:01:38. > :01:48.In the south-east: as 16 more councils apply for funding, we ask
:01:48. > :01:48.
:01:48. > :30:15.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 1707 seconds
:30:15. > :30:19.if Portas Pilot Scheme could really I am Julia George and this is the
:30:19. > :30:25.Sunday politick show in the south- east. Coming up: is it an
:30:25. > :30:30.environment of necessity or a disaster? We examine how so-called
:30:30. > :30:34.green EU proposals could change farming in the region -- this is
:30:34. > :30:38.the Sunday Politics Show. Joining me is the Tory MP for Hastings and
:30:39. > :30:45.Rye Amber Rudd and the Green MP for Brighton Pavilion Caroline Lucas.
:30:45. > :30:49.Why do some of us die younger than others? Money? A report by Brighton
:30:49. > :30:54.and Hove top doctor says that poor people in the City are dying up to
:30:54. > :31:00.10 years earlier than rich people. Caroline Lucas, you have spoken
:31:00. > :31:05.before about alcohol pricing on the Sunday politick show. Would you put
:31:05. > :31:09.a figure on it per unit that would save lives. There has been a lot of
:31:09. > :31:13.research done and most people think a figure of around 50p is probably
:31:13. > :31:17.what is needed. I think we do need some pretty urgent government
:31:17. > :31:23.action on this because a lot of the issues people talk about when it
:31:23. > :31:28.comes to lifestyle or alcohol, a lot of people put all of the
:31:28. > :31:32.responsibility on the individual. The government also has a
:31:33. > :31:37.responsibility. We need to think about access to healthy food. Are
:31:37. > :31:46.people living in poor areas able to get proper access to affordable
:31:46. > :31:50.healthy food? Amber Rudd, it is not just Brighton and Hove. We know
:31:50. > :31:54.that in Margate for instance there is a 15 year discrepancy between
:31:54. > :31:59.life expectancy. I imagine the problems are similar in Hastings?
:32:00. > :32:03.We have seen that the figures are getting wider. I wholly agree that
:32:04. > :32:08.we need to do something about alcohol. We need to have minimum
:32:08. > :32:12.alcohol pricing levels because the price of alcohol bought at off-
:32:12. > :32:16.licences has fallen by about 30%. The other problem we have in
:32:16. > :32:21.Hastings is smoking. Smoking has reduced in those parts of the
:32:21. > :32:24.country but in Hastings it has stayed stubbornly high. I know that
:32:24. > :32:28.the public health laboratories feel that is the main area to do
:32:28. > :32:32.something about. I opened a new stop-smoking clinic just a few
:32:32. > :32:36.weeks ago. How do you save a dying high
:32:36. > :32:40.street? Margate and Dartford have recently received grants under the
:32:40. > :32:46.Portas Pilot Scheme. We found out that 16 more towns in our region
:32:46. > :32:56.are applying in a second round of funding. The maximum grant is just
:32:56. > :32:56.
:32:56. > :32:59.�100,000 which does not go far. 84% of local councils in the south-
:32:59. > :33:03.east are currently bidding for money to revitalise their high
:33:03. > :33:08.streets. It is an extension of a government scene which recently saw
:33:08. > :33:14.Margate and Dartford among the first towns nationwide to win a
:33:14. > :33:20.share of the money. The Sunday politick showed -- the Sun the
:33:20. > :33:29.Politics Show has shown that many towns are hoping to win in the
:33:29. > :33:38.second round. I am the leader of Dartford council. You have probably
:33:39. > :33:45.heard... Dartford's approach... different to markets. -- to
:33:45. > :33:49.Margate's. By winning, they will get advice from retell export Mary
:33:49. > :33:54.Portas who recently carried out a High Street review for the
:33:54. > :34:00.government. She visited Margate last year. Margate will get a one-
:34:00. > :34:05.off payment of �100,000. Dartford will get �79,000. Just how far will
:34:05. > :34:09.this money go? As this shop manager is well aware of doing up the High
:34:09. > :34:16.Street does not come cheap. We had the shop front put back to how it
:34:16. > :34:23.would have been originally in 1890 and that has cost around �150,000.
:34:23. > :34:27.That is just one shot. �79,000 to spend on the whole town, that is
:34:27. > :34:32.just throwing a pebble in the lake. I do nothing the money will go
:34:32. > :34:37.anywhere. Margate will use its money for pop up shops and a job
:34:37. > :34:43.club. Dartford will open up central spaces to classes and clubs. Will
:34:43. > :34:48.this money provide a long-term solution? We think that the �79,000
:34:48. > :34:52.is quite small. Quite frankly, much of what is proposed could easily
:34:52. > :34:55.have been done anyway. I am a little bit surprised that the
:34:55. > :35:00.council did not bid for the full amount of �100,000 because that
:35:00. > :35:03.would have enabled them to do a number of other things. I am sure
:35:03. > :35:06.there will be some worthwhile projects that can be done in the
:35:07. > :35:12.short term but a number of the problems are more deep-seated and
:35:12. > :35:16.they need to be addressed as well. One way of tackling this would be
:35:16. > :35:20.to give small amounts to a larger number of towns. The successful
:35:21. > :35:25.towns are geographically spread equally over the country. Barford
:35:25. > :35:29.and Margate have the highest proportions of a vacant shops. One
:35:29. > :35:32.other town in Lincolnshire has only one in 10 shops and tea.
:35:32. > :35:38.decision was probably made on political rather than economic
:35:38. > :35:45.grounds. The money has been spread evenly around the country. Let us
:35:45. > :35:51.face it, �1.2 million is in itself an absolutely miniscule sum in
:35:51. > :35:55.terms of regional development or regeneration. This is not enough to
:35:55. > :35:59.make a significant difference even if it were all spent in one place.
:35:59. > :36:03.Sir is this scheme little more than a token gesture? I think this is a
:36:03. > :36:07.classic example of gesture politics. If the government really thought
:36:07. > :36:13.that it could turn the tide of high street recession, it would be
:36:13. > :36:18.spending and a awful lot more. �100,000 is the maximum sum
:36:18. > :36:23.involved here. But that is only getting 79,000. �100,000 is a way
:36:24. > :36:29.of seeing -- as saying that we want to be seen doing something but we
:36:29. > :36:36.do not want to pay serious money because we do not think it will
:36:36. > :36:41.work. Is it just a government PR exercise to mask a deeper problem?
:36:41. > :36:47.Joining us now is Gareth Johnson the Conservative MP for Dartford.
:36:47. > :36:51.The shop owner in that report sets it out rather well. It cost him
:36:51. > :36:56.�150,000 for a new shop front. What meaningful change can you really
:36:56. > :37:00.hope to achieve with �79,000? one is claiming it is a magic wand
:37:00. > :37:04.that will make all of the challenges go away overnight. But
:37:04. > :37:13.it is a vote of confidence in the potential that but that has as a
:37:13. > :37:21.High Street. That is something that the Portas Pilot Scheme team
:37:21. > :37:26.recognised. It is a well run local authority. That is why the bid was
:37:26. > :37:31.successful. What are you going to do with �79,000? It is a boost to
:37:31. > :37:34.lots of people coming in with good ideas. People sneer at the money
:37:34. > :37:39.but it is quite surprising what a boost it can be followed, market
:37:39. > :37:44.traders who have good ideas but need a lift to get going. You give
:37:44. > :37:48.them �1,000, that helps to get the ball rolling. I am quite sure we
:37:48. > :37:53.will see Dartford growing in popularity and in success. A school
:37:53. > :37:59.for shopkeepers. What is the point of that if there are no shops?
:37:59. > :38:03.will get the community involved. The money is part of a jigsaw that
:38:03. > :38:07.needs to be put into place in order to make the town centre successful.
:38:07. > :38:11.We need to the local authority with a can-do attitude. We need projects
:38:11. > :38:15.that we have in Dartford like the park looking really good. We need
:38:15. > :38:22.an extra bit of help in the town centre. That is what we hope to get
:38:22. > :38:27.from this. Is it the reality that blue water the big shopping centre
:38:27. > :38:31.killed at Dartford High Street and you should have fought harder and
:38:32. > :38:36.earlier like Gravesend? Gravesend survive better than Dartford.
:38:36. > :38:40.Aren't you trying to breathe life into wait corpse? I was brought up
:38:40. > :38:44.in Dartford. The High Street was going downhill well before the
:38:44. > :38:48.shopping centre was built. We cannot treat be two entities are
:38:48. > :38:53.the same. We have to make sure that we do not have an attitude where we
:38:53. > :38:57.will make the High Street better by holding the shopping centre back.
:38:57. > :39:00.The shopping centre has been good for Dartford. The high street need
:39:00. > :39:06.something different to get the community involved to breathe life
:39:06. > :39:15.into the High Street. That is what the bid will help to ensure happens.
:39:15. > :39:19.Amber Rudd, the professor said that the government want to be seen to
:39:19. > :39:29.be doing something but they do not think it will work. I do not agree
:39:29. > :39:34.at all. I think it is remarkable that 371 pits were put in. It is
:39:34. > :39:37.not all about the money. It is also invigorating the community to look
:39:37. > :39:43.seriously at their high street to see what can be done. I hope there
:39:44. > :39:50.will be a lasting legacy. Will you get face down with Mary Portas?
:39:50. > :39:54.it is determined... Mary Portas? Yes, Mary Portas is determined that
:39:54. > :39:58.the 12 pilots will work so I think we will see her in Dartford. We
:39:58. > :40:02.need a positive approach. The sort of negativity we saw from the
:40:02. > :40:07.counsellor is exactly why Dartford has problems in the first place.
:40:07. > :40:12.Brighton and Hove is bidding it next time. What with �100,000
:40:12. > :40:15.achieved in a city like yours? There is a small amount. There is a
:40:15. > :40:19.risk that it would be gesture politics. I think bigger changes
:40:19. > :40:23.could be made by being able to reduce business rates so that you
:40:23. > :40:27.can get shops being opened in run- down areas and getting the empty
:40:27. > :40:32.shops back in business, we need to tackle the rise of the massive
:40:32. > :40:37.supermarkets. We have now got a dozen Tesco's, 10 Sainsbury's in
:40:37. > :40:41.Brighton. We also thank for a have a thriving independent local
:40:41. > :40:45.trading sector but it is under threat. The government should bite
:40:45. > :40:55.the bullet and look at things like monopoly rules to stop these huge
:40:55. > :40:55.
:40:55. > :41:01.supermarkets sucking the life out of the cities. Doesn't Hastings
:41:01. > :41:05.needed the money more than Brighton? I want to congratulate
:41:05. > :41:12.Dodford put through gritted teeth. I think the point of this is
:41:12. > :41:15.exactly what Caroline Lucas said. It is taking a high street...
:41:15. > :41:18.we not have more of a joint approach from the government
:41:18. > :41:21.because under this and the last government we have seen a loss of
:41:21. > :41:26.around a quarter of our post offices, we do not have the
:41:26. > :41:31.infrastructure now in our high streets. When do we get that back,
:41:31. > :41:35.and post office closures should absolutely stop... We are going to
:41:35. > :41:39.move on to rural areas. Farmers could be hit by European
:41:39. > :41:43.Commission plans to introduce greener regulations from 2014. All
:41:43. > :41:47.farmers would have to grow three crops at a time at least and 87% of
:41:47. > :41:55.their land free from cultivation and retain some permanent grassland.
:41:55. > :41:59.Critics say the arms could end up harming food production. We have
:41:59. > :42:04.won in the tent -- one in 10 of the country's farms in this region.
:42:04. > :42:13.During us now is the European Commission spokesman Roger wait. --
:42:13. > :42:19.joining us now. Why it risked damaging our farmers further one
:42:19. > :42:23.they are doing more than farmers in other European countries? The UK is
:42:23. > :42:28.doing extremely well and farmers in Kent and Sussex in particular but
:42:28. > :42:34.what we want is to raise the baseline. We want everybody in
:42:34. > :42:39.Europe, or farmers in Europe, to do such a good job. What we are
:42:39. > :42:45.planning a is the Common Agricultural Policy for the period
:42:45. > :42:49.from 2014 and we face two fundamental challenges. We have got
:42:49. > :42:55.an increase in demand in food and at the same time we have got
:42:55. > :42:59.problems with our natural resources. There are problems with water, soil
:42:59. > :43:04.and climate change and biodiversity loss. We have got to make sure we
:43:04. > :43:09.can somehow combine the two and make sure that any increase in food
:43:09. > :43:14.production comes in tandem with a green at agricultural policy.
:43:15. > :43:19.us put up on food production. 7% of land set aside. People will be
:43:19. > :43:24.thinking that they would like cheaper food. They want to know it
:43:24. > :43:29.is cheap, readily available. Why make it harder? Why so that you
:43:29. > :43:34.have to set aside some land? It is not set aside. I can make that
:43:34. > :43:40.absolutely clear. Every farm has areas which are not in use. For
:43:40. > :43:47.instance, hedgerows, grass tracks, field margins, a buffer strips
:43:48. > :43:51.being used more and more in British farmers. It is precisely that which
:43:51. > :43:56.we want to take. If there is an area of field that is not very
:43:56. > :44:00.productive, we want to make sure the farmer does not feel that they
:44:00. > :44:05.have to cultivate it does so to maximise their returns. If there is
:44:05. > :44:09.a problem there, he should be leaving it as part of what we are
:44:09. > :44:13.calling for an ecological focus area. The key point is it is not
:44:13. > :44:17.set aside, it is maintaining those areas that are not very productive.
:44:18. > :44:24.Let us look at the number of crops. You do not go to other industries
:44:24. > :44:28.and sate, as well as making cars, you have got to make motorbikes as
:44:28. > :44:32.well. Why are you increasing the regulatory burden? With the three
:44:32. > :44:39.crops, we are looking to avoid monoculture. Bearing in mind that
:44:40. > :44:44.the soil... His is an environment of public good. We are avoiding
:44:44. > :44:49.farmers year in year out grow the same thing. They are planning
:44:50. > :44:54.deeper... But we used British crop rotation. That is just as
:44:54. > :44:59.successful as protecting the soil. If there is a certified crop
:44:59. > :45:03.rotation scheme, we are willing to look at using that as a
:45:03. > :45:07.contribution fully or partly to this whole grain requirement. I
:45:07. > :45:13.underlined again that the whole point is that every farmer in
:45:13. > :45:16.Europe does this. In the UK, in the south-east in particular, we have
:45:16. > :45:21.many extremely good environmentally friendly farming practices. The key
:45:21. > :45:25.point is that we do not just want it in some areas of Kent, we want
:45:25. > :45:30.it in the whole of England and the whole of Europe. Thank you very
:45:30. > :45:34.much. Let us bring Amber Rudd and Caroline Lucas back. I would have
:45:35. > :45:38.thought you would be one of the biggest advocates of making farms
:45:38. > :45:43.greener but you oppose these plans, why? I certainly support the
:45:43. > :45:46.overall aim of making farms greener but I have reservations about the
:45:46. > :45:50.way the commission is proposing to do it with a one-size-fits-all
:45:50. > :45:54.approach across Europe. They are real concerns that without more
:45:54. > :45:59.flexibility we will have some very perverse outcomes. For example,
:45:59. > :46:02.there are risks that pastureland that the commission wants to see
:46:02. > :46:05.looking after, the way they have announced it, there is a risk
:46:05. > :46:09.farmers will get rid of that in the shorter term because it makes sense
:46:09. > :46:15.to get rid of that. We need to say that we have a crisis of
:46:15. > :46:23.biodiversity, yes, and we do need to make the Common Agricultural
:46:23. > :46:26.Policy greener. It accounts for 41% of the EU budget. But you would
:46:26. > :46:29.rather leave it up to farmers to decide how they do it? They need
:46:29. > :46:34.more flexibility because the way this is being imposed means that we
:46:34. > :46:38.could have some very perverse outcomes. You were talking about
:46:38. > :46:44.crop rotation being keep rather than simply crop diversification.
:46:44. > :46:47.These rules need to be looked at again. Their aim is right, making
:46:47. > :46:54.the agriculture was system going up, but some of the detail needs to be
:46:54. > :47:01.looked at again. Why are you so sure this could be damaging? That
:47:01. > :47:05.is not what this delivers. This insists on a level of making things
:47:05. > :47:09.greener. Our farmers are the gold standard at the moment for
:47:09. > :47:14.environmental farming. They want to continue to do that. They do not
:47:14. > :47:17.need more regulation. The whole idea of having won that type of
:47:17. > :47:22.farming policy with its green requirements for the whole of
:47:22. > :47:26.Europe is unrealistic. It is a Common Agricultural Policy.
:47:26. > :47:29.should all have the same common outcome which is a green a way of
:47:29. > :47:33.farming always with sustainable food production at the core. We
:47:33. > :47:38.must have a way of delivering it where each country can deliver it
:47:38. > :47:43.in its best way. But it seemed like he could see some movement and
:47:43. > :47:46.concessions. They would take it into account before they consider
:47:46. > :47:50.taking subsidies away. That is really important and I am hoping
:47:50. > :47:54.some of the concerns we have will be ironed out because maybe it is
:47:54. > :48:01.just a problem with the drafting or maybe people are having second
:48:01. > :48:05.thoughts. We have to learn from the environmental schemes that are
:48:05. > :48:15.already in place. Let us bring you to a round-up of
:48:15. > :48:16.
:48:16. > :48:19.the week's other events in the south-east.
:48:19. > :48:23.The Deputy Prime Minister Nick Clegg proved he is not afraid to
:48:23. > :48:27.get his hands dirty as he carried out an oil check. It is not his
:48:27. > :48:32.sudden Career Change, he was meeting apprenticeships. It comes
:48:32. > :48:38.two weeks after Iain Duncan-Smith met apprenticeships -- apprentices
:48:38. > :48:48.in Maidstone. Gordon Henderson welcomed a big
:48:48. > :48:51.
:48:51. > :48:56.jobs boost at a steel factory. The company has been bought by a Saudi
:48:56. > :49:06.it Arabian company. Lord Adonis accused the government
:49:06. > :49:07.
:49:07. > :49:11.over endless dithering. The Institute of Civil Engineers
:49:11. > :49:16.called for compulsory water metering to tackle the drought. It
:49:16. > :49:22.seems like it is a case of water, water everywhere but not enough to
:49:22. > :49:26.drop the hosepipe ban. Briefly picking up on water
:49:26. > :49:31.metering. There is also a suggestion we should pay according
:49:31. > :49:38.to what we are using water for. should certainly have more water
:49:38. > :49:42.metering. They will have it in place by 2015 which is great news.
:49:43. > :49:48.More expensive if you use it on your garden or your car? There is
:49:49. > :49:53.no reason to have purified water to clean your car, you should use it