:01:28. > :01:38.Eric Pickles warns local authorities over council tax. A
:01:38. > :01:38.
:01:38. > :42:40.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2461 seconds
:42:40. > :42:48.Eric Pickles warned local authorities not to take him up for
:42:48. > :42:54.a mug over council tax. It will backfire in the most spectacular
:42:54. > :43:00.way. My guests are Peter Thornton the Liberal Democrat leader of
:43:01. > :43:10.South Lakeland council and the mayor of Salford Ian Stuart. What
:43:10. > :43:14.do you make of the position of Eric Pickles? Eric Pickles is a very
:43:14. > :43:19.experienced politician at national level and local level. He has a
:43:19. > :43:24.history in local government. But his bluster with councils who are
:43:24. > :43:30.trying to do the best for the local residents does not wash. The threat
:43:30. > :43:38.he has made are in appropriate. have a genuine? I am not sure how
:43:38. > :43:44.he could possibly do what he is threatening. You have been council
:43:44. > :43:48.leader for nine months. Are you finding that a difficult job given
:43:48. > :43:52.the financial situation? If it is tricky. I have not met Eric Pickles
:43:52. > :43:59.yet. I am looking forward to meeting them. There will be a few
:43:59. > :44:05.quiet words in secret. The tone it needs to change. The stone from
:44:05. > :44:13.government but councils are doing everything wrong needs to stop. We
:44:13. > :44:23.are all on the same site. Serving the people of allah areas. --
:44:23. > :44:29.
:44:29. > :44:36.serving the people of local areas. It has been revealed that a number
:44:36. > :44:41.of NHS Trust are being investigated for her height decorates.
:44:41. > :44:46.Some are used to go this woman lost her husband's in hospital just
:44:46. > :44:56.weeks after getting married. His hospital her -- his operation had
:44:56. > :45:03.
:45:03. > :45:13.been delayed. The place was dirty. The trusts mentioned in the report
:45:13. > :45:14.
:45:14. > :45:19.have had high rates for two years. Our quality of care is very high.
:45:19. > :45:23.There is no risk of coming into this hospital. The rates are
:45:23. > :45:27.calculated by looking at the number of people that would be expected to
:45:27. > :45:30.died taking into account their age and profile of people locally.
:45:30. > :45:35.air have been various reports on the health of the people in
:45:35. > :45:44.Blackpool. The problems still remain it - too much smoking and
:45:44. > :45:48.drinking and lack of exercise. saw this in the hospital in Salford
:45:48. > :45:52.we they are so proud of the fact that they asked the staff, the
:45:52. > :46:02.patients, everybody, would you have your friend and family treated in
:46:02. > :46:07.hospital. It is on every single ward. But Salford Royal Hospital
:46:07. > :46:12.hourly checks are carried out to see if the patient is in pain. This
:46:12. > :46:16.makes the hospital one of the safest in the country. It is an
:46:16. > :46:22.effort, but it saves problems. If you can prevent someone being upset
:46:22. > :46:27.it saves time in the long run. cannot Blackpool and others follow
:46:27. > :46:31.suit? The air is some evidence that the doctor and nurse to bed ratio
:46:31. > :46:37.affect the level of mortality. If you look at the ratios in Salford
:46:37. > :46:42.we are much higher than they are in an hour trust. And other three
:46:42. > :46:46.trusts wait to see what form the investigation will take.
:46:46. > :46:55.We are joined by a health specialists from Manchester
:46:55. > :47:02.Business School. How serious is this? I do not think we know yet.
:47:02. > :47:07.The figures suggest the requirement for some investigation. These are
:47:07. > :47:11.unusually complex problems. Therefore it is important not to
:47:11. > :47:21.jump to conclusions too early about the reason for a high mortality
:47:21. > :47:27.rate. There may be a number of reasons. The problems at Stafford
:47:27. > :47:32.hospital started with high mortality rates. They were
:47:32. > :47:37.investigated. It was decided it was normal statistical variation. That
:47:37. > :47:41.is wrong. But is worth investigating. Absolutely. We heard
:47:41. > :47:48.the doctor at Blackpool suggesting that one of the factors here is
:47:48. > :47:51.staff, a lack of staff. Do you accept that? If I was in the place
:47:51. > :47:54.of the person investigating those hospitals I would want to ask a
:47:54. > :47:59.number of hospitals. There are a number of reasons for high
:47:59. > :48:08.mortality rates. One of them might be to do with staffing. A second
:48:08. > :48:18.one might Beek the sickness absence rates. That these usually. -- might
:48:18. > :48:19.
:48:19. > :48:24.be the sickness absence. I would look at the quality of leadership
:48:24. > :48:31.at the hospital trust. We know from research evidence that troubled
:48:31. > :48:35.hospitals are those which have a high turnover of chief executives.
:48:35. > :48:40.The good news from your point of view is that Salford comes out of
:48:40. > :48:46.this looking very good. C offered does not look very good. Salford
:48:46. > :48:50.hospital trust is very good. It starts with a Labour government
:48:50. > :48:54.investing �200 million to build a brand new hospital. A brand new
:48:54. > :49:00.facility means that the hospital can look at that procedures, how it
:49:00. > :49:04.does its work, and improve them. Everything encourages improvement.
:49:05. > :49:11.Sorry to interrupt, but isn't the Labour government park of the
:49:11. > :49:15.problem as well? It was imposing targets on NHS hospitals. You can
:49:15. > :49:23.argue those theoretical things, but the actuality in Salford is that
:49:23. > :49:29.Salford hospital trust is in the top five for keeping mortality low.
:49:29. > :49:32.There is nothing theoretical about this. What is real is that the
:49:32. > :49:39.satisfaction rates of patients and staff are very high at Salford
:49:39. > :49:45.hospital trust. It all goes to show that when you give professional
:49:45. > :49:49.workers from the cleaners to the top consultants a good facility
:49:49. > :49:54.they can review their procedures, they can make it happen for
:49:54. > :50:00.patients. That is the key thing. It is patient orientated. In Salford
:50:00. > :50:06.it is very successful. We have had a issue recently been at Furnace
:50:06. > :50:09.hospital with regard to a lack of staff are due to illness. Under the
:50:10. > :50:16.possibility of losing cuts of moving maternity services. That has
:50:16. > :50:25.gone away but are there other issues? If you look at that
:50:25. > :50:35.hospital, and they should have been there -- if you have not been there
:50:35. > :50:36.
:50:36. > :50:45.you would not know what it is like. It is essential that local
:50:45. > :50:52.politicians, local doctors, feed into this. What about the issue
:50:52. > :50:57.that I was trying to ask about? Targets. There is a real problem
:50:57. > :51:00.with an over focus on target. The Francis Report leader that there.
:51:00. > :51:04.What it has encouraged is a particular style of leadership,
:51:04. > :51:10.which is a very pace-setting, driven style of leadership. What we
:51:10. > :51:13.have lacked in our hospitals, whether the our new hospitals, or
:51:13. > :51:19.all the hospitals in older buildings, is a variety of styles
:51:19. > :51:23.of leadership. Particularly a style which encourages and supports and
:51:23. > :51:27.praises and his kind to staff as well as challenging stuff. If all
:51:28. > :51:37.you do is challenge staff around target how can you expect those
:51:37. > :51:43.staff to be kind to patients? are two words to scare any local
:51:43. > :51:47.authority. Eric Pickles. The Communities Secretary wants some of
:51:48. > :51:51.our local councils to back down over proposed council tax increases.
:51:51. > :51:55.Any council planning an increase of two % or more must hold a
:51:55. > :52:01.referendum. Eric Pickles is annoyed that some councils are putting it
:52:01. > :52:07.up by 1.99 %. He calls them democracy dodgers. Some are putting
:52:07. > :52:12.up bills by more than two % without a boat. How? Look at the largest
:52:12. > :52:16.increase. Manchester City Council. The extra money being raised his
:52:16. > :52:23.four weeks, police, and transport. The but for the city council is
:52:23. > :52:33.actually going down. But overall bills increase by 3.7 %. In a
:52:33. > :52:34.
:52:34. > :52:38.moment Eric Pickles, but first someone quite different.
:52:38. > :52:43.It is a battle with Eric Pickles which has turned Adli. He has
:52:43. > :52:52.accused Labour councils of reliving the past like a bad 1980s tribute
:52:52. > :52:57.band. Please sir I want some more. Now in a Dickensian a twist he has
:52:57. > :53:03.criticised Manchester City Council for asking for more council tax.
:53:03. > :53:07.This is not a loophole. We in Manchester are faced by significant
:53:07. > :53:12.increases in the waste disposal led the, the transport levy, but we do
:53:12. > :53:15.not control. The actual increase in our own share of the council tax is
:53:15. > :53:21.minus 2.4 %. The amount available for council services directly is
:53:21. > :53:24.going down. A major part of the increase in
:53:24. > :53:28.council taxes to raise money for this plant which recycles always
:53:28. > :53:33.collected from nine districts across Greater Manchester. This
:53:33. > :53:37.year the need to raise an extra �20 million for investment.
:53:37. > :53:40.Why are you causing council tax bills to warm up by so much?
:53:41. > :53:46.knew that in the first ideas be would see significant hikes in the
:53:46. > :53:49.cost. We knew we were going to charge greater Manchester council.
:53:49. > :53:55.What we are cream here in Greater Manchester Council is building
:53:55. > :54:00.sustainable waste facilities. �640 million worth, which will last for
:54:00. > :54:03.the next 20 years at least. Try it would council is also facing
:54:04. > :54:07.increased costs from the Greater Manchester waste disposal authority.
:54:07. > :54:11.Rather than passing it on to house sold it has managed to freeze
:54:12. > :54:15.council tax. You will get Labour authorities who will start banging
:54:15. > :54:20.the drum and really criticise this in many respects. We think that
:54:20. > :54:25.just as we as a council are finding it financially difficult, household
:54:25. > :54:28.and hard-working councils are finding it difficult. We have been
:54:28. > :54:34.clear on the bottom line to drive out as much cost, make things as
:54:34. > :54:38.efficient as possible, rather than passing it on to residents to pay.
:54:38. > :54:48.Elsewhere in the north-west Oldham council and Roger council are
:54:48. > :54:57.
:54:57. > :55:01.proposing a 3.5 % increase in the I love my brother next door. He is
:55:01. > :55:06.a neighbour of mine. I would not do it. He should not do it. It is
:55:06. > :55:12.wrong. We will go be on Daphne's. We will go to 2015 without a
:55:12. > :55:16.council tax increase at all. That is fine for Cheshire East. That is
:55:16. > :55:22.his choice. I will not criticise him for the decisions he needs to
:55:22. > :55:27.make. Likewise for ourselves we have to be what is right for our
:55:27. > :55:35.residents. East Cheshire and West Cheshire are both facing a new bill
:55:35. > :55:39.for the new Police and Crime Commissioner. If I wanted to raise
:55:39. > :55:44.at more than 1.99 % and it have to go for a referendum which means
:55:44. > :55:51.going to ask the people of Cheshire what else can I put it up by. That
:55:51. > :55:56.would have cost �1.4 million. A further �1 million to do rebuilding
:55:56. > :56:01.exercise afterwards. We're looking at �2.5 million which in my view is
:56:01. > :56:05.a waste of money. Last some are using a clever police were to avoid
:56:05. > :56:09.a referendum, some local councils say they are feeling the heat and
:56:09. > :56:19.cannot afford a threesome council tax.
:56:19. > :56:29.I asked Eric Pickles what he makes of bells. -- feeling the heat and
:56:29. > :56:32.
:56:32. > :56:42.cannot afford to threes council tax. They do not have the degree of
:56:42. > :56:44.
:56:44. > :56:49.transparency. I shall be taking powers to bring those into the
:56:49. > :56:55.referendum for next year. I will take into consideration the about
:56:55. > :57:01.that they have raised this year. What's will that mean? If they put
:57:01. > :57:04.it up this year I will insure that the two years are taken into
:57:04. > :57:08.consideration and they will not be able to put up to the same level
:57:08. > :57:11.that other authorities will next year. In other words the message
:57:11. > :57:15.for those councils in Greater Manchester were going down this
:57:15. > :57:21.route is they had better stop because it will backfire? It will
:57:21. > :57:26.backfire in a spectacular way. has the waste authority done wrong?
:57:26. > :57:36.The it has delivered a contract which does not take into
:57:36. > :57:44.
:57:44. > :57:53.consideration market rates or waste. A lot of these deals. They would
:57:53. > :58:03.argue this was signed by the Treasury. This was not done by us.
:58:03. > :58:11.That is an appalling move away from responsibility. In Cheshire the
:58:11. > :58:18.Cheshire Police Commissioner is pretty his council tax up by 1.89 %
:58:18. > :58:26.stock -- 1.99 %. I would prefer him to deliver council tax freeze.
:58:26. > :58:33.have you told him? Of course. a democracy Dodger? I am less than
:58:33. > :58:38.happy. What is happening to council tax in South Lakeland. We do not
:58:38. > :58:43.have the secret state that Eric Pickles is talking about. We are
:58:44. > :58:50.going to propose back threes. It gives as financial difficulties but
:58:50. > :58:54.we think it is the right thing to do. It is the policy of the
:58:54. > :58:57.Coalition to leave spending with the people. Every pound we do not
:58:58. > :59:02.take of people as a pound they can spend on local businesses. It is
:59:02. > :59:09.the right way to go. What do you make of the fact that the police
:59:09. > :59:12.commissioner is putting his bit of the council tax up by a 1.85 %? The
:59:12. > :59:16.police commissioner might have to sit down with Eric Pickles one day
:59:16. > :59:19.and account for that. That is up to the Police Commissioner to decide.
:59:19. > :59:23.Were I to disagree with Eric Pickles is this issue of localism.
:59:23. > :59:27.He has tried to push us around the same route. It should be decided
:59:27. > :59:31.locally. If other people decide to put it up that is up to them. We
:59:31. > :59:38.are all accountable to the electorate. We answer at the ballot
:59:38. > :59:48.box. Is the police commissioner bodging democracy? A I am not going
:59:48. > :59:51.
:59:51. > :59:54.to say that. People have to stand for re a Wrexham -- for an election.
:59:54. > :00:02.If he is putting it appears it of the council tax then you are
:00:02. > :00:08.getting less. The problem we have got is a communication issue.
:00:08. > :00:12.People think it is as that is bidding it up. For three years
:00:13. > :00:22.South Lakeland District Council has kept council tax increases of 20.
:00:23. > :00:24.
:00:24. > :00:28.That is the message we need to get across. -- increases to zero.
:00:28. > :00:32.been the leader of another authority I would probably be doing
:00:32. > :00:35.the same thing as the leaders in the other authorities. They have
:00:36. > :00:41.their own pressures. They have to make political judgements to
:00:41. > :00:47.protect their own electorate. In Salford we have decided that enough
:00:47. > :00:54.is enough. We have come at cuts on top of the precepts for police,
:00:54. > :00:57.fire, waste. We have lost �100 million from Salford but the
:00:57. > :01:03.government has taken away in the last three years. 24 million this
:01:03. > :01:07.year. Another 27,000,004 years to come. Another 80 million in the
:01:07. > :01:17.next two or three years. The Government has taken that money
:01:17. > :01:20.
:01:20. > :01:28.away from Salford. On top of all fat -- on top of that, with the
:01:28. > :01:31.atrocious concept of a Belgian tax, -- AB bedroom tax. You are saying
:01:31. > :01:36.you know the list but you do not know what that means to the people
:01:36. > :01:41.of Salford. All that cumulatively is an absolute outrage. We are in a
:01:41. > :01:47.place we have never been in before. In the pit be control, the council
:01:47. > :01:56.tax element for Salford, we have given a little chink of hope to the
:01:56. > :02:02.people of Salford and what is a Coalition government blackspot.
:02:02. > :02:09.it not frustrating to see some of your colleagues putting up their
:02:09. > :02:14.bit of the council tax by 19 %, almost one-fifth? You are not going
:02:14. > :02:19.to be able to compromise me on services to the City of Salford. We
:02:19. > :02:23.put great store on our partnership work in the area of crime. We want
:02:23. > :02:28.to be able to have a situation where the people of Salford and
:02:28. > :02:33.their families are safe. That costs money. That is not that we control.
:02:33. > :02:43.But we control is about the Salford council tax. We have put it at his
:02:43. > :02:50.
:02:50. > :02:53.zeal for the 4th year running. -- put it at zero. I am proud we have
:02:53. > :03:00.been able to do that. But it does not solve the problem for the
:03:00. > :03:06.people Salford. It's a certainly does not. We leave the discussion
:03:06. > :03:12.there. It is time for the rest of the news
:03:12. > :03:16.in 60 seconds. Chilling - that is one the Lord's
:03:16. > :03:20.verdict on an e-mail sent by her anti-nuclear campaigner to a
:03:20. > :03:25.Cumbrian councillor before the boat to reject the nuclear waste dump.
:03:25. > :03:28.Another councillor has resigned over the decision.
:03:28. > :03:32.Standing can be safer. One Manchester M P John Leech is
:03:32. > :03:38.calling for the reintroduction of updated terraces after visiting 42
:03:38. > :03:43.Football League grounds. We can have a positive impact in terms of
:03:43. > :03:45.reducing ticket prices. Probation inspectors say it
:03:45. > :03:54.lacklustre authorities too often dismissed behaviour in youngsters
:03:54. > :04:03.when Tom to abuse others. -- too often dismissed behaviour in
:04:03. > :04:13.youngsters who abuse others. Lancaster council has rejected an
:04:13. > :04:15.
:04:15. > :04:20.application to develop the promenade and Morecambe.
:04:20. > :04:23.A big decision in terms of that nuclear thing. This row about
:04:23. > :04:28.whether there was too much intimidation on councillors. What
:04:28. > :04:32.is you take? It was a huge decision. The reverberations will go on for
:04:32. > :04:38.hundreds of thousands of years. I have got a lot of sympathy for the
:04:38. > :04:42.councillors and all. We were the intimidated? I think they were. Is
:04:42. > :04:47.it fair that 10 people have to make a decision might that three months
:04:47. > :04:56.before an aborted election? We have got to find a better way of our
:04:56. > :05:04.energy policy. -- before and an important election. We saw there
:05:04. > :05:08.about the football terraces. Would you welcome a change? I am very
:05:08. > :05:12.mindful of what the Liverpool supporters and their families