:01:07. > :01:10.Donald Trump's travel ban on refugees and citizens of seven
:01:11. > :01:12.mainly Muslim countries sparks protests at several US airports.
:01:13. > :01:15.And in the north-west: Is the Northern Powerhouse picking up pace?
:01:16. > :01:17.Plus, the Lancashire MP taking the lead on loneliness,
:01:18. > :01:23.part of the legacy of the late Jo Cox.
:01:24. > :01:25.Should she have spoken out more strongly?
:01:26. > :01:27.We'll ask former Ukip leader and Trump confidant Nigel Farage
:01:28. > :01:30.what he makes of the travel ban and the Prime Minister's
:01:31. > :01:33.In London this week, the mayor, Sadiq Khan,
:01:34. > :01:35.has been coming under pressure to explain his fares freeze
:01:36. > :01:37.and why it doesn't apply to everybody.
:01:38. > :01:39.And with me, the best and brightest political
:01:40. > :01:41.panel in the business - Steve Richards, Julia
:01:42. > :01:43.They'll be tweeting throughout the programme.
:01:44. > :01:46.It was soon after Theresa May left the White House on Friday that
:01:47. > :01:49.Donald Trump signed the executive order banning citizens from seven
:01:50. > :01:55.President Trump's 90-day ban covers Iran, Iraq,
:01:56. > :01:58.Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Yemen and Syria, from
:01:59. > :02:03.where refugees are banned from until further notice.
:02:04. > :02:05.Donald Trump's executive order also imposes a complete ban
:02:06. > :02:11.on all refugees coming to the US for the next 120 days.
:02:12. > :02:14.Mr Trump said that the ban would keep radical Islamic terrorists out
:02:15. > :02:23.But the ban has sparked protests across the US,
:02:24. > :02:25.as people affected and already in the air were detained
:02:26. > :02:29.US laws have begun legal action to challenge the ban, which many
:02:30. > :02:35.At a press conference in Ankara, Turkey, Theresa May was asked
:02:36. > :02:40.about the refugee ban three times before giving this response...
:02:41. > :02:42.Well, the United States is responsible for the United States'
:02:43. > :02:48.The United Kingdom is responsible for the United Kingdom's policy
:02:49. > :02:51.on refugees, and our policy on refugees is to have a number
:02:52. > :02:54.of voluntary schemes to bring Syrian refugees into the country.
:02:55. > :03:08.Downing Street later issued a statement saying:
:03:09. > :03:11.This morning, the Treasury Minister, David Gauke, was asked why
:03:12. > :03:14.Theresa May had refused to condemn the travel ban at yesterday's
:03:15. > :03:20.The Prime Minister is not a shoot-from-the-hip
:03:21. > :03:24.She wants to see the evidence, she wants
:03:25. > :03:28.to understand precisely what the implications are.
:03:29. > :03:31.She'd been in a series of very lengthy meetings with
:03:32. > :03:35.President Erdogan, and she's someone who wants to see the briefing and
:03:36. > :03:38.understand it, and then will respond to that.
:03:39. > :03:41.I think there are times where, you know, there's always
:03:42. > :03:44.pressure to respond within a news cycle and so on.
:03:45. > :03:47.The important thing is, we are saying we disagree with it
:03:48. > :03:50.We're joined now from North London by the Conservative
:03:51. > :04:02.Should the Government in general and Theresa May in particular be more
:04:03. > :04:11.vocal in their criticism of Donald Trump's travel bans? Well, as David
:04:12. > :04:15.just said, it is obviously right that Theresa has now said this is an
:04:16. > :04:19.appropriate and not something we agree with in our Government, but I
:04:20. > :04:26.wish she had said something at the time, not least because it affects
:04:27. > :04:29.our own citizens. One of our own MPs, Nadhim, for example, because it
:04:30. > :04:36.is also a global crisis. She had clearly built an excellent with
:04:37. > :04:40.Donald Trump -- she had built an excellent relationship with him, but
:04:41. > :04:44.she could have been firmer. Mrs May hasn't said any word of criticism
:04:45. > :04:50.about the travel bans. She refused to say anything three times in
:04:51. > :04:53.Ankara, and it is merely an anonymous Downing Street
:04:54. > :04:56.spokesperson that has issued the subsequent mild criticism. We have
:04:57. > :05:00.not heard from the Prime Minister at all on this matter in terms of
:05:01. > :05:05.criticism. No, but the spokesperson will be speaking with her blessing,
:05:06. > :05:08.so it is clearly something she has acknowledged. As I said before, I
:05:09. > :05:12.wish she had said something at the time. The global climate at the
:05:13. > :05:18.moment is delicate and we need our leaders to work together to address
:05:19. > :05:21.things like the refugee crisis. Potentially, this plays into the
:05:22. > :05:29.hands of Daesh. It is absolutely not the right message. What would you
:05:30. > :05:33.like the Prime Minister to say? As with any new relationship, it is
:05:34. > :05:36.about testing the boundaries. They had clearly got on well, so she
:05:37. > :05:39.should have felt braver to say something there and then. I would
:05:40. > :05:42.have preferred her to say, for example, I need to talk to Donald
:05:43. > :05:45.Trump about this. It is not something I support and I want to
:05:46. > :05:49.understand why because I believe there is a better way to deal with
:05:50. > :05:53.the terrorist threat. I would have liked her to suggest that she would
:05:54. > :05:57.engage with him to do that. The president has instituted a 90 day
:05:58. > :06:03.temporary ban on people coming from seven mainly Muslim majority
:06:04. > :06:09.population countries. The seven were on President Obama's list of the
:06:10. > :06:13.biggest terrorist threats to the United States. Mr Trump wants this
:06:14. > :06:19.temporary ban until he puts tougher vetting procedures in place. What is
:06:20. > :06:23.wrong with that? Because it appeared to me that it wasn't thought through
:06:24. > :06:26.and it was affecting ordinary citizens and some British citizens.
:06:27. > :06:31.It can't be right that a president in that position of power can
:06:32. > :06:36.arbitrarily come up with executive powers like that. It has already
:06:37. > :06:41.been challenged by his own courts. So it is not the considered approach
:06:42. > :06:45.I want to see in a global leader. Who do you believe will be hurt by
:06:46. > :06:58.this, given that there can be exceptions on a case-by-case basis?
:06:59. > :07:04.I think potentially, our global reputation is going to be hurt by
:07:05. > :07:08.this. I have been to the refugee camps in Europe myself. There are
:07:09. > :07:11.desperate people trying to free persecution who will be hurt by
:07:12. > :07:15.this. We are trying to heal the wounds in this country not only
:07:16. > :07:18.because of Brexit. This is a time of coming together, not about saying it
:07:19. > :07:23.is located discriminatory against race and religion in this way. Do
:07:24. > :07:29.you believe that Mr Trump's state visit should go ahead? Well, he is
:07:30. > :07:32.the leader of America, so it does need to go ahead and we need to work
:07:33. > :07:36.with him. I believe Theresa has started in a positive manner was
:07:37. > :07:39.that she just needs to continue in that vein. If he comes to our
:07:40. > :07:45.country, he needs to respect the way we feel about things. But yes, he is
:07:46. > :07:49.the president, so he does need to come to the UK. There is some debate
:07:50. > :07:53.within Westminster as to where it is appropriate for him to speak to MPs,
:07:54. > :07:57.but it is right that he comes. But if he does come on a state visit,
:07:58. > :08:00.should he be granted what this country has always thought of as a
:08:01. > :08:07.great honour, which is a joint address to both Houses of
:08:08. > :08:09.Parliament? I haven't been an MP long enough to understand the
:08:10. > :08:14.protocol of where is the right location for him to do that, but I
:08:15. > :08:20.believe in the past, it has been the greatest leaders, when they have
:08:21. > :08:24.achieved great things globally, it is Westminster Hall. But there are a
:08:25. > :08:27.number of MPs saying that is not the most appropriate place and I am
:08:28. > :08:30.inclined to agree. You don't think he should be accorded the privilege
:08:31. > :08:36.of speaking to a joint session of Parliament? I think there are places
:08:37. > :08:39.where he can do that, but Westminster Hall is not yet the
:08:40. > :08:49.right place. Thank you for joining us.
:08:50. > :08:55.Steve, within 24 hours, we have seen the difficulty of becoming Donald
:08:56. > :08:59.Trump's best friend. On the one hand, it could have huge advantages,
:09:00. > :09:04.particularly for a Brexit Britain. On the other hand, if you are going
:09:05. > :09:10.to be his best friend, you don't have to give a running commentary on
:09:11. > :09:14.every major thing he does. Yeah. We have learned a bit about Theresa
:09:15. > :09:20.May, that when she has to produce a set piece speech which she has time
:09:21. > :09:25.to prepare, she can get it totally right and sometimes more than right.
:09:26. > :09:33.When she is faced with a fast-moving story, she is leaden footed and
:09:34. > :09:38.can't think quickly on her feet. We know, did she regret not saying
:09:39. > :09:42.more? Evidently she did, because we got a statement from the Downing
:09:43. > :09:45.Street spokesperson saying more. So she can't think quickly. She's going
:09:46. > :09:48.to have to think very quickly in response to some of the things he's
:09:49. > :09:54.going to be doing, because she will be asked about it all the time. It
:09:55. > :09:59.does highlight the wider danger that the assumption that the special
:10:00. > :10:02.relationship is always a safe and fertile place to be has been proven
:10:03. > :10:07.wrong before and I think it will be proven wrong big-time in this case.
:10:08. > :10:12.You're shaking your head. I don't see why we are responsible for
:10:13. > :10:15.American domestic policy. I am as appalled as the next person by what
:10:16. > :10:21.Donald Trump has done. He said he was going to do this, which was why
:10:22. > :10:25.I did not want Americans to vote for him. In fact, what he has
:10:26. > :10:29.implemented is much less than what he said he would do when he was
:10:30. > :10:36.campaigning. I have always felt that the campaigning Trump was the real
:10:37. > :10:39.Trump. But what he has done is actually constitutional. He has the
:10:40. > :10:44.executive power to issue this order. It is within the rules in terms of a
:10:45. > :10:49.class of aliens deemed to be a risk to the United States. It is a 90 day
:10:50. > :10:55.limited ban. The last president who did this was a Democrat president,
:10:56. > :10:59.President Carter. He did it in the aftermath of the Iranian crisis.
:11:00. > :11:02.Well, given the spate of terror attacks on American territory in
:11:03. > :11:10.recent years, you could argue that he meant well. I don't agree with
:11:11. > :11:14.Donald Trump. But have people from these countries that he has banned
:11:15. > :11:19.been involved in terrorist attacks? That is the absurdity. He has not
:11:20. > :11:22.included Egypt or Pakistan. But I don't remove everyone getting in
:11:23. > :11:26.such a state about President Carter. The reality is that it is a legal
:11:27. > :11:35.thing for him to do. I don't like it. But it is not my territory. It
:11:36. > :11:41.is illegal, because they have been given a right to remain by a judge
:11:42. > :11:45.in Brooklyn and another judging Alexandra. That is a different issue
:11:46. > :11:51.for people who have already gone through the vetting. I don't agree
:11:52. > :11:55.with this. However, I don't think it's reasonable to say that Theresa
:11:56. > :12:01.May, because she wants to do a deal with Donald Trump, I don't give is
:12:02. > :12:06.reasonable to say she have to agree with each of his policies. It is
:12:07. > :12:11.nonsense. But the issue, Janan, is not whether she needs to agree with
:12:12. > :12:16.him. The question is that she will be questioned about him all the time
:12:17. > :12:20.now. And although these are matters of domestic policy, the refugee
:12:21. > :12:26.policy is international. They speak to issues that affect Britain as
:12:27. > :12:30.well, and I would suggest that she will not get away with this
:12:31. > :12:34.anonymous statement from Downing Street. People will demand a she
:12:35. > :12:38.says something on the record. She would get away with it indefinitely.
:12:39. > :12:43.These situations will recur every time Donald Trump says or does
:12:44. > :12:47.something contentious. She will be pressed to this associate her
:12:48. > :12:51.administration from his. She will probably be in a better logistical
:12:52. > :12:56.situation to do so. She has spent a big chunk of the past 72 hours in
:12:57. > :13:01.the air. She flew from Washington to Ankara, than from Ankara to London.
:13:02. > :13:03.We don't have Air Force One, we don't have those frictionless
:13:04. > :13:07.communications with the ground. She would have been incommunicado for
:13:08. > :13:11.large periods of time when this story was breaking. That doesn't
:13:12. > :13:15.excuse the stiff response when she landed and issued a statement via
:13:16. > :13:20.Downing Street. But during that delay, she did have a plausible
:13:21. > :13:24.excuse. She has also got a much more tricky geopolitical situation than
:13:25. > :13:28.many other world leaders. She has to strike a favourable trade deal with
:13:29. > :13:32.the new US president. It is all very well people saying Justin Trudeau of
:13:33. > :13:35.Canada was much more vociferous in his criticism of Donald Trump. He is
:13:36. > :13:42.already in Nafta, he is not striking a new deal. For how long, we don't
:13:43. > :13:44.know. Exactly, he's trying to stay in Nafta, but he is in a less tricky
:13:45. > :13:48.situation than she is. Now, Theresa May's was the first
:13:49. > :13:50.foreign leader to meet President Trump and the visit
:13:51. > :13:53.was seen as quite a coup for the Prime Minister,
:13:54. > :13:55.keen for a new trading relationship with the United States
:13:56. > :13:58.in the wake of Brexit. The Prime Minister congratulated
:13:59. > :14:00.the new US President for his "stunning election victory"
:14:01. > :14:02.but might not have intended to be pictured walking
:14:03. > :14:04.through the White House with him That picture of Donald Trump helping
:14:05. > :14:08.Theresa May down the steps through the White House colonnade
:14:09. > :14:11.will be the enduring image Mrs May said the President
:14:12. > :14:20.told her he was "100% behind Nato". And for her part, the Prime Minister
:14:21. > :14:23.said she would work hard to make sure other Nato countries
:14:24. > :14:26.increased their defence spending It's been announced
:14:27. > :14:33.that there will be a new trade negotiation agreement,
:14:34. > :14:34.with high-level talks The hope is that this will lead
:14:35. > :14:39.to a new trade deal between the two countries as soon as
:14:40. > :14:44.Britain leaves the EU. Mr Trump said he believed "Brexit's
:14:45. > :14:47.going to be a wonderful thing". On Russia, Theresa May made clear
:14:48. > :14:49.to Donald Trump her continued
:14:50. > :14:55.backing for sanctions. And following the controversy over
:14:56. > :14:57.the President's support for torture, Mr Trump said he would defer
:14:58. > :15:00.to his Secretary of Defense, General James Mattis, who argues
:15:01. > :15:04.that the practice doesn't work. And I'm joined now by the former
:15:05. > :15:19.Ukip leader, Nigel Farage. Do you agree with Mr Trump's
:15:20. > :15:24.decision to ban Syrian refugees indefinitely from entering the
:15:25. > :15:28.United States? I agree with the concept of democracy, a point which
:15:29. > :15:32.appears to be missed by almost all commentators including the BBC. He
:15:33. > :15:36.was elected to get tough and say he would do everything in his power to
:15:37. > :15:44.protect America from infiltration by ISIS terrorists. There are seven
:15:45. > :15:50.countries on that list. He's entitled to do this. I didn't ask if
:15:51. > :15:56.he was entitled, I asked if agree with it. I do, because if you just
:15:57. > :15:59.look at what's happening in France and Germany, if you look at Angela
:16:00. > :16:06.Merkel's policy which was to allow virtually anyone in from anywhere,
:16:07. > :16:09.look what it led to. You said in 2013 there's a responsibility on all
:16:10. > :16:15.of us in the free west to help some of those people fleeing Syria
:16:16. > :16:19.literally in fear of their lives. That's the Christian community in
:16:20. > :16:23.virtually all of those country, it is almost too late because many have
:16:24. > :16:28.been wiped out but if you are looking for a genuine definition of
:16:29. > :16:33.a refugee, going back to 1951, it is someone in direct fear of
:16:34. > :16:37.persecution of their life because of their race, religion or beliefs. But
:16:38. > :16:41.you didn't talk about only Christians, and in January 2014 you
:16:42. > :16:45.said, I seem to recall it was Ukip who started the debate on allowing
:16:46. > :16:52.Syrian refugees, you seem to be in favour of allowing proper refugees
:16:53. > :17:00.into this country. If they can be defined. Mr Trump won't let any in.
:17:01. > :17:04.He is running American policy, not British policy. Since I made those
:17:05. > :17:08.comments, we have had the Angela Merkel madness and I think Trump's
:17:09. > :17:14.policy in many ways has been shaped by what Angela Merkel did. He is
:17:15. > :17:16.fully entitled to do this, and as far as we are concerned in this
:17:17. > :17:26.country, I would like to see extreme vetting. Since 9/11 can you name any
:17:27. > :17:31.terrorist event in the United States that has involved refugees that have
:17:32. > :17:36.been allowed into the country? No, in fact the terrorist events have
:17:37. > :17:40.been US citizens radicalised. When you have a problem already, why
:17:41. > :17:44.would you wish to add to it? I would remind you that of the eight people
:17:45. > :17:48.that committed those atrocities in Paris, five of them had got into
:17:49. > :17:53.Europe posing as refugees so there is an issue here. But perhaps not
:17:54. > :17:57.for America because it has the most rigorous and lengthy screening
:17:58. > :18:02.process in the world, especially for Syrians. You have to register with
:18:03. > :18:07.the UN agency for refugees, which then recommend certain names to
:18:08. > :18:10.America, they then go through biometric screening, database
:18:11. > :18:21.screening, intelligent screenings, including four separate intelligence
:18:22. > :18:29.agencies screening you. How more rigorous would you want it to be? It
:18:30. > :18:32.is much more rigorous than we are or the rest of Europe. This is why we
:18:33. > :18:35.have elections, so voters can make choices and they voted for Donald
:18:36. > :18:42.Trump to become president and he said he would put bans in place and
:18:43. > :18:45.then move towards extreme vetting. As far as the Syrians are concerned
:18:46. > :18:51.he's made that decision but that's what he was voted in fourth. Since
:18:52. > :18:57.you know him, you have met him, you are confident of his, I'm testing
:18:58. > :19:01.you on the logic of it. Not that he's democratically elected, I'm not
:19:02. > :19:04.asking about that, I'm trying to get the case, particularly since if you
:19:05. > :19:10.take the seven countries of which the ban applies for 19 days, again,
:19:11. > :19:14.of these seven countries, its citizens have not been involved in
:19:15. > :19:18.terrorist attacks in the United States. It would be a mistake to say
:19:19. > :19:21.it is just Muslim countries because the biggest Muslim countries in the
:19:22. > :19:25.world have not been included in this. The point is they have made
:19:26. > :19:30.this assessment, they bought themselves 90 days to think about
:19:31. > :19:37.the policy. This is exactly what Trump's voters would have wanted him
:19:38. > :19:41.to do. You said the President's rhetoric on immigrants made even you
:19:42. > :19:45.feel very uncomfortable. Because he started by saying there was a total
:19:46. > :19:50.ban, then amended it to say there would be vetting. My guess is that
:19:51. > :19:54.what he will do is try to genuinely help Syrian people and he will be
:19:55. > :20:01.talking about the creation of some safe zones. Let's see. He hasn't. We
:20:02. > :20:07.will see. I suspect something like that is coming down the trap. What
:20:08. > :20:13.advice did you give to the president and his advisers ahead of Theresa
:20:14. > :20:17.May's visit? That I wanted us to talk about trade and to give the
:20:18. > :20:21.Prime Minister the impression that actually... When she has been
:20:22. > :20:26.surrounded by her whole career by civil servants and politicians who
:20:27. > :20:30.say that everything takes five years or seven years or ten years, to make
:20:31. > :20:34.it clear to the Prime Minister that if there is will, these things can
:20:35. > :20:38.be done quickly. Isn't there a danger of a British Prime Minister
:20:39. > :20:44.who has to deal with the president of the United States, to Ally
:20:45. > :20:49.herself so closely with such an unpredictable, controversial
:20:50. > :20:53.president, banning Muslims in certain ways and refugees, building
:20:54. > :20:58.a war with Mexico, threatening trade was with other countries, thinking
:20:59. > :21:02.of ending sanctions against Russia? I missing something here, what is
:21:03. > :21:07.controversial about defending the Mexican border? Bill Clinton spoke
:21:08. > :21:12.in tough terms, George Bush built six miles of fence, and because it
:21:13. > :21:15.is Donald Trump there is uproar. So you think there is no risk of the
:21:16. > :21:19.British by Minister being the best friend of this type of president? I
:21:20. > :21:23.think there is no risk in putting together a trade deal and no risk in
:21:24. > :21:28.her being the bridge between America and the rest of Nato to say to Nato
:21:29. > :21:34.members if you don't pay your 2% he is serious so on those things there
:21:35. > :21:39.is no risk at all. It was clear from her Lancaster house speech that the
:21:40. > :21:42.Brexiteers in the Government had won pretty much every argument in terms
:21:43. > :21:50.of negotiations to come out. What you want from her? She was very good
:21:51. > :21:53.as Home Secretary, Tory party conferences, the Tory press saying
:21:54. > :21:58.this was the new Thatcher and she failed. She even failed to control
:21:59. > :22:02.immigration from outside the European Union so yes, it was a good
:22:03. > :22:07.speech and for many on the Eurosceptic side of the argument, I
:22:08. > :22:10.could scarcely believe that a British Prime Minister was saying
:22:11. > :22:17.things which I had been roundly abused and vilified for. But I have
:22:18. > :22:20.a feeling we may be in for a very frustrating 2017. The mood as I can
:22:21. > :22:25.see it in Brussels is that negotiating with Britain is not a
:22:26. > :22:28.priority, they are far more worried about Dutch elections, French
:22:29. > :22:34.elections, German elections and possibly even Italian elections. I
:22:35. > :22:36.worry that by the end of this year we may not have made much progress
:22:37. > :22:43.and that's why the Trump visit suddenly things brings into focus.
:22:44. > :22:48.What if by the middle of June, for argument 's sake, the Americans say
:22:49. > :22:51.OK we reached this position with the British, compromised on the tough
:22:52. > :22:57.stuff, food standards and things like that, we are ready to sign a
:22:58. > :23:01.deal now, and Theresa May is to say actually Mr Juncker says I cannot
:23:02. > :23:07.sign this until we leave. What will they do? They cannot throw us out,
:23:08. > :23:11.we are living anyway. But everybody agrees you can talk about the deal,
:23:12. > :23:16.maybe even do the heads of agreement but you cannot sign a treaty until
:23:17. > :23:20.we have left the EU. Let me predict that at the end of this year we will
:23:21. > :23:23.find a European Union who frankly don't want to talk to us and
:23:24. > :23:28.countries around the world that want to get on and do things and that
:23:29. > :23:33.will be the big tension for Mrs May over the course of this year. If the
:23:34. > :23:36.Prime Minister is giving you everything you want on Brexit, you
:23:37. > :23:41.agree that she's trying to get from your point of view the right things.
:23:42. > :23:45.If she delivers on that and get Brexit on the terms of which you
:23:46. > :23:50.approve, what's the point of Ukip? You could argue that about any
:23:51. > :23:56.political party. If we have achieved the goal that we set out to achieve,
:23:57. > :23:59.there are right now out there 4 million people who are Ukip
:24:00. > :24:04.loyalists. They are delighted that by voting Ukip we got a referendum,
:24:05. > :24:09.they will be even happier if they seek us leave the European Union and
:24:10. > :24:13.I think there is still a gap in British politics for a party that
:24:14. > :24:16.says it as it sees it, is not afraid by political correctness and is seen
:24:17. > :24:21.to be on the side of the little people, and that's why, with the
:24:22. > :24:26.Labour Party is fundamentally split, and it really is totally split over
:24:27. > :24:31.this European question, I think Ukip is in good shape. That proposition
:24:32. > :24:35.will be put to test at the Stoke Central by-election, one of Ukip's
:24:36. > :24:39.best prospects in the country. Some people call it the capital of
:24:40. > :24:46.Brexit. Labour is in chaos over Article 50, is picked a candidate to
:24:47. > :24:55.fight Stoke Central who has described Brexit is a pile of notes.
:24:56. > :24:59.If your successor, Paul Nuttall, cannot win the Stoke by-election,
:25:00. > :25:03.there's not much hope for you, is there? I think he will. I've always
:25:04. > :25:09.been told don't make predictions but I think he will win. If you doesn't
:25:10. > :25:15.it will be tough, we will still have our 4 million loyalists, but if it
:25:16. > :25:19.does we can actually see Labour are beatable in their heartlands and
:25:20. > :25:21.Ukip will be off to the second big stage. Nigel Farage, thank you for
:25:22. > :25:23.being with us. It's just gone 11.25,
:25:24. > :25:24.you're watching the Sunday Politics. We say goodbye to viewers
:25:25. > :25:27.in Scotland, who leave us now Coming up here in 15 minutes, I'll
:25:28. > :25:36.be talking to our political panel. The Lancashire MP taking a lead
:25:37. > :25:41.on loneliness and the legacy Seema Kennedy on that
:25:42. > :25:48.campaign a little later. But here in this studio
:25:49. > :25:50.we welcome Justin Madders, the Labour MP for Ellesmere Port
:25:51. > :25:53.and Neston, and Mark Menzies, We start with Brexit and this week's
:25:54. > :26:00.ruling that Parliament will vote on whether we begin
:26:01. > :26:03.the exit process. Here are a couple of MPs
:26:04. > :26:06.who've said they will vote The Government are trying
:26:07. > :26:11.to persuade the public they can It is all going to end in tears
:26:12. > :26:16.in one way or another unless people reflect positively,
:26:17. > :26:18.and with clarity, on the outcome when negotiations are complete,
:26:19. > :26:20.and that requires, I think, Up until now, I have not heard
:26:21. > :26:27.any convincing argument from the Government about the kind
:26:28. > :26:30.of negotiation that they want to enter into, which will look
:26:31. > :26:32.after the people of So, no surprises on the Lib Dem
:26:33. > :26:37.stance - they want a public vote Much trickier for Labour
:26:38. > :26:40.MPs and Conservative, whose constituents voted to remain
:26:41. > :26:43.in the European Union, Justin, is Jeremy Corbyn right
:26:44. > :26:48.to impose a three-line whip on this, knowing there will be a big crisis
:26:49. > :26:52.of conscience for lots of his MPs? Well, he is the leader so he has got
:26:53. > :26:55.to lead on these things, and I think sometimes people
:26:56. > :26:58.are a bit unfair on him So, I think the shoe's
:26:59. > :27:01.on the other foot. The criticism of him on this,
:27:02. > :27:04.I think, is a bit misplaced. But I do appreciate that MPs
:27:05. > :27:08.who are representing constituencies who heavily voted for Remain
:27:09. > :27:11.are going to be put in a very difficult position,
:27:12. > :27:13.and they have got to listen to what the constituents say,
:27:14. > :27:17.as well as the wider electorate. Jeff Smith and Ann Coffey have both
:27:18. > :27:19.declared that they will vote Do you think we are likely
:27:20. > :27:24.to see more rebellion? I think, certainly, we have got
:27:25. > :27:27.to look at what the votes That is to try to predict
:27:28. > :27:31.where people are going to vote, and obviously Jeff's example, 76%
:27:32. > :27:34.of his constituents voted Remain, and I don't think anyone can
:27:35. > :27:37.argue that he is not reflecting the wishes of his own
:27:38. > :27:39.individual constituents. But I think the majority of Labour
:27:40. > :27:45.MPs will vote to trigger Article 50. Has the Prime Minister had
:27:46. > :27:48.to compromise twice this week, once conceding to the House when it
:27:49. > :27:52.comes to voting on triggering, and secondly she has said
:27:53. > :27:55.she will reveal her hand when it She did not want to do
:27:56. > :27:58.either of those things. Well, compromise is
:27:59. > :28:00.a word that you use. I would actually say
:28:01. > :28:02."setting out a clear position". So, you know, people have been
:28:03. > :28:05.asking for some clarity The Prime Minister,
:28:06. > :28:09.not just on the issue of the White Paper this week,
:28:10. > :28:12.but more importantly in the speech that she made the previous week,
:28:13. > :28:15.made it very, very clear on the key points were that she
:28:16. > :28:17.would be entering in And one of the principal thinks
:28:18. > :28:23.that people in the north-west is one of the principal things
:28:24. > :28:26.that the Prime Minister's concerned about, is ensuring
:28:27. > :28:28.that there is no free movement of people in the way
:28:29. > :28:31.that we had in the past, and also ensuring that we have got
:28:32. > :28:34.as much access for British goods and services, not just in Europe
:28:35. > :28:38.but across the globe. Well, we learnt a little bit this
:28:39. > :28:41.week in that respect. One man who has an unenviable task
:28:42. > :28:44.over the next couple of years is Lindsay Hoyle,
:28:45. > :28:47.the Deputy Speaker of the House. He is going to have to go
:28:48. > :28:50.through all of those amendments This is going to be an incredibly
:28:51. > :28:54.messy divorce, isn't it? Do you think the two-year timetable
:28:55. > :28:57.for agreeing on a deal, I suppose one of the criticisms
:28:58. > :29:05.we can marvel at Theresa May is that she could have got
:29:06. > :29:07.on with this process a little bit earlier,
:29:08. > :29:10.had she fought the court case. That has been a complete
:29:11. > :29:12.waste of time and money, because every legal opinion
:29:13. > :29:14.was clear that she was not So we have lost considerable time,
:29:15. > :29:21.but we could have been And I think it is very important,
:29:22. > :29:25.from my constituents' perspective, that the rights that we have got
:29:26. > :29:28.from Europe, particularly in terms of employment protection,
:29:29. > :29:29.are retained, and of course for the manufacturing industry
:29:30. > :29:32.in my area that we have as good access as possible
:29:33. > :29:34.to the free market. And that means no
:29:35. > :29:36.tariffs, if possible. Prime Minister back in the autumn
:29:37. > :29:44.made it very clear that Article 50 Article 50 will be
:29:45. > :29:47.triggered in March. It looks set to the timetable
:29:48. > :29:54.for now, but I am sure we will be The cabinet came to
:29:55. > :29:57.the north-west this week. With an industry-themed 60
:29:58. > :30:04.Seconds, here's Carol Lowe. From Westminster to Warrington -
:30:05. > :30:06.the Prime Minister brought the top table of Government
:30:07. > :30:08.to the north-west to unveil her industrial strategy and commitment
:30:09. > :30:13.to the local economy. Investment in the Northern
:30:14. > :30:15.Powerhouse that will bring jobs - that's part of our industrial
:30:16. > :30:18.strategy, which is about ensuring the economy is working
:30:19. > :30:22.across the whole country. Later in the week, the Minister
:30:23. > :30:25.in charge of delivering the Northern Powerhouse came
:30:26. > :30:28.to Ellesmere Port to open Also in the money was Blackpool,
:30:29. > :30:33.which is hoping to bring back party conferences with ?15 million
:30:34. > :30:35.of Government funding I hope it will start to make many,
:30:36. > :30:43.many people in Blackpool feel that Labour's Steve Rotheram
:30:44. > :30:48.launched his campaign for metro mayor of the Liverpool City region
:30:49. > :30:50.with a pledge to improve apprenticeships and fight
:30:51. > :30:55.for more devolved powers. And one of the region's most
:30:56. > :30:57.prestigious manufacturers is celebrating a record year -
:30:58. > :31:01.there were bumper sales So, I met the Prime Minister on
:31:02. > :31:12.Monday when she was in Warrington. The thing that stood out
:31:13. > :31:14.about my interview with her was, in the space of a very short
:31:15. > :31:17.interview, she mentioned She was really reluctant to use that
:31:18. > :31:21.phrase last summer, wasn't she? And can we take from that fact
:31:22. > :31:23.it's alive and well? Does it feel like it's something
:31:24. > :31:26.tangible, Justin, to you? Or is it just a phrase
:31:27. > :31:29.that means nothing? I've always felt it was a little bit
:31:30. > :31:32.of PR spin, and not a lot The announcements on investment
:31:33. > :31:35.this week have been repeated twice before,
:31:36. > :31:38.so there is nothing new there. And particularly I am disappointed
:31:39. > :31:47.for my constituency because we had a bid put in to regenerate
:31:48. > :31:49.Ellsemere Port town centre, which appears to have been
:31:50. > :31:51.completely kicked out. But we do know there will be highway
:31:52. > :31:54.improvement in and Cheshire, funding for new bridges and cycle
:31:55. > :31:56.routes, all around Well, it's no bad thing, but,
:31:57. > :32:02.at the moment, my constituents can't get from one side
:32:03. > :32:04.of the constituency to the other on public
:32:05. > :32:06.transport after six o'clock. The whole area turned
:32:07. > :32:08.into gridlock whenever there's an accident on the M56,
:32:09. > :32:10.because the Government And when you have six times as much
:32:11. > :32:14.investment per person in London as you get in the rest
:32:15. > :32:17.of the country, I think we are miles away
:32:18. > :32:19.from the Northern Powerhouse Well, let's have a look at how the
:32:20. > :32:24.rest of the money was divided up. We found out that, in total,
:32:25. > :32:27.there will be more than ?320 million for local enterprise partnerships
:32:28. > :32:29.across the north-west. Greater Manchester will get almost
:32:30. > :32:31.as much as Liverpool And Cumbria got just
:32:32. > :32:36.less than ?13 million - less than a tenth of what it
:32:37. > :32:41.had bid for. Do you think that Cumbria,
:32:42. > :32:44.Cheshire and Lancashire are missing out because they've not reached
:32:45. > :32:46.a devo deal? No, I think more importantly
:32:47. > :32:48.it is about the quality of the leadership in
:32:49. > :32:50.the local enterprise partnerships... A few of them have dynamic people
:32:51. > :32:54.leading and driving them But to pick up just on one thing -
:32:55. > :32:58.we saw in your package Blackpool For years, people in Blackpool have
:32:59. > :33:03.been crying out for investment Conferences, as you know,
:33:04. > :33:07.on the big scale, have gone People were marched up the hill
:33:08. > :33:13.by Labour promising them a super-casino to be let
:33:14. > :33:15.down at the last minute. This is now starting to deliver
:33:16. > :33:18.to the tourist economy That's something this
:33:19. > :33:21.Government has delivered But certainly come up in Cumbria,
:33:22. > :33:25.they think that the LEP They think they are being punished
:33:26. > :33:30.by the Government for not Well, on Monday I asked
:33:31. > :33:35.a question on nuclear. I mean, nuclear fuels
:33:36. > :33:37.in my constituency, nuclear power is hugely significant
:33:38. > :33:39.for the north-west. Greg Clark, in his reply, started
:33:40. > :33:42.to lay out the nuclear vision, which will impact on great tens
:33:43. > :33:44.of thousands of jobs Nuclear power station in Cumbria -
:33:45. > :33:50.21,000 jobs alone. The Prime Minister has made it
:33:51. > :33:53.clear that she backs it. Now, that, to me, is
:33:54. > :33:56.a Northern Powerhouse. And, Justin, when it comes to job
:33:57. > :33:58.creation and when it comes to industry and when it comes
:33:59. > :34:01.to unemployment, that is somewhere where public perception is much more
:34:02. > :34:05.on the side of the public Government Well, I think there's a whole
:34:06. > :34:09.debate that we need have We know that real earnings have not
:34:10. > :34:13.risen for ten years, and there's millions of people
:34:14. > :34:15.now in insecure And I think when we are looking
:34:16. > :34:19.at investing in industry, we also need to look at what sort
:34:20. > :34:22.of jobs we create. Are we creating sustainable,
:34:23. > :34:24.long-term jobs that allow people to put down roots and invest
:34:25. > :34:27.in their own futures as well? Do you feel there is that
:34:28. > :34:29.pressure in Cheshire as well to form a devolution deal,
:34:30. > :34:32.to have an elected mayor so that you can stand
:34:33. > :34:34.as one voice and say, To put in bids the way that
:34:35. > :34:38.Greater Manchester and Merseyside I think there is a very
:34:39. > :34:41.clear message coming from the Government on that,
:34:42. > :34:44.and I think it does, kind of, contradict a little bit
:34:45. > :34:46.the whole devolution stance, in the sense that the Government
:34:47. > :34:49.is saying, you can have devolution but it has to be
:34:50. > :34:51.on these specific terms. That's not really listening to
:34:52. > :34:53.what local communities are saying. Are they holding
:34:54. > :34:55.communities to ransom? I was up in Wyre this
:34:56. > :34:58.week, which is not far They have no interest in having
:34:59. > :35:01.an elected mayor there, and yet they would be handed money,
:35:02. > :35:04.literally, if they agree to it. No, I think that the town
:35:05. > :35:07.of Wyre are right. And I think there is no such thing
:35:08. > :35:10.as one size fits all. The principle of combined
:35:11. > :35:12.authorities in many parts of the country is absolutely
:35:13. > :35:15.the right thing to do, And I think, in my part
:35:16. > :35:22.of the world as well, I'm beginning to question
:35:23. > :35:26.what is in it for the people that I represent in a combined authority,
:35:27. > :35:29.and I think we are going to see The Government have told us, though,
:35:30. > :35:34.the Department for Communities and Local Government told me this
:35:35. > :35:36.morning that you simply are in a position to make stronger
:35:37. > :35:40.bids if you are part of a combined authority, and a unified voice is
:35:41. > :35:43.better than a lot of single voices. I think some of this
:35:44. > :35:47.is about Emperor's new clothes. But I think it's time that we got
:35:48. > :35:52.solutions that fitted each area, Very quickly, Justin,
:35:53. > :35:55.would you like to see Personally, I don't think it's
:35:56. > :36:03.the right fit for Cheshire. There's lots of different towns
:36:04. > :36:06.with different priorities. It's not like in Liverpool
:36:07. > :36:09.and Manchester when you've got a very clear city
:36:10. > :36:11.centre and hinterland. I would like to see more
:36:12. > :36:13.devolution and more power is going to local communities,
:36:14. > :36:16.but, personally, I'm not persuaded that a mayor is the right
:36:17. > :36:18.vehicle to deliver that. Seven months ago, the murder
:36:19. > :36:24.of Jo Cox shocked the country, and close to the Labour MP's heart
:36:25. > :36:27.was what she called Before her death, the mum-of-two
:36:28. > :36:33.from Yorkshire started a cross-party Now a Conservative from this side
:36:34. > :36:38.of the Pennines is looking At the Seasons group in Preston,
:36:39. > :36:47.older people come together to talk They come, they get a coffee,
:36:48. > :36:52.and they sit and chat These gatherings are organised
:36:53. > :36:56.by Longford community church, but anyone is welcome
:36:57. > :36:59.whether they're religious or not. Figures suggest millions
:37:00. > :37:07.of older people feel Before her murder, Jo Cox had begun
:37:08. > :37:14.planning a Loneliness Commission She wanted it to be cross-party
:37:15. > :37:18.and she wanted to involve lots of partner organisations
:37:19. > :37:21.and have a year of looking at the issue of loneliness,
:37:22. > :37:26.which is a really heading Now, Seema Kennedy and colleagues
:37:27. > :37:37.are taking the mantle on, working with 13 charities to look
:37:38. > :37:39.into loneliness and come up So, Beryl, what was it that brought
:37:40. > :37:44.you to Seasons for the first time? Well, I'd heard about Seasons
:37:45. > :37:46.because I was lonely ,and I was looking for a church
:37:47. > :37:49.as well, but he came here because there were people
:37:50. > :37:51.who were like-minded The highlight of many people's
:37:52. > :37:54.day is the food that The Commission will also look at how
:37:55. > :38:00.other age groups are affected. Key is a charity in Leyland that
:38:01. > :38:05.helps vulnerable teenagers They can meet other young
:38:06. > :38:09.people who have been through similar situations,
:38:10. > :38:11.and we know that they can feel a real sense of
:38:12. > :38:13.belonging to this place. What's your experiences
:38:14. > :38:17.of coming down to Key Youth? Coming here, it just feels more
:38:18. > :38:22.better than being sat at home. I will come here and drop
:38:23. > :38:26.in to colour and talk What she said in her maiden speech,
:38:27. > :38:32.and what we think about, there is more in common and we need
:38:33. > :38:36.to love like Jo and have that great empathy for everybody
:38:37. > :38:38.in our communities. The commission
:38:39. > :38:42.will produce a manifesto and call on Government to take action,
:38:43. > :38:46.but it's also hoped that highlighting the issue over the next
:38:47. > :38:49.year will ensure individuals make And a successful commission
:38:50. > :38:57.on loneliness that crosses party divides would be a great legacy
:38:58. > :39:00.for someone who is obviously You know, Seema was working on this
:39:01. > :39:07.with Jo at the time of Jo's death. And rather than let this drop,
:39:08. > :39:11.you know, Seema feels that she owes this, and is working together
:39:12. > :39:14.with Labour MPs such as Rachel Reeves in order
:39:15. > :39:16.to really drive this, and make it happen as part
:39:17. > :39:19.of the memory, just part And, you know, why this matters
:39:20. > :39:25.is that there are thousands of people in all of our areas,
:39:26. > :39:28.in my constituency, of all age It is people that suffer
:39:29. > :39:32.from bereavement. They may have gone through a health
:39:33. > :39:38.crisis, and they find themselves suddenly isolated,
:39:39. > :39:42.and just needing a bit of support, And there is nothing
:39:43. > :39:46.more cruel or wicked And, Justin, is it something you see
:39:47. > :39:50.in your constituency as well, And it needs intervention
:39:51. > :39:54.from the state? It does, and I think it needs
:39:55. > :39:57.as all to have a look at ourselves There is in my constituency a great
:39:58. > :40:02.organisation that has started having elderly people in who are isolated
:40:03. > :40:04.and getting them a meal, getting them a bit of entertainment
:40:05. > :40:08.and a bit of company, and that really can make such
:40:09. > :40:11.a difference to people's lives. We should do an awful
:40:12. > :40:13.lot more of it. It can be the tiniest
:40:14. > :40:15.thing, that it? There is an organisation
:40:16. > :40:17.called Just Good Friends. A nice plug for
:40:18. > :40:21.Just Good Friends, there. A big thank you to
:40:22. > :40:26.this week's guests, It's time to hand you back
:40:27. > :40:31.to Andrew Neil in London. air-pollution. Thank you for being
:40:32. > :40:37.here. Welcome back and let's get back
:40:38. > :40:41.to Donald Trump's travel ban on refugees and citizens from seven
:40:42. > :40:47.mainly Muslim countries. Earlier, the Labour leader,
:40:48. > :40:50.Jeremy Corbyn, told ITV that a state visit by President Trump to the UK
:40:51. > :41:03.should not go ahead I think it would be totally wrong
:41:04. > :41:08.for him to be coming here while that situation is going on. He has to be
:41:09. > :41:12.challenged on this. So until the ban is lifted, you don't think he should
:41:13. > :41:16.come? I am not happy about him coming here until the ban is lifted.
:41:17. > :41:21.Look at what is happening with those countries. What will be the long
:41:22. > :41:26.term effect of this on the rest of the world? Is this state visit going
:41:27. > :41:32.to become a matter of huge political debate in this country? It would be
:41:33. > :41:36.anyway, but it is a temporary ban, so Jeremy Corbyn is on safe
:41:37. > :41:39.territory. It will be over by April and he is not due to come until
:41:40. > :41:45.summer. But there are three bands. There is the 90 day ban on people
:41:46. > :41:49.coming from the southern countries. There is the 120 day ban on refugees
:41:50. > :41:53.from anywhere in the world, and there is the indefinite ban on
:41:54. > :41:59.Syrian refugees. So there may still be some bans in place. But bear in
:42:00. > :42:02.mind the number of Syrian refugees and refugees from around the world
:42:03. > :42:06.that President Obama took over his eight years. There were years when
:42:07. > :42:12.it was not even up to 50 Syrian refugees that were taken since the
:42:13. > :42:17.civil war has started. This is an ongoing American policy. 12,500
:42:18. > :42:26.Syrian refugees have come in the last year. Before that, it was a
:42:27. > :42:29.hundred and sometimes under 50. But they are reasonable numbers now,
:42:30. > :42:35.although not something America couldn't absorb. Donald Trump is
:42:36. > :42:39.discovering that being a president is different from being a business
:42:40. > :42:42.man. And Jeremy Corbyn has to learn the art of leadership, having been a
:42:43. > :42:48.backbench MP, and has struggled to do it, as we are about to discuss
:42:49. > :42:52.with article 50. With this, you have to dramatise the politics of this,
:42:53. > :42:56.and this is what he has done with that statement. Most controversial
:42:57. > :43:00.ever state visit now? I would imagine so. Even regardless of any
:43:01. > :43:06.opposition from the opposition to trump's physical presence in the
:43:07. > :43:11.streets, the presence of demonstrators will be an
:43:12. > :43:15.international new story. If trump's demands for the details of the visit
:43:16. > :43:18.are quite as extreme and as picky as some of the Sunday papers have
:43:19. > :43:22.suggested, that could also be the source of controversy. What do you
:43:23. > :43:27.have in mind? Isn't he anxious that only certain members of the Royal
:43:28. > :43:33.Family turn up? He doesn't want a one-on-one with Prince Charles. Who
:43:34. > :43:40.would, though! Some people may be sympathetic on that. It is the one
:43:41. > :43:44.subject where he is in line with British opinion. Playing golf in
:43:45. > :43:48.front of the Queen may be a higher priority. We have to be realistic.
:43:49. > :43:51.Given the other people from around the world that the Queen has played
:43:52. > :43:55.host to, like the Chinese president and Saudi kings and the like, we
:43:56. > :44:01.have had a lot worse come to visit than Donald Trump. Brexit - how
:44:02. > :44:05.serious our neighbour's problems on this? Very serious, but they often
:44:06. > :44:12.are with Europe. Labour were splits when we joined in the 70s, and still
:44:13. > :44:15.won general elections, in 1974 and 1975. There were all over the place
:44:16. > :44:18.in terms of the single currency. Blair said one thing one day and the
:44:19. > :44:25.opposite the next day. Brown did the same.
:44:26. > :44:34.Brown usually set the opposite of what Blair said! They won landslide
:44:35. > :44:37.because they have the political skills to put all of the pressure on
:44:38. > :44:42.the major government, even though their position on the single
:44:43. > :44:47.currency was the same as major's. It is about with Europe the art of
:44:48. > :44:50.leadership. You have to be a political conjuror, you have to
:44:51. > :44:55.dissemble authoritative leak when you lead a divided party over
:44:56. > :44:59.Europe, and Jeremy Corbyn to his personal credit cannot dissemble,
:45:00. > :45:04.but he's not an individual person on this. He's leading a split party in
:45:05. > :45:10.danger of falling apart, and you need the skills of a political
:45:11. > :45:13.conjurer. Clearly self-evidently he's not displaying it because we
:45:14. > :45:17.are talking about the chaotic split which will manifest itself in that
:45:18. > :45:22.vote on Article 50. Labour and the SNP and the Lib Dems too I would
:45:23. > :45:26.have thought will all put amendments down to the short Article 50 piece
:45:27. > :45:33.of legislation. Do they have any chance of succeeding? No substantial
:45:34. > :45:37.world is changing amendments. I don't think Theresa May has much to
:45:38. > :45:41.worry about actually. I think if anything the reason she's pushed the
:45:42. > :45:45.legal appeal is that it helps her to have a big chunk of the media and a
:45:46. > :45:51.big chunk of public opinion worrying that the popular will of last year
:45:52. > :45:54.is in danger of being overturned and so even if it was a completely
:45:55. > :45:59.hopeless legal appeal, it generated headlines for a week that as an
:46:00. > :46:03.incumbent Prime Minister trying to execute believe vote suits you
:46:04. > :46:07.politically. I think it is a much bigger problem for Labour, we've
:46:08. > :46:12.already seen some Shadow Cabinet issues in the previous week. You
:46:13. > :46:16.have got to remember it's not just a majority of Labour MPs that want to
:46:17. > :46:22.stay in the European Union, but a majority of Labour constituencies,
:46:23. > :46:26.and a majority of labour macro voters wanted to stay as well so we
:46:27. > :46:30.have three lines of division. One amendment that might get through if
:46:31. > :46:33.it was called, and it is in the hands of the Deputy speaker who will
:46:34. > :46:38.be chairing these debates, and that will be an amendment that said
:46:39. > :46:44.regardless of how the Europeans treat our citizens in Europe, all EU
:46:45. > :46:50.citizens here will be afforded full rights to remain. That might get
:46:51. > :46:56.through. It may indeed and lots of backbench MPs would backpack. We all
:46:57. > :47:01.know there will not be mass deportations, it is not legal, it
:47:02. > :47:05.won't happen, it is simply a negotiating tactic. I agree with
:47:06. > :47:09.those who say you shouldn't be using people as a negotiating tactic, but
:47:10. > :47:14.the reality as it is the EU leaders that are doing that because it's
:47:15. > :47:18.already been offered. The remain as should be attacking the EU
:47:19. > :47:23.governments for not offering that in return. Article 50 is the easy bit
:47:24. > :47:26.for her. I agree with other members of the panel that she will get it
:47:27. > :47:30.through and the court case almost helps her by getting an easy journey
:47:31. > :47:35.through Parliament, then it gets really difficult. All of this has
:47:36. > :47:41.been a preamble and once she begins that nightmarish negotiation, there
:47:42. > :47:47.will be opportunities for a smart opposition to make quite a lot of
:47:48. > :47:53.the turmoil to come. Whether Labour are capable of that, let's wait and
:47:54. > :47:57.see. The divisions in Labour are nightmarish for them but by no means
:47:58. > :48:02.unprecedented. Arguably it was much more complicated in the early 1970s
:48:03. > :48:10.when you had Titans on either side, big ex-cabinet ministers... Tony
:48:11. > :48:16.Benn... Michael Foot, they were all at it. The fundamental issue of in
:48:17. > :48:22.or out, and they won two elections, so you have got to be really clever.
:48:23. > :48:24.But also how money more Labour MPs will resign. We shall find out this
:48:25. > :48:26.week. The Daily Politics is back
:48:27. > :48:29.tomorrow at midday and all I'll be back here
:48:30. > :48:33.on BBC one next week. Remember - if it's Sunday,
:48:34. > :48:39.it's the Sunday Politics.