:01:32. > :01:37.And in the Midlands, unlocking the housing crisis. How councils can
:01:37. > :01:47.make the most of what is on their own down steps. Make empty homes be
:01:47. > :01:47.
:01:47. > :30:43.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 1736 seconds
:30:43. > :30:48.Hello again from the Midlands. I am Patrick Burns. During the run-up to
:30:48. > :30:55.next month's council elections, we will hear from each party. It will
:30:55. > :31:01.all balance up. We are joined by Mike Nattrass, the UK Independence
:31:01. > :31:04.Party MEP for the West Midlands and by Susan Juned, a Liberal bowl -- a
:31:04. > :31:11.Liberal Democrat member of Stratford-on-Avon District Council.
:31:11. > :31:19.Mike, some of your opponents believe you are a part of a single
:31:19. > :31:24.issue protest group. We are not, we have a range of policies and you
:31:24. > :31:31.should know better than to say that. It is a question masquerading as a
:31:31. > :31:36.joke. Your opponents say you do not get involved in serious decision-
:31:36. > :31:45.making. Our manifesto at the General Election was bigger than
:31:45. > :31:51.the other three parties. That is true. Size is not everything. Susan,
:31:51. > :31:56.don't you hanker after the old days of the Liberal Democrats. Isn't it
:31:56. > :32:04.difficult being in office? I think it is good to show we are capable
:32:04. > :32:08.of being on the national stage. I have run as leader of the District
:32:08. > :32:15.Council and do know how good it is to be actually able to put policy
:32:15. > :32:23.into practice. And your seat is not up for re-election with poles
:32:23. > :32:30.running at 11%-12%. You are colleagues could be in for a
:32:30. > :32:39.pasting? I don't think so. Liberal Democrat run on local politics.
:32:39. > :32:44.That is the record of local people that people will judge by.
:32:44. > :32:49.Coming up later, waste not, want not is on our lips once again as we
:32:49. > :32:53.look for answers to this shortage of affordable housing. Could
:32:53. > :32:58.reclaiming empty homes help cut waiting lists with prices still
:32:58. > :33:03.high and not enough new ones being built?
:33:03. > :33:07.First, the top story this week with some distinctly off other shades of
:33:07. > :33:11.green. When ambitious plans are launched on a major power station
:33:11. > :33:19.to burn it wood pellets, you would think environmentalists have wood
:33:19. > :33:23.celebrating. -- think environmentalists would celebrate.
:33:23. > :33:30.Sustainable biomass fuels attract generous subsidies, but it is
:33:30. > :33:36.opposed by greed and campaigners. Ironbridge power station will soon
:33:36. > :33:42.moved from burning coal to burning wood. It is a controversial move.
:33:42. > :33:47.And here is another fuel source. A Birmingham invention turning leaves
:33:47. > :33:53.into logs to burn for homes, not power stations, but it could not
:33:53. > :34:00.beat bureaucracy. We were soon put right and all that whilst leaves a
:34:00. > :34:05.on trees, it belongs to the city's council. And some belong to
:34:05. > :34:10.companies like Veolia, which is the contract of Four street cleansing.
:34:10. > :34:19.We then had to negotiate with Veolia and that is where we had the
:34:19. > :34:28.problem. Without being access to -- without being able to access leaves,
:34:28. > :34:33.leaf logs removed from shops. It was a big issue dealing with the
:34:33. > :34:38.rules and regulations. But even so moving up have to green ideas can
:34:38. > :34:42.have unintended consequences. That brings us to Ironbridge. People
:34:42. > :34:47.opposing the switch to burning wood are not happy the move will be
:34:48. > :34:53.partially funded by green subsidy from the Government. The what
:34:53. > :34:58.sustainable seems to be attached, but it does not work. It does not
:34:58. > :35:03.work at all. It is looking a little greener as you for total
:35:03. > :35:07.destruction in other parts of the wobbled. So we have ended up with
:35:07. > :35:12.rules and regulations that seemed to see it is not possible to burn
:35:12. > :35:16.our warned leaves here to Heger house, but we can import millions
:35:17. > :35:26.of tons of North American Forest and pay subsidies for all of us to
:35:27. > :35:27.
:35:27. > :35:31.do it. -- to heat your house. Birmingham City Council's waste
:35:31. > :35:36.management company Veolia tell us their policy of composting leaves
:35:36. > :35:44.is better for the environment and recycling them into leaf logs.
:35:44. > :35:50.Which of those two Ventures strikes you, Susan, as more deserving?
:35:50. > :35:57.Green subsidies are meant to help him mature technologies get into
:35:57. > :36:03.the marketplace and address market failure. -- help in mature
:36:03. > :36:09.technologies. The leaf log is not a mature technology, but Veolia are
:36:09. > :36:15.using leaves for a good purpose, composting is used in a very
:36:15. > :36:22.sustainable way, keeping it out of landfill. Often, the compost is
:36:22. > :36:29.sold as well. So there is a product that has a contract. It is not as
:36:29. > :36:37.simple as that story maintained. Maybe, but leaf lobbying seems to
:36:37. > :36:41.be a new industry that needs encouraging. I do not object to
:36:41. > :36:46.anything said, but we need more research and development into green
:36:46. > :36:52.issues like this, because we ought to give more encouragement for news
:36:52. > :36:57.ideas and techniques. That someone has a new idea, a chance should be
:36:57. > :37:03.given to see how it moves and if it is sustainable and if it is
:37:03. > :37:08.profitable. We keep being told the way ahead is in green technologies,
:37:08. > :37:14.that this is a growth industry for the region. And that is the case.
:37:14. > :37:19.With a Ironbridge, the Government is bringing in sustainable criteria
:37:19. > :37:23.from April 2013, which will mean anyone using by a mass materials
:37:23. > :37:28.for electricity purchases will have to demonstrate they are reducing
:37:28. > :37:34.greenhouse gases by 60% and demonstrate the art of training
:37:34. > :37:42.materials from sustainable sources. -- demonstrate the art of training.
:37:42. > :37:46.That means not from rainforest or biodiversity areas. You are
:37:46. > :37:54.shipping this material across the Atlantic, how can that be deserving
:37:54. > :38:03.of any green subsidy? Should think it across the world cannot be.
:38:03. > :38:05.can be, particularly if it is Forestry pfennigs. But
:38:05. > :38:09.sustainability should be looked at and criteria should be looked at
:38:09. > :38:13.over a number of years. The University of Birmingham have done
:38:13. > :38:17.good work on making sure when decisions are taken that they are
:38:17. > :38:22.be judged against a number of criteria and you should always look
:38:22. > :38:27.at scenarios and what the future brings. But we need to look at ways
:38:27. > :38:32.of keeping power stations like Ironbridge, which are nearing the
:38:32. > :38:38.end of their life. And look at financial viability, such as wind
:38:38. > :38:44.farms, to those make money? I do not think they do, it is a lot of
:38:44. > :38:49.money wasted on generating electricity at a high cost. I would
:38:49. > :38:53.also ask you to look at things not only sustainability, but energy
:38:53. > :39:00.security, making sure people have affordable energy that can be
:39:00. > :39:06.afforded and will keep's going. Some wide and fundamental questions.
:39:06. > :39:10.And another one, our housing market is broken. So say the National
:39:10. > :39:15.Housing Federation, representing social landlords right across the
:39:16. > :39:20.region. Despite economic conditions, property prices remain high and so
:39:20. > :39:25.does a demand for affordable housing. Waiting lists here have
:39:25. > :39:35.risen by 64% in ten years and local authorities want to bring thousands
:39:35. > :39:36.
:39:36. > :39:41.of empty homes back into use. Hazel Poulton has clipped in her
:39:41. > :39:48.Redditch family home for 39 years. But for the last 10, this is what
:39:48. > :39:54.she has lived next door to. It has been broken into, all been boarded
:39:54. > :40:00.up and it just looks horrendous. is the mother in Kidderminster,
:40:00. > :40:08.with neighbours seeing the Arc at their wits end. -- it is the same
:40:08. > :40:14.in Kidderminster with neighbours at their wits end. No one -- we are
:40:14. > :40:24.having problems because of the condition of this. In
:40:24. > :40:25.
:40:25. > :40:29.Worcestershire, there are 2475 empty homes. There are 2361 in
:40:29. > :40:35.Shropshire and 5274 in Birmingham. That is within 28,000 homes that
:40:35. > :40:39.have been sitting empty. At a time when house prices are nine times
:40:39. > :40:44.the average annual salary. It has led to the Government offering a
:40:44. > :40:49.cash incentive to councils under the New Homes Bonus. At Wychavon
:40:49. > :40:56.District Council, they have made a good start by getting 178 empty
:40:57. > :41:02.homes back onto the market in four years. Well -- it is intensive,
:41:02. > :41:09.with staff putting all efforts into getting homes back into use, but it
:41:09. > :41:14.is worth that. The Government is not abandoning
:41:14. > :41:20.building new homes, far from it. Councils can get substantial grants
:41:20. > :41:24.for every new home. For every pound Wychavon races in council tax from
:41:24. > :41:29.these 130 forms, the Government will give the same amount back for
:41:29. > :41:33.six years. Shared ownership and right-to-buy schemes are also all
:41:33. > :41:39.options, but for a captain who lives in this council house, the
:41:39. > :41:45.thought of owning her own property deals like impossible. -- but for
:41:45. > :41:51.Katherine. We would like to have our own property, but it is too
:41:51. > :41:57.much to do at the moment, banks asking for up to �60,000 for a
:41:57. > :42:05.mortgage. The National Housing Federation said be built less than
:42:05. > :42:10.50% of the houses needed in the West Midlands.
:42:10. > :42:13.Also with us to be his Gemma Duggan from the National Housing
:42:13. > :42:17.Federation, representing the housing associations who are trying
:42:17. > :42:21.to help people like happened -- people like Katherine Hutchins
:42:21. > :42:26.there to get started on the property ladder. How did you just
:42:26. > :42:32.have by saying the market is broken? It is broken at all levels
:42:32. > :42:37.and statistics prove it. We have increased homelessness, the highest
:42:37. > :42:42.in this region than anywhere in the country. Everyone knows someone who
:42:42. > :42:45.is experiencing problems getting on to the housing ladder, rental costs,
:42:45. > :42:53.whole families living in one bedroom houses or bed and
:42:53. > :42:58.breakfasts, because they cannot get homes in private or social sectors.
:42:58. > :43:05.We have had the New Homes Bonus, local authorities try to free up
:43:05. > :43:08.empty homes, those should be welcomed? Very welcome, but just
:43:08. > :43:15.part of the picture. New Homes Bonus just give you the equivalent
:43:15. > :43:19.of council tax for six years, about �6,000 per house and �120,000
:43:20. > :43:24.builds a house. It is great to see encouragement and that the
:43:24. > :43:29.Government wants new homes built, but we must invest more money in
:43:29. > :43:35.housing and affordable housing to solve the current crisis. Why are
:43:35. > :43:39.as many as 74,000 houses standing empty in this region? Is that the
:43:39. > :43:45.owners wanting the market to increase before seeing what they
:43:45. > :43:51.can get? It does seem that, when you have this chronic need, it is
:43:51. > :43:55.really serious. It is and it is a range of situations. Once a house
:43:55. > :44:04.is empty, it is expensive to bring it back to use and owners cannot
:44:04. > :44:09.afford that. In others, we can have some investment work from
:44:09. > :44:12.Government, some of which is cut. And we are hearing of serious
:44:12. > :44:18.market forces which militate against thousands of people on
:44:18. > :44:22.waiting lists. We have thousands of people on waiting lists because we
:44:22. > :44:29.have a population that is too high, reflecting in housing, hospitals,
:44:29. > :44:34.schools, roads, infrastructure, even water. But we cannot re-
:44:34. > :44:39.engineer the population. We should control who comes into the country,
:44:39. > :44:43.not allowing millions to come in through the door. It should be
:44:43. > :44:53.controlled in the right way. Government has passed this to local
:44:53. > :44:59.committees, so it is over to you, could that be seen as devolving the
:44:59. > :45:04.blame? It has been an argument. Quite honestly, local authorities
:45:04. > :45:12.do have to step up to the plate and are capable of doing so and have
:45:12. > :45:17.done so well in the past. I would like to seek new homes bonuses and
:45:17. > :45:24.other incentives genuinely used for the purposes they are meant to be.
:45:24. > :45:30.Do you think the numbers are appreciable? Getting the empty
:45:30. > :45:37.homes back into use his only a small amount, it only addresses
:45:37. > :45:46.some of the problem, but it is a great advantage to use that money.
:45:46. > :45:50.Let me raise one comment that came in from my blog this week. It is
:45:50. > :45:54.about a shared ownership schemes. Much favoured by some of your
:45:54. > :46:03.housing associations. 3 Para four points. People trapped in a scheme
:46:03. > :46:13.cannot sell, pay 100% of the cost and rents are rising. -- 3 Para
:46:13. > :46:18.
:46:18. > :46:23.four points. It has been called a scam. -- powerful points. Shared
:46:23. > :46:31.ownership can be a problem. You can be trapped in negative equity for
:46:31. > :46:35.many reasons. If you want to sell, housing associations give you help.
:46:35. > :46:39.If you are struggling, the rest of the share can be bought off you.
:46:39. > :46:46.You are then in a better position and can live in a village you may
:46:46. > :46:52.not have been able to before. from my blog, more homes are needed,
:46:52. > :47:02.which means planning policy allowing enough homes to be built.
:47:02. > :47:02.
:47:02. > :47:08.So planning policy should affect meat. It has to. -- planning policy
:47:08. > :47:13.should be related to need. I would give everyone who came along a
:47:13. > :47:21.lease of nine years, saying you have a right to buy every three
:47:21. > :47:26.years. These are this stepping- stones. Should planning policy
:47:26. > :47:33.reflect need as well as environmental issues? It has to
:47:33. > :47:38.reflect that. And what local people also want. One of the problems we
:47:38. > :47:42.have had in this region, many councils, is we have had a change
:47:42. > :47:48.of national policy for planning. But many councils have not kept up
:47:48. > :47:54.with planning their own local plants. Some councils are now way
:47:54. > :48:00.behind and as a result actually been trapped by planning appeal
:48:00. > :48:05.policy. That is not helpful. must leave it there. Thank you. Now
:48:05. > :48:15.for the regular Marwick -- now for the regular round-up in the
:48:15. > :48:20.politics this week. Four Midlands and MPs had their
:48:20. > :48:24.constituencies targeted by campaigners angry they are backing
:48:24. > :48:30.the so-called pasty tax. Chains like Greggs do not have to pay VAT
:48:30. > :48:34.at the moment on hot takeaway foods. At Dillwyn in Herefordshire, it was
:48:34. > :48:39.drinks all round as they prepared to reopen the local pub. The parish
:48:39. > :48:42.council has taken out a loan to buy it. Families and Gloucestershire
:48:42. > :48:49.are checking their flocks for Casey's of the Schmaullenberg virus.
:48:49. > :48:54.There have been two reported cases so far. And then RAF Cosford in
:48:54. > :48:58.Shropshire, staff are looking at expanding their training offered to
:48:58. > :49:03.get more private business. Deals are in the air at Severn Trent
:49:03. > :49:09.Water, offering to sell any surplus to Anglian Water to ease the
:49:09. > :49:14.drought. We are looking to cut the costs, make a profit, and it is a
:49:14. > :49:20.useful way to move water around and help VAT bills.
:49:20. > :49:25.I suppose if it helps keep bills down, I suppose that is good. But
:49:26. > :49:31.what of the Midlands becomes a drought zone? And these will become
:49:31. > :49:37.more frequent in years. The fundamental question is, do we have
:49:37. > :49:42.enough water and what do we do to manage it? We need to do more.
:49:42. > :49:47.seems fanciable when we heard about what a trading, but it is
:49:47. > :49:54.apparently a reality? There is more like rain and lakes in other parts
:49:54. > :49:58.of the country. It is a national asset. Why not? We should be using
:49:58. > :50:02.it as a national asset and have one system. We are wrong in having
:50:03. > :50:09.privatised water, but that is not part of this problem -- this
:50:09. > :50:14.programme. And we could be water exporting. That is where we have to
:50:14. > :50:20.leave it in the West Midlands. My thanks to Mike Nattrass, Susan
:50:21. > :50:24.Juned. Next week, guests will be Margot James, Conservative MP for