:01:26. > :01:30.And in the South East: As commuters face yet another New
:01:30. > :01:40.Year fare hike, we ask if rail travel is being priced out of the
:01:40. > :01:40.
:01:40. > :29:52.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 1692 seconds
:29:52. > :29:55.Hello, and welcome to the Sunday Politics Show in the South East.
:29:55. > :29:58.Coming up later in the show: As Kent County Council chalks up
:29:58. > :30:02.plans for the first new grammar school in the country for 50 years,
:30:02. > :30:07.we find out if it will really benefit local pupils.
:30:07. > :30:10.First, let me introduce you to our guests of the day: Lib Dem
:30:10. > :30:13.Transport Minister Norman Baker, and Conservative MP for Crawley,
:30:13. > :30:16.Henry Smith. They will be here for the rest of the show with their
:30:16. > :30:26.comments and views on the issues of the week in this region. Henry
:30:26. > :30:32.
:30:32. > :30:42.first. The faulty breast implants, where 40,000 women is estimated to
:30:42. > :30:43.
:30:43. > :30:52.have had them. I have a constituent who is pregnant. She had these
:30:52. > :30:58.implants Patane, and she is very concerned. -- implants put in.
:30:58. > :31:08.she get them removed? The medical advice is she need to have them
:31:08. > :31:08.
:31:08. > :31:15.removed after pregnancy. But a big concern. What is your view on this,
:31:15. > :31:21.Norman? I think Andrew Lansley has stepped up to the plate and offered
:31:21. > :31:31.to help, but those who put in these implants should have the
:31:31. > :31:38.responsibility. It is a very worrying development for women.
:31:38. > :31:48.has been a big week in the transport department as well.
:31:48. > :31:50.
:31:50. > :31:54.has been a fantastic week for railways. It will be a
:31:54. > :31:59.transformation for the country, in terms of helping economic
:31:59. > :32:05.development and cutting carbon, and dealing with congestion. It will be
:32:05. > :32:12.quicker to get from Birmingham city centre to London city centre to get
:32:12. > :32:14.from Piccadilly Circus to Heathrow. We will stick with the issue of
:32:14. > :32:16.rail. A subject that won't have escaped
:32:16. > :32:20.Norman's notice - and certainly hasn't escaped commuters' notice -
:32:20. > :32:23.this week is the rise in train fares. As they returned to work
:32:23. > :32:26.after the Christmas break, the cost of getting there by rail increased
:32:26. > :32:30.by an average of almost 6% in the South East, but for some passengers,
:32:30. > :32:32.the rise was much higher. If fares continue to rise - in line with
:32:32. > :32:38.Government policy - could the ordinary traveller be priced off
:32:38. > :32:42.the trains? Let's start with the Transport Minister, Norman Baker. I
:32:42. > :32:45.know you are going to defend the rise in fares and tell us that it
:32:45. > :32:48.would have been higher if your department hadn't put a cap on it,
:32:48. > :32:50.but the Shadow Spokesman that you used to be would have been
:32:50. > :32:58.complaining as loudly as the commuters have been. I it argued
:32:58. > :33:05.strongly that we have reverted to the position of the Labour
:33:05. > :33:09.government. The number of people on railways is higher than it has ever
:33:09. > :33:17.been. The number of people has doubled. People are clamouring to
:33:17. > :33:20.get on the railways. We have also got to bear in mind that we have
:33:20. > :33:30.got a huge rail investment programme, the biggest since the
:33:30. > :33:34.
:33:34. > :33:38.Victorian era. We have got new railway carriages as well.
:33:38. > :33:45.Tremendous investment in rail. But it has to be paid for somehow. We
:33:45. > :33:49.are getting the cost of Network Rail right down as well. I want to
:33:49. > :33:53.talk about the tax payer. Many commuters, though, who are watching
:33:53. > :34:01.this programme, they do not feel they are getting those benefits, do
:34:01. > :34:09.they? Some may not feel that, but it is the inflation rate as well as
:34:09. > :34:19.up 1%. We hear about the roles that have gone up only. But the return
:34:19. > :34:27.from Hastings to-, for example, has gone down 16%. Henry, I know you
:34:27. > :34:31.are in favour of this shift the government wants to make. We have
:34:31. > :34:35.to get the balance right. The balance has been a little bit out
:34:35. > :34:40.of kilter in the past, and the government believes those who are
:34:40. > :34:50.using the service should be contributing. There is a great
:34:50. > :35:01.
:35:01. > :35:06.local example in my constituency - Gatwick station is being upgraded.
:35:06. > :35:09.We are beginning to see the results of that investment. You are both
:35:09. > :35:14.keen to tell us how much your government is putting into the
:35:14. > :35:24.railways, but the danger is that future. You said you have been able
:35:24. > :35:24.
:35:24. > :35:33.to keep things down. What we are doing is trading down Network
:35:33. > :35:37.Rail's cost. Their report said Network Rail's costs could be cut
:35:37. > :35:46.up to four to be sent without affecting passengers and the
:35:46. > :35:56.services battle. -- 4%. The problem is the amount of money the system
:35:56. > :35:56.
:35:56. > :36:06.has got his sucking from the taxpayer and passenger. We have
:36:06. > :36:06.
:36:06. > :36:11.already taken up steps to eliminate wasteful stop -- waste. Some a
:36:11. > :36:16.necessary regulations, having no purpose whatsoever, are being swept
:36:16. > :36:21.away. We are also seeing each train companies are responding far more
:36:21. > :36:26.to the train passengers. But this RPI plus three, I know you said it
:36:26. > :36:33.might not happen, but for those who have seen a hike in their affairs,
:36:33. > :36:39.they may be worried on that long term. At -- their fares. How you
:36:39. > :36:49.make sure railways are still affordable? Under the Labour
:36:49. > :36:54.government, welfares went up by 11%. -- rail fares. We need to put it
:36:54. > :36:59.into perspective and context. People are being squeezed. But that
:36:59. > :37:06.is partly the consequence of them having to pay down one of the
:37:06. > :37:12.highest deficits we have ever inherited. I would be uncomfortable
:37:12. > :37:22.with RPI plus three. RPI plus one is something we are working on at
:37:22. > :37:24.
:37:24. > :37:27.the moment. Now, Norman here is one of those
:37:27. > :37:30.who benefited from a grammar school education. Kent, of course, is one
:37:30. > :37:34.of the few parts of the country which still has that system of
:37:34. > :37:37.education - and it could be about to build the first new grammar
:37:37. > :37:40.school in the country in 50 years. At the end of last year, the
:37:40. > :37:43.Coalition relaxed the laws which banned the building of new grammars,
:37:43. > :37:53.which means existing schools in Kent can now expand to meet demand.
:37:53. > :37:54.
:37:55. > :37:58.But if it happens, will local pupils benefit?
:37:58. > :38:03.Kent has more grammar schools than anywhere else and the country, but
:38:03. > :38:12.there are none in Sevenoaks. Local parents have been put a check --
:38:12. > :38:16.petitioning to get one. Until last month, this would not have been
:38:16. > :38:21.possible, because the government had said no new grammar schools
:38:21. > :38:25.could be created. But they have altered the rules to allow existing
:38:25. > :38:30.schools to open a satellite's sides elsewhere. Critics believe the
:38:30. > :38:36.system is already damaging to other schools. The children who do attend
:38:36. > :38:41.grammar school, you may be able to increase their performance. We can
:38:41. > :38:47.also show that in the other schools, where children have failed their 11
:38:47. > :38:51.plus, they can become demotivated. And as a result, Kent has a higher
:38:51. > :38:57.proportion than most other authorities of schools which are
:38:57. > :39:02.failing, and are deemed to be in problems by the government's
:39:02. > :39:08.inspectors. The reason for that is the selective system. Some say
:39:08. > :39:12.getting rid of grammar schools would ensure a better mix of pupils.
:39:13. > :39:20.If you can create comprehensive schools, where all ability children
:39:20. > :39:25.go, they are good schools, and create social cohesion, and all the
:39:25. > :39:35.statistical evidence shows that educational outcomes, results, are
:39:35. > :39:37.
:39:37. > :39:42.in fact improved. So his selection has no merit. -- so's election. It
:39:42. > :39:48.creates massive stress, and it divides families and communities.
:39:48. > :39:58.And even of grammar schools to provide the right education, well-
:39:58. > :40:03.
:40:03. > :40:10.lit stop parents problems? -- whip solve parents' problems? A head
:40:10. > :40:16.teacher at this school is concerned. Some grammar schools Select, which
:40:16. > :40:21.means they will take the children of the highest ability. That means
:40:21. > :40:24.children come from a wide distance, whereas it would seem more sensible
:40:24. > :40:29.to have a school which serves the town and local villagers, because
:40:29. > :40:35.we are the ones who have the difficulty. The way to do that
:40:35. > :40:42.would be to accept children from a long distance. Kent taxpayers may
:40:42. > :40:48.have to pick up the bill for a school - said to be �20 million.
:40:48. > :40:52.Part of the problem is that we have enough secondary school places, and
:40:53. > :40:56.grammar school places in Kent. problem is we have over 250
:40:56. > :41:01.children who come into our schools from across the border, and in
:41:01. > :41:11.particular, into West Kents cause. If we were able to stop that, we
:41:11. > :41:16.
:41:16. > :41:21.would have been up provision. -- into West Kent.
:41:21. > :41:28.Is expanding be counted's already large number of grammar schools
:41:28. > :41:37.best for the education system as a whole? Will Kent children get the
:41:37. > :41:44.places that Kent taxpayers will be funding?
:41:44. > :41:49.With me in the studio is Mike Whiting from Kent County Council.
:41:49. > :41:55.Whether Kent children benefit depends on the criteria that the
:41:55. > :42:02.new school is able to apply. Any Amex to be built would have to have
:42:02. > :42:12.the same criteria as existing criteria. What influence can you
:42:12. > :42:12.
:42:12. > :42:22.have? Evaders an academy, we have little power. -- if it is an
:42:22. > :42:27.
:42:28. > :42:34.academy. If a school in Tunbridge Wells is interesting in opening a
:42:34. > :42:44.school, could you say to them, we can opened this, but only if you
:42:44. > :42:46.
:42:46. > :42:52.allow local children as well? formula will have to be worked out.
:42:52. > :42:57.I have got a meeting coming up, with all of the West Kent Head
:42:57. > :43:04.Teachers, to judge the measure, temperature if you like, their
:43:04. > :43:08.willingness to get involved. I think it would be good if we could
:43:08. > :43:17.get the local people from Sevenoaks, who are calling for this to happen,
:43:17. > :43:23.to get the. -- together. I would like to see their interests are
:43:23. > :43:29.best served. There is a problem in the grammar system. You have got
:43:29. > :43:34.enough places for people in Kent, but not enough for those outside
:43:34. > :43:39.Kent. We reckon every five young people who apply for a grammar
:43:39. > :43:49.school place, only four get a place. So there is a need for more places.
:43:49. > :43:49.
:43:49. > :43:56.We cannot stop people. My job, as a cabinet member for education is
:43:56. > :44:02.Kent, it is to ensure they are adequate places for young people in
:44:02. > :44:09.Kent. Grammar schools are single sex. If you were to open one new
:44:09. > :44:19.school, it would you have to choose boys or girls? We would have to
:44:19. > :44:20.
:44:20. > :44:30.find two schools willing to open. I would be happy to look for partners,
:44:30. > :44:43.
:44:43. > :44:48.one Garth School, and one Boys School. -- goal's school.
:44:48. > :44:58.This all played very well with parents. Choice is a very good
:44:58. > :45:00.
:45:00. > :45:08.thing. -- this will play a. Even if, some of those children, are coming
:45:08. > :45:15.from over the border? We need to get away from these arbitrary
:45:15. > :45:23.boundary lines. We need to provide the best services in pragmatic and
:45:23. > :45:31.innovative ways. Crawley have benefited from a new school opening,
:45:31. > :45:41.for example. Norma, -- Norman, grammar-school boy. What do you
:45:41. > :45:47.
:45:47. > :45:57.think about this? There is an issue where there... I went to a grammar
:45:57. > :45:59.
:46:00. > :46:04.school, and benefited enormously. But I also saw nine out of 10
:46:04. > :46:12.children I knew being written off, and being sent to a secondary
:46:12. > :46:19.modern school, which could not attract good teachers or money.
:46:20. > :46:23.Tempers cent benefit, while 90% this benefit. -- 10%.
:46:24. > :46:26.And now time for a round up of the week's events in the region - as
:46:26. > :46:36.told by our political editor, Louise Stewart, in precidely one
:46:36. > :46:39.
:46:39. > :46:45.minute! Dover was the dealt a blow with the
:46:45. > :46:48.announcement that sea France had gone bust. 300 jobs could be saved,
:46:49. > :46:55.but President Sarkozy says they should be French jobs.
:46:55. > :47:01.There was a new Battle of Hastings this week, as Labour's energy
:47:01. > :47:04.secretary turned up the heat on subsidies. Caroline Flint visited
:47:05. > :47:14.her town to tell ministers that they could stick their changes
:47:15. > :47:19.
:47:19. > :47:24.where the sun at do not shine at! -- where the sun does not shine.
:47:24. > :47:34.A newly knighted Sir Roger Gale tried to put the wind up Ed
:47:34. > :47:38.
:47:38. > :47:41.Miliband, over claims that rail increases are the coalition's fault.
:47:41. > :47:45.That was our political editor, Louise Stewart. Let's pick up on
:47:45. > :47:48.some of those stories with our guests of the day. Norman, I want
:47:48. > :47:54.to ask you about solar panels. Leaving the legal issues aside, are
:47:54. > :48:03.you happy to be in a Government that is cutting subsidies?
:48:03. > :48:12.reality is, that demand has increased. The government has to
:48:12. > :48:16.take some action. I do not think it has been a very well handled. The
:48:16. > :48:24.government is not cutting back - it is fully committed to solar energy.
:48:24. > :48:34.But there was a problem with excess benefits. We are looking for
:48:34. > :48:38.
:48:38. > :48:48.changes underway this has handled? We need stability in the future.
:48:48. > :48:48.
:48:48. > :48:56.Henry, you were leader of WSCC - what do you think of the scheme?
:48:56. > :49:03.West Sussex is a great idea for authorities. I think it is a great
:49:03. > :49:08.scheme that will help get people into housing. Especially affordable
:49:08. > :49:11.housing. I supported, and congratulate Hastings for working
:49:11. > :49:16.with Lloyds TSB to introduce that scheme. It is something I am
:49:16. > :49:21.planning to talk to my local authority about. I think it is a
:49:21. > :49:28.very interesting scheme. The public and private sector are working
:49:28. > :49:31.together to deliver more affordable housing. I like it! Perfect!