11/06/2017

:00:00. > :00:00.But stay with us for more drama as we can now go straight

:00:00. > :00:00.to the Sunday Politics with Andrew Neil who's

:00:00. > :00:13.We are indeed in the sunshine. Welcome from the heart of

:00:14. > :00:26.Westminster. Theresa May reappointing key figures

:00:27. > :00:31.to the Cabinet, sacking had to closest aides, Nick Timothy and

:00:32. > :00:35.Fiona Hill. After Conservative MPs demanded their removal in the

:00:36. > :00:37.Conservative failure to win an overall majority in the House of

:00:38. > :00:42.Commons. Over the next hour and a bit we'll continue to take stock on

:00:43. > :00:44.the remarkable events of the last 72 hours and try to work out where we

:00:45. > :00:48.go from here. First though, here's Adam Fleming

:00:49. > :00:51.with a reminder of the high octane I was going to say this

:00:52. > :00:57.chair is quite warm. Michael Fallon's bum

:00:58. > :01:04.was on this chair. Bums on seats, its election

:01:05. > :01:07.night at the BBC, hosted This is David Dimbleby's

:01:08. > :01:11.actual seat! Look, he's got four pencils,

:01:12. > :01:16.stopwatch and a calculator. And what we are saying

:01:17. > :01:23.is the Conservatives Note, they don't have an overall

:01:24. > :01:31.majority at this stage. 314 for the Conservatives,

:01:32. > :01:34.that's down 17. Luckily there were plenty

:01:35. > :01:43.of politicians who never are. What does this exit

:01:44. > :01:50.poll actually mean? Well, if it's accurate it means

:01:51. > :01:53.Theresa May has just presided over the greatest catastrophe that I can

:01:54. > :01:56.think of in the Conservative We haven't seen a seat change hands

:01:57. > :02:02.and we are hearing about possible Conservative gains in the Midlands

:02:03. > :02:05.and losses in London, People will write Ph.D.s about the

:02:06. > :02:10.2017 election Labour candidates were winning

:02:11. > :02:17.in unexpected places. Tories were losing in unexpected

:02:18. > :02:21.places, including eight members of the Government,

:02:22. > :02:22.like Treasury minister The Home Secretary, Amber Rudd,

:02:23. > :02:30.held on in Hastings...just. OK, the former Deputy Prime Minister

:02:31. > :02:33.and former leader of the Liberal Democrats,

:02:34. > :02:35.Nick Clegg, has been beaten I've always sought to stand

:02:36. > :02:41.by the liberal values I believe in, but I, of course, have encountered

:02:42. > :02:44.this evening something many people have encountered before tonight,

:02:45. > :02:49.and I suspect many people will encounter after tonight,

:02:50. > :02:51.which is - in politics you live by the sword, and you

:02:52. > :02:54.die by the sword. Lib Dem leader Tim Farron

:02:55. > :03:00.was narrowly re-elected in Cumbria, unlike the SNP's Westminster

:03:01. > :03:05.leader Angus Robertson, who lost his seat, former First

:03:06. > :03:07.Minister Alex Salmond defeated too. The Scottish National Party have

:03:08. > :03:11.lost many fine parliamentarians this evening, and that is a grievous blow

:03:12. > :03:16.to the SNP. But overall the results in Scotland

:03:17. > :03:20.show the SNP will have won a majority of the seats in this

:03:21. > :03:23.country and a majority of the vote. Paul Nuttall failed to get

:03:24. > :03:30.elected in Skegness So, the green room looking a bit

:03:31. > :03:37.ruined, a bit like Ukip I think we are doing

:03:38. > :03:41.better than the SNP. We deliberately didn't stand in some

:03:42. > :03:48.seats to try to give Brexit I think it's quite interesting

:03:49. > :03:53.the main leading Brexit candidates in this election

:03:54. > :03:56.are getting their seat back. Right, it's dawn in the real world

:03:57. > :04:17.and I found a pub that has been open What state are they going

:04:18. > :04:24.to be in, in there? And was it young people

:04:25. > :04:27.who had seen Corbyn, voted, and got the T-shirt who helped

:04:28. > :04:29.the Labour leader to Right, five past five

:04:30. > :04:34.in the morning, we are outside Jeremy Corbyn's house in Islington

:04:35. > :04:37.in north London. Surprisingly small press pack

:04:38. > :04:39.for the man who's destroyed Jeremy!

:04:40. > :04:43.Jeremy! If there is a message from

:04:44. > :04:49.tonight's result, it's this - the Prime Minister called

:04:50. > :04:52.the election because Well, the mandate she's got is lost

:04:53. > :04:59.Conservative seats, lost votes, I would have thought that's enough

:05:00. > :05:06.to go actually and make way for a government that will be truly

:05:07. > :05:09.representative of all Theresa May did the opposite,

:05:10. > :05:16.popping to the palace, What the country needs more

:05:17. > :05:24.than ever is certainty, and having secured the largest

:05:25. > :05:27.number of votes and the greatest number of seats in the general

:05:28. > :05:32.election, it is clear that only the Conservatives and Unionist Party

:05:33. > :05:36.have the legitimacy and ability to provide that certainty

:05:37. > :05:38.by commanding a majority As we do, we will continue to work

:05:39. > :05:47.with our friends and allies, in the Democratic Unionist Party

:05:48. > :05:52.in particular. 15 hours after election night

:05:53. > :06:24.started, it's all over. And joined by Tom Newton Dunn, Julia

:06:25. > :06:30.Hartley-Brewer and Steve Richards. Julia, why did it go so wrong for

:06:31. > :06:33.the Conservatives? You can't run a presidential campaign if you have a

:06:34. > :06:37.candidate with less than the charisma of this desk. If you're not

:06:38. > :06:40.going to put her out to debate, if she's not coming to the people and

:06:41. > :06:45.selling herself, which she studiously didn't do, you can't run

:06:46. > :06:48.that campaign. There was the possibility another leader could

:06:49. > :06:52.have walked that with 800 majority against Jeremy Corbyn. Another

:06:53. > :06:59.campaign, we will never know, could have delivered a majority of 30 or

:07:00. > :07:07.40, without the deal with the DUP. I'm not saying it was fundamentally

:07:08. > :07:12.wrong to call the election at this time, but it was the wrong candidate

:07:13. > :07:17.and the wrong campaign. The third election in a row that Labour has

:07:18. > :07:21.failed to win. It was still a substantial and historic achievement

:07:22. > :07:26.for Jeremy Corbyn. If you consider the context in which this election

:07:27. > :07:30.was called, Theresa May, on her honeymoon to die for, politically,

:07:31. > :07:36.with Labour voters split over Brexit, suddenly calling an election

:07:37. > :07:39.when most Labour MPs were not willing to cooperate with whatever

:07:40. > :07:43.campaign was being held by Labour, for them to do as well as they have

:07:44. > :07:47.done is an extraordinary achievement. They got no more seats

:07:48. > :07:52.than Gordon Brown in 2010, roughly the same. But the context couldn't

:07:53. > :07:56.have been more daunting, and to wipe out a majority of this figure, who

:07:57. > :08:03.six weeks ago was walking on water and appeared to have Brexit as part

:08:04. > :08:05.of her ammunition against the split Labour vote, remains astonishing.

:08:06. > :08:16.One of the errors she made and so many others she made and probably

:08:17. > :08:20.all of us, was to underestimate the potency of Corbyn and the relatively

:08:21. > :08:24.modest social Democrat manifesto. Doesn't it take stupidity bordering

:08:25. > :08:29.on genius to turn a 20 point lead at the start of the campaign into a

:08:30. > :08:33.hung parliament? It does and it did. That's what happened. I think the

:08:34. > :08:37.lead was soft, largely because Theresa May was unknown. We know her

:08:38. > :08:41.because we have been having lunch and interviews with her for years on

:08:42. > :08:46.end. The public didn't know her. They got to know her and they

:08:47. > :08:51.discovered she was the Maybot, which is the term that will stick after

:08:52. > :08:58.this campaign. I differ from my two colleagues here, it wasn't the

:08:59. > :09:01.amazing right of Corbyn, it was a complete failure to remember that

:09:02. > :09:04.people wanted a revolution when they voted for Brexit, and she came

:09:05. > :09:12.across as the party and candidate of continuity. As things stand, we are

:09:13. > :09:17.where we are. Where are we?! Where do we go from here? I was with

:09:18. > :09:21.College Green with you in the early hours of Friday morning and I didn't

:09:22. > :09:27.see anybody that said, see you back here in October. A second election?

:09:28. > :09:32.God forbid, nobody wants a second election, but I can't see the Tories

:09:33. > :09:37.being able to stay in power with the DUP and I'm personally very unhappy

:09:38. > :09:40.with a lot of DUP policies, their stance on gay rights, capital

:09:41. > :09:43.punishment, abortion rights, and there will be an awful lot of

:09:44. > :09:50.people, floating voters, who will recoil in horror at that, even on

:09:51. > :09:54.unofficial lines. I get the sense Jeremy Corbyn will be up for a

:09:55. > :09:58.second election, as quick as it comes. I'm sure he is, and if there

:09:59. > :10:01.was one company might well win it, which is why there won't be. All

:10:02. > :10:05.logic points to another election but I don't think there will be one,

:10:06. > :10:10.because I don't think any Conservative Prime Minister will

:10:11. > :10:14.feel strong and confident enough after the trauma of this. They would

:10:15. > :10:19.have to be 50 points ahead in the polls to take the risk. I think

:10:20. > :10:22.rather like between 74 and 79 we will have a frail and fragile House

:10:23. > :10:26.of Commons with a minority government for quite a long time,

:10:27. > :10:30.simply because whoever is Prime Minister will not have the

:10:31. > :10:34.confidence to call an election. So the Tories fear of a quick second

:10:35. > :10:38.election could well result in them going more leniently on Mrs May than

:10:39. > :10:45.they really want to. We have seen already, Miss Mrs May is still Prime

:10:46. > :10:50.Minister. That wouldn't have happened by now if they thought they

:10:51. > :10:55.could win a second snap election. I think they will stabilise. They are

:10:56. > :10:57.also desperate to get Brexit negotiations underway. That's

:10:58. > :11:01.another reason she is still there. She is the one who needs to pull the

:11:02. > :11:06.trigger. Most of the Tory party are aching to have the trigger pulled.

:11:07. > :11:09.When that is bold, when I have stabilised, and when Jeremy Corbyn

:11:10. > :11:15.is back the House of Commons, where remember he's not very good, I think

:11:16. > :11:20.they might your right. Lots more to talk about. Thank you for being with

:11:21. > :11:23.me in the open air, the Westminster penthouse, open to the world. I just

:11:24. > :11:26.need to find the cocktail bar. Although it is early.

:11:27. > :11:28.So, let's take a look at the election results

:11:29. > :11:32.Here's how the parties fared in the election on Thursday.

:11:33. > :11:34.And here's how they got on in the previous general

:11:35. > :11:38.As you can see, the Labour vote is up dramatically, by ten points.

:11:39. > :11:41.But the Conservative vote also rose quite significantly, by five points.

:11:42. > :11:44.The SNP and the Liberal Democrats both saw declines in their support.

:11:45. > :11:45.And Ukip's vote has almost completely collapsed,

:11:46. > :11:48.from 13% in 2015 to just 2% this time around.

:11:49. > :11:57.So the resurgence of two-party politics is one of the key

:11:58. > :12:06.The combined vote share of the two main parties is now 82%,

:12:07. > :12:11.the highest it's been since the election in 1970.

:12:12. > :12:16.And it's more if you exclude Northern Ireland.

:12:17. > :12:18.That's partly explained by the collapse of Ukip.

:12:19. > :12:22.According to one estimate, the Conservatives may have got 57%

:12:23. > :12:29.It's also thought that last year's EU referendum has helped to polarise

:12:30. > :12:32.support along the traditional Labour and Conservative lines.

:12:33. > :12:35.In polls carried out before the election,

:12:36. > :12:40.it was estimated that 50% of remain voters supported Labour and nearly

:12:41. > :12:43.two-thirds of leave voters supported the Conservatives.

:12:44. > :12:48.There's also speculation that a rise in the number of young voters may be

:12:49. > :12:51.behind the boost in Labour's support - but we don't yet have

:12:52. > :13:01.But it's notable that Labour did well in certain constituencies

:13:02. > :13:04.For example, it's thought that the large number of students

:13:05. > :13:09.in Canterbury helped Labour win the seat for the first time

:13:10. > :13:13.ever, with a 9% swing from the Conservatives.

:13:14. > :13:17.The two main parties have also seen changes in their number of seats.

:13:18. > :13:21.Labour lost six seats but gained 36, giving them a net gain of 30 seats.

:13:22. > :13:25.Most of those Labour gains were in England,

:13:26. > :13:28.where the party took 27 seats, mainly from the Conservatives.

:13:29. > :13:30.They also gained three seats in Wales and six

:13:31. > :13:38.As for the Conservatives, they lost a total of 33

:13:39. > :13:42.seats but also gained 20, giving them a net loss of 13 seats.

:13:43. > :13:48.Most of those 20 Conservative gains came in Scotland,

:13:49. > :13:54.where the party took 12 seats from the SNP.

:13:55. > :13:59.Meaning the Scottish Tories are allowing Mrs May to try to form a

:14:00. > :14:01.government this week! Who would have thought!

:14:02. > :14:02.In England, the Conservatives won

:14:03. > :14:06.Joining me now from Glasgow is the brains behind Thursday

:14:07. > :14:08.night's astoundingly accurate exit poll, the polling expert

:14:09. > :14:26.And John, the Tories saw a 5-point rise in the share of the votes to

:14:27. > :14:33.42%, very high by recent historical standards, but still lost over a

:14:34. > :14:37.dozen seats, why? Under our first past the post electoral system, the

:14:38. > :14:43.share of the vote you get is almost irrelevant. What is crucial is how

:14:44. > :14:47.you do relative to your opponents. In particular so far as Conservative

:14:48. > :14:55.and Labour are concerned, what determines the fate is the gap

:14:56. > :14:59.between them. In the 2015 election, the Conservatives had a 7-point

:15:00. > :15:04.lead, that only got them a majority of 12, and somebody should have said

:15:05. > :15:07.to the Prime Minister before she pulled the trigger, you do realise

:15:08. > :15:11.you have to be a long way ahead of the Labour Party in order to

:15:12. > :15:16.increase your majority. The opinion polls say you are at that point now

:15:17. > :15:23.but if they fall you are in trouble. In the end of the Conservative lead

:15:24. > :15:28.is 2.5 points, which is not enough to secure a majority given that

:15:29. > :15:33.Northern Ireland is out of the frame, Scotland still has a majority

:15:34. > :15:41.of third party MPs, and there are still Liberal Democrats and greens.

:15:42. > :15:49.This now looks like a two party race once again. We have still got much

:15:50. > :15:54.more in the House of Commons than in 1970 which makes a hung parliament

:15:55. > :15:59.much more likely. Meanwhile there weren't that many marginal seats. It

:16:00. > :16:05.is the relative standing of the parties that's crucial. And how do

:16:06. > :16:11.we explain the 10% rise in Labour's share of the vote? There's a lot of

:16:12. > :16:17.anecdotal evidence of a youth Surge, and I'd like to know if we can nail

:16:18. > :16:23.that down, but also the work of the swings too. Some green voters moved

:16:24. > :16:29.into Labour, some Liberal Democrats, even perhaps some Ukip voters moved

:16:30. > :16:33.into Labour, what do we know? I think we can pick up three crucial

:16:34. > :16:38.patterns. The first is a lot of people who at the beginning of the

:16:39. > :16:43.campaign said are usually vote Labour but cannot imagine doing so

:16:44. > :16:46.under Jeremy Corbyn, he so hopeless. Because of his relatively strong

:16:47. > :16:54.performance they came back into the fold so by the time we got to

:16:55. > :16:59.polling day there was many 2015 voters who said they would vote

:17:00. > :17:03.Labour again. That was the crucial point, getting the faithful back on

:17:04. > :17:09.board. It is certainly clear there was a substantial swing to young

:17:10. > :17:14.voters during the campaign. Labour started off well in that group, the

:17:15. > :17:19.opinion polls had it around 65% by the time the election came. We don't

:17:20. > :17:24.know exactly the turnout amongst young people, but certainly the

:17:25. > :17:28.pattern of the results suggests the turnout was going up more in places

:17:29. > :17:32.where there were young people so probably somewhat more of them did

:17:33. > :17:37.turn out to vote. The third crucial patent is that this was an election

:17:38. > :17:43.which to some degree voters did polarise around the issue of the

:17:44. > :17:55.shape of Brexit, weather you are a Remain or Leave voter. Labour's

:17:56. > :17:58.progress during the campaign was disproportionately amongst Remain

:17:59. > :18:04.voters so although the parties were not thought to be that far apart on

:18:05. > :18:07.the shape of Brexit, they seem to be sufficiently far apart that Labour

:18:08. > :18:15.was more attractive for those less keen on the kind of Brexit Theresa

:18:16. > :18:25.May had in mind. John Curtice, thank you as always. We are now going to

:18:26. > :18:33.Salford. Graham Brady, you think Mrs May should soldier on, why? There's

:18:34. > :18:41.no other party in a position to form a government. Clearly these aren't

:18:42. > :18:44.the circumstances that either the Prime Minister nor I nor my

:18:45. > :18:47.colleagues would want to be dealing with at the moment but this is what

:18:48. > :18:54.we are presented with and it's our duty to make the best of it and try

:18:55. > :18:59.to offer government as resilient as it can be an quite difficult times.

:19:00. > :19:03.But is she ever going to be more than a caretaker leader now? I think

:19:04. > :19:08.one of the odd things about the experience of the last 12 months is

:19:09. > :19:12.Theresa May performed well as Prime Minister and the public rather liked

:19:13. > :19:15.her as Prime Minister. I think few people would say the campaign

:19:16. > :19:21.succeeded in projecting her qualities as strongly as it could

:19:22. > :19:25.to government, albeit in difficult to government, albeit in difficult

:19:26. > :19:30.circumstances and dependent on support from other parties, I think

:19:31. > :19:36.we will see people once again seeing the steady, calm, thoughtful Theresa

:19:37. > :19:41.May as Prime Minister. Do you fear a leadership election might lead to a

:19:42. > :19:46.second general election, and that prospect terrifies you, doesn't it?

:19:47. > :19:51.I'm not sitting here terrified, but I think there is zero appetite

:19:52. > :19:55.amongst the public for another general election at the moment, and

:19:56. > :20:00.I don't detect any great appetite amongst my colleagues for presenting

:20:01. > :20:05.the public with a massive additional dose of uncertainty by getting

:20:06. > :20:09.involved in a rather self-indulgent Conservative Party internal election

:20:10. > :20:16.campaign. That's because they are frightened they might lose, that's

:20:17. > :20:21.why they don't want another one. I think most of us are motivated by a

:20:22. > :20:25.belief in the national interest and we are responsible people who want

:20:26. > :20:28.to try to offer that responsible, steady government, especially at

:20:29. > :20:33.this point as we know it's just a matter of days until those important

:20:34. > :20:37.negotiations on leaving the European Union begins. It's a time when we

:20:38. > :20:43.need experience and responsible people in Government, and I think

:20:44. > :20:47.it's our duty to try to offer that. Many Tories have said to me that Mrs

:20:48. > :20:51.May must never be allowed to leave your party into another general

:20:52. > :20:55.election, do you agree with that? No, these are judgments that will be

:20:56. > :21:00.made in the fullness of time by the Prime Minister and by colleagues, as

:21:01. > :21:04.is always the case with any Prime Minister and leader of the party,

:21:05. > :21:07.but at the moment we are resolutely focused on trying to make sure the

:21:08. > :21:12.country can have the responsible study government that it really

:21:13. > :21:22.needs at this point, and that should be our focus too. In what way should

:21:23. > :21:26.Mrs May change? I think there are all sorts of lessons we can pick up

:21:27. > :21:31.from the campaign and the reaction to it, even from the thing that

:21:32. > :21:36.surprised most of us, the way in which Jeremy Corbyn, in spite of all

:21:37. > :21:41.of his manifest failings, in particular his extreme political

:21:42. > :21:48.views, was able to present himself in a rather avuncular way. I didn't

:21:49. > :21:53.ask about Mr Corbyn. I'm saying I think there are some lessons there,

:21:54. > :21:56.in terms of relaxing little bit into communicating with the electorate.

:21:57. > :22:04.It is something she does very well in person, increasingly so since she

:22:05. > :22:08.became Prime Minister. That's not the experience of the campaign, the

:22:09. > :22:14.more people saw her the more they didn't like the colour of her gym.

:22:15. > :22:18.It didn't communicating the campaign, but also I think we need

:22:19. > :22:22.to see a much more open and inclusive approach within

:22:23. > :22:28.government, within Parliament as well. That's not just a kind of

:22:29. > :22:34.desirable outcome, which I think always would have been desirable and

:22:35. > :22:38.I've had this conversation with previous prime ministers as well.

:22:39. > :22:43.It's a necessity in the circumstances, trying to make a hung

:22:44. > :22:48.parliament and minority government work really requires a much more

:22:49. > :22:53.inclusive approach. You are being brought into the decision taking

:22:54. > :22:58.process on the deal being done with the DUP? I have said to the Prime

:22:59. > :23:03.Minister I think it is important she speaks to colleagues as soon as

:23:04. > :23:11.possible. I'm hoping to bring it forward to tomorrow so she can

:23:12. > :23:16.talk... But are you being involved in this more inclusive process? I am

:23:17. > :23:20.not on a negotiating team but I saw the Prime Minister very early after

:23:21. > :23:24.the election had taken place, I went to London on Friday afternoon and

:23:25. > :23:29.met with her and we had a discussion about all sorts of things that need

:23:30. > :23:33.to be addressed over the coming days and weeks. When Mrs May spoke in

:23:34. > :23:38.Downing Street after she'd gone to see the Queen, it was another

:23:39. > :23:44.robotic performance. It didn't even express any regrets for the Tories

:23:45. > :23:48.that had lost. You had to into being to get her to make a second

:23:49. > :23:55.statement, didn't you? No, she was already going to give the interview

:23:56. > :23:59.she gave. You urged her to do so. She was already scheduled to give

:24:00. > :24:03.the interview. I happen to see her in between the statement and

:24:04. > :24:08.interview, and I was keen to press home that in the past Conservative

:24:09. > :24:11.Party that has been very poor in its communications with colleagues who

:24:12. > :24:16.have lost their seats in the general election, that is something none of

:24:17. > :24:20.my colleagues likes to see so I certainly did say that I think it's

:24:21. > :24:29.important we do better this time. What bits of the manifesto will you

:24:30. > :24:33.now have to jumk for the Queen 's speech? That will be an interesting

:24:34. > :24:40.process to witness. I don't think it will just be the Queen 's speech, it

:24:41. > :24:44.will be the whole experience of government. There's no point in

:24:45. > :24:51.sailing ahead with items that were in the manifesto which we won't get

:24:52. > :24:58.through Parliament so I think we will have to work very carefully. No

:24:59. > :25:06.doubt we will slim down the Queen's speech. So tell me, which bits will

:25:07. > :25:12.you have to junk? Back to the triple lock on pensioners and no grammar

:25:13. > :25:15.schools? How about that? I would be upset if we couldn't make any

:25:16. > :25:23.progress on allowing people to have a choice of grammar schools if they

:25:24. > :25:28.wanted. Are you hoping they will drop it? If we cannot get things

:25:29. > :25:32.through Parliament, we cannot do them so I certainly would suggest

:25:33. > :25:36.that we can look for instance at a rather modest sort of pilots,

:25:37. > :25:41.opening some state grammar schools in inner urban areas, especially

:25:42. > :25:44.where education at the moment is not offering great opportunities to

:25:45. > :25:51.people of lower income backgrounds. I think that is something that could

:25:52. > :25:54.command quite broad support. I have heard from friends on the Labour

:25:55. > :25:59.ventures quietly that they would like that approach to be taken. We

:26:00. > :26:04.will certainly have to trim our policies carefully according to what

:26:05. > :26:11.we think Parliament will support. Graham Brady in Salford, thank you.

:26:12. > :26:15.Let's go to Nottingham where I am joined by Anna Soubry. In the early

:26:16. > :26:21.hours of Thursday morning you called on Theresa May to consider her

:26:22. > :26:26.position. Is that still your view? Yes, she obviously has considered

:26:27. > :26:31.her position and she is set to go in due course, but I very much agree

:26:32. > :26:36.with Graham, we don't want her to go now. We want a period of stability

:26:37. > :26:40.and she has got to reach out and form a consensus and she has got to

:26:41. > :26:46.form a consensus in particular on Brexit. She has now got to make sure

:26:47. > :26:51.she understands that the British people have rejected a hard Brexit.

:26:52. > :26:55.We are leaving the EU, I don't think there's any change there but we are

:26:56. > :26:59.not going to be leaving the EU in some irresponsible weights that will

:27:00. > :27:02.damage future generations in our country and there's a big lesson to

:27:03. > :27:07.be learned as you've already identified in your programme, about

:27:08. > :27:11.younger people and the message they have sent out in this election. I

:27:12. > :27:16.will come onto Brexit in the moment, but you have said she is set to go

:27:17. > :27:24.in due course, what does that mean? I don't know. After the summer,

:27:25. > :27:32.before the end of the year? I would have thought so. She is flawed,

:27:33. > :27:36.she's in a desperate situation. Her position is untenable and I think

:27:37. > :27:41.she knows that and she is doing the right thing, which is she's got rid

:27:42. > :27:44.of these special advisers, she's brought in Gavin Barwell, and she's

:27:45. > :27:48.listening to people from all parts of not just the party but the

:27:49. > :27:53.country. She has got to reach out more and broaden the base within her

:27:54. > :27:58.Cabinet, and she's got to include people from all parts of my party as

:27:59. > :28:04.well as all points of view across Parliament. So what impact in your

:28:05. > :28:10.view will, as you describe it, Mrs May's much more weakened position,

:28:11. > :28:16.what impact will that have on her current Brexit stance? Will she have

:28:17. > :28:22.to change it and water it down? Yes, absolutely. The country did not vote

:28:23. > :28:26.for a hard Brexit. This is based on my experience of having knocked on

:28:27. > :28:31.the literally thousands of dollars, actually since February. I have

:28:32. > :28:40.listened to a lot of people, and the idea of a hard Brexit, people didn't

:28:41. > :28:44.like that. It's one of the reasons we haven't won this election. They

:28:45. > :28:48.accept we are leaving, I accept it, but we want to get the best deal and

:28:49. > :28:54.she must not turn her back on British business as I'm afraid she

:28:55. > :28:58.has. She's got to listen to British business and Philip Hammond, she's

:28:59. > :29:02.got to listen to Greg Clark. Wise owls who know what British business

:29:03. > :29:07.once and they want that single market and they also wanted proper

:29:08. > :29:11.immigration policy that recognises we need immigrants and free movement

:29:12. > :29:16.in order for British business to continue to flourish.

:29:17. > :29:24.She has to at least listen to these things, and she hasn't in the past.

:29:25. > :29:28.Is that what Ruth Davidson, leader of the Scottish Conservatives, about

:29:29. > :29:34.the only Conservative to emerge with credit on Thursday, is that what she

:29:35. > :29:38.means? We should remain members of the single market, remain in the

:29:39. > :29:42.customs union and put the economy before immigration. Is that what you

:29:43. > :29:47.are talking about? Absolutely. And I always have. And in my literature I

:29:48. > :29:51.made it very clear I would continue to make the case for the single

:29:52. > :29:57.market and positive benefits of immigration. Although my majority

:29:58. > :30:02.was reduced, I put on 1800 more votes. It's not about me, obviously,

:30:03. > :30:06.it's about me being a Conservative, but I made my position clear and I

:30:07. > :30:10.have not faulted on that. Turning our back on the customs union in

:30:11. > :30:15.particular is the stuff of madness. The single market sees off the

:30:16. > :30:18.Nationalists and their desire for a second referendum, although the

:30:19. > :30:22.mighty Ruth Davidson is already done that with her remarkable result in

:30:23. > :30:27.Scotland, but it would also solve the problem with Ireland. Don't you

:30:28. > :30:33.risk reopening all those Tory divisions over Europe on this? I

:30:34. > :30:38.haven't. You have held these views for a long time. There are 20 of

:30:39. > :30:45.other, probably more Tories, who want what you call a hard Brexit. --

:30:46. > :30:50.plenty of other. It's what the people want. But you don't have a

:30:51. > :30:53.majority. At this election the people have spoken and they have

:30:54. > :30:58.rejected the hard Brexit. I think we can all agree on that. That doesn't

:30:59. > :31:03.mean to say we are not leaving the EU, we will leave the EU, and I

:31:04. > :31:08.believe even people who voted to remain accept we are leaving. I

:31:09. > :31:14.found very few angry Remainers on the doorsteps. People accept the

:31:15. > :31:18.result, but they do not want a hard Brexit. That's the message coming

:31:19. > :31:23.out from this and I hope Theresa May gets that. If she does, then she has

:31:24. > :31:29.to build the con census. There's nothing to stop her working with

:31:30. > :31:33.sensible people in the Labour Party, who also accept the referendum

:31:34. > :31:37.result, no we will be leaving the EU, and know we have to get the best

:31:38. > :31:42.deal, and we can't close our minds on the single market and Customs

:31:43. > :31:46.union. What are the bits of the Tory manifesto you will now have to drop

:31:47. > :31:50.to keep your new bedfellows happy in the DUP? I don't think we have

:31:51. > :31:56.reached a deal yet with the DUP. But that is the aim. Apparently it's the

:31:57. > :32:02.aim. I will tell you now, Andrew, you probably know far more than I

:32:03. > :32:09.do. I get on well with a number of members of the DUP. I don't like a

:32:10. > :32:13.lot of their policies on abortion, gay and lesbian issues, I completely

:32:14. > :32:18.disagree with them, but if we can put those issues aside and put the

:32:19. > :32:25.focus on making a stable government and putting the national interest

:32:26. > :32:32.first, we might well make strides forward. Many people have been

:32:33. > :32:38.talking about public services and public sector pay, but we have to do

:32:39. > :32:42.recognise that at the same time we are going into choppy economic

:32:43. > :32:47.waters, and that's why I think it's so important Theresa May listens to

:32:48. > :32:51.Philip Hammond and puts him much more at the core and front of this

:32:52. > :32:54.government. It's the economy that matters more than anything else.

:32:55. > :32:59.That's one of the spectacular failings of the campaign. The issue

:33:00. > :33:04.that was hardly mentioned during the campaign. Never mentioned it. Anna

:33:05. > :33:08.Soubry, we will leave it there. After Theresa May had been to see

:33:09. > :33:11.the Queen at Buckingham Palace on Friday she made a brief statement on

:33:12. > :33:15.Friday. We can remind ourselves what she said.

:33:16. > :33:17.We will continue to work with our friends and allies,

:33:18. > :33:19.in the Democratic Unionist Party in particular.

:33:20. > :33:22.Our two parties have enjoyed a strong relationship over many

:33:23. > :33:24.years, and this gives me the confidence to believe

:33:25. > :33:26.that we will be able to work together in the interests

:33:27. > :33:30.This will allow us to come together as a country

:33:31. > :33:35.and channel our energies towards a successful

:33:36. > :33:39.Brexit deal that works for everyone in this country.

:33:40. > :33:43.Securing a new partnership with the EU that guarantees our

:33:44. > :33:48.That's what people voted for last June, that's what we will deliver.

:33:49. > :34:03.I've been joined by the Conservative MP Dominic Raab -

:34:04. > :34:05.a former government minister who's been tipped for a return in Theresa

:34:06. > :34:14.We shall see. Welcome to the programme. Her two most senior

:34:15. > :34:19.advisers have fallen on their swords. Most of the Cabinet has gone

:34:20. > :34:24.to ground since the result. Could Theresa May be any more isolated? I

:34:25. > :34:26.don't think that's true. You have three Cabinet ministers doing

:34:27. > :34:30.television this morning. We are in the middle of a reshuffle, so you

:34:31. > :34:33.wouldn't expect them all to be out on the airwaves, and we also in the

:34:34. > :34:38.business of hammering out the detail on the supply and confidence

:34:39. > :34:43.arrangement with the DUP. Where are we on that? On the question of Chief

:34:44. > :34:48.of staff, a new appointment has been made, Gavin Barwell, I know him

:34:49. > :34:51.well, a smart policy guide and also very sensitive on the political

:34:52. > :34:57.radar and that shows we are moving forward. It was forced on her. I

:34:58. > :35:04.think they did the honourable thing. The two aids that fell on their

:35:05. > :35:08.sword? Yes. The key point is, looking forward, which we have to

:35:09. > :35:11.do, we had the outcome of the election and the people have spoken

:35:12. > :35:18.and we have to make the best of it. Gavin Barwell is an important

:35:19. > :35:21.appointment. Conservative MPs across-the-board know, respect and

:35:22. > :35:25.trust him. Nobody in the country has heard of him, but maybe that doesn't

:35:26. > :35:30.matter. How many had heard of Nick Timothy and Fiona Hill before they

:35:31. > :35:34.were appointed? They do now. Do you agree with Anna Soubry that Theresa

:35:35. > :35:40.May is no more than a caretaker Prime Minister now? I don't.

:35:41. > :35:45.Emotions are way up. But we still won the most votes and most seats.

:35:46. > :35:50.My reading from talking to MPs across-the-board is the overwhelming

:35:51. > :35:53.majority want to see Theresa May continue in office. As a matter of

:35:54. > :35:57.necessity, the people have spoken, and we have to respect what the

:35:58. > :36:01.people have decided, so we will do this supply and confidence

:36:02. > :36:04.arrangement with the DUP. There are strong areas of overlap but we don't

:36:05. > :36:07.agree on everything. The key thing is to give the country certainty and

:36:08. > :36:11.direction moving forward. That's the only viable option and people are

:36:12. > :36:15.rallying behind that. Not all. George Osborne said this morning on

:36:16. > :36:25.the BBC that Mrs May was a dead woman walking. He has made the

:36:26. > :36:28.transition from Conservative MP to mischievous journalist with ease.

:36:29. > :36:32.Most MPs when they listen to that will think it's disloyal,

:36:33. > :36:35.unprofessional and frankly pretty self-indulgent. In reality I think

:36:36. > :36:42.it will shore up support among a lot of MPs for Theresa May. What went

:36:43. > :36:45.wrong? I'm not going to candy coat, sugar-coat the result here. We did

:36:46. > :36:54.far worse than expected and we need to figure out the lessons to learn.

:36:55. > :36:58.I know it went wrong, but why? There isn't anyone thing. You have to take

:36:59. > :37:01.time to learn the lessons. We need to show some humility about the

:37:02. > :37:05.result. Nick Timothy has written a column that touches on some of the

:37:06. > :37:08.issues from his perspective. To be honest with you, I'm focused now, I

:37:09. > :37:13.missed all the drama and disappointment of not getting the

:37:14. > :37:17.result we wanted, focus on the facts. We got 56 more seats than the

:37:18. > :37:20.Labour Party and we are the only ones who can put together a

:37:21. > :37:22.legitimate parliament that can also be affected, passing a judgment and

:37:23. > :37:26.legitimate parliament that can also pass legislation, however tricky it

:37:27. > :37:31.may be. That remains to be seen, you might not be able to do that. We are

:37:32. > :37:35.the only ones, with the DUP, who could form a viable and effective

:37:36. > :37:41.government that would reflect legitimately the outcome of the

:37:42. > :37:43.election and we will focus 100% on that. Let's do that. Mrs May

:37:44. > :37:48.promised strength and stability. We now have a hung parliament and she

:37:49. > :37:51.is dependent on the DUP for the slimmest of majorities. There is

:37:52. > :37:57.nothing strong and stable about that. I have said to you, I will not

:37:58. > :38:02.tell you this result is the one we wanted. We are disappointed. It's

:38:03. > :38:06.not strong and stable. It can still be effective. It's also the only

:38:07. > :38:10.outcome that can respect and be legitimate of the outcome of the

:38:11. > :38:14.election. At the end of the day, we had campaigning, we can differ on

:38:15. > :38:16.the opinions, but the facts and parliamentary arithmetic is there.

:38:17. > :38:18.The only way we can have an effective government of any time

:38:19. > :38:22.that Del Paso budget is the Conservatives with the support of

:38:23. > :38:27.the DUP. To do that you'll have to make compromises you would not have

:38:28. > :38:30.to do make if you had won a substantial majority. What part of

:38:31. > :38:35.the manifesto will have to go to get a budget and a confidence motion

:38:36. > :38:39.through? 48 hours after the election I can't answer that definitively.

:38:40. > :38:43.What we do have to do, every MP, whatever part of the country they

:38:44. > :38:48.were elected, has to deliver as best can be manifesto commitments. At the

:38:49. > :38:51.same time, that's what the country expects. At the same time we had

:38:52. > :38:55.forced on us the need to be flexible. The people didn't vote for

:38:56. > :38:59.your manifesto in the end. Something has to go. The triple lock for

:39:00. > :39:03.pensioners that you were going to change, the DUP is in favour of the

:39:04. > :39:09.triple lock. Does that bit of the manifesto go? You can ask me any

:39:10. > :39:14.aspect of the manifesto, we'll know more answers the detail next week.

:39:15. > :39:19.You were on our programmes more than any Cabinet minister. You will be

:39:20. > :39:25.drafted back in. You should know. I don't bet too much money on the

:39:26. > :39:28.tittle tattle in the media. We have the outline of the supply and

:39:29. > :39:32.confidence arrangement with the DUP. We are hammering out the details.

:39:33. > :39:38.Next week we will publish the details. What about social care? You

:39:39. > :39:42.asking me about different points in a manifesto but you know I can't

:39:43. > :39:46.answer that question until... I want to deliver as much of the manifesto

:39:47. > :39:51.as possible. You don't have a mandate to do that. That's because

:39:52. > :39:59.we've got... The Queen's speech is only a week away, a week tomorrow.

:40:00. > :40:02.You are trying to work out what parts, Labour lost, but you didn't

:40:03. > :40:06.win, and I'm trying to work out how you just said we will have to

:40:07. > :40:10.comprise and make changes. It's legitimate to ask which parts... I'm

:40:11. > :40:13.explaining I don't have the answers on the detail because until we have

:40:14. > :40:18.formed the supply and confidence arrangement with the DUP, we will

:40:19. > :40:21.not have those details. My starting point is that we deliver as much of

:40:22. > :40:24.the manifesto as we conceivably can. That's what the country expects

:40:25. > :40:28.because that's what they are elected us to do. They have given us their

:40:29. > :40:32.verdict, we need to respect the outcome of the election and we will

:40:33. > :40:35.not do it in the same way will as if we had a stonking majority,

:40:36. > :40:41.obviously. The result has given a kind of new spring in the step of

:40:42. > :40:47.politicians who wanted to remain in the European Union. What do you

:40:48. > :40:50.make, and we heard Anna Soubry, and many others have said it as well,

:40:51. > :40:56.that you need to reconsider your Brexit stands, and in their language

:40:57. > :41:00.community soften your Brexit stands. Whether you are a Scottish, Welsh or

:41:01. > :41:03.English MP, elected to Parliament behind me on the basis of a

:41:04. > :41:09.manifesto that sets out in great detail, a 75 page white Paper, the

:41:10. > :41:13.approach to Brexit. All this talk of hard Brexit, our ambition is to get

:41:14. > :41:18.the best possible deal we can with our EU partners. Do you change your

:41:19. > :41:22.stands because you didn't get a majority for your Brexit position.

:41:23. > :41:26.Do you follow the advice of Ruth Davidson, who talked of an open

:41:27. > :41:31.Brexit, framing a new Brexit strategy? Hard and soft Brexit, I

:41:32. > :41:37.don't know exactly what Ruth means by that. But she did a great job in

:41:38. > :41:41.Scotland. But every MP was elected on our manifesto. We will deliver

:41:42. > :41:45.the plans of that manifesto as best we can, including and especially on

:41:46. > :41:51.Brexit. Just a point of fact, obviously be Conservative number of

:41:52. > :41:56.votes went up, Labour effectively... The vote share went up, but we lost

:41:57. > :42:00.seats, but we are 56 seats ahead of the Labour Party. The Labour Party

:42:01. > :42:04.effectively endorsed the leave the EU strategy we set out and they

:42:05. > :42:11.didn't offer a alternative. So no change on the Brexit strategy? And

:42:12. > :42:15.the anti-Brexit parties, the SNP and Lib Dem, both suffered a fall in

:42:16. > :42:19.their vote share. The country has said they want us to make a success

:42:20. > :42:25.of Brexit. So no change? The plans in the White Paper set out are the

:42:26. > :42:29.right ones and the voters expect us to deliver on the manifesto we ran

:42:30. > :42:34.on, whether you are a Scottish, English or Welsh MP. I can hear your

:42:35. > :42:36.helicopter arriving to whisk you off to the wry ministerial meeting. Let

:42:37. > :42:37.us know to the wry ministerial meeting. Let

:42:38. > :42:46.u? know what Good morning and welcome

:42:47. > :42:47.to Sunday Politics Scotland. With nine days to go before

:42:48. > :42:52.Brexit negotiations begin, I'll be asking Scottish Government

:42:53. > :42:55.minister Mike Russell how a diminished SNP presence

:42:56. > :42:57.at Westminster plans And all smiles for the Tories here,

:42:58. > :43:03.but why the reluctance Nothing is certain in life,

:43:04. > :43:18.and especially not in the life When this election was called,

:43:19. > :43:26.many commentators were confidently predicting that the Conservatives

:43:27. > :43:28.would increase their majority - Now, they're rushing to explain

:43:29. > :43:32.why they got it wrong - and why Theresa May got

:43:33. > :43:34.it VERY wrong. What do the results mean

:43:35. > :43:42.for Scotland's parties though - They have a lot to celebrate but on

:43:43. > :43:54.Friday morning there was a sombre tone. The SNP was happy about

:43:55. > :44:02.sending the most Scottish MPs to Westminster but reflecting on the

:44:03. > :44:06.loss of some big beasts. I want to pay tribute to Angus Robertson. I

:44:07. > :44:18.also want to make particular mention of Alex Salmond. Where does this

:44:19. > :44:27.leave our second independence referendum? Nicola Sturgeon said,

:44:28. > :44:33.watch this space. I will reflect on the result. Would it be wise to roll

:44:34. > :44:40.back from the Independence Lane and listen to a different message from

:44:41. > :44:44.voters? The SNP has had a track record of being a very competent

:44:45. > :44:53.government and being able to manage policy well. Part of their problem

:44:54. > :44:59.is they've been challenged on health care and education and have not been

:45:00. > :45:06.delivering with the same degree of competence that they were

:45:07. > :45:10.previously. It's very clear, the evidence shows that people support

:45:11. > :45:15.the SNP because of the way they govern, not independence. Meanwhile,

:45:16. > :45:20.the Scottish Conservatives chose the shadow of Stirling Castle to

:45:21. > :45:35.introduce their MPs. Ruth Davidson has been cast as green maker. Now,

:45:36. > :45:42.she must look on as the distinctly gay-unfriendly again to work with

:45:43. > :45:47.the Tories. I sort of categoric reassurance there would be no

:45:48. > :45:53.rollback of rights in the UK. We are the party of equal marriage. We

:45:54. > :45:56.brought it forward in England and Wales. I wanted reassurances that we

:45:57. > :46:04.would use our influence to advance those rates in Northern Ireland. The

:46:05. > :46:09.speed with which Ruth Davidson moves could signal a shift in power. The

:46:10. > :46:17.fact that came out as a public matter so quickly goes to show many

:46:18. > :46:25.conservatives will be looking to assert themselves in Westminster

:46:26. > :46:33.matters. She's already a fairly well-known figure across the UK and

:46:34. > :46:37.I think that will only increase. Rutherglen town hall and Kezia

:46:38. > :46:47.Dugdale was celebrating worth her six new MPs. But who was responsible

:46:48. > :46:50.for this? Kezia Dugdale or her maligned boss, Jeremy Corbyn?

:46:51. > :46:56.They've not always been in step and she did not want him to be leader.

:46:57. > :47:01.I've done nothing but been behind Jeremy Corbyn all through this

:47:02. > :47:06.campaign. There is a combined message of being a prounion party,

:47:07. > :47:13.talking up the benefits of the United Kingdom but also showing how

:47:14. > :47:18.we can do different. It may not be a case of Kezia Dugdale tucking into

:47:19. > :47:24.humble pie. They may have concocted a successful formula. Between the

:47:25. > :47:30.two of them they made a perfect pairing. On the question of

:47:31. > :47:33.independence, it benefited them. She was saying they will not have

:47:34. > :47:45.another, but in London he was saying, and sometimes in Scotland,

:47:46. > :47:53.the door is open. The message got over, they were looking for the

:47:54. > :48:06.final nudge. The Scottish Liberal Democrats have jumped from one MP3

:48:07. > :48:10.format. They want a second referendum on Brexit. But under

:48:11. > :48:16.Charles Kennedy they had dozens more MPs across the UK saw how much

:48:17. > :48:19.difference can they make? We've quadrupled our representation from

:48:20. > :48:23.Scotland in Westminster. We are back on track and making progress and

:48:24. > :48:29.people were very clear, they want are a positive agenda on mental

:48:30. > :48:32.health. They want to say no to another divisive independence

:48:33. > :48:36.referendum and the right to reject a bad deal on Brexit. They are the

:48:37. > :48:42.only party calling for a second referendum on the Brexit deal. I

:48:43. > :48:46.wonder why that did not play better? I don't think it played better

:48:47. > :48:54.because I think most parties have said, this is a done deal, let's

:48:55. > :48:58.make the most of it. At a time when you've got continuing political

:48:59. > :49:03.flux, we don't know where politics will be this time next week never

:49:04. > :49:08.mind next year. It is difficult for any party to say we should have

:49:09. > :49:09.another referendum in Scotland, particularly where they've not been

:49:10. > :49:14.getting a good press. Alison Rowat finishing that

:49:15. > :49:16.report by John McManus. Well, joining me from Colintraive

:49:17. > :49:19.is the man charged with looking after Scotland's Brexit

:49:20. > :49:31.negotiations, Mike Russell. Given there is now a minority

:49:32. > :49:38.government, do you see a role for the SNP at Westminster in trying to

:49:39. > :49:46.have some influence over a softer Brexit than we saw a few days ago?

:49:47. > :49:50.It is important that the entire Brexit policy is scrapped and they

:49:51. > :49:55.start again. The first part of that is to persuade Theresa May that

:49:56. > :50:00.clinging to Downing Street is not a sensible idea. She is presided over

:50:01. > :50:05.chaos over the last year. This election shows people don't trust

:50:06. > :50:09.her. I don't think her position is tenable. There needs to be a look at

:50:10. > :50:13.everything and that includes the Brexit policy. There a committee

:50:14. > :50:20.established which is not dependent on there being a Tory government. It

:50:21. > :50:24.needs to meet urgently. It has not met since February. That needs to

:50:25. > :50:33.look at the way that Brexit goes forward. First, we need some

:50:34. > :50:39.stability. People everywhere are crying out for stability and they've

:50:40. > :50:42.had nothing but chaos and instability. It is continuing this

:50:43. > :50:47.weekend with the announcement that there was a deal with the DUP and

:50:48. > :50:54.there was not ideal. This is just nonsense. You produced a detailed

:50:55. > :51:00.plan for a Scottish form of Brexit which you claim was dismissed by the

:51:01. > :51:06.previous government and David Davis in particular. Will you be

:51:07. > :51:18.contacting the new government to put that back on the table? We believe

:51:19. > :51:23.it is still on the table. It started with the premise that the whole of

:51:24. > :51:29.the UK should start in the single market. In Scotland, Ruth Davidson

:51:30. > :51:41.and her Tories voted against that on every occasion. Her manifesto was

:51:42. > :51:46.exactly the same as Theresa May. In reality, it is changed

:51:47. > :51:52.circumstances. Let's move forward. What do you plan to do as a

:51:53. > :51:57.government? That is a key political point. As a government we intend to

:51:58. > :52:03.continue to promote Scotland's place in Europe. If others wish to join us

:52:04. > :52:06.they would be very welcome. If the Tories have genuinely changed their

:52:07. > :52:12.view on Brexit, I will be very pleased that is the case. But the

:52:13. > :52:16.forum to take this forward is the joint ministerial committee. I don't

:52:17. > :52:21.think Theresa May can stay as Prime Minister. There is potential for a

:52:22. > :52:24.progressive Alliance in the House of Commons and I'm sure the SNP would

:52:25. > :52:30.like to see that but we need to sit down this week. The reality is we

:52:31. > :52:36.need to sit down this week and look at the Brexit situation and the

:52:37. > :52:43.initial documents from the European Union. We need to devise a new

:52:44. > :52:54.approach. Theresa May has tried to make all the decisions and look at

:52:55. > :53:04.the mess. Did you say in a formal way your proposals have never been

:53:05. > :53:14.rejected? We've had one paragraph in a 4-page letter from Davis Davis --

:53:15. > :53:17.David Davis but that they were not feasible. This was on the day of the

:53:18. > :53:21.Article 50 letter. There was a huge amount of work done by civil

:53:22. > :53:25.servants. The conclusion did not arise out of that work. That work

:53:26. > :53:30.was continuing. That document is still there and it starts with the

:53:31. > :53:40.easiest solution of all. If the UK stays in the single market, the

:53:41. > :53:45.negotiations change. They become negotiations about how that takes

:53:46. > :53:53.place. There is a way to do that. Those things are available and on

:53:54. > :54:06.the table and it seems to me to be a good starting point. You're still

:54:07. > :54:17.the biggest party in Scotland but you lost a lot of seats. Both John

:54:18. > :54:28.Swinney and Nicola Sturgeon accepted this. Would you drop an idea of an

:54:29. > :54:39.independence referendum any time soon? They are right to say we need

:54:40. > :54:46.to focus on this. We have lost seats and I deeply regret that. We've lost

:54:47. > :54:49.good people. There is a group of people we would like to have seen

:54:50. > :54:57.there. That requires a period of reflection. The priority is to

:54:58. > :55:02.achieve some stability because it has been utterly chaotic and has

:55:03. > :55:07.been led by Theresa May saw the first priority is to do that. We

:55:08. > :55:12.must do that this week. 60% of the electorate have voted for parties

:55:13. > :55:19.who had, on the front page of the appeal to the public, no

:55:20. > :55:22.independence referendum. You say you want stability and I'm sure a lot of

:55:23. > :55:30.the people watching will be shouting at the TV set that they want

:55:31. > :55:41.stability from you, not to have a period of reflection, stop this

:55:42. > :55:48.right now. Take it off the table. I don't think people are shouting,

:55:49. > :55:52.don't have a period of reflection. They want stability you want. We

:55:53. > :55:57.need to move forward to get that stability. Reflecting on the detail

:55:58. > :56:02.of this is important but the first thing we've got to do is sit round

:56:03. > :56:07.the table and talk about Brexit and what is going to take place. As you

:56:08. > :56:11.pointed out, the negotiations are meant to start a week tomorrow.

:56:12. > :56:16.We've got to get a position in place this week that says, this is what is

:56:17. > :56:20.going to happen. If Theresa May tries to put her position on the

:56:21. > :56:23.table she will be in deep trouble. Would you honestly trust that women

:56:24. > :56:29.to read these negotiations after what you've seen, what we've all

:56:30. > :56:37.seen over the last 12 months? Surely not. You keep going on about Theresa

:56:38. > :56:41.May. I come back to IndyRef2. A lot of people say the SNP claims to

:56:42. > :56:51.represent Scotland but now has a ten represent Scotland but now has a ten

:56:52. > :56:57.-- now is taking the Michael. You've been told in no uncertain terms what

:56:58. > :57:01.people think of your proposal. You need to say that you will take it

:57:02. > :57:08.off the table until the next Scottish elections. The First

:57:09. > :57:14.Minister has said she will reflect on that. The reality is, I'm not one

:57:15. > :57:19.of these politicians that blank things but we won 35 seats out of

:57:20. > :57:26.59. We have an overall majority of those seats. The best result was 56

:57:27. > :57:34.but before that we only had six. Hang on a second here. We won this

:57:35. > :57:40.election but of course we will reflect on it. The First Minister

:57:41. > :57:44.said absolutely immediately. Your policy was to overturn the results

:57:45. > :57:54.of a referendum with an extremely high turnout. You say you won the

:57:55. > :58:00.majority of the seats. You did that in a system which skews the result,

:58:01. > :58:06.is unfair and unjust according to SNP policy. If you ran an election

:58:07. > :58:14.on the basis you support, you would have 37% of the seats.

:58:15. > :58:21.We are now into hypotheses built on hypothesis. The proposal for the

:58:22. > :58:26.referendum was based on one set of circumstances only in the election

:58:27. > :58:30.we won in 2016, and that was if Scotland was to be dragged out of

:58:31. > :58:34.Europe against its will, that would be the circumstances. That is

:58:35. > :58:39.exactly the circumstances we find ourselves in. Now we go forward and

:58:40. > :58:43.say, what is going to happen with Brexit? To some extent everything is

:58:44. > :58:48.off the table in the sense that Brexit has to start to be sorted

:58:49. > :58:54.this week. That is the urgent priority. There is a way to do it,

:58:55. > :58:59.which is to get the J MC meeting. But you have a problem with

:59:00. > :59:04.credibility even on that. Everyone knows the more there is a move

:59:05. > :59:08.towards a soft Brexit, the more it undermines your case for another

:59:09. > :59:12.independence referendum, so you are caught in a contradiction. If you

:59:13. > :59:18.get your way on Brexit, no indyref2. It might even seem better if there

:59:19. > :59:22.was a hard Brexit. The Scottish government brought to the table in

:59:23. > :59:26.December the most comprehensive plan of how to move forward with a

:59:27. > :59:41.compromise. I have not spent the last six months

:59:42. > :59:45.trying to make that work with people who simply were not listening to it

:59:46. > :59:47.to abandon it. That document is still there and it contains

:59:48. > :59:50.compromise proposals. It starts with the UK staying in the single market

:59:51. > :59:52.and that is a very good step forward. The Scottish government is

:59:53. > :59:55.committed to that still. I am sure there is a seaplane behind you ready

:59:56. > :59:56.to whisk you back home. Thank you very much indeed.

:59:57. > :00:01.Now in case you're wondering, we did try to get a Scottish

:00:02. > :00:03.Tory on the programme, but despite their remarkable

:00:04. > :00:04.election performance here, we were unable to find

:00:05. > :00:07.a Conservative politician willing to come on the programme.

:00:08. > :00:09.Well Labour's performance also improved on Thursday and they're

:00:10. > :00:11.being slightly less reticent so I'm joined by Scottish Labour's election

:00:12. > :00:28.First of all, on indyref2, is what Mike Russell said acceptable? It is

:00:29. > :00:33.clear the SNP have not listened to the result of the election on

:00:34. > :00:39.Thursday. Look at what happened. They are down nearly 500,000 votes

:00:40. > :00:45.from 2015 and the reason for that is that people are fed up with the SNP,

:00:46. > :00:49.not only obsessing about indyref2, but failing to tackle the issues

:00:50. > :00:54.they are responsible for in Scotland. What do you think they

:00:55. > :00:59.should do on that issue? They need to make it absolutely clear that

:01:00. > :01:03.indyref2 is off the table, but more importantly they need to take

:01:04. > :01:10.responsibility for the issues that matter in Scotland. For example,

:01:11. > :01:16.child poverty has gone up 40,000 to 260,000, and the SNP approach for

:01:17. > :01:19.that. I think we know Labour wants them to concentrate on domestic

:01:20. > :01:26.issues, but I want to put this to you. I know we have a pre-recorded

:01:27. > :01:30.interview with Christine Jardin of the Liberal Democrats and she says

:01:31. > :01:33.what they want is for the SNP to bring forward legislation to the

:01:34. > :01:40.Scottish Parliament, in effect cancelling the vote for indyref2 and

:01:41. > :01:45.to take it off the table until at least the next Scottish elections in

:01:46. > :01:48.2021. Is that something you would support? I have seen that Liberal

:01:49. > :01:54.Democrat proposal, it is interesting. If I vote comes to the

:01:55. > :02:02.Parliament, we will obviously oppose indyref2. But the clear thing that

:02:03. > :02:09.the SNP need to start doing is getting responsible. Last year in

:02:10. > :02:13.the budget they underspent the housing budget by ?20 million and

:02:14. > :02:19.there are homeless people dying on our streets and they do not seem

:02:20. > :02:23.able to tackle that. It went under the radar but you said yesterday,

:02:24. > :02:28.and please tell me if I misinterpret you, you said it was important that

:02:29. > :02:33.the new and unexpectedly large Scottish Labour group in Parliament

:02:34. > :02:38.was represented in Jeremy Corbyn's Parliament and that at the very

:02:39. > :02:41.least there had to be a Secretary of State for Scotland or a shadow

:02:42. > :02:47.Secretary of State for Scotland who was a Scottish MP. Am I interpreting

:02:48. > :02:51.what you said correctly? We return to Westminster next week and we are

:02:52. > :02:55.a group of seven MPs who will play an active role in Jeremy Corbyn's

:02:56. > :02:58.team and at the forefront of that there needs to be a leap person

:02:59. > :03:09.speaking for Scotland in the shadow cabinet. And that has to be a

:03:10. > :03:13.Scottish MP? Yes. Presumably if asked, perhaps some of the Scottish

:03:14. > :03:19.MPs in Parliament could play a role in Parliament other than that one

:03:20. > :03:23.post, but there could be more? We are delighted with the team we are

:03:24. > :03:28.sending down there. There is some real depth and experience and we

:03:29. > :03:33.think we can contribute in the Parliament, but also contribute as

:03:34. > :03:37.part of the Labour team, as part of Jeremy Corbyn's team in Westminster.

:03:38. > :03:43.I am not sure that you would necessarily agree with what you

:03:44. > :03:48.would say with what Alison was saying and the mixed messages

:03:49. > :03:52.between Kezia Dugdale and Jeremy Corbyn in Scotland. He was a bit

:03:53. > :03:55.more ambiguous. Is that something you would want to have talks about

:03:56. > :04:02.and make sure there was one line coming out? Jeremy Corbyn made clear

:04:03. > :04:08.during the campaign that the prospect of Independence would mean

:04:09. > :04:11.turbo-charged austerity. He said he would talk to the Scottish

:04:12. > :04:19.government about it and you do not want him to do that? We need to

:04:20. > :04:22.tackle the budget of 15 million. The prospect of indyref2 takes us away

:04:23. > :04:26.from the real issues and the prospect of independence would be a

:04:27. > :04:31.disaster for Scotland and Jeremy Corbyn understands that. RUC Labour

:04:32. > :04:38.policy now, whether in Westminster or Holyrood, is no second

:04:39. > :04:41.independence referendum until there is at least some sign in another

:04:42. > :04:48.election there has been a mass support from the Scottish people?

:04:49. > :04:52.You can see the SNP are starting to roll back from a second independence

:04:53. > :04:57.referendum, so I do not see them bringing back forward any time soon.

:04:58. > :05:00.They have acknowledged it cost them hundreds of thousands of votes on

:05:01. > :05:06.Thursday and they need to reflect on that and get back to the issues that

:05:07. > :05:10.matter. Is there a lesson for the Scottish Labour Party in what Jeremy

:05:11. > :05:14.Corbyn did against everyone's expectations? First of all the mass

:05:15. > :05:21.membership Labour have achieved in England. I know you have more

:05:22. > :05:24.members here, but nothing like what he has managed to achieve. Also the

:05:25. > :05:26.different way he went about campaigning. Will you be sitting

:05:27. > :05:33.down and learning the lessons and trying to replicate in Scotland some

:05:34. > :05:38.of the things he did in England? We will look closely at this going for

:05:39. > :05:50.it. Six of the seats in Scotland had majorities of less than 400. Six of

:05:51. > :05:53.you or a Labour sees? Exceeds of SNP majorities of less than 400, so

:05:54. > :05:57.there is a chance of us moving forward to take those seeds and

:05:58. > :06:03.others. But you will be looking to see what they were doing in South

:06:04. > :06:09.and replicating it up here? The lesson of the election is talking

:06:10. > :06:15.about what matters to people. No, the lesson is mobilising young

:06:16. > :06:19.people and going to rock concerts like Jeremy Corbyn did, and you can

:06:20. > :06:25.do much better than people think you would. But ultimately you need to

:06:26. > :06:30.think about what matters to people like ?10 minimum wage. We have all

:06:31. > :06:32.heard that, we do not want to hear your manifesto again. Thank you very

:06:33. > :06:37.Well, earlier this morning I spoke with one of the Scottish Liberal

:06:38. > :06:41.Democrats' new intake at Westminster, Christine Jardine.

:06:42. > :06:46.What, in your view, does the Scottish government have to do now

:06:47. > :06:52.about another independence referendum? They have to make it

:06:53. > :06:55.clear it is off the table and they have to bring forward legislation to

:06:56. > :07:01.say they will not be another independence referendum. It was

:07:02. > :07:05.clear on the doors from day one in the general election that there is

:07:06. > :07:12.no will amongst the public, even amongst SNP supporters we spoke to.

:07:13. > :07:16.There was a reticence to go ahead with another independence

:07:17. > :07:22.referendum, perhaps for different reasons, thinking it would be a no

:07:23. > :07:26.vote again, people did not want it. You say they need to bring forward

:07:27. > :07:32.legislation to cancel the current position of the Scottish Parliament.

:07:33. > :07:36.You cannot ask the SNP to give up on independence, it is the nature of

:07:37. > :07:42.the SNP. Is it your argument they need to take it off table until the

:07:43. > :07:47.next Scottish election? We want them to make a clear statement to the

:07:48. > :07:51.people of Scotland they will not be another independence referendum in

:07:52. > :07:55.this Parliament. I am confident when we come to another Scottish election

:07:56. > :08:01.we may get another different result. But this time round it is clear.

:08:02. > :08:06.When I say a different result, the SNP may not be in a position to have

:08:07. > :08:09.a referendum after the next Scottish election, but for the time being

:08:10. > :08:13.they have to make it absolutely clear that they have listened, they

:08:14. > :08:17.have heard people are not happy with the idea of going through another

:08:18. > :08:23.divisive debate and put it to one side. And your view would be what?

:08:24. > :08:29.Saying they reflect on this might get them through the next few days,

:08:30. > :08:34.but that is not good enough? That is not good enough because we have seen

:08:35. > :08:39.so often over the past two years Nicola Sturgeon say it is off the

:08:40. > :08:43.table. The other thing that is clear from this general election result

:08:44. > :08:47.and two years ago is that two years ago people thought it was off the

:08:48. > :08:53.table and this time it was not. Nicola saying we will reflect on it

:08:54. > :08:57.will not be enough for people. They will want something that the SNP can

:08:58. > :09:02.be held to, that they can I say after another few months that the

:09:03. > :09:06.situation has changed and they will call for another independence

:09:07. > :09:12.referendum. It has to be off until the next election? Yes. Their

:09:13. > :09:17.argument is they got a majority of seats in this election and they have

:09:18. > :09:23.a triple lock. What do you make of that? They lost seats, they went

:09:24. > :09:28.down by 13%. They still have a majority. They lost seats at the

:09:29. > :09:32.Scottish election and they have a minority in the Scottish Parliament

:09:33. > :09:37.and the Green Party will be thinking people obviously are not in favour

:09:38. > :09:40.of an independence referendum. The SNP need the support of the Green

:09:41. > :09:47.Party in the Scottish Parliament if they are to have it. Your argument

:09:48. > :09:51.is 60% voted for parties which clearly do not want another

:09:52. > :09:56.independence referendum. By the same token can we look forward to in the

:09:57. > :10:00.next few days the Liberal Democrats withdrawing their demand for another

:10:01. > :10:03.referendum on Europe? The vast majority of the electorate

:10:04. > :10:09.throughout the UK have voted for parties which do not want another

:10:10. > :10:13.referendum. What we are seeing is two very different dynamics in

:10:14. > :10:21.Scotland and England. Brexit was not as much of an issue up here. By the

:10:22. > :10:24.very same argument you have made about the SNP, the Liberal Democrats

:10:25. > :10:31.need to say right now within the next few days, we withdraw our

:10:32. > :10:35.policy of having a second referendum in Europe. What we need to know is

:10:36. > :10:40.exactly now what the government policy on Brexit is. It is not clear

:10:41. > :10:46.exactly what will happen with Brexit. Hang on a second. You work

:10:47. > :10:51.telling me a minute ago we have to know what the Scottish government

:10:52. > :11:00.policy is on indyref2, you said they had to withdraw it. By the same

:11:01. > :11:05.token you need an overwhelming idea that the majority of people in Great

:11:06. > :11:10.Britain have voted for parties who do not want another referendum. You

:11:11. > :11:17.need to withdraw it right now. I made it clear, the Liberal Democrats

:11:18. > :11:20.who won, made it clear on the doorsteps that we would be

:11:21. > :11:25.campaigning to keep the UK at the heart of Europe. We were elected on

:11:26. > :11:30.that platform and we will not go back on it and we will continue to

:11:31. > :11:32.campaign and push for the best possible relationship with the

:11:33. > :11:41.European Union. I take what you are saying. Thank you very much. As an

:11:42. > :11:51.SNP MP you will continue to campaign? As the SNP, I would never

:11:52. > :11:54.hear them say they will give up on independence. I would like to hear

:11:55. > :11:58.them say that, but I accept that will never happen, but you are never

:11:59. > :11:59.hear a Liberal Democrats say they have given up on Europe.

:12:00. > :12:05.Well joining me now is Professor John Curtice.

:12:06. > :12:11.A week ago you said, my takeaway line from the polls was that Jeremy

:12:12. > :12:19.Corbyn could do as well as Tony Blair did in 2005, but you can top

:12:20. > :12:24.that takeaway line today. Yes, Jeremy Corbyn one is slightly bigger

:12:25. > :12:28.share of the vote than Tony Blair managed in 2001 as well. There is no

:12:29. > :12:32.doubt as compared to where the Labour Party started this election,

:12:33. > :12:39.which according to the opinion polls were 26%, no party had ever started

:12:40. > :12:44.an election in so bad a position. The turnaround for the Labour Party

:12:45. > :12:48.was truly remarkable. However, we need to remember that in the end the

:12:49. > :12:54.Labour Party in terms of seats they'd hardly any better than Gordon

:12:55. > :12:59.Brown did in 2010. What we can say is Jeremy Corbyn has demonstrated

:13:00. > :13:03.that you can fight and effective election campaign standing from the

:13:04. > :13:07.left, you do not have to follow the New Labour line of tracing the

:13:08. > :13:12.centre, and that does not lead to disaster. What Jeremy Corbyn now

:13:13. > :13:16.needs to demonstrate is that his strategy can actually push the

:13:17. > :13:21.parties such that it could win a general election. Winning a general

:13:22. > :13:25.election will not be easy. It will be very difficult unless the party

:13:26. > :13:30.can regain much more ground in Scotland than it has been capturing

:13:31. > :13:35.so far. It would still need to be five or six points ahead of the

:13:36. > :13:38.Conservatives to have some chance of a majority. There is an awful lot

:13:39. > :13:49.that the Labour Party needs to do before it would look like a majority

:13:50. > :13:56.government. How does the conservative vote compared to David

:13:57. > :14:02.Cameron? They got the highest since 1979. They both did relatively well

:14:03. > :14:10.but the crucial thing is what matters under first past the post is

:14:11. > :14:16.not the sheer of the vote. What matters is how well you do relative

:14:17. > :14:21.to your principal opponents. Failure to appreciate that has led a number

:14:22. > :14:27.of conservative politicians to say, hang on, we did better than we've

:14:28. > :14:31.ever done. But it's also a failure to appreciate that means Labour

:14:32. > :14:40.politicians are overestimating how well they've done because they were

:14:41. > :14:42.beaten by the Conservatives, by 2.5 percentage points. The Labour Party

:14:43. > :14:51.must demonstrate they can beat the Conservatives. There is a

:14:52. > :14:56.probability of boundary changes that will disadvantage Labour. They've

:14:57. > :15:01.got to demonstrate they can beat the Conservatives handsomely. What

:15:02. > :15:07.happened in Scotland? Do we know why the SNP lost a lot of seats? Are

:15:08. > :15:13.people voting tactically, buying into the line Labour and the

:15:14. > :15:24.Conservatives were saying, stop independence referendum to? It was a

:15:25. > :15:29.factor, of the dozen seats, it is perfectly clear in nine of them that

:15:30. > :15:35.either Labour or the Lib Dems were squeezed. It may have been tactical

:15:36. > :15:41.in some places. In Berwickshire people are going for who they

:15:42. > :15:44.prefer. There is an element of tactical voting. What we should

:15:45. > :15:53.remember in the rhetoric, the problem was not it could not

:15:54. > :15:59.appreciate -- appealed to people, but it failed to get those who are

:16:00. > :16:11.in favour of independence to vote for it. Only 75% of them voted for

:16:12. > :16:16.the SNP this time. People say, hang on, we should not hold a referendum

:16:17. > :16:31.now. It is clear there is not the kind of enthusiasm. But there are

:16:32. > :16:38.other explanations. Some supporters are disappointed with their domestic

:16:39. > :16:43.record. And the SNP never did particularly well in Westminster

:16:44. > :16:49.elections before now and it may be that some of that has kicked back

:16:50. > :16:54.in. One of the things that happened towards the end is the rise of the

:16:55. > :17:00.Labour Party donor so that one over young voters and probably damaged

:17:01. > :17:06.the SNP. The truth is there were a number of explanations. It is not

:17:07. > :17:13.simply the question of in the rest to dash of IndyRef2. We should not

:17:14. > :17:19.assume it is wholly off the table for the next three years. Thank you.

:17:20. > :17:27.Time for a look at the week ahead. Joining me here in Glasgow

:17:28. > :17:29.are freelance journalist Kathleen Nutt and Severin Carrell

:17:30. > :17:31.who's Scotland Editor And in Edinburgh, Political

:17:32. > :17:42.commentator David Torrance. David, let us start with the

:17:43. > :17:48.question of IndyRef. If you were the SNP, what would you do? I don't envy

:17:49. > :18:01.them. It is a fiendishly difficult circle to square. On the one hand,

:18:02. > :18:06.if Nicola Sturgeon says it is often dash off the table, she has a

:18:07. > :18:10.problem with the independence wing who are impatient, they want a

:18:11. > :18:20.referendum regardless of the outcome. If she says it is on the

:18:21. > :18:32.table, the fuel that propelled them to those gains is left burning. She

:18:33. > :18:43.is between a rock and a hard place. She needs to neuter the backlash and

:18:44. > :18:48.at the same time keep the dream alive for that section of her own

:18:49. > :18:56.party. It is not clear how she does that. I think Nicola Sturgeon will

:18:57. > :19:04.be working carefully at UK politics, and what will happen in terms of

:19:05. > :19:17.Brexit. It seems there will be a chance of a soft Brexit, if that

:19:18. > :19:26.continues, which is not a given, that could be the way out of it. The

:19:27. > :19:32.only reason she puts IndyRef on the table is because Theresa May had

:19:33. > :19:45.rejected the proposals for a soft Brexit. Those proposals were

:19:46. > :19:50.published by the Scottish Government but Theresa May did not respond

:19:51. > :19:57.until Article 50 was triggered at the end of March. David Davis said

:19:58. > :20:06.it was not feasible. Then Nicola Sturgeon pushed ahead and announced

:20:07. > :20:11.she would go ahead with the second referendum but that was the

:20:12. > :20:18.situation that faced her. If it is a hard Brexit then it will be on the

:20:19. > :20:29.table but soft Brexit, she was not suggesting it. Is that way out? Do

:20:30. > :20:33.remember Angus Robertson said, I asked him on this programme, if

:20:34. > :20:42.there is not a hard Brexit, would that mean in the -- IndyRef is not

:20:43. > :20:50.on the table and he said yes. Yes, Nicola Sturgeon is an onlooker. The

:20:51. > :20:55.outcome of the machinations at Westminster, the questions about the

:20:56. > :20:59.DUP, whether or not to reason may survive is, they are the critical

:21:00. > :21:04.questions. It is those outcomes which will shape Nicola Sturgeon's

:21:05. > :21:09.reaction. She has another problem. She needs to reassert herself on the

:21:10. > :21:16.domestic agenda. It is fine to start talking about Brexit and more

:21:17. > :21:21.conversation to happen in the SNP. Do you agree with David that they

:21:22. > :21:28.have to find some way of parking IndyRef? Yes. This is the

:21:29. > :21:33.opportunity. She can save face. The instability and uncertainty is so

:21:34. > :21:40.great that... She will say, we will park this, maybe we will not have

:21:41. > :21:46.the hard Brexit. They sort of leave it and then they can fight it in

:21:47. > :21:51.2021. It is more to do with the fact that there is so much fluidity in

:21:52. > :21:55.the way the UK Government will respond to Brexit, it gives them an

:21:56. > :21:59.opportunity. They now have an opportunity to get back into the

:22:00. > :22:04.conversation. I'm not sure how meaningful the SNP's insertion into

:22:05. > :22:09.the debate is going to be because they were decapitated on Thursday.

:22:10. > :22:16.It was a seriously difficult outcome. Having said that, one of

:22:17. > :22:19.the things that is unclear is what the Parliamentary involvement is

:22:20. > :22:24.going to be in the Brexit negotiations. Nobody seems very

:22:25. > :22:34.clear about it. Nobody seems to know the answer. You might be wrong,

:22:35. > :22:39.maybe the SNP group, the opposition would only need Kenneth Clarke and

:22:40. > :22:47.half a dozen of his mates and they would be in business. That is what

:22:48. > :22:56.awaits Nicola Sturgeon. If Jeremy Corbyn brings together an alliance,

:22:57. > :23:01.then the SNP are in a significant position. They are still the third

:23:02. > :23:05.biggest party at Westminster. Nicola Sturgeon needs to make a huge

:23:06. > :23:13.strategic decision, perhaps the most difficult, whether she decides in

:23:14. > :23:20.the rest -- IndyRef is off the table to give a coherent alliance down so.

:23:21. > :23:26.Labour will expect a concession on that if they are to start

:23:27. > :23:31.collaborating. David, we should remind everyone, the SNP are still

:23:32. > :23:34.winning, it is just in the last Scottish elections, the local

:23:35. > :23:40.elections and now this general election, support has been going

:23:41. > :23:44.down. Do you think leaving aside Brexit, they need to relaunch

:23:45. > :23:48.themselves as the Scottish Government, say, we have some fresh

:23:49. > :23:52.ideas and we really are going to genuinely try to sort out issues

:23:53. > :23:58.like the health service and education and this is what we are

:23:59. > :24:05.going to do? Yes, one former adviser said was, reset. There's a feeling

:24:06. > :24:10.within some sections of the party that they need to push to be set

:24:11. > :24:14.button on all that. Even they are it is kind of difficult. Education is

:24:15. > :24:19.fiendishly difficult to sort out over ten years, it has obviously

:24:20. > :24:24.declined on certain measurements. It is a push to think by the next

:24:25. > :24:32.election that will have been Karen Brown significantly. Another problem

:24:33. > :24:39.is a narrative one. The predominant tropes over the past few years,

:24:40. > :24:42.Scotland is implicitly anti-Tory and does not vote for conservatives and

:24:43. > :24:56.the Scottish Labour Party is right wing, neither of those attack claims

:24:57. > :25:11.can work. It hinges on Brexit. That is the only opportunity left. Let's

:25:12. > :25:15.talk about narratives. You get the feeling, people are so outraged at

:25:16. > :25:20.being dragged out of the European Union that even people who were

:25:21. > :25:24.against independence will say, we would rather be a separate country.

:25:25. > :25:35.There is no evidence of that happening. The SNP did not run a

:25:36. > :25:42.great campaign, I'm not sure I agree that it was all about opposition to

:25:43. > :25:48.a second independence referendum. Perhaps not and John Curtis made

:25:49. > :25:55.that point. I think the SNP did not put a very positive message in this

:25:56. > :26:00.campaign. It is not just Europe, the narratives are not attached to

:26:01. > :26:06.anything, the idea Scotland is different to England looks less

:26:07. > :26:14.credible when 30% of the population faltered for the Conservatives. If

:26:15. > :26:20.you say that the Tories are toxic you are insulting a third of the

:26:21. > :26:22.electorate. There was a clear difference, apart from

:26:23. > :26:28.anti-independence there was nothing else in the Tory manifesto. Are

:26:29. > :26:35.people really voting Tory to get tuition fees? Do they really know

:26:36. > :26:42.the consequences of what a Tory government would be at Holyrood?

:26:43. > :26:47.David said it was a reset. Do they need to do that? Absolutely crucial.

:26:48. > :26:53.Nicola Sturgeon needs to find a way of bringing the Scottish electorate

:26:54. > :26:58.back into love with the Scottish National Party. She will need to

:26:59. > :27:01.make a speech fairly quickly when she offers something that allows the

:27:02. > :27:11.SNP to get back on top of the agenda. I would agree with that. She

:27:12. > :27:19.needs to refresh the message and bring some new policies that will

:27:20. > :27:21.win over these yes supporters that have moved to Labour. That is all

:27:22. > :27:26.from us. Goodbye.