15/01/2017

:00:35. > :00:38.It's Sunday morning, and this is the Sunday Politics.

:00:39. > :00:42.Is the Prime Minister prepared to end Britain's membership

:00:43. > :00:45.of the EU's single market and its customs union?

:00:46. > :00:48.We preview Theresa May's big speech, as she seeks to unite the country

:00:49. > :00:55.Is the press a force for good or a beast that needs taming?

:00:56. > :00:58.As the Government ponders its decision, we speak to one

:00:59. > :01:02.of those leading the campaign for greater regulation.

:01:03. > :01:08.Just what kind of President will Donald Trump be?

:01:09. > :01:15.Piers Morgan, a man who knows him well, joins us live.

:01:16. > :01:18.In our region, Labour faces a by-election in Cumbria and

:01:19. > :01:21.And we speak exclusively to Labour leader, Jeremy Corbyn,

:01:22. > :01:30.as the Copeland campaigning gets underway.

:01:31. > :01:33.And to help me make sense of all that, three of the finest

:01:34. > :01:36.hacks we could persuade to work on a Sunday - Steve Richards,

:01:37. > :01:44.They'll be tweeting throughout the programme, and you can join

:01:45. > :01:50.So, Theresa May is preparing for her big Brexit speech on Tuesday,

:01:51. > :01:53.in which she will urge people to give up on "insults"

:01:54. > :01:57.and "division" and unite to build, quote, a "global Britain".

:01:58. > :02:00.Some of the Sunday papers report that the Prime Minister will go

:02:01. > :02:04.The Sunday Telegraph splashes with the headline: "May's big

:02:05. > :02:08.gamble on a clean Brexit", saying the Prime Minister

:02:09. > :02:10.will announce she's prepared to take Britain out of membership

:02:11. > :02:15.of the single market and customs union.

:02:16. > :02:18.The Sunday Times has a similar write-up -

:02:19. > :02:20.they call it a "clean and hard Brexit".

:02:21. > :02:24.The Brexit Secretary David Davis has also written a piece in the paper

:02:25. > :02:27.hinting that a transitional deal could be on the cards.

:02:28. > :02:30.And the Sunday Express says: "May's Brexit Battle Plan",

:02:31. > :02:33.explaining that the Prime Minister will get tough with Brussels

:02:34. > :02:36.and call for an end to free movement.

:02:37. > :02:38.Well, let's get some more reaction on this.

:02:39. > :02:40.I'm joined now from Cumbria by the leader

:02:41. > :02:47.of the Liberal Democrats, Tim Farron.

:02:48. > :02:52.Mr Farron, welcome back to the programme. The Prime Minister says

:02:53. > :02:56.most people now just want to get on with it and make a success of it.

:02:57. > :03:02.But you still want to stop it, don't you? Well, I certainly take the view

:03:03. > :03:05.that heading for a hard Brexit, essentially that means being outside

:03:06. > :03:10.the Single Market and the customs union, is not something that was on

:03:11. > :03:13.the ballot paper last June. For Theresa May to adopt what is

:03:14. > :03:18.basically the large all Farage vision of Britain's relationship

:03:19. > :03:22.with Europe is not what was voted for last June. It is right for us to

:03:23. > :03:25.stand up and say that a hard Brexit is not the democratic choice of the

:03:26. > :03:29.British people, and that we should be fighting for the people to be the

:03:30. > :03:33.ones who have the Seat the end of this process, not have it forced

:03:34. > :03:37.upon them by Theresa May and David Davis. When it comes though dual

:03:38. > :03:41.position that we should remain in the membership of the Single Market

:03:42. > :03:47.and the customs union, it looks like you are losing the argument, doesn't

:03:48. > :03:51.it? My sense is that if you believe in being in the Single Market and

:03:52. > :03:55.the customs union are good things, I think many people on the leave site

:03:56. > :04:00.believe that, Stephen Phillips, the Conservative MP until the autumn who

:04:01. > :04:03.resigned, who voted for Leave but believe we should be in the Single

:04:04. > :04:08.Market, I think those people believe that it is wrong for us to enter the

:04:09. > :04:12.negotiations having given up on the most important part of it. If you

:04:13. > :04:15.really are going to fight Britain's corner, then you should go in there

:04:16. > :04:21.fighting the membership of the Single Market, not give up and

:04:22. > :04:26.whitefly, as Theresa May has done before we even start. -- and wave

:04:27. > :04:30.the white flag. Will you vote against regret Article 50 in the

:04:31. > :04:33.Commons? We made it clear that we want the British people to have the

:04:34. > :04:38.final Seat -- vote against triggering. Will you vote against

:04:39. > :04:44.Article 50. Will you encourage the House of Lords to vote against out

:04:45. > :04:48.Article 50? I don't think they will get a chance to vote. They will have

:04:49. > :04:51.a chance to win the deuce amendments. One amendment we will

:04:52. > :04:56.introduce is that there should be a referendum in the terms of the deal.

:04:57. > :04:59.It is not right that Parliament on Government, and especially not civil

:05:00. > :05:03.servants in Brussels and Whitehall, they should stitch-up the final

:05:04. > :05:07.deal. That would be wrong. It is right that the British people have

:05:08. > :05:13.the final say. I understand that as your position. You made it clear

:05:14. > :05:16.Britain to remain a member of the Single Market on the customs union.

:05:17. > :05:19.You accept, I assume, that that would mean remaining under the

:05:20. > :05:21.jurisdiction of the European Court of Justice, continuing free movement

:05:22. > :05:28.of people, and the free-trade deals remained in Brussels' competence. So

:05:29. > :05:32.it seems to me that if you believe that being in the Single Market is a

:05:33. > :05:36.good thing, then you should go and argue for that. Whilst I believe

:05:37. > :05:39.that we're not going to get a better deal than the one we currently have,

:05:40. > :05:42.nevertheless it is up to the Government to go and argue for the

:05:43. > :05:47.best deal possible for us outside. You accept your position would mean

:05:48. > :05:51.that? It would mean certainly being in the Single Market and the customs

:05:52. > :05:54.union. It's no surprise to you I'm sure that the Lib Dems believe the

:05:55. > :05:58.package we have got now inside the EU is going to be of the Nutley

:05:59. > :06:02.better than anything we get from the outside, I accept the direction of

:06:03. > :06:06.travel -- is going to be the Nutley better. At the moment, what the

:06:07. > :06:10.Government are doing is assuming that all the things you say Drew,

:06:11. > :06:13.and there is no way possible for us arguing for a deal that allows in

:06:14. > :06:16.the Single Market without some of those other things. If they really

:06:17. > :06:21.believed in the best for Britain, you would go and argue for the best

:06:22. > :06:28.for Britain. Let's be clear, if we remain under the jurisdiction of the

:06:29. > :06:31.ECJ, which is the court that governs membership of the Single Market,

:06:32. > :06:36.continued free movement of people, the Europeans have made clear, is

:06:37. > :06:40.what goes with the Single Market. And free-trade deals remaining under

:06:41. > :06:44.Brussels' competence. If we accepted all of that is the price of

:06:45. > :06:46.membership of the Single Market, in what conceivable way with that

:06:47. > :06:53.amount to leaving the European Union? Well, for example, I do

:06:54. > :06:56.believe that being a member of the Single Market is worth fighting for.

:06:57. > :07:00.I personally believe that freedom of movement is a good thing. British

:07:01. > :07:04.people benefit from freedom of movement. We will hugely be hit as

:07:05. > :07:09.individuals and families and businesses. Mike I understand, but

:07:10. > :07:14.your writing of leaving... There the butt is that if you do except that

:07:15. > :07:19.freedom of movement has to change, I don't, but if you do, and if you are

:07:20. > :07:23.Theresa May, and the problem is to go and fight for the best deal,

:07:24. > :07:26.don't take it from Brussels that you can't be in the Single Market

:07:27. > :07:32.without those other things as well, you don't go and argue the case. It

:07:33. > :07:35.depresses me that Theresa May is beginning this process is waving the

:07:36. > :07:40.white flag, just as this morning Jeremy Corbyn was waving the white

:07:41. > :07:43.flag when it comes to it. We need a Government that will fight Britain's

:07:44. > :07:47.corner and an opposition that will fight the Government to make sure

:07:48. > :07:53.that it fights. Just explain to our viewers how we could remain members,

:07:54. > :07:59.members of the Single Market, and not be subject to the jurisdiction

:08:00. > :08:03.of the European court? So, first of all we spent over the last many,

:08:04. > :08:06.many years, the likes of Nigel Farage and others, will have argued,

:08:07. > :08:10.you heard them on this very programme, that Britain should

:08:11. > :08:13.aspire to be like Norway and Switzerland for example, countries

:08:14. > :08:17.that are not in the European Union but aren't the Single Market. It is

:08:18. > :08:21.very clear to me that if you want the best deal for Britain -- but are

:08:22. > :08:25.in the Single Market. You go and argue for the best deal. What is the

:08:26. > :08:31.answer to my question, you haven't answered it

:08:32. > :08:36.the question is, how does the Prime Minister go and fight for the best

:08:37. > :08:41.deal for Britain. If we think that being in the Single Market is the

:08:42. > :08:45.right thing, not Baxter -- not access to it but membership of it,

:08:46. > :08:48.you don't wave the white flag before you enter the negotiating room. I'm

:08:49. > :08:52.afraid we have run out of time. Thank you, Tim Farron.

:08:53. > :08:58.The leaks on this speech on Tuesday we have seen, it is interesting that

:08:59. > :09:06.Downing Street has not attempted to dampen them down this morning, in

:09:07. > :09:10.the various papers, do they tell us something new? Do they tell us more

:09:11. > :09:14.of the Goverment's aims in the Brexit negotiations? I think it's

:09:15. > :09:17.only a confirmation of something which has been in the mating really

:09:18. > :09:23.for the six months that she's been in the job. The logic of everything

:09:24. > :09:28.that she's said since last July, the keenness on re-gaining control of

:09:29. > :09:31.migration, the desire to do international trade deals, the fact

:09:32. > :09:34.that she is appointed trade Secretary, the logic of all of that

:09:35. > :09:37.is that we are out of the Single Market, quite probably out of the

:09:38. > :09:41.customs union, what will happen this week is a restatement of a fairly

:09:42. > :09:45.clear position anyway. I think Tim Farron is right about one thing, I

:09:46. > :09:48.don't think she will go into the speech planning to absolutely

:09:49. > :09:56.definitively say, we are leaving those things. Because even if there

:09:57. > :09:58.is a 1% chance of a miracle deal, where you stay in the Single Market,

:09:59. > :10:01.somehow get exempted from free movement, it is prudent to keep

:10:02. > :10:06.hopes on that option as a Prime Minister. -- to keep open that

:10:07. > :10:09.option. She is being advised both by the diplomatic corps and her

:10:10. > :10:12.personal advisers, don't concede on membership of the Single Market yet.

:10:13. > :10:21.We know it's not going to happen, but let them Europeans knock us back

:10:22. > :10:25.on that,... That is probably the right strategy for all of the

:10:26. > :10:29.reasons that Jarlan outlined there. What we learned a bit today is the

:10:30. > :10:32.possibility of some kind of transition or arrangements, which

:10:33. > :10:36.David Davies has been talking about in a comment piece for one of the

:10:37. > :10:41.Sunday papers. My sense from Brexiteers aborting MPs is that they

:10:42. > :10:45.are very happy with 90% of the rhetoric -- Brexit sporting MPs. The

:10:46. > :10:52.rhetoric has not been dampened down by MPs, apart from this transitional

:10:53. > :10:55.arrangement, which they feel and two France, on the one front will

:10:56. > :10:59.encourage the very dilatory EU to spend longer than ever negotiating a

:11:00. > :11:03.deal, and on the other hand will also be exactly what our civil

:11:04. > :11:07.service looks for in stringing things out. What wasn't explained

:11:08. > :11:11.this morning is what David Davies means by transitional is not that

:11:12. > :11:14.you negotiate what you can in two years and then spend another five

:11:15. > :11:20.years on the matter is that a lot of the soul. He thinks everything has

:11:21. > :11:23.to be done in the two years, -- of the matter are hard to solve. But it

:11:24. > :11:28.would include transitional arrangements over the five years.

:11:29. > :11:33.What we are seeing in the build-up is the danger of making these kind

:11:34. > :11:36.of speeches. In a way, I kind of admired her not feeding the media

:11:37. > :11:42.machine over the autumn and the end of last year cars, as Janan has

:11:43. > :11:46.pointed out in his columns, she has actually said quite a lot from it,

:11:47. > :11:51.you would extrapolate quite a lot. We won't be members of the Single

:11:52. > :11:57.Market? She said that in the party conference speech, we are out of

:11:58. > :12:01.European court. Her red line is the end of free movement, so we are out

:12:02. > :12:05.of the Single Market. Why has she sent Liam Fox to negotiate all of

:12:06. > :12:09.these other deals, not that he will succeed necessarily, but that is the

:12:10. > :12:12.intention? We are still in the customs union. You can extrapolate

:12:13. > :12:17.what she will say perhaps more cautiously in the headlines on

:12:18. > :12:20.Tuesday. But the grammar of a big speech raises expectations, gets the

:12:21. > :12:24.markets worked up. So she is doing it because people have said that she

:12:25. > :12:28.doesn't know what she's on about. But maybe she should have resisted

:12:29. > :12:31.it. Very well, and she hasn't. The speech is on Tuesday morning.

:12:32. > :12:34.Now, the public consultation on press regulation closed this

:12:35. > :12:36.week, and soon ministers will have to decide whether to

:12:37. > :12:38.enact a controversial piece of legislation.

:12:39. > :12:40.Section 40 of the Crime and Courts Act, if implemented,

:12:41. > :12:43.could see newspapers forced to pay legal costs in libel and privacy

:12:44. > :12:53.If they don't sign up to an officially approved regulator.

:12:54. > :12:55.The newspapers say it's an affront to a free press,

:12:56. > :12:58.while pro-privacy campaigners say it's the only way to ensure

:12:59. > :12:59.a scandal like phone-hacking can't happen again.

:13:00. > :13:05.Ellie Price has been reading all about it.

:13:06. > :13:09.It was the biggest news about the news for decades,

:13:10. > :13:14.a scandal that involved household names, but not just celebrities.

:13:15. > :13:17.They've even hacked the phone of a murdered schoolgirl.

:13:18. > :13:20.It led to the closure of the News Of The World,

:13:21. > :13:29.a year-long public inquiry headed up by the judge Lord Justice Leveson,

:13:30. > :13:33.and in the end, a new press watchdog set up by Royal Charter,

:13:34. > :13:34.which could impose, among other things, million-pound fines.

:13:35. > :13:37.If this system is implemented, the country should have confidence

:13:38. > :13:38.that the terrible suffering of innocent victims

:13:39. > :13:41.like the Dowlers, the McCanns and Christopher Jefferies should

:13:42. > :13:47.To get this new plan rolling, the Government also passed

:13:48. > :13:51.the Crime and Courts Act, Section 40 of which would force

:13:52. > :13:54.publications who didn't sign up to the new regulator to pay legal

:13:55. > :13:58.costs in libel and privacy cases, even if they won.

:13:59. > :14:01.It's waiting for sign-off from the Culture Secretary.

:14:02. > :14:05.We've got about 50 publications that have signed up...

:14:06. > :14:08.This is Impress, the press regulator that's got the backing

:14:09. > :14:13.of the Royal Charter, so its members are protected

:14:14. > :14:17.from the penalties that would be imposed by Section 40.

:14:18. > :14:22.It's funded by the Formula One tycoon Max Mosley's

:14:23. > :14:28.I think the danger if we don't get Section 40 is that

:14:29. > :14:29.you have an incomplete Leveson project.

:14:30. > :14:32.I think it's very, very likely that within the next five or ten years

:14:33. > :14:35.there will be a scandal, there'll be a crisis in press

:14:36. > :14:37.standards, everyone will be saying to the Government,

:14:38. > :14:40."Why on Earth didn't you sort things out when you had the chance?"

:14:41. > :14:43.Isn't Section 40 essentially just a big stick to beat

:14:44. > :14:51.We hear a lot about the stick part, but there's also a big juicy carrot

:14:52. > :14:53.for publishers and their journalists who are members of an

:14:54. > :14:56.They get huge new protections from libel threats,

:14:57. > :14:58.from privacy actions, which actually means they've got

:14:59. > :15:07.a lot more opportunity to run investigative stories.

:15:08. > :15:10.Impress has a big image problem - not a single national

:15:11. > :15:15.Instead, many of them are members of Ipso,

:15:16. > :15:18.the independent regulator set up and funded by the industry that

:15:19. > :15:24.doesn't seek the recognition of the Royal Charter.

:15:25. > :15:27.The male cells around 22,000 each day...

:15:28. > :15:29.There are regional titles too, who, like the Birmingham Mail,

:15:30. > :15:32.won't sign up to Impress, even if they say the costs

:15:33. > :15:36.are associated with Section 40 could put them out of business.

:15:37. > :15:39.Impress has an umbilical cord that goes directly back to Government

:15:40. > :15:40.through the recognition setup that it has.

:15:41. > :15:43.Now, we broke free of the shackles of the regulated press

:15:44. > :15:46.when the stamp duty was revealed 150 years ago.

:15:47. > :15:53.If we go back to this level of oversight, then I think

:15:54. > :15:58.we turn the clock back, 150 years of press freedom.

:15:59. > :16:01.The responses from the public have been coming thick and fast

:16:02. > :16:02.since the Government launched its consultation

:16:03. > :16:05.In fact, by the time it closed on Tuesday,

:16:06. > :16:10.And for that reason alone, it could take months before

:16:11. > :16:14.a decision on what happens next is taken.

:16:15. > :16:17.The Government will also be minded to listen to its own MPs,

:16:18. > :16:23.One described it to me as Draconian and hugely damaging.

:16:24. > :16:25.So, will the current Culture Secretary's thinking be

:16:26. > :16:34.I don't think the Government will repeal section 40.

:16:35. > :16:37.What I'm arguing for is not to implement it, but it will remain

:16:38. > :16:42.on the statute book and if it then became apparent that Ipso simply

:16:43. > :16:45.was failing to work, was not delivering effective

:16:46. > :16:48.regulation and the press were behaving in a way

:16:49. > :16:53.which was wholly unacceptable, as they were ten years ago,

:16:54. > :16:57.then there might be an argument at that time to think well in that

:16:58. > :16:59.case we are going to have to take further measures,

:17:00. > :17:04.The future of section 40 might not be so black and white.

:17:05. > :17:07.I'm told a compromise could be met whereby the punitive parts

:17:08. > :17:11.about legal costs are dropped, but the incentives

:17:12. > :17:14.to join a recognised regulator are beefed up.

:17:15. > :17:17.But it could yet be some time until the issue of press freedom

:17:18. > :17:27.I'm joined now by Max Mosley - he won a legal case against the News

:17:28. > :17:30.Of The World after it revealed details about his private life,

:17:31. > :17:34.and he now campaigns for more press regulation.

:17:35. > :17:43.Are welcome to the programme. Let me ask you this, how can it be right

:17:44. > :17:47.that you, who many folk think have a clear vendetta against the British

:17:48. > :17:52.press, can bankroll a government approved regulator of the press? If

:17:53. > :17:56.we hadn't done it, nobody would, section 40 would never have come

:17:57. > :18:00.into force because there would never have been a regulator. It is

:18:01. > :18:05.absolutely wrong that a family trust should have to finance something

:18:06. > :18:10.like this. It should be financed by the press or the Government. If we

:18:11. > :18:11.hadn't done it there would be no possibility of regulation. But it

:18:12. > :18:39.means we end up with a regulator financed by you, as I say

:18:40. > :18:41.many people think you have a clear vendetta against the press. Where

:18:42. > :18:43.does the money come from? From a family trust, it is family money.

:18:44. > :18:46.You have to understand that somebody had to do this. I understand that.

:18:47. > :18:49.People like to know where the money comes from, I think you said it came

:18:50. > :18:52.from Brixton Steyn at one stage. Ages ago my father had a trust there

:18:53. > :18:56.but now all my money is in the UK. We are clear about that, but this is

:18:57. > :19:02.money that was put together by your father. Yes, my father inherited it

:19:03. > :19:06.from his father and his father. The whole of Manchester once belonged to

:19:07. > :19:11.the family, that's why there is a Mosley Street. That is irrelevant

:19:12. > :19:14.because as we have given the money, I have no control. If you do the

:19:15. > :19:24.most elementary checks into the contract between my family trust,

:19:25. > :19:29.the trust but finances Impress, it is impossible for me to exert any

:19:30. > :19:35.influence. It is just the same as if it had come from the National

:19:36. > :19:40.lottery. People will find it ironic that the money has come from

:19:41. > :19:49.historically Britain's best-known fascist. No, it has come from my

:19:50. > :19:53.family, the Mosley family. This is complete drivel because we have no

:19:54. > :19:58.control. Where the money comes from doesn't matter, if it had come from

:19:59. > :20:02.the national lottery it would be exactly the same. Impress was

:20:03. > :20:08.completely independent. But it wouldn't exist without your money,

:20:09. > :20:12.wouldn't it? But that doesn't give you influence. It might exist

:20:13. > :20:18.because it was founded before I was ever in contact with them. Isn't it

:20:19. > :20:22.curious then that so many leading light show your hostile views of the

:20:23. > :20:28.press? I don't think it is because I don't know a single member of the

:20:29. > :20:33.Impress board. The chairman I have met months. The only person I know

:20:34. > :20:40.is Jonathan Hayward who you had on just now. In one recent months he

:20:41. > :20:46.tweeted 50 attacks on the Daily Mail, including some calling for an

:20:47. > :20:52.advertising boycott of the paper. He also liked a Twitter post calling me

:20:53. > :20:57.Daily Mail and neofascist rag. Are these fitting for what is meant to

:20:58. > :21:01.be impartial regulator? The person you should ask about that is the

:21:02. > :21:05.press regulatory panel and they are completely independent, they

:21:06. > :21:10.reviewed the whole thing. You have probably produced something very

:21:11. > :21:12.selective, I have no idea but I am certain that these people are

:21:13. > :21:17.absolutely trustworthy and independent. It is not just Mr

:21:18. > :21:22.Hayward, we have a tonne of things he has tweeted calling for boycotts,

:21:23. > :21:28.remember this is the man that would be the regulator of these papers.

:21:29. > :21:34.He's the chief executive, that is a separate thing. The administration,

:21:35. > :21:43.the regulator. Many leading light show your vendetta of the press. I

:21:44. > :21:59.do not have a vendetta. Let's take another one. This person is on the

:22:00. > :22:05.code committee. Have a look at this. As someone with these views fit to

:22:06. > :22:09.be involved in the regulation of the press? You said I have a vendetta

:22:10. > :22:14.against the press, I do not, I didn't say that and it is completely

:22:15. > :22:20.wrong to say I have a vendetta. What do you think of that? I don't agree,

:22:21. > :22:31.I wouldn't ban the Daily Mail, I think it's a dreadful paper but I

:22:32. > :22:39.wouldn't ban it. Another Impress code committee said I hate the Daily

:22:40. > :22:43.Mail, I couldn't agree more, others have called for a boycott. Other

:22:44. > :22:47.people can say what they want and many people may think they are right

:22:48. > :22:54.but surely these views make them unfit to be partial regulators? I

:22:55. > :22:57.have no influence over Impress therefore I cannot say anything

:22:58. > :23:03.about it. You should ask them, not me. All I have done is make it

:23:04. > :23:09.possible for Impress to exist and that was the right thing to do. I'm

:23:10. > :23:15.asking you if people with these kind of views are fit to be regulators of

:23:16. > :23:20.the press. You would have to ask about all of their views, these are

:23:21. > :23:27.some of their views. A lot of people have a downer on the Daily Mail and

:23:28. > :23:31.the Sun, it doesn't necessarily make them party pre-. Why would

:23:32. > :23:37.newspapers sign up to a regulator run by what they think is run by

:23:38. > :23:41.enemies out to ruin them. If they don't like it they should start

:23:42. > :23:48.their own section 40 regulator. They could make it so recognised, if only

:23:49. > :23:57.they would make it independent of the big newspaper barons but they

:23:58. > :24:07.won't -- they could make Ipso recognised. Is the Daily Mail

:24:08. > :24:11.fascist? It certainly was in the 1930s. Me and my father are

:24:12. > :24:16.relevant, this whole section 40 issue is about access to justice.

:24:17. > :24:20.The press don't want ordinary people who cannot afford to bring an action

:24:21. > :24:24.against the press, don't want them to have access to justice. I can

:24:25. > :24:30.understand that but I don't sympathise. What would happen to the

:24:31. > :24:37.boss of Ofcom, which regulates broadcasters, if it described

:24:38. > :24:46.Channel 4 News is a Marxist scum? If the press don't want to sign up to

:24:47. > :24:55.Impress they can create their own regulator. If you were to listen we

:24:56. > :25:00.would get a lot further. The press should make their own Levenson

:25:01. > :25:05.compliant regulator, then they would have no complaints at all. Even

:25:06. > :25:09.papers like the Guardian, the Independent, the Financial Times,

:25:10. > :25:16.they show your hostility to tabloid journalism. They have refused to be

:25:17. > :25:20.regulated by Impress. I will say it again, the press could start their

:25:21. > :25:25.own regulator, they do not have to sign... Yes, but Levenson compliant

:25:26. > :25:30.one giving access to justice so people who cannot afford an

:25:31. > :25:33.expensive legal action have a proper arbitration service. The Guardian,

:25:34. > :25:38.the Independent, the Financial Times, they don't want to do that

:25:39. > :25:43.either. That would suggest there is something fatally flawed about your

:25:44. > :25:55.approach. Even these kind of papers, the Guardian, Impress is hardly

:25:56. > :26:04.independent, the head of... Andrew, I am sorry, you are like a dog with

:26:05. > :26:08.a bone. The press could start their own regulator, then people like the

:26:09. > :26:11.Financial Times, the Guardian and so one could decide whether they wanted

:26:12. > :26:15.to join or not but what is absolutely vital is that we should

:26:16. > :26:18.have a proper arbitration service so that people who cannot afford an

:26:19. > :26:24.expensive action have somewhere to go. This business of section 40

:26:25. > :26:28.which you want to be triggered which would mean papers that didn't sign

:26:29. > :26:32.up to Impress could be sued in any case and they would have to pay

:26:33. > :26:40.potentially massive legal costs, even if they win. Yes. This is what

:26:41. > :26:46.the number of papers have said about this, if section 40 was triggered,

:26:47. > :26:53.the Guardian wouldn't even think of investigation. The Sunday Times said

:26:54. > :26:56.it would not have even started to expose Lance Armstrong. The Times

:26:57. > :27:01.journalist said he couldn't have done the Rotherham child abuse

:27:02. > :27:05.scandal. What they all come it is a full reading of section 40 because

:27:06. > :27:12.that cost shifting will only apply if, and I quote, it is just and

:27:13. > :27:16.equitable in all the circumstances. I cannot conceive of any High Court

:27:17. > :27:21.judge, for example the Lance Armstrong case or the child abuse,

:27:22. > :27:26.saying it is just as equitable in all circumstances the newspaper

:27:27. > :27:32.should pay these costs. Even the editor of index on censorship, which

:27:33. > :27:36.is hardly the Sun, said this would be oppressive and they couldn't do

:27:37. > :27:42.what they do, they would risk being sued by warlords. No because if

:27:43. > :27:47.something unfortunate, some really bad person sues them, what would

:27:48. > :27:50.happen is the judge would say it is just inequitable normal

:27:51. > :27:54.circumstances that person should pay. Section 40 is for the person

:27:55. > :27:58.that comes along and says to a big newspaper, can we go to arbitration

:27:59. > :28:03.because I cannot afford to go to court. The big newspaper says no.

:28:04. > :28:08.That leaves less than 1% of the population with any remedy if the

:28:09. > :28:14.newspapers traduce them. It cannot be right. From the Guardian to the

:28:15. > :28:20.Sun, and including Index On Censorship, all of these media

:28:21. > :28:23.outlets think you are proposing a charter for conmen, warlords, crime

:28:24. > :28:27.bosses, dodgy politicians, celebrities with a grievance against

:28:28. > :28:36.the press. I will give you the final word to address that. It is pure

:28:37. > :28:40.guff and the reason is they want to go on marking their own homework.

:28:41. > :28:45.The press don't want anyone to make sure life is fair. All I want is

:28:46. > :28:49.somebody who has got no money to be able to sue in just the way that I

:28:50. > :28:53.can. All right, thanks for being with us.

:28:54. > :28:55.The doctors' union, the British Medical Association,

:28:56. > :28:57.has said the Government is scapegoating GPs in England

:28:58. > :29:01.The Government has said GP surgeries must try harder to stay

:29:02. > :29:04.open from 8am to 8pm, or they could lose out on funding.

:29:05. > :29:06.The pressure on A services in recent weeks has been intense.

:29:07. > :29:10.It emerged this week that 65 of the 152 Health Trusts in England

:29:11. > :29:12.had issued an operational pressure alert in the first

:29:13. > :29:18.At either level three, meaning major pressures,

:29:19. > :29:20.or level four, indicating an inability to deliver

:29:21. > :29:26.On Monday, Health Secretary Jeremy Hunt told the Commons

:29:27. > :29:29.that the number of people using A had increased by 9 million

:29:30. > :29:37.But that 30% of those visits were unnecessary.

:29:38. > :29:39.He said that the situation at a number of Trusts

:29:40. > :29:44.On Tuesday, the Royal College of Physicians wrote

:29:45. > :29:47.to the Prime Minister saying the health service was being

:29:48. > :29:52.paralysed by spiralling demand, and urging greater investment.

:29:53. > :29:56.On Wednesday, the Chief Executive of NHS England, Simon Stevens,

:29:57. > :30:01.told a Select Committee that NHS funding will be highly constrained.

:30:02. > :30:05.And from 2018, real-terms spending per person would fall.

:30:06. > :30:09.The Prime Minister described the Red Cross's claim that A

:30:10. > :30:13.was facing a "humanitarian crisis" as "irresponsible and overblown".

:30:14. > :30:16.And the National Audit Office issued a report that found almost half,

:30:17. > :30:23.46%, of GP surgeries closed at some point during core hours.

:30:24. > :30:27.Yesterday, Mrs May signalled her support for doctors' surgeries

:30:28. > :30:31.opening from 8am to 8pm every day of the week, in order to divert

:30:32. > :30:38.To discuss this, I'm joined now by the Conservative

:30:39. > :30:40.MP Maria Caulfield - she was an NHS nurse in a former

:30:41. > :30:43.life - and Clare Gerada, a former chair of the Royal College

:30:44. > :30:53.Welcome to you both. So, Maria Caulfield, what the Government is

:30:54. > :30:58.saying, Downing Street in effect is saying that GPs do not work hard

:30:59. > :31:01.enough and that's the reason why A was under such pressure? No, I don't

:31:02. > :31:05.think that is the message, I think that is the message that the media

:31:06. > :31:10.have taken up. That is not the expression that we want to give. I

:31:11. > :31:14.still work as a nurse, I know how hard doctors work in hospitals and

:31:15. > :31:19.GP practices. When the rose 30% of people turning up at A for neither

:31:20. > :31:24.an accident or an emergency, we do need to look at alternative. Where

:31:25. > :31:28.is the GPs' operability in this? We know from patients that if they

:31:29. > :31:31.cannot get access to GPs, they will do one of three things. They will

:31:32. > :31:35.wait two or three weeks until they can get an appointment, they will

:31:36. > :31:39.forget about the problem altogether, which is not good, we want patients

:31:40. > :31:48.to be getting investigations at early stages, or they will go to

:31:49. > :31:51.A And that is a problem. I'm not quite sure what the role that GPs

:31:52. > :31:54.play in this. What is your response in that? I think about 70% of

:31:55. > :31:57.patients that I see should not be seen by me but should still be seen

:31:58. > :32:01.by hospital consultants. If we look at it from GPs' eyes and not from

:32:02. > :32:05.hospital's eyes, because that is what it is, we might get somewhere.

:32:06. > :32:10.Tomorrow morning, every practice in England will have about 1.5 GPs

:32:11. > :32:15.shot, that's not even counting if there is traffic problems, sickness

:32:16. > :32:18.or whatever. -- GPs shot. We cannot work any harder, I cannot

:32:19. > :32:26.physically, emotionally work any harder. We are open 12 hours a day,

:32:27. > :32:30.most of us, I run practices open 365 days per year 24 hours a day. I

:32:31. > :32:34.don't understand this. It is one thing attacking me as a GP from

:32:35. > :32:37.working hard enough, but it is another thing saying that GPs as a

:32:38. > :32:43.profession and doing what they should be doing. Let me in National

:32:44. > :32:50.Audit Office has coming up with these figures showing that almost

:32:51. > :32:53.half of doctors' practices are not open during core hours at some part

:32:54. > :32:57.of the week. That's where the implication comes, that they are not

:32:58. > :33:02.working hard enough. What do you say to that? I don't recognise this. I'm

:33:03. > :33:06.not being defensive, I'm just don't recognise it. There are practices

:33:07. > :33:09.working palliative care services, practices have to close home visits

:33:10. > :33:13.if they are single-handed, some of us are working in care homes during

:33:14. > :33:20.the day. They may shot for an hour in the middle of the data will sort

:33:21. > :33:22.out some of the prescriptions and admin -- they may shot. My practice

:33:23. > :33:25.runs a number of practices across London. If we shut during our

:33:26. > :33:30.contractual hours we would have NHS England coming down on us like a

:33:31. > :33:35.tonne of bricks. Maria Caulfield, I'm struggling to understand, given

:33:36. > :33:37.the problems the NHS faces, particularly in our hospitals, what

:33:38. > :33:41.this has got to do with the solution? Obviously there are GP

:33:42. > :33:46.practices that are working, you know, over and above the hours. But

:33:47. > :33:52.there are some GP practices, we know from National Audit Office, there

:33:53. > :33:55.are particular black sports -- blackspots in the country that only

:33:56. > :33:58.offer services for three hours a week. That's causing problems if

:33:59. > :34:03.they cannot get to see a GP they will go and use A Nobody is

:34:04. > :34:07.saying that this measure would solve problems at A, it would address

:34:08. > :34:11.one small part of its top blog we shouldn't be starting this, as I

:34:12. > :34:15.keep saying, please to this from solving the problems at A We

:34:16. > :34:19.should be starting it from solving the problems of the patients in

:34:20. > :34:25.their totality, the best place they should go, not from A This really

:34:26. > :34:30.upsets me, as a GP I am there to be a proxy A doctor. I am a GP, a

:34:31. > :34:34.highly skilled doctor, looking after patients from cradle to grave across

:34:35. > :34:40.the physical, psychological and social, I am not an A doctor. I

:34:41. > :34:44.don't disagree with that, nobody is saying that GPs are not working hard

:34:45. > :34:48.enough. You just did, actually, about some of them. In some

:34:49. > :34:53.practices, what we need to see, it's not just GPs in GP surgeries, it is

:34:54. > :34:57.advanced nurse practitioners, pharmacists. It doesn't necessarily

:34:58. > :35:02.need to be all on the GPs. I think advanced nurse practitioners are in

:35:03. > :35:06.short supply. Position associate or go to hospital, -- physician

:35:07. > :35:10.associates. We have very few trainees, junior doctors in general

:35:11. > :35:13.practice, unlike hospitals, which tend to have some slack with the

:35:14. > :35:18.junior doctor community and workforce. This isn't an argument,

:35:19. > :35:21.this is about saying, let's stop looking at the National health

:35:22. > :35:27.system as a National hospital system. GPs tomorrow will see about

:35:28. > :35:32.1.3 million patients. That is a lot of thoughtful. A lot of activity

:35:33. > :35:37.with no resources. If you wanted the GPs to behave better, in your terms,

:35:38. > :35:41.when you allocated more money to GPs, part of the reforms, because

:35:42. > :35:45.that's where it went, shouldn't you have targeted it more closely to

:35:46. > :35:49.where they want to operate? That is exactly what the Prime Minister is

:35:50. > :35:53.saying, extra funding is being made available by GPs to extend hours and

:35:54. > :35:56.services. If certain GP practices cannot do that, the money will

:35:57. > :36:00.follow the patient to where they move onto. We have no doctors to do

:36:01. > :36:03.it. I was on a coach last week, the coach driver stopped in the service

:36:04. > :36:08.station for an hour, they were stopping for a rest. We cannot do

:36:09. > :36:15.it. Even if you gave us millions more money, and thankfully NHS is

:36:16. > :36:17.recognising that we need a solution through the five-day week, we

:36:18. > :36:21.haven't got the doctors to deliver this. It would take a while to get

:36:22. > :36:24.them? That's my point, that's why we need to be using all how care

:36:25. > :36:27.professional. Even if you got this right, would it make a difference to

:36:28. > :36:31.what many regard as the crisis in our hospitals? I think it would. If

:36:32. > :36:36.you look at patients, they just want to go to a service that will address

:36:37. > :36:40.the problems. In Scotland for example, pharmacists have their own

:36:41. > :36:43.patient list. Patients go and see the pharmacists first. There are

:36:44. > :36:49.lots of conditions, for example if you want anticoagulants, you don't

:36:50. > :36:53.necessarily need to see a doctor, a pharmacist can manage that and free

:36:54. > :36:57.up the doctor in other ways. The Prime Minister has said that if

:36:58. > :37:00.things do not change she is threatening to reduce funding to

:37:01. > :37:03.doctors who do not comply. Can you both agree, that is probably an

:37:04. > :37:08.empty threat, that's not going to happen? I hope it's an empty threat.

:37:09. > :37:12.We're trying our best. People like me in my profession, the seniors in

:37:13. > :37:16.our profession, are really trying to pull up morale and get people into

:37:17. > :37:20.general practice, which is a wonderful profession, absolutely

:37:21. > :37:24.wonderful place to be. But slapping us off and telling us that we are

:37:25. > :37:28.lazy really doesn't help. I really don't think anybody is doing that.

:37:29. > :37:31.We have run out of time, but I'm certain that we will be back to the

:37:32. > :37:33.subject before this winter is out. It's just gone 11:35am,

:37:34. > :37:36.you're watching the Sunday Politics. We say goodbye to viewers

:37:37. > :37:38.in Scotland, who leave us now Hello and the warmest of welcomes

:37:39. > :37:59.to your local part of the show and 2017 is already shaping up to be

:38:00. > :38:02.full of political drama again. As by-elections are in the offings,

:38:03. > :38:05.Jeremy Corbyn has been talking exclusively to us

:38:06. > :38:07.about the one his party is facing We are also reporting

:38:08. > :38:10.on the upcoming contest they'll face to be first elective mayor

:38:11. > :38:19.of the Tees Valley. With me here in the studio is North

:38:20. > :38:22.Tyneside Conservative Councillor, Judith Wallace, and in London,

:38:23. > :38:24.the Labour MP for Stockton Let's start with that

:38:25. > :38:31.by-election in Copeland caused Let's start with that by-election

:38:32. > :38:33.in Copland caused by the resignation of MP Jamie Reid is going to work

:38:34. > :38:36.in community Labour is defending a narrow

:38:37. > :38:41.majority is so it's going to be Labour has held Copeland

:38:42. > :38:44.and the previous Whitehaven seat since 1930s but recent boundary

:38:45. > :38:47.changes and a declining labour vote When Jamie Reid retained the seat

:38:48. > :38:50.in 2015, the Labour majority over the Conservatives was just 2564,

:38:51. > :38:53.making it one of the most marginal It's a constituency

:38:54. > :39:01.that is dominated by Sellafield and the new power station is also

:39:02. > :39:09.planned at Moorside stop and the new power station is also

:39:10. > :39:12.planned at Moorside. The Tories will want to make much

:39:13. > :39:15.of Jeremy Corbyn's past opposition More than six in ten voting

:39:16. > :39:20.to leave the EU last year But Labour will hope

:39:21. > :39:23.the NHS is their trump card because of public concern

:39:24. > :39:25.about the future of services Hardly surprising that two

:39:26. > :39:29.on the short list to be Labour's candidate are at the forefront

:39:30. > :39:32.of the Hospital campaign. Former Cumbrian woman of the year,

:39:33. > :39:36.Rachel Holliday, is one of them. The other, County Councillor

:39:37. > :39:38.and surgeon, Gillian Troutman. The ex-Penrith and border

:39:39. > :39:39.candidate, Barbara Cannon, Jamie Reid begins his new role

:39:40. > :39:47.at Sellafield on February first. But Labour may want to delay poll

:39:48. > :39:50.to local election day in May. Copeland contains England's highest

:39:51. > :39:52.mountain and deepest lake. Labour will be intent on making

:39:53. > :39:55.sure they don't face Tristan Hunt is triggering the Stoke

:39:56. > :39:59.by-election this week. This is a major test

:40:00. > :40:02.for your party now. Both contests, you have

:40:03. > :40:04.to win, don't you? There are tough contests in both

:40:05. > :40:08.Copeland and in Stoke but we are confident

:40:09. > :40:10.that the messages we have on the health services,

:40:11. > :40:13.jobs and on investment, we believe the people

:40:14. > :40:15.will respond to the Labour Party Most parliaments, and opposition

:40:16. > :40:21.defending their seats, Isn't this a sign of a party,

:40:22. > :40:27.to lose Jamie Reid and Tristan Hunt, two very talented, bright people,

:40:28. > :40:34.held important positions in the party in the past,

:40:35. > :40:40.they have decided there are better but the important thing for us

:40:41. > :40:46.is to secure the Labour MP for Copeland to ensure

:40:47. > :40:48.we can defend the NHS, look after the hospital

:40:49. > :40:57.that is under threat, the hospital where they're

:40:58. > :40:59.going to lose their maternity unit. They're going to lose

:41:00. > :41:02.the maternity unit there and... They are calculating

:41:03. > :41:05.that there is no chance of a Labour They still need people to defend

:41:06. > :41:10.the services there and Jamie Reid and many others that have worked

:41:11. > :41:12.hard to establish new services there, we've got to defend them

:41:13. > :41:15.rather than see them disintegrate. Judith Wallace, given recent

:41:16. > :41:17.polling, your party will be disappointed it didn't

:41:18. > :41:18.win in Copeland. The bookies have made

:41:19. > :41:20.you the favourites. Indeed so and I think it's

:41:21. > :41:22.absolutely astonishing that we've had not one,

:41:23. > :41:24.but two Labour MPs resign their seats and not that long

:41:25. > :41:27.after a general election. It wasn't long ago that

:41:28. > :41:29.a Conservative resigned, Well, it is unusual for them to be

:41:30. > :41:34.going on to other jobs and shows a distinct lack of confidence

:41:35. > :41:36.in their ability to retain their seats at the next election

:41:37. > :41:39.and the ability of the Labour Party I think it's most unlikely that

:41:40. > :41:46.Labour in its current shambles will hold the seats or former

:41:47. > :41:49.government in the future. You say you're going

:41:50. > :41:50.to winning Copeland, I think we have a very good record

:41:51. > :41:56.and I think people can see the shambles that the Labour Party

:41:57. > :41:59.is in at the moment and the economic We'll chat with the

:42:00. > :42:04.results as they happen. There's more to discuss

:42:05. > :42:06.because our correspondent, Luke Walton, has spoken

:42:07. > :42:08.to Jeremy Corbyn is weak and suggested that Copeland

:42:09. > :42:11.was a seat that Labour must win. We're going to be out

:42:12. > :42:16.there campaigning, we going to be We're going to be out

:42:17. > :42:18.there campaigning, we're going to be out there supporting the people

:42:19. > :42:21.of the whole area, addressing the issues of low wages,

:42:22. > :42:23.housing problems and crucially, the future of our National Health

:42:24. > :42:26.Service is and their problems and hospitals throughout Cumbria

:42:27. > :42:28.and other emergency services The people of Cumbria

:42:29. > :42:30.deserve a fair deal. Another big local issue

:42:31. > :42:34.there is the nuclear industry. Thousands of people

:42:35. > :42:36.in West Cumbria rely on that. You have spoken out over a long

:42:37. > :42:38.period against nuclear power. Doesn't that make you the Achilles

:42:39. > :42:42.heel of labour in that area? Sellafield is there,

:42:43. > :42:45.Sellafield employs a lot of people and it would be very helpful

:42:46. > :42:48.if they treated their pensioners properly and treated the pension

:42:49. > :42:50.fund properly as well. Those workers in Sellafield deserve

:42:51. > :42:53.a fair deal just like everybody else and we are working

:42:54. > :42:57.with them on that. You were on Conservative

:42:58. > :42:59.leaflets and your comments about decommissioning power stations

:43:00. > :43:03.is already making hay It is very odd that Conservative

:43:04. > :43:12.leaflet is so well funded, so beautifully produced

:43:13. > :43:14.and so expensive. Didn't find even that amount

:43:15. > :43:16.of space to say something about the National Health Service,

:43:17. > :43:19.about the crisis in I suggest to Conservatives,

:43:20. > :43:22.they are in government, As Prime Minister, would you approve

:43:23. > :43:29.a plan for a new nuclear power station next to Sellafield

:43:30. > :43:33.which 20,000 jobs rely on? Well, we're not sure when that's

:43:34. > :43:36.going to come up yet. That may have happened before

:43:37. > :43:42.the general election takes place. I want to see an energy mix

:43:43. > :43:45.in Britain, I want to see I don't know what the circumstances

:43:46. > :43:52.would be at that time. I've obviously been very concerned

:43:53. > :44:03.about nuclear safety as indeed has I want to see a safe nuclear system,

:44:04. > :44:09.I want to see a strong energy mix in Britain which other

:44:10. > :44:10.countries like Germany... So you don't rule out approving

:44:11. > :44:13.a new nuclear power station? Let's look at the issue

:44:14. > :44:16.when it comes up. I'll be all over Cumbria

:44:17. > :44:21.in the election campaign. Someone who is worried

:44:22. > :44:25.about your antinuclear stance is the departing MP,

:44:26. > :44:26.Jamie Reid. He's talked about you poisoning

:44:27. > :44:29.the Labour Party and not being fit I thanked him for his work and also

:44:30. > :44:41.admired the way he stood up, particularly for very isolated rural

:44:42. > :44:44.communities in his constituency. We had a very good discussion

:44:45. > :44:46.about the need for public investment in good quality,

:44:47. > :44:49.transport infrastructure, improvement of the rail

:44:50. > :44:52.line along the coast, improvement of the rail links,

:44:53. > :44:55.but also issues such as rural bus services such as communication

:44:56. > :44:57.with isolated communities and also post industrial communities,

:44:58. > :44:59.those people that used to work Jamie's voices Jamie's

:45:00. > :45:20.responsibility. I'm happy to have those

:45:21. > :45:24.discussions with him. We've had some good discussions

:45:25. > :45:26.about these issues. We want to see a country where

:45:27. > :45:29.communities are not left behind, where people don't end up forever

:45:30. > :45:32.on zero hours contracts and low-paid jobs, where young people

:45:33. > :45:35.can get into college, can go to university and can get

:45:36. > :45:38.the apprenticeships they deserve. Jeremy Corbyn talking

:45:39. > :45:39.to Luke Walton there. Alex, we know Jeremy Corbyn has been

:45:40. > :45:41.against nuclear power as long That could be a source of disaster

:45:42. > :45:48.in a constituency where the nuclear We believe in a thorough

:45:49. > :45:57.energy mix and nuclear We have been very clear

:45:58. > :46:00.in stressing this. Jeremy said he believes

:46:01. > :46:02.in the mix that is necessary and we will continue to have nuclear

:46:03. > :46:05.power in the mix. We're not going to do anything

:46:06. > :46:08.at all that's going to jeopardise thousands of jobs in West Cumbria

:46:09. > :46:11.and across the county where people are paid good wages,

:46:12. > :46:13.very good wages in many cases and we don't want to

:46:14. > :46:21.see any of that lost. He said he will make a decision

:46:22. > :46:25.about that at the time. If he's a man of principle,

:46:26. > :46:28.why doesn't he tell us he wouldn't sanction a nuclear power station

:46:29. > :46:31.because he doesn't believe in it instead of trying to fudge

:46:32. > :46:33.the issue and try and pretend It was a Labour government that

:46:34. > :46:38.approved the plans for a power Very different Labour Party

:46:39. > :46:42.from now, perhaps. There may be some different people

:46:43. > :46:45.around and we have a different leader and he's got to determine

:46:46. > :46:47.exactly what the situation is, if he is called

:46:48. > :46:50.to make that decision. I hope there is going to be no

:46:51. > :46:54.further delay and we can get those jobs there that can get this power

:46:55. > :46:57.station built and the benefits can Judith Wallace, the reason you want

:46:58. > :47:03.this by-election is you don't want to talk about the NHS

:47:04. > :47:07.because their problems with the hospital that are mirrored

:47:08. > :47:13.in hospitals all around the region. That's why you want

:47:14. > :47:15.to avoid it, isn't it? There is an indication

:47:16. > :47:18.that the Prime Minister is looking at the situation in Cumbria

:47:19. > :47:21.and the NHS is under pressure. Some of the problems in A come

:47:22. > :47:24.about because people misused A My local newspaper is reporting

:47:25. > :47:26.they have had cases of going I think Labour, by removing from GPs

:47:27. > :47:34.the out-of-hours services, We know about the threat

:47:35. > :47:47.of the consultant led maternity services there,

:47:48. > :47:51.we know women in difficult labours can face a 40 mile trip in order

:47:52. > :47:53.to get to an alternative hospital. These decisions are made

:47:54. > :47:56.by the local health trust, They are everything to do

:47:57. > :48:00.with the government. Ultimately the health service

:48:01. > :48:01.reports to the government they should be getting their fingers

:48:02. > :48:04.out and saying, "That maternity unit is safe,

:48:05. > :48:08.that A is safe and the people of West Cumbria can rest

:48:09. > :48:11.assured the NHS is safe." As David Cameron said,

:48:12. > :48:13.it is in the Tory's hands. It is cynical to put out a leaflet

:48:14. > :48:19.which talks about nuclear power and doesn't address what is a big

:48:20. > :48:26.issue in West Cumbria I think having heard

:48:27. > :48:31.what Jeremy Corbyn had to say on that tape,

:48:32. > :48:34.it's no wonder the Labour Party want to postpone this by-election

:48:35. > :48:36.until May which would leave the local people without any

:48:37. > :48:38.representation whilst It is worrying that Jeremy Corbyn

:48:39. > :48:42.wants nuclear facilities That would have a massive effect

:48:43. > :48:52.for this constituency and a disastrous affect

:48:53. > :48:55.for the security of the country. Alex, you quit Labour's front bench

:48:56. > :49:00.with many others because you had no confidence in Jeremy Corbyn,

:49:01. > :49:01.that he wasn't fit Are you any more convinced

:49:02. > :49:05.that he could be the man to hold on and win voters over

:49:06. > :49:09.in Copland and Stockton? I have been enjoying

:49:10. > :49:15.Prime Minister's Question Time. We have seen Jeremy Corbyn wipe

:49:16. > :49:18.the floor with Theresa May. It doesn't matter what the subject

:49:19. > :49:20.is, he's actually putting forward the arguments and most of those

:49:21. > :49:24.are in social care, around our NHS. He has been getting that message

:49:25. > :49:27.across and it has been So you reverse your

:49:28. > :49:30.opinion from the summer. I believe certainly that

:49:31. > :49:34.Jeremy Corbyn will lead us into the election and we will win

:49:35. > :49:37.that election because we've got ideas, we talked

:49:38. > :49:39.about the nationalisation of the railway system which has

:49:40. > :49:43.tremendous public support. We have talked about ensuring jobs

:49:44. > :49:46.are advertised in this country rather than abroad,

:49:47. > :49:49.we can build an opportunity Judith, you can be smug

:49:50. > :49:56.about Labour's current poll ratings. There's a danger is making

:49:57. > :49:58.you complacent on that There will be no extra money for

:49:59. > :50:08.the and Theresa May is in denial. We know the NHS receives billions

:50:09. > :50:16.and billions of pounds and it is right and proper that

:50:17. > :50:19.local people should Local decisions are made

:50:20. > :50:21.by the local trust. There is medical profession

:50:22. > :50:23.after medical professional saying you're not doing enough and this

:50:24. > :50:26.is a huge crisis. The NHS were constantly told

:50:27. > :50:41.as the envy of the world yet know other country chooses

:50:42. > :50:43.to have the same system. We have to be looking

:50:44. > :50:45.at the outcomes which are being Headlines made for the wrong

:50:46. > :50:50.reasons, I suppose. You know your constituency,

:50:51. > :50:52.will the people of Stockton North know what their immigration

:50:53. > :50:54.policy is now? I would hope so because we spent

:50:55. > :50:57.quite a bit of time on the streets of Stockton talking

:50:58. > :50:59.to people about that. We believe that we've got to protect

:51:00. > :51:04.jobs into the long term, we got to make sure that there

:51:05. > :51:07.is still the skills In favour of freedom

:51:08. > :51:09.of movement or not? I think it's no longer

:51:10. > :51:11.really an issue. The British people have made it

:51:12. > :51:14.clear that they do not believe They don't believe in it but we've

:51:15. > :51:19.got to make sure the government do their best for our country

:51:20. > :51:21.and if we require some form of movement of people across the EU,

:51:22. > :51:25.we've got to have that in order to secure the markers

:51:26. > :51:26.that we require. Judith, this is a man

:51:27. > :51:29.of principle on immigration. Your party promised action

:51:30. > :51:33.and never delivered. We have no idea what

:51:34. > :51:36.Jeremy Corbyn's policy is. The speech this week

:51:37. > :51:38.was supposed to clear that up. You promised on it and never

:51:39. > :51:43.delivered it on immigration. The only way we can deliver on it is

:51:44. > :51:47.by leaving the European Union. I've always been very

:51:48. > :51:48.clear about that. As we leave the European Union,

:51:49. > :51:51.Theresa May has been clear we will regain control

:51:52. > :51:53.of our borders and that is what will happen,

:51:54. > :51:57.commencing is important to people. The by-elections in Copland

:51:58. > :52:00.and Stoke aren't the only big tests for the parties coming up

:52:01. > :52:02.in the next few months. Campaigning will soon get underway

:52:03. > :52:05.in the contest to choose the first-ever mayor of the Tees

:52:06. > :52:06.Valley. Could one person represent an area

:52:07. > :52:09.that includes not just Middlesbrough and Stockton but also Darlington,

:52:10. > :52:12.Hartlepool and Redcar also. David McMillan took a tour around

:52:13. > :52:16.Teesside to find out. It stretches from the North Sea

:52:17. > :52:20.to North Yorkshire stop 670,000 people in a city region

:52:21. > :52:23.with five different centres. Industrial, post-industrial

:52:24. > :52:29.and occasionally rural. These offices in Stockton

:52:30. > :52:31.where Tees Valley's But he or she will have a joint task

:52:32. > :52:41.on their hands creating growth and prosperity across a large

:52:42. > :52:43.and diverse region. Four parties have identified people

:52:44. > :52:45.they believe can do just that. The local Councillor

:52:46. > :52:53.is their candidate. There is a thread when it

:52:54. > :52:55.comes to transport and Being from the area,

:52:56. > :53:00.I have a good understanding of how My key drive is not to be looking

:53:01. > :53:12.at what is great for the suburbs of Yarm because if Stockton

:53:13. > :53:14.succeeds, Middlesbrough, Redcar, Hartlepool and

:53:15. > :53:16.Darlington all succeed. South Barton near

:53:17. > :53:17.Middlesbrough is one of many It is suffering in the

:53:18. > :53:20.post-industrial age. Hugh Jeffrey, the leader of Redcar

:53:21. > :53:22.and Cleveland Council says the closure of SSI shows how closely

:53:23. > :53:25.linked the Tees Valley It didn't just affect Redcar,

:53:26. > :53:28.it affected all five It is not going to be

:53:29. > :53:36.about fighting each other, it's going to be about working

:53:37. > :53:38.together, being pragmatic and working to deliver the goals

:53:39. > :53:40.we have the Tees Valley which is and growing our jobs,

:53:41. > :53:42.economy, a proven skills. North of Stockton, their rural

:53:43. > :53:46.partnerships which contrasts sharply with the traditional image

:53:47. > :53:48.of Teesside the north-east party's John Tait, says they can make sharp

:53:49. > :53:51.contrast with the region's Transport will enliven

:53:52. > :53:57.the whole area. Railways, roads, we need proper

:53:58. > :54:00.ambition on how to put a transport infrastructure that is not fiddling

:54:01. > :54:03.with the past but is ambitious and looks towards the future

:54:04. > :54:05.and spreads prosperity Hartlepool is Ukip's

:54:06. > :54:15.strongest race on Teesside. John Tennant is that

:54:16. > :54:19.prospective candidate Andy has We're looking at the possibility of

:54:20. > :54:26.bringing back the Tees Valley Metro system which was shelved

:54:27. > :54:29.a few years ago. It will cost a lot of money to build

:54:30. > :54:37.and we will have to find that money but you need a maypr who's

:54:38. > :54:40.going to fight for the right We would expect the politicians

:54:41. > :54:43.to insist that they can find unity and harmony to bring five distinct

:54:44. > :54:46.areas together but one local journalist thinks they may be

:54:47. > :54:49.underestimating the challenge. There is no natural empathy

:54:50. > :54:51.with the concept of Tees Valley. Teesside is Middlesbrough

:54:52. > :54:53.and Stockton and I don't think Darlington as a town wants to be

:54:54. > :55:07.part of that. It's an artificial construct

:55:08. > :55:09.and the mayor has got to create a region for them

:55:10. > :55:19.to be the figurehead. The Lib Dems expect to name

:55:20. > :55:22.their mayoral candidate at the start of February and there's still plenty

:55:23. > :55:25.of time for others to join the race. The challenge for whoever becomes

:55:26. > :55:28.the first Tees Valley Mayor is to make their new devolved powers

:55:29. > :55:31.work to the benefit of every corner Alex, if you ask people

:55:32. > :55:34.in Stockton where they live, they wouldn't say they lived

:55:35. > :55:36.in the Tees Valley. It will be a tough sell to convince

:55:37. > :55:39.voters that what is good for Hartlepool is also good

:55:40. > :55:42.for Stockton and Middlesbrough. I have been very impressed

:55:43. > :55:44.with the way our five local authorities have

:55:45. > :55:46.worked closely together. They work hard and while other

:55:47. > :55:49.authorities were falling about about creating deals to work

:55:50. > :55:52.with the government to bring prosperity to the area,

:55:53. > :55:54.our area was working I am confident there may

:55:55. > :56:03.be a weird construct, people will work hard together,

:56:04. > :56:07.they will deliver for the whole Fine for councils to operate,

:56:08. > :56:13.but it doesn't need an election Voters will say, "Why am

:56:14. > :56:25.I being called out to do this?" This is an opportunity the

:56:26. > :56:28.Conservatives have given local authorities to take powers from

:56:29. > :56:34.Whitehall and get the money that goes with them. There was no

:56:35. > :56:40.compulsion to take part. Full marks for driving this policy on. Full

:56:41. > :56:44.marks to the local authorities in Tees Valley to take up the

:56:45. > :56:51.opportunity. They decide the geographic boundaries and the

:56:52. > :56:57.powers. There will be deals. More money and more powers. They can get

:56:58. > :57:01.more money if they are successful in driving economic growth. It is sad

:57:02. > :57:05.further north in the region, the Labour leaders and elected mayor

:57:06. > :57:11.have not been able to reach agreements. The danger is this

:57:12. > :57:17.election could raise expectations that cannot be delivered. The Tees

:57:18. > :57:25.Valley Metro, the money is not there to achieve that. Candidates cannot

:57:26. > :57:28.deliver. There will be uneconomic mayor and we will have the

:57:29. > :57:34.development corporation who have a good record of driving growth. More

:57:35. > :57:40.more growth, an opportunity to have more money from the government to

:57:41. > :57:46.extend the powers. We are talking about adult skills, infrastructure

:57:47. > :57:51.and the key to driving jobs. Alex, are you convinced it will be

:57:52. > :57:56.transformative? I hope so. We have seen cuts to our local authority

:57:57. > :58:01.budgets and lots of things they were able to do before can no longer be

:58:02. > :58:06.done. We have to put eggs into this basket and make sure we have strong

:58:07. > :58:10.person in Sue Jeffery as the new elected mayor. We have the

:58:11. > :58:15.possibility of a Tees crossing which will be expensive. We need an agenda

:58:16. > :58:20.that will drive jobs and ensure people have the skills to take those

:58:21. > :58:24.jobs and give our communities the prosperity we need. And you will be

:58:25. > :58:30.favourites to win this election. If you use it as a platform to talk

:58:31. > :58:36.about the cuts to funding, it's not going to get very far. Do you need

:58:37. > :58:43.to get all the parties together and sing from the same hymn sheet so it

:58:44. > :58:48.has some cloud with government? I am always surprised when I talk to

:58:49. > :58:53.people and I tell them I work cooperatively with other people from

:58:54. > :58:57.the other parties. They are surprised about that. That is what I

:58:58. > :59:02.do and what the mayor will do and what the local authorities will do.

:59:03. > :59:07.They work together as a team with their communities to deliver. The

:59:08. > :59:18.impact of Brexit on the north-east was debated in the Lords this week.

:59:19. > :59:26.MPs and unions have criticised plans to change and close two of the post

:59:27. > :59:34.offices in Billingham and concept. They will be located in to new

:59:35. > :59:40.shops. They want to raise council tax by 4.9%. 3% will help towards

:59:41. > :59:44.social care. Lord beef has said the impact on the colour me off the

:59:45. > :59:48.north-east needs to be fully considered in future Brexit

:59:49. > :59:54.negotiations. The north-east of England has had the most positive

:59:55. > :00:01.trade balance of any region of the UK. 58% of these exports are to

:00:02. > :00:06.European Union countries. North-east hospital's a Mac -- A has dealt

:00:07. > :00:10.with over 2 million people and a rise of 4%. North Tyneside Council

:00:11. > :00:13.has approved plans for two huge cranes to be used in the wind

:00:14. > :00:17.turbine industry at Wallsend. One is turbine industry at Wallsend. One is

:00:18. > :00:24.six times bigger than the Angel of the North. That is about it from us.

:00:25. > :00:29.Tomorrow night, inside out and asks if the NHS is to the National

:00:30. > :00:35.Service orders where you live matter to when you want to get treatment.

:00:36. > :00:39.We are back next Sunday. We will have a packed agenda. Why not follow

:00:40. > :00:43.me on Twitter. Details on the screen.

:00:44. > :00:51.Now, if anyone thought Donald Trump would tone things down

:00:52. > :00:53.after the American election campaign, they may have

:00:54. > :01:06.The period where he has been President-elect will make them think

:01:07. > :01:07.again. The inauguration is coming up on Friday.

:01:08. > :01:09.Never has the forthcoming inauguration of a president been

:01:10. > :01:13.In a moment, we'll talk to a man who knows Mr Trump

:01:14. > :01:17.But first, let's have a look at the press conference

:01:18. > :01:19.Mr Trump gave on Wednesday, in which he took the opportunity

:01:20. > :01:21.to rubbish reports that Russia has obtained compromising information

:01:22. > :01:37.You are attacking our news organisation.

:01:38. > :01:42.Can you give us a chance, you are attacking our news

:01:43. > :01:45.organisation, can you give us a chance to ask a question, sir?

:01:46. > :01:51.As far as Buzzfeed, which is a failing pile of garbage,

:01:52. > :01:55.writing it, I think they're going to suffer the consequences.

:01:56. > :01:58.Does anyone really believe that story?

:01:59. > :02:01.I'm also very much of a germaphobe, by the way.

:02:02. > :02:03.If Putin likes Donald Trump, guess what, folks, that's called

:02:04. > :02:11.The only ones that care about my tax returns are the reporters, OK?

:02:12. > :02:13.Do you not think the American public is concerned?

:02:14. > :02:27.The Wiggo, Donald Trump at his first last conference. The Can will he

:02:28. > :02:31.change as President? Because he hasn't changed in the run-up to

:02:32. > :02:34.being inaugurated? I don't think he will commit he doesn't see any point

:02:35. > :02:39.in changing. Why would he change from the personality that just one,

:02:40. > :02:42.as he just said, I just one. All of the bleeding-heart liberals can wail

:02:43. > :02:47.and brush their teeth and say how ghastly that all this, Hillary

:02:48. > :02:50.should have won and so on, but he has got an incredible mandate.

:02:51. > :02:53.Remember, Trump has the House committee has the Senate, he will

:02:54. > :02:57.have the Supreme Court. He has incredible power right now. He

:02:58. > :03:00.doesn't have to listen to anybody. I spoke to him a couple of weeks ago

:03:01. > :03:05.specifically about Twitter, I asked him what the impact was of Twitter.

:03:06. > :03:11.He said, I have 60 million people following me on Twitter. I was able

:03:12. > :03:14.to bypass mainstream media, bypass all modern political convention and

:03:15. > :03:18.talk directly to potential voters. Secondly, I can turn on the TV in

:03:19. > :03:23.the morning, I can see a rival getting all of the airtime, and I

:03:24. > :03:27.can fire off a tweet, for free, as a marketing man he loves that, and,

:03:28. > :03:31.boom, I'm on the news agenda again. He was able to use that

:03:32. > :03:38.magnificently. Twitter to him didn't cost him a dollar. He is going to

:03:39. > :03:46.carry on tweeting in the last six weeks, he was not sleeping. Trump

:03:47. > :03:51.has never had an alcoholic drink a cigarette or a drug. He is a fit by

:03:52. > :03:55.the 70, he has incredible energy and he is incredibly competitive. At his

:03:56. > :03:59.heart, he is a businessman. If you look at him as a political

:04:00. > :04:03.ideologue, you completely missed the point of trouble. Don't take what he

:04:04. > :04:06.says literally, look upon it as a negotiating point that he started

:04:07. > :04:11.from, and try to do business with him as a business person would, and

:04:12. > :04:16.you may be presently surprised so pleasantly surprised. He treats the

:04:17. > :04:19.press and the media entirely differently to any other politician

:04:20. > :04:25.or main politician in that normally the politicians try to get the media

:04:26. > :04:30.off a particular subject, or they try to conciliate with the media. He

:04:31. > :04:35.just comes and punches the media in the nose when he doesn't like them.

:04:36. > :04:39.This could catch on, you know! You are absolutely right, for a start,

:04:40. > :04:46.nobody could accuse him of letting that victory go to his head. You

:04:47. > :04:50.know, he won't say, I will now be this lofty president. He's exactly

:04:51. > :04:53.the same as he was before. What is fascinating is his Laois and ship

:04:54. > :04:57.with the media. I haven't met, and I'm sure you haven't, met a party

:04:58. > :05:03.leader who is obsessed with the media. But they pretend not to be.

:05:04. > :05:10.You know, they state, oh, somebody told me about a column, I didn't

:05:11. > :05:15.read it. He is utterly transparent in his obsession with the media, he

:05:16. > :05:17.doesn't pretend. How that plays out, who knows? It's a completely

:05:18. > :05:23.different dynamic than anyone has seen by. Like he is the issue, he

:05:24. > :05:27.has appointed an unusual Cabinet, that you could criticise in many

:05:28. > :05:30.ways. Nearly all of them are independent people in their own

:05:31. > :05:34.right. A lot of them are wealthy, too. They have their own views. They

:05:35. > :05:40.might not like what he tweaked at 3am, and he does have to deal with

:05:41. > :05:43.his Cabinet now. Mad dog matters, now the Defence Secretary, he might

:05:44. > :05:49.not like what's said about China at three in morning - general matters.

:05:50. > :05:52.This is what gets very conjugated. We cannot imagine here in our

:05:53. > :05:55.political system any kind of appointments like this. Using the

:05:56. > :05:58.wouldn't have a line-up of billionaires of the kind of

:05:59. > :06:02.background that he has chosen -- you simply wouldn't have. But that won't

:06:03. > :06:06.stop him saying and reading what he thinks. Maybe it will cause him some

:06:07. > :06:09.internal issues when the following day he has the square rigged with

:06:10. > :06:18.whatever they think. But he's going to press ahead. Are we any clearer

:06:19. > :06:22.in terms of policy. I know policy hasn't featured hugely in this

:06:23. > :06:28.campaign of 2016. Do we have any really clear idea what Mr Trump is

:06:29. > :06:32.hoping to achieve? He has had some consistent theme going back over 25

:06:33. > :06:35.years. One is a deep scepticism about international trade and the

:06:36. > :06:39.kind of deals that America has been doing over that period. It has been

:06:40. > :06:43.so consistent that is has been hard to spin as something that you say

:06:44. > :06:46.during the course of a campaign of something to get elected.

:06:47. > :06:49.Ultimately, Piers is correct, he won't change. When he won the

:06:50. > :06:53.election committee gave a relatively magnanimous beach. I thought his ego

:06:54. > :06:57.had been sated and he had got what he wanted. He will end up governing

:06:58. > :07:01.as is likely eccentric New York liberal and everything will be fine.

:07:02. > :07:03.In the recent weeks it has come to my attention that that might not be

:07:04. > :07:09.entirely true! LAUGHTER

:07:10. > :07:11.It is a real test of the American system, the Texan bouncers, the

:07:12. > :07:16.foreign policy establishment which is about to have the orthodoxies

:07:17. > :07:20.disrupted -- the checks and balances. I think he has completely

:07:21. > :07:24.ripped up the American political system. Washington as we know it is

:07:25. > :07:30.dead. From his garage do things his way, he doesn't care, frankly, what

:07:31. > :07:34.any of us thinks -- Trump is going to do things his way. If he can

:07:35. > :07:43.deliver for the people who voted for him who fault this disenfranchised,

:07:44. > :07:46.-- who voted for him who felt this disenfranchised. They voted

:07:47. > :07:50.accordingly. They want to see jobs and the economy in good shape, they

:07:51. > :07:54.want to feel secure. They want to feel that immigration has been

:07:55. > :07:58.tightened. If Trump can deliver on those main theme for the rust belt

:07:59. > :08:03.communities of America, I'm telling you, he will go down as a very

:08:04. > :08:05.successful president. All of the offensive rhetoric and the

:08:06. > :08:09.argy-bargy with CNN and whatever it may be will be completely

:08:10. > :08:16.irrelevant. Let me finish with a parochial question. Is it fair to

:08:17. > :08:18.say quite well disposed to this country? And that he would like,

:08:19. > :08:23.that he's up for a speedy free-trade, bilateral free-trade

:08:24. > :08:28.you'll? Think we have to be sensible as the country. Come Friday, he is

:08:29. > :08:32.the president of the United States, the most powerful man and well. He

:08:33. > :08:36.said to me that he feels half British, his mum was born and raised

:08:37. > :08:40.in Scotland until the age of 18, he loves British, his mother used to

:08:41. > :08:44.love watching the Queen, he feels very, you know, I would roll out the

:08:45. > :08:49.red carpet for Trump, let him eat Her Majesty. The crucial point for

:08:50. > :08:55.us as a country is coming -- let him me to Her Majesty. If we can do a

:08:56. > :08:58.speedy deal within an 18 month period, it really sends a message

:08:59. > :09:01.that well but we are back in the game, that is a hugely beneficial

:09:02. > :09:06.thing for this country. Well, a man whose advisers were indicating that

:09:07. > :09:12.maybe he should learn a few things from Donald Trump was Jeremy Corbyn.

:09:13. > :09:14.Yes, MBE. Mr Corbyn appeared on the Andrew Marr Show this morning. --

:09:15. > :09:17.yes, indeed. If you don't win Copeland,

:09:18. > :09:20.and if you don't win Stoke-on-Trent Central,

:09:21. > :09:21.you're toast, aren't you? Our party is going to fight very

:09:22. > :09:26.hard in those elections, as we are in the local elections,

:09:27. > :09:29.to put those policies out there. It's an opportunity to challenge

:09:30. > :09:31.the Government on the NHS. It's an opportunity to challenge

:09:32. > :09:34.them on the chaos of Brexit. It's an opportunity to challenge

:09:35. > :09:36.them on the housing shortage. It's an opportunity to challenge

:09:37. > :09:38.them on zero-hours contracts. Is there ever a moment that you look

:09:39. > :09:43.in the mirror and think, you know what, I've done my best,

:09:44. > :09:47.but this might not be for me? I look in the mirror

:09:48. > :09:49.every day and I think, let's go out there and try

:09:50. > :09:52.and create a society where there are opportunities for all,

:09:53. > :09:54.where there aren't these terrible levels of poverty, where

:09:55. > :09:56.there isn't homelessness, where there are houses for all,

:09:57. > :09:58.and where young people aren't frightened of going to university

:09:59. > :10:01.because of the debts they are going to end up

:10:02. > :10:09.with at the end of their course. Mr Corbyn earlier this morning.

:10:10. > :10:12.Steve, would it be fair to say that the mainstream of the Labour Party

:10:13. > :10:16.has now come to the conclusion that they just have to let Mr Corbyn get

:10:17. > :10:20.on with it, that they are not going to try and influence what he does.

:10:21. > :10:25.They will continue to try and have their own views, but it's his show,

:10:26. > :10:28.it's up to him, if it's a mess, he has to live with it and we'll have

:10:29. > :10:32.clean hands? For now, yes. I think they made a mistake when he was

:10:33. > :10:36.first elected to start in some cases tweeting within seconds that it was

:10:37. > :10:40.going to be a disaster, this was Labour MPs. They made a complete

:10:41. > :10:46.mess of that attempted coup in the summer, which strengthened his

:10:47. > :10:49.position. And he did, it gave Corbyn the space with total legitimacy to

:10:50. > :10:55.say that part of the problem is, we're having this public Civil War.

:10:56. > :10:59.In keeping quiet, that disappeared as part of the explanation for why

:11:00. > :11:05.Labour and low in the polls. I think they are partly doing that. But they

:11:06. > :11:09.are also struggling, the so-called mainstream Labour MPs, to decide

:11:10. > :11:13.what the distinctive agenda is. It's one of the many differences with the

:11:14. > :11:17.80s, where you had a group of people sure of what they believed in, they

:11:18. > :11:21.left to form the SDP. What's happening now is that they are

:11:22. > :11:25.leaving politics altogether. That is a crisis of social Democrats all

:11:26. > :11:29.across Europe, including the French Socialists, as we will find out

:11:30. > :11:36.later in the spring. Let Corbyn because then, that's the strategy.

:11:37. > :11:38.There is a weary and sometimes literal resignation from the

:11:39. > :11:41.moderates in the Labour Party. If you talk to them, they are no longer

:11:42. > :11:44.angry, they have always run out of steam to be angry about what's going

:11:45. > :11:47.on. They are just sort of tired and feel that they've just got to see

:11:48. > :11:51.this through now. I think the by-elections will be interesting.

:11:52. > :11:56.When Andrew Marr said, you're toast, and you? I thought, he's never

:11:57. > :12:00.posed! That was right. A quick thought from view? One thing Corbyn

:12:01. > :12:10.has in common with Trump is immunity to bad news. I think he can lose

:12:11. > :12:11.Copeland and lose Stoke, and as long as it is not a sequence of

:12:12. > :12:14.resignations and by-elections afterwards, with maybe a dozen or 20

:12:15. > :12:17.Labour MPs going, he can still enjoy what. It may be more trouble if

:12:18. > :12:23.Labour loses the United trade union elections. We are in a period of

:12:24. > :12:27.incredible unpredictability generally in global politics. If you

:12:28. > :12:30.look at the way the next year plays out, if for example brags it was a

:12:31. > :12:34.disaster and it starts to unravel very quickly, Theresa May is

:12:35. > :12:38.attached to that, clearly label would have a great opportunity

:12:39. > :12:41.potentially disease that higher ground, and when Eddie the Tories --

:12:42. > :12:46.Labour would have an opportunity. Is Corbyn the right guy? We interviewed

:12:47. > :12:51.him, what struck me was that he talked about being from, a laughable

:12:52. > :12:56.comparison, but when it is really laughable is this - Hillary Clinton,

:12:57. > :13:00.what were the things she stood for, nobody really knew? What does Trump

:13:01. > :13:04.stand for? Everybody knew. Corbyn has the work-out four or five

:13:05. > :13:06.messages and bang, bang, bang. He could still be in business. Thank

:13:07. > :13:08.you for being with us. I'll be back at the same

:13:09. > :13:11.time next weekend. Remember - if it's Sunday,

:13:12. > :13:13.it's the Sunday Politics.