:01:30. > :01:33.In the South West, the wind farm opponents hoping for less public
:01:33. > :01:43.money for turbines. And bad news for Nick Clegg as the
:01:43. > :01:43.
:01:43. > :30:15.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 1711 seconds
:30:15. > :30:20.Hello and welcome to the Sunday politics in the South West. Coming
:30:20. > :30:24.up in the next 20 minutes. It has been blowing a elite this
:30:24. > :30:30.week, and it is blowing in the wind that Tobin subsidies could be
:30:30. > :30:40.slashed. -- blowing a relief. -- power by no subsidies. Here with me
:30:40. > :30:47.now, is Karl Wallace, and still firmly in the Yellow Coroner, Tory
:30:47. > :30:51.MP Adrian Sanders. -- the yellow corner. Let's begin with family
:30:51. > :30:56.matters. Research published last week suggested one in five Liberal-
:30:56. > :31:00.Democrat members have left the party in the past year. Why are
:31:00. > :31:02.people will drink with their feet? people will drink with their feet?
:31:02. > :31:04.Basically because of the leadership. We're seeing Nick Clegg at the
:31:04. > :31:10.moment making some very poor moment making some very poor
:31:10. > :31:17.decisions. Students tuition fees, for one, not supporting the NHS is
:31:17. > :31:22.another. I have people coming up to me and saying, we will not support
:31:22. > :31:26.the Liberal Democrats and the again. As a father of five as well as
:31:27. > :31:33.being a nurse, I felt I had to do something, and the best way for me
:31:33. > :31:37.was too much with my feet. It rain, it is fair to say you take issue
:31:37. > :31:43.with the leadership on all kinds of policy issues. Why do you think it
:31:43. > :31:49.is still better to stay inside the party fighting what some may say it
:31:49. > :31:53.would be a hopeless cause? You do not change it by leaving the room.
:31:53. > :31:58.Decisions are made by those who turn up. The drop in membership is
:31:58. > :32:02.nothing unusual for a party, six years ago there was a study that
:32:02. > :32:09.showed the Labour party was losing one member of every 20 minutes. If
:32:09. > :32:18.that had continued, Carl would be the only member of the party. --
:32:18. > :32:24.Karl Wallace. He we looked at the specific figures. In the south-east,
:32:24. > :32:29.apparently membership is down 60% since 2009. That is really bad news,
:32:30. > :32:34.isn't it? I think it is more likely to happen in a seat we knew there
:32:34. > :32:37.is a member of Parliament. But, things will pick up, in my own
:32:37. > :32:44.constituency we saw a drop in membership and the fresh deer, but
:32:44. > :32:47.at the end of this year we may be in surplus, which is remarkable. --
:32:47. > :32:51.in the first year. What we have to get across is the reason why we are
:32:51. > :32:56.in the coalition, which I think most people understand when they
:32:56. > :33:03.look at the rest of Europe, and do things we have brought for our area.
:33:03. > :33:09.The discount on broadband charges, a bypass we have been waiting 50
:33:09. > :33:13.years for. By Clegg was in Cornwall a few weeks ago and this is what he
:33:13. > :33:18.had to say. There are some people who like their politics completely
:33:18. > :33:23.pure and tribal and prefer to have called -- politicians in opposing
:33:23. > :33:27.corners. I have never been like that. I have always believed in
:33:27. > :33:31.pluralism, in reaching across party lines to do the right thing for the
:33:31. > :33:36.country are a whole. The three essentially saying to people like
:33:36. > :33:40.you, I am comfortable in this centre-rate relationship. People
:33:40. > :33:46.like you are wrong, you are dinosaurs, you are tribal. That is
:33:46. > :33:55.what he is trying to save. Unfortunately, the Liberals are now
:33:55. > :34:04.seen as small Conservatives -- as Conservatives with a small sea. --
:34:04. > :34:08.c. Labour are getting more members. Who was at that started the
:34:08. > :34:15.privatisation of the health service? It was Labour. Who
:34:15. > :34:18.introduced tuition fees? It was Labour. Labour is as right wing as
:34:18. > :34:22.anything this Government has been doing. I am sure that Labour has
:34:22. > :34:27.made errors in the past, but you're getting a new generation coming
:34:27. > :34:34.through who are supporting Labour. I endure part of that new
:34:34. > :34:37.generation of politicians, Karl. Now, onto wind. You may remember
:34:37. > :34:44.David Cameron's catchy vote blue, go green slogans. It was all part
:34:44. > :34:47.of a mission to modernise the Tories. But how green are at his
:34:47. > :34:55.credentials in Government? -- how green are his credentials in
:34:55. > :34:59.Government? He has already strangling their growing solar
:34:59. > :35:04.industry, and now at the same could be said for the wind farm industry.
:35:04. > :35:09.This South West is said to be one of the windiest places in Europe,
:35:09. > :35:14.no wonder Cornwall was host to the UK's Commercial went to a bang. But
:35:14. > :35:24.wind farms have always been controversial. - my first
:35:24. > :35:27.
:35:27. > :35:30.commercial wind tubing. That he is part of a new group set
:35:30. > :35:35.up to fight the growth of wind turbines in Cornwall. At the moment
:35:35. > :35:41.in Cornwall alone, he says more than 400 applications are being
:35:41. > :35:48.considered, and there is no wonder when you do the maths. The script
:35:48. > :35:54.says that for a moderate to a bank the feeding tariff rate is 18.8
:35:54. > :36:00.pence per kilowatt hour. Plus another 3p if it is exported to the
:36:00. > :36:05.National Grid. That depends on how much wind there is, but on an
:36:05. > :36:12.average level, disturbing that would make just over �207,000 per
:36:12. > :36:17.year. -- this car buying. Taking into a new -- account annual cost
:36:17. > :36:23.and a minimum life of 20 years, the estimated total profit is a
:36:23. > :36:29.whopping �3 million. Now those figures could be faults -- slashed
:36:29. > :36:32.by 25%. We think that is good. Firstly, it will raise awareness
:36:32. > :36:38.for the public of the sort of profits being made. There are
:36:38. > :36:43.hundreds of thousands of pounds to be made each year. Yet, the actual
:36:43. > :36:47.impact of them on Co2 emissions, we would argue, is extremely small.
:36:47. > :36:54.but those in the renewable energy industry are seeing a 25% cut could
:36:54. > :36:58.be disastrous. A would be stunned, quite frankly. It is difficult to
:36:58. > :37:02.believe the Government would be prepared to make such a serious
:37:02. > :37:09.mistake on impacting the viability of onshore wind farms and the
:37:09. > :37:13.damaging consequences that would have for the UK. Ofgem says
:37:13. > :37:17.renewable energy puts the average household energy Bill up by �100
:37:17. > :37:22.per year. Not popular with punters, and politicians are not happy,
:37:22. > :37:25.either. In February, five of the region's MPs added their names to a
:37:25. > :37:32.letter calling on the Government to make a dramatic cut to the
:37:32. > :37:35.subsidies given to onshore wind. But is this a crowd pleaser? One
:37:35. > :37:39.enthusiast backs a senior Conservative idea of bigger
:37:39. > :37:43.community bribes. I don't think that is the right word, but I think
:37:43. > :37:48.more benefits need to go to communities to build this --
:37:48. > :37:52.political support that keeps tariffs in place. That is why in
:37:52. > :37:55.organisations such as community for renewables, the idea of recycling
:37:55. > :38:03.profits back into communities is more important. The emphasis needs
:38:03. > :38:08.to move towards that. Consultation has already taken place between the
:38:08. > :38:12.Government and when farm companies on cuts to subsidies, but that was
:38:12. > :38:16.for 10%, something the industry says it could cope with. 25% is
:38:16. > :38:23.different, and if that happens they will be hoping for another of the
:38:23. > :38:27.Chancellor's recent U-turns. We're joined now from Exeter by the
:38:27. > :38:30.Conservative MP for Tiverton and Homerton. He is one of the MPs who
:38:30. > :38:34.would like to seek subsidies slashed. Neil Parish, if you get
:38:34. > :38:39.your wish it is another kick for this claim this is the greenest
:38:39. > :38:43.Government ever? I don't think so, there is only so much money to
:38:44. > :38:48.spend on green energy, and is it right to subsidise onshore wind
:38:48. > :38:52.farms with so much money? In the end, the consumer has to pay for it.
:38:52. > :38:56.We have Hydro-Electric schemes and others, and we can look again at
:38:56. > :39:02.some of the solar power, because the price of panels has come down
:39:02. > :39:07.now, they are more effective. It is making sure we deliver green energy
:39:07. > :39:13.but at a cost that is affordable. Wind farms do not deliver power all
:39:13. > :39:19.the time. He were not one of the MPs who are rumoured to have --
:39:19. > :39:22.rumoured to exist or that all this vote blue, go green business is a
:39:22. > :39:27.lot of non-Conservative nonsense, basically?
:39:27. > :39:30.I think that green energy is essential, because I also believe
:39:30. > :39:34.you have to have a nuclear power, as well. I believe and a whole
:39:34. > :39:42.basket of energy, and I think that wind turbines on land are being
:39:42. > :39:47.over subsidised and the poorer consumers will still have to pay
:39:47. > :39:53.the bills. I think we have to be very careful how we spend
:39:53. > :39:59.consumers' money. A Adrian, this is one of these issues that is a
:39:59. > :40:03.litmus test of the coalition. The Liberal Democrats are very keen on
:40:03. > :40:06.wind power, and the Conservatives are trying to stitch them up.
:40:06. > :40:09.have a programme for Government which makes it clear we want to be
:40:10. > :40:13.the greenest Government ever. You cannot do that unless you are
:40:13. > :40:17.putting more resources into alternatives. Whether you focus at
:40:18. > :40:26.all on wind or look at it geothermal, solar, tidal, all the
:40:26. > :40:30.other possibilities, I will possibly be on the same side. What
:40:30. > :40:36.I certainly don't want to see is more nuclear power. But think it is
:40:36. > :40:41.either a nuclear or wind or the likes call-out. Labour is pretty
:40:41. > :40:47.keen on wind, but a lot of people in Dorset cannot stand it. The us
:40:47. > :40:52.is a very controversial area. In Dorset 85% of the land is a media
:40:52. > :40:59.of an outstanding natural beauty. - - is an area of outstanding natural
:40:59. > :41:05.beauty. There are proposed wind farms going forward between
:41:05. > :41:10.Portland and the Isle of Wight, which may be between 203 hundred
:41:10. > :41:16.wind turbines. If these proposed subsidies are cut, the company who
:41:17. > :41:21.are looking at this may pull out or may reduce their project. That
:41:21. > :41:26.would be catastrophic for some people in the industry. Absolutely.
:41:26. > :41:28.The Government are missing a trick here, though. They should be
:41:28. > :41:36.encouraging county councils and working as a co-operative to form
:41:36. > :41:42.this. When farm companies were really 51 -- were really councils
:41:42. > :41:49.that came together, so all that money is going to them.
:41:49. > :41:57.umbrella body that represents wave power and wind power says that, to
:41:57. > :42:00.meet the target we need to meet by 2020, onshore wind will not do it.
:42:00. > :42:04.Bader and thinks all, the Bristol Channel has the second-highest rise
:42:04. > :42:10.and fall in the world, we can use the tidal power there. We will have
:42:10. > :42:13.to be new -- to be using more renewables. We will need a mix of
:42:13. > :42:21.energies, and we will keep them running without having too much
:42:21. > :42:24.wind power. From wind to the topic of old bags. We are probably all
:42:24. > :42:28.aware of the damage discarded plastic bags can do to the
:42:28. > :42:33.environment, and we are all used to being asked if we want or need one
:42:33. > :42:38.would do when we go to the supermarket. -- want or need one
:42:38. > :42:41.when we go. Now the figure has of - - seems to be rising again, and
:42:41. > :42:46.some are asking the Government to intervene to bring it down. Our
:42:46. > :42:51.correspondent is visiting the town which tried to bang - but tried to
:42:51. > :42:55.ban plastic bags a few years ago. By years ago, this town became
:42:55. > :42:59.famous for banning plastic bags. A film by a local camera woman
:42:59. > :43:03.highlighted the damage they can cause and encouraged traders to
:43:03. > :43:09.back the campaign. After a decade on, they say it is still going
:43:09. > :43:19.strong. When we started, I was probably issuing 200 plastic bags
:43:19. > :43:24.
:43:24. > :43:29.and probably 300 plastic counter bags every day. Now I am probably
:43:29. > :43:37.selling - we charged 10p for the corn starch once, probably one or
:43:37. > :43:40.two a most -- at most. Retailers were warned they would be
:43:40. > :43:43.forced to introduce their own schemes to cut down on usage. Many
:43:43. > :43:48.big retailers now charge for their plastic bags, but recently there
:43:48. > :43:51.has been a 5% rise in the number of plastic bags taken from shops,
:43:51. > :43:56.leading for calls from the Government -- for the Government to
:43:56. > :43:59.do more. A does the Government recognise that the success of
:43:59. > :44:04.taxation schemes in Northern Ireland, Ireland and Wales, which
:44:04. > :44:08.have resulted in a 90% drop in plastic bags and raised revenue to
:44:08. > :44:14.help deal with the environmental problems caused by these icons of a
:44:14. > :44:17.throwaway society... But the Government says it is waiting to
:44:17. > :44:21.see how well taxation schemes work elsewhere before looking at any
:44:21. > :44:25.changes. There has been a voluntary scheme, as I am sure my noble
:44:26. > :44:34.friend knows, in this country which has reduced the use of single-use
:44:34. > :44:37.bags by some 45% across the UK. The first evidence of how the Welsh
:44:37. > :44:42.scheme, which started on the 1st October last year, the first
:44:42. > :44:44.evidence of that will come out imminently... The plastics industry
:44:44. > :44:49.points to recent Government research when arguing against
:44:49. > :44:52.taxation. A study has found that because of the amount of carbon
:44:52. > :44:57.used in manufacturing and transporting cotton bags, one would
:44:57. > :45:03.have to be used 131 times before it was a better option than a standard
:45:03. > :45:07.plastic carrier. Any measure that people have to be
:45:07. > :45:11.looking at is not trying to remove a product that has a low
:45:12. > :45:18.environmental impact, but to lessen its environmental impact further by
:45:18. > :45:22.eight further encouraging the re- use, recycling of bikes. Critic Sir
:45:22. > :45:32.not convinced by the report. According bike is not likely to
:45:32. > :45:34.
:45:34. > :45:38.kill anything. A plastic bag almost certainly will. -- a cotton bag. If
:45:38. > :45:41.they had taken that into account, as well as the pure concept of
:45:41. > :45:48.carbon Footprint, I think they will probably come to a markedly
:45:48. > :45:51.different conclusion. Next month, the latest official figures on
:45:51. > :45:54.plastic bag used will be published. If it emerges more people are
:45:54. > :45:58.failing to use them, the Government could face further pressure to
:45:58. > :46:04.intervene. Adrian, should the Government be
:46:04. > :46:08.more proactive in this? 6.3 billion bags are used in this
:46:09. > :46:12.country and they have a lifespan of 1,000 years. There are difficult to
:46:12. > :46:17.get you read of, and anything that can be done to get rid of our use
:46:17. > :46:22.of plastic bags... Government intervention?
:46:22. > :46:27.Bid does require Government support. Where there have been successful
:46:27. > :46:31.supermarket trials encouraging people to be used plastic bags, the
:46:31. > :46:35.Government has to do a bit more to get them to do that more regularly.
:46:35. > :46:42.Baggage usage goes down when the supermarkets have a campaign, but
:46:42. > :46:46.the creep back up again. Karl, it is the case that a lot of
:46:46. > :46:51.supermarkets ask you whether you want one or not. If you walk out --
:46:51. > :46:56.if you say yes, you walk out with six carrier bags. A absolutely. I
:46:56. > :47:01.agree with the principle Adrian has been speaking about, and it is
:47:01. > :47:06.phenomenal when you think about how many a bags are out there. The
:47:06. > :47:10.reception coming back about Wales is that it has dropped by 86% by
:47:10. > :47:16.implementing that charge. That has to be a good thing, and also when
:47:16. > :47:21.we charged 5p per bag on the 6.4 million plastic bags out there, --
:47:21. > :47:24.if we charged, it would raise millions of pounds. That money
:47:24. > :47:28.could be used for appropriate environment will usage. It has to
:47:28. > :47:38.be a good thing. The clock is ticking, but we have to make time
:47:38. > :47:40.
:47:40. > :47:44.for our regular round-up of the Rain was not the only thing to
:47:44. > :47:47.dampen their Jubilee celebrations. Volunteer stewards from Plymouth on
:47:47. > :47:52.a Government work-experience scheme were forced to sleep rough under
:47:52. > :47:56.London Bridge. We got underneath London Bridge and got told we were
:47:56. > :48:01.staying there for the night. It was horrendous. I can't believe they
:48:01. > :48:04.did it to us, really. It was horrible. Devon and Cornwall police
:48:04. > :48:08.say they will not delete DNA profiles of innocent people until
:48:08. > :48:12.the Government tells them to. The controversy over Cornwall's
:48:12. > :48:18.incinerator continues. There is anger that the taxpayer is now
:48:18. > :48:22.fitting the Bill for the developer's legal fees.
:48:22. > :48:27.The new Enterprise Plan for Newquay airport and is closer after �5
:48:27. > :48:31.billion is invested. Tens of 1,000 pounds -- tens of
:48:31. > :48:35.thousands of pounds of military equipment has been stolen from MoD
:48:35. > :48:38.bases. Be a need to crack down on this and
:48:38. > :48:48.say to people, if you call round stealing stuff, you are going to be
:48:48. > :48:50.
:48:50. > :48:54.Karl, this business of the Government Stuart -- stewards on a
:48:54. > :48:58.Government work-experience scheme, it is pretty poor stuff, isn't it?
:48:58. > :49:05.It is basic exploitation. We have de regularisation of some of the
:49:05. > :49:08.poorest workers in the South West, who are working for nothing. This
:49:08. > :49:14.organisation has a duty of care, and under its remit the Government
:49:14. > :49:21.has a duty of care to look after these people. I would say, Lord
:49:21. > :49:24.Prescott, push it and let's have an inquiry on this. John Prescott was
:49:24. > :49:28.making the point that this company will be providing the same service
:49:28. > :49:32.during the Olympics. He was saying does this kind of thing question
:49:32. > :49:36.their suitability to do that again? Per haps it does, but it is not in
:49:36. > :49:41.the Government's interest for this scheme to fail. It is offering
:49:41. > :49:46.people, when it works properly, good experience, new skills,
:49:46. > :49:49.helping to -- helping them to get back into the labour market. The
:49:49. > :49:55.Government has to firm up on this and make sure people are working