:34:13. > :34:17.programme on tax evasion revenues, alone, but let me ask you. You can
:34:18. > :34:24.say to Starbucks, if you are not going to pay tax on your profits we
:34:25. > :34:28.will tax every cup of coffee. Why don't you nationalise it? I was just
:34:29. > :34:33.checking that would be the policy. Let me ask you this. By what time do
:34:34. > :34:37.you get, start to get worrieded if the polls haven't given to turn
:34:38. > :34:42.round? I mean, I think they will turn round. When do you start to get
:34:43. > :34:45.worried? If they haven't? If in a year's time it was as bad as this we
:34:46. > :34:51.would be worried. I don't think it will be. Jeremy and his team will
:34:52. > :34:56.knows can on the economy, and that is wins every election. Bill
:34:57. > :34:59.Clinton, remember it's the economy stupid. People know if you are going
:35:00. > :35:02.to spend money they want to see where it is coming from, otherwise
:35:03. > :35:08.they will think it is their taxes that will go up and the
:35:09. > :35:12.Conservative, Theresa May, will scare the British public over plans
:35:13. > :35:19.that are not properly... What do you do if things haven't got better in
:35:20. > :35:23.12 months? We lost the leadership election in the summer but we will
:35:24. > :35:29.hold our leadership to account. What does that mean? It means asking for
:35:30. > :35:34.the plan, testing what the proposals are, are they properly credible, do
:35:35. > :35:39.they make sure that they meet the test the public... You just have to
:35:40. > :35:45.bite the bottom lip now, you privately, a lot of you think your
:35:46. > :35:50.party is heading for catastrophe. I don't think it is acceptable that we
:35:51. > :35:54.have this level of performance, currently, I am sure Ken agrees the
:35:55. > :35:58.opinion polls, and those by by-election were just not good
:35:59. > :36:00.enough. We have to show leadership, certainly on Brexit, hold the
:36:01. > :36:05.Government to account. Attack them for the crisis in the NHS, yes and
:36:06. > :36:09.on the economy, to deliver credible policy force, example on defending
:36:10. > :36:13.national security and making sure we stand up for humanitarian
:36:14. > :36:19.intervention. Final point, your party has lost Scotland. You are now
:36:20. > :36:23.in third place behind the stories -- Tories. I never thought I would be
:36:24. > :36:27.able to say that in a broadcast, if you lose the north too, you are
:36:28. > :36:31.heading for the smallest Parliamentary Labour Party since the
:36:32. > :36:35.war, aren't you. But that is our weakness, we in the 13 years of the
:36:36. > :36:38.last Labour Government neglected rebuilding our manufacturing in the
:36:39. > :36:44.way the Germans have done. Millions of people used to have good job, we
:36:45. > :36:48.used to have 8 million jobs in manufacturing it is down two. It is
:36:49. > :36:50.in the north, that Jeremy's strategy has the most relevance, of actually
:36:51. > :36:55.getting the investment and rebuilding. All right. We will see.
:36:56. > :37:00.Come back in 12 months if not before and we will check it out.
:37:01. > :37:02.It's just gone 11.35, you're watching the Sunday Politics.
:37:03. > :37:04.We say goodbye to viewers in Scotland, who leave us now
:37:05. > :37:08.Coming up here in 20 minutes, we'll be talking
:37:09. > :37:10.about Boris Johnson's tour of the Middle East after straying
:37:11. > :37:12.off message, again, and the protestors attempting
:37:13. > :37:23.First though, the Sunday Politics where you are.
:37:24. > :37:26.Hello and a warm welcome to your local part of the show just
:37:27. > :37:32.Claims that air pollution in some parts of the region are almost
:37:33. > :37:39.Are plans to expand the road network going to make the problem worse?
:37:40. > :37:43.Talking about that - and the rest of the week's news -
:37:44. > :37:46.including claims that parents in the North need to be more "pushy"
:37:47. > :37:49.to help their children get on - is the Conservative MP for Skipton
:37:50. > :37:51.and Ripon, Julian Smith and Northumbria's Police
:37:52. > :38:01.The new Police and Crime Bill is back in Parliament this week.
:38:02. > :38:04.It's a wide-ranging piece of legislation which will enable
:38:05. > :38:07.Police Commissioners to take on responsibility for
:38:08. > :38:13.There's also been controversy over plans to hand over some police
:38:14. > :38:21.If money is tight, I'm sure you have found that,
:38:22. > :38:26.it might make perfect sense for a Police Commissioner to also be
:38:27. > :38:32.What we have done is, we have welcomed the duty to collaborate
:38:33. > :38:37.and what we have done is to set up, a couple of years ago,
:38:38. > :38:41.a strategic board and we have worked ever since to see how we can
:38:42. > :38:46.They are very different services, but we have joint premises
:38:47. > :38:53.Police are located in fire stations, and so on.
:38:54. > :38:55.We have a joint set of premises called SafetyWorks!
:38:56. > :39:00.in the West End of Newcastle where children come in classloads
:39:01. > :39:02.and learn about fire prevention, crime prevention and child
:39:03. > :39:09.It's run by the fire service and ourselves.
:39:10. > :39:11.We are looking at all sorts of potential...
:39:12. > :39:13.So you are co-operating. Would you have any...?
:39:14. > :39:15.It's the bottom end joint work which is going to
:39:16. > :39:19.Would you have any concerns about a PCC being in charge
:39:20. > :39:24.It's not what I want to do and it doesn't seem to me that
:39:25. > :39:29.It's about giving better service, governance is the last
:39:30. > :39:35.As long as those in charge of both services can work jointly together,
:39:36. > :39:41.Julian Smith, in North Yorkshire, the commissioner there,
:39:42. > :39:43.Julia Mulligan, is actually very keen to be in charge
:39:44. > :39:47.She produced a report talking about how she could run both
:39:48. > :40:05.I'm bringing together ambulance, fire, police next
:40:06. > :40:08.week in Fountains Abbey and we are welcoming the police
:40:09. > :40:11.I'm disappointed to hear Vera's comments, it sounds
:40:12. > :40:15.We have got to seize the opportunity to reduce costs,
:40:16. > :40:18.to bring together blue lights as closely as possible whilst
:40:19. > :40:19.retaining their individual independence and in places
:40:20. > :40:27.like Ron North Yorkshire, where we have got challenges
:40:28. > :40:44.with ambulance response times, I welcome all of
:40:45. > :40:48.Does a Police Commissioner being in charge of the Fire
:40:49. > :40:54.I think Vera is right, we want to focus on the detail
:40:55. > :40:57.rather than actually government at this stage, but we have
:40:58. > :41:00.to have a vision and the vision has to be not just buildings but how
:41:01. > :41:02.you get these organisations taking much more responsibility
:41:03. > :41:06.The fire and ambulance in parts of North Yorkshire are doing this
:41:07. > :41:09.and I think we need to push ahead quicker and faster.
:41:10. > :41:11.The bottom end is where vision comes, of course.
:41:12. > :41:13.It's people who have got eyes on the ball,
:41:14. > :41:15.day-to-day, who can see what they can do together.
:41:16. > :41:17.We are doing exceptionally well here.
:41:18. > :41:20.I want to move it to another issue in this bill, which you have
:41:21. > :41:22.voiced concerns about, which is giving civilians
:41:23. > :41:23.more powers that the police currently have.
:41:24. > :41:27.The problem is, we have lost more than 800 officers,
:41:28. > :41:29.we have lost 1000 police through Tory cuts.
:41:30. > :41:32.Northumbria has had the worst financial cuts of any police
:41:33. > :41:34.Can't civilians help? 23%...
:41:35. > :41:40.We are very happy with specials, they are properly trained police
:41:41. > :41:43.officers who volunteer from time to time to come in.
:41:44. > :41:45.There is absolutely everything to be said for that.
:41:46. > :41:48.And there are lots and lots of volunteers who are there,
:41:49. > :41:49.keen to support police. OK.
:41:50. > :41:53.But what they shouldn't be asked to do, is the job of police.
:41:54. > :41:56.There is no limits, literally in this legislation save for a very
:41:57. > :42:00.tiny core of police powers of in what volunteers
:42:01. > :42:06.Julian Smith, cheap policing without police
:42:07. > :42:10.If you speak to police officers and go to police stations,
:42:11. > :42:14.they talk about the huge value of the support they get
:42:15. > :42:16.and the difference that that civilian support makes
:42:17. > :42:22.They probably want more police officers, not the chance
:42:23. > :42:34.The important thing is under the coalition government
:42:35. > :42:37.and under this government, we have seen a big cut in crime
:42:38. > :42:39.across the country and we need, in order to continue with that
:42:40. > :42:42.high-performance, push hard to be creative on costs and make sure
:42:43. > :42:45.policing is on the front line and we get as much civilian support
:42:46. > :42:48.in order to have as many front line officers as possible.
:42:49. > :42:51.That doesn't seem to have much to do with the issue.
:42:52. > :42:55.Look at all the child sexual exploitation.
:42:56. > :42:58.If you look at all the statistics, you see crime going
:42:59. > :43:03.Take a look at the amount of time that police have to take over child
:43:04. > :43:06.sexual exploitation compared to small crimes like criminal
:43:07. > :43:10.damage, bending a mirror on a car, it's completely different.
:43:11. > :43:25.You are not comparing pairs with pears.
:43:26. > :43:27.Crime is going down under the Conservative government.
:43:28. > :43:31.We are not going to get agreement between you on this,
:43:32. > :43:34.so we will have to move on to other issues.
:43:35. > :43:36.Now, what's it like growing up in the North?
:43:37. > :43:39.Are there the same opportunities for young people to get on in life?
:43:40. > :43:42.These questions are the focus of a year-long investigation started
:43:43. > :43:43.this week by the Children's Commissioner.
:43:44. > :43:46.But her call for northern parents to be more pushy
:43:47. > :43:48.is already drawing criticism - as our correspondent
:43:49. > :43:54.Early morning and for this family in Stockton, the school run beckons.
:43:55. > :43:57.The investigation launched this week aims to give the young an equal
:43:58. > :43:58.chance of achieving ambitions, wherever they live.
:43:59. > :44:02.I'd like to be a primary schoolteacher when I'm older
:44:03. > :44:05.because I feel primary schools are a key stage in everyone's lives.
:44:06. > :44:08.I want to be something to do with, like, politics or an actor.
:44:09. > :44:23.The Children's Commissioner once more than parents to be
:44:24. > :44:25.pushier when it comes to demanding good education.
:44:26. > :44:27.The message doesn't go down well here.
:44:28. > :44:32.I fought hard to live in an area where I'm able to send my children
:44:33. > :44:35.just excellent schools and in itself is surely need trying to help them
:44:36. > :44:38.So the idea that more than parents on pushy,
:44:39. > :44:41.I think it's rubbish. I think it's offensive.
:44:42. > :44:43.So, is the children's Commissioner guilty of bashing
:44:44. > :44:48.When I was talking about parents, and there has been a big debate this
:44:49. > :44:50.week about pushy parents, I was actually say that given
:44:51. > :44:53.that we know that schools are falling behind at secondary
:44:54. > :44:55.school stage and there are huge variations across the region,
:44:56. > :44:57.actually there is something here that parents want to know
:44:58. > :44:59.about their schools, want to talk to schools
:45:00. > :45:03.Launching a year-long inquiry, the Commissioner painted a mixed
:45:04. > :45:14.At primary school, pupils have some of the country's best results.
:45:15. > :45:17.But by secondary, the region's GCSE results lag behind top performing
:45:18. > :45:19.areas with fewer than average going to top universities.
:45:20. > :45:22.This school has been praised by Ofsted for its focus
:45:23. > :45:24.on standards, but the challenge is not just about academic learning.
:45:25. > :45:27.It's also about encouraging students to aim high when it
:45:28. > :45:30.It's a real positive because you are going to understand
:45:31. > :45:34.Staff here serve disadvantaged areas of Newcastle but see that as no
:45:35. > :45:38.Because a lot of children, especially in this region,
:45:39. > :45:44.maybe don't have parents who are in those massive high jobs,
:45:45. > :45:48.we need to be able to instil that aspiration in children and show
:45:49. > :45:51.that they know that they can reach for the stars.
:45:52. > :45:54.As for this group of sixth formers, many are positive
:45:55. > :45:57.about their education, optimistic for the future.
:45:58. > :46:00.Even if some are considering moving away.
:46:01. > :46:02.There are definitely more opportunities down south then
:46:03. > :46:16.If you've got the drive to do something, I don't forget
:46:17. > :46:26.that is where you are from, you can do it.
:46:27. > :46:29.In the past, a lot of people didn't go to university,
:46:30. > :46:33.But now, like, education is important now and a lot of people
:46:34. > :46:36.A North East MP says the problem isn't education,
:46:37. > :46:40.It's a sad fact of life for the North East of England,
:46:41. > :46:43.one of our biggest export is our young people.
:46:44. > :46:46.When they get to the age to work in the jobs market in awful lot
:46:47. > :46:49.of the mortality youngsters have to go outside the region
:46:50. > :46:59.-- an awful lot of our more talented youngsters.
:47:00. > :47:01.And therefore, I think Anne Longfield needs
:47:02. > :47:04.to look at that as well, look at the jobs market,
:47:05. > :47:08.And that does have an impact on aspiration of our young people.
:47:09. > :47:10.How to ensure the North's next-generation scale the heights?
:47:11. > :47:13.Asking the question will prove easier than answering it.
:47:14. > :47:15.Julian Smith, the aims of the children's Commissioner,
:47:16. > :47:18.to look at problems in the north, most people would welcome,
:47:19. > :47:21.but she has got parents group was backed up,
:47:22. > :47:23.straightaway, by using this idea of the need for them
:47:24. > :47:28.Yeah, I have seen no evidence that parents in the North are anything
:47:29. > :47:31.but incredibly passionate about the life opportunities
:47:32. > :47:35.Every constituent who comes in talks to me about their childreneducation
:47:36. > :47:38.are refocused on how to get the best deal for their child.
:47:39. > :47:40.I think the key thing is we now have 1.5 million more
:47:41. > :47:42.children across the country, 46,000 more children
:47:43. > :47:45.in the North East, going to good or outstanding schools,
:47:46. > :47:47.but we have to continue to move forward and get even better
:47:48. > :47:50.statistics and that is why the government is looking
:47:51. > :47:55.at selection and other opportunities to make that happen.
:47:56. > :47:56.That's opened a can of worms, selection!
:47:57. > :47:59.Anyway, zero Baird, actually, it may not be the only solution,
:48:00. > :48:02.but if parents were more assertive with schools that perhaps one
:48:03. > :48:04.delivering for their children, it might help, might it not?
:48:05. > :48:07.Extraordinary that a Tory can talk about equality of opportunity
:48:08. > :48:11.I don't think it's about pushiness, I think it's about opportunity.
:48:12. > :48:15.And it is right, we have the highest number of NEETs, we have the highest
:48:16. > :48:17.number of unemployed people, we have the highest number of people
:48:18. > :48:21.Michael Wilshaw, who has just stopped being the head of Ofsted,
:48:22. > :48:27.links poverty and deprivation with lack of ambition
:48:28. > :48:31.Until there is some better opportunities in the North East
:48:32. > :48:33.which requires the government to give it some real attention
:48:34. > :48:36.here and let's make it very clear, it's nothing to do with lack
:48:37. > :48:41.Two thirds of young people who are in poverty are in households
:48:42. > :48:43.where there is work and yet educational opportunities
:48:44. > :48:48.We have lost the largest number of public sector jobs
:48:49. > :48:50.in the entire country, the swap over to
:48:51. > :48:57.The government has improved the schools, what more can it do?
:48:58. > :49:01.16 out of 17 underachieving schools are in the north of England.
:49:02. > :49:08.How much is it the fault of those schools and the aspirations of those
:49:09. > :49:12.schools rather than necessarily government funding or policies
:49:13. > :49:18.Very much more government funding and policies made in Whitehall.
:49:19. > :49:22.There is no evidence at all to separate poverty and deprivation
:49:23. > :49:28.They go together like a horse and cart.
:49:29. > :49:31.And until the government put some significant funding back up here,
:49:32. > :49:35.which it has systematically robbed of funding, I have already mentioned
:49:36. > :49:40.OK, Julian Smith, the central accusation is not enough funding
:49:41. > :49:43.and it's all down to poverty and that is what you need
:49:44. > :49:48.Well, doom and gloom from Vera today.
:49:49. > :49:52.We have an upwardly mobile economy in the North East,
:49:53. > :50:00.we have Nissan committing to their investment recently,,
:50:01. > :50:06.we have higher levels of employment than under the time Vera was...
:50:07. > :50:08.We still have children coming out of secondary school
:50:09. > :50:12.who are performing worse than their compatriots in the South.
:50:13. > :50:15.We will continue to make sure that every child in our country
:50:16. > :50:19.and in the North East has the same opportunities...
:50:20. > :50:25.Lots of money was thrown at schools in London and the improvement
:50:26. > :50:28.That's what the North East needs, isn't it?
:50:29. > :50:31.46,000 more children going to good or outstanding schools.
:50:32. > :50:35.More to do, but we need to be positive about the position
:50:36. > :50:40.we are in, which is a much stronger position than when you're Labour...
:50:41. > :50:50.This region has been destroyed by this Tory government.
:50:51. > :50:55.Hang on... Just let me reply.
:50:56. > :50:59.We lost a quarter of a million public sector jobs.
:51:00. > :51:02.We have had replaced by a very low number of sector jobs.
:51:03. > :51:07.The highest private levels in British statistical history.
:51:08. > :51:11.Once again, Julian is not counting apples and apples.
:51:12. > :51:19.We have low quality jobs with uncertain hours and very low pay.
:51:20. > :51:25.Julian Smith, a brief time for you to answer that.
:51:26. > :51:30.Vera doesn't deny... You really...
:51:31. > :51:31.Let him speak. Julian Smith, just answer.
:51:32. > :51:34.We need to focus on the North East a little bit harder.
:51:35. > :51:38.As I said, we have got the best job situation we have had in the history
:51:39. > :51:40.of statistical analysis on jobs and fear is unable
:51:41. > :51:52.Under the Conservative government, we have a jobs revolution.
:51:53. > :51:54.Tell that to people on zero hours contracts.
:51:55. > :51:56.We are not going to reach agreement yet again.
:51:57. > :52:01.Now, Sunderland was the first place to vote Brexit -
:52:02. > :52:04.and this week MPs travelled to Wearside as part of
:52:05. > :52:06.a Parliamentary inquiry to discover exactly what that will mean.
:52:07. > :52:08.Here's that and the rest of the week's news -
:52:09. > :52:11.including a new plan for jobs on Teesside - all in 60 seconds.
:52:12. > :52:14.The North East Chamber of Commerce and Sunderland Council were among
:52:15. > :52:16.those giving evidence to MPs about the impact of Brexit.
:52:17. > :52:19.The chairman of the new exiting the EU committee, Hilary Benn,
:52:20. > :52:23.said it was crucial to hear views from outside Westminster.
:52:24. > :52:26.This is the very first visit we have undertaken as a select committee.
:52:27. > :52:29.We didn't want to sit in Westminster and just take evidence there,
:52:30. > :52:32.because this is so important to the future of the economy
:52:33. > :52:40.Carlisle's MP has called for a review of the scheme
:52:41. > :52:43.designed to ensure people in high flood risk areas can get insurance.
:52:44. > :52:48.John Stevenson said most leaseholders in blocks of flats
:52:49. > :52:52.Lord Heseltine has launched a plan that aims to create 25,000 jobs
:52:53. > :52:54.across the Tees Valley in the next ten years.
:52:55. > :52:57.It was drawn up by the five local authorities of Teesside.
:52:58. > :53:00.And finally, as work continues to fill a 66-foot-wide sinkhole
:53:01. > :53:14.in Ripon, may ageing Morgan says he is concerned about the future.
:53:15. > :53:21.It's the second sinkhole to open up in the city in two years.
:53:22. > :53:23.Julian Smith, of course that sinkhole is in your constituency.
:53:24. > :53:26.Is enough being done to get your constituents back
:53:27. > :53:29.I pay tribute to the work of the emergency services,
:53:30. > :53:31.who dealt very quickly, along with the borough council,
:53:32. > :53:33.Harrogate Borough Council, to deal with the huge challenge
:53:34. > :53:36.of this sinkhole appearing in the back gardens of a number
:53:37. > :53:41.I attended the emergency meeting that weekend.
:53:42. > :53:45.But you are right, we have a big challenge in Ripon.
:53:46. > :53:49.We have probably got more sinkhole under the city than most cities
:53:50. > :53:55.in the country and I will be looking carefully at how we can progress
:53:56. > :53:59.and look at the technologies that are available, we have heard,
:54:00. > :54:01.in Japan, and other countries of the world, to deal
:54:02. > :54:07.But it is serious issue for a key conurbation in North Yorkshire.
:54:08. > :54:18.We will see what happens and let's hope no more open up
:54:19. > :54:22.in the next few days - or weeks or months!
:54:23. > :54:24.Now, thousands of people in the North East are being exposed
:54:25. > :54:27.to a higher risk of lung cancer, heart disease and dementia
:54:28. > :54:29.because air pollution is above safe levels.
:54:30. > :54:31.That was the claim made by the Green Party's new co-leader
:54:32. > :54:34.Caroline Lucas this week on a visit to Durham.
:54:35. > :54:36.She says plans to expand the road network will only
:54:37. > :54:38.worsen the problem - but the local Labour-run council
:54:39. > :54:44.It's often invisible, the pollution being produced
:54:45. > :54:46.by all these vehicles in Durham, particularly those fuelled by
:54:47. > :54:51.Particulates are tiny pieces of oily soot that can be inhaled.
:54:52. > :54:54.Nitrogen dioxide, or NO2, is an invisible but toxic gas.
:54:55. > :54:58.It is estimated that together, they contribute to almost
:54:59. > :55:02.50,000 premature deaths in the UK each year.
:55:03. > :55:07.They have a direct effect on human health.
:55:08. > :55:09.Particulates go straight into our lung region
:55:10. > :55:12.and people who are suffering from from respiratory illnesses,
:55:13. > :55:14.for example children, elderly population and those
:55:15. > :55:17.who are already suffering from respiratory illnesses,
:55:18. > :55:22.Because pollution from traffic can exceed safe levels in parts
:55:23. > :55:25.of Durham, the council is obliged to try and reduce it to help
:55:26. > :55:31.Other places across the North East and Cumbria are having
:55:32. > :55:34.to do the same thing, including in Carlisle, Gateshead,
:55:35. > :55:37.Newcastle, South Tyneside, York and even Malton in
:55:38. > :55:42.So we have to ensure that new development
:55:43. > :55:47.Air pollution has therefore become a big issue and during a visit
:55:48. > :55:50.to Durham, Green Party leader Caroline Lucas spelt out its dangers
:55:51. > :55:52.to a public meeting and warned against council plans
:55:53. > :55:58.Air-pollution absolutely is a silent and deadly killer and it's one
:55:59. > :56:01.which local authorities, government as well, don't
:56:02. > :56:07.I have yet to be persuaded that road-building is the answer,
:56:08. > :56:10.because although it can look like a short-term fix,
:56:11. > :56:13.what happens all too often is that the so-called relief road
:56:14. > :56:17.then becomes congested itself and you end up having to build more
:56:18. > :56:23.I would like this even prioritising instead public
:56:24. > :56:28.But the Labour run council in Durham denies it isn't doing enough.
:56:29. > :56:30.There are a number of projects we have been involved in,
:56:31. > :56:34.But we also just introduced the SCOOT system, which is designed
:56:35. > :56:37.to move through traffic on a more freely basis.
:56:38. > :56:39.And obviusly that will cut down air-pollution by not wasting time
:56:40. > :56:42.people being stood moving through the area.
:56:43. > :56:44.So those are two schemes we have done.
:56:45. > :56:46.Also, also, we are working on cycling routes and
:56:47. > :57:00.Well, we did go have consultation, and asked the people,
:57:01. > :57:03.the vast majority of people thought it was the right solution for
:57:04. > :57:06.The government says it has invested almost ?1 billion
:57:07. > :57:09.to encourage people to switch to low emission vehicles.
:57:10. > :57:11.And it says it will update as quality plans next year
:57:12. > :57:14.as a further measure to tackle air-pollution.
:57:15. > :57:16.Vera Baird, a Labour council there standing accused of looking
:57:17. > :57:19.for a solution to this as building more roads, that's not
:57:20. > :57:22.No, what is a solution is some government action for once.
:57:23. > :57:26.They have been taken to court four times now to get them to do some
:57:27. > :57:28.serious clean air legislation, 2011, 2014, to Europe,
:57:29. > :57:32.2015, the Supreme Court and just a week ago,
:57:33. > :57:40.they were ordered a game to get a grip on nitrogen dioxide.
:57:41. > :57:45.But it doesn't help with your local council just deciding
:57:46. > :57:47.on a relief road, which may generate more traffic?
:57:48. > :57:49.Local authorities have to work within their budget to do
:57:50. > :57:53.We would like some fundamentally improved funding for public
:57:54. > :57:57.We could extend the Metro, that would save a lot.
:57:58. > :58:00.But basically, the government has declined to get a grip on this.
:58:01. > :58:04.They have been criticised repeatedly by Europe and also by the courts.
:58:05. > :58:06.Julian Smith, you are just not getting a grip on this?
:58:07. > :58:09.Thousands of people are dying every year because of air-pollution.
:58:10. > :58:12.Well, we have announced the clean air zones,
:58:13. > :58:15.we have got a consultation on this issue, that launches in October.
:58:16. > :58:20.And the big shift that is happening very rapidly is on the technology
:58:21. > :58:25.changes in areas such as electric cars and a driverless cars
:58:26. > :58:29.and in the Autumn Statement, two weeks ago, I was delighted
:58:30. > :58:32.to see ?300 million going into that area and into investing into more
:58:33. > :58:38.thinking on research and development for new technologies.
:58:39. > :58:41.But the problem is, as Vera Baird mentioned the EU,
:58:42. > :58:45.it is the EU limits at the moment that are the only things that
:58:46. > :58:51.And even then, you are breaching them and being taken to court.
:58:52. > :58:53.The suspicion is, post-Brexit, you might want to relax those limits.
:58:54. > :58:56.Well, as you know, there will be a bill going through Parliament
:58:57. > :59:00.in the New Year with regard to the transposition
:59:01. > :59:06.It would be a great way of avoiding these court cases,
:59:07. > :59:10.I think the important thing is what actions are being taken,
:59:11. > :59:13.as I said, there's consultation at the moment, there are these clean
:59:14. > :59:20.And the big push in terms of the technology is key.
:59:21. > :59:26.We have also made huge strides on the international stage on Paris
:59:27. > :59:29.climate change talks, on committing to the big
:59:30. > :59:32.targets in this area and being a leader in that.
:59:33. > :59:34.Vera Baird, they are doing what they can?
:59:35. > :59:39.These are key threats to the public health of our cities and you mention
:59:40. > :59:42.a range of diseases, lung disease to heart attack
:59:43. > :59:45.and strokes are caused by these pollutants.
:59:46. > :59:50.They have actually reduced from 12 clean air zones to five,
:59:51. > :59:55.But you can't stand in the way of the economy?
:59:56. > :59:58.And they are only intending to put them in place
:59:59. > :00:00.at the time when they thought the European Commission
:00:01. > :00:04.That is an express finding by a High Court judge.
:00:05. > :00:07.That they were playing to that agenda and not doing it as fast
:00:08. > :00:12.We will have to leave it there, we are running out of time.
:00:13. > :00:14.And that's about it from us for this week.
:00:15. > :00:15.We're back, same time, same place next Sunday when we'll be
:00:16. > :00:17.still the biggest factor. We are running out of time.
:00:18. > :00:31.Now, Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson was rebuked
:00:32. > :00:34.by Downing Street this week - yes, again - after the Guardian
:00:35. > :00:36.revealed he had accused Saudi Arabia of being among countries engaged
:00:37. > :00:38.in fighting "proxy wars" in the Middle East, breaking
:00:39. > :00:41.the Foreign Office's convention of not criticising a key UK ally
:00:42. > :00:44.in the region and annoying the prime minister who'd just returned
:00:45. > :00:51.The Defence Secretary Michael Fallon was asked about it
:00:52. > :00:58.And let's be very clear about this, the way some of his remarks
:00:59. > :01:01.were reported seemed to imply we didn't support the right
:01:02. > :01:04.of Saudi Arabia to defend itself, and it is being attacked by Houthi
:01:05. > :01:06.terrorists from over the border with Yemen,
:01:07. > :01:08.didn't support what Saudi is doing in leading the campaign to restore
:01:09. > :01:16.Some of the reporting led people to think that, and that is all...
:01:17. > :01:19.This was simply the way it was reported and interpreted.
:01:20. > :01:21.The way it was interpreted left people with the impression
:01:22. > :01:30.that we didn't support Saudi Arabia and we do.
:01:31. > :01:32.Well, Mr Johnson has been in the Saudi capital
:01:33. > :01:34.Riyadh this morning, so how's he been received?
:01:35. > :01:36.Our security correspondent Frank Gardner is in neighbouring
:01:37. > :01:43.Bahrain, where Mr Johnson was earlier in the weekend.
:01:44. > :01:48.It has probably been a long time since there has been such interest
:01:49. > :01:53.in a British Foreign Secretary visiting the gulf region. What are
:01:54. > :01:59.the political elites there making of it all? Well, they think to be
:02:00. > :02:04.honest it is a bit of a storm in a tea cup this is a bit of a Whitehall
:02:05. > :02:09.story, I think a lot of people I have spoken to tend to believe that
:02:10. > :02:13.Number Ten have made such a fuss about this, that it has created a
:02:14. > :02:18.story in itself. That said, though, I think that behind the scenes there
:02:19. > :02:22.was a certain amount of damage limitation taking place between
:02:23. > :02:27.London and Riyadh, a bit of smoothing of feathers and reassuring
:02:28. > :02:31.and the Stade Saudis tell me they are reassured the message they are
:02:32. > :02:35.taking is. Coming from Number Ten and they are not taking Boris
:02:36. > :02:40.Johnson's comments to heart. He is in the dam, he has met the king, I
:02:41. > :02:46.tweet add picture of that just a few minutes ago. He has been meeting
:02:47. > :02:50.Crown Prince, and he is now meeting the Foreign Minister, so the Saudis
:02:51. > :02:53.got an opportunity to brief him according to their vision of the
:02:54. > :02:57.Middle East. They will share their security concern, which is not just
:02:58. > :03:01.what is going on in Yemen, but they are very concerned about what they
:03:02. > :03:05.see as Iranian expansionism, that has been a theme here at this
:03:06. > :03:11.conference in Bahrain that Boris Johnson addressed only a day or two
:03:12. > :03:15.ago. If we put aside Mr Johnson's supposed gaffes or even the Downing
:03:16. > :03:21.Street slapping down of him, we have had the Prime Minister in the region
:03:22. > :03:28.earlier this week, we have got Mr Johnson there now, can we yet divine
:03:29. > :03:35.what the May Government strategy is in the Golf? -- Guff. In three
:03:36. > :03:43.words, in Boris Johnson's words Britain is back. He was very quick
:03:44. > :03:47.to say not in a jingoistic running up flags, new imperial list way,
:03:48. > :03:54.although that is Howley be seen by some. He gave a very forceful speech
:03:55. > :03:59.which seemed to go down well the gulf hosts here on Friday night
:04:00. > :04:05.which said Britain made a strategic mistake in, after 1968 in
:04:06. > :04:10.withdrawing east of Suez and it will reverse that decision, and invest ?3
:04:11. > :04:15.billion over the next ten years in building up its military not bases
:04:16. > :04:19.exactly but facilities -- facilities that are here in this part of the
:04:20. > :04:22.world. There are currently 15 hundred hundred British servicemen
:04:23. > :04:27.and women in this region, seven warships and so on. It isn't
:04:28. > :04:31.entirely true to say Britain withdrew east of Suez because we
:04:32. > :04:37.have had a military presence on and off here, the RAF had a base here in
:04:38. > :04:43.Bahrain during the Gulf War of 91. In 2003, of course, British planes
:04:44. > :04:48.and troops deployed from this area, but he and Theresa May are both
:04:49. > :04:53.saying post-Brexit, Britain's big emphasis or one of the big pushes is
:04:54. > :04:58.going to be to redouble its ties with gulf Arab nations, that isn't
:04:59. > :05:03.going to come as an easy bit of new, I think, to human rights campaigners
:05:04. > :05:09.and anti-arms campaigners because a large part of the ?7 billion of
:05:10. > :05:13.bilateral trade Britain did with Saudi Arabia comes from arms deals
:05:14. > :05:18.and those arms are being used in the conflict in Yemen, in some cases
:05:19. > :05:23.with tragic consequences. Thank you very much for talking to us.
:05:24. > :05:31.Instead of concentrating on Mr Johnson's gaffes, or Downing Street
:05:32. > :05:35.reaction to it. Frank Gardner there has just given us a really important
:05:36. > :05:40.development, or explained what the British are up to there now. They
:05:41. > :05:43.want to be back in the gulf big time. Isn't that something we should
:05:44. > :05:47.be debating and discussing? It is fascinating. It is yet another
:05:48. > :05:52.example post-Brexit I would say this is someone who voted to Brexit, that
:05:53. > :05:58.the world is changing, and Britain's role is going to be transformed
:05:59. > :06:03.post-Brexit. I mean just on the Boris point, I completely agree, I
:06:04. > :06:07.think a lot of it is ridiculous, in a Whitehall belt way stuff, but I
:06:08. > :06:12.think what is really important about it, is that Number Ten feel
:06:13. > :06:16.threatened by him, and the reason that these ridiculous gaffes and
:06:17. > :06:23.many of them are not even gaffes are pounced upon is he is the main rival
:06:24. > :06:26.for the Crown, so it is high level power play politics, and it is May
:06:27. > :06:32.trying to keep him in his place. What do you make though, of Britain
:06:33. > :06:37.is back in the gulf? That is the big story, is it not. Utterly bizarre,
:06:38. > :06:41.post imperial fantasy, the idea we are back east of Suez? We are
:06:42. > :06:46.breaking off from our closest ally, most like us, the rest of Europe,
:06:47. > :06:52.democratic, decent human rights country, and instead we are allying
:06:53. > :06:58.ourself to perilous, dangerous, unpleasant countries... Why should
:06:59. > :07:05.we be back in the gulf? If that is the trade off, these are, you know,
:07:06. > :07:10.these renasty kingdoms, petty unpleasant and unstable countries.
:07:11. > :07:14.Don't we have to keep the straits open otherwise the oil supply
:07:15. > :07:18.collapses and the world economy will go into the worst recession
:07:19. > :07:23.depression ever? Don't we have to be involved in that We do, and I think
:07:24. > :07:27.what happens is if we leave Europe and we need trade everywhere else,
:07:28. > :07:30.we have to travel the world on our knees begging for friends from the
:07:31. > :07:37.most unsavoury people, where ever they are, whether it is... You keep
:07:38. > :07:41.saying we are leaving Europe, that is a geographic impossibility.
:07:42. > :07:46.Britain is part of Europe, we are the... Not what Liam Fox is saying.
:07:47. > :07:50.The key power in Nato, we are leaving the European Union, that is
:07:51. > :07:56.a different Tring from Europe. I am trying to move away from Mr Johnson,
:07:57. > :08:01.or even Downing Street to... You got yourself into a Brexit row.
:08:02. > :08:05.Everything is through the prism of Brexit, even what you have for
:08:06. > :08:09.breakfast, when you mix up the word like I did last week. What do you
:08:10. > :08:14.make of what Frank Gardner told us? I am somewhere between the two. It
:08:15. > :08:17.is a nighs the line say we are back in the Middle East and we will take
:08:18. > :08:22.this part of the world seriously, the truth is our military is almost
:08:23. > :08:27.tiny, it is smaller than it was in the Napoleonic wars, that is not a
:08:28. > :08:32.huge amount more. Of course there S one of the two new aircraft
:08:33. > :08:37.carriers, that will be deployed in the gulf, to help the Americans keep
:08:38. > :08:45.the straits of her muz open, because it is in Europe's interest, not just
:08:46. > :08:50.Britains, Europe's interest that these straits stay open, which is
:08:51. > :08:55.more so than America. That is what FRANK was talking about. That is no
:08:56. > :09:02.change, British foreign policy has been keeping the straits open... Now
:09:03. > :09:08.we have the ability do it. We don't have an aircraft aier at the moment.
:09:09. > :09:16.Nor do we have the fleet of ships it needs. It is a great thing to be
:09:17. > :09:19.trade morgue with the Nice, to be turning -- Middle East, to be
:09:20. > :09:24.turning round more tax revenues and the like. Even selling weapons. I
:09:25. > :09:28.don't know what more can be done. You look at what has happened. BBC
:09:29. > :09:32.has had horrific reports from the Yemen and if you look at what the
:09:33. > :09:38.weapons are being used for, is that the trade we want? Right. Let us
:09:39. > :09:41.move on. Mr Corbyn was giving a speech yesterday but he was
:09:42. > :09:42.inter#ru79ded by Peter Tatchell. -- interrupted.
:09:43. > :09:55.Peter, could we leave this to the questions please?
:09:56. > :09:58.Peter, we are trying to make a speech here and then
:09:59. > :10:11.Was Peter Tatchell right do that yesterday? It is a bit of a
:10:12. > :10:17.distraction really. Jeremy Corbyn 17% in the polled is not going to be
:10:18. > :10:21.able to change... You mean his personal rating. If you want to do
:10:22. > :10:27.something about Syria you ought to be addressing the Government rather
:10:28. > :10:30.than a failing Labour leader. Peter Tatchell's line was Labour in
:10:31. > :10:36.general, Mr Corbyn in particular had not been vocal enough in condemning
:10:37. > :10:42.what the Russians and their Assad allies are doing in Aleppo. It was
:10:43. > :10:46.interesting Mr Corbyn had to ask Emily Thornberry if and when had
:10:47. > :10:54.they condemned what the Russians were doing? It was unclear. Other
:10:55. > :10:59.than Mrs Thornbury herself. There is a fascinating fault line in politics
:11:00. > :11:03.which is the Trump administration, the way in which parts of the
:11:04. > :11:09.British left have made themselves useful idiots once again for the
:11:10. > :11:12.Kremlin and it its policies. I think more broadly, you consider all the
:11:13. > :11:16.things we have been discussing, it is a national tragedy what is
:11:17. > :11:21.happening to the Labour Party. You don't know whether to laugh or cry
:11:22. > :11:25.watching that event. Corbyn was at a stop the war rally event only last
:11:26. > :11:31.week, and they of course are very close to the Kremlin, they blame the
:11:32. > :11:38.west, well they blame the west much more... They always blame the west.
:11:39. > :11:42.And not the Russians. I agree Jeremy Corbyn having to check with Emily
:11:43. > :11:48.Thornberry what the Labour Party's policy was on bombing Aleppo... If
:11:49. > :11:53.and when they condemned it. He needs to no better. The fact that we are
:11:54. > :11:58.talking about what was a pretty small scale protest, rather than
:11:59. > :12:02.anything Corbyn said, shows he wasn't saying anything relevant. We
:12:03. > :12:06.will get a huge amount of tweet saying the BBC are anti-Corbyn. I
:12:07. > :12:09.understand that, that shouldn't intimidate us from saying, from
:12:10. > :12:13.analysing what is happening, and here is one yard stick, of course it
:12:14. > :12:17.is fundamentally the Government's choice, but it could be an indicator
:12:18. > :12:23.of whether the Labour Party is relevant or not in only issues, in
:12:24. > :12:27.reason pert Murdoch is making a take over bid for all of Sky and so far
:12:28. > :12:33.you would have to bet, policy, that it is going to get through pretty
:12:34. > :12:36.much unscathed. It is extraordinary. It is connected with Leveson, and
:12:37. > :12:40.the fact that that has disappeared. That the idea of restraining the
:12:41. > :12:45.press in any way at all, and virtual will I the whole of the press is
:12:46. > :12:50.behind that, and it seems to go with allowing what wasn't allowed before.
:12:51. > :12:56.He was judged as unfit before. He is as unfit now, to control that much
:12:57. > :13:00.of the media, and as he was when he made the last bid for Sky. It is
:13:01. > :13:04.time people stood up and said so. You look at the press he runs, the
:13:05. > :13:09.cultural effect he has has on this country which has been appalling,
:13:10. > :13:16.you know about this. Tom, I better let you have a word. I don't agree
:13:17. > :13:22.at all Polly but the lesson for the Labour Party, is if they don't want
:13:23. > :13:26.to have any influence at all, they have to be credible, and stand a
:13:27. > :13:28.reasonable chance of becoming Prime Minister or becoming Government,
:13:29. > :13:33.that is the only way they will get leverage. We need to leave it there.
:13:34. > :13:39.I was going to say we will come back to it. We will see. The Daily
:13:40. > :13:42.Politics will be back at noon tomorrow.
:13:43. > :13:45.and we'll be back here next Sunday for the last show of 2016.
:13:46. > :13:53.Remember - if it's Sunday, it's the Sunday Politics.