:00:37. > :00:46.Morning, welcome to the veritable pot pourri that is this morning's
:00:46. > :00:52.Sunday Politics. We have Alastair Charmichael. We'll ask him what he
:00:52. > :00:56.has that his predecessor Michael Moore hadn't. Ken Clarke just keeps
:00:56. > :01:03.going on and on and on. He'll bang his drum for Europe.
:01:03. > :01:06.Free of the shackles of Government, former Energy Secretary Chris Huhne
:01:06. > :01:08.will be with us. We'll ask him for the inside scoop.
:01:08. > :01:20.And coming up in the South... From Diane Abbott
:01:20. > :01:22.And coming up in the South... From here to eternity, the cost
:01:22. > :01:25.And coming up in the South... From says we've misunderstood the problem
:01:25. > :01:30.of human trafficking and that men are the forgotten victims.
:01:30. > :01:35.And with me, as always, are the forgotten victims.
:01:36. > :01:40.pundits who we try to shuffle out of a job but failed miserably, Mick
:01:40. > :01:50.watt, Miranda Green Andijan an Ganesh. They'll Tweet like mad as if
:01:50. > :01:59.Is Ed Miliband's Labour Party moving chid owe Cabinet reshuffle was seen
:01:59. > :02:07.a a shift to the lot of. Two have announced policy changes which could
:02:07. > :02:13.Pensions Secretary Rachel Reeves says Labour will be tougher on the
:02:13. > :02:16.Tories. While Tristram Hunt says Labour loves Tory-style free schools
:02:16. > :02:25.after all. Here he is on the BBC viewers. If you are a group of
:02:25. > :02:28.parents, social entrepreneurs, teachers, interested in setting
:02:28. > :02:31.parents, social entrepreneurs, school in areas where you need new
:02:31. > :02:33.school place, the Labour Government will be on your side. That's free
:02:33. > :02:40.enterprise and innovation. It will will be on your side. That's free
:02:40. > :02:46.be in areas of need. We have a school places crisis going on. It
:02:46. > :02:59.teachers in these schools. And accountability. What is going on
:02:59. > :03:07.with the Al Madina school is because of terrible mistakes with Michael
:03:07. > :03:10.changed, the change of tone is I'm not sure if the policies have
:03:10. > :03:12.changed, the change of tone is remarkable, both on welfare and
:03:13. > :03:16.changed, the change of tone is schools. A significant change of
:03:16. > :03:24.reshuffle on the Labour frontbench last week was init wered as a purge
:03:24. > :03:31.of Blair rights. It seemed to be a purge of anti-reform thinking.
:03:31. > :03:35.Rachel Reeves was not saying anythi different on substance but saying
:03:35. > :03:41.Labour will be tough than the Tories on welfare. You've seen that clip
:03:41. > :03:47.from Tristram, free schools will be allowed to be set up in areas of
:03:47. > :03:51.need. Greater oversight. But a completely different change of tone,
:03:52. > :03:58.we are on the side of parents and social entrepreneurs who want to set
:03:58. > :04:06.these up. A different change. Why are they doing this? On education,
:04:06. > :04:11.polarised. You've had the Michael department. This weekend, we've
:04:11. > :04:14.polarised. You've had the Michael leaked memos from one of Michael
:04:14. > :04:18.Gove's advisers which are extreme views about the state of education.
:04:18. > :04:25.And on the other side teaching unions. It hasn't led to a healthy
:04:25. > :04:29.debate which represents what parents want out of schools or employers.
:04:29. > :04:33.This is a huge move from the Labour Party to sound more reasonable.
:04:33. > :04:37.This is a huge move from the Labour have been silent on education which
:04:37. > :04:45.is a huge policy area on the left. Is this a focus group-driven change?
:04:45. > :04:52.They've seen the polls. Welfare reforms are hugery popular and free
:04:52. > :04:57.only apiece the focus groups by changing the policy substantially. I
:04:57. > :05:01.always thought a test for this Labour reshuffle was not whether Ed
:05:01. > :05:06.Miliband would promote Blair rights, it is clear he did, it is whether
:05:06. > :05:12.they would be allowed to be Blair rights. When Stephen Twigg carried
:05:12. > :05:15.the education portfolio it was clear his own views were closer to the
:05:15. > :05:20.Government than he was allowed to let on. He was constrained. There is
:05:20. > :05:25.no point of giving Tristram Hunt this job if he is not allowed to say
:05:25. > :05:28.what he thinks. I wouldn't mind betting privately he thinks free
:05:28. > :05:35.schools should be available beyond just areas of need. He hasn't yet
:05:35. > :05:44.defined need. It could be, we've run schools are so bad we need schools.
:05:44. > :05:55.If that is it, it is the same Asics itsing Government policy. In they
:05:55. > :06:00.unsatisfactory that's no different. He wanted to say he was in favour of
:06:00. > :06:05.higher educational standards and rigour, he had to tell the audience
:06:05. > :06:09.he has a Cambridge PhD to attack Michael Gove. That was difficult for
:06:09. > :06:17.Tristram Hunt he had to mention that. Is that worth something, a PhD
:06:17. > :06:24.from Cambridge? Obviously to him it is. He said they would demand proper
:06:24. > :06:34.teaching qualifications. That could teaching? Independent schools do not
:06:34. > :06:38.have to have teachers with formal teaching qualifications. I've never
:06:38. > :06:48.been to one? What about you? That decision by Michael Gove to allow
:06:48. > :06:53.free schools to employ nonunionised and non-trained people, so he has to
:06:53. > :06:58.Watch this space. The dust settled after the party resufficients. Do
:06:58. > :07:10.the Tories look a bit more like Britain. Do the Tories look more
:07:10. > :07:15.#4 With reshuffles, you're never really certain. There's whispers,
:07:15. > :07:21.rumours, guesses. But the only way to know it is underway is keeping
:07:21. > :07:27.beady eyes on a front door. Up until now, the only way we knew who was in
:07:27. > :07:30.and who was out was who came walking down this bit of Downing Street
:07:30. > :07:34.and who was out was who came walking a smile on their face after going to
:07:34. > :07:38.see the boss. The once who are to be sacked, they usually go round the
:07:38. > :07:47.back. Not this time. No, something new alerted us all. The-PM started
:07:47. > :07:50.can't remember a triple decker reshuffle where you've three parties
:07:51. > :07:57.changing ministerial teams at the resufficient happened on Twitter.
:07:57. > :08:04.Not that the press stopped watching the door as well. News was a bit
:08:04. > :08:10.Charmichael replaced Michael Moore, the first to be pounced on. I'm
:08:10. > :08:14.disappointed to be leaving office now but pleased at what I've been
:08:15. > :08:18.able to achieve in the last couple of years. Not as pleased as one
:08:18. > :08:34.imagines as the man receiving the welcome that went on, and on and
:08:34. > :08:42.simultaneously having Jeremy Browne, in a sense seen off the premises of
:08:42. > :08:58.the Home Office in conspiracy to let # Blowing hi Jude through a traffic
:08:58. > :09:02.Democrats. We tend to think they are herbivorous. Sacking a Cabinet
:09:02. > :09:04.Minister, another minister, Jeremy Browne. By lunch time, the Tory
:09:04. > :09:09.ranks were shifting too. The PM Browne. By lunch time, the Tory
:09:09. > :09:12.to boost the numbers of telegenic women walking into Government and
:09:12. > :09:20.turning perceptions around. He tipped a so-called flatcap to men
:09:20. > :09:23.backgrounds with room for some which fitted neither label but are friends
:09:23. > :09:30.of George Osborne. And, all the while, those new Tory ministers
:09:30. > :09:33.of George Osborne. And, all the learning of Labour's changes. Labour
:09:33. > :09:36.too knows the value of new young blood striding into the limelight.
:09:36. > :09:43.Again some with TV experience of that. Tristram Hunt and Gloria de
:09:43. > :09:46.peer row would be hard to describe as hard left. But Blairbrushing
:09:46. > :09:51.peer row would be hard to describe past out of the picture seemed to be
:09:51. > :09:57.the name of the day. Liam Byrne With Diane Abbott also gone, was
:09:57. > :09:59.this really a Blair right cull? It depends what you mean. Blair right
:09:59. > :10:03.used to mean someone who wanted depends what you mean. Blair right
:10:03. > :10:07.Blair to be leader of the Labour Party. Somebody who worked closely
:10:07. > :10:11.with him. Now it means sometimes people who believe in a certain
:10:11. > :10:14.with him. Now it means sometimes of ideologyies or ideas. There are
:10:14. > :10:17.still very much those kind of Blair rights within the party. But we
:10:17. > :10:20.still very much those kind of Blair seeing the group around Tony Blair
:10:20. > :10:27.are not long assassin flew enjoys as they once were. By evening, it was
:10:27. > :10:32.over. New bees were sharing the ministers quietly thanked commits
:10:32. > :10:46.raters. Or -- commiserators. Or ministers quietly thanked commits
:10:46. > :10:50.disified. How much much someone standing here might want it to be
:10:50. > :10:58.the case, you are unlikely to get someone coming out of that do going
:10:58. > :11:04."how could." And running off crying! And the brand, spanking new Scottish
:11:04. > :11:11.Secretary Alastair Charmichael joins us from Orkney on a line that hasn't
:11:12. > :11:17.been used since the fleet was used in the outbreak of World War I! I
:11:17. > :11:20.wasn't around at the time. I'm hearing you loud and clear. Why
:11:20. > :11:25.wasn't around at the time. I'm you agreed to run a department?
:11:25. > :11:30.wasn't around at the time. I'm you wanted to abolish six years
:11:30. > :11:31.wasn't around at the time. I'm Hello? Maybe our connections are not
:11:31. > :11:37.Charmichael. Can you hear me? I Hello? Maybe our connections are not
:11:37. > :11:42.hear you now. There was a nasty second there where you disappeared.
:11:42. > :11:43.Let me try the question again. Why have you agreed to run a department
:11:43. > :11:49.you wanted to abolish six years have you agreed to run a department
:11:49. > :11:53.Because this is the, probably one of the most important jobs in British
:11:53. > :12:00.politics at the moment. To ensure that Scotland remains part of the
:12:00. > :12:06.UK. Even when I was talking about the reconfiguration of rep sen Taigs
:12:06. > :12:10.of Scotland -- representation of Scotland within Whitehall, there was
:12:10. > :12:14.always a job to be done. That is true in spades now. I will focus on
:12:14. > :12:17.making sure the UK Government has a real voice in that debate. What
:12:17. > :12:18.making sure the UK Government has a you that Michael Moore didn't have?
:12:18. > :12:24.Look, I think Michael Moore did you that Michael Moore didn't have?
:12:24. > :12:31.excellent job. The work he did delivering the Edinburgh agreement
:12:31. > :12:40.clear legal and decisive referendum, the work delivering extra powers to
:12:40. > :12:47.substantial piece of work. I'm not friend of mine. I will say that
:12:47. > :12:47.substantial piece of work. I'm not we go forward into this, this is now
:12:47. > :12:52.about the actual debate itself. we go forward into this, this is now
:12:52. > :13:01.will be putting the case, with some passion, I hope, for Scotland to
:13:01. > :13:08.just some abstract debate about nationhood, sovereignty, this is a
:13:08. > :13:16.their livelihoods, the cost of their mortgage. That and an awful lot
:13:16. > :13:24.challenge. I understand that. But if you're being put in there to save
:13:24. > :13:29.the union, every pole has the no -- poll has the no campaign margin
:13:29. > :13:34.alley ahead. Mr Moore was doing pretty well to save the union. I
:13:34. > :13:41.suspect you've been given the job to Scotland? And lieu, you misread
:13:41. > :13:44.suspect you've been given the job to situation if you -- Andrew, you
:13:44. > :13:48.misread the situation new think anybody is going to be the person
:13:48. > :13:50.who will save the union. The people who will save the union are the
:13:50. > :13:54.people of Scotland if they turn who will save the union are the
:13:54. > :13:58.next year and vote to save the union. We have to put the case for
:13:58. > :14:04.that. That is what I will be doing. Look at the position of your own
:14:04. > :14:11.party. You came fourth in the last Scottish parentry elections. You
:14:11. > :14:17.were even behind the Conservatives. The latest poll has you still in
:14:17. > :14:22.fourth. Are you there because you're a bruiser and you will pep up the
:14:22. > :14:25.Liberal Democrats opportunity in Scotland. If I had a pound for
:14:25. > :14:29.everybody to referred to me as being Scotland. If I had a pound for
:14:29. > :14:33.a bruiser, I wouldn't need to be sitting here this morning. I could
:14:33. > :14:38.have retired by now. The truth of this, if I can address it once and
:14:38. > :14:45.for all, I have done probably one of the most complex and subtle jobs in
:14:45. > :14:50.three-and-a-half years, Liberal Democrat Chief Whip in a Coalition
:14:50. > :14:53.survived in that job a week, let alone three-and-a-half years, if I
:14:53. > :14:59.was the sort of person who went around picking unnecessary fights.
:14:59. > :15:03.So, can we just please forget about this business about being a bruiser.
:15:04. > :15:08.As far as the position of the party in the polls, this is true also
:15:08. > :15:10.As far as the position of the party the referendum vote, opinion polls
:15:10. > :15:14.are a snapshot. They are not a prediction of what will happen in
:15:14. > :15:19.the future. I will be out there putting the case. Neither the next
:15:19. > :15:24.election nor the referendum is one or lost yet. One of the things I
:15:24. > :15:32.really want to be guarding against because we are a good margin ahead
:15:32. > :15:39.today, 12 months out from the actual polling day, that it is in the bag.
:15:40. > :15:42.Believe me, Andrew, it is not. As you know, wasn't for the Liberal
:15:42. > :15:52.Democrats. Not just talking about the polls. You came fourth in the
:15:52. > :16:02.You said you were happy to facial ex-Salmond in a TV debade. Should
:16:02. > :16:14.David Cameron face him? I am happy debate. Should David Cameron face
:16:14. > :16:18.him? No, because that allows Alex Nationalists to portray this as
:16:18. > :16:22.him? No, because that allows Alex sort of contest or choice between a
:16:22. > :16:24.vision of Scottish social democracy and English conservativism, which it
:16:24. > :16:29.is not. This is a debate that has to is not. This is a debate that has to
:16:29. > :16:38.be held in Scotland about the future of Scotland amongst Scots. David
:16:38. > :16:42.Cameron has a very important part in Scotland's public life, but he is
:16:42. > :16:47.not Scottish and I think he will accept Commies edit himself in fact,
:16:47. > :16:56.the person who should be debating Darling. He has got a Scottish name
:16:57. > :17:03.wealthiest of Scotland at some stage in the past. Anyway, you described
:17:03. > :17:10.the campaign to keep the union together as lacking passion, were
:17:10. > :17:16.you referring to the campaign or referring to Alistair Darling. I
:17:17. > :17:23.think what I was saying is that referring to Alistair Darling. I
:17:23. > :17:29.we move into this new stage, and Alistair Darling said it himself, we
:17:29. > :17:35.are now campaigning for people Alistair Darling said it himself, we
:17:35. > :17:41.hearts because if you look at the range of papers the Government has
:17:41. > :17:49.published, it is pretty clear the arguments lie in relation to the
:17:49. > :17:55.head. I am not giving up the battle for the hearts and Scotland because
:17:55. > :17:57.there is a good strong case, as somebody who is proud to be Scottish
:17:57. > :18:03.and to be British, for Scotland somebody who is proud to be Scottish
:18:03. > :18:09.remain part of the UK. You come somebody who is proud to be Scottish
:18:09. > :18:14.distilleries and I understand you celebratory drink for your new post.
:18:14. > :18:21.Not a drop has touched my lips. celebratory drink for your new post.
:18:21. > :18:26.supporting local business! I will be making up for lost time on the
:18:26. > :18:28.supporting local business! I will be of November, I will be doing it
:18:28. > :18:33.supporting local business! I will be aid of Macmillan Cancer care and if
:18:34. > :18:39.website, they can donate. It is worthwhile. I cannot think of a
:18:39. > :18:50.better cause. One Cabinet minister who many thought might get Reef
:18:50. > :18:53.better cause. One Cabinet minister Clarke. Welcome to Sunday Politics.
:18:53. > :19:02.minorities, where did you fit in? I minorities, where did you fit in? I
:19:03. > :19:08.would describe myself as the elder statesman, to be polite, but it
:19:08. > :19:11.would describe myself as the elder difficult to replace them. I enjoy
:19:11. > :19:13.it. It is a great privilege to have a role in Cabinet and I will carry
:19:13. > :19:19.on as long as David wants me to a role in Cabinet and I will carry
:19:19. > :19:24.I have seen many reshuffles, they are dreadful and I seem to have
:19:24. > :19:29.survived them so far. Did David Cameron talk to you before this
:19:29. > :19:37.reshuffle? No, he didn't. I would have had expected a phone call,
:19:37. > :19:47.asking, how do you think about stepping down, but he didn't and my
:19:47. > :19:51.role is one of giving my wit and wisdom to the Cabinet and meetings
:19:51. > :19:56.of the Security Council so he has got to put up with me a bit longer.
:19:56. > :20:02.You said you are going to stand again at the next election, why
:20:02. > :20:05.You said you are going to stand you keep going? What do you hope to
:20:05. > :20:10.achieve in politics? I am mostly a political anorak, I have been since
:20:10. > :20:16.I was very small, by the process of politics but the older I get I get
:20:16. > :20:20.governance of the country and at the moment the combination of problems
:20:20. > :20:25.is quite appalling. The difficulty of tackling the modern world is
:20:25. > :20:28.is quite appalling. The difficulty difficult and I find it fascinating.
:20:28. > :20:30.The old argument that attracts every decent person into politics, you
:20:30. > :20:34.might be able sometimes to make decent person into politics, you
:20:34. > :20:37.bit of difference, and I try to decent person into politics, you
:20:37. > :20:40.that. I try not to hark back on decent person into politics, you
:20:40. > :20:43.experience but we will have a lot of tough problems which I think the
:20:43. > :20:50.Conservative Government will have to tackle. You opposed referenda on
:20:50. > :20:56.Maastricht, the Lisbon Treaty, you were even against one on Britain
:20:56. > :21:03.adopting the euro. It must follow that you are against the referenda
:21:03. > :21:12.on Britain's membership to the EU? I accountable to the long-term and
:21:12. > :21:18.representatives, but this is a minority now and my colleagues have
:21:19. > :21:23.firmly decided a referendum needs to be held to settle the question of
:21:23. > :21:27.Britain's relationship with the European Union which I think is
:21:27. > :21:31.Britain's relationship with the of the most important things in
:21:31. > :21:37.Britain's place in the modern world politicians are able to look after
:21:37. > :21:44.the living standards, the economy, the safety against terrorism. Last
:21:44. > :21:48.the living standards, the economy, summer you said that only extreme
:21:48. > :21:54.nationalists wanted a silly EU referendum. It follows your party
:21:54. > :22:00.must be full of extremely silly nationalists. The people who are
:22:00. > :22:06.desperate to have a referendum are all the people who actually want to
:22:06. > :22:11.referendum will involve the public and people like me have got to get
:22:11. > :22:14.across to the public, don't just feel angry about the last thing
:22:14. > :22:16.across to the public, don't just read in the newspaper about what the
:22:16. > :22:21.commission is or is not doing, do commission is or is not doing, do
:22:21. > :22:29.bear in mind this is our base in the modern world. We happen to be a
:22:29. > :22:35.leading member, almost as valuable and rich as the Americans, from
:22:35. > :22:40.influence in events. That is not just how the politicians get on
:22:40. > :22:47.influence in events. That is not politicians look after us when we
:22:47. > :22:52.spilling over from the Middle East, or we face public services being
:22:52. > :23:00.threatened. You didn't even turn up to vote for the bill which will
:23:00. > :23:03.threatened. You didn't even turn up engagements on the Friday concerned.
:23:03. > :23:06.It seemed to get through without my participation. You didn't want to be
:23:06. > :23:16.seen voting for something your heart Look, many of your colleagues I
:23:16. > :23:23.seen voting for something your heart interviewed say that if the choice
:23:23. > :23:28.was between the state -- the status quo with the European Union and
:23:28. > :23:32.leaving, they would leave. The truth is that you would vote to stay in
:23:32. > :23:40.even on the status quo, wouldn't supporting the EU to leave now if I
:23:41. > :23:45.got chance. I think our economy supporting the EU to leave now if I
:23:45. > :23:54.investment, as in Washington last been if we were outside the EU.
:23:54. > :24:01.investment, as in Washington last week. We are trying to roll forward
:24:01. > :24:04.the prospect of free trade and I have to reassure Americans that
:24:04. > :24:09.the prospect of free trade and I are not likely to leave the EU to
:24:09. > :24:14.That is true but it also needs reform. The cry for reform, which is
:24:14. > :24:22.particularly Germany, is a good reform. The cry for reform, which is
:24:22. > :24:24.Even if David Cameron came back reform. The cry for reform, which is
:24:24. > :24:33.nothing from Brussels, you would still vote to stay in, correct?
:24:33. > :24:39.one which is dwindling in comparison with others, in the modern world it
:24:39. > :24:43.would be dangerous. I also think the dangers of the Middle East and the
:24:43. > :24:54.dangers of some of the countries disengage. I will take that as a
:24:54. > :25:00.strengthen the case, and of some members of the public don't agree
:25:00. > :25:06.persuaded when David delivers his reforms. The latest poll gives
:25:06. > :25:10.Labour a ten point lead over the Tories and the reason why it has a
:25:10. > :25:14.ten point lead is because UKIP are up there with 18% of the vote and
:25:14. > :25:19.ten point lead is because UKIP are the Tory vote has slumped in the
:25:19. > :25:25.Paul to 27%. How would you see off UKIP? By saying you need a strong
:25:25. > :25:30.Paul to 27%. How would you see off and effective Government. We faced
:25:30. > :25:35.terrible problems. Every Government I have been in has been behind in
:25:36. > :25:40.the polls. This Government is not as popular as the previous Government I
:25:40. > :25:42.have served in under the three previous prime ministers. When you
:25:42. > :25:46.get an election, people have to previous prime ministers. When you
:25:46. > :25:52.themselves who do we want to decide the issues of war and peace in this
:25:53. > :25:58.country? Who do we want to get us out of our economic problems. I
:25:59. > :26:03.don't think Ed Miliband is up to it. That generalised stuff will not
:26:03. > :26:07.don't think Ed Miliband is up to it. off UKIP. People will not listen to
:26:07. > :26:11.that. When people answer an opinion poll, they tell you how annoyed
:26:11. > :26:16.that. When people answer an opinion are by something that has recently
:26:16. > :26:20.upset them, but people are more sensible than this. Every Government
:26:20. > :26:27.I have served in has been behind in the polls. At a general election you
:26:27. > :26:36.have to mobilise the public to start thinking, who do we want to govern
:26:36. > :26:44.us? They did take over a calamitous important problems to be decided
:26:44. > :26:48.going forward. UKIP represents anti-immigration, anti-foreigners,
:26:49. > :26:51.anti-Europe, anti-politics but I don't think it will get 18% of the
:26:51. > :27:25.Thank you. Once upon a time, a politician whose career ended in
:27:25. > :27:28.disgrace might choose to lie low for a while, perhaps to spend a bit
:27:28. > :27:30.disgrace might choose to lie low for time tending the tulips and doing
:27:30. > :27:32.the odd bit of charity work. Not Chris Huhne. He walked free from
:27:32. > :27:35.prison only five months ago but Chris Huhne. He walked free from
:27:35. > :27:39.former Energy Secretary is already back in the public eye - a column in
:27:39. > :27:43.the Guardian, a job with a renewable interview. So is he working on a
:27:43. > :27:46.political rehabilitation? Chris Politics. The answer to that is
:27:46. > :27:49.clearly know, and thank you for inviting me back. You have set your
:27:49. > :27:54.career in politics is over so what does the future hold for you? I
:27:54. > :27:57.career in politics is over so what happy doing what I am doing, I am
:27:57. > :28:02.passionate about green energy and climate change, so I am doing things
:28:02. > :28:08.on that front in terms of business non-governmental organisations,
:28:08. > :28:09.on that front in terms of business I am doing a column for the Guardian
:28:09. > :28:13.on Mondays. You obviously get a I am doing a column for the Guardian
:28:13. > :28:20.of material from the Sunday Politics to write about. Have you embarked on
:28:20. > :28:24.political rehabilitation? It was clear from the point of view of
:28:24. > :28:28.political rehabilitation? It was George when I was sentenced, he
:28:28. > :28:32.rehabilitating you, because I had not offended for ten years, it was
:28:32. > :28:38.actually about stopping people like you, Andrew, Ron doing the same
:28:38. > :28:44.thing. It was a deterrent effect for the public. That is I think why
:28:44. > :28:46.thing. It was a deterrent effect for prosecution was brought. I had not
:28:46. > :29:17.offended for ten years on this, rehabilitate yourself in the public?
:29:17. > :29:23.coalition to the bitter end? Or should they re-establish their own
:29:23. > :29:29.Coalition agreement is for the whole Parliament, and the Lib Dems are
:29:30. > :29:33.going to stay, and should stay. What would be a good result for the Lib
:29:33. > :29:40.Dems in 2015? The loss of ten, would be a good result for the Lib
:29:40. > :29:45.interesting election because I think you will have essentially three
:29:46. > :29:54.party leaders, all of whom are negative ratings so it will be a
:29:54. > :30:00.battle between the walking wounded. In those circumstances, in my view,
:30:00. > :30:12.the Lib Dems can come out very well. But you will lose seats, won't
:30:12. > :30:16.the Liberal Democrats do badly in next year's European elections,
:30:16. > :30:16.the Liberal Democrats do badly in could come fourth on fifth behind
:30:16. > :30:24.leadership be in jeopardy? I've could come fourth on fifth behind
:30:25. > :30:30.in countless cycles where we've could come fourth on fifth behind
:30:30. > :30:35.very low poll ratings. The normal pickup to the subsequent general
:30:35. > :30:39.election on average has been 10 percentage points. So he's not in
:30:39. > :30:41.jeopardy? I think Nick will be there at the next general election. I
:30:41. > :30:44.think he'll lead the party into at the next general election. I
:30:44. > :30:47.next general election. I expect we'll do much better than most
:30:48. > :30:52.people think. If we are heading we'll do much better than most
:30:52. > :30:56.another hung Parliament, which is Let's be honest, you'd rather be in
:30:56. > :31:00.coalition with the Labour Party Let's be honest, you'd rather be in
:31:00. > :31:05.have a repeat of the Conservatives? One of the key things I sawed to
:31:05. > :31:09.colleagues, whatever your personal preference, I used to be a Labour
:31:09. > :31:14.Party member, you can derive from that I'm on the left of centre of
:31:14. > :31:20.the party. I always said to my colleagues in the party, it is
:31:20. > :31:23.the we are in politics because we are Liberal Democrats, not because
:31:23. > :31:28.we are either Conservatives or second best Labour. If you don't
:31:29. > :31:33.take that view, you don't have any bargaining position when it comes to
:31:33. > :31:37.coalition. You have to be able, genuinely, to do a coalition with
:31:37. > :31:41.either of the other parties. I understand that, but you'd prefer
:31:41. > :31:45.Labour? Your personal preference really should not come into this. It
:31:46. > :31:52.is about making sure you get the best possible deal for the things
:31:52. > :31:55.you get that with one party rather than another, that's fine. You stand
:31:55. > :31:59.up for Liberal Democrat values, than another, that's fine. You stand
:31:59. > :32:04.for Conservative or Labour second best values. You said you're keeping
:32:04. > :32:10.up your interest in energy matters. Is Ed Miliband right to promise
:32:10. > :32:13.up your interest in energy matters. temporary price freeze? There's
:32:13. > :32:17.up your interest in energy matters. pop ewe louse posturing. It is not a
:32:18. > :32:22.sensible policy. It was tried in California in 2,000 and 2001 which
:32:22. > :32:27.led to blackouts. We had the Prime Minister promising we should sift
:32:27. > :32:34.everybody automatically to the unfortunately we're at the stage in
:32:34. > :32:41.the political cycle where we are getting clap trap. You're against
:32:41. > :32:44.the freeze? It is a bad idea when we are trying to encourage investment.
:32:44. > :32:50.When the market can give us some of the lowest gas and electricity
:32:50. > :32:53.son-in-law of the lowest? Not our base price? The other European Ian
:32:53. > :32:58.prices are only higher because they put a lot more taxes on to it? Our
:32:58. > :33:04.base energy prices are among the highest in Europe? No, if you look
:33:04. > :33:06.at EU comparisons in what goes out to people's households. That's after
:33:06. > :33:10.all the taxes have been put on them? to people's households. That's after
:33:10. > :33:50.green taxes is George Osborne with should no better. One the-hip ok
:33:50. > :34:00.not want it. We do not need it to agreement because the Conservatives
:34:00. > :34:02.not want it. We do not need it to electricity system. It was a revenue
:34:02. > :34:06.raising measure by the Tories. It set off a whole load of hairs about
:34:06. > :34:12.green taxes which are now coming home to roost. Final point to you,
:34:12. > :34:17.wish we'd more time to talk, you're a big supporter of Leveson-style
:34:17. > :34:21.press regulation. Will you stop writing for The Guardian if it
:34:21. > :34:28.refuses to sign up to the Leveson charter? I think that's neither here
:34:28. > :34:32.nor there. The Guardian gives me a great platform. If it doesn't sign
:34:32. > :34:38.up to what you believe in will you support it? No because I'm sure
:34:38. > :34:43.they'll allow me to make that that point. I think newspapers will sign
:34:43. > :34:47.up for it. They've had a collapse in public trust and confidence in
:34:47. > :34:51.recent years. Unparalleled. They need a third party endorsement to
:34:51. > :34:55.say these guys have cleaned up their act. If they are going to get trust
:34:55. > :34:59.back and they will. When they haven't signed up, which they won't,
:34:59. > :35:03.you can come back and we'll talk about it.
:35:03. > :35:06.You're watching the Sunday politics. Coming up in about 20 minutes, we'll
:35:06. > :35:23.talk to Welcome to Sunday Politics South.
:35:23. > :35:28.My name is Peter Henley. On today's show...
:35:28. > :35:32.Are we in danger of running out of places to bury the dead? Council
:35:32. > :35:35.cemeteries are filling up, so will we have to accept that a burial
:35:35. > :35:47.place is not for the afterlife, but only for a century or less? First
:35:47. > :35:54.the goal, Lamy introduced my guests for today. Energy prices going up.
:35:55. > :35:59.It is getting colder and people are having to put the heating on, what
:35:59. > :36:07.about this idea of capping electricity prices? It is popular
:36:07. > :36:14.initially, but I think it would shortly unravel. People are
:36:14. > :36:22.sceptical. In idea that you could declare an arbitrary price in the
:36:22. > :36:30.markets would not react to that. The needy pleased to hear someone
:36:31. > :36:37.articulating that energy prices are high, but it is the detail of the
:36:37. > :36:43.solution he is proposing. To say you were just that are not take into
:36:43. > :36:49.account the implications on the market of whether, for instance, the
:36:49. > :36:53.places change. It is essentially something all politicians agree
:36:53. > :37:05.with, but it is how you deal with this in the long—term. He said he
:37:05. > :37:10.was going to freeze prices poll the market was reset and that is going
:37:10. > :37:18.to be the problem. We have seen recently, the rising energy prices
:37:18. > :37:26.are getting out of hand in relation to the real price of electricity and
:37:26. > :37:32.gas. And this is opportunity mystic of him, because clearly, the first
:37:32. > :37:40.point where he could implicate this would be in two years time. No, that
:37:40. > :37:43.is something which is common knowledge, so I think he has been
:37:43. > :37:48.straight down the line about that, that this is a policy that the
:37:48. > :37:58.Labour Party would implement straightaway as they got into power.
:37:58. > :38:03.It is just the start of finding a long—term solution to the problems
:38:03. > :38:11.of pricing in the energy sector. I think it is wishful thinking on the
:38:11. > :38:18.part of the Labour leadership. They have caused many of the problems of
:38:18. > :38:22.today. We know that the energy prices are too high and that is why
:38:22. > :38:28.the Prime Minister suggested that everyone be put on the lowest
:38:28. > :38:31.tariff. But just to say that a politician can say we will guarantee
:38:32. > :38:35.this space to years down the line, is not something which can really be
:38:35. > :38:40.done. Parlez—vous Francais? Sprechen sie
:38:40. > :38:45.Deutsch? Chances are it is non and nein. As a nation, we are
:38:45. > :38:48.notoriously poor at learning other people's languages and, according to
:38:48. > :38:51.research out this week, that could be getting worse. The number of
:38:51. > :38:55.universities offering specialist language degrees has dropped by 40%
:38:55. > :38:59.in the last 15 years, yet the CBI reckons that we are already being
:38:59. > :39:04.held back in the export stakes by a national lack of language skills.
:39:05. > :39:07.Mike Kelly is Head of Languages at the University of Southampton. A
:39:07. > :39:10.former adviser to the Labour government, he now heads the current
:39:10. > :39:20.government's Routes Into Languages programme. A set that students do
:39:20. > :39:26.not want to do languages or just that the courses are being cut back?
:39:26. > :39:37.I think a lot of students want to do languages, but there are a lot of
:39:37. > :39:48.obstacles. Part of the problem is that there needs to be specialists
:39:48. > :39:53.late on in school and also, it is something about the unpredictability
:39:53. > :40:03.of how people make do and exams. It tends to be one of the more
:40:03. > :40:11.unpredictable ones, doesn't it? There have been changes at GCSE
:40:11. > :40:20.level, which we are hoping will be sustained. Certainly, getting people
:40:20. > :40:23.to learn difficult subjects is harder, but you have to give
:40:23. > :40:31.recognition for what people achieve. Why is that not working?
:40:31. > :40:39.Particularly at a level, the papers are being graded far too severely.
:40:39. > :40:48.Far fewer people are getting a star and languages than in any other
:40:48. > :40:52.subject. And that is when the pupils are just as bright motivated those
:40:52. > :40:57.taking the likes of chemistry and mathematics. I do not quite
:40:57. > :41:03.understand this. They are getting good teaching and pitting and the
:41:03. > :41:08.effort, but you are saying that the bar is actually been set for 2—1?
:41:08. > :41:13.Yes, I think they are too severe. I do not think they give recognition
:41:13. > :41:20.for the achievement that the student has. The outcome University, ugly
:41:20. > :41:30.tending to take it alongside a degree course, rather than as a
:41:30. > :41:33.first subject. Yes, oil language degrees are struggling, students are
:41:33. > :41:38.coming into language courses and a large way. They are maybe combining
:41:38. > :41:45.them with the likes of engineering or business. And a lot of people are
:41:45. > :41:50.coming in to do extracurricular activities. There is a huge demand
:41:51. > :41:57.for languages. Is it not the old British disease that we expect
:41:57. > :42:02.everyone to speak English? Yes, at his still part of the problem, but I
:42:02. > :42:06.think that people are waking up. The fact that the rest of the world is
:42:06. > :42:21.learning English is not for our benefit. The bottom line is, if you
:42:21. > :42:24.have a company who are working within a number of different
:42:25. > :42:32.countries, if you require these languages, at the moment, they may
:42:32. > :42:37.be forced to hire abroad. In business, it is important that we
:42:37. > :42:47.have people with the skills which will help us build a new markets.
:42:47. > :42:55.Where as the problem? I think it goes back to 2004, when languages
:42:55. > :43:06.were taken note of the essential aspect of the curriculum. We do not
:43:06. > :43:10.want to sacrifice languages. The good thing about the new
:43:10. > :43:15.qualification is that it measures many things, such as sciences, my
:43:15. > :43:20.mathematics and languages. I wonder if we should reduce the standard to
:43:20. > :43:25.encourage more people to do it. I think we are hoping more people will
:43:25. > :43:31.do it at GCSE and then flowed through. I do not think it is about
:43:31. > :43:42.reducing the standard. What seems to be going on is a different range of
:43:43. > :43:48.considerations languages, as well as other subject. It is about getting
:43:48. > :43:54.the comparable comparability of the market, so that people think if I
:43:54. > :43:59.take a languages A—level, I am just as likely to be alongside those who
:43:59. > :44:06.have got a similar grade in different subjects. As merely a lack
:44:06. > :44:10.of a real availability, and so much is that if you do a certain subject,
:44:10. > :44:17.it may prevent you from doing the likes of music or some other subject
:44:17. > :44:22.that you like? Yes, there is still this worry that the rest of the
:44:22. > :44:29.world is speaking English, so we no longer required to speak any other
:44:29. > :44:36.language. We have the likes of Mandarin, Portuguese and Russian.
:44:36. > :44:40.Out proving more popular these days? The bottom line is, whatever foreign
:44:40. > :44:49.language you learn, it will help you learn other languages. If you speak
:44:50. > :44:56.French, for example, it will give you a great deal of background about
:44:57. > :45:03.what is needed to do if you then went on to learn Russian.
:45:03. > :45:07.We have heard a lot about the cost of living recently, but it seems
:45:07. > :45:12.even the cost of dying is on the up. The average cost of a basic funeral
:45:12. > :45:15.is up just over 5% on last year and, added to that, it will not be long
:45:15. > :45:18.before some councils start running out of burial plots. As our Dorset
:45:18. > :45:29.political reporter Tristan Pascoe has been finding out, there is a
:45:29. > :45:39.grave crisis ahead. This is the sort of place people would like to have
:45:39. > :45:42.as our final resting place —a quaint country yard and a pleasant place
:45:42. > :45:50.for loved ones to come and visitors. But for many that will not
:45:50. > :45:57.be possible. The space in our cemeteries in graveyards is rapidly
:45:57. > :46:01.running out. Obviously, a tizzy problem, we have about two years
:46:01. > :46:08.left in the provision of boreal spaces. It is a similar picture
:46:09. > :46:14.across much of the south. Christchurch, the time frame for
:46:14. > :46:24.having the most elderly population in the country, will run out of body
:46:24. > :46:29.within eight years. In Poole, it is an even bigger concern. We have some
:46:29. > :46:37.plans for remodelling the cemeteries we do have. The plan is not to use
:46:37. > :46:42.move their graves, but to maybe use the likes of the pathways in car
:46:42. > :46:48.parks to better utilise the area. With urban sites nearly feel, people
:46:48. > :47:02.are looking for out—of—town alternatives. This may be appeals
:47:02. > :47:06.more to people who want something more out into the open, which is
:47:06. > :47:13.more in keeping also with green issues. We think we will be a
:47:13. > :47:19.benefit to the environment, rather than a detriment. There is a greater
:47:20. > :47:23.emphasis on the trees and what is growing around does and I think that
:47:23. > :47:33.is what people want and need 21st—century. This is an expensive
:47:34. > :47:39.business. The cost of a boreal can depend greatly great you live, going
:47:40. > :47:46.from the likes of £1300 in Portsmouth, up to £1800 in raiding
:47:46. > :47:51.and other expenses and take the average cost up to £7,000. With
:47:51. > :48:04.burial space running out, maybe it is time to forget the idea that a
:48:04. > :48:09.boreal lot is for eternity. Is the case for what some councils are
:48:09. > :48:13.doing really our gasoline digging up old but real places. That is not
:48:13. > :48:20.something we would ever be intending to do. I think that is a horrible
:48:20. > :48:26.thought. That will not be happening in the foreseeable future. This
:48:26. > :48:34.cemetery was deemed fool and closed 20 years ago, but it has now been
:48:34. > :48:39.reopened, with the council digging up pathways like this to create
:48:39. > :48:45.extra burial plot. It is a move likely to be repeated across the
:48:45. > :48:53.country as councils look to make use of every available space. You see
:48:53. > :48:59.this is not unusual to use different spaces within the boreal area?
:48:59. > :49:04.Historically, that this what happened and all the ancient
:49:04. > :49:08.churchyards. All the gravestones redlined up along the edge and
:49:08. > :49:15.people were buried the top of each other before Victorian times. The
:49:15. > :49:27.combination of the huge increase in population and the idea that the
:49:28. > :49:35.graveyard was for eternity. We have to take careful consideration of the
:49:35. > :49:41.amount of space. And some of the ideas, such as woodland burials and
:49:41. > :49:45.other ways of doing things, are very important. We simply cannot go on
:49:45. > :49:52.for ever taking up more around with an increasing population, with a
:49:52. > :50:02.large plot for everybody. What about the cost? When is a huge nation.
:50:02. > :50:06.There's hundreds of pounds difference between the cost of
:50:06. > :50:19.cremation. Are these companies doing this to make money? Yes, they are as
:50:19. > :50:24.such a strange thing going on, I think we really need to get all the
:50:24. > :50:30.councils talking to the commission places in the local area and finding
:50:30. > :50:37.out why there's such a difference. I believe the of Justice has got this
:50:37. > :50:44.under review. Creative solutions need to be found, flexible solutions
:50:44. > :50:49.on the ground. These high costs you mentioned are exceptional. These are
:50:49. > :50:58.not related directly to boreal space, but it seems crazy that you
:50:58. > :51:02.should be paying maybe up to ten times as much for budding your loved
:51:02. > :51:06.one depending on where you live. It is always nice when your
:51:06. > :51:10.community gets an accolade of being top of some list or other, but maybe
:51:10. > :51:14.not so much when it is in a book called Crap Towns. It is not top,
:51:14. > :51:16.but third. Chipping Norton in Oxfordshire gets that particular
:51:16. > :51:20.wooden spoon this week. The citation puts the blame firmly on the
:51:20. > :51:23.Chipping Norton Set, which has to be the first time that having a Prime
:51:23. > :51:37.Minister in the neighbourhood is been seen as bringing down the tone
:51:37. > :51:42.of the place. Patrick is the cheer of discovering Chipping Norton and
:51:42. > :51:57.also owns a book shop in the town. Did you start this book? We have a
:51:57. > :52:07.book shop and cafe. We are such an easy target. This idea of the
:52:07. > :52:17.Chipping Norton Set is silly. None of these people actually live there.
:52:17. > :52:27.We are being criticised for treating people differently than anyone else.
:52:27. > :52:39.People are content to let the Chipping Norton Set get away with
:52:39. > :52:44.it. I always thought, if this was going on in London, everyone would
:52:44. > :52:53.just take this for granted. It is natural that these groups and
:52:53. > :52:59.meetings happen to get together. It is no different and Chipping Norton
:52:59. > :53:08.than anywhere else. I am a resident and have been here for 13 years and
:53:08. > :53:13.I am proud to be a resident. I think a lot of people referred to in the
:53:13. > :53:17.book are not residents. There is a serious point here, that Chipping
:53:17. > :53:23.Norton is insulated from the real world. It says, every are any other
:53:23. > :53:31.bad tones, then the blame must lie with Chipping Norton. People are out
:53:31. > :53:36.of touch and Chipping Norton. Our highest rate is fighting exactly the
:53:36. > :53:46.same battle as every other high Street is fighting. We are in
:53:46. > :53:50.exactly the same situation. Really, you are facing the same problems as
:53:50. > :53:55.the industrial towns of the North? Yes, even the book recognises that.
:53:55. > :54:02.We are doing our best to fight back. We are just an ordinary market
:54:02. > :54:07.town. Come and have a look and make up your own mind.
:54:07. > :54:12.Now, our regular round—up of the political week in the South in 60
:54:12. > :54:24.seconds. And this week, it is rubbish. The largest soil testing
:54:24. > :54:35.plan in the world opened in Oxfordshire. Holes in the road have
:54:35. > :54:41.led to the huge rise in compensation pay—outs. West Sussex have had to
:54:41. > :55:01.deal with 450 claims at a cost of nearly £200,000. Sussex police had
:55:01. > :55:17.to also step in, when they want one MP of harassment. On Twitter,
:55:17. > :55:27.Twitter led to a road regarding the government reshuffle. And fly
:55:27. > :55:34.tipping policy has led to up to ten times the amount of previous
:55:34. > :55:39.convictions. I think the leaders of the party have to make the policies
:55:39. > :55:47.that the need to. I think we all accept that. Getting ready for the
:55:47. > :55:51.election? It is obviously a very difficult decision. It is
:55:51. > :56:00.particularly difficult in coalition, friendly Prime Minister as less
:56:00. > :56:08.options than if he had the majority. So, it was difficult for those who
:56:08. > :56:16.where released. I think some of them have done nothing wrong. It is
:56:16. > :56:21.difficult. But that has always been the way in politics. The Prime
:56:21. > :56:27.Minister needs to refresh the look and give opportunities to other
:56:27. > :56:33.people. A change of direction for the Labour Party? It is a change of
:56:33. > :56:41.line—up, but when you see who's coming into the shadow cabinet, you
:56:41. > :56:50.cannot really say some lot about and some lot are in. Is it just the
:56:50. > :56:56.newspapers? It is partly that. It is a line—up of good talent. It will be
:56:56. > :57:00.the for the next general election and beyond and it is quite clear
:57:00. > :57:04.that we know when the general election is going to be, so you have
:57:04. > :57:09.to get your best team in place for the election and make it work and
:57:09. > :57:19.that is what the reshuffle has done, as far as the opposition is
:57:19. > :57:28.concerned. Available for selection from 2015, both of you? I remember
:57:28. > :57:39.you saying that you were unlikely to get anywhere because you were white
:57:39. > :57:45.and new word meal! I enjoy working with them and I was very relaxed
:57:45. > :57:50.about the reshuffle. It is a question of, if you are at the
:57:50. > :57:55.receiving end of a reshuffle, you obviously quite often have not done
:57:55. > :58:03.anything wrong and feel bad about it. Equally surprised that those who
:58:03. > :58:07.have been promoted. It is an arrangement without a job
:58:07. > :58:09.description. It is not the perfect way to do it, but
:58:09. > :58:12.and these tactics were plain wrong. That is all we have time for. Back
:58:12. > :58:23.to Andrew. That is all we have time for. Back
:58:23. > :58:26.ministerial team this week with That is all we have time for. Back
:58:26. > :58:31.commentators calling it the purge of the Blairites, but one poor lamb who
:58:31. > :58:36.fell victim to this perch was Diane Abbott, not somebody who worshipped
:58:36. > :58:40.at the altar of Tony Blair. Life on the backbenches means she can pursue
:58:40. > :58:47.other interests such as attending the Cheltenham literary Festival,
:58:47. > :58:51.and where she joins us now. Welcome. Why did Ed Miliband fire you? He
:58:51. > :58:58.think the thing that did it for Why did Ed Miliband fire you? He
:58:58. > :59:05.was me coming out on Syria. This was Why did Ed Miliband fire you? He
:59:05. > :59:09.a purge of the Blairites, how did you become collateral damage? I
:59:09. > :59:11.a purge of the Blairites, how did no idea but the fact that I was
:59:11. > :59:14.a purge of the Blairites, how did one member of the front bench to go
:59:14. > :59:21.public about my concerns on Syria probably tipped my enemies in the
:59:21. > :59:25.party machinery over the edge. But he went your way on Syria, in the
:59:25. > :59:33.end he agreed with your line on Syria so why would that be for
:59:33. > :59:36.dismissal? I agree with you - you're fired. Because I actually spoke
:59:36. > :59:39.dismissal? I agree with you - you're and it was the fact that I spoke up,
:59:39. > :59:48.which was like a pebble falling and it was the fact that I spoke up,
:59:48. > :59:55.forest or something. I am glad I spoke up on Syria. He doesn't like
:59:55. > :00:12.people around them than who are outspoken, who speak their minds? I
:00:12. > :00:14.think he's convinced he needs people who read from the scripts. People
:00:14. > :00:21.increasingly upset that even though who read from the scripts. People
:00:21. > :00:27.I was speaking party policy, I was reading from the script. Since Mr
:00:27. > :00:33.Miliband bid you farewell, you've said he's doing his best. Is his
:00:33. > :00:38.best good enough? I am sure it will be. I've always said the Labour
:00:38. > :00:43.Party chose the right Miliband. be. I've always said the Labour
:00:43. > :00:49.will remain loyal to him on the backbenches. You're going to be
:00:49. > :00:54.loyal? However, I want to join in the debate. You're going to be
:00:54. > :00:58.loyal? Absolutely. I was loyal both in public and private when others
:00:58. > :01:05.were bitching about him behind the from the backbenches, I hope to
:01:05. > :01:07.were bitching about him behind the involved in the debate particularly
:01:07. > :01:11.around nick policy. Et's see how loyal you are. You must be happy
:01:11. > :01:20.with all this new tough talk on welfare and free schools? Well,
:01:20. > :01:24.with all this new tough talk on think both Rachel and Tristram are
:01:24. > :01:28.very talented. We're going to have to see how this all plays out. The
:01:28. > :01:32.issue of free schools, they are to see how this all plays out. The
:01:32. > :01:34.thing. But diminishing the role to see how this all plays out. The
:01:34. > :01:42.local authorities is another. There need strong local authorities. I'm
:01:42. > :01:44.local authorities is another. There sure Tristram will be aware of that.
:01:44. > :01:50.As for welfare, I'm sure Rachel knows some of the cuts the Tories
:01:50. > :01:56.have made have been counter prod ublingtive in -- productive in terms
:01:56. > :01:57.of spending. You wouldn't call that your full-hearted endorsement, would
:01:57. > :02:05.you? What are you on, and lieu? your full-hearted endorsement, would
:02:05. > :02:10.haven't seen the detail of Rachel's new position. You have to wait and
:02:10. > :02:15.see the detail. It is in the papers. You haven't stopped reading the
:02:15. > :02:20.papers. It was the Observer. When will you announce you're running for
:02:20. > :02:25.Mayor of London? I have no plans to announce that I'm running for Mayor
:02:25. > :02:25.Mayor of London? I have no plans to of London. No plans. That's what
:02:25. > :02:30.Michael his I will Tyne used to of London. No plans. That's what
:02:30. > :02:34.me. He had no plans to run against Margaret Thatcher. Are these the
:02:34. > :02:41.same kind of plans you have? I know. No, no. I have no plans. You know
:02:41. > :02:51.going for it. Everybody knows you're going for it. Just fess up to your
:02:51. > :02:57.old mate! ! I have no plans to run. If you did run, who would be, what
:02:57. > :03:07.would be your biggest threat other than yourself? I think there's a lot
:03:07. > :03:15.of very talented candidates, David They are all talented. I would have
:03:16. > :03:20.to weigh up the field. What do you think your chances would be of
:03:20. > :03:27.getting the taxi drivers' vote? Well, you know, Andrew, some of
:03:27. > :03:31.getting the taxi drivers' vote? most loyal viewers of This Week
:03:31. > :03:34.getting the taxi drivers' vote? were taxi drivers and their wives.
:03:34. > :03:39.I'm not frightened of reaching out to middle England. You will find if
:03:39. > :03:45.you walk around London sub usual ya, they all know me and they all love
:03:45. > :03:50.This Week. Love This Week. I thought you were going to say they all love
:03:50. > :03:54.you. One person who loves you, is Michael Portillo. He wasn't a happy
:03:54. > :04:00.chappie on Thursday night. You can't see it but you can hear. This is
:04:00. > :04:07.what he said. I was disappointed for her. She had decided to leave this
:04:07. > :04:11.something else in politics. She wanted to do something serious.
:04:11. > :04:13.something else in politics. She had taken what appeared to be a
:04:13. > :04:15.something else in politics. She position but taken it extremely
:04:15. > :04:23.serious and was committed to the issues. I'm quite disappointed for
:04:23. > :04:28.her. Why would Ed Miliband do such a thing. You just mentioned about
:04:28. > :04:37.London mayor, did Diane not ask thing. You just mentioned about
:04:37. > :04:39.Someone who's an eminent person thing. You just mentioned about
:04:39. > :04:43.this programme, I don't know how he could do that. I think Michael's
:04:43. > :04:50.missing you. Are you free this Thursday night? Make him a happy
:04:50. > :04:54.man, come back to the fold. I think I may be free this Thursday night.
:04:55. > :04:59.So, if he'll have me, I'll be there. My people will speak to your people.
:04:59. > :05:04.We'll get it sorted out. Diane, watch that big vase behind you,
:05:04. > :05:10.you're not insured for. That thanks Does she have a chance of being
:05:10. > :05:12.Mayor of London? She's very well known as Michael pointed out. That
:05:12. > :05:19.is important. People who are outside known as Michael pointed out. That
:05:19. > :05:21.the party fold have traditionally done well in the mayoral election.
:05:21. > :05:26.The job of being a London mayor done well in the mayoral election.
:05:26. > :05:30.running an economy the size of a nation. It is a very serious job.
:05:30. > :05:38.There may be problems with her running? That was a transparent
:05:38. > :05:42.There may be problems with her for it. She's potentially a very
:05:42. > :05:52.compelling Coll ticks. People have left-winger but she's quite tough
:05:52. > :05:59.and conservative. Michael Gove said he had fallen in love with Diane
:05:59. > :06:06.which That's one vote he has. What do you think? I thing about Diane
:06:06. > :06:10.Abbott is she has a fantastic way of connecting. She has a really good
:06:10. > :06:16.way of connecting wi people. She would be a very strong candidate in
:06:16. > :06:23.candidate. It will probably be a Labour win next time. Depends, if
:06:23. > :06:28.Labour wins the 2015 election it may be more difficult. There's a danger
:06:28. > :06:30.for Labour that Diane is the big personality liked by the party
:06:30. > :06:37.primary but isn't necessarily a personality liked by the party
:06:37. > :06:42.in come the London general election? That's true. London is traditionally
:06:42. > :06:48.a Labour city. But Boris managed to win as an outsider. There are big
:06:48. > :06:52.dangers for Labour with that. I think, as I said before, somebody
:06:52. > :06:59.who seems a bit independent from their own party machinery tend to do
:06:59. > :07:05.We've only had mayors so far that were independent? Indeed. And how
:07:05. > :07:09.Not that far behind bar Is Johnson. well Ken Livingstone did last time.
:07:09. > :07:11.Not that far behind bar Is Johnson. He was and is much more left-wing
:07:11. > :07:20.than Diane Abbott. Diane didn't He was and is much more left-wing
:07:20. > :07:29.stray on Syria, it was immigration. Why was Jeremy brown replaced by
:07:29. > :07:33.This is very much to do with Clegg deciding he has to go back to those
:07:33. > :07:37.people who abandoned the Liberal Democrats the day they went into
:07:37. > :07:42.coalition with the Conservatives really, and convince them there
:07:42. > :07:46.coalition with the Conservatives some holy areas of policy, sacred
:07:46. > :07:48.areas which they will defend. That includes civil liberties. In the
:07:48. > :07:51.Home Office, that incident with includes civil liberties. In the
:07:52. > :07:57.immigration vans went down very badly across the whole nation. Went
:07:58. > :08:02.down particularly badly with Liberal Democrats and voters. In the Home
:08:02. > :08:12.somebody there to put a shield on purpose behind it. And Nick Clegg
:08:12. > :08:17.has won the argument against the left, Vince Cable on the economy,
:08:17. > :08:22.away day in July, briefings say DrCable's been put in his box. He's
:08:22. > :08:26.won the argument on economic policy against the left. When it comes
:08:26. > :08:28.won the argument on economic policy the touchstone issue in the Home
:08:28. > :08:32.Office, he wants to shore up that vote on the left. And please The
:08:32. > :08:38.Guardian. This is important for something else going on which is
:08:38. > :08:43.that Nick Clegg has to keep his parliamentary party happy. That
:08:43. > :08:47.involves giving them ministerial jobs. A lot of Liberal Democrats
:08:47. > :08:58.losing their jobs, Michael Moore, because vacancies have to be created
:08:59. > :09:06.for number people to come in. By Liberal Democrat MPs will have been
:09:06. > :09:12.on the payroll. It is effective party management. I want to move on
:09:12. > :09:14.to press regulation. Brian Leveson's famous report, appeared before the
:09:14. > :09:19.parliamentary select committee. famous report, appeared before the
:09:19. > :09:31.will run you a clip from Connor politicians got involved in this. We
:09:31. > :09:36.moved away from the press 300 years ago. The centr commitment is Lord
:09:36. > :09:44.Leveson wanted a system the press self-regulation. This is state
:09:44. > :09:50.involvement which I worry about profoundly. He sits on the media
:09:50. > :09:55.interviews and investigations into the media. Chris Huhne said earlier
:09:55. > :10:00.he thought all the newspapers would sign up to the Government-backed
:10:00. > :10:07.Royal Charter. I think he's totally should. But he did say they would. I
:10:07. > :10:12.think he's wrong. They won't sign up. All the mood music when that
:10:12. > :10:19.Royal Charter was agreed on Friday was they would not sign up. It is
:10:19. > :10:21.Maria Miller, is essentially saying to the press industry, if you don't
:10:21. > :10:24.sign up, the Royal charter will to the press industry, if you don't
:10:24. > :10:30.ahead. I cannot control the Labour to the press industry, if you don't
:10:30. > :10:32.industry is wind the clock back to the press industry, if you don't
:10:32. > :10:40.what they are calling the Puttnam stage. That was earlier this year,
:10:40. > :10:44.Lord Puttnam was tack amendments which would introduce statutory
:10:44. > :10:54.regulation. Maria Miller says you statutory legislation but if you
:10:54. > :11:01.don't sign up to this, it will be a lot worse. Will that work? Playing
:11:01. > :11:05.the good cop, bad cop routine? Will that pressurise everyone to sign up.
:11:05. > :11:10.Lots of people are saying this will be a club with no members. It won't
:11:10. > :11:16.work. As Nick and I broke the story last week that the Government was
:11:16. > :11:20.going to reject the newspaper-backed one, I'm certain that the newspapers
:11:21. > :11:28.now, most of them maybe, not all, but most, will go the legal route
:11:28. > :11:32.and to judicial review on what the Government's proposing and will
:11:32. > :11:33.and to judicial review on what the it to strains Bowring where freedom
:11:33. > :11:41.of the press is enshrined. They it to strains Bowring where freedom
:11:41. > :11:44.fight this? There is enough fury amongst Fleet Street to result in
:11:44. > :11:49.that. The big political question going forward is which of the party
:11:49. > :11:52.leaders does the press blame the most for the emergence of press
:11:52. > :11:58.regulation? The Tories are very confident they'll blame Ed Miliband
:11:58. > :12:03.the most. They'll target him before 2015. David Cameron gave us Brian
:12:03. > :12:11.Leveson. You appoint a judge who shouldn't be surprised with what you
:12:11. > :12:15.got in the Leveson report? I big chunk of press will look at David
:12:15. > :12:29.Cameron saying, you were the guy who intended what will happen. If he had
:12:29. > :12:32.have appointed Brian Leveson. If they face more punitive fines over
:12:32. > :12:37.Labour ale cases they take that they face more punitive fines over
:12:37. > :12:44.Europe. The Daily Mail and the tallest presumably will have to
:12:44. > :12:50.suspend their campaign of Britain to leave the European Convention of
:12:50. > :12:59.suspend that. We must never come out Churchill was behind it. He was
:12:59. > :13:00.indeed. But it is actually a major constitutional issue whether you
:13:00. > :13:05.regulate the press or not. There was constitutional issue whether you
:13:05. > :13:11.a lot of ill feeling that this Marie ya miller statement was snubbing out
:13:11. > :13:16.on Friday afternoon. Somebody said freedom of the press too important
:13:16. > :13:20.to sneak out on afully afternoon. The whole subject should be treated
:13:21. > :13:27.with respect. We've run out of time. I'll be back next Sunday with the
:13:27. > :13:37.Communities Secretary Eric Pickles at our usual time of 11.00am. If