:01:25. > :01:28.In the South West... The row over how many new homes
:01:28. > :01:38.should be built in Cornwall and rural MPs fail in their fight to
:01:38. > :01:38.
:01:38. > :37:10.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2131 seconds
:37:10. > :37:15.get more cash for councils. Hello. Coming upon Sunday Politics
:37:15. > :37:20.in the South West. The Peasants revolt that never was, rural MPs
:37:20. > :37:24.fail in their fight to get more cash for council services. For the
:37:24. > :37:29.next 20 minutes I am joined by the Liberal Democrat MP Adrian Sanders
:37:29. > :37:33.and Labour councillor and Jude Robinson. This week the Health
:37:33. > :37:37.Secretary Jeremy Hunt unveiled proposals to end what he called the
:37:37. > :37:42.ruinous costs of care for the elderly. It would mean you could
:37:42. > :37:47.have assets of �123,000 before paying for care and no matter how
:37:47. > :37:53.well the EU are, the amount you pay would be capped at �75,000. Is this
:37:53. > :37:58.a good idea? I think it is. It is long overdue. It is something the
:37:58. > :38:02.Liberal Democrats promised at the last election and that we wanted to
:38:02. > :38:07.end the practice of people having to sell their homes in order to pay
:38:07. > :38:14.for care. It will help, something in the region of 100,000 people who
:38:14. > :38:19.at the moment have to sell assets in order to provide the funding for
:38:19. > :38:23.their care and I think it is a much fairer way of in the future trying
:38:23. > :38:29.to decide what contribution that people should pay given at the
:38:29. > :38:34.threshold is quite high. �75,000 to match? There was a
:38:35. > :38:39.commission that recommended the cap on spending to be set at �35,000.
:38:39. > :38:43.There is a difference and I think that is a reflection of what can be
:38:43. > :38:49.afforded. We mentioned people having it to sell their homes.
:38:49. > :38:54.45,000 people per year are forced to sell their homes. Is this
:38:54. > :38:59.something that should have been done it sooner? People having to
:38:59. > :39:03.sell their homes in their lifetime was something of that the Labour
:39:03. > :39:06.government did tackle and I do not think that has changed. People will
:39:06. > :39:12.still have to sell their homes to pay for their care bills but it
:39:12. > :39:17.will not happen until after they died. I think some of the changes
:39:17. > :39:20.are welcome in the proposals, but I do have concerns about the cap is
:39:21. > :39:26.too high and I have concerns about how this will impact on local
:39:26. > :39:36.authorities. It will allow people to have �100,000 more in assets so
:39:36. > :39:37.
:39:37. > :39:41.it is a big change. I think it is welcome. I think the proposals that
:39:41. > :39:44.the Labour Party is coming out with about integrating and not just
:39:44. > :39:49.health and social care but also mental health services would go
:39:49. > :39:53.even further towards sorting out the problems that we have got with
:39:53. > :39:58.the conflict with the NHS and social care. I think we could go
:39:58. > :40:02.further. We have to move on with our next story which is that
:40:02. > :40:07.councillors in Cornwall approved plans to build thousands of new
:40:07. > :40:12.homes. Planning officers have recommended a target of 45,400
:40:12. > :40:16.homes that members rejected that and voted in favour of just under
:40:16. > :40:21.38,000. However, three communities came forward and said they could
:40:21. > :40:28.take more so the final figure approved was 42,250. Some
:40:28. > :40:33.campaigners say the numbers do not add up. The issue of how many new
:40:33. > :40:39.homes should be built in Cornwall became clearer this week. The
:40:40. > :40:44.council outlined its plans agreeing to a figure of 42,250. The debate
:40:45. > :40:49.over the numbers continues. I am aghast at that figure. I am
:40:50. > :40:54.surprised. It is about right because it has gone through the
:40:54. > :41:00.consultation process. Planning officers had proposed to just over
:41:00. > :41:07.45,000 new homes by 2030. The panel set up by the council proposed a
:41:07. > :41:14.target of nearly 38,000 holders but three communities came forward to
:41:14. > :41:19.say that they could take 4,300 more properties and that final number,
:41:19. > :41:29.42,250 was approved. Were have almost got the same number that was
:41:29. > :41:29.
:41:29. > :41:32.voted down at the beginning of the session. The 38,001. We need to
:41:32. > :41:36.have something that is robust enough to withstand any challenge
:41:36. > :41:40.from government inspectors. The original housing targets proposed
:41:40. > :41:45.for Cornwall was 68,000 and we have come a long way down from that.
:41:45. > :41:48.Some say the adjustment of the figure is a clear demonstration of
:41:49. > :41:51.localism in action, giving communities more power to set and
:41:51. > :41:56.the priorities for a local development through neighbourhood
:41:56. > :42:00.planning but others are not so sure. Here in a manner, the parish
:42:01. > :42:04.council went to judicial review to challenge plans for 25 affordable
:42:04. > :42:11.homes. They felt only half that number was needed but the challenge
:42:11. > :42:18.was defeated. And our experience is that localism has failed. The
:42:18. > :42:23.general experience is that if you conduct a survey or take an action
:42:23. > :42:29.that accords with what the next level of Tia of local government
:42:29. > :42:34.has decided, like Cornwall Council, that is fine, but you cannot say no.
:42:34. > :42:42.That Cornwall Council or for the area says the parish council needs
:42:42. > :42:46.to accept the decision. Hopefully we will see people in the area
:42:46. > :42:51.moving in that so that he can be handled to local families and local
:42:51. > :42:54.people. That is what it is all about. That is the one thing
:42:54. > :43:00.everyone seems to agree on, the need for affordable homes for local
:43:00. > :43:06.people. Some may dispute how many of the 26,000 on the council
:43:06. > :43:12.waiting list are really in need. The housing charity Shelter says of
:43:12. > :43:15.the truer figure is almost certainly higher. It is great news
:43:15. > :43:19.that the council is saying there will be new homes. That is
:43:19. > :43:23.fantastic. The real issue is about whether those homes will be
:43:23. > :43:27.affordable. If you look at house prices in Cornwall, they are nine
:43:27. > :43:32.times more than average income, so will those houses be available to
:43:32. > :43:38.the people who need them? Will lay the affordable? The council says it
:43:38. > :43:41.hopes to achieve a minimum of 40% on affordable housing. The plan is
:43:41. > :43:47.now out for consultation and if that proved it could be in place
:43:47. > :43:52.early next year. Scott Bingham there. Jude Robinson, previous
:43:52. > :44:00.building targets for Cornwall work for 60,000 homes, are all these
:44:00. > :44:04.other figures meaningless? It does seem to be getting petty? I think
:44:04. > :44:10.you are right. It is very difficult to establish what the housing need
:44:10. > :44:14.is. There is certainly a slow down in a recent years of migration to
:44:14. > :44:20.Cornwall which was one of the previous issues that as the economy
:44:20. > :44:24.has slowed down at fewer people are coming here. Because we have got
:44:24. > :44:29.the university and higher education, more young people are staying in
:44:29. > :44:38.Cornwall so there is pressure within the county. Are you happy
:44:38. > :44:41.with the target? I did vote for it. One problem we have got is that
:44:41. > :44:45.people see houses going up but they do not see houses are that they
:44:45. > :44:49.will be able to afford or that the children it can living. When you
:44:49. > :44:54.are losing part of the countryside and part of your heritage and you
:44:54. > :44:59.do not seem to be gaining much, it is creating a massive armies. We
:44:59. > :45:05.have to get to the bottom of providing houses that are really
:45:05. > :45:09.affordable. Will people be able to rent them? Can they buy them?
:45:09. > :45:13.Affordable has become a bit it devalued. An awful lot of people
:45:13. > :45:19.who will never be able to afford to buy a house at the prices we have
:45:19. > :45:26.now. There are plans for thousands of homes in Torbay. Where is the
:45:26. > :45:33.space for them going to be? I think Torbay has come up with a figure of
:45:33. > :45:36.up to 10,000. That is part of the consultation. The question is the
:45:36. > :45:40.type of housing and if they have done the right kind of research
:45:40. > :45:45.work to find out what sort of homes are needed. We know we have
:45:45. > :45:50.thousands of people on a waiting list and we know we have a lot of
:45:50. > :45:55.local families in work who are inadequately housed in a private
:45:55. > :46:00.sector accommodation, often with absentee landlords. Will it be
:46:00. > :46:08.mainly green field sites? A great deal can still be found on a
:46:08. > :46:14.brownfield sites. What about about shops? You see that in places like
:46:14. > :46:17.Barcelona. It means town centres are maintained. Torbay has done a
:46:17. > :46:23.bit of that and I am sure the councillors will have plans to do
:46:23. > :46:26.more. There are quite a few buildings that are empty, that
:46:26. > :46:33.could be used, sides that could be clear that that had buildings on
:46:33. > :46:38.them at the moment. Is this likely to be done? The real issue is
:46:38. > :46:42.making sure that the type of homes that the supply in the future need
:46:42. > :46:47.local housing need and what we do not want his private developers
:46:47. > :46:51.coming in, then advertising in national newspapers for people to
:46:51. > :46:54.come down here for homes that they never thought they wanted in the
:46:54. > :47:04.first place. Especially when we have so many local people who
:47:04. > :47:06.
:47:06. > :47:12.cannot afford to get house. Where previous Labour targets wrong?
:47:12. > :47:16.does seem very high. A lot of the previous housing targets were put
:47:16. > :47:20.together by a regional Assembly and I think devolving that decision
:47:20. > :47:24.closer to Cornwall is probably coming up with a better figure. I
:47:24. > :47:28.agree totally with Adrian. We have got to build the right kind of
:47:28. > :47:33.houses and make sure we're getting to the people in need and that is
:47:33. > :47:36.the big question. Moving on. In recent weeks that the region's MPs
:47:36. > :47:41.have been voicing objections to the government's funding of rural
:47:41. > :47:45.councils. It is unfair that urban areas get 50% more cash per head
:47:45. > :47:50.but when it came to the crunch on Wednesday night, not a single
:47:50. > :47:53.coalition MP from the South West voted against the local government
:47:53. > :48:00.settlement. Some council leaders are now very concerned about the
:48:00. > :48:04.future. You pay your council tax and you expect your rubbish to be
:48:04. > :48:10.collected, but in rural areas, providing essential services like
:48:10. > :48:16.this costs more than it does in towns and cities. It is twice as
:48:16. > :48:21.expensive to do a country route because of the travelling around
:48:21. > :48:26.than it is to do a town Rich. It is a couple of miles and you collect
:48:26. > :48:31.about five times as much. There are more sheep than people in West
:48:31. > :48:37.Devon. It is a thinly spread community and if you live here, you
:48:37. > :48:44.pay �200 more in council tax per year than if you live here, three
:48:44. > :48:49.miles over the border in Plymouth. People in rural areas pay more in
:48:49. > :48:53.council tax her head than people living in urban areas and because
:48:53. > :49:02.of the cost of delivering services in these areas, they get less for
:49:02. > :49:08.their money so they are hit twice. Countryside campaigners say urban
:49:08. > :49:13.areas get 50% more funding per head despite recent lobbying, that gap
:49:13. > :49:16.is not likely to change any time soon. Councils like West Devon are
:49:16. > :49:22.disappointed with what the government has given them to spend
:49:22. > :49:27.next year. This week, the leader put up council tax ignoring pleas
:49:27. > :49:34.from Eric Pickles to freeze bills. We do not want to do this but next
:49:34. > :49:38.April, we have to find another �720,000 against what will then be
:49:39. > :49:43.something like a 7.1 million pound budget. We need every single penny
:49:43. > :49:47.that we can in order to continue to provide a good quality service the
:49:47. > :49:51.to the residents that we are here to serve. Earlier this month, the
:49:51. > :49:56.government announced a grant meaning of that Devon councils will
:49:56. > :50:02.get nearly a million pounds to make savings. That did not stop an angry
:50:03. > :50:08.backbench debate on Monday, calling for more cash. Both Torridge and
:50:08. > :50:14.West Devon are small, highly rural councils. Each of them are facing a
:50:14. > :50:18.threat... In recent weeks there have been strong words from South
:50:18. > :50:22.West MPs are angry about the lack of government money.
:50:22. > :50:26.constituents expect to be treated fairly and they expect me to stand
:50:26. > :50:30.up as their MP and say to government, irrespective of whether
:50:30. > :50:35.it is my own government, you have got this role. It is unbelievable
:50:35. > :50:40.after all that work that it can actually get worse. Despite the
:50:40. > :50:43.strength of feeling, none of the region's coalition MPs have voted
:50:43. > :50:48.against the local government finance settlement. The government
:50:48. > :50:55.says it is a fair deal at in West Devon, the council leader disagrees.
:50:55. > :50:59.The East say it is their. I disagree. I cannot comment on the
:50:59. > :51:05.divide, I do not know enough about it. It is not fair in my opinion,
:51:05. > :51:09.it is not fair on the electors and the council tax payers, the
:51:09. > :51:16.residents of West Devon and other rural areas. It is not fair. The
:51:16. > :51:20.figures prove it is not fair. Earlier I spoke to the Conservative
:51:20. > :51:26.MP Neil Parish and asked him why, despite his serious concerns, he
:51:26. > :51:31.decided to vote for at the local government settlement. Because I
:51:31. > :51:37.believe the government is going to do something about it. I did say in
:51:37. > :51:39.the House of Commons that I can mobilise the local people in I need
:51:39. > :51:44.to and I have taken and the government at their word that they
:51:44. > :51:48.will look at it. If they do not, they will have trouble in the
:51:48. > :51:54.future, because many of us who represent rural constituencies are
:51:54. > :51:58.not happy, we're not getting our fair share. You did it promises us
:51:58. > :52:07.that there would be a Peasants revolt and it has not amounted to
:52:07. > :52:11.that? We did get a little bit more money, not enough, and we did get
:52:11. > :52:20.promises. I have said it to the Minister that you cannot but the
:52:20. > :52:25.promise in a pocket, you want money and he is very aware that there is
:52:25. > :52:32.quite a gang of us. Do you believe there will be more money? How much
:52:32. > :52:36.more are you likely to get? There will be a little bit of funding
:52:36. > :52:41.around the edges for particular projects. What we are very
:52:41. > :52:45.interested to see is that they have not close the that son following
:52:45. > :52:50.years. The problem with this settlement, if it is set in stone
:52:50. > :52:55.and this year, the following years when we move towards district
:52:55. > :52:59.council keeping it more, it will have a real effect on their future
:52:59. > :53:09.funding. Why should authorities like East Devon and made it Devon
:53:09. > :53:13.
:53:13. > :53:20.have a cat of 6% and Greenwich a cut of 3%? This is not sustainable.
:53:20. > :53:26.This makes people cynical about politics I have rebelled in the
:53:26. > :53:31.past. Ice especially rebelled over the referendum in the Europe. I am
:53:31. > :53:35.not adverse to rebelling that there are times, when it you can do a lot
:53:35. > :53:39.of work behind the scenes and sometimes a threat of a rebellion
:53:39. > :53:43.can be better than an actual rebellion. If you will not defeat
:53:43. > :53:48.the government, then they have got away with it. If you threaten a
:53:48. > :53:56.rebellion, perhaps they will look again and that way you get more in
:53:56. > :54:05.the way of a negotiation. Thank you very much. Jude Robinson, what does
:54:05. > :54:09.this boat mean for rural councils? Are they facing disaster? Yes. It
:54:09. > :54:13.is difficult to see how councils will cope in the coming years
:54:13. > :54:17.because not only have they faced the huge cuts in the past four
:54:17. > :54:24.years but it looks as though the next funding round will be worse.
:54:24. > :54:28.Cornwall Council has saved �170 million, it is still having to put
:54:28. > :54:32.money from reserves into the budget next year. Councils are at the
:54:32. > :54:36.front line of service delivery, whether it is libraries, care for
:54:36. > :54:41.the elderly... That is the equation we need to be looking at, what is
:54:41. > :54:46.the need out there? What other services we are trying to deliver
:54:46. > :54:51.and what funding do we need? voted for this. Have you got any
:54:51. > :54:56.sympathy? The bottom line is that the money is not there and
:54:56. > :55:01.everything is having to be tightened up, whether it is a
:55:01. > :55:07.government department or a local government a authority. Some of the
:55:07. > :55:12.cuts include things that could affect beaches, funding for beaches,
:55:12. > :55:19.tourist information centres also the safety alarms and that people
:55:19. > :55:22.wear around and their next. mayor of Torre Abbey spoke before
:55:22. > :55:26.Christmas asking MPs if we can approach government so that he
:55:26. > :55:31.could pay back �50 million that the previous Conservative mayor had
:55:31. > :55:36.taken out for projects that they have not spent. The idea that this
:55:36. > :55:40.is an impoverished council is not true. You have now got �50 million
:55:40. > :55:50.to spend. If that money was invested in an income stream, it
:55:50. > :55:52.
:55:52. > :55:56.were bring in money that could be used. How should it be spent?
:55:56. > :56:01.not that clear cut, but certainly investing in social housing to
:56:01. > :56:09.ensure a rentable income, investing in Workspace it to build on the
:56:09. > :56:13.good news of the bypass so that we can find premises as -- premises
:56:13. > :56:19.for businesses. This would bring in income that would be greater than
:56:19. > :56:29.what the council is having to pay in interest on those loans. Is it
:56:29. > :56:31.
:56:31. > :56:37.unfair the balance between rural and urban areas? There are a lot of
:56:37. > :56:41.increased costs in rural areas. In Cornwall, you have urban areas as
:56:41. > :56:45.well that have the additional costs on top of that. The are in a
:56:45. > :56:51.difficult position because the labour wants to give urban areas
:56:51. > :56:56.are more money but yet you are in a rural council. Labour's decision is
:56:56. > :57:02.to try and match the funding with the needs and there is a whole
:57:02. > :57:11.range. For too long we have had this argument while it Labour was
:57:11. > :57:16.in power. We need a funding mechanism that that is fair to all
:57:16. > :57:22.areas that is based on local need and we need to allow councils to be
:57:22. > :57:26.freed at to have income streams in themselves. They have more freedom,
:57:26. > :57:30.fiscally in order to look after their own areas. Perhaps that is
:57:30. > :57:39.where the coalition is coming in. Now our regular round-up of the
:57:39. > :57:43.political wing in 60 seconds. -- The Week in 60 Seconds. Seven
:57:44. > :57:49.seaside towns were promised cash to revive their weaker economies. In
:57:49. > :57:53.Torbay, the mayor said the money could mean a 350 new jobs. We are
:57:53. > :57:58.delighted to have won at this ground. The Prime Minister said in
:57:58. > :58:01.Devon it would get a chunk of European funding, news which
:58:01. > :58:07.delighted in the county council leader. We're getting back some of
:58:07. > :58:14.the money we are putting in. Almost half the region's GPs say they
:58:14. > :58:22.might quit because of NHS reform according to a survey. Here,
:58:22. > :58:26.councillors rejected plans to build wind turbines. We are confident
:58:26. > :58:32.that any objection to this application will give us the right
:58:32. > :58:38.result. David Cameron was pressed on horsemeat. It is the still
:58:38. > :58:46.eating are processed beef? Horse rugs may have entered the food
:58:46. > :58:51.chain via a Taunton abattoir. Let us look at horsemeat. Who is to
:58:51. > :58:55.blame in this? Is the government, is that the supermarkets or
:58:55. > :59:00.consumers were being it too demanding for a cheap goods? The it
:59:00. > :59:05.is probably a bit of all of that. We need to discover if the food is
:59:05. > :59:10.safe. That is crucial. The secondary element is we want to be
:59:10. > :59:14.sure that when we buy something that says it is beef is that it
:59:15. > :59:20.actually is the. Should meet at like this at the taken off the
:59:20. > :59:26.shelves? Take it off the shelves and people should go to their local
:59:26. > :59:32.butchers. We are looking forward to a revival in Cornwall. Do you think
:59:32. > :59:37.that is likely? Yes. The last time someone said to me that they went
:59:37. > :59:43.to the local picture, it was below. There was a queue. Processed meat
:59:43. > :59:51.is the problem and we do not necessarily have local processed